'Shake Ya Tailfeather'

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― d k (d k), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:13 (twenty-two years ago)

yes?

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:15 (twenty-two years ago)

are you ordering us? or do you want to talk about the terrible song from the awful bad boys 2: the search for more money?

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:16 (twenty-two years ago)

What's terrible about it?

― d k (d k), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:18 (twenty-two years ago)

the song, mostly.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:19 (twenty-two years ago)

though the video sucks too.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:19 (twenty-two years ago)

"shake ya tailfeather" : ready to die :: nelson : pyromania

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:20 (twenty-two years ago)

which is to say that all stylisitic trends reach a point of saturation/self-parody

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:22 (twenty-two years ago)

i'd prefer it if this was an order. get moving, people!

― lauren (laurenp), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:22 (twenty-two years ago)

the only part i like is how diddy references the lil jon song

but seriously, what's with this new style of dance these girls are doing (it's in the chingy video too) where they look like they're doing the 'tardo chicken leg thing on double speed? no good.

― JasonD (JasonD), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:23 (twenty-two years ago)

- I found out that Pyromania is a Def Leppard CD but I don't know who Nelson is.

- He references a David Banner song.

― d k (d k), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:24 (twenty-two years ago)

dk could you please drop the faux-naif thing?

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:27 (twenty-two years ago)

Yeah really, it's not amusing. sub-pinefoxian at best.

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:29 (twenty-two years ago)

actually that was mean, sorry, but jesus, it doesn't say much for modern hip-hop's defenders when the best tack they can come up with is a wearying "what me worry?" anti-intellectualism.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:30 (twenty-two years ago)

defenders on this board, anyway.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:30 (twenty-two years ago)

I was hoping this was a thread about the Five Du-Tones :-(

― M Matos (M Matos), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:30 (twenty-two years ago)

I downloaded this a few weeks ago and gave it a couple of plays. Nothing great or even much good about it but nothing struck me as rotten either. Maybe I am cloth-hipped.

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:33 (twenty-two years ago)

Ehhh. I must not know what 'faux-naif' is. Is 'faux-naif' not getting obscure Def Leppard references?

I don't even like the song! I just wanted to see you guys talk about it.

― d k (d k), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:34 (twenty-two years ago)

also, what IS at stake for those who most voiciferously defend current hip-hop from being aesthetically lacking when it's THE BIGGEST MUSIC IN THE FREE WORLD. i could kinda understand it in 1983, but fuck, you won! let it go, man!

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:34 (twenty-two years ago)

i.e. both "Fantastic track dude!!!" (or whatever d k is saying, god knows) and "Damning indictment of modern hip-hop" seem a bit exaggerated to me.

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:34 (twenty-two years ago)

haha yeah, those keeeeerazy obscure bands like def leppard and nelson.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:35 (twenty-two years ago)

Hijack, point to Matos! What I find most interesting about the Five Du-Tones version of "Shake a Tailfeather" is the limted instrumentation - it sounds like there's just piano, bass and drums. Those harmony vocals are also kicking me in the ass every time.

― J (Jay), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:35 (twenty-two years ago)

actually tom it's not even sonic, more of a worldview exhaustion (i may be taking the video into account moreso here. also, i don't want to come off as my polar opposite/roots fan guys.)

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:36 (twenty-two years ago)

I still have no idea what the fuck 'Nelson' is.

― d k (d k), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:36 (twenty-two years ago)

http://www.brettgarsed.com/Images/Disc/atr.jpg

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:38 (twenty-two years ago)

this song is ok, jess youre an asshole

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:39 (twenty-two years ago)

ask siegbran about nelson

― JasonD (JasonD), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:41 (twenty-two years ago)

taking sides: being an asshole vs. assuming a rather insulting persona of what a "real 15 yr old is like."

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:41 (twenty-two years ago)

and i have no idea who the fuck nelson are either, i thought you meant from the simpsons... you sure do proudly throw around the insult 'faux-naif' a lot considering its just a tarted up version of nu ilm indie guilt accusations; 'you are smart so you must be pretending to like britney' = 'you are smart so you must be pretending not to know who 'nelson' is'

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:42 (twenty-two years ago)

Oh, well, you know, videos...I need to get Freeview at some point.

I blew the dust of the MP3 and it's playing now. Apart from the siren noise (which is underused anyway), it kind of flaps around a bit and never gets off the ground. But it doesn't stink out the place either.

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:42 (twenty-two years ago)

ha ethan, "pretending to be more simple than you are" does not equal "pretending to like something".

