voting age, drinking age, age of consent, driving age

14, 14, 16, never

why 14 for drinking age? just curious

never, 18, 16, 17

18, 18, 16, 16

13-19, 0, 0, 0 ron paul 4evs

14 year old kids can harm themselves in lots of ways, but in my ideal society they also don't have any money. but their parents buy them wine at a restaurant sometimes. their parents are french. xp

never, never, never, never

16, 16, 14 but only with somebody up to 2 years older otherwise 18, 65

15 across the board

16 for all, I reckon. Would put the middle two lower but the way I see it is you'll always get people wanting to do stuff before they're allowed to, so the lower the legal age, the younger the people thinking about breaking it will be. Although NV's version would also work.

dayo's answer is an authoritarian teetotalling BDSM mass transit paradise

in other words he's the median bloomberg voter?

don't blame me I voted for kodos

18, 18, 18, 18

one big party

we need a thread for the ages when people shd be prohibited from doing these things

I mean, in my version, I am totally assuming that people will be breaking the law. So just set the age limit at a reasonable age, accept that there will be some deviation from it but don't make too much of a big deal about it.

don't make too big a deal that millions of dumb teenagers kill people and themselves w/ cars?

just set the age limit at a reasonable age, accept that there will be some deviation from it but don't make too much of a big deal about it

the current age of consent ought to be policed like that really, but there's always room for crazy vengeful parents i suppose

whenever they pass a basic competency test, across the board

I think the voting age should be four. Political campaigns would be endlessly entertaining and more brightly-colored.

haha darraghmac otm

xp

i think they'd be surprisingly similar to now

18, 18, 16, 19

I would be fine with making the driving age 21, but that would mean all suburban teenagers would never ever have a social life, which I am also fine with; I would fix this by making WoW free until you get a driver's license

oh hell no, fewer teens in MMORPGs plz

don't make too big a deal that millions of dumb teenagers kill people and themselves w/ cars?

― iatee, Friday, March 2, 2012 8:04 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Well, millions of people kill people and themselves with cars. I guess my perspective is different as there isn't the massive driving urge/insistence that driving is a God-given right/fear and loathing of buses over here.

Thank god young people don't vote, because I can only imagine the hilarity that would ensue were 14 year olds encouraged to hit the polls. I guarantee the votes would bring us one step closer to Idiocracy, at least when it comes to electing porn stars and pro wrestlers.

So I'd say keep voting at 18, then drinking down to 16 (with parental guidance?), then 16 (love the NV exception), then 18.

And at 65 you have to start getting annual driving tests.

18*, 18**, 16***, 16

Notes:

* A minor under direct supervision of a parent can already drink alcohol at home, and some do.

** The age of majority and voting age should coincide. I don't think kids under the age of 18 should be able to sign legally binding contracts.

*** This one's a total moral morass. I'm leery of setting a definite moment where consensual sex jumps from a criminal act to a brilliant expression of mature love, even though it damn well needs to be done. It is an arena where biology is fighting tooth and nail with culture. Every answer produces crappy results.

14 year olds have more reasons to vote for the long-term interests of america than 60 y/os

tbh I fully endorse giving young people the ability to vote, because some of them will take the opportunity to become more engaged with the civic aspects of American citizenship and hopefully be less stupid re: understanding the Bill of Rights

14 year olds more likely to vote for the very short-term interests of america tho

most people vote out of irrational douchebaggery might as well let the kids have a shot

Raising the driving age is the only one out of these that what would have pissed me off when I was a teenager. Grew up in a rural area, not being able to drive at 17 would have been a huge deal.

$2.50 gallon gas? wahoo, I can go on that road trip this summer and bang hot babes like in that one funny movie

14 year olds would immediately vote for the president promising to lower the drinking age, age of consent and driving age.

nah 14 year olds are like long-term investors, you can't really give them anything directly cause they already live off someone else, so the only thing you can do is
a. ensure them that jobs will exist when they become adults / society won't collapse
b. go to 'cool/entertaining wars'

14, 14, 15, 16

Voting age: 18
Drinking age: 18
Age of consent: 16
Driving age: 18

I don't know, driving age I would say earlier but only accompanied by an adult.

