What do a man's preference for certain looks reveal his character?

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Nina:

ihttp://www.bobgruen.com/potda/1101/iggynina.gif

Miranda:

ihttp://www.studentnewspaper.org/features/03-04/issue09/aocmiranda.jpg

i find 'cute' (miranda) much hotter than 'hot' (nina), which i often don't find hot at all. i wonder if this means i am afraid of aggressive female sexuality.
-- m. (mitchnet70NOSPA...), October 25th, 2004 2:16 PM.

I wonder about this too.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:35 (twenty-one years ago)

i'm not sure if nina is a good indicator of this sort of thing. she's more freakish, as opposed to aggressive.

― lauren (laurenp), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:39 (twenty-one years ago)

actually, she's probably aggressive as heck.

― lauren (laurenp), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:40 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah, OK - forget freako Nina. But the woman doesn't have to be actually aggressive. Just glammy hot, I think.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:41 (twenty-one years ago)

someone like rose macgowan, maybe?

― lauren (laurenp), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:42 (twenty-one years ago)

The grammatical error in my question (should read 'preferences') is annoying me, something which probably correlates with a fear of aggressive female sexuality.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:43 (twenty-one years ago)

Indie boys are wimps? ;-)

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:43 (twenty-one years ago)

I was thinking LA blondes in leather mini skirts, to be honest.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:43 (twenty-one years ago)

The point is, they don't have to actually be aggressive - it's just the suspicion of what that look reveals about them.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:44 (twenty-one years ago)

i kind of figured. i was trying to think of a famous one that's not surgically enhanced, but i couldn't come up with one!

― lauren (laurenp), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:44 (twenty-one years ago)

Yes, it's hard.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:45 (twenty-one years ago)

Ooer Nick, sounds a bit rude!

When I were a lad, Lynsey de Paul bending swooningly over her piano (cute) and Suzi Quatro 69ing her Fender bass (glam hot) both turned me on in different ways. So I don't mind a bit of both. Not that I get a bit of anything these days.

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 25 October 2004 12:45 (twenty-one years ago)

Anyway, the other thing is that nice, middle class liberal women tend to disapprove in some way of men fancying Pamela Anderson types, like the man is deeper or something if he fancies gamine or bespectacled women. Julie Burchill used to take the piss out of this tendency, I seem to recall.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:48 (twenty-one years ago)

Now that you mention it, I do have a thing about women who wear glasses!

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 25 October 2004 12:51 (twenty-one years ago)

It's weird because of those photographs, Miranda Sawyer is blonde and Iggy's girlfriend isn't, so there goes that theory.

I think what you can tell about type though is the less visual things.

Based on occupation alone, what are the chances that an Average ILX Boy will have more in common with a journalist (who probably has a brain, can probably write, hold a conversation, probably has some kind of taste or discernment enough about music to discuss it in reasonable depth) or with a model?

That kind of thing doesn't bother me at all.

But when boys are scared of women because they think they are "sexually aggressive" - that just makes me want to smack them about the head with a teddy bear.

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:51 (twenty-one years ago)

It's weird because of those photographs, Miranda Sawyer is blonde and Iggy's girlfriend isn't, so there goes that theory.

There's a strong, but by no means perfect, correlation with blonde hair.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:53 (twenty-one years ago)

This from the man who once said "If I'm going to date a blonde, she had better be flaxen!"

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:53 (twenty-one years ago)

Interesting choice of phrase there: "boys are scared of women," as opposed to men being scared of women...

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 25 October 2004 12:54 (twenty-one years ago)

Bloody hell, you still remember that!

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:54 (twenty-one years ago)

i'm not "cute." physically i'm closer to the aggressive/amazon type (even though i wouldn't describe myself that way) but personalitywise i'm pretty geeky and shy (like the indie boys fancy). but people will always characterize more well-endowed girls as slutty for whatever reason.

― motown modown (Jody Beth Rosen), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:55 (twenty-one years ago)

(that was in response to Kate, btw)

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:55 (twenty-one years ago)

also i don't wear glasses and i'm sure i'm smarter than 90 percent of the women who do!

― motown modown (Jody Beth Rosen), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:56 (twenty-one years ago)

Oh yeah, that's the other other thing: why on earth is it more shallow, or brutish, to fancy someone for their breasts than it is to fancy them for their face? They're both just parts of the body.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:58 (twenty-one years ago)

Because the eyes are the window of the soul, and the breasts are the windows of the... erm... mammary glands or something.

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:59 (twenty-one years ago)

Marcello otm throughout this thread.

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Monday, 25 October 2004 12:59 (twenty-one years ago)

I'd rather C on a girl's T's than in her I's.

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:00 (twenty-one years ago)

here's a kleenex, hon.

― motown modown (Jody Beth Rosen), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:01 (twenty-one years ago)

What I find more annoying is the sort of insinuation that a female cannot be *both* sexually aggressive and intellectual. It's that old either/or Madonna/Whore shite dressed up in emo glasses and I'm not having it.

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:01 (twenty-one years ago)

God - this thread title makes even less sense than I first thought. There's supposed to be an 'about' in there somewhere, too.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:02 (twenty-one years ago)

Kate - I don't think the intellectual thing has to come into it, really. The 'cute' look doesn't have to belong to intellectual women.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:03 (twenty-one years ago)

"Both sexually aggressive and intellectual" = my ideal!

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 25 October 2004 13:04 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah, Alba, but isn't that the whole schtick of the "cute" - glasses, sweaters, dark hair, etc. - girl?

I suppose I'm thinking more "bookish" cute while you're probably thinking twee hairslides cute, which is perhaps even less intellectually threatening than the blonde amazon in the miniskirt is sexually threatening.

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:04 (twenty-one years ago)

M1r4nd4 S4wy3r looks a bit like Neil Hannon in that pic, ergo ILX will want her b4b13z.

― CharlieNo4 (Charlie), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:06 (twenty-one years ago)

Kate - maybe for some men. I guess I tend to fancy 'cute' looking women more than the average man does, but this covers women I know aren't bookish or whatever at all.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:07 (twenty-one years ago)

i s'pose cute is sometimes another way of saying 'bookish', but not always. and 'bookish' is only one kind of 'smart'.

xpost!

― m. (mitchlnw), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:08 (twenty-one years ago)

(xpost with kate, for the record)

― m. (mitchlnw), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:09 (twenty-one years ago)

You know, this is actually starting to make me feel cross, because people take the piss out of me for having a very distinct physical type. But, you know, if you're a man, then that's OK.

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:10 (twenty-one years ago)

how do you (general "you") know that the "hot" girl isn't bookish?

― motown modown (Jody Beth Rosen), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:10 (twenty-one years ago)

i wonder if indie boys are taught that liking the "hot" girl = the wrong answer. they're more likely to pull if they say they fancy the meek/cute/plain jane girl with glasses.

― motown modown (Jody Beth Rosen), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:12 (twenty-one years ago)

Excatly - that's what I was getting at with the stuff that Julie Burchill mocked, above.

We should drop this whole 'bookish' red herring, btw.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:13 (twenty-one years ago)

"pneumatic"

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:13 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't think it's a red herring, though.

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:14 (twenty-one years ago)

(what kind of cute was the kate winslet character from eternal sunshine? she worked in a bookstore which might lead one to 'bookish', but the changing hair colour thing was maybe more twee cute)(her character was actually not all that fanciable i thought, though i find the actress very attractive)(these questions are perhaps entirely irrelevant)

xpost, sorry about not having dropped the herring

― m. (mitchlnw), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:14 (twenty-one years ago)

She was really thick. And not cute.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:15 (twenty-one years ago)

she was the BATSHIT INSANE kind of cute

― motown modown (Jody Beth Rosen), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:15 (twenty-one years ago)

Also my idea of "intellectual" women is not that of an indie girl; my preferences travel more towards the direction of women like Charlotte Rampling, Helen Mirren, Juliet Stevenson, Jane Birkin...experienced sophisticates. So that probably nails my mindset as being Oedipus with a Ph.D.

I am increasingly tolerant of the idea that if I am ever to find another partner, it will have to be somebody older, but in the Marianne Faithfull sense of "older" as opposed to the Thora Hird sense.

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 25 October 2004 13:15 (twenty-one years ago)

'Old lady with cats' kind of cute.

x-post

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:16 (twenty-one years ago)

i can get with that, marcello.

― motown modown (Jody Beth Rosen), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:16 (twenty-one years ago)

Yes, I agree. Though not Juliet Stevenson.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:17 (twenty-one years ago)

Though I still think we should drop the herring.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:17 (twenty-one years ago)

Alba - what does an attraction to extremely short, feisty London girls in tracksuits say?!?!

― ___ (___), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:18 (twenty-one years ago)

You dirty devil.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:18 (twenty-one years ago)

(did you try it on??)

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:18 (twenty-one years ago)

DROP THE HERRING

― motown modown (Jody Beth Rosen), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:19 (twenty-one years ago)

These are the kind of threads that make me think that I don't like you, Alba.

Because it's this whole "cute" festishisation thing.

I mean, maybe it's personal, because I am of a quite... Amazonian stature. If I take care of myself, I can just about get to the whole "tall, blonde, busty" sort of look.

But never in a million years will I EVER be "cute" in any way shape or form.

And there's just this sort of ingrown prejudice amoung indie boys (or whatever phrase you want to use) that somehow the tall, blonde, busty girls are icky and "LA" but that always fancying the ickle Winona Ryder girls is somehow not shallow in the same way.

I don't know, this sort of thing just really winds me up.

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:19 (twenty-one years ago)

OTM OTM OTM

― motown modown (Jody Beth Rosen), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:19 (twenty-one years ago)

What??

I'm not even particularly into this 'cute' look. I just said that, realistically, I'm probably more into it than the average man on the street, as compared to Pammy looks. I like all sorts of different looks - get off my case!

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:20 (twenty-one years ago)

Alba - No I did not! Funniest car journey home I have had in a long time though. Absolute madness - her take on religion!

We did *accidentally* end up with a case of evian from Harthill due to our London friends!

― ___ (___), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:21 (twenty-one years ago)

i don't think it's automatic that tall, blonde, and busty equals la. all terriers are dogs, but not all dogs are paris hilton.

― lauren (laurenp), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:21 (twenty-one years ago)

And perhaps my extreme type-driven fetish - or at least my extreme going on about such to such an extent - is a reaction to this.

Like... OK, if it's fair for guys to fetishise a certain type, regardless of what the person underneath is really like - then it's more than fair for me to go overboard into an exaggerated parody of that sort of thing.

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:21 (twenty-one years ago)

x-post, Lauren, you have really gone to the dogs today!

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:21 (twenty-one years ago)

Isn't that exactly what I was saying was ridiculous myself, upthread?

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:22 (twenty-one years ago)

Is it, Alba?

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:22 (twenty-one years ago)

Here:

Anyway, the other thing is that nice, middle class liberal women tend to disapprove in some way of men fancying Pamela Anderson types, like the man is deeper or something if he fancies gamine or bespectacled women. Julie Burchill used to take the piss out of this tendency, I seem to recall.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:24 (twenty-one years ago)

I like nice girls. I find it very hard to accept that a girl can be "nice" and "sexually aggressive", so the latter quality becomes a big turn-off to me (not to mention my 19th century prudery about certain things, but that's entirely a personality flaw of my own).

― Markelby (Mark C), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:24 (twenty-one years ago)

I mean, yeah, I was talking about women there, but of course men are complicit in it too.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:25 (twenty-one years ago)

I find it very hard to accept that a girl can be "nice" and "sexually aggressive".

This infuriates me to the point where I want to beat men over the head with feminist tracts. OK, that's just downright AGGRESSIVE rather than sexually aggressive, but still...

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:26 (twenty-one years ago)

Good - attack Mark instead of me. he deserves it.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:27 (twenty-one years ago)

I mean, yeah, I was talking about women there, but of course men are complicit in it too.

No, that's exactly it. You're dissing women for this kind of behaviour, when it's men who are being just as shallow there. In fact, they are the root of the shallowness, as it's their behaviour in the first place!

It's more like, this is the men's problem, and yeah, the women are probably the complicit ones.

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:27 (twenty-one years ago)

this is probably neither here nor there, but pamela anderson is really quite pretty when she's not got scary makeup trowelled on.

― lauren (laurenp), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:29 (twenty-one years ago)

I still think we basically agree, Kate.

What do you think of jody's "i wonder if indie boys are taught that liking the "hot" girl = the wrong answer. they're more likely to pull if they say they fancy the meek/cute/plain jane girl with glasses. "

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:30 (twenty-one years ago)

this is probably neither here nor there, but pamela anderson is really quite pretty when she's not got scary makeup trowelled on.

This is another thing. Yes, I agree, personally, but is mocking heavy makeup just another middle-class-liberal way of belittling what tend to be more the sexual preferences of people in other social strata?

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:33 (twenty-one years ago)

OK, I've probably gone too far.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:34 (twenty-one years ago)

That just sounds so high school to me. It's not even insecurity as much as it sounds like high school tribes or something.

