GAME CHANGE on hbo starring julianne moore as sarah palin and ed harris and john mccain

how is this not going to the most fun hbo miniseries ever

that should be "ed harris as john mccain"

Who is John McCain playing?

dammit

oh and WOODY HARRELSON as steve schmidt

This is based on that awful Mark Halperin book, right? It'll be amusing, I guess.

it is directed by the man responsible for meet the parents and austin powers and it will focus on the mccain campaign

max, mayb bcz this is in retrospect as depressing as any election ever

i mean im sort of assuming this is going to be a comedy?

I was about to be all "wau, real tour de force effort from Julianne Moore there" and then you had to clarify

Who's doing the script?

im assuming this is going to be a game changer

doyle from gilmore girls wrote it

it will focus on the mccain campaign

with a fiercely liberal cast and Hollywood's see-no-evil pose on Obama's hypocrisy? Git outta town

i thought ed harris was one of those hollywood republicans

morbs, you have matt damon

anyway i think morbs is right and that the writers and actors of the miniseries should operate as if they know what happens 3 years later

why not? i did.

haha

Ed Harris is way more imposing/intimidating than John McCain. (I also recall he sat stonily when Kazan got a special Oscar, so I assume librul)

goole maybe you're thinking of gary sinise?

okay i think this miniseries would be way more fun if morbs played cindy mccain as a savant who tells her husband all of the bad things obama will do during his first term but john hates her so much that he never listens, thus dooming his campaign

morbs i'm sure you'd look stunning in a blonde wig and some bright red lipstick

J0rd, you'll look better in it when we share a prison cell one day

i'm cool w/ that as long as we have a TV to watch mets games

talk about cruel and unusual punishment

max, the writer and director are the same as the HBO classic Recount, which I've never seen, but it's bound to be just as memorable.

http://www.danceproof.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Stop-Dancing-Design-copy.jpg

http://img2.timeinc.net/people/i/2011/news/110509/julianne-moore-300.jpg

Not to mention
http://cdn.theatlanticwire.com/img/upload/2011/05/mccainharris464/large.jpg

surm are you so fucking excited for this or what

the trailers for this are incredible

harris doesnt appear to be making many concessions to the real mccain, aside from not lifting his arms above his head

Written by one of the evil nerds from Buffy lol

Moore's Palin voice is even more nails on a chalkboard than the real Palin. No way I could take two hours of it.

this is gonna be the best tv movie ever!!!

ballot poll time

Written by one of the evil nerds from Buffy lol

― Kiarostami bag (milo z), Wednesday, March 7, 2012 10:15 AM (25 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

the clueless cousin from mad men. game change: cure for the common political movie.

Recount was good/entertaining.

Same reaction to Recount--pretty good. I think Primary Colours is a little better still.

better than her southie accent in 30 rock yn

sorta feel like tina fey coulda done this just as good as JM, probably less hacky (just assuming/haven't watched the trailer/don't really care)

good for jonathan tho, finally found his place in sunnydale

I like Primary Colors quite a bit, despite the choice of POV.

pareene has a nice takedown of this totally pointless thing i will never see.

Post very much in character

kinda like OOOOH PALIN PALIN FUNNY DUMB IRRELEVANT PERSON is for others

Sullivan is apparently upset at Pareene.

Onion AV Club review doesn't sound promising. I saw W and really it was a waste of time. Judging from this review, it sounds like they basically took stump speeches, pundit talk, and press releases and lined them all up into basically a 2008 flashback, with little actual character development. Anyone else see this?

http://www.avclub.com/articles/game-change,70584/

“You remind me of myself,” McCain says. “We’re both reformers not afraid to thumb our nose at our own party.”

Lines like that are, in a nutshell, the problem with Game Change: This is supposed to be the inside story of the McCain campaign, with all its dysfunction, backbiting, and Hail Mary gimmickry, yet everyone speaks in stilted pundit-ese. Much like Oliver Stone’s failed biopic W., the film trots out a cast of skilled celebrity impersonators to regurgitate dialogue that seems lifted from press conferences or sessions with “The Best Political Team On Television.” No matter how uncanny the performances—and actors like Julianne Moore and Ed Harris get the nuances and temperaments right—the politicians and operatives in Game Change are not human beings. They are spouters of conventional wisdom.

harris doesnt appear to be making many concessions to the real mccain, aside from not lifting his arms above his head

― these pretzels are makeing me horney (Hungry4Ass), Wednesday, March 7, 2012 9:15 AM (2 days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

he really got the physicality "down" wouldn't you say

this was so fucking good!!!!!!!!!!!

Wanted to check if anyone saw this...A guy at work who gets Canadian HBO said he was going to try to tape if for me, or whatever the equivalent of taping is on a digital box.

its p fn rad

interesting that both todd and sarah were recast as gingers tho

mccain comes off almost as bad as palin for most of the movie before somewhat redeeming himself at the end

an endorsement of sorts from one of the main characters http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entries/nicolle-wallace-game-change-film-true-enough-to

I saw her say that this morning, minutes after seeing McCain dismiss the film up and down--and complain that he was falsely portrayed as someone who curses a lot! (Even though, it just now occurs to me, he simultaneously claimed not to have watched any of it while he watched football instead.) Isn't McCain's temper a matter of public record?

he wasnt portrayed as particularly intemperate, more befuddled really

he just walked around asking his staff what he should do mostly

i can't think of another movie that totally nails the exact feeling of what it feels like to be in the middle of a totally unstoppable clusterfuck the way this one does

There's lots of good in it.

I dug the book, McCain seems to swear more irl than I do which makes me feel a lot better. Interested to see it, will have to check the DVR.

ha gr80 yes totally like when palin was just texting and wouldnt respond to her press secretary there was a moment of recognition

the googling female republicans montage was gold

when palin was just texting and wouldnt respond to her press secretary there was a moment of recognition

this was devastating-- prob at least half a dozen other scenes like this that made me squirm

i think i'm going to re-watch this again tonite

dvr'd to record tomorrow :D

I gotta see this. If my co-worker doesn't come through, I'd gladly cover costs if anyone could mail me a burned copy.

this was hilarious.

