Jury Duty Dilemna!!!! HELP HELP HELP!

Well, I didn't expect to be dangled precariously over the gaping jaws of a two-month case. Normally it's just a week-long jobee and that's that. The timing for this, however, is completely poor and a two-month stint is just completely unacceptable right now.

And, in any case, they always find me. And they follow up.

go to jury duty, be a good citizen, it will be a lesson for the future kid.

But them not being considerate of your Mrs being with kid just plain sucks.

Okay, how about I give them yours and Felicity's addresses and tell them to call you, then? That sound good?

go to jury duty, be a good citizen, it will be a lesson for the future kid.

I'm at jury duty. I'm being a good citizen. I'd happily serve on a more conventional case. Two months, however, is something I cannot do in good conscience.

I can screen print you a t-shirt that says "My Other Car is a Vagina" with a pic of Mr. T on it.

I do not know what this means but I just read the what do you drive thread and that was worse than jury duty.

Hear hear! (I've been called...four times now? Sounds right.)

Try and figure out what work you can do around the trial. In the UK you're only in court for 5 hours or so per day - if falling behind at work is a worry you should still have time to keep up with some stuff.

Otherwise, it's your duty. I'm sorry.

in NJ, it used to be that lawyers were automatically exempt from JD. NO MORE! i'm a worse citizen than either gabb or felicity HAW!

i want to be on a jury w.momus

judge: "have you reached a verdict yet?"
foreman: "don't be silly, m'lud"

1) no i've NEVER used drugs and i think people that do are EVIL
2) no i've NEVER known a person that's been arrested and i think people who are arrested are EVIL
3) i think drunk drivers SHOULD BE SHOT

that should cover all the bases for most criminal trials but i don't know what to tell you if it's a civil trial... maybe

4) i tend to side STRONGLY with the prosecution NO MATTER WHAT THE FACTS

a) Have gone to college (preferably with a master's degree, but bachelors is fine.)
b) Make sure you ASK a lot of questions about WHAT exactly the lawyers mean when they say can you be fair about something (this really helps if the case is business related, it can harder to pull off if it's murder.) Example: Q: "Do you blame the general failings of the economy on the actions of individuals?" A: "You mean other than the president of the United States."
c) Be generally snarky and seem unpredictable. Make numerous references (loud enough for the lawyers and plaintiff/defendants and fellow jurors to hear, but not for the judge) to scrapping the whole awards process and instead forcing the defendant to throw a picnic in the park for the plaintiff as a judgement.
d) Don't claim to be racist. Don't refuse to answer questions. ESPECIALLY don't claim to have ANY specific knowledge ("I am a tax attorney and uh I would be biased to the defendant" bought one guy two weeks of being FOREMAN the last time I was called for regular jury duty) of the case in question. THIS does not disqualify you EVEN if you try to pretend that this knowledge impairs you impartiality. It just makes you look stupid and the LAWYERS want stupid people.

Have fun and good luck.

Can you plead being a new parent? Who'd want to miss 4 months of being with their new baby, to get cold coffee in the morning and a rock-hard bed?

Uh, and Sarah Silverman to thread!

blount and alex on same jury =
judge: "have you reached a verdict yet?"
foreman: *rolls eyes disgustedly*
*far-off sound of furniture being smashed against bone*

I I got called up again I'd go as civic duty n'all, but Alex in NYC has the best reasons for avoiding it I can think of.

I eventually got out of it by calling the courts and saying that I had lost my notice and wasn't sure if I was supposed to be there that day. They said they'd sent me another one. I don't think they ever did.

I suspect that technique will help Alex.

(1) get my boss to draft a letter explaining what a hinderance it would be to lose my services for the two month stretch. On TIME letterhead, of course.
(2) Being adamant, obstinate and emphatic about my wife's pregnancy (this does not involve lying whatsoever). I am a million times more concerned about the health and well-being of my wife and unborn child than I ever will be about this case. That said, I will be utterly distacted, possibly disruptive and almost certainly non-compliant just within the boundries of the law.
(3) Be very vocal about my needs.
(4) Shave currently thugish display of facial hair into disquieting Hitler mustach and possibly wear my "One Night Only from the Hate-Fuck Capital City, PUSSY GALORE!" t-shirt (I'd wear one of my innumerable Cop Shoot Cop shirts, but that might be a bit too foolhardy in a federal courthouse.)

