Lion, Scarecrow, Tin-Man: A very ILX Summer with the ILX Gays.

thank you for leaving implicit the "dorothy"

follow the yellow brick road!!

Yes, but to where?

kansas -- my friend just bought a house in like lacrosse kansas? $23,000.

perhaps it is a bit odd that Kansas is the home of the Westboro Baptist CHurch and Fred Phelps?

Identify the ILX Gays in the poster above.

the lion is def elmo.

not that elmo is a coward.

tin man = casuistry

I've been called the Tin Man far too many times to count.

I'll take Toto or nothing.

surmounter is obviously Judy.

This is all begging for photoshop

Morbius will be upset that you guys think he's the Wicked Witch of the West.

actually Surmounter may be Glinda.

i played the Lion in seventh grade. my theater debut.

If we can be anyone I'm probably mostly Auntie Em. Table, you could be the witch, no offense. I feel a parallel somehow though.

Gays on ILX I No Longer Respect:
--Tiernan

seriously, youse a mean-ass irshman

Um, no offense doesn't work anymore then....

And seriously, okay the way you spelt my name wrong is the way Irish people do sometimes because of the more common surname, but what was your reason? ; )

omg i made a glinda reference today cuz i had on all this white shimmery powder!!

Only you would come out with that! :D

the no offense would have worked if you hadn't included that 'parallels' bit.

also, i didn't know how to spell your name, and i thought that was the correct spelling. sorry.

(and also sorry about that no respect thing-- i still respect you. i just don't like being called names-- it's one of those things that has always pissed me off, no matter what age i am)

I wasn't calling you names, the witch is just the one who's having the most fun! The name thing I just thought was weird that you would spell it that way, it's one of those days, if I had been there to have a tone of voice, I guarantee you wouldn't have gotten offended, sentiment got lost in translation.

Sorry though....

it's all gravy, baby. i'm just in a weird mood myself.

i'll be the guy behind the curtain

That was how the other Tiernan I knew spelt her name. Though, she was a she.

Phil: Abe B. with a longish last name.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-P2NyajUnx0

Though, she was a she.

I don't like this new thread.

For the record Tiarnán

I'm a very good man, just a very bad doctor.
(the Scarecrow had the best song, tho Bert Lahr is the best thing about Oz)

I wanted to call the next thread the ILX Gays' Summer Share. Next year.

Tiarnán

you should hear how i pronounce it

tyair-nin?

well the "air" part has that special irish something tho

hey joe, dave and i have been playing tennis! he likes my net game

i bet he does ;)

how crazy is his beard btw

crazy!!

Wait, how do you pronounce your name, T.? Tiernan the woman I used to work with was just "TIER-nin", but Tiarnán with crazy Irish spelling rules could easily be pronounced "Roger".

I have debating learning Old Irish for academic purposes, but I fear it will drive me insane.

Yeah, that's how you saw Tiernan, which is generally a surname in Ireland, it's pretty common, but my name is more Tier NAWN, sorta.

Cúpla focal

Frank McNally

The Last Straw:

I was chatting with a senior foreign diplomat on his lawn the other night, the way you do. As usual, discretion prevents me saying who it was. Oh all right, you dragged it out of me: it was the British Ambassador. And, inter alia, he told me he'd been taking Irish classes recently, in Donegal.

I was pleased to hear it, as any Irish person would be. We've suffered long enough with the language, I thought; it's time the English shared the pain. But as he described just how challenging Irish was for a beginner, my feeling deepened into pride.

The ambassador is something of a linguist, in fact. So, anxious for comparisons on the language-difficulty scale, I mentioned German, with its notorious mutations and, as Mark Twain complained, "more exceptions to the rule than instances of it".

The ambassador shook his head. Irish was much more difficult than German, he said. "In German, the end of the word changes. In Irish, the start of the word may change as well. And the middle." Delighted, I prompted him on the issue of Irish letters exercising their constitutional right to remain silent while clearly up to no good. He nodded sadly: "Who'd have thought 'mh' could be 'w'?" Still, he had now mastered a vocabulary of "about 70 words". He was hoping to push on from there.

I didn't want to discourage him altogether, but you wouldn't know how secure that beach-head is, either. As an occasional correspondent of this column, Bill Casey, is wont to point out, the same Irish word can have a multiplicity of meanings, including fiercely opposed meanings, incapable of reconciliation even by a diplomat.

You'll recall that Bill is Professor of Aqueous Geochemistry at the University of California and, so far as I know, has never even been to Ireland. He just studies Irish as a hobby - it gets his mind off water, I imagine - and the properties of words, when held under a microscope, fascinate him. A while ago, he was marvelling at how the same Irish expression means "French person" and "rat" (a coincidence that may have influenced US foreign policy). The latest object of his inquiries is "leannán", a noun meaning either "lover" or "chronic affliction", depending on context.

That's only the tip of the iceberg. Writing in this paper half a century ago, Myles na Gopaleen discussed an academic's claim that while the average English speaker got by with a 400-word vocabulary, "the Irish-speaking peasant uses 4,000". Myles thought the 4,000 estimate was on the low side, when you allowed for nuance, irony, evasion, poetic licence, and whatever you were having yourself.

"There is scarcely a single word in the Irish (barring, possibly, Sasanach) that is simple and explicit," he wrote. "Apart from words with endless shades of cognate meaning, there are many with so complete a spectrum of graduated ambiguity that each of them can be made to express two directly contrary meanings, as well as a plethora of intermediate concepts that have no bearing on either."

Slipping on his etymologist's hat, he gave an example: "Cur, g. curtha and cuirthe, m - act of putting, sending, sowing, raining, discussing, burying, vomiting, hammering into the ground, throwing through the air, rejecting, shooting, the setting or clamp in a rick of turf, selling, addressing, the crown of cast-iron buttons which have been made bright by contact with cliff faces, the stench of congealing badger's suet, the luminance of glue-lice, a noise made in an empty house by an unauthorised person, a heron's boil, a leprechaun's denture, a sheep-biscuit, the act of inflating hare's offal with a bicycle pump, a leak in a spirit level, the whine of a sewage farm windmill, a corncrake's clapper, the scum on the eye of a senile ram, a dustman's dumpling, a beetle's faggot, the act of loading every rift with ore, a dumb man's curse, a blasket, a 'kur', a fiddler's occupational disease, a fairy godmother's father, a hawk's vertigo, the art of predicting past events, a wooden coat, a custard-mincer, a blue-bottle's 'farm', a gravy flask, a timber-mine, a toy craw, a porridge-mill, a fair-day donnybrook with nothing barred, a stoat's stomach-pump, [ and so on]."

It's possible Myles was embroidering a little here. I'd be almost certain that, even 50 years ago, there was no word in Irish for "the act of inflating hare's offal with a bicycle pump". He may also have been exaggerating when he added that, "in Donegal", there were native speakers with such vast vocabularies, it was a matter of pride to them "never to use the same word twice." But you couldn't be sure with Donegal, then or now. I wished the ambassador well with his studies.

© 2005 The Irish Times

That guy is brilliant.

I need to read some Myles na Gopaleen finally. I've been meaning to for a decade.

http://landofspices.blogspot.com/2007/05/old-irish-verbal-system.html for a long and funny blog post about the horrors of Old Irish.

I sort of wish we could have done a Fire Island theme for the summer thread. Judy used to hang out there all the time.

My one weekend on Fire Island was more than enough.

same here (more like 30 hours)

I read an interview with a Stonewall riot veteran the other day who said, "We didn't give a shit about Judy Garland."

I don't think I'm gonna be able to do the Toronto filmfest in Sept, Cas. :p

I need to read some Myles na Gopaleen finally. I've been meaning to for a decade.

Yes and yes again. Absolutely stellar stuff.

To quote myself quoting Myles from the Flann O'Brien thread:

Following a (brilliant) rant about Disney's Fantasia:

The Editor: Have you seen this picture?
Myself: No.
The Editor: Why?
Myself: Because the free list is suspended.
The Editor: But why condemn something you have not seen?
Myself: Why suspend the free list?
The Editor: Then is all this an exhibition of spite because you are not admitted free?
Myself: Not necessarily. It is something taut, elegant, alert.

Stonewall riot veteran
this

Yeah Flann O'Brien is a legend

SO WHAT SORT OF CAMPY BULLSHIT IS OKAY WITH YOU OLD QUEENS

embrace the Wizard of Oz, hate on Fire Island.

embrace shitty pop music, deny the genius of Frankie Knuckles.

i mean really, this must jsut be a generational/age thing.

or a matter of bad taste.

when she was alive, Judy Garland was a huge pop star to straight people too. It's true.

bad taste on my part?

"We didn't give a shit about Judy Garland."

she died the week before the riot happened, yeah?

A connection is frequently drawn between the timing of gay icon Judy Garland's death and funeral, also in June 1969, and the Riots.[12][13][14] Time noted "The uprising was inspirited by a potent cocktail of pent-up rage (raids of gay bars were brutal and routine), overwrought emotions (hours earlier, thousands had wept at the funeral of Judy Garland) and drugs."[15] Coincidental or not, the proximity of Garland's death to Stonewall has become a part of LGBT history and lore.[16]

i've been to fire island and it's terrible, but i'd rather embrace the camp image of the place where disco was king and everyone was fucking everyone all the time than a truly awful hollywood camp image that has been worked to death.

favorite gay community (only gay community?) i've visited: rehoboth beach

http://travel.latimes.com/articles/la-trw-nudebeach5-2008jul05

:(

Are boring gays politically progressive?

