MY GOD MY MUM IS A FUCKING BITCH.

I could record it, that's perfectly reasonable but it's a ritual that I've done every week for god knows how long, and she was just being a whore. I don't really care about queer as folk, I like it but that wasn't what I was mad about. Council housing in australia is a nightmare to get into and I'm probably not eligible.
I have 101 excuses.

ALLY ROXX U R ALL GOING TO DJ SAMMY TONIGHT.

DJ SAMMY ROXOR I WANNA GO!!

Momus: A delightful performance art soundclash which evokes all known senses.

I'd rather not, Nellie. I thought you were going to bed anyway! You're fucking grounded, I'm definitely not letting you use the laptop tomorrow.

The house you live in belongs to your mom, not you. It was never yours really. You need to get out in the world and make a life for yourself. Good luck.

I knew a guy with ADD who still pulled a 1200 on his SAT despite being unable to sit through the entire test. He's married with kids now.

(Sarah, the whole 20y.o. thing was my point, thanks for stating it in a non-sarcastic manner)

(Of course whenever I point out that I don't think people in their 20s should live at home--and certainly shouldn't BITCH ABOUT THEIR ACCOMODATIONS--I get yelled at round here COS YOU ARE ALL SCRUBS BOOYAH)

(etc)

who is the masturbator?

my girl never seeked out porn. watched some on channel five 'erotic thriller' and just is way too 'that looks like that's gotta hurt' 'oohh...she's faking it' 'this is disgusting' and the television goes off...

i mean porn soundtracked by dj sammy not with him in it ... i have no interest in watching him getting his phreak on...

(if I felt like getting any more authority-figureish I'd tell you not to spend your aunt's grand but save it or put it in a mutual fund or something blah blah blah)

about the ADD: I've suspected I've had something like this for a long long time. Long stretches of continuous, steady (boring) work are really difficult for me, and I'm very scatterbrained and forgetful, math is like a magic eye picture that won't focus for me. But I'm also lazy and careless, so it's hard to see where one ends and the other begins. Point being, regardless of your diagnosis, you're going to have to find away to work with or through your "impairment" for yourself; don't use it as an excuse for further inaction! (I'm guessing this is something yr folks might fear, if they are aware of the test)

ally and doom-e in snotty bitches decidedly non-shocker

Then again, this is far too much thought necessary for a post like the one that started this thread, especially since if I get a reply at all from jess, it'll be one sarcastic sentence.

It's very obvious that this poster is not on the East Coast of the U.S. but this seems to be a huge East Coast phenom these days.

i am an inveterate fuck-up, and am just pleased that i've managed to stick it out in one place for over 12 months.

demanding everyone to act and be able to deal with a situation in the same way as you is a very east coast u.s. phenom too. (oops, there i go again.)

but yeah, agreement with ally - jess and g--ff in dr phil group hug non-shocker.

housing can be a real bitch even if you are doing well; if you have other things you need to pay for and work it out w the folks, then fine. (I have never lived at home past leaving for school, btw)

my patience ha worn thin with the "my patience has worn thin" line.

i'm with ally. she's absolutely OTM... i have no time for anyone who will call their mother a "fucking bitch" or use any conjugation of the word "cunt" against them unless they're being/have been damagingly abused in some way. the initial post was peurile, spoilt and flat-out wrong. (my advice is to just be fucking grateful you have parents who'll put up with that kind of shit). also isn't it amazing how people always have problems that prevent them from doing something that might be difficult, like standing on their own two feet...

I have a disorder too, complete with suicidal thoughts and all kinds of other goodies. I talk about it too much with others I think, and sometimes I think the unfairness of it means the world should treat me differently, but I'm wrong when I do that.

The simple fact is that it's hard to live with your parents past a certain age. I'm gonna be 29 in a little more than a month, and I live temporarily with my parents right now, and it's frustrating, and I hate it sometimes, but it's something I need to do for financial reasons and because I'm planning to move and it'd be tough to find an apartment to lease for the limited amount of time I plan to stay in this city.

Ally may not have sounded all that encouraging or nice, but I understand her reaction too. It's kinda hard to take anyone seriously when they sound like they're overreacting and they are old enough to make some mature decisions.

If you can't talk to your mom (when you're both feeling calmer) and get some of the tension between you cleared up, then you're going to have to find your own ways to deal with her when you get frustrated or anxious. Do something physical... exercise relieves a lot of aggression. If, with ADD, you can't really make use of other distractions like reading a book, learn which distractions help you turn off the anger. Do like Sarah said and get headphones so you can listen to music without waking anybody up if music is a way to distract yourself.

Nobody here is going to be able to make you deal with things you don't want to deal with until you are ready to do it yourself. Nobody's going to fix your situation for you. At best they can just encourage you when you decide to fix it for yourself. And it will be hard for you, but I'm sure you know that calling your mom names and ranting about it, while making you feel temporarily better, won't fix anything.

