2017 Arcade Fire LP

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zC30BYR3CUk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1tAYmMjLdY

I laughed out loud when the Dancing Queen bit came in. It's the first song I've kind of enjoyed of theirs in years.

Another important detail:

https://www.residentadvisor.net/news.aspx?id=39154

sounds like the scissor sisters lol

Another important detail:

https://www.residentadvisor.net/news.aspx?id=39154

― yesca

It does have a similar feel to Touch from Random Access Memories when it gets going.

This song is better than anything they've done after 'Funeral'. They completely lost me with after that album, but this is good.

I'm really confused by ppl saying this is the best thing they've done in a decade bcz to my ears this sounds like a song they have already made like 6 times

also guys do you think this will be the 2nd to last track of the record?

I expected to hate this. I don't. But that's about the extent of it.

Have they made this song already?

I just think everything after Funeral was way too self-indulgent, aspiring to reach U2 levels of arena rock, which really, completely put me off. If this new one is a sign of things to come I might get on board again. It is an incredible earworm too tbh.

Neon Bible is my favorite album of theirs. I don't know if anything after that one was more or less pompous, but I just didn't care anymore.

Weird that you'd find this one to be them somehow pulling back on aspiration, though...there's a huge choir part.

I enjoy the ABBA-ness.

What I'm not sure about is the fact that it also reminds me of this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGMabBGydC0

It is weird! I think to me it sounds a lot like them grooving out and not take themselves way too seriously? (I mean, they did with Funeral, but that was their debut album, and I took that very serious as well). Not figured it out yet as per the new one. They'd lost me completely after Funeral, and while this is thoroughly different, it sounds good to me idk.

xp

It's alright for what it is. I don't like it nearly as much as "Black Mirror" or "Reflektor" (the track). I've never liked an LP of theirs from beginning to end, though.

Funeral was so good but it's strange to me that nearly everything since has been a straight up pastiche of something. didn't expect it would be ABBA this time but it at least has a nice lightness to it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_sKqFkReZk

Le Bateau Ivre, you should really give Reflektor a chance, if you haven't already. It sounds quite a lot like a bunch of stuff from that record. I love the Hancock-sample :)

My phone's been blowing up for 24 hours because I spent a decade in a band called Everything, Now!

http://everythingnowmusic.bandcamp.com

(also, that single is pretty vanilla)

https://scontent.fybz1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/18835646_10158920585745151_5843268488750753195_n.jpg

https://scontent.fybz1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/18835646_10158920585745151_5843268488750753195_n.jpg?oh=eb648f9ed1dfd54b9931850834b7a441&oe=59E07BB2

Freely translated back: 'hmm… a trifle.'

@Fred, it's not something high on my list but will give it 'nother go.

I love Funeral, Neon Bible half of it and then haven't felt like listening to them again.

The Suburbs was so boring that I almost gave up on them, but Reflektor has some quite good stuff. I mean, it's overlong, and Everything Now kinda trumps a lot of attempts at similar dancey stuff on it, but it's worth giving a shot.

I really, really, really like this new on :) So joyful. Looking forward to shouting along when they play Roskilde this summer.

Suburbs is their best album by far (though Funeral made the bigger impression on me at the time)

New single sounds just like their last album

Will also rep for Suburbs as (maybe) their best album.

Kinda last me with Reflektor. Will check new one out based on the single, which I liked.

lost not last*

New single sounds just like their last album

Funeral and Neon Bible only. Neon Bible is better.

Funeral >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the rest of it is O.K. and wouldn't have got noticed without Funeral. I'm going super stretch this comparison but whatever: The Grammy for 'The Suburbs' is kind of like the indie rock equivalent of Scorcese getting an Oscar for 'The Departed'.

haha I can see that

anyway Neon Bible has good songs but they're lost in the terrible production - muddy, weak and cluttered

*sighs*

It's this fucking lot again.

I don't particularly like them, enjoy a few previous songs, but the new single is ridiculous yet not bad. It's catchy but there are some very silly aspects (the mentioned abba hook, the flute breakdown - borderline spinal tap territory, the everything now chanting part that sounds like simple minds' alive and kicking prechorus...).

Funeral and Suburbs are both great, the second is probably the better "album." Neon Bible has its moments but I don't play it much. Reflektor, I'm honestly not sure I've listened to the whole thing.

I wrote upthread the sample was Hancock, but it's of course this tune:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m56H4E5bZLk

Love it.

I first heard that song through ILX, and imagine Win Butler did the same. Though apparently it's on a pretty influential compilation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xzwicesJQ7E

They've always incorporated New Order into their music but the beginning foundation of this track is about as obvious a nod as it gets.

the "first record" reference is clever but I can't help think the new Killers single trumps them for cheese appeal

decent song but subtlety was never a strong point with these guys huh

I like the Francis Bebey sample

Funeral is their best album because it doesn't sound like a DFA b-sides compilation heard through a thin wall, and neither was it recorded in a big echoey church

haha

rly loving the new track

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-w1GeH8KPU

Lmao nailed it

Just listened and am having trouble not hearing Creature Comfort as a bit of InBetween Days over Love Missile F1-11, but it's pretty damned flashy. I'm a little dazzled right now.

Just got a pop-up ad for a combination fidget spinner/USB drive combo promoting the new album. I assume it is part of their high-concept gag marketing push?

Incidentally, there seems to be broader industry stuff afoot. AF sign to Columbia, War On Drugs sign to Atlantic ... why do these bands need to jump indie ship now, when it would seem that the majors (as such) have less to offer than ever?

AF has less to offer than ever, too, so it might be a good fit? Idk.

Incidentally, there seems to be broader industry stuff afoot. AF sign to Columbia, War On Drugs sign to Atlantic ... why do these bands need to jump indie ship now, when it would seem that the majors (as such) have less to offer than ever?

Arcade Fire can already sell out arenas, win Grammys, etc. They've sold millions of records at this point, certainly more than many major labels, and all on an indie that I assume gives them very favorable royalties. I wonder what more they really want and, again, what a major can give them that Merge can't? If anything, the last AF album was affiliated with a (different) major, Capitol/Universal, and fwiw was the group's lowest selling album in the US (though not by a huge margin).

Anyway, maybe answering my question, here's some 2013 piece about how hard it's been for indie-isa bands to break the glass singles ceiling:

http://pitchfork.com/thepitch/128-reflektor-debuts-at-1but-why-havent-arcade-fire-conquered-the-singles-chart/

Arcade Fire can already sell out arenas, win Grammys, etc. They've sold millions of records at this point, certainly more than many major labels, and all on an indie that I assume gives them very favorable royalties. I wonder what more they really want and, again, what a major can give them that Merge can't?

I'm pretty sure Merge know jack fucking shit about how to properly promote anything.

If you just want to make Art, that's probably okay. If you want to become a global brand, it's not.

#realtalk

By what metric can the band be judged even more successful beyond even bigger record sales, which no one save a handful of acts are garnering? Short of hiring Max Martin or some other writer/producer ringer, not sure there's anything a major can offer. I'd love to hear your (or anyone's) alternative perspective.

I never liked this band--far too overwrought and anthemic, kind of an indie-but-stadium U2 vibe. But a friend played me the song with the Francis Bebey sample/interpolation and it sounds a lot more fun than what little I remember of them previously. I mean, if indie rock has to exist, at least it can be more of a Talking Heads/Knight Rider theme song/Daft Punk/Stereolab/LCD Soundsystem-inspired thing(aka third hand dance/funk/pop) than a Beat Happening/God Speed You Black Emperor hybrid. With all of the terrible stuff involving Barney the Purple Dinosaur level twee singalongs and "Hey! Ho!" and clapping Urban Outfitters bullshit I have to hear on the Pandora at work, I'll take this over that.