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:43 (twenty-two years ago)

in fact, "pretending to be more simple than you are" has nothing to do with taste at all, unless it's something to do with a way of avoiding having to defend your tastes.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:44 (twenty-two years ago)

wow jess i didnt realize everybody besides 20-something white male uk rock critics were adopting a persona....how is dk pretending to be more simple than he is??

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:44 (twenty-two years ago)

or me, for that matter? because i dont know the history of sonic youth?? because i dont incomprehensibly overwrite my sentences for something like posting on a messageboard??? 'he went to college but on this grocery list he mispelled kumquats, his faux naif persona is truly insulting!!!' btw i didnt go to college i dropped out of high school

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:46 (twenty-two years ago)

the same way you do, pal.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:46 (twenty-two years ago)

and ethan your sentences are just as incomprehensibly overwritten as anyone elses here.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:47 (twenty-two years ago)

its a bullshit rock critic conceit that you have to 'defend' your taste or else youre 'pretending' to be an idiot, and anyway dk's 'defended' his taste plenty, remember the justin timberlake thread

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:48 (twenty-two years ago)

On the Justin Timberlake thing and all that I might actually have been on a faux-naif thing. Probably. (ethan: 'rap-rock sincerity is the new faux-naif. if you catch my drift.' That kind of turned me off it.) But not getting a shitty joke about forgotten grunge bands isn't faux-naif.

― d k (d k), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:50 (twenty-two years ago)

really you seem to point the dreaded 'faux naif' at anybody who disagrees with you, i remember in some thread when i said didnt get the point of microhouse and you were like 'ping goes the sound of logic aginst the faux naif shell' ('logistical beatdown'?)

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:50 (twenty-two years ago)

it's a bullshit rock critic conceit to valorize dropping out of high school and disdaining formal education in favor of the "authetic voice of the underclass" too.

let me rephrase dk by changing "faux-naif" to "a brick wall."

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:51 (twenty-two years ago)

dk the justin 'give him a chance, please' thing WAS raprock sincerity!!! i regret that glib comment calling you faux naif, i was just trying to be an asshole like jess

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:52 (twenty-two years ago)

"trying to be"

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:52 (twenty-two years ago)

'it's a bullshit rock critic conceit to valorize dropping out of high school and disdaining formal education'....i didnt realize americas poor followed the rock critics code so strictly!!!

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:53 (twenty-two years ago)

As far as ways to avoid defending your taste go, faux-naif is still rarer (even on ILM!) and better (cos eg on Spizzazz it usually involves some useful bare-bones description of the music) than "Lady if you have to ask..." or appeals to Rock History.

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:54 (twenty-two years ago)

And - this is a big point - it nearly always reads like it's happy rather than jaded.

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:55 (twenty-two years ago)

jess since you hate dk and spizzazzz so much for rejecting formal asshole education, who do you want to write about music?? simon reynolds??

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:55 (twenty-two years ago)

ethan you're about as truly "american poor" as i am. (i.e. kinda, not very. being downwardly mobile isn't exactly the same as being working poor.)

ha tom it ALWAYS reads jaded to me.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:55 (twenty-two years ago)

being scared of the middle of your body vs. being scared of the middle of your brain

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:56 (twenty-two years ago)

but wait i think reynolds is a lot more 'naif' about hiphop than dk or anybody from spizzazzz, its bullshit cz the naif part doesnt refer to actual knowledge of the music but to naivete of HOW TO WRITE LIKE A ROCK CRITIC, and we're all pretending we dont know how, its exactly like indie guilt in that way, if you know abt indie and choose to listen to anything other than indie = you are pretending, if you know about formalist rock critic write and choose to wite any other way = you are 'faux'

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:58 (twenty-two years ago)

ethan do you want me to start pulling up old pitchfork reviews so we can see just how much you "don't know how to write like a rock critic"?

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 21:59 (twenty-two years ago)

i clearly said choosing not to

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:00 (twenty-two years ago)

though my first review for them was copied from another pfork review, i just replaced the adjectives and nouns

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:00 (twenty-two years ago)

i mean if you think its more 'real' to perpetuate the pleasure-denying bitter old rock critic mold, have fun!! i will be writing about music i like and not knowing who 'nelson' were

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:02 (twenty-two years ago)

where will you be writing about music?

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:03 (twenty-two years ago)

simon trife as will hunting

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:04 (twenty-two years ago)

just so i can see what i'm doing wrong, mind you.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:05 (twenty-two years ago)

plus he doth protest too much (and he knows what I'm talking about)

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:05 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah oooh he wrote like a rock critic to get paid, he must be fake then!!!

