American Politics Thread 2013: Bangs, Whimpers and Filibusters

http://image.blingee.com/images18/content/output/000/000/000/784/741856027_566018.gif

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=om24vFEStvw

Good title

It’s simply a hostage exchange. The Republicans gave up the fiscal cliff, and will now take the debt limit, the federal budget and automatic across-the-board cuts to discretionary spending (the sequester), and have another standoff in 2-3 months time. The deal wouldn’t have gotten 85 GOP votes in the House without the leadership giving right-wingers ironclad guarantees that they’ll have another hostage soon.

What leverage will the White House have at that point? They’ve already rejected the “constitutional option” to avoid the debt ceiling — and won’t mint a big platinum coin. The Bush tax cuts on high earners will be off the table. That leaves cuts to defense — which Republicans hate — and public opinion, to which the GOP doesn’t seem terribly responsive when its base is screaming murder and threatening primaries (which is always). That’s pretty thin gruel given that the “austerity caucus” thinks it has a good shot at cutting Social Security and Medicare as part of a “grand bargain” with Obama.

Other than that, we’ll only have the Democrats’ legendary iron back-bone on which to rely. Nobody’s ever gotten rich betting on that.

http://www.salon.com/2013/01/02/the_fiscal_cliff_deal_is_simply_awful/

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m1az41TcVJ1qfy2kdo1_r1_500.gif

morbs desperately searches salon for liberal takedown of fiscal cliff deal, finds one that doesnt say anything about the deal, posts, thank god

Meanwhile Peter King i smiffed.

http://static3.businessinsider.com/image/50d137d6ecad046d79000008-900/obama-has-nancy-pelosi-john-boehner-harry-reid-and-mitch-mcconnell-over-for-lunch.jpg

"These sandwiches are mighty tasty."

"Are they as tasty as GO FUCK YOURSELF?"

A good summary of what's in the thing.

I will give Boehner this -- if I worked in Congress I would want to drink constantly and tell everyone to go fuck themselves.

toothbomb

as there's nothin goin on in politics this year -- ta.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=om24vFEStvw

http://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/gallery/files/6/2/4/1/Cats_Ass_thumb.jpg

one piece of good news in the deal is that it extends the wind energy tax credits for another year. the tax credits have been around for a couple decades now, but every once in a while congress lets them lapse and new wind projects have significantly declined:

http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/PTC-Chart.png

(the tax credit lapsed in 2000, 2002 and 2004, as the chart implies but doesn't explicitly say)

really mad that this is "American Politics 2013: Go Fuck Yourself"

yes, the solar tax credits got in too, which is good news for my job. xp to ZS

glad to hear it! i always hear about the renewable energy tax credits in the context of wind, but i don't know as much about how they've affected solar in the past.

it's worth pointing out that romney opposed renewable energy tax credits and the clean energy industry (in america, at least) would be in trouble right now if he had somehow won. i'm sympathetic to the "both parties suck the dollar's d" argument but this is one case where the choice really makes a difference.

anyway, time to start screaming about the debt ceiling again! yaaaaaaaaaaay

this shit right her is shameful beyond shameful
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/03/nyregion/congressional-members-blast-house-for-ignoring-storm-aid-bill.html

Comment re: King thing in TPM upthread is pretty otm I think.

Yes, how dare the federal government not give my state relief money that would be paid for by the taxes I constantly vote against, and help from the agencies I constantly try to discredit and disband.

our leaders:

Senator Roy Blunt, a Republican from Missouri, suggested that the aid request was harmed by its size.

“Sometimes when you ask for too much, you don’t get anything,” he told CNN.

cool guy

what a shitty fucking person he is

Gonna be hilar when St. Louis goes underwater again.

blunt might not give a rat's about that either

Boy, hope those tornadoes never come through Missouri again LIKE THEY ALWAYS DO.

When we've managed to shrink the economy, the infrastructure, and the population back down to the levels of 1900, then by gawd, we can get back to the kind of limited, inexpensive government we all deserve and it will be paradise on earth again.

Oh, he comes from around Joplin, eh? Yeah, they never need any massive assistance either.

just as long as republicans arent in the throws of a temper tantrum at the time everything should be cool

Biden: most influential veep ever?

both of these are pretty good

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2013/01/big-lebowski-explains-the-fiscal-cliff.html

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/336709/left-and-cliff-yuval-levin

i just cant anymore, all these writers who have spent the past month surely predicting outcomes that never happened are suddenly in possession of pristine counterfactuals

im mean chait was cool w/cutting social security but now somehow this deal is obama getting his rug tooken

game theory is where bloggers are vikings

i don't remember chait making strong predictions but i kinda tuned this shit out over the holidays

yeah hes not a huge offender on predictions aside from reviewing rumors as if they were done deals, w/him its more that the deals he was cool with were much worse than this one now hes all *sigh* not that good bamer, overall tho with everyone its just that imaginary dealmaking is way too fun

it hink you can analyze the deal w/o relying on counterfactuals as to what obama couldve gotten if he wasnt such as wimp

not knowing house procedure, was it some kind of 'concession' on the part of the House Crazies to let the senate bill come to the floor as-is in the first place? even thought they all turned around and voted no?

ya they were basically voting yes w/o voting yes, more protecting their right flank than conceding really

i'm trying to imagine my own COUNTERFACTUAL where democrats started with the position of dealing with pelosi + some house GOP breakaways. but doing so probably would have ensured GOP unity against. that, and a Speaker being abandoned by his own majority leader and whip in the final moments probably shouldn't be characterized as 'breakaways' anyway...

i mean even these insane people had to have realized they they were fucked on this one, also they were tired and wanted to go home, tho not w/o fucking over people whose homes got swept into the ocean

the LOOK WHAT YOU MADE ME DO caucus

there aren't enough moderate house gop breakways, is the problem

there were enough the other day! under the circumstances. which could not be reproduced if you were trying to, is my point, i guess.

they supposedly had some unofficial rule in the house that they wouldn't bring a bill to the floor unless they expected a majority of the majority party to vote for it. so this was a kinda break in their party rules.

'the hastert rule' yes

was it some kind of 'concession' on the part of the House Crazies to let the senate bill come to the floor as-is in the first place?

only if the crazies actually wanted to kill the bill, as opposed to voting 'no', while allowing it to pass. it is the difference between symbolic resistance and knifing it to death in a back alley. so, the biggest crazies are probably very sullen today and plotting their revenge on Boehner.

the hastert rule, which is only a rule i guess until its inconvenient

(/when) do we think cantor is gonna make a move? it seems like it is and will continue to be a shitty job

someone on twitter said cantor doesnt have the votes fwiw

someone on ilx said someone on twitter said cantor doesnt have the votes fwiw

cantor told me he had the votes

tweet: someone on ilx said cantor told them he has the votes

cantor offered to show me his, if I'd show him mine

i wonder if the nutjobs deep down really want one of their own to lead them

really tho what are the benefits to the gig? you gotta be the one who makes deals w/ obama, you gotta rope in the crazies etc

you get to tell people to go fuck themselves

i'm the speaker of the house already!

u get to cry all the time

catch a tan. be on tv.

Toomey looking forward to shutting down the government.

of course theyre going to say that

tbh i wouldnt be surprised if they actually did it, itll prob be the house tho

can the senate even do it, isnt the debt ceiling filibuster proof cause its a budget issue

the thought that the us defaulting on its debts isnt as big of a deal as our 'crippling' budget deficits is some fuckin bullshit

Toomey talks about how little a shutdown would affect "the markets", but he conveniently forgets all the news stories about seniors worrying about not getting their SS payments, families of the unemployed with no food in the house, projects expensively put into mothballs only to be expensively revived two or three weeks later, businesses with goverment contracts not getting paid, etc. This is not just a PR disaster, but gums up the works for the entire nation.

All Obama has to do is sternly lecture Congress in front of cameras on a daily basis, while the Congressional Republicans look worse and worse by trying to talk about hazily theoretical future disasters they are averting by obstinately causing real and present disasters that everyone can see.

This is not just a PR disaster, but gums up the works for the entire nation.

And there's the small matter of signaling to the rest of the world that we are actually willing to default on our debts. Toomey's whole "this isn't about existing debts" is so absurd on its face -- that's exactly what it's about. You can't just imagine some fantasy world where we didn't spend all that money and therefore we don't have to pay it.

the country could still pay its debts and run the government if the debt ceiling isnt raised right away, they just use incoming tax revenue to service the debt and pay out social security and w/e essential stuff then issue iou's for the government costs its cant cover, then once the debit limit is raised you can pay it all back, this could go on for months w/o causing any problems really

it's funny how they never learn their lesson from shutting down the gov't - it's backfired on them every time

the prob is this time there's a limit to the extent that they can get 'punished' for being a shitty gov't

because most of the congresspeople are in safe seats

kind of hopeful the thread title becomes obsolete by year end; would love to see some filibuster reform

so not gonna happen

it may happen but itll be p incremental, unfortunately there will still be the filibuster, some day maybe...

this could go on for months w/o causing any problems really

...except the US Treasury already uses all these dodges and the Congress knows about them and assumes they will be used, so the actual 'shutdown' isn't consdered to begin until all these expedients are exhausted -- and that's what has happened before and what the crazies are talking about doing again.

Meanwhile :

http://m.gawker.com/5972549/wisconsin-gop-legislator-boldly-asks-why-must-we-still-hear-about-kwanzaa

the country could still pay its debts and run the government if the debt ceiling isnt raised right away, they just use incoming tax revenue to service the debt and pay out social security and w/e essential stuff then issue iou's for the government costs its cant cover, then once the debit limit is raised you can pay it all back, this could go on for months w/o causing any problems really

isn't this what we're doing right now? last week there was the statement from Treasury (http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-12-31/geithner-tells-congress-u-s-reaches-debt-limit.html) that the debt ceiling was actually hit on Dec. 31, and Geithner is directing them to take "extraordinary measures" to keep the everything running until Feb 28th.

xpost i'm sorry Kingfish but only Ned is allowed to change the subject using the "Meanwhile: -link-" format.

;)

i could be wrong but its my understanding theres more they can do xp zs

this could go on for months w/o causing any problems really

In terms of actually keeping the wheels on, yes. But from a global finance perspective, turning our willingness to pay our debts into a never-ending political fight is all kinds of irresponsible.

ha yeah i think we passed the all kinds of irresponsible threshold a while ago

well yeah

Hate these guys:

http://maddowblog.msnbc.com/_news/2013/01/02/16305284-house-gop-blocks-violence-against-women-act?lite

All sorts of wishful thinking 'is Boehner toast' chatter out there now.

Boehner ain't going anywhere except the bar for a bourbon, one ice cube.

