Weezer's "Say It Isn't So" vs Hall & Oates' "Say It Isn't So"

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Both groups were led by smug posturing control freaks; both made great singles. Both songs showcase whiny males who can't accept reality. But I'll take the latter, by, like, a fucking country mile. The track's synthetic sheen reenforces Daryl Hall's insistence on returning to the fantasy that he and his lover will stay together.

It also shows the virtues of state-of-the-art 80s production: awesome synths, big drums. John Oates' harmonies alone justify his existence, and put to rest the myth that he was just a mustache and mullet.

Oh, and I love how Hall's voice ascends the scale when he sings the "You move so we-l-l-l-l-l!" line

Case closed.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 23:32 (twenty years ago)

Say It AIN'T So

― The Brainwasher (Twilight), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 23:34 (twenty years ago)

While I do indeed like a lot of H&O (as we hipster hepcats call them), this was never a fave track of mine ("Family Man" shits all over it from a great, runny, brown, splattery height). I'm not a big Weezer fan (by any stretch), but "Say It Ain't So" is a fine single.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 23:42 (twenty years ago)

i only wish the line i misheard from the weezer single actually was "football on telly/wrestle in jelly". in which case it'd win.

― matth, Wednesday, 6 April 2005 23:44 (twenty years ago)

Hall & Oates by about 75 miles

― Matos-Webster Dictionary (M Matos), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 23:45 (twenty years ago)

OTM on "Family Man," Alex, which never gets much love. The guitars are more insane than anything that hit the Billboard Top 10 at the time.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 23:50 (twenty years ago)

Hall & Oates by about 75 light-years.

― Ferlin Husky (noodle vague), Wednesday, 6 April 2005 23:52 (twenty years ago)

hall and oates

― Susan Douglas (Susan Douglas), Thursday, 7 April 2005 00:21 (twenty years ago)

H2O!!!!!!!!!!

― Eisbär (llamasfur), Thursday, 7 April 2005 00:38 (twenty years ago)

http://www.iwc.pair.com/hall_oates/images/bigbamtour.jpg

― Eisbär (llamasfur), Thursday, 7 April 2005 00:52 (twenty years ago)

http://www.iwc.pair.com/hall_oates/images/aboutH&O_front.jpg

― Eisbär (llamasfur), Thursday, 7 April 2005 00:53 (twenty years ago)

I'd put "Say it Ain't So" in my top ten Rock singles of the '90s. The best thing I can say about "Say it Isn't So" is that I wouldn't change the channel if it came on the radio.

― Jeff Reguilon (Talent Explosion), Thursday, 7 April 2005 01:44 (twenty years ago)

"say it isn't so" by a mile, purely on hall selling it towards the end.

― j blount (papa la bas), Thursday, 7 April 2005 01:48 (twenty years ago)

The Outfield "Say It Isn't So" v. Hall & Oates' "Say It Isn't So."

― mike a, Thursday, 7 April 2005 01:53 (twenty years ago)

Are you people out of your fucking minds? I hoped that the hipster world's brief foray into Hall and Oates apreciation ended that stupid week where Ben Gibbard made that dumb list on Pitchfork, then Pitchfork had that dumb news feature about their tour. It's not like the Weezer "Say It Ain't So" falls under their dubious ironic period, it's just great.

― Roadkill Bingo (Roadkill Bingo), Thursday, 7 April 2005 03:11 (twenty years ago)

the dub mix of hall & oates's "say it isn't so" is awesome. i've been a h2o fan since i was a kid, who gives a fuck about some dumb dude i never heard of with a list on pitchfork?

― hstencil (hstencil), Thursday, 7 April 2005 03:13 (twenty years ago)

I hoped that the hipster world's brief foray into Hall and Oates apreciation ended that stupid week where Ben Gibbard made that dumb list on Pitchfork, then Pitchfork had that dumb news feature about their tour.

What about those of us who've always liked H&O back into our early days? I remember listening to Casey Kasem on Sunday afternoons just waiting to hear "Private Eyes" with my finger readied to press the record button.

― Johnny Fever (johnny fever), Thursday, 7 April 2005 03:26 (twenty years ago)

Are you people out of your fucking minds?

New here?