It deserves its own thread.

boring people are boring people. i've come to terms with my own boringness.

should i get drunk at:

a) home (wine)
b) dub night thingy (straight)
c) frou frou gay bar
d) levi/leather gay bar

????????

add "and listening to kate bush" to option a)

i would start a, then c for stupidity's sake, then see what happens

i think you're right!

i would like to meet someone my age for once.

just don't get really upset if they don't know who kate bush is!

i'll try to hold back the tears.

you tin man.

i would like to take:

Mastering Madonna!
Double Entendre 101
Rave History and Appreciation

so i could successfully enjoy option c) more often

x-post i need less heart and more brains

TWoO is a good (if obviously overplayed) movie! I got to show it to a friend once who, in his early 30s, had never seen it before. We were tired of explaining references to him.

The poet Frank O'Hara died in a car accident on Fire Island, which is especially astonishing because what the hell is a car doing on Fire Island? I guess it was some sort of beach buggy and he really died because he had massive liver problems, but still.

He was actually run over.

I need a class in Leather Bar Hysteria, and next semester I need to take Beating Heteronormative Mileage: Mastering the Art of Driving to the Nearest Gay Bar from Suburbia.

i like frank o'hara. don't know much about him though.

alfred, does that mean staying in between the lines on the way home

YOU GUYS I JOINED A GAY KICKBALL TEAM IS THIS GOOD FOR ME OR BAD

ANDREW PLAYS KICKBALL RIGHT?

AM I TOO OLD? (33)

WILL I PRETTY WILL I BE RICH?

Yes, he was hit, but he still died of a ruptured liver, and my understanding is that there has been a bit of the controversy, since it was the sort of that that most people would have survived.

Jesse, it is good.

if he was drunk at the time his chances for survival would have been higher! i know that from an e! true hollywood story about melanie griffith.

I should have something to say about Frank O'Hara, as I wrote a term paper on him, but I was on a lot of drugs around then and all my weeks of research were displaced with

i think frank would have approved.

There's a new selected poems out.

alfred, does that mean staying in between the lines on the way home

Naw -- it means finding someone to drive you to the goddamn gay bar instead of fretting about how far it is.

boring people are boring people. i've come to terms with my own boringness.

Yes but should gays aspire to, um, being boring as a politically progressive act?

In other news, some gays did give a shit about Judy Garland in addition to those that did not.

We were never being boring.

There's nothing more boring than avoiding being boring as a political act.

Hooray kickball!

I'd be more into like a knitting circle or baking club. Oh, I'd love to be in a baking club.

I'd join a baking club with you!

I have not yet baked anything in my new home. But now that my stuff has arrived, I might be tempted to break it in...

There was a period where I was making sourdough bread all the time, like one batch would be finished and another would be in the oven. Great times, great times, until me starter went gross. I should start a new batch like right now.

Hi guys! Nice thread. I have a sore knee from cycling and it's only 6 days till I set off to cycle to Paris :(

Not sure I have anything gay to report right now. I'll work on it.

You've been saying that as long as I've been on ILX.

Still, good luck cycling through the Channel!

http://www.ncccusa.org/gifs/chunnel.jpg

Oh you should go to that place in Marais with the great creme brulee

I think you'd like Marais, it's kinda like this thread.

That is the anal canal of the future!

omg ew

also should i go to the hamptons? i can hitch a ride today. ive never been!

I read that L.Frank Baum wrote Oz as a parable about the 1896 prez election?!

anyone seen that docufilm about Christopher Isherwood and his mate? Good one.

The Annotated Oz is worth reading. It goes into the whole "gold standard" reading in great detail. Then again, so does the Wiki page, which is faster and easier. You decide.

Frank O'Hara....hmmm. Maybe I should revisit, but the last time I read him, I was pretty much floored by this poem:

The Day Lady Died

It is 12:20 in New York a Friday
three days after Bastille day, yes
it is 1959 and I go get a shoeshine
because I will get off the 4:19 in Easthampton
at 7:15 and then go straight to dinner
and I don't know the people who will feed me

I walk up the muggy street beginning to sun
and have a hamburger and a malted and buy
an ugly NEW WORLD WRITING to see what the poets
in Ghana are doing these days
I go on to the bank
and Miss Stillwagon (first name Linda I once heard)
doesn't even look up my balance for once in her life
and in the GOLDEN GRIFFIN I get a little Verlaine
for Patsy with drawings by Bonnard although I do
think of Hesiod, trans. Richmond Lattimore or
Brendan Behan's new play or Le Balcon or Les Nègres
of Genet, but I don't, I stick with Verlaine
after practically going to sleep with quandariness

and for Mike I just stroll into the PARK LANE
Liquor Store and ask for a bottle of Strega and
then I go back where I came from to 6th Avenue
and the tobacconist in the Ziegfeld Theatre and
casually ask for a carton of Gauloises and a carton
of Picayunes, and a NEW YORK POST with her face on it

and I am sweating a lot by now and thinking of
leaning on the john door in the 5 SPOT
while she whispered a song along the keyboard
to Mal Waldron and everyone and I stopped breathing

and i hated everything else.

i also hate Allen Ginsberg.

gay poets i love:

-- John Ashbery
-- DA Powell
-- Richard Siken
-- Cavafy

off the top of my head at the moment. i also should rescind the Ginsberg-hatred-- his early work is gorgeous, lushly real stuff.

this is the first poem that every gave me a hard-on. early Ginsberg.

Two bricklayers are setting the walls
of a cellar in a new dug out patch
of dirt behind an old house of wood
with brown gables grown over with ivy
on a shady street in Denver. It is noon
and one of them wanders off. The young
subordinate bricklayer sits idly for
a few minutes after eating a sandwich
and throwing away the paper bag. He
has on dungarees and is bare above
the waist; he has yellow hair and wears
a smudged but still bright red cap
on his head. He sits idly on top
of the wall on a ladder that is leaned
up between his spread thighs, his head
bent down, gazing uninterestedly at
the paper bag on the grass. He draws
his hand across his breast, and then
slowly rubs his knuckles across the
side of his chin, and rocks to and fro
on the wall. A small cat walks to him
along the top of the wall. He picks
it up, takes off his cap, and puts it
over the kitten's body for a moment.
Meanwhile it is darkening as if to rain
and the wind on top of the trees in the
street comes through almost harshly.

okay, venturing out into the world. bye.

is Hart Crane worth investigating?

I don't like him much, but I have not investigated throughly.

Stephen Crane is the man, though. 'Black Riders...' is brilliant.

So...

London, didn't pan out, I'm staying with my parents, regrouping, planning on painting and making some art generally.

O and I are "on a break". This is so he can go gallivanting in Gay Paris, one assumes. Well, more than assumes, but here is not the place.

My room is a tip, and every attempt at fixing it up has drawn me closer and closer to the kind of insanity that eats a man whole.

I would spend the rest of my money going to Berlin or Valencia or somewhere, but I feel like I'd rather just read, buy something cool like a camera or a violin and unclench. I don't really have friends here anymore though and I've forgotten how to make friends.

Now you all compliment how good my hair looks because I could do with cheering up.

http://i38.tinypic.com/30xcth2.jpg

It really does look good though.

Hart Crane is best read aloud.

My masters thesis was on James Merrill.

A cute guy came over to my apartment today to fix my computer.

We talked about computer shit.

*sigh*

I liked how you put it in the other thread more. It was only missing a "Merc-ay!"

*blushing*
oh shit

IKR, your hair looks great, and that post was lovely. Maybe b/c I was reading poetry right before, it read like poetry.

In my world: I went to the twin leather bars last night and was made to take my shirt off. I met a couple of guys who have boyfriends - 1 bf was out of town, the other bf was in the tangle of bodies in the back room.

Hey thanks.

This is exactly how I feel right now, but I'm not sure why.

Raymond Carver - Drinking While Driving

It's August and I have not
Read a book in six months
except something called The Retreat from Moscow
by Caulaincourt
Nevertheless, I am happy
Riding in a car with my brother
and drinking from a pint of Old Crow.
We do not have any place in mind to go,
we are just driving.
If I closed my eyes for a minute
I would be lost, yet
I could gladly lie down and sleep forever
beside this road
My brother nudges me.
Any minute now, something will happen.

I love Raymond Carver. Thanks, ILM. Hoos knows Raymond Carver, too, I think.

Our honorary lady member is a massive fan.

This is my favorite poem. It was written by Tom T. Hall who probably isn't gay but it would be really amazing if he was.

The Iowa weather was 13 below
I had come to Des Moines for a radio show
I awoke in the evening from a traveler's sleep
With notions of something to eat

The old elevator slid down past the floors
My head and my eyes said "You should have slept more."
The man at the desk said the restaurant was closed
Outside it was 14 below

The lounge was still open and so I walked in
In place of my food I had two double gins
I looked 'round the room, as a tourist would do
That's when I saw the girl in the booth

She sat there and cried in the smoky half-dark
The silent type crying that tears out your heart
Her clothes were not cut in the new modern way
And her suitcase had seen better days

Nobody asked her what caused her such pain
Nobody spoke up, yet no one complained
Without even asking, I knew why she cried
Life is just like that sometimes

The man at the desk said, "It's 15 below."
The bellhop said "Yeah man, that's
cold...that's cold."
I went back to my room and I wrote down this song
Oh it sure can get cold in Des Moines

jesus

P.S. Your hair looks rad.

