Best Horror Film of 1981 (part 3 of a series)

V. embarassed to say I've only seen The Beyond, which I cannot imagine being better than everything else.

haha this is an easy one

prediction of winner: evil dead

i think ill vote my bloody valentine tho

"Evil Dead" is almost certainly going to run away with this, but I'm voting for "American Werewolf" because it was a constant favorite of 12-year-old me. I didn't even see Evil Dead until I was in my late 20s.

Went with The Howling.

hate Evil Dead, i was hoping American Werewolf would have walked this. great film

Wow it was totally the year of the werewolf wasn't it?

I might go totally rogue on this one and vote evilspeak

The Entity is worth watching on instawatch, y/n?

Although "Scanners," dammit.

y

xp

Evil Dead

what a great year tho. I love 80s horror

evilspeak is a pretty bad movie but a) it's called evilspeak and b)
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y176/edwardiii/evilspeak-44.jpg

Scanners is kind of a mess of a movie, Cronenberg still feeling his way around but. MacGoohan is awesome in it, of course. Tons of these I haven't seen but would happily watch most of the sequels on this list (Piranha II, Halloween II, F13th)

"Evilspeak" and "Blood Beach" and "The Burning" and "Omen III" might as well have been on a continuous loop on HBO and Cinemax when I was a kid. I saw them so many times.

I love scanners. the execution sucks but the ideas are fantastic. don't wanna repeat the "what is horror" debate here, but I wouldn't call it a horror film.

don't wanna repeat the "what is horror" debate here, but I wouldn't call it a horror film.

yeah kinda feelin you on this one tbf

Yeah, it's more a sci-fi/paranoid conspiracy thriller than a horror movie. Exploding heads do not horror make. It's more of a kind with "Existenz" than "Rabid."

HARD SCIFI

step

demonz in my computah

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y176/edwardiii/evilspeak-17.jpg

black candles, unholy water, consecrated host, clint howard

where does one get unholy water?

pazuzu springs

Evil Dead will be a fully deserving landslide winner, but I'm probably throwing my vote to The Beyond or The Funhouse.

the funhouse is underrated, one of the few films one can point to when launching a "tobe hooper is not a hack" defense

tobe hooper is not a hack btw

i remember happy birthday to me being pretty fun

i will fight to the death for the honor of tobe hooper. frankly raimi has had as many hack fucking moments in his later career if not more.

xpost right thinking people agree

for example, i just watched texas chainsaw massacre part II yesterday and you know what it was? IT WAS FUCKING AWESOME is what it was

"Evil Dead" over "Scanners"

"Wolfen" isn't scary enough, but it's one of those movies I can watch whenever it's on, so I'm giving it a vote.

I voted for "evil dead" but it was very close between that, "American Werewolf" and "Scanners"

for example, i just watched texas chainsaw massacre part II yesterday and you know what it was? IT WAS FUCKING AWESOME is what it was

dude I know I am the kind of guy who sometimes gets on a dude's nerves but as of this post you and I are blood bros forever before that movie is permanently the shit

before = because, lol afternoon wine

American Werewolf, if for no other reason than the aerial shot of the werewolf slowly pacing towards his victim in the underground. Such a superbly effective shot that 99% of CGI effects people should be shamed by.

Friday The 13th Part II is one of the most inept pieces of shit I've ever seen.

I wouldn't call hooper a hack but I can see where ppl are coming from. maybe toolbox murders 2004 is a lot better than I give it credit? what I've seen of his tv work has been crap and his feature film track record is kind of spotty. anybody wanna defend these?

Mortuary (2005/I)
Toolbox Murders (2004)
Crocodile (2000/I) (V)
The Mangler (1995)
Night Terrors (1993)
Spontaneous Combustion (1990)
The Texas Chainsaw Massacre 2 (1986) - wouldn't call this a great horror film but it's awesome camp, maybe he realized that going gonzo was the best way to avoid having to top the original
Invaders from Mars (1986) - know I saw it during it's nonstop run on HBO in the 80s but can't remember anything about it
Lifeforce (1985) - this movie is insane by any standard and impossible to judge really
The Funhouse (1981) - yeah I like this one, v underrated
Salem's Lot (1979) - has some classic moments but more boring ones
Eaten Alive (1977) - saw it a looong time ago and don't have good memories
The Texas Chain Saw Massacre (1974) - all-time classic no doubt

is 2 the one with Matthew McConnaheyhey and Jennifer Aniston

er Renee Zellwegger

no it's the one with a batshit dennis hopper dueling chainsaws w/ leatherface, kinda hard to forget imo

lol yeah never seen it

haven't see many, but liked Wolfen at the time, Evil Dead later. As far as I can recall American Werewolf starts great but runs outta gas.

uzi wielding nazi werewolf house invasion dream sequence. intense.

this is one of the reasons i <3 ilx - because there are awesome, intelligent people that have seen and loved even more "schlocky" horror movies than i have!

Predictable vote for the unparalleled Evil Dead. Wolfen is a noble second & wd win in a lot of years.

American Werewolf is another great film that I quote all the time but I can't vote for on the grounds of horror/scariness alone.

Am I right in thinking The Black Cat's got Ben Gazzara in it? Cos I heart that dude to death but iirc the movie's a big bag of nothing and well short of Corman's verzh.

Friday The 13th Part II is one of the most inept pieces of shit I've ever seen.

enjoy your SB, baghead Jason is my God

You forgot Poltergeist in your Hooper list, Edward. Sort of.

Seriously, Amy Steel is like the best F13 final girl EVER, and her whole mind-fuck with Jason by pretending to be Mrs. Voorhees is aces.

SPOILER

yeah so me and aerosmith we are OTM, moms severed head altar alone makes part II better than the original imo xposts

Evil Dead. Though The Beyond is great.

F132 is definitely better than the original (4 is probably the best of the series)