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:07 (twenty-two years ago)

is there any reason why this song is being used to represent 'hip-hop's nadir'? it's not even that big a hit, esp. compared to um, everything else nelly or puffy have done

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:07 (twenty-two years ago)

'ethan drop the faux naif act we know you like being a fry cook, you did it eight hours a day'

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:08 (twenty-two years ago)

J--not only is it just bass/drums/piano (maybe guitar somewhere in there though damned if I can hear it) but the vocals are in the red and distort at the top (i.e. wherever the guy screams really loud). the engineer audibly turns the volume down on the choruses. it's one of the most exciting records ever made, definitely, up there with early (pre-funk) James Brown in that category

― M Matos (M Matos), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:08 (twenty-two years ago)

it's certainly the worst thing nelly has been involved with by some margin

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:09 (twenty-two years ago)

the song is fine, jess trying to force a comparison with rockist touchstone ready to die is the most 'naive' thing in this thread

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:09 (twenty-two years ago)

I mean you'd think it was Gigli except there's no 'gobble gobble' for the uninitiated to go 'ok, haha, that is awful' - what makes this 'hip-hop's nadir' instead of just a weak single?

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:09 (twenty-two years ago)

ethan working at subway because you're too lazy or confused to go to college doesn't make you one of "america's poor"

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:09 (twenty-two years ago)

trife - dissmissing bigge whilst defending puffy is the most faux-naif thing on this thread

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:10 (twenty-two years ago)

I mean, is there a bridge you can't burn?

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:11 (twenty-two years ago)

(OK, make that one of the most exciting records I've ever heard, fine, too broad a brush et al)

― M Matos (M Matos), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:12 (twenty-two years ago)

not dismissing biggie at all you know i love him, just saying that this song has nothing to do with ready to die excpet puff and holding it to that standard is bullshit, and lately ive been listening to more puffy, i guess theres that INDIE GUILT at work!!!

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:12 (twenty-two years ago)

i like the weird harmony on mrphy lee's voice! its strange!

― chaki (chaki), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:13 (twenty-two years ago)

gygax: 'you dont really enjoy listening to biggie, you really like pavement more', blount : 'you dont really enjoy listening to puffy, you really like biggie more'

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:13 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah, that's what I said

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:14 (twenty-two years ago)

faux-naif = fake stupid = what you're doing

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:15 (twenty-two years ago)

remind me again why you almost NEVER posted on the jay-z/nas threads?

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:16 (twenty-two years ago)

c'mon blount you should know that all music exists in a cultural vacuum even within its own genre, and any attempt to differentiate quality is a decadent rock crit institution.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:16 (twenty-two years ago)

Blount is OTM - it's an unpretentious party track which doesn't live up to its own exhortations, not the first and hardly the last, what makes it so bad?

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:16 (twenty-two years ago)

jess my fry cook example was just saying ppl do things for money (fry cook, pfork writer) that arent what theyd want to do most, though i dont see how being too 'lazy or confused' to go to college makes me not 'americas poor', are you saying the proverbial poor are even LAZIER and STUPIDER than me cz thats pretty dumb and wrong

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:18 (twenty-two years ago)

yes ethan, that's exactly what i'm saying.

frankly, i don't think there's anyone in america right now stupider than you're being in this moment.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:18 (twenty-two years ago)

I like the beginning(s) of the video, both the 'little havana' mini-drama part, and the 'rockstar video games presents "shake ya tailfeather"' part. I like the vaguely tomahawk chant element too, though I would really like it if they were shouting thru conk shells instead of just their hands - more summery.

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:19 (twenty-two years ago)

tom yr verging on trife territory here: where did anyone on this thread say that it was hip-hop's nadir?

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:19 (twenty-two years ago)

jess now you're being faux-naif

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:20 (twenty-two years ago)

blount i already said i dont want to play a authencity game with you, i dont need to 'prove' why i didnt post on the jayz/nas threads, like i told you before i dislike that hiphop lyrical rockist bullshit as much as any normal ilm thing, its not like that thread was the realest ppl ever anyway it was a white college dude who liked 2pac and a british dude who listend to trip-hop in his spare time, i dont need to impress you by listening to a bunch of internet 'hiphop' dudes telling me jayz is materialistic and nas fell off after illmatic, i have normal ilm for that

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:21 (twenty-two years ago)

before eethan bones up on his sonic youth, he ought to bone up the history of black folks and other people of color worldwide. cause some of us cornell west-enjoying, supossedly pleasure-denying backpacker types make easy work of your ass.