And now you also know, if you didn't before, that most people respond to that by saying that you're being immature. Because it's hard to be mature about something like this when you feel hurt unfairly, and nobody else has any responsibility in a public forum to care about you or to know more of the specifics of your situation before they pass judgement.

Fuck's sake... you of all people have no fucking right to slate other people for posting about their personal problems.

My sympathies and all, but this doesn't make you a better person and it's a shitty thing to hang over someone's head.

that's exactly what i'm saying. it's not a case of "poor me" or trying to make anyone feel worse about anything. the simple fact of the matter is that petty stuff that annoys you now is generally pretty insignificant in the grand scheme of things and saying stuff like the title of this thread, well, you'll only end up regretting it one day and, yeah, a little more respect wouldn't go amiss... but hey, if that's shitty, then so be it...

'the grand scheme of things', jeez you fuckwit!

There is a BIG difference between foisting the guilties on someone and telling them personal stuff to give whiny-ass them perspective.

Nellie, ADD has nothing to do with how considerate you are to the people you live with, whether or not you watch QAF in peace, 'borrow' your mum's clothes or anything else. Use some of that money to buy a cheap secondhand television for your room and get out of your mum's hair.

-- Chip Morningstar (giaou...), June 23rd, 2003

i really don't have any comeback on that and am not going to get into a virtual slanging match with anyone. this thread annoys me on pretty much every level, so i'm not posting to it any more, but to the person who set it up, i do genuinely hope everything works out for you...

First of all I'd think depression is more commonly "lazily" diagnosed than manic depression. Secondly, most doctors aren't gonna call it "manic depression" any more, as it's called Bipolar Disorder and is chronic, serious and potentially fatal (i.e. causing suicide or accidental death from poor judgement during a manic phase) if left untreated. Yeah, I have a personal stake in awareness of Bipolar Disorder.

I agree with you that ADD seems to be problematically handed out as a diagnosis for any kid who has trouble in school, but I also know at least one 18 year old (my sister) who takes medication on school days in the morning and is very aware of how she is feeling with regard to concentration. I've never heard her complain that the world owes her shit because she's ADD, and I've spent time with her when she is not on medication (weekends, holidays). When she gets fidgety sitting 'round talking with me and the rest of our siblings, she just says "I need to walk around for a while because I can't sit any more," and she excuses herself from the coffee shop and takes a 20 minute break before coming back and joining us.

She fights with my folks just like any other young person living at home, and I'm sure she's looking forward in many ways to starting college at the end of this summer and leaving home, but she deals with her condition (which is most definitely an accurate diagnosis) in a way that's 1000 times more mature than Nellie sounds.

The issue isn't whether or not Nellie's ADD is "legit" or not. It's whether or not she should be using it as some kind of excuse or some way to get pity when really the issue is that she's got (not unusual) problems living at home with her folks and either needed to vent or really wanted suggestions for how to deal with it. If she's lying about having ADD or self-diagnosing without knowing what she's talking about, then she'll have to live with it or whatever. If she's telling the truth, she'll have to learn that ADD (or any mental illness) doesn't give anyone the right to special treatment.

Its Nelly Furtado. (And don't you tell her to Turn Out The Light)

do any of you actually read ilx anymore?

but I know that minna is sebastien chakira.

?

work it out you retarded fuck.

thanks N.

Maybe what I said was insensitive (I did say "my sympathies") but it always pains me to see people use their dead/dying/ill relatives as means to one-upping someone else. I read it as "I have problems with my mom." "Oh YEAH, well MY mom's dead! How bout that!"

and jody beth, *think* before you post. no one who brings up death is not 'one-upping' it all. it's the perspective of someone whose parent had died. their opinion should *never* be discounted as a false sympathy. if it is, then, that is easily a disgusting way of treating it as such.

and james, it was light-hearted, at first, in my own 'trolling' ways (which should now include ally). but then to JUSTIFY any behaviour because of ADD is ultimately the more inferior position and a symptom of our PC society. 'oh, he burned down my house, but he's an arsonist and well, that's o.k. because it's a *mental illness*... is just silly. but to justify the above crap, when it has fuck all to do with add but with immaturity is just lame.

just compare and contrast.

nellie wasn't/isn't a troll

anyone who actually you know READS AND CONTRIBUTES AND CARES ABOUT ILX would know that

cue doomies usual rant about internet saddoes and their message boards

just fuck off

no, i don't care about ilx. it's not a dominate factor in my life but why was becky lucas classfied as a troll? she obviously had 'problems' - where was the love for becky?

and yes, jess, you have spoken, etc. i'm not being an asshole, just arguing my point. i have *grown* up with mentally ill folk. i understand illness. i just don't justify it.

you emphasized the wrong part of that last sentence, doomie dear

Like that recent "I'm upset with someone who routinely gets on my nerves... is anger a justifiable emotion?" thread, where everyone ganged up on the poster for being (they assumed) a mercurial thug instead of trying to answer the question that was posed.

