Taking Sides: The Cure Vs Saint Etienne

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The Cure might be okay if they lost the goth following. Goths are hideous, really, and I cannot handle The Cure because one particular goth that I hate badly is into them and I hope he gets hit by a car one day.

Saint Etienne are lovely though. I love Good Humour and "Sylvie" and "Avenue" are great. Anyone else going to see them on the 17th?

Saint Etienne are so much better than The Cure it's not even funny, really. And Sarah Cracknell? Still would.

― Music Mick, Sunday, 5 June 2005 14:33 (twenty years ago)

You're hating on the Cure cuz of their fans?

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Sunday, 5 June 2005 14:35 (twenty years ago)

Hey now, be reasonable here.

― Music Mick, Sunday, 5 June 2005 14:36 (twenty years ago)

The Cure ------> write and play great songs and have been doing so for over twenty-five years.

St.Etienne -------> DON'T

The gormless dinks in St.Etienne aren't fit to clean the cheese out from Robert Smith's portly toes.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Sunday, 5 June 2005 14:40 (twenty years ago)

Alex, have you met any goths?

Do you like them or want to spend time with them? I do not. I actively avoid people dressed in black who listen to goth music. The Cure are goths. This is not good.

― Music Mick, Sunday, 5 June 2005 14:42 (twenty years ago)

Somehow HorrorCons don't seem like a good place to avoid people dressed in black.

― miccio (miccio), Sunday, 5 June 2005 14:46 (twenty years ago)

I think I'm the lone indie kid there.

― Music Mick, Sunday, 5 June 2005 14:52 (twenty years ago)

for once I'll agree. forget the Cure, a couple of okay songs here and there aside.

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Sunday, 5 June 2005 14:55 (twenty years ago)

The little Saint Etienne I've heard has rolled right off me, I'll take the Cure. Pop/rock rules.

― miccio (miccio), Sunday, 5 June 2005 14:59 (twenty years ago)

ts: the cure vs. "the remedy" by jason mraz

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Sunday, 5 June 2005 15:00 (twenty years ago)

Jason Mraz, obvoiousy.

IIIIIIII
WON'T WORRRY MY LIFE AWAYYYYYYY

― The Brainwasher (Twilight), Sunday, 5 June 2005 15:25 (twenty years ago)

"the remedy" by mraz v. remedy by basement jaxx

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Sunday, 5 June 2005 15:31 (twenty years ago)

...vs. "Remedy" by the Black Crowes.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Sunday, 5 June 2005 15:53 (twenty years ago)

Really don't see how you'd pit these tastes as mutually exclusive in the first place.

Both are extremely great in their own way. If anything, Saint Etienne are maybe more great for late morning, and the Cure more great for late evening.

Anyway, two of my favorite bands ever.

― bkjj40a, Sunday, 5 June 2005 16:35 (twenty years ago)

I have met goths, and like them, and think they are often rather hott.

I don't really like the cure or st etienne, though I don't much dislike either band.

I have been listening to Propaganda to-day. You should listen to Propaganda too, Calum.

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Sunday, 5 June 2005 19:35 (twenty years ago)

No Norm - you can't like Goths. You just can't.

― Music Mick, Sunday, 5 June 2005 19:39 (twenty years ago)

I guess I'm not supposed to question the topic but this is totally "apples and oranges" for me. Anyway if I have to pick, Saint Etienne, hands down.

― daavid (daavid), Sunday, 5 June 2005 19:44 (twenty years ago)

The Cure put out their first album in 1979 and is in the works for a new one. The other group was born, if I remember right, in the 1990’s. Also Robert Smith has over double the amount of songs than do Saint Etienne. So this comparison is not even close to being right, IMHO.

The Cure hands down as history and record sales have already proved this.

― BeeOK (boo radley), Sunday, 5 June 2005 21:17 (twenty years ago)

LINKIN PARK > THE VELVET UNDERGROUND.

RECORD SALES HAVE PROVED THIS.

