The most racist city in america

God it took 44 posts, but finally something that I could actually agree with

All major cities in the United States are racist, sexist, homophobic and bigoted. We haven’t evolved as much as we’d like to think since the abolishment of slavery, WWII, Vietnam, and the Civil Rights, Women’s and Gay Pride movements.

— Posted by Justine

July 22nd,
2008
12:57 pm

Memphis, Tennessee… but it’s “racist” in a way you would be surprised to learn. In Memphis (where I lived for 6 years), the black people often oppress the whites. It’s on the news every night through the fear of violence; it’s in job offers (or lack there of, if you are white, thanks to affirmative action); it’s in the public parks where statues of famous war generals are no longer allowed as part of a sad history, but history nonetheless; it’s in the speech patterns that are taught in the government schools. My favorite example is at the University of Memphis, where in order to get a full academic scholarship as a white individual, you must have a 30 on your ACT. But, if you are an african-american, you must only score a 23. It’s on their website. Check it out.

— Posted by Ginger

Is the question largest # of racist jerks or the highest % of racist jerks or the most institutionally racist city? Because I think the answer is different in each case.

what state has the least abortions

Ooooh Ginger bringing the reverse-racism!

just take the first post, replace proper names with variables, cut copy and paste for 500 posts under different aliases pretty much and you have an idea what the page is like:

Surprisingly enough, at least for me, it’s (CITY I LIVE IN NOW AND/OR HATE). No other city in my experience has such a stark divide between the predominately white areas and the predominately minority areas as the (ONE) Side, where news of daily violence is commonplace, and the (OTHER) Side, with its million dollar homes near the lake and recent college grads galore. The police here are notorious for brutality against minorities, and the city government has done its fair share to cover it up.

...

Alex: the question is left open, and the author says he'll go into more detail about the social science thereof next week.

Boston is a shockingly unpleasant town in many ways, I will say (not the least of which the near impossibility of driving there as a tourist.)

sudhir v is not quite to 'bottle opener' territory but as a bloggy shit-stirrer he's getting pretty good

"the grass is less racist on the other side, etc." - xpost

sudhir v is not quite to 'bottle opener' territory but as a bloggy shit-stirrer he's getting pretty good

-- goole, Wednesday, July 23, 2008 2:27 PM (52 seconds ago) Bookmark Link

i like how he turned his sociological study of the projects into mainstream gangsploitation lit in 'gang leader for a day'

man's gotta move weight copies, deej

New England's definitely the most racist part of the country

burt stanton's definitely the stupidest poster on ILX.

Aren't you in SF, aka, fruitcake land? What do you know of the Northeast?

Alex in FL

Do you live everywhere at once that you can unequivocally state it's Racistland? What's your evidence for this "most racist" NE theory anyway?

guys you need to be putting this genius on the times thread for the betterment of all

I grew up in a town with literally no blacks until the 2000s. I went to a private all white beach & yacht club.

What is the most racist Sbarro in America?

There are beaches in Connecticut that still have a whites only policy. and unlike the South, there aren't any blacks .... anywhere, so if you happen to be one of the 1 or 2 black dudes in Madison, you're SOL. Unless you're one of the "really nice ones"... but even then.

I grew up in a town with literally no blacks until the 2000s.

Those South Dakota reservations are pretty racist.

There are basically two parts to New England - country club whitey + braindead working class moron (aka Boston) whitey. Trust me, they aren't particularly inclusive groups. My bro bro has a black girlfriend and my family in New England schemes at family parties at how to break them up. It's just part of the weird culture up there. In the South (perceived as the most racist part of the US), it has the highest rates of interracial marriage. You just don't get that in the Northeast, particularly New England.

Two beach signs in CT are your evidence? I stand by my earlier assessment.

you forgot about his racist family

There are beaches in Connecticut that still have a whites only policy

are you sure they didn't just mean white sand beaches?

Yeah I posted too quick.