And at 65 you have to start getting annual driving tests.

Dude, you're so right. The old guy was driving so slow in front of me, I nearly fell asleep. Then again better than the FUCKING ASSHOLE who got supreme roadrage behind me. OMG!

I quit drinking before I reached drinking age, and I've never voted so have no real preferences there.

No WAY can you let someone younger than 18 vote. I mean, seriously.

18, 18, 18, 18

14 year olds are idiots!

voting - make them pass a test about political practices, institutions, philosophies, current affairs etc (i guess...GCSE standard and age? so 15/16, but if they don't pass then potentially NEVER)
drinking - 18 (b/c people will obv start earlier and that's not policed rigorously and nor should it be)
age of consent - 16 (and yeah obv kids will start earlier, adolescence guarantees it; if two 14-yr-olds get it on, i don't see that as a big issue as long as they're using protection, so this is more a barrier to adults hooking up with 14-yr-olds)
driving age - whenever they pass the test, i am not v concerned about this tbh

14 year olds would definitely vote to legalize prostitution

14-yr-olds are idiots and so are most adults

fairly serious about competency tests for voting, driving btw

Drinking, eh got to go with something similar, drink as early as you want but public drunkenness or w/e to carry a revocation of this until you're 50

Sex- protected and consensual sex prob ok from 15 onwards, with the older party not to be over 18

I have an idea, create a 'president for kids' for all kids under the age of 18 that they can vote for

voting - make them pass a test about political practices, institutions, philosophies, current affairs etc (i guess...GCSE standard and age? so 15/16, but if they don't pass then potentially NEVER)

yeah let's have an essay component to this too while we're at it

when i read these threads i wonder how many people see / work with 14-16 year olds on a regular basis

if two 14-yr-olds get it on, i don't see that as a big issue as long as they're using protection

you can't rely on a 14-yr-old boy to brush his teeth in the morning without prompting, let alone use protection.

voting - make them pass a test about political practices, institutions, philosophies, current affairs etc (i guess...GCSE standard and age? so 15/16, but if they don't pass then potentially NEVER)

-> THIS. But still I'd say 18

i brushed my teeth in the morning when i was 14 and would have used protection if i'd been having sex!

SURE LEX

dayo's idea of a kids president is AMAZING

http://images2.nick.com/nick-assets/shows/images/kids-choice-awards-2012/large/kca-2012-nominees-vote-wap.jpg?height=362&width=650&quality=0.91

yeah let's have an essay component to this too while we're at it

yes! i'd have been voting at like 12

we'll call it a...literacy test! perfect!

k3v otm, the goal of voting rights is to open up the class of voters not restrict it

12 (possibly with test - on fence about this)
12
14
18

lol k3v you should really just jump straight to Jim Crow, ppl are not getting you

iatee's idea of 14 year olds is challops at their finest. I've spent a lot of time around large groups of 14 year olds lately. They're nice kids, but their judgments are wildly unreliable on a day to day basis. Their fits of self-absorbtion can be awesome to behold.

also let's make voting cost $100

i understand the appeal of competency tests for voting, but we have constitutional issues with that. there have basically been no instances of voter-testing in this country that weren't politically weaponized from the start.

the right to the franchise is a higher value than having "good government". ie the consent of the whole of the governed has to include all the morons.

whoa xps

16, 18, 16 (with assorted provisos of the like discussed here), 35-50

No one votes now. Why anyone would want to open up the polls to even more people not voting is beyond me, unless we go the Aussie route. In which case, parents will be paying fines for their disinterested kids not voting.

