Pitchfork: Top 50 Albums

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they got it right for sure this year. Little surprised to see Cam'Ron and ARt brut so high, Edan missing and Wolf Parade and CHYSY so low. But with Sufjan on top, they got it right. Thoughts?

― Tynan DeLong (TynanTynan!), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 08:18 (twenty years ago)

man i was sweating it out for awhile. I was browsing the list and I didn't see Sufjan for the first 49, and lemme tell you bro, i was getting FUCKING PISSED. the dude deserved to be NUMBER FUCKING ONE. and the BRO CAME THROUGH.

peace
gear

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 08:23 (twenty years ago)

Does Ryan S.'s #1 album always end up winning the overall vote, or does it just seem that way?

― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 08:27 (twenty years ago)

where's jens lekman? by my quick and probably inaccurate count, he got 60 more points than orthrelm.

― älänbänänä (alanbanana), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 08:32 (twenty years ago)

no kiki, no credibility. fuck pitchfork.

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 08:36 (twenty years ago)

I thought the top 10 was a little unfortunate, esp. Art Brut so high, and I do not feel the Kanye at all. But overall, not a bad list. Interesting how they seem to be pushing into more electronic genres than they used to. Also, is Purple Haze really that good?

― regular roundups (Dave M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 08:41 (twenty years ago)

NO SURFJAN, NO CREDIBILITY

At least Pitchdork has found the sense of getting behind one decent band this year in Art Brut, and the blurb for Art Brut's entry pretty much summed up why they're awesome and you're not.

― ESTEBAN BUTTEZ~!!, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 08:46 (twenty years ago)

Kanye was NOT as great as it's being touted. It's a good record, but not better than a lot of the other 48 records it placed ahead of for sure.

Also, I think I may be in the minority, but I don't think I'm feeling Sufjan as much as everybody else seems to be either.

― Quinn (quinn), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 08:47 (twenty years ago)

is Purple Haze really that good?

yeah it is, but wasn't that from last year?

xpost -- definately not feeling Sufjan as much as i did when it came out, i only listen to 'John Wayne Gacy Jr.' now

― rizzxxx, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 08:49 (twenty years ago)

where's jens lekman? by my quick and probably inaccurate count, he got 60 more points than orthrelm.

AFAIK, Pitchfork hasn't used the (50, 49, 48, ...3, 2, 1) voting system in a couple of years. Once the points are weighted toward higher votes, Orthrelm scores big with a #1 and a #2 vote, whereas Lekman was named on a bunch of ballots but didn't crack anyone's top ten.

(Sigur Ros were also named on a bunch of ballots -- including #3 and #5 votes -- but somehow didn't score enough to make the top 50)

I wonder if the weighting was particularly extreme this time ... this might explain why so many people chose not to list the full 50 albums?

― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 08:59 (twenty years ago)

It's a really uninteresting list, and I say that as an obvious indie-head. But I guess big lists like that are just gonna average out.

Only 7 of the top 30 would crack mine, i think:

MIA, Clientele, LCD, Antony, Mountain Goats, Wolf Parade, maybe CYHSY.

― sean gramophone (Sean M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 09:17 (twenty years ago)

Yeah, looking at it in more detail, probably their worst Top 5o in a few years (since they 'discovered' hip-hop). But that's no one's fault, i guess.

― sean gramophone (Sean M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 09:19 (twenty years ago)

Sufjan Stevens is lame. Fucking choir kids!!

― Jamey Lewis (Jameys Burning), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 09:37 (twenty years ago)

i think this is a better list then last year's. konono, alan braxe, keith whitman, sunn 0))), robyn and roisin murphy are all nice inclusions i didnt see coming. the top 10 was a bit unfortunate i guess, especially numbers 2 and 3. pforks album list is always kind of predictable though since so many of the albums come from the best new music and now recommended selections.

― jmeister (jmeister), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 09:42 (twenty years ago)

didn't Kiki come out last year?

― Ronan (Ronan), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 09:48 (twenty years ago)

i suppose i should hear this sufjan fella then? what should i expect? listening to jens lekman now, mmm lovely.

― CharlieNo4 (Charlie), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 09:51 (twenty years ago)

hip hop wasnt so great this year as far as a ton of great albums coming out but i was surprised to not see edan while young jeezy, the game and beanie sigel made it. i guess while indie gets favored as far as rock goes the mainstream takes it with hip hop at pitchfork.

i think it is interesting to see how much communication happens between staffers at publications. specifically pfork and stylus. there were definitely some albums that seem revered by only pfork (serena maneesh, love is all, boy least likely to, etc,)While with the stylus list im sure will include girls aloud and kelley polar(is that him on the front page?)

― jmeister (jmeister), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 09:52 (twenty years ago)

no herb, no credibility. fuck pitchfork.

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 09:52 (twenty years ago)

It's just peculiar. I'm basically an indie-kid-who-listens-to-pop (ie, Pitchfork-material), but only 3 of my top 10 even made their top 50. (Robyn, MIA, Okkervil River.)

― sean gramophone (Sean M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 09:59 (twenty years ago)

If you ask me the entire top 5 is wrong. Can anyone really stand MIA? Kanye West - his first album was good, the new one is average. Anthony & the Hohnsons, the guy's voice gets to me after a while and the music is nothing incredible. Another poor Pitchfork list, but I've come to expect that from them.

― m scott, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 10:05 (twenty years ago)

I'm really beginning to think, too, that Sufjan may top Pazz & Jop. Which is pretty annoying. (I even love a few of the songs, but the album's really not fantastic.)

― sean gramophone (Sean M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 10:08 (twenty years ago)

Music sucks.

― Melissa W (Melissa W), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 10:21 (twenty years ago)

ha.
sufjan could top pazz & jop. Id say its the forerunner (over bloc party, mia, kanye, antony)
I think the list isn't bad. As others have noted, art brut, lcd soundsystem, are surprizingly high. I like the list- that said I like sufjan.

― Stephen C (ihope), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 11:47 (twenty years ago)

The list:

50: Orthrelm - OV [Ipecac]
49: Fiery Furnaces - EP [Rough Trade]
48: Okkervil River - Black Sheep Boy [Jagjaguwar]
47: The Boy Least Likely To - The Best Party Ever [Too Young to Die]
46: Fiona Apple - Extraordinary Machine [Jon Brion Version] [mp3]
45: M83 - Before the Dawn Heals Us [Mute]
44: Vashti Bunyan - Lookaftering [Fat Cat]
43: Spoon - Gimme Fiction [Merge]
42: My Morning Jacket - Z [RCA]
41: Róisín Murphy - Ruby Blue [Echo]
40: Young Jeezy - Let's Get It: Thug Motivation 101 [Def Jam]
39: Robyn - Robyn [Konichiwa]
38: Devendra Banhart - Cripple Crow [XL]
37: Dominik Eulberg - Kreucht & Fleucht [Mischwald]
36: Keith Fullerton Whitman - Multiples [Mischwald]
35: The Game - The Documentary [Aftermath/Interscope]
34: Silver Jews - Tanglewood Numbers [Drag City]
33: Bloc Party - Silent Alarm [Vice]
32: Beanie Sigel - The B.Coming [Roc-A-Fella]
31: Konono No. 1 - Congotronics [Crammed Discs]
30: Franz Ferdinand - You Could Have It So Much Better [Domino]
29: Serena Maneesh - Serena Maneesh[Honeymilk]
28: Sunn O))) - Black One [Southern Lord]
27: Jamie Lidell - Multiply [Warp]
26: The Decemberists - Picaresque [Kill Rock Stars]
25: Alan Braxe & Friends - The Upper Cuts [PIAS]
24: The Mountain Goats - The Sunset Tree [4AD]
23: Ladytron - The Witching Hour [Rykodisc]
22: Broadcast - Tender Buttons [Warp]
21: Bonnie "Prince" Billy & Matt Sweeney - Superwolf [Drag City]
20: The Hold Steady - Separation Sunday [Frenchkiss]
019: Sleater-Kinney - The Woods [Sub Pop]
018: Clap Your Hands Say Yeah - Clap Your Hands Say Yeah [Clap Your Hands Say Yeah]
017: The Clientele - Strange Geometry [Merge]
016: Love Is All - Nine Times That Same Song [What's Your Rupture?]
015: Clipse - We Got It 4 Cheap, Vol. 2 [mixunit.com]
014: Vitalic - OK Cowboy [PIAS]
013: Various Artists - Run the Road [679]
012: New Pornographers - Twin Cinema [Matador]
011: Isolée - We Are Monster [Playhouse]
10: Wolf Parade - Apologies to the Queen Mary [Sub Pop]
09: Cam'ron - Purple Haze [Roc-A-Fella]
08: LCD Soundsystem - LCD Soundsystem [DFA]
07: Animal Collective - Feels [Fat Cat]
06: Deerhoof - The Runners Four [Kill Rock Stars]
05: Antony & the Johnsons - I Am a Bird Now [Secretly Canadian]
04: M.I.A. - Arular [XL]
03: Art Brut - Bang Bang Rock & Roll [Fierce Panda]
02: Kanye West - Late Registration [Roc-A-Fella]
01: Sufjan Stevens - Illinois [Asthmatic Kitty]

plus: Individual writers' Lists

― DJ Martian (djmartian), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 12:51 (twenty years ago)

I've heard exactly nine of these (S-K, Animal Collective, FF, S. Jews, Cam'ron, etc.), 10 if you count the 10 minutes of Sufjan I listened to before getting fed up and selling the CD.

― Raymond Cummings (Raymond Cummings), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 12:51 (twenty years ago)

Surfjan @ #1 LMFAO!

― Josh Timmermann (Josh Timmermann), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 12:57 (twenty years ago)

Sufjan's lovely, but a bit * nice * to be indispensable. He sounds every inch the devoted Christian he is, which is a quality that doesn't go down too well on this side of the pond. I still want his babies though.

Bloc Party I look on as a bit 'work in progress'. Silent Alarm was good but not great, in a way that suggested they'll make better albums in the future.

It was also interesting that Broadcast and Ladytron ended up next to one another. They, along with M83's inclusion, could mean one thing: shoegazing's back. Hurrah (perhaps). I love the Clap Your Hands Album, but am still not feeling LCD Soundsystem one little bit.

I'd disagree with them on detail about Roisin Murphy's album though. Matthew Herbert's arrangements ARE what make it sound distinctive.

― klee (klee), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 13:31 (twenty years ago)

No Lightning Bolt?

― Joe Grassby (sloejoe), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 13:46 (twenty years ago)

HANG ON HANG ON where is kate bush?!

oh you cannot be serious. it's KATE BUSH. she's a living legend. she's made an album on a completely different plane of existence to 100 of that list. show some respect!

― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 13:48 (twenty years ago)

i mean, reading the ilm thread had convinced me the entire world had recognised aerial as a work of genius.

i thought indie kids liked kate bush?

― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 13:50 (twenty years ago)

yeah but most of it is naff

― Sororah T Massacre (blueski), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 13:51 (twenty years ago)

aerial? all of it is a masterpiece.

― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 13:52 (twenty years ago)

yes it's a masterpiece but that doesn't necess. mean it's any good/you're going to want to listen to it a lot.

― Sororah T Massacre (blueski), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 13:54 (twenty years ago)

looking at the actual list, i highly doubt that those are factors for anything else making it in.

― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 13:56 (twenty years ago)

it's a masterpiece but that doesn't necess. mean it's any good

Just felt this piece of wisdom needed to be highlighted...