Meanwhile, some sausage making

http://www.nationaljournal.com/congress-legacy/the-gop-s-failed-plan-o-inside-the-fiscal-cliff-saga-20130102

xpost re: house GOP block of VAWA

But House Republicans insisted the bill is too supportive of immigrants, the LGBT community, and Native Americans -- and they'd rather let the law expire than approve a slightly expanded proposal.

jeeeez. maybe the article is missing some sort of argument the GOP made against the bill (expansion of govt. spending or some other bullshit?). did they have any excuse to block the bill other than "we hate immigrants, the LGBT community, and Native Americans"?

if there are any groups that get too much support in this country it's immigrants, LGBT folks, and native americans.

I mean geez we already let them have CASINOS wtf else do they want

We need more LGBT casinos

we need more LGBT immigrants imo

looking into a bit more (also via maddowblog), the breaking point for the GOP (cantor in particular) was protections for Native American women. The LGBT and immigrant stuff he could "bend" on, but protecting Native American women? ENOUGH IS ENOUGH FOR ERIC CANTOR. *barf*

http://maddowblog.msnbc.com/_news/2012/12/07/15751333-gop-eyes-violence-against-women-act-changes?lite

these fucking fucking fucking people
http://mediamatters.org/video/2012/12/05/perinos-advice-to-women-who-are-victims-of-viol/191702

no one even batted an eye at that.

they were all too busy contemplating the other guy's claim that it was a fact that "millions" of people had protected themselves with guns, and that her personally knew "many" people who had protected their homes with guns, or whatever

b/w not voting on Sandy relief and the Violence Against Women Act ... this is pure sand-in-their-pussies spitefulness.

fuck them all to Hell, seriously.

looking into a bit more (also via maddowblog), the breaking point for the GOP (cantor in particular) was protections for Native American women. The LGBT and immigrant stuff he could "bend" on, but protecting Native American women? ENOUGH IS ENOUGH FOR ERIC CANTOR. *barf*

http://maddowblog.msnbc.com/_news/2012/12/07/15751333-gop-eyes-violence-against-women-act-changes?lite

― "reading specialist" (Z S), Wednesday, January 2, 2013 6:07 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

manifest cantor

caveat cantor

eric "richard 'dick' tomato pizza" cantor

Meanwhile, some sausage making

http://www.nationaljournal.com/congress-legacy/the-gop-s-failed-plan-o-inside-the-fiscal-cliff-saga-20130102

― Ned Raggett, Wednesday, January 2, 2013 2:45 PM (5 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

“You get nothing. I get that for free," said Obama

Rules Committee ranking Democrat Louise Slaughter of New York summed up the events: “Today’s legislation is far from perfect, and the process that led us here has been an utter disgrace.”

solitary posts...

5) Subsidies for Goldman Sachs Headquarters – Sec. 328 extends “tax exempt financing for York Liberty Zone,” which was a program to provide post-9/11 recovery funds. Rather than going to small businesses affected, however, this was, according to Bloomberg, “little more than a subsidy for fancy Manhattan apartments and office towers for Goldman Sachs and Bank of America Corp.” Michael Bloomberg himself actually thought the program was excessive, so that’s saying something. According to David Cay Johnston’s The Fine Print, Goldman got $1.6 billion in tax free financing for its new massive headquarters through Liberty Bonds.

http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2013/01/eight-corporate-subsidies-in-the-fiscal-cliff-bill-from-goldman-sachs-to-disney-to-nascar.html

Just a lonely guy eating Cheetos:

“If this is how we end the 112th Congress, it will disappoint every member of the class,” said freshman Rep. Tim Huelskamp, R-Kan., as he munched on Cheetos and walking alone after a GOP conference meeting on Tuesday. “This is exactly what we came to change, problems like this.… We came here to make big bold changes, and at the end of the day, for whatever reason, we frittered away most of the energy that sent us to here in 2010.”

Pobrecito.

keep eating those Cheetos, Tim, and you'll see big bold changes soon enough.

sounds like the kinda guy who sees a doctor because his dick is turning orange.

http://www.lolbrary.com/content/200/the-worst-part-about-eating-cheetos-is-all-the-crap-you-get-on-your-fingers-27200.jpg

Bleurgh.

Huelskamp a media Cheetos glutton.

http://www.morningsun.net/newsnow/x65622948/INSIGHT-KANSAS-Huelskamp-a-media-glutton

Dude is one of the more punchable asshats on news shows imo.

is that one of the guys who got famous for being 'purged'?

of Cheetos?

"We've replaced Tim Huelskamp's committee appointments with a bag of Cheetos; let's see if he noti- What? They're gone already?"

my 2013 resolution is to Custos the fuck out of any and all political threads btw

a chilling resolution

http://www.slate.com/blogs/weigel/2013/01/03/you_ll_have_to_wait_19_days_for_a_filibuster_reform_vote.html

Tumulty and Wallsten's framing of this is straight BS, even if they answer their own dumb question. can't keep the DC press away from 'bipartisan' catnip

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/has-the-fiscal-cliff-fight-changed-how-washington-works/2013/01/02/ee832fb0-5510-11e2-a613-ec8d394535c6_story.html

As ugly as they were, the “fiscal cliff” negotiations produced something Washington hadn’t seen in a long time: strongly bipartisan votes in the House and the Senate on a big, contentious issue.

The question now is whether that victory of pragmatism over ideology offers a new model of governing as President Obama approaches his second term and the shattered Republican Party tries to regroup

The answer: probably not, though it may have helped define the terms of engagement for the battles to come.

lol, reading further: huelskamp really does need to ditch the cheetohs

“I know a lot of folks walked out with a real bad taste in their mouths,” said Rep. Tim Huels­kamp (Kan.), a freshman who has emerged as a leading critic of Boehner’s since the speaker removed him from a plum committee assignment last month. “It wasn’t Republicans clapping and cheering. It was Democrats.”

*eats Cheetos furiously thinking of battles to come*

a picture of said Cheetos muncher:

http://images.politico.com/global/news/110215_huelskamp_cuts_ap_605.jpg

where's that hand been, Rep Huelskamp?

http://pods.wibwradio.com/feeds/media/01268_Tim_Huelskamp_2.jpg

upthread someone asked why anyone would want the speakership. one reason is having the power to give or take away plum committee assignements. just because boehner has been remarkably ineffective as speaker doesn't mean the position isn't the third most powerful office in DC, just behind the potus and the fed chair.

I guess some people still like him

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/dcccteapartymembercard2.jpg

this was sent from the DCCC to the 35 freshmen GOP represenatives today.

http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/webdr01/2013/1/3/9/enhanced-buzz-1532-1357223513-0.jpg

this was sent from the NRCC to freshmen democrats last Thursday.

pelosi should be telling democrats how to vote more often than not

has the party in power ever split votes enough so the minority leader was elected speaker?

Yeah, I have no problem with that

jaymc to thread!

did he answer that on jeopardy or something

has the party in power ever split votes enough so the minority leader was elected speaker?

Something similar happened in our state legislature recently. The Republicans gained control of the House for the first time since Reconstruction. They were all set to put this right-wing guy from the hills into the Speaker's chair when the Democrats schemed with a few Republicans to elect a more moderate Republican from the 'burbs into the chair.

Now this black horse is running the show and in the back of his mind, he knows he's got the Democrats to thank.

The difference though between what happened here and what happens in Washington is that the state legislators were able to cast their votes on a secret ballot, with no fear of retribution if they failed.

so the prez signed that defense authorization bill today with all those goodies in it ("an authoritarian with a very clumsy prose style" in this case, notes Charles Pierce re Obama's comments).

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/01/03/the-10-juiciest-tidbits-from-the-fiscal-cliff-talks/

all pretty nuts

House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) tried to play good cop. ‘John,’ she said, ‘Are you going to try to be a little bit constructive?’ Boehner would not. ‘The House has acted,’ he said. ‘It’s up to the Senate.’”

i can just hear her

Republicans watch too much Mad Men

lolololololol

they prob could use a good PR firm tbh

call me maybe

what do liberals not like about the deal? not enough tax revenue? seems pretty tight to me, i didn't follow too closely through the holidays but i'm p deeply relieved to see no entitlement cuts

Well that's all been left to be dealt with in a few months. Not enough tax revenue though, yeah. I guess tax reform can come down the road though?

made Bush tax cuts permanent yo

ok so all the social security medicare medicaid cuts are still on the table

payroll tax holiday is over, which was probably the best use of deficit stimulus.

Expressing relief that the bill contains no entitlement cuts after the president won an unambiguous victory?

but yeah "entitlement reform" right

everything is always on the table! they have big tables.

taxes went up more on ppl making 50 G than 400 G, howsthatgrabya

harry reid threw something into a fire

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/assets_c/2013/01/joe-biden-frisky-senate-cropped-proto-custom_28.jpg

the Constitution -- or was that Obama?

oh and the Republicans are still going to hold the debt limit hostage xposts

http://www.splicetoday.com/politics-and-media/why-politics-will-always-be-messy

payroll tax holiday is over, which was probably the best use of deficit stimulus.

― goole, Thursday, January 3, 2013 5:29 PM (22 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I'm at 55K/year, what's my damage from this?

you owe me a gin and tonic

gladly

do i look like h&r fucking block to you?

probably about a grand, idk

the payroll tax went up by 2%. to calculate your increase in taxes, multiply your pre-tax income by 0.02

So if your pre-tax income was $55,000 the increase in payroll tax would be $1100 (55K x .02)

i may have found the single dumbest sentence about all this

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/wp/2013/01/02/round-two-of-the-debt-debate-anyone/

The question remains whether, after two failed attempts and much bad blood spilled, House Speaker John Boehner (R-Ohio) will insist on the same fruitless one-on-one meetings with the president. Frankly, it would be far more productive to meet, if he insists on meeting with the White House, with Vice President Biden.

yes, don't talk to the white house. instead, talk to the white house.

surprised I've read just one "The Return of Joe Biden" piece the last few days.

They should meet at a bar. xp

xpost sorry for dumb question; wrongly thought the amount of payroll tax increase varied according to income level

LETS WORK THIS SHIT OUT OVER TALLBOYS

Joe doesn't drink, tho

Boehner will drink enough for the both of them.

he's got to triple up for harry reid too

fucking absurd that our leaders are teetotalesr

otm

xpost sorry for dumb question; wrongly thought the amount of payroll tax increase varied according to income level

― ~farben~ (Jon Lewis), Thursday, January 3, 2013 3:02 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

precisely the opposite! Payroll taxes have a maximum annual income they apply to. They're pretty regressive.

Q: why do we have social security, were old folks routinely dying in the streets

but progressive in benefits paid fwiw

fwiw it's just the Social Security tax that has a maximum; there is no max on Medicare

ha jon i wasn't trying to bust on you, just funnin'. forgot my winky face i guess!

