S&D: national parks, etc.

One could argue that helicopters aren't as bad as hikers crawling all over it, dropping litter, having to be rescued....

excellent, the place is massive, let the choppers rim the north, then everyone's happy.

/gentle Ben Episode

I'm not throwing up my hands. I'm arguing for priorities.

The Forest of Bowland (in Lancashire, east of Preston and west of Clitheroe) has almost no trees at all, apparently. I think 'forest' originally just meant 'wilderness', without the implied woods.

I love the way the New Forest is New because it's only 950 years old.

Bryce Canyon
Mesa Verde
Monument Valley
Petrified Forest
?

Any other suggestions, in the general vicinity? (Going to the Grand Canyon, of course) Thanks!

There are many other places in the Southwest on the level of Bryce that would be more interesting than the others. How long do you have and what will your route be like?

http://www.americansouthwest.net/utah/goblin_valley/state_park.html

Mesa Verde is fun, but really it's half a day's worth of touring around, full day if you do Cliff house and the other big one-- can't remember it's name. Take the hike to the petroglyphs, it takes some time but it's worth it. Don't worry, you'll know them when you see them (we spent all this time wondering if we had inadvertently walked past them). If you have to drive back up towards the Canyonlands from there, a side trip to Telluride is scenic as hell too.

Glyphs:
http://mediaservice.photoisland.com/auction/Mar/2004336487288637573215.jpg
Telluride:
http://mediaservice.photoisland.com/auction/Mar/2004338562776854577735.jpg

http://www.terrachroma-inc.com/images/desert/petroglyphs.jpg

http://mediaservice.photoisland.com/auction/Mar/2004333894074221023597.jpg

However, if I were you, my route would skip Mesa Verde (you can see similar, perhaps more impressive, things without going that far afield) and the Petrified Forest (same), unless you really wanted to go to Four Corners (why?), cross the Hopi reservation (I'd be quite interested in this, but you said you were more interested in nature than culture) or see Canyon de Chelly and the bigger tribal cities of the Navajo Res (beautiful, but not like Utah, and again more culture than nature).

I would also skip Vegas and Hoover Dam, but then again I have pretty much zero interest in those places. For me, it would be worth it only if you want to go to the Lower Grand Canyon sections of the Hualapai or Havasupai Indian Reservations (which would take more time than you have to really experience, I think) and/or drive a small section of AZ Route 66 (and I have no idea how interesting that section is). The better route is to the North of the Canyon through Page.

Can you really do all this in ten days?

I'll propose an alternate route within the next few days.

I liked Mesa Verde, especially seeing the cliff dwellings up close--and being so high up that we could see the snow on the Rockies and turning around in the opposite direction, Shiprock in New Mexico. I also loved staying in Moab and driving around Arches and vicinity. I got interested in Route 66 when I was a kid, so driving the longest single preserved stretch in AZ was quite exciting for me, although after you go through Seligman (worth a stop if you're even slightly into kitsch value, and there is a diner there with excellent chicken-fried steak) there's not much else to really *see* in a tour type way. One place I'd also recommend looking into: the 'ghost town' of Oatman--not really a ghost town, but it's along a smaller stretch of the old highway and another amazing drive through desert/mountains there and out. It's famous for roaming semi-wild packs of burros, and the girls that gave it its name, and has the original old west-style buildings and sidewalks in place.

I could go on with further recommendations since it was the trip of a lifetime for me, but to save space I'll also recommend a book: 'Roadtrip USA: California and the southwest' by Jamie Jensen--clued me into a lot of stuff off the main tourist drags and some excellent stops and small but beautiful highways. For your purposes, probably best for AZ and route 66 and Nevada stuff.

Based in large part on those books, as well as on my familiarity with the area and maps, I came up with a moderately-detailed itinerary of what I might do if I had your constraints and interests. Keep in mind that I’ve been to the Grand Canyon and much of Arizona to the East of it (but not north to Page), as well as through a good chunk of Southeast Utah (below Canyonlands) and the corner of Colorado near Mesa Verde. But I’ve never been to the bulk of the places in Utah that I recommend, though I’ve read lots about them and talked to people about them.