1) Julio is right, the early part of this thread is a "fucking disgrace" I only clicked on it coz I thought it might be some sort of joke, but felt pretty embarrassed to find that it wasn't.
2) Apparently my nephew has ADD (funny how every other kid has it these days, but that's another issue) and even he wouldn't call his mum a "cuntass bitch", either in public or private. He's 10 years old.
3) My mention of my mother was intended to lend a little perspective to the question at hand not to one-up anyone or gain sympathy for myself (Unlike what appears like 95% of people nowadays I have a really bad reflex against being a victim, so wouldn't deal with it well even if I got any). If you want to read anything into it read "life's too short" or "show a little respect". Plus for anyone in their twenties, living with your parents is not a right, it's a privilege - they're the ones who can do what they like.

when i first went to see a doctor due to certain mental distresses, severe depression, suicidal, stuff i dont want to get into really etc, i was shit scared, i didnt see the need to go, and i was talked into it against my will. however after several months of psychological therapy, with no sign of progress, i kinda wanted my shrink to give it a name, give me drugs, that way i could go back to all the people i knew and say "ha, look at me, you gotta look after me forever now cos im mental, certified, med-taking mental." looking back on things, this wouldnt have been useful at all, especially given the nature of my distress, which was sorta social fear, so using an illness to force people to stick by my wouldnt have helped at all, especially when they were fading friendships anyway. instead things were worked out with a psychologist (who believed in drugs only where truly necessary rather than as the first course of treatment) over the a timespan of nearly a year, no drugs necessary. i still wasnt feeling too well at the end of it, but im getting better over time in part due to the lessons learned from the experience. however im quite certain i would still be a shut in, clinging on to the same people and blaming the same people for making me ill, if id been certified with some sort of mental disorder or given drugs to treat it, because of the reason mentioned. instead i learned that i had to sort it out with myself, that it was my problem and i would have to deal with it in my own head.

of course, mental illness differs from person to person, and of course in some cases, ie schizophrenia, meds are clearly gonna be the best option. i guess all im saying is mental things should be treated on a case to case basis. and im kinda worried that not everyone has had it as good as me in regards to personalized treatment.

I agree about your point here, but is someone at the age of 20 "a kid"?

I just have a hard time cutting anyone over the age of 16 slack on the basis of being "a kid."

It only takes the most basic use of empathy and imagination to dig into what her various conflicts might be (has anyone even bothered asking Nellie any more questions to clarify? I know the inital post was an obvious "excuse me while I RANT" thing, but if we've gone 130+ by now, well, why not?) Oh but no, all we get is people reading her situation in their own worst terms, whatever is annoying or exhausting them. And a grand debate about physiology vs morality, seemingly as a mask to determine exactly how rude to Nellie we're allowed to be.

Has anyone actually SIDED with her, really, the 'her' of the initial mom-is-a-cuntbag post?

re: health care: taking care of people costs money. giving them drugs makes money. it's a no brainer!

More or less, yeah. Most of the 20-year-olds I knew in college were living at home during the summer, working part-time jobs, had no plans to get married or have children, and were still pretty immature and irresponsible. Go ahead and pat yourself on the back if you were already the CEO of a major corporation by the time you were 14, though.

More like I was, at 19-20, a waiter-sometimes-bartender trying to drink myself out of being depressed, not going to school, and generally accomplishing nothing of consequence. Still not sure about the last, but the first two are solved.

But I certainly don't chalk that up to being "a kid," nor would I use that as an excuse. My fuck ups were my fuck ups (and likewise, the good things were mine, too).

Even were a college student completely leeching off the family tit, they shouldn't be given an excuse as a kid for screwing up or being immature. They should grow up.

I fear that we coddle young adults (including myself, to a degree - I've always had that parental safety net) too much, give them too many excuses. People should have some kind of responsibility - buying their first car, paying gas/insurance, doing something while in school. But maybe that just goes to my class issues more than anything.

Yeah, but that's what growing up is for. People mature at different paces for different reasons. Maybe the 20-year-old who's spoiled and immature now will get herself sorted in another year or two. It's not a contest, you know.

Not that teenagers should spit in people's faces either but you know.

I'm nervous of getting involved in such a tecthy thread, as I hardly have a long fuse myself, but I sympathise with Nellie, think she's justified in having a moan in public at something that is probably the latest in a line of what she perceives as disses. She's not a *child*, no, but she is not yet a fully mature grown-up (I'm just being honest here. How many of you over 25, say, could imagine dating a 20-year-old? It's a matter of experience, and she justifiably hasn't got all that experience yet. She still has everything to offer.