This is why I don't want to hear indie rock, though--it just brings out my crotchety old man qualities.

I never liked this band--far too overwrought and anthemic, kind of an indie-but-stadium U2 vibe.

One interesting narrative I've seen crop up with the last two records is this idea that somehow they are just now taking on dance music - I don't think people with these opinions have been listening closely enough. If you go back and listen to "Neighborhood #1" and "Crown of Love", both of them explode at their climaxes with straight up disco rhythms, and "Neighborhood #4" is straight up indie extended mix electronic driving beat music.

Since that record I've had a bit of love hate with the band. On 'Funeral' I felt like they really balanced that anthemic and earnest quality with some decent poetry and inspired songwriting. Fast forward to 'Reflektor' and you have sloppy groove numbers with some really obnoxious art nonsense. They just don't have the taste to cash the checks they write with some of these lyrics and creative statements, and while I like "Everything Now" it is really teetering on the brink of goofy.

By what metric can the band be judged even more successful beyond even bigger record sales, which no one save a handful of acts are garnering?

Shakespeare gotta get paid, son.

According to this post from 2014 booking AF costs around 1,000,000 to 1,500,000. That puts them on the same league as Bruno Mars, Rolling Stones, Elton John, Aerosmith... they didn't need the big label money.

https://consequenceofsound.net/2014/06/still-want-to-book-your-favorite-band-heres-how-much-itll-actually-cost/

I get that. But by a really rough estimate they've sold maybe 4 million records to date, maybe more than that, all more or less on Merge. Figure a generous profit split with Merge and that's a huge hunk of change. Factor in sold out tours, festival dates, etc., and the band is doing really, really well. Now, while I concede it's possible in this day and age that a major could somehow match what the band got from Merge, at least in theory, I really don't see how a major can give the band more than Merge got them. I dunno. Back in the day a move to a major could be beneficial, from a financial or distribution or promotion vantage, but now, at this stage, it seems a parallel move at best. Maybe I'm missing something? Is it a coincidence that after a long, seemingly successful run Spoon also left Merge not long ago?

xpost

i've seen the occasional mention in interviews lately that some major labels are now offering 'indie' bands more favourable deals than they used to, so that may be part of the war on drugs etc signing to them

especially considering that, it seems like a natural enough move for arcade fire since they were playing arenas last tour and all

According to this post from 2014 booking AF costs around 1,000,000 to 1,500,000.

That puts them on the same league as Bruno Mars, Rolling Stones, Elton John, Aerosmith... they didn't need the big label money.

When people ask "what can a major provide?" the answer is a corporation-backed marketing and advertising machine. If you think that's something you can just get by Getting on the Internet with Dreamweaver and YouTube then you probably need to ask yourself why Facebook and Google both have market capitalizations of > $400bil and what powers those efforts. There are obvious outliers to this model but outliers always exist and it's dangerous to use them as examples of change or models you should base your decisions on.

BTW, I'm not arguing against indie labels and indie sensibilities - they are obviously more important than ever in our dumb popular culture. I'm just talking about the reasons for why an artist or group or team signs up for that kind of arrangement. When you suggest that Arcade Fire make more than enough money I think their actions should communicate to you that they don't think so.

Daft Punk are not on Soma anymore either.

Is "Everything Now" an obvious single? It feels out of place in 2017 and not in a game changer kind of way. It lacks the immediacy needed for mainstream breakthrough material imho. Not that that's a bad thing.

If a major label got interested it wasn't for their potential as a singles band, but for the success of the band as a live act and all the indie cred that Funeral got them. They're looking at the albums charts not the singles one is what I'm trying to say.

Also I don't know what the hell I'm talking about but when you've accomplished so much without the help of a big label it seems like the best move is not to sell everything to a major label but to merge for distribution rights worldwide. Take for example what Major Lazer or MIA did with "Lean On" and "Paper Planes" respectively. Both huge worldwide hits created on an indie label (Mad Decent, XL) but handled distribution and promotion worldwide by major labels (Warner, Interscope)

But then it's all nonsense without knowing the actual numbers and clauses behind each deal. If Arcade Fire did it, it must have been for the better.

I just hate so much the damage big labels did for music in the past 30+ years that it saddens me to see one of the biggest acts in the indie scene to jump boat and join the enemy. They were the chosen ones dammit.

I have heard (take it with a grain of salt obviously) that key members had been dying to leave Merge at the earliest opportunity and that the relationship between Merge and said members was not particularly...good. (Notice Merge were not thanked in their Grammy speech.)

10 years in, many millions of dollars at stake, I could totally see someone bristling and wanting a change. Like I noted above, even Spoon is off Merge now, back to Matador, the label that way back when first signed them before they left, disastrously, for a major label. The question remains, though, at this point what can a major label offer them that Merge could not? Maybe Merge itself was the problem, not the services it provided.

If a band's needs exceed a label's resources, both parties get frustrated.

Sure, but again, I've been wondering out loud what a major label can offer Arcade Fire that Merge cannot. Obviously money seems like the number one culprit, but I really can't conceive of a major label offering more favorable terms than whatever the band gets on Merge. As for promotion, distribution, that sort of thing, I really don't feel like Merge has been lacking. At least, I don't see how anybody could make those claims, considering the band's sales, sell out tours, that sort of thing. They will never be lacking for success. Could be just old fashioned irreconcilable differences.

*makes an overt throat-clearing sound*

http://alchemisteating.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/566x642xglass-of-water.jpg.pagespeed.ic.Ku3oLTsPTw.jpg

I actually don't know the reasons behind the new move but "irreconcilable differences" and/or "they didn't mention Merge on a speech" are not the reason. I've been to Merge offices and know their staff and know what they're capable of, and the same with Columbia. "Money" is not it, Columbia is a big label with staff and connections, Merge is a small label that otherwise puts out Caribou records. Idk, we're talking about the difference between a staff of twenty and a staff of hundreds. It's not just about who offers more money

It also might have something to do with Live Nation but I don't follow that side of the business because it makes me feel shitty

I referenced the speech only as a potential indicator of discontent, not the cause/source of ~beef~ or w/ever

I do understand the confusion, I mean the last three albums on Merge were all released in all possible formats, in multiple editions, with distribution everywhere (though I guess there was major label help with that?), with elaborate artwork and marketing campaigns, what I have to assume were substantial recording budgets, etc. In terms of actual, material differences, it's not really clear to me either where the advantage lies.

"Reflektor" was helped by a major, and sold less than "The Suburbs" (which itself has sold significantly more than "Funeral").

xpost I trust your opinion more than most, but still can't figure this out (as far as armchair weekend distraction goes). Staff of dozens, staff of hundreds - they can't really become more popular a draw as a live act, I don't see them selling significantly more records. So I think it has to be about money, at least indirectly, which means it could very well be about Live Nation, like one of those 360 deals. (Though of course a 360 deal gone bad is one of their cheeky ironic marketing narratives this time around. It's all getting a bit meta.)

Band moving from one well run label run to another well run label does not seem like a topic worth this much speculation. YMMV.

Arcade Fire signing with SST would be entertaining.

They are the most successful indie band working right now and possibly the most successful indie band of all time (?). I think speculating how and why indie lost one of its most iconic bands to the major labels is worthy of discussion and speculation.

zpost

Band moving from one well run label run to another well run label does not seem like a topic worth this much speculation. YMMV.

I'm interested in this not really because of the specific band, more as just general trivia on the state of the industry

wrote speculating/speculation twice please ignore.

I mean it wouldn't be the first time an indie label jumps to a major label. There's quite a few important rock albums that came from indie bands jumping ship: Nevermind, Goo, Dookie, The Downward Spiral, The Moon & Antarctica, Elephant, Fever to Tell...