Or maybe it's a weird extension that standards thing that we started to get into on the other thread before it became about slagging off female music journalists. That people aspire to date people at about their own level of attractiveness. So instead of being about actually finding someone at the same level of attractiveness, it's about this cliche of... gah, this will x-post and I still can't quite express what I'm thinking.

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:35 (twenty-one years ago)

I like PAris hilton

― sometimes i like to pretend i am very small and warm (ex machina), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:37 (twenty-one years ago)

I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the OC, where they spent a season and a half on the whole Seth-Anna-Summer triangle.
Anna was the cool cute punka chick who read comics and listened to Bright Eyes (just like Seth), whereas Summer is the busty shallow cheerleader type. Then again you could read something into the fact Summer is brunette and Anna blone. Reserval of archetypes or something.
I think Anna's prettier though.

― Stew S (stew s), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:47 (twenty-one years ago)

Wouldn't know, old chap, I'm more of a Coronation Street person.

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 25 October 2004 13:49 (twenty-one years ago)

RE this weekend's OC. Anna and Summer>>>Paris Hilton No contest!
Paris Hilton is sooo vacuous and irritating I wouldn't fancy her even if she looked like Chan Marshall or Liv Tyler.

― Stew S (stew s), Monday, 25 October 2004 13:51 (twenty-one years ago)

WTF does someone's chest size have to do with anything??

― k3rry (dymaxia), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:00 (twenty-one years ago)

It shouldn't have anything to do with anything, but it appears that it sometimes does.

Actually, I'm not sure its chest size per se, more how a large chest is presented.

Anyway, this is maybe a redbreasted herring.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:02 (twenty-one years ago)

Kate, let me emphasise the emphasis in my comment, and add the unspoken inference:

I [personally] find it very hard [because of my various hang-ups] to accept that a girl can be "nice" and "sexually aggressive" [even though I know deep down that there is no reason she can't be both].

Hope that clarifies what I meant.

― Markelby (Mark C), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:06 (twenty-one years ago)

YOU MUST NOT HAVE FAILINGS.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:06 (twenty-one years ago)

i'm the last person to mock the use of make-up. have a look in my bathroom. but i know what you're getting at.. christ. this is a really hard thing to attempt to quantify.

― lauren (laurenp), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:12 (twenty-one years ago)

Ha - "YOU MUST NOT HAVE FAILINGS" is posted at the front of every club and wine bar in West London! Or might as well be.

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 25 October 2004 14:14 (twenty-one years ago)

another middle-class-liberal way of belittling what tend to be more the sexual preferences of people in other social strata

to put this another way: no matter how "sensitive" we are, it's still pretty much open season where gender/class are concerned.

― lauren (laurenp), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:17 (twenty-one years ago)

"Actually, I'm not sure its chest size per se, more how a large chest is presented.

Under a hoodie?

― ___ (___), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:18 (twenty-one years ago)

Down boy!

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:22 (twenty-one years ago)

I think it's interesting that men tend to be pegged as shallow but women end up being just as shallow. For instance, Kate, what makes you think that your liking scrawny dirty drone rock boys is less shallow than liking beef cakey muscle dudes?

― battlin' green eyeshades (Homosexual II), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:22 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't think she does think that, does she?

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:23 (twenty-one years ago)

But she critically considers the socio-economic implications oif her fetishization!

CONCIOUSNESS

― sometimes i like to pretend i am very small and warm (ex machina), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:24 (twenty-one years ago)

I have no idea, actually.

I just have recently discovered that I'm pretty shallow for a shallow-man disliker.

― battlin' green eyeshades (Homosexual II), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:24 (twenty-one years ago)

i think often the problem is not what type one goes for but how much they go on and on about this to people

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:36 (twenty-one years ago)

Dude I know! I mean, blue eyes and dark hair make me swoon but I would never tell a roomful of strangers about it.

― You've Got to Pick Up Every Stitch (tracerhand), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:48 (twenty-one years ago)

*rimshot*

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:50 (twenty-one years ago)

Thanks for the sympathy drumming, Ned. I'm not really on today.

― You've Got to Pick Up Every Stitch (tracerhand), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:51 (twenty-one years ago)

my point was, if you go on and on about your type then regardless of what that type consists of, people may start viewing you as 'shallow' because of the amount of time you spend on the subject. glasses are still rowr tho...

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:53 (twenty-one years ago)

No, they're not. Though for the first time I can remember, I found a girl who looks hotter in glasses than without the other day.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:58 (twenty-one years ago)

NO?! how dare you disagree!

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:59 (twenty-one years ago)

"Types" are really only a guide for lecherous windowshopping. If you only make moves on people who are "your type" then you're as much of a fetishist as someone who only gets off on being peed on or whatever.

(all my gfs since time immemorial have needed glasses. Stevem, would you be so kind as to add the pucnhline?)

― Markelby (Mark C), Monday, 25 October 2004 14:59 (twenty-one years ago)

(of course it's not as if i think anyone wearing glasses automatically = hot - i'm not THAT shallow ;)

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Monday, 25 October 2004 15:00 (twenty-one years ago)

"I'm a rapist!"

x-post

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 15:01 (twenty-one years ago)

I think the addition of a slideshow would really elevate this thread.

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Monday, 25 October 2004 15:03 (twenty-one years ago)

With Powerpoint clip art.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 15:04 (twenty-one years ago)

TEH CHIPETTES

― sometimes i like to pretend i am very small and warm (ex machina), Monday, 25 October 2004 15:06 (twenty-one years ago)

I look ugly in glasses. I should get lenses, but the thought of touching my eyeballs creeps me out. So instead I walk around blind like Marilyn Monroe in "How to Marry a Millionaire"

― battlin' green eyeshades (Homosexual II), Monday, 25 October 2004 15:14 (twenty-one years ago)

If you only make moves on people who are "your type" then you're as much of a fetishist as someone who only gets off on being peed on or whatever.

huh? right tonight I'm going to go out and only come on to people I find unattractive, because otherwise I am a bizarro fetishist! afterall the quality of peoples personalities obviously decreases the more attractive they are! i saw it in Shallow Hal!

― Ronan (Ronan), Monday, 25 October 2004 15:17 (twenty-one years ago)

Mark didn't explictly say there's nothing wrong with being a piss fetishist.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 15:19 (twenty-one years ago)

(That's what I'm clinging to - I don't know how I'd sleep soundly tonight, otherwise)

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 15:20 (twenty-one years ago)

Yes, that's true. Sorry Ronan, what I meant was that it is a bona fide fetish if you only go for girls with glasses, or girls with short hair, or flat-chested girls, or some other physical signifier. I don't know anyone who's stuck religiously to one type like this - people are attractive for the intangible more than the tangible, and even if you happen to have a thing for busty redheads, say, that doesn't mean you're only going to date them.

― Markelby (Mark C), Monday, 25 October 2004 15:22 (twenty-one years ago)

I dunno, I think some people probably are really into certain looks and that's ok really, I don't think I am personally but it doesn't mean whatever I feel my type is isn't based on looks either, I'd say it is as much as the next person's.

Alot of the threads recently ask questions which were well battled out on that giant old thread about attractiveness etc, I forget the title of it though.

― Ronan (Ronan), Monday, 25 October 2004 15:26 (twenty-one years ago)

Miranda should dye her hair.

― jel -- (jel), Monday, 25 October 2004 15:30 (twenty-one years ago)

Oh - I meant "anything wrong", but it doesn't really matter.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 15:49 (twenty-one years ago)

Having preferences towards a certain look or 'type' or whatever is perfectly normal and A-OK. I do, Ronan does, Marcello does, we all do.

Now, I totally see Mark's point that to focus exclusively on one type is unhealthy, and I was about to OTM him on this, but then I thought... WAIT - what's wrong with someone who only approaches/dates people of his/her 'type' - won't that person be happier? i.e., they will constantly be with people they are most attracted to, rather than 'settling' for someone who maybe they grew to like, but didn't really think much of at first...

― Rob Bolton (Rob Bolton), Monday, 25 October 2004 15:53 (twenty-one years ago)

Are these two ladies famous type people?

― jel -- (jel), Monday, 25 October 2004 15:54 (twenty-one years ago)

One writes about Iggy Pop and the other fucks him, so no, not really.

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Monday, 25 October 2004 15:59 (twenty-one years ago)

I never got the appeal of Iggy Pop.

― jel -- (jel), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:02 (twenty-one years ago)

I like teh "cute" girls, myself.

― jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:03 (twenty-one years ago)

Rachael Leigh Cook before transformation in She's All That.

― jel -- (jel), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:05 (twenty-one years ago)

Rob, the whole deal of falling in love is what you grow to love as more and more about the person is revealed to you, including the less good parts. You can fancy someone rotten till their dying day, but can you honestly say that, after 3 years or so of a relationship, the fact thet they have big tits or blue eyes is your number one favourite thing about them?

― Markelby (Mark C), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:05 (twenty-one years ago)

I'd post the lyrics to "I Like Dem Girlz" but most of the qualities described have more to do with personality than physical appearance.

― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:05 (twenty-one years ago)

Oh FUCK this is so confusing - I was thinking "yeah, if busty redeads really blow your skirt up, and you only approach/date them, that's great - we should all be so lucky! i.e., being with people that we are most attracted to!", and then I though - WAIT, what if you fancy busty redeads, but you don't actually succeed at hooking up with any - then you'll become bitter about it and become obsessed, thereby decreasing your chances at meeting busty redeads, and on you go down the spiral...

― Rob Bolton (Rob Bolton), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:07 (twenty-one years ago)

and yes Mark - there's the whole 'growing to love someone over time' thing but i kinda took that as read for the purposes of this thread which is about 'preferences for looks'

― Rob Bolton (Rob Bolton), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:09 (twenty-one years ago)

Well, yes, but think of all the affairs you've had, then subtract all the ones that don't fit within the narrowest definition of your type you can muster. It would have been a real shame not to have experienced any of these intimacies, non?

― Markelby (Mark C), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:10 (twenty-one years ago)

Can people stop talking about busty redheads, please? I am find it very distracting.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:13 (twenty-one years ago)

Oui. I do have 'preferences', but looking at my dating history there is very little consistency, and I wouldn't change that. (well, maybe a couple of them)

and where did kate go? i was curious to see her response after sorta being called on her possible double standard - i.e. her liking dirty skinny rock boys and not the 'beefcake/fit' types, which i'm sure she (and many gals) will immediately say are "gross! eww!" in the same way that a lot of us guys reject the "LA/fake tits&tan/porn star" look...

― Rob Bolton (Rob Bolton), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:13 (twenty-one years ago)

http://gil.formosa.free.fr/galerie/Disney_warner/images/DISNEY%20JESSICA%20RABBIT.jpg

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:14 (twenty-one years ago)

you people are rather defensive

― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:15 (twenty-one years ago)

I think my preferences would indicate that I grew up in the '90s listening to indie and alterna-rock. (ie Corin Tucker, Lisa Loeb, Juliana Hatfield, Claire Danes, et al. forming the 'cute bookish indie girl' archetype, dating girls from the same social sphere I was in going to punk shows and listening to bad music)

― milozauckerman (miloaukerman), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:16 (twenty-one years ago)

I'm a sucker for a pretty face, I don't care if she's a leather or lace.

― Brett (jel), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:18 (twenty-one years ago)

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/biondino/thorared.jpg

― Markelby (Mark C), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:20 (twenty-one years ago)

I only find that picture a little disturbing because she looks 15.

― battlin' green eyeshades (Homosexual II), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:23 (twenty-one years ago)

stop! you're hurting Alba! (and me - i actually have a 'preference' for redheads)

― Rob Bolton (Rob Bolton), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:23 (twenty-one years ago)

Thora Birch isn't a real redhead, so it's not quite right, but oh my on the tight sweater front.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:25 (twenty-one years ago)

really? she's got the pale skin and the red eyebrows...

― Rob Bolton (Rob Bolton), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:26 (twenty-one years ago)

she's a blonde I believe. Rob, eyebrows can be dyed.

― battlin' green eyeshades (Homosexual II), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:28 (twenty-one years ago)

I didn't notice thora's sweater.

― jel -- (jel), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:33 (twenty-one years ago)

Surely it's not possible that I... fetishize breasts?

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:34 (twenty-one years ago)

You evil man!

― jel -- (jel), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:35 (twenty-one years ago)

I think I fetishize breasts in tight sweaters in particular. Far better than in a bikini, most of the time. This is another sign that I am afraid of aggressive female sexuality.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:38 (twenty-one years ago)

JLD, oh my!
http://www.medialifemagazine.com/news2002/feb02/feb11/5_fri/news3f1.jpg

― adam. (nordicskilla), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:39 (twenty-one years ago)

My parents would be delighted.

― adam. (nordicskilla), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:39 (twenty-one years ago)

she stole that dress from cher!

― jel -- (jel), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:40 (twenty-one years ago)

ugh, don't SAY that!

― adam. (nordicskilla), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:40 (twenty-one years ago)

Help her, she's in trouble!

― Jordan (Jordan), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:40 (twenty-one years ago)

If only...

― adam. (nordicskilla), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:41 (twenty-one years ago)

(who is she, btw?)

