All Series Must Die (Which Is Why There Are New Ones) -- The Game of Thrones Series Spinoffs

Talk about going all in:

http://io9.gizmodo.com/hbo-and-george-r-r-martin-are-developing-four-game-of-1794928697

While we’ve known for awhile that there was a possibility of a prequel series, this is a lot more of a commitment than we’d previously heard. According to IGN, David Benioff and David Weiss will be on board all four of the projects, with George R.R. Martin helping to write two of them. Jane Goldman (Kingsman: The Secret Service) and Carly Wray (The Leftovers) each have a project with him. The other two shows will be written by Max Borenstein (Kong: Skull Island) and Brian Helgeland (LA: Confidential).

At this point I am now fully convinced he won't bother finishing the book series.

seems a good bet

Tales from the Stoneheart
Sewing with Sansa
Cleganebowl annual events
Fear the Game of Thrones

too bad ian mcshane is busy at the moment

please let someone interesting get to do the music for at least one of these.

(NB djawadi has improved over time but still)

Seems like the only memorable thing he did was the main theme.

The Light of the Seven, the piece that was playing under Cersei's grand plan in the beginning of the most recent season finale, is pretty cool.

https://youtu.be/pS-gbqbVd8c

Is there going to be a Sand Snakes spinoff on TNT?

thats the sound of a thousand fantasy writers re-purposing their nerdy ass shit to be used as GoT spinoff material

And then after a season or two they all team up in Game of Thrones Defenders and beat up Finn Jones one more time.

Oh I'm sorry -- five, not four.

http://grrm.livejournal.com/536859.html

I kinda love how he goes into deep detail on all this and then at the bottom in a bigger font size and all caps goes

I AM STILL WORKING ON WINDS OF WINTER

No doubt.

And as for how many of these will come to fruition:

Some of the reports of these developments seem to suggest that HBO might be adding four successor shows to the schedule to replace GAME OF THRONES. Decades of experience in television and film have taught me that nothing is ever really certain... but I do think it's very unlikely that we'll be getting four (or five) series. At least not immediately. What we do have here is an order for four -- now five -- pilot scripts. How many pilots will be filmed, and how many series might come out of that, remains to be seen. (If we do get five series on the air, I might have to change my name to Dick Direwolf).

Some stuff

https://grrm.livejournal.com/550336.html

bryan seems like a hardworking, productive guy. how is he at writing books?

after last season, I am about as excited about seeing a game of thrones spinoff season as i am to see the next star wars movie

um yesssss

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/mbkxnp/hbos-game-of-thrones-prequel-the-long-night-george-rr-martin-vgtrn

GRRM:

Yes, this is a prequel, not a sequel. None of the characters or actors from GAME OF THRONES will appear in the new show. All of the successor shows we’ve been developing have been prequels, as I have mentioned before. This one really puts the PRE in prequel, since it is set not ninety years before GAME OF THRONES (like Dunk & Egg), or a few hundred years, but rather ten thousand years (well, assuming the oral histories of the First Men are accurate, but there are maesters at the Citadel who insist it has only been half that long). We’re very early in the process, of course, with the pilot order just in, so we don’t have a director yet, or a cast, or a location, or even a title. (My vote would be THE LONG NIGHT, which says it all, but I’d be surprised if that’s where we end up. More likely HBO will want to work the phrase “game of thrones” in there somewhere. We’ll know sooner or later)

dunno, but this sounds badass to me

"Thousands of years ago, there came a night that lasted a generation," Old Nan explained to Bran back in GoT's first season. "Kings froze to death in their castles, same as the shepherds in their huts. And women smothered their babies rather than see them starve, and wept, and felt the tears freeze on their cheeks... In that darkness, the White Walkers came for the first time. They swept through cities and kingdoms, riding their dead horses, hunting with their packs of pale spiders, big as hounds."

Jane Goldman as showrunner is...not promising

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNwwt25mheo

i guess the dragons are still rendering

matt smith? being scary? i always find that so unnerving because he seems like the kind of non-threatening doofus who furiously resents being a non-threatening doofus and then blows up a town.

I mean, without real time source material to contend with, this might be solid.

The source material was basically what made GoT good, though.

this does have source material—it’s based off the biggest section martin’s fire and blood, which is a history of the targaryen family, plus a few short stories that go into more detail, like “the princess and the queen”

Oh right, it might be good then.

My point was more about the “real time” descriptor, meaning they won’t be outpacing them source material during the run and have to scramble to tie shit together. Okay

lol stupid phone added the stray “Okay”

Yes, if based on completed GRRM material it probably will be decent (though of course I've personally yet to see evidence that he can conclude an epic fantasy story in a satisfying manner).

the story they're planning to tell here def has an ending, and a bit of a scouring of the shire-style epilogue which i doubt they'll include

Really enjoyed the first episode of House of the Dragon. Definitely up for lots more political machinations in this world. The young girl Targaryen was very good and Matt Smith looks like he's having (and will be) lots of fun.

Pretty wild - if not surprising - that the original show has finished and we now have the spin off and still no new book has been published.

forgot about this thread. there was a little discussion about it on the "but is it on netflix" thread. fully expect this spinoff series to end before the next book arrives

i'm debating about whether i should go back and read fire & blood again or just let the series surprise me. idk if i can resist lol

Rhaenyra looks eerily like John Mulaney imo? Am I crazy?

Thought the first episode was entertaining enough. I hope they find ways to broaden the sense of the world beyond just the inner turmoil of the Targaryens. My favorite thing about the GOT books and HBO series was the way the world kept getting bigger throughout them. So I hope we get scenes in the free cities and so forth.

xp i will never unsee that lol

I sort of got Elrond of Rivendell vibes from Rhaenyra.

Just watched E2 and am enjoying very much. Most of my friends are still riding high on the whole “game of thrones sucks now” vibes from the end of the series - so feel like I’m going this alone

i found the first ep reprehensibly gratuitous in its sex, violence and exposition. like if an AI was fed all the episodes and told to make a spin off.

Ha! Much less of it in e2. But the weird sad orgy in e1 did feel very unnecessary. Like they thought people would complain if there wasn’t an ott brothel scene.
The violence was just right tho, imho

Yeah I was a bit put off by the half assed tavern orgy scene and the various gory bludgeonings, like OK we get it, you're reminding us what this show was all about before it went all Iceman Cometh.

what i ultimately liked about GoT at its best was how lore was told through plot, how battles became epic iliad-esque dips into hell, where the quiet moments presented opportunities for exploring character development and not chances to be even freakier, how the shifts in locale and different storylines gave natural narrative gear shifting. The sadism and tits were to be endured more than celebrated. Now its like everybody's joffrey. WTF would i wanna watch that for.
but of course i'll probably watch the 2nd ep. I'm a tv masochist.

there's no gore or sex in episode two so don't worry

there is the possibility of an incendiary incident – but let's not spoil things.

I'm not squeamish! It's just kinda boring and predictable.
I'll watch ep 2 before I complain too much more but the telegraphing of the story direction (and eventual red herrings) are coming fast and furious in episode 1. Gosh, i wonder if those cuts the king is getting on the iron throne might be a more serious problem than they appear?

i feel like that's not supposed to be a surprise? they've made it pretty obvious, as they literally talked about the gash on his back that isn't healing.

this first season is gonna be unlike anything else that has ever aired on tv. from what i can tell, this season is gonna cover roughly 30 years of westerosi history, and they can't really compress the timeline because there are characters who factor heavily into the coming conflict who haven't even been born yet lol

xp, of course; i'm just using that as an example. The birthing murder scene was also obvious from 80 feet away. Every character's presumed arc is being played to the rafters right now to the point where bad guys are twirling mustaches "but they aren't really BAD so much as they are machiavellian do you see"
Wake me when there's an interesting conversation.

xp

yes, I was browsing The World of Ice & Fire last night while I was watching this and counted 12 Targaryen kings between this one and Robert, so this series has quite a lot of ground to cover.

Is that their intention? How many season is this supposed to be?

they're planning to cover a period of history called "the dance of the dragons." i won't elaborate or spoil, but the period they're looking to cover is about three decades, not the 20 or so decades until robert's rebellion.

yeah I assume there will be yet another proposed series after this one that fills in some of the gaps. I had thought we'd see the mad king in this series but we are way way way early for that.

yah, no mad king in this series

that's kind of disappointing

The confrontation at Dragonstone was good in this episode. Disappointed they're using p much the same theme music and titles concept from GoT though.

I'll give it time but its just feeling like more of the same so far. And I am really not liking Matt Smith. He's no Joffrey.

he's more jaime than joffrey, i think

I suppose so yeah. I just dont feel any genuine menace or malice from him, he just seems petulant.

TBH hes more like Viserys!

(er... GOT Vierys obv, not current one)

it doesn't help that everyone on both shows has the same name

Was also very disappointed with the theme xps

You'd think it wouldn't be too difficult to come up with something new that maybe used some of the familiar motifs of the original music a la the new Star Trek shows

ramin dijwadi def could've come up with something new and good. it seems to be a decision from the higher-ups, which makes it worse.

i kind of like that the song and titles are basically the same, that allows me to just think of this as another season of the same show.

