Pavement ,Classic or Dud?

Sure, it fits, they are.

Well, I really like 'em.

i liked their lack of concern for perfection, their embrace of the accident, one-take approach. great guitar playing too but when they actually learned how to play it stopped being original (that and everyone was imitating them by that point).

very influential.

Brighten = most egregiously and unfairly slagged-upon Pavement record. my unfair assessment: lots of people are afraid of growing up and/or watching the bands they like do the same

Wowee Zowee = Pavement's best record

CLASSIC

Never has a band crawled out from beneath a slimey rock that I've hated more vehemently than the pretentious shits in Pavement.

They were shit.

i think they're my biggest love-hate band...maybe one in 5 listens of any given album, i feel like i really *get it*, and even then the payoff isn't that huge. the rest of the time i'm sort of rolling my eyes at myself for even owning it. plus, I got them in a weird order (if memory serves: Brighten -> Wowee -> Slanted -> Terror -> Crooked), and everytime i picked one up, i'd think *this*'ll be the one that clicks for me and be horribly disappointed. the only one that really grabbed me right off the bat was parts of Brighten. the rest have taken their sweet time to grow. I wouldn't say there's a huge margin in quality between any of them; they're all pretty hit'n'miss.

My vote is classic by the way.

*This is quite an odd feeling, not because Pavement have ever been at all important to me, they were a band I liked in 1993 and that's it. It's just an odd thing to find oneself thinking about I suppose. Another thread to start, I think.

Pavement's version of Here is dud.

Speaking of which, Ned, I don't suppose there's any way I could get a copy of that CD-R is there?

Speaking of which, Ned, I don't suppose there's any way I could get a copy of that CD-R is there?

Somehow I knew this would happen. ;-) Drop me a line privately.

And not even ONE mention of Chris Knox or Tall Dwarfs when "Westing" and "Slanted" are mentioned. The TD song "Get Outta The Garage" (from "The Short and Long of it" EP) completely laid out the groundwork for "Slanted" alone.

Blame Brian, I borrowed his singles. ;-)

Pavement have only 3 songs that rip-off The Fall

Isn't this like me saying Oasis had only one or two tunes that reference the Beatles?

Couldn't care for the other stuff. Crooked Rain is okay-ish

Imagine the VW Pink Moon commercial, only slacker-ized.

They are the 12th best band of all time, incidentally.

I guess I missed out on all the internal struggle hoopla with Pavement, because I was caught off guard with the breakup announcement, which by the way may qualify as one of the most stilted in rock history -- One of the ways Malkmus allegedly let a crowd of concert goers know that Pavement was breaking up was putting his wrists together with a motion of air shackles and explaining, to paraphrase, "this is what it feels like to be in this band"... hmmmm...THREAD IDEA!

So, was "Terror" a "Malkmus" record or not? 'cuz I'm not impressed with the Jicks material. And I haven't heard the Preston School Of Industry or whatever they're/he's called... and now I'm curious to hear them. And I'm curious to know how Pavement's songwriting process was like. Hmmm... another THREAD IDEA!

And to slightly backtrack, I forgot to mention that Kannberg and Nostavonich helped co-write a couple of Tall Dwarfs songs on the "3 Eps".... so, yay, Tall Dwarfs connection made.

I actually think the person who brought up the Trompe Le Monde similarity is onto something, because that album is equally underrated, and mostly the work of the primary songwriter of the group, making it their most focused and offbeat album(For the Pixies, incidentally, my favorite albums are Doolittle and Trompe Le Monde, and Pavement, Wowee Zowee and Terror Twighlight). They're also both very 'wierd' albums, nothing too straightforward on either, and even the light songs ("major leagues" on terror, "bird dream of olympus mons" have kind of a twisted undercurrent to them)

anyway, just wanted to put in my two cents. As for one of the best bands of all time... sure, why the hell not? I'd be interested in knowing who everyone thinks is better, but I guess that's for another thread...

Personally, I like TT because of the "rounder sound," prolly due to the complete studio-sound quality, which is prolly why so many people don't like it. Wasn't it produced by one of the Radiohead producers? That could explain a lot.

Classic !!

People turned on Pavement when they refused to make every album sound like "Slanted and Enchanted". Undeniably brilliant, right through to the very end - and that includes "Terror Twilight".

Definite Classic!!!

Just try and argue with me in ten years.

Their music doesn't mean as much to me as The Grifters, which I think many tossed into the Pavement wannabe pile at the time. I also listen to my Red Red Meat albums more than Pavement these days and they were better than Pavement the two times I saw them play. The Thinking Fellers were quite good live and it is a shame their records had so many shabby spots.

I never checked out Terror Twilight. After two spotty albums, I never ended up going back to the well.

Maybe it is me...a friend that I turned onto Pavement has said over and over that "Brighten the Corners" is his favorite. I saw them live a second time right as that one came out. There was a couple of songs that I didn't like at all, then I saw them live and they sounded WAY out of practice, like a pickup band...very shoddy. This is probably why Malkmus wanted to split and considering as such, I can't blame him. Top that with some annoying fanboy writing (just check any issue of Magnet where they appear) about Pavement and I was sick of them and wrote them off.

It has been a few years, so I may be coming back around. I've given Westing & Watery/Domestic a couple of listens in the past month or so.

"No Tan Lines" is great too, haven't listened to that in a while. Candy stripers, bedpan wipers, that one?

I like the Fall too, and I know Pavement ripped them off, but I hear Pavement as extension of classic California rock bands like the Beach Boys or Love...a bit of power-pop mixed in there, I hear some weird echoes of Big Star in things like "Rattled by the Rush." Something very...crepuscular...with Nelly...

blurb:
"Pavement was the most inspired and inspiring band of the 90's, and
their history makes for a great read. I zipped through this engrossing book from cover to cover in an afternoon, and felt overwhelmingly nostalgic - for a great band that no longer exists, for a time in my life when I was still capable of believing that songs were about me, and for a different, better world. Rob Jovanovic has written a loving but rigorous book, which, at the very, very least, should be read by every Pavement fan." - Jonathan Safran Foer

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1932112073/ref=pd_ecc_rvi_1/104-0976994-7812701

Yeah, and Matthew Perpetua to thread.

I think history will show that "Crooked Rain" is a better album than "Nevermind," just as I think "Radio City" is a better album and more representative of the '70s than "Band on the Run." I like Nirvana just fine, but I think my analogy kind of holds, since Cobain's stuff reminds me of the Beatles'... Am I wrong here?

I can't even manage strength to yawn.

Er? I guess this is to me! Yer welcome.

We need to know, because if we back these up on CD-R and sell them off now, we might actually get $4 or $5 each for them instead of $2 or $3 for each after the fact when we sell them back. That could mean a whole $6 profit!

The duddiest dud of all duds.

The previous post wasn't [i]that[/i] long ago, anyway.