― jaymc (jaymc), Thursday, 7 April 2005 04:08 (twenty years ago)

pitchfork's H&O love pales in comparison! hail ILx!

― irrigation can save your people (irrigation can save your peopl), Thursday, 7 April 2005 04:22 (twenty years ago)

Weezer

― Schwip Schwap (schwip schwap), Thursday, 7 April 2005 05:07 (twenty years ago)

Cos I love its petulance and I've always thought it to be about alcoholism (it prob is, but I pay so little attention to lyrics it could be about toestubbing).

― Schwip Schwap (schwip schwap), Thursday, 7 April 2005 05:08 (twenty years ago)

It's a close call and a good comparison. Even their videos are similar: the band stands around and "plays" the song while the camera hovers from member to member, in between long shots of the lead singer. The biggest difference is that Hall and Oates has a sax player wearing a mink coat.

― earinfections (Nick Twisp), Thursday, 7 April 2005 05:18 (twenty years ago)

when i was like 9 i made my dad drive 4 hours through a blinding blizzard so i could see hall and oates play at the baltimore colliseum. the NICest thing about this board is finding out that people who really take music seriously, people who are most positioned to be snobby actually aren't p'shawing something just b/c its not hip, or b/c its very accessible etc. re: indie crowd/pitchfork, its routine that they touch on good stuff now and then, maybe their interest is shallow and of the moment, but doesn't mean the music is the like that.

― Susan Douglas (Susan Douglas), Thursday, 7 April 2005 05:59 (twenty years ago)

I've heard "Say It Ain't So" over a hundred times in the last year or 2, and I might have heard "Say It Isn't So" once in the last five years. So this may be the reason the Hall & Oates song sounds fresher to me right now, and if right now both mp3s were by themselves in a winamp playlist, I would absolutely doubleclick on H&O.

― billstevejim, Thursday, 7 April 2005 06:13 (twenty years ago)

I'd give it H20, but by a very small margin. Both bands are among my all-time favorites, and "Say It Ain't So" is one of my favorite karaoke songs. A very tough call.

― John Fredland (jfredland), Thursday, 7 April 2005 09:30 (twenty years ago)

At my local record store last night, I chose a mint condition "Big Bam Boom" on vinyl over Deerhoof. The indie boy clerk looked like I'd told him I screwed his mother. Hater!

OTM John on its karaoke greatness.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 7 April 2005 10:21 (twenty years ago)

The Outfield "Say It Isn't So" v. Hall & Oates' "Say It Isn't So."
-- mike a (mik...), April 7th, 2005.

god help me, I still love that first record. Might've been my first cassette.

― Will(iam), Thursday, 7 April 2005 11:40 (twenty years ago)

Big Bang Boom was one of my first tapes! It's not that good, tho! I like both songs! Gimme Hall & Oates!

― David R. (popshots75`), Thursday, 7 April 2005 12:31 (twenty years ago)

I still don't understand why people lose their shit over Weezer.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Thursday, 7 April 2005 13:06 (twenty years ago)

They're both good, but I gotta go with H2O. Delayed chorus gratification!

― Rick Massimo (Rick Massimo), Thursday, 7 April 2005 13:13 (twenty years ago)

I should have clarified: Outfield Play Deep

― Will(iam), Thursday, 7 April 2005 13:21 (twenty years ago)

My earlier post wasn't really meant to be an indictment of Hall and Oates. I was surprised at how thoroughly they've dominated this thread. People get irritated about Weezer for a lot of valid reasons, I just figured "Say It Ain't So" was one of their songs that would appeal to anyone without having to rely on some of the hokier aspects of their appeal.

― Roadkill Bingo (Roadkill Bingo), Thursday, 7 April 2005 14:30 (twenty years ago)

http://www.lyred.com/covers/hall_&_oates_-_ooh_yeah!.jpg

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 7 April 2005 14:57 (twenty years ago)

How can you resist?!

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 7 April 2005 14:57 (twenty years ago)

it's boston v. philadelphia, so OF COURSE hall & oates (representin' TSOP) will beat weezer's whiny white-emo beantown asses like DUH.

hall and oates have also aged well (looks-wise) -- oates STILL looks like john oates, and darryl hall looks like yer coolest uncle!