‘John,’ she said, ‘Are you going to try to be a little bit constructive?’

Least-enticing intro to "Computer Blue" ever.

John

Yes, Nancy

Are you going to try to be a little bit constructive?

Yes, Nancy

LMFAO

http://images.politico.com/global/2013/01/03/ipad_list_photo_jw_6051.jpg

Rep. Tim Huelskamp (R-Kan.) — who was recently removed from key committees and supported Rep. Jim Jordan (R-Ohio) for speaker — sat on the House floor during the speaker vote brandishing an iPad. A message was displayed on the screen ticking off members of the House Republican Conference he hoped would oppose the sitting speaker. The title of the document: “You would be fired if this goes out.”

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/01/conservatives-rebel-against-boehner-85749.html

cheeto powder all over ipad

Q: why do we have social security, were old folks routinely dying in the streets

Poverty rate for people over 65 has fallen from about 35 percent in the '50s to about 10 percent now. Lots of factors in that, including obviously a fairly prosperous economy, but Social Security is the biggest difference.

http://theincidentaleconomist.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/Poverty_age_all-years_2-500x379.jpg

looking p good for filibuster reform http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/2013/01/hope-for-filibuster-reform-by.html

one of my senators is amongst the hold outs, im abt to call his ass

yup http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/wp/2013/01/04/the-debt-ceiling-isnt-obamas-problem-its-the-gops-problem

eat the old xps

the link above assumes the dumbfuck media will report things the way they are rather than paint it as being the fault of both parties..

xpost

Obama the liberal Reagan bestrides the world like a colossus.

Ha, I had just read that Krauthammer piece referred to and was wondering what he was smoking.

why would obama negotiate over the debt ceiling? it's not like if the US defaults and everyone blames him instead of the republicans he'll lose the 2012 election. he already won.

blowing through the debt ceiling is legit worse than blowing through the fiscal cliff

nobody really knows what will happen if you play chicken with the bachmann/gohmert wing -- do they even know they're in a game of chicken?

several of the summaries of the fiscal cliff talks suggest that the GOP leadership used the craziness of their backbenchers as leverage; the white house and democrats really don't know wtf is up with them.

oh plz oh plz oh plz

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2013/01/barney-frank-wants-to-be-a-senator.html

I think the goal is to let wall st freak out the gop

I happened to watch Frank's Morning Joe appearance this morning; he also opposes "Chuck" Hagel's nomination.

I saw Joe talking to David Axelrod about how it is obvious to Joe that since entitlements are the biggest growing item in the budget we have to cut spending on them now (especially since Republicans gave Obama his tax rate hikes)

It would be nice if every time somebody talks about "cutting entitlements," there's someone there to say, "you mean taking Social Security and health care away from grandmothers."

Also I hate the way the word "entitlement" has been twisted from meaning "something everyone deserves" into "something people feel entitled to," with the implication that they don't deserve it.

wtf is this

http://blog.nj.com/njv_bob_braun/2012/12/private_education_grant_tied_t.html

What passes for educational reform in New Jersey has relied heavily on private foundation money — millions from the likes of Mark Zuckerberg and Bill Gates, among others — and a common complaint of critics is that the public is rarely made aware of the conditions of those grants. One recent grant from a California-based foundation includes this unusual stipulation: Gov. Chris Christie must stay in office in New Jersey.

great moments in spokespersonship:

A spokeswoman for the foundation had a different take. In an e-mail, Erica Lepping, its senior communications director, wrote:

"Research shows that American school systems making the greatest academic gains have certain ingredients in place, including strong leaders who champion strategies that are designed to create environments that support students and teachers, so we consider the presence of strong leaders to be important when we hand over our dollars.

"Of course the longevity of a governor is entirely up to a state."

i.e. put down the Cheetos, Chris.

bi woman goes to congress. post sends the style section.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/kyrsten-sinema-a-success-story-like-nobody-elses/2013/01/02/d31fadaa-5382-11e2-a613-ec8d394535c6_story.html

Bill Gates, IMF to the states.

In an era when gay men and lesbians getting elected to public office is trending from “oh, wow” to almost ho-hum, it’s a real bummer for this 36-year-old Arizona Democrat that news reports around the world have distilled her to a single distinguishing characteristic based on her sexual orientation (although Sinema has been open about her sexuality for years and welcomed the endorsement and financial support of gay rights groups). And when Sinema is bothered, she isn’t that fun-loving, self-deprecating, laugh riot with the quirky ways. She can turn lecturing, hectoring, defensive, accusatory, pouty and curiously repetitive.

whereas in Barney Frank's time it was "oh bum"

She can turn lecturing, hectoring, defensive, accusatory, pouty and curiously repetitive. Even a softball question about how her sexual orientation has informed her thinking about public policy — she was, after all, the architect of a successful campaign to block a same-sex marriage ban in Arizona — peeves her.

“I don’t have a story to tell,” she snaps. “I don’t think this is relevant or significant. I’m confused when these questions come up.”

Pouty?? POUTY??! And oh yes, how curiously repetitive of her to be angered by your "softball question" fuck you fuck you fuck you FFFFFF UUUUUU.

curiously!

Pouty?? POUTY??!

otm

I heard this chick was bi so i talked to her and it turns out she was kind of a bitch

THE END.

kind of a bitchstabbed me with my own ipad stylus

NJ governors can only serve two consecutive terms. just sayin'

hate it when in an interview somebody "says" something and it gets transcribed that they "snapped" something

yeah, and the grant is done before his term is up anyway. megarich people who give money to fuck with public education are creepy, i think is the point there.

Jonathan Alter wants you fucking liberals to shut up and let adults like the president get to work.

The president already has his hands full dealing with angry and unrealistic Republicans. Now he’s getting reacquainted with their counterparts on the left -- a less ideologically inflexible bunch but not necessarily any more susceptible to reason.

What a twat

That Post piece is one of the more horribly-written things I've seen in a while.

In an era when gay men and lesbians getting elected to public office...

I'm imagining this voiced by that guy who did all the "In a world where..." movie trailers.

I am so totally susceptible

but THIS holiday season

I heard this chick was bi so i talked to her and it turns out she was kind of a bitch

"She was bi but she wasn't curious."

what did she think bi was short for hyuk hyuk hyuk

not necessarily any more susceptible to reason

this makes it sound as if liberals are unable to grasp logic or understand a cogent argument, which is balls. in almost all cases what Alter is calling "reason" is simply the president showing them that he does not intend to use the full power of his office in pursuit of the goals that liberals want him to pursue, largely upon the ground that the cost will be high, while the gains are uncertain.

However, this is merely a calculation of power and nothing to do with "reason" per se. There is no single right answer or single reasonable course of action.

For example, two generals, each with the same troops and weapons, same logistics and same objective will conceive different battle plans. Each plan would be reasonable in the estimation of the general who proposes it and no doubt it is, but the better general will be more successful more of the time.

So, calling those you disagree with 'unsuceptible to reason' in this case is just another way of saying, nyaaah nyaah poopyheads because they won't play the game as you want them to play.

http://mad.ly/d20d63?pact=13506272228&fe=1

The lesson of Les Misérables and Uber is that we need a movement for a better future to see beyond the current Washington mess and begin advocating policies that will create a better future for all of us.

Your friend,
Newt

The nominee to be the next CIA Director:

Shortly after Obama was first elected, Brennan asked the president to take him out of contention for the CIA position. At the time, liberal critics said that Brennan, who had served in a senior intelligence position under President George W. Bush, was too closely tied to that administration’s use of brutal interrogation techniques that critics said were torture. Brennan strongly denied that he had ever supported those policies.

http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-pn-obama-brennan-cia-20130107,0,4544987.story

I mostly agree with digby re Hagel:

I'm sympathetic to Glenn Greenwald's take on the Hagel nomination, particularly the fact that among the possible nominees in both parties, Hagel is probably among the most dovish. But that says more about the degradation of the Democratic Party's foreign policy establishment than it does about Chuck Hagel.

I have to admit that I find all this sort of confusing. The Chuck Hagel I'm most familiar with is a somewhat dull-witted fellow who insisted we send ground troops into Kosovo (over the objections of the likes of Tom DeLay!)and adamantly supported the idiotic Star Wars program --- almost to the extent of being a fanatic on the subject. He was much better on Iraq, of course, although he voted for it. (Recall that more than 30 Senate Democrats voted against, so it wasn't an impossible vote to take.)

Was he worse than many Democrats of the past couple of decades? No. Aggressive militarism combined with convenient dovishness is a bipartisan affair. But he was weird, one of the Senate's "mavericks" which in his case never seemed to me to be political positioning for higher office, like John McCain, or bitter contrarianism like Joe Lieberman, but rather simple incoherence. He just didn't appear to have much of a center.

Now there are many who say this impression is nonsense, that Hagel is extremely bright and has a very well-formed, if idiosyncratic, view of the world. I'll take their word for it. I'm no Hagel expert and frankly haven't followed his career all that closely. I'm basing my impressions on an accumulation of discrete episodes over the course of a couple of decades in which I happened to pay attention to him. As I said, he's certainly not the worst person Obama could have chosen from among the Democrats. And he's much better than 99.9% of Republicans. So, if the WH wants this to be a GOP job, he's a far better choice than most. (I shudder to think who he might have picked.) But he's an odd duck, and not always in a good way.

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2013/01/chuck-hagel-hawk/
http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2013/01/brennan-cia/

What do ppl think? Hagel makes it more or less likely that we intervene in Syria?

i don't really know. i think our chance of intervening in syria is already tiny.

what makes syria different than libya, kosovo, etc?

russia, basically

granted, but russia is moving away from syria atm. they only just acknowledged that assad's regime will likely fall - if assad continues to refuse to step down, russia will - i assume - continue to withdraw their support

syria i think is just generally more of a clusterfuck

certainly way more casualties already than libya (6x as many)

yeah that and i think its just more factionalized and people seem to suspect that a lot of the rebels are as bad as the government and maybe theres gonna be horrible ethnic bloodletting as soon as the regime falls, just a vv ugly situation

i would guess any 'intervention' would be after any real tipping point and billed as humanitarian/stabilizing in intent

I think we'll stay out of syria in terms of military force, including air power. The syrian fighters are absorbing all the punishment and making measurable progress toward deposing assad, so there's no need to intervene. The only wild card is if al-qaeda appears strong enough to control the outcome and use syria as a staging area and safe haven, if we leave things alone.

The biggest wild card is what happens to Assad's chemical storehouses after he is deposed.

http://i.imgur.com/HLN7R.png

nothing up my sleeves

If Hagel/Obama could broker a deal w/the Free Syrians that guarantees the Russian Navy continued access to Tartus in exchange for backing away from Bashir, they'd have done something particularly productive. I don't what Erdogan would think but I'm pretty sure it could be made palatable to him. Everything looks like it's going the other way right now, but that may be posturing ahead of negotiating.

