Belle and Sebastian: CorD??

That said, I find most insults directed at them here very entertaining. Every band deserves to be splattered at least once in a while. And nothing's more annoying than insecure possessive fanboys & girls who can't take it, which B&S seem to have a lot of.

They really, really, really need to stop writing self-referential bullroar like "Chickfactor" and "Family Tree", but other than that for me they're tres classique.

[chzza extends a giant finger across three states, where it enters the building Ned works in and pokes him in the nose]

Just in case you missed the reference ;-)

It's occurred to me that making B&S cry wouldn't be all that hard. Probably saying "Hello," to them, then walking away and chuckling would do the trick.

Oh, and they are mostly very nice people. Which may or may not be important, but perhaps it's worth stating.

B&S Peel Session 2001: astonishing dud, so bad at times that it feels like an April Fool.

My problem with Isobel Campbell and Stevie Jackson songs is that neither of them is as talented at writing songs as Stuart Murdoch.

Don't like the music = fine (of course). All B&S songs are bedwetter's anthems = wrong.

In May 2000 B&S released the 45 'Legal Man'. As expected, it was something of a Breakthrough Hit - top 20 or so. There was some talk about selling out, other talk about lowering standards, more talk about how it was a shame that their biggest-selling 45 was so relatively poor.

In the subsequent 3+ years, B&S have released other 45s and eps - such as 'Jonathan David', 'I'm Waking Up To Us', and 'Step Into My Office Baby' (or was that not released? I don't know).

And it seems safe to assume that their fanbase has grown, not shrunk, in that period, even if one or two old-timers have left the fold.

So why have they not enjoyed any further Breakthrough Hits on the scale of 'Legal Man'? Their 45s seem to be about as successful now as they were in the days of 'Dog On Wheels'.

Surprisingly I also love a lot of the music on it.

I didn't know that it had sold well. Of course I don't mean that they should have multiple Breakthrough Hits - but that after the first BH they ought to have had other hits on a similar scale.

I think I cannot agree with Farrell that their fanbase has shrunk since 2000. I would guess that it has grown, even if it possibly more diffuse and less intense (?).

The fact or claim that B&S were past their peak in 2000 is not plainly relevant either - as I am assuming that 'commercial peak' might be very different from 'artistic peak, in a fan's opinion'.

There was less buzz around them with the release of the new album, I think, certainly in the mainstream media. They hadn't done anything particularly big or controversial, and their previous release was Storytelling, which was widely regarded as a bit of a disappointment.

A fan's opinion (as in fanatic, which B&S seem to attract in considerable numbers) is less than useless about chart position. Aggregate demi-fan/ordinary punter opinion, however, is exactly what we're measuring, and it has been in decline for a while (as William has just pointed out).

(from a Salon article on Elvis Costello: His most loyal fans will doughtily make a case for "Spike," or "Mighty Like a Rose," or "Brutal Youth." That is what one's most loyal fans are for)

(Also: my god that Avalanches mix of "I'm A Cuckoo" is sweet)

I still think Dom P's point is good. Especially as we are always told that you need lower sales to have a 45 hit nowadays.

I think N.'s view is needed here. I don't know quite why.

Now they're on Rough Trade, they've had good press and I think (might be wrong) the new album has sold well, but no, not 'Step Into My Office, Baby' - original EP buying fans have drifted away and anyway, it's on the album (the first time a single has also been an album track).

particularly, given that they're now issuing album tracks as singles. 'step into my office baby' was the first one i didn't buy - not because it was rubbish, but because i already had it, and had managed to get the b-sides from kazaa.

no, because i used to like the fact that they released singles that weren't just advertising fodder for the album, and i bought every one of their singles on that basis. i got a feeling from purchasing the eps that i couldn't possibly have got from a few cdr tracks.

'step into my office baby'... well, i just thought it wasn't even a good album track, and i've already got the b-sides (if i hadn't already got them, i might have bought it for them).

tell that to thin lizzy.
and one of the tracks off the album (i'm sure this has been mentioned before) sounds rather like the soundtrack to 'rupert the bear'. i see this as a good thing.

Hobart has a point with the internet too - cos a lot of B&S' best songs are unreleased stuff (as well as their penchant for doing covers live) they are probably one of the most popular file-shared bands.

