Ladies, how do you meet men in 2007? Online?

move

haha right. money is the prob there. PA vs NY

At 24, bars? No? Gets tougher in bars as you get older.

bars always creeped me out, esp. if i was by myself. it was like, "hi! i'm a lady by myself! plz, creepy dudes, come chat me up!" bleck.

i 2nd moving.

"my best friend"
"my best friend"
"my best friend"

lol molly

just seen this on mashable today...

20+ Dating Sites For Geeks and Freaks
http://mashable.com/2007/08/15/dating-sites/

Yup, moving is the way forward. If you're having a hard time meeting men AT TWENTY FOUR then you gotta get yrself to a place where there are more available men.

i hear perth, australia, has a major shortage of women.

On the other hand, Perth is death.

yeah, but maybe you could go there, find a man, and then take him away.

okcupid.com

Yup, moving is the way forward. If you're having a hard time meeting men AT TWENTY FOUR then you gotta get yrself to a place where there are more available men.

this kinda rings true - 24 yo single girl that can't meet guys? either there really are no men around her or there's something wrong with her

that sounds like really positive advice, yes, "there's just....something wrong with you!"

I have no advice for anybody

haha

in defense of my dear friend, i think it's just that her style isn't very stylish - she tends to go with a fuck-it attitude when it comes to presentation. that and her area of PA is kinda backwoodsy from what i hear.

sounds like someone's itchin to deliver a Queer Eye makeover

http://www.proteinpower.com/drmike/wp-content/uploads/2006/12/deliverance.JPG

YES xp! i would have so much fun.

http://www.proteinpower.com/drmike/wp-content/uploads/2006/12/deliverance.JPG

^^^ clearly prefers his women stylish

I find the idea that just because youre single there's something "wrong" with you if you cant meet guys kind of offensive, guys. Or are we supposed to hook up with any offensive ugly fuckwit we pass in the street?

is there something wrong with him?

well Surmounter perhaps this is one of those fortuitous moments when the desires of a gay man and the insecurities of a hetero woman unite to produce a startlingly sexy ugly-duckling transformation

is there something wrong with him?

hahahahaha exactly

I'm sorry I'm being a totally unhelpful smartass

there's something wrong with you

indeed

maybe someone can recommend some prescription drugs

hahahaha

yes shakey i can see ur point

I find the idea that just because youre single there's something "wrong" with you if you cant meet guys kind of offensive, guys. Or are we supposed to hook up with any offensive ugly fuckwit we pass in the street?

also "meeting guys" and "hooking up with guys" are two totally different things. Sure you can't have one without the other, but all the former requires is usually being young and female (because men are disgusting and will basically hit on anything young with boobs and purty hayur), while the latter requires that the young woman in questions make some qualitative decisions about said pool of men.

this is real science you're dropping. tell me, do you have any theories about men liking sport and women enjoying a good day's shopping?

How long has China been exporting all their baby girls? There must be a lot of eligible boys there by now.

How sad is it that I can't think of three positive adjectives about me for OK Cupid?

I put "awesome" and "a boner," I don't remember my third.

How sad is it that I can't think of three positive adjectives about me for OK Cupid?
"Look Like Cruise"

Oh, that's words, not adjectives.
Okay.
"Cruiselike"
"Nonscientologist"
"Desperate"

but all the former requires is usually being young and female (because men are disgusting and will basically hit on anything young with boobs and purty hayur)

I'm sure this is a great reassurance to the unfortunately plain/unattractive/painfully shy women out there who honestly dont ever "meet" men (and tbh now I have no idea what this even means. Everyone "meets" people, this has nothing to do with getting *anywhere* near a date situation!)

My husband and I bonded on how inept we both were at "meeting" members of the opposite sex.

desperate! Yeah, that pretty much sums it up

But you're a handsome guy, AND lacking confidence! Women LOVE that!

Get a job at a garden center. Girl landscapers are totally sexy.

You could just work part-time. NOT weekends—no pro landscapers then, only homeowners.

Wait, I'm turning this into a "gentlemen, how do you meet ladies?" thread.

Women just have to follow the "how do you meet ladies" advice, but in reverse!

I pretty much sit in my apartment and write. Not very conducive to meeting people. I did, however, settle on "metal," "sardonic," and "shiny."

Oh, you DEFINITELY need to get a garden center job, just for the fresh air and sunshine. The sexy girls covered with dirt and scabs would be a fringe benefit.

what kind of guy does she want to meet? beth parker is right, she should get a part-time job in the service industry as guys always crush on their waitstaff/barstaff/shop girls.

^^^NOT TRUE they crush but they never fucking act on it!! men are hopeless!! although i only ever get guys over 45 crushing on me where i work, so i'm probably just bitter about that.

I think "bitter" is the default for everyone on ILX.

I'm sure people dont hit on waitresses because any sensible person would assume it was inappropriate and/or they'd be rebuffed anyway.

well trayce, ppl need to realise waitresses need sex too ;). i get hit on, but usually they're marries with kids my age.

*married

Waitresses and shop girls want to get hit on?! This cannot be true. I figured they must get hit on all the time and are sick of it. Like hitting on strippers.

Yah, I hated getting hit on when working retail (esp. in a music store, jesus h. that was the worst). It's the worst because you can't just flip them off or something like you can off shift.

you can't just flip them off

Can you believe all those losers out there 'fraid of rejection?

I don't really get chatted up. Apparently something is wrong with me.

Waitresses and shop girls want to get hit on?! This cannot be true. It isn't.