An American Werewolf in London - it's MAYBE only in the last ten mins or so that this runs outta steam, every other part is just perfect
The Beyond - Fulci's best
Bloody Moon - typical Jess Franco stinker that gained some infamy in the UK as a 'video nasty' (mainly cos of the vhs sleeve):
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_jnXVz6pLVOY/RnGbvz_h68I/AAAAAAAADXA/z9CNxNDzg7c/s400/bloody_moon.jpg
The Burning - early credit for the Weinstein Bros I do believe, Savini effects, pretty gd Friday the 13th knock-off
Dead & Buried - another 'video nasty' in the uk (mainly cos of a fairly gruesome injury-to-eye scene iirc) - really underrated movie imho, quite an original mash-up of Invasion of the Body Snatchers and Night of the Living Dead w/ a nice small town setting, written by Dan O'Bannon and directed by Gary Sherman, who also made the great 70s cannibal-tube station flick Death Line (aka Raw Meat) - the Anchor Bay dbl disc DVD of this is well worth tracking down
Deadly Blessing - one of Wes Craven's worst
The Entity - creepey rape-spook shit, from the director of The Ipcress File
Evilspeak - Clint Howard's finest hour
Halloween II - the uk dvd of this has a v. informative Kim Newman/Stephen Jones commentary track that's prob more interesting than the movie - for example, didn't know beforehand that Carpenter went back and directed extra gore scenes to make it more like Friday the 13th rather than (duh) Halloween
The Hand - written by Oliver Stone, this has always been v. hard to see in the UK for some reason
Happy Birthday to Me - again, a classic vid nasty sleeve
http://www.horrordrive-in.com/serendipity/uploads/happy_birthday_to_meorig.jpg
The Howling - great Bottin effects, clever script, awesome cast - Kevin McCarthy, John Carradine, Robert Picardo, Slim Pickens, Kenneth Tobey, Dick Miller, Patrick Macnee - but still no match for AMIL
Inseminoid - aka Horror Planet (in the US) - really sleazy brit knock-off of Alien from UK auteur Norman J Warren, w/ Judy Geeson getting preggo by alien
Just Before Dawn - Big influence on Cabin Fever and other backwoods horror psycho fare - Quentin Tarantino's favourite DVD commentary track (Jeff Lieberman is insanely outspoken/negative throughout!)
The Prowler - again, Savini effects (inc an eye-popping shower snuff), above average stalk+slasher w/ the odd nice period touch
Wolfen - the only other directorial credit for Woodstock director/editor Michael Wadleigh!

no FUCKING WAY is the 2nd F13TH better than the first, which is a genuinely scary movie that no other entry in the series came close to match

ing

Ward's posts remind me that there was a time when horror was a subgenre film geeks would toil in and then eventually leave - does that even happen anymore? nowadays it seems like you make yr name in horror, yr stuck there

I should watch The Howling

Where's Mommy Dearest?

modern special effects still don't stack up to [American Werewolf]

Psyched for 82 poll so I can sock up and vote the shit out of Xtro.

If I can annoy y'all with film score nerdery, Omen III is a really fantastic orchestral Goldsmith joint, easily the equal of his oscar-winning satanic mass for the first film.

While Deadly Blessing and Wolfen are a couple of pretty cool pre-stardom James Horner scores, especially Wolfen.

Also, Edward III's one-sentence summary of Lifeforce upthread makes me wanna see it really bad.

Is Lifeforce the "nudey porno alien is nude and kills some dudes" movie? If so it's worth seeing.

Here is a neat little review of Lifeforce. Fun fact: the movie's based off of a Colin Wilson novel called The Space Vampires.

)ou forgot Poltergeist in your Hooper list, Edward. Sort of.

― SNEEZED GOING DOWN STEPS, PAIN WHEN PUTTING SOCKS ON (Deric W. Haircare), Wednesday, June 23, 2010 4:44 PM (1 hour ago)

spielberg film imo

no FUCKING WAY is the 2nd F13TH better than the first, which is a genuinely scary movie that no other entry in the series came close to match

u r rong, part II is better.

F13 part 1 has better gore effects and the photography looks better, but everything else about part 2 is better: the acting, the editing, the scares.

i would go so far to say that there is exactly one good scare in part 1, and thats leaping lake jason, outside of that meh

which is sort of a rip-off of Carrie anyway. It's the only bit of the film that scared the shite out of me.

the sequence in part 2 where the "final girl" is hiding in the shed and we see jason running towards it through the window is the best sequence in the whole series (sleeping bag kill in part 7 is second best).

Morbius, I can't remember, do you generally like Joe Dante's stuff or not?

("Howling" has as one of its many character actors lol Dennis Dugan, erstwhile Disney star who has since gone on to direct countless Adam Sandler crapfests.)

I've been meaning to watch The Howling forever, but never have. Not a fan of Scanners, even though one of the guys who gets his head blown up taught a course I took on French cinema a year or two later. I like American Werewolf, especially the soundtrack, but Evil Dead is still an easy pick. I'm very surprised Chariot of Fire won best picture in a year that produced both Blood Beach and Inseminoid.

I love PKD & Cronenberg but Scanners really did nothing for me.

yeah I can't quite put my finger on why it doesn't work, but it really doesn't.

head blows up too soon in film. movie was bound to disappoint after that

but I'd watch a movie with noting but heads blowing up for 90 minutes so what do I know

they should remake Ordinary People w/this aproach

Major drawback of Scanners is the aptly-named Stephen Lack, who is a charisma vacuum. Movie is also surprisingly claustrophobic -- except for a couple of chase sequences, everything seems so closed off.

Yeah, the whole thing feels like it could have been filmed in a walk-in closet.

I love that Scanners is one of those films that's inspired tons of no-copyright rip-offs in Hong Kong and elsewhere. Saw Scanner Cop once. It's kinda like you'd expect.

I'd argue that Cronenberg's movies up until maybe The Fly all have turgid sequences and weird off-kilter claustrophobia. Personally that's part of their charm.

i was going through the cronenberg on cronenberg book looking for things to see -- scanners was alright to me -- but i guess consensus is other movies like the brood are better?

Scanners is pretty long and talky iirc but again I take that as good times.

maybe i had much lowered expectations thinking of it as a bizarre canadian tax dodge caper.

for example, i just watched texas chainsaw massacre part II yesterday and you know what it was? IT WAS FUCKING AWESOME is what it was

― AESTHOLE (jjjusten), Wednesday, June 23, 2010 12:52 PM (4 hours ago) Bookmark

and scanners is weird. not a horror movie at all, though it was marketed as one and clearly makes a big point of horrifying its audience. all of cronenberg's movies have a weird aspie awkwardness to them, especially when it comes to the performances of his leading men, but scanners is the one movie that really suffers for it. it's got some great ideas, but a lot of it feels inert, like an architectural rendering of a film, which makes its talkiness and plodding conspiracy thrills hard to enjoy.

all of cronenberg's movies have a weird aspie awkwardness to them, especially when it comes to the performances of his leading men,

I don't think that's true at all! The male lead in the Brood seems perfectly normal, and James Woods in Videodrome doesn't really come across as "aspie-like" - and Peter Weller in Naked Lunch is a junkie, not an aspie ...and I'm assuming you're talking about Cronenberg up until the Viggo era.

voted for an american werewolf over a lot of close competition: evil dead, the howling, dead & buried, etc. american werewolf was huge to me as a kid and has held up very well over the years. unlike most of the films on this list, it doesn't require the allowances that fans make for the genre in order to be counted a success. the script is great, the performances two-dimensional and appealing, and it's put together extremely well, developing not just atmosphere and suspense, but character and place. plus some truly awesome prosthetics work from rick baker, absolutely mind-blowing at the time.

dead & buried is a cool little film, written by dan o'bannon and ronald shusett, who'd also written alien together. it's nowhere near as visually inventive or cinematically accomplished as ridley scott's film, but it's nonetheless a cool and creative little horror mystery. atmospheric and extremely gory, with a story that's reminiscent of 70s UK horror: more dependent on wild imagination than on standard genre tropes.

