fiona apple - fetch the bolt cutters (2020)

this seems to be out in the world. thoughts from anyone who's heard it?

just pressed play, already bowled over

just on shameika and feeling likewise

wrapping up the last few tracks now. "relay," "newspaper," and "heavy balloon" have *really* grabbed me on first listen but honestly the whole thing is just overwhelming and fascinating and i can't wait to spend more time with it. i feel like it took me months if not years to really appreciate idler wheel so...

god all of this percussion is so great

this album is metal as fuck, in that it sounds like it was screwed together at a workbench

industrial music

Assuming this will pop up on streaming tonight? I'm so anxious to hear this.

newspaper is industrial as hell

Does any of it sound like the first 2 albums?

first track kinda did maybe? but it basically follows the idler wheel's stripped down approach into straight up percussion collage. it fucking rips

+ ghost choirs

what in the fuck is "newspaper" btw

I'm sure it'll be cool but also I miss Jon Brion

not sure i'll hear a better song in 2020 than cosmonauts

album of the year, no one on her level

it sounds like it was screwed together at a workbench

― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson),Thursday, 16 April 2020 16:31 (fifty-two minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

i can't think of any other records that sound both as compositionally crazy and rawly handcrafted as this does

kick me under the table all you want
i won't shut up

Can’t wait to hear this!

this is averaging 4.41 from nearly 200 ratings on RYM, almost unprecedented. yeah obv it's mostly the headz and stans thus far but such a rating is still remarkable. you all seem to be quite excited as well. will have to listen

From one listen -- almost a totally new sound. Beat music.

"relay" is so wild i love it

it's like this fully percussive thing and then bam, upright bass and guitar scratching, then voices hanging in silence

about to download

Need to wait for a headphone listen to fully judge. It'll hit streaming at midnight of course.

maura's review of this is great and very otm https://www.bostonglobe.com/2020/04/16/arts/fiona-apple-makes-defiance-sound-exhilarating-fetch-bolt-cutters/

Any word of a physical release?

imago, it’s probably because i had them on yesterday but cardiacs did come to mind a couple times while i was listening

Dare I ask where y'all are hearing this

it leaked, it'll be streaming in a few hours, ymmv

damn this is really something

exhausting, in a good way

i'm in love with everything her voice does in "ladies"

Shameika said I had potential!

amazing that she’s still finding miraculous new textures with her voice

Really excited for this!!!! Based on the reviews I have read so far it seems to be her less accessible out of all of her albums, which makes me even more amped up for it, since some of my favorite songs from her are the ones that hit you out of left field!

the only field is left

holy fuck @ her vocal in "Holy Balloon."

oh my god "newspaper"

Wow this is fantastic. On first listen I reckon this could end up my favourite Fiona alongside When The Pawn.

The sound/approach reminds me a lot of early Veda Hille.

It's my favorite Apple already

finally, Fiona Apple songs I can put on a workout playlist

this album is fucking great and i got to review it

and it's a damn fine review

damn this is good. thanks y'all for putting me on to this.

thanks alfred :)

Feels like 2011 wasn't that long ago! So she has a rate of a new album every 6/8 years.

holy shit this record

10.

The overall sound is interesting, sounds like the 21st century version of the lo-fi, diy album that doesn’t suck.

As usual the best part is how percussive Fiona Apple loves her arrangements.

haven't heard it but Pitchfork giving a Fiona Apple album a 10 in 2020 is something I can get behind

This also has her most manic sounding moments of all time, this is a good sign btw.

10 on p4k

https://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/fiona-apple-fetch-the-bolt-cutters/

Maura read your review earlier, great stuff

it's very good but i wouldn't give it a perfect score yet. p4k has given far worse albums a 10 in the past though so if something's going to get put on a weird pedestal i'd much rather have it be this

thank you ums <3

I like both maura’s and p4k reviews, they pick on different aspects on why this album has the potential of being an early contender for AOTY, great release date too imho. Right place, right moment sort of album.

in one of the videos where she answer fans questions, one of them asks her who some of her favorite musicians are, and the 3 she names are Miriam Makeba, Kate Bush, and Joan Armatrading. I feel like this provides all the context you'd need for the world this music exists in.

anyway, Fiona is my actual hero and she has never sounded more like herself. so grateful for her.

Great review Maura!

And yes I agree that both reviews (i.e. Maura's and Pitchfork's) are good. This is one of those rich, dense but inviting albums that I expect will inspire a lot of good writing.

The Pitchfork review references the Slits which makes sense to me but the other act I hear a simpatico with (perhaps because I have been listening to them a lot recently) is The Raincoats (as well as early Veda Hille as mentioned upthread).

Makes sense -- Pelly wrote a 33 1/3 book on The Raincoats.

I'm adoring this already. So glad it has taken the drums-and-piano-in-conversation style of Idler Wheel and used Hot Knife as the jumping off point.

i don't know if i'm comin across but i'm really trying

The Slits reference would work if they had made more songs like "Newtown" (their most Raincoats-y, so Tim otm). Is late Tom Waits too obvious to mention? I found Pelly's "no music has ever sounded like this" line a little silly (Is This Desire? and Medulla also come to mind; I listened to Horse Rotorvator for the first time the other day, etc.).

Anyway, "Criminal" is the only Apple song I've previously consciously heard, so this is pretty wild! I'm not sure it will quite turn out to be My Thing, but I can see why everyone is flipping over it. Even not paying full attention to the lyrics, some knife-like lines pop out.

Presumably it was the editor's call but referring to it as "Fetch" I found very jarring. Couldn't get Mean Girls out of my head, so in essence, your editor should stop trying to make "Fetch" happen.

"No music has ever sounded like this" is not a good line to write in a review of anything I'll be honest.

Vinyl is available for preorder from her website. Includes immediate download. Looking forward to this.

Presumably it was the editor's call but referring to it as "Fetch" I found very jarring. Couldn't get Mean Girls out of my head, so in essence, your editor should stop trying to make "Fetch" happen.

― in twelve parts (lamonti), Friday, April 17, 2020 6:25 AM (thirty-three minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

lmao

Maybe my googling skills are rusty, but I'm having a hard time finding her website...

just on shameika and feeling likewise

― devvvine, Thursday, April 16, 2020 10:18 AM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

otm

Ha, I don't know why I had a problem with it, but I had to google "fetch the bolt cutters vinyl" to get to a reddit forum which then had a link to her store.

ok now here we are at relay, holy jeez

my display name is more relevant than i would've thought lol

sadly I will never buy the LP thanks to my weird aversion to 2xLP albums that run a hair over 50 minutes

Simon it's sonically irresponsible to press over 45 mins on a single record!! head to the audiophile thread for reeducation

audiophiles can suck it imho

that hurts

two songs on a side I'd rather die

I feel like my only slight criticism after a few listens is I could have gone for a little less repetition on "Cosmonauts". but that's very nitpicky.