― woland, Monday, 11 August 2003 22:22 (twenty-two years ago)

blount, seriously, you give as good as ethan sometimes in avoiding the question game: how is saying that a stylisitic trope (or several) within a genre have reached self-parody the same as calling it the genre's nadir?

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:23 (twenty-two years ago)

i mean if youd actually read the threads instead of glancing at them and saying, oh, theyre talking about rap, ethan must not really ilke hiphop if hes not posting to it, then youd see theyre a bunch of dudes who are going to get fed up with hiphop in the next couple of years and jsut listen to radiohead

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:23 (twenty-two years ago)

i like cornell west : (

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:25 (twenty-two years ago)

and i wish ppl would stop bullying each other

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:26 (twenty-two years ago)

I didnt mention nadir (well I did on my new thread, but that's exaggerating for general effect) - but in two places upthread you're using this single as a vague stand-in for "modern hip-hop" Jess, you do seem to be investing it with some kind of significance.

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:26 (twenty-two years ago)

no trife, what you told me before was that you thought you were out of your depth on the nas/jay-z threads, not that they were too 'rockist' for you. ie. it's easier to dictate about hip-hop with people who have less of a claim on it than you than with people who are likely to either talk circles around you if they even bother to take you seriously (which is hardly a given)

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:26 (twenty-two years ago)

why does ethan always resort to the straw man argument when he talks about indie ?

― woland, Monday, 11 August 2003 22:27 (twenty-two years ago)

from guess who's blog - "rap absolutely leeched of sonic invention, imagination, individuality ('Tailfeather': surely some kind of nadir?)"

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:29 (twenty-two years ago)

ha not mine, brother!

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:30 (twenty-two years ago)

blount youre right they probably do know more about canibus b sides and weird rare bootleg nas dis tracks than me, im not really interested in that part of hiphop!!!! regular ilm is more general pop radio based and id rather talk about the songs i like there, being an obscurist isnt the only way to be a 'real' fan of music

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:30 (twenty-two years ago)

Thanks SR for saving my thread.

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:31 (twenty-two years ago)

my opinion on the state of hip-hop is all over ilx right now, but it basically boils down to a rather surface seeming "healthy biodiversity" (a lot of shit in the charts that doesn't sound like each other or anything else) but might be less chartiably chalked up to no one knowing what to do next. (this depends on how closely you subscribe to the "let's push things forward" mindset.)

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:32 (twenty-two years ago)

jay-z and nas fans /= obscurantist (unless you're a faux-naif rockist)

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:32 (twenty-two years ago)

I wish sr would point out for me why rap being leeched of sonic invention, imagination, and individuality has to be a bad thing

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:33 (twenty-two years ago)

Rep being leeched of individuality would be kind of a deal-breaker surely?

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:35 (twenty-two years ago)

who's rep?

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:36 (twenty-two years ago)

it's doubly ironic since sr is always happier when he can list a dozen songs in his year end round up that circle around a very similar sound, yet gets cranky the minute anything approaches "hegemony."

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:37 (twenty-two years ago)

the plague of the former indiest

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:39 (twenty-two years ago)

unreleased tracks you can only get from rap battle dork internet file sharing places or nyc mixtapes (neither of which i have access to) are obscurist!!!!!! they werent talking about the tracks from jayz and nas albums that i was able to buy in a store and own, much less the singles!!! dave matthews are a huge band but that doesnt mean you cant be an obscurist by having a hundred bootleg tapes of them playing live in holland

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:40 (twenty-two years ago)

im still not understanding why ppl hat eshake ya tailfeather

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:41 (twenty-two years ago)

*cue "wanksta"*

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:41 (twenty-two years ago)

Matos, I think you were right the first time!

― J (Jay), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:41 (twenty-two years ago)

and jess im sorry i calld you an asshole but you were being an asshole to dk, yeah he has weird affectations sometimes but we all do, youre often very mean to him

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:43 (twenty-two years ago)

and trife - why are you arguing with the 'obscurantist' approach here instead of ON the jay-z/nas threads? were you afraid of them?

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:43 (twenty-two years ago)

trife - have you read dk's 'noone smart enough to appreciate malkmus could ever be stupid enough to listen to hip-hop' rants elsewhere? or has he fished you in too?