― The Brainwasher (Twilight), Sunday, 5 June 2005 21:25 (twenty years ago)

record sales have already proved this.

While I still stand by the Cure, it's true.....record sales are no indication of quality.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Sunday, 5 June 2005 21:35 (twenty years ago)

True, but in some cases it is true as the Beatles are number one.

― BeeOK (boo radley), Sunday, 5 June 2005 22:15 (twenty years ago)

The Beatles are so not as good as Pulp or Suede.

― Music Mick, Sunday, 5 June 2005 22:18 (twenty years ago)

Stop saying "Goths", it's annoying.
Most of the Cure fans I know are just 20yrs+ Indie Rock fans/ not "goths".

― Nic de Teardrop (Nicholas), Sunday, 5 June 2005 22:43 (twenty years ago)

I'M A GOTH, AND I HATE THE CURE.

― The Brainwasher (Twilight), Sunday, 5 June 2005 22:47 (twenty years ago)

I thought the "Goths" disowned the Cure quite a while back...

But how do STE fans hold up in comparison?

― KPH, Sunday, 5 June 2005 22:58 (twenty years ago)

NO ONE's a Goth anymore. It's over.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Sunday, 5 June 2005 23:01 (twenty years ago)

I'M A GOTH IN MY SOUL.

― The Brainwasher (Twilight), Sunday, 5 June 2005 23:04 (twenty years ago)

Could someone please come up with a short description of what a Saint Etienne fan is supposed to be like?

― edward o (edwardo), Monday, 6 June 2005 00:59 (twenty years ago)

Pop music

― A Viking of Some Note (Andrew Thames), Monday, 6 June 2005 01:17 (twenty years ago)

Could someone please come up with a short description of what a Saint Etienne fan is supposed to be like?

I'm the only St. Etienne fan I know personally. And that must be the case with many others. I've always felt St. Etienne is the kind of artist people fall in love with privately. I know that a lot of St. Etienne fans are gay though.

― daavid (daavid), Monday, 6 June 2005 02:59 (twenty years ago)

The Cure ------> write and play great songs and have been doing so for over twenty-five years.

St.Etienne -------> DON'T

Saint Etienne write their own (great) songs too (not that it should matter), and they've been around for 15 years.

― daavid (daavid), Monday, 6 June 2005 03:03 (twenty years ago)

Hating on the Cure because you don't like goths = teh lame.

The Cure totally wins, anyway.

― Jessie the Monster (scarymonsterrr), Monday, 6 June 2005 04:54 (twenty years ago)

goth was nov-dec 1977

― fatbob snr, Monday, 6 June 2005 06:01 (twenty years ago)

GOTHICK 4 LIFE BITCH!

― The Emancipation of Baaderonixx (Fabfunk), Monday, 6 June 2005 06:33 (twenty years ago)

The Cures maybe has the one song but at least the song is melodic, unlike St Etienne, where all their records sound like the middle eight of a tune but they forgot to write the rest of it.

― Comstock Carabinieri (nostudium), Monday, 6 June 2005 06:41 (twenty years ago)

what's so offensive about goths, anyway? Actually, what is a 'goth'? Last Cure concert I went to, I saw a lot of khaki pants and checkered shirts, is that goth?

― Richard K (Richard K), Monday, 6 June 2005 07:04 (twenty years ago)

Apparently there are a lot of them in Leeds.

I say "apparently" because I have just returned from a weekend in Leeds and saw none.

― Marcello Carlin (nostudium), Monday, 6 June 2005 07:05 (twenty years ago)

This is a fight between great bands, but I let The Cure win for their consistency and for great albums such as "Head On The Door", "Faith" and "17 Seconds".

― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Monday, 6 June 2005 08:12 (twenty years ago)

Plus for even greater singles such as "Let's Go To Bed", "Friday I'm In Love", "Just Like Heaven", "High" and "Mint Car". Happy with a twist.

― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Monday, 6 June 2005 08:13 (twenty years ago)

The Cures wins because they have tunes, where is St Etienne have noodling about with no actual melody contained. When have St Etienne ever written a song as good as "Friday I'm In Love"?

― Comstock Carabinieri (nostudium), Monday, 6 June 2005 08:14 (twenty years ago)

grrraAARGAHGHARRRRAGARRRRRRARRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGHHHHHHHHH

― hobart paving (hobart paving), Monday, 6 June 2005 09:00 (twenty years ago)

"Hobart Paving" is not even in the same pop universe as "Friday I'm In Love."

― Comstock Carabinieri (nostudium), Monday, 6 June 2005 09:01 (twenty years ago)

WILL. NOT. KILL. YOU.

― hobart paving (hobart paving), Monday, 6 June 2005 09:05 (twenty years ago)

"Hobart Paving" might have been in the same pop universe as "Friday I'm In Love" had they remembered to add a melody to the chord sequence they borrowed from Julie Cruise.

― Comstock Carabinieri (nostudium), Monday, 6 June 2005 09:08 (twenty years ago)

I'm not angry. Just a little disappointed.

― hobart paving (hobart paving), Monday, 6 June 2005 09:09 (twenty years ago)

"Friday I'm In Love"??! Shit song, shit band.

― dm, Monday, 6 June 2005 09:57 (twenty years ago)

"...When have St Etienne ever written a song as good as "Friday I'm In Love"?

"You're in a Bad Way" ... probably the only time they've sounded vaguely similar (and that's just the tempo).

― Jez (Jez), Monday, 6 June 2005 10:21 (twenty years ago)

That is incorrect. "You're In A Bad Way" is a ripoff of "Living By Numbers" by New Musik with the riff from "Telstar." It hardly compares in quality with the likes of "Just Like Heaven" and "Caterpillars."

― Comstock Carabinieri (nostudium), Monday, 6 June 2005 10:25 (twenty years ago)

"You're In A Bad Way" is, in my world, perfect pop. If it rips anything off (and I haven't heard the song to which you refer) that's fine by me. I've always thought of it as one of their most retr0-tinged songs anyway. Its meant to evoke nostalgia for a time that never really existed (as is most retro, come to think of it, so that statement may be meaningless).

― hobart paving (hobart paving), Monday, 6 June 2005 10:32 (twenty years ago)

In the real world, however, "You're In A Bad Way" peaked at #12. Most people's idea of perfect pop at the time, judging by the records which outsold it, was "No Limit," "O Carolina," "Ordinary World," "Deep," "Little Bird/Love Song For A Vampire" and Rolf Harris "Stairway To Heaven," amongst others.

― Comstock Carabinieri (nostudium), Monday, 6 June 2005 10:39 (twenty years ago)

My world IS the real world!!!

Surely we aren't back to quality=record sales thing again?

Crazy Frog>The Cure or Saint Etienne??

― hobart paving (hobart paving), Monday, 6 June 2005 10:42 (twenty years ago)

I repeat: at least Crazy Frog has a tune, even if it is Harold Faltermeyer's tune from the eightis. Therefore Crazy Frog are superior to St Etienne, as they are more melodic. Fact.

― Comstock Carabinieri (nostudium), Monday, 6 June 2005 10:45 (twenty years ago)

St. Etienne wrote their own tunes, thus they are better, while Crazy Frog is needless.

― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Monday, 6 June 2005 11:10 (twenty years ago)

I repeat: at least Crazy Frog has a tune, even if it is Harold Faltermeyer's tune from the eightis. Therefore Crazy Frog are superior to St Etienne, as they are more melodic. Fact.
-- Comstock Carabinieri (copp...), June 6th, 2005.

But we're dropping the argument about sales, just so I'm clear??

You are correct. Saint Etienne are out and out NOISE.

― hobart paving (hobart paving), Monday, 6 June 2005 11:12 (twenty years ago)

"Pale Movie" and "He's On The Phone" are both great pop songs with great melodies.

― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Monday, 6 June 2005 11:13 (twenty years ago)

Except for the "He's On The Phone" re-edit which is just thirty minutes of Sarah Cracknell primal screaming.

― hobart paving (hobart paving), Monday, 6 June 2005 11:18 (twenty years ago)

Crazy Frog had a number one. The Cure and St Etienne have never had a number one. End of argument.

St Etienne have never written a properly-constructed melodic song in their lives, they should learn some lessons from perfect pop writers, such as Diana Warrens or Cathy Denis.

― Comstock Carabinieri (nostudium), Monday, 6 June 2005 11:21 (twenty years ago)

Crazy Frog had a number one. The Cure and St Etienne have never had a number one. End of argument.

-- Comstock Carabinieri (copp...), June 6th, 2005.

So Crazy Frog> The Cure ??

You seem strangely reluctant to address this part of your argument. Is it because you suspect its a RUBBISH argument??

― hobart paving (hobart paving), Monday, 6 June 2005 11:31 (twenty years ago)

You are failing to read. Perhaps you should enroll in some literaty classes, no? I told you that Crazy Frog were more melodic than the Cures isnt it. This is prove by the fact they sell more records. Has the Cures ever had a number one? No, so shut up bollocks1 until they do.

― Comstock Carabinieri (nostudium), Monday, 6 June 2005 11:38 (twenty years ago)

Suddenly it all makes sense.

― hobart paving (hobart paving), Monday, 6 June 2005 11:48 (twenty years ago)

St Etienne have never written a properly-constructed melodic song in their lives

I Buy American Records, Erica America, Former Lover etc. etc. ... all built around melody. Anyway, it was a pointless argument in the first place.

― Jez (Jez), Monday, 6 June 2005 11:51 (twenty years ago)

I have never heard of these songs so they cannot be any good. If they were proper melodic pop everyone would be singing them for the last ten years.

― Comstock Carabinieri (nostudium), Monday, 6 June 2005 11:52 (twenty years ago)

Hobart Paving and Avenue are so much better than any Cure song I have heard, including the examples given above.

― Music Mick, Monday, 6 June 2005 11:58 (twenty years ago)

Avenue is not a song, just a doodle with needless avantgard soundeffects. Hobart Paving is not a song for the reason I describe above. The Cures songs are at least songs. Fact.

― Comstock Carabinieri (nostudium), Monday, 6 June 2005 12:02 (twenty years ago)

Dude, you are not qualified to say something is or isn't a song you fucking nitwit. Go join the Army.

― Music Mick, Monday, 6 June 2005 12:04 (twenty years ago)

This will be fun.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 6 June 2005 12:09 (twenty years ago)

Showtime!

― The Emancipation of Baaderonixx (KERERU 4 LIFE!) (Fabfunk), Monday, 6 June 2005 12:10 (twenty years ago)

No, you are the dude you are not qualified to say something is or isn't a song you fucking nitwit, so you needs to go join the army and maybe you get blown up in iran, no? Unfortunately you are music innumerite and don't understand mechanics of what makes a proper song and what constitute melody. This is because you wasted too much time at remedial school smelly your armpit instead of pay the attentions. You needs to listen to someone who understand music, that like I do, and that St Etienne are not melody. The Cures are more melody. This is not opinion. This is musciologisoclogical fact. Fact.

― Comstock Carabinieri (nostudium), Monday, 6 June 2005 12:13 (twenty years ago)

saint etienne for sure.

the best thing about the cure were their b-sides. i hate to say this to cause a fuss but i always thought the cure were a poor sister of the the banshees and the associates and a little bit of the furs. once he heard billy mackenzie voice robert changed dramatically.

the cure never really thrilled me at all. i went to see them on the disintegration tour and left after an hour. boring. i do understand, strangely enough, even though i am not a big fan, why people like them.

however, i must say the vs. with saint etienne seems a bit odd. why not cure vs. banshees or cure vs. bauhaus or cure vs. sisters of mercy... seems a little more right.