Back in my single days I had a pathological attraction to people hosting events - the person whose house the party was at, the PR girl running the demonstration, the curator of the exhibition. Pretty pointless really, since they're the one person guaranteed to be busy/talking to every single person.

I find the idea that just because youre single there's something "wrong" with you if you cant meet guys kind of offensive, guys. Or are we supposed to hook up with any offensive ugly fuckwit we pass in the street?

Hey, how did this get turned around so badly?

That's not what I said. I said she needs to move somewhere that she is going to meet more available and interesting men.

I didn't have a single date all through my teens because I lived in backwoods hicksville and quite frankly I'd have rather become a nun than date any of the losers around there. I didn't actually meet men I was *intersted* in until I moved to NYC and started meeting a simply better... *class* (sorry for use of loaded word, but I don't mean socioeconomic class... or maybe I do, I dunno. Men who have actually read books and visited an art gallery once or twice in their lives, that kind of thing.) of men. Then I was 24 and positively drowning in a sea of manpussy!

(Insert 'rubber ring' joke here)

work at a bar

waitresses/shopgirls want to get hit on... by smart, funny, cool guys ;)

well, i do anyway. except no smart, funny, cool guys come into either my restaurant or my store, and if they do, they don't hit on me.

the only smart, cool, funny guys i meet are on the internet :(

men over 45 can smart and funny and cool!

also we know the secrets of the sea

oh i know that, but they're all married :(

i am not age-ist.

Mark S is married to the sea.

and everything in it:
http://www.mervynpeake.org/images/books_slaughterb.jpg

see? all married. therefore: no good to me.

Moving to a busier area (city or whatever) might increase chances of meeting somebody but it can also overwhelm plus you might find people are generally not so friendly i dunno. I don't think geography is anywhere near as much a factor as what you're like yourself. London and surrounding areas are full of people but I never just met someone in a bar/party or whatever here.

Waitresses (or whoever) should do the hitting on/not wait to be hit on, if that's what they want. This 'men are useless because they don't do what I am hoping they will do but can't actually act on myself' thing will always be crazy.

I've always found when you're not actively looking is when you meet the best ones.

xpost i HAVE made the effort. but that seems to terrify most men.

When is anybody NOT actively looking (if they actually are single and gagging for it) tho?

xpost if it 'terrifies' them i guess they must just not be interested?

you are bringing me total bummerz, dude

It's the old "yer damned if you do, damned if you don't" WRT to making moves on men.

yeah i didn't mean to sound cold about it. but at least you did make the effort. always worth it even if it doesn't pay off right?

When is anybody NOT actively looking (if they actually are single and gagging for it) tho?

Well exactly. If you're really wanting something the air of desperation dooms your for anything other than casual sex. Meaningful relationships seem to come along during periods of otherwise contented resignation (in my experience anyway)

i think i am just crappy at hitting on men. i can flirt my ass off at work when i'm in 'work mode' (i.e. my work mask is on and i'm not really 'me') but i just blush and stutter and say semi-ridiculous things when i'm being all for-realz.

Lunch waitressing must be better for meeting men because then you get more solo diners who bring a book that maybe the waitress has read, or wants to read, hence an ice-breaker.

xpost if it 'terrifies' them i guess they must just not be interested?

i am, well, was all too familiar with this. i think dudes were intimidated by the fact that i actually made an effort! either that, or i was repulsive.

Yeah, I don't think it's the effort, it's the repulsiveness. I had no problem with me making the first move on boys back when I was young and hott. And 24, as the thread subject is. Sigh.

example: cute guy who works at local secondhand bookstore came in recently with his family. instead of saying something like 'hey, you work at ferret books, right? yeah i buy a lot of books there', i just avoided eye contact. and blushed profusely any time i had to go near the table.

I think it would be better if I blushed and said nothing. I seem to have this annoying almost-Tourettes style way of blurting out whatever random dirty jokes cross my mind. Argh.

I understand your shyness there Ruby. But I'm sure that would have seemed like a nice, non-threatening comment. Swallow the fear and say it next time!

Ruby, at least you know where bookstore guy works! GO BUY A BOOK! A shared interest is HUGE. What you interpret as fear/repulsion is probably just the same nervousness you'd feel if someone who you didn't know suddenly showed an interest. If you can bond on books or music or dogs or grandmas then it eases the way a little more safely, rather than bonding on sexual need and availability!

Whoa, that middle sentence was a remnant of a pre expost post, in response to Kate, I think. Way to confuse things.

I'm getting out of here. My inner matchmaker is going nuts. I'm at the age where I just want to assign everyone a partner and order them to have babies and be happy.

xpost to beth - yeah, i've been thinking about going in there... but he has these really intense blue eyes and i find it really hard to look at them without blushing.

but the other problem i'm having with meeting guys: i've actually already met my perfect guy, but circumstances dictate that we will not be together any time in the forseeable future - something that i'm finally accepting - so now i think it might be time to put myself back out there. but my overseas love is so amazingly awesome, no one else really compares :(

I think she should get on I'm In Like With You. I have invites. :P

(not that I have any experience with people actually hooking up due to it, but if I had been in the right city a few times I may have done so!)

what is this thing you speak of?

rubyredd can you send some pics i'm single xx

"I'm in like with you" ?

WTF???