Imagine if Nirvana, Green Day, Sonic Youth and Nine Inch Nails had remained on an indie label back then? They wouldn't be 1/10 as popular as they are now. The internets changed the rules of the game so that's why I'm curious about the change of heart, it seemed like the correct move in the past 15 years or so was to move from a major label contract to an indie or self owned one.

Most of those major label jumps came after one or two independent releases, not four highly successful releases that have collectively sold millions. As noted, not sure what Merge has not been able to do that a major could do better.

Yes that's my point, I think, seems at this point that having AF in your label benefits more the label than the band.

Think of the Magnetic Fields. Granted, Merritt is a weird grump, but Merge managed fine with a high-concept triple CD that seemed much harder to market than the Arcade Fire. But then he left anyway.

maybe an "indies vs majors in the 2010s" thread would be appropriate

Arcade Fire signing with SST would be entertaining.

I remember Thurston Moore explaining the reason for Sonic Youth signing to Geffen as "being able to pay the rent is pretty cool."

Arcade Fire should buy SST.

Signs Of Life is really good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UymXRxJPOQo

This whole album is a very welcome change for them.

god there are definitely ways to use Regine's voice well but that is not it, yikes

had the same thought

They should have just linked to this thread instead.

http://www.stereoyum.com/072217/arcade-fire-premature-evaluation-everything-now/review/#

Yes they should've. That's a mediocre idea educated very, very poorly.

With this piece, we’re inaugurating a new feature—a review before the review before the review of a new album.

Too long, didn't not not read.

"Clever"

That's a mediocre idea educated very, very poorly.

otm

so this is some experimental/editorial marketing thing where they designed a bunch of sites to comment on the nature of the promotional cycle or something

Can't see the post-forest for the post-trees

it's really...like...idk I consider it unseemly to, as part of one's PR, complain about absolutely everybody giving you ink

Referring to what yesca is saying above... from the perspective of what I see and understand as a music retailer in the UK there's still a truly massive difference between being on, say, Merge and being on a major label. The distribution reach and marketing power of the majors in particular is huge in comparison to even the biggest indie labels. It's issues of both pure spending power and also industry infrastructure. Albums through Sony/Uni/Warners are on another level in terms of wide-ranging commercial potential in comparison to even a hugely successful band on a hugely successful indie label. To me it still feels like a world of difference between the two. I can absolutely understand a band as successful as Arcade Fire still feeling like there's further they can go, if their ambition is to be even bigger again.

Not that I necessarily agree with said move, but I can certainly understand why a band or artist may do it.

I do understand the confusion, I mean the last three albums on Merge were all released in all possible formats, in multiple editions, with distribution everywhere (though I guess there was major label help with that?), with elaborate artwork and marketing campaigns, what I have to assume were substantial recording budgets, etc. In terms of actual, material differences, it's not really clear to me either where the advantage lies.

i'd *love love love* to read a detailed piece on the differences (dollars, tactics, reach, whatever) between the release and promotion of Reflektor and this new one. someone do that.

totally different digital teams

this is like their attempt at 90s U2 irony isn't it, but it's way more Pop than Achtung Baby

You'll be able to buy the new one in Sainsburys.

they put out a fake story about filing legal claims on the Millennial Whoop, this is all so corny and unbecoming of a big famous successful band

They are being so ironic they have found a way for me not to want to hear a new album by a band I like.

this is like their attempt at 90s U2 irony isn't it, but it's way more Pop than Achtung Baby

I recall people saying that about their last album as well. But it could be that this is the Pop to that album's Achtung Baby, albeit a very weak Achtung Baby.

this is from january but lol

http://www.billlboard.co/articles/news/7865084/arcade-fire-suing-artists-millennial-whoop/

Legal representation for Arcade Fire has confirmed that the “Everything Now” hitmakers have filed a series of intellectual property and copyright lawsuits this week. In what could be a precedent-setting decision, the band has left it up to a judge to determine whether or not they invented the so-called Millennial Whoop.

“After careful and sometimes agonizing consideration,” says Jared Fleming, Arcade Fire’s longtime lawyer, “the band contends their signature ‘Wa-oh-wa-oh’ sequence has been plagiarized by several top acts, and therefore seeks fair and just compensation.” Arcade Fire claim that artists from Katy Perry to Fall Out Boy owe their success in part to their wrongful use of the euphoric snippet. Proof, they say, comes in the form of their 2004 hit “Wake Up,” which showcases the rousing sequence, which the band created in the summer of 2002 in a church in Montreal that served as their rehearsal studio. A video of the precise creative process has been submitted as evidence along with their legal actions.

i'm sorry, it is fake news. a friend posted it and i was fooled by the convincing fake billboard.co website

For fake news to work tho they need to be credible which this totally is.

"A video of the precise creative process has been submitted as evidence along with their legal actions." is pretty funny, i can't believe i read that and still suspended disbelief!

just imagining the creative process that leads to whoa-ing

Chemistry is probably the worst song they've ever done

Dorian Lynskey goes into detail about the U2/Pop-connection and hits a dozen nails on the head: Arcade Fire Can't Dance And That's A Problem

haha, that's a great review, v otm

These guys want to be The Pop Group or 'Idioteque'-era Radiohead or the Rapture, but they remind me more of how, in the mid-90s, Eurodance acts like Twenty-Four Seven and 2Unlimited would have a go at social commentary

so many delicious lines in that village voice piece

Stereogum responds, more or less

http://www.stereogum.com/1951376/premature-evaluation-arcade-fire-everything-now/franchises/premature-evaluation/

Arcade Fire have always made dance music.

Out now. As is a 5.6 pan from Pitchfork. Gave it a couple of listens, though, and to me it's easily their best since Neon Bible. Basically the same as Reflektor, except simpler - it's obviously constructed as a single lp, and I imagine it's a much better listen that way - and I never liked The Suburbs.

"For a band who discovered themselves in sincerity, they are thoroughly lost when they bet it all on cynicism."

This sums it all up nicely in one sentence. They've become insufferable.

The ending of the album is as corny as they've ever been, though. But yeah, there are some stretches that are pretty bewildering.

Like, the stretch: Peter Pan -> Chemistry -> Infinite Content -> Infinite Content. That's bad. Like, objectively a bad stretch of music. And I would wager it would kinda work on an LP, where it's an experimental second half of a side after three hits in a row, and then a small introduction to the second side before another hit, but on a cd, that's what the skip button is for.

Signs of Life and Good God Damn are pretty dire too, the title track is pretty easily the best thing on here. Infinite Content might be a bit better if the lyrics weren't as stupid. Their lyrics have generally not been very good (Funeral's are fine though) but this is a new low.

Despite all the bloat on The Suburbs and Reflektor I'd easily take them over this.

can't believe this is the same band that once wrote a song from the perspective of jessica simpson's dad

Major labels, man...

I like Signs of Life, but Good God Damn and Put Your Money on Me is a pretty bad stretch as well. Although I like the horns in PYMOM

that Pitchfork review is the closest thing to a 70s Rolling Stone takedown I've seen in years. just so focused on saying "no" directly to the artist

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/albumreviews/harvest-19720330

It's also a big kick in the nuts to that stupid promo campaign, which I think the WaPo review was right to point out as a big distraction from the final product.

I haven't followed along with the promo campaign, but everything I've read about it makes it seem really inept and annoying and kinda without any sense of what the album is. I mean, they are apparently streaming the album as 'infinite content' in a way where the end links with the beginning, but they fail to see that the two songs Infinite Content are broken up, as if it's an lp. There is really a fight between old and new, sincerity and cynicism, and they decided to sell it solely as cynical. That's stupid.

