FOX HUNT RIOTS!

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holy moley!

― Fritz Wollner (Fritz), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 15:52 (twenty-one years ago)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/3656524.stm

― ken c (ken c), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 15:54 (twenty-one years ago)

Four of the men ran out from behind the speaker's chair. Another wrestled past a doorkeeper from a different entrance.

They were chased by officials but one harangued minister Alun Michael.

hahaharangued.

― ken c (ken c), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 15:55 (twenty-one years ago)

Was Batman involved?

― Huk-L, Wednesday, 15 September 2004 15:56 (twenty-one years ago)

Rural Affairs Minister Alun Michael said the two year delay would give people time to re-home hounds and look at converting to drag hunting and other business activities.

DRAG HUNTING!!!!

― ken c (ken c), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 15:57 (twenty-one years ago)

Run RuPaul Run!

― Huk-L, Wednesday, 15 September 2004 15:58 (twenty-one years ago)

very benny hill.

― Fritz Wollner (Fritz), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 15:58 (twenty-one years ago)

sequel to so graham norton

― ken c (ken c), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 15:59 (twenty-one years ago)

That's hunting IN drag, sillies.

― briania (briania), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:00 (twenty-one years ago)

The media seems to be making a great effort to stress that only a few protestors are violent. Though, as much as I want to see the Right's protests get treated the same as the Left's, I hate to see people get beaten by the police.

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:02 (twenty-one years ago)

i must admit i felt an odd, guilty frisson of excitement as i got to the bit where one of the invaders was quoted as saying "this is not democracy! you are overturning democracy!"

― the neurotic awakening of s (blueski), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:04 (twenty-one years ago)

drag hunting is when you build a super fast car and then go kill animals.

― jel -- (jel), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:08 (twenty-one years ago)

I was kind of hoping the Sargeant-at-Arms would be a bit more ass-kicking superhero than he was. Maybe that's because I get the role mixed up with Mat-at-arms from Masters of the Universe.

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:08 (twenty-one years ago)

perhaps it is telling of this country that this sort of thing happens over the hunting and ripping to shreds of vermin but not over the war in Iraq...

― the neurotic awakening of s (blueski), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:10 (twenty-one years ago)

Man-at-arms. Obviously. x-post.

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:10 (twenty-one years ago)

Maybe Fathers 4 Justice should have staged another condom purple flour attack, that would have been a spectacle.

― jel -- (jel), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:11 (twenty-one years ago)

i don't really get why that guy dressed as Batman. was it supposed to endear us?

― the neurotic awakening of s (blueski), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:13 (twenty-one years ago)

It was a disguise Steve!!!!

― jel -- (jel), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:14 (twenty-one years ago)

but why BATMAN?

― the neurotic awakening of s (blueski), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:27 (twenty-one years ago)

short straw?

― jel -- (jel), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:28 (twenty-one years ago)

what disguise would you use Steve?

― jel -- (jel), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:28 (twenty-one years ago)

A *good* father might have been an idea.

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:30 (twenty-one years ago)

i suppose because Batman fought for justice it makes sense in that context.

― the neurotic awakening of s (blueski), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:31 (twenty-one years ago)

I think it's meant to be "modern fathers are expected to be superheroes", and maybe The Tick wasn't the right image.

Are there any English superheroes?

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:31 (twenty-one years ago)

Bananaman?

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:34 (twenty-one years ago)

Catweasel

― the neurotic awakening of s (blueski), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:36 (twenty-one years ago)

I feel safer already.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:39 (twenty-one years ago)

Hilarious that the upper class won't come out and demonstrate against the war in Iraq, student fees, the many hideous things that their beloved Cosnervative party did to the UK... but WILL muster up the effort to come out and protect their right to violently kill wildlife. There is no other answer:

Get these little ugly inbred bastards (you can always tell a posh bastard by the way they look - that "not quite human" look to their face which indicates decades of inbreeding) and tax them until they no longer exist. Stop them from having their manors and their little posh boy's schools and their homosexual teenage affairs (before denying they were gay in the first place - YES THAT MEANS YOU PORTILLO). They make me sick. They are EVIL. Ever met a nice posh person? Me neither.

― PurgetheUpperClass, Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:42 (twenty-one years ago)

Hah, yeah, all of the people protesting student fees are from sink estates.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:43 (twenty-one years ago)

Clarissa Dickson Wright was on the anti-war march!

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:43 (twenty-one years ago)

What's wrong with teenage homosexual affairs anyway?

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:44 (twenty-one years ago)

but she is a buffoon (albeit one who can make a bitchin' confit of duck)

― the neurotic awakening of s (blueski), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:45 (twenty-one years ago)

Tony Benn? He is posh and nice.

― suzy (suzy), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:48 (twenty-one years ago)

Captain Britain!

― jel -- (jel), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:51 (twenty-one years ago)

Loads of people are posh and nice. I assumed that was a joke.

― Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:51 (twenty-one years ago)

The Avengers, perhaps he should have worn an Emma Peel catsuit.

― jel -- (jel), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 16:52 (twenty-one years ago)

It is so pleasing to see the police thump these twats. Im not particularly anti-hunting but these are such reactionary arseholes.

― Ed (dali), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 17:06 (twenty-one years ago)

Maybe the protestors are smearing blood on their own faces; you know, to mark their first protests or something.

