Original drum patterns

Do any drum patterns stand out in your mind as very distinct? If somebody only played the drum part you would easily know the song it came from, drums that sound like nothing else.
some examples
Devo - Satisfaction
Bauhaus - Double Dare
Public Image Ltd - Four Enclosed Walls
Killing Joke - Unspeakable
The Stranglers - Peasant In The Big Shitty
The Stooges - 1970
The Cure - The Figurehead
The drums are very distinct on the whole in Captain Beefheart's music, but hearing one in particular and knowing which song it's from might not be so easy.

Unwound - October All Over

My Bloody Valentine - Nothing Much to Lose

fucking incredible. it's an expressionist drum pattern - those wild fill/rolls are both in time and slightly out of it, and proudly willing to shift back and forth between them. they are precise at times, and smeared at others, but always propelling forward, fuck yeah, just getting the wordless chorus while typing this and yeaaaaaaah

i will kill this thread with posts

Lots of Prince’s Linn drum patterns from the 80s fit the bill.

might as well just say the catalog of deerhoof. from the drums alone you can always spot deerhoof within 1 minute

Tomorrow Never Knows

Any specific Deerhoof songs that stand out? As I said Beefheart drumming is always easy to spot as The Magic Band but not very often to a particular song.

XTC "Making Plans for Nigel" has a deceptively interesting one. A few Police songs too

And speaking of MBV, "Feed Me With Your Kiss" I guess is largely dictated by the song structure, but the drum track would be distinctive instantly

"And She Was" by Talking Heads also pretty distinct

the firing shots of "this magnificent bird will rise", right at the beginning of Reveille, will always signify Deerhoof to me, but...it's hard to explain. he (Greg Saunier - possible in the top 400 drummers of all-time) has a nervous melodic energy and original "style" that i recognize and always will recognize. i realize now that i was thinking more of styles, when answering, rather than patterns and specific things. but i will think of more

xp vinnie

absolutely. the other day i was airdrumming / thighdrumming the CRAP out of isn't anything, and both of those songs, feed me with your kiss, and nothing much to lose, were very drum-centric in an intense way

Do any drum patterns stand out in your mind as very distinct? If somebody only played the drum part you would easily know the song it came from, drums that sound like nothing else.
some examples
Devo - Satisfaction
Bauhaus - Double Dare
Public Image Ltd - Four Enclosed Walls
Killing Joke - Unspeakable
The Stranglers - Peasant In The Big Shitty
The Stooges - 1970
The Cure - The Figurehead

these are all rad drum parts. I have heard a lot of people emulate and copy them. They are pretty easy to play tbh. Like, I could hear the drums from Satisfaction and Double Dare, and say, "ah that sounds like the drum part from Satisfaction (or Double Dare)" ... but it could also be from a bunch of other songs.

The drums are very distinct on the whole in Captain Beefheart's music, but hearing one in particular and knowing which song it's from might not be so easy.

I've also heard a lot of musicians emulate the drums on Beefheart. Not as many as the list above ... harder to play, not as popular. If you are familiar with Beefheart, then you can hear these other musicians/bands and say, "ha, someone was influenced by Beefheart lol" but idk ... probably harder to copy than the others. I'm sure a discerning listener could easily win at a "Beefheart/Not Beefheart" listening challenge.

Obviously the most distinctive "original" drum patterns are gonna be in jazz (or experimental) music and not rock / pop / indie.

I’d say Police and Van Halen drums also distinct and not even because of the patterns themselves necessarily but because their actual drums sounds are unique.

xp Z -- because they were "hometown heroes" -- there was definitely a few years where like at least once a week I heard a different band where the drummer tried to sound like Greg Saunier ... a few were very close actually. I think I heard Ches Smith do a really impressive Greg Saunier impression ... then went back to sounding like Ches Smith.

a specific spot on Reveille that I would _immediately recognize_ within 3 seconds is [3:18 to 4:45] on The Last Trumpeter Swan. Listen to those drums. it persists over two different sound environments, too, including the beautiful spots in the 4th minute where you can really hear the drums in isolation. that, to me, is just the very best. i respect the hell out of greg saunier during that section. he has taps into something deeper there that other drummers don't have access to, and he still does it now

xp sarahell i will soon again be a local drummer impersonating greg saunier (as i was in 2006 in CHI!). i have no immediate plans but i just feel like this is happening now. i don't have a job, it's cool, i dyed my hair, i am ready to rock

my ridiculous dream is to make it on this thread, later on the other end, as the drummer who makes something that good. out of this empire of shit, drumming has always felt the most fundamental to me, and i'm wanting to lean in hard this year

aim for the moon, and you might hit that dilapidated shack over there

What other songs have the drum patterns from Devo's Satisfaction or Double Dare?

Paul Simon (by way of Steve Gadd) - 50 Ways to Leave Your Lover

Fleetwood Mac - Tusk

Be My Baby (much imitated, of course)

Eno, "Dead Finks Don't Talk"

Anything by Big Country, for sure.

