Flu Shots - C/D?

arm sore at point of injection=classic, oddly.

It was a tiny needle anyway.

Erm, i hope you mention this to the person giving you the shot--it can indicate an allergy to the serum.

(side story: i got a meningitis jab when i was living at the residence hall, and got SO SICK. so i'm still not convinced by the whole thing.)

But as for the ethics of the embryo deal, just don't get sick. (Regular exercise seems to stave off the flu.)

Just do it, the common flu actually kills lots of people, not just the elderly and otherwise weak.

(btw, I really need to start donating blood again. Now you can most definitely feel those needles. Especially when you squeeze that little plush squeeze toy thing they give you to keep that blood flowing.)

And yeah, flu shots aren't supposed to hurt. Where were all you guys above going to get them? These aren't supposed to feel like tetanus shots. (aie, that reminds me, it's been 10 years since my last one.. oh well.)

I never get a flu shot, and I haven't had a serious case of the flu since I was wee, but we just got a scary letter from the health dept. telling us we should get a regular flu shot, and to try to get the H1N1 shot when that comes out, and now I'm scared that if I don't get the shot I will die.

But I'm also scared that if I do get the shot I'll be the asshole who ends up getting sick from it. I need input from reasonable people here.

I am that asshole. Well not H1N1 but regular flu shots. I have a pretty good immune system generally, but I had really nasty flu after having the flu jab at school aged 14, never had shots since and hardly ever get anything worse than a bad cold. Fuck the flu jab IMO.

I don't know, J. I've never gotten one either, and rawther alarmisty people I know have, over time, gone from being crazily supportive of flu shots, to blowing them off and saying it's really better not to over-treat, and to let vaccines go to the truly at-risk. I've had fevers and flus in years past, but I guess I assume these are a fact of life, like colds and sinus infections. Is H!N! really that much more dangerous to normally healthy people that we should worry?

See, it was easier when there was a shortage of the vaccine because I could use the excuse of being relatively young and healthy and having no significant exposure to children to avoid getting the shot. The letter we got says:

Key to EMPLOYER'S prevention efforts will be public information messages beginning in September to encourage everyone to get their seasonal flu vaccination. This annual shot, while not able to protect against H1N1 flu, offers protection from the flu that typically circulates in the country between October and April.

. . .

The second message will urge you to receive the H1N1 flu vaccination when it becomes available. Deliveries of the H1N1 vaccine are expected to begin in mid-October and it is anticipated that two shots, at least three weeks apart, will be necessary to provide protection.

It also says, "Unlike the seasonal flu, which mainly impacts people 65 years of age and older, H1N1 has disproportionately affected younger adults, children and those with certain pre-existing conditions." Of course, I am none of those things, either (they define "younger adults" as being 24 or under FU YOUTH OF TODAY). So I don't know. We get a letter every flu season alerting us to the availability of a flu shot, but this is the first time that we've gotten a letter that actually actively encourages us to get the flu shot instead of just telling us that it's available.

I got one last year for the first time, after spending a week in hospital after my asthma nearly killed me. It seemed to do the trick, I haven't had nearly as many colds/flus as I usually do.

But I'm also scared that if I do get the shot I'll be the asshole who ends up getting sick from it. I need input from reasonable people here.

You can't get the flu from a flu shot. If you get the flu after getting a flu shot, it means you were already infected with the flu or became infected with the flu shortly after getting the shot. The vaccine doesn't take effect immediately after you get jabbed; your immune system needs a week or two to create the antibodies that provide resistance.

Addendum 1: There are multiple strains of the flu out there. Each year's flu vaccine provides protection against a handful of strains that doctors who study this sort of thing think are going to be most prevalent. You can still get infected with a different strain. That said, trust statistics instead of anecdotes. It's much safer, by far, to get a flu shot than not to.

Addendum 2: The needles are so tiny and sharp nowadays, last year when I got my shot I was skeptical the pharmacist had really done it. I didn't feel it AT ALL. Literally, I felt nothing whatsoever until a couple hours later when my arm was warm and tingly.

That is the kind of input from a reasonable person that I am looking for. Thank you.

Second to f. hazel. Other than cost and inconvenience (both of which are relatively minor, no?), I can't see much of a downside to getting the shot. Doesn't really hurt, and the achy tired sore feeling some people get (myself included) is a cakewalk compared to actual flu.

On the other hand you will not die if you get H1N1. You'll just feel like utter shit for two weeks or so. And then you'll be fine.