This seems to back up my belief.

I'm glad this thread was revived today because I was reading the online diary earlier, so I'm in a B&S mood.

don't know if you're being flippant or not, and its just my personal view, but 'wrapped up in books'... (its also accused of sounding rather like cliff's 'out in the country but, given the choice between rupert and cliff (and at the risk of sounding insufferably twee) i'll take rupert any day).

'take' as in 'listen to', by the way.

They're the sort of fans who used to buy multiple formats on the DAY of release and now wait six months for things to turn up in the Fopp sale. This could partially account for the low chart placings.

-- hobart paving (elvistear...) (webmail), January 15th, 2004.

It sounds more like cliff really.

The new record is odd. Once I had it, I thought I liked it. Then, asked what on it I liked, I couldn't say, and seemed to like none of it. (c.96.) But now, I am still still listening to it. It seems somehow durable, or reliable. It seems to be something that I can return to, and stick on when I need it, or need something, which is quite often. It doesn't seem utterly exhausted. It sometimes surprises me with how much it impresses me ('Books', 'Anthony', the sudden leap into 'Caught In Love').

The Vicar says it's their best LP. I will not here concur. But maybe it is the best LP that they could have made at this point.

Why does Trevor Horn have Credibility having produced Simple Minds' Street Fighting Years LP (1989)? Or, does he not?

the hit list: 'the state I am in', 'expectations', 'I could be dreaming', 'my wandering days are over', 'mary jo', 'the stars of track & field', 'if you're feeling sinister', 'judy & the dream of horses', 'it could've been a brilliant career', 'sleep the clock around' (oh good god yes!), 'ease your feet in the sea', 'simple things' (my favourite), 'the rollercoaster ride', 'modern rock song', 'slow graffiti', 'a century of fakers', 'le pastie de la bourgeoisie', 'dog on wheels', 'string bean jean', 'belle & sebastien', 'lazy line painter jane', 'photo jenny', 'the loneliness of the middle distance runner'.

http://i39.tinypic.com/24g7rm0.jpg

New album out in 2 weeks! Cover art above.

The Belle & Sebastian Sing Jonathan David EP's cover is a parody of some 50s or 60s album cover, but I don't know which one? Does anyone know?

I mean, I saw it in a record booth a few years ago, but didn't really take note.

Ned Raggett, your time to shine is NOW:

http://pitchfork.com/news/40296-belle-and-sebastian-write-a-song-aboutyou

hmmm...

United States residents only.

I suppose fair's fair, they've already written about everyone in Scotland already.

all the teenage girls anyway.

I'm listening to the Sinister album right now, an album I used to like very very much, and discovering that it's mostly shit. I've been more and more uncharitable towards B&S over the years, but I think today is the day I finally make my break.

I have come to similar conclusions about many mid 90s albums I used to love but Sinister isn't one of them. There are a couple dud tracks though (Fox in the Snow, Boy Done Wrong, maybe Mayfly).

huh, really? my wife was playing sinister last week and I thought it still sounded gorgeous. whole LP is high quality to my ears, w/ very little filler. maybe because murdoch is the lead on all of them?

Maybe I'm just in a mood.

Nah, it's half-good. I think they could have drawn from the material from a few of those early EPs (and likewise edited some of the mediocrity) to make a follow-up as strong as Tigermilk.

I still think Tigermilk, Sinister, and the EPs are untouchable. It's still amazing to me how much mystique they cultivated (and conjured)!

the problem of Sinister is all the twee imitators that came after and ruined it

Got me thinking that I can't remember the last time I put anything from this band on, though I've never had a problem with them.

B&S have been ruined for me by living in the same town as them

band certainly got progressively worse through the years but sinister stands as an absolute classic, one of the best albums of the 90's

I can still get with some of Dear Catastrophe Waitress and The Life Pursuit, but outside of the earliest eps, I believe I've outgrown the 90s stuff.

crazy talk

Probably prefer Tigermilk slightly at this point but see nothing wrong with Sinister.

Speaking of EPs, Push Barman To Open Old Wounds is gone off the Spotify because of you.

With Belle & Sebastien it's the same situation as Suede for me. First three albums are solid, one excellent B-sides compilation and then the odd decent song but not much else. First half of Sinister is the best thing they've ever done.