Is this like one of those "I saw you..." ads on the interweb?

secret of the sea #1: "i have met my actual real soulmate but our time is not yet" REALLY fucks w.yr antennae, ruby --- i think it unconsciously makes you misread good signals so as to miss out and keep yrself "unencumbered" (ie alone)

xpost to ken c -yeah, and LIKE EVERY OTHER COOL (assuming you are cool) GUY you are on the WRONG side of the world.

move to new zealand, then we'll talk.

[my pics are on the july wdyll thread]

mark, yeah you make a good point. for awhile that's how i felt - 'it's this guy or no one!'. but i'm being a bit more realistic now. but seriously, having met this guy and having raised my standards as a result is a good thing - i've had some SHOCKAHS in the past, through not setting my standards high enough.

sorry sur - i've hijacked this thread from advice for your friend, and turned it into "let's get justine a date!"

uhhh... "let's get justinerubyredd a date!"

iilwy.com

and no it's not the same as missed connection ads. it's way more immature and way more silly and slightly more addictive/fun.

for the record, if i sound like i know a lot about online dating, it's because i work in the field, not because i do a lot of online dating. (i don't work for the above site though, i just like what they do. i WISH i worked for them, i think they're based in NYC and rolling in capital investment... sigh)

give me an invite (please)?

sure, just email me here... xqVEHTRwb9i0z✧✧✧@spam✧✧✧.u✧

that goes for anyone who wants an invite. however that's a temporary email address so after 12 hours it'll expire and the email will go nowhere (really useful if you want people to be able to copy-paste your email without getting spam for the rest of your life). anyway e-mail me there, and i will put your e-mail address in the invite box thing.

argh i forgot about that

xqVEHTRwb9i0zFOB @ spambox . us

oh and i only get like 6 invites a day, so if you miss out (unlikely 7 people will be interested anyway) i will jsut hook you up tomorrow

*returns from WDYLL july

i'm so moving to new zealand one day soon

how about everyone just clubs together and moves RR over here instead?

xpost awwww... THAT'S WHAT THEY ALL SAY

yeah nick!! awesome idea!!

ken c, flight of the conchords is good but that NOT good.

i kid i kid. i am jealous of your NZ moving. a friend of mine actually moved there for a year, but when he came back he was actually like... CRAZY. he always said "feel the burn" or something, like ALL the time, then like a month later he moved in with a woman 15 year his senior after never having a live-in girlfriend who he had just met, and they're having a baby.

i don't know if i can blame new zealand for his going off of the deep end, but I don't know what else there is to blame...

well i was due for one. at the moment I couldn't really contribute much to the fund but as soon as I have one of them elusively unicorn-like job things and gotten the wolves from the door (ha, i move out soon and then they'll have to find my new door) that leftover 20p is ALL YOURS.

i wouldn't actually mind serious advice on this thread, given that i just graduated college and have no idea how to meet people in the "real world." it's easier when everywhere you go there are hundreds of guys your age so you don't have to make that active an effort, you know? (haha maybe i should've just latched onto a guy and been like "let's get married so we won't have to be alone"...but no.)

ixpost - i will treasure your 20p, and add it to the slowly growing fund.

i'm now a member of IILWY!!! thanks will!!

wow will m, this NZ moving sounds better and better.

ruby you're not really 15 years my senior are you?

so wait will what if i want the invite for my friend though? should i include her email in my email to you?

ken, baby, i'm only 15 years your senior if you're 12. i hope you're not 12. i've already had a 15 yr-old trying to friend me on myspaz.

Ruby, I don't know how many bids you'll get with an obscure question like that! Well, obscure by that site's standards (where 50% of people seem to always ask the flying vs. invisibility question). Then again you're pretty so people will probably bid anyway.

I graduated college 5 yrs ago and I still have no idea how to meet people in the "real world". Except when I do meet someone, then it seems really easy.

Walk around on the street holding a "Free Hugs" sign. If you're a chick this is bound to yield results.

awww, we're the same age <3 <3

Surmounter sure, include hers and I can send her an invite directly, or I can just send it to you and you cna give her the short 4-or-5 digit code. Or I can send you each one (site's still fun even if you're not lookngi to date, which IMO is the sign of a good 'dating' website)

the iilwy facebook page has shitloads of free invite codes.

will, i deliberately made the question obscure :)

ken, you must also been a non-hater of the smashing pumpkins; enjoy some kind of literature; and like art (the more weird your taste is, the better). and you must be able to cook, since i hate it (mostly). and you must be a good kisser. and willing to hold my hand in public.

wait... i'm desperate, yet i'm placing restrictions??

Charlie, that is true too, but if peopel were too lazy, I just happen to have a bunch, so... yeah. :)

xpost just because you haven't been in the game doesn't mean you shouldn't have standards, RR.

i've actually already met my perfect guy, but circumstances dictate that we will not be together any time in the forseeable future - something that i'm finally accepting - so now i think it might be time to put myself back out there. but my overseas love is so amazingly awesome, no one else really compares

wow.
i'm in almost the exact same situation.

oh - and replace "guy" with "girl".

haha!! join the ilx club - we have an off-thread support group going (for realz) :)

i like drawing graffiti pictures on facebook, does that count as art?

good enough. i will introduce you to all the art *i* like and therefore customise you to my specifications. but can you cook? and do you hate the smashing pumpkins?

it is the human condition

i thought being barfed on by that woman was the human condition

Wait, RR, does this person have to be a Smashing Pumpkins Hater or Non-Hater? I'm confused. And do the Smashing Pumpkins even exist any more?

Don't know about cook, but ken eats precisely 1 (one) kebab a year and doesn't look like he enjoys it.