AC/DC - Back in Black (like Kashmir, it's the groove that clicks)
Phil Collins - In the Air Tonight
Zeppelin - The Ocean (and most of the rest)
Beatles - Come Together
Ronettes - Be My Baby

I went to see a (professional) musical with my kids the night Neil Peart died. I was listening to the orchestra warm up, and the drummer was without a doubt warming up to "Subdivisions" in Peart's honor. Don't know how many other people picked out that particular pitter-patter without the rest of the song there.

When the Levee Breaks for sure

I could probably pick out a lot of Can stuff by just the drums, such as Vitamin C

Lots off drums can probably be identified by the fills alone, Space Truckin' and Pusherman, say

A Frames - first album in particular - seemed to write their songs from the drums beats up, particularly Hostage Crisis, Chemical, Plastica, Test Tube Baby. Erin was as a drummer as well as guitarist, and certainly thought in those terms.

I interpreted the question differently, it shouldn't be about the original recording/production. This is like, if you had the misfortune to be in Guitar Center, and somebody sat down at a kit and started playing the part, would you know the song?

Something like When the Levee Breaks or AC/DC would be real borderline, it's so tied to the recording and the original drummer's feel. But there are an infinity of other drum parts tied to that particular song, like say 'Cissy Strut'.

Nirvana songs are great examples, obviously Teen Spirit or In Bloom have drum parts as extra hooks, but take the verse parts in Heart-Shaped Box...incredibly simple, anyone can play them, but I think it would be instantly identifiable too.

Rap music to thread

This is like, if you had the misfortune to be in Guitar Center, and somebody sat down at a kit and started playing the part, would you know the song?

that's kinda how I interpreted it as well... maybe minus the Guitar Center. like listening to the drum part in isolation or something?. Of course so much depends on what songs you know, doesn't it? Then the thread becomes about what is "common knowledge" and what is more popular ... which is ... idk ... tedious.

Like I could say the drum pattern opening R.E.M.'s It's the End of the World As We Know It" because that song is kinda omnipresent for me (by choice, tbh) ... but in isolation it isn't that remarkable a drum pattern

Rap music to thread

Idk I think this is also tied to the texture of the break or sample, rather than the pattern usually.

Like on Questlove's podcast he'll play a game with producers where they have to id a break based on a literal split second of the sample, like not even a whole snare note. But most rap beats wouldn't be instantly identifiable if you played them on a kit (or even programmed them with different samples), except for the super classic breakbeats? There are exceptions of course, I think a lot of Timbaland hits are identifiable just by kick/snare/hh pattern.

But most rap beats wouldn't be instantly identifiable if you played them on a kit (or even programmed them with different samples)

otm

Steve Jansen, over and over again. Start with just about any track on Tin Drum.

Any specific Deerhoof songs that stand out? As I said Beefheart drumming is always easy to spot as The Magic Band but not very often to a particular song.

― someeggs, Sunday, July 25, 2021 11:54 PM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoD0WVxrsfQ

this was my first impulse deerhoof selection that typifies what makes saunier's drumming so fun. minimal kit, plays with phrasing/meter, unpredictable fills and cymbal crashes, the violence he plays with etc

As I said Beefheart drumming is always easy to spot as The Magic Band but not very often to a particular song.

Pretty often, I'd say... and not just with Drumbo drumming.

Saunier is sick and a true original, but yeah I'd argue it's more about his style than sitting down at a kit and playing one of his parts and saying "guess what song this is".

Didn't John French release a solo album of some of his drum parts for Beefheart? I think when I saw the Magic Band a couple of years back he played "On Tomorrow" as a solo piece.

Ballroom Blitz!

i'd add the drums to isley bros' "footsteps in the dark" just for the hi-hat pattern alone. revived for multiple generations by ice cube ("it was a good day") and thundercat ("them changes") bc its that good.

The examples in the first post feature intros or long breaks with isolated drums, which obviously makes it a lot more distinctive/easy to identify.
With no particular evidence that I could identify them in isolation, I'll say Ginger Baker on "Deserted Cities of the Heart" and Bill Ward on "Wheels of Confusion".

Al Green "I'm Glad You're Mine"

Mtume "Juicy Fruit"
Audio Two "Top Billin"
Lafayette Afro Rock Band "Hihache" (or are we not doing breakbeats here?)

Ballroom Blitz!

But is it the intro to Ballroom Blitz or to I Want You to Want Me? :)

(I know they're slightly different, but I don't know if that two-step beat rises to the level of very distinct?)

Rap music to thread

― xheugy eddy (D-40), Monday, July 26, 2021 10:29 AM (two hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

This made me think of the Clipse "Grindin" beat, instantly recognizable when kids would pound it out on tables in the cafeteria.

(I know they're slightly different, but I don't know if that two-step beat rises to the level of very distinct?)

If one saw the proverbial drummer in Guitar Center, I think their vibe would drop a lot of clues as to which two-step shuffle, which Bo Diddly, etc they were going for.

Like when I hear the "Be My Baby" beat, I think I can tell if the artist is 100% referencing Ronettes, 100% referencing Jesus & Mary Chain, if they're 50/50 or some other ratio or reference. Like, Lana Del Ray is 60/40 Ronettes/JAMC, but if it were a Johnny Jewel production, it would be 60/40 JAMC/Ronettes.