Here's McCain yesterday (you've got to skip past the 9:00 mark). He doesn't contradict himself, like I suggested yesterday--he prefaces his complaint about coarse language with "I've been told..."--and it was a hockey game he was watching, not football. He does, though, continue to say things like "I thought she was the best qualified person" with a straight face.

http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/fox-news-sunday/index.html#/v/1501260424001/mccain-talks-foreign-trouble-spots-game-change/?playlist_id=86913

it was 'ok' idk, feel like y'all are going a bit overboard; it is basically like if vh1 did a 'remember the 08 election cycle' show or w/e

it was def not really at all like that

so you're telling me that Hal Sparks is in Game Change, johnny?

yes he plays barack obama

MUST WATCH TV

its really inane, but funny. there's a 'who's on first' bit with palin saying biden's name wrong, and harris/mccain makes these hilarious crying-bald-eagle faces when people start screaming HES A MUSLIm re obama at rallies

exactly. it's like 'recognition funny' where a hack standup does like REMEMBER FRIENDSTER? LOL

i mean, yeah, the staging/reenactment aspect of it is ok but just as a premise it's p cruddy imo

this was pointless

clemenza its on thepiratebay

Perrin take:

http://dennisperrin.blogspot.com/2012/03/chump-change.html

I always wondered why liberals so brutally turned on McCain. Before that campaign, he was the liberals' favorite Republican. Yes, it was election-year politics, where reality takes a long vacation. But McCain was scarcely the worst of the GOP field. Hell, on some issues he was probably to the left of Bob Dole, and Dole wasn't all that right wing. Not compared to Bush and Cheney. Not even close.

uh because he sold all that shit down the river when he wanted to be president

exactly

Ed Harris' McCain was breezy and diverting, traits that are rarely applied to the actual man.

otm. part of me wishes ed harris had tried a little harder to capture mccain's voice and awkward mannerisms, but that would have almost certainly been a trainwreck

I never understood Washington liberals' attachment to John McCain even in 2000. He did host great barbeques though!

lol, McCain didn't actually sell anything down the river, just talked shit his constituency wanted to hear, kinda like The Savior

^^ this

gotta agree with that

worst aspect of mccain is his reflexive hawkism. it's hard to deal w/ that. dude likes to bomb people.

....about which he's been admirably consistent in thirty years of public life.

Among the many loathsome memories of the '08 campaign: Joe Klein types wringing their hands over What Happened to the John McCain They Knew.

well thank God I can't think of anyone else like that. I mean... I...

I'm, I'm so in looooove with you

xp

didn't McCain/Feingold win him a lot of liberal fans?

running against bush in 2000 did too tbf

morbs believe me i am not a fan of our president's foreign policy. but i think mccain does a lot more foolhardy saber-rattling than obama. who knows if he would actually follow through on any of that were he president. probably not.

foreign policy and that whole thing about assassinating americans without due process

gr8080: Thanks--I'll look into it. Morbius = reflexive Hawksism.

http://www.philippalmer.net/wp-content/uploads/Howard-Hawks1.jpg

you called?

(howard hawks looks like a man with some dark secrets btw.)

like, who killed the chauffeur?

gasp... morbs comes perilously close to breaking his lenten vows... he dances a bit... saves his immortal soul.

this is an HBO thread

(smacks forehead)... an HBO thread!!

exactly. it's like 'recognition funny' where a hack standup does like REMEMBER FRIENDSTER? LOL

i mean, yeah, the staging/reenactment aspect of it is ok but just as a premise it's p cruddy imo

― johnny crunch, Monday, March 12, 2012 12:19 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

dood the entire premiss is a 'behind the scenes look' smh

youll have to remend me of when palins debate prep footage was aired what channel was that on

O zing!

Watching this soon, cos i'm bored. Expecting what johnny crunch is talking about cos that's pretty much how most political documentaries i've seen go.

it's a "docudrama"

or "docufiction"

word never have i ever seen townhall footage of rubes calling obama a muslim/terrorist which is what i was referencing in canks post

werent ppl @ the time comparing her to harriet miers? and worse? mb it didnt come out explicitly but like i dont really see much value in big reveal, shoe-drop reenacted moments like omg she doesnt know what the fed is

'shoe drop reenacted moments' what r u even talking abt itt

is this all total bullshit, apart from the parts that were actually tv? i found it fairly light, but minorly enjoyable. if any of the behind the scenes was true i guess that'd make it a little more interesting.

the Queen conversation was confirmed as accurate today.

I mean its fine to not like it but easily less than 10% of the movie consists of things that happened in public and most of what's portrayed is was not public knowledge, and the only reason forthinking palin not knowing what the fed was isn't a big deal is just not giving a fuck, its most def a big deal for a vice presidential nom to not know shit, people def suspected it at the time but if that stuff is true and was public mccain would've been forced to drop her

people def suspected it at the time but if that stuff is true and was public mccain would've been forced to drop her

here is where you are wrong

hey great argument shakey!

the stuff about her mental state is fairly scurrilous if it's untrue.

but anyway beside the fact that the movie delt in intersting and important events it was funny and absurd and tragic and juilianne morre owned

oh you want an argument:

the amount of stupidity that can be papered over by candidates in a national election is pretty huge - much can be dismissed by "not understanding the question"/being "misquoted" or "trapped" by "gotcha journalism". As with Palin's many other public blunders, the McCain campaign would have fought aggressively to combat this "revelation" as slander, etc. Secondly, vast swathes of the American public have no idea what the Fed is or what it does either - hearing that a candidate also didn't know what the Fed is would elicit a broad range of reactions ranging from sympathy to incredulity to outrage, but none would have been common enough to force the McCain campaign to take the dramatic step of finding another VP. Thirdly, McCain is not the kind of guy who admits a mistake and changes course, particularly when something as precious as a VP candidate who's recently breathed life into his moribund candidacy is concerned - he's a cranky, combative jerk who in all likelihood would have tried to make any scandal blow over, while reiterating his faith in Palin as the "best person for the job". There are no conditions under which McCain would have gone through the scramble necessary to find another suitable VP candidate over something as insignificant as Palin's ignorance re: the Fed.

xp

No way in hell or heaven that McCain would've dropped beloved Sarah. Not only do you forget that the baseline for presidential intellect has been low since we elected Jackson, she got the base excited!

if you read my post I was talking abt the general level of ignorance palin displayed in the movie not just of the fed but of everything eg thinking the queen ran england not knowing germany started ww2 etc, if that had been exposed no way she survives, recall she was already in big trouble re not reading magazines

lol "big trouble"

the reason the GOP base loved her so much was partially BECAUSE she was so stupid

its most def a big deal for a vice presidential nom to not know shit,

this is just wrong. sorry.