[i]somebody should play you some Sammy, dude! There's a whole world of pedestrian indie that makes Slanted & Enchanted look like Sgt. Peppers averagepedestrian-wise.
-- 'Twan (anthonyisrigh...), December 1st, 2005.[i/]

But [i]Sgt. Pepper's[/i] was pretty much average in the first place! :P

That's how the last third of Wowee and half of Terror Twilight sounds to me.

http://www.cnn.com/WORLD/9511/rabin/umbrella/mideast_map.jpg

He wants two states.

After years of listening, I can't tell the difference between Old To Begin, Type SLowly, Transport Is Arranged, and all the other slow ones. But the last two songs on the record, also slow, are great.

The biggest fault with Terror Twilight is not using the original version of The Hexxx, which is called And Then... It's floating around slsk somewhere, definitely recommended.

Even "Stereo," "Embassy Row," and "Passat Dream"?

it sounds way more stoned than smarmy to me, personally.

"Chesley's Little Wrists," "No Life Singed Her," and maybe "Conduit for Sale!"

it's there, it's just more subdued. it's a different kind of fun. the kind of fun that doesn't have to scream "look! FUN!"

no actually i do like "embassy row" and "carrot rope" but i'd also put them firmly in the camp of treading on past glories rather than splendors - especially "cr" which is basically "goofy catchy pavement song #463." nothin wrong with that, exactly - it's just a little disappointing given what they'd already done.

SIDE A:
Stereo
Transport/Arranged
Date With Ikea
Embassy Row
Blue Hawaiian
Fin

SIDE B:
Folk Jam
You Are A Light
Cream of Gold
Platform Blues (a serious contender for best Pavement song EVAH)
The Hexx

...or re-arranged however you like, I offer them here in order.

i.e. Watery, Domestic, right? I might have to go back and relisten to it, 'cause I've always been squarely in the "everything they did post-S&E blows it out of the water and you have to be a K Records-worshiping Sebadoh fan to think otherwise" camp (though, of course, I do love the album).

BTC was my first Pavement album, actually -- which makes it something of a sentimental favorite of mine, though I understand all its weaknesses. It also made it fairly hard for me to see where all those "PAVEMENT RIP OFF THE FALL" references came from, as you can imagine.

Isn't there a David Berman quote somewhere (in one of his cranky email interviews, probably) where, when asked what his favorite Silver Jews album is, he responds with Crooked Rain, Crooked Rain?

And that comment upthread about difficulty telling some songs apart on BTC is OTM.

A singles collection would convince anyone finding out about them in 2005 that they were hot shit & worthy of further investigation. More than those reissues alone.

seriously though, i'm pretty surprised at everyone coming out to defend btc. i've only ever met one person who really liked that album. i'll have to listen to it again, but if there's one song on there half as good as "perfume-v" i'll eat both of my own kidneys.

also this thread has really made me really want to start incorporating "PHEAR MY HYPEREDUMATATED POSTPUNXOR REBELLION LOLZ" into daily office conversation.

Also -- I love both S&E and what it could be said to "stand for." I just think that to consider it the best Pavement album means that factors beyond the music (low-fi partisanism, "authenticity," amateurism, etc.) might be weighted a little heavily.

*starts to whistle*

No, seriously, I prefer it to Slanted. Like the third Velvets album, it's more subversive than the more famous debut: this warm, friendly guitar-pop album with fetchingly opaque lyrics, one unironic but Ashberyesque love song ("Type Slowly"), and plenty of shady lanes despite the bright corners.

It's also the one with the most tolerable Spiral Stairs contributions.

If you don't like it, or can't see what all the fuss is about, you shouldn't be on a site called I Love Music. Geez Louise!

i'd say "date w/IKEA" is tied with "kennel district" for best spiral song, though.

Please.

It's the best showcase for a trick that a serious Beatlephile like you can appreciate, Tim: quiet arrangements vs unexpected lyrics about self-loathing, faith, redemption, and murder mysteries.

Their other albums very well may be better, but unless they pulled a Talk Talk and did a total 180 towards the end of their career, I have no interest in hearing them.

All 5 records are great, and so different that they hardly seem to be by the same band; I sometimes feel like playing S&E, sometimes Wowee, sometimes BTC, but never just "a Pavement record." (I hardly ever play Crooked Rain but I think that's just because I listened to it a few thousand times in a row over a few months of 1994 and have never again been really able to pay attention to it, much as I love it.)

The reissues are massively great and I will sob if no more come out.

In case my opinion is not clear, classic.

"Sep 30, 2004 at 10:54am
voting
ill be voting for JK. i cant stand Bush and the tone he sets for our nation. If you think the Democrats care for you any more than the Repubs, you are sadly mistaken. Both sides of the same coin WANT TO WIN-- any way they can. But the faintests whiff of a future with universal medical care ,sane tax laws, environmental protection, investment in education--at least we have a chance of that direction with the Donkeys. But dont get your hopes up.

I dont know what the right answer is on Iraq, just sick of all the un examined solipsistic anti war sentiment. I think it is fine to be against the war in Iraq, just realize where that will lead you down the line (inactionn has consequences as well). I think many in the anti war movement are guilty of mistaking the message for the messenger, provoking knee jerk disdain for something that was not just a knee jerk decision (one of the big arguments of the anti war movement is that the neo cons were obsessed with iraq and used 9/11 as an excuse to push it through--an exercise in bad faith, but a faulty argument for the merit or demerit of the war ).

and so on"

I've disliked Pavement -- irrationally -- for a long time. They seemed so juvenile, oh-so-ironic, and half-assed (the lyric/vocal bit I always remembered from them was "Who-o-o-o-o-o-o," from Cut Your Hair, on Crooked Rain; every time I heard it, I imagined Malkmus thinking, "Oh, we're so funny and such slackers, haha old people!").

I had their discs on a Saved for Later eMusic list forever. Finally, after reading this for the umpteenth time in an eMusic review of S&E:

Pavement were modernist noise makers like Thelonious Monk and Charlie Parker inventing bop at their late night jam sessions, or the Bronx revolutionaries who wrought hip-hop out of the rotten Apple in the '70s. Slanted is beauty collapsing, sweetness fading into static, a soft-rock séance amidst the clatter and drone of lo-fi legends like the Fall and Swell Maps

I said "Ah, whatevs., I'll get it and give Pavement another try." And . . . it's great. It's much more tuneful and melodic than I expected. Maybe the lyrics would make me cringe again, but right now I'm paying no attention to them, and that's fine. Anyway, I was wrong about this band, I think.

I read upthread someone say that they made "half-assed mediocrity" acceptable for a generation of bands. But they don't sound so mediocre to me. I mean, Malkmus seems like a perfectly competent (indeed, good) guitarist, the drums have a tumbling kick to them, like they're corralling the rest of the band back into the song's structure, and the melodies are strong -- even hummable. But as I say, I've had a bad impression of them for so long, maybe I'm just overcompensating now.

Plus, wtfdoiknow?nothingthatswhat.