― ebenoit, Monday, 6 June 2005 12:14 (twenty years ago)

I :heart: trollz

also, i like both immensely. but if i was hard pressed to choose only one, it'd probably be st etienne

― rentboy (rentboy), Monday, 6 June 2005 12:17 (twenty years ago)

M, the only problem with the Comstock persona is that you show the strings ("musciologisoclogical", obviously knowing every Saint Etienne song brought up far too well) and then you put them away again too haphazardly! I would have preferred a slow-release, if ya get me.

otherwise highly enjoyable, carry on.

― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Monday, 6 June 2005 12:19 (twenty years ago)

OTM

― The Emancipation of Baaderonixx (KERERU 4 LIFE!) (Fabfunk), Monday, 6 June 2005 12:24 (twenty years ago)

To be fair, I honestly did give St.Etienne a fair chance back in the 90's. I'd gotten both Fox Base Alpha and....shit, what was the other one? Green with a little girl on the cover. Tough something? Whatever. In any case, neither of them particularly floated my boat. I suppose I got what they were shooting for, but the absence of any real tunes sort've put me off, and I abandoned them.

That said, there are two St.Etienne tracks that I have on compilations that I actually don't mind. The first is their cover of "Stranger in Paradise" on the Ruby Trax NME sampler. The second is...is it "Filthy"? It came on some rinky-dink "trip hop sampler" I picked up in a London airport out of sheer boredom. It's actually quite good. But that ain't Sarah Crackhead on vox on that track, is it?

Regardless, the Cure still mop the floor with them.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Monday, 6 June 2005 12:30 (twenty years ago)

...and they're still gormless dinks (I don't even know what that actually means, but I enjoy saying it).

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Monday, 6 June 2005 12:31 (twenty years ago)

so wait, you've only heard the first two albums?

― rentboy (rentboy), Monday, 6 June 2005 12:39 (twenty years ago)

yeah.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Monday, 6 June 2005 12:40 (twenty years ago)

You should probably hear Tiger Bay and Good Humor, imho their two best
(though So Tough is still my favorite for sentimental reasons)

― rentboy (rentboy), Monday, 6 June 2005 12:44 (twenty years ago)

Tiger Bay is my favourite. Good Humour is the should-have-been-singles album.

That said, I don't expect these to change your mind. Not if there's nothing on the first two albums that appealed.

― hobart paving (hobart paving), Monday, 6 June 2005 12:46 (twenty years ago)

I can understand not liking Saint Etienne, but accusing them of tunelessness!!!

On the first two albums alone you've got "Only Love Can Break Your Heart", "Spring", "Nothing Can Stop Us", "Join Our Club", "You're In A Bad Way"...

But maybe it's the wispy production that's getting in the way. In which case I guess Good Humor has that crisp, flat Cardigans sound...

― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Monday, 6 June 2005 12:50 (twenty years ago)

...but it ain't Tiger Bay, which is happily in another world. :-)

A box set would be nice. I have the Cure one, therefore why not a St. Etienne one? ;-)

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 6 June 2005 13:48 (twenty years ago)

I can understand not liking Saint Etienne, but accusing them of tunelessness!!!

By saying they had no tunes, I didn't mean they were devod of melody, but rather that nothing really jumped out and grabbed me. It all sounded pretty flat and dull to me.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Monday, 6 June 2005 13:56 (twenty years ago)

GOTHICK 4 LIFE BITCH!
"Goth the Life"?

It's easier to get to number one these days. The Cure's highest charting singles will have always sold more than fucking Crazy Frog, as no-one's going to be buying Crazy Frog five years from now.

As for the thread subject, I've only heard two St. Etienne songs and so I can't answer this.

― Ian Riese-Moraine. Sweeter than a lorry load of white Toblerones. (Eastern Mantr, Monday, 6 June 2005 14:07 (twenty years ago)

Could someone explain to me what is meant by "real tunes" and "proper melodies" 'cause I totally don't get it. I mean certainly all St. Etienne songs have melodies and chords, right?