The wife and I would totally move to New Zealand if we were allowed to/had a way to actually make a living there.

Beth, I sense that you want to be an additional grandmother/auntie to all the spawn of ilx you can conjure up.

xpost to beth - they have to be a non-hater: i.e. they don't have to LOVE them, but they have to be okay with them. i could not date someone who hated them with a passion.

[they just released a new album, and even when they broke up they still *existed in my heart* ;)]

shakey, i will swap countries with you

hey can i swap countries with someone? my country's pretty great, but i could go for a change of pace. as long as you're not somewhere too sucky like... i don't know, georgia (the country). I bet it sucks there.

SAME DIFF JAGZ

Seriously, one thing I've noticed about as lot of my single friends is that they carry around this idea of their "type," as in, oh, I love facial hair, he can't be overweight, or he has to be a professional, or has to be taller than me...
So maybe you should give a Smashing Pumpkins hater a chance, RR!

"a lot"

nope, sorry beth, but i just couldn't. i don't have much of a type, but the pumpkins thing... well... he doesn't have to be a fan, but HATER is just more than i can tolerate. i'll be flexible on almost anything else.

KEN C WHERE ARE YOU DO YOU LOVE PUMPKINS

so am i the only one that is sometimes mesmerized by the match.com video ad boyz on myspace?

the one with the hot guy in scrubs using a stethoscope or whatever?

lol i think i'm alone on this one.

Oh, I'm sure you're not.

=P at the end he lets the stethoscope dangle from his neck and just kinda looks at you

will M, where are you? i'd consider a swap if you are anywhere near oakland, CA

secret of the sea #2: what beth sez, yes -- "my type" is something YOUR HEAD tells you to fool your body into not bothering (oddly enough this is something my actual-real-soulmate-but-our-time-is-not-yet taught me -- life at sea is v.complicated yo) (yo ho in fact)

so yeah don't be afraid to kiss a bit on foax which aren't type now and then, cz sometimes the world is not the shape you think it is

also: human condition

Seriously, one thing I've noticed about as lot of my single friends is that they carry around this idea of their "type,"

What?!?!? No waaaaaaiiiiiyyyyyy!!! Never!

God, why does my "type" have to be so rubbish? Even I admit that they are rubbish, but why do I carry on being attracted to them?

Blinkin' heck, I told my mum last week that I'd been to dinner with Mitya and she asked about him, (like she does about EVERY man I even mention in passing) and I could just hear the hope in her voice when she hinted "you know, I could deal with a Russian son in law..." coz he sounded like a nice professional, rather than have to put up with one more long-haired wastrel druggie trustafarian who thinks he's an artist.

ok, i give in: i will consider pumpkin-haters. maybe i would have rampant sexy-time with a hater, but not long-term relationship.

LOL @ long-haired wastrel druggie trustafarian who thinks he's an artist ;)

Can't see ken as a Pumpkin-lover, to be frank

aah wastrels

xpost ah well :/

I'm in MTL, Canada... not exactly near Oakland.

i cook like all the time!

and I am not a hater of smashing pumpkins (but don't know if i know enough to be a smashing pumpkins LOVER). i just opened one of their songs on youtube and i will happily make out with that in the background!

do you like computer games? and dancing? and computer games that are based upon dancing?

long-haired wastrel druggie trustafarian who thinks he's an artist

This was my former partner, to a T. My mum was actually nice about him, though, she waited until after we'd broken up to tell me that she'd thought his art was rubbish all along.

I can already hear my mum crying when I start gushing to her about ... wait, Dean doesn't have an acronym yet! How can I have a crush without an acronym? I guess LHWDTWTHAA is a bit clumbsy... besides, he's not an artist, he's a guitarist. Same difference.

i don't like computer games much. esp any that involve actual hand/eye coordination. and i can't dance (except alone, naked, in my room, when i'm getting dressed in the morning).

i think our romance may be over before it's even begun :(

NB you don't have to LOVE pumpkins, you just have to not hate them

i will happily make out with that in the background!

*crosses ken off wastrel list*

I don't have types except no Republicans (social conservatives). You have to draw the line somewhere.

Man, where is a dating site that is all "find me a trusta wastrel to live in my house and let me support while he hangs out and smokes loads of weed and works on his amazing artistic project but he occasionally lets me have sex with him as a precondition for getting his weekly allowance..." I keep saying I want this rent-a-DDB arrangement, but can never find a willing one.

our poor still-birth romance :(

maybe the computer games thing is not essential if you don't mind WATCHING someone play computer games every so often and giving half-hearted praises of someone's computer gaming abilities to nurse his fragile ego?

You scratch my back etc

No no, RR! Ken's love of video game dancing is acceptable! Fer chrissakes girl, HE JUST OPENED A SMASHING PUMPKINS VIDEO!!!
WEDDING, NOW!!!!

xpost why don't you just go to some warehouse apartment somewhere and randomly have sex with some stoned out dude? they are all there WAITING! i mean, they were going to go on internet dating sites... but just that then they got high.

insert xxx's

yeah ken, i'm down with that. as long as computer games don't take precedence over sexy-time

xpost to beth - ken c gets 1,000,000 points for actively searching out the pumpkins ;)

ken, we can dance in private - just not in public

naked yes?

OBVIOUSLY

let's start our wedding list

They will never have sex with *me* is the problem. :-(

The problem is, if they are *trusta* wastrels, then they don't need to live in my flat, as they are too comfy in their mothers' mansions. Goddammit.

x-post, OK, this has all been surpassed by the rapid fire wedding here.

xpost ken
ok

everyone on ile is invited!!

