New Order - Music Complete

Hm and here we go.

https://twitter.com/neworder/status/613030050582134784

Track list:

Restless
Singularity
Plastic
Tutti Frutti
People On The High Line
Stray Dog
Academic
Nothing But A Fool
Unlearn This Hatred
The Game
Superheated

Tutti Frutti

hope this is a silicon teens style cover in honor of their jump to mute

I need to lower my expectations for this but right now I'm really excited.

I'd like this to be like the last Pet Shop Boys album where I can say it's my favourite album by them in forever and really mean it.

ha ha People On The High Line

+ yeah hyped

I'll give it a listen, of course, but I'm not expecting anything Earth-shattering at all.

£65 gets you

Double lp
6 12" singles of extended versions
And a box. Plus download.

I'm sure I'll listen to this at some point, but excitement level is low. Peter Hook has turned out to be a pretty big dick irl, and I'm sure the new NO bassist won't have any trouble mimicking his sound, but I'm pretty sure Hook was integral to how the songs were written and he'll probably be missed.

Even though it's the most cliched opinion to have, I really haven't cared about New Order since Technique. I'm pretty sure I've heard the last three albums, but I couldn't tell you what a single song from any of them sounds like.

I just listened to Krafty and Crystal last week because I couldn't remember how they went. Turns out they're still better than serviceable, but I had no desire to explore the rest of either album.

I went up to Republic before getting off the bus.

Your loss guys

Should I go and see New Order if they play near me? The only time I ever got to see them was Glastonbury 2005 and I remember them being quite rubbish.

There are a bunch of great songs from Get Ready and Waiting For The Sirens Call. The new tracks were the best songs they played on their recent, but short US tour. I'm very excited for this and hopefully the dust-up with Hooky has given Barney some nice venomous lyrics to match the music. Plastic, Stray Dog, Nothing But A Fool, Unlearn This Hatred and Super Heated could all be about the disintegration of their relationship.

Aw, I love Crystal! And side one of Waiting for the Sirens Call. Plus: Return of Gillian! Also last time I saw them live they absolutely killed it.

Get Ready has their best songs since 1989 with their worst production since Brotherhood.

I even heard "Lost Sirens" it was alright, you know..

http://i.imgur.com/YbJo4lJ.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/YbJo4lJ.jpg

love how dorky Steve is on all these promos

Very much worth seeing live, they were great even without Hooky

I'm not sure why people would assume that Hook was more integral to their songs than the other three. If the album turns out to be crap it won't be because Hook didn't play on it.

Steve, Gillian, and Barney have all done great music outside of New Order. Hook's solo stuff has been mostly crap, outside of that one Monaco song with the singer that he pre-programmed to sing EXACTLY like Barney Sumner. From that I'd conclude that Hook misses NO more than vice versa.

Revenge did have a couple of good songs ("Slave", "State of Shock")

Man, the title of this thing, though.

"What shall we call the record?"
*looks at the tracking sheet* "Music complete?"
"Yeah, that'll do."

Man, the artwork of this thing, too.

"What shall we do for the packaging?"
"Well, y'know, that Split Enz album, True Colours?"
"Yeah, that'll do."

Plastic

Here comes love, it's like plastic
It's not stretchy, like elastic

seems like a good ILX pre-cover candidate tbh

I've spent far too much of the day pondering that press shot (without the CSI addition), partly in a "How do I want New Order to present themselves in 2015?" sort of way.

Turrican, I find the comments you're making quite odd considering what a massive OMD fan you are. Music Complete is pretty much on the same level as History of Modern and English Electric. Same with the artwork which is extremely similar to those albums.

I don't.

Its New Order.

First thing I thought of was the OMD cover too. Saville's return to the theme isn't surprising (if this is Saville). The die-cut sleeves of 83 and the flowers from Talking Loud and Clear/PC&L.

I did like those OMD covers and I like the cover for Music Complete too. I much prefer it to the artwork on Get Ready and Siren's Call.

this is the worst album name ever

is it supposed to be a reference to Musique Non-Stop by Kraftwerk?

this is the worst album name ever

are you sure:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_Enemy_discography#Albums

Not a ref to "Music : Response" ?

why is new guy up front in that picture

new songs were ok live

don't expect this to be any better or worse than sirens call or get ready, both of which were eh. fine, they're still great live, even with no hook, if this gets them on the road again I'm happy.

"I really haven't cared about New Order since Technique. I'm pretty sure I've heard the last three albums, but I couldn't tell you what a single song from any of them sounds like."

Even Regret? If nothing else that justifies their not splitting for good after technique; it's probably the best song NO ever did.

I'm tempted to make a "latter-period New Order" playlist to try to change some minds but IIRC most of Republic isn't available on US Spotify so I'd have to leave out "Ruined in a Day"

that's a weird album to leave off. I think there is one great solid album to be culled from those three records.

Republic suffers from an embalmed production that was out of fashion in 1993; it sounds like a Bernard Sumner solo album on which the band was allowed to participate. But the Sumner of 1993 was still writing songs as good as "Regret," "Special," "Times Change," "Ruined in a Day," and "Everyone Everywhere" (the secret highlight, like "Some Distant Memory" on the Electronic album).

if New Order had released "World (The Price of Love)" in 1990 it would've been an amazing barnburner of a single; on this album it's a throwback to other times. I still love it.

total aside: I didn't realize that "World In Motion" was their only UK #1

some distant memory is the best song ever

It is.

Crystal was such a great comeback and the way it all LOOKED was incredible!

http://img-cdn.jg.jugem.jp/966/819789/20130209_353003.jpg

came across this last week. saw the same show a few months later at Ally Pally on NY Eve. SUCH a great show, sounds freaking amazing here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJjkU9bTqlU

^^^ I've got that DVD; it's indeed amazing. The '81 Taras Shevchenko show also included!

oh I was at that Reading gig

Republic suffers from an embalmed production that was out of fashion in 1993; it sounds like a Bernard Sumner solo album on which the band was allowed to participate.

You could say that about almost everything post-Republic though, but when they try to sound more "current" (e.g. Jetstream, Guilt Is a Useless Emotion), they come across as old folks trying desperately to fit in.

pretty much hated Republic and almost everything since.

aside from Crystal the only songs i'd save from a fire with Sumner's voice on since the first Electronic album are Out Of Control by the Chems and this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z15DIchJw7Y

not enough krafty love itt

The mix on WFTSC sounds fine to me -- they got it right.

Can someone explain to me why the title track of Waiting For the Sirens' Call nearly kills me? If it catches me unawares I can even tear up at times. It doesn't have any particular association but something about it really gets to me. Maybe it feels like the end of New Order.

WFTSC is great, Get Ready is 50% great and Republic is a sweet balearic classic (hated it at the time but all the songs bar Liar and Chemical have aged surprisingly well). I think I'd take any of these over Low-Life, no challop

"Low Life" was such a strange one for me..

It kicks off with OMG an actual song! that it's difficult to remember the rest.

Music Complete is pretty much on the same level as History of Modern and English Electric. Same with the artwork which is extremely similar to those albums.

― Kitchen Person, Tuesday, June 23, 2015 7:42 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I beg to differ, Music Complete is a terrible title. At least those OMD album titles (as with a lot of OMD album titles) were chosen for conceptual reasons.

The artwork reminds me far more of True Colours by Split Enz than any OMD artwork.

Music Complete sounds like it could be the title of a K-Tel compilation or something...

"K-Tel presents... Music Complete! 20 sublime chart hits on ONE album!"

the artwork for True Colours is great though. it would be neat if the sleeve for Music Complete came in multiple colours as well

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c92/Tam1976/Other%20stuff/IMG_0186.jpg

idk, to me there's something elegantly New Order-ish about the title Music Complete. With that, the cover artwork, and the snippet of music in the trailer, I'm quietly optimistic about the new album.

'music complete' is a great title and totally in line with new order's aesthetic fuiud

Remember everything from the Republic era said 'A New Order Product', which at the time I thought was terrible but I get the concept of it now.

ppl complaining about the cover art but then like

http://i.imgur.com/snWAsiV.jpg

(this is extremely good cover art btw)

my fave

Good thread: let's discuss New Order's 'Republic'

Can someone explain to me why the title track of Waiting For the Sirens' Call nearly kills me? If it catches me unawares I can even tear up at times. It doesn't have any particular association but something about it really gets to me. Maybe it feels like the end of New Order.

― MatthewK,

This is the only song since Regret that would make my New Order top ten. It's a perfect song. The ending kills me every single time.

How many times must I lose my way, hey
How many words do I have to say, hey
What can I do just to make you see
That you're so good for a man like
A man like me

Turn is beautiful as well:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KmmDElWGbYg

Yeah, Turn is my second favourite on that album. It was supposed to come out after the title track but got cancelled for some reason. It's even on their Singles collection from 2005. It should have been released instead of Jetstream which might just be their worst single.

All time classic status: Achieved

Primitive Notion

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWrWRm2DFtY

Crystal, Someone Like You, Run Wild and Vicious Streak are my favourites on Get Ready.

Prefer the Steve Osborne mix of Run Wild but agree with the rest of those.

I'm gonna live till I die
I'm gonna live to get high

Probably inspired by hanging out with Bobby Gillespie too much.

Yay, it's New Order's El Pintor!!!!

Hopefully it's a lot better than that.

In my head, Hooky & Carlos are secretly working on a set of bass duets called Screw You Guys I'm Going Home.

(Thank you, thread for making me dig out Republic and Get Ready. I have no time for people who don't acknowledge that the bassline on Regret is like the platonic ideal of a New Order bassline.)

Yay, it's New Order's El Pintor!!!!

― The Hauntology of Celebrity (Branwell with an N), Wednesday, June 24, 2015 3:09 PM (14 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Red Owner?

Hooky and Carlos are secretly working on giving groupies venereal diseases.

"Turn" is definitely MOR New Order but that's probably where I'm at these days (though all the Bad Lieutenant songs kinda sounded like Turn but never as good)

Yes, yes, Our Herpes To Admire, Seven and the Raged Tiger, Some Distant Memory, now we never have to have this conversation again, Alfred.

Republic is perfection right until Times Change. Has there ever been a decent song that Barney raps on? I'm thinking there's probably an Electronic song that proves me wrong

The songs are good, Sumner's raps are...tolerable. I think it almost works on "Feel Every Beat."

'Idiot Country'

"Idiot Country" is also weird in that for the chorus Sumner doubletracks himself singing at the top of his register.

< when they try to sound more "current" (e.g. Jetstream, Guilt Is a Useless Emotion), they come across as old folks trying desperately to fit in. >

Doves popped into my head when reading this.

Gillian should be brought to the front of the group, imo. Take on some vocals, do some duets w/ Barney. Selfish is a great track.

My mind boggles at the image of Gillian and Bernard center stage looking at each other, nodding, and exchanging guitar riffs.

Bernard just glares at Gillian. The last time I saw New Order, Gillian just stared down at a notebook perched on her synth. Pretty sure the notations were 'right index finger on the red sticker' and 'left index finger on the blue sticker'. I kid, I love Gillian. So glad she's back.

Am I the only person on ILX who actually likes "Jetstream" and "Guilt Is A Useless Emotion"? where is Spencer Chow

oh I was at that Reading gig

me too!

I like "Guilt Is A Useless Emotion." The "I want your love" bit is like New Order attempting Haddaway.

I made a mix of Jetstream without Ana Matronic that I much prefer to the official version. Love Guilt though. Even the Mac Quayle version is good.

where is Spencer Chow

I'm here and I like those songs!

thinking of starting a tumblr for pictures of Stephen Morris grinning

http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Arrivals+amfAR+Inspiration+Gala+Part+2+oO6qvMhUaHjl.jpg

http://cache4.asset-cache.net/gc/450407164-bernard-sumner-phil-cunningham-tom-chapman-gettyimages.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=GkZZ8bf5zL1ZiijUmxa7QfebhzI6yVvMhnCUyLXlaJ3bGhMAxvfCF7cEzDEYpDwL

http://www.worldinmotion.net/newsroom/pictures/2007/DSC00116.jpg

"some distant memory is the best song ever"

undoubtedly; nothing NO has done after technique really touches the first Electronic record. But I do like Turn a lot too on WFSC.

there will be zero good songs on this record but olds will be pumped anyway, which is fine, my iTunes shows that I've listened to the new UFO album 5 times already

Always thought Steve Morris looked liked Stephen Fry's younger, smaller brother.

I've liked at least a couple of songs off each post-"Technique" album. The question is whether someone will try to ape Hook's sound on the new album, which would be just as weird as a New Order album without his bass.

I should say I finally listened to "Lost Sirens" the other day, having forgotten it existed, and promptly forgot it existed again.

i'm looking a bit forward to this. hey maybe we can re-do the New Order poll after it's release.

j/k

two really important corrections this thread urgently needs:

stephen morris was so beautiful as a young man

& music complete relates to musique concrete more than musique non-stop, right

many xps Whoa, I've never seen that silver & gold cover variation for True Colours. WANT.