I really hate The Life Pursuit, I'm still shocked how popular it was. I remember when they came back with Funny Little Frog, that's excatly when I knew it was over for me.

B&S have been ruined for me by living in the same town as them

― 'Separate Lives', by Phil Collins & Marilyn Manson (PaulTMA), Tuesday, 20 November 2012 18:05 (4 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

you see the guy, he is wearing a hat

I think Sinister is untouchable. I also think there is far more classic than dud in their discography. Fold Your Hands is good but lesser than what came before it; Storytelling was bad. Then they returned to excellence with DCW, and Life Pursuit is great too. Most recent album on the other hand is a disappointment.

glasgow has been ruined for me by living in the same town as B&S

sinister is alright. boy with the arab strap is still glorious... like a lost pastoral twee 70s Donavan album

yeah life pursuit is unlistenable to me. don't get it. waitress is great though, my second favorite after sinister.

funny little frog holds up fairly well, i think, even if it is a little awkward singing the thinly veiled love song to god lyrics. not many bands have pulled off that slick soul throwback sound as well in recent times, imo. it's a bit like comet gain's 'hideaway' as far as those sort of songs/bands go. other than that, i've heard dribs and drabs i've liked but don't as much anymore, and was put off slightly by some overly precious bookish young female fans for years. then again i've meant to explore on the basis of some rockist contempt cast their way, and that a few friends have recommended some earlier EPs/albums. i think i'll probably not make as much of an effort with them as i once would have, but might find a few delights here and there.

i agree with the anti-life pursuit people. the early albums, up to and including dear catastrophe waitress, and all the stuff on push barman to open old wounds, are where it's at. the venom directed at this band in the early comments is lol. it's fun sometimes to read stuff that is the exact opposite of my opinion.

they actually prefer the term pro-abortion

whenever i happen to hear belle and sebastian i get fuzzy feelings about home, and then i kick some puppies to negate that attack of tweeness.

Gotta stay tuff

New b-sides comp coming soon:
http://www.belleandsebastian.com/news/the-third-eye-centre

Excited!

Push Barman to Open Old Wounds has gone off the Spotify because of you, new b-side comp.

Wait, maybe not.

No, this new one doesn't repeat anything from Barman.

Can't decide if I like the "Cover's Blown" remix. I like the ricketyness of the original, but the new one gives it a nice synth-pop groove.

i love The Life Pursuit but seem to be the only one. i sounds like a greatest hits album to me. i was even able to tell Stuart Murdoch how much i enjoyed that album when i met him in Los Angeles a few years back. he came into my work and i had to take care of a few things for him.

I'm a fan of that one.

I too like The Like Pursuit and can't totally understand why people don't like it therefore I wouldn't be able to come up with any arguments to defend it even if I were inclined to do so /late_posting_style

really think the "if i could make sense of it all" bit in "Act of the Apostle Pt 1" is one of the best things they've ever done.

I too stan for The Life Pursuit (and to a lesser extent for Write About Love).

I stan for God Save the Girl, which I think I like more than any of those.

er, God Help the Girl

I probably didn't pay enough attention to it when it came out but the songs were good in the movie.

I like The Life Pursuit a lot, though it still ranks around my fifth favorite proper full length.

Push Barman is where it's at, though, those first 3 EPs are my favourite "album"

Would honestly rank The Life Pursuit as being on par with If You're Feeling Sinister and better than every other B&S record aside from that one. Even Tigermilk and The Boy With The Arab Strap have their dull spots, which I don't think LP does.

The Life Pursuit is definitely one of their most consistently good albums, consistency being a quality sorely lacking in most of their albums after for the first 2. I don't think it really touches If You're Feeling Sinister or Tigermilk, and a few of their other albums maybe have some higher highs in the midst of a bunch of really dull tracks by second or third tier band members.

The life pursuit seems louder and slicker than the older stuff -- more self-assured. While the melodies are catchy I don't think the overall feel of the album suits them at all. Granted, I haven't listened to it for a while, but what I remember is that it lacked the shy, depressive, vaguely bitter yet always empathetic quality I value so much in Murdoch's songwriting.

I need to stop praising shy depressive artists, jeez. I like the rolling stones too!

yes, it definitely lacks the tentative, wispy quality of their earlier albums.