"Friday I'm in Love" almost makes me hate Fridays.

― daavid (daavid), Monday, 6 June 2005 15:28 (twenty years ago)

By tune, I mean something memorable. Something with hooks or at least something distinctive. i wouldn't get all bent out of shape about it. Just because I didn't hear anything that sounded attractive to me doesn't mean that you can't.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Monday, 6 June 2005 15:30 (twenty years ago)

It's easier to get to number one these days. The Cure's highest charting singles will have always sold more than fucking Crazy Frog, as no-one's going to be buying Crazy Frog five years from now.

I think you're right.

However in ten years time Crazy Frog will be Old Skool and therefore featured on myriad revival compilations as well as being available in the latest Real AmphibianTM format.

― LRJP! (LRJP!), Monday, 6 June 2005 15:32 (twenty years ago)

I never cared too much for the first two Saint Etienne albums, Alex, so I'd definately urge you to check out their best of (Too Young to Die) or Tiger Bay and Good Humour which are both excellent and might swing your mind as they did my own. Saint Etienne are one of my fave bands on the strength of these and I'm glad I didn't give up after hearing Fox Base Alpha (which I just don't like at all).

That said, Saint Etienne's best work certainly has tune and melody (Hobart Paving, He's on the Phone, Who do you Think you Are?, Sylvie, Sycamore, Soft Like Me, People Get Real etc etc etc etc). Avenue is just lovely and much better than anything by The Cure.

But, to be honest, I just started this thread to have a go at goths.

― Music Mick, Monday, 6 June 2005 15:46 (twenty years ago)

I have never heard of these songs so they cannot be any good.

There is something strangely familiar about this statement...

Sigvald, is that you? :)

― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Monday, 6 June 2005 22:19 (twenty years ago)

Avenue is boring. So Tough is boring. Good Humour is even more boring. The Sound Of Water is like boring as an artistic statement.

However I love Saint Etienne and Sarah Cracknell very much and I only love Bob a little. Saint Etienne win hooray! :)

― Atnevon (Atnevon), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 06:08 (twenty years ago)

IT'S NOT A BEAUTY CONTEST

― Marcello Carlin (nostudium), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 06:11 (twenty years ago)

Boringness of Avenue + So Tough + Good Humour + The Sound Of Water < Boringness of Wish, Wild Mood Swings, and that silly self-titled one with the neato cover. So Saint Etienne wins both ways.

I love the Cure singles from 1985-1988 or so, though. And the video for Caterpillar is great. They are being so goth and also dancing! And having a good time! And there is a black person playing weirdo drums. Which does not seem very goth. :(

Oh well. I like when he is like YOU FLICKER and then like THE SCREEN FLICKERS! GET IT?

― Atnevon (Atnevon), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 06:22 (twenty years ago)

That's another thing. You never see any black people in Saint Etienne do you? Rascists!

― Marcello Carlin (nostudium), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 06:27 (twenty years ago)

what about q-tee? and how come there's no girls in the cure? sexists!

― fortunate hazel (f. hazel), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 06:48 (twenty years ago)

Tiger Bay is my favourite

Aaah, but *which version* of Tiger Bay

(I have the original on cassette, and the radically different re-release on CD)

― caitlin (caitlin), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 10:17 (twenty years ago)

Oh yes - how could I have overlooked this detail??

The version I have on CD. Which may be the American, Indo-European or Mesopotamian version.

ie. The version WITH "I Buy American Records" on it. Which could only be improved by the addition of "Who Do You Think You Are" which is on the other version I have on cassette.

So, Caitlin, educate me..which is which?

― hobart paving (hobart paving), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 10:32 (twenty years ago)

Neither of the copies I have has Who Do You Think You Are on it - that's on You Need A Mess Of Help To Stand Alone.

The CD one has a photo on the cover, and includes He's On The Phone and Hate Your Drug. The earlier one has a painting on the cover, and has neither of those tracks; I remember buying it well before He's On The Phone was released.