(6x as many)

More and more densely populated, tho..

I'm not convinced that the Free Syrians are as cohesive as has being suggested.

platinum coin: i say no.

platinum coin would be the fn best

they could make a whole sweet photo op of obama depositing it

just don't try to put it in the soda machine. it won't give you a trillion sodas, and in fact, it'll probably get stuck in there

coin is a great idea because it's just as stupid as holding the debt ceiling hostage.

it would, however, fatally split republicans, who could never agree as to whether president obama was more like president mugabe or president camacho

do NOT play pogs with the platinum coin. it's a great slammer, but it could get lost in the pandemonium of flying pogs

rly tho issuing debt that doesn't have a clear legal and consensual basis for its existence is just as suicidal as blowing through the debt ceiling.

you wonder if obama even bringing it up would be enough to freak the market out

naw man its cool

also he should make it appear from behind boehners ear at the state of the union

Wouldn't be able to wait for the right-wing editorial cartoon updates though.

we need this trillion dollar coin only so we can make a nick cage national treasure movie about it

you wonder if obama even bringing it up would be enough to freak the market out

He should bring up bitcoins.

if they made a movie about the invention of the trillion dollar coin the guy who came up with the idea would be played by jeff goldblum

i have been forced due to the gops intransigence to mint this trillion dollar... oh shit *searches pockets*

...shouldn't have been playing pogs this morning...shit

lol lagoon

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2013/01/the-emergency-committee-on-israel-goes-all-in/266898/

kristooooool

http://www.ronanlyons.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/The-trouble-with-trillions.png

was kind of amazed to recently learn there actually were $100,000 bills at one point

$1k $5k $10k too

iirc the 100s and 10s were just for interbank transfer but the 1 and 5s circulated

one of the raymond chandler book prominently features a $5k bill when i read it i was all thats not a real thing

but then i checked wikipedia

I don't think Obama should mint the coin or declare the debt limit unconstitutional or pull any other stunts like that. He should just make it very clear that when the Treasury runs out of money, they're going to have to stop making lots of payments, starting with Social Security, Medicare, etc. Let the blame fall on the Republicans, where it belongs. Republicans will blink.

I think it's pretty clear the blame will fall of Republicans no matter what happens (unless you vote Republican) so he may as well do as little as possible to appease his base.

I am pretty sure I have seen a $500 bill back when I was a bank teller in olden days.

xp

the huge-denomination bills are so awesome looking, too

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/bd/US100000dollarsbillreverse.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5c/5000_Dollar_1878_US_Legal_Tender_reverse.png/800px-5000_Dollar_1878_US_Legal_Tender_reverse.png

AMERICA

*eagle fucking an arrow-pierced shield*

suck it, other countries

is Rutherford Hayes on any of them

the vicious perverted eagle has stolen the american flag and is carrying it off to feature prominently in a parade float dedicated to the desecration of american values

$100000 bill doesn't scan well but i am pretty sure it is holographic/has some op-art/magic-eye qualities

w/r/t 'the blame will fall on republicans', sometimes I wonder if the political fallout effects of this kinda thing are sorta overstated, like the republican house pulled all kinds of nonsense over the last two years, are / continue to be unpopular. how much bullshit would it take for them to actually lose the house next election? cause truth be told, very few people out there understand the details about an issue like the debt ceiling and it's hard to believe that those who do haven't more or less decided who they're gonna vote for already. is the historic-low approval rating really gonna get lower? etc.

kamal atatürk pisses on our stinking $100,000 dollar bill, yo!

http://www.3833.com/files/images/wbn/turkey/turkey_1995_1000000_lira_f.jpg

yeah but that's probably like twenty bucks

yeah but that's probably like twenty bucks

yeah, and $20 may be too high.

still -- ONE MILLION LIRA, BITCHES

kinda trashy having a domain name on your bills

then there's the 1 BILLION mark bill ... with some German dude who looks like (but probably really isn't) Emil Jannings ... which probably really was worth $20 when it was still legal tender:

http://www.vision.net.au/~pwood/Volume389.jpg

whereskamal.com

http://thejetpacker.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Zimbabwe_100_trillion_2009.jpg

beautiful design imo

and they got the diamonds to back it u

p

BiR MiLYON

personal promise from gordon gano on every note

who will win ... the BiR MiLYON!?!?!

BiR MiLYON

― mookieproof, Monday, 7 January 2013 18:16 (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

otm

very few people out there understand the details about an issue like the debt ceiling

This is unlikely to continue to be the case if Medicare / Social Security hit the wall, though.

http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/13/01/general-mcchrystal-on-drones-they-are-hated-on-a-visceral-level/266914/

We can kill without risk of getting killed.

seems fair!

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/bd/US100000dollarsbillreverse.jpg

lol no illustration or anything just $100,000

they print it at the studio where the price is right is filmed

I guess I should not be surprised, but in NPR White House correspondent Scott Horsely's coverage of the Brennan nomination this morning, he never mentioned anything about Brennnan's role re torture during the Bush years; his ongoing support of renditions; and his misstatements re drones and civilian deaths. He did say that Brennan has had the job of telling President Obama about large mass shootings in the US, such as Sandy Hook school.

john brennan is an american hero that is known to hunker down in the basement of the white house, working overtime to keep america safe.

hunkering down, torturing a guy, nbd all part of the job

All while wearing a suit 24/7(just like, per Obama's statement, he does in the August heat at Martha's Vineyard while advising Obama). NPR's Horsely nicely mentioned this important Obama statement about Brennan's qualifications.

he wears a suit, he tortures guys, good enough for me

People ask me about John Brennan, and I tell them, "He is one suit-wearing son of a gun."

i tell them im not sure he owns other clothes maybe he doesnt know where to shop

under his suit instead of underwear he wears another suit

A surprising endorsement.

yeah no kidding

x-post re CIA nominee Brennan's suits--

That's cuz one is his torture suit. But he doesn't have to use it too much now:

Legal issues arising from the arrest of enemy combatants intended for trial in the US, detention at Guantánamo Bay or local prosecution have become so onerous that the Pentagon has recast its orders. “There is no kill or capture any more. It’s kill or kill,” a US official said.

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/world/americas/article3647656.ece

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AtyKofFih8Y&feature=youtu.be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AtyKofFih8Y

thanks, idk why it didn't show up

he's a scary dude. def should not have guns.

http://dailycaller.com/2013/01/08/white-house-agrees-to-respond-to-deport-piers-morgan-petition/

“The White House responds to all petitions that cross the threshold and we will respond to this one. In the meantime, it is worth remembering that the freedom of expression is a bedrock principle in our democracy,” White House spokesman Jay Carney said in a statement reported by Politico.

I think Piers should be sent to the moon

Some trolling over at TPM:
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/Images/platinum_coin_13.jpghttp://talkingpointsmemo.com/platinum_coin_fluke150.jpghttp://talkingpointsmemo.com/platinum_coin_biden150.jpg

"You're just gonna sit there and play your little factoid questions"

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/obamas-failture-to-nominate-women-for-two-top-cabinet-posts-questioned/2013/01/07/eac2e9aa-58e5-11e2-88d0-c4cf65c3ad15_story_1.html

Among those passed over to lead the Pentagon was Michele Flournoy, who became the highest-ranking woman to serve in the Defense Department when she was confirmed as undersecretary of defense for policy in 2009. Flournoy, 52, resigned from the role last February, citing a desire to spend more time with her family. But she also served as an adviser to Obama’s reelection campaign and was considered a top candidate.

hi im going to link to a slate article

www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2013/01/kristol_vs_hagel_why_the_neoconservative_campaign_against_obama_s_defense.html

nate silver ama ongoing fyi fwiw

is he analyzing polls for 2016 yet?

would be pointless

his blog has gotten incredibly boring since the election ended

hes prob mostly napping and counting his book money

trying to skim through various glosses on hagel who is probably going to get there

the extra-congressional noise seems to be mostly kristol but i guess republican congress ppl will be saying some coruscating things for a while

this theory which i quite like is that hagel is chosen not just to triangulate wrt republicans and shift the foreign policy centreground, but as a sort of emblem to project concilliation and retrenchment in the middle east -- caution on iran, de-escalation in afghanistan/pakistan, a bit of subdued hostility towards israel....

irl tho he will have no real influence will remain more or less an instrument of the white house and will allow obama to remain rightish with marginally greater 'credibility' in the islamic world

i know that the whole world pays close attention to us politics but i can't imagine hagel as defense sec pick is going to be on most ppl's radar in the middle east (at least not in terms of reconciliation) plus dude has a history of interventionism - not just re Iraq but Kosovo too.

well that's a relief

OH OK GOOD

he reminds me of mccain a little, more emotionally continent but with an ornery streak and 'tortured conscience' poses

kosovo isn't going to upset the middle east and he seemed contrite on iraq

http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewkaczynski/why-chuck-hagel-didnt-sign-that-1999-letter-again

David Brooks may have a point in his column today. Hagel's nomination may be about providing Obama with political cover for upcoming defense cuts as much as anything.

pray to god that is the case

yeah i wonder about that dynamic. the basic (and maybe wrong) picture is that robert gates was able to make the pentagon play with less, while panetta pandered to it when more cuts were coming. it may not be 'political cover' but, just, the ability and/or institutional respect to put the cuts in action.

Hagel reminds me of the principal in Election; that Midwestern grayness which only sharpens when it's used in the service of showing temper.

where does this meme of the "Democrat Party" misnomer come from (and what is the point of it)? I see it pop up in right-wing commentary every now and then and I can't tell if it's intended as an insult or if people are just stupid.

options not mutually exclusive obviously...

it was a Bob Dole usage from his '76 veep debate ("Democrat wars")

its an intended insult

ah, didn't know about the Dole connection. I suspected there was a substantial history to it, seems like it's trotted out like a dumb in-joke. I just don't really get why it's an insult? is the implication supposed to be that they aren't actually democratic (har har)...?

older than Dole, it seems... McCarthy too

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democrat_Party_(epithet)

or is it just "we don't respect you enough to call you by your correct name"

xp

its just tweaking them via using the wrong name, tho there may be some aspect of reclaiming 'democratic', its kind funny for its utter pettiness

yep

"They aren't really 'democratic'."

it's the same thing as dook vs. tar holes

every time I see it I feel like the author is going "DO U SEE WHAT I DID THERE?" *nudge nudge* in this really ridiculous way

ya its childish

thats why i call them all REPUBLICRATS

oh no you dint

I call them dickwads

Huh. It's been going on longer than I thought. I thought it started with Frank Luntz, who focus group tested "democrat"

http://www.newyorker.com/archive/2006/08/07/060807ta_talk_hertzberg

Republic Party just doesn't have the same sting

'publican party'

pronounced "pubblecan party"

scott brown showed up and complained it was a sausage party iirc

Guys it's RETHUGLICANS

reHUGlicans more like

rethuglicans sounds like a frank miller gang

rehuglicans sounds like a tattoo on a white rasta dude

this guy is hilarious:

"The goal is to try and fill the void that is the middle," LaTourette, who resigned from Congress this year, said. "The American political system is like a doughnut: You've got sides, but you don't have anything in the middle, and it would be my goal to work with Republicans and Democrats who want to find the path forward to getting things done and compromise."