― Edward III (edward iii), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 14:03 (twenty years ago)

no venetian snares? no roots manuva?

hrrmph

― rentboy (rentboy), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 14:09 (twenty years ago)

Bloc Party I look on as a bit 'work in progress'. Silent Alarm was good but not great, in a way that suggested they'll make better albums in the future.

re-listening to it right now for the first time in a few months and this is precisely my conclusion too. it no more deserves nme album of the year than i do. they'll make some amazing music one day, though.

art brut at number 3? that's right up there with them hitting the cover of rolling stone in germany! fair play to 'em.

― CharlieNo4 (Charlie), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 14:12 (twenty years ago)

looking at the actual list, i highly doubt that those are factors for anything else making it in.

oh don't worry i wasn't claiming that was the reason it wasn't in amongst this largely sorry lot.

― Sororah T Massacre (blueski), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 14:17 (twenty years ago)

surprised that: Fiona Apple made the list, LCD and MIA placed high

not surprised that: Kanye and Sufjan finished in the top 2 slots

still not getting: Antony

― Dominique (dleone), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 14:18 (twenty years ago)

How no Sigur Ros?

Sufjan is a novelty act. Feels is the real #1, obviously.

― PB, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 14:36 (twenty years ago)

This whole Pitchfork/Dipset thing goes over my head.

― Whiney G. Weingarten (whineyg), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 14:39 (twenty years ago)

youre not sad enough, dom!

― petesmith (plsmith), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 14:41 (twenty years ago)

nice orthrelm blurb, btw - ive been meaning to check that one out.

― petesmith (plsmith), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 14:42 (twenty years ago)

now in a rateyourmusic.com list format:

Pitchfork 50 Best Albums of 2005
http://rateyourmusic.com/list/ijkidd/pitchfork_50_best_albums_of_2005

― DJ Martian (djmartian), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 14:53 (twenty years ago)

youre not sad enough, dom!

haha, I've been told this before!

― Dominique (dleone), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:08 (twenty years ago)

I have some major issues with the Fiona Apple album being so low, but also the blurb that accompanies it. Spoon and the Fiery Furnaces also got shafted, and for what - a lot of chumpy records that will age horribly.

― Matthew C Perpetua (inca), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:12 (twenty years ago)

This whole ~~Pitchfork/~~Dipset thing goes over my head.

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:12 (twenty years ago)

How could Get Behind Me Satan not make the top 50? And Nada Surf's The Weight Is A Gift is the most underrated record of the year.

― kornrulez6969 (TCBeing), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:12 (twenty years ago)

matthew doesn't the idea of "longevity" kinda fuck up yr whole fake pop thing?

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:12 (twenty years ago)

Not really. I certainly wouldn't consider the chumpy hackwork I'm dissing en masse as pop anyway.

― Matthew C Perpetua (inca), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:13 (twenty years ago)

"chumpy hackwork"

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:14 (twenty years ago)

By this time next year no one will remember who Love Is All is. Just sayin'.

― BlastsOfStatic (BlastsofStatic), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:14 (twenty years ago)

potkettle.jpg

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:14 (twenty years ago)

My feeling is that good pop always sounds good.

― Matthew C Perpetua (inca), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:14 (twenty years ago)

tell me more, mr. metlzer

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:14 (twenty years ago)

If Wolf Parade is #10 this year, shouldn't Modest Mouse have been #1 last year, just on a purely logical level?

― Matthew C Perpetua (inca), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:16 (twenty years ago)

a koan

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:16 (twenty years ago)

I'm just waiting for a few years from now when everyone can just fucking admit that Sufjan Stevens just is not very good.

― Matthew C Perpetua (inca), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:22 (twenty years ago)

Good for you.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:24 (twenty years ago)

I Urge you to stop.

x-post

― Lars and Jagger (Ex Leon), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:24 (twenty years ago)

Surprised to see no Architecture in Helsinki, who were touted by PFork earlier this year (8.8 in May). Weirdly, they were, however, name-dropped in two of the other reviews (Antony and the Johnsons, The Boy Least Likely To). I felt Rogue Wave, Laura Veirs, Andrew Bird, Final Fantasy, and John Vanderslice (all whose '05 albums were widely praised, including by me) were shortchanged. Of course all those rap albums are lost on me.

― TimNYC, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:24 (twenty years ago)

I'm just waiting for a few years from now when everyone can just fucking admit that ~~Sufjan StevensAnnieRobynMIAFiona AppleFiery Furnaces~~ just is not very good.

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:25 (twenty years ago)

not gonna happen. there might be the same 'omg what were we thinking' re Art Brut that there was with much of what is often referred to as Britpop though.

― Sororah T Massacre (blueski), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:30 (twenty years ago)

people be changin and growin

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:31 (twenty years ago)

hacky chumpwork

― PB, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:33 (twenty years ago)

Chunky hack works.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:36 (twenty years ago)

i almost said something mean.

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:39 (twenty years ago)

i think you did.

― jed_ (jed), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:42 (twenty years ago)

MARIAH CAREY WUZ ROBBED

― David R. (popshots75`), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:43 (twenty years ago)

Her album was better than Fiona's....

― Lars and Jagger (Ex Leon), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:44 (twenty years ago)

FIONA ROBBED HERSELF

― David R. (popshots75`), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:45 (twenty years ago)

23: Ladytron - The Witching Hour [Rykodisc]
22: Broadcast - Tender Buttons [Warp]
019: Sleater-Kinney - The Woods [Sub Pop]
014: Vitalic - OK Cowboy [PIAS]
012: New Pornographers - Twin Cinema [Matador]
04: M.I.A. - Arular [XL]

I like these. I either haven't heard the others properly or don't like.

― Colonel Poo (Colonel Poo), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:47 (twenty years ago)

Chunky hack works.

-- Dom Passantino (juror...), December 20th, 2005 10:36 AM.

What three words describe all internet music journos/bloggers?

man i like playing Jeopardy.

― rentboy (rentboy), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:48 (twenty years ago)

partial credit :)

― Sororah T Massacre (blueski), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:52 (twenty years ago)

NO GOLDFRAPP!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

― hobart paving (hobart paving), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:54 (twenty years ago)

Will anyone still be listening to any of these 50 records in 10 (or 5......or 2) years?

― PB, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:54 (twenty years ago)

Wow, both on the albums and the singles lists, my #1 pick didn't even chart.

Damn it, I am so depressingly out of sync with the Pitchfork consensus. I hate the Decemberists, I hate Sufjan, I hate CYHSY...

― joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:54 (twenty years ago)

http://bikemag.com/gear/magic9-big.jpg

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:55 (twenty years ago)

Will anyone still be listening to any of these 50 records in 10 (or 5......or 2) years?

Oh, for fuck's sake. Yes, because NOTHING EVER CHANGES AND OSSIFICATION IS A GOOD FUCKING THING. AND THINKING ABOUT THE CANON AT ALL TIMES IS A MUST. BECAUSE WE HAVE A GREAT RESPONSIBILITY TO BOTH PERPETUATE THE BULLSHIT THAT HAS PRECEDED US, AND THE BULLSHIT WE OURSELVES WILL FUCKING PERPETUATE.

Thank you.

― David R. (popshots75`), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:57 (twenty years ago)

What three words describe all internet music journos/bloggers?

Bloggers in gainful employment? Payola isn't technically a wage, you know?

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:58 (twenty years ago)

what'll happen when/if Art Brut is issued stateside?

― Raymond Cummings (Raymond Cummings), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:58 (twenty years ago)

morelike PERPETUA-TE, amirite?

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:58 (twenty years ago)

what'll happen when/if Art Brut is issued stateside?

Then the US will have served penance for Hiroshima.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 15:59 (twenty years ago)

So I take it you no likee teh Brut, Dom?

(I haven't heard 'em myself but I want to.)

― Raymond Cummings (Raymond Cummings), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:04 (twenty years ago)

If you keep dissing The Art Bruts, Dommy P, then our friendship is OVER!!!

― ESTEBAN BUTTEZ~!!, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:06 (twenty years ago)

So happy that CYHSY was not in the top 10. I fully expected PFM to rank them in the top five just to show off their supposed "star-making" qualities. Although that might explain the Art Brut ranking?

Still, no The National, Tom Vek, Andrew Bird, Juan Maclean? Weird.

― Jason_B, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:07 (twenty years ago)

I first heard Art Brut, like, when they first made moves on the student indie toilet circuit (arse end of 2002? Early 2003? Something like that). I'm shocked that their career has gone anywhere above playing in front of 15 people at the East Thannet Ballroom, but then again their horrid PR campaign works far too well in the UK at the moment (look at these intelligent civillized middle class musicians! Not like that horrid chav scum in the charts, they go to art galleries and everything!). Vile. Like the Kaisers' pretentious cousins.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:08 (twenty years ago)

Word on Andrew Bird getting a raw deal. Just ridiculous.

― erklie, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:08 (twenty years ago)

jmeister - xxxxxxxxxxxxx-post, Kelly Polar is on the 'cover' of Stylus.

― natedey (ndeyoung), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:09 (twenty years ago)

only 2 of my picks made the top fifty. guess me and pitchfork are just really really different

bummed not to see andrew bird, cass mccombs, chad vangaalen, grizzly bear, akron/family
but none of those albums were hyped by pfork so I guess it makes sense

― farning, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:10 (twenty years ago)

ha. i put both akron/family and grizzly bear in my top 10. didn't help.

― joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:12 (twenty years ago)

do you write for them? would have been nice to see one of those in their top 50

― farning, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:13 (twenty years ago)

they got it right for sure this year. Little surprised to see Cam'Ron and ARt brut so high, Edan missing and Wolf Parade and CHYSY so low. But with Sufjan on top, they got it right. Thoughts?

yr a douchebag.

― M@tt He1geson (Matt Helgeson), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:13 (twenty years ago)

x-post
i do, that's why i'm so depressed about being out of sync taste-wise with most of the staff. I put Gustav in my top 10, too - didn't chart.

Correction - sorry, I had Angels of Light, not Akron/Family. Easy to confuse these days.

― joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:17 (twenty years ago)

didn't Kiki come out last year?

-- Ronan

I think that's a reference to Kiki & Herb, not Joakim whatsisname.

― frickin' username (fandango), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:21 (twenty years ago)

yeah, that's kind of a bummer joseph. you should have raised a stink!!! at least will they publish everyone's individual top 10 lists later on? And then you can really show all the readers what a visionary you are? haha

― farning, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:26 (twenty years ago)

I fully expected PFM to rank them in the top five just to show off their supposed "star-making" qualities.

Well, CYHSY received a 9.0 because Brian Howe really liked the album, and lo, it ended up in his top ten. But it doesn't necessarily follow that the rest of the staff liked it, too.

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:27 (twenty years ago)

Farning, 'Fork actually publishes individual lists concurrently with the main list. I don't really care about showing readers anything, or raising a "stink" (this post is as close as I'll come to it!) -- I'm just missing out on the joy of actually being excited about our #1 (and 2, and 3...).

― joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:29 (twenty years ago)

joseph, yeah I'm just kidding around. obviously you wouldn't do that, that's a bummer. where can you see all the individual top 10 lists? I'm curious

on a side note:
wow I just realized no wilderness which was hyped to all high end with pfork this summer....strange I guess that one was only liked by a few. granted I thought it was pretty blah so I'm glad it didn't make it but I'm really surprised that it didn't make the top 50 and randoms like serena maneesh did

― farning, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:31 (twenty years ago)

Grizzly Bear!!! I knew I left someone important off my list. Hopefully they can make it up with their sophomore effort.

As for Mariah Carey, she wuz robbed by David bc he never shared the album, whereby I would have surely robbed Art Brut and bestowed upon her my coveted #1 ranking :-(

(p.s. Dom P. we haven't really gotten the Brut PR skeeziness here in the U.S. I just, uh, love the music.)