(for test, this might be between say 12-18 or something)

14 year olds would only vote if they could vote via Playstation.

problem with lumping all 14 yr olds together as idiots is that you're unfairly privileging the 80% of adults that the term adequately describes

also you have to own land, and be white, and be a man

No one votes now. Why anyone would want to open up the polls to even more people not voting is beyond me, unless we go the Aussie route. In which case, parents will be paying fines for their disinterested kids not voting.

tbh I am 100% in favor of this in theory

i understand the appeal of competency tests for voting, but we have constitutional issues with that. there have basically been no instances of voter-testing in this country that weren't politically weaponized from the start.

well given that this entire thing is an imaginary utopian exercise, there'd be a decent education system across the board which would teach this stuff competently to everyone, too

xpost (to obligatory voting) trust me, people don't get fined. here in belgium you s'posedly get fined for not voting. my dad hasn't voted for years and when he did "vote" it was merely making doodles (?) on the paper. never got fined.

I do vote though. I use the right if only to take a vote away from the racist assholes.

iatee's idea of 14 year olds americans is challops at their finest. I've spent a lot of time around large groups of 14 year olds americans lately. They're nice kids, but their judgments are wildly unreliable on a day to day basis. Their fits of self-absorbtion can be awesome to behold.

― Aimless, Friday, March 2, 2012 3:24 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I think there are a lot of people who should be fined for voting.

And driving. And having sex.

i get you lex, i just felt like being a pedant

there'd be a decent education system

The idea that education can be systematic misunderstands education. You can regularize teaching according to a system, but not learning. Since learning is the whole point, this kind of complicates the issue.

iatee, the self-hating american

I am a citizen of the world

really tho it's hard to look at the gop primary and think that that is a group of people operating on a higher level than 14 yos

Treat 14 year olds more like adults imo

if the debates have to be about boogers instead of outlawing contraception, so be it

What if you could vote at 14 if you passed a test but 18 regardless? Does that present the same problems?

romney is pro-boogers but he used to be against them

Because 14 yr olds would definitely legalize contraception, I mean they're ahead of the game there.

otoh, you should hear the uproar a bus full of 14s can make when somebody farts

xp to Laural: yes, in a way. if constituency turnout then depends at the margins on the 14-18 subset then you can plenty well bet on 'vote test prep' being an enormous political football in, say, city vs suburban vs whackadoo private schools etc.

18, 18, 18, 18

― Wild Flag Post (dan m), Friday, March 2, 2012 12:02 PM (23 minutes ago) Bookmark

this, seems simplest and most sensible, dovetails pretty well with the american status quo. you get to be a kid for a while, under parental supervision, and then, right about the time you graduate high school, you get to do grown-up shit. would make allowances for driving and drinking (not simultaneously, of course) at 16, so long as parents/guardians give formal permission and sign a waiver accepting legal full responsibility for any consequences. figure kids between the ages of 12 and 18 can have sex with one another however they please, with the standard caveats regarding consent & cetera, and maybe a bar set at age differences of more than 4 years? would want to make allowances for the continuation of relationships initiated while both parties were underage when any one party comes of legal age.

I genuinely do not believe that fart jokes would lower the american political discourse

voting - make them pass a test about political practices, institutions, philosophies, current affairs etc (i guess...GCSE standard and age? so 15/16, but if they don't pass then potentially NEVER)

An attractive proposition on the surface, but so incredibly flawed I'm surprised that you would actually consider it. I mean, to actually suggest this seriously without taking into account all of the ways that such testing has been and is manipulated and biased suggests a dangerous lack of knowledge of history, politics, philosophy, statistics, etc on the part of the proposer.

here is the reason why 14 is a shitty age for any of these things ...