In a statement released Tuesday afternoon, LaTourette added: “While we have changed our name, we have not changed our values or our mission. We will continue to be a right of center organization and continue to represent the governing wing of the Republican Party."

in other words our goal is to make the center right-wing

it already is, if you replace "center" with "mid-point"

well sure. "more" right-wing then.

Haven't read this (and sorry if it's linked elsewhere), but the title sure is funny:

http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/337076/how-romney-could-have-won-katrina-trinko

"How Romney Could Have Won Katrina Trinko"

If votes in every state were awarded by congressional district, President-elect Romney would be planning his inauguration right now.

According to the Cook Political Report, Mitt Romney won roughly about 52 percent of the congressional districts.

http://sfcitizen.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/how-about-no-bear.jpg

I love how her basic thesis is, we need to find a way to win without getting an actual majority of votes.

If votes in every state were awarded by congressional district, President-elect Romney would be planning his inauguration right now.

According to the Cook Political Report, Mitt Romney won roughly about 52 percent of the congressional districts.

Hello gerrymandering!

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BALVc4jCIAA7i5v.jpg

no

Only insofar as they are spending the former on the latter.

So, in both cases, not at all?

That ad might sway me more if it pictured an actual, y'know, deer hunting rifle or something, rather than whatever the fuck gun that eagle is so proudly owning there.

I wonder how many gun owners wish the government would stay out of their hunting lives and let them shoot eagles?

oh that's just a paper shooting rifle, what's the big deal

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BALXBqACMAEUf0f.jpg

how can you NOT support #mintthecoin

sinking the titanic isn't really that impressive a feat tbh

serious question: where was the $1 trillion coin idea the last time the debt limit thing reared its ugly head? everyone was talking about it then, the options, the 14th amendment, the consequences of inaction, how long could we actually continue without defaulting...but this year, the platinum coin is part of the mix?

there was an election last time

whoever made that facebook image is going to shit their pants when they find out that the value of OTHER coins doesn't match up with the actual market value of the metal! there are going to be literally dozens of facebook shares

it was mentioned as feasible, but not by important people like paul krugman and max

the platinum coin thing isn't really part of the mix, regardless

xpost

you mean you think they considered the coin idea, but didn't mention it to avoid triggering the idiotic rage of the conservative horde ?

sinking the titanic isn't really that impressive a feat tbh

― mookieproof, Wednesday, January 9, 2013 11:09 AM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Seriously, the human race is 1-for-1 on Titanic sinkings. I like those odds.

i thought yglesias made a really strong case for it on slate yesterday xxp

sinking the titanic isn't really that impressive a feat tbh

― mookieproof, Wednesday, January 9, 2013 10:09 AM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lolled

i don't know that obama considered the coin idea (surely not, actually, in his thirst for compromise) but bloggers did mention it over the summer, that's all

it wouldn't just trigger the idiotic rage of the conservative horde, 'obama is making one trillion dollars worth of coins' would be in the news for weeks - because it's an absurd idea and absurd ideas make news

#mintthecoin only forestalls the debt ceiling increase anyway. it doesn't solve anything.

#mintmorecoins

but my absurd idea reversing the conventions of birthdays so that people are required to give gifts to everyone ELSE on their birthdays rather than receiving them never makes the news. even though there are so many benefits to the change: you only have to worry about gifts and birthdays once a year, and you'd also be receiving gifts from friends (on their birthdays) throughout the year, rather than on a single day. it might also gradually make people a little less selfish and self-centered.

but anyway, agreed that it would make the news, but if it actually came down to the day where we were about to default on interest payments and people were worried about an economic meltdown, i think it might be preferable to mint the coin, pay the interest and incur the wrath of the idiotic horde for a few weeks.

i think if you're skeptical of the idea this is worth looking at: http://www.slate.com/articles/business/moneybox/2013/01/_1_trillion_platinum_coin_the_debt_ceiling_standoff_can_be_averted_with.html

it would be disastrous for a lot of reasons, but the white house has no reason to shut down bloggers etc talking about it cause 'we have other options' is a better bargaining position

is it?? the whole thing lets the house GOP off the hook!

mike konczal suggest multiple $20 billion coins http://www.nextnewdeal.net/rortybomb/should-president-obama-announce-no-prioritizing-payments-debt-ceiling-or-start-minting

I'm going to be honest - to my own ignorance, I don't really understand how the debt ceiling thing is debatable. Am I not understanding correctly that Congressional spending was approved, they approved spending past the debt limit, but now don't want to pay for it? (And/or using this is an excuse to cut other things?)

i think it's a great idea. even better idea is obama letting GOP close the platinum loophole in exchange for reforming debt raising procedure.

That is exactly correct.

xpost

That .jpg somewhat misses the point.

(assuming it even works like they say it will w/o a hitch) "you get your money, the gov't doesn't close, we get to not vote on the debt ceiling AND call you a currency debaser and fascist"

is it?? the whole thing lets the house GOP off the hook!

only if there isn't a compromise and obama uses some nuclear option. but that's almost certainly not going to happen, so it doesn't let them off the hook. the fact that nuclear options 'exist' just shifts the bargaining line.

To Moodles: wow, evil!

For what it's worth, I'm pretty sure that someone who loses their job in a different hemisphere due to debt limit shenanigans doesn't really care about whether or not the GOP comes out of this looking bad or incredibly bad.

but i suppose politics is never really concerned with what normal people think

i love that this trillion dollar coin is even being discussed at all. i hope it happens, it'll be a great moment in dysfunctional us political history. "obama rushes to the federal reserve with 1 trillion dollar coin in hand to avert national disaster."

the gop is going to look terrible regardless, if the white house starts pulling shit like this the world / markets are going to see both sides of american politics and our institutions as irredeemably broken. everyone knows the gop is crazy and is going to continue pulling crazy shit. if the white house joins in, we start to look like a failed state and get to borrow money at failed state rates etc etc. it's all image, but so is everything.

still better than default

this is why the united states will never (or at least not any time soon) be a failed state no matter how dysfunctional republicans are or how many platinum coins we print up

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/carriers.gif

also the fact that we're a huge country w/ huge natural + human resources. thinking we're a platinum coin away from being a failed state is as silly as right-wingers threatening that we're going to become greece soon. just total misunderstanding of how world economy operates.

the platinum coin is basically as bad as default because we enter a world where the markets cannot predict what's going to happen at any level of american politics

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Roman_legions

xp

i didn't say the united states would be successful forever, but i think it looks promising going into the near somewhat-predictable future

the markets can predict that the us won't default on its financial obligations for the next four years tho

also, this isn't going to freak out the markets bc it's not a total breakdown in how us economy works, just a patch on a stupid debt ceiling problem. if anything this will resolve the major uncertainty currently plaguing the markets. no one is going to be like "ohmygod platinum coin what's next??" it's such a highly specific bizarre loophole based on such a weird piece of legislation.

trillion dollar coin is pretty embarrasing, tbh. the very fact that this is something even kruggman and co. are supporting is o_O. might as well legalize pot so we can enjoy the batshittery the way it's meant to be.

well yeah, i agree with that! (re america's non-collapse)

the big magical question is what confluence of events will start to change GOP behavior. what will it be that finally sinks in?

xp

speaking of: my state senator introduced this legislation! (i voted for him last november!) http://www.capwiz.com/norml2/issues/alert/?alertid=62324266 xp

It’s so absurd that it’s bound to prompt a backlash. Rep. Greg Walden (R-Ore.) is already talking about a bill that would close the platinum loophole. It’s a perfectly reasonable idea, and the Obama administration should be happy to agree to do it. If, that is, Congress agrees to close the loophole that lets it pass tax and spending bills that make a budget deficit necessary and then refuse to allow the borrowing to finance that deficit. In other words, kill the loophole in exchange for eliminating the statutory debt ceiling. In the future, the government will spend what Congress tells it to spend and collect the taxes Congress tells it to collect and rely on borrowing rather than platinum to fill the gap. That’s how it ought to work, and it’s how it has worked in practice for decades. Turning the gap into a forum for high-stakes legislative brinksmanship was a terrible idea. But now that it’s happened, we can’t just exhort congressional Republicans to start being nicer. We need concrete action, and silly-sounding though it may be, the platinum coin fits the bill.

some 420th dimension chess there, but very intersting

how can other markets trust us when they see that our head of state has to rush to the bank to deposit a specially-crafted platinum coin to skirt our other main party's intransigence? this is like something you'd read about in a newly formed government or something. forecasts say: america's in a weird fucking place right now.

the markets can predict that the us won't default on its financial obligations for the next four years tho

right but at the cost of a total breakdown of us politics, which affects everything else in the american economy

also, this isn't going to freak out the markets bc it's not a total breakdown in how us economy works, just a patch on a stupid debt ceiling problem.

the us economy is enmeshed with us politics. and it's a total breakdown in how us politics works because it's very clearly the president trying to 'cheat' congress.

the 14th amendment is a much better nuclear option, even tho it's less of a sure thing.

thing abt the platinum coin is republicans are just gonna cave on the debt ceiling and everyone knows it, so its kinda irrelevant, there will be some negotiations but that has really more to do w/the sequester, although itll be reported as debt ceiling negotiations

another thing to remember is obama wants to cut entitlements, as do the republicans, of course both sides want the other side to take responsibility for doing that, the debt ceiling gives them cover to work together on the important non existant problem of long term social security solvency

iatee, my point is no one is going to be like "oh my god Obama circumvented lunatic republican house america is doomed" -- markets are already super troubled by lunatic republican house. this is a band-aid for an already existing problem - no one is going to suddenly figure out that the house is a disaster after the coin is minted. if anything they'll be reassured that the united states executive branch has enough latitude to compensate for house hostage taking

i don't know that obama wants to cut entitlements - i think he's just very willing to cut them for a compromise, but i doubt we'd be discussing cutting entitlements w/ a dem house.

the markets and international opinion (for better or worse) rest on the consensus of the US political system. the coin gets us further away from consensus. running the government on money created via dubious legality is nagl -- despite what the eggheads say, if half the country says it's illegal that's dubious enough

i mean, iow sadly we kind of have to let congress do its thing.

the platinum coins presents perception problem in that it looks ridiculous, p sure it would be a total media shitstorm if it happened which its not gonna

it's not dubious legality. it's based on a law passed by the republican party that works in a way they didn't anticipate.

i don't know that obama wants to cut entitlements - i think he's just very willing to cut them for a compromise, but i doubt we'd be discussing cutting entitlements w/ a dem house.