First song is good, but kind of a conventional piano song for the most part? I guess I expected it to be weirder on first blush....ok now doing some dolphin noises

That's a false signal.

was skeptical during the first track, and then every single song after that bowled me over, fiona cannot be dethroned

I feel like my only slight criticism after a few listens is I could have gone for a little less repetition on "Cosmonauts". but that's very nitpicky.

― k*r*n koltrane (Simon H.), Friday, April 17, 2020 7:39 AM (twenty minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

i could listen to that chorus foreverrr

This is cool.... One thing that comes to mind is The Jungle Line off Hissing of Summer Lawns

I love the super dense piano sound, the booming upright bass, and it's got some of the best clattering percussion since Tom Waits's Bone Machine. The drums sound like a full kit set up in a cramped bedroom. Plus barking dogs. I'm very into this on first listen, and there's a lot to come back to.

This is cool.... One thing that comes to mind is The Jungle Line off Hissing of Summer Lawns

― Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Friday, April 17, 2020 10:02 AM (fifty seconds ago) bookmarkflaglink

agreed, but that song has never connected with me like every song here did almost immediately

I love the super dense piano sound, the booming upright bass, and it's got some of the best clattering percussion since Tom Waits's Bone Machine

I came back here to say that it definitely reminds me of mid-80s Waits in some parts which is A Good Thing

and early '80s solo Lindsey Buckingham.

god the gut punch that bisects "For Her"

kind of crazy how unfashionable Tom Waits has become, checked out a few reviews, none mention him, even though it's a pretty obvious reference point

it's the most conventional track here but still i want you to love me is deliriously beautiful

oh wow Sebastian Steinberg from Soul Coughing plays bass on this, that makes so much sense

agreed on the Tom Waits sound

it'll take a few spins for me to get the hang of this; I found it distracted/distracting on first listen (as I do Waits), but it seems worth further attention

it's the most conventional track here but still i want you to love me is deliriously beautiful

When the album started I was like "Ah crap, this is some more girl-and-her-piano bullshit - I've been suckered again!" NOPE.

This is frustrating. I would like to purchase this, but all I get upon googling is people talking about people talking about what they think of it.

I hate contemporary society.

https://www.fionaapplestore.com/dept/featured?cp=107902_107930

For ease, since I'm not the only one that had problems finding it.

i would beg to disagree but begging disagrees with me

might have to cop that crewneck

JFC finally found it only took thirty minutes

This album

The repetition in Cosmonauts is a necessity, it wouldn’t feel growing in intensity without it.

loving the No New York style guitar on 'On I Go'

ICAMI she did a track by track thing for Vulture

https://www.vulture.com/2020/04/fiona-apple-fetch-the-bolt-cutters-songs.html

I am not normally a believer in identity-based arts criticism - once you put a piece of art out into the world, any member of the public has the right to comment on it - but I really want to read reviews of this album from women over 40.

"I hardly ever write a song about just one person, but there was one time that I wrote a song that was not a nice song, and it was about one person, and I felt the need to tell that one person and play them that song before it came out, and it went fine."

just gonna assume that she means "it went fine, for me" and that this other person melted immediately

good thing i was born in 1975

“you don’t even know hurricane gloria!!!!”

As I said on the other P4k thread this album sounds like tUnE-yArDs and I'm here for it, personally

there's a significant bounty on the first actually-good 'fetch the bolt cutters' pun display name i heard

spare us the cutters

this is great. "Ladies" has a bit of a Cat Power swagger.

i am reminded of suzanne vega's 99.9F°

ladies ladies ladies ladies

This whole album is incredible, but right now Ladies is the one.

for me, it's been "Newspaper" and "For Her"

just cranking the whole discography at this point, best artist of my generation

imagine making a record better than when the pawn????? and i think she's done it twice now

You'll laugh, but When the Pawn.. is the only album I haven't heard.

alfred

production-wise when the pawn is a steely dan album of the '90s

a prime candidate for my Harvest Rule: a major album by a major artist I haven't heard.

When The Pawn now and forever but this album is fucking amazing

Hey this is really good.

I didn't expect it to be so rhythm-focused. I said it after the last album, but this just reinforces it: she's trying to make her own Hounds of Love.

And whoever said Suzanne Vega is also spot on.

i continue to be so happy this album exists

also alfred you need to listen to when the pawn right fucking now!!!!! it'll crush you!!!!!!

it's like imo in the constellation of your tastes that is a missing star, you gotta hear it

I will agree that When the Pawn is a total winner.

And I have to believe the her writing and arranging process is exceptionally intricate. She's become quite a masterful writer.

yeah this album is exceptional. it's unhinged and mad at times, in a way that Brian Wilson's 70's output was mad.

Haven't heard her since the 90s, but so many different people were flipping over this today now I'm interested. Descriptions and references in this thread have me excited--"Jungle Line," 80s Tom Waits...

My only issue with this album is there is going to be absolutely no suspense when it comes to the winner of our end of year album poll next January.

When The Pawn is still my favourite with The Way Things Are being my favourite song of hers.

yeah this album is exceptional. it's unhinged and mad at times, in a way that Brian Wilson's 70's output was mad.

― akm, Friday, April 17, 2020

Not the defense I needed lol

Thanks, Brad. I will. I own the rest.

"heavy balloon" is a really sick r&b song about depression

I was working at a music store when The Pawn came out. I didn’t know anything about Fiona Apple and assumed she was boring angsty teeny pop. A promo of Pawn landed in my lap and I put it on in the car driving home from work and it blew me away. The production, the lyrics, her voice. Just the sound of the album is amazing, everything else is gravy.

Kept up with her since then, but I’ve never heard the first album.

tidal's great, nothing but hits in her catalog

"the first taste" and "never is a promise," right in a row, is some '90s-ass sequencing but i love it

she has a pretty spotless discography, each album is amazing in it's own way.

Just heard about the 10! Wow, congratulations Fiano!

'90s-ass sequencing

against every instinct, i need to know more

"Fiano" lol

against every instinct, i need to know more

― mookieproof, Friday, April 17, 2020 7:44 PM (nine minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

"first taste" is this amazing tactile sade-esque groove thing, "never is a promise" emotionally shattering and spare

and i associate really intensely dynamic mood shifts between tracks with '90s albums

I keep trying to warm up to Fiona Apple, but I wish she would go into poetry slam mode at least 20% less often.

i associate really intensely dynamic mood shifts between tracks with '90s albums

this deserves further exploration imo! (i don't think i agree that the '90s were special for this, but i'll bet we have opinions)

yeah on further examination i'm *certain* the '90s weren't special for that

nor for asses

This is a terrific headphones album.