According to Lawrence Steinberg’s 2004 article, Risk-Taking in Adolescence: What Changes, and
Why?, “risk taking in the real world is the product of both logical reasoning and psychosocial factors” (as
cited in Steinberg, 2007, p. 56). Steinberg further points out that although logical reasoning skills are,
for the most part, fully developed by age 15, psychosocial capacities (impulse control, emotion
regulation, delay of gratification, and resistance to peer influence) continue to develop into early
adulthood ... In fact, physiological research has determined that the prefrontal cortex of the brain is
responsible for executive functions and that this area of the brain continues to develop into your early
20s (Blakemore & Choudhury, 2006).

this is why teenagers are so mean: they are smart enough to understand the logical structures of things like sarcasm, the cutting remark and subtle social manipulation, etc, but they haven't developed the "wisdom" to know when it's a good idea and when it's not

holy shit did I just get the longest "otm" ever from contenderizer?

hm....

I'm 51 and I don't have such a high opinion of the wisdom of most of my contemporaries that I'd be prepared to pit it head- to- head with teenagers, who tend to have some notions of fairness, are generally uncorrupted by money through not having any and, with that cruel intelligence you reference,often have a keener nose for bullshit than the grown-ups. I'd be quite interested in the idea of a compulsory retirement age from voting once the future ceases to be of much immediate personal interest and your default setting is nostalgia for your re-imagined youth.

As for drinking and driving and consent: 16

oh hell no

xp

That was xp to the late great

(and now xp to self)

re sonofstan, interesting to consider the top ages for this kind of thing.

figure sex and drinking kind of sort themselves out. you stop with the first when it stops with you, and the second stops you when you don't stop with it. figure voting and driving could be tied together. everyone age 65 and up has to take a standard driving test every couple years. when you can no longer pass it, you lose the right drive and the right to vote. then you have to go up on a mountain and wait for the bears.

18, 18, 16, 16

I'd be quite interested in the idea of a compulsory retirement age from voting

I could see this idea. But I expect it makes more sense as a theory, and would not produce many benefits in reality. Many old people do vote with an eye to improving a future they will not inhabit.

Or at least fucking it up as much as possible for the whippersnappers

Wayyyy upthread: I kind of resent the idea of 'competency testing' teenagers before they can vote. Fully grown IDIOTS are allowed to vote. Competency test EVERYONE, or no-one. And voting is a right, anyway. Dumb or smart, you get to vote.

Part of this is just me being kind of IA about cramming for my citizenship test to find out that half of my coworkers didn't even know half the shit I was studying for. I get 'raising the bar' and standards and whatever but I'm still mad about it so I'm taking it out on all of you :)

I agree with goole, Aimless, MWhite: 18-18-16-16

16 year olds driving is the single least defensible thing itt

I thought just 'driving' was the least defensible thing

16 year olds driving is the single least defensible thing itt

― iatee, Friday, March 2, 2012 4:06 PM (7 minutes ago)

yeah i'm conflicted about this obviously, i mean in a perfect world cars don't exist - even in a slightly better world there are better options for getting from place to place - but in the world we live in 16 year olds need to get themselves to work

they will start voting on public transit measures at age 14

the one i could be convinced on is the driving age. i'm inclined to let states or even localities vote for higher ages, but then you'd have to deal with pulling over the 16 year old who drove into the city or w/e.

i grew up a in place where kids drove in from the country to go to school everyday fyi

15, 16, 14, 16

18, 16 ("adult supervised" drinking OK but no purchasing your own 'till you're 18), 15, 19

In the rural parts of the western USA, driving is a whole 'nother beast than in urbanized areas. Putting the legal driving age above 16 in those places would put their parents in revolt, as being unworkable nonsense.

kids are already driving less cause driving is expensive. it's gonna get more expensive. those rural kids are p screwed regardless, but at least in my model they can get drunk and vote.

we can give them free iphones too

or they can vote themselves iphone I guess

iphones can't get the hay truck down the road

& bang pretty much whoever xxp

no there's actually an app for that

I've actually noticed that in the States, state by state, they've been more or less pushing back the driving age with a series of incremental experiential requirements. That's a good thing.