― Mordy, Wednesday, January 9, 2013 11:56 AM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah who knows whats in the mans heart but he has repeatedly put it on the table and used the language of a deficit hawk so im just gonna take him at his word, and fwiw its v much in line w the rest of his level headed centrist policies

iatee, my point is no one is going to be like "oh my god Obama circumvented lunatic republican house america is doomed" -- markets are already super troubled by lunatic republican house. this is a band-aid for an already existing problem - no one is going to suddenly figure out that the house is a disaster after the coin is minted. if anything they'll be reassured that the united states executive branch has enough latitude to compensate for house hostage taking

markets have already priced in the lunatic republican party, when the band-aid is 'the other part also starts acting erratically and american politics gets even more crazy than it already was, which was pretty fucking crazy' then you have a crappy bandaid

this isn't erratic tho! it sounds silly but it's legal, it fixes a serious economic problem (not defaulting), and doesn't have unrelated unexpected consequences

in other news, ortho mot jack lew rumored to be next treasury sec

right, if you look at this one single action in a vacuum and pretend that politics doesn't exist

im kinda skeptical of but what will the markets think reasoning, it never seems to play out, its more of a bad idea from a pr stand point imho, i mean dont get me wrong its an amazing idea, but

but w/e its just unnecessary, republicans are gonna cave

you haven't adequately explained imo what the political considerations are here that will rock the economy. i understand that there is a conservative impulse not to do anything wild for fear of rocking the boat, but the boat is already rocking, this is a great fix, and the negatively consequences are imho vastly outweighed by the positive ones xxp

'the boat is already rocking' is like 'the american economy is already growing'. this would make the boat rock more than it is rocking right now and would affect every single negotation (or lackthereof) w/ congress in the next 4 years.

it's not dubious legality. it's based on a law passed by the republican party that works in a way they didn't anticipate.

― Mordy, Wednesday, January 9, 2013 10:57 AM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

the day of the coin's deposit, i can just see it: the entire GOP from arnold to sherriff joe to krauthammer to congresswoman bachmann to gavin mcinnes to your golfing uncle just kind of shrug and chuckle and say, "boy, guess there's nothing we can do about this"

OMFG just read that that titanic macro was created by the NRCC!!!

disband the country, platinum coins for everyone, free wifi for the uninsured

the markets will do what they think will make them money; i really doubt that the coin scenario would make everyone pull out of their american investments or whatever -- it's not like the underlying state of the american economy would be any different

yes, it will

politics is a huge aspect of the underlying state of the american economy!

they might go galt tho, makes u think

good thing i already fired my employees because o was reëlected

some 420th dimension chess there, but very intersting

― Z S, 9. januar 2013 17:47 (27 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

'420th dimension chess' is such a great expression! Title of next thread?

It's regular chess, but you're stoned, right?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/08/call-time-congressional-fundraising_n_2427291.html

jesus that's depressing

i heard a whole hour once on npr abt the v topic of time spent fundraising and they interviewed all these congresspeople and they all just hate it, but of course they wont save themselves by passing legislation to stop it because they got where they are by being good at fundraising

its kind of sad they have to spend hours in these dreary cramped call centers set up by the parties cause theyre not allowed to fundraise from their gov offices

all the lobbyists were like the biggest misconception about washington is that were always trying to weasel our way into congressional politics, they call us!

it also explains the incentive to become a cable news yahoo -- getting your name out there makes the money come to you

plus getting to goon cable more has to be like getting to run around at recess while everyone else is inside cleaning the erasers or whatever

the lobbyists were all a lot of the time you want to be like i just set up a fundraiser for you last week but you cant really afford to get ont heir shit list so you do it again and you call yr connections like congressman soandso wants more money and hes all again wtf i just gave that guy 10k last week ok i guess if i have to

one thing that I find sad is how small the figures really are in 'the big picture'

and then theres often literally a basket at the door where you put yr check, and then you get to talk to the congressperson abt yr project and even then she doesnt necessarily vote for it, but if you stop giving youre out of sight out of mind

like if they were hustling for millions of dollars w/ those calls it would be more respectable but campaign money is really small ball compared to business money

the day of the coin's deposit, i can just see it: the entire GOP from arnold to sherriff joe to krauthammer to congresswoman bachmann to gavin mcinnes to your golfing uncle just kind of shrug and chuckle and say, "boy, guess there's nothing we can do about this"

there are lots of reasons to oppose a last resort plan to avoid default by issuing a coin, but avoiding upsetting people who make their careers by being upset about the stupidest things is not one of them. they will be outraged about something no matter what, and your stupid uncle and my stupid dad will believe them. that doesn't mean that brain stem-level outrage should influence the decision in any way whatsoever.

yeah people think that it's a lot more quid pro quo than it is

xp

everyone hates it but theyre addicted to it too cause its the source of their power

its really much more of a chummy gift economy than quid pro quo, tho obvs its not hard to find examples of buying particular votes if you look

there are lots of reasons to oppose a last resort plan to avoid default by issuing a coin, but avoiding upsetting people who make their careers by being upset about the stupidest things is not one of them. they will be outraged about something no matter what, and your stupid uncle and my stupid dad will believe them. that doesn't mean that brain stem-level outrage should influence the decision in any way whatsoever.

that they make their careers being upset is kinda the point, like do you think bachmann types 'lose' if this happens

and every minute a congressperson spends talking to an oil exec is a minute hes not talking to a constituent, which results in a p warped social scene/worldview

how shall we make bachmann types 'lose'

they'll always win at some level because they prey on the inexhaustible resource of stupidity.

also the congressperson is a total idiot who knows nothing about energy cause he's some lawyer from a small town in indiana or whatever so the oil exec and his lobbyist friends get to teach the congressperson about energy etc. rather than 'tell him how to vote'

xp

they will always exist but pulling crazy stunts is probably going to make more of them exist, making the gop pay for its own crazy stunts and forcing its hand helps alienate the crazies. eg what happened w/ the fiscal cliff.

no one knows everything a congressperson needs to know so its not necessarily idiocy, but you do get to pick who you learn from, or more realistically who you outsource yr policy to

someone should do a very scientific study on the ratio of crazies to norms over the last 100 years. i suspect the crazies get more prevalent every year regardless of what happens in real life

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/images/1-9-13-drudge-sg.jpg

glad drudge is largely irrelevant now so we can just lol at him

needs sirens

no one knows everything a congressperson needs to know so its not necessarily idiocy

a lot of them are fundamentally stupid people too

stupid like a fox

http://my.firedoglake.com/nsolomon/2013/01/08/the-progressive-caucus-enabling-obamas-rightward-moves/

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/01/09/five-facts-you-need-to-know-about-jack-lew/

that and his signature is goofy, apparently

xpost haven't read it, but here's a version of curmudgeon's link that works:

http://firedoglake.com/2013/01/09/the-progressive-caucus-enabling-obamas-rightward-moves/

that and his signature is goofy, apparently

I wonder why the Sec. of Treasury signs the currency when it's the Federal Reserve that actually has the authority to print it.

that's a good premise for an explainer column i'd never read

Adam Serwer: it's impossible to make a case against John Brennan that isn't also a case against Barack Obama.

The U.S. Treasury is in charge of the U.S. Mint, which is the agency which creates both coins and paper bills. The Federal Reserve has oversight of the banking system, which is the system that really "creates" money; it's just that most of the money that exists doesn't exist as coins or paper bills, but as government debt or bank debt. The cash supply is a small component of "money" and physical coins and bills are a small cmoponent of "cash".

More dirt on the fiscal deal:

But there were good reasons to believe the endgame would play out the way Reid envisioned. Reid’s model was the payroll tax cut fight of late 2011, when he and McConnell struck a deal to renew the tax cut for two months because they couldn’t agree on how to pay for a year-long extension. The deal passed the Senate overwhelmingly, at which point conservatives in the House revolted. For a day or two, the outcome looked uncertain—polls showed the public favored the tax cut, but the House had dug in. At that point, Obama suggested to Reid that they reopen the negotiations, but Reid, according to the Senate aide, told him, “Don’t you dare.” Democrats held the line, and the House GOP abruptly folded. When all was said and done, Democrats got an even better deal than they’d hoped for. The Republicans were so eager to put the episode behind them they dropped their insistence that the tax-cut extension be offset with spending cuts.

Long story short: Reid’s strategy would have at worst produced a slightly better deal than Biden negotiated had McConnell accepted his final offer before the cliff (a slightly lower threshold for the new top income tax rate and a one-year suspension of the sequester rather than a two-month suspension). At best it could have produced significantly more revenue (closer to a $300,000 threshold) had we briefly gone over. But Reid never got the chance to execute it. “Their guys were running around asking to be forced to vote for this so they could move on,” says the Senate aide of the GOP. “Everything Republicans were doing signaled weakness and desperation for a deal. Unfortunately, everything out of the White House did, too.”

Weakness all the way around seems like a pretty good description of the current state of US politics. Even the SCOTUS is weak atm, with its constant 5-4 splits and its huge loss of prestige over Gore vs. Bush.

The U.S. Treasury is in charge of the U.S. Mint, which is the agency which creates both coins and paper bills.

Well, the Bureau of Engraving and Printing actually produces the bills, but that's part of the Treasury Dept. too, so point taken. I love the BEP's URL by the way:

http://www.moneyfactory.gov/

Still it's the Fed that orders the bills from the BEP - they are formally known as Federal Reserve Notes after all. So I guess the Treasury Secretary signing the bills is sort of like his vouching for the quality of the print job, rather than any implication that they were issued under his authority.

Still it's the Fed that orders the bills from the BEP

i know after getting fergie on board these guys are huge but shit

“Their guys were running around asking to be forced to vote for this so they could move on,” says the Senate aide of the GOP. “Everything Republicans were doing signaled weakness and desperation for a deal. Unfortunately, everything out of the White House did, too.”

― the little prince of inane false binary hype (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, January 9, 2013 4:43 PM (14 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

this is so silly, they looked weak we couldve had em, totally ignores the fact that the white house got something they wanted out of the deal that wasnt included in this hypothetical senate deal, which is to not have the high stakes post fiscal cliff showdown, and fwiw the country did briefly go over the fiscal cliff

Treasury Sec's signature is on the money to show his glowing approval of its existance and also to implicate him in the crime.

fwiw the country did briefly go over the fiscal cliff

Enough that my first paycheck of the year (which I just got) reflects Clinton-era tax rates. They tell us we'll get the difference back next time. But it's instructive to see how relatively little it is for a moderate-income American like me. So much howling and yowling, but if this was my new tax rate, I'd make a few small adjustments and wouldn't even notice it a few months out.

