Vaccines, Infrastructure, and Kids In Cages: US Politics April 2021

Lock the old thread

xp I do!

the "luxury wank" i think this was once called on these boards

years from now Tracer's post won't make any sense unless someone looks up the final few posts from Beware the Ides of March -- U.S. Politics March 2021

Needs more condoms

I will starting April 12!

Gaetz can't be sure where that hand's been

Invisible hand of government iirc

Good thread title

in one of the gaetz things i saw mention of him being endorsed by jeb bush early on, which reminded me of this car with out-of-state plates that I see parked in a catholic church parking lot all the time
https://i.postimg.cc/q7b6wpqZ/IMG-0989.jpg

lol

https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2021/04/01/russia-warns-of-anti-white-aggression-in-us-a73446

Won't somebody please think of the wites

Meantime, Matt Gaetz everyone

https://www.rawstory.com/matt-gaetz-2651324286/

the sad thing is this is all very acceptable within the current GOP universe, and I wouldn't be at all surprised if he somehow made it through all this with little-to-no damage.

The real question though is how acceptable this is in the DOJ/legal system universe.

Feel like the last four years have taught us that being a Republican politician gives you a lifetime pass to commit crime

Not convinced that the Department Of Justice has taken historical interest in people showing each other photos of people they've fucked. Otherwise we'd probably hear a lot more about Gene Simmons doing nine consecutive life sentences, and 90% of your female and gay friends who use dating apps would have stopped hanging out in bars with you long before the pandemic, due to being in priz.

Literally nobody in my entire life, man or woman, gay or straight, has ever showed me a nude picture of somebody they slept with.

Maybe I don't go to enough bars.

I've been to a lot of bars in my life and that has never happened to me either.

Wow, bars have really changed
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/M6XTITUhENc/hqdefault.jpg

The other day I was listening to someone who said, "Everyone at some point has taken a nude photo of themselves when they felt good and then possibly shared it" and I was like O__O

I think this is one of those areas where people are flabbergasted to learn their own practices aren't universally shared, like "another think coming" vs "another thing coming"

yeahhhhh, perhaps not a universal experience...

who among us hasn't shared some nude pics

well, me

and yeah, never known anyone who has showed any to me. hopefully i send off vibes to people, like "don't show me naked pics, please"

Whomp whomp

Now it's being reported that Gaetz was in the office with Greenberg "on a weekend" looking at fake IDs of women -- the women Greenberg is charged with sex trafficking -- per CNN.

This is not sounds like it's getting better for Matt.

— Michelangelo Signorile (@MSignorile) April 1, 2021

"Everyone at some point has taken a nude photo of themselves when they felt good and then possibly shared it"

favorite White Album song

nude picture

nude photo

nude pics

naked pics

lotta people telling on themselves itt

Nude sics

Nude sics - that's when you *strip off* the facebook link.

Not convinced that the Department Of Justice has taken historical interest in people showing each other photos of people they've fucked.

The DOJ is investigating Gaetz for sex trafficking. Showing nudie pics are a side issue. Unless Gaetz was showing the nudie pics to angle for interested colleagues he could pimp for.

is this Gaetz thing more than him just travelling across state lines to have sex with a 17 year old?

Vaccines, Infrastructure, and Kids In Cages: US Politics April 2021

oh lol missed that post well shit

interesting way to quantify things

If Biden's infrastructure-plus packages become law, the impact of Ossoff/Warnock wins would be in the ballpark of $4-5 trillion.

— Steven Dennis (@StevenTDennis) April 1, 2021

Well well

🚨 The Times has reviewed receipts from Cash App and Apple Pay that show payments from Gaetz and Greenberg to one of the women, and a payment from Greenberg to a second woman. The women told their friends that the payments were for sex with the two men https://t.co/TCS3mC6tkk

— Patricia Mazzei (@PatriciaMazzei) April 2, 2021

What is love?

this is so funny pic.twitter.com/tRJYeqca3C

— Sarah Jones (@onesarahjones) April 2, 2021

"...and looks forward to marrying the love of his life." Who hasn't been born yet.

ok can we clarify the Nestor thing now

My "Matt Gaetz has never paid for sex" T-shirt has people asking a lot of questions already answered etc. etc.

Lol nickn

Thread: The story of how @mattgaetz became a target of the Trump justice department is even crazier and weirder than you can imagine.

It involves blockchain, blatant fraud by a local tax collector, and a scheme to steal people’s government ID.

This is NOT AN APRIL FOOLS JOKE.

— Brianna Wu (@BriannaWu) April 1, 2021

^ now THAT was an interesting tweet thread!

weird how Twitter's trending topic on this starts "Rep. Matt Gaetz says he’s a victim of 'criminal extortion'"

Read that as "I did heinous criminal things that made me easy to blackmail."

I mean, Twitter, the news, whatever, if it's the feds he's already cooked

Meanwhile, a different Gaetz story from CNN:

Sources say Gaetz used his phone to show images of nude women, boasting that he slept with them. He showed such images even while on the floor of the U.S. House.
https://t.co/Lo1buyCjHa

— Mike Baker (@ByMikeBaker) April 2, 2021

Sorry I wasn’t up on the latest

Might as well collate this Gaetz story from circa 2013 itt:

U.S. Rep. Matt Gaetz accused of creating sex game with 'points' for sleeping with staff

"The point system for the game, which was rumored to continue in 2014 and 2015, demeaningly awarded one point for a having sex with a lobbyist, two for a staffer, three for another legislator and six for a married legislator."

Creep

and he really doesn't look the sort

But how would they prove it to gain the points?

Oh, I know....

You got to be pretty damn clueless to be rattling the gates of power and have this type of lunacy going on in the closet then not expect it to blow back. White trash with money.

Boehner speaks!

In the 2010 midterm election, voters from all over the place gave President Obama what he himself called “a shellacking.” And oh boy, was it ever. You could be a total moron and get elected just by having an R next to your name—and that year, by the way, we did pick up a fair number in that category.

Boehner then chuckled ruefully, swirling a large glass of red wine before draining it in a single thirsty sip

OH COME ON!

— Matthew Gertz (@MattGertz) April 1, 2021

That Boehner piece is pretty amazing. Too many quotable paragraphs, but the conclusion is particularly choice:

There is nothing more dangerous than a reckless asshole who thinks he is smarter than everyone else. Ladies and gentlemen, meet Senator Ted Cruz.

Yeah, holy shit at the Boehner article. Old man dngaf swag for days.

NB: Hope Boehner dies soon.

Boehner then chuckled ruefully, swirling a large glass of red wine before draining it in a single thirsty sip

while counting the money he is making off legal weed that he as against during his time in congress.

I can't imagine anyone loving red wine enough to make it their drink of choice. Always with dinner and occasionally with lunch, but just, like, glass after glass? Ick. Never.

No, that’s incorrect; red wine is delicious.

I can’t believe Gaetz paid for sex with CASHAPP!

i can! it's typical white man privileged behavior to not think that any of this shit will come back to you so who cares.

lol fox news just quickly mentioning the very improved job numbers that came out and moved on real quick

I can't imagine anyone loving red wine enough to make it their drink of choice. Always with dinner and occasionally with lunch, but just, like, glass after glass? Ick. Never.

Noted!

Gaetz and Greenberg at AIPAC in 2018 pic.twitter.com/3CChzmZuMY

— Sarah Kendzior (@sarahkendzior) April 2, 2021

According to three people with direct knowledge of the incident: Greenberg visited the Lake Mary, Florida branch of his tax collection agency that weekend. Grainy surveillance footage captured Greenberg standing near a manager’s desk with another man. Greenberg forgot to set the alarm on the way out, which concerned the assistant branch manager when she walked into the office Monday morning. That employee was surprised to find that driver licenses—which are normally turned in when expired at the tax office for shredding—were scattered all over the desk instead of in the appropriate disposal basket. She reviewed the camera footage and alerted her boss, who in turn contacted Greenberg via text.

“Did you happen to visit the Lake Mary Office on the weekend?” the text message read.

The image obtained by The Daily Beast shows that Greenberg allegedly responded: “Yes I was showing congressman Gaetz what our operation looked like. Did I leave something on?”

Starting to feel like Gaetz is patient zero in an epidemic I've long predicted would follow in Trump's wake, namely people who breathlessly watched him recklessly do whatever he wanted while suffering no consequence and thought 'I want a piece of that' without ever realizing that few people are that lucky. And that Trump-level recklessness is basically the express lane to Lucklessville.

I think the idea that what the Republican base really wants is a candidate who does all the stuff they wish they could do (be rich, talk shit, dunk libs, get laid) is going to drive Republican behavior for quite some time

I just looked at Matt Gaetz’ venmo and he apparently knows a lot of extremely young looking women lol

— the artist fka coincelpro (@peachofababy) June 17, 2020

Wait, he had one?

Luke Ball, the communications director for Rep. Matt Gaetz, has resigned, according to a person familiar.
Ball quit out of principle, according to the person. @LACaldwellDC

— Chris Jansing (@ChrisJansing) April 2, 2021

after years of doing a job that required he have no principles, he found a principle

This is why you always involve your key support staff in your orgies with child sex slaves, and get it on video — so they can't quit on you when you come to a few bumps in the road.

When @SpeakerBoehner was recording his audiobook I was told by sources that during these wine-soaked sessions he would deviate from the book’s text and insert random violent attacks on @tedcruz. Well, here’s some tape (listen to the end): pic.twitter.com/NFCQ2QFdTT

— Jonathan Swan (@jonathanvswan) April 2, 2021

lmao!!

Fuck John Boehner obviously BUT he's also right about a lot of that stuff obv. I'm watching this dynamic play out in real time here locally, where our dominant county GOP is being progressively taken over by crazies. It used to have two pretty well-defined factions: the "silk stocking" crowd, who hate taxes but are relatively socially moderate and believe in functional competent government, and the more rural-based GOBs who mostly view local government as a patronage program. Now we have this whole third contingent of suburban evangelical libertarian anti-mask Trumpoids — a good many of whom have moved here recently from out of state, fleeing "Taxifornia" or whatever — and they are huge assholes who basically hate everyone, including the established party people. They have no governing philosophy beyond never raise taxes and pwn the libs, they're terrible at government, and they're big on social media theatrics. Not a promising evolution.

of course boehner can both be right about how he's helped destroy the country _and_ an asshole

Let us never forget this hero: pic.twitter.com/bWIk5zAe6s

— MaryJoy (@tweetsfromhere) April 2, 2021

Gaetz's chin is a poem.

Feel like you're underrating his forehead

https://i.redd.it/3222a1v87v661.jpg

Something's up

🚨🚨Capitol staff just got this text message

I’m in the Capitol and will keep everyone posted here. pic.twitter.com/ydQGyCJcof

— Jake Sherman (@JakeSherman) April 2, 2021

This as well

Large police presence and two stretchers being brought out pic.twitter.com/EmidoLP0PT

— Jacqui Heinrich (@JacquiHeinrich) April 2, 2021

Gaetz's chin is a poem.

― So who you gonna call? The martini police (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, April 2, 2021 11:29 AM (forty-seven minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

A villainelle

Kinda reminding me so far of that tragic case a few years back

Appears that a car smashed into the barrier. Two people are on stretchers. Can’t see whether it’s an officer or civilian pic.twitter.com/Ud5WYGyKFu

— Jacqui Heinrich (@JacquiHeinrich) April 2, 2021

There are reports (unconfirmed) that two @CapitolPolice officers have been shot.

— Steve Herman (@W7VOA) April 2, 2021

Helicopter landing in lawn.

🚨🚨A helicopter just landed on the east front of the Capitol. I’ve never seen anything like this before. ever. pic.twitter.com/LxV0mywRSe

— Jake Sherman (@JakeSherman) April 2, 2021

CRITICAL INCIDENT: USCP is responding to the North Barricade vehicle access point along Independence Avenue for reports someone rammed a vehicle into two USCP officers. A suspect is in custody. Both officers are injured. All three have been transported to the hospital. pic.twitter.com/4TXIdulJc6

— U.S. Capitol Police (@CapitolPolice) April 2, 2021

yikes

This is bad, but sadly predictable. The Trump coup attempt will reverberate for at least a couple more years.

Why would antifa do this

Cop and suspect are dead.

oh man Capital Police not having a good year

Robert Contee of the Washington, DC, Metropolitan Police Department has just said at the briefing outside the US Capitol that the attack by a man driving a car at Capitol Police officers “does not appear to be terrorism related”.

so he's white

hm

Whoa. MLB announces it is pulling this year's All-Star game and the amateur draft from Georgia. pic.twitter.com/QqJzR3lAcy

— Lindsey Adler (@lindseyadler) April 2, 2021

so he's white

Well there must be some reason they're dismissing the terrorist angle. If it was Europe the first reaction to a car being driven at people who are then attacked by knives would be to assume it's an Islamist attack.

"terrorism" is a highly elastic term that has been stretched so far that it has lost most of its meaning. if, for example, the attacker was socially alienated and politically disaffected, but this attack was purely a demonstration of that fact rather than an attempt to change anything in any particular direction, does that make it "terrorism"?

awesome (re MLB)

Tremendous!

wow that seems uh...pretty big

hit 'em where it hurts, in their bank accounts

Does the all-star game really bring in much revenue for the area? Doesn’t seem that devastating - 29 cities survive its absence every year

OK I'll take a symbolic hit as well

Er, I mean the other 29 mlb teams, plus all other cities

Symbolic hit though, hell yeah!

Now we have this whole third contingent of suburban evangelical libertarian anti-mask Trumpoids — a good many of whom have moved here recently from out of state, fleeing "Taxifornia" or whatever — and they are huge assholes who basically hate everyone, including the established party people. They have no governing philosophy beyond never raise taxes and pwn the libs, they're terrible at government, and they're big on social media theatrics. Not a promising evolution.

yeah good way of putting it - while you could argue GWB ultimately did more evil (which I myself would've argued until Covid hit) there at least seemed to be some semblance of humanity there. I never felt like Bush hated America. they at least pretended to care about what's true and what's false. idk to what extent we have Facebook to blame, or if the combination of 9/11 and a black president just caused half the country to lose their minds, but it does seem the right has passed the point of no return and it genuinely makes me scared about what the future of this country is going to look like.