One deviation from your plans is that I skip Vegas. I’m sure it’s worth it if you’re interested in going there (I’m not), but I wouldn’t go if you want to focus on the canyon country. It will add an extra 200 driving miles to your trip versus my route. And, unless you take the Route 66 detour along much of the interstate between Williams and Kingman, AZ, the entire route in AZ West of the Grand Canyon will have little scenic value (most of the route from Vegas to Zion is supposed to be beautiful, though I don’t know that it’s more beautiful than the route I propose, which is all-scenic, all the time). I also skip Petrified Forest because it’s way out of the way given the other stuff you want to see. If you really want to see petrified wood, I recommend a detour to Escalante State Park, about 40 miles East of Bryce Canyon on Utah 12.

I also go counter-clockwise instead of clockwise. I’m not sure I have a rationale, it just seems to make sense to me to do it that way. Perhaps I think it’s more climactic.

In general, I focus on some of the more impressive park areas, and try to allow enough time to experience the sights you can drive to and allow time to hike at them to get different perspectives and not sit behind a wheel the whole time. It’s possible that I’m underestimating the time (or overestimating?). I definitely shortchange Zion NP, and avoid completely some other areas (some of the great canyons surrounding Lake Powell such as Grand Gulch, Paria and Dark Canyon and many in the Escalante area), because these places seem best appreciated through more extended hikes if not backpacking trips, and may be underwhelming otherwise. I’m also not tied to the National Parks themselves – I think you’re overrating places because they have National Park designations – and paying attention to some of the National Monuments and Tribal and State Parks that may be more interesting.

I also would want to find lodging as close to the sights as you can, which may allow you more flexibility (especially at the Grand Canyon) in visiting them (though less flexibility, admittedly, in your route planning). If you do this, even this early in the season, you’re going to have to reserve in advance. Like now. It may be impossible. And staying at the parks may well be more expensive than staying in motels further away, though I think they are relatively inexpensive on the whole. At the Grand Canyon, there are at least four lodges at the actual rim of the canyon. The best is the beautiful (and expensive) El Tovar Hotel. I recommend staying at one of the cheap ones (I don’t remember if the Bright Angel is more or less expensive than the very low-rent-looking Kachina and Thunderbird twins, the ones my family always stayed in), but eating at least one meal (we used to go for both breakfast and dinner) in the wonderful dining room of the El Tovar. At Bryce Canyon, try to stay at the Bryce Canyon Lodge. Goulding’s Lodge is just down the road from Monument Valley.

My itinerary

Day 1
Drive to Bryce Canyon from Salt Lake City. It’s a long way, so I dunno how it fits your plans, but I think it makes sense to start here, and I would want to stay a night at Bryce so that I could see it at sunrise. For maximum scenic value on the way down, I would take I-15 South to US 28 South to US 89 South to UT 12 East to Bryce. If there’s time left in the day, go to the visitor center and check out what’s going on and/or drive the Scenic drive.

Day 2
Watch the sunrise from Sunrise Point at Bryce.
Hike into the amphitheater either via the nearby Queen’s Garden trail (hour and a half roundtrip) or walk back to Sunset Point and do a loop hike, following the Navajo trail into the amphitheater to the Queen’s Garden Trail back to Sunrise Point.
Drive the scenic drive to the extent you didn’t see it yesterday.
Leave Bryce, taking UT 12 West to US 89 South to UT 9 West to Zion Canyon Visitor Center.
Check out the visitor center and drive the Zion Canyon Scenic Drive.
At the end of the drive, hike the Gateway to the Narrows Trail to the Virgin River Narrows at the entrance to Upper Zion Canyon (allow 2 hours). Or take the shorter Weeping Rock trail to see some of the famous Zion waterfalls.
Stay somewhere in the vicinity such as the Mormon settlement of Springdale, just outside the South entrance of the Park, or double back East on UT 9 to US 89 to the ranch town Kanab at the foot of the Vermillion Cliffs and home to movie shoots.