A good part of my reaction to LP might have been that I had gotten sick of that very "tentative, wispy quality" by then, to the point that I even sat Dear Catastrophe Waitress out (though I understand that it's probably more Life Pursuit than anything that came before it).

As a total B+S whore, Dear Catastrophe was GREAT at first, but it's lustre wore out very quickly. Life Pursuit was more of the same.

Write About Love, on the other hand, has fucking jams for days. Best lyrics on a B+S record in at least a decade at that point.

i need to spend more time with write about love. i'm listening to the life pursuit again and it is (a bit) better than i remember. act of the apostle I is pretty awesome. sukie in the graveyard seems like a cheap knock-off of a belle and sebastian song. it sounds good on first listen but ultimately it is a hollow song, i think, and in general the songs just don't feel as personal as those on tigermilk and sinister and even most of the things after that.

funny little frog is good.

Life Pursuit, ultimately, has 'Another Sunny Day' so. . . I can't. . . y'know, say anything all that bad about it.

Write About Love is just fucking ace. Sure, it blows its load in the first half, but what a first half! Fucking 'I Didn't See it Coming' is just about the best B+S opener ever ('That State I'm In' maybe ties it). 'Come On Sister' just absolutely kills me. Even now. I think the whole album is about fantasizing and yearning for what is not. I was in a failing marriage (which I left about ninety days later) when it came out, so I was just sitting there on the bus listening to that shit going to and from work every day thinking, "Yeah, all of this."

Touring North America with Yo La Tengo now. Heard favorable comments re their Friday show at Merriweather Post Pavilion between DC and Baltimore

id never heard the richard x i didnt see it coming - luv it

anyone who doesn't like this band is an asshole. especially the first few albums and the push barman comp.

i've spent the day relistening to them after i got annoyed at someone for using them as a punchline, underling their hatred of all things "twee". this band is not pompaloose. this band is a classic band. what i kept thinking listening to them today is that their career would have been impossible if "eleanor rigby" was never recorded. i mean, maybe not, but most of belle and sebastian's best songs seem like their following a path for pop songwriting that song pointed toward but that the beatles never really pursued. it's to belle and sebastian's credit, though, that they don't demand their listeners "look at all the lonely people." they just sing about 'em.

they've completely sucked since the life pursuit though.

I heard the "Cover's Blown" remix off the internet juke in a near-empty bar last night before last call. Sounded great.

how many men, at a rough estimate, have pretended to like B&S more than they actually do to impress a girl?

i got annoyed at someone for using them as a punchline, underling their hatred of all things "twee". this band is not pompaloose. this band is a classic band.

Totally. I hate twee as much as anyone. It's always about being sort of charmingly rubbish, and on those first B&S records you get the opposite - it's really strikingly ambitious songwriting even if the musicians aren't so proficient. I don't listen to them much any more - partly cos the records are too familiar now and partly cos I live in Glasgow these days and it'd feel corny - but they did great stuff.

I was at a dinner party last year with Stuart Murdoch and his then very pregnant wife except I didn't realise it was him until I got home. He was pretty quiet and had terrible trousers. I just thought, "Why is this guy dressed like a priest?"

Hating when B&S get tarred with the twee brush thirded.

I think I must have listened to these more than any other band between the ages of 25 and 26. I also don't listen to them much any more because, well, it's an aesthetic that's as easy to leave behind as to fall in love with, but I still think Catastrophe and Sinister are two of the most perfect pop albums, and the singles on Barman too..

I never listened to Write About Love beyond a cursory listen. Worth it?

it is not. their whole aesthetic was a delicate balancing act and i think the magic has evaporated, sadly.

i don't know when the song "suicide girl" was recorded but it revolted me, trying to pull off that old lurid-subject-matter-filtered-through-shyness-sensitivity-and-longing thing but doing it in a way that was overly glossy and by the numbers. after that song i'm not interested in any of their new material.

Yeah with these kinds of bands what starts out as charming and sensitive can quickly turn into 'Oh god, will you stop self-analysing and just pull yourself together now please, you've been doing this for years now!'. See also of Montreal and Morrissey.

Write About Love is about half great, half B&S-by-numbers.