― marc h. (marc h.), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:33 (twenty years ago)

here: http://pitchforkmedia.com/top/2005/lists.shtml

― DJ Martian (djmartian), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:33 (twenty years ago)

(p.s. Dom P. we haven't really gotten the Brut PR skeeziness here in the U.S. I just, uh, love the music.)

Yeah, I think for Americans listening to a lot of haircut indie is the same feeling we get as listening to the Dave Matthews Band over here. No baggage, innit? I do think that Art Brut are uniquely tuneless though.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:36 (twenty years ago)

the xhuxk/xgau IDM collabo got robbed

― Nick Sylvester, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:36 (twenty years ago)

holy fuck i am listening to we are scientists right now

they got robbed

― Nick Sylvester, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:37 (twenty years ago)

Cam'ron's album came out in December of '04. ah, whatever.

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:39 (twenty years ago)

Cam'ron's album came out in December of '04. ah, whatever.

2005 got robbed!

― Nick Sylvester, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:40 (twenty years ago)

i love it when dom gets worked up over other middle-class white british folks. it really is like americans getting worked up over dmb!

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:40 (twenty years ago)

did people actually hear the M.I.A. album?

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:42 (twenty years ago)

jess did you not vote for rtr at all?!

― mark p (Mark P), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:44 (twenty years ago)

i love it when dom gets worked up over other middle-class white british folks.

Yes, I'm middle class, well done for your reading skills Jess.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:46 (twenty years ago)

Is the Pitchfork #1 associated with any curse?

Dismemberment Plan/Microphones: Broke Up/Band Name Confusion
The Rapture: Fad sailed into the night. Goodnight, fad.
Arcade Fire, Interpol: Nasty backlash seems inevitable.
Radiohead: Relatively unscathed/Have maintained their love:hate ratio.

Sufjan: ?

― erklie, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:51 (twenty years ago)

hey dom for how much longer exactly do you plan to dine out on being anti-student? til 35 maybe? 40? 50 is a nice round number.

― mark p (Mark P), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:52 (twenty years ago)

hey dom for how much longer exactly do you plan to dine out on being anti-student? til 35 maybe? 40? 50 is a nice round number.
-- mark p (mark.p****...), December 20th, 2005.

dom p got robbed!

― Nick Sylvester, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:54 (twenty years ago)

Posting to a message board = dining out. Fantastic.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:55 (twenty years ago)

so 50 then?

― mark p (Mark P), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:56 (twenty years ago)

I would have thought that Malkmus would place higher. It seemed like most Malkmus fans liked that record - and I would have thought Pitchfork would have a lot of Malkmus fans on staff.

― o. nate (onate), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:56 (twenty years ago)

Malkmus is passe.

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:57 (twenty years ago)

so 50 then?

YES YOUR POINT MAKES TOTAL SENSE AND HAS RESULTED IN YOU ZINGING ME. Feel free to add an extra star to your e-mail address in celebration.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:58 (twenty years ago)

Scott Plagenhoef and Tea Leoni robbed me.

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 16:59 (twenty years ago)

Malkmus is passe

Clearly so, if Pitchfork has turned on him.

― o. nate (onate), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:00 (twenty years ago)

joseph, which writer are you I didn't see a top 10 with those ones you mentioned

― farning, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:03 (twenty years ago)

This thread is funny (in places)

I heard a sufjan track today. It was kind of boring.

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:04 (twenty years ago)

I bet it wasn't the Elf Dance Song!

― erklie, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:05 (twenty years ago)

I guess Missy is passe too, since she didn't make the list either. I'd have thought she'd be near the top of the list of indie-friendly mainstream hip-hop.

― o. nate (onate), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:09 (twenty years ago)

HANG ON HANG ON where is kate bush?!
oh you cannot be serious. it's KATE BUSH. she's a living legend. she's made an album on a completely different plane of existence to 100 of that list. show some respect!
-- The Lex (alex.macpherso...) (webmail), December 20th, 2005 1:48 PM. (The Lex) (later) (link)
i mean, reading the ilm thread had convinced me the entire world had recognised aerial as a work of genius.
i thought indie kids liked kate bush?
-- The Lex (alex.macpherso...) (webmail), December 20th, 2005 1:50 PM. (The Lex) (later) (link)
yeah but most of it is naff
-- Sororah T Massacre (stevem7...) (webmail), December 20th, 2005 1:51 PM. (blueski) (later) (link)
aerial? all of it is a masterpiece.
-- The Lex (alex.macpherso...) (webmail), December 20th, 2005 1:52 PM. (The Lex) (later) (link)
yes it's a masterpiece but that doesn't necess. mean it's any good/you're going to want to listen to it a lot.
-- Sororah T Massacre (stevem7...) (webmail), December 20th, 2005 1:54 PM. (blueski) (later) (link)
looking at the actual list, i highly doubt that those are factors for anything else making it in.
-- The Lex (alex.macpherso...) (webmail), December 20th, 2005 1:56 PM. (The Lex) (later) (link)
it's a masterpiece but that doesn't necess. mean it's any good
Just felt this piece of wisdom needed to be highlighted...

-- Edward III (ehonaue...) (webmail), December 20th, 2005 2:03 PM. (edward iii) (later) (link)

Pitchfork - edgy, 'cool' and SO pathetically desperate to please the demographic's self-image ("we only hear the freshest, bestest, and most innovative sounds of Clap Your Hands Say Yeah, Grime and Dubstep (okay we don't actually buy the Grime...)").

Jesus, Aerial is TWICE as good as anything else I heard this year, even with it's so-called 'flaws'... I mean it's hardly an insignificant margin of error.

Credibility -3 points for that alone. Rest of it's ehhh ok I suppose.

― frickin' username (fandango), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:11 (twenty years ago)

I guess Orthrelm and Sunno))) are as metal as Pitchfork gets. It would have been nice to see Opeth on there - I thought Pitchfork was supposed to like Prog Metal - doesn't King Crimson do well on their Best of the '70s Lists? I guess they draw the line at death metal growls.

― o. nate (onate), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:13 (twenty years ago)

Not bad, was there ever any doubt that Sufjan wouldn't be number one?

― Jeff-Beetle (Jeff), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:14 (twenty years ago)

I listened to at least a whole hour of Sufjan... shit boring. I cannot discern the life, or essentialness in his songs at all. The arrangements were sort of accomplished, but completely lacking surprise.

I don't get the critical mass over someone like Smog, or Bonnie Prince Billy one bit.

― frickin' username (fandango), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:14 (twenty years ago)

schreiber included enslaved on his list, so let's hear it for black metal! everything else is pretty much on the southern lord tip tho.

― blackmail.is.my.life (blackmail.is.my.life), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:16 (twenty years ago)

Art Brut aren't that bad... makes a change for Pitchfork to hype an English band this time.

Good luck selling them to the Arcade Fire/BSS market though. I mean, bit thin on the sonics aren't they?

― frickin' username (fandango), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:17 (twenty years ago)

I get confused between Surfjan and Devandra... which is the Jack Johnson clone with indie cred, and which is the one who sings how you might imagine internet child molestation hero Brian Peppers to sing?

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:18 (twenty years ago)

someday he may even get paid for it, folks

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:19 (twenty years ago)

I can maybe see Devendra being Brian-Peppers-voiced, but that Sufjan/Jack Johnson comparison is way off-base.

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:20 (twenty years ago)

I already do, bucko. And for something with a higher circulation than that local rag you churn out copy for.

(x-post)

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:24 (twenty years ago)

But, you know, keep up the internet hardman routine.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:24 (twenty years ago)

pretty weird that optimo's 'psyche out' made so many appearances on individual lists, just not high enough to place in the top 50...

― firstworldman (firstworldman), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:24 (twenty years ago)

I mean, you've been on a message board for a long time, that's a pretty impressive achievement.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:25 (twenty years ago)

'internet hardman routine'?

― 'Twan (miccio), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:27 (twenty years ago)

Why Aerial is not on my list, anyway = I didn't like it that much?

― nabisco in biblical-stoning shocker, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:27 (twenty years ago)

I mean, you've been on a message board for a long time, that's a pretty impressive achievement

I think you're on thin ice with that one, Dom!

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:27 (twenty years ago)

Hah, yeah, but it's not the top line of my CV, unlike Chuckles here.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:28 (twenty years ago)

i didn't know england had a penny saver

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:29 (twenty years ago)

there's a point where one's attempts to pwn another web denizen become self-reflexive

― 'Twan (miccio), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:29 (twenty years ago)

Art Brut #3? What a fucking joke. When anyone raises the spectre of M.I.A. being the most overrated thing in 2005, I know have a counterpoint for them.

― hector savage, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:30 (twenty years ago)

the circle of life

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:30 (twenty years ago)

I'd stick to you and Matos pulling off the Right Brothers routine, Jess. It's the most success you've had these past months.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:31 (twenty years ago)

is this some british sitcom from the mid-80s that you and two other people are laughing at right now?

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:31 (twenty years ago)

i mean, dom, i'm doing alright for myself these days. i wouldn't get too worked up.

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:32 (twenty years ago)

happiness is easy.

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:32 (twenty years ago)

CAN WE TALK ABOUT M.I.A. SOME MORE PLEASE

― mark p (Mark P), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:32 (twenty years ago)

like, her politics and stuff

― mark p (Mark P), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:33 (twenty years ago)

i really want the total alex in nyc-style meltdown though, mark

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:33 (twenty years ago)

'What gets MIA's home-made version of Missy Elliott's life-affirming dance-floor-scattering sex-funk gibberish over is the conceit that it's a vision of the tribalized world where, say, Islamic fundamentalists hear one of her jams on the radio and decide to forget all this jihadist hoo-ha and get booty loose.'

from the spin top 40 thread

― 'Twan (miccio), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:33 (twenty years ago)

i really want the total alex in nyc-style meltdown though, mark

You already had that a couple of years ago when your girl left you though?

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:34 (twenty years ago)

i guess i asked for that, didn't i

(xpost)

― mark p (Mark P), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:34 (twenty years ago)

so close, i can taste it

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:35 (twenty years ago)

That makes the blurb on Pitchfork's list look like Shakespeare.

xxpost

(as you were)

― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:35 (twenty years ago)

this is getting good.

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:37 (twenty years ago)

it's definitely making the work day go faster

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:38 (twenty years ago)

Why Aerial is not on my list, anyway = I didn't like it that much?

-- nabisco in biblical-stoning shocker

grr. I don't want to get into calling out individual lists or tastes, I hardly care THAT much! Hell, Pitchfork's list will almost certainly look incredibly adventurous in comparison to the NME or something (which sounds harsher than it's meant to be fwiw).

I like Pitchfork on the whole, but it's schmindie/fashion bias is nevertheless frustrating and often looks like a marketing tool, despite it being the product of a collective.

I probably feel how Geir feels that you ignored Paul McCartney... I can deal with that I guess :/

― frickin' username (fandango), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:39 (twenty years ago)

http://gr.bolt.com/oldsite/games/ps2/action/k1_world_grand_prix_rockem.jpg

― 'Twan (miccio), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:39 (twenty years ago)

http://www.mgm.com/mgm/images/box-vhs/SCANNERS-box_hires_vhs.jpg

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:40 (twenty years ago)

more like

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/b3/Hungry.jpg

amirite?