Day 3
From Kanab, drive East across the Vermillion Cliffs via either US 89 or 89A (turning East after going South to Fredonia). I’m not sure which is more scenic. 89A spends a long time at the foot of the Vermillion Cliffs, and takes you across Marble Canyon towards its end, so that will definitely be nice. But 89 passes through the lower end of the Grand Staircase-Escalante National Monument and goes directly to Page.
There are a few things to do in or near Page. The best would be to take a tour (the Navajo don’t let you go there on your own) to and into nearby Antelope Canyon, one of the most dramatic slot canyons in the Southwest. Search for pictures of it on the net and you’ll see why you want to go. The upper section is easier to get into than the lower. You can also tour nearby 710-foot Glen Canyon Dam, which created Lake Powell (and submerged Glen Canyon, which some people consider one of the great environmental crimes) and Wahweap Marina on the Lake. And if you have time, check out the museum devoted to Maj. John Wesley Powell, an early explorer of the Grand Canyon.
Past Page or Marble Canyon, continue South on US 89.through the Echo Cliffs and Painted Desert to the junction with AZ 64.
Follow AZ 64 West to the South Rim of Grand Canyon.

Days 4-5
Spend all of day 4 at the Canyon before leaving early or mid-day on day 5. I’m not sure what the best order to do everything would be but you’ll want to do the following:
Watch the sunrise and sunset
Drive the West Rim and Desert View (East Rim) drives. There are multiple places to stop and look at new parts of the canyon, and trails that connect some of the points. You don’t need to stop at all of them, though you may want to. You shouldn’t miss Grandview Point on the East Rim, and I recall Pima on the West being good too. Desert View Point in the east will give you a good view of some interesting sights East of the Canyon. You may want to save some or all of the East Rim for the drive out on Day 5.
Visit the gift shops at the Village and Desert View tower (the last point before leaving the canyon in the East).
Take a hike below the rim on either the Bright Angel trail (accessed from the village, easier, more touristy) or the South Kaibab Trail (at Yaki Point on the East Rim Drive; a bit steeper, but nothing difficult, slightly less touristy, better views, going Cedar Ridge is a good half-day hike).

Days 5
Drive out of the canyon along the East Rim drive as per above.
Continue East on AZ 64 back through the Painted Desert to US 89.
Take 89 north to the junction with US 160.
Take US 160 Northeast to Kayenta.
At Kayenta, join US 163 North to Monument Valley.
View the "mittens" of Monument Valley from the overlook. If desired, drive the self-guided scenic drive of the monument. If you don’t have a 4WD or at least high clearance vehicle, the route is passable in dry weather, but it will be slow and difficult. Alternatively, take a guided Navajo vehicle or horseback tour. I think the official ones won’t be running until later in the season, but you’ll probably find lots of other people offering. Goulding’s itself also runs tours. Be sure to check out the famous Trading Post there.
If you haven’t gotten one along the road somewhere during the day, have a Navajo taco for dinner.