The composite image, NASA notes, was generated from a series of satellite images taken over 22 days in April and October 2012. The fires were not all burning at once.

oh, shit, well still

Anyone else catch the signature of Obama's proposed Treasury secretary?

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2013/01/09/business/economy/econonix-09Lewcurl1/econonix-09Lewcurl1-blog480-v2.jpg

Dollar bills goin' go all scribbly.

xpost whoops wrong thread lol

It's not!

http://economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/01/09/a-new-scribble-on-your-dollar-bill/?hp

awesome

Really funny that some people are getting upset about this.

such an all time classic signature

Signaturegate

this is a throwback to a few days back, but did the sandy bill have much pork on it? any reliable links that would argue no? because i thought no, but am arguing with a stranger on the internet about it (i know, i know) and they've linked to an opinion piece arguing that there is. i'm sure i read a bunch of pieces at the time saying there wasn't, but... has that changed?

There should be a double whammy of a trillion dollar coin minted with that guy's signature on it. When they dig up that massive platinum disc in the future and see the sig and the value, they'll think we were all bonkers. Well, even more bonkers.

but did the sandy bill have much pork on it?

not sure where they're hiding it

front: obama; back: jack lew signature

every age gets the treasury signature it deserves

bloomberg and republicans on pork and sandy: http://politicker.com/2013/01/mayor-bloomberg-criticizes-pork-in-sandy-relief-package/

au contraire, says Schumer: http://www.nypost.com/p/news/opinion/letters/pork_free_sandy_aid_4qRAitAJjpsnFedrz1kYnM

The main reason that New York and New Jersey got (insufficient) relief 9 weeks after Sandy is that programs like FEMA are chronically underfunded.

Complaints about pork to fisheries: a red-herring.

doesnt even makes sense pork to fish think abt it

I'm all for this if they make the coin huge and prominently displayed in the White House like the giant penny in the Batcave

or scrooge mcduck's lucky number one dime

London already beat us to it: http://www.coinlink.com/News/world-coins/giant-pound-coin-in-potters-fields-to-promote-people’s-50-million/

They should make the coin 20 feet tall then roll it around the country on display through like a roving civics lesson. Of course, people would probably shoot at it.

Like the gong in "Temple of Doom."

http://static4.businessinsider.com/image/4ffdd0ae69beddf16c000016-400-300/penny-plunderer.jpg

I hope this guy is eaten by crocodiles.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_GGAg16fJ8nA/TGr4MVtMalI/AAAAAAAAA2E/pK-Oga1bdRQ/s1600/temple_death.jpg

Fact: I have caught fish with pork.

http://www.wildflorida.com/wildlife/fish/images/PigfishWhole463.jpg

Pigfish

Sure hope he's right.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/100367675

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2013/01/filibuster_reform_republican_attacks_on_barack_obama_s_nominees_is_making.2.html

if you wanted to convince moderate senators that the republican party is totally irresponsible and they should vote for filibuster reform, getting them to threaten stopping a fellow republican like hagel's confirmation is not a bad way to do it. not that i necessarily think that was obama's reason for going with hagel, but if the only thing hagel accomplishes is helping filibuster reform pass, it'll be a worthwhile appointment.

interesting!

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2013/01/the-wild-origins-of-the-trillion-dollar-platinum-coin.php

Its origin can be traced back to the comments section of a blog.

lol the world

Krugman: platinum coins might be silly but so is the GOP.

a+ sleuthing from brian beutler

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/01/10/mr-president-dont-mint-that-platinum-coin/

It is likelier that the platinum coin would drive the Republican Party towards a much more dangerous and enduring standoff. If Republicans never permitted another debt increase, would we just keep minting platinum coins? Would the Federal Reserve abet the strategy and work to hold down inflation, effectively putting itself in the middle of a titanic political fight? Would the market eventually begin to panic because American governance has entered into unknown territory?

There are two ways to truly resolve the debt-ceiling standoff. One is that the Republican Party needs to break, proving to itself and to the country that the adults remain in charge. The other is that America is pushed into default and voters -- and the world -- reckon with what we've become, and what needs to be done about it. Sadly, there's no easy way out. It's heads America wins, tails America loses.

plz let congress impeach obama.

seems kinda unlikely what w the democrat controlled senate and all

they can still impeach him. senate will just reject the charges and he'll remain in office

Bill Clinton, 42nd President of the United States, was impeached by the House of Representatives on two charges, one of perjury and one of obstruction of justice, on December 19, 1998. Two other impeachment articles, a second perjury charge and a charge of abuse of power, failed in the House. The charges arose from the Lewinsky scandal and the Paula Jones lawsuit.

He was acquitted by the Senate on February 12, 1999. Requiring a two-thirds majority for a conviction, only 50 senators (out of 100) voted guilty on the obstruction charge and 45 on the perjury charge. The Senate was 17 votes short of removing Clinton from office .[1]

And the next midterm elections were very bad for the Republicans.

they can still impeach him. senate will just reject the charges and he'll remain in office

― Mordy, Friday, January 11, 2013 12:05 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah its just like why bother

symbolic victory for House against socialist Muslim Kenyan!!!!!

it makes about as much sense as the rest of the republican platform

they do love their symbolism

and nonsense

http://25.media.tumblr.com/c07e5395fc8b0a35f5460494aea219ad/tumblr_mgc13aURp81qjvsoxo1_250.gif

ha

It's heads America wins, tails America loses.

I really hope they just make a made-for-TV movie about this coin, how some criminal mastermind breaks into the mint and steals it after it's minted, and some 80s action movie star has to get it back and deposit it before the Fiscal Cliff 2 or whatever.

they already made a simpsons episode bout it

If the coin were stolen could the treasury dept just declare it valueless?

the coin probably won't exist anyway except as a theoretical coin

well it also wouldn't really be a problem because it would be really hard to spend

if they do this they have to mint the coin otherwise i will be so upset

it would make a provocative photo op

first you'd need a guy who can launder a trillion-dollar coin

they should put it on a chain and Geithner should wear it around the office Flavor Flav style

i would just keep it and stare at it

Geithner?

video of obama sauntering over to the fed, searching his suit pockets for a coin (it's in the inside pocket for sure), flipping it in the air nonchalantly to bernanke and walkin off "that's a tril, send me the receipt'

Geithner?

― the little prince of inane false binary hype (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, January 11, 2013 1:58 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i would make jeans out of his skin

http://rense.com/general83/maurice-greenberg.jpg

Has anyone brought up how kind of awesome it is that AIG suing the gov't for not getting enough money is being spearheaded by this guy that look exactly like a real-life version of Mr. Burns?

DJP wins

aig fwiw decid toed not sue, but i mean even the fact that they were considering it

http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/ten-miles-square/2013/01/biden_hugs_deals_way_back_to_w042302.php

So the White House shoved Reid out of the way to have Biden negotiate with McConnell and craft a fiscal cliff deal that was arguably not as good as Dems could get; and now Biden is out in front on the gun issue; so by Washington standards and surprisingly Ezra Klein's too, he's the mythic bipartisan politician who can bring us all together.

i am skeptical of this hypothetical better fiscal cliff deal, we did briefly discuss it upthread a lil tho

You, various other and the White House thought this was the best we could get on income, estate, and capital gains, while others(Robert Reich, bloggers like Digby, and me and others) thought we could get better; and some are just skeptical of Reid's negotiating strategy as well.

George Will's interpretation of where we stand now is interesting:

Those temporary rates were enacted in 2001, when only 28 House Democrats supported them, and in 2003, when only seven did. But with the “American Taxpayer Relief Act of 2012” — did liberals think about that title? — 172 House Democrats voted to make the Bush income-tax rates permanent for all but 0.7 percent of taxpayers — individuals earning more than $400,000 and couples earning more than $450,000.

Liberals could have had a revenue increase of $3.7 trillion over 10 years. Instead, they surrendered nearly $3.1 trillion of that. They cannot have repeated bites at this apple. They cannot now increase government revenue as a share of gross domestic product through tax reform because Republicans insist that the Taxpayer Relief Act closed the revenue question. And because tax reform is dead for the foreseeable future, so are hopes for a revenue surge produced by vigorous economic growth.

I think his description of income tax rates is accurate. But its funny to see he and all Republicans now saying that tax reform via closing loopholes or making any other tax changes to raise revenues is dead, because part 1 of the fiscal cliff has been done, and therefore we can only discuss spending cuts right now. However, if Obama and the Dems propose further tax reform, and Republicans say they only want spending cuts but no tax reform, I hope that will scuttle Obama's grand bargain part 2 of giving them Social Security and Medicare cuts.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/george-f-will-time-for-a-balanced-budget-amendment/2013/01/09/6ecf85ec-59d5-11e2-9fa9-5fbdc9530eb9_story.html

omg, the balanced budget amendment struggles to rise from the ashes once more.

Kill the Cayman Islands tax loophole if you want to tax revenue.

some tax revenue

About those payroll tax cuts

better link:

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/2013/01/feeling_the_pinch.php?ref=fpblg

There did seem to be a certain cluelessness about the handling of the payroll tax change back. I guess Morbs and others would say its not surprising and that the White House just doesn't care

But it hurts their message indeed; especially since they didn't push harder on capital gains or the estate tax.

haha whoops!

the gop just keeps digging their grave deeper and deeper....

http://firstread.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/01/11/16465141-gop-congressman-akins-rape-comments-were-partly-right?lite

I don't think they're in a grave just yet

there's a whole lotta nadir left to come, as Gore Vidal used to say

xp not in a grave yet, but they'll quickly wind up there if they keep up with those Akin/Mourdock/Santorum/Bachmann/et al. attitudes

agree the admin needs to push to reinstate the payroll tax holiday, they put a lot of emphasis on getting it in the first place so im not sure why they were happy to let it expire, i mean i have a theory and its yr typical srs people deficit reduction bullshit

im sure theyre just thinking the economy is in good enough shape to go back to the old rate

http://prospect.org/article/jack-lew-best-we-can-do

A close ally of Robert Rubin, Lew followed Rubin to Citigroup in 2000, where he was made chief operating officer of Citi’s Alternative Investments Group—its hedge funds. He was not involved in trading or financial strategy. It was mainly a chance for a skilled public manager to make himself some money until the Democrats returned to power. Lew received a bonus of $950,000 when he rejoined government in 2009—cynics would say it was Citi’s investment in getting its phone calls returned.

cool job

cynics Citi would say it was Citi’s investment in getting its phone calls returned.

isn't it time Bill Kristol died?