I haven't heard anything post-Wowee Zowee, because I'm hoping they'll keep the two-disc reissues coming -- every one of those things has been amazing so far. it's like getting to relive their entire career ten years after the fact. plus, the bonus material, while not consistently great, has plenty of high points (Watery, Domestic + outtakes is as good as any seven songs off Slanted and Enchanted, the versions of "Grounded" and "Kennel District" from the Crooked Rain reissue are even better than the ones on Wowee Zowee, "Painted Soldiers", "Pueblo Domain"... I could go on).

This is my favourite band. I guess they had more or less split up when I started listening to them so that probably gives me a different perspective, than most of you..

A Brighten the Corners redux should be due by now, Malkmus himself has said that's when the bonus material starts getting real good

God Alfred get off that schtick, it's predictable... cos it's a schtick... I hate that term. Anyway Pavement're ok, just get the Watery Domestic Ep, there's some good stuff on Wowee, also the Beavis and Butthead clip is funny

http://youtube.com/watch?v=cEvWbwa_1iQ

Westing
Slanted
Crooked
Wowee

...still love them all, but I do find myself playing them when alone. Not enough beats or anger or sweetness or whatever for most of my friends.

Gold Soundz
Silence Kidt
Summer babe
perfume V
stereo
shady lane
cut yr hair

all classic

and the real, proper fans will have more of their own...

Never really got these fellas, but somebody played me "Father To A Sister Of Thought" and it is LOVELY.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1SBQKOW8qE

Not enough beats or anger or sweetness

First two, sure, but they're totally sweet - Crooked Rain era especially. And they're so... comfortable! That sounds like faint praise but it's a total compliment, it's like out of all the bands I'm in a long term relationship with, they're the most dependable; they'll never get too angry or depressed, and whether I wanna rock out or just lay back and relax in the summer sun, they'll totally be there for me.

Man I gotta check out that bonus material on the remasters.

http://www.brooklynvegan.com/archives/2009/09/the_pavement_re.html

better than another boring malkmus solo album, I guess.

That is going to be very very cool.

playing Coachella seems right. i thought they would be a few more years away.

thanks for the info Davey D.

Jurassic Park

Yeah, so? One day you'll be old too little girl.

I am an OLD MAN.

Then I guess I'll see you at the Pavement reunion.

don't really believe this, but hey ... i'd go see pavement again.

xpost Nah, you go.

xp we'll see. as long as it's not some Don't look back crap this could be cool

I don't believe this for a second...at least until a reputable news source publishes the story. Brooklynvegan doesn't know its ass from a hole in the ground (or a PR email).

Maybe. but they'll definitely get back together again, probably soon. Malkmus has expressed interest in interviews, he just wanted to make sure it wasn't too soon. But 10 years away is a good hiatus.

can see a one-off kinda thing happening, but doubtful about a big reunion tour at this point. Malkmus seems pretty into the Jicks - and I don't blame him. They're great. They've been playing a ton of new stuff live too, so it's hard to imagine he'd put all of that on the backburner. I could be wrong!

Waiting for the 1990s nostalgia revival

GBV's turn.

Then Archers of Loaf?

Sure!

Then Archers of Loaf?

Bachmann's writing style is so watered down now I wouldn't even be interested (and I was a HUGE AOL STAN)

been hearing this for a few days from another source. if it does happen they'll hopefully put on a more interesting show than they did from '97 on.

Waiting for the 1990s nostalgia revival

It's sorta here, already. See, e.g., "lo-fi."

i'm way more into the jicks at this point. but still it would be cool if malkmus pulls a neil young and hooks up with pavement occasionally, csny-style

if it does happen they'll hopefully put on a more interesting show than they did from '97 on.
eh, they were good live til the end imo - check it:
http://doomandgloomfromthetomb.tumblr.com/post/125362320/cardiac-kids-terror-twilight-is-probably-the-only

i'm way more into the jicks at this point. but still it would be cool if malkmus pulls a neil young and hooks up with pavement occasionally, csny-style

this

that and what tylerw said

It's sorta here, already. See, e.g., "lo-fi."

It's not here like it will be.

That'd be like someone from 1999 saying the 1980s revival is upon them e.g. the Wedding Singer. Such a pronouncement, in retrospect, would've caused a time traveling, headband-wearing the Killers fan from 2004 to stumble into the room and laugh at all of them.

Leaving those of us in 2009 to laugh at the Killers fan. A lot.

"It's sorta here, already. See, e.g., 'lo-fi.'"

I don't think today's lo-fi has anything to do with 90s nostalgia. (See my new vs. old lo-fi thread to elaborate...)

Britpop and grunge reformations, old skool rave revivalism in the form of dubstep and nu-rave, the balearic revival - the 90s are definitely back.

Have we mentioned the new Spiral Stairs album "The Real Feel" yet? It's not as bad as you might expect.

sweet jesus, classic of course.

well, p-fork seems to think it's real http://pitchfork.com/news/36505-holy-shit-pavement-reunion-is-real/

and have they ever been wrong?

just reminds me how boring and predictable most bands' career paths are

first we were young and snotty and obscure, then we made a great record, then we were kinda sorta famous for a little while, then we broke up, then we made a bunch of shitty solo albums, then we had a reunion tour, then we broke up again *yawn*

I never made it to see them the first time around, so if this is real, it is welcome news.

"old skool rave revivalism in the form of dubstep and nu-rave"

Old skool rave revivalism never went away. That well gets returned to every couple of years (as early 94-95 in some cases!)

ha they don't look too happy about it

http://nymag.com/daily/entertainment/2009/09/pavement_reunion_reportedly_ac.html

does Bob have gambling debts to pay off or something

yeah as much as i dig them, i'm a little "whatever" about them getting back together--i always thought they were better on record than live

except with gary drumming of course

I saw them a few times and they were alternately really good and really really bad (which is clearly borne out by the live footage on that DVD of theirs - if I was in the audience for most of the shows I would've felt insulted/ripped off for seeing a band that so clearly did NOT GIVE A FUCK that anybody had actually paid money to see them "play" music. Malkmus primarily to blame for that attitude, tbf)

their last bay area show ever was a thing to behold tho, that was great.

i'd blame it on Westie, too--the tempos could draaaaaaag and that's not good for Pavement

i think i only saw one show where they were not really on their game -- otherwise they were great, the peak being the many times I saw them on the Brighten the Corners tour ...

i was too young to ever get to see them and i know they're not known for being the best live band but i'd be excited to see them play their shit live.

i srsly recommend that bootleg i posted upthread for anyone who believes the "they sucked live" myth. if that's sucking live, then may all bands suck thusly.

no i totally believe that they were awesome live sometimes--i have some bootlegs (on cassette tape, lol) that prove it.