In high school me and a pal watched the first eight friday the 13ths in two days for the teen page of the local paper's halloween issue. II was faaaaaaar and away our favorite, haven't seen it since but voting for that out of nostalgia and the memories alone. And the wheelchair kid flying down the stairs with an axe in his face.

i would go so far to say that there is exactly one good scare in part 1, and thats leaping lake jason, outside of that meh

the one good scare in friday the 13th one is this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_SOq3MWTms

most you'd see of kevin's bacon until Wild Things

I think five was our second favorite behind II for having the most nudity, IV coming in third for the presence of Crispin Glover and Corey Feldman.

I don't think that's true at all! The male lead in the Brood seems perfectly normal, and James Woods in Videodrome doesn't really come across as "aspie-like" - and Peter Weller in Naked Lunch is a junkie, not an aspie ...and I'm assuming you're talking about Cronenberg up until the Viggo era.

― sarahel, Wednesday, June 23, 2010 6:14 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark

this is sort of a broken thread in his films, as the quality i'm describing is sometimes present in the characters as written, and sometimes seems to be an accidental (?) by-product of the performance. jeremy irons in dead ringers plays a character who is apparently supposed to be extremely "aspie awkward" (half of the team, anyway), but the performance is rich, humane and clear, not at all opaque. same might be said of james woods in videodrome, but there it's less evident what we were meant to make of the character as written. and in history of violence, it seems that viggo was coached into giving a robotically simplifed performance - it's unusual for him and quite different from his turn in eastern promises. on the other hand, you have paul weller in naked lunch, whose featureless performance sits mask-like over the film, preventing any real understanding of the character.

i think that the early cronenberg was specifically interested in isolation, estrangement and clinical detachment, in human beings as instances of programming as much as discrete individuals. that's probably part of what drew him to blank-slate actors and disassociated characters. but i wonder if isn't somehow fundamental to his character, too.

isn't scanners the one where the guy's head explodes sponteneously, like it was a mellon busted open by that bald, unfunny 70s-comedian?

that's got to be the best film of 1981!

george carlin was hella funny!

THAT'S NOT THE BALD, UNFUNNY 70S-COMEDIAN I WAS TALKING ABOUT.

I assumed you were referring to his blowing of minds.

http://steelturman.typepad.com/thesteeldeal/images/gallagher_sledge_o_matic_watermelon_smas.gif

and scanners is weird. not a horror movie at all, though it was marketed as one and clearly makes a big point of horrifying its audience. all of cronenberg's movies have a weird aspie awkwardness to them, especially when it comes to the performances of his leading men, but scanners is the one movie that really suffers for it. it's got some great ideas, but a lot of it feels inert, like an architectural rendering of a film, which makes its talkiness and plodding conspiracy thrills hard to enjoy.

Cronenberg said that it went into production before the script was finished, and I got the impression he wasn't especially happy with the finished film. But it's one of my favorites — for me it's his most "fun" film (though maybe I'm a little aspie myself). If the conspiracy theories plod, it fits the mold of a certain early-eighties doominess that I have always adored, echoed by the bits in Howard Shore's score that sound like industrial collapse. I have a hard time seeing the "architectural" aspect as problematic, but then I actually like Stereo and Crimes of the Future, which seem fascinated with documenting architectural spaces and the antisocial behaviors of the people in them.

Yeah, the whole thing feels like it could have been filmed in a walk-in closet.

Multiple x-posts

i think that the early cronenberg was specifically interested in isolation, estrangement and clinical detachment, in human beings as instances of programming as much as discrete individuals. that's probably part of what drew him to blank-slate actors and disassociated characters. but i wonder if isn't somehow fundamental to his character, too.

I just don't see why this is a problem, though. It seems to me like this quality is central to what makes his films interesting.

― eatandoph, Wednesday, June 23, 2010 6:56 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark

nah, peter weller was great, he kind of nails that burroughs reporter like vibe. he's supposed to be kinda detached from what's happening to him.

tot missed that this was Scanners' year. Pending re-viewing of Wolfen, that wd be my choice.

do you generally like Joe Dante's stuff or not?

I didn't partic care for the Gremlinses -- esp that 'satirical' sequel -- so I'd pick his Twilight Zone: The Movie segment over Innerspace (prime Deniis Quaid hotness) and that Looney Tunes abortion. Except he did a couple "Police Squad!" episodes, which must be his best work.

i think we talked about this in another thread but, i think the opaque/awkward actors work better in Cronenberg's films than Lynch's, where Lynch is constantly doing this tightrope act between authentically surreal and weird and calculatedly quirky and "wacky". For most of Cronenberg's films, the plot and theme revolves around bodily horror, deformity, disease, taboos - and the awkward presences of the actors really brings out the fragility of the body, that it's constantly under attack/threatened. I dunno - there's probably a more accurate/apt way of phrasing this, or maybe the truth is something related, but not quite this.

lynch vs. cronenberg is interesting in this regard. you're right that the awkwardness or blankness of cronenberg's characters does seem more directly connected to the evident themes of his films. you mention "bodily horror, deformity, disease, taboos..." to that i'd add the plasticity of identity, of humanity. to my mind, that's cronenberg's primary concern, though it's often grotesquely overshadowed by the graphic body horror business. his characters are always being reconfigured or reprogrammed: by society, biology and technology, by drugs or madness, by their own emotions and desires. in some sense, the constant transformations and betrayals of the flesh are just a metaphor for this more fundamental vulnerability. we are not who we think we are, because our thinking is discontinuous, unreliable.

lynch's films and characters work in a very different way. i don't see them as the articulation of ideas or arguments, as thematic texts in a direct, cronenberg-like sense. instead, they're environments, associative landscapes that we're invited to inhabit and experience. the awkwardness of the performances is, as you say, intended to walk a tightrope between the disconcertingly surreal and the blandly comical. this creates a dissonance that becomes another level of disturbance, making the goofy stuff as uncomfortable as the outright horror. or so it seems to me. i respect lynch because i think he walks the tightrope so damn well, and because his best films refuse to settle into comfortable patterns, even when we think we understand them. not sure that cronenberg so consistently hits his mark.

probably the last i'll say on this for fear of getting too off-topic, but, I think whether Lynch walks the tightrope well is a matter of personal taste, and your taste and my taste vis a vis Lynch differ significantly.

the two davids are like children of mine. couldn't choose between them.

agree completely about the role taste plays in this. i'm a big lynch fan, to the point where i maybe blind myself to his faults.

but back to the actual poll options - i agree with whomever extolled the greatness of the score for Omen III. As a movie, it wasn't as good as the other Omens, including Omen IV, probably due to the fact Damian was an adult.