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:40 (twenty years ago)

so much for hakuna matata! i like this list. there's something for everyone, yet it somehow lends itself easily to the sort of supposed former chauvinism for which such lists are typically reviled! i guess this is how pluralists explain away things like media bias, etc. but i wonder how some of these discs will fare when they get american releases. serena maneesh is coming to philly in march, but i can't figure out if anyone really cares. championing superwolf is really nice, since it came out so long ago, making up for mu's absence, which also came out a long time ago.

― blackmail.is.my.life (blackmail.is.my.life), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:41 (twenty years ago)

http://www.swr3.de/fun/events/newpop2004/plakat/pix/new_pop_plakat.jpg

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:41 (twenty years ago)

Malky's Face the Truth is pretty good...i thought it was a nice mix of pig lib and swedish reggae...pencil rot is great....ditto post-paint boy.

― M@tt He1geson (Matt Helgeson), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:42 (twenty years ago)

both out of breach (january) and aerial (november) were robbed, for sure

― mark p (Mark P), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:43 (twenty years ago)

I can understand Ellen Allien not making it this time (less well recieved across the board, little crossover appeal, "electropop" less zeitgeisty in general) or The White Stripes (too easy to include, split reception on if it was an improvement on the previous).

Aerial missing just boggles me though...

Anyone got the sub-Top 50 list incidentally?

― frickin' username (fandango), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:46 (twenty years ago)

OK, now I know that Stylus actually have Aerial on their Top 50...Pitchdork's list is looking crappier now just for not including it.

More importantly, Dommy P is turning this into LOL City.

― ESTEBAN BUTTEZ~!!, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:47 (twenty years ago)

and here i thought this thread was suffering from an acute case of lolzheimer's! xpost

― blackmail.is.my.life (blackmail.is.my.life), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:48 (twenty years ago)

It's funny how every year (across sites, not just Pitchfork) the Top Ten of these things always seems both the least interesting and most characteristic of where the list came from.

I am super happy Isolee made it so high, that's definitely a record I haven't heard ANY buzz about outside of ILM, and not even that much in dance circles either. It deserves the extra exposure.

― frickin' username (fandango), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:52 (twenty years ago)

Jess, Dom is successful... he writes for Stylus! xxxxpost

― regular roundups (Dave M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 17:59 (twenty years ago)

is custos passantino normally this whiny or just when people mention websites people actually read?

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:02 (twenty years ago)

Fair play to Stylus, they still have three days to salvage their year...

― ESTEBAN BUTTEZ~!!, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:04 (twenty years ago)

...or continue being a self-parody. Their call.

― ESTEBAN BUTTEZ~!!, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:04 (twenty years ago)

No red Sparowes, dEUS, lightning bolt , high on fire, low, wilderness or jesu?

Bah.

― Last Of The Famous International Pfunkboys (Kerr), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:06 (twenty years ago)

i know broken social scene wasn't as widely accepted this time around, but I thought it at least crack the top 50. surprised to see it missing. and where was Caribou?

― Tynan DeLong (TynanTynan!), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:07 (twenty years ago)

is custos passantino normally this whiny or just when people mention websites people actually read?

Hey Jess, your cheerleader has shown up!

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:09 (twenty years ago)

http://www.anatol.org/images/china/china1/images/man-with-pitchfork.jpg
http://www.gicf.cqdweb.co.uk/Printpics/JimmyCarr.jpg

Jess v. Dom

― regular roundups (Dave M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:10 (twenty years ago)

I already do, bucko. And for something with a higher circulation than that local rag you churn out copy for.

Hmmm.

Lancaster University total number of students: 10,000
Baltim0re City P4per circulation: 86,000

Alexa ranking for Stylus: #43,764
Alexa ranking for Pitchfork: #5,140

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:14 (twenty years ago)

custos passantino ladies and gents! as enjoyed by "dozens" of stylus readers! and perhaps one day an actual woman! perhaps!

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:15 (twenty years ago)

Bizarre Magazine ABC figures: 88,000

Thanks for playing.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:15 (twenty years ago)

DOM LIKES WRESTLING!

NO CREDIBILITY THEN!

― ESTEBAN BUTTEZ~!!, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:16 (twenty years ago)

No Om?

― mcd (mcd), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:16 (twenty years ago)

how many of bizarre's readers actually know how to read? and is this number greater than the annual number of non-stylus writers that actually read stylus?

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:17 (twenty years ago)

I happened upon this magazine ...once, and when I picked it up, I couldn't put it back down. Any magazine that has articles on amputee soccer teams along side articles on the best places to have public sex in Britain is one for me. Sure, it's often vulgar and there are many pictures (and words, for that matter) that you wouldn't want junior looking at, but for the adult interested in the obscure and weird things that other publications will not touch, get Bizarre!!! I subscribe to a lot of magazines on a variety of topics, and this is the only one that gets read cover to cover every month. They take the most stirring and powerful pictures and the kind of stories that other organizations wouldn't even think of, and package it all up into the best magazine on either side of the Atlantic! Even the letters page is a hoot... I just can't say enough about Bizarre! Try it and see!

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:18 (twenty years ago)

http://www.bizarremag.com/

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:18 (twenty years ago)

Bizarre "Fetish and Fantasy" Magazine is a unique fetish publication. Bizarre Magazine allows readers to stay up-to-date on what's going on in the fetish scene with the best fetish photography, classic pin-up artists and the hottest nude fetish models.

?????????

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:20 (twenty years ago)

Sorry, xpost????

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:20 (twenty years ago)

custos passantino : mia :: julie burchill : missy :: custos omicron : mc lyte

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:20 (twenty years ago)

i love a good pissing contest about writing

― 6335, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:22 (twenty years ago)

i'm not sure you could call what custos p does 'writing' exactly

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:23 (twenty years ago)

"about writing"

― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:23 (twenty years ago)

i mean 'writing' implies it might eventually be read

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:23 (twenty years ago)

me, i love a good writing contest about pissing.

― joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:24 (twenty years ago)

ow!

― 6335, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:25 (twenty years ago)

you'll want to read bizarre magazine then joseph!

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:25 (twenty years ago)

Hahahaha

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:25 (twenty years ago)

After coming up with rhythms, riffs and lyrics, I can see how a band would be tempted to say, fuck the vocal melodies, let's just talk. I can respect that, but I'd never rank Art Brut and The Hold Steady in my top 50. I like a good story or joke, but they're only good the first time around. They're just not good for repeat listens.

I think they're buying into Art Brut's sneering outsider status to make up for the embarrssment of rating Interpol and Rapture #1. So they ignore Editors, who improved on Interpol. While they might have obvious influences, so do Wolf Parade and Kanye. I liked Sufjan's Greetings from Michigan, but lately he's a real snore. Meanwhile, My Computer, The Rakes, Field Music, Maximo Park and Dogs are left out in the cold because UK music isn't trendy at the moment. The lack of key metal and Brazilian albums make Pitchfork's scope seem pretty limited.

But no matter how you slice it, it looks like the weakest year in music since about 1992.

― Fastnbulbous (Fastnbulbous), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:26 (twenty years ago)

i think i've seen an issue once. it was disgusting in a strangely boring way (this from someone who kinda enjoys VICE)

― joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:26 (twenty years ago)

Editors improving on Interpol = Stalin improving on Lenin.

― joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:27 (twenty years ago)

The man with a fanny struts his stuff

hahahahahahaha, oh my god! i read about this in savage love about a month ago.

but seriously, everybody has a fanny amirite?

― regular roundups (Dave M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:29 (twenty years ago)

They're just not good for repeat listens.

Uh, that's exactly what makes Art Brut so great. They've defied that rule for months now, at least for me.

― marc h. (marc h.), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:30 (twenty years ago)

The only non-boring track on the Art Brut I found was "Good Weekend." Their sounds just has a very middle range quality to me, but maybe that was just the production. No, it wasn't.

― regular roundups (Dave M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:37 (twenty years ago)

should sufjan's 20 really be above deerhoof's 20?

― mox twelve (Mox twleve), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:40 (twenty years ago)

(the answer is no)

― mox twelve (Mox twleve), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:40 (twenty years ago)

Listening to "Formed A Band" right now. Will delete track as soon as it's over. Yawn.

― joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:41 (twenty years ago)

Holy shit, this thread got awesome for a while.

― Dan (TO THE DEATH) Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:45 (twenty years ago)

And yet even the famed Nick of Sylvester hated Art Brut on first listen...

― marc h. (marc h.), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:45 (twenty years ago)

re: it looks like the weakest year in music since about 1992.

-- Fastnbulbous

I KNOW 1992 was thr weakest year for albums in the past 3 decades - but the weakest year since 92? now that's a bold statement to make !

― DJ Martian (djmartian), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:48 (twenty years ago)

[3 songs in] Dear God, Art Brut are basically a British King Missile!

― joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:49 (twenty years ago)

I know that "This was the worst year for music since X" statements are purely subjective, but 2005 >>>> 2004 for me and I'm surprised that more people don't feel that way.

― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:51 (twenty years ago)

Things that >>>>>>>>> Art Brut:

Okkervil River
Shakira's hips
men with fannies
The actual Ramones
the idea of Art Brut

― regular roundups (Dave M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:54 (twenty years ago)

Also, how does something as boring as LCD Soundsystem happen to end up at the top of so many lists? Is it really just the lyrical handjobs he gives music critic types?

― regular roundups (Dave M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:56 (twenty years ago)

not just

― 'Twan (miccio), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:57 (twenty years ago)

what else?

― regular roundups (Dave M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:58 (twenty years ago)

more verse-chorus-verse than most beatstuff, sounds like the fall ten years ago, which worked for pavement.

― 'Twan (miccio), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 18:58 (twenty years ago)

not a fan of either, so i guess an appeal to that axis would justifiably be lost on me.

― regular roundups (Dave M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:01 (twenty years ago)

the fall ten years ago of pavements time was a bit stronger than the fall ten years ago of lcd soundsystem's time.

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:02 (twenty years ago)

I know that "This was the worst year for music since X" statements are purely subjective, but 2005 >>>> 2004 for me and I'm surprised that more people don't feel that way.

-- NoTimeBeforeTime

2005 >>> 2004 for me too. Not by as huge a margin as I thought initially though (caught up on some nice stuff I missed at the time).

― frickin' username (fandango), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:03 (twenty years ago)

It's the same year! (Franz Ferdinand, Mountain Goats, M.I.A., Kanye, etc)

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:07 (twenty years ago)

how the hell is "Wolf Parade [...] so low"?

It's a debut, and it's in the Top Ten ffs!

― frickin' username (fandango), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:10 (twenty years ago)

i almost sad i had to go a work holiday party.

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:12 (twenty years ago)

you finally fuck that intern?

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:13 (twenty years ago)

http://www.boingboing.net/images/_photos_uncategorized_mysterydate.jpg

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:14 (twenty years ago)

[CONTROVERSIAL MOD EDIT]

― Alex in Baltimore (Alex in Baltimore), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:16 (twenty years ago)

:-o

― mark p (Mark P), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:17 (twenty years ago)

hahahahahahahaha

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:17 (twenty years ago)

jess is on some bill o'reilly shit

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:18 (twenty years ago)

haha i just want to retract myself from this conversation completely at this point

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:18 (twenty years ago)

(to fact check a lyric quote in one of my articles, I should clarify) (xpost)

― Alex in Baltimore (Alex in Baltimore), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:18 (twenty years ago)

haha no seriously though are you in the office? I should come by and pick up those CDs I dropped off.

― Alex in Baltimore (Alex in Baltimore), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:19 (twenty years ago)

haha yeah i should be here til about 5 or so.

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:19 (twenty years ago)

knock before you go in, though

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:23 (twenty years ago)

HA!

