2012 republican presidential nominee II: back into hell

Romney vs. Perry right now, could go either way imho

Nice--all that's missing is iatee's "something weird" option.

http://cdn.gunaxin.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/kang-and-kodos.jpg

man I have no idea how it plays out after somebody gets the nomination. I think the horse race right now is between romney and perry, and I think the party gives it to perry because he'll be more willing to be aggressively an asshole. I do think perry will be a hard guy for the Democrats to beat because they don't know how to deal with somebody that aggro. Mitt just lacks the killer instinct though I think -- he has that pathetic "please, give me this, I really want it" vibe to his campaigning. Perry conveys confidence, which voters like - I think Bachmann does well for the same reason, but she's kinda lawful evil whereas Perry is chaotic evil. the advantage to chaotic evil is deniability; lawful evil has to stick to its guns.

frankly I think elections would go much better if candidates were forced to declare alignment

Why is Huntsman even here except to anger a googling Perry staff member?

you geeks are gonna have a new thread for every primary, God Almighty. I really need to quit these.

stop smelling rick perry's shirt

huntsman here cuz amster had him as a frontrunner and that just amused the hell out of me

Cain/Summer '12

"...leaving me hear on my own."

gonna save my vote but if I were voting right now 'perry will win the nomination but not the white house'

Most of the time, however, Perry upheld the traditional Texas economic model. If Perry is nominated for president in 2012, the Texas model is the model Republicans will again offer Americans, for the third time in the past four presidential elections. Compared with Obama's free-spending liberalism, it may seem the lesser evil. But you have to imagine that there are millions of Americans hoping for a third choice: an approach that balances budgets and holds the line on taxes -- but that also strengthens the private economy and supports a broad middle class.

That third choice is the kind of active, effective government Republicans have championed since Abraham Lincoln signed into law the transcontinental railway. Won't at least one Republican speak up for it now when it has rarely been more needed?

lol @ Frum

kill em all and let mammon sort them out.

good thing we have two of these thread so far, cant wait to purchase the box set

Was he a sportscaster? I've only heard of him RECREATING baseball games that were happening elsewhere off a teletype. An excellent head start in embellishing.

― satan club sandwich (Dr Morbius), Monday, August 15, 2011 2:43 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

this is a p impressive skill tbf

Once, the ticker gave out and he made some player hit balls foul for 20 minutes.

balances budgets and holds the line on taxes -- but that also strengthens the private economy and supports a broad middle class...

... plus kills all the poor, sick and weak, electrocutes lawbreakers, and distributes free lollipops and puppies to all blue-eyed children.

ha those pictures on the previous thread...I went to A&M and the fact that Perry was in the Corp pretty much tells you all you need to know about him.

I've already expressed my thoughts on Texas enough times here, but fuckin' Aggies are the worst.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YTepCLMf_I

ha those pictures on the previous thread...I went to A&M and the fact that Perry was in the Corp pretty much tells you all you need to know about him.

― ryan, Monday, August 15, 2011 3:49 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

plz do tell, these pix are just like i dont even know

http://static.texastribune.org/media/images/AM-Perry_jpg_800x1000_q100.jpg

He looks like he's answering a personals ad: "Interested in: collies and bugger."

*buggery

Perry didn't top 40% in the 2006 election, even right-wing Texans don't really like him. I have a hard time believing he can run nationally.

"Yell" leaders

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yU8mL1639uo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a3Xjrs2mqqE

reading up on him perry seems to have a frequent tendency to say things that almost everyone disagrees with like 'social security is unconstitutional' and 'texas should leave usa'

40%? was that some crazy MN-style situation with 3rd candidacies and such?

xp to milo

I only disagree with one of those things.

xp

lol mee too

people keep bringing up 2006 but it was a 4 way race.
he won easily in 2002 & 2010

that boots pic is perfect for "Lili Marleeen" or "Tomorrow Belongs to Me"

reading up on him perry seems to have a frequent tendency to say things that almost everyone disagrees with like 'social security is unconstitutional' and 'texas should leave usa'
--ice cr?m

who disagrees w/ #2?

Right, but he was a sitting Governor who'd faced no real challenges and ran into a 4-way race. He won easily in his other races because it's a one-party state - if he placates enough of the TX Baptists to keep the nomination, it's a guaranteed win.
Perry's got a lot of ethical skeletons in his closet and he's so far right (wildly more right-wing than Dubya was in 2000) that while he could win the nomination, I don't see how he could win a national campaign.

Once you've called for secession, I think moderates have a hard time voting for you.

what if unemployment hits 10%

Secession? He'll reframe it as a joke. Easy enough to do, unless there was a whole lot of obviously serious follow-through trying to make it happen.

really tho in any normal country the secessionist shit would be enough to disqualify him from running the country he doesn't want to be a part of. this is America tho, so I think it will 'be an issue' for a week or so and then the media will move on.

feel like the secession comment could easily become an 'al gore invented the internet' type sticky joke

has rickperryhatesamerica.com been purchased

Guy who wanted to secede or Guy born in Kenya whose wife hates USA.

xp!

I've been waiting for a batshit Corner post today and could find nothing :(

http://c0848462.cdn.cloudfiles.rackspacecloud.com/783c103a9fe02e127e7c97185be0c5ec712c80deb6.jpg

if governor perry wants to start his own country with no social security i wish him all the luck in the world *smirk*

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4tWZNxnABk

He'll reframe it as a joke. Easy enough to do, unless there was a whole lot of obviously serious follow-through trying to make it happen.

I'm thinking of that scene in The Candidate where the brain trust is sitting around planning strategy, they're trying to figure out what to say about Vietnam, and somebody comes up the idea to brush any questions off by saying, "The Communists can't even see the beaches of Santa Monica, much less land on them." Everyone laughs, they're ready to move on, and someone says, "But do we really want to say that?"

So if he does come up with a clever dodge, yeah, I would hope there'd be some follow-up.

there was secessionist shit with palin's husband's political affiliations, remember?

yeah, and she didn't become Vice-President

not todd's fault!

Remember it well. It kind of got lost in the shuffle of everything else with her, and maybe the same thing will happen with Perry.

stating the obvious: its a lot easier to ignore something a vp candidates husbands friends said than something the pres candidate himself said

and i mean apparently rick perry has said a lot of other crazy shit too

possibly the funniest thing about Palin's demise as a VP candidate is how one of her most clueless comments was actually a line from an SNL skit

Yeah, I kind of think the stuff about social security being unconstitutional could be more of a potential liability than the secession talk, which I doubt anyone takes seriously. xp

people who call Social Security a Ponzi scheme don't understand what Social Security actually is

obama v devolved gw bush would be a somewhat surreal meta matchup

'let us out of this recursive loop cries nation'

feel like u all are sleeping on the potential points to be scored off the secessionist gaff particularly in the primary #antiamerican #unpatriotic

Almost wish we had had a chain of Bush-Clinton-Bush-Clinton-Perry and then Jim Guy Tucker or somebody.

Or Bush.

i'm really gonna get tired of a #whowonthecivilwaragain election

Just thinking about the kind of Supreme Court Justices that a President Perry would appoint, given his views on Social Security, is probably enough to make all but the most extreme conservative voters a little anxious. Expect him to backpedal furiously on that.

Some other things that Perry thinks are unconstitutional:

http://motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2011/08/rick-perry-too-radical-even-tea-party

Yeah, I kind of think the stuff about social security being unconstitutional could be more of a potential liability than the secession talk, which I doubt anyone takes seriously. xp

― o. nate, Monday, August 15, 2011 3:34 PM (11 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

^^^Hella otm, looking forward to town hall meetings with AARP.

obama devolved clinton v devolved gw bush would be a somewhat surreal meta matchup

I've already expressed my thoughts on Texas enough times here, but fuckin' Aggies are the worst.

paul begala's tweets about texas a&m are funny and harsh

S.E.C won't invite A&M to join. Poor Aggies. They stayed up all night studying for the urine test.

____________________________

Texas A&M plans to join the SEC. One drawback: 75% of Aggies can't spell "SEC."

also, nice zing on palin/perry

y first Tweet: Big GOP debate tonight in Iowa. @SarahPalinUSA and @RickPerry will not participate. Probably busy at a Mensa meeting.

A&M's hockey team drowned last week during summer workouts.

^^^ amazing

MOAR AGGIES JOEKS.

Google image search: bachmann corn dog

who disagrees w/ #2?

would be awesome if you & everybody who votes like you would quit saying shit like this

no kidding

the state we want to kick out is Arizona

haha didnt we do a thread about that?

hoos was mad that everyone wants texas out of the union

sorry hoos

Fuck Texas. They can build a wall around the whole state, not just the Mexican side. I don't care if West Texarkana becomes East Berlin if it means we won't ever have a fourth Texan president to lead us into some misguided war. Don't mess with Texas? FINE. Just sit there by yourself and whistle "I've Been Working On the Railroad". Long as you don't try coming over here because we'll chase you back across the Red River with a bullet over your head like nobody's business. Piss on your Alamo.

Except Hoos and Milo. I'll sponsor them for hardship visas.

I will never defend Texas

I'd defend Willie Nelson if he needed a hand, I guess.

He won easily in his other races because it's a one-party state - if he placates enough of the TX Baptists to keep the nomination, it's a guaranteed win.
― Kiarostami bag (milo z), Monday, 15 August 2011 20:15 (1 hour ago)

TX is not a one party state. It's arguably not even one of the 10 most conservative states in the country (certainly not one of the 7 or 8 most conservative.)

I wish the DNC had realized this and gotten a better opponent against Cornyn in '08 (and given him or her more money.)

like that episode of monk where willie was accused of murder xp

I'd defend Willie Nelson if he needed a hand, I guess.

he generally seems to need a hand

I will say though that Bill White was a pretty strong candidate and it was terribly disappointing that Perry was able to beat him by a solid margin without even showing up for the debates.

xp

It's arguably not even one of the 10 most conservative states in the country

what barometer are we using here

http://www.gallup.com/poll/146348/mississippi-rates-conservative-state.aspx

Certainly not congressional representation, electoral performance in presidential elections, state legislature, executions, hand gun laws and willingness to use Creationism as a viable educational platform.

xp

self-identification /= policy tho

xp

have you fucking people ever been to Texas and met some of the awesome people there? RIP Houston hip-hop, you changed the game & added lots to it but you had to go so people could feel cooler about themselves

Roky? Daniel Johnston? the Butthole Surfers? fuck all y'all, Shakey Mo says Texas suxx

the Rothko Chapel in Houston? whatever, it's gotta be an accident that it ended up there

Art Car museum up the street from the Rothko Chapel? lol, like mindless "my region is better than your region" dumbfucks would even notice it

have you fucking people ever been to Texas and met some of the awesome people there? RIP Houston hip-hop, you changed the game & added lots to it but you had to go so people could feel cooler about themselves

aesthetics don't always have very much to do with politics

jeez it's almost like people are talking past each other itt

Lots of poets in the USSR.

i'll tell you what, rick perry can secede... from my nuts!!

