The Sundays : C or D

The later albums are also exceedingly nice, but suffer a bit from over-sedatedness; both the playing and the singing sounds too contented, whereas the first album always struck me as the perfect evocation of the impatience of small-town youth.

As for the Sundays -- absolutely wonderful. Like Tim, Reading, Writing & Arithmetic is one of my favorite albums (I won't even qualify it with "indie"). Harriet Wheeler just has one of the great voices in pop. They've been awfully quiet lately, haven't they? A shame.

I have a Sundays T-shirt which is too small for me. The first time I wore it, a girl asked me 'Is that the band with the woman with the very high voice who sings about toilets?'. It was a long time ago. But my life is made of memories like this.

They are still among my idols. I hope I never meet them. (And that goes for the Sundays too.)

That said - you've rekindled something or other which is making me quite want to hear Here's Where The Story Ends or somesuch.

Was the third album any good? Did one even exist?

Now, anyone care to defend Blind?

Static & Silence was a major comedown after the first two: I guess I agree about the cardigan comment, which sums it up neatly enough. It always mystifies me that so many people rate LP#3 over LP#2 - which while not as good as LP#1 (what is?) still feels close enough (cos early enough) to the essence of the band.

'Summertime' is an OK 45, but it's not what's great about the Sundays. I can't say that much for 'Monochrome' either. Probably the best track is indeed 'She'.

Seriously, Harriet Wheeler has the most beautiful female voice I've ever heard. Going against conventional rockist wisdom, I'd pick her over Aretha, Dusty, Nina, Billie or any other highly regarded musical woman in pop's history.

It's hard to believe it's been six years since Static & Silence came out (a full five years after Blind). I'm hoping there will be a 4th album by 2010, but I fear that will forever remain a daydream.

I am touched by Gareth's reference to Stevenage back there. But it's difficult to reconcile the wistful charms of Wheeler with the damply grim banality of the town. In fact they remind me of Norwich, party because that was where I was studying when I heard them and partly because they seem more appropriate to that slightly sleepy market town setting.

Harriet Wheeler once kissed me. I will take that memory to the grave.

She once waited at the same bus stop as me in Camden with David G, child and shopping. I will take that memory to Safeway.

I don't know if "Cry" is about the death of Harriet's dad, but I KNOW it's about the death of mine: I have to programme it out if I don't want to burst into tears.

But how about "Monochrome"? What an extraordinarily atmospheric song. It's so visual; I see these two little girls looking at the moon landings on a television, and Armstrong and Aldrin dancing through the air, and then the girls looking out the window at the moon.

They're dancing around -
slow puppets, silver ground,
and the stars and stripes in the sand.
We hear a voice from above,
and it's history.
And we stayed awake
all night.

They're dancing around.
It sends a shiver down my spine,
and I run to look in the sky,
and I half expect to hear them asking to come down.

That song sure sends a shiver down *my* spine.

"This is my life and it's all very well, but never never ever again...."

reading, writing and arithmetic does seem out on its own - sonically, lyrically - and Blind has a closer relation in Static and Silence I think. rwa is such a chilly, bare-floored record for all its talk of woollen things.

I recall the mixed reception Blind received on its release from the UK inkies. MM, which seemed to have thrown its lot in with the resurgent US rock scene and Brit rave culture with a little more gusto than indie centrale NME, embraced Blind as a wilful anomaly, a wistful gem - there was ET's glowing LP review, Mueller gushing over "Medicine" on the radio and a Quebecois live review in strips of purple. Lamacq gave the album a desultory three, maybe four out of ten in the NME, sad that the band he'd championed had somehow lost the power to jangle.

I saw them that December in Wolverhampton. Winter recast in the Wulfrun Hall, icicles on the lighting rig.

"This is my life and it's all very well, but never never ever again...."

This is a bad line that illustrates their weakness. It's nothing like Morrissey, or not like good Morrissey anyway.

I've been on vacation. Can someone please clue me in on what IIRC means?

IIRC means "if I remember correctly".

how did we let this go by without more explanation?????

I tried to post to this thread yesterday and things went wrong. So now, again, I will say, perhaps dully:

Careminted phrases pay the rent, and Jones delivers.

That sentence was far better the first time I sent it.

I *think* it was 'careminted'. If you have any better ideas, post them... below.

What a beautiful, poignant, delicious album. It has so many elements that have irritated me senseless in other bands (Cranberries, "Torn", Sixpence) but somehow it's all just charming and perfect and bicycles and cardigans and a dress, dress, dress that I've been sick on.

I also love the lyrics for "I kicked a boy", kind of the same violent un-twee-ness, sung in Wheeler's wonderfully girlish voice that has some sort of hidden madness to it deep down somewhere.

Oh x-post! :-)

I assume that Gauvin has never worn a dress, so it's probably safe to assume that particular lyric is Wheeler's. ;-)

I heard "Here's Where the Story Ends" in a grocery store the other day, making my sandwich-purchasing experience just perfect.

A particular thought of mine. And they were fantastic live the one time I saw them.

Definitely try S+S, it's gorgeous, and quite subtle.

It was around the time she foolishly decided she could also play the guitar that I decided I wanted to see someone kick her teeth down her throat.

http://www.stylusmagazine.com/feature.php?ID=1175

--

If there's one advantage to being too poor to afford new records it's that you're forced to listen to the old ones you haven't quite figured out yet. Because of this it seems likely that the Sundays would benefit from a depression. Their 1990 album Reading, Writing, and Arithmetic has the unfortunate habit of reminding nearly everyone who hears it of the Smiths, and on first listen it does indeed sound like an inferior version of the latter band's debut, with strangely high-pitched vocals and guitars that can't quite find Johnny Marr's subtle hooks. But unlike most music, the album is better than it sounds. It takes some time before even the joy on its surface starts to shimmer—but once it does, Reading, Writing, and Arithmetic slowly begins to reveal itself. Only a few weeks later will one, while patiently watching the ripples on that surface, finally spot the tiny sparks of light that flicker beneath it like small, silvery fish. And perhaps a few months later, won over by the intensity of those sparks, one will begin to think about the album.

It's probably best to assume that most of the people who bought the record, and, as it seems, every critic who has written about it, never arrived at this point. If they did, they would have discovered that the Sundays are, in fact, the antithesis of the Smiths. Or if one dislikes that word, they are—among other things—the solution to the problem that the Smiths pose. You ask: 'What? The Smiths pose a problem? I knew Morrissey had problems; I even knew he liked posing—but I didn't think he posed problems...?'

When comparing the music of both groups, though, it becomes easier to see what makes Reading, Writing, and Arithmetic not only great, but truly unique—specifically their respective debut singles: the Smiths' “Hand in Glove”/”Handsome Devil”, and the Sundays' “Can't Be Sure”/”I Kicked a Boy”. Both deal with the problem of desire and love.

In “Hand in Glove” and “Handsome Devil” Morrissey makes two accusations. First, in “Hand in Glove”, he accuses a couple of fooling themselves into believing that their love will last, that their romance and thus they themselves are truly special, and that their feelings are deep and real. But, more importantly, Morrissey believes that they are aware of this. More specifically, that all romantic love is a manufactured shared 'love' to fill an internal void born of loneliness and the self-doubt that accompanies it—all of which a powerless ego attempts to conceal.