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 17:10 (twenty-one years ago)

does anyone think these sort of incidents do not bode well for Open House London this weekend?

― the neurotic awakening of s (blueski), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 17:10 (twenty-one years ago)

"I'm not a terrorist--I'm a physiotherapist."

― RJG (RJG), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 17:34 (twenty-one years ago)

RJG - did you get my email? It was about hare-coursing this weekend.

― Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 17:35 (twenty-one years ago)

got. get.

― RJG (RJG), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 17:41 (twenty-one years ago)

One of the men arrested is Bryan Ferry's son. Daddy will be proud.

― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Wednesday, 15 September 2004 20:08 (twenty-one years ago)

Well of course he'll be, he's a hard-right Tory whose ex-wife opined that striking miners should be shot.

― Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Thursday, 16 September 2004 06:59 (twenty-one years ago)

the cover of the independent is reminding me of 'music for a jilted generation', kinda.

― HKM, Thursday, 16 September 2004 07:05 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah, Ferry's political views are quite baffling aren't they?

It's kind of vaguely interesting that the coverage of this and the guy dressed as batman has been pretty much all based on OH MY GOD WHAT IF THEY HAD BEEN MAD BOMBER TERRORISTZ!!!1@# and almost no mention at all of the issues the protestors want to raise. Well ok, maybe not that interesting at all really.

Weird, the way that the reactionary right tries to dress itself up in the clothes of the protesting left when someone wants to take their phun away, anyway.

I should go and do some work.

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Thursday, 16 September 2004 07:06 (twenty-one years ago)

The media seems to be making a great effort to stress that only a few protestors are violent.

do we know how daily mail et al have covered the riots yet?

seemed much more violent than the may day protests i covered for NME a few years back, an experience that taught me if there's an 'us' and a 'them', the police will always side with the 'them' if they include wealthy property owners and vested interests. and infinitely more violent than the anti-war potest last year (?).

so yeah, people in the countryside will lose their jobs when this (morally justified) bill goes through. but on the same day, thousands heard they might lose their jobs because Jaguar are closing their Coventry plant down. and think about the miner's strike of the early 1980s. why do these people seem to have the right to violently protest the los of their livelihood, while protests/strikes would be treated much more negatively by the same corners of the press...

― stevie (stevie), Thursday, 16 September 2004 07:08 (twenty-one years ago)

brilliantly, some tories are now invoking the European humang rights act that says you can't have irreplaceable job losses (makes about as much sense as the german economy). but i don't buy that 6,000 people are permanently employed in this 'industry' anyway.

i don't see the point in asking faux-naive questions about why the right wing press prefers these guys to the miners, to be honest. we know why.

― HKM, Thursday, 16 September 2004 07:13 (twenty-one years ago)

Depressingly predictable that much of the press is taking the "well if they have to fight for what they believe in against this erosion of democracy than SO BE IT!" line. Whereas if it had been May Day protestors storming the Commons the same voices would have been calling for them to be hung in the street above the Cenotaph. I'm not remotely surprised but god I hate this country sometimes.

This has to be an inside job, hasn't it? Which group of Tories to we think let them in, then?

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 16 September 2004 07:15 (twenty-one years ago)

fatty 'nicholas' soames, almost certainly.

― HKM, Thursday, 16 September 2004 07:18 (twenty-one years ago)

It is so pleasing to see the police thump these twats. Im not particularly anti-hunting but these are such reactionary arseholes.

Ed, not only is this a tremendously dickish thing to say in itself, it's also an exact reflection of what the right would have said about the anticapitalism demonstrators.

― Ricardo (RickyT), Thursday, 16 September 2004 07:27 (twenty-one years ago)

IIRC, didn't the most vocal protests against student fees come from well-heeled, spoiled middle-class brats who were enraged (a) that they actually might have to pay their way through life and everything wasn't going to be handed to them on a plate like Mummy and Daddy assured them; and (b) that financial assistance would only be avaialble for the "lower orders"/"working-class oiks" and consequently Mummy would have to sell her weekend four-wheel drive?

― Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Thursday, 16 September 2004 07:36 (twenty-one years ago)

no, qkds, not really. i protested, sure, i'm middle class, sure, but you can fuck right off with your moralizing: 'spoiled' kids, mums with big cars -- these are right-winmg hate-figures. what are the quote-marks doing around 'oiks'? who are you quoting? as it happens not very many students get financial aid; more get exempted from fees, but given the grants you no doubt received under thatcher, it's a bit rich you querying our right to protest. socialism is *not* about making the middle classes pay. it's about abolishing classes, and crude economism such as you advocate only keeps classes as stable entities. if you think that one has to 'pay one's way through life', then you are clearly more tory than you admit -- where is the socialism there?

― HKM, Thursday, 16 September 2004 07:43 (twenty-one years ago)

You know you people coming on all anti-posh and condecending here are just the same as those posh people who sneer at the "working classes". What next, "coloureds"? What's I'm really trying to say is: boyofbadgers OTM in many ways.

― Steve.n. (sjkirk), Thursday, 16 September 2004 07:47 (twenty-one years ago)

Apoilogies for my ill-considered glee. As I said I'm not that opposed to fox hunting. However What it represents is the last vestiges of a anachronistic feudal society (possibly the real reason for the intense desire to ban it in many people minds if they are honest with themselves).