Ladies!!! Loving this.

Lately I’ve been working my way through stacks of cds that friends have given me as they spotified up. Good music but it’s all old stuff. John Prine, blues, singer-songwriters.

It’s great to hear something new and captivating. Just what I needed. Every song feels like an environment with a startling sense of space.

I remember listening to I Want You To Love Me a lot in 2013 when it was on YouTube, so glad it made it all this way.

Out of interest, was this a "surprise" release?

I realise that reviewers obviously had it in enough to for all the reviews to drop on release day, but was it definitely coming out this Friday all along or was that only announced this week? There wasn't any mention of a release date in the New Yorker article last month as far as I can remember.

check out that rack of his

the release date was announced at the start of the month

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_66Skytfh3Y

it's wild to compare this early version of "Ladies" to the final one

the release date was announced at the start of the month

― ufo, Saturday, April 18, 2020 10:43 AM (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink

ah right! thanks, obviously i totally missed that.

I liked the singles on the debut but never really followed her after that. I really like this. First thing I thought of was Tom Waits. I wish it was a little more melodically interesting - a lot of the vocal melodies are very sing-songy - but I see that the vocals are in service of the rhythm, which when combined with all the wordplay and internal rhyme makes me think of hip-hop.

She seems to be having a real good time on this album, even in moments of pain, there is a real confidence to her delivery. She is self-indulgent, but not self-conscious. I don't know anything about her now, but this strikes me as an album made by someone with a lot of time, money, and pot.

Newspaper is probably my favorite so far; when she double tracks the vocals on certain lines it kills. Is it just me or does it speed up in the second half?

Its not just you! Very subtle tempo changes throughout the song ( around 3:30 , and 4:07 mark) Or it could just be us.

I couldn't tell if it was just her vocal attack speeding up or the rhythm as well.

took my first walk with this yesterday, it was pretty special. top 2 music walks of the year, along with a Saint Cloud one.

Very impressive record. Gimme a few more listens before I can tell you how much I actually like it (she's been hit and miss with me in the past).

"Shameika" is pretty amazing.

For anyone just hearing Apple for the first time and liking this one, I recommend the previous album 'The Idler Wheel...' its in a similarly vein with the clattery percussion etc. At some point I need to spend more time with the first 3 which I've never really fully engaged with.

Never heard, but "Hot Knife" (which I think was from that record) was my favourite thing that she'd done so far.

The stretch of Ladies, Heavy Balloon, Cosmonauts and For Her is 10/10

The stretch from I want you to love me to On I go might be too.

is there a word for the type of vocalizing she does at the end of "i want you to love me"? it reminds me of patty waters.

I can't decide if I like this or if it annoys the hell out of me.

on my first listen right now, felt very "this is really good and will reward multiple listens" until "newspaper" lifted me off the fucking ground and now "heavy balloon" is killing me. this is really, really good.

just want to say i really like this album too. "Relay", in particular - i have no idea how she came up with the vocal rhythm of the chorus, it seems like it wouldn't work at all, and yet by the 4th time around it's the center of the song

definitely worth hearing this on headphones or a good system because the low-end percussion *knocks*

I will say that on my first pass through this album, I was constantly noticing the percussion (in a good way).

This is some amazing lofi/hifi shit. I feel it opens up flawlessly but there is a bit of a lull for me with Relay and Rack of His, but this is nitpicking a pretty outstanding record. The editing and arrangements are so intricate yet playful! This was made by someone who loves making music. I love how she calls them percussion orchestras.

It's referenced above, but here is the incredible New Yorker profile.

Relay is my standout after five or so listens.

Miriam Makeba's Sangoma seems a good analogue for what she's doing here.

One listen through, totally unfamiliar with Fiona Apple outside of the popular song or two back in the 90s, very impressed. I like the storytelling, the vocal performances, the energy, the sequencing. But so far I'm mainly focused on the literal *sound* of it all. The simple and unadorned most everything is recorded is combined with incredibly meticulous spatial staging--resulting in a sound that is exceptionally intimate but ultra-widescreen at the same time.

More than usual, I almost can't help but "see" the sounds as almost structural, latticed across the stage, almost with different shapes in different parts of the stage. (The theatricality of the music and presentation seems to contribute to that, too).

I'm not a writer, so I doubt I'll really have anything to say about this album. But I feel the itch to make a mix in response to it of sounds/songs it calls to mind. . .

The percussive noises at the start of newspaper sound like ping pong being played in the purple world in twin peaks s3

I like that "Relay" does the same trick as "Once In A Lifetime" (albeit in a more brutal fashion), keeping the same pulse but offsetting where the downbeat lies for the verses (and as a bonus, switching into compound time, very cool)

all the people who have never listened to The Idler Wheel... really should get on that

I will physically fight people who hate this album.

karl was half right after all

There’s a lot to celebrate!

I like that "Relay" does the same trick as "Once In A Lifetime" (albeit in a more brutal fashion), keeping the same pulse but offsetting where the downbeat lies for the verses (and as a bonus, switching into compound time, very cool)

― we have no stan but to choice (flamboyant goon tie included), Saturday, April 18, 2020 4:35 PM (three hours ago)

Am obsessed with this and the effect it has. Instant insanity.

Never heard, but "Hot Knife" (which I think was from that record) was my favourite thing that she'd done so far.

― Maria Edgelord (cryptosicko), Saturday, April 18, 2020 5:47 PM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

Hot Knife is the closer and to me it's completely the jumping off point for this album which feels very much like a continued, but deeper exploration, of the sound world created on The Idler Wheel...

How many boring men have called this album “autobiographical” so far.

have any of them also used the word “confessional”

U guys can survey the reviews here - https://www.metacritic.com/music/fetch-the-bolt-cutters/fiona-apple/critic-reviews

is it a confessional tour de force

sadly I will never buy the LP thanks to my weird aversion to 2xLP albums that run a hair over 50 minutes

― k*r*n koltrane (Simon H.)

two songs on a side I'd rather die
― k*r*n koltrane (Simon H.)

there are 13 songs though. I don't think they cut a third of the album for the vinyl release.

I have mixed feelings about this. On the one hand, splitting an album up like this can be a pain in the ass because of constant side flipping, on the other hand, I think those generally sound better and are higher quality transfers.

sometimes this is more annoying than others. like the Seer by Swans; that's an annoying album to listen to on vinyl. Or the Peter Gabriel 45 RPM pressings. But in this case I think there appear to be enough songs per side that it won't irritate me much.

Crazy solution here re: 2LP... Buy the CD?