“I’d much prefer a secretary of defense who was a more mainstream internationalist — not a guy obsessed by how the United States uses its power and would always err on the side of not intervening,” he added

haha classic

not a guy obsessed by how the United States uses its power and would always err on the side of not intervening

i shudder to remember all the many horrible instances when the united states erred on the side of not intervening

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rwandan_Genocide

yes but remember all those awesome times we intervened and it worked out great for everyone, like Korea and Vietnam and Cambodia and Nicaragua and Cuba and all those other awesome democracy-spreading interventions?

i don't disagree that the united states has been involved in some pretty horrendous, poorly designed and poorly motivated interventions. i can just also think of numerous instances when non-intervention (militarily or otherwise) led to horrible instances. even if you tend towards non-intervention, isolationism, etc you have to be pretty cynical to say, eg, gaddafi should've been allowed to destroy benghazi, or slobo continue to commit genocide (similarly it's hard to condemn france for intervening in Mali - despite concerns of francafrique policy - when they are stopping extreme humanitarian crimes). and i'm sure there are plenty of syrians who would prefer more western involvement in their affairs atm.

Until we do it, then they'll hate us forever.

too bad we can't intervene at cuddlestein mountain

squee!

Korea and Vietnam and Cambodia and Nicaragua and Cuba and all those other awesome democracy-spreading interventions?

― Frobisher the (Viceroy), Sunday, 13 January 2013 20:50 (27 minutes ago)

none of these were conceived of as 'humanitarian interventions' in any more than an ancillary way

the whole stopping communism thing was obv very ideologically immature. i can certainly understand why you wouldn't want to be bffs w/ stalin + mao but some of those anti-communist interventions don't even make sense from a realpolitik pov.

they make sense from a 'kill as many communists or at least noncapitalists as possible without employing nuclear weapons' pov

obv the turn communists into capitalisms jujitsu is much more clever

an intervention is still an intervention, justifying cuba et al with some excuse other than a humanitarian one doesn't render it any less so.

even if you tend towards non-intervention, isolationism, etc you have to be pretty cynical to say, eg, gaddafi should've been allowed to destroy benghazi, or slobo continue to commit genocide

before congratulating ourselves on our good intentions it's worth remembering that both of these interventions arguably made matters worse.

i'd be interested in reading such an argument

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/mar/21/kosovo-template-for-disaster-libya

so the argument is:
1. albanians were just as bad as serbians so no point stopping the serbians
2. serbians were angry they couldn't stop nato so they ramped up the killings and
3. we can't afford to be committed to regime changes if they involve multiyear troop commitments

#1 is silly (you're never intervening to save saints from villains - you're generally trying to stop violent cycles between multiple militant groups from impacting civilians), #3 is inexact (we didn't commit a particularly robust ground force to kosovo or to libya - tho i guess we did stock that consulate w/ CIA) - #2 is whatever. were the killings ramped up bc we bombed? should we not intervene bc the ppl committing genocide might ramp up the killings? that's some sudeten bullshit. lots of genocides increased despite no western interference - look at how syria has become progressively more deadly without any nato bombing campaign. if nato had bombed sometime in november and the murders had continued someone would be blaming assad frustration on nato too. meanwhile who knows how many deaths could be prevented by not giving assad's Mi-25 gunships free purchase in the skies?

i'm happy to see tho that greenwald is happily condemning france's involvement in mali:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jan/14/mali-france-bombing-intervention-libya

Y'all remember Aqua Buddha, right?

http://media.zenfs.com/en/blogs/theticket/RandPaulDeadSea.jpg

"Hey, guys, I'll be the watermelon!"

There's something about an Aqua Buddha man.

same ol same ol: Just saw Dana Bash and Gloria Borger on CNN saying that if only Obama socialized and had dinner more with Republicans that would make things better. They did not respond to Obama's contention at a press conference that his golf matches with Boehner in the past did not lead to a grand bargain. He also said he's a friendly guy who likes parties!

Thought that clip was really funny, especially when he started talking about his daughters getting older and having no time for him anywhere, so maybe he'll need Republican house members to come over and play cards with him and keep him company. He seemed to be 23% serious.

"anymore"

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/01/14/the-best-donald-trump-tweet-ever/

favorited by stalin, no less

I like this:

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/slacktivist/2013/01/15/who-should-pray-at-the-inauguration-how-about-nobody/

Gets into the tribalism aspect of the Inaugural Benediction part, and points out that anybody who would be acceptable to the evangelical romney voters would be rejected by non-assholes, because nobody accept to everybody else would hate gay people loudly enough to be acceptable to the conservative types the President is trying to reach out to again.

Also points out that having religious services of a secular govt is stupid and damaging.

They should keep it neutral by making it a Scientologist ceremony

The swearing-in should be in the form of a Whole Track Security Check.

thinking of starting a blog that summarizes David Taintor's (TPM) coverage of Stewart and Colbert.

he sums up the best bit from each episode so that you don't have to watch, and then once a week or so i aggregate the best bits of his summaries into one post so that you don't have to read his articles

Hagel secures key senator's support by vowing to do 'whatever it takes' on Iran
New York Senator Charles Schumer says 'prepared to vote' for confirmation of Hagel as Secretary of Defense, removing major obstacle in Senate.

who wouldve thought a democratic senator would support the president nominee

i'm more interested in the things hagel has felt forced to say to get that democratic support

"we will drop a nuke on iran, i will blow bibi personally, sic transit gloria"

"hi, I'm Chuck Hegel"

ya i mean its all just kabuki, dems were always going to support him, he was always gonna say whatever they want, everyone knows he still thinks the same stuff he did before

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/wp/2013/01/15/debt-ceiling-endgame-comes-into-view

Republicans entering the depressive phase after days of megalomania and paranoia.

nah, they're just accidentally sober 5 minutes after waking up. give them time to eat a granola bar and get into their stash again, they'll be back to their old tricks pronto

thing is you only need a fraction of republicans to make it work as described above, then the rest of them are free to throw their lil temper tantrum, which is all they really want anyway

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/01/15/coulter-not-a-gun-problem-u-s-has-demographic-problem-with-non-whites/

dont feed the troll

Someone remind her that the two recent big mass murders were committed by white people.

The clunky attempt to make jokes about "Mitt Romney's book of binders" at the beginning of that video is maybe the most damning part.

On the night of Barack Obama’s inauguration, a group of top GOP luminaries quietly gathered in a Washington steakhouse to lick their wounds and ultimately create the outline of a plan for how to deal with the incoming administration.

“The room was filled. It was a who’s who of ranking members who had at one point been committee chairmen, or in the majority, who now wondered out loud whether they were in the permanent minority,” Frank Luntz, who organized the event, told FRONTLINE.

Among them were Senate power brokers Jim DeMint, Jon Kyl and Tom Coburn, and conservative congressmen Eric Cantor, Kevin McCarthy and Paul Ryan.

After three hours of strategizing, they decided they needed to fight Obama on everything. The new president had no idea what the Republicans were planning.

Tonight’s film, Inside Obama’s Presidency, explores the behind-the-scenes story of his first four years. With inside accounts from his battles with his Republican opponents over health care and the economy to his dramatic expansion of targeted killings of enemies, FRONTLINE examines the president’s key decisions and the experiences that will inform his second term

After three hours of strategizing, they decided they needed to fight Obama on everything. The new president had no idea what the Republicans were planning.

...lol?

http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2013/01/opportunity-cost-playing-nice

If only Obama had offered to do more socializing and golfing with that Luntz organized group before he was even elected, they all could have gotten along and passed a grand bargain or something.

Frank Luntz also meddles in British politics. SO GRATEFUL.

wait i thought obama was too socialist?

Gee! Look who's back, floating the impeachment balloon.

He knows plenty about shadow governments, doesn't he

Given the way the issue is currently positioned in the electorate, Obama had to appear to do something after the Newtown mass killings, but I tend to agree with my brother, who thinks a titanic battle over guns and the Second Amendment would be a horrible waste of energy right now and a monumental distraction from more important issues. Given the rabid single-issue nature of most gun rights voters, it will only be cement them more firmly against the Democrats for another decade. It is a losing issue for liberals.

so was health care, the question is whether its a losing issue that's worth losing for

anything that moves the USA away from fossil fuels is worth a huge fight, imo, losing or otherwise. a few new piddly-ass gun restrictions? fine, if you can get them quickly at low cost.

I agree. More nuclear energy! Less greenhouse gasses! Open up Yucca Mountain! Put more money into researching fusion power!

Also, they recently engineered a bacteria that produces electricity as a waste product or something. That sounds cool.

I guess I only like energy solutions that are dangerous or bizarre.

one year of mandatory giant-hamster-wheel duty for all americans at age 18.

dig immense hole into the mantle, pipe heat into new england during winter

convert all cars to run on grease, replace gas stations with Five Guys

build humongous wall in the ocean to prevent gulf stream from reaching Europe

eat humus

announce offshore wind farms near affluent communities; burn petitions circulated by angry residents as fuel

did we mention the one where we create artificial volcano particles to bounce heat rays back into space?

expel all the jews (all at once, into the upper atmosphere, creating a reflective layer protecting us from the sun)

troubling!

http://ecimages.kobobooks.com/Image.ashx?imageID=4sMoAMOOz0uRt4tg3_rpFw&Type=Full

Silby is the kind of visionary thinker we need, but don't deserve. He's what you might call the "dark knight" of alternative energy.

Charles Pierce on the dumb chorus of Beltway gnomes urging Obama to "socialize" more often:

I really liked Lincoln. Truly, I did. I was entertained for the full two hours plus. I think both James Spader and the great David Straithairn got hosed in the Oscar nominations. But I have a terrible feeling that, within six months, I'm going to hate it purely for its use as a cheap analogical device. First of all, not even the movie is about Lincoln's "schmoozing" anyone except his reluctant Cabinet, and Thaddeus Stevens. It's about Lincoln's subcontracting out the job of buying votes in Congress. Jefferson may have set a good table, and been a lively conversationalist, and hell on the fiddle, but he bought the Louisiana Territory all on his own, and he sent the fleet to deal with the Barbary Pirates and didn't tell the Congress until the fleet was halfway there. And LBJ? A schmoozer? Not until your pecker was firmly in his pocket. Would anyone like to guess the reaction if this current president were to offer a job to get a bill passed, or act as unilaterally as Jefferson did? (Wait, you don't have to guess on the second one. Note the reaction around the country -- even among the Walking Dead -- to the notion that he might use executive orders as part of his gun control strategy.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/01/15/co-ops-were-supposed-to-replace-the-public-option-now-they-are-dead/

White House signing off on fiscal cliff changes that weaken Obamacare

Republicans questioned whether the nonprofit plans would make good on their loans, or go belly-up like the solar panel company Solyndra.

so, are we going to get more gun control now or what

funny that we've hardly talked about it here (though i guess we did beat it to death on the sandy hook thread)

anyway, my answer is no, no we won't.