This time last year, Ken was offering to be *my* wife, dammit! ;-)

they'll have sex with you kate.

or maybe they would have sex with you, but then they got high

you need to sober them up for a couple of hours for the sex, then get them stoned again

too much weed=no sexy-time in my experience (xpost to masonic)

wait... YOUR WIFE??

KEN R U MAN OR WOMAN??

The warehouse hook-up method probably offers the same odds for enduring marriage as "met-in-college," "arranged-by-grandma" or "found-on-internet."

Ken is probably already married to a big scary lady.

too much weed=no sexy-time in my experience (xpost to masonic)

I know. Trust me, I know!

(Ken C is a mang, I just want a wife, you know? I can't be bothered with a husband)

((I suppose I better not *actually* do this warehouse/drugs method, or I will end up with Anton BJM in my flat. Oh, the hilarious stories I have heard of his ill-fated pickup attempts recently.))

hey can i swap countries with someone? my country's pretty great, but i could go for a change of pace. as long as you're not somewhere too sucky like... i don't know, georgia (the country). I bet it sucks there.

will, I'll trade with you. You'd love Mississippi, it's, uh...it's...the air is very clean and the cost of living is low.

I R A MANG ruby - the wife thing was a kind of obscure art project that we were doing in which we try to expose to follies of a woman always being the wife and man always being the husband.

It was a genius art project, I tell ya. Would have won the Turner Prize, that's why I kept buying him the kebabs and giving him pocket money to go down the Sega arcade and play Dance Dance Revolution. Or so he said!

masonic, i will share him with you.

i admit it: i actually bought fried chickens instead of kebabs

YOU LIED TO ME, KEN!!!

RR, you can have the dirty lying bastard. ;-)

i wouldn't actually mind serious advice on this thread, given that i just graduated college and have no idea how to meet people in the "real world." it's easier when everywhere you go there are hundreds of guys your age so you don't have to make that active an effort, you know?

Yup. What's especially tough is that if you're interested in someone in college, you just sort of start hanging out with them. You talk to them on the quad after class, you go to the cafeteria together, etc., and eventually one thing sort of just leads to another and you're a couple.

Whereas in the real world, it's all sort of random how you end up meeting someone, and then once you do, there's this whole rigmarole of phone calls and "dates" that has to take place, because otherwise you might never even see the person again.

The first time I was hit on after college, I was completely oblivious to it, since I didn't know how the game was played yet.

16 views, will M, no bids :( my game question is truly weeding out the undesirables

too much weed=no sexy-time in my experience

This may be true but just the right amount can equal mind blowingly awesome sexytime.

hmmmm... i will keep that handy tip for future reference...

Not for me, it wouldn't. Any amount at all would equal screaming paranoids and no sexytime ever again. :-(

Oh, I'm depressed when it's back to reality and realise that even the daydream boys aren't interested in me, they're interested in hott 23 year olds. I should go jump off a bridge or something.

i wouldn't actually mind serious advice on this thread, given that i just graduated college and have no idea how to meet people in the "real world." it's easier when everywhere you go there are hundreds of guys your age so you don't have to make that active an effort, you know?

I really think that online dating is the way to go. After college, you get into habits, you see the same people, you frequent the same places, and if you do not have a standing crush at anyone who also frequents these places, you have to break the habit.

I did the online dating thing on and off over the course of a few years. I ended up dating one man I met for about 8 months or so.

It was actually kinda funny. I'm glad I had that experience. And though I did not end up with someone from these electronic escapades, I'm glad I put myself out there and did it. It's rather entertaining. I have some great stories because of these dates.

My uncle just got married this weekend to a woman he met on match.com
He is a professor, she is a professional cellist. It's not all creepy fuckin people out there . . . just mostly. :)

my (divorced) mom's adventures in online dating sounded very, erm, unsatisfying. But then, as usual, she had a lot of pretty weird prerequisites.

really, online dating's legit? it just feels weird forking over $_$ to click on HOT ROMANCE NOW.

It's significantly more successful in boomer and slightly-under-boomer demographics. As you get younger, it gets exponentially less effective.

I should point out that my mom's in her early 60s and single and I cannot imagine a rougher dating scene.

I mean you wanna talk about limited options, by comparison yr average 24 yo girls has a vast buffet of choices.

WAHOOOOOOOOOO THANKS WILL M!!!!
so i just became facebook friends with a very cool-sounding dude whose profile i randomly clicked on IILWY. he sent me a message (in response to a retarded message i sent him) and he's VERY FUNNY.

but OF COURSE he lives in california. that's where i find all the cool guys.

I NEED TO LEAVE NZ CUZ IT IS FULL OF SHEEP FUXXORS

(sorry ken c, but i must keep my options open)

How does one join teh iilwy? None of the haxxoed promotion codes I found worked.

you need to email will M. his email address is a little further upthread.

xqVEHTRwb9i0zFOB @ spambox . us

i mean, you need to email will cuz he has the hookups to invite you.

exactomundo. I've invited Daric Haircare, Rubyred, and just now Surmounter (and/or possibly theoretically his friend). I've onyl got a couple more, but they refresh daily, AND people who've been given invites will start refreshing their OWN invites soon, so even if you don't get one today, I can probably still hook y'all up. Eventually. :)

=) ilx pimp

will M i <3 u

sur are you on facebook?

and will, i have one bid on my game, and the dude got the book right!!