― Eisbär (llamasfur), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:06 (twenty years ago)

A Hall & Oates cover of "Say It Ain't So" is key. Cut to Oates on "awakens latent feelings."

― miccio (miccio), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:08 (twenty years ago)

I haven't heard the the H'n'O song but "SIAS" is actually one of the Weezer singles I'm less enthusiastic about.

― miccio (miccio), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:09 (twenty years ago)

would weezer ever have the BALLS to open their most commercial rekkid w/ something as dischordantly left-field as "dance on yer knees"? I THINK NOT, HOTTENTOT.

― Eisbär (llamasfur), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:11 (twenty years ago)

I heard "Dance..." for the first time really drunk last night; not even New Order came up with an electro-bass as insistent and crunktastic.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:15 (twenty years ago)

I'm always amazed that Hall'n'Oates has all these singles people are ape for and its fucking "Private Eyes" and "Maneater" I hear everywhere.

― miccio (miccio), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:16 (twenty years ago)

Hall & Oates and Steely Dan are/were pretty much the for-yer-dad groups that really weren't for your dad at all.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:19 (twenty years ago)

Heheheh. (And I say this partially because my dad was a big fan of Hall and Oates and we actually saw them in concert together when I was 13.)

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:21 (twenty years ago)

I'm always amazed that Hall'n'Oates has all these singles people are ape for and its fucking "Private Eyes" and "Maneater" I hear everywhere.

what's wrong w/ "private eyes"?!?

("maneater" is musically fine, but lyrically kinda dumb.)

and now many of us are old enough to be dads ourselves, so = h&o AND steely dan DOES = DADROCK yay!!

― Eisbär (llamasfur), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:22 (twenty years ago)

I'm surprised you live in Pennsylvania and your local oldies stations don't play the big hits, Miccio. "I'm in a Philly Mood" or something.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:23 (twenty years ago)

Eisbar hear one 'Tired of Sex', fuck

― Schwip Schwap (schwip schwap), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:25 (twenty years ago)

H & O were hell of a lot more subversive than you'd expect from the best-selling duo of all time. "One on One" practically invents electro; "You Make My Dreams" is new wave done right; "Adult Education" is one of the better Chic rip-offs.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:25 (twenty years ago)

Eisbar hear one 'Tired of Sex', fuck

in what world is pinkerton weezer's most commercial record?

― Eisbär (llamasfur), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:31 (twenty years ago)

They're a commercial band, for God's sake don't act as if there're great divisions between their Lps, ILM should maintain some allegiance to reality

― Schwip Schwap (schwip schwap), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:44 (twenty years ago)

I'm sorry, is there some bizarro world where a gigantic section of Weezer's mainstream fanbase DIDN'T hate Pinkerton to the point where even Rivers disowned the album that I don't know about?

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:47 (twenty years ago)

WTF w/ Weezer reppin' BEANTOWN? Rivers is from CT! Raised in an ASHRAM! Near UCONN!

― David R. (popshots75`), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:51 (twenty years ago)

But he went to HAHVUHD, my good boy.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:51 (twenty years ago)

It might just be there is, Dan. It's called New Zealand. "Pinkerton" beat the crap out of 'Weezer' here, w/my drunken rugbyish friends anyway. Regardless it's a retarded comparison.

― Schwip Schwap (schwip schwap), Thursday, 7 April 2005 15:54 (twenty years ago)

And Daryl Hall went to Temple! Fuck all y'all!

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 7 April 2005 16:24 (twenty years ago)

Wow, that's actually kind of awesome. Everyone else except for the superfans hated it.

― The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 7 April 2005 16:35 (twenty years ago)

And Daryl Hall went to Temple! Fuck all y'all!

so did john oates!

― Eisbär (llamasfur), Thursday, 7 April 2005 16:37 (twenty years ago)

Kids today who weren't paying attention when it came out (Scary though I know, but remember the scarier one - Avril Lavigne was inspired to become a musician after hearing Matchbox 20) probably won't look at Pinkerton as a flop in the slightest.

― miccio (miccio), Thursday, 7 April 2005 16:42 (twenty years ago)

It's sort of their Paul's Boutique in that sense

― miccio (miccio), Thursday, 7 April 2005 16:43 (twenty years ago)

Do H&O have a "Paul's Boutique" in their catalogue?