You stand by having no clue whatsoever about culture up there. You'd only know it if you were part of it or had to deal with it as a minority.

what is the most racist board on ilx

No I stand by my assessment that anyone who would make a blanket statment like "X part of the county is the most racist" = a complete moron.

"New England's definitely the most racist part of the country"

What the fuck are you talking about???

Beaches and his family. Jeez Bill read a little.

If you're a part of it, you know it. I bet that Catsup dude knows what I'm talking about.

(the south) has the highest rates of interracial marriage.

by number maybe, but not per capita, which is minneapolis/st. paul, actually!

not that i have a source for this

it has "england" in the name xposts

what would the stantons think if they visited minneapolis

"There are beaches in Connecticut that still have a whites only policy"

I really doubt this.

Catsup do you know burt's family?

Is the question largest # of racist jerks or the highest % of racist jerks or the most institutionally racist city? Because I think the answer is different in each case.

otm, and then you have to get into what qualifies as institutional racism and the extent to which the population is responsible

I used my family as an example of the general culture up there; trust me, it's not just my family. It's representative of the culture.

and yes, there are whites only beaches in Connecticut. There was a huge legal battle over that a few years ago. See? You guys do not know what you are talking about.

Vidor, TX

95.July 22nd,
2008
3:37 pm My grandfather told me there are two kinds of racism in America: Southern Racism, which allowed black folks to live close by, so long as they didn’t get uppity; and Northern Racism, which allowed black folks to get uppity, so long as they didn’t live close by.

— Posted by Owen

Do you have a Southern family you can compare this to, burt? Preferably one with Klan roots so we can get a good picture? That might help us clear this up.

There are basically two parts to New England - country club whitey + braindead working class moron (aka Boston) whitey.

Burt that is some kind of ignorance you got going on there.

http://static.zooomr.com/images/688974_7e484081c8.jpg
racist beach

95.July 22nd,
2008
3:37 pm My grandfather told me there are two kinds of racism in America: Southern Racism, which allowed black folks to live close by, so long as they didn’t get uppity; and Northern Racism, which allowed black folks to get uppity, so long as they didn’t live close by.

— Posted by Owen

in the tradition of whites appropriating black culture, he stole this from dick gregory

In the North, they don't care how big I get, as long as I don't get too close.

"maintain limpness" xxpost

full quote
''In the South white people don't care how close I get as long as I don't get too big. In the North they don't care how big I get as long as I don't get too close.''

Dick Gregory = teh awesomeness

Klan roots? What is this, 1948? The only times you see a Klan parade it's like, 10 really old guys and 1,000 protestors.

Alex in SF, you my friend are clueless. Stick to your little west coast baggy khaki land.

(fwiw Klan's biggest membership was in the midwest, not the South. or New England. make of that what you will)

ahahahaha burt

didnt the klan originate in indiana

snark aside i would like to see the answer dr. venkatesh comes up with and how he got to it.

My Irish grandma blamed my Korean girlfriend for bombing Pearl Harbor.

baggy khaki land.

most non-sequitur stereotype of SF ever

Then that settles it: Indiana is the most racist city in America.

Well, given that the last time I was in Boston, i stayed with Dan P and his wife in what seemed to be a predominantly Indian part of Somerville (although I could be wrong), Burt's assessment of (greater) Boston is just ass.

Not saying Boston is the most culturally open city. But Burt's take on Boston is sooooo bullshit.

Boston is shit.

Ladies and gentlemen, Burt Stanton

Dr. Burt Stanton.

fruitcake land sounds like a nice city

[potentially bullshit generalization, but i think i know what i'm talking about] Boston is a tough place to be black for historical reasons. Boston is a pretty nice place to be like any other minority. Allston, Brighton, parts of Cambridge, Somerville, several of the other small cities are actually cool and open and integrated.

Burt's characterization of New England whites is basically offensive but whatever.

The real answer is probably whatever city tops the whitey charts at st0rmfr0nt.arrghhh

link?

lol it was joeks, these st0rmfr0nters are ruthless with the trackback board invasions, i am told.