I almost never listen to B&S on my own, but they're one of my wife's favorite bands. They have a handful of truly brilliant, classic songs that contain a remarkably human pathos that I find very poignant... but they unfortunately ran the formula into the ground, to a point where every song started sounding like a retread of something they'd previously done, only worse. If they had stopped after Sinister, we'd probably be talking about them in a different way than we are now.

I agree but I think it's shitty. Like, we want bands to maintain this aura of specialness and resent them when the cracks in the creative process start to peek through on imperfect works.

If bands didnt think their personal beands were so fragile maybe theyd experiment more

*brands

Bit of a ramble this post... (had a couple of pints at lunch for a leaving do). But this is a really good and interesting topic, Treeship. I think with B&S they started doing this on Catastrophe Waitress and it makes for a really fascinating, eclectic record. A lot of acts who I'd consider favourites from the past (particularly the nineties) e.g. the Boo Radleys, Aphex Twin, Outkast, Blur and many others would make a point of toying with the idea of genre and make these real chocolate box-y records that crammed stylistic ideas into an album. In the last decade or so I've come to champion acts who have a style and hone and shape it over the course of several albums. But as you say, it's a brittle thing. If a band ends up slacking, spending too much time between albums and then releasing something that's maybe just a more refined version of their last record, it can seriously backfire. Like, I like Katy B but I don't have a big inclination to listen to the new album because for me it's a refinement of something I was really excited about a couple of years ago but which I'm not sure I'm quite ready to revisit and accept...

Yeah, there's a topic in there, acts who broaden vs. acts who refine (vs. acts who tried both approaches)

It's always about being sort of charmingly rubbish, and on those first B&S records you get the opposite

Someone never saw early B&S live, then...

... even so they were the Mahavishnu Orchestra compared to the Pastels.

i like the outrageously mean shit stuart sings in the first verse of "a century of fakers". i think it shows "self-awareness" in that they had to know that those lyrics sung in that voice is comedy gold. it's also fitting with the overall theme of the song because it's impossible to become wrapped up in questions of "authenticity" without becoming an unbearable dick, lashing out at the hypocrisy of everyone around you. the troubling thing, though, is that these kids aren't wrong to demand a more meaningful life for themselves than is possible under current social conditions. holden caulfield isn't wrong. just annoying, and maybe that just because he reminds us of our own dissatisfaction. this is the sort of thing stuart murdoch understands.

Through Boy With The Arab Strap this band is completely Classic. I wish girls I dated pretended to like this band more! I think losing Stuart David and Isobel Campbell really hurt this band. They never had the best songs but were part of a really strong identity the band possessed. Collecting those early EPs on import, the little stories about the band and the characters, etc. This band just had such a perfect identity to latch on to and a lot of it got lost when they became more "professional."

eh. how long do you think they could have gone on the way they were going though? i don't blame belle and sebastian for sucking now. nothing lasts forever.

also, their best song was after arab strap.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXAbar6PzRA

I guess but I feel like after Isobel and Stuart. D. left they could have given up the name. Everything post Fold Your Hands sounds like Stuart M. deliberately took the band in a very different direction.

I feel that vibe was tied to a certain time/age in my life and was glad they shifted away even if the results weren't as resonant for me. But everyone moves on. They've still got some killer tunes here and there. Act of The Apostle Pt 1 is one of the best things they've ever done. Last album had some really good stuff too.

listening to if you're feeling sinister when it came out and collecting those three perfect EPs as they appeared as imports was a top thrill. fuck the haters. no one anymore much discusses the mystique they had coming off of the impossible-to-get-a-copy of tigermilk. the only other 90s band i can think of that rivals that origin story is pavement, whose early drag city EPs set the table for the glorious slanted & enchanted

Tigermilk and If You're Feeling Sinister are great. I didn't really find myself connecting with much they did after that, but I love those two albums.

Sinister is way better than Tigermilk

I think they're both pretty good, with the edge given to Tigermilk. The fact that Stuart could crank out both records (and a couple EPs) in <6 months is pretty insane to think about.

Especially since he was coming off ten years or whatever when chronic fatigue syndrome left him unable to function at all

But yeah, those two albums considered together are an almost miraculous debut.

I think I must have listened to these more than any other band between the ages of 25 and 26.
ah, totally!
that was a longish time ago...