Secondly, in “Handsome Devil”, Morrissey accuses not only those who are motivated by sex, but sexual desire itself. The force of this accusation parallels that of the first. Sex, he seems to be saying, is ultimately the main element of relationships, and the inconstancy, emptiness, and arbitrariness of desire—and thus its injustice—torments him. And not only this: desire motivates us to conceal our true intentions (“Miserable Lie”: “I recognize that mystical air / It means "I'd like to see your underwear"”) and prevents us from seeing beyond appearances and into the real character of others—and thus makes the birth of a real love impossible from the start. Love is caught up in appearances, grounded in lies, and motivated by our blindest impulses, and the fact that we are so powerfully drawn by it is only a mark of our inability to know the real love of which we can conceive. Love and desire are inseparable, and yet they are bitter opponents. Obviously this is a recipe for despair—but that doesn't mean it's false. The messages of “Hand in Glove” and “Handsome Devil” are similar, although certainly—and significantly—not identical. How do we respond to the problem they present?

A few listens to Reading, Writing, and Arithmetic quickly reveals that the Sundays' are somehow accept love and desire at the same time. But it isn't this alone that sets them apart. Not only do they accept both at the same time, but they do so with full knowledge of the problem that Morrissey posed. They haven't simply ignored it, forgotten about it or remained ignorant of it. They actively affirm both. The affirmation of desire is readily apparent on “Can't Be Sure”, and the affirmation of love is easy to hear in the album track “My Finest Hours”. But is it really possible to affirm love and desire once one has realized their opposition? Isn't this having the cake and eating it too?

“Give me a story and give me a bed / Give me possessions / Love, luck, and money they go to my head / Like wildfire”, “Can't Be Sure” begins. Harriet Wheeler's lyric goes beyond merely ignoring or glossing over the full impact of sex and falsehood—she asks for them outright. “It's good to have something to live for you'll find...live for a job and a perfect behind”, she continues. Here she is directly and joyfully affirming the arbitrary, the contingent, and the frivolous. And what of injustice? “England's as happy as England can be / Why cry?” The next lines could almost be read as a direct response to the first Smiths single: “and did you know desire's a terrible thing / It makes the world go blind / But if desire, desire's a terrible thing / Well I rely on mine”. This last line is the key to the Sundays' response: they saw that all of our decisions rely on a kind of desire—and in fact even Morrissey's desire for an ideal love is a desire!

Wheeler's admonition “it's good to have something to live for you'll find” points towards a further conclusion. Not only is the desire for ideal love a desire like other desires—one perspective of many rather than a position of objectivity—is in fact a nihilistic desire, that derives, as our reading of the “Hand in Glove” single seems to show, from the values of truth, rigidity and the fiction of an austere mind that resides somewhere above a body that it controls—a nihilistic desire that gains power over us through its alignment with the forces of traditional morality. Only by recognizing that the impulse against the sexual and the frivolous is but one impulse among many and not the sole 'true' impulse, the only one proper to the 'mind', do we regain our innocence and freedom. And this is the sound of “Can't Be Sure”. Wheeler affirms the body and the impulses of the body; she frees herself from the barely concealed world-negation that appears to dominate Morrissey's values. “Though I can't be sure what I want anymore / It will come to me later...”. Even the uncertainty that accompanies Wheeler's freedom becomes a source of joy.

But what about love? It strangely appears that love has been regained. Morrissey wanted a love that was separate from the body. But having recognized, as Wheeler does on “Skin and Bones”, that we are only the body, we regain the body's ability to love—our own ability to love, and not an idealized love trapped by morality and chained to the denial of the world and of our own nature. The chorus of “Skin and Bones” oscillates between lamentation and exultation. At first it laments our fate, laments that we are limited by the body: “work and vanity wasted my time inside”. But as the chorus is repeated, Wheeler's cry “we're just flesh and blood / And nothing much more” becomes filled with the same strange joy that shoots through “Can't Be Sure”—a joy barely concealing the sharp pain that ultimately heightens the feeling of exultation.

But more important than this rejection of others’ criticism, especially as a response to Morrissey, is the rejection of the devaluation of her own hopes and desires that the phrase ‘skin and bone’ initially appears to imply. For the young Morrissey, ‘skin and bone’ could only refer to the desires of the flesh as distinguished from the desires of the mind or spirit, and to say that we are only skin and bone would be to say that the desires of the mind do not hold the privileged position we have assigned them, and can never bestow the kind of beauty and peace that should be the reward of those who dwell above the body. It would be tantamount to saying that this mind does not exist at all: the destruction of all meaningful values. Indeed, this was the possibility that confronted Morrissey, and of which he was certainly aware. “Does the body rule the mind or does the mind rule the body?” (“Still Ill”); “No heavenly choir / Not for me and not for you” (“Jeane”); “You may sleep, but you will never dream” (the price of moral failure in “Suffer Little Children”). But for Wheeler, the collapse of the hierarchy dominated by the mind ultimately results in the reactivation of the desires previously suppressed by it—desires which were struggling for and toward life and not against it.

And now an essential point becomes clear: the moral imperative that guided Morrissey was in fact incapable of generating an impulse toward life with sufficient power to replace that of the desires it suppressed; that is, it was only capable of limiting the forces that could actively affirm life, and not of doing so itself. This, and not simply loneliness, is the source of Morrissey’s depression. Recall his search for “people who are young and alive”—contrasted, obviously, with himself—in “There is a Light That Never Goes Out”, as well as the earlier lines “vivid and in your prime / You will leave me behind” (“These Things Take Time”).

In his relentless and perceptive criticism of desires of the body, Morrissey destroyed the possibility of bringing to prominence the ‘higher’ desires for which he so longed. For if love cannot be separated from the desire for sex and the desire to be together no matter with whom, then it is clear that love can only be fully regained when the other impulses are affirmed along with it, and that it is placed entirely out of reach when we seek the absolute suppression of those that seem to contradict it. Moreover, affirming the competing desires within the self is the only way to effect the unification of the self: engaging in this affirmation, we no longer look down on the body from a position we take to be higher, and thus turn against our own impulses—the very forces that constitute our being. This unification, however, does not eliminate the differences and disagreements of the competing desires. Only when we affirm them even in their contradictions are we able to make any of them active; only when we affirm their multiplicity are we able to discover our unity.

If you're unconvinced by my argument, or by the claim that Wheeler's declaration in ‘Skin and Bone’ once again makes love available, you may want to listen once more to the incredible 'My Finest Hours'. With its achingly beautiful chorus and unexpected but perfect coda, it shows the heart of Reading, Writing, and Arithmetic with both its words and its music—which provide their own argument.

and I keep hoping
that you are the same as me
and I'll send you letters
and come to your house for tea
we are who we are
and what do the others know...