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:24 (twenty years ago)

hahaha i think i like the controversial mod edit better now

― Alex in Baltimore (Alex in Baltimore), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:25 (twenty years ago)

it does add a certain mystery.

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:26 (twenty years ago)

Geez, WTF: I spent weird amounts of this year reviewing reissues and feeling desperately old, but some of y'all are sounding positively dust-dry and crow-picked! Waah, Art Brut don't have fresh guitar parts, waah, Art Brut are kind of funny and talky, waah -- have y'all no memory of being 15? What other acts' songs are high-school bands that barely know power chords gonna play in their parents' garages? And laugh at and quote to each other? What could possibly be better for crushed-out 15-year-old bicycling than hearing Eddie Argos sing "Emily Kane?" And what does it say about that band that this is not just me admitting teenage-me would have liked it, but 2005-me actually liking it like a teenager? Don't try to break it down into a bunch of critic-categories of what they're doing -- genre, sonics, chops, etc. This is about the spirit and the humor and the incredible not-even-funny things to say (the firework teenage joy in the "I've seen her naked," for God's sake). I like that well enough to be baffled by haters, because I suspect similar haters in years past were probably saying the same thing about, say, the Violent Femmes ("their sound's so tinny, man! and that guy's voice is all froggy!") and -- obviously -- missing the point entirely.

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:26 (twenty years ago)

Things that >>>>>>>>> Art Brut:
Okkervil River
Shakira's hips
men with fannies
The actual Ramones
the idea of Art Brut

you forgot 'the entire world'

(the firework teenage joy in the "I've seen her naked," for God's sake)

!!! nabisco i genuinely think that's the worst, most nauseating lyric i heard this year (OH apart from that terrible killers soul/soldier one): it's creepy and disgusting.

― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:36 (twenty years ago)

No way man, Violent Femmes were excellent musicians. They deserved the hype, at least on the first album. They overemoted and were nearly embarrassingly nerdy and demented. And keeping in line with a band more similar to Art Brut, I liked Dead Milkmen too, but I never rated them #3..

― Fastnbulbous (Fastnbulbous), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:39 (twenty years ago)

I worry that there's this quality called "personality," and we've gotten so damned knowing about everything that we actually see past it as if it's always contrived to distract us from some underlying "substance" -- right until something comes along that's actually insane all-personality, and everyone's like "What? The riffs sound pretty basic."

xpost

LEX what the fuck, have you no soul??? You are honestly telling me you have no memory of / appreciation for the very pure teenagey sentiment of being deliriously happy about reaching new levels of intimacy, both for emotional and sexual purposes??? You are honestly telling me you prefer the ongoing act of every other band ever, which is more or less that they could care less about seeing people naked, cause, like, whatever, just suck it??? He's dating a girl! He likes her! They got naked! He's overjoyed -- it's a boon and a cherished accomplishment!

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:43 (twenty years ago)

why's "ive seen her naked" disgusting?

― petesmith (plsmith), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:43 (twenty years ago)

If Art Brut go Xian like the Femmes, I'll maybe listen to it.

― detoxyDancer (sexyDancer), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:43 (twenty years ago)

I think Art Brut need to up their speed.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:43 (twenty years ago)

yeah - word.

― petesmith (plsmith), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:44 (twenty years ago)

He can't believe his good luck! He has to repeat it twice, not even so much to you as to himself!

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:44 (twenty years ago)

the lex is gay lol

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:45 (twenty years ago)

Lex is gay in one sense of the term, and Art Brut are gay in the other two.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:46 (twenty years ago)

nabisco not otm : (

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:46 (twenty years ago)

I didn't value "teenage joy" in songwriting while in my teens, and I'm sure as hell not starting now.

― joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:48 (twenty years ago)

LEX what the fuck, have you no soul???

He's got soul, but he's not a soldier.

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:49 (twenty years ago)

nitsuh remember when i used to say all this stuff and then we "talked"?

― Nick Sylvester, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:49 (twenty years ago)

I didn't value "teenage joy" in songwriting while in my teens, and I'm sure as hell not starting now.

What about Nizlopi!

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:49 (twenty years ago)

I still think Eddie Argos's voice sounds like this comedy-British accent I did on a song I recorded when I was 16.

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:49 (twenty years ago)

nabisco, it's the way he says it. i don't get the impression that he's seen her naked twice because they've reached new levels of intimacy together, i think it's because he's been spying on her in the showers. because i am convinced that every self-respecting female would rather chew her own clitoris off than go back to mr art brut for seconds.

also when he sings it, he completely fails to hit whatever notes he's aiming for. which means it's sonically distressing as well as completely ewww.

― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:50 (twenty years ago)

INSOUCIANCE IS SEXXXY!

― petesmith (plsmith), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:54 (twenty years ago)

it's creepy and disgusting

it's rock and roll!

― Lukas (lukas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:55 (twenty years ago)

What other acts' songs are high-school bands that barely know power chords gonna play in their parents' garages?

You don't seem to understand that the sound of a garage band is a sound of underqualified ambition, not conscious primitivism! Nobody picks up a guitar and starts covering Moldy Peaches - people pick up a guitar and start off sounding like Moldy Peaches.

― joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:56 (twenty years ago)

Not anymore, olde fart. WELCUM 2 TEH FUTURE.

― detoxyDancer (sexyDancer), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 19:58 (twenty years ago)

― joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:02 (twenty years ago)

i like how all the people who are like "no i totally get art brut and they totally suck" actually don't get art brut

guys there's nothing to get! that's the thing! maybe stop trying to approach it as music-qua-music? for me at least it's much more about music-qua-expression, music-qua-jumping the gap between what is/how one feels vs. what can be said about what is/how one feels, etc. you can say "well then they still could have written better guitar parts" or whatever, but thing is i wonder the extent to which that would have distracted from each song's singularity, thrust of purpose. he's not writing songs for them to be enjoyed, he's writing them to communicate really simple, but still utterly complex moments that (as nitsuh spelled out but everybody jumped on "teenage joy") most if not all people have had to deal with

ok more stuff about chewing clits

― Nick Sylvester, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:03 (twenty years ago)

Well, when he sings it, it reminds me of the first time I kissed [insert name] and then walked all the way home smiling like an idiot thinking "I kissed [insert name]! Multiple times! I kissed [insert name]! With tongue! Multiple times!"

I dunno, one thing I miss about the modes of fandom that first got me into music was that there wasn't some ascetic division between "personality" and "substance." E.g. it's the Smiths' songwriting quality that keeps me able to cherish those records today, but what first made me love them had much less to do with "substance" stuff than what they represented and stood for to me -- that was what they "meant," and what mattered much more than the freshness and complexity of the guitar lines, or whatever. This year Art Brut were a strong and obvious reminder of how that kind of thing can work; I hope I'll be seeing at least a few more subtle versions of the same thing at work over the next few years.

xpost Mr. Cotten I understand all about the sound of crappy teenage garage bands -- I was in plenty of them! And when we wanted something to cover, we looked exactly to songs like the ones Art Brut sings -- songs where the music is rudimentary and easy to fool with, songs where it's not so much about "the music" and all about the personality, songs where you can just play the power chords really fast and it's still all about the joy of what you're saying and embodying. I've talked plenty on here about mistaking the way music sounds naturally when you don't know what you're doing; that's not the point. The point is that there's a special quality to the funny awesome songs you learn even back when you can only play six chords, because the "song" isn't in the chords and is all about the thing itself.

(Why do I feel like I'm explaining punk now?)

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:04 (twenty years ago)

CAN WE TALK ABOUT CIRC RATES QUA CIRC RATES SOME MORE PLEASE

― mark p (Mark P), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:07 (twenty years ago)

Nitsuh, I understand what you're saying and I think it's great, but I just don't get that with Art Brut, which is why I said, "the idea of Art Brut>>>>>Art Brut." I even love the personality of bands like The Smiths and Violent Femmes as much as I love the "substance" of the music. I think what a band means to you can be a very important and even overwelming part of what you like about them, but I really just don't like Art Brut's music. The only song I truly feel what you're saying in regards to them is "Good Weekend," which, to be fair, is the one you're quoting. Having you explain this stuff even kind of makes me want to listen to Art Brut again while being attentive to this kind of stuff, but I also don't think we should force ourselves to listen to bands we feel we don't like until we "get it" in the ways it has been explained to us. This definitely harkens back to arguments of, "Anyone can like any band given enough time, etc." To whatever extent this could be true for me wrt Art Brut given how much I enjoy the idea that your argument is proposing, I don't feel like I could love them, and I guess what I'm saying is I don't feel like I have to in order to appreciate "personality" or the kind of simple pleasures you describe.

I have no idea if any of this made sense. I hope you know what I mean.

― regular roundups (Dave M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:27 (twenty years ago)

E.g. it's the Smiths' songwriting quality that keeps me able to cherish those records today, but what first made me love them had much less to do with "substance" stuff than what they represented and stood for to me

exactly the same for me and tori amos.

except art brut fail on both counts - what they represent is completely off-putting to me, and they sound terrible while representing it.

― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:28 (twenty years ago)

Modern Lovers to thread

except still different because Jonathan Richman has a certain distinctive aesthetic and not an easily imitable, revivable "sound," so it's not like Art Brut are to ML what Interpol were to JD

regular: i think (hope) you'll find the songs have more to them than you'd guess from the sonics, including the telling lyric "why don't our parents worry about us?" and absurdist closer "18,000 Lira" (wtf?!) all within a relatively simple, if subtle, narrative structure

― marc h. (marc h.), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:29 (twenty years ago)

I guess what surprises me is how ape Pitchfork has gone for this, whilst the rest of the world... hasn't.

Even last years hypes seemed to have a little genuine following here & there. I've only heard the singles here anyhow, I might even check this out (although it's probably going to be more a case of it being inescapable from now on), I'm not *that* cynical as to write it off being good. That's what these lists should be for ideally.

It just feels a little like a reaction to previous years hypes by being nothing unique or 'heavy' musically, and deliberately anti-hip.

My previous encounters with their music = "the idea of Art Brut>>>>>Art Brut" I have to agree.

I think that lyrics kind of funny, I have no problem with it.

― frickin' username (fandango), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:30 (twenty years ago)

Maybe they're the new Pavement or something.

― frickin' username (fandango), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:32 (twenty years ago)

however: I also don't think we should force ourselves to listen to bands we feel we don't like until we "get it" in the ways it has been explained to us

this is particularly true of art brut, i would think, given that getting it should involve mindless, embarrasingly tough-to-explain enthusiasm... then again, what say you, nick?

― marc h. (marc h.), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:33 (twenty years ago)

The impression I get Nitsuh is that Art Brut are nostalgic for that kind of joy and are de-complicating it, and I think you might be nostalgically de-complicating it a bit too.

I think I'd have disliked Art Brut at 15 and liked them at 25 missing being 15, and now I'm nearer 35 than either of those ages I think, "Well, um, Jilted John is kind of truer. And funnier." (and also that TONS of music expresses complex things simply and truely, that's lots of why we listen to music.)

On the other hand part of the reason I'd have disliked Art Brut at 15 is that I'd never seen ANYONE naked. So maybe the bitter 15-year-old in me is still bitter at a distance.

(Seeing Eddie Argos perform inspired the greatest karaoke performance of my life, though, so respect for that.)

― Tom (Groke), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:35 (twenty years ago)

They remind me a bit of Helen Love, who I also can't stand, so I may just have a problem with indie types being happy.

― Tom (Groke), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:36 (twenty years ago)

Art Brut: Ian Dury without the funk?

― frickin' username (fandango), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:39 (twenty years ago)

my only problem with art brut the one time i heard the album is the hooks didn't really grab me and it seemed very very 'are you enjoying our LYRICS?'. seemed very much a rock album.