But even if I kinda think sincerity wins on the album, their cynicism has really become off putting. There was a moment during their show at Roskilde on july 1st where Win jumped down towards the crowd during Here Comes the Nighttime, and stood at the gate to the stage and sang 'they won't let you in' and he seemed so sneering, so condescending, so full of himself that he was on this side of the gate, and we were on the other side. It took me out of the whole experience, and I never really got back into it for the rest of the show.

wtf is "Banksy disco"?

is that from the pfork review? pretty good descriptor imo.

but what does "Banksy" mean in that context? trendy but superficial and lacking in real substance? if so how would that be any different from referring to a "Banksy TV show" or a "Banksy sandwich shop"?

I think of Win stealing that dude's basketball all the time

So which is/was the bigger miscalculation this year, the AF album or the Katy Perry? Either way, the lesson that should be learned is that if you want to make a big statement, you have to put at least a little more thought into what you want to say and how you want to say it. DOYOUSEE? style fake marketing sites can't do the heavy lifting for you.

I'd just like to bring up once again that there is almost nothing ironic about Achtung Baby beyond Bono wearing sunglasses. The album is totally earnest songs about relationships and religion, not some big goof on stardom and consumerism, and the way people bought into the "irony" line remains total bullshit. Maybe by "Pop," sure, but that was much later, and they dropped it, fast.

I think 'banksy' in this context refers to the superficial sloganeering on the new Arcade Fire album - every chorus is just three words shouted repeatedly.

haven't read the review yet, but cynical, shallow ~truth telling~ about our times? xpsts

the Discotheque video aside, Pop as an album is thematically pretty serious and dark. maybe "Miami" is a little bit on the consumerism tip, maybe "The Playboy Mansion" too, but i think w/the latter at least it's going for something else. also Pop is still underrated (even by the band itself) and Arcade Fire has always been vastly overrated, also not as good or fun in their dance music dalliances as U2 was.

Oh, I agree, I don't think Pop the album is particularly ironic, at least not dramatically so. But once they toured behind it, that was the giant lemon, Neil Diamond karaoke sing alongs, the disco balls and glitter suits. I can understand Arcade Fire maybe being bored, or wanting to challenge themselves somehow, but not only are they really the wrong band to do this, it seems way too early in their career for some sort of giant ironic statement on fame. Especially because they are not particularly famous, not in the celebrity Bono rock star sense.

We Don't Deserve Love is my favorite thing in here and it's very different to anything they've done before.

When releasing the singles the band themselves released the opening three songs then skipped the stretch from Peterpan to Infinite Content and released Electric Blue. Which makes me think they knew that stretch is fucking terrible but released it anyway.

It's the first three songs on Side A and the first song on side B, I suspect (there are four short interludes on the album, which I don't count). Yeah, it's old school lp filler.

Speaking of U2, this AF album scans like a similarly mistimed miscalculation to U2's Joshua Tree nostalgia tour. Now, I get the U2 tour was massively successful, so this is totally aesthetic armchair, but if ever we needed (as much as we needed anything from U2 these days) a return of Zoo TV it's now. Likewise, if ever AF should have played to their strengths and returned to earnest and angry catharsis, it's now as well. No one needs ironic dance music from a rock band, period, let alone from these dudes. Let alone a *second* one from these dudes.

"way too early in their career for some sort of giant ironic statement on fame"

Unless you're Lady Gaga.

She's a lot more traditionally celebrity/image-driven than AF. Like, being visible is her (part of her) thing. AF might be successful, but it's a stretch to call them famous. I'd wager people are more likely to take pictures of Lurch Butler because he is really tall than because they recognize him as the guy from AF.

on first listen, this is at the very least way better than reflektor. "we don't deserve love" is a great side b surprise.

Yup. And personally, I can forgive a lot if the final song is good, though I guess that's one of the (many) things that makes me a shit music critic. However, I do love this lyric from that song:

If you can't see
the forest for the trees
just burn it all down
and bring the ashes to me

It's a nice conclusion to the whole 'overload' theme running through the album. And the constant mention of ashes, though I don't entirely get that yet.

It's pretty ridiculous that they've gone from BNM to 5,6, and anyone saying that Peter Pan and Chemistry are awful fake reggae will have to explain why on earth Flashpoint Light is supposed to be better. I'd perhaps even say the former are better because they're more obviously dub-based, which helps since the rhythm section can't and never could play Caribbean rhythms convincingly. However, Arcade Fire have sorta been overrated for a while, so while I think this is a pretty hilarious overcorrection, it's not as if any negative description I've read has been particularly wrong.

This quote from the Pitchfork review is OTM and sums up my frustrations with Trent Reznor's music for the last 15 years as well:

Butler’s commitment to the detached frontman where singing occurs barely or not at all robs songs of their emotional largesse, that basic thing we licensed to Arcade Fire and upon which their entire identity relies.

you guys are not making me want to listen to this album. never did warm up to Reflektor and The Suburbs is massively underrated especially if you trim off like three songs.

Well I mean it's worth listening to once. It's not like it spews razor blades coming out of a speaker. But if you're not up for the feeling of disappointment, maybe pass.

After listening to the album a couple times, I feel the 5.6 is appropriate... maybe it could have been a 6, but this album is worse than "meh". Some songs are downright unenjoyable lyrically and piss me off. Others are boring musically. I felt Reflektor was a huge "meh" and not nearly worthy of that ridiculous 9.2, but still better than this.

Did Reflektor seriously get 9.2? That's ridiculous. And I love Reflektor, but.

damn, 5.6... harsh

Josh otm itt

Man the songs they haven't released yet from this are terribad. I get the rating.

Banksy Disco is one of the best things i've ever heard.

There was a moment during their show at Roskilde on july 1st where Win jumped down towards the crowd during Here Comes the Nighttime, and stood at the gate to the stage and sang 'they won't let you in' and he seemed so sneering, so condescending, so full of himself that he was on this side of the gate, and we were on the other side. It took me out of the whole experience, and I never really got back into it for the rest of the show.

― Frederik B, Friday, July 28, 2017 1:25 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Perhaps satire? *strokes chin*

Problem is Will doesn't have the charisma to pull satire, he makes me cringe more than bono if that's possible.

Bono at least appears to be enjoying himself

it's got to be a tiring job

How much are you willing to bet that Arcade Fire release a different, good album today to admonish all those suckers who took EN seriously

— Laura Snapes (@laurasnapes) July 28, 2017

that would have been the only possible trick to make the anti-marketing marketing gimmick worth it, though IIRC Old Man Gloom and Akron/Family beat them to it

It's not a bad album really if you don't pay much attention to lyrics, there's at least 4 decent songs in there.

"at least 4 decent songs in there" a pretty weak endorsement.

Unless you're talking about, like, a single 30 minute song.

It's a short album

I'm not even a huge U2 fan but these chumps aren't even in the same league as U2, "I Will Follow" alone is worth more than every note of Arcade Fire and that's if U2 quit after their first big single

U2 > AF

Don't think it requires a poll but curious on seeing the arguments. Also why are we all comparing these two bands? Is it having a self-righteous prick as a frontman? Because musically speaking they seem to be more inspired by Springsteen.

U2 is aight but they would be much better if a little person ran out and punched Bono in the dick at some unspecified point during each of their gigs

arcade fire is more Eddie & the Cruisers

Ouch

You're not totally wrong:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYDAF6NbgKc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEZockGkEyY

It's not a bad album really if you don't pay much attention to lyrics, there's at least 4 decent songs in there.

I judge an Arcade Fire album by how good the Regine cuts are, so Reflektor was already a bit of a disappointment. No leads from her, but 'Joan of Arc' was fun.

...so here we are, and omg I find 'Electric Blue' really grating???

no one was lying about how bad "Chemistry" is, wow

I sorta think "Sprawl II" ruined this band by making them think they should try for that sort of thing as the rule rather than the exception

Listened to this a couple of times now and really haven't liked it, for much the same reasons as other people are saying, I think. Poor lyrics, a lot of filler and some actually bad/embarrassing songs, a nasty smug, arrogant vibe prevailing.

this really reminds me of that terrible, disappointing Aeroplane album from a few years back.