The All-Star game is worth tens of millions in added revenue, which isn't chicken feed, but major cities generate billions in economic activity. A lot of it is prestige. This is bad publicity and it is tied directly to the actions of GA republicans.

also wrt to the BLM game cancellations last year individual athletes and teams (as a collection of players, not management per se) now know they can really fuck shit up by just refusing to play

it's a big deal. sports boycotts were a big part of the electoral backlash to north carolina's anti-trans stuff IIUC.

it's also honestly kind of surprising

I have no doubt it took a lot to get Manfred to do it.

also there's the fact that MLB isn't known as a "progressive" league like the NBA nor are they desperately trying to overcorrect the way the NFL is

What a week! (Given it's Brown sharing this and she has her sources, I'm inclined to thing the Daily Mail is on to something.)

"Gaetz's arrest is said to be imminent after the alleged victim, who has not been named, testified before a Florida grand jury this week saying she had sex with the conservative Republican before she turned 18, https://t.co/GJvXjxKQiq has learned. " https://t.co/Lci46QovWC

— julie k. brown (@jkbjournalist) April 2, 2021

Wow, that's made my day.

I'm just gonna get on the record and say it: I never liked that guy

if just one of these evil motherfuckers ever experienced any consequences it would be great

Countdown to rumor that it was George Soros’ daughter/ a plot to entrap

The rumor won't save him from prison, but it will reassure the hopelessly conspiracy-addicted that the deep state exists. otoh, the hopelessly conspiracy-addicted are gonna reflexively protect their beliefs no matter what, so they are not in play.

Georgia might not be done getting slapped around — apparently NJ (where I live) is offering tax breaks to studios to stop filming in Georgia and start filming here.

I will be happy even if it just ends up seeing Gaetz get his due punishment, but I’ll say that he strikes me as the type to be more than happy to name names in return for some leniency. But maybe I’m getting the cart ahead of the horse.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/7e/56/93/7e56933f68d79c9fd77d507a94f1187c.jpg

Man up Mr. Congressman, it is Mann Act time!

I'm thrilled people are treating GA like the apartheid state it explicitly seeks to become, but it's also important not to reduce this to one state: https://www.brennancenter.org/our-work/research-reports/voting-laws-roundup-march-2021

Stunning new data from @brennancenter: 361 bills to restrict voting rights introduced in 47 states as of March 24

That’s up from 253 restrictive bills as of Feb 19, a 43% increase in a month

55 restrictive bills in 24 states moving through legislatureshttps://t.co/77myHbs9qo pic.twitter.com/hzSuKda4J8

— Ari Berman (@AriBerman) April 1, 2021

boycott USA

I just got spooked by the thought that Matt Gaetz gaetz out of the charges and truly becomes the successor to Trump.

I'm thrilled people are treating GA like the apartheid state it explicitly seeks to become ...

good on MLB for moving the All-Star game, but please let's not equate the state of Georgia with the GOP hacks in its legislature... Warnock and Ossoff didn't elect themselves (y'all are welcome btw)

what I see here looks like the state GOP pandering to its Trumpist base and in the process earning tons of bad press and handing its opponents everything needed to continue mobilizing non-GOP voters ... even if the new voting laws are strictly enforced, African-American turnout in 2022 will exceed that of 2020 if Abrams is in the ballot

Warnock and Ossoff didn't elect themselves (y'all are welcome btw)

thank you

Warnock and Ossoff have made a world of difference. thx GA voters.

GA did us a better turn than fucking Maine did.

let's not equate the state of Georgia with the GOP hacks in its legislature

Sorry, that was imprecise of me. By "state of Georgia" I meant "State of Georgia." I lived there seven years and have closer family there still, so I swear I'm not one of those "red states are evil" dummies.

Georgia lawmaker Park Cannon, who was arrested after knocking on the door where Gov. Brian Kemp was signing the law restricting voting rights, says she is now facing 8 years in prison after being charged with 2 felonies. https://t.co/8f1UV57qwc

— Taniel (@Taniel) April 2, 2021

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/03/us/politics/trump-donations.html

The guy in hospice who ended up donating $500/week to the Trump campaign because of this scheme... jfc

When I snooped on the public records for people in my town who donated, I recognized a woman who had many recurring payments to the Republicans. Strongly suspect she didn't realize she was giving away money her pension every month.

Wow. Just simple scammers, through and through. Utterly uncomplicated.

That shit is sinister. My 90 year old grandma with virtually no short term memory left had like $4000 a month in recurring church donations. There’s an entire industry based around scanning senile people.

Fwiw act blue usually defaults to recurring donations too, although I assume it’s easier to cancel them assuming you notice. The whole small donation industry is a cesspool.

I was going to say "wait I give to Act Blue all the time and I don't think it defaults to recurring" but looky here

https://support.actblue.com/donors/contributions/i-thought-i-made-a-one-time-contribution-but-its-recurring-what-happened-and-how-can-i-stop-it/

It seems that it's up to the individual campaign; Act Blue gives the campaign an option to make recurring the default, and yeah, they shouldn't. (And if you find that a candidate you like has set it up that way, honestly, there are many many many other equally deserving candidates, contribute to them instead.)

Act Blue is way more insidious about the mailing lists than the donations, imo. I ended up on a million lists after making donations for 2020.

For a while I got emails from the previous president. I unsubscribed after the election, but now I'm getting a ton of emails from other Republican accounts, they just go straight to my spam folder.

https://www.politico.com/news/2021/04/02/alexandria-ocasio-cortez-campaign-contributions-478943

Giving back the money will surely stop the GOP from trying to link centrist Democrats to AOC.

I called Medicare the other day, the number my mom wrote down. It immediately said there was a thing we could win, and then when someone pulled picked up, they said we won. My mom immediately said no and then they hung up on us. I soon realized my number had gotten the number wrong, by a digit. I’m sure that if any number that resembles Medicare, but off by a single number, is a scam. I kind of want to call that # back and chew them out

geez signaling that you're more aligned with Republicans than one of your party's most popular and well-known members seems a bit worse than getting literally the same attack ad that you would've anyway

any dem complaining about the optics of getting 5K from AOC can eat shit imo

JUst hearing a suggestion that the Capitol has replaced teh White house as the target of attacks by people disgruntled with the goings on in DC. Like weird legacy of the 6th and all.

It's kind of astonishing to me that the *entirety* of the Republican message on the infrastructure bill is "Roads and bridges! Roads and bridges!"

I'm sure that Fox News will eventually stop booking Pete, but in the meantime, he'll keep doing this:pic.twitter.com/6ONqZY8WWu

— Brian Tyler Cohen (@briantylercohen) April 4, 2021

neither roads, nor bridges

One obvious rejoinder to the roads and bridges thing is that roads and bridges already have a dedicated funding source in gasoline taxes, which can only be spent on roads and bridges, where most of the other things the bill is talking about don't. (Well, airports and ports do through user fees, but not at the same level as gas taxes.)

This is a Halloween costume. pic.twitter.com/3gARoLSxEq

— Richard M. Nixon (@dick_nixon) April 4, 2021

a candidate for gabbneb

She. Put. Her. GPA. In. The. AD. 🤣 pic.twitter.com/nYsZrN7cwP

— DR. KRUPALI 🇺🇸 (@krupali) April 4, 2021

a candidate for gabbneb

🐦[She. Put. Her. GPA. In. The. AD. 🤣 pic.twitter.com/nYsZrN7cwP🕸
— DR. KRUPALI 🇺🇸 (@krupali) April 4, 2021🕸]🐦

(physically removes opponent's king from the board on first move) Checkmate. (leans back in chair, crosses arms, smirks)

imo if your king isn’t on the board it cannot be threatened by an opponent’s piece and is therefore invincible. She played herself

maybe she should just go fuck herself instead

anyone who brags about their grades (lol) or where they went to school (lol) or their IQ score (looooooool) is tied for the dumbest person in the universe

read down the replies, looks like it's a photoshop

makes sense. turning point USA are some of the most hitler-esque youth that i know of, but even they are smart enough to not put their logo on that

lol if it’s a shop it’s uhhhhh pretty racist

the replies suggest the quote is real, she just said it with her mouth instead of putting on her ads

well, who can really know what actually happened these days. it's kind of like right and wrong, truth or fiction. toss it all in the wash, it doesn't really matter and these things are just unknowable

what sery kim originally said was indeed racist:

https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/02/politics/sery-kim-endorsement-texas-candidate-chinese-immigrants/index.html

I'm kind of surprised that News corp/Fox has not had more blow back in their other media properties by people just not wanting to deal with a business that supports their news organization. I suppose money is money, but you got to figure if say Lebron James just flat out quit doing any media or business with Fox Sports and their entertainment business over say their media's right wing propaganda money maker, it would not take long for that to become 'a thing'.

Indeed, why can’t athletes just fix everything for us?

lebron james.....doesn't do any business with fox sports

Fox News is iirc its own entity now, no longer affiliated with the larger (and basically nonexistent) Fox Corporation.

See how they’re suffering already? The Australian government had to take broadcast rights away from the public broadcaster, AND give a $30 million untendered grant, AND then another $10 million bonus for no reason, just to show women’s football exclusively to a fraction of the previous unrestricted audience. Lebron has Rupert on the ropes.

xp

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/bernie-sanders-senate-budget-committee-b1825305.html

they call him the idea man

No idea what the trends are on this but I’m constantly struck by the range and quantity of objectively successful people who enjoy some of the highest living standards in human history who are nonetheless consumed by bitterness.

— Matthew Yglesias (@mattyglesias) March 30, 2021

Might as well collate this Gaetz story from circa 2013 itt:

U.S. Rep. Matt Gaetz accused of creating sex game with 'points' for sleeping with staff

More details now revealed:

Matt Gaetz's Florida sex game included a 'Harry Potter' challenge and 'extra points' for sleeping in sorority houses, a female Republican tells Insider

Anyone who had sex with a certain conservative woman "won the whole game regardless of points," she said. That woman was known as the "snitch," a nod to the "Harry Potter" game of Quidditch. The GOP source said she "heard specific references of Gaetz being involved and scoring points." She declined to name the woman to protect her privacy.

Another way to obtain points was to have sex with "virgins," ABC reported this week, citing a source

Lawmakers who participated publicly bragged about it, even among their female colleagues; some male legislators who didn't participate jokingly lamented the fact that they abstained, the Republican said.

Some - to me - quite good and surprising picks in here and, after a quick scroll through, no immediately glaring omissions either, although I'm sure they'll come when I think on it a bit more.

(Of course 18 years is a hilariously short period of time to even think about a canon and even tho it is essentially a click-bait article, it seems like it would be of interest here).

http://www.vulture.com/2018/09/a-premature-attempt-at-the-21st-century-literary-canon.html🕸

🐦[Damian Lillard didn’t used to hold back💀 pic.twitter.com/p0Yvt3eFUJ🕸
— r~ steph curry’s burner acct~ (@fymroo) May 8, 2020🕸]🐦

preemptive apology as i am not spotify savvy, but there was a series of old school hiphop compilation albums from the early 90s called /street jams: hiphop from the top/ and they really gave me an education back in my junior high cassette walkman days.

part one🕸
part two🕸
part three🕸
part four🕸

there was also the slightly more "new school" oriented (i.e. post-run d.m.c.) but equally as great rapmasters🕸 series. i had like five of them, but i never knew just how many volumes there were. according to discogs, there were at least nine volumes (!!).

https://reverb.com/item/35773270-japan-casio-fujigen-eg5-1984-grey-guitar-with-a-cassette-player?show_sold=true🕸

Also, this stuff still resonates...

🐦[Biden could end up with 306 or 290 Electoral College votes and a popular vote margin of over 5 million. If Trump got this, it would be seen as a big and decisive win. https://t.co/LE290cLc3o🕸
— Tom Wright (@thomaswright08) November 4, 2020🕸]🐦

Trump loses popular vote but manages an EC win, GOP parties like it's the biggest mandate ever. Dems win popular vote even bigger and manage a likely similar EC victory, it's all *tug at collar* aiiiiie we better not screw this up.

what am I looking at here?

ILX's most consistent poster.

#oneveryoddthread

good morning!

what?

It’s called a digest. Now we don’t need to go anywhere else!

#onethread
#onepost

he's getting ready to make a deal

West Virginia Democrat Joe Manchin said he does not support Biden's infrastructure bill as written. He does not support a 28% corporate tax rate and says that 25% is more appropriate, reports @elwasson.

Manchin was appearing on the WVMetroNews' program, "Talkline."

— Nancy Cook (@nancook) April 5, 2021

let's call it 27% and then hire antifa to do the catering

yeah Froggy wants a-courtin'.

Lol at Talkline (cf Simpsons' "Smartline").

Some actual good news

FUCK YESSSS. Everyone you made your voices heard. Gov. Hutchinson has vetoed the bill.

— Chase Strangio (@chasestrangio) April 5, 2021

He explains that the bill is creating new standards of legislative interference in the decisions of families and physicians.

— Chase Strangio (@chasestrangio) April 5, 2021

why are you making me google governor hutchinson

oh fuck wow, that is good news I was *not* expecting

of course...

Gov. Hutchinson recognizes that General Assembly will likely override. This is not over. Arkansas has a simple majority override. We have to flip a lot of votes. Keep up the pressure folks. We need to protect trans kids!

— Chase Strangio (@chasestrangio) April 5, 2021

What I think you're seeing here (and maybe I'm wrong, I can't look into the dark souls of these people) is that the struggle between the true-believing loons and the traditional cynical business-suit-wearing "I just don't wanna pay taxes" people within the GOP is not over. The difference between "happy to spout vile anti-trans BS to cynically win votes" and "actually believes they were put in office by The Lord God to enforce genital determinism" may not look like much, but here it is, the difference. Human rights for trans people are not a threat to capitalism, and business-suit Republicans have no reason to alienate tons of people, including some rich people, unless it's to protect capital. Democrats relocate shoe factories too.