But we’ve oversimplified things. And oversimplified Morrissey, whose complex position would develop subtly as his career progressed, in order to put the Sundays into clearer relief. As noted in passing, the two sides of the “Hand in Glove” single, though similar, are not identical. While the straightforward B-side fits into the argument relatively neatly, the A-side—one of the least understood Smiths songs—is more difficult, and the Sundays' response less obvious. Here Morrissey's clear vision becomes important, and pushes us to make finer distinctions. Indeed, it may be that Morrissey, at this point in his career, failed to recognize the true nature of desire; or it may be that he was simply unable to escape the grip of a morality that even he did not have faith in. But all this doesn’t fully respond to “Hand in Glove”, nor does it shake the feeling that something really is wrong with the love the song depicts—especially for those who have unwittingly found themselves in the situation Morrissey describes.

What distinguishes the couple in “My Finest Hours” from that of “Hand in Glove”? Even leaving the question of authenticity aside, it’s evident that the two loves differ profoundly in origin: for the pair from “Hand in Glove”, 'love' is the product of a deep poverty, of a despair in which even the identity of the beloved becomes meaningless. But the mad beauty of Wheeler's love arises from an overabundance of life that spills over in the coda of “My Finest Hours”: ecstatic, gentle and overwhelming at the same time. The former 'love' is not the “reason to live for” that Wheeler spoke of, but the result of a despair that gives us a reason to not live; the latter is quite the reverse. If the former is the product of a pure negation, the latter is affirmation itself. And this, the affirmation of the body, is the Sundays’ response to the problems Morrissey posed. “You're, you're, you're too young...”, Wheeler sings: in the conclusion of “My Finest Hours”, the early morning sun filtered and refracted into white-gold curves, with none of its freshness lost.

By: John Polewach
2004-08-17

i got stuck on this sentence for about five minutes.

While it's fine to make an exercise out of "connecting the dots" of each album's themes, I was hoping that the review was going to be a reevaluation of the album, not a simple compare and contrast.

I give the essay a C-.

-- righteousmaelstrom (righteousmaelstro...), August 17th, 2004 2:42 AM. (later)

the sundays' debut is better than *all* of the smiths albums, and by a considerable margin.

I've just been thinking lately that the Smiths' albums as a whole are not that good. They lack a cohesiveness that you see in strong albums from other groups. Fact is, they were a superlative singles band.

(xpost) I had to look up Asperger's Syndrome in my medical dictionary and I'm still not grasping that assertion.

1. sordid loss-of-innocence sex / "i threw up on that dress"
2. rivalry / "sometimes i think about other people"
3. sordid loss-of-innocence sex / "i'm not really sure what i'll major in"
4. sordid loss-of-innocence sex / "i can be witty, though"
5. defensive fear of child-death / "teehee what if i did stuff?"
6. gagging for sordid loss-of-innocence sex / "i think i'll hide in the bathroom instead"
7. but sordid loss-of-innocence sex won't help / "what if i had lots of cash?"
8. tragic sun-on-behinds love / "remember when i kicked that kid?"
9. oh who cares about anything / "hey look, a pound!"
10. i can't relate to people / "i'm sad about the lone ranger or something"
11. child murders / [no track]

though i wonder, given nabisco's explanation of their appeal, whether it would reach me in my old age.

5. defensive fear of child-death / "teehee what if i did stuff?"

Priceless!

Mainly, I think that you neglect the romanticism.

Big caveat: my sense of this subject matter as "mundane" may have to do with my growing up (and loving the Sundays) mostly in the same general sort of quiet-suburban landscape they're always said to conjure. The everyday is a relative thing.

Love in an elevator? Never happened to me.

Sleeping in a chair? Happened quite often.

http://www.sirensofsong.com/Harriet/harriet.jpg

But I agree with you more now that you have admitted the romanticism of the mundane.

Yet, 'mundane' is a very unromantic word, and perhaps not the right one.

I think the Clientele a red herring here. I don't think they are about the mundane - more about a certain vocabulary. I think I, let alone the Sundays, am more about the mundane (and associated romance) than they are. But I only know their first LP.

http://www.originalscasualwear.com/item_images/299P-KH_FULL.jpg

unpleated pants:

I was listening recently to the first album and Gavurin's guitar work actually reminds me of Peter Buck's earlier style. Also, the last part of 'Hideous Towns' could have been written by the Wedding Present.

I can't and don't speak about the couple's actual relationship - that may be as nabisco describes. But the *records* aren't like that. And it was odd how nabisco kept going back to 'one day my life could be like that', as if they were a description of mature life or wedded bliss. I think they are not - I think they are a description of young, drifting life, which is where the Smiths comparison comes in again. I think that if the records really made one feel 'one day my life could be like that', it would be to feel: 'one day my life could be as romantic as that'.

There are Cocteau comparisons to be discussed too, I think, not in the traditional vocal sense but in the sense of how "likely" their respective worlds seem.

ilx was far better a year ago: only 4 years since the last Sundays LP.

N., this is a bad line that illustrates your weakness.

No, but neither did Buck. I'm sure of it and you're going to make me have to drag out my copies of 'Murmur' and 'Reckoning' and listen to them, aren't you?

I'm also puzzled by what you mean about "...shapes sliding up and down the neck in a slightly perverse fashion." Are you talking about the beginning of the album where you hear the slide on the guitar that then kicks into the riff?

I have often heard things that sounded exactly like it, but they were never guitars.

re. Buck, my memory is of his draping every other song in a pattern of notes off the top 3 strings, in certain very clear and indeed predictable patterns. Which I like, a lot. I have always been a tad vexed at the thought that I may have picked up more from him than those - Gavurin included, I guess - I consider my real heroes.

Possible example of what I mean: 'I Believe'. That absent-minded picking-at-a-G stuff is barely to be found on the Sundays' records.

Nabisco if you were this insightful as a guitarist when you were 15, then you're a better guitarist than I will ever be (which is quite probably true!)

Though I still think that slide at the beginning of 'Skin & Bones' is a guitar: it sounds like a descending slide on one string moving to two strings. It sounds like there's a pitchshifter or harmonizer in there too.

Can we all agree on one thing though? It's a telecaster Gavurin is playing. Y'all are not going to fight me on this are ya?

It's nice to be spot on, but unfortunate that I am implicated in teenage folly. Or is it?

I don't really know what Nabisco means by '8th note'. I think he is saying that Buck plays a lot of notes, but I don't know what the number signifies.

Though I still think that slide at the beginning of 'Skin & Bones' is a guitar: it sounds like a descending slide on one string moving to two strings. It sounds like there's a pitchshifter or harmonizer in there too.

I don't know the last items, but in any case I still don't get how you hear it as an axe. It sounds like a found everyday sound to me. But which sound?

Can we all agree on one thing though? It's a telecaster Gavurin is playing. Y'all are not going to fight me on this are ya?

How can you tell?

That Polewach essay is bloody awful. A classic example of a liberal arts education creating a monster.

It seems that I don't know about such things.

Well, when he goes "low" (snort) he sounds like Stevie Nicks!

Yeah, I finally heard the Sundays this year by accident from a radio on Primrose Hill. Then I heard them in a pharmacy in Dupont Circle. Then I heard them in my car on Chapman Highway, and I skreeeeed over to buy the damn cd. They followed me home!