Here to Stay was great, particularly in the extended version, Plastic is good and the teaser from the video also sounded interesting. They should make a whole album with the Chems (or Weatherall).

This excellent live recording of Singularity shows how Tom's bass is going to fit in. Basically sits in the same place as Hooky but without the chorus pedal on. Starts like Joy Division then kicks in with pretty decent lyrics and a reappearance of Gillian's synth lines over top. Good omen for the album.

http://youtu.be/bFb1JLmCdaY

two really important corrections this thread urgently needs:

stephen morris was so beautiful as a young man

& music complete relates to musique concrete more than musique non-stop, right

didn't think of musique concrete, d'oh

but I never for a moment meant to suggest that Stephen Morris was anything other than beautiful as a young (or indeed middle aged) man!

Morris grinning as a beautiful young man:

https://40.media.tumblr.com/99c95429271bbfbe867c4395d07e534c/tumblr_np4to4AstW1t0u876o1_540.jpg

stephen morris had the best look in the perfect kiss video

mimicking boredom?

His "Do we have to do it again?" face.

Gotta say that for all the love I have for New Order's blunt charm, that Sumner autobiography is like being trapped at the bar with that hot guy/girl who turns out to be mind-crushingly literal and dull.
I remain, like others, quietly optimistic that I will like bits/most/all of Music Complete. Still remember the shock when Get Ready turned out to be a flawless resumption (but then I hated Republic).

seems like a good ILX pre-cover candidate tbh

― fuck me, archipelago (Simon H.), Tuesday, June 23, 2015 12:26 PM (2 days ago)

You know...you're on.

And here we go

ILX Pre-Covers New Order's _Music Complete_

I'd call "Get Ready" a flawless resumption only in the most literal sense. That is, it is not a flawless album but it was a flawless return to active status. Wonder if Barney returns Billy's phone calls these days ..

Seems Billy and Hooky may be on better terms since Little Hook is joining Bald Billy on tour.

Is The Game just does a cover of the Echo & the Bunnymen song? Could already hear it done with Barney vox in my head

It's a cover of the Queen album, in its entirety.

did Billy and New Order leave on bad terms? i found the only interview they all did together (in Q) the other day and it was hilarious! i'd scan it in if i .. had a scanner.
it seemed so bizarre at the time when he did the tour with them, but in the photos he was as happy as i've ever seen him. not saying much like..

happy as a man holding cats

The Cure's "Happy the (Cat) Man"

"The Lovecats" - Smashing Pumpkins

I'd call "Get Ready" a flawless resumption only in the most literal sense. That is, it is not a flawless album but it was a flawless return to active status.
― Josh in Chicago, Friday, June 26, 2015 1:18 AM (8 hours ago)

I remain, like others, quietly optimistic that I will like bits/most/all of Music Complete. Still remember the shock when Get Ready turned out to be a flawless resumption (but then I hated Republic).

― MatthewK, Thursday, June 25, 2015 12:57 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Realistically, I'm expecting one, maybe two very good songs. I'm certainly not expecting any future classics, and I definitely expect there to be filler. A lot of New Order's tension "back in the day" came from Sumner's more electronic direction mixed with Hook preferring the band approach. It's going to be interesting to see what a new New Order record with that tension removed is going to sound like, although I have a sneaking suspicion the end result might lack a bit of edge.

Well probably Republic is a reasonable approximation of NO with Hooky's input dialled out. But Barney has been more guitar-happy in recent years, viz Bad Lieutenant I guess.

Yeah, and I guess Republic can be accused of having a distinct lack of edge to it, bar 'Regret' of course.

That is exactly how I would describe Technique, bar 'Fine Time'.

Oh shit, now I am listening to Republic and liking it a whole lot. "Ruined in a Day" FTW.

Oh, then "Spooky". Never mind, I still hate it apart from Regret and RiaD.

you need to stick around for Everyday Everywhere and Special, at the very least

I just hear Republic as a diary of the dissolution of Factory Records and find it fascinating. Bernard's best album lyrically. Hoping the break-up with Hooky will lend to great lyrics this time. I was also thinking about the fact that Steve and Gillian may be able to contribute some songs to this album now that Hook is gone and remembering that the only number 1 New Order had, was written by The Other Two. 1963 was also apparently a Steve/Gillian song. Definitely looking forward to Music Complete. Hopefully we won't be able to hear Phil Cunningham anywhere on the album. He useless.

Hooky was always full of praise for 1963.

Whereas Bernard would slag off "World (Price of Love)", another Steve/Gillian one.

Basically, they got their wack,

Ugh, special guests on record. Brandon Flowers, La Roux, Iggy.

Shoulda headfaked everyone and said it was Iggy Azalea.

I literally had 90 seconds of NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO echoing through my head until my Google search completed.

Flowers finally bored Tennant and Lowe.

I didn't think it would be possible, but my expectations for this record managed to become even lower.

Brandon Flowers named The Killers after the band in New Order’s video for ‘Crystal,’ and has become a good friend of the band. Here on Music Complete he lends his unmistakable vocals on ‘Superheated,’ giving the album a fittingly epic closer.

Following an enthralling guest appearance performing ‘Love Will Tear Us Apart’ at the Tibet House benefit in New York last year, Iggy Pop now applies his unique tones to ‘Stray Dog,’ creating a brooding track that blends perfectly with the eclectic array of sounds on Music Complete.

“Elly Jackson (La Roux) is featured on 'Tutti Frutti,’ ‘People On The High Line,’ and provides backing vocals on ‘Plastic.’ La Roux first supported New Order on their 2014 tour, starting a mutual appreciation of each other’s work.”

ginormous frowny face

Fittingly epic

Yeah, I've gone from excited to 'who gives a fuck' in the time it takes to read a tweet. Nothing good ever comes from collaborations. This is a very bad sign.

Oh no. Elly's voice is probably my least favourite vocalist in music after Danny Embrace and she's on three of the songs! With Iggy Pop I'm just expecting something similar to Rock The Shock.

It's a shame they've resorted to this sideshow bullshit. La Roux and the Killers are so far beneath the level of people who should be anywhere near New Order in a recording studio. Suppose they already ruined their legacy with Billy Corgan and Ana Matronic though, so this really shouldn't surprise me. I don't know why they wouldn't just let Gillian sing on those songs. Hopefully Iggy Pop just plays guitar or something. So disappointed in the way this is shaping up now. The snippets on the videos sound good but none of them feature vocals. Unfortunately i've already pre-ordered the deluxe box set.

LaRoux is good at least. but I don't know why they need any special guests. wtf it's not a Santana record.

To be fair, I have only heard 1 La Roux song and it was a Skream remix (I think) but it was terrible.

lol y'all

the new new order album, featuring: some people who will maybe occasionally accompany or sing instead of barney

more like barfy

brandon flowers rules and i am excited to hear him on this record

same

It's a shame they've resorted to this sideshow bullshit. La Roux and the Killers are so far beneath the level of people who should be anywhere near New Order in a recording studio. Suppose they already ruined their legacy with Billy Corgan and Ana Matronic though, so this really shouldn't surprise me. I don't know why they wouldn't just let Gillian sing on those songs. Hopefully Iggy Pop just plays guitar or something. So disappointed in the way this is shaping up now. The snippets on the videos sound good but none of them feature vocals. Unfortunately i've already pre-ordered the deluxe box set.

i think it's weird to ha e this opinion about a rock band that did a rap song about soccer in their prime

All these New Order collaborations scan like they just looked to see who was hanging around backstage at some festival and invited them to record. We're lucky it's not, like, Jared Leto.

Iggy Pop, I can understand. They've been fans of his since before Joy Division started. The others just show a massive lack of quality control. Hopefully it's relegated to buried backing vocals and not a duet like Turn My Way.

Also, RE: World In Motion. That was a novelty record that was intentionally ridiculous.

Brandon Flowers with New Order could be interesting, but if there's anything a New Order album doesn't need, it's a "fittingly epic closer".

Unfortunately i've already pre-ordered the deluxe box set.

but if there's anything a New Order album doesn't need, it's a "fittingly epic closer".

as if press releases aren't a randomized mosaic of 10 total words

I must admit, closing with an epic would be more fitting than starting with one.

if there's anything a New Order album doesn't need, it's a "fittingly epic closer".

OTOH "Dream Attack" rules

even more epic:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dElcbE2HEdQ

grrrrr

it's funny, joy division's career also ended with the fittingly epic closer

Deborah Curtis may not agree.

Maybe you mean the album "Closer"? Epic.

Even "Republic" has an epic closer:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gPRw-_jOhFA

I think Bernard once said on stage 'little dicks, big endings' as a way to sum up New Order's sound.

not sure Gillian agreed with that one

Our definitions of "epic closer" don't seem to agree, but if I was going to pick one from NO it would be "Leave Me Alone".

Dream Attack is the most perfect closer - don't hear it as epic tho

It ends a soundtrack, not an album, but don't act like "Here To Stay" didn't happen.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPAfi6fbvTk

i like it seems like the kind of song i can grow into

That's really nice!

Oh I like this a LOT

Apparently I'm now allowed to say the album is fantastic - their best since Technique even if you really hate Brandon Flowers.

Morris sounds crisp!

Pleasant, but honestly I'm not getting the first-single-and-we're-BACK! punch of either "Crystal" or "Krafty." Going with the 'kind of song I can grow into' feeling.

Yep. Sumner sounds buried.

it sounds very by-the-numbers, not a bad thing, but I dunno, this is like Weird Al trying to write a New Order song

I would prefer a punchier mix.

Something sounds off about the vocals. Bernard sounds like he either has a cold or he's a bit upset.

The song itself needs a stronger chorus. It's pleasant enough but it would probably be about the fifth best song on Waiting For The Siren's Call.

first five seconds is like pressing play on the trailer for an enchanting christmas movie, maybe like divorced gary oldman meeting emma thompson or something, their kids bump into one another in washington sq park

THIS HOLIDAY SEASON-

whoa this is great

Sounds like something from one of the recent Johnny Marr solo albums.

Hmm. I'll reserve my thoughts for when the album comes out.

pleasant but man the conscious avoidance of peter hook-itude on the bassline bummed me out a little

"Restless" by Bad Lieutenant & The Other Two

No hooks, and not the Peter kind.

^^^ rehearsing the Christgau one-line review.

Verse vocal melody is very "Save a Prayer".

first five seconds is like pressing play on the trailer for an enchanting christmas movie, maybe like divorced gary oldman meeting emma thompson or something, their kids bump into one another in washington sq park

― tender is the late-night daypart (schlump), Tuesday, July 28, 2015 11:45 AM (11 hours ago) Bookmark

was thinking this sounded like classic BBC intro music or maybe classy nintendo 'realistic wii sports and not mario' intro music

pleasant but man the conscious avoidance of peter hook-itude on the bassline bummed me out a little

― da croupier, Tuesday, July 28, 2015 5:45 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Hmm, the bassline sounds like classic Hook to me!

Reminds me of "Tighten Up" but that's got a much stronger chorus. Barney sounds kind of tired here. Could grow on me though, I pretty much agree with Ned.

I hear Hook's influence all over that bassline.

It's not strong enough for a first single. Lyrics are typically poor. Bernard doesn't sound great in that lower register. Chorus is weak. Musically it's decent, like an acoustic Technique album track, but it lacks 'hooks' (top comment, whoever made it upthread). Someone needs to be able to tell Bernard something isn't good enough. I feel like he doesn't have any critical voices around him right now.

lol two people who would probably disagree with you if you think the bassline sounds like "classic hook" - peter hook and tom chapman

http://www.theguardian.com/culture/2015/mar/19/peter-hook-if-my-son-joined-new-order-at-least-theyd-get-the-bass-played-properly

(Bernard) might get my son onboard in his band instead. Oh well, at least they’d finally get the bass played properly! Fucking hell, I’ve never seen a more annoying comment in my life than when their fucking session man turned around and said: “I’m going to put my own stamp on it.” I bet all these New Order fans were fucking delighted – just what we need, an uppity session man who’s going to put his stamp on something that defines the whole sound of the band. Thank you, Bernard!

there's definitely a hook-like riff in the song but i don't think its being played on a bass - you can hear a bass under it!

Just relistening and you are right. It's definitely a guitar with some mild distortion on it that is playing the Hooky style melody line. The biggest problem is really the mixing. The synths in the final half of the song should be louder in addition to Barney and the acoustic guitar. Maybe it will sound different on vinyl.

There are a few New Order songs, fwiw, with either what sounds like two bass parts, or a low bass and what sounds like Hook actually played on guitar. Even "Blue Monday," iirc, was on a 6-string.

Hook, Robert Smith, and Simon Gallup often used six-string basses.