Human rights for trans people are not a threat to capitalism

*phew!*

one for the c&p over and over thread

some leftover gaetz schmutz
https://www.orlandoweekly.com/Blogs/archives/2021/04/02/heres-the-creepy-voicemail-from-matt-gaetz-and-joel-greenberg-left-for-florida-rep-anna-eskamani

:)

Earlier this week, the Times broke the story that Gaetz is being investigated for having a sexual relationship with a 17-year-old girl and violating laws against sex trafficking in the process. The story has since been confirmed by multiple outlets, as well as Gaetz.

https://media2.fdncms.com/orlando/imager/u/blog/29073527/screen_shot_2018-08-21_at_10.31.16_am.png

nightmare material

Matt Gaetz is an extremely dumb motherfucker who, in a just world, would not have been trusted to do a single damned thing, ever.

and yet, somehow he has failed upward at every step

tbh a driving motivation for me to accrue wealth and power is to have the resources to partially inoculate my kids from their inevitable fuckups

The only photo more frightening than that one:

https://i.imgur.com/93dlDpx.jpg

who's da meathead on the right?

that's Joel Greenberg

Infrastructure Week is here!

#BREAKING: Senate parliamentarian to let Democrats bypass GOP filibuster on two more bills https://t.co/2DLODweqZc pic.twitter.com/TUDcfnGUl7

— The Hill (@thehill) April 5, 2021

nice

Oh fuck

Thank you senate parliamentarian!!!!

Infrastructure Week is here!

Yes, but it was all Trump’s idea.

A little over a week ago, I called on the USPS Board of Governors to fire DeJoy.

Today, I received the letter below informing me that, "DeJoy continues to enjoy the Board's full support..."

RT to tell them how unacceptable this is. pic.twitter.com/0QDIxnVJQa

— Tammy Duckworth (@SenDuckworth) April 5, 2021

This article is pretty good, though the first paragraphi is blood-boiling.

When the political scientist Robert Pape began studying the issues that motivated the 380 or so people arrested in connection with the attack against the Capitol on Jan. 6, he expected to find that the rioters were driven to violence by the lingering effects of the 2008 Great Recession.

Why did he expect that? The author apparently never asked him.

But instead he found something very different: Most of the people who took part in the assault came from places, his polling and demographic data showed, that were awash in fears that the rights of minorities and immigrants were crowding out the rights of white people in American politics and culture.

If Mr. Pape’s initial conclusions — published on Tuesday in The Washington Post — hold true, they would suggest that the Capitol attack has historical echoes reaching back to before the Civil War, he said in an interview over the weekend. In the shorter term, he added, the study would appear to connect Jan. 6 not only to the once-fringe right-wing theory called the Great Replacement, which holds that minorities and immigrants are seeking to take over the country, but also to events like the far-right rally in Charlottesville, Va., in 2017 where crowds of white men marched with torches chanting, “Jews will not replace us!”

“If you look back in history, there has always been a series of far-right extremist movements responding to new waves of immigration to the United States or to movements for civil rights by minority groups,” Mr. Pape said. “You see a common pattern in the Capitol insurrectionists. They are mainly middle-class to upper-middle-class whites who are worried that, as social changes occur around them, they will see a decline in their status in the future.”

Well, yeah.

I am just gonna assume based on that first paragraph that Robert Pape is a comfortable white man

https://popular.info/p/mcconnell-versus-the-first-amendment
(worth subbing to imo)

As Georgia considered its bill to restrict voting, Delta refused to take a position. But about a week after it passed, CEO Ed Bastian issued a memo that said the new law is "unacceptable and does not match Delta’s values."

Hours later, Georgia Representative Sam Watson (R) introduced an amendment "to repeal a tax break on jet fuel." The provision was quickly approved by the Georgia House. Georgia House Speaker David Ralston (R) did not try to hide that the measure was retaliation for Delta's statement on Georgia's voting law:

They like our public policy when we’re doing things that benefit them, and they reap the rewards of those benefits and then turn around and do this. As all of you know, I can’t resist a country boy line or two, you don’t feed a dog that bites your hand. You’ve got to keep that in mind.

The provision was not taken up by the Senate and the legislature adjourned, so it will not become law. But Ralston said the issue "could be revisited during next year’s legislative session."

booming Jamelle Bouie column:

The laws that disenfranchised Black Americans in the South and established Jim Crow did not actually say they were disenfranchising Black Americans and creating a one-party racist state.

I raise this because of a debate among politicians and partisans on whether Georgia’s new election law — rushed through last month by the state’s Republican legislature and signed by Gov. Brian Kemp, a Republican — is a throwback to the Jim Crow restrictions of the 20th century.

Democrats say yes. “This is Jim Crow in the 21st century. It must end,” President Biden said in a statement. Republicans and conservative media personalities say no. “You know what voter suppression is?” Ben Shapiro said on his very popular podcast. “Voter suppression is when you don’t get to vote.”

The problem with the “no” argument here is that it mistakes both the nature and the operation of Jim Crow voting laws. There was no statute that said, “Black people cannot vote.” Instead, Southern lawmakers spun a web of restrictions and regulations meant to catch most Blacks (as well as many whites) and keep them out of the electorate. It is true that the “yes” argument of President Biden and other Democrats overstates similarities and greatly understates key differences — chief among them the violence that undergirded the Jim Crow racial order. But the “no” argument of conservatives and Republicans asks us to ignore context and extend good faith to lawmakers who overhauled their state’s election laws because their party lost an election.

I haven’t read the article by the person who was shocked SHOCKED to discover the rioters were racists, but in defence of his initial assumption it turns out they were mostly failed business owners and bankrupts. Like literally a majority of them.

Nearly 60 percent of the people facing charges related to the Capitol riot showed signs of prior money troubles, including bankruptcies, notices of eviction or foreclosure, bad debts, or unpaid taxes over the past two decades, according to a Washington Post analysis of public records for 125 defendants with sufficient information to detail their financial histories.

lol

This maybe the wackiest Civil War memory story in a while. 20 years from now this will make a great vignette in a book on Civil War memory. https://t.co/sc8T1PwbhU

— Dr. Adam H. Domby (@AdamHDomby) April 5, 2021

http://www.al.com/resizer/BFnI2oW2apxmcR9AEUi-OCw0WAU%3D/700x0/smart/cloudfront-us-east-1.images.arcpublishing.com/advancelocal/VP4XCFMJE5FN3AN3KYGCHRQEBE.jpg

I was very confused because I misread the group name as White Lives Matter and I was like "I think irony is irrevocably broken"

In other news: https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/06/politics/alcee-hastings-died-florida-democratic-congressman/index.html

A guy constantly in the news down here for most of my childhood.

I saw the Davis toilet/chair article last night and misread it the same as DJP, provoking momentary, "wha-what?" before I re-read the name.

I would make a nice donation to be able to relieve myself on the Davis toilet/chair.

Valuing that chair at half a million dollars is just a load of stupid pro-Confederacy propaganda. The communique from the group struck just the right tone.

If the Daughters of the Confederacy have seen Black Mirror, they know they're getting off lightly.

how likely is it that they put up the banner?

also i'm holding back on letting you all know what else that chair could be used for and you're welcome

xp, Very unlikely. The chair is worthless except as a token of power, so any act of submission would be far worse than letting their stupid chair be "desecrated".

also i'm holding back on letting you all know what else that chair could be used for and you're welcome

I think everyone here has seen Burn After Reading.

I’m not sure what that is but there are “birthing chairs” from throughout history and some of them look pretty much like that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZrzEDyS9Ddw

Amazon backs a corporate tax rate hike https://t.co/81SFbxbx3J

— Lachlan Markay (@lachlan) April 6, 2021

"Of course, we'll swiftly move all our financial holdings to Ireland, but we nevertheless support this bold move."

Lol Amazon

Where did that Jamelle Bouie piece run?

NYT

Thanks

The Biden administration next week will launch a funeral assistance program that will provide up to $9,000 to cover the burial costs of each American who died of covid-19 — the largest program of its type ever offered by the federal government.

The program is open to families regardless of their income, as long as they show documentation and have not already received similar benefits through another program.

The Federal Emergency Management Agency has reimbursed burial costs before, but it has never offered as large a payment to so many people. In 2017, for example, FEMA paid $2.6 million to 976 people for funeral costs of victims of three hurricanes — an average of $2,664 per applicant.

But the novel coronavirus’s immense toll means a burial assistance program of an unprecedented scale is now being assembled. More than 557,000 Americans have died of covid-19, the disease caused by the novel coronavirus.''

Because the number of people who will be eligible is not known, neither is the program’s ultimate cost — but it will easily be several billion dollars. FEMA is setting up a dedicated toll-free hotline — 1-844-684-6333 — and a call center to answer questions about the program and take applications starting Monday, April 12.

“Although we cannot change what has happened, we affirm our commitment to help with funeral and burial expenses that many families did not anticipate,” acting FEMA administrator Bob Fenton said in a statement.

Senate Majority Leader Charles E. Schumer and Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, both New York Democrats, have been pushing to help families pay for burials since last spring, when covid-19 was ravaging their state and mobile morgues were needed to handle the surge of deaths.

“To not be able to give a decent funeral and burial to someone who is near and dear to you is outrageous,” Schumer said at the time. He said people were losing their jobs and without enough money to eat, at the same time that they needed to pay for funerals of loved ones.

Ocasio-Cortez said the pandemic that disproportionately affected Latinos and Black Americans was “decimating an already vulnerable community. . . . The absolute least we can do is to help these families bury their loved ones. It is the very core, basic measure of human dignity.”

Funeral aid was held up during the worst of the crisis last year until then-President Donald Trump signed a nearly $1 trillion covid stimulus bill in the final weeks of his administration. The details were never made clear, but the maximum benefit discussed at the time was $7,000 and the funeral assistance program was to be capped at $2 billion.

After President Biden took office and signed the $1.9 trillion American Rescue Plan last month, the program was expanded. The funeral aid — even if it doubles from the $2 billion in the measure signed by Trump — is still a tiny fraction of the $1.9 trillion covid relief bill, which was opposed by all but a handful of congressional Republicans.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/covid-funerals-assistance/2021/04/06/d7d1db20-9659-11eb-b28d-bfa7bb5cb2a5_story.html

i just want to say that this program is very, VERY important to my family right now. thank you to those reading it that pay into it. it's helping us a lot. among my familial duties is waiting for Apr 12 so I can submit the application. for all of our differences, an aversion to wealth runs in my immediate family (it's funny how the expectation of apocalypse can match a cynical view of the monetary valuation of artistic fartput), so this program makes a big difference. my mom is going to be living off of SS now. my dad was due to start his SS payments this very month. he worked his entire career in public service, working 60+ hours a week on multiple jobs his entire life, and now my mom gets $2200 a month. so just covering his $3K cremation is going to be huge.

thank you to you all. seriously, for paying into this kind of thing, and supporting it. i won't be TOO vocal and irritable about it, but i do plan on letting my mother know where this benefit is coming from and which political party actually gave 1/10000000000000000000000th of a flying fuck about covid

but also, fuck this entire country

<3

seriously though - fuck this country

eat shit USA

much love, Z, and I hope you're able to restart your (horribly brief) extrication from family communication after these obligations, if that will still be beneficial to you.

Sending you love, Z.

Indeed.

Oh no. I'm glad that this is good news for you KM and also sorry to hear about the circumstances that make it good news. It's never easy, even when relationships are complicated/strained.

I really feel for everything yr going through at the moment, KM - wishing you strength and calm

I found out last night that the SBA’s disaster loans have been extended by a year (meaning I don’t have to start making payments until July 2022) *and* they’re letting people apply for increases, so I’m gonna try for another bite at that apple. Thanks, Biden!

Best wishes, KM.

♥️ km, wishing all the best for you

Yeah, best to you, KM.

Wishing you all the best, Z.

Joining the chorus - wishing you the best possible next steps in this very difficult journey, KM.

Glad to hear there is some slight relief, KM, in the middle of so much difficulty and grief. I hope you find some space for peace.

KM, I am so sorry. My deepest condolences.

laughing and crying at your posts at the same time km.

I am so, so sorry that it ended this way.

very sorry km. glad to hear about that program.

Oooooof, ❤️ and thank you, but also it is weiiird that I post this kind of shit when I black out. At least it was related to US politics? But thank you. Honestly, in the morning with this headache, I do blame US politics for his death. It’s impossible to put a number on such things, but I’d say it’s around 40-45% the fault of US politics.

Can I name the may thread? US politics: look out!!

oh look out you anti-vaccers!
ch-ch-ch-changes

look out, ya onethread posters-ch-ch-changes

a couple holes in white supremacy. biden said “let’s fill in the gaps 😏” https://t.co/MhAjSqjSY5

— 🌱 (@noname) April 7, 2021

obviously that could be true, but from what I could tell the only primary source for that is a right-wing rag (the Washington Times)

same source but more context

As @n_th_n_ reminded me, Mayorkas, who said ICE has a “noble mission” and needs to “strengthen [its] policies and practices,” was Obama’s director of UCIS (2009-13) and then deputy secretary of DHS (2013-16). https://t.co/DgIa8aIAZs

— Zoé (@ztsamudzi) April 7, 2021

There have been stretches of walled barriers along the US-Mexico border since long before Obama was president. If some of Trump's new sections of barrier can be made contiguous with earlier sections at minimal cost, it makes a kind of sense. Not good sense, mind you. The wall is mostly useless. But filling in any smallish gaps appeals to one's natural sense of order and tidiness.

Hard to believe the Biden admin would like to discourage everyone to the left of Hillary and under 40 from ever voting again... but maybe.

the Biden admin would like to discourage everyone to the left of Hillary and under 40 from ever voting again

Yes. That must be their plan. Only possible explanation.

Lol nothing about borders makes any sense, period.

Americans lose their minds over many things, but (a) Israel (b) brown people racing across an open border to take assistant vice president of HR positions at Applebee's destroy them.

qft

Hey, that was my Applebee's position (for which I am wildly unqualified)!

imagine if a Guatemalan had jumped in line!

anti-Zionism is not anti-Applebeesism

McConnell was downright giddy about the Citizens United ruling, now he cautions corporations to stay out of politics. Hmmkay.

the "only roads are real infrastructure" semiotics/culture war stuff may not be the vote winner they think it is?

President Biden’s proposal is about anything but infrastructure. pic.twitter.com/fRtbPqg7QK

— Sen. Marsha Blackburn (@MarshaBlackburn) April 7, 2021

What elicits the most intense Republican opposition in Biden's infrastructure plan? The part about electric vehicles. https://t.co/z0jDWGrTdW pic.twitter.com/5BzgF2Fzml

— David Roberts (@drvolts) April 7, 2021

How close are we to a major GOP politician literally complaining about lousy mooching war widows?