Terror Twilight is probably the only Pavement record that no fan names as his or her favorite.

one of my best friends names this as his favorite pavement album. i love it too, but he's nuts

well, there ya go. that is a crazy opinion, but he's welcome to it!

i think it's got as much to do with the whole "first one you hear" phenomenon as anything

tyler have you heard brewstock? like a one off show they played at a beer festival on an off lollapalooza day, so it's all like wowee zowee stuff? hilarious.

no i haven't heard that one! sounds fun. they were always fun, even the time i saw them and they sucked. 1994 at the splendid Hollywood Palace. There was a mosh pit. Different times!

i didn't like them till i saw them live. the wowie zowie show in iowa city friends dragged me to over my protests was so amazing, louche in terms of musicianship yet somehow swaggering, i finally 'got pavement'

that's true, they were always fun. the one time i saw them on the BTC tour they were half great half awful, but the banter was good and they played Grave Architecture, so yeah.

I saw them a few times and they were alternately really good and really really bad

Yes. They loved to play extended, jammy versions of unreleased songs that nobody knew. But on a good night they were absolutely fantastic. They were never what anybody would call tight, though.

I saw them once with Gary Young in NYC, as part of a triple bill with Superchunk and My Bloody Valentine. They were fantastic, but Gary Young would not shut up. Pointless banter between every song. You knew it wouldn't be long before he was gone. Hell of a drummer, though.

Also saw them on the BTC tour. They were awesome and Malkmus made fun of Beck.

tylerw, they played the palace 3 times that year (my radio station sponsored all the shows)... do you remember which one they were at?

the first one was with further & rollerskate sknny opening

the second time was an early/late show, both sets with drive like jehu opening... this was a weird day because they also taped Tonight Show ("brinx job-cut yr hair" with guests Drew Barrymore and Harry Shearer) earlier, came out to the Palace and DLJ just SLAYYYYYED (yank crime era) the first set and Pavement put out the weakest, most shitty set together and sucked ass. Then DLJ came out and did I think the same exact set, but Pavement was able to pull it together and rebounded with one of their best performances that I'd ever seen (and I impishly admit I saw them way too many times).

i was just thinking about the Tonight Show appearance the other day. the first like 10 seconds is hilarious

i saw the early show w/ Drive Like Jehu in September. Are you a KXLU dude or was it a different station. I recently came across a recording of this show! Sounded as ramble-tamble as I remembered it. Long waits between songs, amps blowing up, Spiral leaving ... Sucks that the late show was so much better! I think the early show was all ages and I was 15 or 16 at the time ....

my dad drove us to the show so I don't even think I had a driver's license then, haha.

I saw them a few times and they were alternately really good and really really bad (which is clearly borne out by the live footage on that DVD of theirs

Yeah -- the video comp on DVD has just ghastly live shows.

Was Spiral always turned way down?

kinda seemed that way, though on the recent live LP Matador put out you can hear him better. actually, it's funny, for some reason before I saw them live I assumed that Spiral was the lead guitarist.

the first TT show I saw was just terrible - they had a bunch of technical problems (Spiral's piano didn't work on Major Leagues, etc.) and Malkmus was clearly bored/irritated/not bothering to play or sing anything anybody else could follow or identify. Frankly, US Maple blew them away.

I still love this band. I concede to being incapable of objectivity with regards to them, but everyone's got a couple of those. I like all of the records, although S&E is a little overrated, often at the expense of the rest of their catalogue. Don't get me wrong, I think it still sounds great, but there's a weird thing with some people and that record. It's the album that non-Pavement fans can cop to liking without any negative fallout. BTC is very underrated, and Terror Twilight is much better than most people gave them credit for - even if it was essentially a Malkmus solo album. I had the pleasure of seeing them play a few times, and while it's true that nobody went to a Pavement show to see flashy solos or other examples of expert musicianship, they were much, MUCH better than they often got credit for. They were never able to shake the "slacker" tag, although I'm not sure how interested they were in doing so. They were definitely "loose" on stage, but never sloppy (at least in my experience). There was always a fair bit of stage banter, improvisation, and they generally seemed to really enjoy themselves. I was upset when they broke up and hope that the reunion rumours one day pan out.

^^quality post, i agree. they do not deserve the can't-play-their-instruments-epithet more than any other random indie band

I think it still sounds great, but there's a weird thing with some people and that record

I am proud to have that thing. I can't even begin to explain how cool that record sounded when it first came out.

The "slacker" tag came out after Wowee Zowee, when Beavis and Butthead told them to try harder, damnit.

there's a difference between not being able to play your instrument and not being interested in playing your instrument. tbf I think that live they mostly all tried pretty hard, except for Malkmus

yeah i feel like malkmus has talked about his tough love approach to audiences

dunno about the whole "not being interested in playing your instrument" -- I think Malk is a great guitar player, who seems really interested in trying out new stuff/not playing the same thing twice. Same goes for his vocals --they're fun! You don't know what weird phrasing he's going to try out next. I mean, "not trying" would be getting a part down and repeating that ad nauseam, right?

also i think the "not trying" on malk's part that seemed to manifest itself more and more from the wowee zowee shows onward seemed to be his frustration at being in a band with a band that wasn't able to keep up with him.

opps, i meant in a band in which some of the mebers couldn't leep up with him. )west, maybe spiral?)

yeah that's entirely possible

The "slacker" tag came out after Wowee Zowee, when Beavis and Butthead told them to try harder, damnit.

funny. I always felt like they actually were trying harder on that one!

A couple of you guys aren't getting it. As Shakey said, no one denies Malk's guitar and vocals, but live sometimes he just didn't give a shit.

Also:

BTC is very underrated, and Terror Twilight is much better than most people gave them credit for - even if it was essentially a Malkmus solo album.

Hasn't most critical opinion accepted these as truisms?

yeah, he had shows where he didn't care - I guess I just get tired of the Pavement = slackers line. Can we come up with something else to say about them?

how about Malkmus is a comptentuous jerk?

wow that is some bad spelling

contemptuous

lol, there you go.

I loved Pavement a decade ago, maybe it's just from getting old, but I wish they wouldn't do this...they ended on such a bummer note (check out the Coachella show on the TT tour for one of the all-time feel bad shows by anyone) that I wish they would just let sleeping dogs lie.

Waiting for the inevitable "Kanye:Pixies greatest indie reunion of all-time" jpeg.

"the first one was with further & rollerskate sknny opening"

HOLY SHIT dream show!!!!!!!!!!!

Terror Twilight is probably the only Pavement record that no fan names as his or her favorite.

You can count me in this very, very small minority. And it was actually the fourth Pavement album I heard -- didn't much care for the first two, then a year or so later got Wowee Zowee and enjoyed it, then skipped to Terror Twilight and... AWESOME!

If they can get US Maple (and especially US Maple w/their first drummer) to reunite and open for them, I will go.

ok ok
Terror Twilight is probably the only Pavement record that no fan only crazy people name as his or her favorite.

Terror Twilight is great but apparently nobody is allowed to enjoy it more than the others.

oh i'm just kiddin' -- enjoy, enjoy

opps, i meant in a band in which some of the mebers couldn't leep up with him. )west, maybe spiral?)

West was obviously not a very good drummer, but Spiral plays fairly well imo? Did he particularly suck live or something?

never saw them, even tho i absolutely loved/love them. I was totally old enough to see them, too... could've caught them circa WZ & BTC but was either broke and/or lazy :(

I didn't mean to sound so angry!

nah it's cool - i like TT too! It's a Pavement album, I like 'em all. I'd just be hard pressed to make a case for it as my "favorite."