There's Too Much Love really is a stellar song, I always forget because that album came at the waning edge of my b&s fanaticism.

it feels like a total springtime dance-outside song.

That album has some really blegh songs but the high points are world class. Also, the cover and album title are the best

Sleep the Clock Around came on today as I was walking home and I forgot how beautiful it is. Also, I like Tigermilk quite a lot.

they had that song "funny little frog" or w/e in 2006? good times

oh i bought a 33 & 1/3 book about them for someone.

"sleep the clock around" is so epic. imo they peaked with boy with the arab strap (the album). the production is magnificent, it sounds so deep. and there are not nearly as many cringy lyrical moments. i wonder what stuart murdoch's favorite album of theirs is because that one is the one where i felt there were most successful doing what they were trying to do.

Dirty dream #2 is also really incredible

yeah i love hearing that shock of motownesqueness, especially after the (fabulous) trip hop track. i think the first side of the album is way better though. but "rollercoaster ride" is what got me into B&S, it has this deep pastoral trip going on.. i still can't quite pin down why it's so enchanting.

man dear catastrophe waitress is prob my favorite b&s record at this point. though i agree write about love wasn't all there

First three albums still sound great to me. Tigermilk has replaced Sinister as my favourite now but it's close between those two. Never need to hear the title track of Arab Strap again (thanks to watching the TV show Teachers and going to way too many indie clubs when I was younger) but I that's a pretty solid album.

The EP collection has a lot of their best songs on it. After that there's really not many songs I like by them. Scooby Driver, Stay Loose, Your Cover's Blown, Don't Leave the Light on Baby, I Fought in a War and Wrapped up in Books are all up there with the quality of some of their early stuff.

I used to really like If you're feeling sinister and Boy with the Arab strap. Now I just like a handful of songs.

Stuart's Lou Reed side is much more obvious to me now for some reason.

But I was obsessed with those two albums at one point.

re: Write About Love, I'll vouch for the title track, the opener, "I Want the World to Stop" and "Sunday's Pretty Icons."

fold your hands, such a huge drop in quality. it started with the modern rock song ep. Dear Catastrophe Waitress was super refreshing, they made fun of themselves a lot.

"beyond the sunrise" is great, though, wondeful vocal grain

of course a B&S thread on ILX in 2014 will have someone repping for "Beyond the Sunrise". Of course.

it was the only good song on that sack of shit album when it came out, and it's the only good song on that sack of shit album now, i'll fuck you up

you probably like the stranglers

or xtc

or the finn bros

fold your hands has a bunch of solid tunes, the one you mentioned is more like a noble failure

the model. now THERE's a catchy belle and sebastian tune.

#tune

solid tunes like family tree and the song about throwing a glass at a woman

messin' wit u brim, just thinking back to the old #sinister days

though that song is kind of rubbish

this is not fun

it's not as if they're paying you

i mean, the b&s is not bringing me fun at this moment, i had to switch to fania all stars

what are you listening to, treeship?

i'm listening to the song redlights by salem

I remember sitting in class back in high school, reading a Time or Newsweek and seeing this one page article on "The Underground Phenomenon of Belle and Sebastian" or some such wherein the writer interviewed some fans who stood in line outside the NYC Tower Records on release day for FYACYLLAP (this also allowed the writer to compare & contrast this bookish lot w/the throngs of teeny boppers who'd camped out at the same locale a couple weeks prior for Nsync's No Strings Attached). As hard as it is to believe now, that was B & S's 'big event' release here.

it was FISHYCLAP iirc

fyhcywlap disappointed me big time. last thing they did i really got into was the "legal man" EP. keep thinking some day i'll come around and realize how wrong i've been about what they've done since then

Guys, Dear Catastrophe Waitress is one of their best albums. Don't sleep on it. I prefer it to Boy With The Arab Strap (which like Fold Your Hands Child represents to me about 4-5 great songs and a lot of filler).

xposting Yeah, that initial ramp-up was pretty near-Pavement samizdat-style awesome. Just barely the cusp of the broader internet age, murmurs of B&S, getting a cassette of "Tigermilk" from Pam at Chickfactor, getting the EPs/BBC sessions (which were stuck on the other side of the cassette), getting a promo of "Sinister" when the band was briefly signed to the Enclave, happy they went with Matador, because that meant the stuff would be easier to get, super excited to see their first Chicago show, which was so pin-drop silent between songs my friend who showed up late just assumed it was canceled because the band didn't show. He did get me a poster signed by the entire (then) line-up, though.