Roky? Daniel Johnston? the Butthole Surfers? fuck all y'all, Shakey Mo says Texas suxx

this is like some Lot-pleadin-with-God-not-to-destroy-Sodom & Gomorrah silliness

There are some awesome sculptors in North Korea apparently.

I think they even have a car museum there.

Katherine Anne Porter? whatever, those people don't "appreciate" literature, they probably can't even tell a Chard from a Grigio

*farts*

jd you can find a state's political impact on the country toxic and still have no prob w/ the ppl/culture/houston rockets/etc

You have to hate the Astros though. That's a given.

*law & order sound effect*

ggreenwald Glenn Greenwald
Can't stand the partisan fear-mongering surrounding every election, but the more I read of Rick Perry, the more it seems merited for him

seriously Shakey Mo you on this subject is one of my least favorite things in the world & I feel you on more subjects than a lot of people. when some motherfucker starts hating on a city/state/region, I think, wow, you don't get the whole fucking point of being human. you shouldn't participate in politics, because you judge people on where they're from, and fuck you permanently if that is actually how you feel. redistricting has as much to do with Texas politics as anything else, not like you'd give a shit because "lol fuck Texas!" meanwhile doesn't your neck of the woods tolerate the murder of BART riders with a slap on the wrist? sweep around your own damn front door

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPcTHJodp6M

xp I know balls but these motherfuckers try to pretend they don't, like, elect Arnold fucking Schwarzenegger governor. I've lived in flyover/"backwoods" places for over half my life now and seen more & better community engagement in these places than I did where I grew up & I go fucking ham when people bust out bullshit "fuck Texas" garbage. fuck Texas? fuck you, and fuck your pleas for donations when your party comes calling

I'm not the only person who feels this way; I'm just one of a few who'll tell people to their face how badly they're screwing the pooch when they bust out their snooty halfassed social parsings

i mean i love love love the south, fave region in terms of culture cuisine and women, but if in the context of politics (or many many other contexts) someone said 'fuck the south, america would be better off w/o it' i would totally get where they're coming from.

Certainly not congressional representation, electoral performance in presidential elections, state legislature, executions, hand gun laws and willingness to use Creationism as a viable educational platform.

xp

― https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9LStRxwN7hI (Pleasant Plains), Monday, August 15, 2011 9:53 PM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark

Plenty of states are more Republican by percentage of congressional representation, even with DeLay's gerrymandering: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/politics/2010-race-maps/house/

I imagine that electoral performance in presidential elections for Texas is about where I estimated it: 9th or 10th most conservative.

You have to hate the Astros though. That's a given.

Texas produces great pitchers at an alarming rate! also, migas!

jd you realize from my vantagepoint north carolina looks like a liberal utopia

aerosmith: I said I wouldn't defend Texas. Why should I? It's kind of ... not my responsibility?

I'm more flyover than anyone here and I can't bring myself to stop saying FUCK TEXAS.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3382/3640211558_8aa96e755d.jpg

if texas seceded & rap bloggers still wrote about houston hip-hop we could at least then ward off claims of not caring about international rap

I do this about every six months, sorry to be so lit up yall but I've been to 46 of the states and anybody who gives me "fuck _______" about any of them should go huff dog farts, it's a bullshit personal style and disrespectful to the likeminded people who are hard at work to make things better in all of them

like, I'm pretty sure Texas has many able and willing defenders lol. I'll be over here defending my own turf.

xp

if texas seceded & rap bloggers still wrote about houston hip-hop we could at least then ward off claims of not caring about international rap

I lol'd!

jd you realize from my vantagepoint north carolina looks like a liberal utopia

lol idk shit gets pretty intense outside of the Triangle

meanwhile doesn't your neck of the woods tolerate the murder of BART riders with a slap on the wrist? sweep around your own damn front door

also funny you should bring this up cuz I wouldn't say this is being "tolerated", exactly. it's being sued over/protested/rioted about. the problem is BART has no public oversight cuz it's a private firm, and has been legally shielded from responsibility blah blah but this is for another thread

xp

I think the primary reason Texas is perceived as one of the most conservative states is that the states that are more conservative than Texas are mostly very poor and low in population, i.e. not as powerful.

xxxxxxxp

I also have the most powerful liberal in the country for a Rep so there. nyah nyah

it's a bullshit personal style and disrespectful to the likeminded people who are hard at work to make things better in all of them

It's called FIGHT FIRE WITH FIRE

http://www.foxnews.com/images/378080/2_62_060808_mansion_fire03.jpg

also Schwarzenegger, while a total moron whom I hate with every fiber of my being, is demonstrably more liberal than 90% of the Republican party. He believes in global warming! and homosexuals! and smoking weed!

xp

I do take Texas' politics kind of personally given how much they like to fuck with our internal state politics (Enron, various state propositions, etc)

otoh, Perry's candidacy has been facilitated/bankrolled by Californians lol.

I wouldn't say this is being "tolerated", exactly. it's being sued over/protested/rioted about.

oh yeah down south there's zero resistance of any kind to any statist bullshit, I mean you'd have heard about it if there was right?

I don't take kindly to other states financing ballot challenges to laws passed by our own citizens, fuck that shit.

xp

It's called FIGHT FIRE WITH FIRE

I submit to you that fighting fire with fire is bad science & will do nothing to extinguish any fires.

man john you talk a hard game about the left but when alls said and done ur just an effete liberal aesthete whose back is gonna be up against the wall

oh yeah down south there's zero resistance of any kind to any statist bullshit, I mean you'd have heard about it if there was right?

dude yr all over the place. you brought up a specific instance, I refuted yr contention about how it's been responded to. how Texas handles "statist bullshit" (is BART "statist bullshit?" what?) is completely immaterial.

xp

I submit to you that fighting fire with fire is bad science & will do nothing to extinguish any fires.

um lol you know this is not true right?

Perry's candidacy has been facilitated/bankrolled by Californians lol.

lol for real! California invented Reagan! game, set, match! except that you know & I know that California is more complex than that & to say "fuck California" is to basically say "I don't know shit about California"

CTRL+F "California" type "Texas" click "replace all," same fuckin deal, this shit is seriously a major annoyance to me. Utah. Arkansas. Montana. Alaska. All full of awesome people doing awesome work imo

man john you talk a hard game about the left but when alls said and done ur just an effete liberal aesthete whose back is gonna be up against the wall]

it's true I think about it all the time but not as much I'd guess as my marxist-leninist bassist lol

um lol you know this is not true right?

can you actually extinguish fire with more fire? I await the science on this, as an effete liberal aesthete I am admittedly underscienced

http://imgur.com/tCp90.gif

I'm watching "Friday Nite Lights" the TV show as I type this and it's a giant refutation to Perry and Texas stereotypes.

"lets not send the bourgeoisie to labor camps, theyve created so much good culture, and their food is delicious"

can you actually extinguish fire with more fire? I await the science on this, as an effete liberal aesthete I am admittedly underscienced

yes it's called a controlled burn

xp

CTRL+F "California" type "Texas" click "replace all," same fuckin deal, this shit is seriously a major annoyance to me.

as far as I can tell Californians have never financed propositions in Texas. correct me if I'm wrong

yes it's called a controlled burn

yes that's what the two of you have attempted for ten minutes

re: presidential elections, McCain garnered a higher percentage of the vote in 14 states than he did in texas (55.5).

couldn't make the grammar of that sentence work, sorry.

but if in the context of politics (or many many other contexts) someone said 'fuck the south, america would be better off w/o it' i would totally get where they're coming from.

yeah i'm w/ this. i mean i like a lot of things about where i'm from, but the only thing i'd be super sad about if the south & tx (and az?) were to secede would be nola i guess. most people down here are just really fucked up y'all.

my friend in nola says that one out of every 4 or 5 restaurants he goes to has a gloryhole in the men's bathroom.

Is this nola's fault or his dining choices'?

I loved going to college in Texas but it was weird how people there who were from the state made sure the first month or so or school that everyone from out of state needed to be clear that it's in the Texas constitution that Texas can secede from the union whenever it wants. Perry would be a horrible president for the USA but in Texas stupid secessionist talk is pretty par for the course.

fwiw my scholarship was funded entirely by oil money (there's an Allen Ginsberg poem that calls out my scholarship's donor by name) & Karl Rove's son goes there now, & fellow grads are now involved in Perry's anti-university bullshit, & from my fb feed apparently most of my friends there were conservatives, so maybe my secession-trumpeting peers represented a particularly slanted perspective on this, I dunno, but whatever: it strikes me as pretty normal dumb big Texas talk w/o real world consequences in this case

and of course texas can't really secede, it can just break up into separate states (which would be pretty rad if there was a houston-SA-Austin state tbh).

I hear more "secessionist" talk from liberal friends to be honest.

TX is not a one party state. It's arguably not even one of the 10 most conservative states in the country (certainly not one of the 7 or 8 most conservative.)

Texas is very much a one-party state, just as it was when Dixiecrats ran shit. A one-party state that may be trending competitive over the next generation, but over of the next several elections you will not see a Democrat elected governor or a Democrat win the state in a Presidential election. I don't know which was more LOL-worthy, Tony Sanchez's gubernatorial platform of "I LOVE BUSH" in 2002 or Texas Dems thinking Bill White had a snowball's chance in hell in 2010.

I mean, yeah, Dallas County elected a Latina lesbian as Sheriff in 2006, but that doesn't mean anyone to the left of Attila the Hun can win a statewide race.

Rick Noriega won 43% of the vote against Cornyn with basically zero push. And he wasn't a very good candidate at all.

I'm watching "Friday Nite Lights" the TV show as I type this and it's a giant refutation to Perry and Texas stereotypes.

It's also, alas, fiction. Except for the really liking high school football stuff.

The thing is, in a lot of states, community involvement is indeed very high, as are liberal, even activist, enclaves. And yet time and again, on a state-wide level, these enclaves get stomped the fuck out. Seem to recall a so-so but memorable doc called "Dear Jesse" about how a state with people as good and nice as North Carolina's could again and again elect a total asshole like Jesse Helms. Which is to say, it's wrong to reduce an entire state to its objectionable national political face, but someone is still voting for those dicks.

"lets not send the bourgeoisie to labor camps, theyve created so much good culture, and their food is delicious"

max have you read The Iceman Cometh? this is a huge returning-to point for me

we won't ever have a fourth Texan president to lead us into some misguided war

Wait, is Obama from Texas too?

as far as I can tell Californians have never financed propositions in Texas. correct me if I'm wrong

lol no, California passed prop 8. has Texas got one of those? oh I know; in California it's different

No push for Norieaga, but Cornyn didn't have to blanket the air with ads and campaign non-stop (as he could have) - because it was never a competitive race and the DNC money people knew that going it.