My glee does howvere stem from the fact that these people who would preserve an anachronism by violence are dealt with in the same way anyone who tries to advance a cause by violence.

― Ed (dali), Thursday, 16 September 2004 07:52 (twenty-one years ago)

So by your logic Nelson Mandela should have got whacked with the truncheon back in '62.

Middle-class guilt getting to you, Hank?

As far as I'm concerned the middle classes are the biggest fucking bunch of spongers in this country who expect to be served a first-class education and health service without having to go through the tedious business of FINANCING it by PAYING EXTRA TAXES. So the public services have to suffer because the middle classes prefer to spend their disposable income on second cars, second holidays, second houses and second nannies.

And let's invoke Godwin's law if we must, but that's how Hitler got in back in 1933: supported and voted for by a pissed off middle class.

― Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Thursday, 16 September 2004 07:53 (twenty-one years ago)

This is turning into one of the most hotly-contested strawman building contests in the history of ILE.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 16 September 2004 07:54 (twenty-one years ago)

ed, i spose that's why i'm not very anti-hunting: it's so obviously a cultural stand-in for real change. ed, given that the reason we still have hunting is the HOUSE OF LORDS i don't think you can really say hunting is the 'last vestiges'. we also have a monarchy, right?

qkds, did you know that the labour vote among the middle classes went UP in 1979? and that a third *of trade-unionists* voted thatcher? just sayin'.

― HKM, Thursday, 16 September 2004 07:56 (twenty-one years ago)

However What it represents is the last vestiges of a anachronistic feudal society (possibly the real reason for the intense desire to ban it in many people minds if they are honest with themselves).

George Monbiot to thread

― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Thursday, 16 September 2004 07:58 (twenty-one years ago)

Oh all those otherwise law abiding folk that protested and get a belt off a policeman.

But enough of the anti-poll tax protest...

― mark grout (mark grout), Thursday, 16 September 2004 07:59 (twenty-one years ago)

No I don't think anyone should get whacked with a truncheon. However if society is going to let people be whacked with a truncheon let's do it even handedly.

OK not last vestiges. I've always said trying to ban hunting was a waste of time when we still have upper chambr reform and getting a properly democratic electoral symbol in place.

― Ed (dali), Thursday, 16 September 2004 07:59 (twenty-one years ago)

This is crap: Fox Hunting = Anachronism, X = advancing a cause is not objective truth, it's an opinion. When each side gets violent, the tratment is much the same by the police. The right wing press treating the right wing better = duh. Get pissed off at the right wing, all this posh hatin' is sooo 80s.

Having said that I don't know many posh people. They could all be twats but I doubt it.

― Steve.n. (sjkirk), Thursday, 16 September 2004 08:01 (twenty-one years ago)

mdc otmfm.

― toby (tsg20), Thursday, 16 September 2004 08:01 (twenty-one years ago)

Jesus, Monbiot doesn't know what he's talking about.
The residual power of the landed class arises from other people's aspirations. The British remain mesmerised by our pre-democratic rulers. Their version of the past is still widely accepted, thanks to costume dramas, the National Trust, and our balmoralised popular histories.
Pure idealism! But what costume dramas does he mean? Is he suggesting that costume dramas uniformly idealize the feudal order? I find this unlikely -- to give recent examples it is untrue of the Trollope adaptations, of 'Pride and Prejudice', and basically untrue of 'Stage Beauty'.
It is Monbiot who is being taken in by costumery: fact hunting as it stands has little to do with the Norman aristocracy because the salient fact of British history is the compromise settlement between the the feudal elite and the bourgeoisie. The archaic costumes are paid for by the most modern practices of economic exploitation, and banning hunting will no more remove the feudal taint from society than will banning ball gowns and gentlemen's clubs.

― HKM, Thursday, 16 September 2004 08:05 (twenty-one years ago)

"Get pissed off at the right wing, all this posh hatin' is sooo 80s."

A meme which is often deployed by gentrified bourgeois Tory oppressors.

A clip round the ear would be far more use than a truncheon.

But then so would a machine gun.

It depends who's wielding both, or either.

― Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Thursday, 16 September 2004 08:06 (twenty-one years ago)

That said, the NuLab approach to politics is ALL ABOUT building strawmen and the Countryside Alliance strawman is the one they can most afford to piss off, because it is never going to vote Labour anyway.

Meanwhile pissing off the Posh Country strawman plays well with the otherwise pretty pissed off Old Labour strawman which, through the unions etc, gives NuLab a lot of badly needed cash.

I have little doubt that yer New Labour strategists have exactly the same view of Middle Class strawman as Marcello upthread because that is why New Labour exists in the first place and why we have all sorts of complex PFI and PPP structures in our public services these days - to do it on the cheap, or at least give the illusion of doing it on the cheap. Is this overly cynical?

I suspect that a lot of the anti-foxhunting MPs actually care considerably more about the foxes themselves than any of the strawman builders would like to admit. Its easy to forget there are actually foxes involved in all this, isn't it?