― jel -- (jel), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:41 (twenty-one years ago)

JULIA LOUIS DREYFUS, star of STAGE and SCREEN

― adam. (nordicskilla), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:42 (twenty-one years ago)

Where does she fall on the cute - hot line? I don't fancy her, anyway.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:43 (twenty-one years ago)

(I'm sure she's mortified to hear)

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:45 (twenty-one years ago)

Where does she fall on the cute - hot line

I am not familiar with this principle. At the midpoint, maybe?

― adam. (nordicskilla), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:46 (twenty-one years ago)

so Nick, why made you ask this about men only?

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:48 (twenty-one years ago)

In some ways, JLD seems like someone I should find attractive, but I've never fancied her.

― jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:50 (twenty-one years ago)

I'd like to build a little Kibbutz with her.

― adam. (nordicskilla), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:53 (twenty-one years ago)

Steve - sometime specificity is best. I thought maybe some issues were specific to the heterosexual male experience.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:55 (twenty-one years ago)

http://www.amit.org.il/Hagim/sucot/images/Lulav.gif

― adam. (nordicskilla), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:55 (twenty-one years ago)

I fancy the hell out of her (and strangely, I'm not usually attracted to Jewish women) (I'm assuming she's Jewish, Adam).

― Jordan (Jordan), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:56 (twenty-one years ago)

Are men more likely to have a "type" than women are? I think maybe so, KSt.C excepted.

― jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:57 (twenty-one years ago)

fair dos Alba/Nick/N (i never know what to call you), they say it is a man's world after all (by they i guess i mean MENG)

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:57 (twenty-one years ago)

Are men more likely to have a "type" than women are? I think maybe so

why would that be tho? (not necess. disagreeing)

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:57 (twenty-one years ago)

You can call me Alba.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:58 (twenty-one years ago)

I think JLD has always seemed to me like a "cool aunt" or something.

― jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:58 (twenty-one years ago)

Women like funny, ugly men,

― adam. (nordicskilla), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:58 (twenty-one years ago)

Stevem, probably for the same reason why men are more "visual" with sex in general.

― jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 25 October 2004 16:59 (twenty-one years ago)

To the point of incorporating slideshows into lovemaking.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:01 (twenty-one years ago)

One of my own little pecadilloes - scale models.

― adam. (nordicskilla), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:04 (twenty-one years ago)

graphs

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:11 (twenty-one years ago)

ooooooooh, that's hot.

― adam. (nordicskilla), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:13 (twenty-one years ago)

http://www.moviecitynews.com/archives/david/images/maggie.JPG

Fuckin' deadly.

I like 'em coy but dirty, and as unconventionally pretty as possible without actually being ugly.

― Hank Tenbeer (kenan), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:18 (twenty-one years ago)

Who is he?

― adam. (nordicskilla), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:18 (twenty-one years ago)

Which, in Maggie G's case, is not very far.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:19 (twenty-one years ago)

Is it supposed to look exactly like she's doing a bump?

― W i l l (common_person), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:31 (twenty-one years ago)

Someone really ought to knit the rest of her top, she'll catch the death of cold.

― jel -- (jel), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:31 (twenty-one years ago)

I find it very hard to accept that a girl can be "nice" and "sexually aggressive".

WTF

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:39 (twenty-one years ago)

Mark has addressed that already

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:44 (twenty-one years ago)

I think there's a difference bewteen sexually aggressive vs. aggressively sexual -- kinda like what is done in bed vs. what is done to get someone in bed. I think I may have seen this on another thread. I like those who are the former but not so much the latter.

― W i l l (common_person), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:47 (twenty-one years ago)

I think maybe the word 'assertive' would have been better.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:49 (twenty-one years ago)

So is it every guy's fantasy to be with a girl who's "shy" and "nice" in public, but "assertive"/"agressive" in the bedroom?

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:52 (twenty-one years ago)

By which I mean people who are upfront about what they get up to, and like, sexually, maybe with a hint of not putting up with sexual partners who don't come up to scratch. Sex and the City, yes.

I think I find sexual assertiveness in men obnoxious, and (a bit) scary in women.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:52 (twenty-one years ago)

Phwoar - yeah, Barry.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:52 (twenty-one years ago)

(no, not really, but someone being shy/submissive in bed is certainly not good)

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:53 (twenty-one years ago)

One problem in this unfair bashing of indie aesthetics here (which shock of shocks I am going to stick up for) (and may have already been mentioned but this thread is too long) IS that along with a stereotyped look, come stereotyped interests. So when indie boy sees a Winona clone, it may not be "hey, she's hot b/c she looks like that girl in Azure Ray" but may actually be "hey, I bet she digs some of the same stuff I do."

Also notice ILx will never point out this stereotyped bullshit against any other group but indie kids, as if there are no other marketable sub-genres of people out there.

Finally once again I would like to point out that most ilxors who bash indie look really fucking indie in my experience.

― bnw (bnw), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:53 (twenty-one years ago)

Not for the first time, I am trying to think about this in relation to me and not getting terribly far. In the last few years my sexual/romantic partners have included white, black and asian; blonde, brown, black and red hair; tall and short; heavy and light; big and small breasts (and male and female, but that's out of the scope here I guess). I can't think of any common physical characteristics at all. I guess I've never got anywhere with anyone who wasn't distinctly on the intellectual side, but we do seem to be talking about physical matters here really. Glasses are a significant plus for me in sexual attractiveness terms, generally - I think deep down I see them as a signifier of an intellectual type, even though consciously I know they are only a sign of less than great eyesight.

― Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:55 (twenty-one years ago)

Is this an unconscious thing, do you think? Because I certainly don't find women sexy on the basis that they look like they might share my interests.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:56 (twenty-one years ago)

Finally once again I would like to point out that most ilxors who bash indie look really fucking indie in my experience.

This is where someone inserts the photo of Jess with the bear, right?

― jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 25 October 2004 17:56 (twenty-one years ago)

Haha, I barely even listen to rock music, and yet I do look very indie.

― Jordan (Jordan), Monday, 25 October 2004 18:06 (twenty-one years ago)

I consider it "stealth indie." Somehow the indie rock chicks always know that it's a front, though.

― Jordan (Jordan), Monday, 25 October 2004 18:06 (twenty-one years ago)

I guess I look indie-ish or man at uni-qlo, or oh dear why did you buy that shirt?, but I mainly listen to rock and metal these days.

― jel -- (jel), Monday, 25 October 2004 18:09 (twenty-one years ago)

I consider it "stealth indie." Somehow the indie rock chicks always know that it's a front, though.

"Show me the Elephant 6 vinyl, bucko."

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 18:10 (twenty-one years ago)

I have a limited edition neutral milk hotel 7 inch picture disc (holland bw engine - no 328), I should take it with me when I'm out and about.

― jel -- (jel), Monday, 25 October 2004 18:12 (twenty-one years ago)

I've gone too far.

― jel -- (jel), Monday, 25 October 2004 18:15 (twenty-one years ago)

Indie is the default look (intentionally or not) for people who don't spend a lot of time and money on their clothes (the converse is NOT true, of course). Jeans and a t-shirt is indie. Therefore, I look indie, whether I want to or not.

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Monday, 25 October 2004 18:19 (twenty-one years ago)

Indie is the default look (intentionally or not) for people who don't spend a lot of time and money on their clothes

I don't think this is true. You can just look like a slob in jogging pants and a stained T-shirt without looking remotely indie.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 18:20 (twenty-one years ago)

I see Stevem, I scrolled through with a quickness and missed it. I still say WTF to his response as well, though.

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Monday, 25 October 2004 18:21 (twenty-one years ago)

My glasses pretty much seal the deal on my indieness. In point of fact, I'm coming to hate all indie rock. My glasses might also work for "jazz guy," but I'll need more mileage on my face before anyone'll buy it.

― Hank Tenbeer (kenan), Monday, 25 October 2004 18:21 (twenty-one years ago)

bnw's got a point, that's why we all fall for the record store girls even though if we saw that same girl walking down the street we might not give them a second look.
(apologies for the overuse of the royal "we")

xpost to Alba : yes, I should have disqualified slobs in my comment, slobs do not apply

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Monday, 25 October 2004 18:22 (twenty-one years ago)

but that's true of both sexes of course, the fancying people more because of what they're doing/what they're being associated with thing

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Monday, 25 October 2004 18:25 (twenty-one years ago)

the thing about indie clothes def isn't true. indie kids here have a definite, cultivated look (even if it's based on a kind of supposedly ramshackle secondhand salvation army thing), you can see they've put time, effort and money into it.

― m. (mitchlnw), Monday, 25 October 2004 18:31 (twenty-one years ago)

Here's one that always gets me that seems to address the question in the thread title:
I can't help but be creeped out when I see an older, paunchy, aggressively average White guy leading around a younger, clearly-just-learning-English Asian woman.
It's definitely a prejudice I have, with no real basis in any personal experience.
Can anyone get my back on this? Or am I just an asshole?

― Clusterfuck at the Baja Fresh Salsa Bar (Ben Boyer), Monday, 25 October 2004 18:49 (twenty-one years ago)

i like all kinds of ladies:-(

― latebloomer (latebloomer), Monday, 25 October 2004 18:53 (twenty-one years ago)

What's with the frown?

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 25 October 2004 18:59 (twenty-one years ago)

They don't like him back?

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 19:03 (twenty-one years ago)

he can't make up his mind

― Ronan (Ronan), Monday, 25 October 2004 19:06 (twenty-one years ago)

This thread is weird. I imagigoogled 'ladies' and the first picture was these two women who are very beautiful IMHO:
http://www2.physics.umd.edu/~yskim/style/milan22.jpg

― nickalicious (nickalicious), Monday, 25 October 2004 19:14 (twenty-one years ago)

imagigoogled = making up big numbers

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Monday, 25 October 2004 19:15 (twenty-one years ago)

i cant be bothered to read another 'indie ilx' thread but after a quick skim im glad to know i still break all the rules

― kephm (kephm), Monday, 25 October 2004 19:18 (twenty-one years ago)

So is it every guy's fantasy to be with a girl who's "shy" and "nice" in public, but "assertive"/"agressive" in the bedroom?

Jeezus. Do me a favor and never employ any women.

― k3rry (dymaxia), Monday, 25 October 2004 20:57 (twenty-one years ago)

(unless you're not planning to have sex with them)

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:01 (twenty-one years ago)

There's a reason they're called "fantasies" and not "realities".

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:04 (twenty-one years ago)

he can't make up his mind
-- Ronan (ronan.fitzgerald6NOSPA...), October 25th, 2004.

OTM

― latebloomer (latebloomer), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:15 (twenty-one years ago)

girls

― RJG (RJG), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:18 (twenty-one years ago)

btw, I was thinking about this on the way home, and I think the sexually assertive / assertive-in-bed distinction is a good one.

I've got no problem (personal, not moral, I hasten to add - this isn't about disapproval or anything) with women who talk about their sexual desires a lot, per se. That isn't intimidating in itself. For example, Kate can go on all she likes about what she'd like to do to her dirty dronerock boys, and it's not scary, because I get the impression that she doesn't even really expect them to do much - just lie there and be ravished by her.

It's when public sexual assertiveness is combined with the implication of traditional male-female roles in bed (the man as sexual athlete, delivering a damn good fucking) that it's perhaps scary. The feeling that one might not match up to their high standards.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:20 (twenty-one years ago)

hmm

― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:37 (twenty-one years ago)

I am intimidated by your "hmm".

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:41 (twenty-one years ago)

yes

― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:44 (twenty-one years ago)

Alba, are you saying that you're not an Olympian sportfucker in bed?

― Michael White (Hereward), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:46 (twenty-one years ago)

Is it time to make this thread a "pictures of your ideal" thread yet?

― Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:48 (twenty-one years ago)

I'm kind of fascinated by that Thora Birch picture up there but I'm not sure why.

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:49 (twenty-one years ago)

No, Michael - obviously I am. I'm just insecure.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:49 (twenty-one years ago)

i hate the winona type, i tend to think boys who like flat-chested, short-haired, skinny and petite girls are all secret homosexuals.

I like the three Bs - blondes, boobs and boots. I'm also a big fan of overbites. The wife, while busty, and prone to boot-wearing, is not blonde nor dentally challenged. Lucky for her she's easily the hottest woman in the world, though, so that'll have to be good enough. It's far more than I deserve. (yall saw the photo of us, after all)

Aside from Wifey, I find Cheryl Hines and Claudia Schiffer to be the ideal women, look-wise.

What does all this say about me?

― Roger Fidelity (Roger Fidelity), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:50 (twenty-one years ago)

Spencer, Alba has really been talking as much about behavioural and social clues as mere physionomy though.

Alba, join the club.

― Michael White (Hereward), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:50 (twenty-one years ago)

He's afraid his Olympian sportfucking might in turn intimidate the sexually aggressive woman.

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:50 (twenty-one years ago)

all pictures are taking a hell of a long time to download on this thread. After all the buzz, I'm expecting some capital knockers.

― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:51 (twenty-one years ago)

OMG hawt.

http://www.bsotl.org/mvc4.jpg

― Hank Tenbeer (kenan), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:55 (twenty-one years ago)

I hate the winona type, i tend to think boys who like flat-chested, short-haired, skinny and petite girls are all secret homosexuals.