Couldn't get past the first episode of Friday Night Lights - here's to good friends drinkin' beer in Texas!!!! but I don't give half a shit about HS football.

lol for real! California invented Reagan! game, set, match! except that you know & I know that California is more complex than that & to say "fuck California" is to basically say "I don't know shit about California"

see, here's the thing - if someone says that to me, then I'd be inclined to respond about the forward-thinking policy the state has produced, the goods and services provided to the rest of the country, the natural wonders within it's borders, the industries it has nurtured and developed. Macro-level stuff, you know? Not "OMG you hate Eazy-E FUCK YOU".

xp

srsly if you're from Cali and you actually wanna wax some "fuck Texas" bullshit after prop 8, then you're full of shit

i think california should secede too

the united states of my america is new york, new jersey, rhode island, maine, pennsylvania and hawaii

The A&M/SEC bullshit did highlight the weirdness of having a governor who still acts like a fifth-year senior. It wouldn't be hard to argue that he's actively worked to undermine the UT system, and there's only one glaring motive...

lol no, California passed prop 8. has Texas got one of those? oh I know; in California it's different

don't change the subject.

(also, it's being repealed. and was financed by the good people of the state of UTAH)

xp

like our state passing a shitty law is one thing. going into ANOTHER state and trying to make that state pass a law to benefit themselves is a whole other level of assholishness.

I'm assuming you know what I'm talking about here, but maybe I'm wrong

benefit themselves ourselves

that should say

I love Texas. Everytime i go to Houston or Austin i meet crazy creative awesome super nice people. The big cities seem to be doing pretty awesome too.

Er, i mean, yeah those are the big cities.

No push for Norieaga, but Cornyn didn't have to blanket the air with ads and campaign non-stop (as he could have) - because it was never a competitive race and the DNC money people knew that going it.
― Kiarostami bag (milo z), Monday, August 15, 2011 10:36 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark

The DNC and DSCC were shocked towards the end of the campaign by the polls showing Noriega surprisingly close. Perhaps if they had actually tried to win the race (and gotten a better candidate) they could have made it close.

DFW is a 'bigger' city, technically.

lol I can't believe I started all of this with my bait-an-aero texas joke

aero you know I don't h8 states I h8 the suburbs = I h8 almost all of america equally

i think california should secede too

I actually believed this in the 80s

coastal california should secede

it would sorta look like japan

State of Jefferson 4EVR

The thing is, in a lot of states, community involvement is indeed very high, as are liberal, even activist, enclaves. And yet time and again, on a state-wide level, these enclaves get stomped the fuck out. this is georgia to a t. very activist (relatively) progressive base in athens, thanks to gerrymandering no representation at any level of govt beyond city level and there are current machinations in the state govt to do away w/ that, to effectively turn over liberal city govt to conservative state govt. this following previous but as yet unsuccessful effort to eliminate any ability for local govts to say collect a sales tax, set property tax rates, or determine how they would spend revenues. when conservative counties voiced concerns the legislator behind it reassured them that they had nothing to worry about, that the effort was designed to correct the unchecked liberalism in athens. our congressman is paul broun who some of you may have heard of, and he won w/ heavy athens support thanx to his equally rightwing opponents comments about how he wished someone would bomb athens off the map the next time the bulldogs had a road game.

i think california should secede too

I actually believed this in the 80s

Steely Dan predicted the turn of this thread.

Don't forget ATL, 'gayest city in America'.

paul broun is fantastic, just a wonderful human being and legislator

State of Jefferson 4EVR

state of jefferson would prob be sending 2 republicans to the senate, fwiw

we dont need MORE states we need FEWER states

fewer states whose politics i disagree with, i mean

http://uploads.neatorama.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/redrawn-U.S.-map.jpg

dream the impossible dream

if all the big states splinter into a 100 new states we can basically destroy the senate

then we'd almost have a real democracy almost

haha as always my favorite thing about that map is the made-up state names

i mean imagine the guys who made it spend like a couple days drawing up the boundaries and then like a month brainstorming names on a whiteboard

bitterroot is a stupid name, I woulda gone with 'montana n'friends'

"Brownia"

lol i read bitterroot as bittorrent at first

Me too!

lol at calling south Florida "Everglades" when so little of it remains.

NEW New England

lol i read bitterroot as bittorrent at first

Corporate sponsorship states.

i've actually spent long minutes wondering how you could redraw state boundaries at all in this country, like, new constitutional referenda 50 times? or would each "new" state start with one of the old states legal codes? some of those are big states split, but some are very different states thrown together. plus the circuit courts would be all f'd up.

this kinda thing almost happened after the civil war to the southern states btw, had the congressional radicals had their way.

The Constitution expressly forbids existing states from forming their own partitions, so we'd have to amend the thing.

doesn't texas have the right to do it

texas has the right to go fuck itself amirite

otm

iatee would amend it so that rural counties would have no bullet trains to connect to cities.

I don't think bullet trains mean the same thing to me as they do to texans

are they gay suppositories in Texas?

states can reform their boundaries but only if they have really good rap scenes

http://www.snopes.com/history/american/texas.asp

so congress says 'go for it' but it's unconstitutional

just found the original site for that

http://fakeisthenewreal.org/reform/

this is even more hilaire:

Alaska and Hawaii are part of the states of Olympia and Coronado, respectively.

", respectively"

did everybody watch that awesome Williams Brothers video or are you just fronting

haha as always my favorite thing about that map is the made-up state names

I like how they were all Blahblahville, Indian Name, Peepeetaila and "Missouri".

Disadvantages
Some county names are duplicated in new states.
Local governments would have to deal with shift in state laws and procedures.

Looks like you'd also have Rio Grande observing PDT butting up against Llano Estacado observing CDT.

Oh, and by the way...

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6191/6045969391_bb5949159a_z.jpg

just so we circumvent all the innuendo I wanna say that for all his obvious drawbacks rick perry looks like he gives pretty good head

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_HXvURCQ2Q

perry always looks like an evil snake about to moult out of its scaly skin.

good hair, tho.

Speaking of Texas, what if the Ron Paul thing is for real?

It probably isn't, but everyone in that Iowa straw event knew full well that Perry was available as a write-in, and Paul still came in second.

He's the spiritual leader of whatever that angry weird movement was before it was stolen by evangelicals and astroturfers.

also, Bill White was holding morning prayer breakfasts in Lubbock when he should have been co-headlining stadium rallies in Houston and Dallas with fucking Dems.

http://www.dailypaul.com/164590/ames-iowa-straw-poll-ron-going-for-the-win

Students. The campaign is subtly emphasizing high school seniors and college students. The website emphasizes that in order to participate in the Hawkeye Cauci and vote in the general election, one needs to be of majority age as of the general election, Nov. 6, 2012.

** Citizens who are 16 and 1/2 years old **<>** (born before Nov 6, 1994) will be old enough to vote in the general election in Nov '12, and can therefore vote in the Ames Iowa Straw Poll in three months. ** Additionally, students who attend an Iowa college (presumably recognizing out of state students, but who attend an Iowa college) can vote in the Straw Poll as well.

cute star-eyed birdie **<>**

Kids.

Larison has a few excellent posts on Perry and Paul Ryan.

everyone in that Iowa straw event knew full well that Perry was available as a write-in, and Paul still came in second.

CLOSE second. I was saying this exact thing to my wife over the weekend. Yet all you hear about on the news 24/7 is hateable extremists like Bachmann and now Perry, rather than the "harmless" eccentric grandpa.

and the gop establishment begins its campaign against perry http://www.commentarymagazine.com/2011/08/15/rick-perrys-serious-unforced-error

just so we circumvent all the innuendo I wanna say that for all his obvious drawbacks rick perry looks like he gives pretty good head

and the gop establishment begins its campaign against perry

wait so who do we think the gop establishment favors? romney?

absolutely

Agreed. Establishment would love to harness the energy/gather the votes of the Tea Party, but not actually have to nominate a wingnut.

the establishment *is* wingnuts at this point

the Hawkeye Cauci

callin it.

bachmann/nyarlathotep 2012
halliburton/dolce&gabbana 2016

Today on Perry Watch: he hates Ben Bernake and the Fed.

Poaching on Ron Paul's riffs.

Some Austin outlets did try to spread gay rumors about him a few years back...

If you google Rick Perry, "rick perry gay" is the first auto-complete suggestion.

http://c0848462.cdn.cloudfiles.rackspacecloud.com/783c103a9fad4a4900852f02bcaa1a2d2404942b58.png

rick perry gay wiki texas

Loved that bit on last night's Daily Show where they show a CNN(?) anchor telling a reporter "If you find any footage or soundbites of Sarah Palin, send that in. Forget about the Ron Paul stuff."

rick perry gay wiki texas

really like the cadence of this

Perry already pulling one of these:

http://col.stb.s-msn.com/i/3A/6D2A34F2A5479B39DD788F91874E.jpg

Just realized that two of the three front-runners (Bachmann and Perry) once identified as Democrats.

so, paul ryan, now?

how many different ways can the GOP run against the public sector itself

Bachmann was once a Democrat? Wow. (Is that like a Hillary thing, when she was a teenager?)

lots of conservative Dems in the seventies, especially if like Bachmann you love Jesus.

Carter was a conservative Dem.

xxp Yeah, basically -- she campaigned for Carter in college, attended his inauguration.

She worked on Carter's campaign - first evangelical Pres.

And then she had her famous epiphany that she was in the wrong party while reading Gore Vidal.

I guess Reagan was the bridge for people like her.

We once had liberal Republicans like Jacob Javits too.

feel like deej had a "what are rick perry's flaws" thread or something but couldn't find it, anyway, some good muckraking by the LA Times: http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-0816-perry-donors-20110816,0,7718310.story

http://www.latimes.com/media/photo/2011-08/64000435.jpg

Perry has received a total of $37 million over the last decade from just 150 individuals and couples

this is kind of remarkable. seems like a really small pool of donors, no...?

damn how can i receive a total of $37 from just 150 individuals and couples

one of whom is this man:

http://image.guardian.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/red/blue_pics/2007/07/02/larry460.jpg

More evidence for my view that the modern GOP is a wholly-owned subsidiary of the top 0.1%. xp

not sure that your view is entirely your own, tbh

You are shitting me: Larry Hagman is giving $ to Republicans?

More evidence for my view that the modern GOP is a wholly-owned subsidiary of the top 0.1%. xp

― o. nate, Tuesday, August 16, 2011 1:11 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

eh its not just the gop, totally unsurprising but theres been the polisci study making the blog rounds recently that tried to find correlation between public opinion and the congressional voting record and basically couldnt find it... UNTIL it looked at just the opinons of the rich at which point everything lined up perfectly - iirc it wasnt just the top .1% more like top 5 or 10

xpost -- uh...that's a certain famous character played by Larry Hagman rather than Larry Hagman, I would say.