The Entity is almost the exact movie as Poltergeist, except with explicit ghost rape

exact same*

As a movie, it wasn't as good as the other Omens, including Omen IV, probably due to the fact Damian was an adult.

I actually really loved Sam Neill's big speech in this, as well as some of the crazy set pieces (the demon scouts with the doberman!). Even with the literal deus ex machina ending (complete with bible quote), I would probably take it over Omen II, which had that crazy choir go off a few seconds before anything remotely exciting (take it over the remake too). Omen IV, which I only recently saw, is whole nother league of crazy above this, though.

Omen IV is awesome. It, like Planet of the Apes, goes against the theory that sequels get progressively worse.

I can't believe it was originally aired on Fox! Love that HBO has put it in rotation all the same, feels like an honor.

it's like the Rudy of Omen sequels

so did anyone see Fred Astaire's last film, up there?

need to see omen iv, apparently

All the wolf movies are great in this lot. I think "The Howling" is the scariest/smartest of the bunch, with "American Werewolf" right up there but more funny than scary. "Wolfen" is such a great idea given a so-so execution. "Evil Dead" is a tour de force. People forget how intense the first one is!

And yeah, I'm first in line to ride the Hooper/hack train, but "The Funhouse" is a solid slasher (that I saw on cable all the time). But also, it could have been directed by anyone. Seem to recall "Hell Night" being serviceable, unless I'm thinking of "Prom Night." or "Terror Train."

Maybe I'm thinking of "One Dark Night" (1983)? "Hell Night" is some Linda Blair shit.

re: fred astaire

missed ghost story on the list when reading it over. not the greatest movie in the world, but i dug it. deliberately old-fashioned, um, ghost story, with an impressive cast a lot of studio polish. and it's fun to see astaire, douglas fairbanks jr, patricia neal and melvyn douglas all together in one film.

re: american werewolf,
how would you guys rate Thriller if it were in here? (the non-singing/dancing parts)

"Thriller" is solid! Nice to see MJ didn't skimp when it came to making it actually cinematic. Kind of surreal to think of the guy watching "American Werewolf" and going "get me Landis!"

Or, hell, maybe he watched "Blue Brothers" and then said "get me Landis!" MJ was a weird cat.

I'm pretty sure I read somewhere American Werewolf was his favorite movie, at least that year.

Sorry, I suddenly remember ... Michael Jackson WAS a weird cat!

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:OnMJst9Nuk1XwM:http://galeon.hispavista.com/fxcr3aturesalive/img/Wwere

dude, the snout and teeth are canine, not feline.

he had the weird cat-eyes tho! closeup on the last shot.

always bugged me that one of the pupils was kinda crooked. like your gonna spend a billion dollars on a music video, at least get your contact lenses in right.

"your"

xxxpost Scanners...I think that movie works pretty well except for two scenes: the scene where Lack tries to telepathically infiltrate the computer system, and the way Dr. Ruth goes superaspie towards the end...both of these don't really make much sense and do injure the movie's atmosphere, but neither really sink the movie, which is pretty great in my opinion.

I saw scanners in the theaters and thought it was decent, didn't love it. later in life, when I was hanging around a lot with ellis dee, I saw it again and really loved it. the concept of a bunch of amazing ppl who were self-destructive outcasts unless they took their meds, with some being able to control their weird condition by making insane art, really resonated w/ me. being able to forgive the film's technical limitations is key, from the wooden lead (I agree with contenderizer this is part of cronenberg's style, and mr lack is one of his least effective mannequins) to the awkward plotting. the sound even goes out of sync with the film for several minutes!

don't agree with the "filmed in a walk-in closet", there are tons of diff sets, exteriors, etc. but it is part of the film's problems, the scope was more ambitious than the budget would allow, like he was trying to make an international conspiracy film for $112 (canadian). you want to talk about claustrophobic, try shivers.

Can we have a separate poll for best movie poster of 1981?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/ec/The_Hand_Poster.jpg

vs.

http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/G/01/ciu/f4/e7/42f2b340dca074bb6b2b8010.L.jpg

hard to tell exploitation producers eventually got tired of holiday-themed horror movies or if they just ran out of holidays

hard to tell if...

http://www.movieposter.com/posters/archive/main/8/MPW-4002

vs.
http://www.wrongsideoftheart.com/wp-content/gallery/cache/6589__x400_hell_night_poster_01.jpg

we have a horror festival here where they exhibit a ton of those posters & lobby cards...they are so awesome

I need to see "Ghost Story" again. IIRC I enjoyed it but didn't think it was a very successful adaptation of the Peter Straub novel. I remember that book scaring the hell out of me in a delightful early-Stephen-King way.

I haven't seen "Ghost Story" since it was originally out and aired on HBO. The only thing I really remember about it is Craig Wasson's junk in the opening scene.

I didn't partic care for the Gremlinses

"Gremlins" is my favorite Christmas movie ever! With the possible exception of "Die Hard."

This was just on the Onion AV Club recently re: Dante's TV work.

Better or worse than the Ghost Story starring the real-life Withnail?

please don't let mine be the lone vote for Dead & Buried, Unjust Universe.

http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/G/01/ciu/f4/e7/42f2b340dca074bb6b2b8010.L.jpg

ok, why didn't they just call it Death Kebab

because the scarf-in-the-motorcycle-wheel scene is much more memorable than the mostly off-screen skewering?

ugh, Stephen Lack. "charisma vacuum" is right. it's not only his drug-dazed Scanner persona; he was just as blank and flat of affect in Head On. isn't he predominantly a successful artist, not an actor? i believe Cro even acknowledged this by casting him as the eccentric metallurgist who forges the "surgical instruments for operating on mutant women" in Dead Ringers.

why the #@%! is Zulawski's Possession missing from this list?

I would describe Possession as a "thriller" or "awesome mindfuck" rather than horror, even though there is a monster in it.

but it's more horror than Scanners is, so yeah

would have had my vote.

Unless I'm mistaken, polls are limited to 50 variables per thread. Maybe a moderator can confirm.

couldn't Suddenly at Midnight, which i doubt anyone here has even seen, or the execrable Don't Go Near the Park be dropped in favor of Possession, which is only one of the best horror films of the '80s?

how about putting Possession in place of Band's Alchemist, an '84 movie which wasn't seen until '86, anyway, and is only notable for being one of the first Empire Films pictures?

Somehow I ended up reading the novelization of Final Exam when I was in seventh grade, ten years after the fact. I don't think I even realized it was a film at the time - I was just into horror novels & randomly stumbled across it, I guess. The thing is, I really liked it in book form at the time & a couple years later, when I found out about the film, I had really high hopes. They were not met.