Day 6
Drive US 163 Northeast to Mexican Hat, UT.
Just beyond the Hat (the city, not the rock), detour on UT 261 and then 316 to the overlook for Goosenecks State Park, a great view of the dramatic Goosenecks of the San Juan River. Return to 163 East.
Drive 163 East along Comb Ridge and the San Juan River towards Bluff.
If you have a high-clearance vehicle, and it’s not raining, you may want to follow the detour between Mexican Hat and Bluff to a scenic dirt loop road through the Valley of the Gods, which sounds like a mini compilation of many of the parks that surround it. Allow an hour to an hour and a half for the detour.
From Bluff, continue on UT 163 to UT 262 into Colorado until the junction with US 160. Detour Southwest to Four Corners if you wish and return.
Follow US 160 East and turn North where the road joins US 666 (!) towards Cortez.
At Cortez, turn East on 160 to the turnoff to Mesa Verde.
Spend the afternoon at Mesa Verde. I don’t have much to say about it, because I don’t know it well. Unfortunately, I think the three largest cliff dwellings will be closed while you’re there (some of them open April 11). But the ones that are open sound like it will be worth the trip. It sounds like you want to visit the museum, drive the loop road, and take a self-guided tour to Spruce Tree House. Then walk around one or more of the Chapin Mesa trails. Walking to Soda Canyon Overlook will give you a view of Balcony House while the Spruce Canyon Loop trail will let you hike along the canyon bottom. Or you can walk to the Far View Archaeological sites.
You can spend the night at the Far View Lodge in the park or somewhere in Cortez

Day 7
See more Mesa Verde if you didn’t get enough the day before (the entrance fee is still good)
From Cortez, take US 666 West
At Monticello, Utah, turn north on US 161
Detour on Utah 211 to the Needles section of Canyonlands National Park.
At Needles, drive to Big Spring Canyon Overlook. If you have a 4WD vehicle, drive one of the trails or take a hike. They’re all pretty long though. A shorter one that sounds good to me is the hike to Chesler Park from Elephant Hill Trailhead (6 mi RT).
Return on 211 to 161. Spend the night in Monticello or drive North to Moab.

Days 8-9
I’d spend these two days in the vicinity of Moab, visiting the surrounding parks – Arches, the Island in the Sky district of Canyonlands, Dead Horse Point State Park, and the area known as Behind the Rocks (now a wilderness area?). I recommend various drives and hikes, but you can do all sorts of stuff here – take river trips (I don’t know if day trips are possible in this area), jeep tours on the 4WD trails in the parks, or go mountain biking on the Slickrock Trail (highly recommended if you’re a bike person, but be careful – people have died here).
I would spend a full day at Arches, checking out the Visitor Center (pick up the auto tour guide), driving the Park Road and checking out the viewpoints. I would do the hike to Delicate Arch (RT 3 mi) in mid to later afternoon.
To the extent time remains in another day, I would visit the overlook at Dead Horse Point and tour Island in the Sky on your own or with a jeep trip on the White Rim trail or a river tour. Some good-sounding hikes include the strenuous (but not Gooseberry Trail down below the rim to the 4WD trail, and the Grand View Trail along the rim from Grandview point.

Day 10
Drive North from Moab on UT 128 past the Fisher Towersto I-70. Take 70 West to Green River. From here, there are various routes you can take. I would continue on 70 over the San Rafael Swell to Salina, and then return to Salt Lake on Utah 28.
If you have a lot of time, you might want to detour south on Utah 24 to Goblin Valley, and then perhaps continue on 24 through Capitol Reef National Park.
If you’re pressed for time, the best approach might be to head north to Price on US 6/191, the second half of which is scenic, and continue to Salt Lake from there.

Additional Option: River Trips
While I’m not sure how conducive the weather will be while you’re there, if it’s appropriate, I’d highly recommend taking a day-long or half-day raft trip on one of the rivers of the canyon country. It will get you both out of the car and off your feet while giving you an upclose view of canyons very different from those you’ll get from an overlook or even on a trail. And it can also be incredibly relaxing or exciting, or both. Various commercial outfitters will set up the trip, including transportation to or from the put-in/put-out. Holiday River Expeditions, for instance, runs trips all over the area. If you can find a trip that will let you go even part of the way on your own in say an inflatable kayak (very easy to handle if you’ve never done it before), so much the better, though I imagine this will be hard to find for single-day trips.

There are two places that on the Colorado itself that seem optimal for river trips. One is near Page – outfitters will take you down the canyon below Page to Lees Ferry near Marble Canyon. I’m not sure if these will be running at the time you’re there. The other place is around Moab – outfitters there will take you northeast toward the Fisher Towers area and float back to town.