I don't take credit for the idea. Krugman, among many, has made the same point in his column:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/10/opinion/10krugman.html

who shot (money at) rick perry

LOLLLLL, never mind, Ned. One of those days.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/16/us/politics/16perry.html?pagewanted=2&hp

The freewheeling atmosphere that surrounded Mr. Perry, whose smile broadened every time a passer-by offered a wave or an encouraging word, stood in contrast to Mr. Romney. Four days earlier, Mr. Romney was surrounded by admirers, too, though he did not linger to absorb the compliments as Mr. Perry did.

Even in casual conservations, Mr. Perry inserted salient pieces of his message, particularly how 40 percent of the jobs created in the United States over the last two years have been in Texas. When a reporter asked how the same theory could apply to the entire nation, given that many of the jobs came from California and others were specific to the oil and gas industry, Mr. Perry raised his hand to signal silence.

“Come on now, son,” he said. “You’ve got to get your economics hat on here.”

amazing

It's a folksy, down-home "These aren't the droids you're looking for."

actually, less amazing. i thought it said 'you've got your economics hat on here', like that's how he was rejecting the question.

the story doesn't say how having your economics hat on helps answer the question.

http://i.imgur.com/kBJZR.gif

http://www.stupid.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/Money_Hat_btn.jpg

"Come on now, son, ah say, son... ya gotta get your economics hat on!"

http://fitsnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/foghorn.jpg

holy shit icey

Trying to come up with a Bachman-Turner Overdrive joke for that gif.

("Bachmann-Perry Corndogfite" isn't doing it for me)

“Happy birthday,” she screamed to the crowd. “We played you a little bit of promise land when we pulled up. You can’t do better than Elvis Presley. We thought we’d celebrate his birthday as we get started to celebrating Take Our Country back tour.”

Tuesday is not Presley’s birthday, but rather the 34th anniversary of his death.

More evidence for my view that the modern GOP is a wholly-owned subsidiary of the top 0.1%. xp

And Democrats are all proletariat freedom fighters.

Long story short: GOP is worse.

Birthday, deathday, Presley, Costello, John Wayne, John Gacy.... you people are so nitpicky!

Take Our Country back tour is the gross bit of that, not the elvis trivia

Yeah, they've been threatening to "take their country back" since day 1 of the Obama admin.

Trying to come up with a Bachman-Turner Overdrive joke for that gif.

("Bachmann-Perry Corndogfite" isn't doing it for me)

Race to the bottom.

At a campaign event Monday night, Texas Gov. Rick Perry (R) suggested that a truly committed president of the United States would have served in the country’s military.

“The president had the opportunity to serve his country I’m sure, at some time, and he made the decision that that wasn’t what he wanted to do,” the Republican presidential candidate said of Obama in Cedar Rapids, Iowa.

ha

ha

I guess commanding the military doesn't count.

http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/48/1255996996856.jpg

wow, really bringing out the classics there

Nice headline, Australia.

makes it sound like his mom makes him skin boxers from the remains of the executed

either colbert or stewart said last night that perry's vasectomy was done by his... father-in-law

so sounds like he's got a real open-access policy down there, an extended family situation

so intrade has em at:
perry: 39
romney: 30
bachmann: 6.5

I would say buying all 3 would be a pretty good bargain atm cause 'something weird' seems like way less than 25%. bachmann maybe underpriced.

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0811/Today_in_Mitt_Romney_awkwardness.html

omg this whole "weird"/"awkward" = "Mormon" thing is a real line of rhetoric

Have these people never actually SEEN Mitt Romney? There are about a bazillion Mormons on Dancing With The Stars and none of them appear to be socially stunted train wrecks.

http://www.stuffedsuits.com/news/national-politics/721-fraud-rick-perry-is-political-herpes

UPDATE: Per a phone conversation with Robert Morrow, he has invited anyone who wants to discuss his article and the specifics of the allegations therein to call him at (512) 306-1510 between the hours of 11am and 11pm or to email him at Morrow✧✧✧@a✧✧.c✧✧ for further information. Please do so if you have any doubts about anything in the article.

dayum

HAHAHA, I had seen snippets of his rants online, but never the whole thing. He was evidently not fond of the Clintons, either:

http://www.sptimes.com/2008/02/29/Worldandnation/Some_people_just_love.shtml

The same man who used a presidential prayer rally (8/6/11) for his personal ambitions and who often spouts Christian buzzwords and Bible talk to advance his political career is a flagrant adulterer, having sex with women who are the approximate age of his daughter Sydney, age 24.

I know this because I am a patron of Austin strip clubs.

CLASSIC

"Adulterer Rick Perry is sitting on a keg of slut-fueled nitroglycerine that if it ever exploded, would make Anthony Weiner look like a mere pimple popping."

"a keg of slut-fueled nitroglycerine" = new display name heaven

Was Clinton the last major Presidential candidate who had this many adultery/sexuality rumors surrounding him?

no -- Mark Foley.

Irrelevant then, and irrelevant now?

I imagine a Republican candidate could weather a Gennifer Flowers situation, but a a gay sex scandal of the same size seems like a deal breaker.

yes i'd say that is quite an understatement.

There was McCain's "illegitimate child" in 2000.

I will only support candidates who have had at least one gay sex scandal

Rick Perry is McCain's son?

he meant Luke Perry.

Somewhere, Lindsey Graham sits in a wicker chair, fanning himself in the portico while muttering, "Why, I never."

that guy (^^^^^^^^^) needs to run, too. every wingnut and crank to the front, plz.

lindsey graham is like the fifth least conservative GOP senator or something!

That Carolinian lesbian is a hack, not a crank.

lindsey graham was "the 16th most conservative member of the 110th Senate - and keep in mind, Senate Republicans are a pretty conservative bunch." his voting record was to the right of mcconnell and lott and chambliss and brownback, among others.

yeah i was kinda making that up tbh i just kinda think of him as being after the mainers and president brown as "the guy who's not completely insane about guantanamo and immigration" but they're all basically the same at this point

http://i.min.us/ie3YvCPhK.png

hah

Was Clinton the last major Presidential candidate who had this many adultery/sexuality rumors surrounding him?

http://topnews.in/usa/files/John-Edwards-2.jpg

You know, Mr. Perry just got into the presidential race. I think that everybody who runs for president, it probably takes them a little bit of time before they start realizing that this isn't like running for governor or running for senator or running for Congress, and you've got to be a little more careful about what you say. But I'll cut him some slack. He's only been at it for a few days now.

*pats Perry on head*

Goole, whose quote is that above? "He's only been at it for a few days now" is some ridiculous excuse making. He's a three term governor, not some freshman house member. I'm sure his wingnut base eats up all of his dick-measuring about Obama's lack of military service and his threats to beat up Bernanke, and he's making headlines now, but his chance of nomination is going to be decided by a fair amount of independent voters for whom debating the "unconstitutionality" of Social Security is nagl.

that would be the president

http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2011/08/iowa-2012

It seems that a good deal of Texas' debt comes from bonds issued to finance new infrastructure. Given Texas' population growth, the last several years' low interest rates, and a large pool of un- and under-employed workers, this might be smart government. But try telling that to Mrs Palin, or Michele Bachmann.

xp lmao

that would be the president

smdh...

drudge linked to that obama quote yesterday and in big 42-pt font the headline was

OBAMA WARNS PERRY:
'WATCH THE MOUTH'

drudge worried his audience has no sense of irony

lol wow

xpost -- last I checked it didn't?

for tad:

ezraklein RT @jonathanalter: Sources say NJ Gov. Chris Christie is conducting focus groups in preparation for a possible run for president in 2012

I really can't see how anyone can read that Obama quote and not hear it in the most condescending voice imaginable

lol christie, ryan, flawed candidates observing a group of their peers want to join up

Definitely--the Obama quote was him at his (rare these days) very best. It makes Perry sound like a little kid setting up a lemonade stand, but does so as deftly as possible.

if christie gets in how long does it take for an opponent to start calling him out for being a fatass?

Perry? probably 30 seconds.

prefaced by "I don't know about New Jersey, but in the great STATE OF TEXAS..."

perry's beginning to sound to me like a cross between luke-duke and rosco p. coltrane.

I hope that Perry takes a bale of hay with him everywhere he goes. Like, when he's debating, instead of a podium, he insists on planting his foot on a bale of hay.

here's a badger caught in a hay bale:

http://www.outdooroddities.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/badger_caught_in_a_hay_bale_01.jpg

I imagine most people have seen Nate Silver's Venn Diagram, but I'll link to it anyway:

http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/08/17/pondering-perrys-electability/?hp

Can't imagine what will happen if Chris Christie jumps in. The romance with Perry lasted about 24 hours.

Texas' job numbers – a pretty good analysis.

My favourite part of Silver's Venn is Donald Trump on the outside. Unelectable, not reliably conservative, uninterested in running--yet he seemed to be the front-runner for about a week!

really can't picture a lot of voters eager to turn America into New Jersey

Teapartiers pretty unanimously dislike Christie.

new jersey isn't that different from most of america

christie is definitively not a national quality candidate

Tim
Castle Rock, CO
August 17th, 2011
2:20 pm As a Republican, I fear that this is an election that is being handed to us on a Silver platter; yet none of the existing candidates are tall enough to reach the plate.
Recommend Recommended by 2 Readers

maybe because you've cut all the candidates off at the kneecaps

I don't know - I think Christie could be a pretty strong candidate. But I don't think he'll run.

he'll waddle

lol

I think America is probably ready for a fat president.

christies fatness is the least of his worries, hes an angry bastard who yells at teachers, just blatantly unlikable

i mean only in new jersey could this guy get elected to anything

i was under the impression that he was aware of this, now these rumors im not so sure

I think America is probably ready for a fat president.

http://humor.gunaxin.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/william_howard_taft.jpg

http://www.irasabs.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/bill-clinton2.jpg

The Screaming Lobster of Geniality

i mean only in new jersey could this guy get elected to anything

NJ is a pretty blue state these days, so the fact that Christie was able to defeat a well-financed Democratic incumbent by a 3.5 point margin is pretty impressive.

Wasn't he just in the hospital for not being able to breathe?

Iowa flapjacks will be a bigger hazard for this guy than any parking lot in Maryland could be.

I thought Christie's defense of the Muslim judge was momentarily likable, but he was an angry bastard there, too.

Said defense probably sealing his fate with the tea party.

NJ is a pretty blue state these days, so the fact that Christie was able to defeat a well-financed Democratic incumbent by a 3.5 point margin is pretty impressive.