After that, law of diminishing returns. "Dear Catastrophe Waitress" was no good, though it and its sequels all have their high spots and the band seemed to grow a more obvious sense of humor and actual stage presence. My sister saw a show in Philly where Stuart came out in boxing gloves and shorts to the "Rocky" theme.

Dear Catastrophe Waitress is good. Lord Anthony passes the lachrymal test. Really, the turning point was The Life Pursuit; that's when they started sounding like a major label ripoff of themselves.

I think I love FYHC. I keep listening to it hoping to see why it sucks, and there are definite low points, but the high points are very enjoyable.

it doesn't suck. but there used to be no low points, and then all of a sudden they sound a little tired, the ones about to abandon ship, at least, tony doogan, stuart david, and isobel campbell

I think I'm confusing Fold Your Hands and Dear Catastrophe. The latter has some songs I like a lot, but the former ... nothing rings a bell(e). I like a lot of "The Life Pursuit." "Write About Love ..." ... once again, none of the titles ring a bell.

it doesn't suck. but there used to be no low points, and then all of a sudden they sound a little tired, the ones about to abandon ship, at least, tony doogan, stuart david, and isobel campbell

― reggie (qualmsley)

I always thought I really disliked FYHC but then a year or two back I listened to it and realized that, yes, there are a couple of low points, but overall it's quite good. Those low points ("Beyond the Sunrise," "Nice Day for a Sulk") really drag it down. There are three classics on that album - "I Fought in a War," "The Model," "Don't Leave the Light On". The rest is quite good, though generally not as great as the three previous albums.

i fought in a war and the model are as good as any other one-two b&s opening. i kind of don't want to hold the low points against this album, because it features some of the most joyful-sounding bitter songs ever recorded.

I really like "Women's Realm" and "Family Tree," as well.

family tree is very pretty.

i think i'm going to get this on vinyl so i can frame the cover

"The Wrong Girl" is one of the best Stevie songs.

"Don't Leave the Light On" was one of the high points from the show they played with the LA Philharmonic.

i think i'm going to get this on vinyl so i can frame the cover
― très hip (Treeship), Thursday, April 3, 2014 5:56 AM (8 hours ago)

Or you could hit up your GP's office and get the next best thing...

http://i.imgur.com/MtxX4tQ.jpg

Belle and Sebastian Talk About Chlamydia.

Fold Your Hands has my favorite B&S album cover. I don't think it's any worse than Arab Strap, although both are a step down from the first two albums. I still think letting the other band members have their own songs was a big mistake.

I don't think it's any worse

and by this I meant the album itself, not the cover

I still think letting the other band members have their own songs was a big mistake.

When isn't it?

true, it's just very glaring in the case of B&S because they made 2 classic albums that were 100% Stuart Murdoch, and the subsequent drop in quality is hard to deny.

When isn't it?

I like the Spiral Stairs songs

The Beatles

Deerhunter

Yo La Tengo

Those examples were never the product of one writer. Maybe Deerhunter? B&S was more like Fogerty letting the others at CCR.

I remember a review when Fold Your Hands came out that was like "You've got a guy with the voice of a nightingale in your band - why are you letting these pigeons squawk?" or something like that.

it was FISHYCLAP iirc

Also, Beyond the Sunrise's real title was The Clunker.

listen to what other people say cuz things are going wrong your own way

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4de-RHHLCBA

in a town so small there is no escaping you

true story when i saw them in 2002 in atlanta i was given the mic to say that bit but realised I had never actually paid attention/made out the words so i just mumbled "town" something something "you"

that song is one of the best songs ever recorded.

seriously, when i think of belle and sebastian's first 3.5 albums the only thing i feel is gratitude, like what harold bloom describes feeling when contemplating the existence of shakespeare.

Just watched that Pitchfork doc, and it was both lovely and informative but it was also pretty much the most twee thing ever.

it would be a bit disappointing if it weren't

What, couldn't hear you, too busy skipping down the street blowing bubbles on the way to feed the ducks at the park.

now you're doing it right!