And the Beatles did, too. And lots of folks.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v383/iamthebassman/111208.jpg
Sup.

loving the outro on this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=THwp-hWtC5Y

also I hope you like yr New Order songs long 'cause

1."Restless" 5:28
2."Singularity" (produced by Tom Rowlands) 5:37
3."Plastic" 6:55
4."Tutti Frutti" (featuring Elly Jackson) 6:22
5."People on the High Line" (featuring Elly Jackson) 5:41
6."Stray Dog" (featuring Iggy Pop) 6:17
7."Academic" 5:54
8."Nothing but a Fool" 7:43
9."Unlearn This Hatred" (produced by Tom Rowlands) 4:19
10."The Game" 5:06
11."Superheated" (featuring Brandon Flowers, additional production by Stuart Price) 5:04

During the parts where Barney's not singing, Donna Summer is singing in my head.

4."Tutti Frutti" (featuring Elly Jackson) 6:22 :-(

"plastic" is great

possibly i am thrilling more over the synth oscillations than the hooks

1."Restless" 5:28

more like "Hookless"

levels

'Plastic' is okay, I think... although I like the way the track sounds more than the song itself.

Completely fucked up with the vocals by La Roux. So irritated by that decision. Why not let Gillian sing? Even Gillian agrees with me. Check out my tweet she Favorited.

https://twitter.com/biznotic/status/644190612951035904

hahaha

Well, at least this has now got me on a New Order binge!

already joined the Twitter campaign

the la roux vocals are fine?

I can't stand Elly's voice usually but this could be anyone singing those backing vocals.

The production is good but the song goes nowhere and the chorus should be way stronger. Sounds very similar to Axis from the last Pet Shop Boys but no way near as good.

They took all the power out of it in the studio. It was much better live. The backing vocals are just pointless.

The backing vocals suck. restless however has been a huge grower.

the la roux vocals are fine?

Everything up until Barney sings is pretty amazing. After that, well...

I've just given 'Plastic' another listen on headphones and while I'm glad that New Order have went down a more heavily electronic route this time around, I have to agree with those that are saying that vocals are somewhat lacking. I understand that Sumner has had some truly shocking lead vocal moments throughout New Order's career, but his vocals on the new stuff seem to be lacking in a completely different way. I'm just not feeling much passion or power in the vocal. Sumner's vocals on some of the '80s New Order recordings may not be ideal, but at least he sounded like he fucking meant it.

He's 30 years older

That's not much of an excuse to be honest, not when the likes of Neil Tennant and Andy McCluskey still sound as committed as ever on recent Pet Shop Boys and Orchestral Manoeuvres In The Dark releases, and while I'm not fond of the direction in which Dave Gahan's vocals have taken on recent Depeche Mode releases (particularly the bluesy croak he's adopted since Exciter) there's no denying that when he sings, he sings as though he fucking means it - not to mention he seems to be going places with his voice that would have been completely unthinkable during the days of Violator. By comparison, Sumner sounds like he just doesn't really give a fuck, and not in an "album version of 'Sub-Culture'" type of way where he's obviously in no fit state to be singing, more he sounds completely bored and not into it. His vocals on Get Ready and Waiting For The Sirens' Call at least sounded like he wanted to be there.

So yeah, the songs I've heard so far sound good, but I'm not taken by the vocals and the songwriting so far. At this stage, I'm fully expecting this album to be a bit of a dud.

^totally agree.

It would all be forgiven if at least the song had a decent chorus, tho.

They've had so many other projects, other names. I don't see why they even had to call this project New Order, beyond the usual combo of cowardice and greed. They should have called it something else, which would have freed them up to do anything they wanted, minus high expectations. Because frankly, I still have trouble with the idea of New Order minus Peter Hook. To me it's not that different from the Pixies minus Kim Deal. More than just musicians, they're defining elements of the band.

Was the name Electrafixion already taken?

You know it.

Crucifixion, more like.

Only after a few listens I've noticed how Pet Shop Boys the intro sounds. I wish somebody would take the backing track and made a different song with it.

All this recent New Order activity has got me listening to Get Ready and Waiting For The Sirens' Call a fair amount over the last couple of days - I'd forgotten how good some of the highlights on these records actually are, although having said that there's a couple of tracks on both (particularly on Waiting For The Sirens' Call) that I suspect will never grow on me.

I still prefer those two albums to the majority of Republic, though.

"Singularity" or 35 years of this band in 6 minutes:

http://picosong.com/J7hy/

Only after a few listens I've noticed how Pet Shop Boys the intro sounds. I wish somebody would take the backing track and made a different song with it.

― daavid,

It sounds just like Axis from Electric in my opinion.

Ok, Singularity is brilliant. Easily the best of the three songs out there.

The intro alone is wonderful

ok NOW I'm interested?

Around 3:40-4:25 of Singularity this band sounds more alive and urgent than they have in forever.

My interest in this was ebbing somewhat after the leaks, which were fine in that bland "we are comfortable in our career and not really pushing ourselves" way; this song is a) not what I expected them to put together and b) way more appealing than what I thought I wanted to hear, which was the aforementioned aural comfort food.

Huh, that song is pretty good! I think what's dragged the band down a bit has been Morris' drums, actually, which have sounded like the same pre-recorded loop (basically, the Regret drums) dropped in again and again. But here the percussion - programmed and real, or real enough - is pretty alive, which in turn helps make the song more exciting. Which is to say, the most successfully dance-rock they've sounded in a while.

There's something very demo-y about that, like a bunch of unrelated ideas that got jammed together without much reason. The keyboard riff during the verses sounds like it parachuted in from a completely different song (that song being "Bizarre Love Triangle"). That said, the intro is awesome and the song as a whole, despite all the weird shifts in style, somehow seems to work.

Lauren Lavern played Unlearn This Hatred. 2:40:00 in to the iPlayer stream here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b06bb9n9#play

Like each of tracks other than Singularity this is a grower. Initially I didn't like it.

for most of the track it sounds like New Order finally heard that Bloc Party album their kids told them about in 2005.

Album is out there.

I'm surprised how more reviews aren't calling out how DISCO this record is? For nearly 20 minutes between "Plastic", "Tutti Frutti" and "People on the High Line" we cover everything from Moroder to Chic. Obviously New Order have definitely embraced house music before but this is the first record where Bernard seems to finally be paying homage to the some of the key inspirations that brought him to dance music in the first place.

Still processing it.

Wow, album runs out of gas half way through. "Academic" couldn't be more appropriately titled.

Still, first five tracks are easily the best things they've done in ages.

goth psych folk vibe intro of "nothing but a fool" rules. want more acoustic guitar barney please

I'm going to be in Brooklyn for the record release party on Thursday night. Can't wait to hear it in full then. Hope they have some giveaways as well.

will they give Bernard away

Peter Hook set to reopen Dry201 to coincide with the launch of his new line of Bitters.

There seems to be some good reviews cropping up of this. I remain skeptical until I hear the whole thing.

I'm actually shocked how good this is. Tutti Frutti is just so wonderful.

The Brandon Flowers duet is such a great ending to the album. I didn't see that coming at all.

I think Bernard's voice must have degraded significantly the last 10 years. That's the only reason I can see for him singing in the lower register and relying so much on guest vocalists.

Given where his voice started from, I'm expecting most of the album to be delivered in Sprechgesang

Technique > Low-Life > Brotherhood > Power, Corruption & Lies > Movement > Waiting For The Sirens' Call > Get Ready > Republic

Based on what I've heard so far, I'm expecting the new one to realistically fall amongst the last three.

"Tutti Frutti" is perfect. They knew exactly what they were after there.

So far (up to TF), it's pretty great!

yeah this is a pleasant surprise, fully expected this to be worse than Lost Sirens. Best since Republic, certainly; maybe edges that album except for REgret of course.

also, yes, apparently much of this was written by Gillian and Steven, and it shows. It's a much more electronic and dancey record than the last two and after a few listens I prefer it vastly to Sirens and Get Ready.

Hmm, yeah ... giving it a fair shake and no doubt, this is the best album from them that no one wanted, needed or expected. But better than that! But still, that.

Enjoying this more than '...Sirens Call'.

It's taken me a little while to get used to the overall sound of the record and the lyrics but it's wearing in nicely. I'll never like Stray Dog but at least it isn't as dire as Rock the Shack or Working Overtime.

holy christ -- "People on the High Line" has a pulse!

well this is a surprise

I'm so surprised at how good this album is. Restless was such an odd choice of lead single. It's definitely one of the weakest songs here.

Restless is wonderful. New order grand cru. The stomping electronic beat of Singularity is awful. It totally overshadows the rest of the song. Singularity sounds pretty much knit together. It is not of one piece, more like several samples glued together.

Plastic is a time machine back into the 70s. Donna Summer is back. And she has aged quite well.

Tutti frutti is alright and getting better the more it unfolds itself. Another crap hammer beat in the beginning which then gives place to a tune which is then elaborated on by strings etc. A pretty good effort. The first new order song with a low voice on it, i think. By an italian, another novelty.

People on the high line is a little pointless, not really going anywhere. Okayish but not essential.

I like stray dog. The deep voice reminds me of the old man lamenting about coney island on that never ending godspeed song. Great stuff treading new terrain for new order.

Academic is better than the title implies. Something like an interlude leading to something out of itself.

i wish iggy sang academic & barney sung stray dog

anyway my love for new order is unconditional & i am enjoying this
academic is better than everyone says it is & is just sort of frustratingly restrained as a production, is better than the next few songs
tutti frutti's so good
it's also weird just imagining these songs improved by 17 - 22% if hooky was playing on them

This is better than expected. Much looser, they're having a bit of fun. I kind of wish "Tutti Frutti" was all "Fine Time" robot guy over proto-"Blue Monday". I'm reminded of extended Happy Mondays grooves on some of them.

Tutti Frutti is good but it sounds so much like a Juan Maclean song. Not a bad thing, just an observation. After 3 days with the album on heavy rotation, I'm ready to say it's their best since Technique. I don't love the laconic delivery of Bernard's vocals but i'm getting used to it. In the back of my mind I keep thinking this album would have been a beast with Hooky involved but I'm trying to suppress that thought. Having Iggy on Stray Dog was a horrible mistake. I hope they put an instrumental version on one of the singles.

I've decided the only problem of this album is Sumner, who is clearly incapable of conveying any kind of emotion anymore.

emotion is a useless emotion

Flat affect has always been Barney's calling card. Come on. He has two modes: sullen; and yelping outrage. If you have not come to terms with Barney's limited emotional range, like, oh, 30 years ago, you are not actually a New Order fan. What's brilliant about this record is that he has finally, finally, finally LEARNED what his vocal range is, and how to stick in it. Which is a bit of a loss (I love it when Bernard tries to hit a high note and ends up in a wincing whoop) but I do like the things he's doing with his voice. I think the slight fray on some songs is intentional. Bernard has learned a new mode: Vulnerability.

But the album. OMG this album. I was listening with very low hopes indeed (I would have settled for "does not suck too hard" which actually seemed like an impossibly big ask for this band from Rock The Shack onwards). OH MY GOD THIS ALBUM IS ACTUALLY AMAZING.

Seriously, the only way I can process how good this album is, is bascially "Stephen and Gillian dealing with Empty Nest Syndrome by throwing a MASSIVE DISCO PARTY WOOO THE KIDS HAVE MOVED OUT LET'S HAVE A RAVE!!!" Handbags all round! Plastic is their Donna Summer karaoke! Tutti Frutti is them doing Chic karaoke with that weird robot guy they met on Ibiza that crazy summer back in 1988.

I'm not actually a big fan of New Order duets but I don't mind the Iggy Pop track, though it doesn't sound like The Stooges, it sounds like Death In Vegas. It's alright. Getting that twat from the Killers in to do the Big! Sweeping! Rock! Choruses on the last track was not the best idea, but hey, it actually makes me appreciate Barney's monochromatic emotional and tonal range by comparison.

But mostly I'm just basking in the BARNEYWAVES. Best album since Technique (and I liked Republic!)

protip: all of the lyrics are 100% better if you just pretend they're all about Hooky. Especially Plastic. Even the one about seeing a photo of your ex's new boyfriend on her make-up shelf. Especially that one. Seriously, if this is what they sound like without Hooky, man, they should have sacked his leather-clad ass 20 years ago. There are so many tracks where I was swaggering about, listening to them (Tutti Frutti especially) where I was just like "HOLY SHIT, this is what they could have sounded like all along if they had had a decent bass player. I do not miss that guy one bit. This album would have been 17%-22% worse if he had been involved. There are so many moments where a bassline comes to the fore, and it's an amazing bassline and it just shows up what a shallow, one-gear bass player Hooky was. Gillian was the missing ingredient. Gillian is the crucial member in that band.

Now I can't wait for it to be a decent hour of the morning so I can blast this again without my neighbours killing me.

This album would have been 17%-22% worse if he had been involved. There are so many moments where a bassline comes to the fore, and it's an amazing bassline and it just shows up what a shallow, one-gear bass player Hooky was. Gillian was the missing ingredient. Gillian is the crucial member in that band.

ha ha, i don't agree with this but i am 1000% loving the kinda classical gillianisms on this, like the synth stabs on tutti frutti

I know I am the only Gillian stan on this board, but Gillian R000000000000000000000000000LS, OK?

This album just proves it, she is the best. They can make a brilliant album without Hooky. They can't even make a good album without Gilian. Q.E.D.

they haven't made a brilliant album since Republic.