I think it's a misnomer that kids can currently drink with parental supervision, xposting to whomever broached that. I'm pretty sure that's flat out illegal, however unenforceable.

16 year olds driving is the single least defensible thing itt

lol yup, it is worse to let 16 year olds drive than it is to let them drink, because that makes sense

well...

I think it's a misnomer that kids can currently drink with parental supervision, xposting to whomever broached that. I'm pretty sure that's flat out illegal, however unenforceable.

No, it is true. Or at least, they can drink at home with parental supervision. It's still illegal to do so in the pub in most places.

18, 18, 16, and 18 to have sex with me.

From the time I was 15, my parents would let me drink small amounts of alcohol on special occasions, such as New Year's Eve. If this was criminal child abuse, then fuck tha law.

the law isn't interested in kids drinking -- it's drunken kids crashing into old ladies or causing a public disturbance that interests them

According to wikipedia, Britain is the only country in the whole of the world that has a minimum age of private drinking. And that age is 5.

14, 14, 16, 21

I could be talked into having no drinking age, & I'd think age of consent could go somewhat lower b/c I'm not sure the law is effectual anyway.

16 year olds driving is the single least defensible thing itt

lol yup, it is worse to let 16 year olds drive than it is to let them drink, because that makes sense

― Vaseline MEN AMAZING JOURNEY (DJP), Friday, March 2, 2012 4:39 PM (20 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

it is much easier to kill someone or yourself w/ a car than with alcohol

If you combine the two then it's even easier still.

(Oh wait, this isn't the 'tips for murdering everyone' thread?)

well I think it's without question that anyone who drinks and drives goes to jail forever

I just checked iatee's answer: 14, 14, 16, never.

Whew! For a minute I thought he was advocating to have a whole generation of 14 year olds go to prison for life. Lucky for him, they would never be allowed to drive, and thus be saved from this dismal fate.

also all drugs are legal and everyone in jail for a drug crime is freed so there are lots of spots for drunk drivers

wait so is this the libertarian thread part II

No, never being able to drive is the dismal fate.
xp

iatee str8 trolling now

i dunno, late great, if studies showed that there were valid concerns over any other grouping's 'pyschosocial tendencies' how'd you feel about a blanket denial of rights? Why then should any individual 14 year old not share these rights?

kids r property, iirc

xpost You can do whatever you want in the privacy of your own home. Doesn't make it legal.

it is much easier to kill someone or yourself w/ a car than with alcohol

this is entirely dependent on what you're drinking

also, you realize that your "millions of kids die in car accident" statistic which you pulled out of your ass is gross overstatement to about 4-5 degrees of magnitude, right: http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/trafficandcommuting/teen-deaths-in-car-crashes-climb/2012/02/17/gIQAoUW9JR_story.html http://www.ghsa.org/html/publications/pdf/spotlights/spotlight_teens11.pdf

From some Wall Street Journal article:

Although the minimum drinking age is officially 21 in all 50 states, 31 states allow parents to furnish alcohol to minors, and 30 allow minors to drink for religious purposes. 31 states allow parents, guardians or spouses to furnish alcohol to minors. In seven of the 31 states, that's permissible only in a private residence.

lol regionalism

so in 24 states, kids can drink with their parents in public places? that has to be wrong, right?

Josh, are you disagreeing with me here? You do realise that that quote backs up what I was saying - it is legal to drink AT ANY AGE when you're in a private residence being supervised by a guardian. IT IS LEGAL. Those other things are when you allow children to drink outside the home as well.

dan I mean over history and not limited to america, there are only 300 something mil people in america so there aren't v many things that millions of people could die from

I think what you guys are failing to understand is that if a parent takes that law and bends it so they're getting pissed with the child all the time, then the parent can be charged with other crimes, e.g. negligence, endangering the kid's life. Those things aren't legal, whereas giving your kid alcohol is.

so in 24 states, kids can drink with their parents in public places? that has to be wrong, right?