I've been cold on a lot of AF stuff in an 'I'm not feeling this, but I get why people like it' kind of way. This is almost like they're actively trying to be crap.

Yeah, the filler is obviously filler-like, instead of just less good versions of the singles. But I'm still making my mind up, and at this point I kinda love Peter Pan and Chemistry. It really helps the rhythm group to go full dub, they never figured out how to play this stuff live.

this album is like watching a software tutorial on YouTube presented by some stoned guy who spends the first 5 minutes cracking bad jokes and humming to himself.

Arcade Fire are selling $110 fidget spinners
Novelty toy contains a copy of the band's latest album, Everything Now
https://consequenceofsound.net/2017/07/arcade-fire-are-selling-110-fidget-spinners/

Reflektor was pretty crap too though.

oooof

http://thequietus.com/articles/22936-arcade-fire-s-everything-now-reviewed-track-by-track

there are a few U2 comparisons upthread and my other thought on that is i think Arcade Fire these days seem to be making a lot of empty gestures that don't really hit very hard. i think the context for Achtung Baby and Zooropa was a lot more compelling as well, the whole European sensibility that permeated those two albums (plus Passengers) was genuinely fascinating and often very haunting. the songs were very personal for the most part but the sense of place and time was palpable.

I agree with that. They are also, as I've noted many times, not the least "ironic." They are indeed personal and often quite affecting in their emotionally honesty, imo.

quietus piece was good. much better thought-out than the rather cruel takedown of Animal Collective they did last year.

There’s an overton window of pop culture and we need to give it a good shove away from this pap. Or, to put it another way: we don't have to put up with this shit. It's really not good enough. You deserve better, we all do.

I'm very glad someone said it

But I'm not sure some of you really do deserve better?

heard the title track blasting out of a car window and would say it qualified as noise pollution

look forward to FJM getting this treatment

But I'm not sure some of you really do deserve better?

If you bought this album you certainly deserve better for the money spent

count me as one of those who never saw what was the big deal w these guys

the "concept" for this is weak as fuck. someone bought them some wind breakers with a logo on it? wow deep man.

If you bought this album you certainly deserve better for the money spent

― octobeard, Wednesday, August 2, 2017 3:38 PM (fifteen minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

you deserve a one way bike lane into the middle of the ocean

Norman Records‏ @normanrecords · 9h9 hours ago
Finally listening to the new Arcade Fire. Full apologies if you are one of the people we sold it to.

Also, is there any excuse for using (a) woodwind that sounds like the panpipes on The Fast Show and (b) this combination of piano, strings and chanting choir that desperately demands we feel emotional in that Coldplay-Snow Patrol way

Didn't we establish earlier that Wake Up did it first and it's Coldplay and Snow Patrol and a trillion indie bands the ones copying the emotional peak choir thing (which I've always fucking hated btw)

it's all just watered down Hey Jude bullshit

Which is also a terribly annoying song.

Might be a bubble/perspective thing, but I've not seen a fall from grace in this spectacular car crash way as with this Arcade Fire LP for quite some years. And Joan Crawford was otm (reviewers telling a band simply "no, just no"). And not just that one review, or Dorian Lynskey's, but the Quietus review one-ups it and basically brands Win Butler as a misogynist creep (and Anne Wood makes a strong case tbh).

I suppose the fan base are praising AF for their 'daring' effort and sticking up for them fiercely? Regardless, this album is bombing in every respect, except for youtube comments by fans I suppose.

from the quietus:

This is a song of yelling that might have a distant ancestor in Billy Joel’s 'We Didn’t Start The Fire', but it is not as good.

damn

There should be a thread for when writers try to do a takedown and fail to realize they are describing a sample. I don't think anyone would call Francis Bebey 'woodwind that sounds like the panpipes on The Fast Show' if they knew it was Francis Bebey, not Arcade Fire.

was reminded of the Quietus review reading the YA book scandal thing... I can definitely relate to a lot of the reviewer's criticisms wrt Win's bad lyrics, but all the same perhaps it's a bit too personal in its mean-spiritedness? I dunno, Signs of Life is not a great song but maybe this is not a wholly fair description:

This is mean-spirited conservatism that thinks it’s edgy and cool, with the added bonus of sexist undertones

AF publicist boasted on Facebook when the album debuted at number, something like "three number ones in a row, suck it, haters!" Which of course invited people to post all these other shitty bands that have had multiple number one albums in a row.

the publicist is supposed to be some sort of meta "joke"

can't remember if i posted this in here already but that p4k review is an incredible piece of music criticism and one of the best things they've ever published. i haven't heard the record so my jaw dropped when the author mentioned a lyric about a fan "committing suicide to Funeral."

win butler ✔ @DJWindows98
Hey guys. Taking an extended break from this thing, will miss the opinions and the 1 liners :)))) talk later when I got something to say 🌐
3:00 PM - Aug 7, 2017

Yeah, I've been worrying how this band will take a backlash... They've had one coming for a while now, and even if I like Everything Now more and more, it's a weird album and they fucked up the rollout severely. I'm not sure I see them course correcting gracefully.

I get that Win is becoming more and more punch worthy, and people want to take it down, but focusing the critique on him has the unfortunate side effect of belittling what the rest of the band, including Regine, is contributing to the music.

Nobody actually commits suicide to Funeral, btw.

I forgot that Reflektor got a fucking 9.2 on p4k. I would've guessed the backlash would've happened in 2013.

& focus on Win over other band members is obviously because of the lyrics, which appear to be the most loathsome aspect of this record for a lot of people, other than the bad/boring songs. So even if he had co-writers in the band, he bears the brunt as the lead singer.

It's kinda too simple to say he is the lead singer. Regine also sings lead on a song, and joins him on several songs, including Signs of Life. It still diminishes her contributions.

I really like Reflektor, but yeah, 9.2 is ridiculous, and something that invites course correction.

If you sing lead on every single song except for one, you're the lead singer. Does Regine write the lyrics for the songs that she sings backup on? Do they co-write their lyrics? I genuinely don't know. If Win sings lead & writes lyrics on his own, he's the lead singer.

the album review for the new one is the only negative notice i've ever seen them get on PF. they're still posting a new AF story every day.

watch: Win Butler taste tests pasta sauces
Arcade Fire releases cover of Father John Misty song
Arcade Fire announces new line of band member papier mâché head Halloween masks

x-post: Afaict lyrics are credited to the entire band. And I'm not saying he is not an asshole - his behaviour during Here Comes the Nightime at the live show I saw a month ago was off-putting, as I've mentioned a couple of times - but the case of who is saying what is really complicated. And has kinda always been so with this band. In fact, I'd say that's one of the things people probably liked, how much 'we' there always was on earlier albums. And still is, but it is getting a bit different as they're getting older and older, and also still singing about 'boys' and 'girls' and 'kids'.

x-post: Afaict lyrics are credited to the entire band.

but do you think all 27 members of Arcade Fire actually contribute to the lyrics. maybe Win & Regine do. but the way he talks about it, seems like Win writes his songs.

To the earlier conversation about major label signing, notice that Win's smell you later tweet even has a brand logo in it. All this meta layer stuff, if true, is going to be lost on people because AF lack the nuance to pull it off.

The Arcade Fire backlash began circa Neon Bible, and it was hardly surprising.

Their career trajectory: an overhyped debut that has maybe 4 passable songs on it, followed by an immense dud with one good song on it that also happened to be an old song, followed by 10 years of tripe.

'member when Ned posted the Scritti Politti guy's evisceration of AF, almost 10yrs ago? prescient

Sure wish I remembered that.