Seems more like incidental music than a theme

I'm certain the opening credits to ep 1 played a different song, that only had references back to the GoT theme, but then ep 2, it was jus tthe old theme?

there wasn’t a credits sequence in episode one, i don’t think

True but it did have an opening sequence with a thematic tune that wasnt the same. I assumed that would be the theme and as it turns out, no.

how it's going:
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/house-of-the-dragon-miguel-sapochnik-leaving-1235208276

u guys are crazy the actor playing Daemon is by far the best thing in this show so far. stony and surprisingly complex (the portrayal, not the role)

yes Matt Smith is good. dunno why anyone is complaining about him.

I didn't quite get why he freaked the fuck out at that letter and the messenger; did he not want help?

All the endless pouting from both king and princess in ep3 was a bit of a drag. This show badly needs some additional plots to follow.

xp

This campaign was meant to show that Daemon was stronger than the king and could lead his own war effort. The king stepping in to save him means he's failed.

He wasn't going to let the king claim this victory after doing jack shit for months

Im not getting a sparky feel from any character so far. If anything the only person I was *intrigued* by at least was the crab King and well, he's in 2 pieces now so whatever .

I will say that last act was quite engaging - loved the scoring, and the lack of dialogue/suspense.

But wheres the sassy heroes and villains? Wheres a littlefingr or tyrion?

Some time in the middle of the episode I got a fit of the giggles because it was so dull, and so many similar-sounding names were coming out of people's mouths, it was like a parody of a terrible fantasy. And for some reason everything is just dirt coloured. The episode definitely picked up towards the end, but I think I don't care enough to keep watching it.

At least from the first couple episodes, just like with the last couple seasons after the main plot got outside the books, you can tell they don't have the depth of material. I'd figure keeping the cast down might be a cost control thing too.

This so far looks like if you just made Game of Thrones about the goofs hanging around the main castle.

This show is dumb as hell. Richly appointed (though some of the cgi is terribly uncanny valley), generally well presented (though the whole Matt Smith fight sequence was nearly incoherent), ably-acted (though everyone seem utterly trapped in character rather than performing), poorly written (if i hear "mine daughter" one more time) and basically dumb as hell. My guess is that after ten hours and hundreds of millions of dollars, they'll likely start making something interesting next year. I expect it will be the Final Fantasy of prestige TV and get interesting after the fifteenth hour. Even then, I'll never be able to unsee Princess John Mulaney.

"mine X" sets my teeth on edge for reasons I'm sure I needn't relitigate around these parts.

Whoops

Not the green screen glove on Viserys’s missing fingers 🤣🤦🏻‍♀️#hotd pic.twitter.com/4CLUw5tDhI

— Sarah Capps (@SarahBKnowsBest) September 5, 2022

as i suspected the compressed timeline is messing with the drama. i did enjoy daemon's bemused, then furious reaction to the king's letter tho

oh i also thought it was funny that the guy who played the lannisters did his own version of dinklage's terrible accent

I'm saving this show up for a binge, but I have to say I'm quite amused by complaints on the socials that having black people and pugs is not "realistic."

So far I’ve read 1,000 hot takes about the people complaining about black people in this show and zero actual people complaining about it.

was one of the Lannister bros in EP 3 *not* ser hugh of the vale who was killed by the splintered Lance to the neck whilst jousting in season 1 of got?

no they were both played by the same actor, who also played ser hugh briefly in season 1

Is this going to end up being like Law and Order where they just recycle the same actors thru various minor roles over the years.

GoT did a lot of that, the actor playing one of the Lannister lads who Lord Karstark slew for revenge came back to play Tommen Baratheon a season or two later

there are only so many beardos in the acting world

i definitely didn't realize that he was in the original series, it's been a long ass time since i've sat down to watch season 1

finally, the extended john mulaney armor fetish softcore we've all been hoping for

Didn’t try to verify it yet but (we just got a ridiculous large new hd tv) and I swear I saw a visible zipper on that grubby striped pillow Daemon was lounging on. Oops?

damn, that last episode was great. this is turning into a good show, reminds me of what i liked about the first couple seasons of game of thrones

did not expect episode to end on a day after pill cliffhanger

i watched the first episode of rings of power last night -- to me, at least, the difference between the shows (that one and this) was noticeable. as in, rings of power was noticeably worse, more cheesy, worse dialogue, worse acting, lots of cgi, etc. there is a lot of complicated shit going on in hotd right now, i'm enjoying it

full agreement. the dialogue in Rings is fucking terrible and cringeworthy. Still watching it but jesus christ.

Meanwhile this had a full on incest sex orgy and an abortion. I know which show I'm looking forward to each week!

Also I really like Alicent, I'm be sad when they move forward in a few episodes and recast her with an older actress.

Man, I was really not into this week House of the Dragon. There is just no real reason imo for the sex scenes to take so much damn screentime. not a prude just easily bored. Thought Daemon's entry with his dumb fucking crown was pretty cringe. Hated the street carnival puppets and plays stuff. The ep ended strong, w/ the bit were Viserys put Hightower in his place, Alicent being cool, and abortion also fine.

nothing more coherent rn. better than Rings Of Power this week which was also pretty rough going.

you guys are not making me wanna watch lord of the dragons

The ending… it took me a second to realize!
I am definitely enjoying the more political aspect of HotD - Hightower being a good example.

yeah. i am very into the court intrigue, which was also my favorite part of GoT. i didn't much like the actor who plays king viserys, at first, but i've grown to like him. he has a softness of heart to him that is very different than ned stark. and clearly viserys is doomed. you have to love that.

Those Hightowers piss me off, trying to cancel the Targaryen's fiery alt sexuality.

The master of kink shaming

That"s Paddy Considine xps

He's been in lots of good things but especially excellent in Dead Man's Shoes

I have zero expectations for this and as a result quite like it? I started watching cos I love Paddy Considine but weirdly Daemon and Rhaenyra bring me back. I didn’t know about them casting black actors but it makes sense in this medium cos otherwise they’re pretty identical looking to the Targaryens and yeah, unrealistic is a joke as always. It’s nice to see something of House Hightower, who are this very grand house that you keep seeing getting mentioned in the books.

Also I like very much the whole “we used to be friends” vibe with Alicent and Rhaenyra. Obvs that’s canon but it’s good!

Also also - the sex scenes in episode 4 are so different from GoT. The characters are obviously different and Rhaenyra has a lot more power than most of the female characters ever did, but the focus on Alicent’s blank face as Viserys’s scabby old body is pumping her is contrasted so well to Rhaenyra and Cole and the playful way she starts taking off his armour. It never feels leering or gross the way GoT often did.

ok ep 5 is a banger, best one yet

Yeah pretty decent

gyac otm about seeing more of the Hightowers, they always seemed part of the lore in the books/previous series rather than active participants in the story

Ya. Fuck the haters, That episode was great!

I hope every episode has a wedding.

the rat creeping up to the blood at the end was 👌🏻

it isn't a westeros wedding without at least one gruesome death.

I also liked ep 4, and agree with gyac that the sex scenes felt different and less gross compared to GoT's. also sets up the events of ep 5 nicely - the pact between Rhaenyra and Laenor, Criston's jealousy and betrayal, Alicent's discontent, it all stems from that one night on the town

i think i've complained enough about this already but the long and the short of it is that it's missing the patience, the resolve, the nuance, the intelligence (brutal though it was) that GoT had and has replaced that with algorithm and pageantry. that stuff works to the degree that it makes this watchable but it's not something to get excited about.

GoT didn’t have any of that a lot of the time. It was shit like Littlefinger intoning “chaos is a ladder”, horrific rape scenes, terrible writing and btw did we mention we clearly despise female characters?

This also is a smaller more contained story than GoT - everyone is in the same location, you have access to a limited number of characters. It’s basically a bottle episode.

I was a bit confused t'wards the end.

Why did Criston wail on Laenor's loverboy? He had just told him they could protect each others secret. Is it all just because he cant talk Rhaenyra into doing a Wallis Simpson with him?

I was not ready for the pulpface.

Gah someone needs to fix that linebreak bug in the hide code.

i don’t really understand the algorithm comment. it’s based on a different book by george rr martin, and has been pretty faithful to it so far.

perhaps martin is an algorithm friendly storyteller?

trayce, i think that sir cristin was just really going through it, questioning his honor and own sense of character and lashed out in a very “i am not like you!!!” kind of moment

Was it not him flipping the lid at the idea he’d ruined his honour to be nothing more than a paramour and also being invented at the idea of being subject to wink wink nudge nudge insinuations from the court after his (completely unrealistic btw) proposal was rejected?