As someone who lives in the Boston area, I'd say burt's take is over-exaggerated but not inaccurate, and the only reason I'd say it's over-exaggerated is due to the social stratum in which I live.

Also my neighborhood is mostly Brazilian/Haitian/Cape Verdian.

Goole, yeah. I just posted on the mods board to fix that. I should have garbled the URL.

Sorry, mods. :(

the lead guy from TV on the Radio had a funny truism about how racist Boston (something along the lines of "in Boston they shit on you, but then they give you a towel afterwards... so you can wipe their ass")

gone. no problem. xpost.

call all destroyer has a point but I have had conversations about Boston-area racism with friends of Taiwanese/Chinese/Filipino/Korean/Japanese descent; where I've been followed around stores by employees convinced I was going to steal something, they've been complemented on their immaculate English despite being born and raised in the US. Racist nonsense up here is nothing if not pluralistic.

why is that a truism, Shakey? or funny?

how many Boston racists are members of economically-challenged ethnic groups and what percentage of the population do those ethnic groups make up compared to other Northeast cities? < / racist >

lol it was joeks, these st0rmfr0nters are ruthless with the trackback board invasions, i am told.

-- goole, Wednesday, July 23, 2008 4:12 PM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

as an amateur st0rmfr0nt anthropologist i can say this isnt true at all

I just don't understand the characterization that every white person up here is a yuppie with a boat or a brandead Sully type who works construction. I am from the Boston suburbs, work a white-collar job, and therefore know about 100000000 white people up here, and that stereotype is not fucking true.

I'd say the worst run-ins I've had have been with blue-collar folks of Irish descent and white-collar first-generation folks from Russia. (Bear in mind that this is a total of maybe 4 incidents over... oh god I have lived here too long)

what city has the highest number of racially-motivated attacks adjusted for population (and income?) (and level of beer-consumption?)

x-post And yeah, those Sully types can be ignorant fucks and I'm not surprised that you've had incidents with them.

Gee, is there anything burt_stanton doesn't know?

I'd assume the proper "most racist" place in the U.S. is some small little-known town like whatever that one was that ran out the entire black community somewhere back toward the 30s and now it's occupied by one of the heads of the Klan and a bunch of retirees who move there specifically because everyone's white (though I think that town has a contingent that desperately wants to bring black people around, only all black people in the region are like "uhh no thanks I'll pass") --

But everyone sitting around being racist is different from places with contentious segregation/class issues (like St. Louis, probably the most messed-up place I've been to on that front), or places with weird cultures of antagonism (like Boston, where I can't always tell what's entirely racial and what's just about a city-wide culture of weird aggression). But I haven't spent long enough in many places to tell (I doubt anyone has), and I don't know much about the south beyond big cities like Atlanta.

I was cringing it'd be the Lou as soon as I saw the link.

Also AFAICGoogle there are no present day "white only" beaches in Conn., most are references to Florida and the South in the 60's.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sundown_town

So which century is the thread title making reference to?

I'd assume the proper "most racist" place in the U.S. is some small little-known town like whatever that one was that ran out the entire black community somewhere back toward the 30s and now it's occupied by one of the heads of the Klan and a bunch of retirees who move there specifically because everyone's white (though I think that town has a contingent that desperately wants to bring black people around, only all black people in the region are like "uhh no thanks I'll pass") --

This is very close to the situation in Vidor. They tried to integrate the public housing in town in the early '90s which brought out the Klan for a couple of rallies and within a few months the black families had moved back to Beaumont.

I think most people are interested in examining the question as applied to the biggest cities, or certainly nothing smaller than 100,000

This concept is too abstract to quantify obv, but the first thing that comes to my mind is Benton Harbor/St. Joseph, MI. Like Minneapolis/St. Paul, they are cities of nearly equal population separated only by one bridge. Yet Benton Harbor is 95% black, while St. Joseph is 95% white. And (surprise!), there is also a huge economic rift separating the two areas. From what I understand (I'm a MI native with friends who've come from/moved to the area), that bridge is like the Hatfield/McCoy property line and both sides have the battle scars to prove it (there were major riots there as recently as 2003).