― o. nate, Wednesday, August 17, 2011 4:46 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

a well hated democratic incumbent in a gop wave year, but w/e thats beside the point, the point is hes a raging asshole in a way voters tend to not at all prefer in their presidents

also he is a hueg fattay

im pretty sure their isnt anyone in america who wants to have a beer w/him

Alright, I'll go get some popcorn, just quit YELLING, okay?

i mean only in new jersey could this guy get elected to anything

Agreed.

I thought Christie's defense of the Muslim judge was momentarily likable, but he was an angry bastard there, too.

― Hey T-Paw, mow my lawn! (Dan Peterson),

I'm all for angry bastard politicians if they're angry about the right things.

If Christie yells at teachers, I've got to draw the line there. Sorry--we do the yelling. Those are the rules.

exactly

more lols with Jim Moore

http://www.theatlanticwire.com/politics/2011/08/bushs-crew-gunning-rick-perry/41383/

kinda amazing that we're at the point where dubya and his posse seem like the 'reasonable republicans'

Nah, it's just politics, Jake.

no I meant dubya's policy views vs perry's not the fact that he didn't like him

I am genuinely afraid of Perry, but it seems a weird to me that that Bernanke comment he made is drawing heat from Rove & co. while Taibbi grudgingly agrees w/ it...

Taibbi's pointing out how our political culture would rather concentrate on manners ("I can't BELIEVE he said that about Ben Bernake!") than substance (i.e. the Fed Reserve is really fucked up). Plus, did you Taibbi's article on the excrescence known as the SEC?

American politicos hauling others up for bad manners = lol the ironing, unless your name is Barack Obama. Then the response is HOW DARE YOU, PRESIDENT UPPITY.

xp read some of the SEC article; have it saved to my hard drive; stuff you posted in other thread already is o_0 x 1000

Taibbi was saying that things are so fucked up now, that threatening Bernanke with a lynch mob was the closest thing we had atm to speaking 'truth to power'. Quantitative easing has the potential to makes things harder on lots of people.

I'm slightly suspicious that Rove is going to crack down on Perry this early in the game just bcz of the lynch mob subtext. I mean obv it makes sense, logic is watertight, and it even has the added benefit of rivalry/enmity subtext, but I guess I'm just paranoid enough to think that maybe Rove is subtly aligning himself with Bernanke/QE and doing his best to keep it from becoming a Republican talking point I guess...?

yeaahhh this is where i get off the taibbi train--perry was essentially saying "if the chairman of the fed does this thing that [i, rick perry, think] will help the economy, hes 'playing politics' and committing treason"

I'm so jaded during campaign season that I don't give a damn anymore unless a candidate suggests Ke$ha is a Moslem terrorist.

lol

cannot get the image of Ke$ha fucking up a bean pie out of my head

i dont actually "care" that perry said that, i just think its pretty ridiculous to pretend that hes "speaking truth to power"

hes "speaking garbage to a gathering of idiots"

What Taibbi actually wrote:

To me this whole issue encapsulates the basic failure of the Obama administration. It has surrendered to Wall Street interests, and in doing so has allowed lunatics like Rick Perry to step into legitimate roles as critics of corrupt policy.

Of course Perry’s gripe with QE isn’t that it boosts corporate/banking profits at the expense of the general population, but that it’s unsound economics and fiscally irresponsible – which is true as well, but that’s not the point. The point is that we’re heading into 2012 and Barack Obama is going to be owning a hell of a lot of corrupt policy. Voters who want to break up the Wall Street/government oligopoly are increasingly left with only fringe politicians as champions, and (here's my Captain Obvious observation) that blows.

and "ost notably, Texa-creep Rick Perry came out recently with a uniquely thuggish criticism of QE, essentially threatening Bernanke with a Texan mob if he does what everyone expects him to do and enacts a third QE program"

I don't see "speaking truth to power" anywhere

getting elected to anything is pretty easy if you're running vs Jon Corzine.

really can't picture a lot of voters eager to turn America into New Jersey

You're just pitiable.

max is worried that Taibbi is laying the groundwork for a third party.

yeah, sorry, i just dont agree with taibbi!

To me this whole issue encapsulates the basic failure of the Obama administration. It has surrendered to Wall Street interests, and in doing so has allowed lunatics like Rick Perry to step into legitimate roles as critics of corrupt policy.

like, sorry, what? "legitimate"? shouldnt "legitimate" criticism involve, i dunno, something beyond a vague personal threat? (like--say--a reason as to why loose monetary policy/"printing money" is "playing politics," or, in taibbi's formulation, "corrupt"?) when did perry "step into" this "role"? how long has he occupied it? seems to me he was just shooting his mouth off!

Of course Perry’s gripe with QE isn’t that it boosts corporate/banking profits at the expense of the general population, but that it’s unsound economics and fiscally irresponsible – which is true as well, but that’s not the point.

but--thats not perry's gripe at all! perry's gripe is that loose monetary policy would improve the economy, boosting obama's chances at election and "playing politics"! he doesn't think its unsound economics or fiscally irresponsible at all!

(and i should note that rick perry talking shit with some iowans didnt happen because obama "surrendered to wall street interests"--it happened because rick perry is a shit-talker!)

it’s unsound economics and fiscally irresponsible

this is... arguable

http://motherjones.com/files/images/blog_dollar_decline.jpg

yeah that too

This is well thought out:

http://money.cnn.com/2011/08/18/news/economy/bachmann_gas_prices/index.htm?iid=Popular

"He realizes that talking about the Fed is good, too," Paul said. "But I’ll tell you what, he makes me look like a moderate. I have never once said that Bernanke has committed treason."

Pausing a beat for effect (and showing a good sense of comic timing), Paul continued: "But I have suggested very strongly that the Federal Reserve system and all the members have been counterfeiters for a long time." That brought down the house.

According to a 2009 study from the government's Energy Information Administration, opening up to drilling areas off the East Coast, West Coast and the west coast of Florida would yield an extra 500,000 barrels a day by 2030.

The world currently consumes 89 million barrels a day, and by then would likely be using over 100 million barrels.

After OPEC got done adjusting its production to reflect the increased American output, gas prices might drop a whopping three cents a gallon, the study said.

ha

It's certainly true that prices -- now about $3.50 a gallon on average -- have risen since President Obama took office.

2000-2008 doesn't count?

I suppose the post-Katrina price gouging actually happened in 2009, not 2005 like I remember it.

smh @ Bachmann, sounds like kids campaigning for class president and promising an end to homework and pizza for lunch everyday...and we saw through that in 6th grade!

did we...?

If Bachmann walked into the newsroom door carrying three boxes of pizza and a pitcher of beer, I'd vote for her.

*through lol

If nothing else, she should have remembered how well McCain's promise of a gas-tax holiday (or some such gimmick) went over as the election neared in 2008. He was ridiculed by the media, and it didn't register at all with voters.

Drilling talk is never about gasoline prices; that bit is just a justification. Drilling talk is borne from resentment by Palin-type assholes with the mindset of petulant teenagers who rage at anybody telling them that they can't do something. ANWR is about pissing off and pissing on all them liberals who want get in the way of total domination etc etc etc.

Drilling talk is further spread by ignorant idiots who don't even have anything approaching a first-order understanding of these systems.

Refining and distribution are bigger factors

Right, but we're deluged by a political and media culture where anything but the most thick-headed simplistic causation is understood. Its like some people can't think in systems to save their(read: our) fuckin' lives.

on liberals' Perry hysteria:

http://dennisperrin.blogspot.com/2011/08/nietzsches-abyss.html

ha it's been so long since I've seen a Perrin link on this thread that I almost clicked that

he literally sounds like he is 14 years old.

i like the boys as much as you do dr m but come on

@jonhuntsman: To be clear. I believe in evolution and trust scientists on global warming. Call me crazy.

lol

you ppl, anything to avert your eyes from who you voted for. xp

yes, I am purposely avoiding reading the blog of a tiresome harpy because I don't want my precious illusions shattered, not because dude is a shrill blowhard with nothing to say other than pandering nonsense to people whose self worth is intrinsically tied to how cynical and "pierce through the veil" they can appear on a messageboard

otm

I voted for you btw xp

From Morbs' Perrin link:

The main reason why liberals aren't engaging the class war is because they'd have to oppose Obama.

C'mon, Dennis. This is so simplistic you sound like an idiot berating liberals for their simplistic views a paragraph or two before this quote.

his tone is annoying but he's not saying anything particularly novel or crazy - it's pretty easy to read that and just solemnly nod at a few of his points

i mean the main idea that the fascination with these idiots 15 months from the election is stupid and bad for america is obv correct

and hence, this thread...

I mean, it's HELL! these ppl are HELL, with the power they're exercising right now!

The dudes with blood on their hands are the cynics, btw

fuckin A Jon Huntsman

JonHuntsman Jon Huntsman
I wonder if a tweet where I admit how much I like Captain Beefheart will make the followers skyrocket even more! youtube.com/watch?v=HE32tc…
5 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

wait waht

anxiously awaiting Huntsman's tweetise on the Christina Milian's "Dip It Low"

I was actually compelled by this dude's relative non-nutso-seemin-ness to check out his website - don't worry everybody, he signed onto bullshit "fetal pain" bills & wants to criminalize 2nd trimester abortions

whew! I was worried!

If Huntsman were to promise a Beefheart commemorative stamp, it would cause me some anguished soul-searching about my political allegiances.

give a shit/van vliet 2012
xp

Pisses me off that Perry's a Who fan.

One woman who did not appear to be affiliated with the protesters ushered her son up to the governor and prompted him with questions for Perry like "do you believe in evolution?"

"It's a theory that's out there," Perry told the child. "It's got some gaps in it. In Texas we teach both Creationism and evolution."

The mother then told her young son: "Ask him why he doesn't believe in science," as Perry continued into the cafe.

I lol'd

Yeah, creationism has no "gaps in it..."

gaps are all God iirc

fwiw the evidence has gaps, the theory does not

Is Huntsman really a Beefheart fan?

JonHuntsman Jon Huntsman
by bgzimmer
I wonder if a tweet where I admit how much I like Captain Beefheart will make the followers skyrocket even more! youtube.com/watch?v=HE32tc…

if so wtf

Apparently, he is:

Jon's childhood, though, seems to have been relatively carefree. His passion as a teenager was a "progressive rock" band called Wizard, which he formed with school friends. A keyboardist, Huntsman idolized Rick Wakeman of Yes and Keith Emerson of Emerson, Lake, & Palmer. Howard Sharp, the drummer in Wizard, has remained a close friend. He recalls that one of Huntsman's favorite artists was the avant-garde composer Captain Beefheart. "It's about the worst music in the world," Sharp remembers. "I tried to listen to it; I really tried. I just couldn't do it."

http://www.vogue.com/magazine/article/jon-huntsman-the-outsider/

The worst music in the world, says the drummer of Wizard.

i didn't see if this came up upthread—i don't think so:

http://www.tnr.com/blog/jonathan-chait/93861/portrait-rick-perrys-mind-work

rick perry trying to defend the claim that abstinence-only education 'works' even though texas had (then) the third-highest teen pregnancy rate in the country.

if there's a logic behind it, it must be that… if you stop some teens from having sex, then you haven't failed! you just haven't succeeded at getting ALL of them to stop yet.