If my employer makes it reasonably easy to get the shot, I'll get it. If not, and there are no other easy options to get it, I'll take a pass.

Cost and convenience are non-issues. My employer provides the shots right here in the building where I work. Also I have no fear of needles.

Most of my concern was based on a fear that the shot would make me sick, when I have not had the flu at all since I was about seven. f. hazel has refuted this concern nicely, so I suppose when the shot becomes available, I will trot on down to get it.

Man I hope the company I work for provides them, that would be ace.

fucking freaked out about this this year. every year we're like, "yeah whatever we are healthy" but now my wife has a compromised immune system (and therefore can't even be vaccinated against it) and my son is starting preschool and germs are everywhere.

I think half of my co-workers brought their entire families for the flu shots this year. I keep looking up to see spouses and schoolchildren walking around.

Really? You're missing work just to come down here for a flu shot? They don't do this at other workplaces or you can't afford ten bucks to go to Walgreens?

I react horribly to flu shots. It hurts for days afterward. The last shot I got, about 5 years ago, left my arm with a golf ball sized bruise around where the needle went, and didn't go away for two weeks. My flu shot reaction is almost as bad as the flu itself.

I haven't tried the nasal spray mist thing yet, maybe that would go over better.

if you're otherwise healthy (and under 50) you should get the nasal spray, yeah

The girl who works in front of me was talking to her husband, saying she could "feel the juices going through her veins."

I get iodine iv's once or twice a year and even I say fuck that noise.

The nasal spray is much more expensive around here tho

The girl who works in front of me was talking to her husband, saying she could "feel the juices going through her veins."

I get iodine iv's once or twice a year and even I say fuck that noise.

― pplains, Thursday, November 3, 2011 1:26 PM (3 hours ago)

lol it's an intramuscular shot, prob 99% of the antigen was still sitting there in her arm as she was saying it

Psychosomatic feelings feel about the same as any other feelings. So, in that limited and stupidly literal sense, she was correct.

I get the flu shot every year because my job will administer it at work free of charge, but damn if I don't get the flu every other year still (or at least something that feels like the flu -- hard to tell sometimes if it's a stomach virus vs. flu).

I get one every year, and for the last couple of years I've been able to receive it for free in combination with a physical, so that's nice. Dealing with the public each day kinda requires precautions in flu season.

how much does it cost at a drug store, usually?

I think I paid ten dollars a few years back.

I get the flu shot every year because my job will administer it at work free of charge, but damn if I don't get the flu every other year still

Hmmmmmmmm.

hard to tell sometimes if it's a stomach virus vs. flu

I don't believe the symptoms are the same. from what I can tell, 'the stomach flu' doesn't exist, or is attributable to norovirus or similar things. the flu vaccine doesn't work against those, it's for strains of influenza, which don't have digestive symptoms (throwing up etc).

Yeah, "stomach flu" is frequently just food poisoning or something.

My whole family gets shots every year. Well, one of my kids insists on the mist (the other is tougher). The shot I got this year was so painless I briefly thought I'd been scammed.

My favorite flu shot story was from a couple of years back, in just an every-day supermarket. I go up to the pharmacist to ask for my shot, and this woman waiting for something else loudly proclaims "I think those shots MAKE you get sick!" And her son, lost in his texting, adds a droll "mmm-hmmm." So I turned to her and asked, why would they give you a shot to make you sick? And she looked at me with total confusion, like her world had been turned upside down.

The flu shot costs $30 at Walgreens in Chicago, but they'll bill your insurance company for you for reimbursement if you have health insurance.

I got my first flu shot ever this year. I felt very responsible.

after a got a flu shot someone called me an aspie on ILM, i'm telling jenny mcarthy

I get the flu shot every year because my job will administer it at work free of charge, but damn if I don't get the flu every other year still

Hmmmmmmmm.

― pplains, Thursday, November 3, 2011 6:06 PM (3 hours ago)

getting the flu shot won't guarantee you won't still get the flu - every year the CDC studies trend data and tries to predict which strains are most important to immunize against, but the shot/spray of course can't/doesn't contain every strain out there - they do an excellent job from a public health perspective, and everyone should 100% get a flu shot unless told otherwise by a health professional

http://www.cdc.gov/flu/
http://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/qa/fluvaccine.htm

I get the flu shot every year because my job will administer it at work free of charge, but damn if I don't get the flu every other year still

Hmmmmmmmm.