"Sucker MCs" - Run-DMC

oh yeah "Walk this Way" of course

Photek - Consciousness

Devo - Satisfaction

The Satisfaction beat is the same beat that Charlie Watts plays, just on the wrong drums

Nina Simone "See-Line Woman"

I'm not a drummer, but is that really true RE: Satisfaction? Devo rhythm is so off kilter.

First thing I thought of for this thread is Mick Fleetwood's intro to "Hypnotized."

Idg what you're saying about the Devo beat either Whiney? Even if you just play it all on one surface it's a different rhythm.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIQJIQHmV4o

1, 2, 3 and 4
1, 2, 3 and 4

wow dude

even for you this is a stretch

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RI71ebbU0PQ

It might mess w/ yer head because the Devo bass drum is on the *4*, but I've played the beat and can assure you its the same rhythm

I'll go to the drum studio this week and record a video if you guys don't believe me.

And Waterface, if you're going to be pedantic, yes, it's the beat Watts plays AND Jack Nitzsche's tambourine, excuse me

it's the same rhythm but its a different pattern

Devo = 1 and 2 e-and, 3 and 4 e-and

Where are those 16th notes in the Stones beat (even with the tambourine)?

(I have also played the beat, lol)

You're double-timing it

You can at least admit the beats sound *completely* different, yes?

xpost What if I told you that if you speed up two bars of the Stones rhythm (1, 2, 3 and 4
1, 2, 3 and 4) you get ... exactly what you posted (1 and 2 e-and, 3 and 4 e-and)

If you count it off the way the quarter note feels natural, it's basically a double-time beat (it cycles twice in one bar).

And ok, I get what you're saying now, so "the Satisfaction beat is the same beat that Charlie Watts plays, just on the wrong drums AND twice as fast". I hadn't thought about it like that before, and I'm into it.

Yeah, it's p brilliant

Bell Biv Devoe - "Poison"

1 and 2 e-and, 3 and 4 e-and

lol this is so many songs.

I mean ... granted it's no ...

1(kick) - 2(snare) - 3(kick)-and(kick) - 4(snare)

or even, the exceptionally original, I can totally tell exactly what song it is, where you take that pattern and add eighth notes on the hi-hat.

my ridiculous dream is to make it on this thread, later on the other end, as the drummer who makes something that good. out of this empire of shit, drumming has always felt the most fundamental to me, and i'm wanting to lean in hard this year

― Z_TBD (Karl Malone), Monday, 26 July 2021 05:19 (fourteen hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

I love this post!

or the truly original fill that is

1-and 2-and 3-e-and-a 4-ee-and-a

I hope this thread culminates in a Whiney vs. Jordan Verzuz drum-off

lol, a 'name that tune' drum-off would be more fun that the regular kind

Whiney vs Watergate showdown is A+, keep it going

Esp Waterface thinking he had a gotcha there

ehhhh not really a gotcha more of a "these two drum patterns sound completely different to me" of course they both count to 4, both songs are in 4/4!!!!

i love talking about drums

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tL7uVSRnOms

Talking about drums is like architecting around rock criticism.

“theme from shaft”

(ctrl+f "funky drummer" no results)

hrmm.

Yeah the classic James Brown breaks absolutely fall into this category, though I would argue that a lot of other breakbeats don't (ie 'Apache' is really tied to the recording and the bongos, and I'd argue that "Hihache" isn't that recognizable just as a beat).

Top Billin', Grindin', Poison all great calls for programmed beats btw.

not a beat, but the descending drum fill when ringo comes in on "a day in the life" is very memorable and i would know that anywhere

"I'd argue that "Hihache" isn't that recognizable just as a beat"

That dragging hi-hat leading into the next bar is instantly recognizable, distinct from any production personality.

Good point, that's one for the true heads

Saunier is sick and a true original, but yeah I'd argue it's more about his style than sitting down at a kit and playing one of his parts and saying "guess what song this is".

― change display name (Jordan),

Not as virtuosic as Saunier or French, but Hamish Kilgour (the Clean) might be another one of these.

Rap music to thread

Idk I think this is also tied to the texture of the break or sample, rather than the pattern usually.

Like on Questlove's podcast he'll play a game with producers where they have to id a break based on a literal split second of the sample, like not even a whole snare note. But most rap beats wouldn't be instantly identifiable if you played them on a kit (or even programmed them with different samples), except for the super classic breakbeats? There are exceptions of course, I think a lot of Timbaland hits are identifiable just by kick/snare/hh pattern.

― change display name (Jordan), Monday, July 26, 2021 11:53 AM (six hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

But most rap beats wouldn't be instantly identifiable if you played them on a kit (or even programmed them with different samples)

otm

― sarahell, Monday, July 26, 2021 11:54 AM (six hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

strongly disagree. sucka mcs ?

theres certain rhythmic patterns that get repeated throughout rap history. you can hear them getting repeated in like, industrial music from the late 80s

i think "top billin" is pretty much the goat here honestly. you could play that shit with toothpicks on a glass table and it would still be instantly recognizable.

blue monday
hot for teacher

starski live at the fever
fearless four - f4000 (im counting scratching as essentially percussive)
i mean, freakin the message

someone said prince, but i think that's more reliant on the sound of the linn drum (even though i do agree that those songs are unmistakable when heard). i would say, however, "777-9311" is even more relevant. technically not prince, but still deserves a mention.