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:39 (twenty years ago)

And I think the feeling of "mindless, embarrassingly tough-to-explain enthusiasm" is hard to get if you don't get it from the first couple of listens, marc. So part of what I'm saying is definitely that Art Brut "just don't do it for me." Although, I too am interested in hearing how Nick parses this issue out.

xpost

― regular roundups (Dave M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:40 (twenty years ago)

don't be a curmudgeon, tom.

xpost: haha blount i think art brut might be the hold steady for those of us suspicious of classic rock.

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:41 (twenty years ago)

it seemed very very 'are you enjoying our LYRICS?'.

Hah god yes. One thing I've realised since I got a LiveJournal is that there are still an awful lot of bands around who write 'good lyrics'. Art Brut far, far from the worst offenders.

― Tom (Groke), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:42 (twenty years ago)

franz ferdinand are a horrific offender on that particular front.

― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:44 (twenty years ago)

for some reason i don't mind it when nellie mckay does it though (poss because her lyrics are actually funny)

― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:45 (twenty years ago)

people be excusin excesses in sounds they like

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:46 (twenty years ago)

I'll take Art Brut lyrically over anything Pete Doherty's shat out of his crack-addled visons of being the Romantic Poet of Albion that's for sure.

― frickin' username (fandango), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:46 (twenty years ago)

One thing I've realised since I got a LiveJournal...

Ha ha, Tom, maybe it's something I will understand when I actually reach your age, but I don't feel like any self-respecting thirty-five year old should start a sentence this way.

― regular roundups (Dave M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:46 (twenty years ago)

not so much the sound, jess, i excuse nellie more because she's a more sympathetic protagonist

― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:47 (twenty years ago)

I have trouble feeling too much of a split between Art Brut and Jilted John, really, except that (a) Jilted John feels much more distanced/removed from the subject matter, but also (b) the Jilted John LP has all those great keyboard lines involved.

Possibly if Art Brut covered "Goodbye, Karen" and the Gordon-the-Moron songs we could all be happy.

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:47 (twenty years ago)

people be excusin excesses in sounds they like
OTM

― regular roundups (Dave M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:48 (twenty years ago)

americans going crazy over babyshambles would actually have made marginally more sense

― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:48 (twenty years ago)

people be differing on how they like their irony

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:49 (twenty years ago)

Also Jilted John was constantly losing, except in the one song where he gets Karen -- and then in the next song he loses her anyway. Argos is almost anti-indie: he's pleased, he embraces his successes! He wants to immortalize Emily Kane in popular milkman-whistled song! I will shut up about this now.

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:50 (twenty years ago)

i mean, i understand where yr coming from lex, but yr not really offering any qualitative reasons why art brut is "worse" than nellie mckay (which i would think was a bullshit position anyway, as "better" and "worse" doesnt really do anything for me).

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:51 (twenty years ago)

Good grief Tom, why on earth are you running a livejournal when you have all of FT to play with?

(I've never heard art brut, fwiw)

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:52 (twenty years ago)

anyway, i just want to say that nitsuh is repeatedly otm here and i am so glad i don't have to deal with any british class/chart baggage in enjoying their music, as much as they don't have to worry about the difference between nickelback and my chemical romance.

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:52 (twenty years ago)

i had this professor in college who claimed the movie psycho was quite literally about how "money = feces", based on how Marion Crane's license plate having the first three letters of "ANL" and how the money was flushed down the toilet.

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:52 (twenty years ago)

lots of insight into landau's "woman's intuition" line in north by northwest, too

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:53 (twenty years ago)

art brut are basically the british thermals with more of a pose. (which is probably why i like them.)

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:54 (twenty years ago)

hmm see they didn't seem that, um, propulsive when i heard but i guess i'll give it another shot maybe.

omg gear i'm totally gonna steal yr prof's theory. plz more details.

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:57 (twenty years ago)

who the hell is art brut?

― Susan Douglas (Susan Douglas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:58 (twenty years ago)

yes yes very good

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:58 (twenty years ago)

people be differing on the value of qualitative reasons!

― marc h. (marc h.), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:58 (twenty years ago)

it wouldn't be a particularly useful comparison given that they operate completely differently - the deliberately clever-clever lyrics are really the only similarity, and i'm not actually familiar with art brut's lyrics beyond that awful line we've been discussing. and there i prefer nellie cos she's funny, and art brut/franz ferdinand are clunky.

also, i don't think british people are dealing with any class/chart baggage here! art brut don't get into the charts (actually they may well do but i don't know what goes on in the charts these days) and i've no idea what class they are. possibly we suffer from a surfeit of similar stuff, there'd be british howls of protest whichever token british indie act the americans picked up on this year.

― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 20:59 (twenty years ago)

and i'm not actually familiar with art brut's lyrics beyond that awful line we've been discussing. and there i prefer nellie cos she's funny, and art brut/franz ferdinand are clunky.

???

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:01 (twenty years ago)

Dom pwned by blount, Dom retreats, meltdown averted.

― Dom de dom dom, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:01 (twenty years ago)

Shame that Drones record didn't make it onto their top 50. The biggest service that Pitchfork paid to me all year was introducing me to that phenomenal record.

Don't get the CYHSY and Sufjan Stevens love. I gave both a fair shake and both of them flatlined for me.

― Brooker Buckingham (Brooker B), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:02 (twenty years ago)

I'm not really gonna argue with the appropriate "clever lyrics" tag, except insofar as the idea that, e.g., a song that goes "my little brother's just discovered rock'n'roll" is "clever" -- as opposed to kind of ground-level reality -- well, this idea probably says more about music that isn't Art Brut's than it does about music that is. Why don't your parents worry about you, eh?

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:04 (twenty years ago)

the bog into which marion crane's car was submerged looked a lot like shit!

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:05 (twenty years ago)

Shame that Drones record didn't make it onto their top 50.

omg the drones were actually the worst live act i saw in the whole of the year, possibly my life.

― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:06 (twenty years ago)

true story: i have seen the psycho remake and all the psycho sequels (evne the showtime prequel one) but never seen psycho. it any good?

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:09 (twenty years ago)

Cary Grant captured by James Mason's cronies, led into his office, Mason sizes him up, not because he thinks he's a government agent, but because he thinks he's a government agent and WANTS TO HAVE GAY SEX WITH HIM

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:09 (twenty years ago)

Hahahaha I think the real reason Dom got so steamed on this thread is because it looks like Pitchfork editorial solicited for blurbs AFTER figuring out how the entries placed on the list, meaning that instead of having all of the enthusiastic superlative-filled entries in the middle of the list, the piece builds momentum up until it seems that the top ten really are the top ten as opposed to feeling like the mediocre mean of common intersection of divergent tastes.

― Dan (Also He Really, Really Hates Pitchfork And Certain ILMers) Perry (Dan Perry, Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:09 (twenty years ago)

psycho is great!

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:09 (twenty years ago)

i heard art brut are like the 2nd biggest selling band in germany at the mo or something?

― hold tight the private caller (mwah), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:10 (twenty years ago)

in shadow of a doubt, teresa wright greets joseph cotten at the train station. in the shot where they embrace, his umbrella moves upward behind her AS IF IT WERE AN ERECT PENIS FUCKING HER

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:10 (twenty years ago)

gear - whered you go to college? i had a hitchcock class too!

― petesmith (plsmith), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:10 (twenty years ago)

"uncle charlie wants a piece of his niece" was the sub-title of a paper i wrote for the class

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:11 (twenty years ago)

fordham u, lincoln center for a year

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:11 (twenty years ago)

rear window: stewart's broken leg LOOKS LIKE A COCOONED, IMPOTENT COCK

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:12 (twenty years ago)

Why does no one love Oneida?

Is Sufjan Stevens more interesting than this makes him sound?

― Sundar (sundar), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:12 (twenty years ago)

more gear plz plz plz

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:13 (twenty years ago)

I never said AB's lyrics were 'clever' Nitsuh. You seem to feel AB's lyrics as a direct line to "ground-level reality", I feel them as a kind of cel-shaded version of g-l-r and they don't make that connection for me.

xpost this thread moves too fast for my old bones.

― Tom (Groke), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:13 (twenty years ago)

strangers on a train: mama's boy/gay psycho falls for tennis pro, is betrayed by him

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:14 (twenty years ago)

i heard art brut are like the 2nd biggest selling band in germany at the mo or something?

-- hold tight the private caller

http://www.schnappi.tv/static/imgs_cards/herz_thumb.gif

― frickin' username (fandango), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:14 (twenty years ago)

marnie: sean connery RAPES THE SHIT out of marnie in the guise of saving her. also: possibly misdirected gayness

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:15 (twenty years ago)

Norman Bates says "falsity" instead of "fallacy" because he can't bring himself to pronounce even the sound of "phallus."

― detoxyDancer (sexyDancer), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:15 (twenty years ago)

the birds: PROMISCUOUS WOMAN COMES TO TOWN, RECKLESSLY ENTICES LOCAL DUDE (and lesbo suzanne pleshette) and then PAYS FOR IT VIA KARMIC PECKING. ORDER: RESTORED! WOMAN: TAMED!

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:16 (twenty years ago)

No, Tom, I was directing the "clever" thing more at the Lex. And I don't think "clever" is inaccurate (or kinda 2-D cartoony, as you're painting it). The distinction I'm interested in is maybe between "clever" things that only refer to themselves (which I don't think Art Brut are) and "clever" things that aim whatever cleverness at real human basics (which I do think Art Brut are.) Basically I'd hate for anyone to hear their lyrics are "clever" and think they're all jokes and imaginary scenarios and character-studies of alien politicians or whatever people do these days -- I guess we both agree they're at least aimed at some common reality (whether the depiction is complex or not).

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:17 (twenty years ago)

what's topkapi about? sincere question

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:18 (twenty years ago)

rope: nuff said.

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:18 (twenty years ago)

Hahahaha I think the real reason Dom got so steamed on this thread is because it looks like Pitchfork editorial solicited for blurbs AFTER figuring out how the entries placed on the list, meaning that instead of having all of the enthusiastic superlative-filled entries in the middle of the list, the piece builds momentum up until it seems that the top ten really are the top ten as opposed to feeling like the mediocre mean of common intersection of divergent tastes.

I've not actually looked at the list yet, other than Martian's invaluable repost of it upthread.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:19 (twenty years ago)

notorious: claude rains FUCKS HIS MOM but then GETS A REAL GIRL. mom gets suspicious and jealous, son finds out new girl's a spy, realizes MOM IS RIGHT and also SEXY AGAIN

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:19 (twenty years ago)

vertigo: jimmy stewart is crazy!

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:20 (twenty years ago)

are there any a2m hitch flix?

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:20 (twenty years ago)

Dom, I was kidding (and referencing the silly argument from the Stylus thread)!

― Dan (It's Okay To Smile) Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:20 (twenty years ago)

dude - i wrote a paper on shadow of a doubt in my hitchcock class at maryland, too. did you guys watch frenzy? that movie is awesome.

― petesmith (plsmith), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:21 (twenty years ago)

yeah, but it was a scene cut out of family plot. devane screws some chick and then she a2ms him

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:22 (twenty years ago)

devane you magnificent bastard!

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:22 (twenty years ago)

"Art Brut" sounds like the name of a particularly noxious patchouli-esque scent.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:23 (twenty years ago)

Why does no one love Oneida?

i love oneida, but the wedding wasnt their best.