I mean do you need me to list failed VP candidates and how fucking stupid they were cuz there were a lot.

hell even successful VP candidates have been plenty stupid (Quayle, Agnew etc)

In the (tele)film, the dilemma gets painted as a simplistic "what is best for the country" versus "what it takes to win" and McCain kind of goes along with it, despite his desire to run with Lieberman and bridge the divide. I'm not sure they really handled him very well here, as he sort of rationalizes her as a "Maverick" like himself despite the fact that she's really nothing of the sort - not in the way he would have wanted, anyway. It sort of gets away with it by kind of dodging how little she actually knows, or how that might worry him.

I mean I know u guys are part of the nothing's too stupid for america club cause it makes u feel smart or w/e but it's not a coincidence that national candidates tend to know what the fed is, and if they dont they sure as hell don't tell people abt it

can we start with this veep

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/67/George_Clinton_by_Ezra_Ames.jpg/245px-George_Clinton_by_Ezra_Ames.jpg

hell even successful VP candidates have been plenty stupid (Quayle, Agnew etc)

― the sir edmund hillary of sitting through pauly shore films (Shakey Mo Collier), Monday, March 12, 2012 6:09 PM (27 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I bet you they knew what the fed was

I mean I know u guys are part of the nothing's too stupid for america club cause it makes u feel smart or w/e but it's not a coincidence that national candidates tend to know what the fed is, and if they dont they sure as hell don't tell people abt it

It's MORE okay for a VP not to know; and, no, I'm not one of those dumb liberals who condescends to "red states."

u guys are part of the nothing's too stupid for america club cause it makes u feel smart or w/e

would that it were so, sadly

The vice presidency of the United States has not been distinguished by intellectual heavyweights.

I bet you they knew what the fed was

is your argument specifically about VPs knowing what the fed is or is it about the overall level of VP intelligence, cuz you seem to keep changing back and forth here

xp

Isn't her stupidity part of the whole point, the "Game Change"?

For the fist 2/3s, it does a pretty good job of eliciting sympathy for Palin - she's a well-meaning idiot thrust into this position and the Big Bad Media is relentlessly attacking her for reasons she doesn't understand. I liked all that, especially because that cosmic joke that she's the bloody VP candidate is hovering over everything, and when that really comes to the fore in the end I think it sort of lets the side down in its explicitness. The implication through all of this is the sad facts of the internet/youtube/blogging/everyone-has-an-opinion age is that merit doesn't mean jack shit anymore. The country has convinced itself that "anyone can do anything", which is why in some circles Santorum/the Tea Party's "They think they're better than you!" and Ivy League-disdain plays so well. Schmidt being horrified throughout works pretty well, but I think when it turns into a "What Have We Done!?" thing it feels a little obvious.

And guys, there are "intellectual heavyweights" and then there's "The Queen runs Britain".

it was a BIG deal that she didnt know anything, the McCain camp was working v hard to conceal it, why u think she only did two interviews, otherwise just send her out there riles up the base nbd, I mean it's no coincidence she ended up one of the most reviled politicians in the country

And guys, there are "intellectual heavyweights" and then there's "The Queen runs Britain".

haha I bet there's ILXors who think so!

is your argument specifically about VPs knowing what the fed is or is it about the overall level of VP intelligence, cuz you seem to keep changing back and forth here

xp

― the sir edmund hillary of sitting through pauly shore films (Shakey Mo Collier), Monday, March 12, 2012 6:12 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

not intelligence, knowledge, she didn't know anything, not abt the fed not abt the queen, the financial collapse, nothing

it was a BIG deal that she didnt know anything, the McCain camp was working v hard to conceal it, why u think she only did two interviews, otherwise just send her out there riles up the base nbd, I mean it's no coincidence she ended up one of the most reviled politicians in the country

She wasn't reviled because of her stupidity -- I wish! That's a venal sin in my book. She was reviled because she was petty and mean and made no bones about hiding it.

I mean she's prob smarter than Dan quayle, but at least he prepped for the job a lil

lotta lefties reviled her because of her stupidity. remember Damon's interview.

Quayle knew what the Fed was cuz he had made hay while serving in national office by bashing Greenspan's interest rate policies. On the other hand, he couldn't spell potato.

in the view of the general US electorate, the latter is probably more damning as evidence of stupidity than the former. yet Quayle was not dropped from his ticket.

I mean it's no coincidence she ended up one of the most reviled politicians in the country

she didn't become "most reviled" until much later, and the reasons for the revulsion didn't have anything to do with her being stupid. They had to do with her being shamelessly opportunistic and irresponsible (ie, prematurely resigning from her post as Gov to do reality shows etc)

xxp

Plus, it's the difference between uneducated and ignorance. She made no effort to project that she knew what the Fed was even after it was probably explained to her (she probably took long hot showers when she should have been studying). THAT's what made her stupid: she didn't bother concealing her contempt for books or reading of any kind.

lotta lefties reviled her because of her stupidity

yes but lefties/Dems are not a majority in this country

but they run the elitist media so

what turned things around for Palin was when REPUBLICANS turned on her (e.g. David Frum, Kathleen Parker, etc). Liberals don't mean shit.

^^^

RIP moderate Republicans

I'm in the UK but yeah, it was a huge deal at the time that she didn't know stuff from what I can recall. Even if it made some people like her more it surely also did huge damage, and as mentioned, that's even after they tried to hide her stupidity.

Was it really only lefties who were suspicious of her lack of knowledge? xpost

Was it really only lefties who were suspicious of her lack of knowledge?

in the US? mostly. sure there was some grumblings from establishment GOP figures, mostly quiet, and that didn't build into a backlash from the right until well after the election and her subsequent shenanigans prompted it.

not intelligence, knowledge, she didn't know anything, not abt the fed not abt the queen, the financial collapse, nothing

and not to harp on this but yeah there have been loads of VP candidates who didn't know things and were not even remotely intellectually curious

her approval plummeted from the moment she saw putin rearing his head into American airspace, I know it's tough for u guys but americans do have some slight standards as far as a candidates being qualified for office, its not high but it exists

On the other hand, I couldn't stand pious liberals attacking her in print with language that they have properly condemned when Rush Limbaugh used it two weeks ago.