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 16 September 2004 08:11 (twenty-one years ago)

>No I don't think anyone should get whacked with a truncheon. However if society is going to let people be whacked with a truncheon let's do it even handedly.

on the bbc news this morning there seemed to be people in rugby shirts continually running up to a line of policemen with batons, throwing a punch (getting pounded on in return) and then backing off 5 yards. rinse, repeat. maybe they can adopt this as a new bloodsport in place of foxhunting? they seemed to be enjoying it.

(without exception the people on the news reminded me of either Tim Nice-But-Dim or Peter Serafinowicz's character in How Do You Want Me

(and i think the batman costume thing was the illogical progression from the first bloke up a crane who had a much more appropriate spiderman costume on)

― koogs (koogs), Thursday, 16 September 2004 08:12 (twenty-one years ago)

We do remember that Countryside Alliance protest levels were inflated by landowners who applied certain coercive strategies to get their tenants to attend, right? That is the feudalism Ed is discussing, in action.

It is likely in the current climate that police have issues with any pressure group you could name. Truncheoned demonstrators are unacceptable if they have not themselves been violent. We have to allow that the socioeconomic advantages of some of these protestors will make it easier to pursue the police for damages etc. than would be otherwise possible in say an Outrage or anti-war protest. We have to focus on the cruelty of the pursuit and not the background of its adherents. Hate the game, not the playa, seen? And we do hate this game.

Enough complaints about class from people who went to Oxford on merit on a full grant thanks to EVERYONE who paid tax, millionaires and their cleaners alike. Eh?

― suzy (suzy), Thursday, 16 September 2004 08:15 (twenty-one years ago)

MDC -- true that foxes are being forgotten amid the straw men (though any political calculation involves abstracts, really, but point taken) -- but surely the foxes are going to be killed whatever happens. no fox will be saved fom death by this bill.

― HKM, Thursday, 16 September 2004 08:20 (twenty-one years ago)

too bad they can't be hunted/shot in the city omg roffle

― the neurotic awakening of s (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 08:21 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah but its the way the foxes are killed that's the divisive point surely?

Incidentally, is this the first domestic policy issue thats grabbed the front pages since the Iraq war? I think it might be - I don't think tuition fees made the same impact, certainly not foundation hospitals and no one in the media seems to care about the rest.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 16 September 2004 08:29 (twenty-one years ago)

yeah, only iraq isn't domestic?

― HKM, Thursday, 16 September 2004 08:31 (twenty-one years ago)

Okay, is this the first domestic policy issue that's grabbed the front pages in the last 18 months?

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 16 September 2004 08:35 (twenty-one years ago)

Enough complaints about class from people who went to Oxford on merit on a full grant thanks to EVERYONE who paid tax, millionaires and their cleaners alike. Eh?

Not "everyone" pays tax. As well you know.

― Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Thursday, 16 September 2004 09:01 (twenty-one years ago)

"Everyone who who paid tax"

Who doesn't pay tax, anyway? Even kids pay VAT.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 16 September 2004 09:04 (twenty-one years ago)

Woo woo.

I still haven't seen the video of all this happenning. Is it as funny as people have told me?

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 16 September 2004 09:06 (twenty-one years ago)

It's like the 'bald brummies' ep of Knowing Me, Knowing You.

― HKM, Thursday, 16 September 2004 09:07 (twenty-one years ago)

Translation: "Enough complaints about class from working-class scum who went to Oxford on merit on a full grant thanks to OUR taxes and should keep their mouth shut and be grateful that they were even taught to read and write."

Another favourite demeaning tactic of the gentrified bourgeoisie to keep us in our place.

"Who doesn't pay tax, anyway?"

Millionaires and company directors with offshore/Swiss accounts. So-called socialist actors and musicians who pretend to live in Dublin because of the "craic" but really it's because they don't have to pay so many taxes and are ashamed to reveal themselves as the craven Tory scum they actually are. Wealthy homeowners who will use every nook and cranny of trickery to avoid the burden of inheritance tax. And, as mentioned above, the pampered middle classes who pay tax but not in sufficient amounts to finance their petulant demands.

― Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Thursday, 16 September 2004 09:13 (twenty-one years ago)

you are a rubbish translator

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 09:14 (twenty-one years ago)

(Translation: i have a thing for you)

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 09:14 (twenty-one years ago)

Wow, think of all the millions Daniel Day-Lewis is keeping from us.

― HKM, Thursday, 16 September 2004 09:18 (twenty-one years ago)

Ah, so "don't pay tax" means "don't pay as much income tax as they should".

I like this translation game.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 16 September 2004 09:34 (twenty-one years ago)

"The fronts showed Tony Blair with red horns, and the legend adapted from the French Connection ads: "FCUK your ban. I'll keep hunting." On the back, weirdly, was Cherie Blair tricked out as the Queen, wearing a tiara, the words: "I signed the declaration" above her and "God Save The Hunting" below."

description of their t-shirts from the grauniad. what the fuck is going on with that? why the french connection meme? why cherie blair? what declaration? 'the hunting'? i thought posh people were taught to express themselves with words.

― HKM, Thursday, 16 September 2004 09:39 (twenty-one years ago)

So-called socialist actors and musicians who pretend to live in Dublin because of the "craic" but really it's because they don't have to pay so many taxes...

An excelllent point, though, and one that bears repeating many times, I think.