Wish I had a more original answer, but u just can't fuck w/ The Evil Dead. I actually think that the Campbell/Raimi commentary track on the special-edition DVD is the yardstick that all other DVD commentary should be measured by.

full horror stan shameful confession - thx to seeing evil dead 2 first, evil dead (uh 1 i guess) will also seem a little slight and unmemorable to me

i really dig the burning tho, that might be my vote.

christ, possession didn't even occur to me! probably cuz this list is so much more thorough than previous installments. but fuck yeah, one of my favorite movies, and certainly the best performances i've ever seen from both sam neill and isabelle adjani. late write-in for possession.

American Werewolf

full horror stan shameful confession - thx to seeing evil dead 2 first, evil dead (uh 1 i guess) will also seem a little slight and unmemorable to me

I am in this same boat - first one just can't compare, having been not just surprised by HOLY FUCK WOW PERFECTION'd by EDII

DEAD BY DAWN! DEAD BY DAWN! DEAD BY DAWN!

I like ED1 better than ED2, but that's because I saw ED1 first.

I saw ED1 first, but prefer ED2. It may not have tree rape, but it has the 'A Farewell to Arms' joke, which is my favourite visual joke in a movie.

(The main difference is that ED1 is properly a horror movie, whereas ED2 is a horror comedy, surely?)

was there a killer Santa Claus movie in '79 or '80?

silent night deadly night isn't 'til '84, shockingly!

I think the OTT gore is just funnier in the first one, given its obvious budget shortcomings. I mean, oatmeal!

evil dead was huge for me - when I saw it in '84 I had become, at the advanced age of 13, very jaded about horror. I still liked horror movies but they had lost the capacity to scare me, and the evil dead scared the crap out of me. sledgehammer supernatural grue, yowza!

FYI, the evil dead didn't get a real theatrical release until '83. I remember this distinctly because it was the *only* time I was ever refused admission to a movie, it was rated X! ended up seeing curtains instead, lol. there was huge buzz on the evil dead by this point, stephen king had done a big write-up on it the previous year in twilight zone magazine lamenting its lack of a distribution deal.

when I saw evil dead 2 it was a huge letdown. too slick, and the comedy stuff was corny, I wanted sheer terror! I should prolly watch it again, haven't seen it since it came out.

I like that the music in the first one sometimes actually sounds like a buzzsaw.

detailed article on the production/distribution of ED... raimi was 20 when he directed it, crazy

http://www.bookofthedead.ws/website/the_evil_dead_production.html

Sam travelled over alone to France for the Cannes film festival in May 1982, a trip funded by Irvin Shapiro. It was there that Stephen King first saw the film, and wrote a glowing review for the November 1982 issue of Twilight Zone magazine, entitled, 'The Evil Dead: Why You Haven't Seen It Yet and Why You Ought To'. This review combined with the brisk business being done in the UK, really raised The Evil Dead's profile in the US, and New Line picked US distribution rights. When it was submitted to the MPAA, it received an X rating, and so was subsequently released unrated. The movie finally opened in New York on April 15, of 1983, premièring at the Rivoli and other houses, and playing at the Wellmont in Montclair, New Jersey.

^ wish I still had my copy of that twilight zone mag, article doesn't seem to be online anywhere

started thinking about the movies on this list I saw during their original theatrical run when I was oh, 10 or 11 AKA how to be a jaded horror fan at 13 AKA hello inappropriate parenting

An American Werewolf in London
Dead & Buried
The Entity
Evilspeak
Friday the 13th Part 2
Ghost Story
Scanners
Wolfen

thought wolfen was terrible, even at 10 I found the urban indian stuff o_O

There was a New Yorker profile of Sam Raimi a few years back, and he says that the original title for The Evil Dead was The Book of the Dead, and some producer said "What? You can't have a horror movie with book in the title."

couldn't Suddenly at Midnight, which i doubt anyone here has even seen, or the execrable Don't Go Near the Park be dropped in favor of Possession, which is only one of the best horror films of the '80s?

I didn't omit Possession on purpose! Totally a mistake. I'll keep future polls as thorough as possible, but obviously all horrors films from each year should be up for discussion. I trust that you and contenderizer will bring these omissions to our attention!

amen, brother contenderizer! Darin, i'm really not trying to be difficult. it's just that Possession TOWERS over anything here. and i love a lot of these.

EIII, the theatrical release of Evilspeak was so watered down, it might as well have been a kids' movie. little did we know. the AB DVD was such a revelation.

like many, saw ED2 first and thought "meh" when i finally caught up with the original. it simply didn't live up to the sequel's breakneck summary sequence. have since come around to appreciate Raimi's ingenuity and energy. tho he did lose beaucoup originality points once i saw Equinox.

EIII, the theatrical release of Evilspeak was so watered down, it might as well have been a kids' movie.

yeah, decapitating that topless woman in the opening scene was a straight rip from bedknobs & broomsticks

haven't seen the AB DVD tbh

oh, you must! you haven't really seen a woman devoured in her bathtub by a horde of hell-spawned hogs until you have.

should do a poll of the alternate titles for the evil dead:

Sex Bad, Must Kill!
Lick the Blood Off My Shovel!
Blood Flood
A Hundred and one percent Dead
These Bitches are Witches
Fe-Monsters
The Evil Dead Men and the Evil Dead Women

srsly, tho, a detailed list of the deleted and trimmed frames in Evilspeak reads like an atrocity exhibition catalog. much of the mangling was done to the climactic sequence in the chapel. also, if you saw it in the theater, you didn't see the cut from said topless woman's head to the flying soccer ball in all its gory glory.

f'in love this movie's score. "Satanas! Vidimus!" sure, Goldsmith could have sued them blind. but i'll be damned - and eaten by hellhogs - if it doesn't work.

detailed article on the production/distribution of ED... raimi was 20 when he directed it, crazy

This is why I was repping upthread for the Raimi/Campbell commentary track on the special edition DVD - ED was essentially Raimi's senior project as a film undergrad iirc & pretty much everything in the film was extremely makeshift by necessity. Hearing their play-by-play on how they dealt w/ each obstacle as they went along is as compelling an insight into the creative process as you'll find anywhere else imo. Plus, both of those dudes are hilar

Oh yeah, the commentary on that ED DVD is a riot.

An American Werewolf... is my fave horror film ever. This is one of the resaons why: http://www.kindertrauma.com/?p=352
Can't recommend the new 2-disc dvd that came out late 09 which has a brilliant documentary film on disc 2, a proper feature length job.

The original American poster is a classic:
http://www.rathcoombe.net/horror/american_werewolf_in_london.jpg

especially compared to the bloody awful UK one that made it look like a Carry On film
http://screenrant.com/wp-content/uploads/an-american-werewolf-in-london-poster.jpg

Can't recommend *enough* i mean

Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.

like many, saw ED2 first and thought "meh" when i finally caught up with the original. it simply didn't live up to the sequel's breakneck summary sequence. have since come around to appreciate Raimi's ingenuity and energy. tho he did lose beaucoup originality points once i saw Equinox.