Have you guys read Game Change? Mark Halperin is a contemptible worm.

and not to harp on this but yeah there have been loads of VP candidates who didn't know things and were not even remotely intellectually curious

― the sir edmund hillary of sitting through pauly shore films (Shakey Mo Collier), Monday, March 12, 2012 6:23 PM (24 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

not like palin

He writes like a fratboy sleazo with a poli-sci degree

I mean examples plz

http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_home/2005/Jul-07-Thu-2005/photos/stockdale.jpg

yah halperin is the worst, his trashiness served the movie well tho

Do you really want us posting photos of Agnew, Charles Curtis, etc

I agree with lag here... it was such high profile babbling, I don't think you can dismiss it, I refuse to believe that her lack of knowledge was only a big deal with one side of the political fence, it's just too overt. I mean FFS that thing about Alaska bordering Russia destroyed credibility in a major way.

should I start with the two actual Vice Presidents who were literally from the Know Nothing Party

xp

Do you really want us posting photos of Agnew, Charles Curtis, etc

― Exile in lolville (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, March 12, 2012 6:28 PM (43 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i would like evidence that their levels of ignorance even approached palins

Agnew was a thug and an idiot. where to begin.

yah halperin is the worst, his trashiness served the movie well tho

yeah I can see this

do u think he knew england had a prime minister, cause i suspect he did xp

oh look Esquire already ran a story about this very subject

Let me concede this point: while we have seen veeps as stupid as Palin run for office, none has boasted of his stupidity with such insouciance.

I haven't mentioned Andrew Johnson because he became president, but, man, was this guy a stupid louse -- our worst president ever.

oh look Esquire already ran a story about this very subject

― the sir edmund hillary of sitting through pauly shore films (Shakey Mo Collier), Monday, March 12, 2012 6:31 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

so youre stepping down from the argument then

Esquire cheated by calling Aaron Burr a "pick" (also: he was by far the brainiest of this dreary bunch).

I still think it's impossible to determine whether Palin was a plus or a minus for McCain--she's the reason he momentarily went ahead, and then, if I'm remembering the timeline correctly, Lehman collapsed within days and Obama went ahead for good. I'd like to think that, absent Lehman, Obama would have won anyway, and that Palin would have been one of the reasons why, but who knows. I don't think there was ever a chance she was going to be dropped, though. She displayed more than enough of her ignorance before the election, and, as the McCain clip I posted this morning shows, he still can't bring himself to (publicly) admit that she was a ludicrous choice. I'm guessing that the long-term legacy of Eagleton is that it's better to stick by your choice, no matter what (with obvious exceptions--criminal revelations, etc.).

one of the central points of the movie is that palin was pick out of desperation , they needed a GAME CHANGE, and were impulsive and didnt vet her properly, which /ml explains why we havent seen anything like her before, vps are usually picked from a short list of well known insiders and smart campaigns know the vp pick is not gonna help you win but is could help you lose

I still think it's impossible to determine whether Palin was a plus or a minus for McCain--she's the reason he momentarily went ahead

― clemenza, Monday, March 12, 2012 6:38 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

naw he got a standard convention bounce

clemenza otm generally though

so youre stepping down from the argument then

not really that was just the first google result for "agnew stupid"

ferreting out specific instances - especially pre-internet era - of VPs being publicly ignorant of facts is a bit difficult for reasons that I should think are pretty obvious (no 24-hour news cycle, historical tendency for these kinds of details to be lost, greater capacity for them being obscured etc.) Like, there are lots of instances of VPs being CALLED stupid, ignorant, etc (Johnson re: Ford springs to mind, also see everybody's accounts of Johnson) but I assume that doesn't meet your strict standards for evidence.

xp

She displayed more than enough of her ignorance before the election, and, as the McCain clip I posted this morning shows, he still can't bring himself to (publicly) admit that she was a ludicrous choice. I'm guessing that the long-term legacy of Eagleton is that it's better to stick by your choice, no matter what (with obvious exceptions--criminal revelations, etc.).

― clemenza, Monday, March 12, 2012 6:38 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

her worst flubs were claiming being in proximity to alaska constituted national security experience and not knowing the names of magazines, neither of which approach demonstrating how ignorant this movie alleges she was, i mean i have no idea what line wouldve had to have been crossed for mccain to have dropped her but if she had been say been forced to do an interview every day of the campaign im sure the thought wouldve crossed his mind, and obvs to this day he has some p strong incentives to not publicly admit how bad she was

referring separately to LBJ and Andrew Johnson there in that last post, in case it wasn't clear

xp

shakey if theres no evidence which at least meets the stringent standards of game change ie disgruntled whispering what exactly are you basing yr opinion on, is it googling agnew stupid

Wait a minute, did she really not know about the Axis in WWII?

that is what the movie says

or at least she was taking notes while they were explaining it to her

and i mean i have no doubt that shes portrayed in the worst possible light via the story being told by people who hate her

but at the same time its w/in the realm of believability

But I think there was a general sense that her startling lack of intelligence was unprecedented--in her bizarre sentence formation, in the mere fact she was kept so hidden, etc. And, as others have pointed out, this just gets a large part of the Republican base to dig in their heels and become even more protective.

idk if its a large part of the base, most people think she had no chance at the nomination this year

shakey if theres no evidence which at least meets the stringent standards of game change ie disgruntled whispering what exactly are you basing yr opinion on

I'm basing it on a general knowledge of people that have run for vice president in the US, successful and otherwise, and the remarkably low bar that has been set to merit nominations. Agnew was a deeply stupid person, so was Andrew Johnson, so was Dan Quayle, so, I have no doubt, were a great many others who did not actually make it into office. Whether or not they were caught on record making factually inaccurate statements about the Queen of England in the pre-HBO movie era is sort of immaterial. Of recent successful VP candidates, Quayle has the most storied record of factual misstatements in public (US is part of Europe, Phoenix is in California, Chicago is a state, pollution doesn't harm the environment, etc.) but even that doesn't quite match the stringent qualifications you're putting up.

xp

i mean there are def people who still like her that would never vote for her in the primary because its been demonstrated that shes shockingly unqualified

Agnew was a deeply stupid person, so was Andrew Johnson, so was Dan Quayle, so, I have no doubt, were a great many others who did not actually make it into office. Whether or not they were caught on record making factually inaccurate statements about the Queen of England in the pre-HBO movie era is sort of immaterial. Of recent successful VP candidates, Quayle has the most storied record of factual misstatements in public (US is part of Europe, Phoenix is in California, Chicago is a state, pollution doesn't harm the environment, etc.) but even that doesn't quite match the stringent qualifications you're putting up.