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Thursday, 16 September 2004 09:40 (twenty-one years ago)

Are you talking about the famous artist's exemption (because that doesn't apply to performers), or something else? Income tax in Ireland is about the same as here, I think.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 16 September 2004 09:53 (twenty-one years ago)

Lucky Ronan. Seriously, though, that's a great thing; if it weren't a theocracy I'd move there. Constantly positing higher taxes as the solution to England's woes just isn't going to work; it doesn't make sense in terms of socialism, and it doesn't make economic sense either. Taxes son't service the 'petulant demands' of the middle-classes; they pick up the pieces after unrestrained capitalism has had its way.

― HKM, Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:04 (twenty-one years ago)

In theory it is a great thing. To the best of my knowledge there is not an income ceiling (?) on it. perhaps there should be? (perhaps there is?)

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:07 (twenty-one years ago)

I think it's an absolutely ridiculous thing. Why the fuck shouldn't artists pay tax like the rest of us?

― Ricardo (RickyT), Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:09 (twenty-one years ago)

because we're ethereal creatures who barely leave our garrets, let alone use up state resources.

― HKM, Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:11 (twenty-one years ago)

Ricardo otm, it seems absurd.

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:12 (twenty-one years ago)

i think it's fair play, sorta. i mean, being an artist/writer often means being effectively unemployed much of the time, but without getting any benefits. so going untaxed seems okay to me.

― HKM, Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:15 (twenty-one years ago)

That would be the same with anyone who's self-employed though.

― NickB (NickB), Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:18 (twenty-one years ago)

how much 'art' do you have to produce to qualify?

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:18 (twenty-one years ago)

Does ILXing count as art?

― HKM, Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:21 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't think ILXing (as far as I know) earns royalties, so I think the point is moot.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:22 (twenty-one years ago)

What NickB said. I don't see what makes artists so special.

― Ricardo (RickyT), Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:23 (twenty-one years ago)

they wear funny clothes

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:23 (twenty-one years ago)

I suppose it's like any tax break - the government decided certain things are to be encouraged for the good of the nation as a whole, so incentivizes them.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:25 (twenty-one years ago)

On a corporate level, the UK government has been doing the same with film (though it's recently pulled a lot of the breaks away).

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:26 (twenty-one years ago)

**Well of course he'll be, he's a hard-right Tory whose ex-wife opined that striking miners should be shot**

Did you mention that to Bryan when you met him Marcello?

― Dr. C (Dr. C), Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:27 (twenty-one years ago)

Incidentally, did anyone else spot that the protest organisers blamed the violence outside Parliament on football supporters infiltrating the demonstration? One of their spokesman said this on Channel Four News last night, but I haven't seen it mentioned anywhere else.

― caitlin (caitlin), Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:45 (twenty-one years ago)

a few people suggested that there were agent provocateurs (agents provacateur?) involved although i didn't hear football supporters being mentioned.

― koogs (koogs), Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:54 (twenty-one years ago)

Amusing how people who like to tear foxes to pieces with dogs will blame the violence on people who like to watch people kicking a leather ball around for 90mins and PEOPLE WILL BELIEVE THEM.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 16 September 2004 10:57 (twenty-one years ago)

haha i was watching the footage of the outside fracas and to be honest the young-middle aged men lunging at police did resemble yer stereotypical hooligan (not necess. football)

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 11:02 (twenty-one years ago)

the best thing about it all was that last night I realised BBC News had actually become Brass Eye.

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 11:03 (twenty-one years ago)

'On the haranguement scale this is definitely a Code Red!'

― the neurotic rassafrassa of ted maul (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 11:04 (twenty-one years ago)

and my knees go weak when Fiona Bruce coos 'unprecedented!' like that

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 11:05 (twenty-one years ago)

Fiona Bruce really was off on one last night with her come hither eyebrow and her new tan. "I've been on holiday and look what you silly little people have been doing".

The way Andrew Marr told the story you'd think his Mum had just been mugged. This spurious "parlimentarians won't be able to get close to their constituents" bollocks as well, good: maybe they'll turn up to teir own surgeries more often. After all parliment isn't particularly handy for constituents say in Sedgefield is it?

― Pete (Pete), Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:19 (twenty-one years ago)

yeh her eyebrows reached dizzy new heights, rowr

i like Marr more these days, but there was some idiot later on reporting about the demise of Jaguar or something and he actually said 'gooovy baaaby'.

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:32 (twenty-one years ago)

There was one particularly inbred looking fellow on the news last night threatening CIVIL WAR if the ban went ahead.

― Wooden (Wooden), Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:36 (twenty-one years ago)

the guy on stage singing that song was just jaw-dropping

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:37 (twenty-one years ago)

I would love it if this really did start a civil war.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:38 (twenty-one years ago)

Easy for you to say that, cocooned up there in foxhunting-free Glasgow.

― Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:41 (twenty-one years ago)

Who would win, do you think? The government or a load of farmers?

― Wooden (Wooden), Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:41 (twenty-one years ago)

God yes, rural toffs clashing skulls with the rozzers and urbanites, while on yonder heath a fox just cocks it's head aside, sniffs nonchalantly, and makes that horrendous yelping sound (laughter?).

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:42 (twenty-one years ago)

Now that's no way to talk about Bryan Ferry.

― Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:43 (twenty-one years ago)

The real winner was football (hooligans).