OTHERS
I like to be in America!
O.K. by me in America!
Ev'rything free in America
For a small fee in America!

I still remember the Weekend Update with Fey and Fallon where they talked shit about a bunch of cities in which the show wasn't being shown (Sharpton was the guest, and since he was a candidate for President at the same time, some markets thought it would violate equal time laws in their state).

They had a bunch of harmless one-liners for various cities like Des Moines and Sacramento, but when they got to Boston, they kind of apologetically mumbled, "Boston...well, they just hate black people." And to paraphrase Homer Simpson, "it (was) funny because it's true."

And they hate Jews there, too: Anti-Semitism and anti-black sentiments are notoriously strong in Boston, and I'm kind of shocked that anyone would have the chutzpah to question that. It's not as bad as it was even twenty years ago, but it's still pretty bad, and racial tensions are still pretty high. And yes, Irish-Americans are frequently among the main perpetrators.

I don't at all agree that "New England's definitely the most racist part of the country", though I'd guess it's probably not the least racist, either.

And no, I can't offer stats (or stfu), but I've encountered a shitload of anecdotal evidence (via friends' stories of firsthand experiences) that makes me pretty confident in the above.

Also, "There are beaches in Connecticut that still have a whites only policy" -- uh, there are counties in other places that have that policy.

Ginger's "woe is white people" quote from that website=*eyeroll*

I think what people are missing about Boston is that much of the time now (as opposed to what was true in the past) it isn't about race, or not just; it is about the fact that many, many people in Boston are assholes. They hate people who are not their friends, whether black, gray, purple, Jew, Muslim, Pastafarian, etc. Obviously, I'm excluding any Bostoners here from such a blanket comment!

Where I grew up in New Hampshire was one of the worst places I've been as far as racial attitudes. I think it was because their weren't any minorities for hundreds of years (not counting the Catholics), and when suddenly "others" started moving in people freaked out. I hate going back there for any reason; more so since I am part of an interracial couple. Just not comfortable.

DC was the worst place I lived that had any sizable minority population. Horrible place where people of color were followed in stores, talked about as if they weren't there and generally encouraged to stay in segregated neighborhoods. My wife and I often heard things said as soon as people thought we were out of earshot.

Strangely, we rarely had that problem in Baltimore, and have never had that problem in southern Maine (I know their are notorious problems with Lewiston and the Somali immigrant population; we've thankfully never been to Lewiston).

My wife had to make a trip to Boston recently and was followed around a couple of stores, and had a salesperson walk away when she approached with a question. Bunch of Massholes.

i don't care if you're black, white, purple

lol I read that line and then thought of the thread and then there it was

Pastafarian = logical outcome of munchies?

By the way, God you people make Boston sound like hell. Is there something wrong with me for living here and being able to make friends and so on?

The last time I was in Boston was 1991, but I liked it, flaming garbage cans and all. I love Massachusetts, but I only know the cabin by the lake kayaking bullshit. Never met a "Masshole" really.

I think I'm just getting defensive because Fey and Fallon (who I always thought of as uber-classists) were trotted out as authorities, and because of phrases like "braindead working class" morons. Of course there's serious issues with personal and institutional racism in Boston, as elsewhere.

I think I'm just getting defensive because Fey and Fallon (who I always thought of as uber-classists) were trotted out as authorities

I think that's exaggerating things just a bit. (I mean the part about trotting them out as authorities -- I don't really watch a lot of SNL, and am indifferent to both of them.)

I'd rather not go into detail with some of the stories I've been told, since it's not my place to do so. But let's just say things like "landlord suddenly decides apartment isn't available upon learning that prospective tenant's last name is Jewish" still seem to be commonplace around Boston.

haha, people even do that? Jewish? Really?