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 7 April 2005 17:09 (twenty years ago)

Do H&O have a "Paul's Boutique" in their catalogue?

closest would be either (or BOTH) abandoned luncheonette or war babies.

then there was darryl's solo rekkid w/ ROBERT FRIPP ... one of the great WTF? moments.

― Eisbär (llamasfur), Thursday, 7 April 2005 17:21 (twenty years ago)

http://image.allmusic.com/00/amg/cov200/drd700/d754/d7543708gfk.jpg

― Eisbär (llamasfur), Thursday, 7 April 2005 17:22 (twenty years ago)

the track listing from war babies:

1. Can't Stop The Music(He Played It Much To Long)
2. Is It A Star
3. Beane G. And The Rose Tattoo
4. You're Much Too Soon
5. 70's Scenario
6. War Baby Son Of Zorro
7. I'm Watching You(A Mutant Romance)
8. Better Watch Your Back
9. Screaming Through December
10. Johnny Gore And The > Eaters

― Eisbär (llamasfur), Thursday, 7 April 2005 17:23 (twenty years ago)

I'll tell you what's a great track: "It's A Laugh," which, with the exception of a treackly sax solo, is paranoid perfection.

How's the second Hall solo album (the one with the long-ass title)?

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 7 April 2005 17:34 (twenty years ago)

this review of hall & oates's debut (whole oats) makes them sound like some sorta proto-belle and sebastian!

(i haven't actually heard this one, so i can neither confirm nor deny that thought.)

― Eisbär (llamasfur), Thursday, 7 April 2005 17:41 (twenty years ago)

I could have sworn Jon Bon Jovi wrote a song for H&O.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 7 April 2005 17:48 (twenty years ago)

i'm beginning to think that hall & oates were like the american elvis costello, only (a) they were BETTER lyrically (their rhymes, wordplay and puns weren't as contrived); (b) they were better MUSICALLY (i.e., they were better able to smoothly integrate all of the disparate influences on their sound -- philly soul, new wave, r&b, folk -- and weren't as self-conscious/self-congratulatory about it; and (c) they actually had HITS, in the top reaches of the charts (as opposed to scraping the edges of same). but also (d) for better or worse, H&O weren't given the rimjobs that EC got on a regular basis from rock critics.

also, check out the video for EC's "the only flame in town" -- EC getting PWNED by his mastah, darryl hall!

― Eisbär (llamasfur), Thursday, 7 April 2005 18:34 (twenty years ago)

Miccio's idea of a Hall & Oates cover of "Say It Ain't So" makes me smile. Perhaps it could develop into an entire covers album. I can hear Oates doing the "uh huh" parts on "Getchoo."

― John Fredland (jfredland), Thursday, 7 April 2005 19:37 (twenty years ago)

"...and the FUNNIEST thing of all was that some dude, completely out of nowhereinparticular, tried to make out that Hall & Oates were lyrically superior to Elvis Costello. i know! i soiled myself there and then."

seriously though...no.

― Lee F# (fsharp), Thursday, 7 April 2005 19:47 (twenty years ago)

I can TOTALLY see H&O doing "Pink Triangle." Can't you hear Hall revealing several layers of outrage, hurt, and smug pride - similar to "Family Man"?

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 7 April 2005 20:59 (twenty years ago)

Most people're lyrically superior to EC!

― Schwip Schwap (schwip schwap), Friday, 8 April 2005 05:11 (twenty years ago)

this review of hall & oates's debut (whole oats) makes them sound like some sorta proto-belle and sebastian!

As Douglas Wolk has pointed out elsewhere, "Las Vegas Turnaround" from Abandoned Luncheonette is TOTALLY a B&S song.

Having just finished seeing EC 30 minutes ago, as far as comparisons between him and H&O, well, I can't go for that (no can do), just because there's really not much in common there (plus EC's catalogue's a lot better)

― Matos-Webster Dictionary (M Matos), Friday, 8 April 2005 05:37 (twenty years ago)

How about...Weezer's "The Good Life" vs Steve Winwood's "Back In The High Life Again"?