So many OTM things in this thread. I would like to give a shout-out to these two in particular:

i wouldn't actually mind serious advice on this thread, given that i just graduated college and have no idea how to meet people in the "real world." it's easier when everywhere you go there are hundreds of guys girls your age so you don't have to make that active an effort, you know?

and

but the other problem i'm having with meeting guys girls: i've actually already met my perfect guy girls, but circumstances dictate that we will not be together any time in the forseeable future - something that i'm finally accepting - so now i think it might be time to put myself back out there. but my overseas other side of the country love is so amazingly awesome, no one else really compares :(

But also there's the part about not seething with desperation. After six months in Chicago with nary a bite, I finally threw up my hands, conceding that I had other, more important things to focus on than meeting a ladyfriend. And then they come crawling out of the woodwork. WTF, I say.

women are attracted to power. Displays of desperation = you are weak and not worthy of attention.

(not that men are any better - we're just drawn to a combination of physical attractiveness and availability)

also did I mention WOMEN BE SHOPPING

So you should hang around some shoe stores. Or Victoria's Secret.

also: wear a trenchcoat and lurk menacingly

Yeah, I spend a lot of time window shopping for pumps and flats. Works like a charm.

Rubyred I am taking responsibility if you end up happily ever after. "Yeah, so I was on this internet, and this girl I barely internet-knew was looking for that special someone, so I did my magic, and two hours later they were dancing naked to Smashing Pumpkins in Cali."

I guess I could give advice, since this is an advice thread.

I can't stress the avoidance of desperation enough. There are few things that turn me off more than someone who is way into me right off the bat with very little reason for being so. It indicates to me that she's all about finding A Guy and I fit the bill simply because I happen to be A Guy.

Also, it seems like it's almost becoming more prudent these days for women to be the approachers rather than sitting back and waiting to be approached. And I think that might be (based solely on my own observations) that guys are becoming kind of more forthrightly creepy. Like, I know that a lot of girls kind of just assume that the type of guy who would approach you unsolicitedly is the type of guy you don't want approaching you. I know that this growing fratty douche contingent has made me think twice about approaching girls that I might fancy, for fear of looking like One Of Those Guys. Of course, some of this might (admittedly) just be my own shit.

I'll also say that I generally have zero inclination to ever attempt chatting up anyone in the service industry. It's so difficult to tell how much friendliness is artificial and a direct result of their line of work. And I'm sure Those Guys misconstrue signals all the time and react, perhaps, inappropriately. So that's another arena where it pays to be the initiator.

Basically, if you're interested, INITIATE.

not to complicate things, but being overly not-desperate will come off as a pretty transparent attempt at not looking desperate :)

re: the those guys thing, I think it's pretty common in the 20-30 age bracket these days, I've heard a lot of guys and girls alike complain about it. I think it can be overcome by not trying to be cool or witty or clever or sarcastic, and just being kind of genuine and relaxed and confident but not overconfident about it. Like, if you like someone be all, "Hey, I would really like to grab a drink sometime. How about it?"

I say 20-30 because I haven't heard 10-20s or 30+ people complain about it, but that probably says more about the demographic I hang out with and less the complex psychosocial demographics of the western world.

*should read "0-20s"

Okay, I just gave away my last invite of the day, but if anyone wants one still please feel free to hit me up with an e-mail at gmail. My address at that site is "magacid"-- read THAT, e-mail spiderer things!

Yeah, I made this argument a while back that, while it's certainly a good thing that the '50s-style patriarchal misogyny is fading, there was a level of chivalry built into that mindset that is seriously missing from this whole leery, creepy brand of misogyny that's gaining a toehold nowadays. A more pure form of misogyny, if you will. I'd be terrified of attempting to date anyone if I were a single, straight woman.

will m gives some good advice

If only I knew how to follow my own advice! At least I know what I'm supposed to do...

haha nice delayed response!

but will ur a young straight guy can't ya just go have a drink somewhere and look smart?

It's kind of hard to explain the difference between "those guys" and guys who can express interest in non-creepy ways because it has to do with body language, presence or absence of leers, and decent timing (i.e. not making a move the second you recognize a female)...but if you're worried about it, then you probably already know how to be respectful and not creepy.

Yeah, I was not around on the weekend (as usual I kind of disconnect myself from everything but e-mail on Saturday and Sunday) so the delay was there.

I don't know if that's how it works Surmounter, I am pretty much too nervous to go have a drink somewhere on my own and look smart. I've done it about twice, and both times were because there was a specific beer I wanted to try. So I sat down, drank it, doubt anyone even really noticed me, and shuffled out.

The problem with nervousness about being one of "those guys" is that the fear can translate to a lack of confidence, which never translates to anything other than "creepy," really.

i don't know. i mean, i'm not your typical "ooh let's go out and talk to the bar" person, but lately i've been forcing myself to do little things like that.

sometimes i guess a lack of confidence may come off as creepy, but i think this is an idea that needs revisiting. there is a lot of pressure, esp. in New York i find, to be confident or brazen.

confidence is a good thing but i think it comes in many forms, maybe even nervous ones? i don't know, just thinking.

to me it's a challenge, you know, to go to the bar and make the conversational move. i wanna like prove it to myself or something.

I can see it being easier to make conversation with someone if they're there alone, but every time I've been to a bar there's been nobody by themselves that seemed worth speaking to-- I suppose I wasn't looking super-hard, but still.