There are two more subtle and placid options on tributaries of the Colorado that I think might be even better choices. One option is in beautiful Gray Canyon on the Green River north of the town of Green River. The other is on a section of river that I’ve rafted/kayaked twice – the San Juan from Bluff to Mexican Hat. This is a really wonderful trip that is mostly calm (there are a few small rapids along the way), takes you through some diverse environments and beautiful scenery and lets you get up close to a number of archaeological sites (including the Butler Wash panel upthread). While often done in 3 days, Wild Rivers Expeditions of Bluff (among others? it’s the best) runs a 1-day trip here that uses motors part of the time and human power the rest. There was a recent article on this section of the river in the New York Times travel section, which may mean it’s totally booked.

You could do one of these by, say, dropping the trip to the Needles section of Canyonlands.

Alternate Option: Betatakin
I think I’d probably go to Mesa Verde, even if most of the dwellings will be closed. But you can see an equally if not more impressive Anasazi ruin – Betatakin – without detouring there. It’s at the Navajo National Monument, just a mile off the road you take from the Grand Canyon to Monument Valley. The catch is that to see the ruin up close, you need to take a guided hike with an interpreter, it’s 5 miles RT and they only depart first thing in the morning. And at this time of year, you’d have to call in advance to make sure they’re running it (I think they do it as long as there’s no snow on the ground). But if you choose this, you wouldn’t have to go off into Colorado (admittedly not that far). Instead, you could head North from Mexican Hat up UT 261, following the great Moki Dugway (a dirt or gravel road that switchbacks up a big hill with incredible views) and then check out the Natural Bridges National Monument (a place you could spend a day at) a few miles West of where 261 meets UT 95 (on UT 275), and then take UT 95 East to 161 near Blanding and rejoin the route north to Monticello as above.

I don't mention the place above, because it's not that exciting if you don't get up close to the ruin. But it may be worth stopping at if you have the time to see the visitor center. There's a mile hike - the Sandal Trail - to an overlook that lets you look across the canyon at the ruin set into the cliff.

Arches
Mesa Verde
Petrified Forest/Painted Desert
Grand Canyon
Zion

Also went to the Meteor Crater (near Winslow, AZ) which had a great museum, Flagstaff (and had the largest burrito in the world. It had the dimensions of a POUND CAKE, I mean, good lord.), Hoover Dam, Las Vegas (one day was enough...sooo cheesy. Food was excellent, though. Won $69 at craps! Woo! All the free entertainment at the casinos was laughably bad and seemingly aimed at easily amused middle-aged men and 3rd graders.), and Salt Lake City.

I went on the Petroglyph hike at Mesa Verde, and it was a really fun hike - you have to do a bit of climbing (i.e. grabbing rocks with your hands and pulling yourself up!) but it's worth it for the views.

There's only so much petrified wood a person needs to see, BUT, I highly recommend seeing the badlands at the Petrified Forest N.P. - that place is like being on another planet. Wow.

At the Grand Canyon, we did a rim trail one day (started at the Abyss and walked westward to Hermit's Ridge), and a hike into the canyon the next day (South Kaibab trail - 3 miles to Skeleton Point, and back). Hiking into the canyon lets you see everything so much clearer than from the rim - the smog is considerably noticeable from the rim...it's kinda sad. It actually took the same amount of time going down into the canyon as it did coming back up, because I didn't wear hiking shoes and the trail has a lot of small pebbles and loose dirt...so I had to be really careful going down, but going back up was no problem.

Zion - fantastic rock formations, several easy hikes, a few waterfalls...good stuff.

And...late March was a perfect time to go. The weather was warm, not hot, and there were cool breezes. I didn't even break out into a sweat on all of the hikes! And, there were not huge crowds (except in Las Vegas).