― John Fredland (jfredland), Friday, 8 April 2005 08:58 (twenty years ago)

"Having just finished seeing EC 30 minutes ago, as far as comparisons between him and H&O, well, I can't go for that (no can do), just because there's really not much in common there (plus EC's catalogue's a lot better)"

After listening to "Big Bam Boom a couple of times, I conclude that it's a better album than "Punch the Clock." But no damn way is "Private Eyes" a better album than "Trust," nor is "Abandoned Luncheonette" a better album than "This Year's Model."

EC can still write great songs, while H&O's original inspiration seems to have dried up. Frankly, I dont think they listen much to the radio; they were always great synthesists. Maybe if you played Daryl Hall the new Beck he'd show Mr. Hansen how to do soul right.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Friday, 8 April 2005 11:30 (twenty years ago)

I'm more familiar with Hall & Oates' singles than their albums, but Alfred's comparisons hint at one big difference between them and EC: their career trajectories. I'd take Costello's work as a 20-something (My Aim Is True, This Year's Model, Armed Forces, Get Happy!!, Trust, Almost Blue, Imperial Bedroom and Punch The Clock) over Hall's work as a 20-something (Whole Oates, Abandoned Lunchonette, War Babies, Daryl Hall & John Oates). (Hall is three years older than Oates, so I'm using his age for the purposes of this discussion.) But I'd take Hall's work as a 30-something (Bigger Than Both Of Us, Beauty On A Back Street, Along The Red Ledge, X-Static, Voices, Private Eyes, H20, Big Bam Boom, the solo Sacred Songs) over Costello's work as a 30-something (Goodbye Cruel World, Blood & Chocolate, King Of America, Spike, Mighty Like A Rose, The Juliet Letters). In their 40s and 50s, it flips again: Costello's Brutal Youth, All This Useless Beauty, Painted From Memory, When I Was Cruel, North, Il Sogno and The Delivery Man probably have more appealing moments than Hall's Ooh Yeah!, Change Of Season, Marigold Sky, Do It For Love and the solo 3 Hearts In The Happy Ending Machine, Soul Alone and Can't Stop Dreaming.

― John Fredland (jfredland), Friday, 8 April 2005 21:08 (twenty years ago)

Whoa! John, have you actually listened to post-Big Bam Boom H&O?

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Friday, 8 April 2005 22:22 (twenty years ago)

meaning, I'm impressed. You're a brave man ;)

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Friday, 8 April 2005 22:23 (twenty years ago)

Not the albums -- but I remember a fair number of radio/VH1 singles from the "Ooh Yeah!" and "Change Of Season" albums. To test my theory about career trajectories fully, I would need to sit down and listen to more of the H&O albums, of course.

― John Fredland (jfredland), Friday, 8 April 2005 22:33 (twenty years ago)

As Douglas Wolk has pointed out elsewhere, "Las Vegas Turnaround" from Abandoned Luncheonette is TOTALLY a B&S song. -MATOS

YES I AGREE!

― Susan Douglas (Susan Douglas), Friday, 8 April 2005 23:57 (twenty years ago)

two weeks pass...

Revive, cuz I just head "Say It Isn't So" at the supermarket during my lunch break, and it still shits all over Weezer.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 28 April 2005 17:27 (twenty years ago)

The chorus of "Say It Isn't So" is ear ambrosia.

Weezer is so entirely inconsequential.

I am frequently castigated for my H20 love. I'm so glad there's H20 love on ILM.

― Brooker Buckingham (Brooker B), Thursday, 28 April 2005 17:38 (twenty years ago)

I was thinking about this thread yesterday. Unless Weezer's commercial radio presence reverts back to what it once was post-Pinkerton pre-Green Album, Hall & Oates will always win over Weezer. Until that day, I will remain tired of the majority of the Weezer songs I once loved so dearly.

― billstevejim, Thursday, 28 April 2005 21:35 (twenty years ago)

two years pass...

I'm always amazed that Hall'n'Oates has all these singles people are ape for and its fucking "Private Eyes" and "Maneater" I hear everywhere.

Miccio totally OTM! I've been gradually really getting into H&O over the last year or so, and it's not like I've never been to a dentist's office before...they just never play the really great shit!

Also, I would fucking love to hear Hall and Oates in their prime covering "Say It Ain't So." The Weezer performance is one of the high points of 90s rock (certainly the best thing they ever recorded) - but I think Hall could pull it off.