Seriously, I prefer "R & R & A" – when their shtick was fresher – to Blind.

"A safe, cosy, misty-eyed 'Englishness' that would warm the heart of John Major but leaves me cold." - stevo

I'm not sure I understand these sort of sentiments about RW&A. All that aforementioned kicking of boys until they cry, being sick on one's dress, having thrown up no doubt due to the hideousness of the town, and seemingly just preferring to flee to the lavatory... If that's English for 'cosy' I'll be careful not to visit.

And the aforementioned dissonance and often odd rhythmic structure throughout has almost nothing in common with the supposed strummy whimsy typically ascribed to it.

"Here's Where the Story Ends" pops up in the weirdest places...I heard it in a Winn-Dixie in Panama City...and in Western Steer steakhouse, which is actually in the same shopping centre as that Winn-Dixie.

i never really got into blind too much, i think i've only ever listened to it less than 10 times the whole way through in my life. i don't really know why, i imagine if i listen to it more, and read the lyrics, i'd like it a lot more.

maybe it's something as superficial as her vocals being too quiet in most songs on Blind, and i always have trouble with songs like that. i like guitars and drums and stuff but i prefer to listen to the singing (and pick out the guitar from the background when i choose to).

Maybe this is where they invested their money.

This thread needs a pic:

http://www.ear.fm/Encyclopedia%20S/sundays.gif

Are they still a going concern? Not very prolific if so.

http://www.sirensofsong.com/harrietsiren.jpg

First album really still is just perfectly right.

just casting my vote.

http://www.phpbbforfree.com/forums/thesundays-about13.html

doubtful, though.

So yeah: very classic, and I'd love to hear another album.

http://www.sundays.secret-hideout.com/img/harriet01.jpg

the sundays are incredible.

the coda, the last four bars, of "hideous towns", are beyond music. they are magic.

the sundays are magic. too good to be true. incredible, etc., etc.

Oh yes, "Hideous Towns's" ending is great.

Yes.

"Hideous Towns" is one of the most perfect songs ever.

SO GOOD

I listen to my "Goodbye" b/w "Wild Horses" single a lot.

i love the five of you.

I just love Harriet's lyrics so much - "I joined the army/but it drove me barmy" - who else could sing that so earnestly????

Someone who's in Iraq right now? oh wait...

Sorry if this sounds snooty, it's not meant to and I wasn't trying to get political on anyone's ass either. I'm going to pull out Reading, Writing & Arithmetic right now. It's shine has dimmed over time somewhat, but I think a trip down memory lane with it can't be bad.

Also this will sound funny but it always reminds me of the chemistry lab I was in in college. I remember playing it on my walkman in that chemistry lab. It was absolutely stunning, couldn't get the songs out of my head.

>I listen to my "Goodbye" b/w "Wild Horses" single a lot

I went through a period last year of listening to Goodbye on repeat play - it would come round on shuffle and then I'd have to hear it several times in a row - by which I mean it's just heartbreakingly fantastic. The final section where Gavurin cuts completely loose and Harriet comes back in with "oh as the heavens shudder baby, I belong to you" makes this into pretty much the best single of the 1990s.

So erm, classic!

omg i'm breakin out the cassettes!

i used to imitate professional ice skaters in my basement on roller skates listening to the sundays - ah the life!

Reading, Writing and Arithmetic, to my ears, sounded like Cocteau Twins without Robin Guthrie's dreamy guitarscapes, but in their place something ordinary. Perhaps having listened to the Cocteaus before having heard of them ruined them for me.
-- acb (acb), Friday, 11 November 2005 22:24 (1 year ago) Link

OTMFM

That comparison always strikes me as a bit odd actually. Where is the commonality? Not in the guitars, the singing, the lyrics, the song structures... May as well say "The Sundays, to my ears, sounded like The Bad Seeds without Nick Cave's unholy raving, but in their place something ordinary..."

Better comparison would be The Smiths crossed with Sugarcubes' "Birthday", surely.

nah, i get the comparison. if liz sang clearly around the time of heaven or las vegas, it'd be a pretty similar thing, i think.

and, what acb said and stephen quoted, i'm about to say this as a sundays obsessive (have their entire discography and about 10 bootlegs), that might be about right. but, that might also be part of what makes them great. but, hm, that's one to chew on.

i always loved the Sundays much more than the Cocteau Twins. the performance worked better for me, and i was happy to not have the guitarscapes on Reading, Writing and Arithmetic. easily a favorite album from my youth.

i heard sundays before the cocteaus, by the way. if that might matter.

i think the less lush design of Reading Writing and Arithmetic (sans guitarscapes) made it feel less cluttered and more pure to me. i liked that it wasn't doused in ambient guitar.

my post before my last is silly. replace 'heaven or las vegas' with 'four-calendar', even though the syllables were clearer then, too.

this needs remastering!

and where can u get a cd-quality copy of DON'T TELL YOUR MOTHER in this day and age.

You can get it in most any dollar bin on the DGC Rarities volume 1 cd.

Or on Amazon.com for one penny.

wow! DGC rarities eh? really? that's genuinely brilliant advice. great stuff thanks!

hahaha, dgc rarities is CLASSIC! deserves it's own thread.

The DGC Rarities disc (volume one-and-only) is kind of great, actually! I found my copy a couple years ago and was surprised by how much fun it was to listen to. Teenage Fanclub, what might be Weezer's best song, a good That Dog track, St. Johnny sounding more like Dinosaur Jr than ever, a great weird Sloan thing, the only Hole song I've ever really liked ... I seem to remember even liking the CELL track on this.

Wait, I must have found a NEW copy, as I'm pretty sure I had this on TAPE back in the day?

Beck's maybe best song ever, "Bogusflow"

um. yeah. i wasn't kidding about fucking dgc rarities.

My January band for the last few years.

Good choice. :-)

I'm in a "I Kicked a Boy" kind of mood.

Haha, I was born in that born.

????

in that MOOD!

You were born twice. A special birth.

The rebirth of slick, like my gangsta stroll.

I Kicked A Boy!!!! gooood call

that album = this weather to the t

Yes, "I Kicked A Boy" is a damn good call! I tend to forget about that one. I should dig out that cassette download...

I Kicked a Boy is easily in the favorite three songs on the debut.

I especially love "My Finest Hour" (esp. the end, SHIIIIT!) and "Can't Be Sure".

Classic, i.e., I liked them and have since forgotten all about them.

xcept of course I Kissed A Girl is like echoing in my brain whenever i think of I Kicked A Boy

Which song/artist is that, Surmounter? "I Kissed A Girl"?

Jile Sobule.

The first album was so good that i never listened to anything that followed - but even only on one-albums-worth of merit, classic.

That album somehow helped me mourn the passing of The Smiths in a comforting kind of way.

Cortney Tidwell is surely the new Harriet Wheeler...

Jill Sobule yeah. who i actually liked for a while. she's actually really not bad. but she's no The Sundays.

Really wintry = "Joy."