― pplains, Thursday, November 3, 2011 6:06 PM (3 hours ago)

getting the flu shot won't guarantee you won't still get the flu - every year the CDC studies trend data and tries to predict which strains are most important to immunize against, but the shot/spray of course can't/doesn't contain every strain out there - they do an excellent job from a public health perspective, and everyone should 100% get a flu shot unless told otherwise by a health professional

― MODS DID 10/11 (k3vin k.), Thursday, November 3, 2011 10:59 PM (10 minutes ago) Bookmark

It also takes a few weeks post-injection to become immune. And people interpret any feelings of malaise as the flu.

after my dad got this, i've never ever ever gotten a flue shot again. it's been 16 years— i've had the flu ONCE since then.

http://www.cdc.gov/flu/protect/vaccine/guillainbarre.htm

*flu

also what kate said

i got shingles a few days after a combined flu/swine flu shot last year and so did a bunch of other people on the internet and even though it's highly unscientific of me it's put me off getting one again.

You can't get influenza from a flu shot; the virus is inactivated in it. What CAN happen is that if you're already catching something, it will sort of bring that on worse as your body is now building immunity against the three influenza viruses in the shot while also fighting off whatever else you've caught. Not fun.

FluMist (a live, very weakened combination of the same three flus) is actually going to give you better immunity - especially true in pediatric populations (plus no needles!). I took the shot on the off chance that if I got a stuffy nose from it... it would probably seem a little ridiculous for me to be giving flu shots all day in that situation.

Flu vaccines will NOT protect against "stomach flu" - also known as gastroenteritis. They protect against respiratory influenza. I have had this one time in my life and it was distinctive and horrible. Fever comes on fast, body aches, respiratory symptoms... I was sick for over a month. This may have been related to the fact that I was pregnant at the time.

But yes - if you've ever had Guilliam-Barre, I would not get a flu shot, as it can re-activate that (as I understand). For most people, it is safe and a good way to prevent influenza. That being said, recent studies show that the inactivated (shot) form isn't as effective as it was thought to be (about 60% effective; the live version is more like 80% effective) - so improvements desperately need to be made. Still, I'll take a 60% less chance of catching influenza...

Also, stay home from work if you are sick, stay away from sick people, wash your hands frequently, and don't touch your face.

That is my super boring nurse lecture of the night!

Sara, yeah, I am super-paranoid about staying home, frequent washing (even if not sick), and staying on top of potential contact with illness. After seeing what my dad went through with GBS, I just will not get one.

*fist jab from a fellow nurse-lecturer* xpost

that's understandable tables, that must have been really hard. there is no link between flu shots and GBS in otherwise healthy people, however

this is true. still, won't do it, and given my relative good health and anal retentiveness regarding bodily cleanliness, i've been fairly lucky. *knocks on wood

(re not getting the flu i mean. man, i'm still tired).

Because influenza is so very, very dud, this makes flu shots at least modestly classic. They would achieve a greater degree of classicness if they always worked, but they mostly do, so it's not a fatal flaw to their classic status.

I give flu shots every day and even I'm not sure I'd call them "classic!"

also hi kate78, nice to meet you (almost)!

i logged into my kaiser account last night and it reminded me i'm overdue for one of these.

Been feeling really drained since I got mine last week. Maybe I already had flu, not sure what result that'd get. Seemed to be verging on the constant and I seemed to be pretty much clear for once.
Got pneumonia shot in other arm too.
Then went back to the camp the next day. Probably got pretty wet there.
Now seem to be losing my voice.

If you already had an influenza, it wouldn't make any difference. But most likely you were exposed to some other virus and now you're feeling crappy because your immune system is building against influenza and pneumonia while you're also a bit sick. Not fun. Get extra rest, extra liquids (not caffeinated or alcoholic) - and then more extra rest!

do i get one of these? they are free at work and the email makes me seem like a sociopath if i don't get one.

they aren't recommended by default in the UK or germany. in fact i don't think i know anyone my age who has ever had one.

i've had one for the past 5 years w/o any ill effects

i mean ,each of the past 5 years, not 1 shot for all 5 years

i guess if it's free and you know you're not one likely to have an adverse reaction to flu shots, why not? so many people on the subway, so many people in your classes. i don't think it guarantees immunity against the flu though, from what i understand secret scientists select the three or five strains most likely to be prevalent that year, so it's always possible you get infected w/ the third cousin twice removed strain

The only people who opt out of flu shots are either crazy or convinced they've had the flu in the past few years when in fact they had something much more mild and are in for a rude awakening should they eventually catch the real flu.

ok thanks josh in chicago m.d.