FWIW, I like Boston, actually -- or some things about it, at least -- and have consistently enjoyed my time in the city. This is despite the fact that the driving/traffic/why-the-fuck-don't-you-label-your-roads? there is, hands-down, the worst I've ever seen.

xpost Um, yeah, to say the least.

I mean, for one, there are a lot of Catholics out there who have refused to accept the edicts of the Second Vatican Council. One of them's a rather famous actor/director, you might have heard of him, he made that snuff film a while back...

Weird. Of course I grew up in an area where in public school they made everyone play with dreidels and eat matzoh so we could get in touch with our Jewish classmates. I'm guessing they don't do that everywhere.

or places with weird cultures of antagonism (like Boston, where I can't always tell what's entirely racial and what's just about a city-wide culture of weird aggression)

lol this is pretty otm

a couple years ago i would've said boston in a heartbeat, but now i think their brand of racialism is just more aggressive whereas racialists in other places may be less overt, but also more hateful. imo.

burt did you grow up in brookline? brookline is israel~

I think what people are missing about Boston is that much of the time now (as opposed to what was true in the past) it isn't about race, or not just; it is about the fact that many, many people in Boston are assholes. They hate people who are not their friends, whether black, gray, purple, Jew, Muslim, Pastafarian, etc.

This is pretty OTM.

Indianapolis.

Catholics out there who have refused to accept the edicts of the Second Vatican Council.

BULLSHIT BULLSHIT BULLSHIT

Seriously do you have any idea what the fuck you're talking about?

OH Hey and their priests there are all pederasts LOLZ

Before anyone jumps my shit I will state reasonably that conflating Mel Fucking Gibson with Catholicism in Boston makes you sound like a fucking moron.

lolz

Catholics out there who have refused to accept the edicts of the Second Vatican Council.

I don't know if it's B.S. - as call all destroyer says - but what does this mean?

Referring to Nostra Aetate, no?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relations_between_Catholicism_and_Judaism

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traditionalist_Catholic

Traditionalist Catholics are Roman Catholics, or people who identify as Roman Catholics, who believe that there should be a restoration of many or all of the liturgical forms, public and private devotions and presentation of Catholic teachings which prevailed in the Catholic Church before the Second Vatican Council (1962-1965).

I think it's a stretch to accuse me of "conflating Mel Fucking Gibson with Catholicism in Boston". But then again, if you're accusing me of saying that Boston's tradition of anti-Semitism is somehow related to its status as a Catholic stronghold -- well, I'm not going to lose too much sleep over that.

aldo, yep

But Irish-Americans are incapable of doing anything wrong

Ditto the Irish, in general

Thanks Charlie. xxp

Dude, you went from:

But let's just say things like "landlord suddenly decides apartment isn't available upon learning that prospective tenant's last name is Jewish" still seem to be commonplace around Boston.

to:

I mean, for one, there are a lot of Catholics out there who have refused to accept the edicts of the Second Vatican Council. One of them's a rather famous actor/director, you might have heard of him, he made that snuff film a while back...

in three posts. Sorry for getting pissed, I'm not for-real catholic anymore but i grew up in that tradition and when people still ask you shit like "do they all still follow the pope over political leaders" and drop a million priest-molester jokes in your presence it makes you kind of defensive.

There is little if any traditional/fundamental Catholicism up here, it's a boring mainstream religion with unenthusiastic, reserved church services. If Boston has "a tradition of anti-semitism" stronger than other parts of the country you'd need to educate me on that but really eastern Mass. these days is probably one of the least strongly religious areas in the country.

I hear you, and while Jewish friends of mine ("I have lots of Jewish friends!") went through some pretty horrendous shit some years back -- repeated physical attacks, for one -- I should re-emphasize that from what I understand, things have gotten a lot better in Boston on the anti-Semitism front. Certainly that's apt to have something to do with the 2VC, etc., and it's not the church's fault if some of its members resist its efforts to move on. Obviously I disagree with the Catholic church on many issues (while respecting its progressive stance on others), but it's clear this is one where it's genuinely trying to make amends and do right.

way xpost but yes, exact, which is why I was saying before:

Boston, where I can't always tell what's entirely racial and what's just about a city-wide culture of weird aggression

... which, if anyone can tell me what the deal is with that, I'd love to know.