JonHuntsman Jon Huntsman
I wonder if a tweet where I admit how much I like Captain Beefheart will make the followers skyrocket even more! youtube.com/watch?v=HE32tc…
5 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

― pathos of the unwarranted encore (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Thursday, August 18, 2011 3:52 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

wait waht

― Rob Based and DJ EZ God (DJP), Thursday, August 18, 2011 3:52 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

*_*

I bet the ticket'll be Perry/Ryan, the electability of which I find frighteningly plausible.

eh i voted romney losing in the general, but its an amazing collection of flawed dudes all around

Huntsman/Beefheart is this decade's Clinton/Brötzmann.

lol, otm

huntsman 2012 is the best campaign of all the campaigns. run by stoners, not even trying to get any GOP votes

thanks to following these links to the youtube & vogue magazine, i am reminded 1) of a sonic youth cover of that beefheart song and 2) maybe check out diorshow mascara. (that's right The Mascara Snake!)

didn't realize huntsman came out with a 3 minute version of that great motorcycle ad:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=biqIuX3uX0U

omg the narrator mentions Wizard

doing an interview with vogue magazine from the campaign trail in south carolina:
Surveying the motley crowd with an ironic expression, he begins, “All I can tell you is that I never thought I would be making an appearance at Mutt’s BBQ.”

probably preaching to the choir in his interview with vogue magazine

vogue will run a puff piece on any politician with a photogenic family. they told us the president of syria was totally wonderful and a great reformer a few months back. his wife wears tasteful designer clothes and that's all they needed to know

Who is Wizard? Are we talking about Wizzard?

daria otm, huntsman, more like blunts-man

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/assets_c/2011/08/Michele-Bachmann-speaking-gesturing-cropped-proto-custom_2.jpg

julianne moore as michelle bachman

Merl Streep as Rick Perry.

the long form of that motorcycle ad seems like a promo for a TNT domestic drama called 'Huntsman'

ep. 1: Daughter needs an abortion

http://images.salon.com/news/politics/war_room/2011/08/18/rick_perry_women_ad/morrowadbig.jpg

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/08/18/rick-perry-sex-ad_n_930250.html

imao my god

love the badly kerned quasi star wars font

tf is a 'hillary clinton boots'

holy shit

tf is a 'hillary clinton boots'

― ice cr?m, Friday, August 19, 2011 10:04 AM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark

probably oughta be condi rice boots

condi in fuck me boots

an easton classic

I imagine they'll come forward in one huge wave.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u93bhAimFFU

Palin is on Obama about his vacation. This really is a kind of brazen genius at work with her.

Yeah, how come he's not shooting moose from a helicopter like real Americans?

Republican presidential candidate Jon Huntsman took to Twitter Thursday to offer his support for evolution. 

Huntsman made the tweet shortly after Texas Gov. Rick Perry offered comments that cast doubt on evolution — his comments can be interpreted as criticism of Perry. 

“To be clear. I believe in evolution and trust scientists on global warming. Call me crazy,” tweeted Huntsman, the former ambassador to China.

What a loser, a real man doesn't let scientists tell him what to believe! Those motherfuckers be lyin', and gettin' me pissed.

Greenwald on this laborious, news-drowning quadrennial freakshow (now with Disappearing Ron Paul):

The GOP is extreme now and has been extreme for 30 years. The "Tea Party" is little more than a rebranding of conservatism in the post-Bush age. That they're MORE EXTREME THAN EVER!! is a fear-mongering slogan -- hauled out every four years -- to cause Democrats to forget about, or willfully ignore, their own leader's glaring, gaping failures.

http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/2011/08/16/elections/index.html

you know has a really annoying rhetorical style, its glenn greenwald

lol like it would matter what his rhetorical style was with a mr. glass half empty perspective like he's got - his rhetorical style would miraculously seems less grating to many if he weren't constantly using it to harp on Democrats

sort of in a "facts are stupid things" way, huh

people who say shit you don't like tend to have a really irritating rhetorical style

thanks god George W Obama trills and thrills w/ style, that's my jam

1 p sure ive been reading greenwald longer than either of you two n00bs so not sure abt yr 'things i dont want to hear' hypothesis

2 the use of such charming overheated flourishes such as 'glaring, gaping...' really has nothing to do w/facts or w/e, and are likely better served for ocasional emphasis instead of like all of the time text yelling

3 his post are obvs almost always way too long and full of redundancies

4 im sure glen totally agrees that any argument w/his style must be rooted in feeling totally omg threatened by what he has to say

i mean im totally sitting here feeling the world shift beneath me 'is it troo am i an obama pasty'

If you have valid points to make, and you do so in such a way that's so abrasive that people who might be otherwise convinced by what you have to say don't even bother to hear you out (because life's too short to be lectured every day), then what's the good of that?

also he was better when he wrote more abt the law and less abt cable news

goole said on his blog that greenwald "writes like a lawyer, which is about as withering an insult as I can think up"

not very far into this but imo anyone pining for internet privacy is an idiot

I do agree that campaign hooplah is fucking wearying and distracting tho

GG tends to post about abuses within Obama's administration, focusing mainly on his clampdown on whistleblowers and continuing expansion of the security state. As long as what he is reporting is factual (and it seems like it is), then it more than makes up for the occasional broad negative opinion piece on Obama. As long as he keeps pumping out long and redundantly researched articles on human rights abuses I say we take the good with the bad.

you take them both and there you have
http://epguides.com/FactsofLife/logo.jpg

Rick Perry has big plans!

I don't begrudge Greenwald his boldface etc. He is, after all, trying to get the attention of ppl who can't get enough corndog pics.

If you have valid points to make, and you do so in such a way that's so abrasive that people who might be otherwise convinced by what you have to say don't even bother to hear you out (because life's too short to be lectured every day), then what's the good of that?

venting spleen? I don't think that Greenwald offering his views in a gentle, persuasive style nets him any more converts. Like most opinion writers - like most people! - he is preaching to the converted. The only people he might win over are those who will be shocked by the excesses of power, and honestly, his style is appropriate to the outrages he's cataloging, in my opinion.

"writes like a lawyer, which is about as withering an insult as I can think up"

oooooh! somehow I don't think a lawyer came up with this "Green Lantern presidency" terminology.

guys do you really think arguing about Greenwald's rhetorical style is any less of a bullshit distraction than 500 years of pre-election coverage

The GOP is extreme now and has been extreme for 30 years. The "Tea Party" is little more than a rebranding of conservatism in the post-Bush age. For supporters of the president to assert that this extremity is new amounts to fear-mongering - in the service, one suspects, of drawing attention away from the President's failures.

^^^ like, I think this is a fair cleaning-up & de-CAPS!!ing of the graf in question. "The President's failures" now sits at the end of the graf, a rhythmic smoothing-out, a nice ending with almost no effect. The failures in question are glaring (I don't personally need "gaping") and that we're not talking about "failures" but, say, failure to prosecute torture: this requires a modifier that fairly describes the extent of the outrage, even if - perhaps especially if - the point has been made before.

xp lol djp I assert no value of any kind to this discussion

Again, I'm speaking personally here, but I imagine I'm fairly representative of the kind of Obama partisan who is more than open to hearing fair criticism of him. Cohn and Chait at The New Republic are often tough on Obama. I take the time to read them, because I like the way they write; Greenwald I skim, because I don't like the way he writes. Getting someone to read you is the first step in getting them to agree with you. If, as you say, he's content to preach to the converted, then yes, by all means, have at it.

no, a lawyer did not come up with the term

http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/2006/07/10/the_green_lantern_theory_of_ge/

greenwald "writes like a lawyer, which is about as withering an insult as I can think up"

many lawyers are extremely good writers.

http://brainsyndicate.files.wordpress.com/2010/10/obama-thumbsx-large.jpg

uys do you really think arguing about Greenwald's rhetorical style is any less of a bullshit distraction than 500 years of pre-election coverage

otm

greenwald is a shitty writer. he writes like a lawyer in that he writes to an opponent's argument and not to evidence. i've been reading the guy and disliking his writing forever!

Cohn and Chait at The New Republic are often tough on Obama.

really? links plz

guys do you really think arguing about Greenwald's rhetorical style is any less of a bullshit distraction than 500 years of pre-election coverage

― Rob Based and DJ EZ God (DJP), Friday, August 19, 2011 3:10 PM (15 minutes ago) Bookmark

lol c'mon

Greenwald is not Hamilton but who is.

bcuz they def argue about greenwald's rhetorical style in the new york times and on cnn?

Chait has a "disappointed in Obama" piece in basically every TNR issue these days.

and Kevin Drum has a "disappointed in Chait" piece in basically every TNR issue these days.

That's the thing--it's difficult to link to specific pieces, because they tend to see most issues as a mix of positives and negatives. I'm not trying to duck here, but they'll be negative about Obama in one sentence, then in the next they'll be "On the other hand..." But I'll try to find something where I think they've been pretty tough. It won't match Greenwald for stridency.

For the triumph of 'style' perhaps y'all should stick to Quentin Tarantino's masturbatory, preadolescent widescreen fantasies.

Ew. Why would I want to see Quentin Tarantino masturbate?

I don't see the point in "on the other hand" in an argumentative post. It's the Beltway guys who indulge in equivalency about the left and right.

For the triumph of 'style' perhaps y'all should stick to Quentin Tarantino's masturbatory, preadolescent widescreen fantasies.

really stayin on target here

can't you slag off Oscar Wilde too while you're at it

bcuz they def argue about greenwald's rhetorical style in the new york times and on cnn?

Today's conversation up until this point had been about how everyone in this thread was wasting their time talking about Republican candidates when they could be reading Greenwald criticize Obama, which promptly turned into a bitchfest about Greenwald's rhetorical style.