This is a brilliant album and FUIUD not even saying sorry

It is a brilliant album, I did think it would be only me but most people have said so.

The extra-guests are mostly unintrusive except for Iggy but he won't be kept in a corner, c-mon.

So, yeah!

The second half is a slog, but I dig the first.

I still haven't heard this album yet and am definitely looking forward to after reading some of the positive comments about the album in this thread, but bearing in mind what I read on the thread for Waiting For The Sirens' Call on here when I looked back to see what ILX thought of that album when it first came out, forgive me if I'm taking some of the praise here with more than a pinch of salt.

I'm in the WFTSC camp. This album's as uneven. Let me put it this way: the 2005 album boasted better guitar songs, and this one boasts better dance ones.

there's no "Krafty" or "Morning Night and Day" on this one.

Bernard was plenty emotional on the last album, with stuff like Krafty, Turn and the title track. If anything it's his gift of sounding sort of wistfully emotional no matter what kind of lazy gibberish he's spouting.
That said, folks forget that Gillian was on and involved with "Get Ready," up until the tour, so unless she was distracted by the same family stuff that lead to her dropping out, her presence alone apparently does not guarantee anything particularly "Gillian-esque" and more than Hook's absence means lack of Hooky/hooky bass.

FWIW, the first time I heard the Iggy bit I thought of the sampled man vox on "Fine Time."

Get Ready's a good record.

absolutely, get ready is their last great record. it's where they have proven that they were still able to rock out.

er, you mean rock the shack

I have trouble remembering anything from "Get Ready" save "Crystal" and "Rock the Shack," for different reasons. Like, I look at the titles and get ... nothing. Really liked a lot of "Sirens Call," though. And this one is good, too. But then maybe absence makes the heart grow fonder, because I heard some Bad Lieutenant song on the radio the other day, and it sounded pretty good

Crystal, Someone Like You, Run Wild and Vicious Streak are all fantastic songs. Rock The Shack is the worst song they've ever recorded.

Get Ready and Waiting For The Sirens' Call both have some great songs on them, and I think the latter would have been even better if it had been a couple of songs shorter. Both are, on the whole, better albums than Republic, IMO. At the same time, I don't think any of 'em come close to their '80s work.

Every album they've ever made is uneven except for Technique if I'm giving "Guilty Partner" the side eye.

i.e. "Regret," "Everyone Everywhere," "Here to Stay," "Special," "Young Offender," "World," "Krafty," "Someone Like You," "Crystal," "Run Wild," "Primitive Notions," "Morning Night and Day," "Turn," "Waiting for the Siren's Call," and "Spooky" are as good as anything between 1981-1989.

also, yes, apparently much of this was written by Gillian and Steven, and it shows. It's a much more electronic and dancey record than the last two and after a few listens I prefer it vastly to Sirens and Get Ready.

― akm, Thursday, September 24, 2015 2:50 PM (4 days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

this convinced me to listen to this album, and I like it a lot more than I was expecting to! not sure what % 'much of this was written by Gillian and Steven' works out at, but I enjoy Music Complete more if I think of it as a third The Other Two album that features Barney as one of several guest vocalists

I've never heard the Other Two. Should I?

And where does "Lost Sirens" fit into the "there are some good tracks" analysis?

Not really feeling it on first listen, it's better than their last few but I dunno, it felt like listening to a middle-ranking album by Cut Copy or the Juan Maclean or a compilation of other mid-00s bloggy bands who are all vaguely New Order-influenced, except they got Barney in for a guest vocal. Struggling to put a finger on what was missing but it seemed to be that sliver of melodic inspiration that gave peak-New Order that rushiness.

yeah same here - it seems ok but slightly generic. Surprised by the general dismissal of the last two albums, which I loved back then and still listen to surprisingly often. I suppose there were a bit more middle-aged, while the new one harks back to their summer in Ibiza in '88 and imagined disco nights at Studio 54.

Now we get to the part of the thread where people compete to see who can strike to most blasé, over it all stance while they piss on our chips.

I really wanted to love it! And it was pretty good for the most part, but in a way that felt professional but without real magic. Doesn't help that there was a real glut of stuff in this vein a few years back.

having a great time with this! I am surprised, found the last couple dull dull dull.

"And where does "Lost Sirens" fit into the "there are some good tracks" analysis?"

I listened to it twice and don't remember anything about it.

oh wait Hellbent was on that, that was a barely passable song.

How comforting that once again New Order creates no consensus.

i've had "singularity" in my head for three days

Heard it while shopping in TK Maxx today and it stuck to my head like a burr.

(Still can't get the song titles straight. But that's a problem I've had with New Order song titles since 1984)

"Stray Dog" sounds like a late submission to the ILX Lulu compilation

xpost yes, thanks to their hit singles "One of these days", "How does it feel", "morning sun" and "Now you are mine"

"nothing but a fool" is so lovely

So yeah, I've finally got around to listening to this. It's kinda like Technique but for people who wear carpet slippers. It's alright, but I don't wear carpet slippers.

Well you're an idiot coz slippers are great. :)

that twat from the Killers

who released a better album than this one this year

It's a bit difficult to figure out how I truly feel about the record based on just a couple of listens, but that's my initial impression - it's like Technique but with the pains that come with age, settling down in an easy armchair with the carpet slippers on before a nice mug of hot chocolate and a fitful sleep in a Craftsmatic Adjustable Bed.

After listening to more dense/full sounding electronic records over the last few years, I'm surprised by how sparse in comparison some of this sounds. It's very trimmed back. As for the quality of the songs, I'm finding 'Plastic' popping up in my head a fair bit, but in all honesty I've listened to that track the most due to it being previewed prior to the album coming out. The rest of the songs may grow on me or may not, but I'm struggling to recall many of the vocal melodies on the record at this stage, just bits and pieces of tracks that either made me think "that's a good bit" or made me chuckle (I'm looking at you, 'Tutti Frutti')

On initial listen, I think "Unlearn This Hate" may be my favorite New Order song since "Dream Attack"

Definitely at the stage where I'm skipping Stray Dog already, but I'm really enjoying the rest. Tutti Frutti is just so great. I can't get enough of that one.

Stray Dog would be great as an instrumental. There's an interesting track below Iggy's growl.

It's Iggy doing Vincent Price's "Thriller" bit for a whole song.

who released a better album than this one this year

this is true, the brandon flowers record is awesome

Isn't it just Iggy reprising his role from that Death In Vegas song?

After playing this record a lot walking around cities and in my car it's a complex record me. The first half is wonderful and truly the best work they've done since Technique. The second half is mostly as O.K. as WFTSC and bad as Lost Sirens - I don't even really feel Unlearn this Hatred too much.

But man, those first five songs are like an early great Christmas gift. Ever since Republic and World in Motion I have been so disappointed with their output. Republic was especially a let down given how brilliant "Regret" was - I remember listening to each track on the album and getting progressively sadder that the record was crap. By the time things like Brutal and Rock the Shack were released I'd already pretty much let the ship sail on caring about their releases.

Slippers! A ha haha haha slippers. Sorry, I'm still getting over the idea that this is considered an insult towards people who like different music than you do. Like OH NOES. Isn't it terrible, You are young and hip and glacially cool but mmmmmmmmmm my god, my feet are SOOOOOO warm. Yup.

it's like Technique but with the pains that come with age, settling down in an easy armchair with the carpet slippers on before a nice mug of hot chocolate and a fitful sleep in a Craftsmatic Adjustable Bed.

Band whose average age is what, 60? in making a record that reflects the concerns that come with age SHOCKCAH! Isn't it awful that people age. Isn't it shocking and terrible and oughtn't to be allowed. Guess what, it will happen to you, too.

New Order have been in my life since I was like 13. I'm 45 now. I'd be embarrassed if New Order were still making the records now that reflected them in their 20s. I'm realising, with a lot of the music I'm listening to now, what it's like to grow up with a band, and grow old with a band. It gives me hope in a way, that the mid-life dip is a transitory thing. That the 40s suck and the 50s suck, and then, at age 59, someone can go and make a record like this.

Slippers, man, slippers are awesome.

music excrete

xpost On Tha Damn Money! Yeah!

I disagree actually, I think this sounds like the work of a much younger band, in that it sounds like the sort of thing the third or fourth best band on DFA or maybe even the best band on Modular might have made. One that (literally) makes all the right noises and wears its New Order influences heavily (and I mean peak New Order), but lacks something because it doesn't do anything much on top of that. I'm at the stage now when I've heard so many bands use an I Feel Love bassline that outside the original it's lost all its potency, it's gone from "Wow! A Moroder bassline!" to "Oh, it's a Moroder bassline", just a bit of stodge that second tier electro-rock bands use to hold a track together, a standard tool of the trade, and that saddens me a bit. I feel the same when I hear Richard Norris or Death In Vegas or Primal Scream apeing a motorik beat, just killing a sound with overuse.

I suppose what I'm missing is the kind of silvery, joyous melodies that really elevated New Order records for me. Maybe that's Barney's growing acceptance of his limited range, but it also means that a song like Reckless feels content to gesture at an amazing landscape in the distance, when previously New Order would have soared above it. My general feel is like listening to that Pet Shop Boys record with Jacques Lu Cont, where they're making exactly the kind of record you've wanted them to make for years but it doesn't quite sit right because the songwriting isn't quite there.

And if anyone tries to start a New Jersey thread based on that concept it's being deleted on sight BTW.

You know, that's kind of how I felt about the previous 2 albums - in a way I *don't* feel about this album.

I also think that, your feelings of jadedness, with regards to sounds and signifiers, sound a lot like I was feeling about 10 years ago, when I was going through dissatisfaction about the retro re-treading of signifiers of stuff that meant something to me in my youth. (I'm sure there are loads of cranky mid-00s ILX posts from me in my 30s being annoyed at Nu-gaze or whatever.) Now I'm old enough to accept the fact that most things are copies of things I knew the source of. And rather than being annoyed at the cop, it's more like... oh, hello old friend. You're still alive! I'm still alive! Isn't life a funny thing.

Like, being disappointed at New Order for releasing a record that sounds like Technique because Cut/Copy made an album 10 years ago just seems... misguided.

As you get older, more and more things will start sounding like that. Familiar. One goes through a period when one feels disappointed and annoyed that things don't sound NEW! like they used to. But I honestly feel like I've seen so many people go through that stage with different musics and different signifiers that it's just part of the ageing process, rather than evidence of stagnation or terribleness in the artists one notices it first with regards to.

I should probably just stop reading this thread. :-/

There's no substitute for being able to listen to the album in front of you, rather than hearing all those other albums at the same time.

Which is no pop at anyone, what I mean is: It's great if you can forget all that other stuff and just enjoy it for what it is. If that doesn't happen, it's a failing of the music, or of yourself, or of environment, or etc.

I don't really think it does sound like Technique though, other than it's a New Order record where the house influences are upfront and centre, otherwise the feel quite distinct to me.

As you get older, more and more things will start sounding like that. Familiar. One goes through a period when one feels disappointed and annoyed that things don't sound NEW! like they used to.

Like honestly I would agree with this if I wasn't simultaneously caning the new Chvrches record, which does literally nothing I haven't heard a million times before, but does it really well so I don't care. Or the Haim album, or whatever. The Cut Copy record from 2008 or whenever is better than this as well, like sometimes it just IS the record that's in front of you, and I've listened to this one three times without being able to remember any of the vocal melodies :/

It's also the way in which fashions change, eventually everyone will get bored and put the Moroder synths and the Chic guitars away and move onto something else, and when you suddenly hear them again in a new context it'll feel exciting again, rather than well-worn. That reaction is part and parcel of what keeps listeners moving on and looking for new things, or new twists on old things, Restless.

sounds like the sort of thing the third or fourth best band on DFA or maybe even the best band on Modular might have made.

Lock the Avalanches thread and redirect it here!

Branwell, I am loving your posts on this thread. They articulate my excitement about how unexpectedly good this is.

enjoying this album a lot. i like stray dog, i was going to make a comparison to that godspeed song but i see someone already did that.

Blimey - it's a bit of a slog getting through this album tbh...And I don't feel I'm going to remember any of it by tomorrow. Competent, but far too bland.

What was the last New Order album to have a memorable second half? Brotherhood?

uh I guess we still have no consensus

second half of this still getting better for me

So far, there's been a number of new albums this week where people are saying about the second half being a 'slog'.

Lol you like mini albums.

Or they're just frontloaded albums, and bands have been doing that for as long as albums have existed. FYI I didn't notice a particularly big drop-off in quality on the second side (in fact the best song is in the second half).

I'm Team Branwell on this one. I wonder what more the people who are disappointed expected from a New Order album in 2015, apart from the impossible dream of songs as good as they wrote in the 80s.