By definition of worth here is useless though, because the more interesting someone is, the more intimidating it is to speak to them, so as the value of conversation goes up, so does the risk, and talking to a person is never 'worth' it.

yes but this is clearly a fatalistic approach. i mean, the thing about conversation is that if you're interesting, and the other person is interesting, then the conversation should be WORTH it, even given the risk/nervous factor. i mean, i find the truly interesting ppl are going to bear it out with you, get to the meat of the interaction w/as little attention to superficial nervousness as possible.

but ur right it is tough to find the interesting ppl all by themselves.

Do you meet enough uncynical people who will get in a conversation with a stranger in a public-ish place? I mean... I would assume that this person wanted to tell me about Jesus or something :/

Hey, I get into conversations with strangers in public places, and I'm not cynical! Most people who start random conversations are interesting for at least five minutes and not insane, and it's easy to exit those conversations because you're strangers in a public place. (But I am also oddly attracted to people who want to tell me about Jesus, which is bad because it could never work between us.)

haha ok, this is the thing. i know ppl who will go to a bar, and let's say while they're ordering their drink, will peer over to the person next to them and totally just STRIKE up a conversation. u know, something like "god when was the last time u heard this song?", something fluffy.

i started seeing this more and more and it really did just seem like a friendly/neighborly thing to do. u know just talk to people. i think people go to bars for amusement a lot of the time, not just to be weird. so talk is often welcome.

i guess this doesn't happen that much anymore? cuz it does seem like ppl are surprised when approached this way, but in my experience, pleasantly so.

Jesus should be avoided in small talk, IMO, but a lot of the people around me apparently do not agree. A bad way to open a conversation is "Have you accepted Jesus as your personal lord & savior?" TO which I reply, "I'd prefer not to discuss that."

Man if I ever go to NYC I am so going to a bar with you. I gotta see this in action.

Me?

err that was some xpostage-- although the not-discussing of Jesus is always grebt

I wondered.

Are you in NYC? Because if you are we should totally go to a bar anyway (if I ever go to NYC).

I am in Las Cruces, NM, a bit of a long commute.

You know, entirely based on the fact that we're on the same messageboard even if we've never really directly tangled with our words.

Uhm.

SEE WHY I NEVER TALK TO PEOPLE AT BARS I CANT EVEN DO IT ON THE INTERNETS

"Will, how do you fail at human interaction in 2007? Online?"

Big xpost!

Is it [the talking to people in bars] a NY-vs-elsewhere thing? Because that's totally fine and friendly in my college town, where it's also rude not to say hi to people on the street, but maybe in big cities people are more wary. (xpost)

And yeah Abbott, I totally agree...the only times I've ended up talking about Jesus in a bar were with someone I already knew. (And failed horribly at initiating anything with several times. Sigh. He's off to theology grad school now.)

I was reading somewhere that the place to meet guys is Home Depot on Friday nights. Not that I'm looking or anything, and I would never have found Mr. Jaq there. But hey, now the hardware store is the new supermarket. (Although really, has anyone ever picked someone up/been picked up at the grocery?)

Oh man, all that happens anywhere I've ever been (bar, shop, restaurant, school, bus sop, etc.) is big conversation about whatevs. EVEN when I don't speak the same language. They say something in Spanish, I say something in English, nothing really happens but I think the main point is that it's talking.

xp

haha. more ppl deal with social anxiety than u would think. the thing is what other ppl notice. a lot of the time ppl have NO CLUE what's going on in ur head, meanwhile u think u have just committed the 8th deadly sin of human interaction.

hmm Maria... i really think it depends on the person. some people are just SO freaked out by conversation with strangers, other ppl expect it. i mean even here, there it is a gradient situation.

hehe here = NY

i'm trying to type like an intelligent human...

I mainly don't like convos with 60-yr-old CREPES or obvious douches, but even then I have been known to misjudge the latter.

but will ur a young straight guy can't ya just go have a drink somewhere and look smart?

As a young-ish straight female I used to go to bars alone a lot (though mainly only when there was live music, otherwise it would have felt too weird and creepy even for me, but I did try making the one not actively unfriendly bar in town my "local" for a bit) and, uh, never worked for me. Nobody else there ever seemed to be alone, standing at the bar is a scrum trying to get served and nobody wants to take their eye off the barman to turn round and chat, and I don't understand the boundaries of normal social interaction but I'm fairly sure barging up to a group of friends and interrupting their conversation to go "uh, like, yeah, hi, you guys don't know me" is not likely to be popular.

Then again, I'm the ugliest person you've never met, which is probably the main determining factor. After all we are just a bunch of pack animals like any other, squabbling over our pecking order, no point in social interaction unless you think it'll raise/cement yr position in the hierarchy... and a guy may, MAY be able to swing it with some other signifiers of status like wealth or being in that month's cool band or whatever, but if you're female then the only status you can possibly have is looks, the only reason anyone might acknowledge your existence is if they either want to fuck you or think onlookers will want to and seeing you talking to them instead will make them ALPHA MALE du soir.