Incensed not invented

yeah, he's an honor-above-all kind of guy and the insinuation that it's common knowledge that he's not keeping his oath drove him into a fury.

xps to gyac, i agree with basically all of that, i come not to praise caesar but to bury him.
more accurately should have said "that GoT had at its best"

to vc: the adaptation is leaning heavily on what HBO thinks will work and this show's wonky speed of execution, shallowness of character, often incomprehensible filmic style and general lack of complexity, while partially GRRM's fault, are more readily blamed on "give the people what they want" instead of trying to offer more assured and patient storytelling.

forks fwiw i thought the first episode veered closely, at times, to what you're describing, but i've been really impressed by where it's gone since. have you watched the last couple episodes?

my favorite GoT season was 1, my second favorite was 2, third favorite was 3, etc. every time a new season came out, i would go back and do a grand rewatch, starting at S1E1, and every single time i thought "they nailed this show right at the beginning"

the last few episodes of hotd remind me a lot of that warm fuzzy season 1 feeling. the last episode, in particular, was absolutely gripping, and it was mostly a series of long, intense dialogue between pairs of characters.

i've watched every episode and just haven't been into it. i found the dialogue in this episode tedious. i'll quit complaining now, don't think it's for me. will pipe up if it shifts from background watch to something i'm actually enjoying but i really think that's gonna be second season when they can calm the fuck down.

yeah idk how they could've adopted a patient approach to this story, given the scale of the narrative they've chosen to adapt. chapter 1 of the story takes 30 years, while the next 4-5 chapters will cover a period of 3.

i don't know the material well enough to speak to that, i just know that we're being asked to give a shit about political machinations, personalities, relationships and frailties that I don't have any engagement with but they're supposed to carry weight. the king in waiting's consort was just bludgeoned to death and i don't care about him or the king in waiting or the queen or the current king who has been withering away at mach speed over his train set since we started the dang thing. it's not taking the time i need to connect with anyone before we have to rush forward to the next plot point imo.

it's not taking the time i need to connect with anyone before we have to rush forward to the next plot point imo.

yeah, i think that's a very valid criticism. ser criston's character, for one, goes through _a lot_ of stuff in episodes 4 and 5, leading to narrative payoffs that arrive before the viewer has gotten a full sense of the character.

xp the show is five episodes old

xps to gyac, i agree with basically all of that, i come not to praise caesar but to bury him.
more accurately should have said "that GoT had at its best"

xp the show is five episodes old

Its best was almost all from the source material, the drop in quality was huge and the show has zero rewatch value for me as a result.

apparently we get whole new actors for Rhaenyra and Alicent in the next episode

Timeskip Alicent is played by Olivia Cooke, who I’ve liked in the recent remake of Vanity Fair. It’s some great casting.

https://wwd.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/olivia-cooke-as-alicent-hightower.jpg?w=640

I'm going to miss Milly Alcock, tbh. I wasn't sold on her at first, but she's really helped sell the role for me.

there was a scene posted as a preview on the hot d official twitter that featured the adult actors for laenor and rhaenyra and they both seemed pretty good, with the laenor actor seeming like a seismic improvement lol

finally, the extended john mulaney armor fetish softcore we've all been hoping for

"It was about the struggle in every way: the struggle to get the armour off, the struggle of him to betray his vows... That's how I wanted to pitch it," he said. For Frankel it was all about the integrity of the scene, and he was dedicated to making every aspect as realistic as possible, even if it took months of forethought to accomplish.

"For even a world-quality squire, you've got 10 minutes to get the armor off. Let's say five, maybe at best. There's no way Rhaneyra and Cole are gonna take that armour off in 10 seconds. So I was like, 'Well, you have to have that in,'" he said. "These are all the things I really cared about, 'cause they take away this sort of, to my mind, archaic sexual sex scenes that have existed for so long in television and film, and make it feel real."

"a world-quality squire"!

it would have been more realistic if they were both complaining about the awful smell of his sweaty high fantasy body as the pieces of armor came off one by one

(Alicent walks to the window and throws it open in desperation. Criston proceeds to remove the cod piece)

Ok, this show rocks.

Fantastic "one-take" opening act this week and *so* much politicking

Also lol at "Well he's a twat"

yeah this week's episode was excellent. they handled the time jump pretty gracefully imo, and the characters are coming into sharper definition each week.

kinda darkly funny to see daemon become a widower anew in consecutive episodes

lol no, this episode was terrible - dumb characters, barely-there motivation, actors without charisma. what a step backward.

It wasn’t great but I love Olivia Cooke cos I always love Olivia Cooke.

They really need to dial it back with the nighttime filter on everything

Ok, this is getting fucking crazy

Strong shades of Joffrey's humiliation by Arya in GoT s1.

i've been kinda bummed this season/show, like plenty of soap opera and palace intrigue or whatever but not enough big momentous battles, but have to say things have ramped up quite nicely.

were there any momentous battles in season 1 of Game of Thrones?

I don't remember. But maybe with the expanse of things it felt more clearly heading there? Anyway getting that feeling now at least.

I was a little confused to see Otto Hightower back as the Hand, but I guess he was reinstated since last ep?

Larys Strong engineered the death of his brother and father, making room for Otto to be invited back

I'm pretty sure the action in season 1 of GoT was roughly the same or less, it was mostly putting the pieces in place for the war that erupts in season 2, the truly big battle coming at the end of that season.

xp - I get the why and how of the machination, just wasn't sure it was a given he'd be back

xp yeah the majority of the first book and series is build up

xp

I liked how impressed he was by the goings on, but I was disappointed that the writers didn't have the guts to make a character intone ponderously "so now the dance of the dragons commences..."

I am anti-big battle scenes. The last few seasons of GoT had a lot of them. It didn’t fix what was going wrong with the show. I like episodes that are entirely filled with people talking. Or in the case of that last episode, everyone at the wake/funeral suspiciously watching each other

a couple things from this episode that didn't quite sit right with me:

1. Aemond seemed rather lively about 10 minutes after having his face utterly sliced to pieces. You'd think he'd need to chill out for a bit after losing an eye and getting massive disgusting stitches. That must be painful!

2. The fact that he brazenly stole a whole-ass dragon was rather quickly forgotten amidst the outrage over him (accurately) calling the little brown head boys bastards.

was the picture too dark for anyone? i watched on my ipad and it was 100% fine, but i'm seeing lots of complaints about it from so-called tv critics that are about to turn me into the joker!

it was extremely dark for me starting near the end of the funeral and then through the dragon exploits

xp to moodles for number 2, you can't really "steal" a dragon. in the books at least, each dragon can only be ridden by one person at a time. once the dragon's rider dies, the dragon can be claimed by anyone with targaryen blood. after aemond successfully mounted and rode vhagar, the dragon is bound to him now and won't accept any other rider. laena's girls use the word "stole" because their mom rode vhagar their whole lives, and the younger daughter hasn't claimed a dragon yet. laena would likely have wanted the dragon to pass to her daughter, but it doesn't really work that way

I mean, I get this, but on the other hand he did steal it for all intents and purposes, but thanks for explaining anyway

right, i mean laena's daughters have a reason to be pissed, the king is a dragonlord who claimed his own dragon in a similar way years ago. he's also very established as an expert on turning a blind eye to things.

Oh, too soon

the one good thing abt the persistent gloom filter is i had an eye procedure today & my eye was dilated way to fuck & bc of light sensitivity this show was about the only thing i could comfortably watch lol

rename this show House of Furtive Glances w Occasional Dragons, god that funeral reception was interminable

oh and re prev episode: i’ll take a hard no on the squelching-noise foley work for any more birth scenes, god that opening birthing scene was ott it sounded like she was taking a shit!

It must be true

Give It Up For The King Of Fantasy: George R.R. Martin Just Announced That Instead Of Finishing The Game Of Thrones Books He’s Just Gonna Stay Rich AF And Let These Broke Boys Worry About Dragons https://t.co/aZKr3Iv1af

— ClickHole (@ClickHole) October 3, 2022

Why does everyone have to have the same names in this and GoT, fuck its as bad as Elden Ring with its Godfreys and Godefreys and Marikas and Miqellas and Marigolds and Marriots.

(and yes I'm aware thats also GRRMs doing!!!)

agree its the most annoying part

Even the fact all the same Houses existed hundreds of years prior is a bit of a side eye for me but ok, I get they get passed down and tradition etc but really? Theres no change in fashion, we're just calling everyone Joffrey and Aemon?

I feel like there's some nods to it being a different era — that carriage they ride in doesn't look like anything designwise in GOT — but definitely true it overall feels kind of generic.

ugh i fkn hate that carriage it looks like something out of harry potter it is so shit

just wait til daemon and rhaenyra have kids and name them…aegon and viserys

oh and that incesto-wedding was the creepiest shit ever lol

the repeated names are annoying but if anything grrm actually spiced up the variation in names a bit from the real middle ages. i remember wolf hall where every character was named either thomas or jane

yeah thats v true please god no more anns

Despite all the endless sound alikes, the ones that irk me the most are Luke and Jace. Like wtf, why in the world would Rhaenyra pop out a couple of brats with ugly generic 2000s names?

yeah jace was v triggering, total bogan kid name

The new heir to the throne has been born! And their name....is Madison!!

*light clapping*

um it's spelled maedysyn

Ok I’m not even finished this episode but the lighting was a total joke. Literally couldn’t even see if there was incest happening.

It was like the night in the daytime crappy filters on old 70s films. Why didnt they just film at night? It *was* nighttime right? I mean it started off qute bright. And there were stars later.

https://www.vulture.com/article/why-house-of-the-dragon-episode-7-driftmark-was-so-dark.html

https://i.imgur.com/uYRVqak.png

I have to say I was able to see everything. Maybe it’s my decently setup plasma screen but I never felt like it was impossibly dark. RIP plasma screens.

We have frequent problems with way-too-dark shows esp when set indoors at night/in night scenes outside, and AppleTV seemed to be the worst offenders (looking at you, "Invasion"). BUt yeah this wasnt DARK, it was just filtered really strangely so it looked like "daytime but someone put the wrong film stock in".