Ha ha. Is this only when all four physical traits are found in combination? I mean, Winona's not flat-chested, and used to have long hair.

I once saw a porn star say a similar thing on Donohoe. I hate it when people call curvy women 'womanly', like a woman's not a real woman if she's flat-chested.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:56 (twenty-one years ago)

What does all this say about me?

Roger, it says you distrust the liberal media establishment.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:57 (twenty-one years ago)

I like a certain personality as a fixed trait more than anything else. I like waify little flat chested girls and voluptuous sirens too but they have to have a certain sparkle to me.

― Michael White (Hereward), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:59 (twenty-one years ago)

Spencer, Alba has really been talking as much about behavioural and social clues as mere physionomy though.

Oh I know, I've been reading, and a picture of someone you find ideal may in fact reveal more than just what you find physically appealing.

― Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:59 (twenty-one years ago)

Secret homosexual!
xxxxxxpost!

― Damn Yankees- High Enough (nordicskilla), Monday, 25 October 2004 21:59 (twenty-one years ago)

By sexually aggressive do people mean someone who'd ask you out on a date or someone who'd grab your thigh or something?

― l, Monday, 25 October 2004 22:01 (twenty-one years ago)

Actually I think the porn star on Donohoe said that men who liked petite, flat-chested women were actually secret paedophiles, not homosexuals.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:01 (twenty-one years ago)

secret paedophiles vs secret homosexuals vs secret lemonade drinkers

― Damn Yankees- High Enough (nordicskilla), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:03 (twenty-one years ago)

I like petitie, flat-chested women because I have had good experiences with one in the past. I also like girls with tummies and big boobs for the same reason.

― Hank Tenbeer (kenan), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:03 (twenty-one years ago)

Calumny!!!! You know for a fact that I drink my lemonade in public, adam.

― Michael White (Hereward), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:04 (twenty-one years ago)

I hate it when people call curvy women 'womanly', like a woman's not a real woman if she's flat-chested.

Oh come on. Womanly=curvy, manly=muscular. Deal with it.

― oops (Oops), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:04 (twenty-one years ago)

My ideal body type is the same as my first girlfriend, actually. Smallish, with pink and perky everything. Once you're out of your teens that gets ahrder to come by.

― Hank Tenbeer (kenan), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:04 (twenty-one years ago)

there are a lot of different types of women, it's true.

― Damn Yankees- High Enough (nordicskilla), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:06 (twenty-one years ago)

I am a secret homosexual.

― jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:07 (twenty-one years ago)

Oops, the secret is out.

― jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:07 (twenty-one years ago)

You know, it's getting to where you can't think of "British Isles" without "Paedoph" in front of it!

― Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:08 (twenty-one years ago)

No, I'm not going to deal with it! I'm going to battle against these hurtful gender stereotypes, and will have a statue erected in my honour when men and women of any shape can go through life without having their gender questioned!

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:08 (twenty-one years ago)

there are a lot of different types of women, it's true.

There are as many types of men. Hell, there are a lot of different types of *me,* depending on my current eating, sleeping, and drinking habits.

― Hank Tenbeer (kenan), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:09 (twenty-one years ago)

Paedophbritish Isles?

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:09 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't like the idea of anyone finding me attractive as a "type".

I hate it when people call curvy women 'womanly', like a woman's not a real woman if she's flat-chested

Yeah, that sort of thing used to make me pretty insecure before I learned to ignore it.

― Cathy (Cathy), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:09 (twenty-one years ago)

Paedophilious Albion!!!

― Michael White (Hereward), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:10 (twenty-one years ago)

What should "womanly" refer to, then, Alba? (Not arguing with you, just trying to imagine the word in any usage that's not demeaning somehow to someone.)

― Hank Tenbeer (kenan), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:11 (twenty-one years ago)

Paedophbritish Isles?

sorry, it doesn't work as well without the slick CGI.

― Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:11 (twenty-one years ago)

Actually 'womanly' isn't too bad. It's when 'be fat and proud' types go on about being 'real women' that it really bugs me.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:11 (twenty-one years ago)

'Womanly' and 'manly' are basically pretty stupid words, in this age.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:12 (twenty-one years ago)

(though)

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:13 (twenty-one years ago)

What type am I?

― Damn Yankees- High Enough (nordicskilla), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:13 (twenty-one years ago)

heheh Yeah, I know. But that works to a point, too. I mean, I can see it coming from Queen Latifah (big and obviously supposed to be that size), but not Starr Jones (just too damn big), if you know what I mean. "Real" in that sense is about as useful as thinking that wearing flannel makes you "real."

― Hank Tenbeer (kenan), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:13 (twenty-one years ago)

You're a 'nice guy', adam.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:14 (twenty-one years ago)

I hate it when people call curvy women 'womanly', like a woman's not a real woman if she's flat-chested

Women and men can all be assigned types. It's bothersome 'cause we only get one vote for ourselves and can be outvoted by a majority of observers but I learned not to run me as a democracy anymore.

― Michael Rex (Hereward), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:14 (twenty-one years ago)

Winona is so not flat.

I think what makes Nina seem more sexually aggressive than Miranda isn't her body type by itself but her self-presentation in terms of clothing and posture. I did think the picture was kind of hot myself but not thinking it is might not indicate a fear of sexual aggression as much as perhaps a disinterest in certain types of sexual presentation and interaction?

― sundar subramanian (sundar), Monday, 25 October 2004 22:42 (twenty-one years ago)

Argh, gah, it looks like this turned into a really interesting thread and I missed it all because I got sacked from my job. (Long story.)

I've only really skimmed it, but I'm so glad that Alba finally just subconsciously let something very interesting slip out of his imaginings...

For example, Kate can go on all she likes about what she'd like to do to her dirty dronerock boys, and it's not scary, because I get the impression that she doesn't even really expect them to do much - just lie there and be ravished by her.

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 11:45 (twenty-one years ago)

i wear all-black a lot because i can't be bothered to worry about color coordination most of the time, plus it's one color i know doesn't look stupid on me. i probably look indie or goth or something but i'd imagine it's closer to the "cynical new yorker" stereotype. big surprise there.

― motown modown (Jody Beth Rosen), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 12:06 (twenty-one years ago)

"subconciously", Kate?

― Daniel_Rf (Daniel_Rf), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 12:10 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't see anything in it beyond the "scared of not living up to it" thing that is mentioned at lenght afterwards...

― Daniel_Rf (Daniel_Rf), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 12:15 (twenty-one years ago)

(and strangely, I'm not usually attracted to Jewish women)

sorry to derail...

i've heard lots of jewish guys say this. what's the reason?

(nb: a jewish ex-coworker was once surprised to find out a girl he knew was jewish because she was "too pretty.")

― motown modown (Jody Beth Rosen), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 12:16 (twenty-one years ago)

Jewish girls are HOT

― Deadaismus? (Dada), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 12:18 (twenty-one years ago)

And I know lots of friends who think Jewish girls are hot, and to be fair I know some REALLY hot Jewish girls, but I've never actually gone for one of them. Possibly just because I know it would make my family all too pleased with themselves?

― Jordan (Jordan), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 12:33 (twenty-one years ago)

Enough of this Jewish girl debate, let's go back to talking about how Nick wants to lie back and be ravished... ;-)

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 12:35 (twenty-one years ago)

Oh, I didn't say that exactly. I'm all for being the dominant Olympian sportfucker or whatever too, just that it's more demanding.

― Alba (Alba), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 12:39 (twenty-one years ago)

Either way's good for me*

*please read this on all levels you so choose

― Markelby (Mark C), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 13:06 (twenty-one years ago)

This thread has taught me nothing about myself or the rest of humankind. There is no deeper insight to be made into my character. I have no type, or indeed a character.

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 13:36 (twenty-one years ago)

oh, there's so much to comment on in this thread, but my head hurts and i want to go home. one thing that i did pick up, though was this...

the fancying people more because of what they're doing/what they're being associated with thing

this is certainly true for me. bonus points for boys that skate. i should write about the big chart thingy that jim and i came up with on holiday, which allows us to numerically categorize how attractive we find people. includes 'modifiers' such as 'politically active' or 'wears glasses'

and i know i have a type, but i'm not exclusive to it. although sounds like i'm going to have to fight tracer over who gets all the dark hair/blue eyed londonors...

― colette (a2lette), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 13:38 (twenty-one years ago)

oh, there's so much to comment on in this thread, but my head hurts and i want to go home. one thing that i did pick up, though was this...

the fancying people more because of what they're doing/what they're being associated with thing

and i know i have a type, but i'm not exclusive to it. although sounds like i'm going to have to fight tracer over who gets all the dark hair/blue eyed london-folk...

― colette (a2lette), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 13:39 (twenty-one years ago)

see? i'm so out of it today that i'm posting twice after just changing how i refer to people from london. kill me now.

― colette (a2lette), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 13:40 (twenty-one years ago)

Phew, I thought you were saying you only fancied Cockneys there

― Deadaismus? (Dada), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 13:42 (twenty-one years ago)

Anyone who surfs, skates, skydives or does anything else that's likely to involve a fucking stupid little beard and a sense of stoned smugness can give up all hope of ever getting into MY pants.

― Markelby (Mark C), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 13:44 (twenty-one years ago)

are you ruling out girls with beards generally?

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 13:46 (twenty-one years ago)

Perhaps he meant only if said fucking stupid little beard were not accompanied by a moustache.

― Marcello Carlin, Tuesday, 26 October 2004 13:47 (twenty-one years ago)

Indeed, active sporty women are ruled out altogether - the more indolent and comatose the better

― Deadaismus? (Dada), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 13:48 (twenty-one years ago)

*cancels skydiving lesson*

― Bam Margera (roxymuzak), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 13:51 (twenty-one years ago)

Oh, N., really.

But in truth I cannot follow this thread, the Peel thing is still making me shiver and sake.

― the bellefox, Tuesday, 26 October 2004 13:57 (twenty-one years ago)

Yes, I don't really care about this thread just now. But I'm sorry to have disappointed you, again.

― Alba (Alba), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 14:00 (twenty-one years ago)

Sorry, 'shake'.

It's OK that you've disappointed me, now that you're sorry about it.

We will have to return to this discussion some day. Perhaps it was good after all and shock is getting in the way.

― the bluefox, Tuesday, 26 October 2004 14:06 (twenty-one years ago)

Anyone who surfs, skates, skydives or does anything else that's likely to involve a fucking stupid little beard and a sense of stoned smugness can give up all hope of ever getting into MY pants.
-- Markelby (boyincorduro...), October 26th, 2004 2:44 PM. (later)

haha it so totally is just the beard bit that mark opposes to.

― ken c (ken c), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 15:21 (twenty-one years ago)

There's nothing wrong with that!

― Leon Czolgosz (Nicole), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 15:28 (twenty-one years ago)

haha i know! i hate beards too. and boys in general. but it's not skater related. some sk8r grrls for example are quite cute.

― ken c (ken c), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 15:56 (twenty-one years ago)

I think that looks are a shorthand, often, for personality type. If a guy goes for a "look" that screams "I am a vapid sex object" it says he doesn't want to be intellectually challenged and isn't into anything but boinking. If a guy goes for a look that says "I will tie you to a chair and wank you" then it says he wants to be tied to a chair and wanked. If the look is less defined, then it says less about his character and becomes harder to read.

― Orbit (Orbit), Tuesday, 26 October 2004 16:01 (twenty-one years ago)

I think that looks are a shorthand, often, for personality type.

Well, yeah, OTM. It used to be, once upon a time, when my sexuality and predelictions were being shaped, that men that looked and dressed a certain way, it was almost certainly a dead giveaway that they were into certain music, certain art, certain books, and their lack of hair-washing signified "I am faaaaar too busy contemplating the lyrical significance of the Velvet Underground and the future of contemporary art to be concerned with anything so mundane as the care of my hair."

Of course, now it's just a fashion thing, and boys that look that way have just been styled to look that way and the only place they've heard of the VU is in Strokes presscuttings and their idea of art is Dazed & COnfused, but still, my sexuality just kind of *set* that way.

I'm not saying that it isn't shallow that I have a particular "type". Just that it exists for a reason.

― Kissing Time At The Pleasure Unit (kate), Wednesday, 27 October 2004 08:29 (twenty-one years ago)

OK, so why have I grown up thinking that it is better to say what great legs a woman has than what great tits she has?

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 12:57 (twenty-one years ago)

Saying legs is supposed to be classier?

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Thursday, 28 October 2004 13:04 (twenty-one years ago)

Yes, but it's anatomically incorrect to call them legs.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 13:06 (twenty-one years ago)

If you only like them from the knee down it's not.

― Liz :x (Liz :x), Thursday, 28 October 2004 13:07 (twenty-one years ago)

calves are sexy

― Rob Bolton (Rob Bolton), Thursday, 28 October 2004 13:08 (twenty-one years ago)

Mmmm gastrocnemius-tastic. But what about thighs, dude?

― Liz :x (Liz :x), Thursday, 28 October 2004 13:09 (twenty-one years ago)

sexier than lambs?

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 13:10 (twenty-one years ago)

aren't thighs part of legs?