'superheated' is so good woowowowowowowowowowowowowowowowowow

imo this album is pleasantly uneven, like most of their discography and unlike the last two albums, which were unpleasantly uneven

TOOT-TEE. FROO.TEE.

i'm getting serious king of snake vibes from Plastic but im not even mad

actually i feel like i am getting a lot of vibes of bands who ripped off new order, like they're ripping them off back, and it's kind of amazing (but they're also still being new order which is the only reason it's not depresssing)

For a band that have supposedly lost their knack at pop songwriting, I sure get People On The High Line stuck in my head an awful lot.

Nice to see that the two Rowland and one Stuart Price tunes aside, the band returned to producing themselves.

I had a couple of further listens to Music Complete this morning and am quite prepared to say that it's their worst record, for me at least. I think Get Ready and Waiting For The Sirens' Call are superior collections of songs, and Republic at least had 'Regret', 'World' and 'Young Offender' on it, all of which I feel are superior to any track on Music Complete. I usually gravitate towards the more electronic side of New Order than the guitar-led side, so you'd think that this album would be mostly right up my street, but after several listens I find it unmemorable and, as mentioned by someone else earlier, a bit of a slog (the length of this record doesn't help) and rather bland. 'Plastic' is probably the one song on the record that I can remember all that much about, and I'd still rank that song pretty low in terms of what New Order have done in their career thus far. It must be said, when tracks were being previewed pre-release, that I came into this record not expecting much so at least one positive thing I can say about the record is that it met my expectations. I had low expectations for Pet Shop Boys' Electric too, but that record not only vastly exceeded my expectations, but I'm still listening to it very regularly. Being a New Order fan, of course I was hoping that I would react to Music Complete in the same way, but I just haven't. I can't see a time when I'll feel like giving Music Complete another listen, I think I'm pretty much done with it at this stage. Fortunately, there's the new Chvrches record, Susanne Sundfor released an incredible album earlier this year, recent albums by contemporaries of New Order are still holding up: Electric, Splinter, The Minutes, English Electric, Delta Machine, Interplay etc., and there's (of course) still New Order's superior, still refreshing earlier work.

OMFingG I just tried to listen to this Chvrches record that some of you reckon is better than Music Complete. Are you fucking kidding me? For real? You think this tinny twee pabulum is even listenable? I couldn't even make it more than 3 songs in before I went into hypoglycaemic shock. This is like Belle and Sebastian trying to recreate the Pretty In Pink soundtrack with a copy of Ableton. Feh!

Honestly, those of you saying that that is better than this, I don't just think that invalidates your opinion on New Order, I think I will never listen to anything you say about music ever again!

Haha I've just got my boss to listen to this, I can hear Restless on his wireless headphonse.

Is turning into Alex in NYC also part of the ageing process then?

Dude, if I wanted to be an asshole, I'd have gone on the Chvrches thread to tell you all that you were stupid for liking it. Repeatedly. :-P It's more frustrating for me, because it's something adjacent to an album that I'd actually like so I react to it more strongly for missing an open goal than if it were just something I didn't care about anyway.

Smilin' and cryin' here.

I haven't listened to the Vrchrvs album yet, so I won't wade in.

I did hear the "Noel Gallagher Remix" album, and if you only play the "Instrumental" versions, i.e. the ones without his vocals, it's pretty good.

The closer, Superheated, is just an amazing song, so arching, so majestic. To my mind it's great that the people like Brandon and Elly who grew up listening to New Order and whose own music was shaped and influenced by them are now collaborating with them. I wouldn't like to try to express how this album compares with their imperial Factory phase, but I already prefer this album to Sirens, not least because there were a couple of tracks on Sirens which I never 'got' no matter how many times I heard them, Dracula's Castle and Morning Night and Day and I can't say that about any of these.

chvrches aren't remotely twee unless you associate lauren mayberry's voice with "twee" which is a cool thing to project onto something

glad this thread turned into a "why are you all insulting me with your wrong taste" branwell fest

You may not be aware of this, but Matt DC and I are actually friends IRL, and teasing one another about each others' musical taste is part of that friendship? But you go ahead and interpret my posts however you like, I mean, now who's projecting?

NEW ORDER, WHAT ARE YOU DOING TO US???? *rends garments, plays "Tutti Frutti" again*

Was skimming this thread this morning and I realized I'm not sure I ever made it to the end of this album. Now I have and ... is "Superheated" the most synth-pop thing they've done? Like, total album track A-ha or something, '80s movie montage fodder maybe. Pretty cheesy.

I love Every Open Eye AND Music Complete so I'm having a great week.

Yeah, these are both great albums. The Miguel album came out on vinyl too so I'm having a great and expensive week.

The closer, Superheated, is just an amazing song, so arching, so majestic.
― Grandpont Genie

is "Superheated" the most synth-pop thing they've done? Like, total album track A-ha or something, '80s movie montage fodder maybe. Pretty cheesy.
― Josh in Chicago

Aside from being unfamiliar with A-ha's album tracks, totally agree with both opinions.

I went from dismissing the album completely to thoroughly enjoying it over the course of five or six plays. Probably wouldn't have even listened twice if it weren't for some of the positive comments in this thread, so thanks.

Number two in the albums chart, that's their best ever placing, isn't it?

technique and republic were number ones.

superheated sounds like some postal service bullshit

xpost ah right, still though..

Yeah, I've never heard A-Ha beyond the single, I just imagined it sounds like that song. Not really in a good way. Basically toss-off synth-pop album track.

I'm not following you – you imagine it sounds like "Take On Me" but you're not sure?

No, I've never heard anything by A-Ha but "Take On Me!" Honestly, I just randomly picked them as an '80s synth pop act whose album tracks I assume don't stand up to the reputation of the hit. I could have just said, I dunno, Alphaville or something.

how long have you been on ILM?

I know, A-Ha's got lots of love here, right?

I just think that last song on the New Order album is kind of lame, coming from a group whose closers are almost always awesome. "Face Up"!

Ha, I meant I am unfamiliar with non-single A-ha; didn't mean to out Josh.

http://www.pcrail.co.uk/images/norwich/aha.jpg

"Face Up!" is a bag of shit

^^^ cannot bear the thought of you

So where's Ned on this thread?

walking in the park

All of Scoundrel Days > 'Take On Me'

'Face Up' > all of Music Complete

This album just brings me such complete and utter idiot joy.

Like... there was dancing this morning. On the train platform. In Peckham.

(Gillian Gilbert meets Gillian Wearing to People On The High Line...)

Will give Scoundrel Days a shot! Does it also feature Pitbull? Has Norway ever produced a better rapper?

After a week, I can say with 100% certainty that I love Music Complete with the exception of Stray Dog. This is a great album.

This is a decent but not great album. Nothing but a fool is so untypical for new order, so restrained, so not euphoric-melancholic as all great new order used to be. And is it their longest song? More than seven minutes.

The full-length version of 'The Perfect Kiss' is longer, and yet feels a fraction of the length.

Because it's reasonably competent, the sense of disappoint lessens over time as I listen to it. Calling it a 'great album' is over-doing things however.

I call it a great album because I have 30years worth of experience, emotion, life, tied up in listening to the band. So the sound of New Order is more than the combination of guitar, bass, synth, vocals etc, it's the accumulation of riding the bus alone in Jr. High, losing my virginity, dancing all night, driving across the country etc etc. It's not an objectively great album, but it's an album that makes me happy. I can sing along to every song now after less than a week. I would never try to convince a friend to listen to it or defend the album as it relates to any of the other 'great' albums released this year. But for me, and really, that's all I care about, this is a great album.

Ah - ok...I'm not invested as a fan..even though New Order were a big part of my life in 1983 - 1987.

xpost Yeah, I can see that. Like the last OMD album, which is a pretty strong album ... if you're already well on board with almost everything the band has done. This, like that, is not trying to convince anyone, though I will say that New Order's accidental brilliance is its greatest attribute, and there are times in recent years/albums that it sounds not accidentally brilliant and just sort of lazily adequate.

Anyone else think the melodic bass stuff was mixed pretty low to prove a point?

I think the acoustic guitar in the intro to Nothing But A Fool that is replicating a Hooky style bassline is more of a FU to Hooky than anything else. Basically saying it doesn't take a special talent to play this style.

You guys are way too forgiving. I think this is their cheesiest album by far.

I agree it's their cheesiest album by far but that doesn't = a bad thing to me.

I mean...when did they forget to record synths so they didn't all sound like some cheesy Trance preset? What happened to the sound of Morris' drums? Gillian's back? Coulda fooled me.

I don't think there's any argument or statement that will make a light switch on for you and increase your enjoyment of this record so I won't respond to your questions. I'm just glad I gave the record more than a couple spins. Initially I was disappointed but the more the songs began to sink in, the more I liked them. Find myself singing along to all of them now. If you haven't heard the album in full ~5 times and you have enough interest in the band to make the effort, I recommend you do. Otherwise, they're an old band who will never reach the heights of their heyday and nobody really expects them to either.

yeah this record expanded considerably on successive listens

i still don't remember what "the game" is like though

Funny you say that, that's the one that took the longest for me as well. Part of the problem is my cycle commute is about 50mins long so I always get to Unlearn This Hatred and have to intentionally play the last 2 to get to know them. I originally hated Superheated but I woke up with the lyrics in my head this morning and put that song on first thing.

What happened to the sound of Morris' drums?

Morris' drums are the star here -- he's doing fills all over the place.

I don't remember "The Game" no matter how often I play it.

RE: the sound of the album:If you listen to Technique, and listen to the 'acid house' or 'balaeric' sounds that were current in 88/89 when the album was recorded and released, Technique does not sound like it fits in that mold. Fine Time did not sound like other acid house tunes. Republic sounded dated immediately. I think at some point you have to remove the album from the year it was recorded. In 50 years people listening to Music Complete won't associate the synth presets with any particular style. It will just sound like a synth.

I think the acoustic guitar in the intro to Nothing But A Fool that is replicating a Hooky style bassline is more of a FU to Hooky than anything else.

there's a fake-hooky bit coming out of the first chorus of Plastic that feels like a 'yes we both know who you think this is about' tease

loving it more the longer I listen

was not going to buy tickets to see comfort act, have now bought tickets and am excited

I wish "dated" wasn't used as an insult anymore.

How can a record not sound like the time when it was recorded? Is there some kind of timelessness to which a record should aspire?

I understand what Captaine Jay Vee means about Morris' drums. There's some good drumming on this album in places, but I don't think the drum sound itself is particularly great. It's noticeable for me particularly on 'Singularity' during those moments where it goes into "half-time", it sounds curiously flat and not punchy at all.

aye, there's the rub.

xpost

Soto OTM about "dated" being used as a pejorative term, it's one of my big pet hates.

I mean, even all of those so-called "classic"/"canonical" albums that folks describe as "timeless" aren't as timeless as many folks think they are. Those Beatles albums that folks have continued to cherish throughout the years may still bring a hell of a lot of enjoyment for music listeners in 2015, but they very much sound like albums recorded in the '60s on the equipment of the time - 'Tomorrow Never Knows' is no exception.

Besides, I like the fact that recordings reflect the period in which they were made, for many reasons.

I was there, maaaan with them from '85 until probably "Republic". I went with the changes because it *still sounded* like New Order. They had their sonic signature, or signatures, which surfaced pretty much up until that album in -what? 1993?. They were even there, I guess, in diminished quantities on "Get Ready" and "Siren's Call" but I feel it's gone altogether on this one. And it's not just because Hook is not there. Either way I was just surprised at how far they've crossed over into what I consider a cheesy, slick sonic palette. If you can ride with it then that's great. I no longer have the same emotional investment in artists I used to have but I do like to continue rooting from the sidelines.

Singularity was produced by Tom Rowland and I'm not sure how the drums were recorded. Recorded live then sampled and placed digitally or programmed on a computer or a mix of both. Arthur Baker asked him in the recent live Q&A but Steve was vague in his response.

I agree it sounds different but then I hear something like the last minute of Academic and it reminds me so much of Brotherhood era cuts like Way of Life or Paradise.

Again, I totally get the opinion you are stating now. It is definitely a departure. To illustrate this, even though I like the album very much, I haven't texted my buddy who used to listen to New Order a bunch and tell him to listen to it.

Nothing But A Fool is a classic

Xpost Morris drums in the modern era pretty much all electronic, which is a prob. No excuse for fake cymbals in the studio, but they sound fake/synth to me.

He's doing rolls and fills here, electronic or not.

what's wrong with fake drums

New Order have always been cheesy! It's been one of their greatest strengths over the years, the ability to mix the utterly cheesy and sentimental and even saccharine with such utter sublimity that somehow elevates all of it. Love Vigilantes is cheesy. "I think you are a pig, you should be in a zoo" is cheesy. "You got style, you got class, you got... love technique" is cheesy as fuck. Mixing the sublime and the cheese is New Order's hallmark, even more than a melodic bass with a chorus pedal on it or those fake orchestral stabs.

This is the first one I've felt like proselytising for since 1989. (OK, the thing is, Republic came out at the height of my Barney obsession, so I probably did make people listen to that record a lot. I hear that record now as "flawed, but nowhere near as bad as people make out that it is". Which is not something I can come around to on Get Ready or either Sirens. I have never got more than a Duty Listen into either Sirens.)