I've always thought they were for the elderly and the immuno-compromised and ninnies and I haven't had the flu in 5 years, but carl agatha made a good point about herd immunity last year that I found p convincing.

Fuck yes get a flu shot. Christ. Only people I've ever met who didn't get vaccinated were "afraid of needles".

Seriously, you'll likely end up OK either way, but the flu can wipe you out for two weeks, if you actually get the flu. I understand the "I haven't had the flu in years" mentality, and I have friends who say the same thing, but really, come on, it's just a little shot you can get at almost every drug store, super market ... my kids got their flu mists at Target a couple of weeks back. Why wouldn't anyone get a free shot? Because really:

I've always thought they were for the elderly and the immuno-compromised

logic seems redolent of "why *wouldn't* you have an MRI" (good luck usa).

and our dear and glorious leader, the NHS, says not necessary.

but the herd immunity thing, yes. ok i will get one.

literally never had the flu. i lick my palms after a ride the subway and put my jeans on my pillow.

hot

You can't just get an MRI for $10 on just about any city corner. And more importantly, an MRI does not prevent anything.

Licking your palms after the train ... that's one other way to build immunity.

I'm probably going to start getting these this year. Turning 50, better insurance, blah blah.

I think I only noticed flu shots the year that there was a shortage of them being reported and ppl were advised to leave them for kids and old ppl, and I just carried that association through.

i'm pretty surprised to learn that the NHS recommends against routine influenza vaccination, i'll have to read about that, but in the US it is strongly recommended that everyone (over 6 months iirc) get one. flu shots are fairly efficacious for the person getting them -- around 66% last year iirc, which means that yes, you can still get the flu even if you get a flu shot -- but the benefit is seen mainly by those at greatest risk for flu complications -- the elderly, children -- people with weaker immune systems and those for whom the shot itself is less intrinsically effective. i don't feel comfortable overruling the NHS when i'm not familiar with the UK-specific evidence, but if you're in the US, get a god damn flu shot. if you are around kids or old people or sick people and don't get one, seriously f u

it's not just the nhs. flu shots are not a "thing" in any country i've ever lived in.

if you really haven't had the flu, you may not realize how fucking awful it is. clearly herd immunity is a good thing, but my #1 reason for getting them is that I never, ever want to have the flu again. the shot reduces the odds of that happening significantly, and the downside is almost nil... maybe an afternoon of feeling kind of cruddy.

Always get a flu shot every year. I work with the public, it's just necessary.

if you are around kids or old people or sick people and don't get one, seriously f u

so just a question: sure, a flu shot helps prevent you from getting the flu, but why would it prevent you from transmitting it? presumably, i could be exposed to and then transmit the virus without ever getting infected myself, right? and such a exposure and transmission could occur even if i receive a flu shot, right?

just curious, i don't actually know

Well, I’m glad you asked. As Dr. Zubin Damania (or as you may know him, ZDoggMD) reminds us in his charmingly bizarre video, One Injection: The Flu Shot, up to half of people with documented influenza viral infection are asymptomatic. These lucky bastards get the flu but don’t experience any symptoms, then spread the flu to the vulnerable populations who will definitely experience symptoms. So even though that asshole yapping on Bluetooth, spraying spittle all over the cream and sugar counter at your neighborhood chain coffee shop may seem physically robust, he could in theory be spreading flu to vulnerable members of the community, like little kids and old people. "These folks should get immunized," notes Dr. Damania in our email correspondence, "Or else they are dicks."

lol

but why does immunization prevent transmission?

if i'm immunized, it prevents me from getting sick, but how does it prevent me from transmitting the virus? presumably the virus could still live on my hands, saliva, etc., yea?

my guess is no, they can't live on your hands etc. for long. they need a host.

so just a question: sure, a flu shot helps prevent you from getting the flu, but why would it prevent you from transmitting it?

Because people infected with the flu turn into flu virus factories until their body can fight off the infection. If you are inoculated, you fight off the infection quickly and spend less time creating and spreading flu virus.

ok, that makes sense

Just an echo that actual influenza sucks so much more than a bad cold or whatever; I had it once, in college, and am now religious about getting my flu shot every year. Two weeks of misery in bed, and another two weeks before I felt more or less back to normal. Ugh.

i have to get rid of my flu, then wait a week and then get a flu shot. Brilliant.

how do i know whether to get sdv (single dose vial) or mdv (multi dose vial)?