BTC is very underrated, and Terror Twilight is much better than most people gave them credit for - even if it was essentially a Malkmus solo album.

Hasn't most critical opinion accepted these as truisms?

― vulva eyes (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, September 16, 2009 6:03 PM (5 hours ago)

revisionist critical opinion, sure

xps yeah terror twilight is a great and (yawn) underappreciated album, but you are a crazy person if it's your favorite, either that or you prob have some very specific emotions/memories tied to it

Nope, it's just my favorite because I think it's got the best songs, front to back.

revisionist critical opinion, sure

Well, there's him:

Brighten the Corners [Matador, 1997]
Mature or die is the whole of the law. So of course there's no longer much insurgency in their ill-mannered sounds, now deployed to serenade a self-sustaining subculture and celebrate a band's collective success. Moderate tempos that once breathed psychedelic wooze turn reflective if not thoughtful as lyrics reference the material emoluments of middle-class life. Yet it's still exciting, because it isn't dragged under by the nagging disappointments that generally dull such music (and security). As convinced ironists, Pavement never expected anything else. Closure is a chimera--they'll drink to that. Onetime insurgent Thelonious Monk--they'll drink to him, too. A man known for his brilliant corners. A

Terror Twilight [Matador, 1999]
Since I was fooled myself until I saw them live and knew every riff, I'm wondering why some believe there are no songs here. Probably the explanation is tempo. There's never that frantic hang-on-for-your-life moment when you either pay attention or embrace brain death--when you engage at gunpoint. And though the music seems stitched together rather than wound tight, it's never in any apparent danger of falling apart; it isn't riven or driven by internal contradictions. Thus, too much meaning is left up to the words. But that's not the same as the songs not being there--or as the meanings not being there either. A-

I realize there's other critics, but good grades for BTC and TT were par for the course in '99; I was there and remember. The only album that really made critics scratch their heads was Wowee Zowee.

i dont think ive read any critic dismiss them

I saw Malkmus solo at Langerado a few years ago. He is certainly a good guitar player. But the songs were just so . . . I don't know, bland? Unmemorable, maybe?

I run hot and cold on Pavement. Sometimes I really appreciate their way with pop songcraft (e.g., a lot of stuff on Crooked Rain). Sometimes I feel like I'm trying way too hard to like them (this is especially true on their nosier stuff, which I gather is supposed to be Pavement at its most brilliant).

The only album that really made critics scratch their heads was Wowee Zowee.

Yes. That got trashed when it first came out. I think Christgau was the only one who recognized it as the masterpiece it was. It finished 17th in the Pazz and Jop poll, where the first two both finished 2nd.

I remember the critics being lukewarm in their assessment of TT when it was released, and most fans of the band, that I knew at least, were pretty down on it. Especially the "Why-couldn't-they-make-Slanted-and-Enchanted-four-more-times" brigade. BTC simply never comes up in discussions of their best work, and it certainly contains some.

for a record he gave an A- to, that is an amazingly lukewarm review of TT

Official then http://www.dominorecordco.com/uk/news/16-09-09/pavement-reform/

Domino is delighted to make it official that the line up of Mark Ibold, Scott "Spiral Stairs" Kannberg, Stephen Malkmus, Bob Nastanovich and Steve West is reuniting for dates around the world in 2010

Following years of speculation and extremely polite answers to obligatory reunion questions, Pavement, the most influential band of their generation, have announced details of their first show in over a decade.

The first show announced is a New York performance on September 21, 2010 at Rumsey Playfield in Central Park. A pre-sale begins at 10:00 AM EDT on Friday, September 18, 2009 (tomorrow). The password for the pre-sale is ZOWEE and the ticketing link is www.ticketmaster.com/event/00004330A3C355DD. The general on-sale is slated for 10:00 AM EDT on Friday, September 25, 2009. Please note that tickets will be available without surcharges from the Nokia Theatre box office in Times Square and from Earwax at 218 Bedford Avenue in Williamsburg.

Please visit www.crookedrain.com for details on this on-sale as well as all Pavement news as it develops.

Renowned for the thrilling ride of their live shows, Pavement’s unique sense of wit, style and pop chaos ensured the band’s iconoclastic run of LPs, from Slanted & Enchanted to Terror Twilight Is the most assured canon in all of indie-rock. And set the template for pretty much everything else that’s followed.

Bearing all that in mind however, the band would like it to be known that the tour does not constitute a full-on permanent reformation.

Pavement, the most influential band of their generatio

hahahaha

it's always weird when a band that doesn't need help being made to seem like a big deal gets an over-reaching press release like that anyway

Matador was a little less hoity toity

Ever since that fateful night in late 1999 when Pavement left the public eye with a final show at London’s Brixton Academy, we’ve often fantasized about the day when we could finally tell the world “yes, Brooklyn Vegan scooped us, Pavement are back.”

After years of speculation, the most important American band of the 1990’s is returning to the stage, with the lineup of Mark Ibold, Scott “Spiral Stairs” Kannberg, Stephen Malkmus, Bob Nastanovich and Steve West reuniting for dates around the world in 2010. Please be advised this tour is not a prelude to additional jaunts and/or a permanent reunion.

Described in their own Wikipedia entry as having experienced “moderate commercial success”, Pavement’s catalog for the Matador, Domino, Drag City and Treble Kicker imprints has come to define in the eyes of many the blueprint for independent rock over the past generation. In spite of this, the records are still pretty fantastic, and we’re fully prepared to remind you of such with a details-to-be-determined compilation album planned for release sometime in 2010.

The first show announced is a New York performance on September 21, 2010 at Rumsey Playfield in Central Park. Things worked out really well when Diana Ross played Central Park in 1983, and we have no reason to suspect Pavement’s return to the live arena won’t generate similar headlines.

oh boy a greatest hits comp

Bearing all that in mind however, the band would like it to be known that the tour does not constitute a full-on permanent reformation.

c'mon boys, you can't play hard to get and reform at the same time

"Maybe Maybe"
"Forklift"
"Spizzle Trunk"
oh boy a greatest hits comp

"Jackals, False Grails: The Lonesome Era"
"Sue Me Jack"
"Texas Never Whispers"
"Frontwards"
"Lions"
"Shoot The Singer"
"Silence Kit"
"Raft"
"AT & T"
"Grave Architecture"
"Kris Kraft"

haaaa whoops

xxpost i think that means: "we'll do this tour, and then occasionally play a big festival when the money's too good to turn down."

forgot one: Gangsters and Pranksters

yeah i mean, probably more big indie/alt-rock reunions the past few years have involved new albums and sustained touring than not, so it's fair for them to want to squash that thought right out of the gate if that isn't their intention

funny how I'm totally not very excited by this! Pavement was one of my favorite bands during adolescence/young adulthood. Still love and listen to the records, probably could even be considered a Pavement nerd. I guess because I saw them plenty back in the day, I'm not chomping at the bit to see them again. But it's cool for people who were too young at the time! I was excited to see Mission of Burma/Pixies/etc for that reason.