Also xposting: Indianapolis strikes me as having the same type of problem St. Louis does, and yet less heatedly, somehow.

I've been thinking about that Nabisco, can you elaborate a bit on what you mean by weird aggression?

... which, if anyone can tell me what the deal is with that, I'd love to know.

This is merely conjecture but I always assumed it was the outcome of the conflict between people who were immigrant, Irish and Catholic in a town whose dominant population, once upon a time, was 'anti-Papist', Anglo/bigoted against the Irish, and looked down on all the poor/working class. The proverbial snobbery of the Boston 'Brahmins' is (in)famous, no?

"I've been thinking about that Nabisco, can you elaborate a bit on what you mean by weird aggression?"

Red Sox fans.

Also c'mon, even apart from racism or a history of being an underclass and whatever else, people of Irish cultural heritage are the most ball-busting, shit-talking, prankingest group I can think of. There's that whole Borderer dislike/suspicion of authority already and a substantial sort of "Trickster" inheritance. It's not a particularly earnest or formal culture to begin with, as far as I can tell?

so dude never really followed up on this huh

As a native of Connecticut, I would just like to reiterate that the claim that it has whites-only beaches is total bullshit.

Which Connecticut are you native of, though? There's the grungy inland part, and the good part by the coast, like Madison and Olde Lyme.

I see Indianapolis listed on here a couple of times, but at least by comparison, I think there is a whole lot more racial tension in Cincinnati or at least what I can tell from living in both places for a while.

Cinci is a weird town, the topography of the town seems to really separate areas and there is a very active and loud political scene from both ends of the spectrum and they don't seem to like each other very much. Indianapolis is really tame by comparison, there may be tension but the politics of the town are a whole lot less vitriolic.

If you go historically, yeah there was some real bad stuff that went down in Indiana in the 20s and 30s with the klan and all. I'm not sure that it is quite as applicable today, as a lot of those old car factory towns are screwed for all residents. Those towns are heavy and sad for anyone involved.

Connecticut has shitty parts both on its coast and inland (same for nice parts), and I don't really think that Madison and Old Lyme are at all indicative of what most towns on the coast are like. They're pretty awesome though.

I was born and raised in what is apparently referred to as "the gold coast." Don't hate me because of it.

The "Gold Coast" really isn't Connecticut... it's basically a piece of Long Island that got pulled away during an earthquake and drifted upwards. It's like calling Westchester County "New York state". Technically true, but not really.

Milwaukee only desegregated its schools in 1976? How was it not federally mandated to have been desegregated decades before?

http://uwmpost.com/article/53/13/4107-Our-segregated-city-part-one-

prob because that's when a court told them specifically they had a problem and had to start busing--that happened a whole bunch of places. i don't think it says in the article but i would guess milwaukee never had legally segregated schools in the first place so after brown came down they probably thought they didn't have to do anything.

A number of cities were sued and instituted busing programs to desegregate schools in the mid '70s. Desegregation efforts in Boston in the mid '70s sparked violence.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Soiling_of_Old_Glory

OK, Boston it is.

boston seems right.

there's a lot of racism in l.a. too... the WASPs hate the mexicans hate the armenians hate the koreans hate the etc etc. we all just hate each other; it's an excuse to keep ourselves isolated from our fellow humans.

in NYC, the prevailing attitude is "i don't hate you because of your race or ethnicity, i hate you 'cause you're an asshole." (obviously racism exists there, but being an asshole supersedes anything else that might be "wrong" with you.)

I think there is a whole lot more racial tension in Cincinnati or at least what I can tell from living in both places for a while.