; )

Is this an appropriate space to address the weird gender politics that have emerged in the wake of the album's critical reception? Or is that too dire a topic?

that phenomenon makes me way too depressed to ever talk about it but i say go for it if you want

weirdly i'm feeling very thankful that ilx is least worst place to talk about the fiona apple record online

"I wasn't afraid of the bullies and that just made the bullies worse" only on track 2 and yeah, this certainly owns

Shameika and Newspaper are my current favorites

Those plus Heavy Balloon.

I've listened to it several times (under, admittedly, less than ideal conditions)... "Under the Table" is the one that sticks in my head (it's the "keeper" for me, I guess). I think the first four tracks are v good, and then I kind of lose the thread after that. There are moments in later songs that grab me, like the opening groove in "Heavy Balloon."

circling back to say that in my limited musical experience no one writes bitterness like fiona and i love it

I like that "Relay" does the same trick as "Once In A Lifetime" (albeit in a more brutal fashion), keeping the same pulse but offsetting where the downbeat lies for the verses (and as a bonus, switching into compound time, very cool)

― we have no stan but to choice (flamboyant goon tie included), Saturday, April 18, 2020 6:35 PM (two days ago) bookmarkflaglink

Oh nooo, I thought we established that Once in a Lifetime doesn't do this! And I don't think this one does either. The downbeat is exactly the same, the phrases are even, it's just that the melody starts on an upbeat. I think we must just hear rhythm/arrangements very differently!

whatever it does (and maybe we can all try transcribing the rhythm and compare) it makes my heart flip

Heavy Bjork energy from 'Newspaper'

She's such a drummer (like, in her vocal lines and piano parts). The NYer article has a bit about her relationship to rhythm and how she ties it to childhood obsessive tics & tendencies, and yeah, big same.

The NYer article has a bit about her relationship to rhythm and how she ties it to childhood obsessive tics & tendencies, and yeah, big same.

big same here, too! that's interesting - never really talked about it here before, but i also had a childhood obsession with rhythm and counting, all the way into my early 20s. i thought of it as the "counting letters", and it involved counting out the letters of words and spaces as 8th notes, with capital letters and punctuation as quarters. "perfect" sentences or phrases were those that ended exactly on the last beat of the "measure", so that the next sentence or phrase would begin again on the downbeat.

i could not stop doing it, to the point where i thought i was actually losing my mind.

same here too. i'm a big rhythmic tapper, to the annoyance of many. when i was younger, one of my favorite exercises was to finger-drum through the beats of a song in order (one finger then the next) until the verse or phrase ended on my thumb or pinky.

*mechanically nods back at voodoo and Jordan and Fiona Apple*

Most of mine would involve counting or tapping a number that felt "balanced", which were actually usually odd numbers (like I would see 7 as 3 on each side and 1 in the middle). Really feel like this led to a connection with Euclidean rhythms way before I knew the term, like the various ways five dotted 8th notes fit in a bar of 4/4, etc).

Love to read about other people's weird mental tics btw

I spread like strawberries! I climb like peas and beans

Been shouting that first sentence into the winds on my daily walks since Thursday.

Yeah, the way she just trumpets those lines is cool.

in that it sounds like it was screwed together at a workbench

SWEET! I learned a DIY recipe for bolt cutters!

lol

:D

have still really not decided how I feel about this album past track one -- I think I might at some point just have to give up and admit that I prefer the idler wheel

(track one, though, is brilliant and among the best things she's ever done)

this album reminds me a lot of trilectic the highest praise i can give an album

i keep expecting eskimo suit to come up next in the sequencing

expected this to be about the truly-awful-on-all-sides f*nt*no discourse

Newspaper has a Flowers of Romance thing going on... maybe?

oh yeah

Also - Jordan I have to pick your brain about ‘balanced’ rhythms and geometry and so on

Pretty sure Whiney was the last (if not only) ilxor to give a fuck about F*nt*no, and he's been scarce of late.

keep that shit outta this thread for as long as possible imo

I heard a Flowers of Romance last week too.

*a FOR approach

Some thoughts. . .

So I've been mulling this over for a while now and I'd just like to make a generally unclear post.

I've been a Fiona Apple fan since I was 19. The majority of my life at this point. Being a male into her music has always carried a bit of stigma along with it — hell, I've been a fan long enough to remember when being a fan, regardless of gender, was something that needed to be defended. My point in bringing this up is that, across the board in my travels, up until recently, the people who have been traditionally the most critical have been females. I've met many other people who were fans (casual to even bigger than myself), but none of those people (save one) who were simultaneously accepting of her music and critiquing it fairly were female. I've certainly met other female fans, but they will always have a superfluous, unrelated to the music, criticism. I'm not saying this is right or wrong, as I have absolutely no place to tell anyone how to treat or perceive their peers. I just don't understand it.

The biggest thing that I've seen as a criticism to her music —and I'm not saying that I share this view at all— is that she portrays herself as a "damsel in distress" and, subsequently, caters to a cliched "male fantasy" of rescuing the girl. No matter how many discussions I've had —going back to defending myself just for enjoying her music— I've ultimately been made to feel like I'm giving her music "extra credit" because of how she presents herself.

This is infuriating.

She's fucking brilliant and always has been. Truth be told, I've considered her like a makeshift soul singer for a very long time. 60s and 70s soul music was honestly the first time as a music fan I found myself listening to artists sing and talk about things and ideas that I had no knowledge of — and still finding myself able to understand and enjoy that perspective all the same. That's what soul music is after all, right? This new record is possibly her best one yet —especially in this regard— and, basically having grown up with her music, it's unbelievably satisfying.

To see that the vitriol towards her is seemingly stronger than ever is so disappointing. But maybe that will change as hopefully a new generation of fans will get into her wonderful music on the strength of the new album.

What a fantastic and expertly articulated album.

What vitriol? It’s the most critically acclaimed album in years! Idk, if you’re hanging out in any online places that are tossing vitriol at Fiona right now (not to be confused with genuine thoughtful critiques, I’m not saying everyone HAS to love the album)...maybe stop going to those places?

Yeah, I'm with Evol -- i've heard nothing but positive things about this album (granted mainly here on ILM, but also all the rave reviews).

Side note: my 8-year-old spent the weekend singing "I spread like strawberries, I climb like peas and beans". The number of listens required to get these songs stuck in your head is really astonishingly low.

Heavy Balloon through the end hits so fucking hard but it lands lightly somehow? Teary eyes, but I just start the album over again.

The number of listens required to get these songs stuck in your head is really astonishingly low.

otm - my partner, not a Fiona fan, started humming “kick me under the table all you want, I won’t shut up, I won’t shut up” unprompted today even though I’ve played it through for him only a few times so far.