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:43 (twenty-one years ago)

Why has Dave B not come onto this thread and shouted 'CUNTS!' repeatedly yet?

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:43 (twenty-one years ago)

I'm pretty sure that horrendous yelping sound is fox shagging.

― Wooden (Wooden), Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:44 (twenty-one years ago)

Do you not laugh during copulation?

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:45 (twenty-one years ago)

Only if there's a mirror in the ceiling.

― Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:46 (twenty-one years ago)

omg the guy singing on stage! thing is, he reminded me more of the levellers (civil war ref -- ed) than any posh people's music like busted, bryan ferry, dido, etc.

― HKM, Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:47 (twenty-one years ago)

haw haw

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:52 (twenty-one years ago)

Busted and Dido are apparently the secret celebrity weapons for the next Tory election rally, that is if they can't persuade Madonna to get up on stage with Jimmy Tarbuck and Antony Worrall Thompson.

― Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:54 (twenty-one years ago)

Busted aren't posh music - They're the soundtrack to the revolution.

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:55 (twenty-one years ago)

They're the soundtrack to Conservative complacency.

― Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:57 (twenty-one years ago)

They're just three young guys havin' some fun

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:58 (twenty-one years ago)

They're three puppets who think Michael Howard is "the Right man for the job" of Prime Minister!

― Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Thursday, 16 September 2004 13:58 (twenty-one years ago)

is that right? i mean i'd read dido as archetypal blairite N1 music. busted are pure kingston-upon-thames, though.

― HKM, Thursday, 16 September 2004 14:00 (twenty-one years ago)

Michael Howard IS the Right man, it's good they do their homework

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 14:00 (twenty-one years ago)

It's what they go to school for.

Did anyone else hear Andrew Marr say that the BBC had been tipped off the day before about a planned protest in the Chamber, but ignored it cuz they didn't really think it was all that important?

― NickB (NickB), Thursday, 16 September 2004 14:07 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah, we certainly haven't heard the last of the BBC tip-off story.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 16 September 2004 14:08 (twenty-one years ago)

"Jug-eared Lefty Goon". I love Marr.

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Thursday, 16 September 2004 14:09 (twenty-one years ago)

I imagine they were rubbing their hands together in glee, going "this'll show the fuckers". There's a gigantic turd on Lord Hutton's doorstep as well.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 16 September 2004 14:09 (twenty-one years ago)

A fox turd.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 16 September 2004 14:10 (twenty-one years ago)

I almost, almost, stop hating Teh Sun when they run headlines like today's painfully obvious one

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 14:10 (twenty-one years ago)

They nicked that one off Ronan.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 16 September 2004 14:12 (twenty-one years ago)

What was it? (Haven't left the house today, no papers for me)

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Thursday, 16 September 2004 14:12 (twenty-one years ago)

FOR FOX SAKE!

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 16 September 2004 14:13 (twenty-one years ago)

also in today's super throwaway Metro

"There was also applause from the crowd when model Chloe Bailey, 28, stripped off a fox costume to reveal a message; "'For fox sake, don't ban hunting'.

'She had walked for three days from Cambridge dressed as a fox.'

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 14:14 (twenty-one years ago)

there are two fantastic photos on that same page of the STM that need to be scanned in soon as poss.

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 14:15 (twenty-one years ago)

Really? That's alright. Just "For Fucks Sake!" would have been better though.

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Thursday, 16 September 2004 14:16 (twenty-one years ago)

the silly bint could've been shot. i guess they don't let overgrown vermin on the train and that's why she had to walk.

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Thursday, 16 September 2004 14:17 (twenty-one years ago)

That would have been the best headline ever printed, Kevin.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 16 September 2004 14:17 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't like foxhunting. And I'm afraid I don't like its apologists, either, except the unfortunate one or two that I, in fact, do. I hope it will be banned, at long last, love.

The Ferry element surprises. Any information on Bryan's views? I am sorry if I have missed this and it has appeared, already.

― the fox, Thursday, 16 September 2004 14:56 (twenty-one years ago)

He may well be some kind of non-voting high Tory type. Ersatz member of squirearchy. My editor at Poshmag knows him, will have to report back.

― suzy (suzy), Thursday, 16 September 2004 20:20 (twenty-one years ago)

pro hunting protesters storming the parliament - what better time than this to RELEASE THE HOUNDS???????

"FOX HUNTING SUPPORTER TORN TO SHREDS BY PARLIAMENT HOUNDS"

awesome.

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 17 September 2004 09:15 (twenty-one years ago)

Ferry's on some Tory steering committee trying to drum up celebrity support for the next election. From my sources they are trying to persuade Madonna to turn up at their rallies (as Shireen Ritchie runs Tory HQ in Portilloland - RBKC) and have definitely also approached the management of Busted and Dido. Simon Cowell might be involved and might force some of the Pop Idol people under contract to him to turn up as well, to stand shoulder to shoulder with Tarby, Lynsey de Paul, Frank Bruno, Kelly Holmes (wanna bet?) etc.

― Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Friday, 17 September 2004 09:20 (twenty-one years ago)

Frank Bruno! Erm, from a PR point-of-view, not the best asset.

― HKM, Friday, 17 September 2004 09:22 (twenty-one years ago)

Bruno thinks he's De Tori, nowadays.