I think Brotherlovesdub gets to the heart of it, in terms of having a history and a long-term emotional history with a band. Obviously, you can totally grow out of a band (there are groups I listen to now, and feel absolutely nothing, even though they were very important at certain stages of my life) but having deep history and resonance with a band repeatedly soundtracking your life as you live it, as opposed to encountering their entire catalogue as a data dump, it just creates a different level of ... I dunno, I'd say tolerance for flaws? Acceptance or even joyful love of limitations? Like when someone tells me "Bernard Sumner can't sing" I'm like "I know; that's that point!" in the same way that if someone tells me "your Dad is too skinny and has a big nose" I'm like "I know, but he's my Dad, ergo he is the most handsome man who has ever lived!"

Granted, that kind of long-term love can't get me to invest Sirens Call with anything but a joyless Duty Listen. But this album, despite all the complaints other people are making about it, makes me feel validated in my long-term love, in a way that the previous two didn't. So I'm telling people who haven't given New Order a chance since 1993 to give it a listen.

As to the "dated" thing, I've been thinking about this so much recently, and on multiple different threads and even platforms.

Like, I just spent 20 minutes looking through a 70s Style blog on Tumblr, not just 70s clothes and music, but 70s furniture design, 70s stereos. And obviously that blog has been specifically curated to reflect things that look specific to "the 70s". And it's interesting to see not just the tiny micro-trends (in 1972 every single thing in the world went leopard print!) but that even though there is no unifying stylistic trend, and there were many 70s in different cultures and subcultures, and very specific different periods of the "the 70s" - the person curating that blog has a very specific idea of what constitutes "the 70s" in terms of what they have excluded as much as what they present. For me, it's much easier to see in visual art and design things that are harder to express in terms of sounds, because I don't have a language for describing sounds.

I just feel like "dated" as a pejorative means a couple of different things which are being conflated and used interchangeably: And I wonder if this is a function of "having lived through these events and being able to assign them to specific periods with specific personal memories" versus the ~eternal now~ of the streaming era.

1) Being just slightly behind the curve. Dated as being "there is nothing quite so out of fashion as that which is most recently out of fashion" - wearing a suit from 1978 in 1983 is going to look bad and dated and out of fashion and *terrible* in a way that wearing that same suit in 1993 looks retro and cool and kinda Beastie Boys hip. This is a pejorative, and I do feel that it's an accurate one. Bandwagon jumping after the bandwagon has passed is often (but not always) the sign that an artist is approaching creative bankruptcy.

^^^but the problem with this kind of "dated" is that it's so contextual. One has to be *aware* of what the fashions (sartorial or musical) *were* and what the time frame was. This is easier if you were present during that time period and that culture. (This can be a function of youth, as well as age. Being 13 in 1983 or 23 in 1983 or 40 in 1983 is going to give you a different proximity and perspective to those fashions.) And just because one is alive during that period doesn't mean one had access to that culture.

2) Stuff which just sounds "very much of its time" in terms of being an exaggerated or playful or knowingly over-stated version of the current technology. It is not necessarily a bad thing to sound "of its time" when that time, that style, that technology is something that one enjoys and appreciates. It's often tied in with retro-futurism, in that the Past's idea of what The Future would look like often takes the things that are shiny! and new! technology! and exaggerates them, producing wonderfully anachronistic 1973 visions of "A Future" that looks a lot more like 1973 than it ever looks like 1999. Appreciating or using this kind of datedness is a stylistic hallmark, is value-neutral, rather than pejorative. It can be "good" - the right kind of retro at the right time looks dazzlingly hip. It can be kitsch, or it can even be bad and lazy. But it's the use that makes it so, rather than inherent in being "Dated".

This one isn't necessarily tied to having a personal connection to a time period; it's enough to learn what the signifiers are.

So I don't think that the term "dated" is a bad term. I just think it's important to specify which usage one intends.

Oh look a whole thread about Dated

I dunno; I keep thinking about the weight of New Order, tho.

Like, the look on my boss's face when I said I thought New Order were "better than Kraftwerk" and how I don't make sweeping statements like "best band in the world" but I can never think of a band that I actually genuinely consider to be better than New Order.

But this creates a weight of expectation, that when people describe bands to me as "sounding like New Order" whether that be Delphic or Cut/Copy or Chvrches or whoever it is supposed to be this week. I just listen to them and think "no, no they don't!" They sound like a New Order flavoured band, but they don't sound like New Order the way that sweets can be strawberry-flavoured but do not actually taste in the slightest way like the strawberries that we cultivate in the community garden.

Like, I guess I can understand how someone who hasn't spent the summer weeding and pruning and clearing out and netting those strawberries to keep them from the birds won't have the emotional weight of attachment to those strawberries. And I guess I can also understand how someone can come to *prefer* the taste of "Strawberry Flavour" to real strawberries, which aren't actually that sweet when it comes down to it. And there are intensely grown bad supermarket strawberries which are watery and bland and not-good in the way that the community garden's strawberries are. But as bad as those supermarket strawberries are, they are still preferable to "strawberry flavoured". Which doesn't taste like a strawberry at all, it just tastes pink. So when someone tries to tell me that current bands are "doing New Order" better than New Order have for the past 20 years, it's like... you have the right to prefer "New Order flavour" to supermarket New Order. But don't try to tell me that 'strawberry flavour" is a strawberry. It just isn't.

OK, I'm hungry now.

Plastic could be a track from PSB's Relentless in '93 IMO. or yeah their last album; take the vocals off; same damn thing!

The threads got interesting...As well as 'dated', I think one question for me is whether a band has an identifiable essence that continues over time? If so, how strong is it?

Well, replace that idea of "essence" with something approaching... *personality* and we're getting closer to it?

Sometimes that's tied to a singer's distinctive voice (I certainly feel that way about Barney, and maybe why I didn't particularly like the previous two albums is because the guest vocalists were foregrounded too much, while on this album, with the exception of Iggy Pop (and really, who puts Iggy in the corner?) they stay in the background, as supporting players to Barney, or conversations with Barney) and sometimes it's tied to something else.

Like, with New Order, what I love about them is ... for lack of a better word DORK SWAGGER. I don't really care if Morris is "A Good Drummer" or not, or how he assembles or reconstructs his drum sounds. What I care about is the way that he has an uncanny knack of hitting a particular swagger of a beat. It's ever so slightly too slow to be properly capital-D Danceable (New Order songs are best danced to, late in an evening when everyone's a bit drunk and sloppy - the best New Order songs are the ones you can dance to while not spilling your pint) but it just has this peculiarly New Order, distinctively Mancunian dorkish roll to it. Which is a swagger, but also just has that married-couple-of-maths-professors dorky-on-holiday-in-Spain charm that Morris and Gilbert have.

Xpost Morris drums in the modern era pretty much all electronic, which is a prob. No excuse for fake cymbals in the studio, but they sound fake/synth to me.

― Josh in Chicago, Saturday, October 3, 2015 1:24 AM (14 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

He's doing rolls and fills here, electronic or not.

― The burrito of ennui (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, October 3, 2015 1:40 AM (14 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

what's wrong with fake drums

― insufficiently familiar with xgau's work to comment intelligently (BradNelson), Saturday, October 3, 2015 1:59 AM (13 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

There's plenty of acoustic drumming on this record. Of course, there's programmed-up electronic drums too, but it's not like Morris has ever stopped playing an acoustic kit and this album is no exception. Not that there's anything wrong with using electronic drums at all, of course, and there never has been anything wrong with that approach.

Absolutely nothing wrong with electronic drums! Love fake drums. But they don't sound like real drums. I'm not talking about the ur-electronic Simmons drums that sound like "pooosh" or whatever. I'm talking about current, modern electronic drums, like Roland V-drums, that are made to sound like real drums but of course don't. The last couple of times I saw him live I could have sworn he used them exclusively - fake cymbals, too - and I found it kind of distracting. I always loved the way he used to mix real drums and synth drums, but the all-synth approach sounds kind of stiff, especially coming from one of my favorite drummers of all time. He's definitely doing fills again, which is cool, but it sounds strange to me. I dunno. Maybe he's gone back to real drums and they're just recorded weird?

My fave sound, which New Order often used, is/was a mix of drum machine and analog drums. ABC's "Lexicon of Love" is this at its best, the drummer playing live in sync with programmed drums. Sounds cool.

Yeah, found this quote from him:

Previously (for the last ten years) with New Order, I used either a TD10 or TD20 V drum kit exclusively with only a real kick and snare to provide triggers.

Looking at more recent live clips it looks like he's gone back to analog, so maybe it is just the way they were recorded?

Was visiting Cleveland and went to a record store on Monday, was a pretty nice place, as I was browsing the racks I thought "this is a nice place, shame about this boring shit they're playing on the PA right now" and it was Music Complete. And I own a copy, listened to it half a dozen times last week.

(FYI I don't think anyone claimed Chvrches sound like New Order - I was making a point about the use of overfamiliar sounds still working in the right context. I do think my problem with 'Music Complete' is that it feels more 'strawberry flavour' than actual strawberry though)

Well, Chvrches don't sound much like New Order. They sound like a kind of 80s pastiche as done through a twee-ish Glaswegian kind of lens. And my point, underneath the joking, is that if you genuinely prefer the sound of that Chvrches record to the current incarnation of New Order, then we're looking for such different things in music that I don't think your observations are going to help me make decisions on music.

I mean I vastly prefer the original incarnation(s) of New Order to both, so I'm not sure where this sits in your decision-making grid.

I'm listening to Waiting For The Sirens' Call right now and it's amazing how much better it sounds.

OK now you've gone too far.

I'm being serious - trim it down to about 40 minutes and it urinates on Music Complete from a huge height.

Chvrches are also the best UK synthpop band since Pet Shop Boys.

It's a slightly odd objection to make though - two people might be looking for completely different things in 1980s throwback music, while looking for exactly the same elements in, say, drone-based techno or punk rock or dancehall. There are some genres where I would take, say, a Lex recommendation as absolutely rock-solid and others where I wouldn't trust his judgement in the slightest.

Yeah, fair enough, Matt.

I think you may have been at the exact party where AMPy first played me The Postal Service and the expression on my face on hearing Chvrches is exactly the same! Like... Why are you doing this to my ears?!?!? though I would respect her taste in stuff that was not shit indie!

But it's also kind of making a jokey riposte - fans of Chvrches object in strenuous terms when I slag them off in the same way that I go "Noooo, Barney's GREBT!" when people say "but that's the point?" level criticisms of Barney. But jokes are less funny when you explain them huh.

Chvrches sound no better that the swathes of other ex-emo rock 2007 sadsacks from Glasgow they directly inspired to also 'go electronic', if anything they have the disadvantage of featuring a singer with a voice like curdled milk

I wanted to not like this album but its catchy as hell. hooks get stuck in my head all day long. its kind of a pastiche of their career and some bits and pieces from electronic and bernards collaborations but I LOVE that shit in the first place so ...

OK I'm officially obsessed with "Tutti Frutti". I think it's the best New Order track since "Crystal", possibly even "Regret". It makes me want to meet the guy who does the spoken bits in Italian. And I want him and La Roux to be in the video, if there ever is one.

My wife asked if it was Nancy Whang singing in Tutti Frutti. The cycle of influence is complete.

Nah, 'Regret' is one of New Order's best ever tracks and 'Crystal' is one of their ten best songs since Republic. 'Tutti Frutti' is a half-decent chorus surrounded by useless guff, and the spoken Italian bits in particular are quite fucking embarrassing in a way that the spoken bits on 'Fine Time' aren't.

It is the best New Order track since Crystal though, the chorus is classic Barney lyrical genius.

'Krafty' and the title track of 'Waiting For The Sirens' Call', though... now we're talkin'!

Waiting for the Sirens Call is ütterly forgettable shite from end to end. I have never made it through that record in one go.

'Who's Joe?' dwarfs 'Restless' as an album opener in every single possible way: stronger chorus, catchier hooks, clearer production, more energy, superior singing.

Superior bass playing too, obviously.

^^^ agree.

I do appreciate how WFTSC and Music Complete both sport creamy mixes. Get Ready, the best of the three, sounds like a mixing board victim or an attempt to "rock up" the mix.

Yeah, the mastering/mix on Get Ready definitely wasn't the best it could have been. A little bit more space in the overall sound of it would have done the album a world of good.

I see no reason why I can't enjoy Get Ready. Waiting For The Sirens' Call AND Music Complete

You're welcome to! But I didn't feel the need to spend 8000 posts on the WFTSC thread saying how New Order sucked now and you were all stupid for enjoying it. Like Turrican seems intent on doing on this thread. Repeatedly. I'm just kind of bored of their schtick at this point.

You know, it's not like I can't take criticism or debate of my favourite artists, and I welcome criticism of albums which help me understand them (their strengths or weaknesses) better or put something into words that I hadn't felt or seen expressed.