The stickiness could hurt in the long run I feel - I’m already wary that I’m going to burn out on this album too quickly.

Epicenter of the Anti-Fiona vitriol :
I HATE APPLE

I currently have multiple hooks stuck in my head, probably with the wrong lyrics.

Also - Jordan I have to pick your brain about ‘balanced’ rhythms and geometry and so on

― Priory, Thursday, April 23, 2020 6:59 PM (four days ago) bookmarkflaglink

haha sure. Maybe we should have a thread for our musical OCD.

I’m so sad that this fucking quarantine is making us miss some potentially genius live performances of this record.

Fiona is notoriously histrionic when performing live, she’s always in “the zone”, doesn’t break character much live. There’s many manic moments in here that I’m dying to see played live.

/Also - Jordan I have to pick your brain about ‘balanced’ rhythms and geometry and so on

― Priory, Thursday, April 23, 2020 6:59 PM (four days ago) bookmarkflaglink/

haha sure. Maybe we should have a thread for our musical OCD.

we haven't talked enough about how good For Her is

I don't even know what's going on in it but it's good

I haven't found a weak song yet.

good morning!

lol

The downbeat is exactly the same, the phrases are even, it's just that the melody starts on an upbeat. I think we must just hear rhythm/arrangements very differently!

― change display name (Jordan), Monday, April 20, 2020 8:26 AM (two weeks ago)

Yeah, you're right.

Nearly 2500 words that could easily be summed up in 5: "I don't get difficult music."

https://longreads.com/2020/05/04/i-dont-like-fiona-apple/

oh my god no

There are a lot of sentences in there that are very strange coming from a purported music critic.

But the second I heard whatever that sound is, I don’t know, a keyboard and cymbals chucka-chucka-chucka-ing, I thought, “Fuck, no.” I am not listening to that experimental shit.

Wut kind of music does this person usually listen to(?)

xp She's not a music critic, unless you mean Carl.

I thought the essay was an honest examination of Roberts's own reaction to the album within the inescapable context of other people's reactions. It's not meant to be a review.

I mean, there's all kind of stuff that's popular on this very board that I just shrug off unless I'm feeling particularly spicy that day, at which point I'll toss off a dismissive zing. I've never once felt the urge to construct a piece of this size to ostensibly sort out why and still not try very hard in the end.

The thesis of the piece looks like "this should be a message board post, not an article" but I was pleasantly surprised at how fine it was, though I was biased bc of all the positive stuff about Carl

"Bolt Cutters" is mixed and mastered really loud which also did well for MBDTF's reception but not so great for my own listening tastes, especially considering how dynamic "Idler Wheel" was but ah well

i have a separate complaint, they call that a long read???? kids these days

as someone who likes this album, the piece is in fact really good, reminds me of when longform music writing was more of a thing

I like it too, mainly because I’ve always felt kind of the same way about Beyoncé (and Lemonade in particular).

yeah it was a good piece!

I understand the "why don't I like this thing that all my putative peers like?" feeling. I've certainly talked myself into buying enough critically praised bullshit over the years. But "I don't like this thing that all my putative peers like" is not an inherently interesting statement. I'd almost always rather read someone telling me about a thing they do like. (I suspect that in this case, I would not like the things Roberts likes - the phrase "I am intimidated by the blues and by jazz and reject them because of how stupid they make me feel" was a giant clanging alarm bell.)

also weird that referencing Reich, Meredith Monk, and Yoko is apparently "critical flexing." sure, to the average man on the street two of those names are very obscure, but I think just about anyone who's reading Pitchfork would already have pretty decent familiarity with what's being described there.

I wish FTBC were as forbidding and avant-garde as she makes it out to be.

A number of sharp comments swathed in self-reflexivity.

xp Yeah, I mean, it's not difficult music (which is totally fine, it is what it is, but the what is this shit? reaction does not track).

‘Weird shit’, to boot. I don’t even like the album all that much but there’s a hyper-normative, anti-intellectualist streak to her argument that I find off-putting, despite how deftly she reframes it.

pom, the choral works from the 60s classical polls (partic. the berio and babbitt) helped prime me for the chaotic vocals on this album, so thanks for that.

also made me give a serious side-eye to that "no music has ever sounded like this" pitchfork logline.

Hah, my pleasure! Fwiw The Idler Wheel is my fave of her albums.

xp

mine too, i think, but i like this one a hell of a lot.

if you seriously can't see how the vocalizations on the album might be offputting to many people -- even if you happen to be OK with them -- then you need to be extricated from your bubble

Which Babbitt?

I can see how people in *a different bubble from mine* might find Apple's vocalizations offputting...I just don't care very much what people like that think. Ooh, you've discovered that non-pop music exists, have you? And now you'd like to share your thoughts about this "weird" "new" music? Let me pull up a chair so you can tell me all about it.

I like this album a lot, think the rapturous critical response is silly and super overblown, think the dismissals of Soraya Roberts' piece are unconvincing even though I don't think I particularly agree with it, and am wholly unsurprised that no one is commenting on or even noticing the magic Negro extravaganza permeating "Shameika"

in general there is a phenomenon I fucking hate, in which a writer -- almost always a woman, for some reason, can't imagine why -- dares to write that she committed the cardinal sin of being unsuccessful at liking (critically acclaimed piece of media, or sometimes not even critically acclaimed, just rehabilitated by The Discourse), and immediately there is a mob pile-on that is functionally identical to "LET PEOPLE ENJOY THINGS" except for things that aren't Marvel

xp -- I have seen one or two people comment on that about "Shameika" but yeah, only one or two (fwiw I also noticed it but didn't say anything because I knew for a fact it would be turned into "how could you sjws POSSIBLY think Lorde is talking about hip-hop?????")

Which Babbitt?

― Feel a million filaments (Sund4r), Tuesday, May 5, 2020 12:34 PM (four minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

im not saying the album sounds like philomel (the only piece of babbitt's i've heard), but that listening to avant-garde choral pieces like that one primed me a bit for the more chaotic moments in bolt cutters

This is terrific:

The whole thing just struck me as too insular for how sweepingly it was being lauded. And despite the claims at raw unprocessed sound, those dog barks on the title song are so strategically placed I was more tickled by the actual dogs barking behind the fence I passed while listening to it. But then you can’t deny the added texture Apple’s voice has acquired with age and her own liberation from her old song strictures. The song I momentarily hated the most on the album, for the opening repetition of its title (“Ladies,” sixteen times!), is also the one I liked the most. Despite the clunky lyrics — “ruminations on the looming effect and the parallax view” — some subterranean motor seems to power this track through the history of music, from folk to rap to whatever, sailing between genres like there’s nothing to it.

if you seriously can't see how the vocalizations on the album might be offputting to many people -- even if you happen to be OK with them -- then you need to be extricated from your bubble

This isn't about the vocals:

But the second I heard whatever that sound is, I don’t know, a keyboard and cymbals chucka-chucka-chucka-ing, I thought, “Fuck, no.” I am not listening to that experimental shit.