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:44 (twenty-two years ago)

because:

a. it's boring
b. it sounds clumpy at loud volumes while driving
c. the basic sentiment has been expressed before a hundred times and often one hundred times better
d. it's easily the worst thing nelly has ever been involved with

ethan i'm sorry too if you felt like i was turning you into a caricature, but fuck you.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:45 (twenty-two years ago)

ie. dk's faux-naif act is more about shutting down discussion than fostering it (some people say the same about you)(some people sometimes have a point)

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:45 (twenty-two years ago)

jess, that carson daly roast = worst thing nelly's ever been involved with

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:47 (twenty-two years ago)

plus he's been on mad tv a couple of times

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:48 (twenty-two years ago)

what?
i thought dk was into ludacris and pastor troy?
am i thinking of someone else?

― robin (robin), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:48 (twenty-two years ago)

it depends on what thread dk is on

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:49 (twenty-two years ago)

what does that mean?

― robin (robin), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:50 (twenty-two years ago)

he's another 13 yr. old kid writing a book about the internet like scaredy cat and doomie

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:52 (twenty-two years ago)

ok yeah thats really really dumb, i dont get dks weird obsession with indie, but he hasnt done stuff liek that in all the threads i know him from , he just talks enthusiastically about stuff he likes and its usually stuff i like too

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:53 (twenty-two years ago)

unless he was trying to do like a parody of faux naif/indie guilt namecallers

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:55 (twenty-two years ago)

btw blount if you hate ppl who blindly shut down debates so much i dont see why youre so adament about me posting on the jayz/nas threads

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:56 (twenty-two years ago)

cuz then maybe you'll stop whining?

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:57 (twenty-two years ago)

no im just saying my take on current hiphop wouldve gotten me ignored for being 'materialistic' while they parrotted back and forth lame disses and the sincere earnest poetry of the most boringest pac and nas rhymes

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 22:59 (twenty-two years ago)

and i really wish youd stop insulting me all the time

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:00 (twenty-two years ago)

HA HA HA

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:00 (twenty-two years ago)

I mean if some other poster was whining all the time about country not getting taken seriously and ilm's classist anti-country stance and how ilxors don't know/appreciate country like he does too the point of self-parody and then almost never posted on a huge (the hugest in fact) country thread cuz 'they like it/know about it more/differently than I do' I'd think it's fair to assume they full of shit

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:01 (twenty-two years ago)

i dont post about rap not 'getting taken seriously', i like to argue with ilm ppl most because even when theyre being annoying they are more interesting than most ppl on the internet, ive read rap forums since i got the internet when i was 14 and the jayz nas thread is the same fucking cliched thing as all of them...im sorry for saying things about rock critics then because i guess thats why ilm is more interesting, just stop

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:04 (twenty-two years ago)

anyhow, I really really doubt one way or the other whether the tailfeather haters/luvvers are gonna be bringing it up in conversation in five years (the way only rockists bring up biggie), so may dk shutting down this discussion is exactly what it needs. (maybe he can brag about his malkmus flexi-disc as one of those stock sitcom tagouts gags)

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:04 (twenty-two years ago)

really whats the point of this the indie authenticity game, what are you trying to prove? that i dont really like hiphop? id rather occasionally argue with ppl on ilm than bang my head against the wall with broken record hiphop cliches of jayz/nas posters, this is just like when marcello went off on this quasi racist rant about how those threads had more 'soul' and 'fire' than the rest of ilm

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:07 (twenty-two years ago)

* cue "wanksta" again*

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:08 (twenty-two years ago)

how in gods name is it anything like that? because it happens to involve the jay-z/nas thread?

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:08 (twenty-two years ago)

* cue nu shooz "point of no return" *

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:10 (twenty-two years ago)

blount is saying im fake because i didnt post to it

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:11 (twenty-two years ago)

actually the phrase I used was "full of shit"

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:13 (twenty-two years ago)

really jess and blount i like both of you a lot but i wish you wouldnt be so glib and pointlessly cruel sometimes, im not at all saying you always are, but sometimes, and things like blounts smarmy song posts just now 'shut down the discussion' more than anything, im posting in paragraphs explaining what im trying to say and youre just being clever and hurtful

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:13 (twenty-two years ago)

trife's antipathy towards both "hip-hop fan's cliches" and "ilm's indie authenticity game", his disdain the "pleasure denying rock-crit style of discourse" and "ilm being 'more interesting'" than any other internet forum despite it apparently hewing to this model above all others is one of the most perfect gordian knots (something else for dk to google) i've ever seen.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:13 (twenty-two years ago)

and i wish you both wouldnt be so quick to the personal attack, jess you always bring in these details abt my life instead of actually talking abt the issues we're talking about, i wish we could just be civil and not try to make each other feel bad....im sure one of you can find some old thread where im mean to someone and then thatll make what im saying 'not matter' but im being sincere here

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:15 (twenty-two years ago)

jess i said im sorry for dissing rock critics above and that i was probably wrong for it bcz thats what makes ilm interesting, its not a contradiction!!