― the sir edmund hillary of sitting through pauly shore films (Shakey Mo Collier), Monday, March 12, 2012 6:55 PM (12 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah but thats the whole point is palin even by the standards set by these guys was remarkable, like they were dumb but via hanging out in washington or w/e they had a least picked up on some basic facts, i mean santorum who was voted the stupidest member of the senate by his colleagues still knows a lot more abt the world than palin did in 08

and he prob would say pollution doesnt harm the environment if he felt like it

lol according to the movie they each thought the other guy was gonna ask palin policy questions in the vet

pollution doesn't harm the environment,

Reagan said this iirc (trees produce carbon dioxide, therefore BAD)

I would be very curious to see how Dan Quayle et al. would do in a modern election, with every dumb utterance analyzed beyond belief.

This is pretty entertaining, but it does mostly feel like watching people roll their eyes at how stupid she is.

I'd rather was Rifftrax do her autobiographical film.

it is fun, but like grady said the other aspect of them being caught in their own cynical political trap is p good too

and j moore is really good

the '88 election was the first for which I was old enough to remember, and Quayle's lack of qualifications and intelligence, despite being a sitting senator, were discussed often and openly.

The '88 election still worst of my lifetime btw

naw he got a standard convention bounce

That's another thing that I think is hard to determine, because McCain's announcement came the day after Obama's convention speech--it was all one big jumble. I found this old Gallup page:

http://www.gallup.com/poll/110107/republicans-enthusiasm-jumps-after-convention.aspx

While they also point out that convention bounces are typical, the key points for me are that Republican enthusiasm went up 18% after the convention, and that the response to Palin's speech was so much more positive than to McCain's. My own opinion is that McCain's temporary lead was almost wholly attributable to Palin.

well it couldnt have been wholly attributable to her because u do have to account for the convention bounce but yeah she couldve for sure added to it, it def brought some sizzle to their side for a min at least

yeah but thats the whole point is palin even by the standards set by these guys was remarkable, like they were dumb but via hanging out in washington or w/e they had a least picked up on some basic facts, i mean santorum who was voted the stupidest member of the senate by his colleagues still knows a lot more abt the world than palin did in 08

the original point of contention wasn't that Palin was stupider than every other VP candidate (hell, maybe she was, I don't know and have no real way of assessing this) but that her public statements were so bad that she would be dropped by the ticket. This wouldn't have happened for a number of reasons, which I (and Alfred, and others) have already pointed out. Quayle said loads of stupid things - he was not dropped from the ticket. Andrews was a publicly drunken incompetent - he was not dropped from the ticket. Agnew was a race-baiting hatchet man that even Nixon thought "lacked intelligence and experience" - he was not dropped from the ticket. The only major VP switch I can think of in recent history was Eagleton, and that was not due to being ignorant but to being "weak/crazy"/prone to crying. My larger point is that ignorance and incompetence are not really cast-iron predictors of whether the VP candidate will be successful or not - partly because the public doesn't care (or is just as ignorant/incompetent lol) and partly because fighting back against being portrayed as ignorant/incompetence by the media, especially in recent GOP campaigns, is a badge of honor.

xp

Reagan said this iirc (trees produce carbon dioxide, therefore BAD)

yeah Quayle said it too.

and then there's Reagan's "facts are stupid things"

Political movements built on self-righteous ignorance are as old as time...

correction:

but that her public statements were could have been so bad that she would be dropped by the ticket

I haven't mentioned Andrew Johnson because he became president, but, man, was this guy a stupid louse -- our worst president ever.

WTF was wrong with Lincoln... Hannibal Hamlin (Lincoln's VP during his first term) was a perfectly good VP, but got tossed so Lincoln could carry a vague southern vote.

shakey the weird part abt this argument you keep making is you refuse to grapple w/the intensity of palins ignorance, its like you think theres a quality called ignorance which is synonymous w/stupidity and it just has an on off switch and voters just accept it regardless of how much of it there is

btw only a handful of veeps got cabinet status before FDR institutionalized it (Van Buren probably the most powerful veep before the 20th century). Veeps weren't trusted and were seen as part of the legislative branch.

WTF was wrong with Lincoln... Hannibal Hamlin (Lincoln's VP during his first term) was a perfectly good VP, but got tossed so Lincoln could carry a vague southern vote.

i think the idea was to bring northern democrats into the fold. oddly, johnson was considered a pretty hardline anti-confederate before he actually became pres.

voters just accept it regardless of how much of it there is

the list of stupid things elected officials have said in public is so long and voluminous I sort of don't know how you could come to any other conclusion...? Large parts of the electorate have historically assumed the worst about their elected officials, and not without evidence.

xp

lol right on time

Phil Elliott ‏ @Philip_Elliott
Santorum quote of the day: "The dangers of carbon dioxide? Tell that to a plant, how dangerous carbon dioxide is." #2012
Retweeted by Jim Newell

I guess you think "not knowing things" is some sort of special category for the electorate but I really don't think that's the case. It's hard to fault an elected official for not knowing things you yourself don't know (see: basic geography, American history, etc.)

xp

sad to realize that cheney prob ranks among the smartest and most capable of all VPs.

fwiw the carbon dioxide quote from reagan or santorum isnt imo stupid its just v cynical

I guess you think "not knowing things" is some sort of special category for the electorate but I really don't think that's the case. It's hard to fault an elected official for not knowing things you yourself don't know (see: basic geography, American history, etc.)

xp

― the sir edmund hillary of sitting through pauly shore films (Shakey Mo Collier), Monday, March 12, 2012 7:37 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah theres even a word for not knowing things and everything

let's ask Dan Quayle if he can spell it

tbf the answer card did say 'ignoranc' on it

fwiw the carbon dioxide quote from reagan or santorum isnt imo stupid its just v cynical

well um Reagan believed it

is there some sort of evidence of that, srs question

Santorum believes the world is 8,000 years old or whatever. fyi

is there some sort of evidence of that, srs question

The biographies have all confirmed the truth of these utterances.

Reagan said trees cause more pollution than automobiles iirc

xp

oh man that "cruel and stupid lizard line" has stuck with me. Hitch could be good on occasion.

He also used to spook Nat'l Security Adviser Colin Powell with anecdotes from Human Events about how the US was "Gog" and the USSR "Magog" and Chernobyl meant "wormwood."

The biographies have all confirmed the truth of these utterances.