Cool, VC. I still haven't heard this album but your post made me curious.

the percussion, to which the same applies to maybe a lesser extent

For those unfamiliar with Soraya Roberts, last year she wrote a an essay about attending Toronto International Film Festival that's worth your time.

A leitmotif in her work is how paeans to communal experiences often omit who's left out of the party.

I have long had in mind some questions about her vocalisations and inspired by DJP's reservations I'm going to give them an airing; I'm probably about to look extremely stupid, but here goes: is showy jazz-singing by a rich white person not...a little bit...idk...fetishistic? wrong word maybe. embarrassing? certainly very irritating (to me at least)

do they have to be rich

am wholly unsurprised that no one is commenting on or even noticing the magic Negro extravaganza permeating "Shameika"

― DJP, Tuesday, May 5, 2020 10:35 AM (twenty-four minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

i'm completely ignorant of this and would like to know more

Jfc imago with all the fancy pants shit you listen to

idk what showy jazz singing is, but i also don't think that's what she's doing here

i'm completely ignorant of this and would like to know more

― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson),

A POC gives her blessing to future white artist, fades away.

that does not seem like a summary of the song

Anyway, musical unadventurousness is just about the most normative and reactionary aesthetic stance there is and I don’t think it needs a vocal apologist at a rare moment when a ‘difficult’ album by a brilliant woman artist lands smack dab in the mainstream’s middle. Like I said, I’ve got my own misgivings about FTBC but the fact that so many people are talking about it is frankly awesome.

but i also have no argument here so i'll just drop it xp

I wasn't providing a synopsis, though? xpost

there’s a hyper-normative, anti-intellectualist streak to her argument that I find off-putting, despite how deftly she reframes it.

the 'critical flexing' bit deploys that weird circular logic i see ppl defensively use on twitter a lot: "i know these references, but people who use these references are clearly poseurs trying to seem smart"

It's very weird to me that this album is considered "difficult"

"shameika" just seems like another song where she's mourning her disconnection from other women, while attaching all of this to how she has been perceived by other people through time. "you have potential" doesn't really function as a blessing to me, it feels deployed more ambivalently, or rather apple still doesn't know how to receive it even as it was a port in a storm of middle school bullies. admittedly i am a white person who did not see the magic negro thing at all until djp brought it up

of course now that i understand it i am trying to reexamine my own assumptions

also doesn't seem to enable lj's "is it embarrassing for rich white women to use jazz inflections" thought experiment at all

Shameika wasn't gentle and she wasn't my friend
But she got through to me and I'll never see her again

it's possible to read this interview by her on the song as patronizing, or at the very least shocked and amazed that certain assumptions she had weren't true. (it's possible, also, to not read it that way, but there at least seems to be an undercurrent) https://www.vulture.com/2020/04/fiona-apple-fetch-the-bolt-cutters-songs.html

Someone just let me know how many more days i can enjoy this album guilt-free before the backlash fully kicks in.

sorry, I forgot to add the 4,285th reiteration that I like this album, I assumed I could get away with 4,284

that was aimed at you specifically katherine, just at the general shift in the weather.

I know, it's just inextricably part of the phenomenon above that any dissenting opinion is absorbed into "the backlash"

not talking about anyone in this thread or that article’s writing but: it’s really exhausting how much negative criticism is just complete nonsense, like I feel like there’s a simpsons Viking element where some people just can’t deal with “not liking” something for basic reasons such as “I don’t like this person’s voice” and they have to come up with some bullshit theoretical framework to make their opinion “objective” or something. shots fired

I know what you mean. I think part of it is just a function of music writing as a genre, with its own set of assumptions and expectations.

The thing I don't get about the backlash to Soraya Roberts' article (now that I've read the whole thing) is that her framing device of her personal distaste highlights a bunch of what makes the album work for people who aren't her. The piece is more about her alienation and self-described neuroses than it is about the album being bad; it certainly doesn't read like she's trying to take the album down a peg or decry it as overrated or anything. The entire point of the piece is "it frustrates me that I can't get into this piece of work that has been embraced by a wide swath of my peers," not "why are people falling for this obvious shit", so unless you are just de facto against writers being up front about their viewpoint when offering opinions and analyzing things, I don't see why this piece would be objectionable.

The thing I don't get about the backlash to Soraya Roberts' article (now that I've read the whole thing) is that her framing device of her personal distaste highlights a bunch of what makes the album work for people who aren't her. The piece is more about her alienation and self-described neuroses than it is about the album being bad; it certainly doesn't read like she's trying to take the album down a peg or decry it as overrated or anything. The entire point of the piece is "it frustrates me that I can't get into this piece of work that has been embraced by a wide swath of my peers," not "why are people falling for this obvious shit", so unless you are just de facto against writers being up front about their viewpoint when offering opinions and analyzing things, I don't see why this piece would be objectionable.

― DJP, Tuesday, May 5, 2020 3:18 PM (thirty-four seconds ago) bookmarkflaglink

otfm; also, someone who is lazily dismissing an album wouldn't email a music critic asking why people like it, unless that email consists of "wow you suck loser"

And I would also say that it is the highlighting of what makes the album work in the face of what she can't cosign that makes the piece interesting and a good read.

That’s the generous reading, yes.

There was already backlash from the moment FTBC was released as a consequence of how instantly and loudly it was celebrated. Pitchfork may have hurt initial perception of the record by posting their 10 before most people had the chance to hear it. They should have waited until the following Monday or something. It totally makes sense that instant loud praise gives people an idea that they should anticipate a true unifying moment, and it's disappointing and frustrating when you don't feel it right away.