Just about everything George Hurley did on Double Nickels.

“The Jungle Line” by Joni Mitchell
…and relatedly…
“C30 C60 C90 Go!” by Bow Wow Wow
…although “original” may be a stretch bc I think both are derived from field recordings that were used in the hit record “Burundi Black” from 1971.

Also, someone mentioned “50 Ways to Leave Your Lover,” but also “Late in the Evening” by Paul Simon

I guess about 70% of the Liars catalog between Drowned and Sisterworld

"blue monday"

Donna Summer - Our Love tbh

What about the beat In Schoolly D’s “P.S.K. What Does it Mean?” that Siouxsie Sioux used later. It was from a drum machine, does it count?

Haruomi Hosono has this weird rhythmic thing which flips the downbeat that's so distinct that I can often easily identify songs he wrote just by the drum programming

Britney Spears - Boys

we will rock you

Sunday Bloody Sunday is instantly recognizable.

theres certain rhythmic patterns that get repeated throughout rap history. you can hear them getting repeated in like, industrial music from the late 80s

― xheugy eddy (D-40), Monday, July 26, 2021 4:17 PM (three hours ago)

As someone who is a fan of industrial music from the late 80s, you are very otm. Like I'll hear some old school rap song and be like, "Damn this is awesome, this reminds me of Thrill Kill Kult" ... or something like that

if we are looking at "rock/pop" music -- Adam & the Ants -- totally underrated for original drum patterns

Soul Coughing - "Super Bon Bon"

Iggy Pop - "Lust for Life" -- though I guess it's dependent on how we define "pattern" -- the specific drums as well the rhythm is how I interpret it. Because I think rhythmically the most recognizable pattern is also there in "Third Uncle"

Still no mentions of Toto’s Rosanna huh?

Also no mention of any Tool song?

I nom mmm Eulogy

Dave Brubeck - take 5 also very unique and recognizable

Benny Goodman - sing sing sing

YYZ

For Schooly D I was thinking PSK was recognizable just cause of the 808 sounds and Saturday Night was the one that had a unique pattern. But I just listened to both and PSK def has a unique pattern, whereas I'm now hesitant to say that Saturday does.

The Rhythm of the Heat
Spellbound
The Flowers of Romance
Tempo House

All songs where at moments there isn't much besides the drums.

Limb By Limb

Sylvia "Pillow Talk"

Pretty much the entirety of The Meters 1st album

The electro-handclap rhythm in The Cure "Close to Me"

Claps + the breathing is A+

And that sound portrayed as 'plucked comb' in the video.

I can think of a few metal-related and metal-adjacent ones:

Metallica - And Justice For All
Slayer - Raining Blood
Chilli Peppers - Blood Sugar Sex Magick
Sepultura - Roots Refuse/Resist
Kyuss - Demon Cleaner
Alice in Chains - No Excuses (the hi-hat trills alone)

I don’t think I’ve ever heard Suede’s « The Drowners » drum pattern in another song.

strongly disagree. sucka mcs ?

― xheugy eddy (D-40), Monday, July 26, 2021 6:16 PM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

theres certain rhythmic patterns that get repeated throughout rap history. you can hear them getting repeated in like, industrial music from the late 80s

― xheugy eddy (D-40), Monday, July 26, 2021 6:17 PM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

Tbh I was thinking more of the trap era, which is great and all, but how many tunes can you recognize just from the drum pattern?

Metallica - And Justice For All

And 'One' is definitely the first thing you play when presented with a double kick pedal.

my man

It's funny, I briefly thought (figuring you mean the flurry of double bass rolls before it gets heavy), nah, no one would recognize that particular double bass blast as "One," but then I thought, you know, I bet people would!

I’d agree that One is the Metallica song most drummers seem to learn first.

Herbie Hancock "Palm Grease"
Drummer Mike Clark doesn't stick with that halting rhythm the entire track but does it for quite a while. He said other drummers would play it for him as a tip of a cap of he walked into the room when they were performing.

Tbh I was thinking more of the trap era, which is great and all, but how many tunes can you recognize just from the drum pattern?

― change display name (Jordan), Tuesday, July 27, 2021 12:51 PM (thirty-five minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

one that comes to mind this year is the LPB Poody intro lifting the 'teach me how to dougie' drum pattern
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5sdCwzqIkE

my pal foot foot
moonlight on vermont
minutemen - disguises
so many tatsuya yoshida moments

This is an iconic one in New Orleans:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlBuc863hU0

So's this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RpyyA0nCeFQ

i'm curious how many 'original' drum patterns are actually original - no ideas original etc

schoolly d's 'saturday night' is actually: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3RaaHfzcD0

anyway a big collection of 'original drum beats'

https://www.discogs.com/Various-Ultimate-Breaks-Beats-The-Complete-Collection/release/1075570

john cage 4'33"

tbc i know these arent what the thread is delineating but i think its the source of a lot of songs which are immediately identifiable by their drum pattern -- i think of wu tang 'its yourz' as one of those but its a disco sample

I have real semantic problems with the thread concept so I can't really engage with it even though I love drum talk

you could play that shit with toothpicks on a glass table and it would still be instantly recognizable.