― Doctor Casino, Thursday, 13 December 2007 05:47 (eighteen years ago)

Yeah, since this thread started I've heard "SIIS" and it is sweeeet. "Say It Aint So" might be one of my least favorite Weezer singles, though it's still fine enough.

― da croupier, Thursday, 13 December 2007 05:54 (eighteen years ago)

There was this band in my high school that did basically Beach Boys songs, "Runaround Sue" and "Say It Ain't So." Singer was a fat kid with a cowboy hat.

― da croupier, Thursday, 13 December 2007 05:56 (eighteen years ago)

They weren't an intentionally quirky band or anything, they were just kinda inexplicable.

― da croupier, Thursday, 13 December 2007 06:01 (eighteen years ago)

four months pass...

I'm ready to like "Say It Ain't So" a little now, but still.

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Saturday, 26 April 2008 13:13 (seventeen years ago)

I take back what I said about Weezer.. Of course around the time I wrote that message was probably around the last time I listened to 90s Weezer up until a few weeks ago. Their streak of brilliance pretty much ended when Sharp left, obviously.

This TS is still very difficult for me. "Say It Isn't So" might be my fav H&O song.

― billstevejim, Saturday, 26 April 2008 23:38 (seventeen years ago)

This is that Weezer song I was trying to remember the name of some weeks back while I was in the car and couldn't! Yeah, I liked that one at the time, I really did, but it makes me wince now. It's got that same "cooler-than-thou" thing that so much fucking emo crap has these days, and it's really just a bunch of power chords and little else isn't it? The Hall & Oates tune on the other hand has never been one of my faves of theirs, but I like the way they make it sound like everything is echoing. So yeah, Hall & Oates win. Which I didn't expect when I first clicked on this thread!

― Bimble, Sunday, 27 April 2008 01:40 (seventeen years ago)

it's really just a bunch of power chords and little else isn't it?

Well to be fair/pedantic it does start off with the full chords and has a few bitching licks/good solo.

― jim, Sunday, 27 April 2008 01:45 (seventeen years ago)

And Say it isn't so is probably my third least favourite song on the Hall & Oates greatest hits I have after One on one and Wait for me.

― jim, Sunday, 27 April 2008 01:47 (seventeen years ago)

Alfred! He dared to diss One On One! My heart is breaking. Please stop now.

― Bimble, Sunday, 27 April 2008 03:13 (seventeen years ago)

I haven't stopped.

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Sunday, 27 April 2008 03:19 (seventeen years ago)

The laid-back Southern rock comping on "SIAS" is actually pretty good, but its not nearly one of my favorite Weezer songs.

― The Reverend, Sunday, 27 April 2008 06:20 (seventeen years ago)

The weezer tune is great but the progression is basically lifted from "Where is My Mind" by The Pixies.

― St3ve Go1db3rg, Sunday, 27 April 2008 06:44 (seventeen years ago)

OMG the H&O video ends with a shot of the WTC. "SAY IT ISN'T SO" INDEED.

Anyway, the H&O song is too damn long. I choose Weezer for brevity.

― al.b, Sunday, 27 April 2008 18:09 (seventeen years ago)

That's cuz the video uses the 12" version!

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Sunday, 27 April 2008 18:47 (seventeen years ago)

Holy shit, I think Steve's on to something re: Pixies. I've played them side by side now and it isn't really a ripoff but the comparison is definitely valid. And I feel like I knew that subconsciously. Wow.

― Bimble, Sunday, 27 April 2008 19:02 (seventeen years ago)

The weezer tune is great but the progression is basically lifted from "Where is My Mind" by The Pixies.

-- St3ve Go1db3rg, Sunday, April 27, 2008 6:44 AM (12 hours ago) Bookmark Link

isn't every chord progression pretty much lifted from some other pop song?

― Surmounter, Sunday, 27 April 2008 19:03 (seventeen years ago)

The video uses the 12" version! Hahah. I love it.

xpost

― Bimble, Sunday, 27 April 2008 19:03 (seventeen years ago)

Perhaps, Surmounter, but an awful lot of bands ripped off the Pixies.