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 17 September 2004 09:24 (twenty-one years ago)

at least they're beating Kilroy-Silk to it

― the neurotic rassafrassa of harrumph (blueski), Friday, 17 September 2004 09:30 (twenty-one years ago)

... unfortunately not physically beating Kilroy-Silk... but I'm sure those new heroes of the working class, the Metropolitan Police can help out in that regard

― Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 17 September 2004 09:32 (twenty-one years ago)

All the CA pillocks are due to show up in Brighton in a couple of weeks time to demonstrate at the Labour Party Conference. I'm trying to think of some sort of counter-protest I can make. Preferably one where I don't come out of it with my head on a pole.

― NickB (NickB), Friday, 17 September 2004 10:03 (twenty-one years ago)

oh man my Frankie De Tory joke was so funny i can't believe no one's excelsiored it.

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 17 September 2004 10:07 (twenty-one years ago)

Strangely enough, Frankie Dettori is also on the Tory celebrity wish-list.

Others to look forward to: Marco Pierre White, Vinnie Jones.

― Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Friday, 17 September 2004 10:12 (twenty-one years ago)

May I suggest Phil Collins perhaps?

― NickB (NickB), Friday, 17 September 2004 10:14 (twenty-one years ago)

He lives in Switzerland ... mind you Sean Connery's a Scottish Nationalist and he lives in Monaco or somewhere

― Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 17 September 2004 10:16 (twenty-one years ago)

Roger Moore also lives in Switzerland but he managed to turn up for the last one.

― Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Friday, 17 September 2004 10:18 (twenty-one years ago)

Bev Bevan perhaps?

― Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 17 September 2004 10:19 (twenty-one years ago)

The Darkness! Where are they from again? Some Tory heartland seat.

― Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 17 September 2004 10:20 (twenty-one years ago)

Its going to be David Dickinson and Clarissa Thingy-Wright and you know it.

Actually, have they wheeled out Clarissa to rant about this yet? I'm quite surprised no one's blamed it on Brussells so far.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Friday, 17 September 2004 10:21 (twenty-one years ago)

'Blame it on Brussels' has a pleassing ring to it.

― HKM, Friday, 17 September 2004 10:22 (twenty-one years ago)

I reckon Jordan could be persuaded

― Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 17 September 2004 10:22 (twenty-one years ago)

The Darkness are from Lowestoft. Is that a Tory heartland?

Yes, Brummie's beatmaster Bev Bevan...he could bring Jeff Lynne along with him as well. In '68 the Idle Race said they were donating the royalties from one of their many flop singles to the Conservative Party to protest on behalf of the "misused youth" of this country.

Roy Wood - who isn't a Tory - has always said that his split from the original ELO was down to "political problems with Jeff."

― Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Friday, 17 September 2004 10:28 (twenty-one years ago)

"This was treason. The royal party and the lords - aided by a bit of feudal muscle from their hunt servants - were usurping the people's democracy."

Polly Toynbee. And she isn't joking. She really does believe that England under New Labour is a people's democracy.

― HKM, Friday, 17 September 2004 11:53 (twenty-one years ago)

Britain surely?

― Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 17 September 2004 11:54 (twenty-one years ago)

i think they've already banned hunting in scotland.

― HKM, Friday, 17 September 2004 12:04 (twenty-one years ago)

And Polly Toynbee.

― Alba (Alba), Friday, 17 September 2004 13:17 (twenty-one years ago)

Britain is funny.

The clip of the guys in tights chasing the protesters will be shown on the Japanese equivalent of Chris Tarrant's programmes for years to come.

― Joe Kay (feethurt), Friday, 17 September 2004 13:44 (twenty-one years ago)

Chu was good, about THE HOUNDS.

I am disappointed in Ferry - that's mild.

Donnie, is it true about those celebs?

― the fox, Saturday, 18 September 2004 10:18 (twenty-one years ago)

Okay, the Brighton body count so far is one dead horse dumped outside a bank (nay!) and a dead cow plus two dead calves cluttering up the road outside the Pavillion (moo hiss!). The first blow however was struck by the anti-hunt lobby apparently. According to the Guardian:
'Distinctly un-PC graffiti was daubed on the Countryside Alliance stand in Tony Blair's hotel. Large capital letters declared: "The Countryside Alliance are total cunts"'
Huzzah!

― NickB (NickB), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 09:53 (twenty-one years ago)

If Eno had stayed in Roxy Music none of this would have happened.

― Jasper Milvain, Tuesday, 28 September 2004 10:09 (twenty-one years ago)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v472/birdnestsoup/horsey.jpg

Sickening!
(I'd imagine the horse was gutted too)

― NickB (NickB), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:26 (twenty-one years ago)

Sorry, that pun was offal.

― NickB (NickB), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:27 (twenty-one years ago)

wow, they've gone like a whole body better than vito corleone. they shouldn't be messed with.

― Pete W (peterw), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:29 (twenty-one years ago)

If the headline had read "Protestors dump Ferry family carcasses in city centre" we would all be happy inna Mussolini stylee.

― Jasper Milvain, Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:30 (twenty-one years ago)

Blimey, the BBC just said it was a very lighthearted protest. Perhaps they are worried about alienating the CBeebies viewers.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:31 (twenty-one years ago)

http://image.guardian.co.uk/sys-images/Politics/Pix/pictures/2004/09/28/deadcow372.jpg

― NickB (NickB), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:34 (twenty-one years ago)

What the fuck?