^^I think this is a pretty good metric actually, otherwise the thread is just 'name breakbeats and drum intros'

(the Roots version of that Schooly D beat is one of my favorite things btw)

^^I think this is a pretty good metric actually, otherwise the thread is just 'name breakbeats and drum intros'

― change display name (Jordan), Tuesday, July 27, 2021 2:58 PM (one minute ago) bookmarkflaglink

this is a weird metric to me bc it discounts tons of stuff that's done w texture

Tbh I was thinking more of the trap era, which is great and all, but how many tunes can you recognize just from the drum pattern?

― change display name (Jordan), Tuesday, July 27, 2021 12:51 PM (two hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

dababy - "suge"
chief keef - "faneto"
yn jay - "coochie"

Ya obv but talking about breakbeats and samples has been done to death, and that's a different conversation anyway. I think the original thread concept is fun, to see what drum patterns (ie rhythm and voicing) are still indelibly associated with a song even when they're divorced from the original recording and re-played.

yea i mean the ones ive been listing qualify i think??

some of the most famous i guess would be busta rhymes 'put your hands where my eyes to see' and clipse 'grindin'

but i think the ones voodoo is mentioning would qualify too -- tho w/ 'coochie' that beat is kind of spawning a genre so might lose that w time

I'm down to here anyone's examples they themselves deem to be relevant, but how I read "drum pattern" is that it excludes the contribution(s) of texture

Lust for Life
Can - Oh Yeah
Devo - Freedom of Choice

sincere question: why have there been so many drum threads lately?

because they have a good beat and you can dance to them?

I'm down to here anyone's examples they themselves deem to be relevant, but how I read "drum pattern" is that it excludes the contribution(s) of texture

― A True White Kid that can Jump (Granny Dainger), Tuesday, July 27, 2021 3:13 PM (thirteen minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

hmm. i think how memorable a drum pattern is in many of the given examples is tied to texture / timbre of the drums used

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geez -- i wasn't complaining i was wondering why people are so interested in drum questions lately. i am a drummer! i am not being hostile. see you later jerks

some of the most famous i guess would be busta rhymes 'put your hands where my eyes to see'

This is a Seals and Crofts sample

'There There'

You're right, D. I was consciously trying to list only ones I thought had a unique, memorable pattern. It's harder than I thought! Because yeah most of the time it's hard to entangle the pattern from the texture. For me at least. I thought "toothpicks tapping on a table" was a good guideline.

Plus there's whole genres and subgenres based off a drum pattern (or slight variations of it), and it can be difficult to pick out which is the "original". Like I was trying to remember which reggae track had the first "steppers" style beat but gave up lol.

This is a Seals and Crofts sample

― my Least Favorite Writer (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, July 27, 2021 3:35 PM (five minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

i know!

So it's ... not original?

idk, I can't engage with this thread because there's like three overlapping definitions of what it's actuallu about, but gonna throw this in there for all the "Lust for Life" heads

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6y7PHFpiLVo

*actually

So it's ... not original?

i brought up the beats and breaks link for a reason. sometimes the origin of the sample isn't what's associated w the beat.

the original question i had itt was questioning the idea of 'original' that no idea's original. no one associates that song w the seals & croft song because its not the 'beat' of the song its just a moment. but if i tap that pattern people associate it w the busta song

idk, I can't engage with this thread because there's like three overlapping definitions of what it's actuallu about

debating the terms of the thread seems pretty relevant because there's confusion about it, because it's interesting, etc.

hmm. i think how memorable a drum pattern is in many of the given examples is tied to texture / timbre of the drums used

But is it still identifiable once you separate it from the recording/engineering/samples used? Can you play it on live drums or stomp it out with hands and feet (since you can still get low/medium/high voices that way) and know what the song is?

Btw I mentioned Timbaland generally but I think you could do this with Big Pimpin' or Get Ur Freak On and absolutely id the song.

xp

'big pimpin' is a sample too

its interesting when you start to realize how much of an artist's sound was more about curating samples that sounded 'of a piece' (as opposed to drum programming) (although Timbaland probably straddled that I think people undercount the sample curation aspect)

OK as an example 'teach me how to dougie' strikes me as an immediately recognizeable one (that LPB Poody seemed to be lightly referencing on "Batman")
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LLZ-PIx6Ss

But the pattern is distinct in part because of how the drums are pitched -- so by that definition it wouldn't qualify for the thread because i think if someone just tapped it with toothpicks i wouldn't recognize it. but isn't the thread more interesting if its incorporated?

We need Suga Free to tap out the beats mentioned and see which we can identify
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=re5uxcHpB8Q

'big pimpin' is a sample too

I know, but the sample didn't have drums (and obv the drums are programmed to fit the sample like a glove, which is why they're recognizable!).

For 'Teach Me How to Dougie', obv you can't replicate the exact pitches and samples, but I'm playing that beat at my desk now with three voices (using a pen for that cowbell/tabla/whatever sound that is what really makes the beat), and I think it sounds pretty close. :)

The Roots – 'The Seed (2.0)' def fits the bill.