Funnily enough, I think I first got hold of RW&A just after Christmas of my first year of high school -- I remember lots and lots of January listening to it. Like all-day, no-school, sitting in room listening to Sundays record over and over.

http://images-eu.amazon.com/images/P/B0000082KA.02.LZZZZZZZ.jpg

I'm breathless about The Sundays. I'm serious.

i'm not buying it.

oh well too bad for you

thats not new sundays or what? are they still around

there is a young girl at the pharmacy in the grocery store who looks like harriet wheeler, grandmother hair and all.

they are rather breathless

It's the last part of "My Finest Hour" you know it...the last fucking 45 seconds or whatever it is that they do there...totally divorced from the rest of the song, but you know...

And then they go into "Joy" and by god I want to know what the hell else you want out of an album than this one.

You know when I met Harriet Wheeler at the club, I remember asking her what they were into musically and she said "oh you know the Smiths, Cocteau Twins" you know just what you'd expect! She also mentioned Jimi Hendrix, believe it or not.

I Kicked A Boy, too.

The Rolling Stones!

Fucking YES! WILD HORSES!!!!!

Certainly the best version of that song I have ever heard; but then I don't really understand the general heated adoration of the Burritos' take. The delicate touches that the Sundays added, the low-slung and high-flying guitar riffs and her dreamy way of singing it, seem to me to clean up next to any other reading of t that song - indeed it must be the greatest Stones cover I have ever heard. Virtually the greatest COVER I have ever heard, full stop.

these records (the first one anyway) seriously need a remastering and some kind of deluxe treatment.

Apart from the remastering, what would the deluxe treatment involve? I have 3Rs on first-month-or-so-of-release vinyl (as well as CD), Norwich HMV £5.99 sticker probably intact, which, though I haven't spun it in ages, is probably the most deluxe I can imagine it ever getting.

Mind you: I used to be really frustrated about the lack of a lyric sheet on, at least, the vinyl, and actually wrote to Rough Trade asking them for this (or anything else Sundays-related). A white envelope came through the door a few weeks later with the lyrics to the LP photocopied by someone in the office, nothing else, no note or acknowledgement as I recall. I was looking for that envelope the other day but goodness knows just where it is now.

The Sundays had b-sides (a few anyway), and I'm sure that if whoever was putting together a deluxe edition was feeling industrious that demos, alternate takes and non-album cuts could be located. I wonder what the demand would be like, though. Anyone who was a Sundays fan in 1990 still seems to be as big of a Sundays fan today, but there's definitely a drop-off point.

They released fewer extra B-side songs that almost any other band of comparable stature. Re. the first LP for instance, there is only one extra B-side: 'don't tell your mother' (which is tremendous). There were a couple of B-sides re. the 2nd LP: one is about 90 seconds long (and gorgeous), the other is a (gorgeous) cover. They did more for the 3rd LP, I think - but at least 2 or 4 of the B-sides from that era are indeed demos and alternate takes (of 'can't be sure' and 'you're not the only one i know').

Certainly the best version of that song I have ever heard; but then I don't really understand the general heated adoration of the Burritos' take. The delicate touches that the Sundays added, the low-slung and high-flying guitar riffs and her dreamy way of singing it, seem to me to clean up next to any other reading of t that song - indeed it must be the greatest Stones cover I have ever heard. Virtually the greatest COVER I have ever heard, full stop.

I think I agree.

My January band for the last few years.

― roxymuzak, Friday, January 4, 2008 9:12 PM (1 year ago) Bookmark

^^^^^^^^^^^^

Yeah linger is an amazing song to hear at this time of year.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v165/noodle_vague/post.jpg

Listening to STATIC & SILENCE for first time in years, actually, on spotify. It hasn't of course changed, but sounds fine.

'She' probably still the highlight, the equal of most of the 2nd LP, say.

Dear me, my opinions seem never to change, over however many years.

I like the clanking piano at 3:20 of track 5 also.

'Your Eyes' is OK, lively and nimble, a bit different from other Sundays. I've only just noticed, nearly 12 years on, the line about 'I think I'm off to Japan', accompanied by 'Japanese' crashing gong.

listening the entire back catalog is helping me through my working day right now.

Wild Horses couldn't drag me away

Oh god, please don't even get me started on the Sundays.

don't even get me started. Have you heard the first and second albums? HAVE YOU?

Come on, let's bring it down to earth. Most folks only know them from this song:

And they don't even the HALF of what they're missing.

Alex, thanks.

Okay no, I want to talk about this band RIGHT NOW. I don't care if you hate them, write me about them. god, in heaven the last traces of the soul of the Smiths were evident in the Sundays. You can't take it away from me, you young people with your hip hip-hip stuff...

I'm sorry but if you stack the first Sundays on top of the second one, then you have got some fantastic fucking legendary music going on.

See you at the Stone Roses fanclub meetup! LOLOLOL Mark G. back me up!

Oh god the cops are going to arrest me cause I sing too loud to it

But I gotta tell you that one "I Kicked A Boy" that one sends me to tears.
Hurts me in my heart, that one. Don't care if anyone thinks I'm square.

And that's why "Finest Hour" is a moment every respectable gay man should experience.

I'm 18 years old again when I hear this music. Take note, gay lads.

still <3<3<3<3

Aww, I was hoping this was a Bimble thread revive from beyond the grave.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9i-0FB68LoQ

This is srsly one of the best things ever. ilu bimble

In such a mood for Harriet's voice today, listening to Reading Writing & Arithmetic is really improving my afternoon

Thank you once again, Spotify, for stuff like this: an absolutely gorgeous song, which should have been on Static and Silence, consigned to the b-side of the Cry single.

See how it's shining through the dark
As the teardrops fall and it illuminates the room
And we can't stop staring for a moment

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFBAGSO7TrI

Static & Silence sounds lovely tonight.

"I used to be really frustrated about the lack of a lyric sheet on, at least, the vinyl, and actually wrote to Rough Trade asking them for this (or anything else Sundays-related). A white envelope came through the door a few weeks later with the lyrics to the LP photocopied by someone in the office, nothing else, no note or acknowledgement as I recall. I was looking for that envelope the other day but goodness knows just where it is now."

Reading this made me think "I miss the days when I'd do this kind of thing" but when I thought about it, I don't ever think I've written to a record company for lyrics ... A weird nostalgia for something that never actually happened.

I think I might now know where that envelope is.

I think Reading Writing and Arithmetic is pretty solid, though I'm not as crazy about Wheeler's voice as some. It's that fashion for faux-naive, girlish-sounding voices in early '90s alternative music that dates it a bit. Cf. Kim Deal and Edie Brickell.

faux-naive, girlish-sounding voices in early '90s alternative music that dates it a bit

One of the only styles from the 90s I'm still fond of and wish was as widespread now as it was then.

And yet, if the Sundays came back, they would still have a massive amount of goodwill.

ha that's a great story about the lyrics sheet! very Rough Trade.

their cover of Wild Horses is ... somethin else

just imagine Mark Wahlberg and Reese Witherspoon necking

ok now what

Now take your shirt off.

Always makes me think of Buffy's prom

Glad pop culture never ruined this song for me. I still think of just listening to it in my room and pining for Harriet.

ditto

it breaks my heart

Where did they go?