― Mr. Hal Jam, Friday, 25 June 2010 16:30 (1 week ag

I'm open to the idea that Evil Dead 2 is a better film than 1, but Evil Dead 1 is definitely a better horror film. It has a feeling of terrifying loneliness to it, while Evil Dead 2 is just a comedy imo.

An American Werewolf... is my fave horror film ever.

saddddddddddddddd

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

Kinda upset by this upset.

Dr M if you're going to hate like that you're kind of obligated to name better horror movies

not that I don't believe there are plenty (plenty of Argento/Fulci/Bava beat AWIL for me, plus Phantom of the Opera, The Unknown, The Texas Chainsaw Massacre, I'd argue Pasolini's Oedipus Rex as a horror movie, et al) but come on man, cards on the table

I can't believe ED didn't win this. And no votes for The Beyond?

The best film won!

how could it? the best film wasn't even included in the poll! sorry, sorry... /sourgrapes. seriously, though, mine was the only vote for D&B?

love dead & buried, but no way i could vote for it over the likes of american werewolf, evil dead and galaxy of terror (ha)

Only two votes for The Howling!?

Dr M if you're going to hate like that you're kind of obligated to name better horror movies

Just from this year, Scanners, Evil Dead and Wolfen! c'mon, it's friggin JOHN LANDIS.

I have much, much love for Scanners, but it is not a better HORROR movie than American Werewolf. It's a political thriller with horror elements.

Just from this year, Scanners, Evil Dead and Wolfen! c'mon, it's friggin JOHN LANDIS.

― kind of shrill and very self-righteous (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 6 July 2010 14:44 (20 minutes ago)

This from a Chris Columbus defender.

huh? Always found him mediocre at best.

Much as I like American Werewolf, rather amazed Evil Dead didn't win. I guess it's II that would be near-unbeatable.

American Werewolf is as much of a horror movie as Scanners - American Werewolf is like an 80s teen comedy but with horror elements

horror w/ unmistakable socio-sexual-political subtext is what I like

Ah, yes, the hair-raising, blood-curdling horror of socio-sexual-political subtext.

^^ works for me.

otherwise it's just kiddie stuff.

horror w/ unmistakable socio-sexual-political subtext is what I like

this covers an awful lot tbf

And that's why Wes Craven's "The People Under The Stairs" is a better movie than Wes Craven's "A Nightmare On Elm Street." Or something.

And the socio-sexual-political stuff in Scanners isn't subtext, it's text.

^^^got a point there

And that's why Wes Craven's "The People Under The Stairs" is a better movie than Wes Craven's "A Nightmare On Elm Street." Or something.

a case could be made for this! the 1st Nightmare is kinda lame

what 80s teen comedies is American Werewolf like?

Teen Wolf

nah.

AWIL feels much closer in spirit/substance to british exploitation/comedy flicks of the 60s and 70s - it's like a mash-up of Curse of the Werewolf and Carry on Screaming

yeah I was kidding there

man you even love it when jokes die

AWIL is actually lot like "The Breakfast Club" if you really think about it

lol latebloomer

The Breakfast Club is more like a drama w/ socio-political sexual stuff than an 80s teen comedy

You can make a very strong argument that David's transformation in AWIL is directly analogous to Allison's transformation in TBC

was thinking more along the lines of Ferris Bueller's Day Off actually

a case could be made for this! the 1st Nightmare is kinda lame

Wow--the first one I consider genuinely frightening. I'm not sure if I ever saw another one, though.

1st nightmare is so not lame!

We'll get there but 1st "Nightmare" is kind of brilliant in its originality/intensity.

Dunno if I'd defend tapping "Werewolf" as the top, but no question the top films finished best. All pretty different, too. Goofy, gonzo, smart and subversive, in that order of finish.

have never seen any Fulci. If I love Suspiria, will The Beyond be a decent starter?

The Beyond is def Fulci's best horror movie, tho The House by the Cemetary, City of the Living Dead, The Black Cat and Zombi 2 all have their moments. Thing is, Fulci and Argento don't actually have that much in common - Fulci's movies are generally a lot slower, and even more incoherent at a narrative level, but their combination of ultragore, old school gothique, insane zoom lensing and bad (dubbed) performances somehow creates an incredible... aura... of otherness and strangeness.

I also like Fucli's earlier giallos, Lizard in a Woman's Skin and Don't Torture a Duckling. I wld avoid everything post New York Ripper.

Yeah, Fulci is no Argento. The Beyond is good, though, and definitely worth picking up. We just got Lizard in a Woman's Skin, am excited to see it.

I hate Fulci with a passion. His movies exist as nothing more than vehicles for lazy gore, which consists largely of pig entrails and piles of maggots spewing from bad make-up and models. It's one step up from student filmmaking, to my eyes, and the complete incoherence - which I wish I could blame on the bad dubbing - doesn't help. Things happen. Little makes sense. Which I suppose one could say of Argento, too, but at least Argento is an ace stylist with a real sense of vision. The gap between "Suspiria" and "The Beyond" is like the gap between ... I don't know, something sublime and something inept.

Sold! Thanks all.

sorry, Josh, but that dismissal of Fulci doesn't apply to his pre-Zombi 2 films of the '70s: his gialli, Don't Torture a Duckling, Six Notes in Black, and (my favorite) Lizard in a Woman's Skin are all excellent, well-crafted (sub)genre pieces. and his overlooked Beatrice Cenci is a startlingly powerful, Church-critical historical opus deserving of a place in its select pantheon alongside Russell's The Devils. it's also the only film of Fulci's career that is not only devoid of his (unfortunate) token misogyny, but in fact fiercely feminist. Fulci was more than a gore-smitten hack who could wrangle a maggot (or a couple thousand) on camera. the man had range. he made a (really good!) White Fang movie, FFS!

Yeah, a defense could be made of his giallo stuff. But all his zombie films are a total mess, and variations on the same mess, for that matter. They're just excuses to shove things in people's eye-sockets with a grim, joyless, cheap determination. Though I suppose he gets points for his lame shark-vs-zombie showdown in "Zombi 2," stuff like "City of the Dead" and "The Beyond" are just garbage that seems assembled from the same pile of unused b-roll footage. They're the sorts of boring movies where the zombies are buried two inches under ground to allow the beleaguered actor to sit up easier and let the maggot and mist wranglers do their work. Just astounding to me how lazy his flicks can be.

To me, The Beyond is the only Fulci film I've seen to transcend his basic horribleness as a filmmaker.

Tho I guess Don't Torture a Duckling is supposed to be great.