Pretty sure Trump has gone there already

Long term care = infrastructure. It's time for Congress to step up & pass the #AmericanJobsPlan. https://t.co/Kl8xBI2acW pic.twitter.com/3GAFW74ivD

— SEIU (@SEIU) April 7, 2021

haha "it's a care train and you need to get on it"

Note that Blackburn put her logo at the top of the $400 billion graphic; then she can claim she supported that part of it, but not all the bloated, wasteful electric car stuff.

"400 billion for elder care" intended as a scare quote suggests a great deal of disconnection with the needs of the people

Yeah but "elder care" is probably shorthand for Obama's death panels

I'm almost...unnerved at the lack of GOP response to any of Biden-Schumer-Pelosi's plans/considerations/musings. This is not what I've been trained to endure.

they seem to know they're beaten and that there's not much upside in arguing just now
https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2021/04/democrats-get-one-more-bill-that-cannot-be-filibustered.html

quick reminder that in the past year under GOP rule we saw literal death panels as doctors were forced to chose whose lives deserved saving over others at least in part BECAUSE OF LACK OF INFRASTRUCTURE
likely no one in this thread needed that memory jog but it bears pointing out at every turn

I guess they await signals from their leader, but Trump, banished from Twitter, hasn't given a shit about policy anyway, and it's complicated by how popular the COVID relief bill and infrastructure bill are.

Still, a weird place to be in.

They probably feel pretty good that thanks to Manchin/Sinema/etc. Democrats get two more bills for this entire year that matter and that major Biden campaign promises like the public option, PRO Act and $15 minimum wage (not to mention the VRAA) are flatlining.

GOP doesn't really give much of a shit about policy either over the past few years as far as i can see beyond DEATH CULT MONEY MONEY

i'm enjoying the relative silence while i can

"400 billion for elder care" intended as a scare quote suggests a great deal of disconnection with the needs of the people

― G.A.G.S. (Gophers Against Getting Stuffed) (forksclovetofu)

And with a large segment of their base.

A couple of bills they can play deficit hawk on is the best case scenario when they could be facing down a radical reimagining of American politics with two DC Senators or abolishing the filibuster to pursue all the Democratic policies that enjoy supermajorities of support.

I'll believe it when I see it.

Biden wants to “take care” of your grandparents

He "wouldn't want anything to happen" to them.

I'm told this is real?

https://i.imgur.com/7Q8OYgd.png

Joe Manchin says he won't support filibuster reform because we need "a new era of bipartisanship."

Meanwhile, Mitch McConnell, Ted Cruz, Lindsey Graham and Josh Hawley are laughing all the way to the ballot boxes they're closing down.https://t.co/zydySkKA4d

— Keith Boykin (@keithboykin) April 8, 2021

screw you joe manchin! fucking idiot clown

Yet Dems need him anyway. He goes, his seat turns red.

As usual with this clown he has a price so he can flash bipartisan semaphores to his constituents. Then he'll sigh, shake his head, mourn the loss of comity, vote.

It's probably time to retire the 'he's just holding out for flying cars in West Virginia' line.

Turn. all. screws. Joe. Tho if he bails the party, that would suck too.

Has anyone heard of Dems trying to turn a GOPer to Dem or indy?

Jim Jeffords.

Charlie Crist!

I think the best bet in this Senate would be persuading Murkowski to go independent.

Biden should work that famous charm on her.

My perception of the Republican position right now is that they're focusing heavily on the state governments they control and on redistricting. They can afford to write off two years of Biden getting some things done (while obstructing wherever possible), all in anticipation of controlling the House and Senate again in '22 and the White House in '24.

And then they use whatever maneuvers Biden and Schumer have concocted to ram literally everything they want through the Senate in about six months. Heck maybe they'll even pack the court themselves and add 5-6 more justices, who will proceed to roll back most of the past 160 years. It is entirely conceivable.

'the democrats clearly signalled their willingness to consider these changes, so it's pure hypocrisy for them now to attempt to block the same expansion when it's coming from our side" - which will have the added bonus of being correct

Good moooorning!

Hardly sufficient, but it feels like another step in the right direction:

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2021/04/07/us/biden-news-today

The ghost gun/parts kit bit is a classic bit of pretending to do something while actually doing absolutely nothing at all.

The problem is that unmilled/80% receivers are just blocks of metal. With CNC technology making it easy for any dipshit who can press a button on a communal machine to finish one, you have to tackle that through actual legislation.

https://www.thenation.com/article/economy/biden-infrastructure-plan-caregiver/

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/04/biden-tax-increases-infrastructure-bill-wages-class-warfare-without-the-war.html

Whoops!

JUST IIN: Joel Greenberg, a key figure in the ongoing investigation into Rep. Matt Gaetz, is likely to strike a plea deal with federal prosecutors, his attorney said in court @PaulaReidCNN reports

— Ana Cabrera (@AnaCabrera) April 8, 2021

ruh roh

I think the best bet in this Senate would be persuading Murkowski to go independent.

Agree. If Manchin bailed and Murkowski turned independent and caucused with the Dems, she'd 'sell high' on her vote and bring home the bacon for Alaskans in a big way, then she'd make sure they all knew about it. She's just pragmatic enough I could see it happening, but only if Manchin switched sides.

EXCLUSIVE: My story in the Guardian: "The DOD inspector general has uncovered evidence that Michael Flynn accepted hundreds of thousands of dollars from foreign interests & governments, despite repeated warnings that his conduct might be illegal."https://t.co/StoLd7L6L3

— murray waas (@murraywaas) April 8, 2021

https://i.ibb.co/hKtzYcB/DI7k-BSx-XYAAzg0i.jpg

wow! I'm shocked!

The memo field for the first of Gaetz’s transactions to Greenberg was titled “Test.” In the second, the Florida GOP congressman wrote “hit up ___.” But instead of a blank, Gaetz wrote a nickname for one of the recipients. (The Daily Beast is not sharing that nickname because the teenager had only turned 18 less than six months before.) When Greenberg then made his Venmo payments to these three young women, he described the money as being for “Tuition,” “School,” and “School.”

If you don't specifically say it's for illegal activities on the memo line the government can't prove you were doing illegal activities.

"What school was this, Mr. Gaetz?"

"Sex school, uh, wait, can I change--"

"No further questions, your honor."

so

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2021/04/09/president-biden-to-sign-executive-order-creating-the-presidential-commission-on-the-supreme-court-of-the-united-states/?s=09

Here we go

It takes an executive order to form a commission?

Meanwhile, Gaetz has lawyered up.

It takes an executive order to form a commission?

Hillary's most moving book.

lol

"I just dropped in to see what condition my commission was in ... "

So that's what that gremlin Harlan Hill has moved on to.

https://www.politico.com/news/2021/04/08/gaetz-reporters-trump-480534

The whole “his denials are super-strong” outta you-know are so fucking gross, now that i’m more attuned to them.

After the first big splash of news around the $1.9 trillion "Jobs for Americans Act", or whatever the cute title is, with Manchin immediately (and typically) announcing his preference for a corporate tax hike from 21% to 25%, instead of to 28%, the process of shaping this bill into its final form has entered the cone of silence. Now judging from this thread, ilxors all seem to think the Gaetz scandal is the biggest story out there.

It's rather refreshing in a way.

Looks like I’m gonna need to buy the Post tomorrow

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/md-politics/hogan-vetoes-police-accountibility/2021/04/09/c0ac4096-9967-11eb-962b-78c1d8228819_story.html?fbclid=IwAR0nLw9kJkvi_7GBBRjPtDaq_PWYrOgn3TieDio0BUAIv5tnnNGymeBKEcY

Sorry again Sic

this thread dead on the weekends is a real shift

No one tweeting fresh meat for us, we have to occupy ourselves elsewise. It is kind of amazing to think of how much mental and emotional energy has been liberated for other purposes.

one thing that has bipartisan support in the US is genocide

BREAKING: The Biden administration will allow oil to continue to flow through the Dakota Access Pipeline despite the ongoing threats it poses to the Standing Rock Sioux Tribe and the fact that it is operating illegally. We will not stop fighting. https://t.co/t5unQPROhk

— Earthjustice (@Earthjustice) April 9, 2021

the level of racist oppression involved is plenty bad enough, but calling it genocide just makes you sound foamy at the mouth

you might want to check up on how many genetic variants have already died as a result of oil policies

it is literally fucking genocide (& ecocide). this is what america is about

denial of this is not or should not be acceptable

crabcakes and footballgenocide and ecocide

Left now literally foaming at the fucking mouth. denial of this is not or should not be acceptable.

Left otm

Good morning!

Left OTM.

There is not a single honest person in this country who, if they know their recent history, can't say that the US is committing an ongoing genocide against Indigenous people. Given that 8 of 10 of these 'stages' of genocide can easily be filled, looking at today's climate, it's absurd to parse terms— it's ongoing genocide, plain and simple. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten_stages_of_genocide

the level of racist oppression involved is plenty bad enough, but calling it genocide just makes you sound foamy at the mouth

― sharpening the contraindications (Aimless), Sunday, April 11, 2021 4:11 PM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

S
T
F
U

alternative name for pitchfork music festival

Ecocide & Juice

lol get fucked asshole

Lawyer for Tommy Webster, retired NYPD cop accused of beating an MPD officer with flagpole on #J6, says his client is in a "dormitory setting" with people serving time for "inner-city crimes" - "for a middle aged guy whose never been arrested before this has been a shock for him"

— Rachel Weiner (@rachelweinerwp) April 9, 2021

that's called karma

“Increasingly isolated”

https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/11/politics/matt-gaetz-donald-trump-denied-meeting/index.html

.@BernieSanders on upcoming reconciliation

-Rebuild infrastructure + millions of jobs
-Tackle climate change
-Lower Medicare eligibility age
-Expand Mcare to dental, hearing, glasses

"The American people are not staying up nights worrying about the process. They want results."

— Sahil Kapur (@sahilkapur) April 12, 2021

Bernie Sanders, the Budget Committee chairman, asked by Hill reporters when he'll write another budget resolution (which triggers the filibuster-proof process) for all this: "Working on it... as quickly as we can."

— Sahil Kapur (@sahilkapur) April 12, 2021

hells yeah

student debt forgiveness?

Debt forgiveness goes into the crisis queue.

thanks caek, great news

just saw that Charles Booker is considering a 2022 run against Rand Paul :)

read that as Charlie Brooker

Read that as Booker Ervin.

hell yeah, fuck you rand paul, i am a booker supporter myself

i follow booker on the old twitter, and at least at this point, he is not full of shit. rooting for him.

hi, Zach!

These are not rookie numbers.

UK vaccine rollout days away from extending to those aged 40-50.

Check out these whopping takeup rates by age groups:

80+: 95.2%
75-79: 100%
70-74: 96.9%
65-69: 93.8%
60-64: 96.9%
55-59: 93.6%
50-54: 87.0%

(Figures are percentage who've had at least one dose in England)

— Bevan Shields (@BevanShields) April 12, 2021

100%?!

💯

#onethread?

this seems, how you say, ridiculously stupid

Breaking News: The U.S. will seek to pause Johnson & Johnson’s coronavirus vaccine after six women developed rare blood clots, officials briefed on the decision said.https://t.co/9cnE2E0Ehn

— The New York Times (@nytimes) April 13, 2021

stupid -- as if anti-jabbers needed talking points

seems ultra-stupid on the back of Europe and UK having just been through all this and it was correctly overridden. Dumb, but I'm not surprised.

I guess the system works? In my non-expert opinion, though, I suppose the CDC/FDA could've said the subsector of the population shouldn't get the J&J.

the way conspiracists reject all "official" stories, some anti-vaxxers might start clamoring for J&J shots now

Official narratives are doubly reliable when they prove your point.

It definitely seems counter productive, from a strategy standpoint, but it's worth a reminder that afaict *all* of these vaccines are being rolled out with emergency authorization, and for all we know it's quite possible that *none* of them would have been approved (at least not yet) had they had gone through the regular rigmarole. I think they're doing the best they can to do rapid trials and ensure safety in real time. If they discovered any of them had unwanted effects and then kept that secret, that would a huge scandal, wouldn't it? I think that's one reason why the US has more or less planned to have an excess of vaccine, not because they're hoarding it, but because they want options should they need them. Australia, for example, put all its faith in AZ, and with that one out of the picture there now, suddenly that country's vaccination goals have been punted until next year.

the way conspiracists reject all "official" stories, some anti-vaxxers might start clamoring for J&J shots now

Conspiracy theorists are definitely consistent in that way, yes

The problem with the “they shouldn’t have announced it this way” criticism is that there is an obligation to make the health care community aware that this is a possible side effect. Have to start there, then discuss whether pause is warranted too

— Ed MD (@notdred) April 13, 2021

I'm not smart enough to know what the right way to do this is. I do know that anti-vaxxers will run with anything, whether it's a truth or lie. And media coverage is frequently negative even when the vaccine news has been great. Seems like a true no-win scenario.

— Ed MD (@notdred) April 13, 2021

👍🏻

I can’t stop thinking of the anonymous Republican operative quoted in the WaPo article about the Biden-Harris infrastructure plan who said in panic that they even associating it with “cancel culture” didn’t decrease its popularity in focus groups.

— Jason Stanley (@jasonintrator) April 13, 2021

I wish I could find that WaPo story.

so is cancelling cancel culture... cancelled?

Building broadband is cancelling copper wire. You could be next!

What are they going to do next, build a smart grid?? The nerve of these politicians. Cancel the build!!

I can't find the article, either. Does it exist?

Maybe it was cancelled.

Cancel culture? More like can'tcel culture, am I right?

i also can't find it. possibly it's embedded in a weigel mailing list piece or something.

I look forward to hearing from ILX's super-lefties why this is bad, actually.

Biden administration to lift abortion pill restriction amid pandemic

The Biden administration will temporarily lift a medication abortion restriction that requires abortion pills to be dispensed in person, reversing a Trump-era policy and handing abortion-rights groups one of their first major victories of the new administration.