― petesmith (plsmith), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:23 (twenty years ago)

"have you ever...tasted...it...post...backside?"

http://www.thecolumnists.com/miller/miller18updateart3.jpg

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:28 (twenty years ago)

Hahahaha I think the real reason Dom got so steamed on this thread is because it looks like Pitchfork editorial solicited for blurbs AFTER figuring out how the entries placed on the list, meaning that instead of having all of the enthusiastic superlative-filled entries in the middle of the list, the piece builds momentum up until it seems that the top ten really are the top ten as opposed to feeling like the mediocre mean of common intersection of divergent tastes.

That is what happened. Also, now that we can assign points to our choices, you don't get the Rapture winding up as #1.

― save the robot (save the robot), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:38 (twenty years ago)

I'm not sure how you'd assign blurbs BEFORE figuring out how the entries placed on the list, at least not without either wasting time or traveling through it.

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:40 (twenty years ago)

Hahahaha I am so not peeling off that scab regardless of how funny it is when Dom starts ranting!

― Dan (Check The Stylus End-Of-Year Thread) Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:43 (twenty years ago)

where is the stylus end of year thead again? (I read it, but missed the lolz)

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:44 (twenty years ago)

They were only really lolz to me because I made what I thought was a minor point in an admittedly heavy-handed manner and then snickered at the defensiveness (also Dom didn't really rant on that thread, nothing like what happened here):

For your consideration - stylus' 2005 singles list

― Dan (And So On) Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:48 (twenty years ago)

(Actually my favorite part of the thread is the "Madonna: CAN SHE SING?" throwdown.)

― Dan (Easily LOLled) Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:50 (twenty years ago)

Let's restart the argument, Don!

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:51 (twenty years ago)

DOM + DAN = DON

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:54 (twenty years ago)

You've just given me stomach acid.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:55 (twenty years ago)

I like Oneida lots. And the Occasion.

― joseph cotten (joseph cotten), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:55 (twenty years ago)

DON PERRANTINO

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:56 (twenty years ago)

haha. Vowels are silly things.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:57 (twenty years ago)

(although the slip was no doubt Freudian)

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:58 (twenty years ago)

http://identitytheory.com/idgraphics/vowell05_2.jpg

"HEY!"

― Sarah Vowell (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 21:58 (twenty years ago)

Dom D-Dom Dom. Dom D-Dom Dom DOM!!!

(=easily aggrevated amirite?)

― regular roundups (Dave M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 22:01 (twenty years ago)

Is that "Connection" by Elastica?

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 22:03 (twenty years ago)

Haha funny shit esp 1/that madonna clip and 2/ blount on fire again.

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 22:06 (twenty years ago)

One thing I've realised since I got a LiveJournal is that there are still an awful lot of bands around who write 'good lyrics'. Art Brut far, far from the worst offenders.

-- Tom (freakytrigge...), December 20th, 2005.

franz ferdinand are a horrific offender on that particular front.

-- The Lex (alex.macpherso...), December 20th, 2005.

It's only necessary for postmodern music to have lyrics that are "good" in some kind of traditional literary sense if the aesthetic of the particular postmodern concept the band is aiming for requires it, though. Seems like Franz Ferdinand are an easy target for criticisms of this sort because their style has more to do with musics that, in the past, one might have judged on the literary quality of the lyrics (i.e., the Fall = good; some other band = not as good).

― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 22:11 (twenty years ago)

art brut are basically the british thermals with more of a pose.

otm. I think I had the same thought first time I heard Art Brut. Anyway, if AB is what's wrong with the pfork list, that's ok. I mean, they are different, they have a little spunk, a little energy, joie de vivre. This list is FULL of middle of the road albums by decent bands who were much more exciting the first time around (Franz Ferd, Sleater-Kinney, Spoon, Clientele, New Pornographers, Animal Collective, Decemberists, Bonnie Billy, ad infinitum), not that everything has to be new to be good, but ok a little energy please. Doesn't this stark fact bore anyone else to tears?

oh man way too slow for this thread xpost

― mcd (mcd), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 22:12 (twenty years ago)

the sleater-kinney is hardly more of the same from them

― j blount (papa la bas), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 22:13 (twenty years ago)

Has anyone heard this Keith Fullerton Whitman Multiples disc that Drew Daniel raves about? Sounds interesting.

― darin (darin), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 22:21 (twenty years ago)

yes.

― caspar (caspar), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 22:23 (twenty years ago)

Yeah it's kind of an early electronics thing, lots of old synths that take up whole rooms (I imagine). It's really good.

― mcd (mcd), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 22:24 (twenty years ago)

Oh, wait: I forgot to throw in a quick word about the supposed blandification of collective voting on stuff like this! So like we all understand how voting -- just mathematically -- can lead to top choices that are built on consensus, things everyone can agree are really solid, but not as one-in-a-million as that one personalized gem. And we tend to talk about this like it's a bad thing, but in terms of audience-serving I'm suddenly not so sure. People looking for those idiosyncratic one-in-a-million gems -- they tend to be more tapped in to begin with, reading all through the year, looking at other sites, etc, and if they're going to pick up gems from year-end lists, it's cause they'll notice some Japanese thing they've never heard of floating around #30 on a bunch of people's lists, because they'll already have a sense of the things in the top 10.

Whereas: lots of people just kinda drop in for year-end lists, right? A broader audience? And so I'm wondering today if maybe that consensus effect actually serves them really well -- it means the albums they're seeing up top have been cross-tested and agreed on by a wider group of critics, offering some guarantee of solidness or broad accessibility. Plenty of these people will even take that cross-section effect further, by looking at a whole bunch of lists one day and jotting down whatever was on a whole bunch of them. So while the year-end-list consensus effect might not serve some ideal of criticism, it might actually work out decently for casual readers, people who want the recap and not the everyday details.

(Someone will probably accuse this sentiment of being possibly condescending toward "casual readers," but that's not how I'm imagining it at all. Imagine a guy who's really engaged and up-to-date with rap, but who's also interested in some indie bands; imagine him dropping in on an indie-site year-ender to see what might be interesting; chances are having the expected "consensus" top-of-list wouldn't serve him so badly at all, since those really may well be the broad-crossover highlights he'd dig.)

NB I am not sure how much I believe this, but maybe what I'm saying is that the consensus-effect gives the whole thing the purpose of wrap-up journalism as well as critical-decision, which we tend to rant about as bad, but is maybe partly a nice thing to have on offer for a really big segment of the people who drop in on year-end lists.

― nabisco (nabisco), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 22:35 (twenty years ago)

Is that "Connection" by Elastica?
Actually, I was going for some cop/court TV show theme, but I forget what. Funny that you even took that semi-seriously at all, and I hear the Elastica. Ha ha!

Also, Nitsuh, I think your point is valid, although who are these casual readers of whom you speak? I have heard of their existence but never in fact seen one.

― regular roundups (Dave M), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 23:06 (twenty years ago)

you should get out more

― 'Twan (miccio), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 23:13 (twenty years ago)

I'm very surprised that Broken Social Scene didnt make the top 50. Not because it's my favorite album of year but I thought it was an obvious choice for a site like Pfork.

Actually, maybe that's a good sign?

― Lovelace (Lovelace), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 23:18 (twenty years ago)

that is a surprise; ditto "7/4 (Shoreline)" not placing on singles.

― Matos-Webster Dictionary (M Matos), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 23:19 (twenty years ago)

"Not because it HAPPENS to be my favorite album of the year..."

― Lovelace (Lovelace), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 23:20 (twenty years ago)

NO BORKEN SOCAL SEED NO CREDIBILITY

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 23:21 (twenty years ago)

ditto "7/4 (Shoreline)" not placing on singles.

I believe I was the only person to vote for this on Stylus.

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 23:28 (twenty years ago)

is that the only single they've released from the album so far?

it's all gonna break, superconnected and the pavement song are my favorites.

― Lovelace (Lovelace), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 23:41 (twenty years ago)

who the hell is art brut?
-- Susan Douglas (SusanisDougla...), December 20th, 2005 3:58 PM. (Susan Douglas) (link)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
yes yes very good

-- u saved me (wt...), December 20th, 2005 3:58 PM. (dubplatestyle)

?? no seriously, who the FUCK is Art Brut?

― O RLY? (eman), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 23:46 (twenty years ago)

Spoon deserves better than that, as does Of Montreal.

― billstevejim (billstevejim), Tuesday, 20 December 2005 23:55 (twenty years ago)

Of Montreal deserve the world.

― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 00:00 (twenty years ago)

THE WORLD, I TELL YOU!

― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 00:01 (twenty years ago)

Please, somebody, everybody, enlighten me. Where does that "No [X band], no credibility" come from?

― Jibé (Jibé), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 00:05 (twenty years ago)

Art Brut does "formed a band, we formed a band, look at us, we formed a band." It's a novelty song.

― billstevejim (billstevejim), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 00:06 (twenty years ago)

xpost to Jibe:

MIA? LCD SOUNDSYSTEM? give me a fucking break. no sufjan, no credibility. fuck the wire.

-- Tynan DeLong (mhalberstra...), December 15th, 2005 4:47 PM. (TynanTynan!)

― O RLY? (eman), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 00:12 (twenty years ago)

(from the wire top 50 thread)

― O RLY? (eman), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 00:13 (twenty years ago)

Ah, muchos thanks, 'cos it's been getting massive use lately and I wondered why.

― Jibé (Jibé), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 00:15 (twenty years ago)

I almost wonder if this thread would be interesting if I knew what Art Brut was.

― Alex in Baltimore (Alex in Baltimore), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 00:30 (twenty years ago)

http://artbrut.nikkidido.com/

― Merry Christmas (fandango), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 00:34 (twenty years ago)

tell me if the thread gets more interesting...

― Merry Christmas (fandango), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 00:35 (twenty years ago)

oops... try http://www.artbrut.org.uk/

― Merry Christmas (fandango), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 00:36 (twenty years ago)

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B0002OWXA4.01.LZZZZZZZ.jpg

How did this miss Pitchfork's list last year? :)

― Michael F Gill (Michael F Gill), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 00:47 (twenty years ago)

Art Brut does "formed a band, we formed a band, look at us, we formed a band." It's a novelty song.

That's bollocks, Sunny Jim. YOU KNOW NOTHING.

― ESTEBAN BUTTEZ~!!, Wednesday, 21 December 2005 00:56 (twenty years ago)

question (not another complaint):

why did the national get so much blogger love but none from pitchfork? my roommates really loved alligator, but i thought it sounded like coldplay as a joy division cover band. or something. forget the joke. i am missing out on something good here?

― theghostrobot (theghostrobot), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 01:33 (twenty years ago)

http://www.stereointeractive.com/ILM/ArtBrut.jpg

― Schroedinger's Catsuit (Schroedinger's Catsuit), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 01:35 (twenty years ago)

Fart Brut more like amirite? (...yawn)

― Merry Christmas (fandango), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 01:37 (twenty years ago)

I feel really out of the loop… I hadn't heard a whisper of Art Brut until about three weeks ago, and when I did I thought it was some Buzzcocks I hadn't heard. Why all the love?

― remy (x Jeremy), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 01:40 (twenty years ago)

Thread taught me that i'd rather be blind than deaf

― Reggie, Wednesday, 21 December 2005 01:43 (twenty years ago)

http://www.stereointeractive.com/ILM/FartBrut.jpg

A Disclaimer: I've nothing against Art Brut, but I prefer Photoshop.

― Schroedinger's Catsuit (Schroedinger's Catsuit), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 01:47 (twenty years ago)

― Merry Christmas (fandango), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 01:50 (twenty years ago)

I've nothing against Art Brut either... anyone put together the sub-Top 50 list yet?