Thing I always loved about "It's Yours" is the switch to a totally different beat every 4 bars or whatever it is yet it still sounds like one cohesive thing. And it's pretty fun to drum along to.

I’d agree that One is the Metallica song most drummers seem to learn first.

― ✖✖✖ (Moka), Tuesday, July 27, 2021 11:16 AM (three hours ago)

lol, the first song I learned on drums was Size by DNA -- pretty original as far as drum patterns go, but fairly easy to play.

xp - massaman -- yeah, I thought of Yoshida first thing when I saw this thread premise ... though, like Saunier, lots of drummers recognize how awesome his playing is and imitate it. I think it was actually only a few weeks ago, I was hanging out with a friend, and her roommate is a drummer and had music on, and I was like, "this sounds kinda like Ruins?" And it was OOIOO

the toothpicks on the glass table thing ... that's the rhythm though, and not really the pattern, which includes the instrumentation, as I see it ... so it's kinda hard to approximate in some cases, where the originality comes largely from the instrumentation (e.g. the Satisfaction example way upthread). ... and then there's tempo. Like, I could say, I would totally recognize a Zach Hill pattern if I heard it, but I think a lot of that is the tempo. I would bet that if you slowed down Zach Hill's characteristic patterns, it would be easily mistaken for some esoteric jazz drummer.

How about the "Amen" break. The texture is distinctive, of course, but I think the pattern itself would be identifiable regardless.

does "ich bin's" count?

i'm sure there's a load of faust, too.
kinda getting the feeling that "original" in the thread title shoulda been "recognisable", which depends on anyone knowing the thing in the first place & precludes a lot of improvised music.

autechre - that first one off untilted

Talk Talk – 'New Grass'

A lot of the tribal stuff Stephen Morris is doing in Joy Division. Like "Atrocity Exhibition."

A drum pattern that comes to mind a lot is the one in the intro to Gut Of The Quantifier, not sure if it's original, it sounds like a kind of Burundi Beat thing.

I've been obsessed for several years with this drum pattern in Korede Bello's "Godwin". I don't know if it's based on a traditional Ghanian rhythm or if it's something else, but it's this strange shuffled canter that pushes forward constantly

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w14zUTXOhYE

Ya that's neat

Lumidee "Uh Oh"

Whenever I have to sound-check the kick drum I do the Diwali riddim (w/stick clicks for the claps).

the toothpicks on the glass table thing ... that's the rhythm though, and not really the pattern, which includes the instrumentation, as I see it ... so it's kinda hard to approximate in some cases, where the originality comes largely from the instrumentation (e.g. the Satisfaction example way upthread)

True, you can't really approximate cymbals (esp. a hi-hat opening and closing) on a table. Like I totally agree that the Amen break is recognizable as a pattern, but that crash on the open hi-hat is pretty key.

Xp to self which is just the Diwali rhythm

kinda getting the feeling that "original" in the thread title shoulda been "recognisable", which depends on anyone knowing the thing in the first place & precludes a lot of improvised music.

― massaman gai (front tea for two), Wednesday, July 28, 2021 12:48 AM (eleven hours ago

exactly!!!! Not to claim any kind of superiority whatsoever, or to make any negative argument about this thread, but half of the songs upthread that people have mentioned, I don't actually know, or if I know, I don't know that I know them?

I do question though -- that series of 16th note rolls at the beginning of It's the End of the World As We Know It ... is that something that people would associate with a different song, or enough other songs they wouldn't recognize it as the REM hit?

"half of the songs upthread that people have mentioned, I don't actually know, or if I know, I don't know that I know them?"

I don't understand what this has to do with anything. Go listen to the ones you haven't heard. Once you do, don't you think you'd be able to recognize the rhythm of you heard it somewhere else?

*if

Once you do, don't you think you'd be able to recognize the rhythm of you heard it somewhere else?

1. rhythm is different from pattern
2. I honestly don't care that much

Rhythm is literally defined as a repeated pattern

This is such a semantic nightmare of a thread. Plz just post distinctive drum parts thx.

Haha. This is what I keep trying to say! It's not just rhythm, since drums are pitched instruments even if they're not tuned to a scale. So I guess I've been using 'pattern' on this thread as a stand-in for "rhythm + tempo + x number of voices required to reproduce it". Even if those voices are just approximating an original recording (since kick/snare/cymbal is basically just low/medium/high).

Rhythm is literally defined as a repeated pattern

― A True White Kid that can Jump (Granny Dainger), Wednesday, July 28, 2021 1:00 PM (one hour ago

A drum pattern -- Idk maybe because I played drums and have written drum parts -- is the rhythm plus the instrumentation (which drums ... now this is just in the context of the conventional kit and if we are extending this to electronically created drum patterns it gets more complex) ... like

1-2-3-4 is a rhythm
1 (kick) - 2 (snare) - 3 (kick) - 4(snare) is a pattern

which is different from

1 (snare) - 2 (kick) - 3 (kick) - 4 (snare)

2 patterns, same rhythm

I kind of think of "pattern" as rhythm + number of voices irrespective of timbre, specific voice, tempo, groove, etc.

i.e.: Billy Squier's "The Stroke" and Bad Brains's "Banned in DC" are essentially the same **pattern** even if they're at vastly different tempos.