Barry Lydon it aint.

again, this show is dumb as hell

Consider not watching and posting about it then?

I seriously enjoy Olivia Cooke in this.

The dark scenes thing is a...dark scheme by Big Content to make us all feel inadequate and feel like we have to spend thousands on a set.

The Maester during the incest-wedding was Phil Daniels right? Been waiting for him to turn up. And only just realised young Aegeon is David Tennant's son.

He was great casting, saw a comment about how he looked exactly like Olivia Cooke in a scraggy blonde wig which was otm. Too bad they get recast next week!

Olivia Cooke looks insanely like Rachel Weisz+Jenna-Louise Coleman

And only just realised young Aegeon is David Tennant's son.

― nashwan, Wednesday, October 5, 2022 5:02 AM (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink

whaaaaat

did not know that!

Consider not watching and posting about it then?

Game of Thrones in dire need of a sitcom spinoff

House of wisecracking funny dragons

_Consider not watching and posting about it then?_

where's the fun in that?

_Consider not watching and posting about it then?_

where's the fun in that?

i mean, they actually darkened the screen and made it difficult to watch the show out of a mix of hubris and gross negligence, then played the "no we MEANT for it to look like that even though it's clear the shots are taking place during the day" then the general discourse slid toward "boo hoo you people are sad you didn't get to watch INCEST on the INCEST DRAGON SHOW" so honestly "this sucks" seems about right where the bar should be for criticism

russellcrowegladiator.gif

actually the incest was perfectly well lit with just a tasteful smudge of vaseline on the camera lens

xxp you’ve been stinking up this thread with your posts for a while, but dw, I won’t be reading any more of them

i mean, that's cool? i never understand threads where when somebody has legit complaints about the thread title along the lines of "i've already explained why i think this sucks but for many small and uninteresting reasons i'm continuing to interact with thread topic, so i'm going to occasionally note my general disdain" devolves into ad hominem but i don't exactly mind? I have only myself to blame for watching the incest dragon show.

if i had to point out the biggest problem i had with this show, it's the obviously immense amount of money and talent being thrown at something that is so consistently ill considered. The last show that threw away so much baby with the bathwater was Raised by Wolves... which, to be fair, was actually worse than this. And I watched the whole season of that and complained the whole way through there too. But people have attachment to GoT and GRRM in a more bone marrow way because of the sunk cost of the novels so i get it if you're touchier about them.

i'm one of those fools who have never read any of the novels. and never will, either. i plan on taking the events of the tv shows as canon and if i ever meet someone who has read the books, claiming that the tv version is the real one, not the books. i believe sounds and moving images before the stillness of the printed text -- i don't touch that stuff.

a friend of mine has read all of the books many times and is always angry with the show but can't stop watching. he also can't stop telling me about what is going to happen, or rather, what should happen. i have learned to stare blankly and let all the future and past Aegons and Joffreys and Maedysyns, and how they all slept with each other, probably, come and go with absolutely zero attempt to remember any of it

girl same

with the key difference being that i enjoy the show, lol

I never made it past the first book. My eldest, who had the patience to finish the entire Wheel of Time series, eventually gave this series up in frustration, proclaiming the entire thing a hot mess that would never resolve. Which, if she's right, kind of gives the showrunners a free hand.

i grew up reading GRRM's various other work (notably wildcards, where my user name comes from!) but i only read the first two fire and ice books on the subway when the show first came out. They were fine! They were better than what everyone else was reading in the subway at that time, which was shades of gray.

this series is based off a completed story by grrm, albeit one told in history textbook fashion

In my (admittedly limited) experience, the best thing GRRM wrote was "Sandkings."

if things get a little out of hand, you just have a monster from beyond the wall invade. everyone fights, nearly everyone dies, only one remains to reign.

speaking of game of thrones, i'm hoping that at some point in HotD they show these guys building a wall in the north, and all the villagers make fun of them because there's no way they could build a wall so wide that it span the entire peninsula. but then these guys say "not only will it span the peninsula, but it's gonna be thousands of feet tall as well. so tall that absolutely no one will ever be able to breach it, not even a epochal monster from beyond...this pile of bricks, that one day may well make a name for itself."

xp to jimbeaux

(all the above to say, if i seem brusquely dismissive of massively successful HBO spin-off television program HOUSE OF DRAGONS, i think i have earned it)

i'd like to see an entire spin-off that's all about the wall, every episode, including issues with the contractor wanting to modify the scope of work

pic.twitter.com/GSfx6khmkU

— Out Of Context Football (@nocontextfooty) October 6, 2022

xxps The Wall is already there in the current show though, iirc characters have made direct references to being sent there as punishment already (Harwin Strong perhaps?)

I'm a little curious who has read the book the current show is based on… I only read it once right after it came out and my wife got it as an Xmas gift. It moves very differently than ASOIAF, particularly in the "major battles" segment. My memory is of much more palace intrigue, doublecrossing, etc than epicness, but perhaps my memory is flawed.

xxps The Wall is already there in the current show though, iirc characters have made direct references to being sent there as punishment already (Harwin Strong perhaps?)

Awwwww maaaan

xp there was some epic dragon stuff and big bloody battles. some exciting set pieces to come, and some moments of extreme discomfort and (emotional and physical) brutality!

Matt Smith as Daemon when in the full armor pretty much looks like Elric from the comics, especially with the dragon on the helm.

good lord, this show just keeps delivering the brutality

yeah, the decapitation scene was some more body horror. there is a lot of it. it is just as it was in real life, in the time of the game of thrones - life was brutal and so we must see every entrail

btw that was a fucking episode. old man dying viserys was incredible. my first thoughts on his character and how he was playing it were so negative. if/when i do a S1 rewatch i'm looking forward to watching the first episodes with an eye on how it will play out. great character

paddy considine rules

loved this ep

dinner party scene was really excellent too, i was genuinely moved by it

I’m impressed the silent sisters were able to keep the top of his skull from falling over and rolling off the table.
I guess this maybe isn’t their first rodeo in that regard.

Anyways - aside from massive difficulties keeping track of these fucking dragon people names, I very much enjoyed the episode. Shits gonna get real soon!!

I cant get over how Daemon just cut that guy's head off and they kind of all went "oh well, lets go have supper!" Seemed a bit weird.

he was gonna get executed anyway for his treason so they were like “welp, i guess now we don’t have to pay a headsman”

that particular scene had me cackling and screaming more than any moment so far. Daemon daring him to say it, which led to chants of "say it say it say it" over here, and then Vaemond just utterly shouting the b word and whoosh, head departs body, chef's kiss. Quality TV making, I tell you what.

The b-word is not allowed in the throne room, official policy

he did yell it quite loud

Viserys is extremely hard of hearing at this point though

honestly loved him reaching for his dagger like what was left of him was about to go stab a guy

xp hard of seeing too

man the names things, so confusing. I paused this episode 10 times to try to sort out which kid was which when they were talking about them.

alicent's kids:
aegon - short, blonde, both eyes
aemond - tall, blonde, one eye
helaena - blonde, likes bugs, only girl

she has a fourth kid in the books, prob cut from the show tho

rhaenyra's kids "with laenor":
jacaerys (jace) - tall, black curly hair
lucerys (luke) - younger, black curly hair
joffrey - even younger, black curly hair

rhaenyra's kids with daemon:
aegon (yes another one) - child, blonde hair
viserys (yes another one) - toddler, blonde hair

this episode was excellent; this show is actually getting better with each episode.

and helaena is married to brother aegon right?

now do daemon's kids.

yes helaena is married to aegon

daemon's kids are harder for me to tell apart, since they've had less screen time and not much in the way of personality distinction.

daemon's kids w/ laena
baela - ward at driftmark with her grandmother rhaenys, shorter hair
rhaena - chilling at dragonstone with rhaenyra and daemon, longer hair

lol sorry to add to confusion. baela's hair may be shorter than rhaena's, but it's still long. rhaena has the cool hairstyle with her long hair elaborately done up, while baela's hairstyles have been simpler

i was having a serious hard time figuring out who was who in the driftmark line of succession

same! also “driftmark” is such a nothing name that i can’t always picture right away who all that is, it’s so undramatic like Kirkland Signature

that's prob why they keep saying "lord of the tides," which is an objectively cooler name

waiting for nick nolte to show up “all hail prince of tides”

Plus drift mark is the island and high tide is the castle right?

that particular scene had me cackling and screaming more than any moment so far. Daemon daring him to say it, which led to chants of "say it say it say it" over here, and then Vaemond just utterly shouting the b word and whoosh, head departs body, chef's kiss. Quality TV making, I tell you what.

his depiction of being a very sick man struggling through pain was so good. it was painful to watch, in a good way

i was fairly confused by 'sea snake' because I thought the sea snake was that dude Matt Smith cut to pieces in the cave. But I guess it's Corlys. Also did Corlys actually die? wouldn't it be funny if he just showed up next week?

and helaena is married to brother aegon right?

Wait what? I get this mob interbreeds like crazy but actual brother and sister are married?

Also what was actually wrong with the King anyway bcs I was thinking someone was poisoning him. It looked like leprosy or syphyllis or something.

xp this was mentioned in the last episode during a conversation between the two brothers?