Cinci is a weird town, the topography of the town seems to really separate areas and there is a very active and loud political scene from both ends of the spectrum and they don't seem to like each other very much

OTM. cincinnati was racism central when i grew up there in the 60s and 70s. ironically people there pride themselves on not being southern yet the racial attitudes were the same.

suburban DETROIT takes the cake though. when i lived in that area during college i was pretty blown away by the casual expressions of racism and it wasn't like I hadn't heard this idiotic bullshit my whole life -- "maaaark our dog just doesn't like ni**ers" -- but people from the southern michigan suburbs would code it in vicious "jokes" so if you objected you didn't have a sense of humor. (this is why i never bought the critical line about eminmem's anti-gay joeks being ironical or whatever.) more than any other U.S. city Detroit never recovered from the riots in 1967.

Milwaukee only desegregated its schools in 1976? How was it not federally mandated to have been desegregated decades before?

http://uwmpost.com/article/53/13/4107-Our-segregated-city-part-one-

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― your son rip is on line toot (iiiijjjj), Saturday, June 13, 2009 6:58 PM Bookmark

de jure vs de facto

Is the question largest # of racist jerks or the highest % of racist jerks or the most institutionally racist city? Because I think the answer is different in each case.

― Alex in SF, Wednesday, July 23, 2008 2:22 PM

I was thinking exactly this right before I read it. Of the two major cities I've lived in, Houston is *way* higher in the percentage of people who are not only racist, but completely comfortable with their bigotry. They'll throw around the n-word in mixed company with no fear nor retribution, assume that all criminals are black by default, etc. And yet the city isn't as structurally racist as many places -- there aren't many areas that you just can't go at night because you're the wrong color, and the cops aren't even that notorious for kicking more of the darker-hued asses. Mostly, everyone is mixed together economically and racially, even if they don't much care for one another. Chicago, OTOH is, *massively* institutionally racist, thanks in part to the first Mayor Daley, who made it a matter of public policy to keep the blacks on the South Side. It worked. I fell asleep on the train a couple weeks ago and woke up way on the South Side, near 95th street, and I was quite literally the only non-black person in the train car, and then the only non-black person on the train platform, and in fact the only non-black person anywhere in sight. How many places does that happen, even in big American cities?

That reminds me of how once, a couple of college buddies and I took this whirlwind road trip of the Midwest one weekend, circling through Missouri, Iowa, the Twin Cities, Wisconsin, Chicago, and back to Missouri in about 36 hours.

We found ourselves in Chicago at seven on a Sunday morning and decided to be adventurous and just hop on the first train car we caught. Within a few stops, we were the only white people on the train.

My friends were getting nervous and looking out the window a lot. An old man was reading the paper, saw us, folded it in half and looked at me. "So, where you all from?" I said Arkansas, and he nodded. "I've got family in Blytheville. It's a pretty state."

He then told us we could get off at the next stop, cross the platform, and catch the next train if we were "interested in seeing the Sears Tower."

(I keep reading this thread title to the tune of "The Most Beautiful Girl in the World", even though the syllables don't fit.
"Hey, did you happen to see the most racist city in America?
And if you did, was it Boston? Baawwwsss-ton"

He then told us we could get off at the next stop, cross the platform, and catch the next train if we were "interested in seeing the Sears Tower."

That's nice of him. I'm sure he wouldn't have said anything if you hadn't looked nervous. Would have assumed you were after some kick-ass barbecue or something. :)

I was quite literally the only non-black person in the train car, and then the only non-black person on the train platform, and in fact the only non-black person anywhere in sight. How many places does that happen, even in big American cities?

everywhere-- from sea to shining sea

its pretty common where i live for me to be the only non-black person on the subway car, the platform, each block that i walk home, my apartment building, etc! and i very much doubt my experience is unique in NYC--especially not in bed-stuy

Bed Stuy is overwhelmingly black, sure, but it's also not over half of a giant city.

plenty of places in Atlanta, Baltimore, Memphis, St. Louis, DC, etc.