― Exile in lolville (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, March 12, 2012 7:44 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

there is nothing abt trees in that piece u jerk

I should add that in the interest of fairness that Hitchens recanted some of this in a column last year.

geez google some Reagan quotes goonie

xp

re: Santorum and cynicism - he hates science and learning, dude manifestly and wholeheartedly believes all sorts of ignorant bullshit. sponsored bills to allow creationism in the senate, doesn't believe humans cause climate change, etc.

xp

i know reagan said stupid stuff i know he said the thing abt the trees i just asked if there was evidence that he believed the thing abt the trees why because he had plenty good reason to say it even if he didnt believe it

same for santourm

You want proof.

here he is urging the teaching of creationism in public schools

and then there's the recent quote where he said he's "never believed in the hoax of global warming" etc.

what constitutes proof of belief.

serious question.

that is just the front cover of a digital book, not even made of trees!

but they cause pollution!

jus someone being all yes reagan told me he thinks tress are the sun or w/e anything any scrap of evidence will do, i mean really do not care w/e

i know reagan said stupid stuff i know he said the thing abt the trees i just asked if there was evidence that he believed the thing abt the trees why because he had plenty good reason to say it even if he didnt believe it

Plenty of evidence shows he believed the dumbest shit.

i know that jesus people

said in private

and lots of evidence shows he was a smooth cynical political operator too

i mean i do not care and am not demanding research from you but

Santorum's voted against climate change legislation, he's against cap and trade, he's for more coal mining etc = proof of belief enough for me.

here's a nice bit from Rick (transcripts from Limbaugh appearance:

I believe the earth gets warmer, and I also believe the earth gets cooler, and I think history points out that it does that and that the idea that man through the production of CO2 which is a trace gas in the atmosphere and the manmade part of that trace gas is itself a trace gas is somehow responsible for climate change is, I think, just patently absurd when you consider all of the other factors, El Nino, La Nina, sunspots, you know, moisture in the air. There's a variety of factors that contribute to the earth warming and cooling, and to me this is an opportunity for the left to create -- it's a beautifully concocted scheme because they know that the earth is gonna cool and warm. It's been on a warming trend so they said, "Oh, let's take advantage of that and say that we need the government to come in and regulate your life some more because it's getting warmer," just like they did in the seventies when it was getting cool, they needed the government to come in and regulate your life because it's getting cooler. It's just an excuse for more government control of your life, and I've never been for any scheme or even accepted the junk science behind the whole narrative.

obvs we cannot go inside these peoples brains but like you know he has a political motive for saying those things right

I know this is said by his acolytes as praise but Reagan was one of the last truly uncynical politicians. He believed a lot of the scripts he read.

I kinda don't get what "proof" yr after if neither private statements made in confidence and actual legislative records count

xp

and should NOR

Wow @ Steve Schmidt saying "It was really accurate".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tS2cXwFV98

should BE nor argh

xp

that's what makes him so fascinating and why I keep reading about him

shakey do you think all republican climate change deniers believe what theyre saying

they're a lot less talented at doing the Reagan thing of ducking his head, shrugging, and going "Well..." with a chuckle

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3eyISCTG5Y&t=7m44s

the fun starts at the 7:44 part

That Schmidt interview's fascinating--with the weird disconnect that he was so integral to the decision (which he acknowledges, to a degree).

You really see that he's realized he's unleashed a monster.

its funny how political operatives are often so open after the campaigns, you think thatd get them black listed

shakey do you think all republican climate change deniers believe what theyre saying

you know, thinking about this a little more, perhaps we should reverse this and put the burden of proof on you: can you cite a single instance where a VP candidate was dropped from a ticket because of something stupid/ignorant they said? As far as I know this has never happened.

also Santorum's WHOLE persona is built on the fervency of his deeply-held and deeply-backwards beliefs. I have no doubt he believes these things. If it walks like a duck etc

damn, ppl love cable comedies that're up their alley

If they didn't I'd expect they might be something of a grouch.

"And bear whatever comes what may"--that's so unwieldy, it might just be right for all I know.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1rj4E6fRgc

Watched this last night and liked it as a camp horror movie... it's the real life version of Lonesome Rhodes from A Face In The Crowd. Moore was eerily spot-on (better than Streep/Thatcher I thought) even when the movie lapsed into true-crime-re-enactment production values.

...patently absurd when you consider all of the other factors, El Nino, La Nina, sunspots, you know, moisture in the air.

And all of these "other factors" are, of course, mutually exclusive. Because warmer air doesn't hold more moisture or anything...

That interview is so awesome after just watching the movie, it feels like a continuation of the "Memorize these talking points to respond to questions". How do you feel about this portrayal of you in an upcoming movie? "Well, blah blah job creation, blah blah wealth redistribution, blah blah, folksy saying".

Washington Post weighs in on how Palin "ruined" American politics

oh, no one is going to click on that

I dare you

I doubleDOG dare you

richard cohen, come on dude

At some point while watching HBO’s absolutely smashing (and terrifying) movie “Game Change,” it occurred to me that Sarah Palin has ruined America.

Richard Cohen vs David Gergen for Most Grindingly Obvious Pundit in America.

absolutely smashing!

Ok this thing (GAME CHANGE) is hilarious. Ed Harris's McCain reminds me of Adam Schiff's role in L&O.

i would just like to point out that lagoon/icey was very OTM in this thread.

No way all those Republican TVs were always set to CNN.

i would just like to point out that lagoon/icey was very OTM in this thread.

by pointing out that Palin was a lol choice? idgi

apparently the chairman of the law firm I work for is all over this movie for fucking up the vetting process. way to go a.b.!

by pointing out that Palin was a lol choice? idgi

― the sir edmund hillary of sitting through pauly shore films (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, March 14, 2012 7:13 AM (1 hour ago)

not just that one post i linked to-- everyone was all "hmmm very interesting VP pick, this could be what helps McCain defeat Obama.... very interesting choice indeed *strokes chin*" except icey.

enjoying this movie quite a bit. basically lulzy foreshadowing + a great soundtrack.

everyone was all "hmmm very interesting VP pick, this could be what helps McCain defeat Obama.... very interesting choice indeed *strokes chin*" except icey.

what am I, chopped liver.

hey hey - yeah I was gone last week, missed lots of fun it looks like :(

― Shakey Mo Collier, Tuesday, September 2, 2008 6:10 AM (3 years ago)

sorry shakes, i was looking at 8/29/08 posts only : )

her worst flubs were claiming being in proximity to alaska constituted national security experience and not knowing the names of magazines, neither of which approach demonstrating how ignorant this movie alleges she was

I'd forgotten about the DJ who phoned her up and pretended he was Sarkozy--which she fully believed, and talked away for five minutes before catching on. I think it happened about a week before the election. It was too late to really become an issue, and obviously way, way too late for McCain to consider dropping her (if you even think that was a possibility at any point; as I wrote above, I don't). But this was much worse than the Russia-from-my-window or magazine gaffes. It's sobering to think so, but inside a week or two of the election, I'm sure she must have had some level of security briefings by this point. And here she is, talking away to a radio clown and thinking he's Sarkozy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JV_IphAIGPg

i blame her handlers for that, mostly.

http://joemande.com/post/19407102466/heres-the-movie-game-change-in-less-than-a

Rick Hertzberg falls under her spell:

Julianne Moore is a marvellous actress. “The Big Lebowski,” “The Kids Are All Right,” “Vanya on 42nd Street,” “Boogie Nights,” “Far from Heaven,” “A Single Man,” “The Hours”—she was terrific in them all, and in many more besides. And there’s nothing wrong with her performance in HBO’s “Game Change.” She does a fine Palin impression, as good as Tina Fey’s—better, really, because more nuanced.