I agree with sara for the most part and making it more complex that that gums up the works

Same, maybe "beat" encompasses all that plus tempo and dynamics? As in the beat from that song? Glad we're getting to some working definitions here, good work team.

so going back to the toothpicks on the table ...

(idk how someone can actually play toothpicks ... chopsticks are easier, you would not be able to hold them in anyway approximating holding drum sticks or mallets or even brushes really ... idk I could get 2-4 stick bounces from chopsticks depending on the table and amount of alcohol consumed)

you would not be able to convey the difference (recognizability) of different patterns because there isn't going to be any tonal/textural/pitch variance which is inherent in patterns. I mean ... maybe it would depend on the table construction? Like hitting it flat vs. hitting the edge ... if different materials were used? wood/metal vs. glass?

"which is different from

1 (snare) - 2 (kick) - 3 (kick) - 4 (snare)

2 patterns, same rhythm

"

Gotcha, thanks

I kind of think of "pattern" as rhythm + number of voices irrespective of timbre, specific voice, tempo, groove, etc.

yeah, and I would say, not just number of voices, but some basic characteristic of voice -- like at least some pitch variation like: low / middle / high

and tempo really doesn't factor in, like, if I see a drum pattern on a piece of paper and someone says "play this" ... at what tempo is a separate question ... unless, you know, that someone is the bass player and they are also playing along, and then it's like, uh, I'll follow your lead, because the bass player generally has better time than the drummer.

and bass players are more likely to quit and/or be in 5x as many bands as anyone else

and with that, chaki, you can post on this thread now

Tables are very musical, you can get so many tones out of them! Ok I've been mentally disregarding the chopsticks + glass thing, I've been thinking about hands on a wood or metal table. I think you can get low/middle/high using say a closed fist, fingers, fingernails.

(obv none of us are conga players, lol)

xp

A beat is still the same beat at different tempos obv, but tempo is important in the "name that tune!" drum game if it's based on a known recording imo

I'm just trying to keep this thread going because I like talking about drums

I've always really loved Mitch Mitchell's drum pattern on She's So Fine - a Hendrix tune that doesn't get a lot of love, probably because it's a Noel Redding vocal.

I'm using rhythm and pattern interchangeably since we've already limited the discussion to drum kits p much. But it's a good distinction to make. Akin to composition vs arrangement.
I was just wanting to distinguish drum parts that are distinctive due to production techniques vs those that are distinctive due to the pattern.

ESG definitely has quite a few, though so many more well known musicians have copied them ...

It's kinda like playing "Contortions or James Brown"?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRIWH4HCoz8

I've heard other mbalax stuff but this one always stuck out to me.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=51t8ETHdpns
Super Diamono - "Domou Gaïndé Ndiaye"

Stumbling beat

I still think timbre is a requisite part. Someone can make a sliding noise that’s difficult to replicate with chopsticks

On that note, Tru - No Limit Soldiers has an awesome drum beat

Deej I hope you're not talking about gliding 808s, because I'd argue those are more bass than drum.

Portishead 'Machine Gun' is a good example of having very distinct & processed samples, but also passing the table test.

If you’re making sliding noises we’re very likely past the point where we’re talking about drum patterns

??? Brushes? Sample effects? I basically disagree

pandit anindo chatterjee

Yeah Yeah Yeahs drummer Brian Chase has some very original and instantly recognizable songs like say, maps.

Gang Gang Dance, House Jam

(pretty much any GGD fits, but the the weirdly halting/stuttering pattern of House Jam is another level)

"The Stroke" - Billy Squier

We Will Rock You by Queen is an interesting example that kinda shows the awkwardness of the thread title/premise -- the pattern is not very original, but when hearing it, a significant number of people would probably identify it immediately as We Will Rock You by Queen.

Ha I thought the same thing a day or two ago. Thus, excellent point, sarahell!

Also I keep reading thread title in the voice of Buckshot a la "home of the original gun clappers"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lvns30-6Lz0

“We will rock you” shouldn’t qualify because those are not drums, they are stomps and claps with effects on them.

It does sound original to me though? I’m trying to remember a song prior to it that does the same stomp-stomp-clap-pause beat and I can’t think of any atm. Maybe it’s so iconic that everytime I’m trying to remember where I heard it I go back to the Queen one.

that's a false distinction, then no drum machine beats would be allowed either. if they are functioning as drums they are drums.

Ok, I'm developing my unified theory of recognizable drum beats. Let's say it doesn't require all of these elements, but can be accomplished with one or more depending on the song:

-Rhythm
-Instrumentation (ie voices/texture/sound etc)
-Tempo
-Dynamics (accents etc)

So "We Will Rock You" is a good example where the rhythm isn't at all unique, but it's easy to recreate the instrumentation, and tempo is actually really important here. If you stomp and clap that beat at around that slow 80 bpm zone, it will be universally recognizable.

Whereas if you tap the cymbal intro rhythm from 'YYZ' on any surface with those accents, any nerd will recognize it, regardless of the instrumentation or tempo.