Unexpected turn for this thread. Anyway, Ted Berrigan was not gay but he was one of those straight guys who acted like maybe he would do something with a dude if the moment was right. And maybe he did, I dunno. And this is by him:

Postcard

THE SENDER OF THIS
POSTCARD IS SECRETLY
(STILL) UNSURE OF YOUR WORTH
AS (EITHER) A FRIEND OR A
HUMAN BEING. YOU COCKSUCKER.

i'll throw my hat into the poetry ring. this is "disappointment" by mike topp:

6'5"
4"

That's a nom de plume, isn't it?

i don't think it is!

I dated a guy last summer who was 6'4" and around 5". It didn't really make any difference, as he was an avowed tease.

we had dinner tonight, out. the dinner was blaaaaaa and the place looked like an airport restaurant.

it's true that you may not care about my dinner at all, but for me it's all i got.

Hmm. You just reminded me that I'm hungry. And exhausted (spent all day moving). Those two feelings will have to battle it out.

I'm lonely too. :\

I found a bottle of poppers under my bed today and my female friend tried them for the first time. She was overwhelmingly compelled to have buttsex.

never tried this. i don't even know what it is really. i mean, yeah.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/67/HOpoppers.jpg/250px-HOpoppers.jpg

Poppers is the street term for various alkyl nitrites taken for recreational purposes through direct inhalation[1], particularly amyl nitrite, butyl nitrite and isobutyl nitrite. Amyl nitrite has a centuries-long history of safe use in treating angina,[1] as well as an antidote to cyanide poisoning.[4][5]

That last part I did not know.

I think we talked about poppers before - they make whatever your doing 10X more of whatever it already is.

so there are a whole bunch of different kinds?

are they pills or is it something you sniff?

how long does it last?

There are many brands. You sniff them. It lasts maybe 30 seconds; the headache, much longer.

how terrible

Yeah, but was he 6'4" erect or flaccid?

Mike Topp is, as far as I know, his real name. Though I don't think he's gay.

Also, Jesse, you moved?

I moved to the other apartment on my floor - it's smaller, but nicer, painted, has a porch (!!) and brand new windows.

Fuck: I'm the ONLY MALE on the kickball team that I joined to maybe make gay male friends.

Mike Topp is, as far as I know, his real name. Though I don't think he's gay.

Then that poem does nothing for me.

Roddy Bottum should turn it into an Imperial Teen song.

So "Boys in the Band" is coming out on DVD soon. Watch it (if you're) alone, I'm told.

play it at a birthday party.

You haven't seen it? It is something to see.

Oh man maybe I'll watch it on my birthday.

She was overwhelmingly compelled to have buttsex

You don't know how lucky and privileged you are :(

Tiarnán (is the accent round the wrong way?), you are gorgeous. Post that pic on ILE and you will have half the ILX chixors eating from the plam of your hand.

TABLE, I AM IN OAKLAND!!!!

and IKR, i has recently acquired a first edition of carver's A New Path to the Waterfall.

hi gayz. i have been waiting all day to hear back about an apartment and it is AGONY

speaking of feel-bad gay films, i'm really looking forward to before i forget (not having seen any of nolot's other movies)

Phil: Abe B. with a longish last name.

oh..... him

oh rubes, that's great! let's fap soon.

i am also feeling weirdly blue. don't really understand why> eh.

i do too but i know why: i am BROKERS

Man, I've made absolutely no progress on that prospect I teased about a month ago. I am lame.

tabes, i think i have a gmail address for you from a long time ago - is that an address you check regularly? i will be in touch within the next couple of weeks about fapping, hopefully.

i think i might do shopping therapy. i need a lamp.

oh just do the webmail thing. tho i'm pretty sure i do check that address all the time.

aaaand apartment is OURS

(i think i am living even CLOSER to you now, sur)

sweet!! congratulations :) where it at?

clinton hill, somewhat near pratt

oh!! i go there all the time. very cute

good for you.

Before I Forget is a bit meh, esp the last scene

Phil: Ha! What's the scoop? It's not as if we were terribly close, or like I've seen him since ninth grade...

well i knew him from my minimal techno party days, haha. he would always show up but i never really had anything to say to him, partly because he had terrible body odor when he sweat. i think he for awhile was sleeping with my friend, and she came up with a nickname for him (skabe). im not sure exactly what it means, but it didnt sound too flattering.

i've seen him out and about more often these days at like disco things or fashion'y things. much cleaner now, but still not much to talk about. Seems nice enough, but i barely know him.

Was hoping you knew someone i was closer with so i could get some embarassing junior high stories...

and IKR, i has recently acquired a first edition of carver's A New Path to the Waterfall.

Cool! Does this have a romantic backstory? I just reread "Nobody said anything" that last line kills me. I'm in the middle of Cathedral, a friend of mine moved flat and it was in the bottom drawer of her room so she gave it to me!

I gather from the America thread that you's having lots of American fun!

if we're talking carver, any of you read the original version of What We Talk About When We Talk About Love that was in the New Yorker last December? so much better than the published version, it kind of made me angry.

There's thread about this. I'm so opposite, I'm a big fan of Lish's hackjob. Compare The Bath with A Small Good Thing. There's this line, y'see, in The Bath that makes me go fetal, srsly.

The birthday boy told his mother what had happened. They sat together on the sofa. She held his hands in her lap. This is what she was doing when the boy pulled his hands away and lay down on his back.

I know I'm not really in the majority on this one. Rubes for one is in your camp. Your camp.

Oh and thanks for the kind words and, um, suggestion Mark! A little trivia, in Ireland we call those accent thingys "fada" pronounced fotha, literally meaning long. There you go.

we had to do that comparison in a Fiction class i took once. i dig The Bath a lot better.

Let's stay friends forever!

yes!

someone needs to make a youtube music video for ian dury's spasticus autisticus made entirely of clips and images from i, claudius. someone with spare time, i mean. it just makes so much sense.

Martin and I watched all of "I, Claudius" a few weeks ago- omg at the Caligula tranny dance sequence!

partly because he had terrible body odor when he sweat.

Well, I guess some things never change.

arrrgghhh 'a small good thing' is, IMO, so much better! can we still all be friends? tiarnan (i don't actually KNOW how to do the accent thing on a keyboard), the romantic backstory to the purchase of that book is: one of the first places jordan took me when i got here was jeff maser's warehouse (really well known book seller and friend of jordan's) - it's MAGNIFICENT... great small press collection, huge black sparrow press collection, tons of stuff... so i found this book and jordan bought it for me. he also bought me order and chaos chez hans reichel by henry miller, which is a large format, completely letterpress printed hardcover in a gorgeous slipcase (published/printed by the infamous loujon press).

ok i'll shut up about books now.

a+alt gr or just alt on a mac

You can keep talking about books, this stuff is like porn to me!

drew, dustin & i just watched that episode! -- i didn't think they could ever top the image of john hurt's face painted gold with blood dripping down his mouth but they certainly did, omg

still got a couple episodes left

sometimes my voice takes its sweet time

Macs don't have an alt. opt-e then a: á should do it with a standard keyboard layout.

Oh hey wait I take that back! It does say alt on it! When did that happen? It didn't used to. Anyway, that shows the folly of touch typing.

ok, i cant let another summer go by without some sort of fling....

I love how you actually typed that without bothering to look! Confident!

I would like to know how many people here do something "gay" every day?

Does youtube count as gay?

My behavior is pretty "straight" on most days I don't get any. For example, I watched baseball on TV til 1:37 this morning.

i guess my "gay" thing tonight is watching projrun (except i didn't even know it was starting again until yesterday and i barely watched last season to begin with)

what? i thought it was starting on Thurs.

I would like to know how many people here do something "gay" every day?

I ogle students!

I do lust for cock at least a little most days. But I get the feeling that's not what you mean?

I think about wieners every day.

Hey, w/r/t baseball: The Cubs are National League, right? And who won the All-stars game last night?

i do gay things all the time. like listen to gay music, and wear gay things around the house. and rose petal lotion.

I made out with a dude with a goatee last night. I am not sure it was a great idea. I'm not sure it wasn't. I'M JUST NOT SURE.

you sound unsure.

i do gay things all the time. like listen to gay music, and wear gay things around the house. and rose petal lotion.

and revive gay Mariah Carey threads.

Hey, w/r/t baseball: The Cubs are National League, right? And who won the All-stars game last night?

1. Yes
2. American League, for like the 12th year in a row (except for the tie in 2002)

damn you xp jaymc

Lurky McLurksalot.

I'm so fucking sick of the White Sox that I could burn down the whole South Side. It was nice to have a World Series winner in town for like a day, but now they're insufferable.