Everyone in this thread needs to stop fronting like they don't post here just to be a supercilious ass about a politician or towards another ILXor.

lol Morbs Shakey has a point there, dragging QT into this is kinda like me pointing out that not only is Obama is a crypto-fascist but also Kate Bush is awful

The reality is that both parties' voters, early on in the process, like to flirt with candidates who present themselves as ideologues, but ultimately choose establishment-approved, establishment-serving functionaries perceived as electable (e.g., the Democrats' 2004 rejection of Dean in favor of Kerry, the GOP's 2008 embrace of the "maverick" McCain). In those rare instances when they nominate someone perceived as outside the establishment mainstream (Goldwater, McGovern), those candidates are quickly destroyed. The two-party system and these presidential campaigns are virtually guaranteed -- by design -- to produce palatable faces who perpetuate the status quo, placate the citizenry, and dutifully serve the nation's most powerful factions.

this is an interesting paragraph. it's almost getting at something but skips over it. the whole process by which all of these extreme voters "but ultimately choose" is interesting and really important. exactly how that happens is worth figuring out, no? funny enough, jonathan bernstein, the guy greenwald IN THE SAME POST slags off as one of the "self-proclaimed experts who know nothing and babble about the most ultimately irrelevant matters", is one of the people trying to do just that

http://plainblogaboutpolitics.blogspot.com/2011/07/parties-and-nominations.html

or search for "the invisible primary" (about how behind the scenes apparatchiks think and what they want) which has implications greenwald could probably find useful.

Chait and Cohn have mostly been writing about Republicans lately, so I had to go back a bit and find something from the debt-ceiling saga--I guess that doesn't support my point very well that I had to go so far back. Anyway, this is pretty representative, I think, of the stuff they were writing every day during that month. If Greenwald is your benchmark, then this will not seem tough.

http://www.tnr.com/blog/jonathan-chait/93085/how-clinton-foiled-debt-ceiling-extortion

But I think it's fair, and I think it's persuasive. Again, it comes down to the simple question of whether the objective is to reach someone who's already incensed with Obama, or whether the objective is to reach someone like me.

well, since this isn't a tarantino thread, morbs has no choice but to use him in an analogy

see to me that is framed so as to be more fear-mongering re: republicans, with Obama merely showing a republican-enabling "weakness" for reasons that are not even examined. i appreciate yr post tho.

also he was better when he wrote more abt the law and less abt cable news

― ice cr?m, Friday, August 19, 2011 2:35 PM (1 hour ago)

i agree w/ this

he writes to an opponent's argument and not to evidence

Really, how so? What is "writing to evidence", is that supposed to be an 100% objective view or something? Is writing in support of a certain point of view "writing like a lawyer"? Because I have no idea what "writing like a lawyer" means.

I don't see the point in "on the other hand" in an argumentative post. It's the Beltway guys who indulge in equivalency about the left and right.

― a 'catch-all', almost humorous, 'Jeez' quality (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, August 19, 2011

I think TNR mostly does this firstly to acknowledge anger from the left, and then to allay it.

c'mon guys less bickering about rhetoric and more talking shit about rick perry.

Ill start: he gay, lol

This is fun:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ngiJhmoFKkw

I misspeak all the time, but I do love "comparable" as a noun.

lmao at citing the green lantern presidency as some sweet as blog poetry (and greenwald didnt come up w/it)

u very well know Kate Bush is NOT awful, sweetie

i dont get the reference but it is true kate bush is totally and completely not awful!

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/images/2011strawpoll6.jpg

btw

lol at the flyer

i was reading it upside down & at first thought it was

RON PAUL

MOST HIP

& it managed to be be even better!

I don't like the expression in her eyes -- she'd strangle your chihuahua without blinking.

well i don't exactly think it's our position to tell people what they can and can't do with their pets

Two guys on the left = two biggest assholes on the dorm floor during freshman year.

I bet that actually says "institution"

they put him in an institution, said it was the only solution

is that goatse on the t-shirts?

typically iconoclastic

Nothing major, but I meant to post this last week--Perry responding to Obama's "But I'll cut him some slack" comment:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zzoxWtrmMoE

Perry might very well win the nomination and might very well beat Obama. But I look at that clip, at the little shrug of his shoulder and the long, tentative pause before he says "Actions speak louder than words"--that's it? that's your comeback?--and I think it would take Obama about one day to get inside his head in a general, the way he got inside McCain's in 2008.

"crime... boy i don't know"

clem, in what ways do you think obama got inside his head?

mccain was/is old, crazy, sold out on the few things he stood for over the years so really had nothing to stand on, never had the support of his base. he woulda been in a shitty spot against h-dawg too. I don't think there were many higher-level mindgames going on.

the opening of Perry's campaign has been pretty awful. Everyone is calling for some new candidate already. I understand that the Republican party is farther to the right now, but he's going too far to the extreme of nuttiness.

in what ways do you think obama got inside his head?

I'm thinking of stuff like McCain's desperate ploy to cancel that one debate and go back to Washington, contrasted with Obama's casual "We can do two things at once"; or the debates themselves, where Obama began to look more and more preternaturally calm and deliberate while McCain grimaced and cajoled and just generally looked overmatched. The last few weeks, he seemed to be in a state of total disbelief that Obama was about to be elected rather than him.

Having said that, everybody looks good winning, and not too many people look good losing. This time--well, "sold out on the few things he stood for over the years so really had nothing to stand on, never had the support of his base" may mean something different.

We're all assuming that McCain has a head to get into.

Actually, I vividly remember the few days after Palin's introduction when McCain improbably moved a point or two ahead, and Obama seemed at a complete loss what to do about it. At that moment, McCain seemed to be very much inside Obama's head.

It's all perception, I guess, playing out in my own head.

A few of my evangelical friends on fb were impressed with Perry's comments on evolution over the last few days, since he granted more to opponents of evolution than progressive commentators seem to have thought.

ha that wakes up my stereotypical liberal asshole more than anything - wow Rick Perry you'll concede that the accepted by everybody anybody takes seriously model might have something to it - you'll own up that it's "a theory that's out there"? jeez that's swell of you, almost makes me feel bad that the other side can't really grant I.D./creationism the same courtesy, only it can't, because that shit is bullshit

I feel you but to Perry's audience with those remarks, he's conceding a bunch.

re. "God is how we got here. God may have done it in the blink of the eye or he may have done it over this long period of time, I don’t know. But I know how it got started."

the "I don't know" part is a big concession

I hear you, but "it's a theory" = I.D. newspeak/dogwhistle for "'theory' means it's just an opinion!" imo - that's sort of been a big wedge for I.D. people, this popular conception that the word "theory" somehow impacts the truth value of an assertion - whereas it's my understanding that another "theory that's out there" is gravity, and that if you don't accept that theory, cool for you, but you still don't get to fly.

fwiw in my experience (as in, based on real ppl I know and have met), ID is the prevailing ideology among evolution-doubters, not young-earth creationism. I see Perrys admission of "doubt" less as a concession to the left, and more as a bid to gain the support of right leaning folks that are a little spooked by hardline creationism. I mean, as aero said, acknowledging that there's a "theory" out there is just a way to hammer on the so-called controversy. It shouldn't be read as some kind of sober recognition of prevailing scientific opinion. Dude still thinks we should teach the two side by side.

president perry's economic beliefs are gonna matter a lot more than his religious beliefs

matter if he's elected or as a candidate?

LADY BRACKNELL: Both if necessary.

gbx otm, I don't think his economic ideas matter at all as a candidate, all candidates just talk empty horseshit about their economic ideas on the campaign trail

Our politics would improve drastically if candidates cited more Wilde.

you don't think the fact that rick perry has called the fed treasonous matters a. for his candidacy b. when it comes to his potential presidency?

No one hear will vote for him in a primary.

*here

Candidate Obama's position on FISA didn't matter at all to lots of people but it's had enormous consequences as prez.

sure but it also didn't make the news cycles, whereas this already has

you don't think the fact that rick perry has called the fed treasonous matters a. for his candidacy b. when it comes to his potential presidency?

not a whole lot, no. it matters to you & me & a lot of other people who aren't going to vote for him primary or general. to registered Republicans I think it attracts more fish than it repels, this is the party of "Obama's Hawaiian birth is just a theory"

I'm surprised iatee of all people cares about the sensibilities of GOP primary voters.

i think that calling the fed treasonous matters to moderates / independents

Huntsman gave a coherent, reasonable explanation of his platform on "This Week" -- he sounded like a late eighties GOP Senate candidate -- but it won't matter fuck all.

in any case, my point was more that creationism is sorta an also-ran political subject...sorta low stakes compared to the other stuff. beliefs are gonna correlate w/ abortion beliefs very highly and abortion's an issue some people do vote on.

feel like theres conflict brewing between the tea party and the slightly less crazy wing of the republican party, should be interesting to see how that plays out in the primaries

i thought huntsman would be wise to hang in there, try to pull the roommate switch w/ romney somehow, being credible as a so-called moderate beats not being credible in any capacity even in the primaries (mitt is a dead man walking imo). this may involve maxing out his credit cards for a bit, nobody said this would be easy

since when has credibility been an asset for a GOP candidate?

i think hed be smart to do that just in terms of making a name / brand for himself

Sullivan's been writing about Huntsman the past week. He suggests the same thing as termendoid--that his new turn towards calling out everyone else who's running is his one chance at catching lightning in a bottle in New Hampshire if Romney stumbles. Of course, that won't happen, so he may as well say whatever he wants to.

I wd agree with Romney as a dead man walking: I think that's why so many of Perrin's Facebook friends are freaking out

http://www.salon.com/news/politics/war_room/2011/08/20/lady_rothschild_2012

i dunno what to say to this except "lol"

yeah i just think the party echelon will be hedging back toward moderation earlier than planned; the combination of perry blowing his own wad/making romney his personal zingbag is gonna make the 'middle' very valuable ie. contested real estate sooner rather than later and besides the money advantage (lol) huntsman seems waay better equipped to articulate from this position if he can catch a headwind. and moneyed interests have plenty of time to notice any of the above, i dunno.

bachmann's a more viable candidate than huntsman at this point (esp if perry blows up). I think she already has a pretty decent shot at iowa whereas huntsman's nh chances depend on other people fucking up.

but yeah you're a fairly rich unemployed dude, why not stay in the public eye? it might pay off in another election or land him somewhere else.

Two guys on the left = two biggest assholes on the dorm floor during freshman year.

I'd be inclined to agree if they were wearing tees showing Obama opposite MLK Jr.

martin luther asshole jr right morbs?

Those dudes would've already pledged Omega by the time I got there.

Huntsman gave a coherent, reasonable explanation of his platform on "This Week" -- he sounded like a late eighties GOP Senate candidate -- but it won't matter fuck all.

i thought his economic plan was too general to assess ((a) his biggest idea, reform tax code, e.g., eliminate corporate tax loopholes and lower corporate tax rates; (b) lower regulations; (c) energy independence). if anything, these all sound like ideas obama would endorse, and supplement with other items.

also, his explanation for agreeing that he wouldn't take a 10:1 cuts to tax deal was awkward and not believable. not the worst thing in the world, but not a good moment, either.

what is his plan for jobs? at the last debate, he admitted he didn't have one yet (he said, "give me some time").

maybe obama wouldn't "lower regulations," but it's hard to tell, given how general huntsman was.

don't get me wrong, tho, i like his tone. and his line on science and evolution and his general moderate positioning is a good, healthy addition to the gop primary. i could see him and obama on a unity-ticket, actually.

oh let's not start any dangerous ideas that the immense chasm between the Ds and Rs is bridgeable.

hey balls, clean mine.

what is his plan for jobs? at the last debate, he admitted he didn't have one yet (he said, "give me some time").

none of these guys will have a plan for jobs because the only feasible plans for job involve substantial gov't spending and planning and even if they secretly know that's the case they're not gonna go on record saying it

unfortunately the same can be said for obama

It's not unfortunate that he won't say it if it involves policy that doesn't stand a chance of passing through congress right now.

it's pretty much the only thing he should ever be talking about. if it doesn't pass in congress, that should be on their back.

yeah, why give people a reason to vote for a new Congress?