(this is especially true on their nosier stuff, which I gather is supposed to be Pavement at its most brilliant).

i disagree w/ people who say this, and many others do too - wowee and crooked rain are their masterpieces imo

actually a greatest hits would be good for pavement.

they better not sweep the terror twilight reissue i'm anticipating under the carpet because of all this reformation malarkey.

que, are those songs your favorite? i'm confused as to what prompted that

they didn't really have any "hits" though!

xpost--yeah those would be my favorites

my Pavement greatest hits comp if you will

i'm sure shady lane and carrot rope made the uk top twenty at least. At least a singles comp or a band-picked best of would be alright.

xp i dunno what a greatest hits comp would really do tbh - there's very little material (ok that's probably a lie but run w/ this) that hasnt been already released via those huge reissues and whatnot. many of their even more obscure songs/bsides have already been canonized as well. i guess the only people who would benefit from such a thing would be those just getting tinto the band, though pavement are one of those bands around which there's very little consensus as to what their best work is

though pavement are one of those bands around which there's very little consensus as to what their best work is

yeah that's totally true--one of their strengths i think

oh i think that the barrel has been scraped for the most part in terms of unreleased Pavement stuff. I think this'll be a pretty straightforward hits comp. Summer Babe, trigger Cut, Cut Yr Hair, Gold Soundz, Range Life, Shady Lane, Stereo, etc.

tyler that boot on yr blog of the TT tour is pretty great in places--Folk Jam especially

yeah! the Terror Twilight songs are (IMO!) much improved. Just sharper, more rocking, more exciting.

Yeah, you can line up their poppiest moments and make a great album: I'd add to Tyler's list "Here", "Date With Ikea", "Embassy Row", "AT&T" and "Kennel District". I guess that's why I've had lots of time for CRCR over the years and am still waiting to really "get" S&E.

they didn't really have any "hits" though!

Cut Your Hair

(shortest greatest hits comp ever)

that would be awwwwwwwwwwwwwwesome if they did that

you know what's undeniably classic about this band? Those t-shirts that said "Pavement" in the style of the Peavey logo.

xp yeah but they had some classic singles with hilarious accompanying videos

shit wait False Skorpion and Easily FOoled need to be on my comp as well

my "best of" while we're at it. It's a fairly conservative lineup it seems, although i'm at work so it's hard to remember tracklists and obscurities:

Shady Lane
Trigger Cut
Father To A Sister Of Thought
Range Life
Greenlander
Motion Suggests
Harness Your Hopes
Embassy Row
Major Leagues
Infinite Spark (Fin)

maybe No Tan Lines to close the comp on out

shit Harness Your Hopes!!!! And the fast version of the Hexx

my top 12 or whatever's probably pretty boring as far as pavement fans go:

here
range life
summer babe
we dance
frontwards
black out
box elder
fillmore jive
silence kit
zurich is stained
father to a sister of thought
spit on a stranger

yeah we could be here all day deciding which of their b-sides is best

Harness Your Hopes though - that's a jam that seems to have been dug out recently amongst the ilx massive as a fave.

from what i've read it seems like it was a live favorite at the time (it was part of the "spit on a stranger" EP), though it was released as part of the recent BTC reissue so maybe it's been more widely recognized recently. i'd assume many of the people who loved it at the time liked it for its "back to basics" sound - it's "classic" pavement-by-numbers in the best possible way imo

hmmm, that's funny. when it came out, i think i liked it for the opposite reason. it's one of the catchiest things they've ever done and to me "classic" pavement is the sort of scuzzy pop stuff i listed above, that isn't really catchy at all

yeah, "Harness" is more "classic rock" than "classic Pavement" -- I always thought the guitars were a straight up CCR tribute

great song either way

the goth kid has a hearse

coachella + atp = snooze

why can't any long awaited reunions stay away from huge festivals for once?

$$$

if they re-create their first coachella set, it won't be 'boring', per se

Off the top of my head:

Trigger Cut
Summer Babe
Silence Kit
Debris Slide
Frontwards
Lions (Linden)
Unfair
Heaven is a Truck
Kennel District
Transport is Arranged
We Are Underused

what the hell, is this ticketmaster not working for anyone else?

yeah, it keeps telling me that no tickets are available. Either it sold out in less than 3 minutes, or Ticketmaster is fubared.

atp - huge?
ATP NY has a max capacity of 2800

Yeah something is going on. I can't get tickets either. At least they're not directing people to Tickets Now like they did with Springsteen last year.

Could this be sold out already?

ughhhhh

man i did mine within a minute of it going up, i can't see it being sold out.

The chorus of Conduit For Sale seems appropriate right now.

Ticketmaster is stubhubed.

Ha. Tickets are already on stubhub starting at 130

wow

i got a ticket. worldfap, anyone?

Man this blows.

i would imagine they'll add more shows. . . ????

guh, just google the "internet presale" password. it's not "internet presale."

either way, non-presale tix go on sale a week from now

the password's zowee, but that's not the problem

case sensitive?

doesn't matter, both don't work.

worked for me. they prob sold out of the presale tix already.

shouldn't it be "zowie" ?

http://putitup.files.wordpress.com/2008/09/b00007gzfh02lzzzzzzz.jpg

apparently a second show was added?

http://pitchfork.com/news/36516-pavement-confirm-2010-world-tour/

wait nevermind, that's from yesterday

yeah you can already buy tickets for a 2nd show, just got some... same password

same ticketmaster url???

http://www.ticketmaster.com/event/00004330AC6859CD?artistid=750321&majorcatid=10001&minorcatid=60

got it, yessss

Yeah me too.

Funny, I had a look at the website after you all were going "oh no, they sold out" and thinking "what they mean? It says here they have tx"

.. must have been the first one in.

Although not being in NY/USA, and also not that bothered, didn't get tix.

i'm considering just buying a ticket now, hoping i'll be in NY september 2010. but it's a gamble.

Got them for first day!!!

They added even more.

Yeah second show (at least/as far as I know) still has tickets

got mine for day 2

is this second show a pre-order too? crazy how #1 sells out in less than a minute but #2 still has tix

i think it'd be hilarious if planning this show a year in advance means the band is going to take a ton of time to rehearse and everyone ends up all disappointed at how tight and professional they are

xp yup think so--had to enter ZOWEE

Because the masses probably don't know the second one exists. It was kind of suddenly there. And yes it is pre-sale too, use ZOWEE

xxp haha, doubt that for a few reasons but it would be pretty funny. don't think i'd be one of the ones disappointed though

Yeah how picky can you get?

you know outside of Weezer (lolz) I can't think of a single marginally successful band that was really "influenced" by Pavement... Grandaddy maybe?