I have a phone number in my pocket. It could be from the goatee dude, or it could be from another dude. Too many dudes. I think I'll use that as the title to my first children's book. Too Many Dudes.

too smug. What about Hair Raiser?

i don't know much about the White Sox. is it really spelled Sox?

i watched that playboy show last night, the Girls Next Door. they had a birthday party for their dog Wednesday, and they made doggie pizzas. the girls looked good but odd.

but Jesse, they're in first place too!

In the early 20th century they were the WHITE STOCKINGS.

How about It Could Be From The Goatee Dude.

no they were not the white stockings

Not gay but equally not quite the sexual norm: I had a dream where a woman who was a physical manifestation in human form of the Specialized brand of bicycle wanted to make out with me, but she was a bit old and sour-faced and I didn't really fancy it.

Ha. It Came from the Goatee Dude.

Go Cubs Go.
Go Cubs Go.
Hey Chicago, whadya say?
Cubs are gonna win today.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=DrlLmTh32KI

I could only listen to like 10 seconds of it. Eeek.

wait did you just call it to find out?

Sur:

http://www.slate.com/id/2128744

Many early baseball teams were named after their uniform colors. In the 19th century, there were clubs called the Red Stockings, Brown Stockings, and Blue Stockings. Newspapers like the Chicago Tribune often shortened these nicknames to "Sox." When Charlie Comiskey founded the American League's Chicago White Stockings in 1901, the Tribune wasted no time in dubbing them the White Sox.

that Cub song is so bad, it's ...bad.

Jesse, I don't hate you even if you can't match numbers with makeout partners.

instead of watching the all star game i finished a book i'd been reading for two weeks. i get fidgety when i spend that much time on a book that i could've finished in less than half that time.

i need to start reading some girly, i decided, but i don't know what. i don't want romance novels.

Yep. I was MORTIFIED when they revived it last year (or when was it?)

I did not call the number, I was just talkin'.

I just read a couple short stories by a writer I hung out with last weekend (we're not dating). They're both sexually violent.

Huh. Is the guy Dennis Cooper?

no. (He's not the only one.)

Dudes. I want to die. And be reborn as a beer pitcher.

you'd go fast!

Jesse Genuine Draft.

I like how the Reds were rechristened the Redlegs during the Commie scare.

drew, I totally accosted martin when you played london for the wire 25th thing and I was drunk; threw my flash right in his face : / he was super sweet about it tho... and it turned out a cuet pic:

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3164/2674637694_b2e166c4d3.jpg

when I say threw my flash in his face I don't mean I beat him with my flash just that I snapped him and the flash was kinda full on; hence why he's squinting, I guess^^^^

Oh Mike, your name on a napkin,
Who are you --
Are you the general manager of a Scottish bar,
Or are you a dude with a goatee and glasses?
How do I find out?

Aw, squinty Martin! Thanks czn.

Have you tried googling the number? Or Facebook-searching it?

he poppin he rollin she rollin
he climbin that pole and
I'm N Luv with a stripper
he trippin he playin he playin
I'm not goin nowhere little duder I'm stayin
I'm N Luv with a stripper

(he was def. not a stripper)

intriguing series of texts from a friend:

her: "i met your doppelganger last night"
me: "is he single?" (<- JOEKS)
her: "yes! he's like [attractive mutual friend of ours] but hotter! i want you guys to meet!"
me: ...

:)

i do gay things all the time. like listen to gay music, and wear gay things around the house.

Read that as "wear gay thongs around the house."

not thongs.

Does youtube count as gay?

possibly. xtube sure does!

suuuure doez

not thongs.

You walk around gay commando?

o you

ANYway.

The new Dolly Parton is good!

ohh i've been so curious! we've listened to the new Jewel, which is good.

ILM effect is setting in, today I picked up Gaucho and a paperback I, Claudius, Also, finally bought Plastic Letters which I have wanted for years

And I'm picking up a digital camera.

I need to get a camera.

Also want to learn violin.

they make such cool sounds.

I wish I'd've learned violin and how to dance.

i've been into the viola

I think I'm unlearning how to dance. I used to have moves. Now, I can only dance to old records I used to like, but new records I like I can muster no rhythm for.

i read poems like this all day. this guy is a more subtle and beautiful inheritor to dennis cooper:
http://www.colorado.edu/journals/standards/V7N1/MMM/siken.html

even if you're remotely inclined to, read it. it is quite something.

perhaps it is that european techno that has amde you lose your groove, tiarnan. (lol, just kidding).

Why is dennis cooper everywhere I look these days?

I mean like ballet or tap, et al.

xp,

I think it might be! My spine has more of a new wave feel than disco, I've got naturally stuttering rhythm.

No really on the dennis cooper thing, there has to be a reason he's being talked about so much but what is it?

he's the explicit gay king who hasn't written much decent stuff in years but who is well-known for being the go-to guy for commentary/reviews of contemporary gay lit, esp in the US

also, really, read that Richard Siken. he blows my head off every time i read him. love his book.

i've never felt the inclination to explore gay art/lit/poetry like some other boys i know have.

you should try!

what would you say you get out of it?

No, I know who he is, it's just I've heard about 10 mentions of him in the last couple days on web, papers, magazines in relation to everything from guantanamo bay (!) to xiu xiu videos. I just wondered if there was some reason he was so on the radar again.

I think the problem I'm having with dancing is, really, I like pop music, and most of the house music I hear recently is so clever instead of poppy.

Most of the time, I'm more interested in exploring my inner nun than homo. For a completely atheistic person, I watch a lot of christian tv and enjoy it , and not ironically.

Remind me too table of that guy you said wrote the agnes martin poem.

there's something about gay culture for its own sake that doesn't sit well with me. i'm sorry if that sounds vague or annoying, it's the only way i know how to phrase it at this time.

i feel like i just said something terrible.

:D

What do I get out of it? Well, some of what I get is a sense of following in a tradition. Reading EM Forster and Cavafy or Andre Gide is rather exhilarating-- these men felt similar things as me (tho i must qualify, i am not into little boys like Gide), and expressed them creatively when doing so was, simply put, illegal. That's quite something. Reading newer things like Siken and DA Powell, which are more explicit and perhaps more abstract at the same time, I am simply pleased that there are some weird literary gays out there who are dealing with major issues of being a gay man in today's world.

Gay culture for its own sake? I mean, really, Sur, you're a Mariah Carey loving, lip-gloss toter. That to me is gay culture for its own sake.

And also, that you are makes you all the more charming !

got it. ok. see i don't really think about being gay, as like a huge issue. i do when it comes to family, b/c having one is hard. but it's not something for which i feel i have to participate in this grand, collective struggle. which might annoy some gays, like i'm not doing my part.

But anyway, Tiarnan, the Agnes Martin gay was my advisor/mentor for the past year, Kazim Ali. the poem is in his book, "The Far Mosque," which is not as good as his most recent, "The FOrtieth Day," but is still awesome. here are the first four lines:

'Wetten to work here seen against the sky sandscape sandbox silent
Alone mind unleashed mouth a close open cave stone breathe
Stone whiten away sharp sky edge dusk blend down dark self edge
Thrown aloft five birds little surface wind lettered and fettered'

it gets better and better as it goes on.

oh i don't feel part of that collective struggle either, Ramz, it's just that i've always been a dorky boy who loved books and poetry and other boys. so it makes sense for me to care about the literary things, but i don't think it is requisite for anyone.

Gay culture for its own sake? I mean, really, Sur, you're a Mariah Carey loving, lip-gloss toter. That to me is gay culture for its own sake.

-- the table is the table, Wednesday, July 16, 2008 7:39 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

see i don't see it that way at all. i like mariah carey because i like her music, and i like lip-gloss because it looks really cool. but i've never felt like i needed to engage in things just b/c they fit in the gay culture.

oh i don't feel part of that collective struggle either, Ramz, it's just that i've always been a dorky boy who loved books and poetry and other boys. so it makes sense for me to care about the literary things, but i don't think it is requisite for anyone.

-- the table is the table, Wednesday, July 16, 2008 7:44 PM (26 seconds ago) Bookmark Link

right, i totally hear you.

i am not into little boys like Gide

lol this reminds me of my very christian, very conservative high school psych teacher who loved to point out that allan ginsberg was a card-carrying N4MBL4 member

Okay I gotta go, too much Agnes talk, it makes me feel swoony and lightheaded sometimes. I'm gonna go listen to records in my room.

Also, I think this thread just came full circle.

what do pplz on this thread think of bruce labruce? i used to really adore his films/photography when i was really into "subversive" things but now i'm not so sure

Bruce LaBruce = smart, but he's no Wolfgang Tillmans.

Ginsberg was a card-carrying member. he wrote a somewhat famous essay about it, too.

Every see the south park episode with NAMBLA?

I wanted to say earlier that I too hate Alan (Allen?) Ginsberg. Except that poem that was posted here. Howl is unbearable. Though I do respect him as a person and I respect Howl as an important part of the history poetry.

Ginsberg was a member of NAMBLA.

Ooops. I just remembered that someone said that. NEVERMIND ME I'LL BE OVER HERE MUTTERING ...

I like the one about meeting Walt Whitman in a supermarket, but I prefer Walt Whitman. I love America though.

Just saying "Ginsberg was a member of N." suggests one thing, but the actual situation was a bit more nuanced than that.

Ginsberg isn't my cup of tea, but it's fine for what it is.