― sgs (sgs), Thursday, 28 October 2004 13:14 (twenty-one years ago)

Alba you beast

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Thursday, 28 October 2004 13:15 (twenty-one years ago)

Beast is best.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 13:18 (twenty-one years ago)

If a guy goes for a look that says "I will tie you to a chair and wank you"

What kind of look is that?!

― Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 13:24 (twenty-one years ago)

I wish I looked like that.

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Thursday, 28 October 2004 13:24 (twenty-one years ago)

thighs are sexier than lambs

― Rob Bolton (Rob Bolton), Thursday, 28 October 2004 13:31 (twenty-one years ago)

When I was in high school we used to call tight shirts "lamb shirts" (l.a.m.b. = look at my breasts, natch.)

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Thursday, 28 October 2004 13:36 (twenty-one years ago)

ok, now i think lambs are sexy

― Rob Bolton (Rob Bolton), Thursday, 28 October 2004 13:41 (twenty-one years ago)

I've started finding it interesting, that I'm completely unconcerned about breast size.

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Thursday, 28 October 2004 13:59 (twenty-one years ago)

Also, conventionally attractive is indeed that, but I reckon I prefer ladies who are more unconventionally attractive or less obviously attractive too.

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:00 (twenty-one years ago)

"Jolie laide" is one of the greatest concepts of all time

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:02 (twenty-one years ago)

what about leg size? xpost.

― sgs (sgs), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:02 (twenty-one years ago)

Leg length you mean?

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:04 (twenty-one years ago)

It's breast shape that's important visually and for tactile purposes it's how much sexual response they provide.

If not for 'jolie laide' goers I'd have been a virgin much longer.

― Michael White (Hereward), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:04 (twenty-one years ago)

i prefer leg size 77-XT-3b

― Rob Bolton (Rob Bolton), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:04 (twenty-one years ago)

Rob has answered my query.

― sgs (sgs), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:05 (twenty-one years ago)

Leggy is nice until they're too long and then they begin to look silly

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:06 (twenty-one years ago)

Too...long...?

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:07 (twenty-one years ago)

Preferable to too short, in truth

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:08 (twenty-one years ago)

You don't fancy giraffes then? Mind, their legs are all spotty and hairy as well.

― Liz :x (Liz :x), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:08 (twenty-one years ago)

... not unlike most women I've been out with

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:09 (twenty-one years ago)

... BOOM BOOM

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:09 (twenty-one years ago)

I have revised my opinion of the characters of serveral people.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:12 (twenty-one years ago)

Put off men for life, then?

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:18 (twenty-one years ago)

serveral? Alba, don't talk with your mouth full!

― Michael White (Hereward), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:20 (twenty-one years ago)

he hasn't said opinion of whom it was that he'd revised just yet!

― ken c (ken c), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:22 (twenty-one years ago)

xpost

― ken c (ken c), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:23 (twenty-one years ago)

i dunno about the assertiveness thing. could it not be that some prefer those that have a non-obvious mystique about them, something to delve into, fundamentally, which works with but doesnt exclude sexuality or common interest? perhaps, rather than fear of aggression it's the dude's desire to imagine what's missing.

however when i think about this, now and then, i'm always reminded of being creeped out by amateurist saying milky pearlescent naomi watts was "so, so lovely", maybe esp cos it was after she had been casted in 'the ring' (eerie horror suspense movie thing) for what i thought were those very qualities. (actually i forget if he did put a comma between his so so tho; proper grammar seems to exacerbate the effect, interestingly)

― candour floss (mwah), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:24 (twenty-one years ago)

I actually really like it when womens' legs are just a tiny bit short in proportion to the rest of their body. No idea why, I just find it kind of cute.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:27 (twenty-one years ago)

(grammar thing: perhaps because it intimates an unflapping of studied control, despite enthusiasm - thus back to distanced mindwork do u see)

― candour floss (mwah), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:28 (twenty-one years ago)

Matt DC in Dwarf Sex Cult Shockah

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:35 (twenty-one years ago)

'tis an interesting pecadillo

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:37 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't think I even notice what size peoples legs are in proportion to the rest of their bodies.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:40 (twenty-one years ago)

Sorry about the 'serveral' thing. From the start, I've been too over-excited on this thread for my grammar and typing to be up to much.

I remember telling a female friend, ages ago, that I fancied Catherine Keener and her saying she was "impressed" that I liked her rather than a typical Hollywood look. Ridiculous, really.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:42 (twenty-one years ago)

A ladies' fashion designer once told me that most people have bodies that are 7 heads tall, in proportion. Designer's sketches have to be lengthened to 9 heads, and this length gets added in the legs. I've seen this play out in the photoshopping of models' legs to be longer as well.

She didn't say anything about shortening legs. Perhaps that would be anti-fashion.

― sgs (sgs), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:43 (twenty-one years ago)

Barbara to thread.

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:45 (twenty-one years ago)

Doesn't everyone fancy Catherine Keener?!??!?!

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:45 (twenty-one years ago)

I often have crushes on older actresses 'cause they aren't playing ingenue roles anymore. If there isn't a playful but dangerous spark to a woman, what's the point?

― Michael White (Hereward), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:45 (twenty-one years ago)

Young ass?

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:48 (twenty-one years ago)

She's not that old

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:48 (twenty-one years ago)

I know this.

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:49 (twenty-one years ago)

I liek gurlz. Sometimes I quite like boyz, but not in the same way. I like gurlz's bumz. And also breastz and legz and facez and what they say to me and how they dress and whether they carry a weapon. This thread has like 5000000 replies and none of them say anything any more profound than what I just said.

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:58 (twenty-one years ago)

Fuck off.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 14:59 (twenty-one years ago)

Good

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:00 (twenty-one years ago)

I think there have been interesting responses from Kate and many others.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:00 (twenty-one years ago)

Haha! I didn't say I didn't like the thread - I've enjoyed it very much, but it's a bit like an indie disco with no music or beer.

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:01 (twenty-one years ago)

pure snogging!

― ken c (ken c), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:02 (twenty-one years ago)

haha! If only! Pure looking at peoples (mainly your own) shoes and pulling on your sleeves!

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:03 (twenty-one years ago)

TS Shoe fetishism vs. Shoegazing

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:04 (twenty-one years ago)

I shouldn't have said 'fuck off'. But what you said was quite rude. I don't like it when people pass judgement on everyone else's responses to a question.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:04 (twenty-one years ago)

I watched The Ring last night and, in an odd way, it goes out of its way to make Naomi Watts' attractiveness part of the scenery (can't get past the blonde locks tho).

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:05 (twenty-one years ago)

I didn't mean it as rude, at all. I meant it as quite jokey. Superficially it looks like a very good question likely to promote a lot of debate, and it is and it also has, but all the debate has been about saying "not a lot, I fancy all sorts" (except Mark and Kate!).

If this thread does anything then it's vaguelly prove that Freud and the Oedipus myth are still a bit silly.

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:10 (twenty-one years ago)

How does it prove that?

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:11 (twenty-one years ago)

Cos no one has said "I fancy women who are like my mother".

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:14 (twenty-one years ago)

I fancy women who are like my mother. There, I said it. It's also true.

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:15 (twenty-one years ago)

Like your mother in what way?

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:17 (twenty-one years ago)

I fancy women like Dadaismus's mother too.

― Michael White (Hereward), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:17 (twenty-one years ago)

Look like my mother. I mean, when she was younger (before I knew her - ha ha).

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:19 (twenty-one years ago)

Although I fancy 'all sorts', it would be deluded of me not to admit that I've fancied more of certain types than others, as compared to the average man.

We do tend to know our mating spheres, more or less. I get female attention, but throw me into a towny nightclub on Sauchiehall St and I doubt any woman would look at me twice.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:23 (twenty-one years ago)

How much is that because breeding across species is unnatural and we view oursleves on a biological level as different? I was gonna say "tribal" level but tribes needed to spread their gene pool across other tribes - does that instinct manifest itself as indie boys fancying townie girls secretly?

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:29 (twenty-one years ago)

My enduring actress crushes: Natasha Lyonne, Catherine Keener, Linda Fiorentino and Emily Watson. All are absolutely gorgeous.

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:30 (twenty-one years ago)

If we're bringing our mothers into this, I have probably been more attracted to fairer/light skinned black women, like my mother, than dark skinned. According to the TV drama Soul Food, I'm therefore colour-struck. Absolute nonsense.

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:34 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't know who Natasha Lyonne is. Emily Watson, no way.

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:34 (twenty-one years ago)

i was actually going to post about being attracted to people vaguely like your parents a few days back but decided against it so thanks dadaismus. i flip-flop over whether there's really anything in it tho.

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:36 (twenty-one years ago)

It's surely not that surprising that you would be attracted to people who look like members of your own family?

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:37 (twenty-one years ago)

My dad was pretty cute in high school. He was 6'7" and bleached his hair out. I guess I've traditionally dated tall guys (?) but deffo not guys that resembled my dad.

xpost it seems more logical to be repelled by them?

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:38 (twenty-one years ago)

I think my dating sphere is a University, which sickens me.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:40 (twenty-one years ago)

Not identical to members of your family, similar but not enough to be weird

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:41 (twenty-one years ago)

Sometimes I fancy women who I think are like my mum is, or used to be, and it does feel like a kind of deep "well maybe that's the one for me" connection. But then the greatest loves of my life have not been like my mum at all, so it's hard to say how important it is.

I definitely do, physically, fancy people who look like they could be in my family (cute nose, cheekbones, straight hair - there's a woman I have a crush on who totally fits this bill). But I fancy other types too.

So yeah, different types, physical and otherwise, give me different feelings, and I don't know whether one of these is the 'true path' to follow.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:43 (twenty-one years ago)

I categorically do not go for people who look like they could be in my family.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:46 (twenty-one years ago)

Natasha Lyonne I met her years ago and am thus completely immune to her charms.

― Michael White (Hereward), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:49 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't think I can echo Alba's sentiments, really. In fact, the only vague physical connection would be fair black skin as I mentioned above, and that's not enough evidence at the end of the day. And although my mother is one of the best people alive, I could never want anyone with a large number of similar personal characteristics (a personal choice, mum is not on a giant pedestal of my mental imagining, I just prefer more free-spirited and sweet-but-sarcastic types, tho that's definitely an imaginary standard haha).

And D, Emily Watson has the best eyes.

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:49 (twenty-one years ago)

Emily Watson's just got a certain, wonderful way about her.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:53 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah, she's lovely.

― Michael White (Hereward), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:53 (twenty-one years ago)

Blue? I prefer Brown............ like my mother............... no, her's aren't brown, ha ha

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:54 (twenty-one years ago)

But y'know, I like Mandy Moore too.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:54 (twenty-one years ago)

My cousin is married to a woman who has EVERY facial feature he has - they look like what identical twins would look like if you could have one boy and one girl. It's freaky and not a little disturbing.

Emily Watson is A1.

― Markelby (Mark C), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:56 (twenty-one years ago)

I love Mandy. Goodnight, peeps.

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Thursday, 28 October 2004 15:58 (twenty-one years ago)

Maybe, coming back to my original point, what is most impressive is to genuinely (like me, ha ha) fancy people of many different types. Not in a "well it really doesn't matter to me what they look like" way, and maybe with blocks about certain looks.

A few people here and elsewhere have said "well I wouldn't want to be fancied just for being a type, like I'm just another busty redhead". That's understandable. So it's not good to just go for one type, and even more so if it's not the kind of woman you actually end up going out with (eg. only ever going on about how gorgeous blonde supermodels are). Maybe that's why some women like it when you mention your Emily Watsons and Catherine Keeners. Not because it's shallow to fancy Kylie Minogue, or because EW and CK are actually ugly or anything. Just that it shows a broadminded appreciation of beauty.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:02 (twenty-one years ago)

Not because it's shallow to fancy Kylie Minogue, or because EW and CK are actually ugly or anything. Just that it shows a broadminded appreciation of beauty.

otm

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:03 (twenty-one years ago)

Reversing the whole thing to try to understand it better, I would be turned off a woman if she just went on about Brad Pitt and Joaquin Phoenix or whatever, but if said she fancied, I dunno, Dylan Moran and Jarvis Cocker as well, then it would be OK.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:06 (twenty-one years ago)

I'd be more turned on if she said she fancied me.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:07 (twenty-one years ago)

I'd be more turned on if she said she fancied Ronan too.

― Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:09 (twenty-one years ago)

No, that would be a big turn off.

x-post, I think.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:10 (twenty-one years ago)

Anyone who fancies Jarvis Cocker is an absolute menko IMHO. But then, different strokes etc.

― Markelby (Mark C), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:11 (twenty-one years ago)

I dunno anymore.

― jel -- (jel), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:11 (twenty-one years ago)

actually Alba you're right, if that was an x-post. completely right. fuck it I'd obviously suppressed that.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:13 (twenty-one years ago)

Still suffering from that Ronan? I think I might be over it, in truth.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:15 (twenty-one years ago)

What, Dylan Moran and Jarvis Cocker aren't sex symbols?