Seriously, I'm going to be totally fucked (in a not nice way) if I don't escape this.

If your wife has had any difficulties with the pregnancy I would play these up; a note from her doctor will be more effective than one from your boss.

I doubt this excuse will work for someone living in NYC, though.

or this
http://www.metaphilm.com/images/philms/monkey2.jpg

The lawyer bringing the case asked as one of the questions "does anyone have any experience with chiropractors?" (one was going to be giving evidence). So I put my hand up & said "Well, my dad's an insurance company lawyer, and in the process of talking about his cases, he's pretty much swayed me to his opinion of them..." To which the lawyer said "Yes, and?" And I replied "Well... I really don't want to poison the jury pool and state exactly what I think of them" Haha, and the lawyer was "No, I want to know what YOUR opinion is" -to which I just shrugged my shoulders & told him that chiropractors, so far as I could tell, were total bunk, and since they didn't have medical degree, they should not be giving expert opinion in court. Hey, I warned him.

Heh, so I was excused for cause, called my dad on my way out, and he laughed with me about the idiot ambulance chaser lawyer. Err... so lesson for Alex: they can't seat you if you say that you'll be impartial. If you tell them "I can not be impartial in this case" and they still seat you, the defendant has cause for appeal if he loses.

a) they're not and suck it up, or
b) you didn't adequately explain the particulars of your situation.

If the second is true, do what you can to explain this provided you are presented with another opportunity to do so (though it appears that you won't be as regards this trial).

As I understand it, this preliminary round dealt only with whether you would be dismissed from the pool for the case for hardship, not with the regular voir dire issues (to which the whole Killing Joke/Pussy Galore axis, etc. will be far more relevant), although the regular voir dire issues sometimes come into play in the hardship round. If and when you go through the actual voir dire, you should be honest with and respectful of the court, both as a matter of principle and effectiveness. To the extent that you can do so consistent with the preceding, however, bear some of Alex in SF's advice in mind - while a college degree (even a legal degree) is totally insufficient to get you excluded (the idea that lawyers don't want smart people is not always or even usually correct), and mere obstinance usually has the same impact, lawyers generally are wary of unpredictability - or, more to the point, uncertainty - especially regarding a juror's willingness to apply the law as written regardless of whether they agree with it as a matter of policy.

considering that i know no small # of NYC lawyers who were some sort of failed artist, i don't think that that tactic will help Alex at all.

Today, my job would pay for NONE. (I get paid by the hour). And I'm NOT going to say that so far i've never been called here in Washington state because that will surely mean i WILL be called if i say so... OH SHIT. TOO LATE :(

True. The actual voir dire doesn't start until Thursday (tho' I was hoping that having a pregnant wife --- which is true -- would trump whatever cards they brought to the table. It didn't).

If and when you go through the actual voir dire, you should be honest with and respectful of the court, both as a matter of principle and effectiveness.

I can do that, but being honest also means explaining to them that I will be completely useless to them as a juror, as I will be entirely distracted during the proceedings of the case. Moreover, it will also be impossible for me to be objective, impartial and fair as a juror, as I am already DEEPLY RESENTFUL and EXCEPTIONALLY BITTER in regards to BOTH the prosecution and the defense for not allowing the FACT that my wife is pregnant excuse me from serving on this case (once again, the health and well-being of my wife and unborn child matter more to me than the any particulars of the case). That they failed to consider that has only increased my inability to react to them with anything other than abject disdain and hostitlity.

The letter from TIME is a flawed concept, but I may use it just to have another arrow in my quiver. Like someone mentioned above, it's going to sound wholly devoid of merit that the media giant that is TIME-Warner cannot find another employee to fill my shoes while I'm serving on the jury. That said, my department is not just a gaggle of cogs. A new person would have to be trained, and that takes time. Moreover, this is also the busiest time of year for the magazine (and I'm sure the busiest time of year for everybody), with the "Person of the Year" double-issue looming.

The tasteless t-shirt idea sounds entirely juvenile, I know, but why not? I really don't give a tinker's cuss if I offend any of them. At this stage of the game, this is about self-preservation. Moreover, lest any of you think I'm shirking my responsibilities as a citizen, I would be happy to be tossed back into the jury pool to wait for another (ideally more conventional) case. I just cannot sit on a jury that expects to last no shorter than two months. If that means wearing an offensive t-shirt, fuckin' so be it.

Here's the text of the letter I got from my boss. Think it'll do the trick?