Smog in Grand Canyon? You sure? Maybe it was just a nature-made fog because there shouldn't be enough pollution around there to produce smog. (btw, Painted Desert is supposed to have the cleanest air in the continental US)

In the 1980s the Navajo Generating Station at Page, Arizona, (15 miles away) was identified as the primary source for anywhere from fifty percent to ninety percent of the Grand Canyon's air quality problems. In 1999, the Mohave generating Station in Laughlin, Nev (75) miles away settled a long standing lawsuit and agreed to install end-of-point sulfur scrubbers on its smoke stacks.

The primary mobile source of Grand Canyon haze, the automobile, is currently regulated under a series of federal, state and local initiatives. The Grand Canyon Visibility Transport Commission cites U.S. government laws regulating automobile emissions and gasoline standards, often slow to change because of the automobile industry's planning schedule, as a primary contributer to air quality issues in the area. They advocate policies leaning towards stricter emission standards via cleaner burning fuel and improved automobile emissions technology.

Closer to home, there is little disagreement that the most visible of the park's visibility problems stems from the park's popularity. It's probably safe to suggest that there are not very many people who do not want to visit the Grand Canyon, and on any given summer day, the park is filled to capacity, or over-capacity. Basically the problem boils down to too many private automobiles vying for too few parking spaces. Emissions from all those automobiles and tour busses contributes greatly to air pollution problems.

Doesn't mention that the smog could come from cars in LA, but doesn't rule it out either. I always thought one of the reasons why smog is so bad in LA is because it's surrounded by mountains, so the air has nowhere to go.

Yeah, it costs like $12, which is a bit much compared with other sights, but I liked it. The museum is quite good (kinda with a "hands-on" children's museum vibe), and apparently there's a tour, but we arrived too late for that. No big surprises there ("Yep, that's a big hole..."), but I'd recommend it. (A "gee whiz" fact: the meteor was probably only 150 feet across, but the crater it made was 4000 feet across and 700 feet deep. Gee whiz!!)

First, why do I want to go here instead of, say, Glacier NP, or Bryce/Zion/Escalante, or the Sierras? Are the scale and diversity and colors of Yellowstone enough to justify a trip? I'm not that excited by geysers and springs and wildflowers and bears, though elk and bison might be interesting. I'd like to see the canyon, and the river/grass areas seem nice, but a lot of the park is forested plateau. I'm more interested in alpine terrain. Is it really that interesting? Also, Yellowstone has been called a place of 'industrial tourism.' How easy is it to get away from the roads and crowds and see interesting stuff?

And what about the Tetons? You have the dramatic East face, but overlooking Jackson Hole doesn't seem very wilderness-y. What about the interior to the West? I'd still definitely want to play on the East side, though, probably doing some day-mountaineering here with a guide service and maybe floating on the Snake River. Has anyone done this?

Second, what in particular do I want to see in or outside the parks? I'd definitely try to drive the Beartooth Highway. What about the road to Cody? I also definitely want to see the Wind Rivers, which seem maybe more interesting than the Tetons. Has anyone driven or hiked here? Are there any non-mountain areas nearby that are worth taking time to drive to? What about the Wind River reservation?

(I clearly didn't know about Hwy 12 in my Ernest P recommendations above)

Bryce is open all year. You can visit in Winter, tho there may well be snow. The visitor center (and I think the main lod*e) are open (but many of the nearby motels wait til April 1). The road should be driveable and viewpoints accessible, and at least a few trails walkable (there is snowshoein* when lots of snow). Not a time for backpackin*, obv.

Of course, this is the desert (tho at si*nificant elevation - it's plateau country) (to be cont'd)

“Sprin*� probably starts in early or mid-April and at this time day temps can be warm or even hot (but not unpleasant), while nite temps will remain cool to cold. This may be the best time to visit, tho you may risk rain at this time (this may be more of an issue in the Eastern part of the state).

Early or mid-March to late March or early April will be an in-between time. (To be cont'd)

Note that Zion is at about 2000 feet lower elevation than Bryce and will be sli*htly warmer - niice pleasant perhaps as early as mid-March.