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:35 (twenty-one years ago)

Ban hunting with cows now!

― NickB (NickB), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:35 (twenty-one years ago)

is bill drummond behind this?

― Pete W (peterw), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:35 (twenty-one years ago)

I'm trying to work out how dead (or live, for that matter) cows have anything to do w/foxhunting.

(haha x-post my first thought was the klf's dead sheep as well)

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:36 (twenty-one years ago)

They just love animals that's all - the deader the better

― Jedermann sein eigener Fussball (Dada), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:37 (twenty-one years ago)

i think it's about killing the countryside. subtle innit?

― Pete W (peterw), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:37 (twenty-one years ago)

Be good if it was the KLF - that would mean we might get some new records from them... :-))))

― Jasper Milvain, Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:38 (twenty-one years ago)

They've gotten all metaphorical on our asses. Dead asses are probably next on the menu

― Jedermann sein eigener Fussball (Dada), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:39 (twenty-one years ago)

Get Cliff Thorburn on the phone!

― teh pow! (blueski), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:41 (twenty-one years ago)

News just in - David Blunkett has just been found wandering around Brighton seafront looking lost, bewildered and without his guide dog.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:42 (twenty-one years ago)

Ha ha

― Jedermann sein eigener Fussball (Dada), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:43 (twenty-one years ago)

Someone take him for a walk off the pier.

Apparently the carcasses of dead farm animals are fed to the hounds. Take away the dogs and the streets will be awash with putrifying heifers.

― NickB (NickB), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:43 (twenty-one years ago)

sounds like Hatfield town centre on a Friday night

thanks i'm here all year

― teh pow! (blueski), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:44 (twenty-one years ago)

Dead farm animals are wasted on dogs

― Jedermann sein eigener Fussball (Dada), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:45 (twenty-one years ago)

Aah, that second winter of discontent, where the horses lay uneaten in the streets for weeks on end. Thank god the Tories will be around to get us out of that mess.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:46 (twenty-one years ago)

i thought the dead cow etc thing was about how the foxes will KILL ALL THESE COWS AND HORSES AND SHIT omg! if they don't rip the foxes to bits.

― ken c (ken c), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:49 (twenty-one years ago)

So where are the chickens then? It's always chickens they say foxes kill, these country folk.

― Jedermann sein eigener Fussball (Dada), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:51 (twenty-one years ago)

they were hiding cos they were chicken

― ken c (ken c), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:52 (twenty-one years ago)

Feed the cows to the foxes and they'll have no room for eating chicken.

― NickB (NickB), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:54 (twenty-one years ago)

"If you see a lovely field with a family having a picnic, and there’s a nice pond in it, you fill in the pond with concrete, you plough the family into the field, you blow up the tree, and use the leaves to make a dress for your wife who’s also your brother."

― Jedermann sein eigener Fussball (Dada), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 12:56 (twenty-one years ago)

So which side is depositing dead farmyard animals? Seems to me that if you enter the realm of tenuous argument, you can make points in favour/against each side by dumping ovine corpses.

― Markelby (Mark C), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 13:03 (twenty-one years ago)

Aah, that second winter of discontent, where the horses lay uneaten in the streets for weeks on end

it's a good thing i wasn't drinking milk when i read this, or it would have been coming out of my nose...

the carcasses of dead farm animals are fed to the hounds

hein? where the hell does all that meat in the supermarket come from then, is that not dead farm animal???

― CarsmileSteve (CarsmileSteve), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 13:14 (twenty-one years ago)

There is obviously an EEC Dead Animal Mountain somewhere. In Wales probably.

― Jedermann sein eigener Fussball (Dada), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 13:17 (twenty-one years ago)

Yep, but hopefully not animals that have died of dysentry and then been left in the corner of a shitty field all week.

x-post

Feeding them to the dogs is the most economic option, otherwise the farmers need to pay to get them incinerated. Why the foxes are to blame for this I don't know.

― NickB (NickB), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 13:21 (twenty-one years ago)

Feeding them to the dogs is the most economic option, otherwise the farmers need to pay to get them incinerated. Why the foxes are to blame for this I don't know.

yeah, it isn't like they can't keep their hounds around as cutesey wootsey little pets, and they'd still need to eat...

this whole thing really disgusts me. there's some fucked up people out there.

― colette (a2lette), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 13:26 (twenty-one years ago)

Woah, I totally missed the whole carcass dumping thing. (Officially condemned by the Countryside Alliance incidentally.)

Yet another lengthy and unpleasant bus journey home tonight I dare say.

― Archel (Archel), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 14:25 (twenty-one years ago)

Officially condemned by the Countryside Alliance incidentally - I think we got a Sinn Fein/Provos thang goin' on here

― Jedermann sein eigener Fussball (Dada), Tuesday, 28 September 2004 14:26 (twenty-one years ago)

Jasper, if you're the Jasper I know, what sucked you into this particular whirlpool?

― Milton Pinski, Tuesday, 28 September 2004 14:35 (twenty-one years ago)

Jasper Buckaroo? He's back?

― the bellefox, Tuesday, 28 September 2004 15:06 (twenty-one years ago)

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