Neon Bible is their best album imo

yeah i agree, neon bible has held up a lot better than funeral (maybe because its songs haven't been licensed and ripped off as endlessly as those on funeral). i listened to it for the first time in years the other day - it's great, and while the whole anti-organized religion thing seems so dorky and try-hard now, it was still relatively unusual in early 2007 at the end of the GWB administration. "Intervention" is one of their best songs. I always had a soft spot for the title track, too - maybe their most simple song, imo their most beautiful.

perhaps there was indie backlash against them, but The Suburbs won fucking Album of the Year at the Grammy's in 2011. that was really shocking. and yeah, as discussed above, Reflektor got really good reviews for some reason.

wtf is up with "everything now" sneaking into the NB tracklist on Spotify

just crunched the numbers on this, that is not allowed

I've never seen any backlash except via ilx and among small groups of similarly minded folks. Until now.

looking forward to never having to hear about this band again tbh

Too bad. If something sucks ILX is more likely to talk about it.

they're also one of like a dozen arena rock bands that formed after 2000

The Suburbs won fucking Album of the Year at the Grammy's in 2011.

Unfortunately, by the time that 2011 rolled around, stuff like this meant sweet FA.

In fact, by the time 2011 rolled around, "indie" music in general meant sweet FA, its popularity having died crushed by a landfill circa the release of Kings of Leon's 'Sex on Fire' ... in the '10s, only a small handful of already existing (or reformed) "indie" bands have put out decent work. Newer "indie" bands have pretty much had it from the get-go.

what is 'sweet FA'

sweet failure analysis

Fanny Adams (30 April 1859 – 24 August 1867) was a young English girl murdered by solicitor's clerk Frederick Baker in Alton, Hampshire. The expression "sweet Fanny Adams", or "sweet FA", refers to her and has come, through British naval slang, to mean "nothing at all".

In 1869 new rations of tinned mutton were introduced for British seamen. They were unimpressed by it, and suggested it might be the butchered remains of Fanny Adams. "Fanny Adams" became slang for mutton[6] or stew and then for anything worthless – from which comes the current use of "sweet Fanny Adams" (or just "sweet F.A.") to mean "nothing at all". It can be seen as a euphemism for "fuck all" – which means the same. The large tins the mutton was delivered in were reused as mess tins. Mess tins or cooking pots are still known as Fannys.[citation needed]

in other words, Turrican, a little "too soon" maybe

guys, if you found the album cycle offputting and the music not to compensate, I regret to inform you that you, my tiny child, have merely ~misunderstood the art~ http://www.vulture.com/2017/09/arcade-fires-win-butler-on-everything-now-album-rollout.html

(were there this many people during the Reagan and/or Bush years suggesting less-than-glowing reviews of their record sprung from The Forces That Elected Not My President?)

(by "this many" I suppose I mean "also any" but I suspect we're going to see more of this rhetorical move in the next three-to-seven years)

What a dumb interview (his answers, not the questions). So full of himself. What is the point of proving that if you intentionally spread misinformation about your band and music people will believe or further spread said misinformation?

That said, their plan might have worked had a) the music indeed resonated and b) had they followed it up with some sort of full-U2 Zoo TV tour spectacle. Maybe there's still time for that, but grouchy Win "you don't get it, maaaan" interviews aren't helping things.

His lecture tour with Darren Aronofsky'll be great.

"Bad On Purpose: The Made-You-Think/Mission Accomplished" Tour.

Lol Ned.

His answers are embarrassing.

Haha Josh

Easily my favorite bit is the "Well the FRENCH got us!"

my least favorite bit is the way it throws out generalities about how broken music journalism is and how toxic the political climate is, things designed to make people nod along (particularly music journalists, perpetually looking for something, anything, anyone, to validate their despair at their earning potential), and uses those generalities to sneak through some real bullshit undetected. the dress code thing is a good example. the way Butler talks about it, you'd think the story was completely manufactured. (by the town of Macedonian teenagers who weren't good enough at fake news to reach the Trump leagues?) but it wasn't -- there was, in fact, an email requesting exactly what was reported. the guidelines, furthermore, are pretty much standard for anything that's going to be filmed -- logos have to be blurred out in post, solid white and red tend to film poorly -- but "look, this is how TV production works" is quite a different statement from "this email that clearly exists doesn't exist, how dare you report on it."

of course,

given he's outright said it there's a decent chance the postmortem interview will get a subsequent postzombie interview in which he says "hahaha, you journalists were fooled into being irritated by my deliberately irritating statements, gotcha!"

(this isn't just limited to arcade fire, obviously -- a side effect of aforementioned journalism climate is that PRs now have a fantastic strategy of calling anything that deviates from their manufactured narrative "fake news"). doesn't help that the most visible people who are the most visibly "skeptical" are right-wing cranks

He comes across as being lost in 2017 imo. In understandable despair about fake news and such, but shooting from the hip entirely with an ill advised campaign.

Stuff like this:

The other part of it is that when you make a record in this modern context, it instantly gets refracted in the media. There’s all this side content, this trail that follows everything. So we thought that maybe we’d just make all that content, as opposed to just making the art. That stuff was going to get made anyway, so why not make it ourselves?

And this:

we just wanted to see where fake-news articles about the band would go. The media is built for clicks now, and we were trying to see firsthand how it all works.

And this:

So it was really interesting to us to see what got picked up about Arcade Fire. That idea plays into what we were doing as well: We were providing the ammunition for people who wanted to write negative things about the band: Here you go! Here’s something to be outraged about!

seems like despairing cluelessness and, quite frankly, it's cynical. Which he categorically denies, saying it's maybe their most "earnest" record or whatever. And then we're back at the beginning, that the roll-out was a complete mismatch with what they are trying to express. But no, we didn't get it. Except the French. And Europe. Which is bogus btw.

Also, Katherine otm.

He's such a dick.

Also, as i said on facebook about this: perhaps next time spend less time "creating" "side content" and more time writing lyrics that aren't awful.

ah yes, France, an oasis of reason and kindness, where one-third of the populace did not vote for a far-right-wing demagogue

Maybe the lyrics were bad on purpose. Everything about that? And you fell for them! Sucker.

I call this the Frank Zappa defense. Oh, you thought the music was brilliant? Well it was a piss take, and you fell for it. Oh, you thought the music was terrible? Well, it was terrible on purpose, and you fell for it!

haha, that should be ever think, not everything. Stupid phone. Now I know exactly how Trump feels.

infinite content, we're infinitely covfefe

Oh Will, you asshole you're tarnishing whatever good songs the band previously had with that attitude. He's turning into indie BIlly Corgan.

shocking that a guy who hadn't lost a parent or lover or sibling but named his debut album funeral anyways would eventually be revealed as tone-deaf cluebag

The infuriating part is that he refuses to believe what people didn't like about the album was the music, but the campaign. A couple of years from now when the album is revised without the "fake news" context, will the reviews be kinder to the music and lyrics? I doubt it.

i am lolling at this guy and his Adbusters for Dummies.

its pretty easy to ignore though. he seems genuinely stunned that a record label would be successful at doing the thing that they do. he isn't saying anything new, criticizing internet hate is the easiest thing in the world to do.

Internet Outrage is the Background Radiation of the modern era. everyone exploits it constantly. there is nothing insightful about noting this, people note this constantly, all day long, every day. it just makes it more pathetic when you try and pretend that pointing this out is some brilliant thing people aren't picking up on.

maybe try no concept next time this over achieving pomo marketing is off putting.

Like I said, he could have said everything he needed to say on the tour. There was absolutely nothing about "Achtung Baby" the album that tied it to the themes of the Zoo TV tour. The difference, of course, is that "Achtung Baby" is awesome, and by all accounts this Arcade Fire album is not. Start with good music, music that means something to people, and you earn the right to be heard, let alone the right to preach.

he should put 'Band Is Really Amazing At Music' on a T shirt instead.