READING, WRITING & ARITHMETIC is one of my favorite albums of all time. Equivalent in quality, IMO, to The Smiths' or The Stone Roses' debut LPs.

mmeeeeee too

Equivalent in quality, IMO, to The Smiths' or The Stone Roses' debut LPs.

I am offended on behalf of The Sundays.

o SNAP!

Correct, though, that this is one of the finest albums.

Blind gets a lot of stick but imo Goodbye is the best thing they ever did. It has serious bite, none of the whimsy of the debut that doesn't really appeal, and the multiple guitars at the end absolutely slay me.

I love them so much that I even think Static & Silence is great, adult contempo synth horns and all.

agree that "goodbye" is an all-time great song! "those stories were a good read... they were dumb as well" is undeniably classic.

I've listened to RW&A a few times recently, influenced by the fact that it was released 23 years ago this month. 23 years. That's a lot of memories, but every time I listen I still remember listening to it when it first came out; it was my getting ready to go out music, of all things. And, as dear old Bimble wrote in this thread: "I'm 18 years old again when I hear this music.", but it sparkles with the same quiet power even now, and Harriet's voice is pretty, but never drippy or girlish - there's a steeliness to it, and, although her lyrics can be somewhat impressionistic, they also contain lines that are straightforward, brusque or barbed. I do love her phrasing, though. This go around I'm being particularly haunted by "Joy", and how she sings the line "Well you saw him/and you can hardly know", which gives me shivers.

http://www.rockofages.uk.com/stock/18180.jpg

I don't anticipate them ever falling out of my all-time top five artists.

The weird thing about them disappearing as early as they did is that when I found out just now Harriet Wheeler turned 50 this past June, it seemed completely unfathomable to me. I haven't seen a single image of her since she was 34, so I guess that's the age she'll always be in my mind.

Also, August 20th will mark the 25th anniversary of their first live show.

Help me out of this rabbit hole!

She always looked much younger.

Mojo needs to get on the case..

Blind is easily my favourite. "God Made Me" my favourite song. There is a youtube clip of a church choir singing the song. I heard they had a song with anti-Christian lyrics (someone in a review marked down the album for that reason). I'm an atheist who doesn't care either way, great songs.

great timing on your revive!

http://www.stereogum.com/1432519/preview-the-sundays-comeback-single-i-cant-always-be-a-lady-bw-nothing-doing/mp3s/
http://pitchfork.com/news/51857-the-sundays-announce-new-album-seasons-of-your-week-share-two-new-tracks/

blind is the best album . on earth is one of the most evocative songs I have ever heard. the first album is also good, here's where the story ends nearly made me cry the other day (late teenage yearsdirst relationship memories). as for the third album bought summertime avidly, but was so disappointed with it gave the album a miss.

Blimey, is the year of long-awaited returns or wot?

(Next week, the return of Hadaka no Rallizes?)

Mind you, that pitchfork page seems to be gone!

Both those links are AWOL and Google seems to return nothing...

I shall call it "News released too soon" and hope for the best..

I have to say that the band who covered "Here's Where The Story Ends" spoiled it for me quite a lot. I was very familiar with the cover version but the original Sundays version was totally new to me when I got into them.

other way round for me. hated the tinny backbeat of the cover.

I think at this point "Hideous Towns," "You're Not The Only One," "Love" and "Summertime" represent their best for me, and I will be more than glad to hear any new work from them.

Their "Wild Horses" was far better than it had any right to be, and it's use in Buffy the Vampire Slayer is an all-time TV tearjerker moment for me.

This links that unregistered posted were bs, y'all. "Seasons of Your Day" is the name of the upcoming Mazzy Star album.

swine.

Why did those two links disappear? Did pf and stereogum fall for a hoax or something?

Oh, too soon, thanks JF!

http://www.youcanmakeanythinglooklikealink.com/if-you-put-http-in-front-of-it.htm

Http://yeahiknowsorryifellforitbutitwasacrueljoketbh.com/

lol yeah, I clicked on the Stereogum one myself, then I read the Pitchfork one before clicking on it and raised my fist and shouted skyward "UNREGISTERED!!!"

Haha!

so the whole comback was a joke? that's wack.

hilarious

just happens that today i listened to their first album for the first time. liked it more than i expected to tbh!

by the way wild horses was not actually on blind, it was tacked on the end of the u.s. edition.

It got a lot of airplay and a few years later was used in the Witherspoon-Wahlberg movie Fear

The first album is magical. The other two are good as well, but RW&A is <3<3<3

I actually calculated the age of their daughter and thought, yeah, that makes sense, kids out on their own now, they can return to making music. Taking this much worse than expected.

The oldest would only be 18 now, and the younger one would be 14. Maybe in another four years?

Didn't realize there was a 2nd kid.

sorry, guys, for trolling

http://www.strangewaysradio.com/blog/2014/04/22/the-sundays-reunion/

The "answer" loses the posed question which gives it context..

Just the news that they've written new music, whether they even go on tour or not, totally makes my heart swell.

the 3 song Peel session is suddenly on s0uls££k in a decent bitrate and the best quality i've ever heard it. Skin And Bones in particular sounds incredible. the album production definitely robbed them of a lot of their punch but hey that's Peel sessions for you.

Did any new stuff ever surface?

Hadn't listened to the Sundays in a while and the beauty of My Finest Hour almost brought tears to my eyes. "I'll send you letters / And come to your house for tea" recalls a world that seems nearly as distant now as the Roaring Twenties.

Every day I view ILM hoping someone has new news, or information on there whereabouts.
I Google them sometimes, but all that ever comes up is that short interview from a year-and-a-half ago. Nothing's happened since.
I check Wikipedia sometimes, and even the talk page, but no new news, or information. Ever.

They're my favorite band.

Quickly, by the way. As I am a SUNDAYS FREAK, I have a very wonderful live recording of their most obscure, unplayed, unreleased song, called "Something More". It must be from the 'Blind' era, for it sounds as if it were. It should have been on that album.

^ Message me privately and I'll send it to you. It's amazing. (I'm sure this is legal, so no worries, right?)

There's more to say, but not now.

Where are they? Where have they been? :'-((((((((((

Maybe if I start praying to St. Bimble they might return? :D

Indeed, they're incredible. I might hit you up for that mp3!

ive probably listened to Reading, Writing and Arithmetc more than any other album this yesr. I love it so much! come back Harriet!

About that lost Sundays song I mentioned a few posts ago,
It comes from: 1990-03-02 - Paard Van Troje - The Netherlands.
And, there's a flac torrent of the show which contains it floating around out there somewhere.

Nonetheless, I am extremely happy to share the mp3 version of that song with anyone!

If things are rough going, I can definitely upload both the mp3 and flac versions of that show to a one-click site.

(We don't normally trade on ILM, but, I think this is legal. I might check with a mod.)

the link(s) wouldn't be posted here, by the way. you would need to private message me.

which is the lost song?? would love to hear that.

some unusual titles on the setlist 'Turkish'?? https://www.rockinconcerts.com/the-sundays-cd-1990-03-02-den-haag-soundboard.html

I kinda wish we could institute a policy of not updating this thread unless there's new Sundays news. Because I also love them and I'm still way too hopeful that there will be news someday. I can't even believe that it's been almost twenty years without a peep!