I will admit that my initial reaction before hearing the album was "this is going to be like listening to that fucking Lana Del Rey album again"

hope is a dangerous thing!

it really bums me out, to be honest, that I read one of, in my opinion, the best pieces of music writing this year and everyone is dunking on it because it is not by a Designated Writer(tm) and doesn't close ranks around the Correct Opinion(tm) to have

Don't personally care if someone is pro or con this album, and it is admirable that she puts so much work into interrogating her own biases, but it is also jarring to see someone tasked with music writing admit to those biases.

this isn't running on a music site, though, nor is it a music review; it is an essay that happens to be about music, running on a general-purpose site

^^^

it really bums me out, to be honest, that I read one of, in my opinion, the best pieces of music writing this year and everyone is dunking on it because it is not by a Designated Writer(tm) and doesn't close ranks around the Correct Opinion(tm) to have

― like, I’m eating an elephant head (katherine),

Katherine, this is not the case. Many of us have endorsed it.

everyone is dunking on it because it is not by a Designated Writer(tm) and doesn't close ranks around the Correct Opinion(tm) to have

Who is "everyone" in this sentence? Because you are radically misrepresenting what I, for one, didn't like about the piece.

it seems that virtually everyone I've seen, with the exceptions of one or two people, has been dunking on it, primarily because "lol she isn't a music writer how dare she open her mouth" and "lol she doesn't like this kind of music how dare she open her mouth"

essentially, most (or "many," or whichever word is fitting) people seem to be treating it like it's the my husband's record collection blog, and it's like we read two entirely different things

This article is the flip side of the hyperbolic 10/10 reviews that breathlessly tell us that no one has ever made music like this before. Robert's is instead saying she found it incomprehensible and unpleasant, but in doing so lends credence to the line of thinking that mystifies this album in the first place.

The reality is, it's an above average collection of highly personal songs with some truly extraordinary vocal performances. Fiona Apple didn't reinvent the wheel, she just made a really good album that plays up her personal idiosyncrasies to great effect. What grates is that a passing familiarity with music would bear this out, and would allow people to engage with it materially as part of a musical tradition, rather than as some unknowable, alien object.

Fiona Apple didn't reinvent the wheel, she just made a really good album that plays up her personal idiosyncrasies to great effect. What grates is that a passing familiarity with music would bear this out

...no...? as someone who loves fiona apple, I can still conceive of someone who has "a passing familiarity with music," or even a deep familiarity with music, and yet does not think it's a really good album, or recognizes that it's a really good album that they don't personally get (which is where the piece seems to end up).

Sorry, to be clear, by bear this out, I mean that Apple didn't reinvent the wheel. I don't mean to imply that it is an undeniably great record. I'm totally happy with people not liking it or not relating to it. I'm less happy with the notion that it is somehow unprecedented.

If you haven't experience the precedent, you don't have a reference point. And I think it's fair to say that many of the sonic reference points are a little bit outside of the standard modern "singer-songwriter" wheelhouse (if there is such a thing). This is not that outlandish an angle for a non-music-critic to come to this album from

Look at all the Fiona bros

Love this record, but while "Ladies" doesn't sound just like it, it does give me some strong "Fooled Around and Fell in Love" vibes. Maybe it's the chords.

We're Fionabrahs, D.

fetch the bro cutters

katherine fwiw my first introduction to this article's existence was a chorus of people on my Facebook and Twitter feeds telling the author to "save it for her journal", so

Me I thought it was good

what I really want to read -- it may exist, there have been over 20 years for it to -- is someone really digging into and tracing the cabaret/vaudeville influence, because I know enough (and have read enough interviews) to know there is one, but not enough beyond that

Nobody I've recognized from around these parts, but that article kicked off another one of those weird twitter things where suddenly people are acting like they now have "permission" to admit they didn't like the album. Like somehow they were forbidden from saying so before there was an "official" voice of dissent?

I saw three or four tweets yesterday linking the article with variations of, "finally i can admit that i didn't really think the album was very good either".

Brionahs?

lol

xp to Katherine re "cabaret": certain 6/8 or 3/4 meter choices, certain chordal choices. Chronologically the first "cabaret" song in her catalog is "Shadowboxer" but Pawn is really where you start to get that influence

plus a lot of vocal choices

Yeah... the way she turns "braaaaaain" into a violently swinging melisma on "Every Single Night" is a sound I can only associate with cabaret or Weimar stuff

It's interesting though, when "cabaret" is mentioned as an influence on an artist/song my tastebuds turn purple but with Fiona she makes it work for some reason. That is the curiosity

going backwards here a bit. . .

if anyone has a problem with the "weird" vocalizations on this album, that's confusing. because from al green to kate bush, there's always been people who have idiosyncratic styles of singing in their music - and who also simultaneously make great pop records.

haven't read the linked piece. don't care to. not in a malicious way; just don't care.

also: fiona has covered some pre-rock pop music in the past. stuff like "blue skies", etc. i think her influences from that stuff are a big contributor to her 'cabaret' moments.

There's a rawness to her singing and the production overall that maybe helps sell it.

xp

xp -- there are a lot of people with idiosyncratic styles of singing, and a lot of people turned off by that.

For example,some people REALLY hated Macy Gray and she just had a gravelly voice

welp, if you wanna say al green is "experimental" because of it, idk what to say to that. it's fine to dislike someone's singing style, but it's a little farfetched to try to justify your dislike in that way.

and yeah: i was one of those people - macy gray has a horrendous voice. her music is not "weird" or "experimental" in any way whatsoever.

Fiona Apple ends the first song on the album with a Diamanda Galas-esque vocal freakout session. I know most people here are very used to that but we are not most people.

would you reckon that "most people" have heard a song by al green?

again, my discrepancy is not with disliking a singing style. who cares - you like it or you don't. but trying to pass that off in an "objective" way by saying it's "experimental or weird" music is the issue.

singers displaying idiosyncrasy is very common.

Nobody I've recognized from around these parts, but that article kicked off another one of those weird twitter things where suddenly people are acting like they now have "permission" to admit they didn't like the album. Like somehow they were forbidden from saying so before there was an "official" voice of dissent?

I saw three or four tweets yesterday linking the article with variations of, "finally i can admit that i didn't really think the album was very good either".

okay lol

is this like interviewing voters who said they secretly voted for Trump

Mary Margaret more than Diamanda, to my ears, but it's a good point DJP

Yes, totally MMO'H!

Macy Gray's voice (which is pretty much just her timbre) seems to be an entirely different thing than the vocalizations on this album, which I think it's entirely fair to call experimental -- particularly given that they're compared to Meredith Monk and Yoko Ono, both of whom make experimental music.

I like this album, but it’s nowhere near as odd or challenging as its detractors and some of its most ardent supporters are claiming.

would you reckon that "most people" have heard a song by al green?

yes

I like this album, but it’s nowhere near as odd or challenging as its detractors and some of its most ardent supporters are claiming.

― A White, White Gay (cryptosicko)

In my case I'd substitute "but" with "and."

Practically everybody has heard "Let's Stay Together" without necessarily seeking it out.

the vocalizations on this album, which I think it's entirely fair to call experimental -- particularly given that they're compared to Meredith Monk and Yoko Ono, both of whom make experimental music.

al green also very comparable to yoko then.

Anything can be compared to anything if you want to badly enough. Ch_ck E))y made a whole career out of it.

i'm just saying that if we're using the fifteen second performance at the end of the first track as a basis for labeling things "experimental", then we're going to need to redefine a lot of other things.

this reminds me of when the roots released phrenology and some people were writing off the entire album because of a thirty second bad brains homage and they didn't want to hear that on a hiphop record.