― Bimble, Sunday, 27 April 2008 19:04 (seventeen years ago)

I feel the chord sequence is fairly common. Is it not also in "Teenage dirtbag"? :/

― jim, Sunday, 27 April 2008 19:11 (seventeen years ago)

a lot of chord sequences that make for really catch songs are fairly common, IMO

― Surmounter, Sunday, 27 April 2008 19:12 (seventeen years ago)

it's really just a bunch of power chords and little else isn't it

There is more to rock music than chord progressions.

― billstevejim, Sunday, 27 April 2008 19:42 (seventeen years ago)

Say It Ain't So and Where Is My Mind share the same chords but in a different order, and the tempos are similar.. however they also have different vocal melodies, different counter melodies, different guitar fills, different production, different lyrics, and the musicians play the songs differently, and also Frank Black and Rivers Cuomo do not have similar vocal styles.

― billstevejim, Sunday, 27 April 2008 19:46 (seventeen years ago)

also the instruments used on both songs are different

― Mr. Que, Sunday, 27 April 2008 19:47 (seventeen years ago)

also different producer

― Mr. Que, Sunday, 27 April 2008 19:47 (seventeen years ago)

Yeah.. what I was saying is that I'm sick of people saying that song was "ripped off" from another because the chord progressions are similar.

― billstevejim, Sunday, 27 April 2008 19:50 (seventeen years ago)

Perhaps, Surmounter, but an awful lot of bands ripped off the Pixies.

H&O didn't!

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Sunday, 27 April 2008 19:58 (seventeen years ago)

I don't think SIAS was "ripped off" from WIMM and I don't think the shared progression takes anything away from it being a great song. But I think the case for WIMM influencing SIAS is strong and I think it's an interesting connection. It's not a super-obscure chord progression (and not just power chords-- WIMM verse goes E C#m G# A, SIAS verse goes C#m G# A E), but it's not exactly a "standard" progression either. The G# following the C#m rather than preceding it and then resolving deceptively to the A is pretty distinctive.

― St3ve Go1db3rg, Monday, 28 April 2008 00:53 (seventeen years ago)

Can we get back to discussing what is clearly the superior of the two tracks?

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Monday, 28 April 2008 01:00 (seventeen years ago)

I love this thread.

― Bimble, Monday, 28 April 2008 01:15 (seventeen years ago)

What if you think they're equal?

― billstevejim, Monday, 28 April 2008 20:45 (seventeen years ago)

eleven years pass...

Hall & Oates' "Say It Isn't So" is the greatest song of all time.

― TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 8 January 2020 03:33 (six years ago)

Are you people out of your fucking minds? I hoped that the hipster world's brief foray into Hall and Oates apreciation ended that stupid week where Ben Gibbard made that dumb list on Pitchfork, then Pitchfork had that dumb news feature about their tour. It's not like the Weezer "Say It Ain't So" falls under their dubious ironic period, it's just great.
― Roadkill Bingo (Roadkill Bingo), Wednesday, April 6, 2005 11:11 PM

I listen to H&O about 10x more than Weezer, but "Say It Ain't So" is Rivers' best song, and "Say It Isn't So" wouldn't make my list of top 20 H&O tracks
(I'm sure Alfred already made this list, so I'm off to compare it with my own mental list).

― enochroot, Wednesday, 8 January 2020 13:22 (six years ago)

https://humanizingthevacuum.wordpress.com/2017/01/02/mano-a-mano-the-best-of-daryl-hall-and-john-oates/

― enochroot, Wednesday, 8 January 2020 13:26 (six years ago)

Say It Isn't So would sound amazing coming from nearly any other band, but it's up against things like I Can't Go For That and Kiss On My List.

Why haven't Weezer ever put out a greatest hits btw? They're totally a singles band.

― does it look like i'm here (jon123), Wednesday, 8 January 2020 14:50 (six years ago)

they did, it's the one with the blue cover

― frogbs, Wednesday, 8 January 2020 14:57 (six years ago)

No Head, no cred.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhTa2PeIdxs

― Briania, Wednesday, 8 January 2020 15:57 (six years ago)

I would not have guessed that that guy had a soft-rock/folkie period

― Οὖτις, Wednesday, 8 January 2020 16:17 (six years ago)

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