I'd support that policy.

I'd say an unreleased track is a great justification for thread revival

2 weeks ago.
nme.
elijah wood :

'the song i cant get out of my head' : the sundays - homeward

"i'm a big sundays fan, and this is an awesome song from their final album, 'static and silence'.
i was listening to it yesterday and i've had it stuck in my head for the last 24 hours.
i want harriet wheeler to come back please.
she needs to make another record.
"

Poor David Gavurin, just as integral to the sound of The Sundays as Harriet, but never appreciated by anybody ever. I guess he's okay with it, but still. Poor guy.

He's nowhere near as attractive as Harriet.

I gave up after Blind included a poor cover version of Wild Horses. Just thought it was a shameful marketing ploy and ignored everything else they did. Also got obsessed with techno around 92 so that factored in as well. I do still love the first album and play it 5-10 times a year. Never even heard Static and Silence. I can't imagine any of their albums living up to the perfection of the debut though.

Trying to remember, and maybe I posted about this, but I could have sworn I saw them on a bill with ... Luna? In maybe 92? 93? TLA in Philly? Who headlined?

I gave up after Blind included a poor cover version of Wild Horses. Just thought it was a shameful marketing ploy and ignored everything else they did. Also got obsessed with techno around 92 so that factored in as well. I do still love the first album and play it 5-10 times a year. Never even heard Static and Silence. I can't imagine any of their albums living up to the perfection of the debut though.

I had the same reaction. "Summertime" got some airplay in '97.

Yep, February 1993. Luna opened. Don't think I recall a lick of either set!

i think i saw that tour too:

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/t8Lkz4-kXQR76vVCI6JYOcNzwwGzSFJH2gQNHZmmnjS9g2gSlibJxsw3Dml3EzE_kHYaFdqCTi8hUY1T0ADP1Q4BFYbwVL1czIAsc-gNHO00GiGG7y5runSS6eMnNStaEGdCRPqTrTBlP9VnKIiE5Kg4SPAVPDvD-bs2dpOJZaEXzI_o1frK25ueYZoBYO8saUPj48iqvLX4h4nsd-0aLywWNkZeCXRlZA-Qn8qa08F3I3D2iCkieyNljNArBnQ3FtmBXdHVJ9HQFnpiM9aE6Mil9fhLYpHPJ9fPuU2bmFnW5GEhH7VVFMu06PediFGA9cEQwHz9K6rotL2mQNLCe5Ks0hBLaXj-nZJFTffWwelQ8YDDIu43cf3ZYyDCZc8qI3brXDxacvSjzMrsuZGve3YKlvcjlGPpRiZX7QSQNeHwXG2spuwB0KrcT6nfJtVE0Q67e9ysDYySCA8u6u6MuQpW5xJdKA1_HUcGO2b9an4rFQ4Y46YI9UR1rbVMxmFlhq6wsL4xq1x7HPujhDf1M_lWDjs_qR4Qqcmg6o_RQ6A=w1484-h835-no

sorry for that being so big.

Static and Silence is understated but lovely. I prefer it to Blind (though the debut is best obv).

I'd co-sign that, Tim.

Right now would be a good time for their return.

I think they need to wait for every shoegaze band to reunite first. We're almost there, though.

I think there are some misses on static and silence but Another Flavour rocketh the land. It is, as they say, my jam. Reading Writing is unimpeachable, as has been noted.

Blind is my favourite.

which is the lost song?? would love to hear that.

― piscesx, Friday, November 6, 2015 11:15 PM (2 days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Just message me! I'll send it that way. It isn't "Turkish", it's called "Something More" (as far as we know) and is much more obscure.

Robert: a little off-topic, but if you like both ethereal goth and The Sundays, then I have to recommend the second Innocence Mission album to you 'Umbrella'. It's one of the only good Sundays imitations I've ever heard (I've given dozens of bad Sundays imitations a chance), and it has, surprisingly, at least a couple of songs that sound kind of dark. At least search "Evensong" from that album - I promise you'll like it a lot. (Nothing else by Innocence Mission besides the 'Umbrella' album sounds like The Sundays though, - just to save your time).

I gave up after Blind included a poor cover version of Wild Horses.

^ It blows my mind that anyone with properly working ears attached to their head could even say such a thing!

RE: 'Static And Silence'. Yeah, what a major comedown. If that album had come from any other indie pop band, it'd be k-classic. But, coming from The Sundays, especially after those first two albums, it was a letdown, in a way. Still v. v. good though, regardless.

--

I feel like they'll be back, someday. The brief interview from a year-and-a-half ago is slightly encouraging, and they also have their own recording studio built into their house. Honestly, I have a theory: they seem like really cool, down-to-earth people, but sort of conservative in a way? Anyway, they went on hiatus so they could raise their kids in private (we all assume - but it wasn't stated by them). My thinking is that they're still waiting for their youngest child to leave teenage-hood before they finally come back. Because; parents are never, ever cool, and they probably just don't wanna embarrass their kids by being indie rock stars, talking to the press, going on tours, etc. They probably just wanna live quietly and raise their kids normally, I figure.

Honestly, when they come back, I just hope they go wayyy back, back before S&S, and do something more abstract and dreamy as they did on the first two albums. Either that, or do a bunch of stripped down acoustic guitar/voice only songs, a la "Wild Horses".

Poor David Gavurin, just as integral to the sound of The Sundays as Harriet, but never appreciated by anybody ever. I guess he's okay with it, but still. Poor guy.

― Ⓓⓡ. (Johnny Fever), Saturday, November 7, 2015 6:53 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I love him, as a guitar player. I hate him as a man, because he married Harriet and I didn't. Lol.
He's actually done the only good Johnny Marry impersonation that I've ever heard, on "Don't Tell Your Mother".
He's actually one of my favorite guitar players! I'd listen to him even without Harriet!

Honestly, when they come back

This guy. You're alright.

They stopped just short of the period when artists were incorporating inadvisable electronica elements into their music, and they missed the autotune era altogether, so I hope they also draw deeply from those wells.

I did think Chvrches were how The Sundays would sound with electronica.

Thread revive made me deep-listen to rrr the other night for first time in like ten years, and I can tell you Gavurin is crazy appreciated by me, at least. This is prob totally cliche, but it's guitar hero work for someone who's inclined to abhor guitar hero stuff.

Although it actually predates S&S, Frente's Shape sounds a lot like what one might imagine a more ecumenical Sundays album to sound like (and also is an excellent album).

This weekend I received my first CD copy of this album (I owned it on tape for 25 years).

x-post

i have 'marvin! the album' by frente! i always liked it and thought parts of it were sundays-esque. should i really check out 'shape'? is it before or after 'marvin'?

Shape is the follow-up and is much better IMO.