Nellie doesn't want to be coddled. She just wants to be heard.

Certainly not. But making excuses into our twenties isn't healthy for the process. I see it as "you should take responsibility to gain maturity" rather than "you should take some responsibility whenever you actually get maturity." Maturity is something you gain through effort, not something that magically appears on your birthday.

So OTM. And my parents weren't particularly restrictive or forceful, and never laid a hand on me. But cursing at my mom would have gotten me a (deserved) whacking.

What I'm saying is that sometimes you grow into it of your own accord, just through life experience and accumulated wisdom -- that's not discounting the importance of "effort," but responsibility alone does not make you an adult.

Anyway, whew, guess I needed to rant. Toodles.

Responsibility - for one's own existence, for one's choices, for one's beliefs - certainly plays the largest part in that determination.

But when you chalk stuff up to "being a kid" - how is earning "life experience and accumulated wisdom"? That's what I'm getting at. Excuses serve no purpose in maturing. Confronting your actions - acting like a spoiled brat in this case - is a good place to start.

However when I went to college I learned about the difference between swearing AT and swearing WITH my parents. Amazingly, my mom graduated to calling people ¢unts by the time I'd graduated.

I had a phase of living at home for eight months between stints in London and I think my mom got through it by going to the casino an awful lot.

I'm sharing this because I want to show that people's experiences are different and should be judged individually.

no 1. last nights thing was a rant, and I did act brattishly but I still feel my mum was inconsiderate i.e. having her own tv that I'm not allowed to watch but refusing to let me watch the tv that I am allowed to watch in the ritual I've had for at least a year. It's a petty complaint, but it's annoying.
no2. I don't expect anyone to owe me anything because I have ADD, I genuinely want to move out and will do so in a couple of weeks after I have a job and the CAPABILITIES to genuinely make this work. Yeah people do have jobs and stuff w/ ADD. but they have the diagnosis and strategy to make it work. I've had jobs before but all I ever ended up doing was frustrate the managers and the people who work around me . It's not fair on them, and I'd rather make this job long term then have to be bailed out when It all falls apart. Last night's little tanty was just as much about me feeling powerless as it was about my annoyance over my mother's actions.
no3. My sister lives at home also, she is 23. My parents have no problem with her being there. It really is just a clash of personalities. My mother and myself are very similar.
no4. I swear a lot, and I love using the word cunt. so I what I said was no more offensive than if I called her a dickhead,.. and I didn't swear at her during the argument I swore at her recounting the story later.
*exhales* I think that's it. Oh, Ally.. I apologize, I was in a shitty mood and I would genuinely like to hear any tips you have for entering the real world with some sort of disorder, whatever it may be.

Is cunt all that much more offensive than dickhead? Like next-level offensive?

I think my favorite bad word moment was when my brother called me a son of a bitch.

(sorry, we now returm you to your regular non-withnail-geek thread)

my friends brother has some kind of disorder, which has led to him going down the wrong track, in prison, losing sons etc, suicide attempt in jail cell aged 20, all that stuff that everyone knows at least one person on that track, which culminated in a knife attack in which he has been slashed from eye to mouth.

and of course the world that he moves in causes problems for my friend, people turning up in the middle of the night looking for him, demanding money all that stuff. and she has to be harsh, she has to turn him away sometimes, which is tough when hes in a hospital bed and everything. but, its a hereditary degenerative disease which they only just found out the dad had a couple months ago, and explained him living on the streets for the last 25 years, and his own alcoholism.

of course, she cant tell the brother this because hes not in a fit state to process it, so she has to make allowances, while at the same time knowing that it could hit her at any moment, and she may go insane herself. its difficult, because until what point does the illness justify the behaviour, and if shes too judgemental about it, she may end up following similar paths herself once it hits.

as for the above post, whether its a spoilt brat or a serious illness maybe isnt the point. it could be either, perhaps both, each individual case is very difficult to judge from afar, and i think its good that people gave it the time of day, and made the effort to respond.

mental illness is not a badge, and shouldnt be glorified.

You can't do that, this thread is *owned* by a withnail geek.

Tourette's Syndrome as well? Your house must be so much fun...

Nellie, I kiss you!

i didnt know if there was anything wrong with it for a long time andrew, and then i got into a screaming match with my dad over coffee cups and then i thought, fuck this, "if i'm going to get into an argument with someone over coffee cups, i might as well be fucking them."

I never would have taken this guy for a coffee cup fucker.

I'll be honest. I find that somewhat disturbing, but I am nobody to judge. I never had thoughts about sexual intercourse with any of my parents.

Having said that, that reminded me of this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dOxHc4Ix7c