To whom it may concern,
I would like to request a deferment for Alex Smith. He is a key part of the operation of TIME's News Service operation in its Rockefeller Center headquarters. Finding and training a replacement for him will be extremely difficult at this time, which is a critical period in the magazine's yearly schedule.

I will appreciate your kind consideration of this matter. Please accept my gratitude in advance

Sincerely,
(his name)
(his title).

http://edition.cnn.com/US/fringe/9603/03-14/sketch.jpg

http://edition.cnn.com/US/fringe/9603/03-14/trek.html

My life is "interesting" enough with a baby on the way, thank you very much. I am in no need of further intellectual stimuli.

Even better, it might involve defendant(s) who are not only obviously guilty but guilty in a colorful and entertaining fashion.

Afraid not. It has something to do with asbestos.

Alex, the letter from your employers is a bad idea.

Why do you think, Ally?

I think the idea of the doctor's note was good.

It just seems...self-important.

Well, it's not like I wrote it.

I think your obvious distraction and displeasure towards the case because of your wife's situation is more than enough to make them not want to seat you because you'd be likely to be a hostile juror.

Well, I'd have thought as much yesterday, but that didn't stop them from telling me to come back. I just think the letter, while it doesn't support the main plank of my campaign to be thrown off (my pregnant wife), does provide a booster argument.

The letter is just a bit much.

I actually thought it was too light, honestly.

I mean it's not like they're going to seat you to spite you

Some people have suggested otherwise. It's hard to tell.

you want to win a bit of sympathy towards yourself, I think.

Well, I'd certainly like to, but I'd also like to instill the notion in them that I will be an angry, potentially uncooperative, almost certainly distracted, disgruntled juror.

I think the idea of the doctor's note was good.

I do as well, but getting a note from my wife's obstitrician is a tricky thing to achieve on such short notice. Moreover, desite the fact that I want to be present for every step of the process and every doctor visit, I'm not specifically a necessary ingredient to the proceedings (i.e. the doctor visits, sonograms, etc. could take place without me, though you'd have to be a huge asshole to impose that.)

You use the privilege of being on a jury to make your voice heard in the courts. A single Juror can have more power than the Judge and all the lawyers on a case.
--
-- Sometimes you have to turn the lights off in order to see.

i mean i imagine there are people who would be enduring greater hardships if they were asked to serve on juries for this period of time...people who would lose their jobs, are self-employed, or who get paid by the number of sales they make....

i served on a two-week long jury that included such people and they sucked it up.

welcome to democracy

Hey dickless, I'm not refusing to take a "longish" trial on general priniciple....MY WIFE IS PREGNANT!!!!!! I don't have time! I'm perfectly willing to serve time on a conventionally-timed trial, but I simply cannot serve for two months.

NOTHING was resolved today. Because they are trying to fish twelve jurors out of a pool of about fifty, they numbered us up (I'm number 41) and went through an agonizingly slow (and wildly inefficient) voir dire. They never even reached number 30. Moreover, we didn't START until 10am. Why didn't they ask us to be there earlier? The lack of consideration is completely appalling. In other words, I'm still completely in limbo....and I am FUCKING FURIOUS!

AHEM.

p.s. all i was KIDDDING

Har! I might as well call her said moniker if I don't get sprung tomorrow.

If it were me (and Ive never been called up, and dont know anyone who has but voting is compulsory in Aust so the pool is large), I'd have to refuse if it meant being on less money than I am on normally (ie if my work only paid for one week and I was on for two or some such). I would be in severe financial hardship if that happened! :(

-- Alex in NYC (vassife...), November 19th, 2003. (later)

It is an interesting dilemna, not in the sense of "How Do I Get Out of This?," but ethically. Our system says you are a necessary ingredient to somebody's case. Civil legal proceedings are often the only way to redistribute wealth and correct economic injustices done to people.

What if you got asbestosis and that meant you couldn't have children? Or if your child died because you lived in a housing project with loose asbestos and no one in the landlord's office, City, State or federal government cared? Or, after you finally found a lawyer willing to take your case, you had to wait many years to get a trial date because nobody wanted to sit on a jury?

I guess these are all ethical choices we must make for ourselves.

It's crucially important. Depending on the case, certain answers could get you bumped immediately. In this case, the easiest way to get bumped would be to find a conflict of interest. Alex might be able to do that, since he works for a multinational.

would your work pay you for the duration of the jury duty? would it actually take you away from your wife more than your job?