At least, that's how it feels when you're in the same bar week in week out alone in the corner for so many months/years that you see other people manage to make it with the same groups of people you see every week and you've got nothing to do but think "what do they have that I don't?". Like, oh, not being bitter enough ever to type the previous paragraph, maybe.

conversation from Superbad about meeting women in bars to thread, please

Meet? Men?

i don't have too much of a problem talking to people or strangers or men at bars or wherever really. and yet somewhere along the line in the past couple of years i feel like i accidently managed to turn off my flirting aparatus. or maybe i am flirting and unaware of it. i don't know. it's like how i don't talk to babies in a baby voice but probably do sometimes anyway without knowing, i mean, b/c you know sometimes it's what you need to do.
and then the babies cry.
haha no, that is a joke. forget that analogy.

was talking to some friends the other day re: me and guys and they said i come off as smart and funny and blahblah but also 'distant' and 'aloof' + intimidating. huh. yet i think i come off as overly analytical and rambly + goofy!* i wondered if i should be more touchy-feely b/c i mean, i admire appropriate levels of touchy-feely in other people, depending on the people sure, and they said 'well, no, you don't want to do what isn't you' and i said 'yeah, exactly; i touch people with my MIND'
lol
i am not really worried abt all this tho these days**
anyway, i'm working on this whole 'being distanced' thing b/c i know that one's true for suurre

*oh there is some kinda self-esteem issue going on there, yeahp
** it comes and goes. money/work/brain seems more important***
*** okay maybe being single in yr early 30s is a bitch like that

xposts

anyway, meeting people is easy (there are many many people, in the world, evarywhere), actually liking people is less easy (so many people not on yr level man), making out with people when drunk/wheeoo used to be kinda easy but is no longer what's interesting to me (wtf :/ i know), 'dating' is ugh, i don't know, i still think we put up our own barriers to (the right) relationships and have to figure that shit out before diving into the meeting-people fray wherever it might be.

After all we are just a bunch of pack animals like any other, squabbling over our pecking order, no point in social interaction unless you think it'll raise/cement yr position in the hierarchy... and a guy may, MAY be able to swing it with some other signifiers of status like wealth or being in that month's cool band or whatever, but if you're female then the only status you can possibly have is looks, the only reason anyone might acknowledge your existence is if they either want to fuck you or think onlookers will want to and seeing you talking to them instead will make them ALPHA MALE du soir.

^^^^^ OTM best post ever. I like drinking and I like live music and bars are good for that, but as mating+dating scene = uggghh worst ever

I won't disagree that it's the worst ever BUT I wish there was just a nice way to talk to strangers no strings attached about shit, and I really would rather they aren't in to the same shit as me because I am tried of always ending up talking about the same familiar things (therefore I am certainly not interested in joining a Street Fighter II' club).

That is NOT the best post ever, it is bitter and cynical and wilfully ignorant of plenty of good things/people/conversations. I am not unsympathetic but that is not really the world. Or at least it is a PART of the world that you're free to reject and look away from. So please do so.

it's not THE WORLD, its THE WORLD OF BARS - big difference

Going to the wrong bars, then. Or on the wrong days/nights. Not in most American smaller towns, probably, but in the city/ies and probably in more non-US places where attitudes are different there're a fair number of "old man" local places where you can come and go as you please and become a regular and be chatted up by the bartender once you show that you have manners etc etc.

I mean let's not have this whole thing again, okay? I know how I get sucked into pointless fucking arguments. I'm just sayin'.

(for the rec, I was agreeing that the 'dating/mating scene' is 'the worst ever but it is in its essence filled with people who would say 'dating/mating scene' so how could it NOT be the worst ever?)

I used to love this one place in Ottawa, that was never really full, but very much 'downtown'-- after I went twice, the guy already knew my drink and he was really friendly and that (ironically, I was having that drink because I'd never had it before and decided to have a couple on the first night, and while I was in the loo he told the lady I was with that she should 'hang on to a guy who has only one drink, he won't mess around' or something to that effect, SO I FELT TOO WEIRD EVER SWITCHING DRINKS... but anyway...). I still never talked to the patrons, really. Only my mates, maybe the bartender a little bit...

yeah, that never happens at sockstar!

unless status = basket of fries

Oh boy, I'd kind of rather have the fries. CRADLE TO CRAVE.

The problem with Los Angeles bars is that they are in Los Angeles.

The problem with X Ys is ALWAYS that they are in X.

will don't even hit submit response that shit literally makes no sense no stop ple

OK, I'll admit that that was a little pithy. The problem with bars in Los Angeles is that they are filled with hipsters Hollywood types and rich girls, all of whom look alike and none of whom look very interesting to talk to.

no that makes sense, i can always pinpoint "the problem with NYC bars" but in reality i think it's another problem.

i can see all the stuff about dating/mating scene being awful, but i really like lauren's points because i have seen people who honestly look at going out to bars (single or not) as something fun and amusing like you say, will. just a place where you can allevaite boredom by casually chatting it up with a few people. whether or not this leads to something romantic, i know that it is possible to not thing of the dating world so dramatically.

it gets hard when self-esteem enters the picture because social situations of the like tend to make people feel as though there is a test of self-esteem going on, when most often, everyone would just rather no one felt that way - let the cocky guy be cocky, the timid guy be timid, the awkward girl be that and the ugly kids be fuckin ugly, as long as they're entertaining each other when there's just shit else 2 do.

xp 2 will w/ the first line

anyway, meeting people is easy (there are many many people, in the world, evarywhere), actually liking people is less easy

yes! this has been my problem. altho my 'jokey' posts on here may have led to the impression of me being desperate (HA!), it's not so much that as a lack of meeting interesting ppl IRL (i meet tons of way cool ppl on the net).

will M: i did get a bidder on my game, and he guessed the right book! he is also a dan fante fan, which is very hot.

but things with my international love have gotten a bit serious in the last few days (big, serious talks) so now i'm back to not really being interested in dating anyone else.

fuck this dating shit, i just need someone to sponsor me a job in the states.

i just wait.

I still want that basket of fries.