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:16 (twenty-two years ago)

and please dont make fun of dk for not knowing what things are

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:17 (twenty-two years ago)

trife - I'm TRYING to shut down the discussion, I even invoked dk a la candyman!

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:18 (twenty-two years ago)

ethan your sincerity would mean more if the same damn thing didn't happen on every thread!

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:18 (twenty-two years ago)

and trife if you think dk doesn't 'know what things are' you've been conned

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:18 (twenty-two years ago)

A mere 60 minutes after hearing Shake Ya Tailfeather upthread I cannot remember it at all any every time I try to I get Lil Jon's "Get Low" in my head instead. This may back up somebody's point.

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:21 (twenty-two years ago)

i didnt know what a gordian knot is, i figured it out from context though

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:22 (twenty-two years ago)

haha - let's all be civil!

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:22 (twenty-two years ago)

the biggest problem
is not trife or jess or blount
it is murphy lee

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:31 (twenty-two years ago)

I know, I know: stay
the fuck out of it with my
corny-ass "haiku"

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:33 (twenty-two years ago)

haha!

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:34 (twenty-two years ago)

i like it but idunno about an hour from now.

and murphy lee always sounds sleazy and good to me.

― brian badword (badwords), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:34 (twenty-two years ago)

his 'guest spot' on the
chingy album convinced me
that he just plain surrxx

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:36 (twenty-two years ago)

stop making me feel all wrong :/

― brian badword (badwords), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:39 (twenty-two years ago)

hes one of my favorite mcs from recent years, his verse on the toya 'i do' remix (over a mase beat!!!!) and his verse on air force ones are both incredible

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:40 (twenty-two years ago)

oh yeah 'air force ones'
his thingy on the chingy*
made me forget that

*awwwwyeah

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:48 (twenty-two years ago)

im amazed so many ppl bought the chingy album!!!! roscoe came out that same week, cop it or at least dl '5 seconds'

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:50 (twenty-two years ago)

i didn't buy it
i reviewed it, it was free
oh and one more thing

i must just admit
that lee's 'dental plan' line was
pretty damn funny

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:53 (twenty-two years ago)

hes only like eighteen or nineteen you know...he was like sixteen on that first nelly st.lunatics song

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:55 (twenty-two years ago)

i like him because he flips the mournful distressed vocal style of ghost and freeway into this weirdly positive singsongy thing, ja rule but less scratchy, snoop but less syrupy

― trife (simon_tr), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:57 (twenty-two years ago)

i guess i just think
he goes beyond 'southern slow'
a little too far

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Monday, 11 August 2003 23:59 (twenty-two years ago)

missouri isnt southern!!

― trife (simon_tr), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 00:01 (twenty-two years ago)

(my cousin is moving there next week!!)

― trife (simon_tr), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 00:01 (twenty-two years ago)

i hate when ppl refer to missy and tim as southern too, isnt that practically washington dc!!!

― trife (simon_tr), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 00:03 (twenty-two years ago)

geographically
that is right for sure I know
but why the two R's?

I think it's just that
MO and VA are not
cali or brooklyn

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 00:04 (twenty-two years ago)

Hi, guys. I know it's kind of late for this, but:

Blount: I think you might be crazy. Because you're saying nonsense. I don't know about this 'shutting down debates' thing or 'fishing people in' or whatever you said. I make, like, at most one post a week and it's usually silly and you or jess make a cute remark (I think your last one was 'write new material,' right?) and I don't post again for a while.

I read ILM everyday. I check it a bunch of times and read all the new stuff. And there's not really much I can comment on. This might shock you but, I know absolutely nothing about seventy five percent what's discussed on ILM. But I still like reading it. I can't take sides between Juliana Hersh and Kristen Hersh or Suede and Urge Overkill. I couldn't afford to buy The Wire. I've never heard Kraftwerk or Elvis Costello. I can't tell anyone about Peaches. And when there is stuff that I could comment on, it's usually threads about funny-noise hip-hop by the two or three producers you like, and it's not really stuff that people can say a lot about.

I usually don't mind that. I like reading it. But sometimes I guess I am frustrated with it. And that's where the silly stuff comes from. I usually regret it.

jess: You are crazy, too. You have some kind of deep, crazy anger. That's probably not news to you and I'm not being mean or anything. I think you're cool but you definitely have some troubles.