I mean, he was a colorful and caring person, it seemed. The Arthur Russell doc made me rethink some of what I thought of him.

I have heard him speak about his reasons for being a member. It was interesting. I don't think of him as a dirty old toucher of children's buttholes or anything.

There's a documentary (maybe the one you speak of?) called A Poet on the Lower East Side which shows him at home, which is an apartment where a friend of mine has been squatting for several years.

Will you fucking shut up about Br1an Z3g33r already?

http://bp1.blogger.com/_KYgjpL1TYxQ/R-Ka6Gbl85I/AAAAAAAAAUE/vynJpOcYzN4/s1600-h/DavidCross_AllenGinsberg.jpg

He's my whole world.

In the poet house? On 13th?

I guess we have talked about this maybe.

Sphincter
Allen Ginsberg
(1986)
I hope my good old asshole holds out
60 years it's been mostly OK
Tho in Bolivia a fissure operation
survived the altiplano hospital--
a little blood, no polyps, occasionally
a small hemorrhoid
active, eager, receptive to phallus
coke bottle, candle, carrot
banana & fingers--
Now AIDS makes it shy, but still
eager to serve--
out with the dumps, in with the condom'd
orgasmic friend--
still rubbery muscular,
unashamed wide open for joy
But another 20 years who knows,
old folks got troubles everywhere--
necks, prostates, stomachs, joints--
Hope the old hole stays young
till death, relax

March 15, 1986, 1:00 PM

It did not last another 20 years, alas.

i kind of like that!

Allen Ginsberg was a genius

speaking of gide, this thread may or may not have influenced my recent (as in, 5 mins ago) decision to buy the counterfeiters off a guy on the street for a $1!

you guys are all so smart, i don't know about these things.

Hey everyone, look at my new sticker on my old bag! Yay!

http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/9680/dscn2236qe3.jpg

unfortunately it's already peeling off because nothing will fucking stick to my yucky vinylesque bag.

W00f. Or something. Staple it on, or use pins, punk rock style.

blech, pins would look so yuck! Stapling would be amusing. I'm only going to have the thing for another few months before I get a new (Chrome Citizen) bag so i think I'm just going to sew it or something.

I watched Satantango and Persona this weekend; both were excellent. Satantango had some of the most bleakly pathetic and depressing scenes I've ever seen on film. Anyone else happen to have triumphed it?

Me. I got a headache, lost it, and got it back during that movie. It's awesome!

http://youtube.com/watch?v=q8DOQFccj00

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFmu7BYbthY

Oh come on, that's not fair! You can't post a clip out of context and not expect people to get all "Eeew that's so LONG and BORRRRRing"

I can't help if it not everyone's tastes run towards formalism.

this guy online just showed me his pix. you like click this thing and then they can either show you or not. so anyway he did. and he wasn't for me so i didn't respond. well then he goes "you ask me to show you, you could at least say thanks"

and i was like "um, no i couldn't. this isn't a lesson in emily post it's a GAY HOOKUP SITE"

i have also seen (and loved) satantango, esp. the middle third (girl/cat sequence WOW)

Having basic manners = sexy.

being oversensitive on the internets = not.

That's also true, but it doesn't negate my point.

hey, Csuistry now posts in the Eastern time zone!

I liked Satantango, but have mostly forgotten everything but that opening 8-minute (?) tracking shot of the cow pasture.

Stevie, will Rutgers bears zero in on that sticker?

whatevs, i'm not about to pussyfoot around some weird sensitive guy on a stupid sex website :D

Yeah but manners is about habits. And if you want to be in the habit of getting laid, you should be in the habit of saying thanks. You're not going to stay young and milk-skinned forever!

i guess, but i'm one of the most polite people i know! i just don't think there's much room for hurt feelings in a gay chat room where everyone's trolling for cock...

i mean, if i send someone pix and they don't respond, i don't get all "ohhh, you could at least SPELL IT OUT FOR ME that you don't find me attractive." i just move on.

It's really easy to just ignore someone when chatting on Manhunt or whatever, but I think that best practice is acknowledging the person, even if only to say no thanks just as you would (I hope?) if that same person approached you in person at a cruisy bar.

really? i can't, that's too much for me. i don't expect that from other guys either. if i say hi to no avail, i just close the window. i think a lot of guys on these websites operate under these expectations. i get a lot of messages that i don't respond to and that's the end of it, no kid gloves.

but i'm glad you two are so sweet :)

i mean honestly, though -- don't you think getting upset in those circumstances is kind of um, unintelligent? i mean, i realized a while ago that there are like, LOTS of things in life to get upset about, that don't include gay pickup sites.

I'm not saying I always operate according to my suggestion, but I have started to make an effort to do so b/c it takes 10 seconds and it's good karma.

As far as someone ignoring someone's IM, that's another story. I find it annoying when I leave myself signed into a site and return to find that someone has IMed me repeatedly saying "YOU COULD SAY HI!!1!"

XP

Hi guys! I'm in India. It feels like there is nothing gay here.

Except me.

lol awww. be gay enough for all of us =D

A friend went shortly before 9/11, and he went to some gay bar somewhere. Research!

I'm with my boss though!

Actually, I googled and apparently Bangalore (where I'm at) just had their first Pride parade in June.

their=its

re morbs: It would be nice, yes, but I truly feel like none exist. Maybe I'll get lucky!

did I mention I paid for a lap dance in Cleveland? He was very skilled.

omg slut

: ) v impressed

Oh and since it's been like a year since I've been around can everyone post pictures of themselves?

no Sur, I'm an ex-slut who gets nostalgic when I leave New York.

stevo you know what i look like. also today i have these huge circles under my eyes cuz i didn't sleep so much. i played tennis at SIX AM. SIX.

I have some recent photos of myself at rooftop barbecue, but they are nondigital! also I have no scanner, and I am dressed kinda like Hunter S Thompson in them.

but you know, i don't know what you look like, at all! which i find distressing. somewhat.

Right now I only have the old one I posted on WDYLL a while back. I have some new ones from July 4th at home.

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r305/superflouis/Me1.jpg

what is that piece in the back? it's nice!

:) My boss from the record store painted that for me for my birthday a few years ago.

http://photos-a.ak.facebook.com/photos-ak-sf2p/v286/3/79/706000209/n706000209_1361896_6380.jpg

I keep meaning to take a pic of myself with the CN Tower in the background, or something, to prove that I'm in Toronto.

Sur, we could have a NY HomoFAP sometime if yer curious.

fab lighting there, Chris.

Being from NYC is a great conversation starter with go-go dancers in the middle of the country...

He: "You're taking us back to Broadway, right?"

Me (examining his thighs): "Yes, we could get these an audition for Xanadu."

this is probably the gayest recent picture I have. It was a miserable day at Six Flags with a downpour that soaked all of our socks before we even made it through the parking lot. This was shortly before one of my friends gave Batman her number. Note Aquaman's wet spots.

http://photos-e.ak.facebook.com/photos-ak-sf2p/v251/126/81/8810981/n8810981_39971716_699.jpg

p.s. let's have a NY HomoFAP again!

yes that is a good pic cas. PS you have the PERFECT NOSE. there i complimented you, deal.

yes NYCfap should happen soon before i'm old and ugly. haha i'm not superficial.

really!

True fact: My nose is mildly asymmetric. Also, it is pop-o-matic.

frolicking in vondelpark, amsterdam:

http://photos-b.ak.facebook.com/photos-ak-snc1/v274/239/87/800421/n800421_41096985_9610.jpg

"Frolicking" is so not how I first read that word.

Especially in "fondle park"!

nah, i was doing something else illicit at the time. ahem.

well obv, or you would've done the collapse in a more grassy area.

i like your sneaks

I'm picking up an awesome camera today. I'll update whenever I figure out how to use it.

Illicit even in Amsterdam?

no. hah.

I posted yesterday (I think) on the main ILE WDYLL thread, hope that's okay.

Suffice it to say, the two actors I think I most closely resemble were both nominated for Emmys this morning.

Where's YOUR nomination, handsome?

who besides NPH, Eric?

Hugh Laurie?

No, Sandra Oh.

(No, really, I've been told Michael C. Hall ... I think by you even, J.)

I may be nominated for an Emmy again. I'll find out in a couple days. (A regional Emmy, that is.)

aren't you satisfied with ONE?

Hell, I'm not even satisfied with one WIN, thankyavermuch.

thank God I have that 8th-grade spelling bee trophy

Spell this.

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a332/ephender2/n513642357_276315_7478.jpg

in French, obviously

:D =) ;P

zuh? you won an emmy?

farthest i got in spelling bee was statewide

that Emmy looks suspiciously like a Tedi Award...

http://www.sitcomsonline.com/photos/mtm15.jpg

funnily enough, i have no recent pictures of myself, w./ haircut and whatnot. but soon.

Haha. Yeah, it's a real one, but smaller than the primetime ones.

You should've thrown your hat in the air in that photo.

anyone else actually watch Mary Tyler Moore?

okay, so in news, that boy levon (with the whole picture-posting controversy thing) and i have been going out on weird pseudo-dates, and...i dunno. we're both attracted to each other physically, but i can't help but feel it would be super weird to do anything serious since we've known each other since we were 13. he feels similarly ambivalent.

what to do..