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:16 (twenty-one years ago)

maybe I am. I don't know, I think a major part of it is just thinking "oh she's nice" but then when it comes to the crunch, ie realising they like you and something could happen, you think "but not nice enough???" and have doubts.

Though at the moment I (still) fancy a girl with a boyfriend, so maybe I'm not over it.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:17 (twenty-one years ago)

No, they are, but not for being conventionally handsome or buff or whatever.

Re: Catherine Keener. Thinking about it, she's actually is conventionally beautiful. She just doesn't carry herself like a piece of Hollywood meat, which makes it feel like she has unconventional looks. Anyway.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:17 (twenty-one years ago)

(that was in reply to Dadaismus, btw)

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:18 (twenty-one years ago)

I think Catherine Keener, Dylan Moran and Jarvis Cocker are all conventionally attractive

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:18 (twenty-one years ago)

You must go to some weird conventions.

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:19 (twenty-one years ago)

Perhaps Ugly Conventions for ugly people.

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:19 (twenty-one years ago)

Gena Malone > Mandy Moore

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:20 (twenty-one years ago)

Apropos of nothing, I saw Brett Anderson in the street the other day and he is really really handsome

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:21 (twenty-one years ago)

Apropos of nothing, I saw Brett Anderson in the street the other day and he is really good-looking

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:21 (twenty-one years ago)

haha, let's keep posting that until it ends up as 'king of the munters'

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:23 (twenty-one years ago)

Ha ha, I thought the first was a bit over the top!

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:24 (twenty-one years ago)

Dadaismus, gay man?

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:29 (twenty-one years ago)

... oops that was supposed to be blue

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:30 (twenty-one years ago)

this is a family thread

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:31 (twenty-one years ago)

Back to Freud it seems

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:32 (twenty-one years ago)

Emma?

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:33 (twenty-one years ago)

This is like a pathetic Men's Support Group.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:34 (twenty-one years ago)

I think we should talk about football instead.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:34 (twenty-one years ago)

I fancy girls with breasts like footballs.

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:35 (twenty-one years ago)

x-post I don't see how that'll help us get laid.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:35 (twenty-one years ago)

I fancy girls with breasts like footballs.

European footballs or American footballs?

― Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:39 (twenty-one years ago)

Left = American
Right = European

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:40 (twenty-one years ago)

x-post I don't see how that'll help us get laid.
-- Ronan

That's what all ILX sex/relationship threads are actually about, isn't it? "How can I get laid?"

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 16:57 (twenty-one years ago)

No, I think that is being rude again. That wasn't why I started this thread at all.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:01 (twenty-one years ago)

Come on N., be honest! What inspired the thread? Vague insecurity about how the opposite sex perceive you? Ona REALLY base level why do we talk about sex AT ALL EVER WITH ANYONE? And I don't mean "because we want to fuck that individual person".

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:06 (twenty-one years ago)

Ona REALLY base level why do we talk about sex AT ALL EVER WITH ANYONE?

Because it's interesting? If you want to get so reductive about it, you might as well just say "Why do we do anything AT ALL? To GET LAID AND PASS ON OUR GENES!".

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:08 (twenty-one years ago)

What makes it interesting though?

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:10 (twenty-one years ago)

mine wasn't a serious comment.

I think this is an interesting thread, it seems quite obviously interesting issue, to me anyway.

I always feel like something of a sleaze if I admit to fancying someone who isn't conventionally attractive or whatever, even if I do actually fancy them. for example recently my friend, whom I do fancy, asked me which Sex In The City character I would fancy, and I said I'd probably like the red-headed one best, and she then reacted as if that reflected well on me.

I actually felt sort of embarassed, I guess cos it's odd that a discussion of objectifying random celebrities can possess even a small amount of characteristic currency.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:10 (twenty-one years ago)

I know it wasn't a serious comment, Ronan, but even so it is quite a revealing thing to say.

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:11 (twenty-one years ago)

Natasha Lyonne is much cuter in person than she appears on film. She's tiny.

― Loose Translation: Sexy Dancer (sexyDancer), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:12 (twenty-one years ago)

It's interesting because.. oh this is ridiculous. Because I'm a curious human. I find the ways in which we talk and think about attraction interesting to unpick.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:13 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't think so really, ILX is a good place to have discussions like this, because in real life it's difficult to dissect past relationships or just come straight out with whatever insecurities or preconceptions you have in front of friends who you deal with regularly.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:13 (twenty-one years ago)

can we get back to topic, I just made my first post here which involved actually thinking about the thread and I want to discuss it.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:15 (twenty-one years ago)

Did you mean 'is conventionally attractive' in the first sentence? Otherwise I don't really understand. Though the S&TC Miranda example seems a bit odd in that case, as I'd have said Sarah Jessica Parker is clearly the least conventionally attractive of the four.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:20 (twenty-one years ago)

(but maybe I'm just part of some Miranda-fancying freako convention and I don't realise it)

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:21 (twenty-one years ago)

Wouldn't be the first time I crushed on the cute lesbian.

― Michael White (Hereward), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:22 (twenty-one years ago)

Half of the women I date look just like me. Two of my last 3 girlfriends were basically my twin and we'd get asked all the time if we were brother and sister. When those two met, the ex pulled me aside and said "Spencer, you're a piece of work, she looks just like me!" I said "get over yourself, she looks just like *me*! I'm just being narcissistic!"

― Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:23 (twenty-one years ago)

Ha ha - that's so cool!

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:28 (twenty-one years ago)

haha!

― cºzen (Cozen), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:29 (twenty-one years ago)

oh right Alba, well I mean in the context given I felt odd because my friend acted as though she was not conventionally attractive, I don't really know if she is or not. I don't know though.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:31 (twenty-one years ago)

did I mention the fact that I don't know

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:31 (twenty-one years ago)

I love that "Spencer - you're a piece of work!" line. It sounds like it comes from the golden age of Hollywood.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:31 (twenty-one years ago)

I think, more than anything, that Miranda is the indie boy pinup, or at least the European guy's pinup. So if she was in that arena herself, you might have been thinking it was the right one to say, to make her feel good.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:33 (twenty-one years ago)

"European guy's" is a bit riduculously vague. The cultured, liberal European guy's pin up. There. Ha ha, this is funny. Anyway, the other three are just no way (I mean Charlotte's pretty but her outlook is so not me that, no).

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:36 (twenty-one years ago)

no no I wasn't thinking of the right thing to say, I genuinely do think she's the nicest!

I would have thought Charlotte was the pinup, or pimp as I initially read your post.

Also her reaction seemed consistent with this.

x-post I think most guys never watch the programme hence Charlotte is hot. I didn't really like it until it was on C4 every night at midnight for the last year. midnight on Sundays is a vulnerable time for anyone.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:38 (twenty-one years ago)

But if you feel embarrassed about admitting to liking obvious choices, then surely the converse of this must also apply, that you're keen to admit to liking women when they're non-obvious choices?

With S&TC basically, it's:

Samantha - sex vixen
Charlotte - drippy homemaker
Miranda - indie brainbox
Carrie - some kind of 'everywoman', I dunno.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:46 (twenty-one years ago)

I with agree with Ronan that there is a certain level of embarrassment when admitting that you find someone attractive who is certainly not the "norm" at all. Admitting these things can be well, not difficult because nothing's really at stake, but awkward when you are going against your common opinion. Boy did I get the piss taken out of me leaving the theatre recently when all my friends were crushing on Tobey Maguire as Spiderman and I confessed that I found both Alfred Molina and Willem Dafoe about 200 times more attractive. I don't know what this reveals about my character, other than I tend to find the "spark" that someone has more attractive than physical features.

― jocelyn (Jocelyn), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:52 (twenty-one years ago)

No Alba I said I was embarassed of liking NOT obvious choices, if you look back. I always feel like something of a sleaze if I admit to fancying someone who isn't conventionally attractive or whatever

it seems an obvious ploy to me! even if it's not the fact I know it may result in a positive reaction perhaps means I shouldn't bother.

I suppose indie brainbox is a good description of Miranda, she has the best eyes of any of them, my reasons for fancying her are shallow, thank god.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:53 (twenty-one years ago)

Oh, OK. Sorry. I totally misunderstood.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:54 (twenty-one years ago)

Charlotte - hot physically but horrible character
Samantha - not that hot physically but has the sexxx appeal
Miranda - not my type physically but is the best and most likeable character by far
Carrie - no redeeming characteristics

― Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:56 (twenty-one years ago)

All four of them are incredibly sexy in different ways.

(xpost Jordan you mentalist, Carrie has the best body.)

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:58 (twenty-one years ago)

there's a wider issue here of being shoehorned into stereotypical gender roles in discussions like this, I guess it's inevitable though considering most people grow up with the idiotic classroom approach to their gender, ie fucking lame semi jocular semi nervous "battle of the sexes" type debates in school or college.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 17:59 (twenty-one years ago)

Anyway, it's interesting what jocelyn said. The thing is, Tobey Maguire isn't seen as conventionally especially attractive, though. He's like the nerdy leading man of our age. Very popular in certain circles, yes, but that's not the same thing as being conventionally attractive.

I agree that Defoe and (esp) Molena are even further off the map, though.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:00 (twenty-one years ago)

!!!

Sarah Jessica Parker? But she's all SPINDLY and POINTY and BLONDE. Pretty much the exact opposite of my type.

(x-posts)

― Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:00 (twenty-one years ago)

Charlotte has the best body.

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:01 (twenty-one years ago)

Charlotte has the best face. Carrie has the best body. Miranda has the best personality. Samantha has the best libido.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:02 (twenty-one years ago)

Carrie has terrible legs

― Penelope_111 (Penelope_111), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:02 (twenty-one years ago)

She's got a great ass, though.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:03 (twenty-one years ago)

Oh God, Ronan, what have you done?

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:03 (twenty-one years ago)

Maybe I just like (much) older men, secretly.
I think Sarah Jessica Parker is horsey, maybe because she has been pushed in our faces as "hott" when it was so obvious that earlier in her career she was considered not.

― jocelyn (Jocelyn), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:03 (twenty-one years ago)

I still don't understand your Carrie-madness, Dan Perry.

(um, x-post)

― Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:04 (twenty-one years ago)

Mmmm, Miranda.

― n/a (Nick A.), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:04 (twenty-one years ago)

She has a horrifyingly odd pointy arse cheek

xpost

― Penelope_111 (Penelope_111), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:04 (twenty-one years ago)

I saw Footloose recently and it reminded me that Sarah Jessica Parker actually used to be attractive, once upon a time.

― n/a (Nick A.), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:04 (twenty-one years ago)

Which one is Miranda?

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:04 (twenty-one years ago)

I think Sarah Jessica Parker is horsey

This is because she is. Her face is very long and gaunt, like a horse's. Kristen Davis is far and away the "prettiest" woman in the cast. HOWEVER, as evidenced in that recent Gap commercial, SJP has AMAZING curves to her body.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:07 (twenty-one years ago)

(Miranda is the red-haired cynical one)

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:07 (twenty-one years ago)

sorry Alba.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:08 (twenty-one years ago)

I like the brunette, I think, simply based on thinkign she's pretty. I don't watch it so don't know what their characters are like.

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:08 (twenty-one years ago)

That's Charlotte, and she is VERY pretty.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:09 (twenty-one years ago)

(I wonder what this has revealed about my character.)

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:10 (twenty-one years ago)

Charlotte has the best face. Carrie has the best body. Miranda has the best personality. Samantha has the best libido.
Good points. Samantha would be fun to party with. Carrie would be fun to sleep with. Charlotte is the girl I would secretly have a crush on but never ask out. Miranda's the one I would end up going out with, because she's neurotic and I seem to end up with picky, neurotic girls. We'd go out, but there's no way it'd last.

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:10 (twenty-one years ago)

I know nothing about this show, but Kim Cattrall's character is obv. the hottest and you're all mentalists.

And Spencer's tale upthread is utterly classic.

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:12 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah, Sarah Jessica Parker is horrible and horsey. I don't understand her AT ALL.

Mind you, I have never seen the show -- which means I can't consider the characters' personalities -- but I find Charlotte the most attractive. And then Miranda. I have a theory behind this, but I'm going to keep it to myself for now.

Actually, I will say this, though, re: Charlotte having the best face and Carrie having the best body -- I've never been able to find a woman attractive whose face I don't find attractive, no matter how hot her bod is.

― jaymc (jaymc), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:12 (twenty-one years ago)

Nick, did you have to post that picture? Some of us are reading this thread on office computers.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:13 (twenty-one years ago)

Actually, of the four of them I would initially be attract to Miranda but probably end up going out with Charlotte because I seem to gravitate towards women more conservative than I am as representing stability (completely ignoring the fact that instability can manifest itself in a myriad of ways and Miranda is probably the most compatible with me in terms of stability).

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:14 (twenty-one years ago)

This is a large reason of why I think Charlotte is more attractive than Carrie.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:14 (twenty-one years ago)

Sorry N - I didn't realise Monica's nipple was so obvious from the google thumbnail. Does someone want to turn it into a link?

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:15 (twenty-one years ago)

They all have bodies I wouldn't kick out of bed.

― Michael White (Hereward), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:19 (twenty-one years ago)

SJP doesn't have curves!!!