In a two-page letter letter to the American College of Obstetrics and Gynecologists, a professional medical organization, acting FDA Commissioner Janet Woodcock announced Monday evening that her agency would "exercise enforcement discretion" surrounding the FDA's requirement that abortion patients using mifepristone to terminate a pregnancy obtain the pills in-person from a medical provider. The decision will allow providers in some states to prescribe via telemedicine and send the pills in the mail.

Temporarily!

Oh, Joe Biden loves his dog huh WHAT DOES THE LEFT HAVE TO SAY ABOUT THAT?

can someone check in with the left

as a member of the super ultra mega left i am not available to respond to dumb strawmanning today

can someone check in with Left

in 2021, let's not be left, right or center. let's be above it.

#ThirdWay
#LincolnProject

sorry, leftover hashtags

#ThirdWay
#LincolnProject

#FourthWay
#JimmyCarterInitiative

I'm still waiting to hear** from the "I'm socially liberal, but fiscally conservative" cohort.

**I'm willing to wait a long time.

"the carter initiative" is a good start but needs a lot of workshopping to get the OK from Ludlum's editor

The Carter Memorandum

now we're cooking with gas solar power!

What are they going to do next, build a smart grid?? The nerve of these politicians. Cancel the build!!

― Zach_TBD (Karl Malone), Tuesday, April 13, 2021 12:49 PM (three hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

#stopthesteel

Whitmer vs. Feds---can...kinda see both sides of this, so far: https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/12/us/politics/michigan-coronavirus-whitmer-biden.html

Indicted Gaetz Associate Is Said to Be Cooperating With Justice Dept.

A former local official in Florida indicted in the Justice Department investigation that is also focused on Representative Matt Gaetz has been providing investigators with information since last year about an array of topics, including Mr. Gaetz’s activities, according to two people briefed on the matter.

Joel Greenberg, a onetime county tax collector, disclosed to investigators that he and Mr. Gaetz had encounters with women who were given cash or gifts in exchange for sex, the people said. The Justice Department is investigating the involvement of the men with multiple women who were recruited online for sex and received cash payments and whether the men had sex with a 17-year-old in violation of sex trafficking statutes, people familiar with the inquiry have said.

Mr. Greenberg, who is said to have met the women through websites that connect people who go on dates in exchange for gifts, fine dining, travel and allowances and introduced them to Mr. Gaetz, could provide investigators with firsthand accounts of their activities.

Mr. Greenberg began speaking with investigators once he realized that the government had overwhelming evidence against him and that his only path to leniency lay in cooperation, the people said. He has met several times with investigators to try to establish his trustworthiness, though the range of criminal charges against him — including fraud — could undermine his credibility as a witness.

Anything new in the story?

Up till now the presumption was that Greenberg was likely to begin cooperating. Turns out he's been snitching on Gaetz for six months or more already.

We definitely knew for weeks that he was cooperating - the leaks all came from his collaboration iirc, and his lawyer even did courthouse steps interviews last week saying "In my, how you say, opinion, I would estimate that Mr Gaetz is, hm, how would I put it, shitting himself liquid with fear" - but six months is an increase in scope, yeah.

Was it mentioned in that article that it appears the feds seized his phone back in December, as well as that of his then girlfriend?

'known-psychotic-but-oddly-electable-florida-man-in-snitching-escapade' is just not enough in 21, sorry kids. *sad musics* and i'm not even identifying which psychotic!

Issues, issues

https://www.politico.com/news/2021/04/13/gaetz-bahamas-investigation-481273

Gaetz’s predicament as the subject of a serious investigation became clearer this winter when federal agents executed a search warrant and seized his iPhone, according to interviews with three people who were told of the matter by Gaetz, who changed his phone number in late December. Around that time, the sources said, federal agents also seized his former girlfriend’s phone before she went into work in the morning. She declined comment.

just lmao that the day the story broke he was going around the right-wing network saying "wow this is all such a surprise you know as much as I do"

I look forward to hearing from ILX's super-lefties why this is bad, actually.

Biden administration to lift abortion pill restriction amid pandemic🕸

Thank you, will. I didn't even know where to begin with that ridiculous post.

wow, sounds like you guys really miss donald trump!

don’t take the bait

So much for the tolerant left.

the kneejerk left take would be "this is not good enough" and "look at all the other terrible things" not "this is bad actually" get your caricatures straight

I know this makes me a bad leftist but I find it hard to get too worked up about this stuff coming off an administration that bungled a pandemic so badly that it can be framed as nothing less than a crime against humanity, led by a party that unanimously voted against one of the most popular and bottom-heavy stimulus packages in US history, instead focusing all their efforts trying to stop people from voting while trying to get as many people killed from the coronavirus as possible. there's plenty to criticize Biden for but god, just having an administration in there that actually cares if you live or die has done wonders for my anxiety

i got an email today saying that my healthcare.gov/obamacare premium had gone down by $50, thanks to the Covid-relief bill. $600 extra per year means a lot to me

Same, frogbs

seems like a lot of people are tired

...
Other presidents have been more popular in their first 100 days, Trump excepted. Biden's recent predecessors generated massive resistance, with visible swings in public opinion. At this point in Trump's presidency, the largest one-day protest in American history had come and gone, followed by spontaneous rallies against Trump's “Muslim ban” and a march to demand the president's hidden tax returns. At this point in Obama's, the first wave of tea-party protests was over, and the second was underway — hundreds across the country, advertised on Fox News, organizing with a speed and an ethos that confounded liberals.

Nothing like that has unfolded under Biden. Although shutdowns have ended in red states where the president is least popular, and although traditional campaigning has returned, there's none of the mass organizing that confronted the Trump or Obama. That has been a shock to liberals. Groups that grew out of the 2017 Trump resistance just wrapped up two weeks of “Recovery Recess” events, promoting what's in Biden's recovery plans. If there was a grass-roots conservative resistance, they couldn't find it.

“We were prepared for it,” said Mary Small, the policy director of Indivisible, a member of the Recovery Recess coalition. “We were ready for the backlash dynamic we saw in the Obama administration.”

The opponents never showed up. There was no visible grass-roots organizing against Biden's legislative priority, the infrastructure bill. One tea party group focused on organizing against H.R. 1, the Democrats' omnibus election bill; most House and Senate Republicans focused on immigration, with junkets to the U.S.-Mexico border, an issue Biden has not discussed at length unless pressed, as he was in his sole news conference last month.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/04/13/trailer-less-talking-more-spending-how-biden-avoided-100-day-slump/

coming off an administration that bungled a pandemic so badly

The current administration is still pursuing nearly the exact same policies, resulting in nearly 1,000 deaths per day, with the exception of vaccine distribution. Cases are on the rise, steeply in some places, and more contagious variants are being welcomed in and spread. The figurehead is just shutting the fuck up about how the policies are killing thousands of people a week, instead of tweeting and holding press conferences about how it’s nbd.

nearly the exact same policies

lol

omg

so similar, even in their differences

just having an administration in there that actually cares if you live or die has done wonders for my anxiety

citation needed

(also very obviously "you" ends at the borders of the United States - and excludes child prisons near the border, prisons in general across the land, etc.)

I am with frogbs here. The previous administration was actively doing evil all the time- every day it was a new and different outrage, just stacked on top of all the others. Absolute crimes against humanity, intentional cruelty, setting half the country against the other half, and almost impossibly unethical behavior. Agency leadership actively undermining their own agency missions. Dismantling the United States’ standing and reputation in the world, and our relationships with allies. Cozying up with nations/regimes who are not our allies, and who are committing atrocities and human rights violations. That was every single day under Trump. I’m not saying that Biden is perfect, but he can’t fix everything at once, nor can he fix everything in 4 years (and certainly not in 2 years, if you are among those who expect the GOP to regain control of Congress in 2022). My take is that he is prioritizing so as to make the biggest impact as possible in terms of fixing Trump’s 4 years of national sabotage as well as leading us through various crises, while navigating the difficult waters of a 50-50 Senate and a slim House majority. It seems like every time he punts on an issue that is important to some, or announces some delay, or says he is looking into something before taking action, or whatever, it gets put out in the media as “Democrats should be FURIOUS that Biden is REFUSING to do THIS”. It’s true that I may be speaking from a place of privilege here in that I am not feeling impacted by these things at present. But I have a feeling that how people on the left are reacting to Biden’s decisions and actions (or lack of certain actions) has a lot to do with where they are getting their news, who is letting that news out, and what angle is being pushed or what spin is being put on the fairly slim amount of information that is coming out from the administration. To me it seems like Biden is keeping most of his plans pretty close to the vest, and that is causing some outrage among those who won’t be satisfied without immediate positive action on everything all at once.

The current administration is still pursuing nearly the exact same policies, resulting in nearly 1,000 deaths per day, with the exception of vaccine distribution.

seems like one hell of a huge exception to me

if ppl's mental health depends on pretending the bad shit isn't happening / isn't bad enough / that those in charge really do care / can't be blamed for any of it then i'm sorry. but it is and it is and they don't and they can and should xps

lol

― bulb after bulb, Thursday, April 15, 2021 4:22 AM (seven minutes ago)

damn I missed how Biden closed the borders to non-residents and instituted hotel quarantines and established track & trace for travellers, thus eradicating import and spread of the virus and variants, and adopted the VP's policy of paying people to stay home! guess he should have tweeted more about it after all, my mistake.

And when it comes to dealing with the ongoing deaths from the pandemic, let’s not forget the Republican governors, state legislatures, etc. who have gone full Trump and are making the situation worse just so they can show how Trump-aligned they are! Not sure how Biden can fix that situation other than by telling them to stop fucking around and get things back under some level of lockdown in their states, and by making the vaccines as available as possible.

The problem is there are a number of regular posters here who assume the rest of us are morons who can't handle having more than one thought in our brains at the same time, so they feel compelled to respond to even the mildest complimentary post towards one of Biden's moves with a laundry list of "what abouts" for the bad things he's done/continues doing, as if we can't possibly be glad he ended a shitty Trump-era abortion policy while also, at the exact same time, being disgusted about his terrible handling of immigration.

xp my mental health does not depend on pretending anything.

TBF some of the counterexamples in will's post (e.g. the fentanyl thing) sound like the administration is buying time, not actively seeking to continue Trump's policies. still awful obv, but nothing that makes me come anywhere close to regretting my vote.

Dismantling the United States’ standing and reputation in the world, and our relationships with allies. Cozying up with nations/regimes who are not our allies, and who are committing atrocities and human rights violations.

shocking & unprecedented behaviour for an amerikan president

nearly the exact same policies

Trump actively subverted the expert dvice of Dr. Fauci and Dr. Birx. He constantly claimed hydroxychloroquine was a miracle cure. He promoted conspiracy theories about a 'plandemic' and 'China virus'. He told the nation the pandemic would disappear, then it was about to be over, then it was getting better, then the numbers were being "fixed" to make him look bad.

I could go on, but why bother.

seems like one hell of a huge exception to me

Vaccines started going out while Trump was still in office, though? Doesn't seem like the timeline has changed much for any of us on that front.

if the abortion thing was celebrated w/o the crowing about unpleasable lefties then the reaction would prob have been different

Cozying up with nations/regimes who are not our allies, and who are committing atrocities and human rights violations.

Incredible.

i don't really there's anything policy wise biden can do (aside from vaccines), a federal mask mandate would be a clusterfuck of court cases, a bunch of governors would ignore it and tell em what are you gonna do about it?

basically, there's just a ton of people who won't wear masks or take precautions and there really isn't a hell of a lot you can do about it

Good presidents on both sides afaict

I am very glad that Biden did the bare minimum from a pro-choice perspective. I have no idea why that would impact anyone's opinion about anything else he's done or ever will do, of ourse.

Or shitty presidents if you will

Or just shit, shit everywhere you look, both sides, inside, outside, shitty shit shit

milo - you don't think the vaccine distribution would be more disorganized and fucked up with trump? cmon

Congress should give Biden a gold star every time he doesn't fuck up, he could trade them in at the end of the month for ice cream.

There would have been basically no difference in the public-private partnerships with CVS/Walgreens that have started out as a shitshow and smoothed out over time as supply caught up.

And when it comes to dealing with the ongoing deaths from the pandemic, let’s not forget the Republican governors, state legislatures, etc. who have gone full Trump and are making the situation worse just so they can show how Trump-aligned they are! Not sure how Biden can fix that situation other than by telling them to stop fucking around and get things back under some level of lockdown in their states, and by making the vaccines as available as possible.

otm

Man I love it when people grab little quotes from my posts and take snipes at them while doing verbal eyerolls.

you don't think the vaccine distribution would be more disorganized and fucked up with trump? cmon

question not directed at me, but the trump administration didn't even bother to put together a vaccine distribution plan. it was the same as the test "plan" - just let the states figure it out

xp hope that's not at me, epistantophus! i was on-the-money-markin you

We cornered the market on vaccine supply under Trump, that's why all of us early middle-aged assholes get to have the jab already.

Trump probably would have been a much louder asshole in refusing to loosen IP protections for the vaccines, though - Biden's doing that pretty quietly at least.

No not you Karl! That was an xp <3

hey I’m extremely glad I don’t wake up everyday and grimly open my browser to see what horrors have unfolded, but I just don’t get the angle on pursuing actively *bad* policies that virtually no one who will ever vote for you supports in any meaningful way. And in fact, millions of people who did vote for you oppose vehemently.

Obv defense spending could be the exception here (which is fucking pathetic, but both parties’ greasy little hard ons for the Trooops and empire is sadly as absolute as the sun rising).

But a lot of stuff he actively ran against, and the other bad stuff (shoveling resources towards cops which they will 100% use to murder more brown people) is never ever ever ever going to sway someone who’s a blue lives matter idiot.

So, like, just don’t.

iirc there was literally no vaccine distribution plan when the biden admin took office

if i could go back and change my vote milo i would you convinced me

xp phew! i was like, have i fallen so far that even when i otm it is perceived as a slight?!

i'm high as fuck, getting ready for a 3-week self-funded fake residency (tentatively titled The Purple Haze "Second Chances" Residency Series) in the woods. the way forward for US democracy is for everyone - and i mean every single person - to quit their jobs

OK. I'll go on. There seems to be some very bad memories here.