Xp he was poisoned by the throne, literally

Excuse me I know I am late to the game and I am watching episode 3

the Kingswood bit literally reenacts the "Rodents of Unusual Size" segment from Princess Bride

I am legit astonished

now we just need a six-fingered ser

anyway, carry on

this vulture discussion about how the time jump plotting leads to necessary viewing disconnection hits on lots of reasons why I find this show difficult to care about as anything more than a really well filmed wikipedia page
https://www.vulture.com/article/house-of-the-dragon-time-jumps.html

The new episode was kind of weak

i agree that it was a step down, but still enjoyed it greatly.

the foot fetish thing was a bit cheap, but i guess it's relatively tame compared to the proclivities of many in this universe

I thought the building tension throughout the first 50 minutes was great, the climax was absolute shit though.

it just felt like it was very randomly thrown in there. same with the search for Aegon, the whole point seemed to be that they wanted to come up with something really demented that he was doing.

xp

the climax was very frustrating. I don't know how much can really be gleaned from next week's preview, but if the idea is that she's flying back to dragonstone to warn everyone that it is war time, then why the hell did she not just roast the coronation party first?

i guess it's not technically a "hot war" yet and she was prob moved by alicent protecting her kid. she didn't have a problem murdering dozens of innocent bystanders tho lol, im sure there were mothers in that crowd

yeah, that was a weirdass ending. she murdered about a hundred randos, had a chance to end the entire show and prevent the next several seasons from needing to happen, and then flew off

https://www.vulture.com/article/house-of-dragon-eve-best-interview-escape-green-council.html

Okay, so: Why didn’t Rhaenys just torch the royal family and the whole Green crew?

[Laughs long and hard.] I know! The temptation is there, right? In the end, she makes a bigger choice. We see that at the moment with what’s going on in Ukraine; to choose not to destroy is the better choice. That’s an important thing for us all to remember right now.

it's true that i had not considered the ukraine angle

what else would be responsible for rising gas prices in the riverlands?

I enjoyed the episode. The foot thing was def a “wtf - why couldn’t this just be incest” moment. I liked the ending - tho they were obviously milking the moment a little much.
I was wondering - do they store their battle armour in a locker by their dragons?!

Saw half a dozen "Larys CK" joeks today and loled more than once

the argument of "i don't care about any of these characters" gets hand waved away as fatuous but the more damning problem here is that I don't care about this especially violent fairy tale or the grandiose stakes or this shows propensity for perversion and vivisection in lieu of thoughtful character development. as garbage watching goes, it's compelling for cheap thrills, melodrama and the best production values money can buy. but if literally everyone in the whole show were to die in the next episode, so what? they'll all be replaced by a full english breakfast of new niece-fucking actors or older BAFTA-winning actresses, likely all named aegyon and vanyra.
Creator press pap like "to choose not to destroy is the better choice. That’s an important thing for us all to remember right now" would be laughable if it weren't blatantly offensive as an attempt to rhyme a real human rights violation with a pantomime where the "good guy" murders thousands of innocent bystanders with a fucking dinosaur. peak teevee used to be a bit more peak as i recall.

- ignatius j. reilly

oh for the days when a man could safely talk shit about the incest dragon show without being accused of middlebrow snobbery

last episode leaked btw

i can wait!

I enjoyed the episode. The foot thing was def a “wtf - why couldn’t this just be incest” moment. I liked the ending - tho they were obviously milking the moment a little much.
I was wondering - do they store their battle armour in a locker by their dragons?!

i'll refrain from spoiling but it's quite a bit more of the same.

sounds good

now excuse me while i spend what little time I have on this earth harrumphing and “coxcomb!”-ing through a show i dislike

Mr Belvedere?

harrumph

streaks on the china never mattered before
who cares?

Jace and Luke bringing strong Ari and Uzi vibes in this new one

https://media.guestofaguest.com/t_article_content/gofg-media/2017/10/1/49766/lxyphjgl.jpg

one thing I don't totally buy...I feel like Alicent knows her kids totally suck. I feel like she'd be like "yeah sure, no, you be queen, my kids are terrible."

i'm still betting on a peace deal in this show, probably in season 2, episode 2, "let bygones be bygones"

After being pretty lukewarm on this all season, I thought the finale paid off well. Did in fact make me want to see the next season. Especially the prospect of dragon warfare.

On Alicent's kids my question is just, why are they such terrible kids? Their parents weren't psychopaths or anything, it's just kind of stipulated that they both turned out as assholes.

A big part of it is that they are the long awaited male heirs of Viserys, but then they have to always defer to Rhaenyra and her bastard children. On top of that, Aegon just seems to have been born fairly worthless, and Aemond has a chip on his shoulder for being bullied when he didn't have a dragon and for being parted from his eye once he stole a dragon for himself.

it's implied that aegon neglected his children with alicent and favored his grandchildren with rhaenyra. and alicent spent decades convincing them that rhaenyra would murder them if she ever became queen.

helaena seems like a sweet girl, tho

*viserys neglected his children with alicent, d'oh

also realizing that my post implies even greater incest than was already happening haha. need some coffee

did the show ever explain who Erryk and Arryk are? I haven't been able to figure out why we are supposed to see them as important in this thing.

one thing I don't totally buy...I feel like Alicent knows her kids totally suck. I feel like she'd be like "yeah sure, no, you be queen, my kids are terrible."

It's such a nice detail how Rhaenys never once bows to Rhaenyra. No one questions her on it, either, there's a silent understanding that giving her shit for it would be unfair and disrespectful. All conveyed subtly, no dialogue, just with Eve Best giving that little smirk of hers pic.twitter.com/NOta4SyMZ1

— Nix 🇺🇦 (@SnowyNix) October 22, 2022

*how much bigger

did the show ever explain who Erryk and Arryk are? I haven't been able to figure out why we are supposed to see them as important in this thing.

Helaena is cool btw, she’s clearly a prophetic dreamer like Viserys.

That ending shot was great, really enjoy Emma D’Arcy.

yes, but I'm under the impression that they are supposed to be very important characters and the reason for that is not particularly clear so far

xp

yes, but I'm under the impression that they are supposed to be _very important characters_ and the reason for that is not particularly clear so far

xp

erryk defected to rhaenyra, arryk stayed with aegon.

feel like they serve a thematic purpose to illustrate the silliness of the power struggle - the two sides of the conflict are so similar that literal identical twins wind up on opposite sides!

erryk was aegon's personal protector and grew so disgusted with the idea of him becoming king that he defected. arryk was all like "is rhaenyra that much better?" and "we swore an oath!"

feel like they serve a thematic purpose to illustrate the silliness of the power struggle - the two sides of the conflict are so similar that literal identical twins wind up on opposite sides!

that, and there's a chance they're going to sleep with each other

And now

A century before @GameofThrones, there was Ser Duncan the Tall and his squire, Egg.

Executive produced by George R. R. Martin, Ira Parker, Ryan Condal, and Vince Gerardis, A Knight of the #SevenKingdoms: The Hedge Knight has received a straight to series order. #StreamOnMax pic.twitter.com/MRPUke5Upt

— HBO Max (@hbomax) April 12, 2023

FINISH THE FUCKING BOOKS imho

not gonna happen

Oh dan m, such a sweet and simple naive faith you have

point: cool, maybe

counterpoint: this is approaching marvelesque levels of oversaturation

contrapunto: the bonfire of nerd rage is stoked for another decade, yaaay

I'm no sweet summer child, that's for sure xp

Oh ye of little faith.

He said just last week that he's 75% done with Winds of Winter so I'm sure it'll be just a few short years until we finally get to see it.

it's like elaborate performance art, makin us all ~~~really think~~~ about our need for definitive endings in fiction, and our desire to impose them on real lyfe as well, the decades-long build up of a narrative itch that will never be scratched by its happilyeverafter

They should adapt "Shovel Knight" next.

I predicted next year, 2024. for the new book awhile back, but I've given up hope on that front.

gap between #2 and #3 was 1 year
gap between #3 and #4 was 5 years
gap between #4 and #5 was 9 years

so I predicted 13 years for the next gap... putting us at 2011 + 13 = 2024

but if he's publicly stating 75% done, well, so not gonna happen

"75% done" does not mean that the remaining 25% will take the amount of time that is implied by the previous 75%.

I was 75% done writing a novel in 1993. You know what? It's still 75% done.

oh exactly, that’s why I’ve given up on 2024

honestly I don’t think we’ll ever see it. but as long as we don’t end up with Brandon Sanderson being dragged in to finish it…..

Funny that this is from a film released in 2017

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nwa6xgIZCv8

If we get to 2026, the gap between #5 and #6 will be more than the gap between #1 and #5 xps

But yeah, if it ever turns up great, if it doesn't, well I guess most people are past caring now

What are the other big series that are also stuck in limbo?

Gentleman Bastards and Kingkiller Chronicles spring to mind (last instalments on both of those also 2011) - any others?

Annnd here we go

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQ8H5gqGA34

So I spent the last few days re-watching the first season of House of the Dragon. I liked it a lot more the second time around and feel prepped for the new season.