(Although it's possible I just haven't been able to look past her face)

― Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:20 (twenty-one years ago)

SJP's feet really scare me. I used to be a ballet dancer and have awful feet but she needs a good podiatrist stat.

― jocelyn (Jocelyn), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:21 (twenty-one years ago)

I certainly dont find SJP attractive on any level.

― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:21 (twenty-one years ago)

(xpost to Dan)
Ha, for me it'd be the opposite. I'd initially be attracted to Charlotte because she's the prettiest, but she's the least "in your face" of the three ... personality-wise, we look so I think we'd look mismatched together in social situations. I'm too much of a shouty loudmouth for her ... then again, she ended up marrying a shouty loudmouth -- hey, wait a minute!

In the meantime, Miranda and I would end up talking about out university degrees and she wouldn't mind letting me come over and watch a baseball game on her giant TV. We'd be verbal sparring partners and we'd slowly drive each other nuts.

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:22 (twenty-one years ago)

Actually, here's my theory: there are two kinds of women that I'm attracted to. The first is the kind that's cute, short, brunette, kinda curvy, and the second is the kind that's not so much cute as interesting-looking (and because of that maybe even more SEXY) and probably taller, skinnier, and, I dunno, just more of a wild card. The first is what I usually think of as my "type" and is the kind that I imagine myself in relationships with (also the kind who I end up pursuing); the second just sort of holds a certain fascination for me, and is more purely sexual. My guess is that would be Charlotte vs. Miranda, but again, I haven't watched the show, so I'm just speculating.

― jaymc (jaymc), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:22 (twenty-one years ago)

They all have bodies I wouldn't kick out of bed.

Although if my gf came home and found four decapitated actresses in bed with me, I might get a wee scolding.

― Michael White (Hereward), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:23 (twenty-one years ago)

Kim Cathrall's character is so unattractive. I mean a guy who talked that much about sex would be considered an utterly boring loser.

hang on though why are we still talking about SITC

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:23 (twenty-one years ago)

http://accept.ong.ro/cinequanon5.jpg

Jordan, put your hand over her head and look at the difference between her waist and her hips. CURVES.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:24 (twenty-one years ago)

Oh.

― Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:25 (twenty-one years ago)

Samantha is written too extremely to be quite believable, though upon reflection, that may be true of all four characters. Not only do I find Cynthia Nixon attractive, but I find Miranda the most realistic character.

― Michael White (Hereward), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:25 (twenty-one years ago)

her eyes are amazing.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:26 (twenty-one years ago)

I've honestly never seen this show, not even a second of it

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:26 (twenty-one years ago)

... but then I've only just started watching "Friends"!

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:28 (twenty-one years ago)

I think Carrie is the most believable because she's the only one who doesn't correspond to a basic "type", i.e. Samantha's the raving sex lunatic, Charlotte's the girl-next-door, Miranda's the neurotic one. Carrie can't be summarized in two or three words.

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:28 (twenty-one years ago)

This thread has gotten really funny.

― n/a (Nick A.), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:29 (twenty-one years ago)

Sarah Jessica Parker is quite horsey-looking, but nevertheless I think she is very attractive. Of the 2 women at the beginning of the thread, I find them both attractive. What a person does, or how they act, or what they think about stuff affects how attracted I am to them. Nina is less attractive to me b/c she is with iggy pop, miranda is more attractive, because I have enjoyed reading her writing in the past.

(x-post, SITC I found interittently enjoyable, "friends" I found excruciating)

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:29 (twenty-one years ago)

Say, is this show "Cheers" any good?

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:29 (twenty-one years ago)

I'm going to point to this thread the next time my male friends (who think that only women watch, or would want to watch SITC) want to make fun of me for loving this show.

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:30 (twenty-one years ago)

I UH ONLY WATCH IT BECAUSE MY GIRLFRIEND LIKES IT AND I DON'T REALLY WATCH IT, IT'S JUST IN THE BACKGROUND WHILE I'M READING UH SPORTS ILLUSTRATED OR SOMETHING ELSE MACHO.

― n/a (Nick A.), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:33 (twenty-one years ago)

Why do you have to put your hand over her head to see the difference in her waist and hips?

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:33 (twenty-one years ago)

I really, really, really don't like SITC, yet I have seen the bulk of the episodes thanks to gf.

― n/a (Nick A.), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:33 (twenty-one years ago)

So you don't turn to stone.

xpost

― Michael White (Hereward), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:34 (twenty-one years ago)

Tradition (xpost)

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:34 (twenty-one years ago)

"See guys, a bunch of dudes I met on the INTERNET watch Sex In The City. Last time I checked, the INTERNET wasn't exactly a place for weedy losers. no sir. alpha males all the way."

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:34 (twenty-one years ago)

In Sex and the City, I like Charlotte best.

― jel -- (jel), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:35 (twenty-one years ago)

I liked Viz's description of Sarah-Jessica Parker in their (pretty funny) Borderline Boilers feature of a few years back: horse-faced titstand. Don't know what it means tho.

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:36 (twenty-one years ago)

I really, really, really don't like SITC, yet I have seen the bulk of the episodes thanks to gf.
This is how I once got hooked on Buffy the Vampire Slayer. I used to hate it, and I still found it corny and slow-moving even once I got hooked on it.
I think there's a soap-opera addiction gene that runs in my family. Everyone's always hooked on something. It's been like that since we were kids.

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:37 (twenty-one years ago)

I think I like Samantha the best but I haven't watched enough of it to be really sure.

― Penelope_111 (Penelope_111), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:37 (twenty-one years ago)

Is she the old slapper?

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:39 (twenty-one years ago)

That's the one. The tart with a heart.

― Penelope_111 (Penelope_111), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:40 (twenty-one years ago)

I've only ever watched the odd episode, usually whilst listening to music on my headphones.

― jel -- (jel), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:40 (twenty-one years ago)

Miranda, by miles. But then I would say that, being a signed up European liberal indie type.

― RickyT (RickyT), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:40 (twenty-one years ago)

What one is Miranda - the ugly redhead?

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:41 (twenty-one years ago)

She is the pretty redhead. I'm not sure who the ugly redhead is.

― n/a (Nick A.), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:42 (twenty-one years ago)

I can honestly say that Miranda is the only redeeming factor of SITC.

― n/a (Nick A.), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:42 (twenty-one years ago)

There's another one, but I don't know who she is or what she looks likes

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:43 (twenty-one years ago)

Perchance you are referring to your mother?

― n/a (Nick A.), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:45 (twenty-one years ago)

I presumed nobody liked Miranda, as did my friend. maybe she doesn't hang out with Euro-liberal-indie-gays. I mean guys.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:45 (twenty-one years ago)

Why do you have to put your hand over her head to see the difference in her waist and hips?

[quote]
SJP doesn't have curves!!!

(Although it's possible I just haven't been able to look past her face)

-- Jordan (jordan...) (webmail), October 28th, 2004. (later) (link)
[endquote]

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:46 (twenty-one years ago)

We've covered my mother in great detail earlier on in the thread

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:47 (twenty-one years ago)

Covered her with what?

― n/a (Nick A.), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:47 (twenty-one years ago)

Glory

― Dadaismus (Dada), Thursday, 28 October 2004 18:48 (twenty-one years ago)

This thread is very long. I suppose it has become hard for me to venture an answer, now. One thing I think I can say is that I don't think sexuality should be aggressive. If it is aggressive, I think it has gone wrong.

― the bellefox, Thursday, 28 October 2004 19:19 (twenty-one years ago)

I think you should venture a longer answer. Forget the Sex & The City tangent.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 19:25 (twenty-one years ago)

When you say it means it has 'gone wrong', do you just mean it's no longer something you find appealling, or do you mean aggressive sexuality is intrinsically unhealthy or bad in some more fundamental way? If the latter, can you elaborate?

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 28 October 2004 19:28 (twenty-one years ago)

Maybehe thinks aggression denotes some kind of violent undercurrent or something?

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Thursday, 28 October 2004 19:50 (twenty-one years ago)

you have all ruined this thread.

― cºzen (Cozen), Friday, 29 October 2004 00:14 (twenty-one years ago)

I hope a janny-long-legs bites you.

― cºzen (Cozen), Friday, 29 October 2004 00:14 (twenty-one years ago)

Gena Malone > Mandy Moore

Gena Rowlands >>> Stevem

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Friday, 29 October 2004 10:23 (twenty-one years ago)

Incidentally:

1. Charlotte
2. Miranda
3. Samantha
4. Carrie

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Friday, 29 October 2004 10:24 (twenty-one years ago)

Would the order be the same if you were to rate them according to the kind of personality/character you find more attractive?

I ask because my sister, who's quite a bit younger than me, told me that she was having a similar conversation in a pub last weekend. She said she was a bit stunned that most of the guys said that they weren't particularly attracted to strong, funny, smart women because they felt that these 'types' were always trying to 'get one up on them' or something similar. They admitted to liking smart women but didn't really like the combination of smart AND funny/extrovert.

I wouldn't have thought this is too common, is it?

― Penelope_111 (Penelope_111), Friday, 29 October 2004 10:32 (twenty-one years ago)

I think over-exposure to S&TC means that I couldn't fancy any of them even if I wanted to - it's now too hard to discuss their attractiveness for some reason. Let me try and disassociate myself:

If I was on the pull and saw them in a bar Miranda would be the one I was immediately drawn to, but I suspect I'd be a bit intimidated by her. Samantha and Carrie are immediate nos; so Charlotte would be the one I'd make moves on. I would have said there was no way she'd have responded, but then she had that storyline where she dated the bald guy, so I'd probably be in there.

― Markelby (Mark C), Friday, 29 October 2004 10:39 (twenty-one years ago)

Penelope - the way I see it is that women who have everything going for them are simply too intimidating to men who immediately feel that they'll not be as attractive/bright/funny which stresses them out and self-fulfils. That's certainly happened to me numerous times.

― Markelby (Mark C), Friday, 29 October 2004 10:40 (twenty-one years ago)

Personality-wise:

1. Miranda
2. Charlotte
3. Carrie
4. Samantha

NB, Samantha is only last because at this point in time, I'd actually like to have something that resembles a relationship. However, Carrie's Mr Big obsession is a serious health hazard.

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Friday, 29 October 2004 10:44 (twenty-one years ago)

charlotte in the garden
carrie in the kitchen
samantha in the bedroom
miranda on the internet

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Friday, 29 October 2004 10:45 (twenty-one years ago)

Are you suggesting Carrie can cook?

― Markelby (Mark C), Friday, 29 October 2004 12:33 (twenty-one years ago)

i panicked

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Friday, 29 October 2004 12:33 (twenty-one years ago)

Those aren't the Beastie Boys lyrics you were looking for.

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Friday, 29 October 2004 12:44 (twenty-one years ago)

It wasn't Steve.

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Friday, 29 October 2004 12:49 (twenty-one years ago)

Well, those girls have standards.

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:11 (twenty-one years ago)

i finally got bored enough at work to wade all the way through this thread...and here's what i'll contribute this afternoon

Leggy is nice until they're too long and then they begin to look silly

boo. we have enough problems finding trousers that fit, don't point out that we're silly looking as well!

hasn't there been a thread about which SATC character you like most? i'm all for a steve/big hybrid, myself.

― colette (a2lette), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:12 (twenty-one years ago)

I think this is a very interesting question and I also think that a man's preference for certain looks say lots about his character, a lot of which cannot be heard.

― cºzen (Cozen), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:22 (twenty-one years ago)

Miranda is actually my least favorite char--she is too normal and boring. I would rank:

1. Charlotte/Samantha tie or combine them into one person with Charlotte's head.
2. Carrie
3. Miranda

― Orbit (Orbit), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:25 (twenty-one years ago)

Ew, Charlotte's head on a freakish two-body amalgam of horror???

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:27 (twenty-one years ago)

Samantha's the only one of the four I find even remotely fanciable.

― Marcello Carlin, Friday, 29 October 2004 13:30 (twenty-one years ago)

Miranda's the only one i could stand to be with for more than five minutes, everything else is moot.

i'm drawn to eyes big time and face shape/features generally - 'feminine' style i suppose (but who can define that really?) - there's usually some eyes/smile combo i seem to look for and (unfortunately) gawp at if i catch it. what this says i'm not sure. pretty conventional me (liking glasses seems to have become conventional/pedestrian, or was it always?) but really like subtlety (intentional i.e. geekness or otherwise)

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:34 (twenty-one years ago)

most of the guys said that they weren't particularly attracted to strong, funny, smart women because they felt that these 'types' were always trying to 'get one up on them' or something similar

I can understand this point of view, it's not so much "getting one up on them", I just personally don't want to date people who like me cos of intellectual grappling or something like that, there's just no magic whatsoever in stupid intellectual power game flirting, and I hate when I feel people are trying to "get" me.

― Ronan (Ronan), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:41 (twenty-one years ago)

sexy: harry connick jr.
unsexy: harry connick sr.

― Jordan (Jordan), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:43 (twenty-one years ago)

Wrong thread...OR IS IT?