Should probably be taking a bicycle, imho. With some books in the basket to read in the shade after the ducks are fed.

don't forget the big cuddly lion

You mean Audrey Hepburn, my imaginary lion? She's there, playing hopscotch.

http://www.fabaudrey.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/BATscreen617.jpg
Twiddly-dum, twiddly-dee, feeding ducks at the park ...

God Help the Girl (the film) opens in Toronto tom'w... apparently it ran somewhere in the US in September, but not NYC.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2141751/releaseinfo?ref_=tt_ql_dt_2

well apparently it did come and go in one week here...

http://us.godhelpthegirl.com/

yeah, it had a short run in Austin, didn't get to see it

I saw it many months ago, but I was charmed. When I saw it, it felt a little long and rambly, but there were enough good musical numbers and fun moments that I enjoyed it as a whole. It often does feel like a Belle & Sebastian cover come to life.

I would never want to see God Help the Girl but people I know who have seen it - including personal friends of members of B&S - say it's terrible and that this guy's ongoing fetishisation of a certain kind of slight young girl is getting tedious. In that sense it probably does feel like a Belle & Sebastian cover come to life.

I like B&S, but a film version of one of their album covers does sound horrifying.

Haven't seen the film but I listened to the soundtrack and it made the Sunshine on Leith soundtrack seem edgy as fuck.

A number of problems with the film but overall I think it's pretty decent.

So, after being essentially lukewarm on Girls in Peacetime, I picked up the three recent EPs in piecemeal and am just now this evening getting around to them.

Four songs in and it definitely feels like a comfortably strong affair so far. We'll see.

In the the new print issue of Rolling Stone, there's a review of the new one paired with a thumbnail of the Girls In Peacetime... cover.

Ha. Oh well.

I like these new songs. Nothing new or all that exciting by any means, but some strong melodic ideas for sure.

a few of the new songs came up in my release radar, all sounded good

but basically what I'm always kind of hoping for, and what will never happen, is that they start making imitations of If You're Feeling Sinister

I went to see Rich Hall last night and he told an anecdote about the drummer from B&S getting left behind on tour at a Wal-Mart in Montana or somewhere in his pyjamas.

Was biggish news at the time, made the national press

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-40960413

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2017/aug/16/belle-and-sebastian-accidentally-leave-drummer-in-pyjamas-in-walmart

NME as well, but that is 50% adverts so I won't link it

Ha! Hall's - presumably invented - punchline was that their manager called someone at the WalMart and asked if there was a guy wandering around in his pyjamas and they replied 'You'll have to give us more information than that...'

is anybody planniung to go on this cruise in the mediterranean with them? a fun idea but pretty expensive (4 days starting from above 1000 quid onwards)...

Little bit of history up for auction:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/332822766068?_trksid=p2471758.m4704

"Previously loved by...Stuart Murdoch"

https://i.imgur.com/4Yc30dm.jpg

14,100 quid. People are crazy and too rich at the same time!

I just watched the Hal Hartley movie Trust for the first time in ages (since “back in the day”), and noticed a few lines of dialogue that seem to be paraphrased in the lyrics of Tigermilk. Is that a known thing, or maybe just a coincidence? I don’t know a lot about B&S, but I know the main guy makes films and stuff; seems like he may have been into indie film in the early ’90s...

I really miss Adrienne Shelly

Could be. There’s another band that I always thought reminded me of Hal Hartley, My Favorite, although I never found any explicit connection. But I do find that Stuart Murdoch was a fan of theirs and asked them to open at least one Belle & Sebastian show.

I used to see her walking around downtown and when that terrible thing happened I moronically thought “she did look sad the last time I saw her.” Then soon after I realized when I saw Nathan Lane walking around the same neighborhood he could look really sad or animated on different days depending on whether he was on or off.

As to the other point again, I want to say that there would appear to be a natural affinity of a particular brand of far-flung artsy Francophilia between the various artists mentioned.

The Hartley thing is 'a known thing' in the sense that an ILXor or two has raised it in the past, at least. And...that's all I can contribute here. :)

Oh yeah, thanks, just found something here: Allusions to CULT FILMS in Rock