SHIT SHIT SHIT

the way cable pundits have brainwashed ppl is amazing.

idk you guys it's august 2011. y'all're doing a lot of "this but not that" shit w/r/t huntsman etc - I mean, if the primaries are held today, he's toast, agreed. in august of 1999 (and don't anybody gimme "I was five years old" or w/e if that's the case this q ain't for you) how many of y'all would have said "Republican presidential nominee vs. Gore next year is George W. Bush, former governor of Texas"? lots of unusual shit can go down in the long primary season and Huntsman's maneuvering this week seemed pretty bright to me

none of these guys will have a plan for jobs because the only feasible plans for job involve substantial gov't spending and planning and even if they secretly know that's the case they're not gonna go on record saying it

__________________

unfortunately the same can be said for obama

there's a lot of optimism -- from people like former sect. reich -- that obama will make a tough, aggressive push for a jobs-creations program based on gov't spending (wrapped in a broader "spend now (for jobs), cut later (for deficit-reduction)") in his september speech.

Yeah, that will be interesting to see. I was referring more to just stumping for another stimulus or something at this point.

idk you guys it's august 2011. y'all're doing a lot of "this but not that" shit w/r/t huntsman etc - I mean, if the primaries are held today, he's toast, agreed. in august of 1999 (and don't anybody gimme "I was five years old" or w/e if that's the case this q ain't for you) how many of y'all would have said "Republican presidential nominee vs. Gore next year is George W. Bush, former governor of Texas"? lots of unusual shit can go down in the long primary season and Huntsman's maneuvering this week seemed pretty bright to me

― pathos of the unwarranted encore (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Monday, 22 August 2011 02:37 (8 minutes ago)

it's smart in the way that desperate hail mary passes are sometimes the smart play.

idk you guys it's august 2011. y'all're doing a lot of "this but not that" shit w/r/t huntsman etc - I mean, if the primaries are held today, he's toast, agreed. in august of 1999 (and don't anybody gimme "I was five years old" or w/e if that's the case this q ain't for you) how many of y'all would have said "Republican presidential nominee vs. Gore next year is George W. Bush, former governor of Texas"? lots of unusual shit can go down in the long primary season and Huntsman's maneuvering this week seemed pretty bright to me

he's not toast because of how he's played his cards, he's toast because of *who he is*. bush wasn't outside of the mainstream gop in 1999, hunts is far outside of the mainstream at this point and the party's not gonna change for him. romney's at least willing to pretend to be crazy.

there's a lot of optimism -- from people like former sect. reich -- that obama will make a tough, aggressive push for a jobs-creations program based on gov't spending (wrapped in a broader "spend now (for jobs), cut later (for deficit-reduction)") in his september speech.

Yeah, that will be interesting to see. I was referring more to just stumping for another stimulus or something at this point.

that would be a stimulus program...

I guess I'm just still a little unclear about the specifics w/r/t hypothetical "substantial gov't spending" that could result in a substantial long-term positive effect on the job situation. As I say, it will be interesting to see what those specifics are.

the american government can borrow money pretty much for free and the country's infrastructure is going to shit. lots of people who used to build houses are unemployed.

it's not 'can government spending have a positive effect on the job situation' it's 'will this occur'?

?' not '?

I totally called Bush Jr. before the Republican primaries. Who else did they have, McCain?

tim what the hell are you talking about

job program: hire a ton of ppl to do something cool/needed/who cares (maybe repair/prepare our country's transportation infrastructure for the coming/here energy crisis) and pay them government money. tada! more jobs!

one program idea i thought was really brilliant is for every new hire a company makes, the government will subsidize half the salary (there are a lot of variations on this idea), thereby creating a direct incentive to add employees to payrolls and create jobs

or we could do the hot new socialist idea - just pay ppl money whether they work or not. of course, this idea basically ends capitalism so ymmv.

check out Bolsa Familia in Brazil for an example of how that last idea can work: http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/01/03/to-beat-back-poverty-pay-the-poor/

paying people to work is a better idea than paying people not to work

depends on what you want, but anyway my point was that there's no shortage of a whole variety of ideas for how the government can create jobs. just a lack of will to implement them.

we can pay people to unbuild houses

Of course, a lot of the provisions of the '09 stimulus were, I think, more about saving and protecting jobs.

it's almost unfair to call the 09 program a stimulus. 40% of the overall 820B program (or 288B) was tax-cuts. roughly 20% (or 145B) was, as you say, supporting state and local gov'ts; absent that money, these more local entities would have had to shed programs and jobs at an alarming rate (and now that the 09 program's money is ending, you're seeing the impact on state and local gov't, all unfortunately happening before the economy meaningfully recovered). the balance (roughly 40%, or 350B) was for a variety of gov't spending programs designed to stimulate the economy. and of that latter category, about 105B -- 110B was for infrastructure projects.

btw, the american-society-of-civil-engineers recently released a study saying that the u.s.'s infrastructure is in total, rapid decay, hardly befitting a world superpower, and that this will cost the u.s. roughly 875K high-skill jobs and force u.s. businesses to spend an extra 430B in transportation costs over the next 10 years. so it's a perfect marriage of smart economic policy and sound nat'l policy. current gop proposals in the house would slash surface-infrastructure spending next year, immediately costing hundreds-of-thousands of u.s. jobs and setting up a clear debate.

the gop's response will be that the last stimulus failed and that we shouldn't spend more money we don't have. but this is wrong on the facts, so let them argue it. the jobs market urgently needs relief (reich, for example, recently suggested that we "(r)ecreate the WPA and Civilian Conservation Corps to put long-term unemployed directly to work," which -- symbolically at least -- gives you a sense of how serious the problem is).

fwiw, i think the measures that the obama administration took prevented a depression. but we're now facing a long, grinding recession (or, if you prefer ken rogoff's term, a "great-contraction" or sustained period of de-leveraging), and more stimulative measures are needed.

paul krugman has made this case all along: the stimulus was probably only half the size of what was needed, it wasn't really stimulative anyway, and if the ARRA didn't do the full job, we would lack the political will to do the rest.

Lots of Perry-related stuff going on, from Huntsman calling him an extremist, to this NY Times piece

Over three terms in office, Mr. Perry’s administration has doled out grants, tax breaks, contracts and appointments to hundreds of his most generous supporters and their businesses. And they have helped Mr. Perry raise more money than any politician in Texas history, donations that have periodically raised eyebrows but, thanks to loose campaign finance laws and a business-friendly political culture dominated in recent years by Republicans, have only fueled Mr. Perry’s ascent.

“Texas politics does have this amazing pay-to-play culture,” said Harold Cook, a Democratic political consultant

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/21/us/politics/21donate.html?nl=todaysheadlines&emc=tha2

As tremors are felt underfoot:

http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/275146/she-will-run-robert-costa

Hah Morbz on fire this morning.

And they have helped Mr. Perry raise more money than any politician in Texas history

this btw is the only thing that's going to matter in re: who gets the nomination

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0811/61807.html

from NRO:

Filmmaker Stephen Bannon, who directed The Undefeated, tells NRO that he is amazed at how popular Palin remains in Iowa. Her reception in Pella, he says, was indicative of how a campaign could be received.

if you know anything about iowa you know how hilarious this is

http://www.salon.com/news/politics/war_room/2011/08/20/lady_rothschild_2012

i dunno what to say to this except "lol"

― goole, Sunday, August 21, 2011 9:22 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

lol just based on the url i thought 'lady rothschild' was an hilarious new name for romney

"To have done healthcare without dealing with the cost curve, and without giving us ultimately what we should have -- like the British have, which is a single-payer system -- is an outrage."

And so I'm switching my allegiance to... Jon Huntsman?!

even weirder when you finish the paragraph

"He's created a monster; he has taken healthcare, which is 17 percent of GDP right now, and has expanded it to another 30 million people. He is going to bankrupt America. He's so vain and he's so convinced of his own transcendence as a solution to everything that he's incapable of doing the right thing for the country."

we need a single payer system, but we also need to stop providing health care to people, because that costs a lot of money

"and if elected, i promise to retract healthcare coverage for up to 60 million american citizens"

"To have done healthcare without dealing with the cost curve, and without giving us ultimately what we should have -- like the British have, which is a single-payer system -- is an outrage."

And so I'm switching my allegiance to... Jon Huntsman?!

― Hey T-Paw, mow my lawn! (Dan Peterson), Monday, August 22, 2011 5:57 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

even weirder when you finish the paragraph

"He's created a monster; he has taken healthcare, which is 17 percent of GDP right now, and has expanded it to another 30 million people. He is going to bankrupt America. He's so vain and he's so convinced of his own transcendence as a solution to everything that he's incapable of doing the right thing for the country."

― iatee, Monday, August 22, 2011 6:06 PM (2 hours ago)

http://images.yuku.com.s3.amazonaws.com/image/gif/914251be389f0a17257ebc496e5022907b0ade4.jpg

Michele Bachmann still thinks there's a Soviet Union. smdh

you guys

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-5ul-kMl5CzM/TdKjPrKeFBI/AAAAAAAAANc/j8Q_ovtgakk/s1600/Ron%2BPaul%2BHope%2Bfor%2BAmerica.jpg

is this serious

I like how she painted it in 2007 and someone added the 2012.

perry's poll nos. are surging apparently

in response to 'i do not want ron paul near my baby'

I'm very concerned about Perry's poll numbers as of August 2011

im not 'concerned' i think its fairly predictable tho

It's August 2007, guys.

im not 'concerned' i think its fairly predictable tho

^^^

guess what, his biggest poll numbers are among "conservative Republicans"

I think obama's got a considerably better shot against perry

like, that already shows up in poll numbers but it's gonna be much more drastic when people get more familiar w/ perry.

I give Perry about the same shot Palin has once people get to know him

I wouldn't use the word "shots" around Rick Perry.

The party won't nominate anybody who's not frothing at the mouth, and the rest of the nation won't elect anybody who is frothing at the mouth, so I think Obama's path to reelection is fairly clear.

^^^

this is the whole point of Obama's "lone adult" strategy

I'm glad you placed that phrase in quotation marks.