The article itself called the 10 seconds at the beginning of the first track "experimental."

huh, sounds like joni -another person who has made mounds of stupidly popular records- to me.

Not the vocals; the looped percussion sample before the piano comes in.

I said this upthread but this album is mixed and mastered really really really loud and I think that fact can attract and repel certain people in equal measure and find them using the word "experimental" as a proxy for "it is really loud"

yeah maybe it’s tin foil but seems like vocals are recorded/mixed differently others days )on pop/rock records esp) in a way I really can’t handle

differently “these days” ugh

xp -- there are a lot of people with idiosyncratic styles of singing, and a lot of people turned off by that.

See Alanis Morrissette's entire career for instance

see the dave matthews thread

Is 2020 the year of the great DMB reassessment?

was 2018 just the preamble?

"We've reassessed Dave Matthews and... he is still corny as fuck!"

Just listened to this---deluxe edition on youtube---for the first time, after a lot of things by and including Robert Wyatt, also Shelby Lynne's 2020 s/t---and I'm stuck by the compatibility: small group, bass, percussion, keyboards, usually piano, which is what seems like the main writing instrument, for a freewheeling yet instantly recognizable style---depplyed,in Apple's case, for challenging and sometimes(?) lavishing the object of her attentions with self-expression and "idiomatic to idiosyncratic but clear enough" results, as I said about Lynne's album---and maybe Apple's learned something from jazz, like the other two (upthread, she's quoted re Miriam Makeba, and I get some of that too, also the oblique strokes of xpost non-standardbearers Kate Bush and Joan Armatrading)(Tuneyards, or some of the same sonic sensibility, although Apple came first, recording-wise). Nevertheless, she's got her own agenda, own axes and axis, as always.
On first listen, her music seems like it's in good shape---still tensile, even robust in its lean way, despite and maybe because of some more allnighters now and then and again and again---a driving and driven quality in there, but her own kind of discipline, pace---not quite like anybody else, despite the comparisons (though I would not have been surprised if she hadn't lasted very long, but then I ditto re Jerry Lee and Little Richard). But---is it basically just more of the same, of a good ol' artist we're glad to get more of? If so, does it "basically" matter?? Considering that she, the musical persona and creator, *isn't* quite like anybody else, oh hell no: that nobody else, even from the small convergence I've mentioned, will quite do as substitute---but I wonder if I will listen to this, incl. in memory, as much as I do these other (more prolific) artists, or did listen to her previous albums---years ago, with all those years between them, and this one too: does that matter, momentum and impact-wise? As long as she seems to be more about holding the fort than breakthroughs--although who knows what kind of offstage breakthroughs it might have taken for her to get this far.

the vocal arrangements on "newspaper" >>>>>>>>>>

it definitely qualifies as some kind of breakthrough from the close attention it's received, irrespective of quality or innovation or consistency relative to her previous work. it's a really good album, I wish that was a good enough hook for critics who feel the need to exaggerate how unprecedented and avant garde it is

I used to get a lot of shit from indie types for liking her (and other mostly dissimilar women who were grouped together), I assume at least some of the hype from these circles is motivated by a need to redress years of that bullshit

some of the more negative reactions elsewhere are a bit "i'm the only person brave enough to admit beyonce sucks" which is tedious

The person who posts as mostly dylan on Twitter has this list of personnel on new Dylan album, which supposedly will incl. FA (and Blake Mills) as additional musicians, if it doesn't show up below:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EatdRdOWAAERL5L?format=jpg&name=medium

How is this holding up for everyone?

splendidly. just waiting for my vinyl.

It's still good, but I burned out quickly

Still great but that Pitchfork review has aged extremely poorly, as was always likely.

I love Tidal which I suspect is her only good album

I was never a fan previously, but I think this is strong and fresh and I love how confident she is with her powers. It’s also gone over very well with my 18yo daughter and consequently I like how few fucks Apple gives about image and knowing her place.

It’s still great

got the vinyl! hooray! good thing my stereo's in storage!

d`oh

Tidal which I suspect is her only good album

― this has been the best year fuiud (rip van wanko), Sunday, July 19, 2020 4:47 AM

also ya, no

I hadn't listened to this before today not because I didn't think it would be any good but *because* I knew it would good and was just waiting for the right day. And hey, it's really good!

after the dust has settled, "heavy balloon" is *easily* my favorite track on this.

mine too

It's difficult listening to this album; it reminds me of the first stage of quarantine, i.e. April.

I think it's better for that; a reminder that awesomeness can still exist.

Yep, same as you, Al

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kT4SZiEgJ_g

live versions!

Thanks. She’s an incredible live performer.

An amazing interview/story with the real Shameika and her reunion with Fiona: https://pitchfork.com/features/article/fiona-apple-shameika-fetch-the-bolt-cutters-interview/

She turned out to be a rapper so of course they collab'd: https://open.spotify.com/track/5IelFDwkj5eJEnTSfwroxa?si=mlk-AyQHQuKY3R14anvdCg

And there's also a video now for "Shameika":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yM63Tzv-uZg

Love that they were reunited by their New Yorker-reading 3rd-grade teacher.

really glad this worked out in the best way possible

(although a bit surprising that she was a public figure but nobody put the pieces together before now?)

beautiful story, glad they were able to reconnect.

This fixes all the issues I had with "Shameika"

ayo real talk: if you don't like this album, how does it feel to be objectively wrong?

this album is metal as fuck, in that it sounds like it was screwed together at a workbench

― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson)

There’s also a seething rage through the whole thing - even in the “sweet” ballads such as cosmonauts - that makes it sound heavier than most metal albums I’ve heard. I haven’t heard this album a lot because it feels like a bad influence to me. Whenever I truly connect with it, it makes me want to burn the world to the ground.

It reminds me of Rain Dogs in that sense but this one feels more wore down and old and angrier.

Such a landmark album. I can’t listen very often because it’s too real and can’t be backgrounded.
I don’t even know how to say this and I feel sure it will sound weird or patronising or just off somehow, but - I gave this album to my ex wife as a gift, because I knew she had a lot of unexpressed anger about me leaving, and I wanted her to know that I understood that and respected it. She loves the record fwiw.

Did she not do any live performances at all? This album sounds like it could be pretty good live but I don’t see evidence of her doing any live performance after 2017.

All I could find is her performing three songs for the New Yorker festival.

it released during covid and she hasn't toured since, though she said in an interview at the time that she wanted to tour once things opened up again. last year she said she still really wants to tour again but her mental health really isn't up to it right now.

she played "ladies" and "i want you to love me" on her 2013 tour with blake mills though