"actually" in the '70s, Sur

Ha, I don't remember making any Michael C. Hall comments, but I can see it.

ah, well i used to watch the Nick at Nite re-runs and we have the DVD's now. sooo classic.

tabes, just go with it! i feel like you'll know if it's a good thing or not.

yeah, that's what we both agreed to....

:) you have butterflies

Hey, I just got a fbook invite to hear Drew read! Sent by the bookstore, no less.

I am seeing Matmos tom'w night (3rd time). And THE Brian Wilson tonight (first).

Musicking or reading, though? I'm kind of excited that it's a book event, because I am old and withered. Maybe they're playing later and I don't know about it, though.

you have such a babyface!

Yes but inside, inside I am withered.

i need to get some wrinkle cream.

i am going to see the herzog movie at FF tonight and then BEACH BEACH BEACH tomorrow! :D

Tomorrow night I'm back home where I belong: in the pit orchestra.

I'm going to the jungle.

It was my birthday today and I got a lovely serenade tonight from the audience at Whartscape! I am 37 years old as of July 17 1971. Ouch!

I will be reading at This Ain't the Rosedale Library at 1 pm and then we play that night at the Music Gallery so Torontonians are invited to come on down to either event . . .

must sleep now

sorry to interrupt the party guys but...

i went to three bars tonight bcuz i look ok and three drinks loosen me up, but then i avoid looking at people like there's a nuclear zone around them. convo of six or seven words outside, thank god i still smoke, haven't spoken to anyone in a week. i can't figure out if i hate this city, hate gays in this city, hate the bars and the people who go to them, hate the fucking music, hate retards in miner caps and camo capris, hate myself for spending so much, hate myself for shrinking so much, hate myself for hating myself, hate thinking too much about it... i need an out so fucking soon. glad i'm moving back to salt lake city in a month (from l.a.) if only because i think i'll feel ok being alone in a season that's meant for it (fall). not exactly a meet n greet city but the people here are all industry related and i just can't get with that no matter how hard i try.

haha that was really interrupting a party.. time to sleep, thank god for that

curious: no brit-tard ilx jomoseckuals on here????

ok. hello. first of all, i'd like to say that i go through this stuff as well. the people stuff. sometimes i want so much to connect with everyone, but putting yourself out there, talking to ppl etc, that's hard! it's not something everyone can do just like that. a lot of people have this sort of trouble. so don't feel like you have dibs on the issue :D

i was having a similar night last night. i had 1 too many scotches, and i kept wanting to go out but i knew i'd just wind up at a bar, alone, exchanging furtive glances with seedy men and trying too hard to be cute.

i think the bottom line is you have to keep positive (i know how innovative). you may feel like shit, but it's not going to last forever. you'll find a way to talk to people, and a way to feel happy with your limitations. also get the fuck out of LA, salt lake city will be great.

also HBD Drew!! concert serenade sounds great =]

yeah happy birthday!

hi gays, long time lurker first time poster:

strgn: you need to get out of LA but fast. Surms: you don't have to try to be cute.

recommence regular gay programming

http://icons.iconator.com/112/ICONATOR_aba26db0af3607073a1f7c289e080dab.png

It seems that it can be tough to approach people in a bar unless one is so drunk that it is just a bad idea; this is especially true when at the bar alone. I would imagine that being in LA doesn't help matters any.

I signed up for kickball and got the rules in my email. I'm nervous!

That sounds like voluntarily re-creating gym class.

Hopefully only the fun parts! Kickball was the only activity where I didn't suck. My nightmare of nightmares would be playing basketball.

I wish I could play softball or flag football, but alas, I lack the prerequisite knowledge for it, plus I bear emotional scars from those sports in middle school.

Strikes and Balls
1. Each kicker starts with a 1 strike – 1 ball count.

This seems strange to me.

strgn-- you are most certainly not alone.

that said: SLC? really? i try to avoid Utah at all costs. mormons scare the living fuck out of me.

Yeah, but compared to LA?

perhaps it is because i have not spent much time in LA and have a few friends who live there and like it, but my opinion of LA is: you could always be in a worse place.

There are plenty of reasons why someone would enjoy LA, and plenty of reasons why someone would want to stay the hell away, and it all depends on who you are and what you want out of life. I wouldn't want to live in either LA or SLC, really, but if forced to choose I'm not sure which one I'd pick. SLC is, probably, at least a more interesting type of insane than LA's overly familiar variety.

totally, i understad that. i am just very wary of utah. i feel more comfortable in most places than i did in slc. but i love omaha, and cheyenne. maybe that's because of the old movie theater.

http://www.airforcebase.net/personal/architecture/Cheyenne_Lincoln_Theater_WY_20050316.JPG

perhaps more pertinent, though is this: dorothy! (there is no image available of the whole theater at night, in all of its glory)

hey, finally met Dr Drew! He gave me a drink ticket, which I gave to one of my companions as I didn't want to pass out. Good show.

table - i grew up in slc, and yes, mormons scare the living fuck out of me too. but my family are them, so i've learned how to get over being scared the living fuck out of them and other generally nice people who won't bother you if you don't let them.

thanks for the intervention guys. i feel a lot better fwiw.

Did Drew have different glasses on from the last time I saw him?

Oh my goodness but I feel like a fag now

it's all your fault

...cryptic.

i am TAN now. this is weird.

I would like to know how many people here do something "gay" every day?

Not sure if I got in gay every day. But this week I saw this documentary on Dolly Parton fans and Mamma Mia! which gave me the chills in some parts (the lady parade in "Dancing Queen;" "Voulez Vous") and made me cringe in others (pretty much any time Pierce Brosnan sang, e.g. "SOS" was a mess). Both very gay and recommended.

Oh I need a movie this weekend, and I'm really sour on the idea of seeing Batman. The more I think about Meryl Streep in Mamma Mia! the more excited I get...

I'm not sure, but I'm guessing there has to be at least one more ILX gay who'd probably much rather get his gay cinema fix this weekend with Jacques Nolot instead of ABBA.

Who is he?

Dr. Morbius

Oh wait. I mean he directed a movie about a French gay porno theater.

Nolot, not Morbs.

Morbs was key grip.

I worked on his 1st unit.

...except morbs said upthread he didn't really like his new one

(i, however, remain enthused to see it) (and also mamma mia)

I'm not sure, but I'm guessing there has to be at least one more ILX gay who'd probably much rather get his gay cinema fix this weekend with Jacques Nolot instead of ABBA.

La Chatte à deux têtes (also known under the much better title Porn Theater) is the greatest film of this decade. However, I don't live in a city that's screening the new Nolot. In fact, I doubt it'll ever come here. In any event, you can be sure that I would've chosen Nolot over ABBA.

But I would've chosen ABBA second anyway. Mamma Mia! is more than fine. Check it out!

I still feel like a fag. I blame everyone on this thread.

What's wrong with feeling like...you're gay?

Alright damn, there was a lot of stuff on this thread I didn't see before.
I mean shit. I poked my head in here and then I didn't even read the responses to my post. I feel like...I feel...well...like a faggot.

yeah what's wrong with feeling like you're gay anyway?

Especially if you have an electric guitar to back it up.

Feeling gay, in every way. A warm, fuzzy feeling. Of feeling gay.

But I would've chosen ABBA second anyway. Mamma Mia! is more than fine. Check it out!

The problem with this recommendation is that I absolutely hate ABBA.

Then definitely avoid it at all costs! There's probably more singing than dialogue so you'd only be getting heart palpitations. Go for Nolot if you can.

Something gay happened last night.

Somewhere.

and you're still alive.

Yes, I swooned in the pit for about the umpteenth time playing "I Got Lost In His Arms," so, yeah, something gay happened last night.

You know who else I like? Theo Parrish. Maybe someday I'll find a nice, quite appreciation thread for him on ILX.

Something Gay Happened Last Night

The new TV miniseries.

life is so weird.

Damnnit, I am STILL gay. Time has changed nothing. I feel cheated.

I hope ILX will forgive me. I want to prove how gay I am by posting this.

Neneh Cherry "Buffalo Stance":
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3EQCOshGwPI

Thanks, ya'll.

At a party the other night someone said I looked like Stephen Harper. They asked if I get that all the time. I said, well, until a few days I lived in a place where no one knows what Harper looks like.

If I actually look like Stephen Harper I will never get laid in this country!

I'm still gay. I'm still gay. There's nothing I can do about it. Still gay.

Here's Quarterflash's Harden My Heart. Which is flipping my WIG right now. Early 80's music rules.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1_E6pHa3hc

Alfred Soto? Hall & Oates?

Gays, last night I saw Ariel Pink and took two pills of very very excellent e. Great times watching the sun rise and walking around the deserted streets of the Castro.

Anyway, the problem-- I totally cancelled on that date I was supposed to have today. Though I think the excuse was a good one, it also made me feel shitty.

Then I watched "Stand by Me," and totally fell in love with the world again!!

Look, I'm in love with Rick James. I already told people this. I'm really totally in love. I want him so bad.

Look at his fucking checkerboard suit/guitar:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8La48eIHUo

table- did you tell your date the reason for canceling?

i saw 2 boys i went to college with at Metropolitan last night. 1 of them was a total douche. i mean, in college. so i didn't say hi. but he was all whispering to his ugly friend, and the ugly friend mouthed my name as he tried to sneak a glance past me.

if i don't hookup with someone in the next week i'm going to vandalize my own house.

i came close last night. i slammed the refrigerator door so hard the sidebar broke.

don't worry, i don't usually slam people that hard.