But the truth is, no one plays Sarah Palin like Sarah Palin. No one can. I realize that the rules of attraction are a little different for everyone. The mysteries of eros are treacherously subjective. That said, what Palin had, and what Moore couldn’t quite nail, was an ineffable—and, apparently, inimitable—sexiness.

I’ve glimpsed the former half-term governor a couple of times lately in her post-gubernatorial habitat at Fox News, and I regret to say that the past couple of years have not been entirely kind to her (the same can be said of many of us). But in 2008, 2009, and 2010 she was about as beautiful as a woman can be and still be a person of manifestly bad character. (I’m talking about skin-deep beauty, of course, not “Beauty is truth, truth beauty” beauty.) The tempestuous Alaskan’s tousled pile of hair, her liquid eyes and stylish glasses, her childlike window-washing hand wave, her (to my ears) musical voice, her lips…. Uh, oh. The point is, I’m sure I wasn’t the only man, even the only male Democrat, who was mesmerized by her corporeal and sonic affect. (A side note: most of the women I know found her looks unexceptionable—a well-groomed suburban matron, but hardly a knockout. And to the extent that this was how women in general saw her, it was a political plus.)

In “Game Change,” Julianne Moore gets the feral ambition, the small-mindedness, the catatonic depression lurking beneath the public perkiness. But she doesn’t quite get the flirtatiousness, the seductiveness, the juiciness—the magic.

gross

loool

the juiciness, the magic

God loves his children, yeah.

(A side note: most of the women I know found her looks unexceptionable—a well-groomed suburban matron, but hardly a knockout.

lol this guy can't write for shit

Thank god for homosexuality.

lol

Hertzberg's an excellent writer. And I understood the piece--it passed the more she started to speak, and by palling-around-with-terrorists I despised her, but I shared in his initial attraction.

man i don't get that at all. i grew up with women like that on the school board and shit. instant recognition.

her (to my ears) musical voice,

get them shits checked son

I agree she gave an impressive imitation of a committed conservative at the convention but sexy? Nah.

Hertzberg's an excellent writer.

lol really

most of the women I know found her looks unexceptionable

I'm pretty sure he means "unexceptional"

Usage Note: The confusion between unexceptionable and unexceptional is understandable, since both derive from the noun exception. Unexceptionable takes its meaning from exception in the sense "objection," as in the idiom take exception to ("find fault with, object to"). Thus unexceptionable is commendatory, meaning "not open to any objection or criticism," as in A judge's ethical standards should be unexceptionable. Unexceptional, by contrast, is related to the adjective exceptional ("outstanding, above average), which takes its meaning from exception in the sense "an unusual case"; thus unexceptional generally has a somewhat negative meaning, "not superior, run-of-the-mill" as in Some judges' ethical standards have unfortunately been unexceptional.

the real problem is "her corporeal and sonic affect".

Hertzberg is one of the better political writers, yeah. He misspelled the word because Pain's corporeal and sonic affect befuddled him.

I put out a tape on the Sonic Affect label, no shame in their game iirc

feral ambition

I'm not buying any of this shit Alfred

Pain's corporeal and sonic affect

About right.

middle aged men always write like shit when they're horny, great to see this "starburst" garbage emitting from a liberal.

i heard plenty of tales (none direct tho) of older professional liberal-ish women who thought palin was pretty great, even pretty late into the shitshow

Palin's "sonic affect" =

http://www.heyuguys.co.uk/images/2010/07/banshee.jpg

i def recall a lot of women complimenting palins looks 'bone structure' etc but w/e this piece is hilarious and ill advised

tho tbf moore couldve played it a lil foxier, like why no hot todd on palin sex shots

who played todd palin in this thing?

some guy

it was a weird kinda twist tho and i mentioned this up thread that both sarah and todd were played by gingers

rank revisionism imo

He's being honest about his initial reactions to her--knowing what we now know about her, it's easy to ridicule someone for saying as much. Honesty, especially when it runs counter to expectations, is one hallmark of an excellent writer.

conversely, political guys maybe dont write abt yr boners

Ha, "Todd Palin" was also teenaged Tricky Dick in Nixon.

http://www.wearysloth.com/Gallery/ActorsG/22682-13780.gif

Also, his ass is all over Google.

Honesty, especially when it runs counter to expectations, is one hallmark of an excellent writer.

ok, but "counter to expectations" is a good way to gin up a column out of nothing + then resort to "I'm just being honest!" when what you have to say is laughable

"the tempestuous Alaskan." come the fuck on man. I'm not the world's premier stylist but anybody on this thread could do better than "the tempestuous Alaskan"

the oleaginous Alaskan

except maybe as a display name, it's unimpeachable as a display name

the conundrum from the tundra

somebody must have done "The Thrilla from Wasilla" back then

lol yes

About 99,800 results (0.45 seconds)

Tempestuous Alaska should be a desert. Like, it's baked Alaska, but with sriracha or something on it.

conversely, political guys maybe dont write abt yr boners

He's writing about Game Change. Not talking honestly about his own response to Palin would be disingenuous.

I don't mean to press the point, but I can't see passing summary judgement on a writer because you disagree with him about this one particular point. Whatever he's doing there, Kael did as a matter of routine. And he is writing about a movie.

just stop the piece is blatantly shit lame and embarrassing

Sayeth you. Disagree.

fine just please spare us yr theories re writing when were loling at political writers perving out

Calm down. Lagoon, I genuinely enjoy your posts on the Republican thread. And if you'd like to spell out your problems with the piece in something other than this cryptic shorthand that you communicate in, I'd be glad to engage. But I don't think I've offered any theories thus far; I've said that it's perfectly okay--preferable, even--that a guy writing about Game Change be honest about his initial reactions to Palin. If you don't share those reactions, fine, leave it at that.

no u leave it at that

Hah I was gonna say the real SP actually kinda hotter than JM SP (even though out-of-character JM obviously way hotter) but this guy is ridiculous. The music in her voice? WTF?

yeah its a legit observation, but wouldve been better served by like two sentences max

I'm out of my depth here--I must hand off to Dr. Evil and duck out of this skirmish.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/32C0eKRQVt8"; frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Oops--stepped on my own punchline.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=32C0eKRQVt8

hahaha, "oh behave!" he got you good icey.

internet hardman lyfe is tuff

know the difference between a pitbull and an internet hardman?