We Will Rock You by Queen is an interesting example that kinda shows the awkwardness of the thread title/premise -- the pattern is not very original, but when hearing it, a significant number of people would probably identify it immediately as We Will Rock You by Queen.

― sarahell, Thursday, July 29, 2021 10:43 PM

We Will Rock You is a great example of a beat being recognizable is because of an effect that makes it standout. Boom boom bap is one of the most common beats, only made recognizable because of the distinctive timbre (stomps and hand clap). Distinctive timbre or effects put on a rhythm can certainly make them stand out, but not because of any original or unique drum parts.

Also I fail to see the awkwardness of the title or subject. Seems that the idea may be harder to understand I than I realized. I don't know if playing the drums helps broaden one's perspective on originality or not, but something seems to. There's probably more technically original drumming in Jazz or experimentation, but like I mentioned in the post about Beefheart. Unless those unique parts are trimmed down into a repeating rhythm it become imposable to find them instantly recognizable.

Eno, "Dead Finks Don't Talk"

― Wouldn't disgrace a Michael Jackson (Tom D.)

THIS

The effects on We Will Rock You are great, but I think you can reproduce the beat without the effects and everyone will know what you're doing. It's the tempo + how central to the song that beat is (not just an intro, it's inseparable from the song itself).

Obviously a lot of this has to do with culture, not just the music in isolation, just like how a big Neptunes song that uses a certain Korg preset now 'owns' that sound, and everything that uses that preset afterward will be referencing that song.

Question: is pebblee poo’s “a fly guy part 2” the we will rock you pattern? It sounds like it has less of a pause at the end of the bar so is technically a different rhythm even if that’s where it was initially inspired

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LlVNUtAyLlM

A fair number of songs in the 80s lifted this pattern

IMO they're very similar but "fly guy" pattern has a cymbal note on the 4th beat that "rock you" doesn't.

The effects on We Will Rock You are great, but I think you can reproduce the beat without the effects and everyone will know what you're doing. It's the tempo + how central to the song that beat is (not just an intro, it's inseparable from the song itself).

ppl used to do this all the time at high school football games and everyone knew exactly what it was

gza's "labels" has also always evoked "we will rock you" for me

A fair number of songs in the 80s lifted this pattern

Let's Go All The Way?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMPJdr4XtQo

one specifically 70s/80s “funk” drum lick i’m really into is where the drummer plays these little sort of triplet fills on the hi-hat at the end of a bar. who did it first? here’s a newer track that does what I’m talking about:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=taWtXyUsY0o

My guess is that it has Go Go DNA?

"a fly guy part 2” is a response to "Fly Girl" by the Boogie Boys which had the same producer/beat from "Let's Go All the Way" even though "Fly Girl" came out first

Che - “be my powerstation” also uses this rhythm pattern

PiL - 1981

The effects on We Will Rock You are great, but I think you can reproduce the beat without the effects and everyone will know what you're doing. It's the tempo + how central to the song that beat is (not just an intro, it's inseparable from the song itself).

ppl used to do this all the time at high school football games and everyone knew exactly what it was

Yes of course they would because they would be doing 2 foot stomps and 1 hand clap exactly like the song. If you played 2 kick drum beats and one snare in the tempo of song on a drum kit it would just sound like a basic beat used on a million songs. It's not at all a unique or creative drum pattern.

The effects on We Will Rock You are great, but I think you can reproduce the beat without the effects and everyone will know what you're doing. It's the tempo + how central to the song that beat is (not just an intro, it's inseparable from the song itself).

ppl used to do this all the time at high school football games and everyone knew exactly what it was

Yes of course they would because they would be doing 2 foot stomps and 1 hand clap exactly like the song. If you played 2 kick drum beats and one snare in the tempo of song on a drum kit it would just sound like a basic beat used on a million songs. It's not at all a unique or creative drum pattern.

these are somewhat similar but also similarly recognizable

lil mama - lip gloss
j-kwon - tipsy

This doesn't disprove my theory!

Ok, I'm developing my unified theory of recognizable drum beats. Let's say it doesn't require all of these elements, but can be accomplished with one or more depending on the song:

-Rhythm
-Instrumentation (ie voices/texture/sound etc)
-Tempo
-Dynamics (accents etc)

We Will Rock You is a good one for instrumentation (+ tempo & rhythm) being integral parts of the beat.

I was thinking about this recently while listening to an interview with a drummer who does sample replays for a living, ie trying to exactly re-create a breakbeat for a big artist who can't clear the original sample. Of course, that's only allowed because you can't copyright a drum part, only the master recording. But...what if you could? What if there was a threshold where you could reasonably have claim to have written a unique drum pattern (which again, wouldn't just be limited to the notated rhythm)?

Pussy Galore:

Constant Pain: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiKK1nAYTH0
You Look Like a Jew: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y4KJR4m1ZVg

Both iconic, instantly recognizable to me at least.

Huh. Pussy Galore is an age-restricted video.

I thought to mention tipsy but figured it was too indebted to grindin or something maybe. good lord I love that beat, though

Joe Morello's intro and the repeat pattern of his solo on "Take Five."

"tipsy" is certainly redolent of "grindin," but it's recognizable on its own, i'd say