Like I said, he could have said everything he needed to say on the tour. There was absolutely nothing about "Achtung Baby" the album that tied it to the themes of the Zoo TV tour. The difference, of course, is that "Achtung Baby" is awesome, and by all accounts this Arcade Fire album is not. Start with good music, music that means something to people, and you earn the right to be heard, let alone the right to preach.

― Josh in Chicago, Friday, September 22, 2017 4:29 PM (fifty-eight minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

This is interesting and otm. The huge difference - apart from AB being a great album - is that U2 did succeed in merging the earnest and the obscene/cynical, mostly through Bono's Mephisto personage. It was a very clever move to comment on consumerism by taking on a Faustian guise, and take nothing away from 'saviour Bono' (for better or for worse).

The other part of it is that when you make a record in this modern context, it instantly gets refracted in the media. There’s all this side content, this trail that follows everything. So we thought that maybe we’d just make all that content, as opposed to just making the art.

ban optics metaphors

Band Is Really Amazing at Music and Plays a Live Show and People Cry Because It’s So Beautiful

I’m increasingly starting to believe that every musician is a talented, empathetic, normal person, at first, but that the mechanisms and pressures of having to sustain a business based on your ability to document your experience in saleable and relevant ways turns people into antisocial bizarro versions of themselves

Just going to post what I posted earlier:

Yeah, I've been worrying how this band will take a backlash... They've had one coming for a while now, and even if I like Everything Now more and more, it's a weird album and they fucked up the rollout severely. I'm not sure I see them course correcting gracefully.

― Frederik B, 8. august 2017 23:48 (one month ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

The final song on the album ends If you can't see / the forrest for the trees / just burn it all down / and bring the ashes to me Which is lovely. So why the fuck did they decide to sell that sentiment by planting more trees?

I have worked with and been personal friends with a number of clients through their ascendency, their halcyon days, a period of backlash, and then the doldrums that follow, and I think that it's a far more terrifying complicated and beautiful thing than anybody could ever imagine

I think about it with all my present clients who are currently golden-children-who-can-do-no-wrong, seeing their management teams throw absolutely everything their way, seeing, literally, reality bend to meet their needs, as private jets are hired to accommodate a night out, or orchestras summoned to magically appear onstage to Elicit Even More Pathos, and seeing tens-of-thousands-of-dollars well-spent to make everything work and feel exciting and hold the audience's attention

And then there's this moment where the person and their music loses all its potential energy, and now it feels like an inert presence, and their words and the sentiment of their music no longer feel valuable but actually unwanted, and it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy as their songwriting voices become solipsistic, and we're left with whatever-the-fuck-it-is that this music is trying to do

Now, see - and you would absolutely know better than I - but Arcade Fire never seemed like superstar personalities. That is, people like the music and they are great performers, and that is why they're popular, not because Win is some pin-up or Regine gets on TMZ or something. They seem (and again, could be wrong) like they could easily go out anywhere and not be recognized/bothered, or chased down the street or whatever. A lot of pop stars definitely go down the rabbit hole of fame you observe, but I think that's often because they can't go out, or are so famous they need to be isolated or isolate themselves. People like Bono, or Bowie, or maybe even, say, someone like St. Vincent, recognizable icons; I suspect they exist/existed in a parallel universe of private back rooms, surrounded by other famous faces. They have to be careful with their statements, because people parse and misquote. They have to be careful who they hang out with, because people are always taking their picture. But Arcade Fire? They just seem like the wrong vectors/vessels for jaded cynicism. I don't know if someone's been whispering in their ear, or if they really feel like they have something to say but don't know how to say it, but it just feels wrong from them. Like someone yelling "pay attention to me!" and then saying something silly, and then complaining that everyone is listening and hearing the wrong things. Almost as if they wanted to be jaded rock stars as a pretense to thematically protesting the role.

I do agree with Win that the album is not 'jaded cynicism' at all. It's very very earnest. But the cynicism of the campaign, of parts of their performance at Roskilde, and of this interview, perhaps hits even harder because everything else is so earnest. Like, where the fuck is this coming from? What happened? But yeah, I guess you get lost in the hall of mirrors from time to time.

Josh, that's a thread of analysis that I don't really participate in, I haven't met or worked with a single person occupying a "superstar" role who seemed naturally born into it, or who fitted comfortably into it-- even Bowie was saying dumb solipsistic shit through the 80s and 90s

With regards to this band in particular, I felt and feel as if there are two disparate and incongruous approaches to the songwriting approach. The first is a voice of inclusivity, where the often-used word "kids" is meant to denote the singer and band and audience and world at large. The second is a voice of exclusivity, where "kids" becomes a strawman group, that seems to indict all listeners, and positions the singer somehow morally above the object of their ire.

One astute reviewer referred to this second voice as one that employs "the Dylan-esque 'you'", which I really thought was spot-on.

The second voice started to kind of appear on Neon Bible, but only fully took form for the first time on "Rococo", where the lyric "let's go downtown and watch the modern kids / they will eat right out of your hand / using great big words that they don't understand" subverted the previous usages of the word "kids" ("nothing's hid! from us kids! with the lights out!"; "us kids know / no cars go"; "all the kids have always known / that the emperor wears no clothes").

The effect is like when your wife or husband spitefully uses a term of endearment in a fight, a sneering "have it your way, SWEETIE," and effectively ruins all past and future usages of that term of endearment

That's my biggest concern, really, just a songwriter's voice that once spoke for the audience, and now seemed to turn around to indict the audience. If you're singing vaguely about a group of people you don't like, it's possible the audience will feel personally attacked-- "is he calling ~me~ a hipster?"

Anyway

The lyrics on this album don't work for me, and it's frustrating to revisit an album like Funeral where a title of a song is maybe sung once or not at all in the lyrics, to an album like this one where the title of a song is repeated more often than is beautiful

You are so massively otm about 'kids' :(

It's funny to me that more people are waking up to the fact that Arcade Fire is terrible. Funeral had a bunch of good tracks, and everything since then has been largely awful, with a few small exceptions.

I disagree with that assessment, but agree with much of fgti's aforementioned. I think the band's problem (if it's a problem) is that they are really good with general feelings, but less strong with statements. Unlike, say, Springsteen, they're just not as suited to big picture commentary as they are to catharsis; I can't defend the last couple of Coldplay records, for example, but I do think they made a concerted effort to dumb things down to better match the simple, broad emotions their music is designed to project. AF, it's like they're trying to will themselves into being something they're not, but unfortunately it doesn't work that way, even when you are very smart (like Bowie or, by all accounts, Bono).

Hard disagree with "this band has always been terrible", tho I see and hear that assessment often. What I think people mean is "this band has always been corny" which is like yes obviously, there was never a moment when this band was not corny, but when they pull it off it really works

"This band has always been terrible" is lazy challops. 'Funeral' is a near perfect album, whether you have any need for it or not: it's devastatingly honest about its intention: using Grand Gestures to convey Big Emotions in a maximal way. It worked because it was completely, almost embarrassingly honest.

AF going the cynical, 'see what we did here, wink wink' meta route just falls completely flat. It alienates the people who got on board early because of the honesty and lack of cynicism, and I can't really see a lot of new listeners getting excited about it. It's certainly not something you can't find anywhere else.

Counterpoint: The band is still playing the United Center here in a month. Counter-counterpoint: not sold out yet, don't think.

absolutely superb observation re "kids", fgti. ties in v much with the changing sense of "we" that i had felt in the band's recent music but been unable to articulate/observe in so exact a way.