S1 definitely got off to a slow start, and I think didn’t really find its footing until as late as episode 8 or 9. The entire first half of the season felt more like moving chess pieces around the board, with the exception of some great performances from Matt Smith and especially Milly Alcock.

Even on the second time around I felt some whiplash in the second half, with two time jumps and so many similar-looking and similar-named characters. Of all things, I think I’m still most thrown by the fact that young Aegon was played by a tall skinny boy with long blonde hair, but two eps later when they are older, its Aemond who is played by a tall skinny actor with long blonde hair. If they’d just swapped which actors were playing which brothers, I think it would have been less disorienting!

It’s been said upthread (albeit 2 years ago), but this season made the odd decision to keep the scale of the action very limited to the politics of the court, even as great battles were waged offscreen. They spent the first few episodes building up the Crabfeeder and the Triarchy, only for Daemon’s three-year effort to defeat them condensed over half an episode. Later, Corlys (aka the Sea Snake) goes off to fight a resurgent Triarchy, coming back mortally wounded and near death—and that 100% took place in a time jump between two episodes, so we never saw that battle nor is there much weight truly given to Corlys’s formidable navy nor his essential abandonment of his wife in the wake of their children’s deaths. Still elsewhere, Rhaenyra will have two small children in one episode and then nine month’s pregnant and giving birth in the next. All the fast forwarding and changing actors to show age created so much whiplash. Even on second viewing it was hard to keep up, though I did a better job of it this time.

There is a version of this show, which would have made it closer to the scale of GoT, if they had stretched the first season across two or even three seasons, and allowed some of the adventures in the background to come forward. On the other hand that only would have delayed the war between the two factions which has been set up for season 2. So I’ll reserve judgement on that choice. There is definitely a version of this show with a major, satisfying payoff ahead that would make all the table-setting of s1 feel worthwhile.

i probably should have done the same. i'm still confused on a couple details, but the recap i read worked well enough.
i won't risk spoiling any of the episode, but i did think the opening credits were much improved

I spent most of this episode trying to piece together who the different characters were and what they had been up to last time we saw them. Too many silver-haired weirdos.

plus literal twins.

And of course the children resemble their respective enemies

The rewatch definitely helped as I understood precisely who everyone was and what their motivations were. There are a lot of characters (like Larys for instance) who I would have totally forgotten.

That said, even on my rewatch over the weekend the twins did not register as serious characters so I still scratched my head for a minute as to who they were or why I should care. But ok, I’m on board with them now, sure.

so much went on in that first season of this that I thought this might be the 3rd one

The gf is out of town and watching any of our current shows would be a hostile act, maybe cramming in a rewatch before the next ep would be doable

I spent most of this episode trying to piece together who the different characters were and what they had been up to last time we saw them. Too many silver-haired weirdos.

― Muad'Doob (Moodles), Monday, June 17, 2024 12:24 AM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

plus literal twins.

― FRAUDULENT STEAKS (The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall), Monday, June 17, 2024 12:41 AM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

reminding my wife that Arryk's brother's name was Erryk felt like the final straw.

But it was I who had to stop the episode cause I was falling asleep.

this week’s ep was the best of either season to date

yeah the bar is v low but it actually NOW feels like an actual show and not a powerpoint slideshow of a family tree

yeah, it was an insane decision to zoom through the first season. there’s still a lot going on, but at least now the action has room to breathe

still struggling to keep all the various blonde weirdos straight in my head

still struggling to keep all the various blonde weirdos straight in my head

I cant keep it straight either. I have to go "ok so we've got one eye, and Matt Smith, and dreadlocks dude, and creepy twins, and some random other blonde girls nfi who they are, and... "

also King Egon (sp?) looks like the lovechild of Gerard Way & Evan Peters

I've noticed as I rewatch s1 that youn Aegon looks more like old Aemond, and vice versa. It's like they got the casting of the younger ones mixed up.

i thought the point was that aemond was a shrimpy, bullied kid who grew up to be a physically imposing adult

Exactly, who would care about Aemond if he couldn’t fight? He’s the second son.

there might be some thematic relevance to the visual interchangeability of the targaryen characters, as the story is about a family tearing itself apart (r.i.p. rryck twins), each side fighting for survival but destroying themselves at every stroke, but yeh it's a lot of pale blondes w/ similar names to trainspot.

ask me questions abt this dumb show if you are confuse! i read a book, once

super dumb question:
are any of these weirdos going to be the Mad King they refer to in GOT or does he come later

aware that maybe this lowers me in your estimation of my comprehension skills re this show but i don’t care lol

He's much later.

ok ty

ya this is like 150+ years before the start of game of thrones

but the mad king wasnt even IN got

so i kinda privately, wrongly, just assumed this series was going to cover him & his whole crazy deal but i guess not

i haven't watched the new season yet (scared to because I forgot everything and don't have the energy to rewatch the first) AND it's been ages since I read the books or saw GOT, but the Mad King was just before GOT. Jamie is "kingslayer" because he killed the mad king right?

Yup!

I mean at this rate I'm waiting for them to do a Blackfyre Rebellion series.

to be fair most of these kings are pretty fkn mad and there are rich veins of crazy to be mined from all these brotherhumpers

the proposed jon snow show's a no go but they're going ahead with dunk and egg/a knight of the 7 kingdoms, a kind of midquel series post hotd and pre got, which will feature the mad king's grandad who is also great (great?) grandson of some hotd characters, should be a good time where nothing bad happens i reckon!

huh! did not know that. that sounds like it could be ok!
*barring speed-runs through family trees lol

they are some nice little novellas and could make another dope series which i am cautiously kind of looking forward to! not so much of the tangled bloodlines, more knightly adventures, kind of like if brienne & podrick roamed the countryside during a less cursed era

there might be some thematic relevance to the visual interchangeability of the targaryen characters, as the story is about a family tearing itself apart (r.i.p. rryck twins), each side fighting for survival but destroying themselves at every stroke, but yeh it's a lot of pale blondes w/ similar names to trainspot.

Oh yeah, definitely intentional! The whole war is based on Allicent not knowing which Aegon her husband was talking about on his deathbed. And then the assassins not knowing which baby was the boy, then the twins killing each other. Not to mention all the incest and inter-marrying! I definitely think all the viewer confusion as to who is who is somewhat intentional.

Huh I never thought of that - that gives the whole plot some better colour.

There are sixteen historical Aegons in ASOIAF, I think, not to mention that Aegon is the name of the tallest hill in King's Landing as well as an island south of the Summer Isles.

The first of them was Aegon the Conqueror, or Aegon I, who was who Viserys was talking about on his deathbed. The current king is Aegon II. Rhaenyra has a son with Daemon named Aegon as well.

i thought the point was that aemond was a shrimpy, bullied kid who grew up to be a physically imposing adult

― the defenestration of prog (voodoo chili)

It's not so much the growth spurt that threw me, but the shapes of their faces. Young Aegon has a more narrow, long face, and long nose, and so does older Aemond. Young Aemond has a rounder face, as does older Aegon.

Yes the casting of those young/old characters throws me off too.

r.i.p. to a rhael one

That was a really good episode!

i am now fully given over to being excited for this show

we are so back baby!
the throne is throning, the dragons are dragoning, and the witch is a goddamn barnowl

lets
fkn
go

lol <3

Agree - this is the show I look forward to every week. A far cry from season 1.

I also enjoy listening to the Talk the Thrones podcast the next day as two of the hosts really go deep on their GoT knowledge (without spoilers) and make a lot of connections I’d otherwise miss.

i’m into Ringer’s House of R podcast recaps - they have a weekly scene by scene deep dive that seemed excessive at first but now i’m v into it because I can never remember shit from GOT and I don’t know much lore

although tbh dragon fandom is a rubicon i don’t think i will ever cross

like knowing all their names like my little ponies (sunfire!? lmao)
too much commitment for me

like i dig Aegon’s dragon bc it’s fucking huge.
it’s name? raygar vaygar gaydar idk it escapes me.
Big Fuckoff Dragon wins. the end.

I always refer to Aemond's dragon as Big Honker

i’m into Ringer’s House of R podcast recaps - they have a weekly scene by scene deep dive that seemed excessive at first but now i’m v into it because I can never remember shit from GOT and I don’t know much lore

― werewolves of laudanum (VegemiteGrrl), Monday, July 8, 2024 5:02 PM bookmarkflaglink

YESSSS Ringer's House of R is great.

Chris, Mallory, and Joanna recapping it like a sports season always cracks me up.

Mallory predictably reduced to tears describing the bond between rider and dragon

lol yes vmic for Mallory

and i realize i said aegon when i meant aemon re big fuckoff dragon obv

these names are going to kill me

Aegon, Egon, Egg-On, Egg, Ayyyygon and Steve

Rhaegar Eagon Aemon Dozy Beaky Mick And Titch

Talk the Thrones and House of R are the same podcast. TtT is the one-hour instant recap they do, and then later the week they do the epic deep dives. I only do the short ones because even as I’m into the show, I can’t devote myself to a 3.5 hour weekly podcast.

oh lol yr right i forgot that

yeah i started with Talk only, like was repelled by the idea of a 3hr recap

…but i do regularly listen to Bandsplain so it’s not like 3+hr podcasts are not NOT for me

so yeah once i warmed up to their nerdiness i discovered i could cope with the full experience

I am loving just about everything this season, but the one nagging nit for me is Alyn. He seems like a compelling character and someone who I’ll enjoy watching eventually. But they’ve now done exactly one scene per episode with Alyn standing on the dock fixing Corlys’ boat, essentially repeating the same conversation each time but with a different person. This guy needs a new setting with something to do! I imagine following the most recent episode, and Corlys’ inevitable response next week, that will finally change.