Trump attacked Governor Whitmer for trying to impose restrictions on public activities, approved of the mob that stormed the Michigan Capitol, and remained silent about the kidnap and murder attempt on her life. He never wore a mask, taunted those who did, and held rallies in places where there were hotspot outbreaks. He decided that the pandemic was a 'blue state' problem. When warned about it in January he decided that preparing for it would adversely affect the stock market and did nothing. He loudly complained that he wasn't being personally thanked effusively enough when he sent respirators to NY. He put Pence and Kushner in charge and when the Biden team arrived on January 22 they discovered there was no written plan for moving forward.

He politicized the pandemic at every turn and always ok the side of the worst possible public policies.

Who said anything about regretting or changing votes?

i think it's less that i want to give biden a cookie for being a good boy and more than i'm really annoyed at the total flattening out of everything via self-impressed discourse

iirc there was literally no vaccine distribution plan when the biden admin took office

yrc, iirc

if it's any consolation i have not given joe biden ANY cookies or gold stars

I regret starting this thread

Aimless otm

will's post upthread is otm to me without any willful distortions, it's good stuff

If I believed that everything that Biden was doing (or not doing) was worthy of outrage, it would be hard to imagine that *any* U.S. president would be tolerable. And I understand that a lot of people actually do feel that way (I recall Dr. Morbius labeling all presidents as "war criminals"). But I don't have the stomach to go through life in a constant state of outrage, so I choose to believe that there are some things that are "good," even if they are not perfect. I absolutely recognize my privilege in saying that, but it feels necessary when the alternative as never-ending anxiety.

I mean the 23 or so people in DC/ NoVA/ NYC who actually like this dumb cop and troop and wall shit and all write op eds for the Post or the Times are going to drop you the second the GOP manages to lock down Nicki Haley as their nominee

i bought biden some thin mints with my stimmy

will's post upthread is otm to me without any willful distortions, it's good stuff

xp times 1000: imo the one thing that people need to keep in mind is that our political system is designed to move very slowly, especially when one party's entire M.O. is now dragging everything out as long as possible to run out the clock. it's shitty but the truth is that it's much easier to break things than it is to fix them, especially when you literally have the slimmest possible majority and it consists of dipshits like Sinema and Manchin who would be considered hardline conservatives in a sane nation. like as much as I would've loved a President like Warren or Sanders I'm not convinced they could fix even a fraction of our many, many urgent problems all at once either.

as far as Covid goes, obviously what Trump was doing 13-14 months ago is exponentially more important than what Biden could do now, and it goes well beyond just his lack of action. he willingly spread misinfo and convinced half the country that we should trust him over the doctors who have been preparing for this their whole lives. he perpetuated a culture that turned a deadly pandemic and any efforts to mitigate it into a political issue. if he just shut the fuck up and let the doctors speak for him we'd probably have saved 200,000 lives. Biden can't exactly put that genie back in the bottle, especially when most prevention measures are going to be run by individual states.

This 'whatabout' tendency among some posters itt drives me up a goddamn wall.

'Thank goodness factor x is better under Biden than it was under Trump.'

'Yes, but whatabout factors a, z, and w, HUH, MAKES U THIIIIIINK'

Your points may be valid. You may find a lot of agreement here with your points when the discussion is centered around those particular points. But when your hand is just twitching over the buzzer, waiting to lob a barely-related bad faith retort back in someone's face, it seems clear that you aren't interested in actual discussion.

Lots of things are bad, we can all agree. I don't know why some of y'all insist on ensuring that others feel bad about the things that are bad literally every second of the day. I mean, have fun dying of a coronary at 46 if that's your bag but maybe allow some of the rest of us to relax our cracks just a touch now and again.

froggy otm

frogbs otm

so it comes down to personal comfort, I get it, I wish ppl were generally more open about that instead of doing the whole I'm a sensible grownup posturing

as if what you are doing is not posturing

that's the fucking point. the I'm a reasonable moderate who understands nuance shit looks like posturing from this side too

Man, some of you would be exhausting to live with.

"Oh, I'm so happy, my COVID test came back negative!"

"Oh, you are happy? What about the 1,000 people who died from COVID yesterday? Are you happy about that? Sounds like you don't care about those lives lost."

xposts It doesn't 'come down' to anything. Your intransigent ability to see any shade of gray is your own shit, and it's frankly fuckin' repugnant and (imo) nearly inseparable from hard right 'YOU'RE EITHER 100% WITH US OR 100% AGIN' US' bullshit.

Your refusal to recognize how many people here are mostly with you on most things? It's straight-up fucked. There you go.

Mom, Dad, are the white dude arguing again

fucking horseshoe theory now. fuck this

Honestly, just looking at one of the URLs linked upthread about wall construction?

construction could resume in gaps, gates, and areas where the wall had been built but planned technology had not been installed...

(Biden) halted all federal funding for the border wall on his first day in office...

Officials told Insider that a plan would come "soon" but seemed to have struggled to work out legallyhow to divert funding that had been allocated for the wall under Trump to other projects.

some has already been funded through a congressional authorization and funding allocation. But (...) it's paused while agencies are developing a plan for the President on the management of the federal funds.

This scans very differently to me than “OMG Biden admin will continue wall construction despite his campaign promises!!!” and I think it’s disingenuous at best to post it here as an example of what Biden is doing wrong.

This 'whatabout' tendency among some posters itt drives me up a goddamn wall.

what about the posters who don't do this, though?

ICWYDT

I feel the driving difference in this thread is between people who think fewer people will be hurt by effecting change via bureaucracy vs people who think fewer people will be hurt by effecting change via revolution vs people who think change is impossible and there is so much yelling because no one actually wants anyone to get hurt.

honestly I think Trump's legacy, the thing that sets him apart from any other US President, is how much he made his entire presidency about culture wars and his own ego, to the point where every single issue, from hurricanes to immigration to a once-in-a-lifetime pandemic was actually about *him* instead of the people who were suffering. his entire M.O. was to punish the people who didn't vote for him and to govern as though they didn't exist. he created a culture where his voters would get furious about people wearing facemasks because it meant they trusted science and the "fake news" over our glorious golden boy President. that culture is now singlehandedly threatening to prolong the pandemic even further because so many Republicans are refusing to get vaccinated. I have no clue how Biden can combat that.

Your refusal to recognize how many people here are mostly with you on most things? It's straight-up fucked. There you go.

Who refuses to recognize this? Is it a personal attack on you when Left calls Joe Biden a rapist war criminal?

frogbs booming today.

also <3 DJP’s very kind take

I apologize for running hot, y'all. Particularly high anxiety today. Much love, hugs, etc.

there is so much yelling because no one actually wants anyone to get hurt.

I expect there is much truth in what you say. I just wish revolutionaries produced their intended consequences with a much greater record of success.

thank u I’ve never been otm before feels good

I would also like to point out that will has been good and otm in this thread recently

Lots of things are bad, we can all agree. I don't know why some of y'all insist on ensuring that others feel bad about the things that are bad literally every second of the day. I mean, have fun dying of a coronary at 46 if that's your bag but maybe allow some of the rest of us to relax our cracks just a touch now and again.

― You Can't Have the Woogie Without a Little Boogie (Old Lunch)

Your refusal to recognize how many people here are mostly with you on most things? It's straight-up fucked. There you go.

― You Can't Have the Woogie Without a Little Boogie (Old Lunch)

This whole digression started with unperson posting something that nobody objected to, and crowing that loser lefties itt would scream that it wasn't good enough.

Trump actively subverted the expert dvice of Dr. Fauci and Dr. Birx. He constantly claimed hydroxychloroquine was a miracle cure. He promoted conspiracy theories about a 'plandemic' and 'China virus'. He told the nation the pandemic would disappear, then it was about to be over, then it was getting better, then the numbers were being "fixed" to make him look bad.

I could go on, but why bother.

― sharpening the contraindications (Aimless), Thursday, April 15, 2021 4:42 AM (fourteen minutes ago)

that's me thoroughly telt oh wait none of those are administration policies, and all of them come under tweeting and holding press conferences about how it’s nbd.

The Kent variant is now the most prevalent in the US, found in every single state even AK and HI, and nearly 100% of infections in MT, ND, WY, NM, IA, LA,WV and VT.

Alaska U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Arizona U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
California U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Colorado U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Connecticut U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
District of Columbia U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Florida U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Georgia U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Illinois U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Indiana U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Maine U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Maryland U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Massachusetts U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Michigan U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Minnesota U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Nebraska U.K. variant/Brazilian
New Hampshire U.K. variant/Brazilian
New Jersey U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Ohio U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Oklahoma U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Oregon U.K. variant/Brazilian
Pennsylvania U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Rhode Island U.K. variant/Brazilian
Tennessee U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Texas U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Utah U.K. variant/Brazilian
Washington U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Wisconsin U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Alabama U.K. variant/South African
American Samoa none
Arkansas U.K. variant/Brazilian
Delaware U.K. variant/South African
Guam none
Hawaii U.K. variant/South African
Idaho U.K. variant/South African
Iowa U.K. variant
Kansas U.K. variant/South African
Kentucky U.K. variant/Brazilian
Louisiana U.K. variant
Mississippi U.K. variant/Brazilian/South African
Missouri U.K. variant/South African
Montana U.K. variant
Nevada U.K. variant/South African
New Mexico U.K. variant
New York U.K. variant/South African
North Carolina U.K. variant/South African
North Dakota U.K. variant
Northern Mariana Islands none
Puerto Rico U.K. variant
South Carolina U.K. variant/South African
South Dakota U.K. variant/South African
U.S. Virgin Islands none
Vermont U.K. variant
Virginia U.K. variant/South African
West Virginia U.K. variant
Wyoming U.K. variant

There would have been basically no difference in the public-private partnerships with CVS/Walgreens that have started out as a shitshow and smoothed out over time as supply caught up.

Jared would almost certainly have tried to get a PPE-style battle royale happening between states in order for middlemen to siphon millions out of the process - there's no way it would have gone as fast or smoothly as it has under the previous admin, even if the process had been broadly the same.

Trump probably would have been a much louder asshole in refusing to loosen IP protections for the vaccines, though - Biden's doing that pretty quietly at least.

yeah this sucks, but there are various cases that could be made (eg the US has the worst outbreak of the pando globally so we're holding off until it's under control here, or we're still learning side effects so don't want to let the 'ccines loose willy-nilly into third-world countries), convincing or no - it's the quiet that's most alarming.

I’m ok with Biden so far but if anyone wants to talk about the shit that’s going to go down once the 6-3 Supreme Court starts to REALLLLYYYY make itself heard, I will be all anxiety in here with you.

not sure how “revolutionary” it is to question draconian and ghoulish and unpopular moves like mandatory minimums and giving cops more money. in 2021.

oh wait none of those are administration policies

do tell

I'm with dearly departed Morbz: all US presidents are war criminals. It's legitimately an exercise in ignorance to claim otherwise.

All the talk about "our national enemies" and so on upthread is pukeworthy.

I did a Ctl-F on "our national enemies". nada. Could you quote who or what you are referencing?

still high

I like Biden as president because the fossil is Not Trump. But Trump behaved in ways so exponentially beyond what even our worst war criminal presidents did that a return to semi-normal times means reckoning with inchoate border policies, projects of strength overseas, cuddling up to global conglomerates -- you know, other sins for which we rightly castigated American presidents before Trump.

I mean, I don't pay attention to what Blincken, Austen, and the national security adviser dude say or do (I even had to google their names) because I know I'll loathe them less than their Trump-era predecessors.

Not exact wording, but from epistantophus:

Cozying up with nations/regimes who are not our allies, and who are committing atrocities and human rights violations

Please explain.

Alfred, I actually agree with you! I just don't think that the imperative to be like "everything's so cozy and great under Biden, his policies are such a dream" is remotely correct, or true. They're simply in line with what came before, which *wasn't that great*.

it's like edging for your mind (the table is the table) at 2:32 14 Apr 21

I'm with dearly departed Morbz: all US presidents are war criminals. It's legitimately an exercise in ignorance to claim otherwise.

this is said like once every two days and I wonder who on ilx is supposed to be disputing the point?

perhaps jaymc, the person who brought that statement up in the first place?

"everything's so cozy and great under Biden, his policies are such a dream"

absolutely no one in this thread has been saying, or even suggesting, this though!

But as ever, why would someone saying “all Presidents are war criminals” bother you if you... agree?

not sure how “revolutionary” it is to question draconian and ghoulish and unpopular moves like mandatory minimums and giving cops more money. in 2021.

I strongly doubt giving cops more money is unpopular among white people and am going to need data to support that assertion. From cursory googling, it seems multiple polls show most Americans extremely wary of defunding the police across multiple demographics, including Black people, along with an article from Mother Jones saying "it doesn't matter if it polls poorly", which I agree with but also points towards the policy itself not actually being popular with the majority.

Again, we should not only do it but build time machines and go back 50 years and do it then, but represent things as they are and not what you want them to be.

Um, regarding “our national enemies” that’s probably referring to me when I said Trump cozied up to “nations/regimes who are not our allies”. I was trying not to be all USA! USA! but seriously, did he not strengthen Russia and China by creating a vacuum in global leadership while simultaneously encouraging their worst behavior? Did he not first almost dare NK to start a nuclear war, and then later give support to NK’s totalitarian regime by having meetings/photo ops with Kim and also falling weirdly and publicly in love with him? Did he not drive Iran back to developing nuclear weapons by fucking up the nuclear deal, just because it was Obama’s legacy so he had to tear it down? I mean really, should we just not mention these things, just because all US presidents are bad? I didn’t say these countries are our enemies, but they are certainly not aligned with our values- not that our values are the best! I guess I have to qualify everything I say like that?

I'm with dearly departed Morbz: all US presidents are war criminals. It's legitimately an exercise in ignorance to claim otherwise.

You do this thing where you say "Anyone with eyes can clearly see that 99.9% of elected office holders are soulless, morally depraved monsters who would crush you and everyone you care about if given the chance."