Listening to this for the first time, since I'm seeing them next week, and ... no, it's not very good. A bunch of half-assed musical and lyrical ideas. I can imagine a few of the tracks doing well live, though.

this band has gotten worse with every album since the (really good) debut. a stunning achievement! i look forward to seeing what horrible depths they reach by album #10

neon bible is better. funeral rules but so much of it has been stripped and exhausted of meaning by ubiquitous licensing & influence (epiphany-core style "WHOAAA-OHHH-OHHH-AH-OHHHH" songs)

I like The Suburbs a lot. I'd say this one marks their entry into the two stiffs in a row club.

The Suburbs is still their worst album by a mile.

wow. why do you say that? At the very least even if you don't like it it's got two or three or four or five songs even that are clearly better than anything on the new one or the last one.

Suburbs is def the one I prefer these days

It's overlong - yeah, Reflektor is longer, but it's split in two - it's samey, and I dislike the hits. I like We Used to Wait, and that's pretty much it. Also, a concept album about suburbs is the most boring thing Arcade Fire could have ever done.

the firs three albums are all good to a degree, just each one is less good than the one before it.

yea suburbs has tracks but it was definitely the beginning of "oh, this is a completely exhausted and tin-eared concept they're going for, great." I mean with funeral, it looks worse in retrospect because of how much it was copied, but it was original for its time. and the anti-organized religion angle of neon bible was relevant or at the very least not embarrassing in the second to last year of the Bush administration.

This band is actively ruined by their frontsman’s ego. Funeral is the best for me because he had no clue how huge it would be. Every effort since then shows promise but it’s ruined by this certain douchiness in every delivery of its lyrics. Too judgmental of its own fanbase in such a shallow ways.

Funeral - a solid, decent rock album that sounded really fresh at the time and still gets play at Latin Heights on occasion
Neon Bible - just couldn't get my head around how horrible the production was on this one. Seemed to lay the foundation for dozens of bad indie acts with no control over the high-end and reverb knobs on their mixing desks
Suburbs - never made it all the way through, but it gets points for 'The Sprawl II: Mountains Beyond Mountains' which is maybe their first or joint-best song after 'Rebellion (Lies)'. I liked the weird signature on 'Modern Man'. The rest I don't remember.
Reflektor - Like a bad copy of a bad copy of Talking Heads with every ounce of groove drained from it. Terrible lyrics. Terrible terrible.
Everything Now - See Reflektor but even worse, plus added disco parodies and weak 'stick it to THE MAN' lyrics

Neon Bible - just couldn't get my head around how horrible the production was on this one
a sad thing since the songwriting was good

what's Latin Heights?

where i live

the other thing I couldn't get my head around was re-releasing a b-side from their first album on their second one.

Not least because "No Cars Go" sounds like a b-side.

No Cars Go was not a B side, it was on their first EP and by far the best thing on there

still

Can I be mad that this record sucks AND effectively erased my old band (yes....Everything, Now!) from the Internet. Just tryna sell Basecamp mp3s and leftover vinyl, Win, sheesh.

...rude.

a not quite small enough number of extremely unimaginative ilxors will still get this into the eoy 77, you just watch

still really can't get past his singing voice. i like bad voices sometimes but his isn't interesting.

I really want to get this into 77, both because I still like it a fair amount, and because it would piss people off, but I'm fairly certain it won't work.

I think this album is a good candidate for a fake top 10 placement

@ dog latin - there are plenty of bands that re-recorded strong songs from earlier/poorly recorded albums and EP's for later records. "Welcome to Paradise," pretty much everything on the pre-TOTBL Interpol EP's, Ariel Pink's 'studio' records...

no way in hell is this going 77

'No Cars Go' is the very best this band could ever do.

Yeah it's one of their marquee songs. Not sure but I'd bet it's been on their the setlist every night for over a decade, along with Rebellion (Lies) and Wake Up.

So weird. Even when the band was touring Funeral people would go crazy for No Cars Go, but I think it's a big nothing.

The Suburbs we always be the most underrated thing they ever did!

we = will

One I feel most compelled to return to. It’s great.

this band has gotten worse with every album since the (really good) debut. a stunning achievement!

Hahaha yes I can agree to that

I still believe that the promise indie showed in the early to mid 00’s pointed out to something fucking amazing, but it got lost.

and Funeral was one of the best examples

Oh well

I still believe that the promise indie showed in the early to mid 00’s pointed out to something fucking amazing, but it got lost.

― ✖✖✖ (Moka), Saturday, October 28, 2017 7:53 AM (four days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

This. I'm on a real 2005 nostalgia tip right now and it feels like (especially in the US) there was this point around 2004 where 'indie' music was having this incredible renaissance where rock and noise and folk music were converging and doing some really inspiring stuff. Flash forward to about 2009 and it had homogenised and dissipated into this terrible self-congratulatory woodcutting shit.

not all indie

what actually happened was that there was a tremendous explosion in the number of bands,meaning you had to search harder to hear the good stuff as the lowest common denominator shit floated to the top

saying that indie itself stagnated is dumb. and the arcade fire were always crap

(that's harsh obv but imo if you ever saw them as the flagbearers of indie then you were taking your eye very far off the ball)

no sure that's fine, of course there was good stuff if you looked, like in every genre at every time. But like, 2004-2005 you had (off the top of my head) Arcade Fire (Funeral), Animal Collective (Sung Tongs), Fiery Furnaces (Blueberry Boat), Wolf Parade (Apologies to the Queen Mary), Devendra Banhardt (Rejoicing In The Hands) all kind of bursting into the alt limelight at roughly the same time and making music that sounded relatively credible and original-sounding; compare a few years later and most of these bands had stagnated into self-parody and begat a commodified scene that encompassed stuff like Fleet Foxes and Bon Iver. The noise scene that felt very vital and challenging (Lightning Bolt, Black Dice, Wolf Eyes etc) hit a dead-end in many respects too. That whole Amerindie loft-scene thing burnt brightly for just a few years and it's easy to dismiss that in retrospect.

It'd be interesting to compare the numbers of bands coming through at those times - I think it's hard to get a handle this on given the shifts in what constituted indie music in that timeframe so I'm wary of making claims about the genre as a whole but there did seem to be a move towards blandness on the folk side of things (would definitely consider Fleet Foxes and Bon Iver key artists in that respect).

^ that all feels very real to me, but maybe because I was in college and Pitchfork was at its peak taste-making powers and it’s hard to see objectively around those two major forces

*xp to DL

Saw the band Monday night and they were great, as usual. The high-concept BS of the marketing campaign was largely abandoned (short some occasional fake ads or goofy pre-recorded used car salesmen schtick to buy merch), and the in-the-round setup worked pretty well. The band's theatricality remains really effective, and their passion (affected or not) is pretty infectious. Still don't like the new songs, but they definitely sound better when there are less of them to listen to. I do wish the band were smarter, which would make its attempts to act smart more effective (a la Peter Gabriel or someone equally presentation-aware), but they sure know how to put on a cathartic show.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KvqNWYggnVA

this is really not good lol

hoo boy

....

good god this is lame

"inspired by the current climate of the country, with a hopeful message to the youths"

poor youths. this is teh cringe.

embed still is sufficient lol

have never seen a band with a more mid life crisis vibe

should have retired after The Suburbs

this isnt that bad, it sounds like slower andrew wk

also reminds me of this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2GhPUAVgHZc

this isnt that bad

I mean yeah on the surface it's a decent song musically speaking, but devvvine really nails it with the "midlife crisis rock" label. Win Butler has sounded desperately try hard since Reflektor, and Everything Now was straight cringe and utterly, lyrically tone deaf. I'll admit this is a marginal improvement though but I wish they'd focus inward again.

priors: i dont have any strong emotional attachment to their earlier work, so i have no expectations

i'm just not really sure who this is speaking from the perspective of or who it's speaking to

i know they said it's a message for the youths but it is not speaking their language and it is not clear what the message is

nope, nevermind, I get what you meant about midlife crisis rock, that's it otm