― Merry Christmas (fandango), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 02:04 (twenty years ago)

So in conclusion, lyrics generally suck.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 02:37 (twenty years ago)

TS: Hating lyrics vs. loving music?

― marc h. (marc h.), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 02:50 (twenty years ago)

why did the national get so much blogger love but none from pitchfork?

Cuz they toured with Clap Your Hands?

― mcd (mcd), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 14:36 (twenty years ago)

Because PFM writers sit around eating Cheez-Its and reviewing albums they get in the mail instead of going to shows? Did this "national" play Intonation or not?

― the burning (mike h.), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 14:59 (twenty years ago)

Lemme slip into a clean mumu & check on that for you, Mike.

― David R. (popshots75`), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 15:05 (twenty years ago)

Hah! All couch potato-baiting aside, it always amazes me how some people I know seem to miss out completely on some albums because the band didn't tour, while some publications have very little on bands that tour but don't do much promo work.

― mike h. (mike h.), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 15:32 (twenty years ago)

Because PFM writers sit around eating Cheez-Its and reviewing albums they get in the mail instead of going to shows? Did this "national" play Intonation or not?
-- the burning (trogdo...), December 21st, 2005.

roffles

― Nick Sylvester, Wednesday, 21 December 2005 16:35 (twenty years ago)

national/cyhsy tour was reviewed on the site; write-up was much more kind to the national

― scott pl. (scott pl.), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 18:50 (twenty years ago)

What I would like to know is how come 98% percent of the records on their list were complete crap? Please could someone tell me that? Most of the turds on their list could have been better rendered by an autistic 7 year old. I guess if you can't play your instrument or sing a song believably, then you're in the running. Maybe them Bitchfork fellers need to loosen up their trucker caps or stop toxifying they's heads with cheap American beer. If you don't believe me, just listen to Okkervil River's holocaust of a Tim Hardin cover. Poor guy can't just lie in the ground safely dead from a heroin overdose they have to tar his name with whiny, pansy-assed, embarassingly self-conscious version. Hmm, come to think of it that kind of sums up most of the stuff they tend to think is real great: whiny, pansy-assed & embarassingly self-conscious.

Keep up the good work suckas!

― valdemar (nubbin), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 20:26 (twenty years ago)

Valdemar OTM

― save the robot (save the robot), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 20:43 (twenty years ago)

Nabisco's blurb on the "consensus effect" is spot on, I think. The inevitable carping about such lists is expected I think on a board like ILM, which is by nature elitist. Of course most of us are going to have some "gem" that we love but doesn't get the year end love: because for a lot of us, it's finding that rare gem that's part of our love of it.

What is more interesting to me is gauging the attitude of a group like ILM (I'd say: a group of cultural (critical) elites)) on those "casual readers" Nabisco mentions. This is something that's changed in rock criticism, I think: when I read Lester Bangs, I get the impression this guy is writing for that casual reader. Even though the music may not be all that accessible to that casual reader, Bangs wrote like it was his divinely appointed mission to convince that ordinary guy that he hadda love "Fun House", that it was just like "Wooly Bully" but MORE SO...and now I read rock crit and I'm not so sure that this is a goal anymore. Why exactly is this? Is it because of continuing mistrust of the mainstream out of fears of being coopted by the establishment ("just another way to be right wing")? Or is it that the rock market has shrunk and so we know that e.g. Nelly's got a better chance of reaching the common guy than most of the elite-loved stuff and so as a consequence we ignore the common guy? Or is all this just a Freud/fraud and crits these days are still just looking for the great songs, other cultural/instituitional biases be damned, and by def. great = accessible to anyone?

In short: how important is it to you that a song/record be something we (in pretty broad terms, "we", not just ILM or indie kids or whatever) can reach a reasonable consensus on? Is that a virtue or a vice or a non-factor?

― Euler (Euler), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 20:44 (twenty years ago)

hey valdemar, Orthrelm beg to differ you

― Dominique (dleone), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 20:54 (twenty years ago)

with

― Dominique (dleone), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 20:56 (twenty years ago)

Orthrelm, save your begging for Bitchpork. They need to give all of us a break. Go back and read your Lester Bangs schmucks! Maybe a day or two on a cough syrup nod will set you straight and give you some perspective. Hint: don't take yourselves seriously, wankers.

― valdemar (nubbin), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 21:03 (twenty years ago)

ok guys i give up i'm valdemar

― Nick Sylvester, Wednesday, 21 December 2005 21:11 (twenty years ago)

SYLVESTROLL

― nabisco (nabisco), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 21:12 (twenty years ago)

I wonder if anyone posts to bitchpork anymore

― Dominique (dleone), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 21:14 (twenty years ago)

Hmm, now I understand your Orthrelm reference. Please forgive me, I am an old man whose mind is addled from reading the very complex new Medicare rules.

Perhaps Orthrelm is not whiny or pansy-assed or even embarassingly self conscious (or Sunn(((()___________0)??? for that matter), but those are two examples, pork thrown to dangerous lovers of all things metal. Would you want to anger them? I think not! Though the fact that the Snicksnack review of this mentions Steve Reich, Can, alcoholism induced painting and mathematical concepts only serves to tell us how boring the whole thing likely is. If it's so great, how come it didn't beat out Sufjan Stevenson? Is Bitchwork secretly controlled by neo Christian suburban art punk hippies? Most likely.

― valdemar (nubbin), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 21:19 (twenty years ago)

how important is it to you that a song/record be something we (in pretty broad terms, "we", not just ILM or indie kids or whatever) can reach a reasonable consensus on? Is that a virtue or a vice or a non-factor?

I almost never count on this anymore - very few bands today reach beyond a narrow audience. Arcade Fire and Sufjan are becoming popular, but a lot of my favorite albums of the last couple years stick to a niche (Rehearsing My Choir). Or think about Othrelm - they deserve recognition, but I wouldn't recommend OV to any of my friends.

― save the robot (save the robot), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 21:23 (twenty years ago)

Musicianship is a crutch for people devoid of ideas. How do you play this thing?

― Jason Toon, Wednesday, 21 December 2005 21:24 (twenty years ago)

Results 1 - 10 of about 26,100 for neo Christian suburban art punk hippies. (0.19 seconds)

― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 21:30 (twenty years ago)

For Jason Toon: Oh no! How wrong you are! Let's think of building a house, would you want to live in one designed by a blind, retarded troll or one built by an architect who studied Japanese joinery with Takao Minosa?

― valdemar (nubbin), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 21:34 (twenty years ago)

Which house would rock harder?

― save the robot (save the robot), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 21:39 (twenty years ago)

Save The Robot: That is a good point, but Mr. Toon's point was about *Musicianship*, not rocking hard. It's possible that the troll house would rock harder, but Japanese joinery can be very rustic and aggressive.

― valdemar (nubbin), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 21:41 (twenty years ago)

Music is different from houses.

OK, my original comment is an exaggeration. I don't own any Old Skull recordings (anymore). But I'm weary of all things tepid and tasteful. So very, very weary...

― Jason Toon, Wednesday, 21 December 2005 21:54 (twenty years ago)

Jason Toon: Prove that music is different than houses.

― valdemar (nubbin), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 21:56 (twenty years ago)

if you try to live under an mp3 of "candy shop" during the winter, you will die

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 21:58 (twenty years ago)

U Saved Me: That is likely true. But if you lived under a WAV of Black Sabbath's "The Wizard" you would not die.

― valdemar (nubbin), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 22:01 (twenty years ago)

well a wav is larger than an mp3, i agree.

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 22:02 (twenty years ago)

It is also better constructed and designed.

― valdemar (nubbin), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 22:04 (twenty years ago)

now here, sir, we must differ. the world is moving towards smaller and more compactly built formats. evovle or die, as they say.

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 22:08 (twenty years ago)

the blurb doesn't actually say anything about Can - but does concede that you might very well find it boring. I don't. To be honest, I can't believe it made the list (happy as I am that it did). It's not a very user-friendly record, even for people that are into metal or prog or whatever. in conclusion, thanks pfork for letting me write about it, hopefully someone reads about it and doesn't think it'll be totally boring

― Dominique (dleone), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 22:08 (twenty years ago)

I'm in the "put me to sleep" camp but I'm still glad I heard it.

― Mark (MarkR), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 22:15 (twenty years ago)

Dominique Leone: You'll notice that if you carefully parse my statement above I clearly said the *review* mentioned Can, not the blurb, whatever that is. Here is a snippet from the REVIEW:

"...not to mention Neu! and Can..."

Also, what in God's name is "math-jazz"?

― valdemar (nubbin), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 22:16 (twenty years ago)

jazz that is like math-rock, only it is jazz

― Matos-Webster Dictionary (M Matos), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 22:18 (twenty years ago)

Does anyone else think the Gorillaz album should be on there?

― Nigel (Nigel), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 22:29 (twenty years ago)

Probably because Hitchcock has some sort of Pol Potian concept of purity that will not allow them to include more than 2 albums on a major label.

― valdemar (nubbin), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 22:39 (twenty years ago)

Late Registration is both a sonic cathedral and a cathredal of sonic details.

― Nigel (Nigel), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 22:51 (twenty years ago)

ok, the review. chances are, if you don't like minimalist music, you won't like the record (and even if you do, this is a lot less forgiving on the ears than anything philip glass ever did). in any case, if mentioning Can means it's boring to you, we're not exactly coming from the same place. (in fact, allow us to see how non "pansy assed" you are, what are your fave records this year?)

― Dominique (dleone), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 22:53 (twenty years ago)

I think Sufjan is a hotty. Thank the lord baby jesus for his #1 album. If he were to ask me for oral favors, I'd probably say yes, but I don't know about sex. Save it till marriage, right? That's my thoughts. I bet it will rock after I get married though. Do you think he'll like me if he's more experienced than I am? I hope experience won't really matter like some people say it does. I'm gonna be a virgin until marriage.
-(713)553-1256

― Hot to trot, Wednesday, 21 December 2005 22:57 (twenty years ago)

I like maximalist music, it's less fussy and less concerned with perfection. Who needs perfection I ask you! Not me!

As for my favorite recordings of the past year that is hard for me to say. As I mentioned before I am a feeble old man and I live in far northern Canada where it is cold and desolate and there is a dearth of independent music stores. So I am a pauper when it comes to experiencing the avant garde of what's "groovy" these days, and I can barely hear anymore due to my years of studying Ligeti's studies in dissonance and inonation at extremely loud volumes.

That said, I would say that William Oldham's most recent recording gave me some pleasure. Album covers with blood-covered feminine hands and songs about werewolves surely don't qualify as pansy assed. William Parker's Sound Unity recording raised a few eyebrows up here, but it's certainly not his best (also not pansy assed or maudlin). And that band called Deerhoof can really cobble together an quite an interesting array of grinding sounds and lilting sounds (possibly maudlin at times, but never pansy assed). Most everything sucked though, and showed us all how very difficult it is to make good music.

― valdemar (nubbin), Wednesday, 21 December 2005 23:16 (twenty years ago)

ok just so we're clear here i'm *not* actually valdemar

― Nick Sylvester, Thursday, 22 December 2005 05:50 (twenty years ago)

That's right, you ain't. You a sucka.

― valdemar (nubbin), Thursday, 22 December 2005 06:07 (twenty years ago)

the most depressing one yet

― corey c (shock of daylight), Thursday, 22 December 2005 08:52 (twenty years ago)

comments, go:

http://www.stereogum.com/archives/002172.html

― mark p (Mark P), Thursday, 22 December 2005 22:10 (twenty years ago)

i'ma get you for that one, mark

― u saved me (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 22 December 2005 22:12 (twenty years ago)

four months pass...

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