Maybe I just don't think that's a useful frame.

further xp to will: also you probably gloss over Left's "destroy the USA" posts

FWIW, I mentioned "all U.S. presidents are war criminals" as an example of a worldview that I don't share, but it doesn't bother me, exactly. I understand where it comes from.

xp: Ideally that wariness can be converted very quickly with messaging on actual policy around defunding / reforming / whatever: ask people to consider whether they have ever personally had a satisfactory encounter with police, point out budget imbalances and what can be done with the money, pledge to prosecute murdercops and corrupt cops (mb let all weed criminals out of proz to make room?), etc. People are "wary" while what happens instead of cops having tanks and teargas is unknown: they ought to be more enthusiastic when offered a specific better alternative (or twenty better etc).

do tell

me: the main federal policies spreading covid and causing thousands of deaths are still going on. Trump also said and tweeted a lot of unhelpful bullshit.

Aimless: Ah! But what you haven't considered, is that Trump said and tweeted lots of unhelpful bullshit.

me: yeah, I said that. also here are some stats on the actual point.

Aimless: (strokes chin) Did you though

I like Biden as president because the fossil is Not Trump.

When Brett Favre stabbed the Packers in the back I remember a lot of fans saying something to the effect of "I can't be mad at him, he won a Super Bowl for us" and honestly that's how I feel about Biden. I've got the same issues with him that most of you do but at the end of the day, he's the guy that won, and I'm not entirely convinced that a more progressive candidate would have. in fact if you saw the election in Nate Silver terms: "just win Pennsylvania and you're set" - I think Biden was your best shot.

I don't want to be dramatic about this but I really did feel like the 2020 election was America's last chance...if Trump had won I think that would've been it for us. We'd be out of the WHO, out of the Paris Accord, and it's possible we'd never have another fair and free election again. Yes, vaccines would be distributed but 40 million of them would probably be expired after getting left on a tarmac in West Virginia while the Moderna one would suddenly get banned because the CEO retweeted a Washington Post article giving Trump 2 Pinocchios for claiming that masks give you brain damage and make you vote Democrat. Not to mention the shit that would do to our already deteriorating mental health. The past four years were a fucking nightmare, even worse than I thought they would've been, and when it became apparent that Biden had it in the bag I felt legitimately happy because finally a day came where my sense of impending doom wasn't rapidly intensifying. I was actually hopeful!! And I don't want to forget how I felt on that day. I don't want to like Joe Biden, there are dozens of reasons why I shouldn't, but Republicans have been electing such monstrous people that they're forcing me to!!

Those feelings are legit, frogbs

I just turned the teevee on to catch a clip of Biden offering boilerplate sentiments about the fallen dead; it was such a relief to be bored again!

(are there any US presidents who aren't war criminals? Jimmy Carter might get away clean, right? Ford's probably personally clean on Vietnam, despite whatever crimes Americans still committed before he got them out, but idk what he did as veep.)

frogs...yes.

Has there been a poll to see how many people are/were/have been all 'Biden is my guy, my #1 choice, we got the best man in the WH!'? Because I'm willing to bet that % is a one-digit number, maybe low two-digits at best. And Biden has a pretty big family, so you gotta figure they're making up a lot of that demographic.

Joe Bombin (milo z) at 2:54 14 Apr 21

But as ever, why would someone saying “all Presidents are war criminals” bother you if you... agree?


it's repetitive and annoying, doubly so because it's always posted as if it's a big truth bomb that has never been posted before

Ford's probably personally clean on Vietnam, despite whatever crimes Americans still committed before he got them out, but idk what he did as veep.)

East Timor.

it's repetitive and annoying, doubly so because it's always posted as if it's a big truth bomb that has never been posted before

it was specifically posted as "here's a thing that an extremely repetitive and annoying poster used to say all the time"

btw proz priz

ask people to consider whether they have ever personally had a satisfactory encounter with police

I would take this tactic off the table immediately. I've had more racially-fraught encounters with park rangers than I have with police officers; family members who have been directly hassled by the police for nothing, including pulled out of vehicles and handcuffed, then released without any charges because they hadn't done anything, have also had helpful, fruitful encounters with the police. Plus, "satisfactory" is a nebulous concept. If you are speeding, get pulled over, and get a ticket from a respectful and deferential police officer, is that a satisfactory encounter or is it unsatisfactory because you got a speeding ticket? If you survived the encounter, is that "satisfactory"? What is the baseline.

All of which is beside the point that leaving rights issues up to polling numbers is tyranny and we should be doing it because it's the right thing to do. I support changing the messaging to build more groundswell support for it but the primary motivator for reform is more likely to be constant, consistent images of police brutalizing and terrorizing people who haven't done anything, and even then we are in such a media glut that those images feel more like ghoulish entertainment at the expense of people like me than they do a catalyst for change (look, for example, at the past week while the Chauvin trial has been going on).

it's repetitive and annoying

doubly so because it's always posted as if it's a big truth bomb that has never been posted before

Who does this? Again, you went down this line because jaymc brought it up as something he disagrees with and table reiterated that he agrees with it. No one spiked a football in your face and said PRESIDENTS SHOULD ALL BE SENT TO THE GALLOWS.

There is a double standard that any number of generally soft and uncontroversial leftist opinions (like "all Presidents are war criminals") are either personal attacks on everyone else present or TRUTH BOMBS being flaunted directly your face. Somehow this is never pushed from the opposite direction toward any liberal positions - no one on the left takes offense at your vote for Biden or Obama or whatever.

literally everyone here thinks it's fine to say that and is just exhausted with your rhetorical approach to fucking everything

sorry should've saved that one for the second thoughts thread

East Timor.

Ta - obv I grew up in the 80s and 90s with Australian governments' ongoing complicity as a regular news issue, and the US having sold the invasion's weapons is more of a "as usual, the aggressive invasion was done with US military supplies" - it's just standard background for the Pentagon or State Department to be involved, and used to not be associated with the leader. I guess that covers Carter, too.

I find the anxiety/mental health framing (as in jaymc's "the alternative as never-ending anxiety") kind of odd - general hostility to Presidents and antipathy to the country in general releases you from some anxiety. The existence of Trump certainly seemed to hit harder for people who think Democratic Presidents are (capable of being) good people.

I'm anxious about economic survival, and about actual physical survival because of problems resulting from decades of limited access to healthcare, and about a senior parent on both counts, and about more vulnerable people than me being brutalized and murdered by the state and about climate change wreaking havoc on billions of people... Joe Biden and the Democrats don't assuage any of that anxiety.

The existence of Trump certainly seemed to hit harder for people who think Democratic Presidents are (capable of being) good people.

once again can't tell if you're having a conversation with the ppl on this board or if you are really fuckin projecting

i feel relief from the void of spewing hatred yeah. i don't think the democrats are good

well, most of them

it's kinda odd that ppl would feel some kind of mental relief from a piece of shit who literally said the worst possible thing every day from the loudest position in this country..... really odd......................

and i'm anxious about all the shit you are!!!! but you can take your projections elsewhere

call in to your favorite lefty podcast or whatever

once again can't tell if you're having a conversation with the ppl on this board or if you are really fuckin projecting

Well, I mean, I quoted jaymc there and responded to it, and various other posters have referred to anxiety that must be felt by always being mad about the US government.

it's kinda odd that ppl

I didn't say that at all? I'm responding to the presumption (stated multiple times in this thread) that hostile leftists must be constantly wracked with anxiety because of their beliefs, constantly outraged and mad at the world. I'm saying it doesn't work like that - that when your default political position is that 'American politicians are all guilty until proved otherwise' there's less anxiety.

re more cop $$$ — to be clear I’m not talking about “defunding”, which is obv v controversial. I should have been more clear in my post.

I simply have a hard time believing that a majority of people who voted for Biden — white or not — think cops need more $$$. I may be totally off base here. I don’t have poll data; just the ‘intuition’ that anyone trying to backslap cops is definitely not voting Democratic Party in the post-Trump era.

.... this is extremely fuckin tedious xp

afaict the goalposts have been moved all the way up the hill and i'm out

or i misunderstood milo's point bc it's like nested within overlapping conversations. jaymc seems fine with us thinking that all politicians are murders or whatever

Has there been a poll to see how many people are/were/have been all 'Biden is my guy, my #1 choice, we got the best man in the WH!'? Because I'm willing to bet that % is a one-digit number, maybe low two-digits at best. And Biden has a pretty big family, so you gotta figure they're making up a lot of that demographic.

there's a guy down the street who has the Trump flag where he's photoshopped onto Rambo's body. if someone did that with Biden I'd think they were either an incredible troll or an insane person. even more insane than the guy with the Trump flag.

Has there been a poll to see how many people are/were/have been all 'Biden is my guy, my #1 choice, we got the best man in the WH!'?

Thousands of older Black voters in the South want a word.

I am wracked with anxiety and constantly outraged and mad at the world though xps

Adding one more person or party to the list for the gallows adds no extra weight, though.

Who does this? Again, you went down this line because jaymc brought it up as something he disagrees with and table reiterated that he agrees with it. No one spiked a football in your face and said PRESIDENTS SHOULD ALL BE SENT TO THE GALLOWS.

I know it's beside the point, but...it's less that I *disagree* with it than that I don't find the rhetoric useful. Do nearly all presidents contribute to the suffering of others through their policies? Yes, but I object to framing this as a personal quality of amoral malevolence (which is what "war criminal" implies) rather than an inevitable consequence of the structures of state power that have been in place for decades.

Thousands of older Black voters in the South want a word.

I know there was an article on this, was it because they legitimately thought he was the best man for the job or because they thought he was the candidate most likely to get white people's votes?

The line between those two explanations is thin in politics.

Yes, but I object to framing this as a personal quality of amoral malevolence (which is what "war criminal" implies) rather than an inevitable consequence of the structures of state power that have been in place for decades.

whynotboth.gif?

You have to be willing to blow up the Doctors Without Borders hospital or aid and abet ethnic cleansing to want the job in the first place - and each of those Presidents you want to see in their best light has done their utmost to uphold and expand the structures of state power. It's an ouroboros of human misery.

. I'm saying it doesn't work like that - that when your default political position is that 'American politicians are all guilty until proved otherwise' there's less anxiety.

I'll have to take your word for it. I guess I'm not ready to accept the premise, which seems depressing and dispiriting.

Rather ouroboros than theiroboros

re more cop $$$ — to be clear I’m not talking about “defunding”, which is obv v controversial. I should have been more clear in my post.

I simply have a hard time believing that a majority of people who voted for Biden — white or not — think cops need more $$$. I may be totally off base here. I don’t have poll data; just the ‘intuition’ that anyone trying to backslap cops is definitely not voting Democratic Party in the post-Trump era.

I'm not sure about more recent data but this is from August 2020:

https://news.gallup.com/poll/316571/black-americans-police-retain-local-presence.aspx

This is also from August 2020:

https://news.gallup.com/poll/317114/black-white-adults-confidence-diverges-police.aspx

That being said, I think increasing spending on the police in 2021 is fucking stupid. I am not convinced it's unpopular.

Obama and Carter probably didn’t enter office looking forward to presiding over the deaths of innocent people but it wasn’t a dealbreaker and they didn’t exactly take steps to stop their successors to preside over the deaths of innocent people.

All of which is beside the point that leaving rights issues up to polling numbers is tyranny and we should be doing it because it's the right thing to do.

Yes.

I would take this tactic off the table immediately.

Yes, perhaps I should have said how many, or what proportion of satisfactory encounters - or asking how many positive encounters? Either way it's a personal messaging / campaigning tactic, not a policy-marketing one.

(I do consider getting pulled over and ticketed for having expired registration to be a satisfactory encounter, and giving an officer directions to be neutral. But reporting a theft, or reporting an assault, or protesting a named officer's inconsistent application of restraint, or being lightly swatted by a harassing neighbour (who eventually broke through his own floor and smashed the ceiling onto a housemate's bed, after the police refused to respond to any of our own reports about him), or engaging in discussion about policy with officers on the barricades at the protests last year, or being repeatedly tear-gassed and pepper-gassed, or getting bottlenecked with 700 ppl at the train station bcz the cops are running sniffer dogs at the top of the stairs, or working in an office with ex-cops and having to engage in polite discussion about how all juries should be abolished and how great it is just to work for fun because of your $100k pension at age 50, have all been unsatisfactory ime.)

((I had to cross the road twice on one block yesterday to pass the huge concrete barriers topped with cyclone fences that they still have on the road around the cop shop, nine months after "retaking" the street from taco stands, mutual aid lawayers, free food tables and dancers. Didn't encounter any actual officers, but it's still an unsatisfactory way to get to a door on the same block.))

i agree with milo and often find interesting information in what he posts but it's pretty clear to me that he's always in fight mode and it gets fuckin old, not least because doing that is like a complete refusal to actually like or engage in positive terms with anyone here and quelle surprise, people don't like that - unless you've got some deep seated anger / hardman issues.

also, the biggest empire on earth isn't going to reform itself and its violence by any significant amount, which would lead to it no longer being an empire. so shocking it needs to be posted 5,000,000 times i guess.

Yes, perhaps I should have said how many, or what proportion of satisfactory encounters - or asking how many positive encounters? Either way it's a personal messaging / campaigning tactic, not a policy-marketing one.

I think it's a perilous road to go down in a society that, by majority across demographics, wants to trust cops more than distrust them. If you give people the opportunity to personalize their interaction with police, people who have had bad experiences will have had REALLY BAD experiences but A) I don't think data supports that being the experience of the majority of the country, which would cause the messaging to backfire, and B) I would be surprised if American psychology didn't warp inconveniences or bad situations that should be blamed on police not handling things correctly onto a nebulous, diffuse array of Other (read: ANTIFA these days, but also GANGS and STRANGERS and basically whatever the adult version of the scary thing that was hiding in your closet when you were a kid is) because people want to believe that mental image of a competent organization that will help them if they find themselves victimized by a criminal situation.

This is part of why I think positive messaging would work better as a personal campaigning tactic; talk about funding and empowering social workers trained in de-escalation and crisis management, talk about funding medical professionals who can render aid to people causing a disturbance, talk about funding risk analysts who can interpret a situation and line up the correct resources to deal with it in the correct priority order, etc etc etc. You can even pitch it as streamlining the responsibilities of the police so they can focus their training on fewer things and be more effective and less dangerous when they do need to be involved.