(xp - late Mar mi*ht be a *amble, but with the potential to be ideal)

kaibaneb, your posts have a bunch of weird character substitutions. There's an asterisk everywhere there's supposed to be the letter g.

I was just at Big Bend and loved it a lot -- can't wait to go back.

This is a very good (photo-based/spoilers) page for getting a sense of the area. The guy even offers to plan your trip for you.

D: Yellowstone, Everglades, Mt. Rushmore

Everglades is the only national park I've visited I would - unqualifiedly - call boring. I'm terrified of alligators, and the place was otherwise just a big dumb swamp. Okefenokee Wildlife Refuge, somewhat nearby, offers the same stuff in concentrate.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080724/ap_on_sc/exploring_snowy_river

Gonna do Bryce and Zion National parks around April 20th. Hope there's no government shutdown at that time.

S: Crater Lake and Great Smoky Mountains Nat'l Parks are my favorites. Mammoth Cave is cool. I think I will love Acadia, too (going there in the summer). Massacre Rock in Idaho is a great state park, and Craters of the Moon is an amaaaazing National Monument.
D: Mt Rushmore Nat'l Memorial?! Don't actually destroy it please, but I'm not a fan.

Acadia in the summer will not disappoint

If you put a black curtain over the huge presidential faces on Mt. Rushmore, but kept everything else the same, it would still be a hella wonderful place in the Black Hills of South Dakota, so I'm cool with preserving it as a nat'l monument.

the whole etching presidents faces into a sacred native place is pretty gross

S: Yellowstone, Badlands, Sand Dunes, Dry Tortugas
D: none, they're national treasures.

Just got back from doing Bryce and Zion in Southern Utah. Pretty amazing. Love the huge rock spires in Bryce especially. The weather was great too.

they are both so amazing!

has anyone here been to any national parks in:

*france
*francophone africa

Been to a good few in Madagascar if that counts.

totally counts. there are like a million there, iirc. any bad experiences or boring places? which was your fave?

the wiki entry about amber mtn natl park in madagascar is lol. "On this trip up the mountain to the entrance of the park you will pass through a few small villages. Among these is the little village of Sakaramy, a great place to stop and inquire with locals about different fruits, especially the odd-looking jack fruit."

Hmm let's see what I can remember without consulting the diary.

Zombitse: a short walk through a small dry rainforest with some glimpses of lemurs from afar.
Isalo: A long walk across a dusty landscape with some wild swimming in a very scenic pool, no lemur action till the end when the highly habituated (though not tame) lemurs try and steal your food.
Anja park: a nice small local run private park, lemurs very visible but kept their distance.
Peyrieras Reserve: Another private park, don't know who ran it but seemed quite commercial: greenhouses with chameleons and snakes, crocs in a pit, wild but very habituated lemurs, to the point of strokability.
Ranomafana & Andasibe-Mantadia: both large and forested but also obviously geared up for visitors, large and paved paths through lots of the forest, but when your guide spots the lemurs you get to go creeping (or running) through the undergrowth. The lemurs are habituated to people crashing about beneath them, but that's it. We were only going for day long or shorter treks, maybe if you're there for longer you can go deeper and see more of the wilder side of things. We got our money's worth, though managed to see something like 5 out of 7 diurnal and 3 out of 5 nocturnal lemur species.

No bad experiences, wouldn't even be fair to call any of it disappointing. Due to the massive deforestation a lot of the parks were smaller and less green than I was expecting, and even the larger forested ones weren't as wild as I had imagined. But the guides (compulsory in all parks) are very good at finding what you want to see - not just lemurs, they also did a great job at spotting near invisible beetles and chameleons. Ranomafana & Andasibe-Mantadia were obviously the best for wildlife.

Feel compelled to also mention the "park" that was the last stop on our visit, an island in an exclusive hotel full of (supposedly) rescued ex-pet lemurs, tame enough to jump onto you and eat bananas from your hands. Possibly ethically questionable, not at all natural, but stupidly fun.

anyone got any tips for big bend?