― caitlin (caitlin), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 10:40 (twenty years ago)

I promise to check out their later stuff.

― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 10:55 (twenty years ago)

FWIW the one with the painting is the earlier UK edition – the superior version if you ask me, more cohesive as an album/song cycle/whatever. The one with the photo of the girl is European (German?) and while it does have some nice extra tracks they totally spoil the flow; indeed you lose a refrain of one of the songs which seems very unbalanced if you’re used to the other version. I think the US and Japanese versions were different again…

― LRJP! (LRJP!), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 12:22 (twenty years ago)

Thanks... I'm still not sure which ones I possess - although one of them is definitely the earlier UK version.

Caitlin - there is definitely a version where "On The Shore" goes into "who do you think you are".. I can tape it for you if you like!

I do prefer the version with the extra tracks, although it took me a while to decide that, chiefly because "I Buy American Records" is one of my favourite of their tracks.

So...were there 3, 4 or 5 versions???

Amazon is advertising a version which is different again:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000025COI/qid=1118152733/sr=8-3/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i3_xgl/026-4508908-2603669

I think that's just because they're confused too.

― hobart paving (hobart paving), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 13:01 (twenty years ago)

Do I need to remind y'all: the long version of Tiger Bay is the best album ever. I've always thought the flow was perfect.

― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 13:08 (twenty years ago)

'Ironically', the best St Etienne song was written by The Field Mice (Lets kiss and make up), while the best Field mice song sounds like it was written by the Cure (Letting go).

― flowersdie (flowersdie), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 14:01 (twenty years ago)

"Saint Etienne are so much better than The Cure it's not even funny, really."

---otm

― A Viking of Some Note (Andrew Thames), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 14:12 (twenty years ago)

the american version of tiger bay has "i was born on christmas day" tacked on, along with a small shuffling of track order and some different mixes used. the cover is a photo of the band, not the woman or the painting. i'd imagine the japanese version is different to all these as well... but there's one with "who do you think you are?" on it? odd.

― fortunate hazel (f. hazel), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 17:14 (twenty years ago)

The Cure and St Etienne have never had a number one.

Didn't "You're In A Bad Way" hit number one?

"Too Young To Die" is basically the "Singles Going Steady" of the 90's -- a near-flawless collection from a fantastic singles band that nearly obviates the need to buy any of the albums they released before it. TYTD is better than any Cure album.

But overall, Cure >> St. Et.

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 17:44 (twenty years ago)

A new single-disk version of Smash The System has just been bunged out; at first glance it seems to comprise Too Young To Die + "Burnt Out Car" + "Sylvie" + "The Bad Photographer", but, no "I Was Born On Christmas Day", you see. I think this is now unavailable on any non-deleted St Et 'official' UK release, which seems a bit bothersome and contrary.

(St Etienne by many lightyears, but then my favourite Cure song is "The 13th", so, yes)

― Alex in Doncaster (Alex in Doncaster), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 17:51 (twenty years ago)

don't know if it's been said upthread but i'll say it here...Cure in winter, St. Etienne in spring and summer. Arrange your albums by season, it makes the choices easier.

― biz, Tuesday, 7 June 2005 21:12 (twenty years ago)

'Ironically', the best St Etienne song was written by The Field Mice (Lets kiss and make up)

Ahhh, but *which version* of "Kiss and Make Up"?

― Nixon's ghost/goat, Tuesday, 7 June 2005 21:54 (twenty years ago)

The only issue I have with the Saint Etienne as singles-group concept is that while, yes, they do make fantastic singles, the stuff which they do on their album tracks to complement the singles is often entirely different and kinda crucial to understanding them. Their albums aren't "singles + less good songs" but "singles + haunting quasi-folk ballad, eerie dub meander, driving house groove, melancholy trip hop instrumental etc." The long version of Tiger Bay in particular is up there with A. R. Kane's I in the kaleidoscopic-musical-mosaic stakes.

― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 22:02 (twenty years ago)

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