That is wrong: http://drinkingage.procon.org/view.resource.php?resourceID=002591

for medical purposes??

i dunno, late great, if studies showed that there were valid concerns over any other grouping's 'pyschosocial tendencies' how'd you feel about a blanket denial of rights? Why then should any individual 14 year old not share these rights?

― Streep? That's where I'm a-striking! (darraghmac),

yes!

i support, for example, a blanket law not allowing blind people to drive.

well driving isn't a civil right, voting is

ok, well, i support a blanket law not allowing dogs to vote

seconded

does that mean that the dog gets a blanket in lieu of its vote

should it ever be legal to give your dog some beer?

xp

no, it means a law that covers all dogs, including you

it is always to give your dog beer, especially if you are producing kobe dog for kobe dog burgers

dan I mean over history and not limited to america, there are only 300 something mil people in america so there aren't v many things that millions of people could die from

― iatee, Friday, March 2, 2012 5:28 PM (9 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

1. Plague
2. Embarrassment
3-infinity: ??

srs q tho, what are the medical purposes for drinking alcohol

Treatment for poisoning by other alcohols

Ethanol is sometimes used to treat poisoning by other, more toxic alcohols, in particular methanol[70] and ethylene glycol. Ethanol competes with other alcohols for the alcohol dehydrogenase enzyme, lessening metabolism into toxic aldehyde and carboxylic acid derivatives,[71] and reducing one of the more serious toxic effect of the glycols to crystallize in the kidneys.

withdrawal, but i doubt thats what it's referring to

xp

so if you drank illegally you can drink legally so you don't die

sneaky

see also:

Alcohols have applications in industry and science as reagents or solvents. Because of its relatively low toxicity compared with other alcohols and ability to dissolve non-polar substances, ethanol can be used as a solvent in medical drugs, perfumes, and vegetable essences such as vanilla. In organic synthesis, alcohols serve as versatile intermediates.

Nyquil used to be a good example of this, although I think they've reformulated it so that it's now alcohol-free

I had a cocktails with my mom when I was 17 at a restaurants, actually a few times at a grill/bar under parental supervision. Granted this was Texas in the 90's and maybe the law has changed.

Arrested for "minor in possession of vanilla extract."

(xp) According to the link I posted, it hasn't.

how much vanilla extract would you have to drink to get drunk?

Well, there's a tree/forest component to this: maybe you can drink in your private residence with your underage (how underage???) kids, but as soon as someone else finds out about it you're potentially liable for all sorts of things. No? Regardless, the law is totally regional and piecemeal about this. Do any of the laws even list a minimum age? Because surely it can't be legal to give toddlers recreational booze. So at what point does it become sympatico? This is why I doubt it is legal, per se. Overlooked, maybe. Slip though the crack, maybe. But it seems like a grey area at best.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100918194935AAri3Xn

xp: Josh, there's a pretty detailed link posted upthread that addresses a good chunk of your alleged "grey area"

wow that's less than I expected, people should do that

you could have some vanilla extract shot + cake making party

when I worked in a bar in MI during college geographically-challenged people from across the border in WI would come in and try to order their over-18-under-21 kids drinks, then complain when we wouldn't serve them. in WI (at least at that time ~10 years ago) it was legal for parents to do this.

wouldn't you get super-nauseous? vanilla extract is pretty damn strong, i get nauseous just from sniffing a bottle and i can't put more than a teaspoon in a batch of pancakes or french toast.

Dan, I'd call the crazily inconsistency of those state by state laws pretty close to a grey area. Is it legal for underage people to drink alcohol in the privacy of their own home? Yes. No. Sometimes. Never. Depends on where you are and why you're drinking.

Are there any cocktails that call for vanilla extract? It's essentially like a bitter, but I've never come across one.