But there's a point at which the same person saying "this sucks" over and over in different words just becomes really tedious. So I feel as justified in saying "we get it, you don't like this album, now go piss on someone else's chips" for the third time as Turrican feels in saying "this isn't as good as their earlier albums" for the tenth time.

Maybe someone should go and bump The Magic Whip thread then to deflect it a bit

Is that the thread were I would take the position of saying "I like it" and loads of reasoned arguments are put forward as to why I should not?

In that case, lock that thread now.

watching them play rn

https://instagram.com/p/8nO-ousG2Z/

one of their flightcases reads "JOHNNY FARTPANTS" stencilled in giant white letters

tutti frutti sounds fucking fantastic

JOHNNY FARTPANTS PARTY!!!!!!!

Yes, god forbid someone express their opinion on a piece of music on an opinion-based music-related forum, particularly a piece of music by a band the said person happens to rate highly, who wanted to like their recent album but unfortunately doesn't and has his reasons for doing so. Same deal with The Magic Whip, but that record had several folks underwhelmed, and I guess the fact that the thread has seldom been bumped since its release speaks volumes. But hey, at least I haven't called anyone an idiot because they don't like the Chvrches record, so there's that.

I've enjoyed both Branwell and Turrican's posts, and hope they both keep posting.

xpost:

In fact, I don't think I've called anyone an idiot for enjoying Music Complete either, as much as I disagree with them over the quality of the record and as much as I feel it doesn't even come close to their earlier work, not even the two or three albums that came before it.

Anyway, believe it or not, I do have something positive to say about this record, despite the fact that I've been so down on it...

I'm taking the fact that this record exists as a good sign, regardless of my feelings towards it. The vibe in the New Order camp seems upbeat and healthy, they've obviously been boosted by the injection of new blood into the line-up (even though I can't hear much of that excitement on the album itself) and, if the relations are healthy between the band members, then it's more likely that the band will make another record. Music Complete could be, and I hope it is, a dry run for something better in (again, hopefully) the near future.

oh Brandon Flowers has a writing credit on Superheated as well as vocals that's why it sounds so much like something that could have been on his album.

Definitely prefer this to the last few, it's not great but certainly better than I was expecting. Barney's vocal melodies are still a bit weak mostly but there's a lot more instrumental hooks thankfully.

The Magic Whip's thread not being bumped pretty much seals the deal as a commercial and critical flop. Can we get this info up on Metacritic?

Unlearn This Hatred is my fav. song on the album today. Restless 12" w/ mixes showed up on Spotify today as well. Bernard mentioned the Tom Rowland mix of Tutti Frutti was getting released. A+ day so far.

The Magic Whip's thread not being bumped pretty much seals the deal as a commercial and critical flop. Can we get this info up on Metacritic?

― PaulTMA, Friday, October 9, 2015 4:07 PM (21 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

While the critics were undoubtedly glad to have Blur back, and I suspect this was a huge factor in the album receiving decent reviews, really the only people to give much of a shit about The Magic Whip were the serious hardcore Blur fans. Judging from what I've seen, the album was greeted with a bit of a shrug elsewhere - yes, including by people who wanted to like it.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p034sfzk

Albarn projects get fawning reviews from broadsheets because Damon more closely resembles a broadsheet journalist than pretty much any other frontman who isn't Jarvis or, like, Richard Hawley or someone.

Or at least is more easily identifiable to them.

The 8 min 12" Extended Mix of Restless is fantastic.

Well, I wasn't much fussed about anything Damons done without Coxon, so.

Unlearn This Hatred is my fav. song on the album today.

That's the one track I'm tempted to skip every time I play the album . . . giving it time though considering I was ready to write off the entire record the first time I heard it.

I like "Unlearn This Hatred" because it sounds to me like New Order remixing Richie Hawtin

I love the part from 1:55 - 2:32 on Unlearn This Hatred and again at 3:03 ish when it drops back into what sounds like the Chemical Bros. The track has def. grown on me over time. It's interesting that this song started with the lyrics and the band wrote the music to fit the words. Apparently the only time New Order have written a song like that.

.. And now I have Blur emailing me: No I do not want a yellow vinyl copy of "Parklife", and your noms for "Best Album" and "Best act in the world today" will most likely stay that way: Noms.

i know v little about new order but my impression of the show i saw today was:

music - tick really quite vg

lyrics - yeeesh

singing - well, if lou reed can get away with it so can he

Yeah, we've been thinking that since "Procession", dude!

I saw footage from a live New Order concert, not sure which one, but it cemented in me the certainty that this was a band I was probably never, ever going to see live if I wanted to continue to like them.

They are terrible live.

Seeing them next month for the first time. I am not expecting much

I don't know if I just have extraordinary good luck or abysmal standards when it comes to Barney's vocals but I've seen them maybe 3 times live, and never had a bad experience? It may be fine!

(Granted, once was in 1993, once was at a festival and the other was at Brixton Academy I think, which was small enough to feel really intimate and special.)

they were terrible live in the 80s, but I saw them three years ago and they were absolutely fantastic. one of the best shows I've ever seen.

I would really rather see New Order live in 2015 than see Kraftwerk live in 2015 TBH.

As long as he doesn't dance, whistle or whoop, you could be in for a good night.

You really only need to see Kraftwerk live 1 time in your life. New Order can actually pull a good show out of the hat, but they're few and far between.

I saw them during their second of two western hemisphere tours in 2004: I was enthralled and took a nice cat nap. No need for a repeat.

I would still bang Ralf Hütter in 2015. Would you bang 2015 Bernard Sumner, that is the question!

(I know, I know; shut up and take a bromide, Branwell!)

Sumner was unbangable after 1991. Plus, he's probably an asshole.

I've seen them twice, Reading Festival before one split/rest, and Hyde Park with The Specials and Blur.

Both were fine but the first one was the best one.

the Reading show is the 1998 show, right? Boy, they were on fire.

Sounds about right, yes.

Saw them twice: 1985 (righteous!) and then again in 1989. The Sugarcubes and P.I.L. opened for them in '89 and The Sugarcubes were so great that I couldn't help but be disappointed by NO. OK with never wanting to see them again.

I just have to get one line, and that line gives birth to another line, and that line gives birth to the next line, and so on. Then it starts taking form. When you’ve got four lines, you think, “Where could it go from here?”

Is ... is Bernard talking with pride about his lyric-writing process

Sumner is one of the few lyricists where I might be interested in their writing process because I just want to know, what made him think that was a good idea? Does he actually *work* on them, is it just stream of consciousness (what I always assumed) or things that rattle around in his head? Is he telling fictional little stories? (Obviously, sometimes yes) but the idea that he sits down and *crafts* them... tell me more about how that works?

come on, when he gets it right they are transcendent

I know they can be totally transcendent but you are as aware as I am just how hit and miss they are! To the point where I do wonde if it's just totally random, and the transcendence is totally projected by the listener? It's not "consistently profound with the occasional clanger" or "consistently awful with the occasional flash of insight through sheer chance" it's so completely all over the shop: banal, sublime, absurd, nonsensical, transcendent. Consistently good or consistently terrible would indicate some process. But Barney's quality seems to come completely by random chance!

"you got me where it hurts but i don't care" is a great line, but then immediately followed by "cause i know i'm ok whenever you are there" and it's like dude, those two things don't go together, one directly contradicts the other. the first is a recognition of the paradox of loving someone who makes you feel pain, the second is a pseudo-psychological banality (which continues in subsequent lines, like he really didn't know what he had in that first line)

Every indication seems to be that lyrics remain a chore. He sits down with a bottle of wine and cobbles sentences together. I notice the lyrics less on this album because he buries his voice in the mix.

I have an enormous amount of affection for his terrible lyrics. One of the times I genuinely felt "ah, it's good to have you back" was when I heard the "I want a nice new car / A girlfriend who's as pretty as a star" couplet.

Same here. The lyrics and voice are indivisible. If he were a better singer, the same lyrics would be horrifying.

Didn't he say Republic or Technique was the first album he wrote all the lyrics by himself? I think it's a chore for him to write them and don't think he likes the process very much. His lyrics are terrible overall. If you like a lyric before 89, it's likely it wasn't written by Bernard.

Technique.

I guess maybe the o_0 terrible lyrics only serve to reinforce the brilliance of the profound lyrics when they come round. I mean, yeah, I feel a huge amount of long-term affection. So it's not as if I'm complaining. More just marvelling that after 35 years he hasn't got any better (or substantially worse)!

After listening to the Gilbert-Morris axis and Hook's own solo lyrics, I think it's easy to distinguish Bernard's. For one, he's funny, readier to throw a line in bad taste when things are getting too serious.

Rob Gretton helped as well. Could be a false memory but I think he got credit/blame for the 'piss off' line in Your Silent Face.

line & vocal on yr silent face are so exemplary of what's beautiful & bold & unusual about new order i think

I've seen New Order five times iirc and easily the best was Brixton Academy in 2005. They seemed really tight and fired up. Incredible setlist too: opened with Ceremony > Love Vigilantes > Crystal, ended with True Faith > BLT > Love Will Tear Us Apart > Temptation > Blue Monday, encored with Shadowplay > Warsaw > She's Lost Control.

Only seen New Order live once - Old Trafford Cricket Ground (or whatever it's called), 2002. Thought they were excellent.

I was browsing in HMV this afternoon, (I don't usually, thesedays) and the new album came on (in a selection of some other albums), it sounded that good, I nearly danced. I didn't though..

They sound pretty good on the Maida Vale session.

But Barney's quality seems to come completely by random chance!

otm post of course, but more than that I hadn't thought about how mysterious the variability in the lyrics is. Thanks for making New Order strange again!

New Order was amazing live, when I saw them in 2013. Much more energetic and engaging than I was expecting, all members in good form. I've seen a heck of a lot of disappointing live shows from acts I love that are past their prime (Devo e.g., much as I love them), but New Order was not one of them.

Yeah, honestly, the New Order writing process is pretty much inscrutable. It's all but impossible to discern who does what, who writes what, etc., - a la the VU - and that's not even accounting for whatever each respective producer brings to the project, or who is doing the programming behind the scenes and such. I think what makes the band so frequently accidentally brilliantly is that collectively I'm not sure how much they care(d), which means they don't toil too long on each song/album, which I think is the downfall of a lot of acts. New Order just sort of stumbles around in the studio and comes up with something cool. Or so not cool it's cool. I do know Johnny Marr has expressed his love for Barney's playing, which I've always heard as a detail-minded dude in total control of his instrument admiring his opposite for being able to come up with neat stuff minus the baggage an A+ muso can't leave behind.

I saw NO live three times; once after "Sirens' with Hooky, and twice in the past few years in support of nothing, really, but with Gillian, and both of those shows were much better than the Sirens tour, which did ahve too much Barney whooping and dancing; the last two shows had 586 and Your Silent Face and awesome videos in the background and proper live version sof Love will Tear Us Apart without whooping.

I think I am having the same issue with this album that I had with The Magic Whip: I really dig the music, but the vocals let the tracks down, although not down far enough that I can dismiss any of the songs. I made an instrumental edit of "People On The High Line" that I like better than the original. I do love "Tutti Frutti" though, perhaps because I associate the deep-voiced guy with the main guy singing on Gunther's "Tutti Frutti Summer Love" (which is total Eurodance cheese, but I love it).

IDGI! The idea of New Order songs without Barney is like the idea of a cheese sandwich without pickle. Why would you do that? It's the sourness that makes the creaminess of the cheese so good!

The recent Noel Gallagher remix album has a bunch of tracks rendered with and without his vocal.

I enjoy the 'without' tracks much more than the 'with'.

Then again, Barney's sourness is as nothing compared to Noel's.

For now, Academic is my favourite on this (tho I can imagine most people considering it as filler)

cheese sandwiches with pickles sound disgusting

"pickle" is a chutney in this construction

Then I withdraw the statement.

I suddenly had a vision of pickle chutney.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/10/30/article-2225194-15C1F31A000005DC-400_634x433.jpg

Branston. With an N.

Took a break from this album for a few days and then came back to it, starting with Academic and playing the 2nd half first. This album is so fun, so solid straight through, that it's going to work its way in to my top 5 New Order albums list with ease. The BBC Maida Vale set was pretty good. I think i'll make an effort to see them play this stuff live. They sound great already.

Tutti Frutti is the next single. 11min Hot Chip remix. Pretty excited for that.

This album actually made me download Bernard Sumner's autobiography. (Not that I think the record is particularly autobiographical, it's just that it rewoke my interest in the guy.)

After a couple of weeks, I like this album more and more. Like, side 2 has opened up wonders on repeated listens. I didn't give it as much time when I first got the album, because the run of pop tunes on Side 1 was so compelling. But I get things like Nothing But A Fool and Unlearn This Hatred stuck in my head at odd times, and I want to dig them out and scratch that itch. My morning commute, I start at the beginning and listen until I get to my office. The afternoon commute I start on Academic and go round.

The only thing I am not 100% on is the Iggy song. It's not bad, by any stretch, it's just not at the high level of the rest of the album, and thusly non-essential. But it does kind of function as a pivot between the two halves of the album. (And it spells out most explicitly the theme of the album: make an active choice to hold onto people in your life, or you will lose them.)