I mean, How many people in North America would know who Nelson was!

I'm not dumb and I don't really try to pretend to be. I read books and stuff, jess. I know about music and stuff, too.

Everyone who likes or dislikes Murphy Lee: Download 'Boughetto,' Ali featuring Murphy Lee. It's good.

― d k (d k), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 00:06 (twenty-two years ago)

a premonition:
this will just heat up again
okay now I'm gone

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 00:07 (twenty-two years ago)

Nelson has the same birthday as me. :(

― Nate Patrin (Nate Patrin), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 00:27 (twenty-two years ago)

Sorry Jess, but if I was just going on this thread, and wasn;t familiar with the quality of your work, I would think you;re a fucking tool and a half, too. My old roommate was one of those arrogant, know-it-all music collector types who made people feel like shit for the sport of it ... and then wondered why he had no friends in time of real need. Only vivisble difference, judging by the shit here, between you and him, I would think, is the fact you have the confidence to pursue good gigs and not sit on your ass.

That said, keep up the good professional work ...

― Chris O'Connor (Chris O'Connor), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 00:37 (twenty-two years ago)

gygax: 'you dont really enjoy listening to biggie, you really like pavement more', blount : 'you dont really enjoy listening to puffy, you really like biggie more'

hi there ethan! you typically misunderstood my sentiments... let me refresh your memory with the general idea:

those of you who were so gung ho into indie... why are you now so anti-indie? do you feel guilty?

sorry you got the wrong impression, yo!

― gygax! (gygax!), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:11 (twenty-two years ago)

this thread has taken several hilarious turns since i went to dennys with my lady. i thought of ethan while i was eating. he's a good kid.

dk i would think the millions upon millions of people who bought nelson's albums, saw their videos, or heard their songs on the FUCKING RADIO would probably know who they are. last time i checked, nelson weren't getting reviewed for their limited edition lathe cut 8" by david keenan in the wire.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:15 (twenty-two years ago)

also, i quite like "boughetto".

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:17 (twenty-two years ago)

i mean, would it have been better if i had said mr. big? or were they more "obscure" with their huge world conquering hit than nelson was with theirs? how in the fuck am I being a music snob talking about bands who were world famous, at least at one point? christ i'm not sitting here comparing this song to deerhoof or some shit.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:18 (twenty-two years ago)

i.e. don't blame me because the world existed before you started paying attention to popular culture, either by age or inclination.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:19 (twenty-two years ago)

but i guess this is why us evil rock critics are losing the ever important 18-35 demo.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:22 (twenty-two years ago)

so it's settled then: the Five Du-Tones' "Shake a Tail Feather" is better than this new soundtrack cut, "Shake Ya Tailfeather." excellent.

― M Matos (M Matos), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:23 (twenty-two years ago)

jess will your retire the lathe-cut 8" thing i mean really

― gygax! (gygax!), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:24 (twenty-two years ago)

will you retire indie guilt?

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:24 (twenty-two years ago)

which i guess means disappearing in a poof of smoke like an angry little devil on someones shoulder in a cartoon?

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:25 (twenty-two years ago)

racist

― gygax! (gygax!), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:28 (twenty-two years ago)

ha, i just realized that if i had answered "indie guilt: c/d?" truthfully way back when (i.e. "i feel like i've wasted an incredible amount of time and money on it") then maybe it wouldn't have ballooned into the wonderful monstrosity it became.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:28 (twenty-two years ago)

devils are an ethnicity now?!

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:28 (twenty-two years ago)

"the naadp"

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:28 (twenty-two years ago)

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=%22angry+little+devil%22

― gygax! (gygax!), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:29 (twenty-two years ago)

"kittie4you"

― gygax! (gygax!), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:31 (twenty-two years ago)

nothing will ever beat "healthybutt@yahoo.com", i think.