The thing about Fulci is that you have a talented, versatile, fairly successful writer and director of studio sex and spy capers, who was by all accounts too intellectual and creatively restless to settle for a life of lazy, lucrative Ratnerdom. he lashed out by securing private financing for Beatrice Cenci, a contentious, controversial and very personal project whose aggressive politics did nothing for his popularity among Italian studio execs. his artful gialli, which he co-wrote, were very popular with the Italian public - casting Euro beauties like Florinda Bolkan surely didn't hurt - but further deepened the schism between Fulci and the studios. when the graphic Lizard was plagued with post-production allegations of animal vivisection and related legal woes, they had the excuse they needed to sever ties completely with the difficult director. Fulci struggled to reestablish his reputation, trying his hand at low-budget westerns.

it was Zombi 2, the cheap and nonsensical semisequel to Argento's smash-hit Continental cut of Romero's Dawn of the Dead, that ultimately gave him a shot at redemption. Fulci didn't share a writing credit for Zombi 2, which was the brainchild of vet genre scribe Dardano Sachetti. nevertheless, Fulci had finally found an appreciative audience and a winning formula. the worldwide horror community embraced Zombi 2 not only for the unprecedented grisliness of its onscreen carnage, but for its mood and atmosphere, achieved in close collaboration with skilled makeup artists, musicians, and cinematographers. Fulci was smart enough to know not to deviate. so while subsequent projects were more thematically ambitious, culminating in the pastiche Lovecraftian American gothica of City of the Living Dead and The Beyond, they stayed true to the grue. if you can't see past the rubber critters, maggotty decor, pretzel-logic plots, and sometimes drab cinematography to the indelibly haunted hearts of these films, you're not looking hard enough.

even the most ardent Fulci fan would concede that, at some point, he gave up all pretense of making art and settled for churning out cheap, profitable grindhouse fare. scarred early in his career by a bitter divorce and who knows what other psychological damage, his work began to manifest a virulent misogynist taint that reached its toxic nadir with the vicious, leering violence of The New York Ripper and Touch of Death. hack-for-hire projects, like Poltergeist cash-in Manhattan Baby, slash-dance mystery Murder Rock and sibling Patrick-goes-to-boarding school and nuns-amok supernatural gorefests Aenigma and Demonia, marked Fulci's steady decline throughout the '80s, sealing his fate as a fading maestro. and yet even these lesser films feature inspired, memorable moments of visceral abandon. glimmers of late-career hope came with Conquest, a surreal and frankly mystifying peplum exercise, and the debatably brilliant self-excoriating A Cat in the Brain, a Fellini-esqe meditation on moviemaking, misogyny and madness. the passionate support of his fans boded well for a return to genre ascendancy, had Fulci only lived to realize his planned remake of Michael Curtiz's Mystery of the Wax Museum. we will never know.

That's a great post, but I'd only concede his "haunted heart" in the most facile sense. Like, his films are about decay, because they showcase things ... decaying. Really, his gore is hardly unprecedented, and his cinematography, etc., workmanlike. There may be any number of reasons why his films are shit, but at their heart they're mostly just shitty. Call me old fashioned, but I find "rubber critters, maggotty decor, pretzel-logic plots, and sometimes drab cinematography" very hard to see past. "City of the Dead" features supernaturally teleporting zombies that appear out of nowhere, rub fistfuls of maggots in peoples' faces, then just vanish again! At least Raimi's gonzo work is actually gonzo, and he understands the innate silliness of what he's doing, as opposed to Fulci's laughable portent.

I mean, come on - Zombi is the only movie where the people move slower than the zombies!!!

http://il.youtube.com/watch?v=2Qwp904lxTo&feature=related

Hey, more standing around staring at horrible effects!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQV1OA4a0vc&feature=related

Look, mannequin-eating tarantulas!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RUqqVo0JxM4&feature=related

appreciate that post hal jam, esp. yr defense of fulci's non-zombie/gore work, which i'm haven't paid anywhere near enough attention to. i've held back because, like josh, i'm not a huge fan of the zombie films, not even the beyond. i grant that he's able to develop atmosphere - the films have an air of weary, zombified vacancy that can be compelling - but he doesn't seem to know what to do with that atmosphere once he's got it in place. so the films just sit there, waiting for the animating spark that the gore effects provide.

i really believe that there's more to The Beyond and City of the Living Dead than either of you is allowing. when you brush away the fog and the plastic spiders, i find that Fulci touches on genuine existential dread in these movies. their subtler horrors slip the veil no less effectively than Lovecraft's explorations of same in the Mythos writings. and even the gore isn't just pointless set dressing. Fulci started his career as a medical student and as an art critic. i think this informed his perspective as a filmmaker, and that he saw decomposition as far from the ultimate (or worst) fate awaiting all flesh. at the whims of (super)natural forces, we can become puppy chow or a putrid puddle on the floor without notice. neither man, woman, beast, nor child is spared such desecration of the flesh.

*** SPOILERS ***

yes, the tarantula attack is hokey. but Fulci was trying, at this point, and i'm sure it was the best he could muster with the meager resources and funds at his disposal. ignore the sub-par FX and appreciate the scene for what it is - the unknown reminding us of our insignificant place in the scheme of thing by targeting our squishiest, most vulnerable points. Fulci's fondness for depicting the wholesale annihilation of eyeballs - and tongues, and lips, and brains, and nipples - is an effective translation of rational body horror into the artificial cinemechanics of fear. this was a man who knew how to manipulate an audience as well as any of his peers. can you deny the effectiveness of the sequence in City where the pickax comes crashing the coffin wood, inches from the eyes of the victim trapped within, between slow suffocation, freedom, and a painful, pointy end? or the inexpressible horror of a child watching as acid dissolves her mother's corpse,staggering numb and resigned into the wormy arms of the undead?

but back for a moment to existential dread. the villagers in the prologue of The Beyond crucify the alchemist and attempt to eliminate every mortal trace of his body, flensing it away with chains and quicklime. in their superstitious naivete, they believe that this will stem the destructive forces threatening to destroy them. their actions prove effective, but only in the short term. man can not tame the chaotic universe through will and deed, as we learn when the hotel is reopened. similarly, the fate of the living in City hinges on the corporeal integrity of a dead priest, now a gatekeeper whose continued metaphysical being holds back the horrors pounding at Hell's threshold for Earthly egress. and the survivors of the sanity-stretching terrors of The Beyond ultimately find themselves trapped in a limbo-like void of inconceivable design and expanse. the universe laughs. my point, Fulci was no fool.

not to diminish anything you've said, cuz i'd happily read this kind of analysis at much greater length, but the existential angst present in fulci's zombie flicks (and i agree that it IS present) only makes them interesting. it doesn't make them good, doesn't make them work. fulci's seeming despair is integrated into the films at the most basic level, it's not trivial or grafted on, but it's cinematic expression is far too literal. these aren't zombie movies so much as movies-as-zombies. pitiless, rotting, turgid flesh. there's a quality of cinematic inertness/indifference that makes them very difficult to engage with.