I mean this is not a band that had an approach that could be easily repurposed

Yeah, there aren't many at all. Later stuff by Blur would probably qualify.

i think a lot of current guitar-based indie rock bands would say they were influenced by pavement, i guess the question is whether you mean "influenced " as "sounds exactly like" or "inspired by"

Yeah there's that one Blur album (13?), the one with Song #2. That is so blatant... but Blur are basically ripoff/pastiche artists so I dunno if citing them is really relevant.

I'm just still marvelling at the silliness of the Domino press release I guess.

i think a lot of current guitar-based indie rock bands would say they were influenced by pavement

well, like who? Grizzly Bear? Fleet Foxes? Bon Iver? The Dodos? Cuz yeah I don't really hear anybody copping Malkmus' scrabble-board-poetics-as-lyrics approach, or the slapdash 70s-prog guitar work... and those are probably the two most readily identifiable stylistic signifiers of the band

yeah but "influenced by" doesn't mean "sounds like" is my point

yeah but influence can also mean "i like this Pavement band so much it makes me want to play music, which may or may not sound anything like Pavement"

xpost

Yeah, i think you'd be hard-pressed to find any guitar-y indie band these days who wouldn't say "oh yeah, Pavement, loved them, owned all the records." dude from deerhunter I think is a pavement megafan. But yeah, actually sounding like pavement these days? there aren't many ...

fair enough

re: Deerhunter - they def have some Pavement-ish album/songtitles/graphic design that's for sure

but i do think you're right, Shakey, that hardly anyone sounds like them

having to buy 4 tix at once is a bit annoying

but think about sonic youth, are there any successful bands that sound ike sonic youth? surely sonic youth is a bigger and more influential band than pavement...

"Yeah there's that one Blur album (13?), the one with Song #2."

I read somewhere that this was an homage to Fugazi(!)
What Fugazi record sounds like that? (I've only listened to one Fugazi record)

Repeater

(the influence is only in the song titles)

sorry blonde moment carry on

but think about sonic youth, are there any successful bands that sound ike sonic youth? surely sonic youth is a bigger and more influential band than pavement...

you can credit SY for a lot but I dunno about bands that are successful (are any guitar-oriented noise bands "successful"?) But yeah tbg I would def say SY's impact on music has been way more pronounced. Basically any guitar band using non-standard tunings and copious noise is acknowledging them in some way.

were modest mouse influenced by pavement?

seem to recall an interview where Malkmus said Isaac Brock told him they were ...

don't think MM really sound like pave very much tho

Beetlebum is Blur trying to sound like Pavement iirc

and yes, Pavement's influence is definitely of the "these guys makes me wanna play music" more than actual bands sounding like them, although i'm sure you'll find plenty of the latter too with a quick browse through myspace

Always thought "Coffee + TV" was the Pavement-y one. And of course the guitar in "Tender" is pretty obviously inspired by "Here"

"Yeah there's that one Blur album (13?), the one with Song #2."

I read somewhere that this was an homage to Fugazi(!)
What Fugazi record sounds like that? (I've only listened to one Fugazi record)

― Philip Nunez, Friday, September 18, 2009 1:17 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

kinda embarrassing story: in high school one time i was waiting in the car of a friend who had recently gotten me into Fugazi. he got out of the car and left the self-titled Blur album in the CD player and someone asked me what we were listening to, I ventured a guess that it was Fugazi. I've never gone back and listened to that Blur album to try and determine whether Albarn actually does sound a bit like Picciotto on it, or if I was just really dumb.

that's not that dumb. if we want to start swapping dumb music stories. . . i thought Mick Jones was the lead singer of the Clash until almost the end of college

well yeah it's not a world class music nerd blooper but i remember later in the album when i recognized one of the songs as Blur my face was red even if noone else noticed or called me on it

and i've probably gotten confused as to the voices/identities of any band w/ multiple singers of the same gender at some point in my youth (They Might Be Giants, the Posies, once again Fugazi, you name it)

but think about sonic youth, are there any successful bands that sound ike sonic youth?

I dunno what you mean by successful, but Blonde Redhead used to get compared to Sonic Youth quite a bit, on their first three albums. They've mostly moved away from that sound, though.

i think a lot of bands try for Sonic Youth but the overall sound/feel isn't that close partly because they don't have the same personalized tunings and effects. it's almost like their own proprietary software.

Dud

i wouldn't equivocate blonde redhead in the same league as weezer or grandaddy.

if you do, then Sammy was the most shameless Pavement rip-off band. Image-aside I personally don't hear any Pavement in Blur, Weezer or even Grandaddy. But Sammy was the first band that I was like... oh these guys are trying to be Pavement. There was another obscure band on Ringers Lactate that was like really really close to capturing Pavement's sound... can't remember their name. off to google.

Wingtip Sloat

Sexual Milkshake

Blue Green Gods

am0n otm...Pavement is probably the only band i've ever bought more than 3 albums by that i kind of regret ever getting into and barely like more than a handful of songs by now.

Sammy was the most shameless Pavement rip-off band
i agree! but the Sammy EP I have is actually kinda great ...

do any of you other guys hav e any regrets

that and the Blur/Fugazi thing, that's about it.

Tiger Trap
that Heavens to Betsy full length

hockey night

no... i'm thinking that it was a band that only released one single ca. 90-92... kinda like a gothy pavement. actually i think one of the guys in the band was a brief member of pavement...?

who was the guy who worked at Strand Books and dj'd at kuva with those dudes?

lol wtju

what

I thought Mick Jones was the lead singer of the Clash until almost the end of college

I thought Mick Jones was the lead singer of Foreigner until almost the end of college.

ok, Rob Chamberlain's band he formed after he left Pavement in 1990... they released a single on Ringer's Lactate right?

steve you're basing all this on chickfactor aren't you

cf: someone told me that david berman and [uva homie] rob chamberlain were like the deathrock milli vanilli in college.
stephen: yeah, sort of. they were kind of gothic.
cf: were you deathrock too?
stephen: no, I thought they were these scuzzy people that weren't nice because of the way they dressed. I was afraid of them.
cf: did you like living in charlottesville?
stephen: it was okay. other people had more fun than me. to me it just passed right by. I didn¹t really have much fun. I couldn’t wait to leave. that being said, I had a good enough time while I was there. but I was always thinking, god, I can't wait till the next stage of my life. high school was the same way. I totally expected to have no ties with anybody from that school when I left. then I met bob and david at the end of it. it was better then. my class sucked. they're a year younger than me, all those guys.

actually another zine... maybe marc master's or mike mcgonigal's that may have reviewed it as "a gothy pavement"... i knew he worked at Strand Books too back then.

there is no ringer's lactate discography on grunnen rocks! only one entry. sadface.

I've only heard the Weakerthans maybe once but i remember thinking they were very Pavementy.

Heh The Weakerthans...

Third show now you know people, on the 23rd if you haven't gotten tickets

hahaha four shows!!!!

they're just going to keep adding shows til one of them doesn't sell out

So then by tomorrow there'll be 12

Its this new kind of tour, where you stay in one place and keep having shows and everybody visits YOU!

Central Park is the new Las Vegas

Sammy xpost. I've probably stuck up for them enough on other threads, so keeping it short.