Yes yes there are black neighborhoods in every city, and not every neighborhood SHOULD be mixed, IMO. My point was more about how deliberate, systematic, widespread, and old the segregation is.

i was chattin about this w/erstwhile ilxor fluffy bear, prior to his trip to the south, and we seemed to agree that mpls/st paul are about as institutionally racist as any other northern city, but that, for example, "mixed" relationships are probably more common and normal here than they are elsewhere.

also most of the twin cities' minority population is comprised of immigrants and refugees, which changes the dynamic somehow

fwiw, i've always thought that the rule of thumb was

- north: institutionally racist, but avg person is much less likely to say horrible things (and will be grossly offended by suggestions of racism, even if they like cross the street when they see some young african american men)
- south: actually out and out racist in parts, but everyone's living all over everyone else, and even white ppl who say horrible things probably have more african american friends and acquaintances than most totally not racist northern liberals.

like i've got this stereotype of southern dudes who will very casually drop into something like that chris rock bit about the difference between black ppl and n***ers ("black ppl drive like this blah blah blah oh i didn't mean *james* he's not like the rest etc etc")

am i totally wrong??

Not in my experience, no. It's like how people honk their car horn in the north to let you know they're there, or that they're pissed at you, or because they're bored. Down south that's considered totally rude and unthinkable -- they won't ever honk at you, but they'll shoot you.

I was quite literally the only non-black person in the train car, and then the only non-black person on the train platform, and in fact the only non-black person anywhere in sight. How many places does that happen, even in big American cities?

atlanta

Yeah, I give. You're totally right. MARTA is even elevated tracks in places.

the public transportation breakdown in los angeles is this (and i say this as one of the rare white nondrivers here): mostly latino, some black (usually men), lots of teenagers and elderly and disabled folks of every race/ethnicity, a smattering of poor whites and whites who have lost their license or are generally homeless or drunk, some "hipster" whites like me (mostly with bicycles), some hipster asian girls carrying their design homework for FIDM. if they're eurasian or middle eastern they tend to be armenian or russian. this is true in most parts of town, although some places are obviously more segregated than others.

Columbia, SC?

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/politics/2009/06/13/hoover.michelle.gorilla.wis

I was quite literally the only non-black person in the train car, and then the only non-black person on the train platform, and in fact the only non-black person anywhere in sight. How many places does that happen, even in big American cities?

atlanta

that's what my parents said about the place. is Atlanta, like LA, a place where a car is a virtual necessity for anyone of means?

Northern racism: They don't care how uppity you get as long as you don't live near them

Southern racism: They don't care if you live near them as long as you don't get too uppity

is how I break it down to an extent

That's been said upthread a coupla times already Rev (but it's a good quote and well worth reading more than once all the same)

um i think he was breaking it down to an extent, dude

think that's generally used to refer to places East of the Rockies, xxp

i sort of assumed that the whole north/south divide only existed east of the rockies??

just pointing out that Rev's breaking it down about two places he's never been

(waits for it)

the institutional racism in chicago runs deep and is firmly entrenched, but i think racial tensions to a large degree aren't what they are in other places, at least in places that i've been. l.a. is much worse imo.

the west is the west

also, it's completely possible I gleaned that nugget from upthread

idaho city, ID

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/04/28/the-most-racist-places-in-america-according-to-google/

clarification: cities where google users searched for the n-word the most

yeah, seems like there'd be some spurious positives from that

idk maybe it's brooklyn?

cw offensive stereotyping

So what the colonizer hell is Elrow Chinese Rowyear? pic.twitter.com/JzpzbIzisg

— Rafael Shimunov (@rafaelshimunov) February 12, 2023

idk maybe it's brooklyn?

cw offensive stereotyping

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they're bringing that "experience" to brooklyn soon

ever so “subtly” mixing in “Short Dick Man” as well

(in a very awkward #onethread with my post in the 2022 EOY tracks rollout thread, what are the fucking odds?)