every time with the "it's"

fuck that thing

these aren't zombie movies so much as movies-as-zombies. pitiless, rotting, turgid flesh.

that's a really interesting idea.

in fairness would extend the idea to a bunch of non-fulci/non-zombie italian exploitation flicks of the 70s & 80s (cannibal holocaust, joe d'amato flicks, etc.)

i actually haven't seen any fulci - i just liked the idea.

i won't deny the turgidness, but i'd argue that it's a large part of the movies' charms. didn't like any of Fulci's films on first viewings. but they do wear you down, until they're as comfortable as old socks. and just as reeky and full of holes. so now i take the visceral thrills with the longueurs, without complaint. it may even have helped me to appreciate Jean Rollin, Dead & Buried (for which i voted here. it's just such a perfect, self-contained chiller), Deathdream, The House with the Laughing Windows, and pretty much the entirety of the Japanese cinema of the '60s and '70s.

great posts Mr Hal Jam, and i agree w/ pretty much everything you say

i wonder if this is - partially - a Euro-America divide, in that genre audiences in Europe and American have different expectations and demands w/ regard to narrative cinema and the 'well-made' film. i think its profitable, or more critically exact, to consider the different ways of telling between fulci and, say, john carpenter w.out resorting to (impossible to prove or disprove) accusations of hackery and incompetence.

just a minor correction, tho it is an important one. Fulci is evoking existential dread, not angst. his characters seem to surrender, powerless and defeated, to the growing realization that their world is not bound by the natural rules they came to accept as reality. that's some cool shit.

Deathdream is hardly a pair of old socks.

more like john cassavetes' jockstrap

but in a GOOD way

not exactly what i said, is it?

excellent point, WF. there's definitely a Euro/US divide with regard to "acceptable" pacing and narrative expectations. also the meting out of satisfying explanations by the picture's end. but filmmakers like Roger Corman were already instilling European art-cinema sensibilities into grindhouse pictures as early as the '60s, so our cinema has had ample opportunity to acclimate. denigrating the films of Fulci, Argento, D'Amato, et al, for their lack of narrative cohesion seems to be counterintuitive. at their best, like a Suspiria or The Beyond, they're faithful to their inner illogic, representing fantastic, frightening worlds in miniature, not outright reflections of our shared reality.

just a minor correction, tho it is an important one. Fulci is evoking existential dread, not angst.

― babytown frolics (Mr. Hal Jam), Friday, July 9, 2010 12:38 PM (9 minutes ago) Bookmark

yeah, i knew i was being lazily imprecise even as i typed that

on second thought, D'Amato was just a marginally more ambitious pornographer and should probably be excluded from such esteemed company. i'll substitute Sergio Martino for D'Amato. though i think he was the hackiest of hacks that ever hacked.

denigrating the films of Fulci, Argento, D'Amato, et al, for their lack of narrative cohesion seems to be counterintuitive. at their best, like a Suspiria or The Beyond, they're faithful to their inner illogic, representing fantastic, frightening worlds in miniature, not outright reflections of our shared reality.

― babytown frolics (Mr. Hal Jam), Friday, July 9, 2010 12:48 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmarkthing is, i would never denigrate argento for reasons under discussion here. my problem with fulci and d'amato isn't that their films are slow and incoherent, but that they don't provide sufficient cinematic reward to offset these trivial deficiencies. argento does. you brought up jean rollin earlier, and he's worth considering in this context. now, i love "la morte vivante", though i don't have much use for rollin, overall. i love LMV because it not only creates this dreamy, otherworldly reality, but it invests that reality with some emotional weight. argento, in comparison, doesn't make emotionally affecting films (for the most part), but he's an obsessive and brilliant craftsman of cinematic moments. it doesn't matter that his films make little sense, because each moment is more deliriously unhinged than the last.

d'amato and zombie-fulci, on the other hand, create a cinema not of rewards, but of punishments. one has to enjoy cynical tone poems celebrating the fundamental and brutal banality of existence. and i don't. i find fulci's mournful gravitas and d'amato's leering cynicism equally tedious. but that's just me. maybe it's an american thing, too, i dunno. my primary response to all of this isn't to revisit city of the living dead (which i do remember liking, if only for the grue), but to dig back into his earlier giallos.

do you have one or two best-of-fulci recs in that regard, HJ?

yeah, i understand wanting to exclude d'amato. i'd sub deodato.

interesting, Contenderizer. i need to think about what you said before i respond to it.

as for my Fulci recs, see Lizard if you haven't. just a beautiful picture, very controlled and elegant. there's a solid central mystery, for a giallo, and nice use of color, framing, distractions, music. it's like nothing else Fulci ever made. and of course it was brushed off by critics as mere Argento mimicry, which must have set the ol' boy's teeth on edge.

Duckling is a good picture, technically, but not one that i could ever say i enjoyed. it's didactic, bleak, and paced as lethally as What Have You Done to Solange? (which D'Amato lensed, incidentally). but it is well made, with the best of intentions, and it has one of the better stories told in a giallo picture. it's just not fun, so i hesitate to recommend it. the gory pay-off almost sways me - it's one of Fulci's most satisfying (and brutal) - but i just can't do it.

try Lizard, though. if the dream of bisected dogs doesn't win you over, and convince you of Fulci's warped, wry humor, nothing will.

if you like historical horrors, a la The Witchfinder General and Onibaba, do try to see Beatrice Cenci. i think it's an amazing film, though neither giallo nor genre pic. it's available on DVD as Conspiracy of Torture, and its only the graphic torture tableaux that betray Fulci's involvement. you'd seriously think this was a lost Reeves or Russell. yeah, that good.

oooh! good call! Deodato is IN. i'm a tireless CH apologist, with plenty of breath left to defend The Washing Machine, Dial Help, Cut and Run, and all his other cheese/sleaze.

re-watched American Werewolf in London last week. It was okay but I don't think it's entirely successful in its attempts to merge horror and comedy - the comedy is too dry/restrained and undercuts the more trad horror elements, which are similarly not strong enough to carry the whole movie. The transformation scene is amazing, of course. Compared to some of the comedy-horror stuff that came later this just seems neither funny nor scary enough.

I wonder if Cannibal Ferox would've won this poll if more people realized that it's the same movie commonly known as Make Them Die Slowly.

also re-watched An American Werewolf in London. first time i've seen it since about age 15. thought it was fantastic. i didn't really get that conflict between the horror and comedy elements. found it thoroughly entertaining. what horror/comedy films are you comparing this too?

that dream sequence David has where his family's household is assaulted by a bunch of ghouls with machine guns is surprisingly intense and shocking. also, great ending. from the phone call home, to the porn theater, to the massively violent traffic accident, to the DEAD -> ROLL CREDITS. a+.

i'd vote for this over Evil Dead now, breaks my heart to say it.