I'm still in Chicago for Pitchfork Festival, during which I saw only two passable men.

hope you're having fun!

work isn't a good match for my energy today. i feel volatile, and i don't want anyone to talk to me the wrong way.

I absolutely hate ABBA.

OMG, hope for Eric yet!

I don't know all of Annie Get Your Gun (I've never seen the film even tho Betty Hutton is the star). Eric, did this production cut "I'm an Indian Too" for PC reasons? That never makes any sense to me, she's empathizing w/ the native Americans for God's sake.

This weekend I RESCREENED an Andre Techine film that Jacques Nolot wrote, I Don't Kiss, which was somewhat better than I recalled. It's about a 20-year-old hustler instead of the dissipated 60-year-old in JN's new one; so, easier on the eyes.

there were a few hot indie boys at the Siren fest at Coney (among thousands).

if i don't hookup with someone in the next week i'm going to vandalize my own house.

Try your fiancee.

Yeah, Morbs, they cut out "Indian." It's a bummer since it's the only other real barnburner in the show, as far as dance numbers go (the other: "Sun in the Morning"). She's sympathizing, yes, but there are still lyrics about scalping and whatnot. I still think it's an overly cautious move, but what can you do?

... I did my customary Northside gay dive crawl this weekend (I've come to realize that this is yet another reason I need gay friends - I go out with straight people, get a little drunk, then want to meet a boy, so I go get way too drunk at the gay bars). Anyway, I once again met a really nice cute guy who said, "You're totally marriage material! How is it possible that you're single!?"

I want men to stop telling me that and start *showing* me.

That sounded like a complaint post - it wasn't. It was fun and all, but there was a ring of familiarity through the whole weekend.

Maybe they're not marriage material.

Nor are they looking for it.

I bet scalping is fun.

still, I remember when a friend programmed some old comedy shorts at a museum, and even with a disclaimer, the blackface actors from the '30s did not go over well.

You're right Eric, maybe they're not. Maybe I'm not. But I think I am.

I guess I'd hope I'm marriage material, but I also don't think many guys aspire to that until they actually find themselves proposing, et al.

I live alone and like it.

I want the ol' LTR, and I would like to think I'd be way better at it than I was last time (2001). My concern would be integrating my peculiar mode of living with another person's. I mean, sometimes I want to get up at 3 AM and replace the bathroom tap or pay bills - I could see this being a source of annoyance for someone else.

I think you're ignoring the fact that you're replacing the tap and paying the bills.

My concern would be integrating my peculiar mode of living with another person's.

This might not only be my concern, but also something I just don't want to do.

booin' u abba haterz

also i wish i were still at the beach. guh

Is "marriage material" code for something, though? Does it mean something like "hey, you're not tweaking!"?

"mm" is a mysterious phrase... like, material for what KIND of marriage? A orth/heterodox one -- gee, thanks but no thanks...

Hahaha. Yeh, probably!

right.

i was talking to a guy last night and i said "cool beans." and he told me never to say it again. and then i asked if it wasn't cool enough for him and he said no, it wasn't. and i told him that was terribly uncool, as a perspective. and he told me not to talk to him anymore. and i told him i'd rather not.

that guy sounds like COLD beans.

I was at Coney Island for 5 hours and did not get sunburnt. Key: go at 4 pm.

Is "marriage material" code for something, though? Does it mean something like "hey, you're not tweaking!"?

-- Casuistry, Monday, July 21, 2008 9:29 AM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

Hahaha. Yeh, probably!

asdfjk;alsfj

sounds like a typical metropolitan conversation, sur

I hate to almost caricature myself by saying this, but:

(I've come to realize that this is yet another reason I need gay friends - I go out with straight people, get a little drunk, then want to meet a boy, so I go get way too drunk at the gay bars)

Would having gay friends really change this much? Wouldn't you need just as much alcohol running through you to meet a boy?

Part of the problem is that I just don't like meeting boys. Or I mean. It's like people who want to be writers -- they don't enjoy writing (sensibly enough), they just want to have written. I'm the same way with guys. Also, with writing.

i have 1 of those gay friends, great for going out with. it helps a little.

i like meeting boys, but it's tricky. guts are a requirement.

I think I'm settling down material. Seriously, I am sick of partying (not "partying" - which I am definitely so sick of that I don't do it).

I think it would change things. When I go out with gay folks from my former work, I tend to go out later and get home earlier b/c we started out at the gay bar and I have either found someone or decided enough was enough. The problem is when we start off at a straight bar and I should just go home, but it seems totally reasonable at that point that to go spend more time drinking more while on the prowl.

Who threw the bucket of water on this campfire?

see what i did there

Would having gay friends really change this much? Wouldn't you need just as much alcohol running through you to meet a boy?

I missed that 2nd part. I liked going out with my gay co-worker b/c he facilitated conversation in a way that my straight/female friends don't do. Also if I go to the bar alone, I definitely need more liquid courage than if I have a wing man.

But it's not all about meeting boys.

you and i'd have a good time of it jesse, too bad we can't meetup for beerz.

Well, OK, if you have someone outgoing like that who can make things happen, that will help for sure. I guess I'm thinking that not just any ol' John Q. Cocksucker will do.

No Eric; is that from The Women?

too true. ben and i were saying the same thing last night -- "make it happen" friends are ace.

heres the thing. it's one thing to see a boy all alone, and make it happen. buuut when it's like a group, things get tougher.

Mostly I'm talking about the fact that as things stand, my outings to the gay bars tend to be extensions of my evening rather than the main event.

Surmounter, come to Chicago and we'll score mad dudetang for each other.

Also, "John Q. Cocksucker" is a lovely name.

It's like people who want to be writers -- they don't enjoy writing (sensibly enough), they just want to have written.

Hi dere.

Writing is indeed like a one-night stand, only there's less laundry to do after.

You really can't suss out what someone's like in a bar, except in special circumstances, unless you're naturally good at it.

I don't even think of gay bars as sites for dudetang fishing anymore.

Yes. I love the feeling of accomplishment that comes with having written, but the writing itself is agony. Very much like running or working out really hard.

xp

i feel that way about music sometimes, but i also really, really enjoy the process. stepping into the studio is like stepping onto the tennis court -- peaceful. but there are definitely times when i want things finished, without all the fuss.

writing agonizes me so much that i don't even do it at all! (tho this will change come september)

i wish i had access to/ability to play musical instruments

I don't even think of gay bars as sites for dudetang fishing anymore.

Where's your fishing hole, then?

online?

so i don't want to wind up 50 yrs old without having been superficial enough. i'm a little too quaint, i feel. i like write music, and have friends. not enough stupidity with stupid gay boys at stupid locations. is scene-hopping a worthwhile mid-year resolution?

What, you've never met superficial 50-year-olds?

:)

I mostly let my rare "activities" happen randomly. Except when I don't. (eg, Cleveland stripper bar)

My occasional online ads are usually for specific "intos" I won't detail here.

Oh come on - give us a hint.

Too old and smart for that! :D

I'm left with no choice but to make up particulars.

you have my permission to fantasize about my particulars.

should i go out tonight?

I don't know. Should you?

yes.

eww but it's so fucking hot out

maybe i'll just talk to idiots online?

Where is your manfriend during all of this?

in the area. i just have this mission i need to accomplish.

also i cut my LIP shaving today! has that ever happened to you?

why ponder life's complexities...?

"a mission"

I hate to harp on this, but I hope your SO is also on a mission right now, Surmounter.

;) don't waste pity on me we're both very happy

or pity on him, rather. we're very understanding of one another.

guys i'm in a sticky conversation with a friend about money. do you talk about money with your friends?

as long as it doesnt involve a loan.

plz don't even mention the word "loan" right now

Yeah, I gather the world is both your oysters, goddamn you both.

ha
i mean, i would go crazy in an exclusive relationship. absolutely
crazy.
but that's just me!!

Possibly dumb question: what's the point of being in a relationship at all?

I'm sorry if it seems like I'm targeting you a lot lately, btw, it's just that it feels like you're my 100 percent opposite on everything except for being into dudes.

love, friendship, support, understanding, humor, physical intimacy

pls i never mind it :D

PS i suspect we're more alike than you may think. i'm not all about lip gloss, glitter and cock.

You forget I'm into the last two of those three things. (Glitter the soundtrack, I mean.)

=) great record

The only reason I'd get into an open relationship is if I thought I was inadequate and the only way to keep someone was to let them go on a few fishing trips every now and again.

... oh wait.

isn't that just another way of saying men have short attention spans?

It's a way of saying they prefer not to commit.

mhmm.

Since I've never even gotten to the monogamy-or-not discussion stage with anyone, maybe I just think couples are ... overinvested in it. (as long as the nonexclusivity rules are understood)

The other side of the coin, though, is that I've seen what a farce it is when people try to make polyamory work. It doesn't.

At least not for a sustainable period.

polyamory is very different tho. i mean, you can't have more than 1 relationship

"can't" is a very big word.