Yeah. I like the Iggy track, it's sort of "light relief" - I guess some people would rather have another pure NO track but if you call it an 'extra' I think it's fine.

I have to say I d/l the Bernard autobiog, it's alright and it is a fair counterbalance for Hooky's book, but I did find that one much better. Was it because it came first? I dunno,..

"Unlearn This Hatred" is the one that refuses to get stuck in my head. I finally got a hook(y) out of "The Game."

Ha, I love New Order, less Nu-Order, but I love that y'all have clearly listened to this album more than I've listened to maybe any album, new or old, in the past year. That's some due diligence. Anyway, makes me want to give it a shot to determine if it's worth giving another shot as something I'd want to listen to more than once every few years.

Like I said, it's as good as WFTSC and GR, which means a yearly spin is about right.

I once again wish more bands, New Order included/especially, would revert to releasing stand alone singles every several months or years. If anything, Sirens and Get Ready and even this one demonstrate that more New Order is always a good thing, but I'm not sure exactly how much New Order is needed.

Yeah, I remember singles.

I think they said they were thinking about just recording a bunch of EPs instead of an album a few years ago but that didn't happen obviously.

Here's the Hot Chip mix (video stream seems to be regionally restricted and unauthorized): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ry4T3vUmDm4

3 seconds in and I love this

now that is good stuff

Yeah, this has a nice tip o the hat to the glory days of New Order. Going back to the album version of Tutti Frutti made me associate that album version more with the old Boys Own style NY house / garage feel back in the early 90s. I think Heller and Farley could turn in a sweet mix if they were given a chance.

Not available in my region but I am kinda allergic to Hot Chip.

Soundcloud link sounds higher quality to me: https://soundcloud.com/neworderofficial/new-order-tutti-frutti-hot-chip-remix

This Hot Chip track is cool. Honest question, since I'm shaky on this stuff, but when did remixes essentially become remakes?

sometime around 1985

I'd say the early 90s but I think that question is probably tied more to when a particular technology became available or computer software reached a certain capability.

I'm with the detractors here. There's something I can't stand about everything Hot Chip does and this is no exception :/

There is literally nothing in that mix that I would associate with Hot Chip if I hadn't been told it was them who did the mix, but ok.

hot chip remix is great, joe goddard is a genuinely great remixer

Ugh, that Hot Chip remix is absolutely and completely DIRE. Like, seriously, dude took every single thing that was good about that track and just stripped it out, turning it into the most tedious, flat, one-gear dirge with all the fun and playfulness and joy stripped out of it.

Seriously, I'm going to go and listen to the Arthur Baker 12" remix of Confusion eight times in a row to remind myself of what New Order remixes can sound like when someone with a good sense of BASS does it.

I dunno, I quite like it. I'll have to make me a CD single of both versions and decide which I prefer, I guess..

Damn, I posted and the youtube play stopped. I forget that happens.

The box sets are sporadically being sent out and includes download codes for the extended versions. All between 7 and 10 minutes in length. No sign of mine showing up yet so I've not heard them. Getting impatient!

Oh great. Twice the agony.

Oh great. Twice the pleasure.

Can't wait for my copy to arrive.

You can listen to the extended tracks online here:

http://www.radionomy.com/en/radio/neworder/index

Some fan is broadcasting his copies on a loop

(Sorry Turrican)

Saw them last night here in Brussels. They were fantastic. Tight, relaxed and clearly enjoying it. No whooping.
Oh and I couldn't have asked for a better setlist (tho would have preferred swapping the mandatory JD encore for some a couple of extra new songs). Tutti Frutti slayed.

Will gladly pay to see them play Lonesome Tonight. New versions of BLT and Waiting for the Sirens Call sound good too on the youtube recordings I watched.

The actual box of the box set is a flimsy, cheap piece of shit held together with freaking staples. Out of the 30+ vinyl box sets I own, It's the absolute worst. Good thing I like the extended versions.

you don't have sudden sway's "Spacemate" box then? Cause that's pretty thin.

Mind you, its supposed to be, probably.

"Nothing But a Fool" is slaying me today. Best chorus on the album, and one of the few, genuinely moving sets of lyrics in their entire catalogue.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qvffYeNJyM

Yeah.

.. back in happier times:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JK9B5S8M5Qg

This record is still woeful, IMO.

This record is still great, IMO.

yes.

Thought this album popped up on shuffle and I was kind of into it, then noticed it was "Lost Sirens," which I hated on first listen but which I apparently could not distinguish from this one, which I thought I liked better but admittedly still did not give much time.

Good capsule review.

Huh, just occurred to me that "Stray Dog" actually sounds quite a bit like Yello, a similarity only emphasized by Iggy's gruff talkyvox.

i relistened to most of this this past weekend and really liked it. I kind of forgot that it came out.

It's easily my favorite of the albums since Get Ready (all of which I am a fan of, btw)

agreed

I still think the highpoints of Get Ready and Waiting For The Sirens' Call are superior to anything on the new one. I'm still completely baffled by comments of it being a return to form, because a return to the form of Low-Life or Technique it certainly ain't!

Apart from 'Lost Sirens', they never lost their form to begin with - so Music Complete is just another great NO album, period.

Sumner lost form circa Republic. He managed to climb out of that dip to a point, but not to the level of the '80s work.

Most of the 80s albums are patchy as hell, though

Tooti
FROO.TI.

I still love Music Complete. Great album.

yes

should have voted for it in the albums poll tbh.

About to see these guys live and Hookless, but if losing him means losing Regret from the setlist, I just as soon they wouldn't bother. My expectations are conspicuously in check.

Don't they have a ringer?

Two!

Saw them do "Regret" sans Hook in San Francisco in 2014 and it was great so I doubt that is the reason for it being dropped from the set. They seem to be playing more from the new album on this tour. Wish I was seeing them again.

Ok, the dude playing Hook is having a blast.

They've added a second bassist? That sounds both hilarious and an actually good idea

Still not really sure what Gillian does, but it's nice to see her up there.

Xpost no, just a bassist and extra guitar, sorry!

Would love if they had two bassists!

she plays synths and mimes guitar, what do you want

they just announced a few dates in Sydney with an orchestra which sounds interesting but a bit strange.

I guess that's the Vivid second announcement

and extra guitar

if you mean Marionbloke, he was in the band with Hook for six or seven years

It's always disjointing to have triggered female backing vocals when the one woman on the stage never sings. But she's cool, love Gillian.

Yeah, Tom Chapman and Phil Cunningham. Forget which was in Bad Lieutenant.

But previously he was subbing for Gillian. Now he's just extra.

Temptation killing it tonight. True Faith was pretty ace too.

Forget which was in Bad Lieutenant.

Both played with Bad Lieutenant, actually.

pretty sure it's Phil playing with Electronic in this live Vivid clip from TFI: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Ux2AIFFEZE

If you're criticising *Gillian Gilbert's* musical competence in a band that also contains Bernard Sumner, (Sumner, one of the most inept guitarists to ever have a career), all you are doing is displaying your chauvinism. Leave it out. It's deeply tedious at this point.

They're both really, really good at playing New Order songs after many years of practice, but you wouldn't want either one teaching musical technique in schools.

Who said anything about competence? One of my favorite thing about the band is that everyone except Stephen is really to some degree of rudimentary. But she doesn't move, and while she did add a third guitar to Ceremony, her keyboard is always set up so that I literally have no idea what she is doing. I mean, I know she's triggering some stuff, but there were times when Stephen and Phil were doing that, too, and l couldn't discern what she was adding. Like Fletch in Depeche Mode, but even more hidden. Doesn't hurt the band, but it's strange to see a group with an added member and the return of a longtime member that sounds exactly the same as before. Maybe they are just all doing less, and she didn't do much before?

how do you know Stephen and Phil weren't playing stuff either?

Judging from videos she's usually playing one particular synth part with the rest being additional sequencers or backing tracks. It's not surprising it'd be hard to tell which one though, especially when a few of them are on keyboards.

Gillian doesn't have to sing, does she?

Xpost I could see them playing. Phil's rig is turned to the side, and Stephen is hitting everything in sight. But you're right, it's possible no one was doing anything! Hence the genius of New Order.

And no, she doesn't sing. Can she?

Anyway, it reminded me of when I saw the Beach Boys a few years ago and 7 people on stage were holding guitars.

I know she's on "Ceremony" single, and she does sing a lot on The Other Two records.

No, it's because of someone saying about the triggered female backing vocals..

Yeah, that was me. It's weird to hear female vox and they're not coming from her. Not that I expected them, but it's conspicuous.

Anyway, it reminded me of when I saw the Beach Boys a few years ago and 7 people on stage were holding guitars.

If this was the Brian-band+others 50th anniversary reunion Beach Boys, Al Jardine was low in the mix apart from a wee solo or two, but was playing when he actually had a guitar, Mike's bandleader guy was there for his vocals, but was playing, David Marks was v obviously there for solos and additional leads as nobody knows who he is and you could hear him scrobbling away over the top of the rockier songs, and Brian's multi-instrumentalists played as and when.

But if you're talking about mysterious deceptive stage keyboards, Bruce Johnston's electric piano was at most appearing in his own foldback, and may have been made of cardboard.

(If you mean Mike Love's Contractually Legal Beach Boys Band, I can't imagine he'd pay anyone to tour who wasn't playing 99% of the time, and possibly driving a truck as well.)

(Well, there's that thing again: Mike Love being right about dropping the "real" beach boys, but boooo anyway)

I actually might give this another listen later on and give it another chance.

Hray!

I think I've actually warmed to it a little this go-round, but mostly on the more electronic tracks rather than the guitar-led ones. I still don't think it's anywhere near Technique or the first Electronic album, and I still think the best of Get Ready and Waiting For The Sirens' Call are better than the best on this. But, the first half of the album (well, actually from 'Singularity' to 'People On The High Line') and 'Superheated' didn't sound all that bad to me this time around. Weirdly, I quite enjoyed 'Academic' the most of the guitar stuff... that one just passed me by when the album first came out.

'Restless', 'Stray Dog', 'Unlearn This Hatred' and 'The Game' all had me reaching for the skip button, tbh.

I already forget what new songs they played last night, besides "Tutti Frutti." I do know they played pretty radically remixed versions of "Waiting for the Sirens Call" and "True Faith," the former sort of in line with the stuff on the new album.

They also renamed "Blue Monday" "Green Thursday" and passed around a silly plastic St. Patrick's Day hat.

I like the relentlessness of "Academic," as if it wants to prove its title right. It doesn't change temp.

I love "Unlearn This Hatred". "Nothing But A Fool" is a forgotten favourite, I don't like the start but once it gets going I get into it. Nice wee "Everything's Gone Green" nod at the end and as clunky as the lyrics can be this one has a little personal relevance at the monent.

'Nothing But A Fool' has a nice ending section, it just seems to take an eternity to get there!

I still have no idea why 'Academic' completely just went by me without leaving any kind of impression months ago, but this time around the opening guitar lick just drew me in. I've just had to listen to it again!

I think the nice ending section is a reward for patience.

The extended mix of Academic turns it into a long-lost Technique classic. It's improved in the remix, in my opinion.

post it

I'm surprised it's not on youtube.

I'm really struggling to imagine what 'People On The High Line' would have sounded like with Hook on board. It sounds like the kind of track they couldn't have made with him, or if they had it would have sounded very different.

TOOTI

FROOTI

Stumbled across this thread tonight: as a fan since Power, Corruption, & Lies, I would say that there's one 10/10 song here in Tutti Frutti, which would have sat proudly on Technique. Plastic might be another great song if they had dispensed with its coda: most of the songs here would benefit from editing - for example, Nothing But A Fool could say everything it has to say in 3 or 4 minutes instead of 7. Still, as someone said above, when a band has been part of your life for decades, you're just glad that they made a new record with one great song on it.

'Tutti Frutti' has a great chorus, but I think the verses could have been better.

http://pitchfork.com/news/64491-new-order-announce-expanded-edition-of-music-complete/

Yep, here comes "Complete Music" - all the expanded versions from the big box.

looks like after they get this release out they're going to become realtors.

The 10-track EP of "Singularity" remixes that is now up on Spotify is a slog to listen to in one sitting, but the Errol Alkan Extended Mix and a couple of the other mixes that reframe the song as more of a pure synth/sequencer-driven track along the lines of "Plastic" are an improvement over the album mix, in my opinion.

The 10th track is a Tom Rowlands remix of "Tutti Frutti" that throws everything and the kitchen sink into the mix, but is pretty fun to listen to.

Tried this album again last night but couldn't get past the third track IIRC.

The running order for this album could be re-arranged in any conceivable way, and I still wouldn't be able to get past three tracks.

your loss
I feel like a sucker but caved in and impulse-bought the new extended version

Is that 'extended' as in extra songs, or as in average track-length now 12 minutes?

New Order - Music Complete

Extended versions are on the whole fantastic - loving this album more than ever ("Superheated" probably the only song I never warmed up to).