― Jordan (Jordan), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:43 (twenty-one years ago)

I think that's a little too slanted a view - the few people I know in such situations aren't constantly engaged in one-upmanship behaviour. I think that's a nice way to dress up the fact that those guys couldn't take a bit of playful teasing every now and then.

xx-p to Ro.

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:47 (twenty-one years ago)

Well on reflection I think I am attracted to strong, smart, funny women, or at least I hope so, but not "strong, smart, funny, women".

― Ronan (Ronan), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:49 (twenty-one years ago)

actually I think what I'm trying to say is the stereotypical "strong, smart, funny woman" is not attractive to me, nor are people who'd define themselves that way. I can totally understand in a conversation in a pub how people would assume the stereotype is what's being discussed. smart, funny, strong are all in the eyes of the beholder obviously.

― Ronan (Ronan), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:51 (twenty-one years ago)

i love funny women and it unfortunately seems like a stereotype that too often in a relationship it's the guy who is making all the jokes and that's a big part of what's attracting the woman. plus when guys get together you tend to get them trying to outdo each other with jokes often at each other's expense. excuse the generalisation but this never seems as common with women, as if they don't think it's 'their place' to provide the funny (and certainly not in that 'competetitive' style which isn't attractive per se but occurs because men realise women like to laugh (duh)

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:54 (twenty-one years ago)

most of the guys said that they weren't particularly attracted to strong, funny, smart women because they felt that these 'types' were always trying to 'get one up on them' or something similar

Sounds a bit paranoid and insecure...

― Orbit (Orbit), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:54 (twenty-one years ago)

conventional wisdom is that women are needy and insecure, but look at this thread.. most men are like "omg women they scare me what if they laugh at me and are better than me help."

― lauren (laurenp), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:55 (twenty-one years ago)

This discussion appears to be masking the question "How do your insecurities shape what you find attractive in other people?" It seems that everyone is couching what they find attractive in terms of what is least threatening to temselves, or what puts you in the best light in relation to the other person (by which I don't mean what makes you look better than the other person; rather, what makes you appear/come across "better" than you do when you are single).

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:57 (twenty-one years ago)

I would have have conventional wisdom the other way round, lauren, and this thread just another affirmation.

― cºzen (Cozen), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:57 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't believe in conventional wisdom though, not even to a point.

― cºzen (Cozen), Friday, 29 October 2004 13:57 (twenty-one years ago)

HETEROSEXUAL POLITICS IN A NUTSHELL

Tom Cruise: YOU. COMPLETE. ME.
Renee Zellweger: Shut up and fuck me, you dipshit.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Friday, 29 October 2004 14:01 (twenty-one years ago)

(I should have been the Jerry Maguire scriptwriter.)

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Friday, 29 October 2004 14:01 (twenty-one years ago)

by which I don't mean what makes you look better than the other person; rather, what makes you appear/come across "better" than you do when you are single).

I guess that's what people look for in relationships to some extent. On an unrelated topic I don't think the men on this thread are too like "omg what if women laugh at me", are they?

― Ronan (Ronan), Friday, 29 October 2004 14:03 (twenty-one years ago)

i haven't tho i do actually feel that way all the time and always have in real life, yay

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Friday, 29 October 2004 14:05 (twenty-one years ago)

i was exaggerating, a bit, but there's a huge level of anxiety on this thread.

― lauren (laurenp), Friday, 29 October 2004 14:07 (twenty-one years ago)

Since I laugh at myself more than anyone else does, no, not me.

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Friday, 29 October 2004 14:10 (twenty-one years ago)

well we are a bunch of fucking losers afterall

― Ronan (Ronan), Friday, 29 October 2004 14:10 (twenty-one years ago)

If anything, what bugs me is that I feel incompatible, rather than, say, anxious or inadequate. I hate feeling that way but I seem to come off as too individual to be seen as "boyf material".

Or yeah, what Ronan said, haha.

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Friday, 29 October 2004 14:12 (twenty-one years ago)

you'll always be the El Pimpo to me dog

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Friday, 29 October 2004 14:18 (twenty-one years ago)

Poor dog.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Friday, 29 October 2004 14:19 (twenty-one years ago)

Damn, g, I gotta be the motherfuckin' role-model up in here!

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Friday, 29 October 2004 14:20 (twenty-one years ago)

i am mortified by how much we now seem like JD and Turk out of Scrubs (PS not really i think they are great)

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Friday, 29 October 2004 14:22 (twenty-one years ago)

http://base58.com/pics/_myphotos/people/mattdcandbarima.jpg

http://www.usatoday.com/life/gallery/upfront/scrubs.jpg

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Friday, 29 October 2004 14:40 (twenty-one years ago)

(It's almost the same thing)

― B.A.R.M.S. (Barima), Friday, 29 October 2004 14:41 (twenty-one years ago)

i don't look THAT much like Matt DC...

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Friday, 29 October 2004 14:43 (twenty-one years ago)

tho people do accuse of sharing the same brain (even tho we disagree about 90% of stuff) so close enough...

― Freelance Hiveminder (blueski), Friday, 29 October 2004 14:44 (twenty-one years ago)

anxiety? on an intarweb message board???

― still bevens (bscrubbins), Friday, 29 October 2004 14:45 (twenty-one years ago)

this thread is creepy

― \(^o^)/ (Adrian Langston), Saturday, 30 October 2004 00:42 (twenty-one years ago)

just a jk! but it is v. weird.

― \(^o^)/ (Adrian Langston), Saturday, 30 October 2004 00:43 (twenty-one years ago)

What is 'aggressive sexuality'??? I mean, there a zillion thread on ILE with guys posting about how they would love women to make the first move/hit on them, etc etc, which I would consider somewhat agressive frankly.

― tokyo rosemary (rosemary), Saturday, 30 October 2004 01:11 (twenty-one years ago)

yeah, i didn't even wanna touch that one. there's a lot of tunnel-vision in this thread

― \(^o^)/ (Adrian Langston), Saturday, 30 October 2004 01:35 (twenty-one years ago)

Cozen, I believe in you - to a point.

I suspect that people (human ones) can be needy (we all need things) and insecure (the world is dangerous). We must try to be sympathetic and tolerant about this, and try not to make the issue a gendered one, I think.

Hi, N.: it was nice of you to be interested enough in my views to say:

I think you should venture a longer answer. Forget the Sex & The City tangent. // When you say it means it has 'gone wrong', do you just mean it's no longer something you find appealling, or do you mean aggressive sexuality is intrinsically unhealthy or bad in some more fundamental way? If the latter, can you elaborate?

I think I mean the latter. Roxymuzak adds:

Maybe he thinks aggression denotes some kind of violent undercurrent or something?

- and she is right, really, I do. I am not sure how much I can elaborate. I think that sexuality should - if it takes place or expresses itself at all (and it usually does not) - be consenting, safe, interesting, and maybe even mixed up with tenderness and affection. Possibly this is too much to ask. We live in a hard world. But if sexuality becomes a matter of aggression and violence, then it is best abandoned. Perhaps, though, I am missing something, here. I am hardly an expert on this issue.

I don't like Sex and the City much. It always sought to elevate banality to profundity while leaving it as banality.

― the bellefox, Saturday, 30 October 2004 10:05 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't like Sex and the City much. It always sought to elevate banality to profundity while leaving it as banality.

I think this is definitely true of Carrie's commentary, but I am never sure how much you are supposed to agree with Carrie, and how much to think she is a silly caricature. I don't know if you are supposed to take Carrie's (often ridiculous) musings as the "message" of the show. Which bits are supposed to be satirical and which aren't? The book the show is based on is more obviously satirical in places, as I remember, and it's not told through Carrie's voice. The book reminded me of American Psycho a bit.

Sorry, I don't mean to fuel further derailment.

― Cathy (Cathy), Saturday, 30 October 2004 10:40 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't think people on this thread are using the word "aggression" in that way, though, The Pinefox. Of course I can't speak for them, but I interpret it here as meaning "willing to make the first move", "forward", or even "honest" or "frank." But I think the crux of your argument/idea is to be found in these words: I think that sexuality should (...) be (...) mixed up with tenderness and affection. (Sorry to paraphrase you.)

― roxymuzak (roxymuzak), Saturday, 30 October 2004 11:22 (twenty-one years ago)

Roxy is right - when people talking of hetero men being aggressively sexual (a rare expression in this case), some of the violence the Pinefox talks about may be implied, but it generally isn't when they talk about women, where they might simply mean that they are as overtly sexual and forward as, say, most men. I personally see this as a good thing, and like it. I'm not very good at being pushy, so being with someone who also hangs back for firm signals can be a difficulty - and anyway, overt sexuality is most often very sexy, for me. Also, since I talk very openly about these things, it's more pleasant doing so when other people happily do the same, rather than having them look at you as if you're being disgusting.

― Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Saturday, 30 October 2004 12:59 (twenty-one years ago)

perhaps the fear of aggressive sexuality comes from those who wouldnt think of themselves as sexually aggressive or confident, and subconsciously many people feel more comfortable with someone who is at their level.

i think theres also, perhaps, a disparagement of 'the obvious' or anything overt, which is unsurprising on a board such as this. people looking, consciously or otherwise, for something they think of as quirky, or that little bit different.

the answers are telling here, and unsurpising

i know the type of girl i am attracted to, physically, and i think it reveals a lot about my character. it is similar to many of the answers on this thread.

a tangential, and interesting spin off of this, is what it says about male looks...

...subonconsiusly, we think the indiewaif-euro-intellectual blah blah girl is more likely to be interested in us, because of our interests and personality, ie that we might be exciting to them in a ways other than looks. and that, perhaps, they are less likely to be physically oriented. an obviously hugely presumptive stance, but one i think it can be easy to fall into.

following from that, then, doesnt it lead to us thinking that it is interests/personality/charisma that is important (in the male), and not just looks (as many recent threads have complained about)?

ie, "i like quirkygirl because she will like me for my personality and be interested in me, and then maybe she will have sex with me"

there are many threads about being unable to attract girls because of failure of looks. there are fewer threads about being unable to attract girls because of failure of charisma/personality. but the latter is more telling, and more prevalent than people seem to want to admit.

― *@*.* (gareth), Saturday, 30 October 2004 13:54 (twenty-one years ago)

I AM MOMUSFOR HALLOWEEN

― sometimes i like to pretend i am very small and warm (ex machina), Sunday, 31 October 2004 01:02 (twenty-one years ago)

OTM.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Sunday, 31 October 2004 07:40 (twenty-one years ago)

Fallen foul of that so many times.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Sunday, 31 October 2004 07:43 (twenty-one years ago)

So is it every guy's fantasy to be with a girl who's "shy" and "nice" in public, but "assertive"/"agressive" in the bedroom?

If anything, the opposite.

Orbit (not about SITC), Spencer and *@*.* otm. I like girls whose appearance is, and suggests a personality that is, in some way like mine (and perhaps in some useful ways complementary to mine). I dislike the indie girl - don't find Winona Ryder remotely attractive - because I'm not much into the indie thing or possessed of the indie aesthetic. I'm not sure my appearance is properly reflective of my personality, though. Perhaps this is a problem.

Oh come on. Womanly=curvy, manly=muscular. Deal with it.

I don't deal with anything I don't like.

i've heard lots of jewish guys say this. what's the reason?

perhaps it's a numbers/diaspora thing - if most people around you aren't Jewish, your aesthetic is going to be defined, perhaps, by a non-Jewish majority. Or perhaps it's a secular thing - the more religious you are, the more someone who shares your worldview and practice is going to appeal to you.

and on the SITC front...

1. Carrie (best on every level)
3. Miranda-Charlotte tossup - both relatively attractive (Charlotte is more attractive than Miranda, but Cynthia Nixon is more attractive than Kristen Davis) and moderately likeable but both somewhat annoying. Miranda's 'intelligence (which is more asssumed than displayed)/worldliness' (for lack of a better word) and Charlotte's warmth/'charm' (sort of) are mitigants. If I had to lean one way, it would probably be Miranda-ward. Dan otm about the 'instability' factor.
4. Samantha (zzzzz)

I don't like Sex and the City much. It always sought to elevate banality to profundity while leaving it as banality.

too true. but when the characters are allowed to be characters, it has some good performances and oh yes all that New York.

― gabbneb (gabbneb), Sunday, 31 October 2004 15:07 (twenty-one years ago)

So is it every guy's fantasy to be with a girl who's "shy" and "nice" in public, but "assertive"/"agressive" in the bedroom?

It's the before and after in Grease syndrome, innit? Sandy thinks she has to be all tarty and obvious to get Danny to notice her, but every bloke I know preferred the lemon-cardigan-swinging-ponytail-fresh-faced Sandy, and would run a mile at the leather-trousered slap-covered monstrosity she turns into at the end.

― ailsa (ailsa), Sunday, 31 October 2004 15:13 (twenty-one years ago)

Not me - I'd prefer any woman in black leather and t-shirt to a cardigan. Not that I cared much for Sandy in either mode, and I do prefer no/minimal make-up.

― Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Sunday, 31 October 2004 15:17 (twenty-one years ago)

I like a girl who's nice and kind but also self-aware and strong in life, and I like exactly the same thing in the bedroom.

― Markelby (Mark C), Monday, 1 November 2004 13:52 (twenty-one years ago)

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