Oh I thought you meant important ethically. Anyway, Alex already did that once, that's how he got stuck with the 2-month asbestos trial.

(though it's not like I haven't gotten out of two cases in NYC in my time, because they would have interfered with school; now I wish I could have seen a jury operate)

Moreover, we didn't START until 10am. Why didn't they ask us to be there earlier? The lack of consideration is completely appalling.

Because judges just sit around all day. They don't have any work to do.

I think if they made a better effort to compensate jury duty (ie either compulsory full-day pay from the govt or forcing person's employer to do same)

I believe in NYC you get paid a certain amount (not large) a day, whether or not you are sat on a jury. There may also be a financial hardship out.

Yes, little old ladies and the unemployed are all stupid or corrupt, I've noticed.

whether or not they are stupid or corrupt, they are unrepresentative.

You live in Cobb County? Like, right outside Atlanta?

my heart goes out to alex ... think jaz coleman thoughts while yer waiting in the jury pool.

run, alex, RUN.

For a start, I've seen the jury system operate. I've been on more juries than you've had hot fuckin' dinners. And I think my reason for wanting to be sprung (a pregnant wife) trumps your reason (school interference) every damn day of the week!

I think if they made a better effort to compensate jury duty (ie either compulsory full-day pay from the govt or forcing person's employer to do same)...I believe in NYC you get paid a certain amount (not large) a day, whether or not you are sat on a jury. There may also be a financial hardship out.

My reasons for not wanting to serve have never been about money. I'm paid by my employer. My freelancing gigs will be hurt, but it's not about money at all.

After yet another agonizing morning of waiting around and countless instances of inefficent shenanigans, they finally got around to the second batch of prospective jurors (self included therein). When they got to me, they practically imediately conceded (I guess my constant fidgeting, glaring and fang-baring gave them the clue), and I was released. Two of the twenty (!!!) lawyers came up to me as we broke for lunch (after I'd been excused) and expressed their apologies, admitting that when they'd heard I had a pregnant wife, they expected I'd be a reluctant juror and blah blah blah... They were perfectly nice about it, truthfully, but by then I was so relieved that they could've been speaking in Klingon for all I was absorbing. I tell ya, after being so tense and angry and anxiety-ridden for the last three days, I feel positively hungover.

Anyway, that's that. Thanks to everyone's advice and support.

(my back-up plan wz you shd print out ilx threads and read them out doing all the voices)

http://members.aol.com/motelhell/KJ-Webster-Hall-2003/images/JazRaven2.jpg

No, it's pretty hysterical. ILX Theatre would be pretty fantastic.

Here's my New York juror story:

My summons came in spring 2002 to serve jury duty at the Supreme Court in downtown Brooklyn. "Supreme Court" sounds like hot shit (not that it would affect my hatred of civic obligation) but in New York-- gotcha-- it's the court in which trial cases are first heard. After a Lionel Hutz-narrated orientation to your duty as a juror, with what I think was a musical number, hundreds of average drips took our seats on the hard benches. Morning, day two: I was called into a 50-person pool for voir dire on what was evidently a serious assault case. For a day and a half, we were kept STANDING in a hallway upstairs while a plea was worked out. Every time the door to the empanelling room opened, dozens of frustrated potential jurors, driven mad by aching legs and in a kind of shock from the inhuman interior design, looked at whoever came out like they wanted to take a rock hammer to some skulls. A young guy who looked to be the defendant was brought in and out in front of this hate chorale, and after a few iterations gave up on his jury trial. So we were free to eat at Juniors or whatever, fuck yeah.

I suppose three days split evenly between the waiting rooms and STANDING in a hallway beats a potential two month trial, but neither fills me with any desire to serve on a jury. But HStencil: it was made clear that volunteering for jury service is a-okay, if you're really all that bored.

I was about to say!

Alex, truly glad you were able to get out of jury duty. They should've let you off the hook from the get go, what with your pregnant wife situation and all.

My dad was called to jury duty six months before he passed on, and he was able to get out of it by just sending in a doctor's notice that he was quite ill, so he wouldn't be able to serve. It worked.

I've never YET been called to jury duty, but hopefully if that day ever comes I'll know how to get out of it. (Unless I can actually handle it, that is.)

I didn't show up for jury duty. But I incurred an injury and had to be hospitalized for (minor) surgery! Will I be forgiven?