My fondest wish is to mix Tim F a cocktail and sit on a cool terrace while this album plays.

not sure if it was a deliberate homage, but the Spanish indiepop group Fine! often sounded just like Static & Silence-era Sundays, right down the vocal mannerisms:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7T1cH-X9LIU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53zklL0VIHI

(I've never heard that Frente album, but I'll have to check it out)

I bought an album by Moonpools and Caterpillars because it was RIYL-ed the Sundays but I didn't see it myself.

I've been into the s/t Stretch Princess album since it came out in 1998, chiefly because it has a few songs where they channel The Sundays in subtle ways. (Stretch Princess goes full on distorto guitar in most of their choruses though.)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15lof9jLSdk

very nice

i like how this thread has (temporarily?) devolved into trying to find good sundays sound-a-likes.

i have those fine! albums. i checked that band out because i thought it was a great name, but they didn't leave an impression on me :-/

The Sundays are coming back. Someday they will. Trust me. I just know it.
There is honestly no doubt in my mind that they will be back within the next 1-5 years, for reasons I mentioned upthread a little while ago.

Anyway, short of their inevitable, eventual return, this thread has nearly been done to death, for the time being. . .

Unless, however, we'd like to post/share more about good Sundays sound-a-likes. The Sundays are my favorite band times a million-billion, and I think going into depth on their best imitators would be a purposeful thing to do. (I'm always up for a good imitation/clone of my favorite band, The Sundays! (though, few exist). It seems truly odd to me, however, that some Sundays fans slag off other bands that sound a lot like The Sundays -- like, don't you want more of that Sundays sound???

So, maybe we can do that for a while, unless consensus requires another thread.

Shoestrings: "Naked"
This is a great one. I hate to just call them a Sundays imitation, for they're a fine band in their own right. And, believe it or not, I can actually imagine this song coming into being even without The Sundays having existed! But, because of the vocals, I have to rate this as probably the best Sundays sound-a-like I've ever really heard. It just sounds like The Sundays picking up from S&S with a few synth-string washes, and slightly more naiveté, for these people were younger when recording this than the Sundays people ever were on any of their albums.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KIGJY_ZyplM

I can really only think of very few other, worthy Sundays sound-a-likes. There really are a few, though (I've searched, and searched, and searched. I'll post them here later, unless we need another thread or something.

PS: The guy sings most of the songs on that Shoestrings album/most of their songs don't sound exactly like this.

Seeing this thread reminded me that I saw the Sundays with Madder Rose in Houston. One of the best shows I saw in the 90's. I need reading writing and arithmetic on record.

Saw that very tour:

https://nedraggett.wordpress.com/2010/10/04/not-just-the-ticket-65-the-sundays-june-5-1993/

Listened to a bit of their first LP this weekend, and wondered ... whatever became of Harriet Wheeler?

She and Gavurin have just been enjoying the domestic life for the last 18 or so years, it appears.

This thread is such a mean tease every time it gets bumped.

a little off-topic, but if you like both ethereal goth and The Sundays, then I have to recommend the second Innocence Mission album to you 'Umbrella'. It's one of the only good Sundays imitations I've ever heard (I've given dozens of bad Sundays imitations a chance), and it has, surprisingly, at least a couple of songs that sound kind of dark. At least search "Evensong" from that album - I promise you'll like it a lot. (Nothing else by Innocence Mission besides the 'Umbrella' album sounds like The Sundays though, - just to save your time).

― monster mash, Sunday, November 8, 2015 4:33 PM (one year ago)

I've been listening to the first two Innocence Mission albums a lot lately, and this is otm! I'm starting to wonder if 'God Made Me' might have been a deliberate send-up of the Innocence Mission. I like to imagine Harriet and Dave listening to Umbrella, being like, 'hey, these American Jesus freaks are eating our lunch!', and writing an innocuously-titled apostate anthem for the express purpose of breaking the Perises poor Catholic hearts. it probably didn't happen that way, but I can dream.

as for Sundays imitations, the lead singer of the Spanish band Fine channels Harriet Wheeler pretty strongly at times, though their style is more loungey indiepop than ethereal goth:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EE5XOBgU_po

nothing makes me happier than a sundays bump : )
will check out that IM album

Talking of Sundays imitations…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Vt0d9YlTC4

^good call, this song is very Static & Silence-ish. I hadn't even heard of the Sundays back when it came out

and I don't think I've ever seen that video before because what is even going on with Natalie's hair

Wrong Impression was the reason I finally got Reading, Writing & Arithmetic. I told my brother how much I loved it and he said, "you should probably get the first Sundays album then". He was right. I do still love the Natalie Imbruglia single as well.

I avoided Wild Hoses for the longest time but it’s actually a great vehicle for Harriet

Wild Hoses.

OK .....

The rock stars who went back work thread makes me wonder about this lot & how they fund their child rearing. Even though it's none of my business.

p sure Harriet went into service with the civil service

Finding a pound doesn't count for much these days.

The Sundays are my go to for smiths-like music when i'm in a smiths-like mood but really don't want to hear morrissey (which as of the last year or so is all of the time, forever)

Leave us alone.
https://longreads.com/2019/07/30/searching-for-the-sundays/

^ That's rather good. Can't say I've ever yearned to meet any musician. But can understand how something like RW&A could inspire such a thing.

Gawd this article is the embodiment of “tl;dr”... I can’t even skim it effectively.

tl;dr for ya: big obsessive buildup and then he didn't meet them.

It's the story of an adult learning about boundaries (ie, figuring out, thankfully in time, that showing up unannounced on your heroes' doorstep when they clearly value their privacy and have explicitly said as much to you through a proxy is an unambiguously bad idea).

Seemed like a string of clichés and truisms threaded around a fairly creepy premise - "they've demonstrated they have no interest in publicity or interviews, but if they only met me they'd change their minds, and I won't take no for an answer! Oh I guess they have a right to privacy after all, we've all learned something and let me explain it to you." Yeesh.

And yet, people moaning because he didn't 'deliver'

wow this guy is the absolute worst

this isn't even about the band, this is an awful guy's attempt to make himself the centre of a story that nobody else wanted to be told

I mean, would I have been thrilled if they consented to an interview? Absolutely. If it turned out that their 'consent' was the result of someone jimmying the lock on their back door at 3 AM and sitting at the foot of their bed until they finally relented? Not so much. Not so much.

wow this guy is the absolute worst

hey, he’s no Abraham Reisman

Well, something I did not expect

BIG MUSIC NEWS: I have a new band with Patrick Hannan of The SUNDAYS! An absolute dream come true. We are called The Wild Fell. More music (and shows) soon, but for now stream (or download) our first song "The Ghost You Love" now!
https://t.co/v52c76tsoI

— David Obuchowski, Peugeot Haver & Vax Getter (@DavidOfromNJ) June 20, 2022

new song! really lovely, unsurprisingly - came upon it by chance in searching for their music to play. been so long. really great to know they're still going at it. "life goes on"

was also excited to see this, but alas, it's a b-side from 1997: https://www.discogs.com/release/787085-The-Sundays-Cry

still great to see it show up. maybe some other archive stuff is forthcoming? they certainly could use a b-sides+rarities comp!

omg!! i had no idea. but yes agreed.