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:32 (twenty-two years ago)

this is kinda heartbreaking:

hey diary what's up? not too much going on here.i havent been online for two weeks yet it seems that i'm not missing it. so i guess ill write about my week. last sunday i went to my "familly" reunion. now it's not like i HATE them...i'm just on the border line of it. well since you dont really know me.. i guess you can describe my in different ways. some people may see me as an angry little devil worshiper that hurts innocent kids. (really been told that) or you may just see me as a punk teen girl that likes wide leg jeans and boys with spiked hair. so anyway i was at the reunion and my dad finally just brings it up that two weeks earlier this chubby chick named megan who i think is my 2nd cousin was talking smack about me at my grandpa's wedding. (his 2nd.. or 3rd.. i kinda lost track)so i was like gonna kick some major tail but then i got threatened that if i do.. serious consicencous will happen. i guess i dont do well with threats.. i never have. so im like not by her, and my adrenaline is like rushing but im getting me a can of pop and i hear her go oh look at that fatty..... well FUCK HER! i am not fat at all... if you know me you know i wear like a size 9 and im 5'9''...and then shes talking to this nappy ho thats not even related to me

― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:35 (twenty-two years ago)

that is kinda heartbreaking

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:47 (twenty-two years ago)

dk you a fule

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:48 (twenty-two years ago)

oh, and trife - no harm, no foul. I didn't mean to go all darni3ll3 on ya.

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 01:50 (twenty-two years ago)

"hes one of my favorite mcs from recent years, his verse on the toya 'i do' remix (over a mase beat!!!!) and his verse on air force ones are both incredible"

I'll read the rest of the thread later but this is all very very true! Murphy Lee's a champ!

― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Tuesday, 12 August 2003 04:10 (twenty-two years ago)

one month passes...

phew. i missed this thread first time round and almost started a new one today about 'tailfeather' being one of the mediocrest no. 1s ever. it's no.1 in the US now, isn' t it ? i wanna hear that 'i do' remix, except if it doesnt have the filtered microjungle i dont give a fuck really.

― mitch lastnamewithheld (mitchlnw), Friday, 26 September 2003 14:40 (twenty-two years ago)

When I first read this thread it was very annoying but now it's charming

I heard this song drunk once and it was storming

― Sonny A. (Keiko), Friday, 26 September 2003 15:14 (twenty-two years ago)

heh, yeah, i totally missed this the first time around, i think it went down the week i was out of town and offline. what an eyeful. makes me kind of glad i don't post enough to have that kind of serious ILM baggage, where people can throw previous unrelated threads in each other's face.

the song is ok.

― Al (sitcom), Friday, 26 September 2003 15:45 (twenty-two years ago)

i just saw the video. yeah, it's kinda alright actually.

― mitch lastnamewithheld (mitchlnw), Saturday, 27 September 2003 15:59 (twenty-two years ago)

four years pass...

what a weird thread

― J0rdan S., Wednesday, 28 May 2008 21:09 (seventeen years ago)

anyway this song just came on sucker free and i still really like it a lot. my opinion of it is prolly warped cuz i wasn't thinking about rap cliches and chorus volumes in middle school when this was my jam but it still sounds really fun to me, and that tomahawk ooooh thing in the chorus isn't really hackneyed at all. verses are good too, pretty good chemistry between the three of them

― J0rdan S., Wednesday, 28 May 2008 21:13 (seventeen years ago)

haha

― deej, Wednesday, 28 May 2008 21:34 (seventeen years ago)

Do you know who Nelson is?

― jaymc, Wednesday, 28 May 2008 21:50 (seventeen years ago)

i dont

― deej, Wednesday, 28 May 2008 21:54 (seventeen years ago)

no naifo

― deej, Wednesday, 28 May 2008 21:54 (seventeen years ago)

I smell an upcoming generational divide along these lines:

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41RNEZ3W7ZL._SL500_AA240_.jpg http://manzanoproductions.com/uploaded_images/l_d63dc0ecead578b706e1edd396a18faf-721941.jpg

― jaymc, Wednesday, 28 May 2008 22:02 (seventeen years ago)

I think Nelson's big single came out at almost exactly the point when I first started to pay attention to pop music: I remember seeing it on Saturday Morning Videos along with videos by Poison, Bell Biv Devoe, and Wilson Phillips.

― jaymc, Wednesday, 28 May 2008 22:08 (seventeen years ago)

bad boys 2: the search for more money? Is that really the full title?
I enjoyed it, I just didn't feel it had the same humour the first one did. The buddy-buddy format still flowed really well and Martin Lawrence was great but Will Smith's character where in the first Bad Boys was charmingly arrogant was just a full blown arse in the second one. Still really funny.
Shake Ya Tailfeather is a hot ass mess of a song. I refuse to co-sign on that. Nelly needs to be removed from the world quite quickly. Video was fun though.

― VeronaInTheClub, Thursday, 29 May 2008 01:20 (seventeen years ago)

http://youtube.com/watch?v=_FKgKpkVrxw

― xhuxk, Thursday, 29 May 2008 01:50 (seventeen years ago)

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