Regardless, the law is totally regional and piecemeal about this.

it's regional and piecemeal about everything, we have "state laws"

i mean i don't understand the substance of what your arguing or who with

goole OTM

well there is a national law too, it just couldn't be as expansive as it would like to be http://www2.potsdam.edu/hansondj/YouthIssues/1092767630.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amethyst_Initiative

this is interesting!

whoa what happened to my text there

There aren't too many local laws that go totally contrary to a constitutional amendment, are there? Not arguing anything. Just stating that it's a weird grey area, because, no, local laws don't usually trump federal, constitutionally dictated laws. State by state speed limit changes are one thing; there is no national speed limit. But state by state underage alcohol consumption exceptions? That, to me, is unusual. See also: legal to sell medicinal marijuana in some place, contrary to federal law. Do you have the right to buy? Yes. Do you have the right to use? Yes. Does the government have the right to punish you for doing those legal things? Yes. Do they always? No. Grey area.

it's not really 'exceptions', there is a federal law but what the law can do is limited by the fact that it has to be justified by the interstate commerce clause

my understanding is that federal 'drinking age' laws are not that exactly. the US Congress agrees to give states money for their freeways if the states adopt the drinking age of 21 and do other stuff maybe besides.

my understanding of this could be way off and i don't feel like looking it up r/n

congress can't make laws to regulate the drinking age, it can make laws to regulate the sale of alcohol

Actually, that sounds about right. The gov can't legally mandate it, but it can withhold funds to non-complient states. That sounds familiar. Most states comply. Or comply enough.

haha u must admit that is angels on the head of a pin shit

xp

So it's never legal to buy alcohol under 21, but it is, in certain situations, legal to consume it.

well i think we need to differentiate between "legal gray area" and "takes more than a 4-word sentence to describe accurately"

In Louisiana the legal drinking was 18 until sometime in the 00's. So many kids would drive across the boarder to buy their booze, the danger being the highway patrol man who parked at the boarder waiting for them.

louisiana's highways were famously shitty too!

xpost (to obligatory voting) trust me, people don't get fined.

They do in Australia! i have been, twice.

I'm still confused about one aspect: is it legal to get your kid shitfaced? Is there any age that it is illegal to get your kid shitfaced? (I can't imagine "it was legal" would hold up as a defense in court, regardless, ironically.)

in most states it is illegal to get your kid shitfaced but it depends on the state. it is illegal for 20 y/os to purchase alcohol in every state.

lol america

14, 16, 16, 21

it is illegal to get your kid shitfaced in every state if it is endangering their well-being

goole is right about why it's 21 in every state

it is illegal to get your kid shitfaced in every state if it is endangering their well-being

― the late great, Friday, March 2, 2012 3:56 PM (10 minutes ago) Bookmark

yeah, that's the thing. as far as i can tell, the laws aren't very clear on this

but common-sense should kinda dictate this might not be a good move, just as ILXORS talkin baout things right?

unclear how?

unclear in that the degree of resulting intoxication that might be permissible (or impermissible) isn't specified

well yeah but the same is true of spanking or any other type of child abuse / endangerment

yeah, exactly. difference is that very few people voluntarily consume unhealthy amounts of spanking.

yep, uh huh, very few *coughs*

lol

the assumption of the law is that minors don't have "voluntary"

Are there any cocktails that call for vanilla extract? It's essentially like a bitter, but I've never come across one.

― Josh in Chicago, Friday, March 2, 2012 6:05 PM (3 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

it shows up in some tiki-type cocktails by the drop. it's actually a tincture, not a bitter, since there is no bittering agent.

I would post on this thread but there's just too much to read. Drinking age should be 12 or so though.

I've got no real beef with the status quo in Canada but if I were going to lean in any direction, it would be towards raising the voting age and lowering the drinking age.

18-21, 16, 14, 16

i dont really know what ages for these things would be fairest but i hate teenagers so:

25, 10, 32, 28

They do in Australia! i have been, twice.

How much was the fine?

I think not voting is stupid. But that's because I have been brainwashed by my political minded husband. lol