(Whether that last bit is actually true or not kind of doesn't matter as long as you can convince people that keeping armed police off the streets in interminable, unending training sessions will make everyone safer)

here are the 4 police encounters I can recall:

1) when I was 13, I got arrested for shoplifting, had both of my parents come into school so they could watch footage of me NOT ACTUALLY STEALING ANYTHING, then was told they had footage of me shoplifting the next day even though I wasn't at the store. I was given a $350 fine but was told if I didn't push back I'd be eligible for a "second chance" program. I had to actually go into this convenience store (which "banned" me for a year) and apologize to the owner, not even knowing what the hell it was they thought I stole (on second thought, I absolutely should have fought this, but I was 13 and scared). It was humiliating and I kept having to hear my parents say how disappointed they were. I really wish I had pushed back but I was 13 and $350 seemed like SO MUCH MONEY.

2) pulled over for expired plates. the cop made me walk home in the cold and told me he'd be waiting around the block for me. prick.

3) a buddy had a brick thrown through his car window, so he called the cops, not knowing what to do. they didn't do anything nor did they really try but they did breathalyze him and gave him a ticket for blowing a 0.02, literally a month away from his 21st birthday

4) got a speeding ticket on the highway. this cop was actually pretty nice. what can I say, I was speeding.

here's what's infuriating about it - some of the people I know who are the staunchest Blue Lives Matter and It Wouldn't Have Happened If They'd Just Complied idiots are the same people who tense up the hardest every time they see a cop car behind them. I had a Crown Vic for a while and these are the exact people who called me an asshole for driving it (tbf, they kind of had a point). Seems to me that it's got nothing to do with "supporting the law".

xp 2 Dan

Good post.

(And part of the idea is that you follow up the initial question by focusing on what these people have had go well with cops, what hasn't (eg did they get your stolen shit back?), and how reallocating resources can emphasize the things that go well, above the tanks and violence.)

Oh yeah, being breathalysed is a positive encounter. It's a public good, and the cops are usually polite.

i’m probably pretty unusual on this board for having had lengthy interactions with a number of police detectives about a pretty serious crime. i was very impressed by them. they didn’t believe my story at first, and eventually they did. i don’t doubt that my skin color and social background helped in that regard. but once they believed me they were... how do i say this? straight fire. detailed, patient, persistent, dependable. just a world away from the lunkheads on the beat. there’s got to be a way to nurture this specialist investigation strand of policing while basically getting rid of the lunkhead aspect? surely?

I feel like even cops would welcome being relieved of a lot of those functions of their job that they aren't really prepared for

but then I don't know really know the mentality of who becomes a cop now, violence seems to be the point so I don't know how to reform

yeah.

Oh yeah, being breathalysed is a positive encounter. It's a public good, and the cops are usually polite.

well, not in the situation I mentioned. someone damaged his car, he called the cops because he couldn't afford to fix it, and instead of helping him they gave him a $200 citation because he drank a Bud Lite a month early. the cops were polite, sure, but what's the public good?

I think you really have to consider both the background a police officer is coming from and which job they’re doing; beat cops and detectives and station administrators aren’t all coming into their jobs by the same avenue or with the same perspectives.

There’s a guy from my college class who is a police chief in New Hampshire and I would really like to corner him at a reunion and ask him what he *really* thinks of American policing

Being relieved of functions weakens cops’ social position. Even if they made the same money for less work they’d oppose it reflexively (as a body, maybe not individually) because it drains their base of power.

like sometimes we get ants in the house because the kids drop food on the floor. if I were to deal with the problem using America's policing philosophy instead of telling them "you gotta stop dropping food and not cleaning it up" I'd say "I'll give you a buck for every 10 ants you kill" and once they got smart they'd be leaving raisins everywhere

applying for grants to open a for-profit private ant farm

We’ve known the danger of letting internal security forces build up independence since ~41CE.

thank u I’ve never been otm before feels good
― Washington Generals D-League affiliate (will), Wednesday, April 14, 2021 7:59 PM (two hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

don't OD on the otm, nabisco rip

it's repetitive and annoying, doubly so because it's always posted as if it's a big truth bomb that has never been posted before

As others brought up, I was merely agreeing with our dearly departed Morbz.

But also as others have brought up, it's just as annoying when people post what amounts to state propaganda about "our enemies" or whatever.

When posters here say "we already know all of this and agree with you" to more hard-left posters, what I often read is, "we wish you wouldn't keep bringing us down," or alternately, "we disagree with your rhetorical tactics." Both are fair responses, but to be quite honest, I don't actually know that many of you "know all of this," because otherwise I would expect many of you to take very different positions on sociopolitical matters. Sometimes when I vent frustration here, that's what it's about--.

In any case, I've never had a positive interaction with a cop, and I'm a white cis guy who grew up middle-class.

To be fair, though, I've been arrested a number of times, and have spent some time in different parts of the carceral system, so my experience is different.

(One of these times was when I was thrown in juvie for four days for protesting the RNC in 2000. A lovely time that was)

6 years ago I had a close buddy overdose on fentanyl and I'm getting pissed off all over again thinking of the way the cops essentially terrorized one of my closest friends - he was the guy's roommate, who'd just returned from Afghanistan all fucked up, and since some of the drug paraphernalia was his they made a deal where they wouldn't arrest him if he agreed to do some recorded phone calls, including one to me, after which he felt so guilty and wrecked that he started franticly calling his friends saying he was about to kill himself. apparently the cops were just badgering him relentlessly and as far as I can tell he really did tell him everything he knew, which was not much, because the guy who OD'd kept a number of secrets. at the end of the day they wound up jailing 3 people, one of whom was just selling his prescription meds to pay his child support, none of which provided any sense of "justice" to the family, but it did make a lot of people's lives much worse. go ahead and count the levels of systematic failure there.

Well!

https://theintercept.com/2021/04/14/house-and-senate-democrats-plan-bill-to-add-four-justices-to-supreme-court/

I don't actually know that many of you "know all of this," because otherwise I would expect many of you to take very different positions on sociopolitical matters.
― it's like edging for your mind (the table is the table), Wednesday, April 14, 2021 6:04 PM (two hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

In reality, people react differently to matters, each of us can care in a different way. It would be a little more peaceful if some here gave the benefit of the doubt that we are all mostly good people here who don't approve of death and destruction abroad.

We probably all have a personal list of which issues are most important to us, and those lists are probably all over the place. Doesn't necessarily mean there's huge differences on where we stand on individual issues, but the order in which we want them addressed could be very different.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RpkQEq75y18

It occurred to me last night that I care about politics because I believe change is possible, and I believe change is possible because I believe there are good, well-intentioned people who are capable of effecting it within the halls of power.

I don't see how one can believe change is possible without believing in the people who can make it happen, and I don't see why one would care about politics without believing change is possible (except, I suppose, as a perverse spectator sport).

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/04/14/daunte-wright-minneapolis-police-shooting/#click=https://t.co/OStVguFlrx

Minneapolis police union continues to be fascist shitbags even after Bob Kroll is gone

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/04/14/daunte-wright-minneapolis-police-shooting/#click=https://t.co/OStVguFlrx

fucking asshole FL Republicans

We gave everything we had to give. We reasoned, we shouted, we pleaded, we cried, we broke down & left the House Floor. But today, FL Republicans passed a bill not only banning trans kids from playing sports but subjecting kids whose sex may be disputed to genital inspections.

— Rep. Omari Hardy (@OmariJHardy) April 15, 2021

I was in a rage last night.

Jesus.

Some GOPers' genitals need to be inspected with a steel-toed boot. The fuck world are we living in.

god save us from assholes who think other people's everyday physical bodies are subject to their critique and enforcement

i'd say unbelievable but i guess it's not, hope everyone who voted for it dies a painful death

I don't see how one can believe change is possible without believing in the people who can make it happen

It's fairly easy - other people view those in the halls of power as obstacles to change rather than makers of change. They have a pretty good argument, unless one is of the "America is already great!" Clintonite school. These people might be able to 'make it happen' but haven't and aren't.

I mean, yesterday your argument in favor of past Presidents and politicians was their butting up against "structures of state power that have been in place for decades"? Who was governing during these decades? Who created the structures?

The worst thing about all these terrible trans bills is the deep cynicism of them. Yes there is a level of actual freak-out, especially from evangelicals, but just like all the lgbtq-bashing legislation of recent decades, a lot of the people voting for them do not really give a fuck about it. They just know it is an easily marginalized and targeted minority that they can rally people against.

Picking on trans kids is pretty much as low as you can go, it's despicable.

don't worry everyone, the only remaining arbiter of morality, sports, is here to save us.

...

Wednesday’s vote came the day after a nearly four-hour hearing on the House floor in which Democrats tried to amend the bill 18 different ways. The policy tweaks offered by Democrats ranged from exempting elementary school children from the bill’s provisions to allowing children to prove their gender with a birth certificate. Each amendment was voted down by Republicans — almost all of them after no debate from anyone in the majority party.

One of the few amendments which provoked commentary by a Republican was a tweak which would have exempted out-of-state athletes competing in Florida from the bill’s provisions. Rep. Kristen Arrington, D-Kissimmee, who offered the amendment, said she did so in part to discourage the NCAA from boycotting Florida if the bill passes.

That sports organization issued a statement Monday saying it could pull championships from states which pass bills limiting transgender participation. Florida is set to host more than 40 regional or national NCAA championship events between the next academic year and May of 2026.

On Tuesday, Rep. Chip LaMarca, R-Lighthouse Point, pointed out the organization’s recent failure to offer equal accommodations to men and women at the Division I basketball championships. He argued the NCAA is in no position to lecture the Florida Legislature — an argument which has been repeated by other Republican proponents of the bill in recent weeks.

“The NCAA is not the moral authority that some in this chamber have set them out to be. They simply do not treat women’s and men’s sports equally,” said Rep. Chris Latvala, R-Clearwater, on Wednesday.

With the passing of HB 1475 in the House, all eyes now turn to the Senate, where a similar measure, SB 2012, is being debated.

That bill was scheduled to be heard in a committee Wednesday, but its sponsor, Sen. Kelli Stargel, R-Lakeland, postponed that discussion.

When asked whether the hearing was postponed because of the potential for the NCAA to pull championships from Florida, Stargel responded with one word:

“No.”

https://www.tampabay.com/news/florida-politics/2021/04/14/florida-house-passes-bill-banning-transgender-athletes-from-womens-sports/

other things of note in that article - it still has to pass the senate, in FL. and also, nationwide, 30 other states are considering bills like this right now.

It occurred to me last night that I care about politics because I believe change is possible, and I believe change is possible because I believe there are good, well-intentioned people who are capable of effecting it within the halls of power.

I don't see how one can believe change is possible without believing in the people who can make it happen, and I don't see why one would care about politics without believing change is possible (except, I suppose, as a perverse spectator sport).

..

It's fairly easy - other people view those in the halls of power as obstacles to change rather than makers of change. They have a pretty good argument, unless one is of the "America is already great!" Clintonite school. These people might be able to 'make it happen' but haven't and aren't.

i fall closer to jaymc's view here, but i have a wider definition of who can effect change, and also a wider disappointment with "people". politicians have power, of course, but at some point, that's supposed to come from "people". watching how people responded to covid-19 in this country was the last nail in the coffin for me. i no longer believe that "people" - hundreds of millions of "people" - will collectively come close to assessing the reality of a situation or the consequences of various responses. we just don't. people can be and are almost completely manipulated. basically, all the bad things said about humans in the introduction to the Fellowship of the Ring film are correct.

what does this mean? beats me

just barely related, but i am in the headspace as this _exclusive_ TPM PRIME article that i am sharing with you non-PRIME members

There’s a sizable batch of new polling out which shows that President Biden’s infrastructure plan is popular with a broad cross-section of the public. The popularity isn’t quite as overwhelming as it was for the American Rescue Plan. But by almost every standard in a polarized age the numbers are still overwhelming. A new poll sponsored by the Times shows 64% support. Democrats almost unanimously support it (97%). 72% of Independents support it. And even 29% of Republicans support it. The support is spread broadly across demographic groups and the individual components of the plan poll well too.

According to the Times, Republicans plan to focus their opposition on raising the corporate tax rate, a move that would reverse a central part of the 2017 Trump tax cuts. But polling from Quinnipiac and (to some extent) Morning Consult suggests an infrastructure bill becomes more popular, not less, if it is funded through corporate tax hikes as opposed to borrowing alone.

This is all good news for Biden’s bill. But it also highlights one of the central oddities of the political moment. I believe I’m on firm ground when I say that most political observers believe Democrats will lose control of Congress next year. That creates so much of the urgency of the political moment. I don’t mean a certainty but more likely than not. I’m less pessimistic than most. But at least for the House that’s my assumption too.

There’s redistricting which is expected to be a windfall for Republicans. Incumbent Presidents seldom do well in midterm elections, a big problem when the margins in both chambers are so close. And yet here we have a President who is reasonably popular. He is pushing bills which range between very popular and overwhelmingly popular. And the opposition party is 100% unified in total opposition.

Something here doesn’t fit.

Either our assumptions are wrong or there’s some part of the apparatus of government that isn’t working. A party operating significantly out of step with public opinion should pay a price at the polls. But our assumption is that that party will be rewarded at the polls. This diagnosis isn’t new and it’s central to much Democratic thinking and reform proposals: the substantial built in advantages which American electoral machinery grants to the current version of the GOP. Small states have more power. Rural areas are advantaged versus cities. ‘Excess’ Democratic votes are wasted in cities while Republicans win consistent if not overwhelming numbers in exurban regions. Each feature compounds on the others and is magnified by partisan redistricting.

But is that it entirely?

Another possibility is that voters won’t vote on the legislative political issues we see as central. Perhaps Biden can be popular and his legislation can be popular. But voters will say thank you very much for the great bill but vote on their polarized political identities regardless.

I don’t know the answers to these questions, though as I noted I’m not as sure we know what the 2022 will look like as many seem to be. But all of this does make for a persistent oddity to the politics of the moment. The fly wheels connecting public opinion to electoral outcomes seem broken. The President is pushing massive spending bills which were deemed anathema for decades and yet is garnering widespread public support. Finally, Republicans continue their lockstep support for President Trump even as he seems to drift further and further from the political scene. Together these disconnects and surprises create an uncanny and unsteady political moment. Political gravity doesn’t seem to function. The political equation on so many fronts doesn’t add up. And the reason is that some basic assumptions we have about the political moment and the coming years are simply wrong.

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/prime/the-uncanny-political-moment/sharetoken/xQVFOEF4r3T4