Yes! That has been driving me a little nuts too, there seems to be absolutely no forward motion with that!

I think they revealed quite a bit about it in the conversation between Corlys and Rhaenys, although they are hinting at a somewhat different direction from the book.

yeah that definitely stuck out to me too

This season has been great af and this episode was incredible. What an ending, I rarely find the battle scenes in these compelling but this ruled: drunk out of his depth Aegon, Rhaenys shrewd but still gazumped by a man, Aemond just ruthless. The second he saw Sunfyre fly over his head I knew what was going to happen. Just not the how. You really get a sense of the sheer destruction of the dragons, like little tactical nukes that go off multiple times and can asphyxiate an area from their dying breaths too.

Also liked the Daemon/Aemond parallels a lot. You know they’re going to fight and at least one of them’s going to die.

Also Vhagar is one of the original three dragons of House Targaryen which is why he’s so huge compared to the others, that fucker is much older. I never read the book (?) this series is adapted from but I know the backstory from the books. Oh yeah, common Criston Cole L.

Sunfyre and Seasmoke are total my little pony names, agreed xps

they mentioned this in Talk The Thrones, they did an excellent job of giving you geographical points of reference in the dragon battle and making it feel so real and thrilling to watch without getting lost in the cgi of it all

in terms of the irl distance covered in the battle?

I liked the way all the dragon riders had distinct fighting styles, like Melys just raking the shit out of Sunfyre with the talons

not distance but like, up in the air with the land semi-regularly being IN the frame

Ah right yeah makes sense

rook's rest battle was one of the best sequences in either series. really sad, brutal, and hard to watch!

Dragon warfare is incredible to watch. Well done polygons. Mallory Rubin always geeked out over saying "Caraxes" with extra vocal fry last season.

With the price of goats in King's Landing, you might ask "Why aren't you driving a vegan dragon?" This is why. Give me a big honker.

I love the battle scenes but with each fallen dragon I get a bit stressed out because they are pretty rare and I do not like seeing them get totaled.

was unprepared for the “rain of dragon entrails” element … as were the poor folks who copped it yeesh

oh yeah the dragon blood scalding the soldiers was an incredible touch

will never get tired of dragon battles I fear

great episode, knew exactly what was going to happen the moment aegon suited up and it was very satisfying when it did lol

whomst among us hasn’t gotten drunk and recklessly flown a dragon into battle

Where people suprised that Aemond took out Aegon? I feel like that was telegraphed since last season.

I wasn’t surprised by his desire but I was surprised by his brazenness

not surprised no
i guess maybe more shocked by the action of the sequence, and the bloodymindedness of it, going for it out in the open with whoever on the ground watching it all happen like wow dude really did that

yeah they definitely built that up for awhile

bummed criston cole is still around though, i hate that guy so much. I was trying to figure out where I’d seen alicent’s brother before, just clocked that he’s Spider from Slow Horses lol

yeah criston is a choad

Also King Hugo on the Great, where he was...great.

Yeah I suppose surprised that Aemond would clearly go after Aegon before good older lady who's name i'm too lazy to look up. At first thought it'd be like "friendly fire" but no.

Least surprising development ever, only question I had was if Cole would connect Aemond standing over his (dying? wasn’t he still hanging on?) brother with sword in his hand with malevolent intent since he clearly can’t use “putting him out of his misery” as an excuse.

my guess is Criston would connect it and try to use it as leverage somehow maybe?

Seems accurate but given his success rate so far you’d have to imagine it ends in tears 🤞🏻

I thought they had shown Criston and Aemond to be scheming buddies enought that he'd be like "whatever, 1 eyed brothers better"

Criston has a weird moral code, where I don’t think he could justify plotting Aegon’s death (especially since he is the Hand). Thats a level of dishonor he couldn’t handle. Meanwhile scheming a battle tactic with Aemond without checking with the king first is Ae-OK

yeah that is otm

dude’s whole moral code is basically a series of sand dunes

and he's really just pissed still that Rhaenyra wouldn't run off with him I assume.

I was trying to figure out where I’d seen alicent’s brother before, just clocked that he’s Spider from Slow Horses lol

― Roz, Wednesday, 10 July 2024 15:54 (one hour ago) link

THANK YOU

Poor actor, he has one of those "smug bad guy" faces like James Spader

yeah, it took me a minute to realize it was the endlessly hateable "spider" from Slow Horses. he's a good addition, with strong personality and a grounded, identifiable sense of reason... good foil for sir criston cole. hopefully he'll stick around for a while.

i don't think it would've been visible to folks on the ground that aemond was attacking aegon. would they have clocked the intricacies of the interpersonal dynamics or would they just have been like, "aaahhhh wtf three dragons ahhhh"

Criston was genuinely upset Aegon died even if it just meant he failed horribly at his job

Meanwhile he seems to be overachieving at the job of Head of the Queen.

But hey, the glass of moon tea is half full: a slot opened up to name another kid Aegon in case the cuppa Plan B fails

Feels kind of dumb to realize that the reason every character has so many interchangeable offspring is because they need plenty of fodder to support multiple seasons of dragon roastings.

I did get very confused briefly when I thought the woman Daemon was hallucinating was Daenerys

I liked this episode even as it was a quieter one. I think they needed a brief reset after last week

I think this whole Daemon off his gourd at Harrenhal plot has gone on way too long.

Yes I’m ready for that to resolve too.

so long as it's not Ayra in Braavos long we're ok.

That plot was fine, but the Dany in the desert one was teeeeeedious.

i want someone -- mysaria? -- to plonk one of aegon's baby pit fighter bastards on a dragon

I am really loving the trajectory of Allicent’s character this season as she slowly comes to realize she is on the wrong side of this conflict, that she’s far more powerless than she ever thought, and that the whole thing is a tragedy that she can’t keep from unfolding.

yeah agreed! honestly the ~internal~ storylines of many of the characters are v compelling right now - Alicent, Rhaeyna, Daemon, Aemond, even creepy old Laris

Yes for sure. The very tedious first season is really paying off this season. It laid so much groundwork for all the payoffs we’re seeing.

i def have notes for the failed dragon-rider

I want to see the training manual that advises you to carry a knife in order to slit your own throat should you be engulfed in dragon flame.

right!? very wild detail

dragons be dragoning

Little lord Tully is such a badass

ladies & gentlemen we got ourselves a bastard squadron 🔥🔥🔥🔥

that opening shot of Rhaenyra and Addam on the beach was chef’s kiss

this was the best episode of the season imo. only real dud this year was ep 5, otherwise i think they're doing a great job of telling this story. especially now that they have rhaenyra out there doing things besides getting mansplained by her advisors.

her catchphrase has been, "what would you have me do?," and i think that will evolve from a phrase of passivity to an abdication of responsibility as she and her side are responsible for worse and worse

choosing new dragonriders is like a medieval fantasy version of Squid Game

“anyway good luck”
(fire, screaming)

had a good laugh at Rhaenyra and crew getting the hell out of there before things started popping off

Why didn’t she teach them a line or two in Valyrian first?
I feel like if they knew how to say “yo, chill” things would have gone a lot better.

knowing a couple of words didn't work out for the darklyn guy

wild that she just sent them all in as a huge group

hey vermithor we whipped up a batch of tasty smallfolk for you

Utter disdain for the smallfolk amongst every last one of the major characters has been a big theme this season. Jace's little hissy fit over mom's plan was a good instance of a generally likable character acting like a total shithead.

Oh god don't make me feel like I have to start watching this now

it’s so good!

Oh god don't make me feel like I have to start watching this now

Utter disdain for the smallfolk amongst every last one of the major characters has been a big theme this season. Jace's little hissy fit over mom's plan was a good instance of a generally likable character acting like a total shithead.

exactly! you realize how much of his thinking is along the lines of, "well i can ride a dragon, so i'm not just some dirt-hair coloured bastard and am therefore a legit heir".
like major lynch-pin of how he views himself and copes with a pretty fucked up / confusing situation with his father just got ripped away from him. legit felt bad for him after that. he still needs to suck it up, but still felt bad for him.

Was this the first time he discussed his ... bastardness with his mother? Like, it seems she's never told them who their dad is but he's just worked it out right?

first time discussing it with rhaenyra but her boys have always known - in season 1, Luke tells Jace people wouldn’t question him as heir of Driftmark if he looked more like Laenor than Harwin and Jace tells him to ignore it.

i thought there was a scene when jace was little where he asks rhaenyra, “am i a bastard?”, but maybe i am misremembering

I did get very confused briefly when I thought the woman Daemon was hallucinating was Daenerys

I'm still unclear who it was...was it his mother or Viserys' first wife?

it was his mother

i thought there was a scene when jace was little where he asks rhaenyra, “am i a bastard?”, but maybe i am misremembering

I enjoyed Alicent's spa retreat

Ophelia Spa

Totally thought she was going for a swim-with-rocks kind of deal there, but I suppose that was an intentional fakeout?

yeah me too!