OK, I'll admit that the real disconnect here is the fact that right now I don't even have one sex partner, much less am I working on seconds or thirds ...

we're talking THEORY, Eric.

I just can't believe that a whole bunch of other conditions are automatically attached to being intimate with one partner for any reason other than convention.

Or, at a certain age, fatigue.

I mean, you have family then, right? I think the idea of being utterly, completely alone would be the quickest route to insanity and suicide.

^^^

Not to be mistaken for theory.

Wow, weird times on this thread right now.

And yes, I did tell him the reason for cancelling the date. He was working on Saturday, so there wasnt much to be done about meeting up or anything. I was just happy I had some headphones and could have private dance party on the streetcorner time.

I've said it a zillion times before, but I would like for an "open" relationship to work for me, but I'm simply too jealous. Like I've said before, I'm more interested in the "forever" part of a relationship than the "only" part. Most people to be interested in other people regardless of how much they love their partner.

i have never deeply thought about the "am i a one-horse kinda cowboy?" issue, tbh. and i'm not about to at this moment because i have work that needs doing. but i've only ever been in (tacitly agreed-upon) monogamous situations

The problem is that all relationships are forever, whether you are committed or not.

I'll say that when I've been in a relationship with someone, it's been generally really hard for me to even consider anyone else. I managed, at one point, to have a few fbs running at the same time, and it was nice enough, but two of them were with exes, and that's a somewhat different thing, I think?

Maybe instead of thinking of every date as a first date you should think of your ongoing relationship as being with someone you're always already an ex with.

Also for those who haven't met him, Drew is pretty cute. But you all know I'm a sucker those glasses...

Something gay is happening.

Where?

http://www.edsdeadbody.com/otherwork/writings/tp-giant.jpg

"it is happening...again..."

I see gay people.

me too! when i go out at night. i'm trying to figure out what gay things happen on monday night.

I wonder what Surmounter is doing RIGHT NOW.

Something gay is afoot, that's for sure.

xp!!!! haha

jesse take a jet over here and let's go talk to stupid people!!!!!!

:/

and look now all of a sudden it's monday and no one's happening anywhere. what's the deal? i could go to some place called THE LITTERBOX. or i could go to BOXERS OR BRIEFS and check my pants for a free drink. og

this is awful.

Hi!

I was just talking to a cute cute cutey who I met amidst rather tawdry circumstances and I hope to talk to him again rrreal soon!

yay!! i might go to the cock

You can lead a Surmounter to the cock but you can't make him ______________.

I didn't know the Cock was still even open.

yes it's open. it's so open.

mmhmm.

anyway, i thought yall might want a photo de moi of recent maybe:

http://photos-c.ak.facebook.com/photos-ak-snc1/v276/197/92/4204079/n4204079_31296114_6834.jpg

i also have very embarassing druggy photos.

anyway, the cock is def open was there sometime in march, i believe.

yowsa! all ur friends look like ppl i would befriend. blue dress is hottttt

show druggy photos

now

i may also have that shirt, table?

probably. one of my only american apparel purchases ever.

http://photos-g.ak.facebook.com/photos-ak-snc1/v276/197/92/4204079/n4204079_31296126_780.jpg

impromptu dance party outside of ariel pink. we are listening to my friend's band on a portable speaker.

explaining something to my friend. we are both quite not right.

http://photos-b.ak.facebook.com/photos-ak-snc1/v276/197/92/4204079/n4204079_31296129_1780.jpg

So I find the friendliness and general good nature of the Indian guys on our development team to be completely charming! It usually takes me quite a while to get comfortable with someone I've just met but they make it easy.

That said, despite being asked repeatedly about dating and whether or not I have a girlfriend, etc. I only had it in me to explain the gay thing to one of them in private. Does this make me a massive panty waste?

It's not your job to enlighten another country. You cannot use shock and awe tactics to win their hearts and minds.

no, just human :)

guys guys the cock wasn't a waste of time!

oh and tabes, looks like so much fun and who is that cute brunette behind you in the 1st? also cute guy in denim in the 2nd? i'm into this crowd.

& girl in red sunglasses is cute.

CUTE

denim dude looks like louis

i mean the one to our right

I got unexpectedly invited to a dinner party tonight! It meant missing Matm0s but it was unexpected and scrumptious. There was not teh gay there but we drank this stuff called Caribou which is some Quebecois fortified wine. Wheeeee!

Usually when I work somewhere, I just mention boyfriend casually to one person, and they tell everyone for me.

Yeah, that works at home but not over here.

really, is there nobody who's really obnoxiously loud, they're usually the best ones. They can't shut up.

Haha we do have one of those but he's the one who asks about girls/dating the most!

Mind you, I don't really think it would be that big of a big deal if I told him.

Usually when I work somewhere, I just mention boyfriend casually to one person, and they tell everyone for me.

also, only works if you have a boyfriend.

to state the obvious.

My strategy for outing myself at work used to be to make a comment like, "T.R. Knight is adorable," and the rest took care of itself. This strategy was well-suited for waitering, but now that I'm in a very, very small office, it has failed me. However I know that my female boss is a big fan of the homos*, so I mentioned going to the Pride parade and doing volunteer work for the local AIDS service org.

*She told me about one of her early cases in which she represented a gay guy who got both of his eye sockets crushed by the Ch|c@go P.D. Horrible, horrible story. The guy kept screaming, "Call the police!"

What were we talking about?

http://img2.timeinc.net/people/i/2008/startracks/080324/tr_knight.jpg

Awwwwww!!!!

What were we talking about?

The cock.

I didn't know the Cock was still even open.

It's not the same location as the legendary old '90s Cock on Ave A, with the "dance floor" than was just one big gropey bacchanal ... so I've heard!

the cock was a colossal waste of time (and money) every time i've been there

these days, sunday nights at the cock are sperm nights. there's a big sign.

last night, this person had me ride on the handlebars of his bike? it was bumpy.

What are "sperm nights"??

i don't know i asked someone there and they said something about blowjobs. ::shrugs::

http://www.thecockbar.com/Parties.html

googling suggests that it is just the name of a recurring party they have there.

i wasn't about to google "the cock sperm nights" at work, so thanks for that

Our kickball team is named the Ch!r0b@tors b/c a chiropractic clinic is sponsoring us. Ch!robating is when you crack your own back, FYI.

oh, the things that I've googled at work...

thanks sur. guy in flannel is crazy dude who used to put cigarettes out on his tongue. but he is straight, sadly. girl in glasses is his old friend.

the girl in the second picture is one of my best friends. guy who looks like louis is this dude named joe-- think he goes to nyu, just met him last week.

anyway, yeah! work time.

joe can ny my u

yep i said it

Have we done a poll re who's a bottom and who's a top and who right in the middle?

nope i've thought of it a few times and then forgotten

I'm a toppom.

I'm a bottop.

Of I'm understanding the terminology correctly.

Rather "IF" not "of."

what position are you taking when you're 69ing? (just an acadenmic query)

what what?

i hate being on top for 69! (because i'm lazy and b/c i'm short)

I was just emailing a friend about the Golden Girls and I remembered that when I was about 14, I recorded the GG theme and played it while showering, and while tanning on the roof.

hahaha. I was picking an activity where "top" theoretically doesn't exist, but I've been outsmarted.

xp

When masturbating alone? In the dark? With tears running into your ears?

lol

off to do some paralegal work. jesus, i need a better part-time gig.

Wait "toppom" and "bottop" are terms with some level of currency? Do they then mean what I'd hope they'd mean?

I have never heard those terms before Morbs and I just said them!

Results 1 - 20 of about 1,700 for toppom.

Xorp Gallery - Szilveszter 2004 - 2005 :: "Jajj... félrelóg a toppom!"
"Jajj... félrelóg a toppom!" Sziaaa Zsófi! Atis, megkönnyebbűlt! ... "Jajj... félrelóg a toppom!" Atis, megkönnyebbűlt! Megvan már a cigim? ...

Similar results for "bottop," according to my very limited search.

so going out tonight would be dumb i think. yes?

that would be then 3 nights in a row. uh and all of them schoolnights. hmm.

do you have pin money?

pin?

pls to explain.

"pin money" is what husbands gave their wives.

lolol

i had to give some money to ryan to go to the movies tonight :D

i got an instant message tonight, from someone called "thecoolbro"

i'm just not sure

It's the internet, go for it

I watched the Birthday Party DVD earlier tonight and I think I've got my Halloween costume this year:

http://www.rosaselvaggia.com/tracy_pew_partn.jpg

I can be a gay cowboy!

What, another one?

DVD, you mean? I watched Pleasure Heads Must Burn

Well, I meant another gay cowboy, but hey.

So...kickball is a lot harder than I thought. I wonder if it's the fact that I was on a team made up mostly of lesbians or the fact that Chicago guys are way into sports? Even the super nelly queens were way better than me. It was like 1st-6th grades all over. Horrible.

The fucking spectators were screaming at me "GET OFF THE BASE! DON'T STAND ON THE BASE!!! BLA BLA BLA!!!!" but I wasn't anywhere near the base! It was an optical illusion caused by the lights!

tsk tsk, gays becoming their own childhood tormenters.

"toppom" and "bottop" are terms with some level of currency?

Suddenly people are taking my jokes at face value? How to take advantage, hmmmm...