This seems like a fine thread to recount my own experience with SP.

I was in Maine visiting my aunt w dad and she was speaking in an airport hanger in Bangor. It was the middle of October. We went down to check it out and there were probably 500 or so people huddled around, listening to a pretty basic speech that lasted maybe 10 or 15 minutes. While we were there, there were a few democrat protestors holding up signs. The balls on these guys! Of course Palin supporters shouted "Get a job!" etc at them and they were escorted out. I took some photos of SP in the distance. That night the local news channel had a story on it and the footage they shows was kinda odd so i looked at my photos and it was from a totally different event. Also the news story said the turnout was something like 5,000 people.

banger in a hanger in bangor

*ar

The Dr. Evil clip was silly and infantile and rather embarrassing.

no u leave it at that

That was kind of the point...

(A little voice inside my head said, "Don't check back, you should never check back." Need to follow that voice.)

no hard feelings all i was saying was c'mon son

No problem. I read Hertzberg's Obama book, liked it a lot, so I'm defending him. And again, you always make me laugh on the Republican thread.

i like hertzberg but he's probably already feeling embarrassed by that column

hertzbergs good but im a little suspicious of his schtick

what is his schtick

"writing"

bonerz

his schtick in brief is psychologizing political proceedings from and here were coming to the part im suspicious of somewhat of a 'just a simple man' or outsider prospective

Unfrozen Caveman Political Pundit

ha yes i had to stop myself from writing exactly that

w/ palin this would be the best-looking election in decades

― max, Friday, August 29, 2008 4:05 AM (3 years ago)

i had a dream that i was romneys campaign manager, v much inspired by this film

who was your veep?

morbz

"Which papers do you read?"
"NONE OF THEM."

ha it took place during the present day primaries iirc so no veep, i spent the whole time being all why am i doing this i hate republicans i dont want him to win

Finally saw this. (Took my brother-in-law about 30 minutes to hand me a USB.) Do I want to wade into this again?

I thought it was basically as good as Recount. I didn't think it was nearly as good as the trailer with "American Woman." (Which was better than almost any film I saw last year.) Thought the best performance was given by Woody Harrelson; I don't know if I've seen more than half-a-dozen Harrelson films in my life, but I always find him impressive. Maybe I just get lucky and see the right ones. If they hadn't borrowed the book's title, they could have called it Saint John. Boy, McCain gets a pass.

I'm trying to think of a way to revisit Hertzberg's review without getting into his starry-eyed crush on the real thing, which caused such a commotion upthread, but it's inextricable from what he wrote. (The film is so careful to avoid the centrality of Palin's looks, it's bizarre--I think there are two brief mentions, one of them by Pat Buchanan.) And, big surprise, I think Hertzberg was exactly right--Moore's good in a studied, Joan Allen way, but she misses something fundamental. I totally understand why Moore had to come up with something other than what Tina Fey did. But in trying to convey what Moore was missing, I think of that moment in SNL's debate parody where Fey said, "Can I call you Joe? 'Cause I've got a couple of zingers where I call you Joe." She missed that. One moment made me laugh aloud: when Palin sees Biden doing some stretching off-stage just seconds before the debate and tries to mimic him.

lol yeah i loved that and really hope it actually happened

I thought it was basically as good as Recount.

i dug Recount more, because the specifics of the story weren't as familiar to me. game change is well done but i couldnt shake the been there, done that feeling. as far as hbo docudramas featuring caricatures of famous politicians, i prefer dennis quaid's clinton in the spesh relaysh

Going to a screening of Will Ferrell-Zach Galifjasuygckis The Campaign tonight, directed by Roach, with Dan Aykroyd and John Lithgow as "the Motch brothers." The subtlety rolls on.

this has essentially replaced Pulp fiction as my "anytime I'm flipping through the channels and see this is on HBO I will turn it on" thing. So funny.

needs a sequel

Wow, Moore's great.

This was fun, well done if colored by the usual Halperin mush. Moore manages to be sympathetic as in over her head as well as breathtakingly ambitious and deluded.

Does reinforce some pro-Palin myths, like the one that she did the 2nd half of her convention speech from memory after the teleprompter broke (it didn't), or that she added the hockey mom joke off the top of her head (the handwritten signs were stage-managed like everything else), or that the fancy clothes were the campaign's fault instead of what she wanted all along (yeah right, her "I don't want to go back to Alaska" line near the end is closer to the truth). The 8th grade civics and history lessons were totally damning, and so was the idea that the debate could be successfully scripted in advance. She didn't do that well in the debate either, to anyone who actually paid attention, but the comeback narrative was irresistible to the press, and evidently to the screenwriters here.

Schmidt comes off best because he's the source, but the "celebrity" ad counterpunch was great politics and very effective, full credit. The idea that McCain shut down the attack dogs instead of just making them work under the radar at a distance (which is the usual approach anyway) is also self-serving, but the moment he took the mike away from the "he's an Arab" woman at the town hall and corrected her was a genuine mark in his favor, one missing from Obama's opposition ever since. The "it's not about you" scene at the end is a very nice bit of American political mythologizing.

Now I need to see Recount.

i liked recount more

Nice write-up, plasmon, most of which I agree with. One thing I won't do is give much credit to McCain for correcting that woman. As I've said before--and I was very attentive to the whole timeline as it unfolded--that came way too late; that stuff had been going on at McCain rallies for at least two or three weeks before he spoke up. Also, when he finally did, it was about a week after the stock market meltdown, when it was starting to become clear that he'd lose. To me, it was just a guy trying to salvage whatever goodwill was left towards him at that point.

i cancelled my hbo so i can no longer watch Game Change when it comes on, as I'm sure it still does from time to time

The look on Sarah Paulson and Woody Harrelson's faces when they realize that Palin doesn't know what the Fed is.

somehow i ended up watching this last night.

it was kind of unsettling to watch it in the trump era. seems like all of the collective madness of the mccain campaign happens every week now.

it was a more innocent time