Who among us has not just thought "oh fuck all of this" and walked off into the forest to go lie in a lake, tbrh.

especially with kids like hers, cant fault her really

well this was an frustrating way too wrap the season.

heard that hbo cut their episode count from 10 to 8 during the strike, and as a result, feels like the season was unfinished

wasn’t a bad episode but we’re gonna have to wait til at least 2026 for the payoff. frustrating

making GRRM proud with this approach

even with only 8 episodes there was a lot of interminable faffing about in this season, like rhaenyra's daughter running around the hillside looking for a dragon, 100% the most useless time consuming subplot

I really loved this season, but that was definitely a damp fart to end it. If HBO cut the episode count, might not have been much they could so, but such an unfortunate ending.

Really did feel like it should have been episode 8 of 10 (reminded me of GoT S6 - episode 8 set up "Battle of the Bastards", 9 was the battle, 10 fallout and setting up S7).

Yeah, great episode unto itself but not a satisfying season finale, especially considering how far off the third season likely is.

Some of the episodes are pretty long.

I don’t object too strongly to anything in this show that feels like wheel spinning, because I think both this show and GoT have a good record of making any investment in their characters pay off in the long run. Best example being all ways this season succeeded thanks to what was laid out in the first season. So I am ok with spending an inordinate amount it time with a third-tier Lannister mud wrestling in the Triarchy, or what’s her name traipsing around looking for a wild dragon.

Still wish there was a big battle to conclude the season, but eventually, when I can immediately segue from this episode to the s3 premiere, all my complaints about this episode will evaporate.

(I will hold on tight to my “too strongly” qualifier though because I do think some character arcs, especially Daemon and Alyn, were dragged out and featured redundant scenes. So i am not without quibbles.)

daemon's storyline did pay off, tho they could've probably taken one lest episode to play it out

*less

I honestly don’t think the hunt for the sheep muncher dragon really consumed that much time?

And how did Otto Hightower wind up in a cage somewhere? Did I miss something?

I was wondering the same thing actually, found a little speculation here: https://mashable.com/article/house-of-the-dragon-season-2-finale-otto-hightower-jail

oh that's who that was

The Beesburys make the most sense to me - or possibly a splinter faction of the Tyrells (not sure when/how they become the dominant power of the religion) for the death of their lord (was it) during the greens takeover of kings landing / the crown

tyrells were one of the few neutral houses during the dance (figures)

they were elevated after aegon's conquest, hightowers were an older and richer house so they looked down upon them even tho they were technically sworn to them

I honestly don’t think the hunt for the sheep muncher dragon really consumed that much time?

― FRAUDULENT STEAKS (The Cursed Return of the Dastardly Thermo Thinwall), Monday, August 5, 2024 1:45 PM (thirty-eight minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

it was probably 1 minute per episode. could have shortened some of the mud wrestling and given a glimpse of her claiming the dragon (not just encountering) to end the season.

then again, i've been pretty annoyed by all the folks who've been trying to rewrite the season in their heads. the writers were dealt a pretty hard hand with the strike and zaslav budget cut

I enjoyed the Hightower tease. No idea how or why he’s been imprisoned although it’s a nice callback to the episode where he’d been called back to be Aemond’s hand and everyone realized they hadn’t heard from him and couldn’t find him. Not going to look for any book spoilers - content to learn that story next season.

daemon's storyline did pay off, tho they could've probably taken one lest episode to play it out

Ulf calling for more ortolan ruled

Also, “do you know my cock was destroyed” almost an insanely inappropriately funny line for the way he just drops that bombshell and then compared it to a sausage exploding on a fire (!) Larys just kind of nodding along to that bombshell, probably wondering if he can bribe a maid for some of Alicent’s dirty socks or something.

i liked daemon's harrenhal adventure, don't get me wrong, i do think they could've used that time on other stories (mostly thinking of that one episode where he has a sex dream about his mom, yikes)

*some of that time

In terms of stories or plotlines that I wish they could have spent more time on (given the hypothetical posed by spending too much time on other plots)... I really wish Alyn's story could have progressed more than it did, although I *loved* his scene with Corlys in the finale. But aside from that I don't really think they overdid Daemon at the expense of something else. Everything has moved at more or less the pace it should. I just wanted some dragon fire, or a naval battle, or mass sword slaying, to make a more climactic conclusion.

I found myself quite confused by Alyn's bitter rant at Corlys at the end, because unless Ive not been paying attention, I dont recall any backstory to explain all that. He's Corlys's bastard is he? I must admit I'm terrible at keeping all the threads going in shows like these.

They’d been hinting at it for a bit

There's a scene in Episode 6 with Alyn diligently shaving off his white Valyrian white hair while Addam chides him for hiding it

Does anyone else think the cocky arsehole dragonrider guy is gunning for comeuppance btw? What a dick.

ooooh yeah, bit of a dick that one.

I missed it but apparently the trailer they showed prior to the finale last night included a glimpse of the other upcoming spin-off, A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms

I think it's the other way around. I might've seen a spoiler or something to that extent, that he's some surprising hero while the other guy blows it. Or something.

I don't know, the dream thing, the winter etc etc. It's just the actual GoT series blew it's ending so bad, felt like the white walkers were just killed so easy that I find it hard to think anybody should be so worried about it at this point.

I loved the Alycent & Rhaenyra scene, great emotional punch for a season finale… lots of thread pulling which I love!!

But ffs could we not have plopped Jason Lannister & his mud wrestling in a previous episode? Like, ok, wee yes now they have ships etc i get that logistically important but honestly putting ALL that into THIS ep was maybe not the move imo zzzz

And yes, thx Aegon for the burst sausage overshare O_o

Brings a whole new meaning to “sausage sizzle”

sausages = ruined

Larys shouldve been all *cough* *loud chair scraping* ACTUALLY WHY DONT WE GIVE HIS HIGHNESS SOME MORE MILK OF THE POPPY

He asked for rum and they denied him, he just wants the sweet release of death and if not that let him get drunk dammit

Also, this show definitely seemed to push my Alicent/Rhaenyra agenda when Alicent was like, out of nowhere, RUN AWAY WITH ME. In an episode featuring a pirate queen from the free cities with multiple wives!

I was cutting up some burst half-cooked sausages just 10 mins ago and I regret that line did come back to haunt me :(

Should note, given the overall thread title, that we have the first snippets of A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms as part of this coming attractions bit (this should take you right to it, 1:10 in)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_fSOMJxgVk

(Alas the embed did not take you right to it, but yes, 1:10 into the overall clip.)

we live in ip hell

knight of a seven kingdoms should be good tho

a thousand xposts but Jason Lannister = Tyland Lannister obv
wtf my brain

I think you mean TyWON/Tyran/Tybob Lannister

TyFFSFUCKMYLIFE

*wife

lol

Jimmy Bob Lannister

A Good Ol' Boy of the Seven Kingdoms

can get you a great deal on a used boat

I'm cautiously optimistic about AKot7K, but I am very wary of a show that takes place 100 years after the current show and 100 years before the original show. Feeling boxed into the canonical storyline - which is the dire fate of most of the Star Wars franchise.

Yeah I’m keen to give it a go, i love these worlds & lore

Matt Smith is on another great run as queen-husband (cf The Crown, his prince philip was gr8)

really loved Daemon’s big scene in this finale w Rhaenyra, both actors really bring the dramz whenever they’re together
A+

I was starting to get irritated with Dr whosit and his castlevania nightmare adventures, so I was pleasantly suprised when he decided Rhaenyra deserved to run things after all. Was he purely convinced by the weirwood vision?

weeks of having to confront his inadequacy issues probably helped open him up to that - have taken to calling harrenhal daemon's therapy castle

honestly that whole storyline doesn't work without matt smith being good at matt smith speeches

agree that it was a good episode but a bad finale - if not a battle climax, felt like they should've closed with last week's ending shot of Rhaenyra standing with her three dragons at dragonstone

As a dumb aside my loathing for *googles IMDB cos I forget which name he has* Aemond is made hundredfold by how weird his face is. He has the profile of a cartoon villain from Wacky Races.

lmao

figured out that an easy way to remember aemond's name is that he's daemon with the d at the end. they both have long hair and look like the weird squished version of the other.

aemond, daemon & aegon i can manage, after that the wheels fall off

this show needs more different names. that said I can't remember the names of the ones that are differrent. corlys, I got...his wife? Rhaenyra's kids? No idea.

Rhaenyra and Rhaenys ok, but I'm always forgetting Rhaena, or "her who's not Baela and wants a dragon"

I’ve never really had this problem apart from infrequent characters (me: “Who the fuck is that fella hanging around with Criston Cole?”) but this is mainly because I watch with subtitles on so get to see the names as well as hear them.

Please to enjoy some casting news:

https://deadline.com/2024/08/a-knight-of-the-seven-kingdoms-game-of-thrones-prequel-adds-cast-1236034665/

I have no idea who any of those people are

“the Daeron Targaryen in A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms is a different Daeron from the one mentioned in HOTD)”

NOT HELPING

lol

A big interview about things

https://deadline.com/2025/02/house-of-the-dragon-season-3-game-of-thrones-spinoff-knight-renewed-1236285772/