Really only Pavement-y on a few tracks from their first album. Lead singer Jesse Hartman is copying Lou Reed shamelessly anyway, not Malkmus. Lyrics are narratives about preppies. They put out two albums, an ep, and a bunch of singles with very worthwhile b-sides. Mostly they did chugging 90's indie rock w/better production/lyrics/tunes than usual. Album photos make them look like Robert Chambers.

2nd album, Tales of Great Neck Glory, is the perennially overlooked masterpiece (look around the net and people are constantly discovering it and wondering why it isn't better known). They have a b-side, "Cafeteria Hawker" that's wonderful and I'm sure almost nobody has heard it. Total miscarriage of justice that they weren't on the soundtrack to Igby Goes Down or some Whit Stillman film.

Lyrics are narratives about preppies.

ah, so they've influenced Vampire Weekend? Cool.

heard the 1st Sammy record, liked a coupla things off of it ... didn't hear Great Neck Glory, though I recall it being a used CD-bin perennial back in the day. Maybe I'll have to track it down. I do really love the Tales of Greatneck Glory EP. Think that's what it was called. 4 great songs.

oops Inlad Empire EP is what I meant, durr

INLAND EMPIRE

i'm referring to Sammy's first ep, not record fwiw... i never even knew they released any records other than that first EP!

didn't they have a record called "Debut Album" or something?

yeah, Debut Album came out before Inland Empire: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sammy_(band)

$0.98 at Amazon http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B0000030KE/ref=ntt_mus_ep_olp

Their Wikipedia discography is missing a bunch of stuff. The Trouser Press one is a little better, though it's still missing a few things.

Mysteriously, Debut Album seems to have been reissued somehow with bonus tracks. I can't remember where I found it, but it popped up on some online store and includes three songs that weren't on the original CD. No idea why anyone would want to do that!

Anyway, my discography (without release dates) is:

Debut Album (full length)
Kings of The Inland Empire EP
Majik Man EP
Encyclopedia-ite EP
Neptune Ave. EP
Leopard Skin Swatch EP
Tales of Great Neck Glory (full length)

There's also a vinyl 7", but I think both songs are on one of the above EP's.

This, if you can find it, has really nice b-sides:

http://www.amazon.com/Encyclopedi-ite-Cd-Single-Unrelease-Tracks/dp/B000TBQWOS/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1253310340&sr=8-2

Oh yeah, emusic is where I found the bonus tracks reissue of Debut Album. No idea what the hell it is...I never managed to google anything about it...

http://www.emusic.com/album/Sammy-Debut-Album-bonus-tracks-MP3-Download/11260062.html

No idea why anyone would want to do that!
well that wiki entry says the main guy went on to be geffen's a&r director, so he must be pretty connected ...

Oh hell, as long as I'm turning this into the Sammy info-trove, their lead singer Jesse Hartman had a one-man band Laptop later, and put out a single (released in Norway for no good reason that I can think of) that included three Sammy tracks redone in his Laptop style. This is it:

http://www.mfn.musiconline.no/shop/displayAlbum.asp?id=27332

It's just ok.

when is sammy reuniting is what i want to know. they could play the park across the street from my house.

Oh, here we go:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSB1wjxjTaU

god, can you please start a separate thread for "sammy"?

what is the result of someone listening to the watery, domestic album 100x in a row and then going into the studio...?

haha xpost

Wingtip Sloat

― Mr. Que, Friday, September 18, 2009 3:23 PM (3 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Sexual Milkshake

― Mr. Que, Friday, September 18, 2009 3:23 PM (3 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Blue Green Gods

― Mr. Que, Friday, September 18, 2009 3:23 PM (3 hours ago) Bookmark

If no-one else is going to give you massive props for this trifecta of recall, then it falls to me

fuckin blue green gods, holy shit Que you run deep in the game

and by game I mean the all-important "bands who appeared on many compilation 7"s" game

hmm i was wondering why sammy were all of a sudden very popular in my slsk upload Q

just got my ticket for friday. havn't had access to a computer all day. really glad they kept adding all these shows for the slackers.

yeah now I am kinda in a situation where I'd probably rather go Friday but I've got Wednesday tix. didn't want to buy more though. luckily I've got roughly 369 days to figure it out

But Sammy was the first band that I was like...

It's funny, earlier today when we were naming Pavement-y bands, this was the obvious one but I didn't feel like going through the whole "great obscure band" thing again.

However, Tales From Great Neck Glory is indeed an overlooked classic. Especially Encyclopediate and the one that goes "he's afraid of open space."

i no nobody cares anymore but here was the band i was referencing earlier, i had to dig through a shit load of 7"s for you, ilx, i hope you're happy:

http://www.discogs.com/Sugartime-Girl-Crash/release/1507060

can't find that online but here is(?) their 2nd 7" that came out on simple machines
http://7inchoftheday.blogspot.com/2008/05/sugartime-awestruck-bw-gemini-enemy.html

so from what I hear, the presale sold 4000 out of 5500 tickets for each Central Park show. the rest go on sale tomorrow morning.

"All Tomorrow’s Parties is honoured to announce that the legendary Pavement will curate ATP in May 2010"

http://www.atpfestival.com/Events/Pavement/News/0910071500.php

man, this is crazy.

i just hope they keep adding shows so i can see them...

supposedly gonna be 10 to 12 u.s. cities and some more in Europe

Come to Austin, please, fellas!

or Nashville, since none of ya's have deigned to play a Memphis show in over 12 years.

The ATP fest is on sale this morning by the way, selling fast.

could you guys not shift the venue to Center Parcs? that would rule.

if we upped the ticket price by another £50-£100, possibly

ah fuck do i buy tickets even tho i don't know if anyone will go with me yet

As if you'd have trouble scalping them if you need to.

just sold out of 2 and 3 berths. this is the fastest an atp has ever sold.

I got my ATP tickets this morning. Even more 30 something indie d-bags in attendance for this one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJhSESlpsIM&feature=PlayList&p=941E54E8C999709B&index=24

check this out--great live clip of an exuberant pavement playing unfair in a stadium in 1994, with amazing crowd mayhem...followed by a brinx job instrumental. this is why i won't go see them now, i'm too old, too old

hey wait is that bit nastanovitch on the album? mind being blown here o_o

no, bob always did malk's shouty vox live. bob wasn't in the studio til btc? maybe the pac trim ep?

huuuh. i sort of remember him wailing in 'stereo' when i saw them (i was 13 and not very sure who they were; the set was mainly terror twilight so i don't think there was that much screaming to get through.) i didn't know he made such a habit of it. quite a weird thing for a band to do, i guess.

bob wasn't in the studio til btc? maybe the pac trim ep?

is this true? just seems a bit weird seeing how in the doc he sort of makes a point of him being a "real" member of the band.

bob did alot of the shouting parts from "i'm trying" forward, and always the part in unfair when played live (but maybe not on the record?)
anyway, i love this clip--i saw them three times but never like this :(

quite a weird thing for a band to do, i guess.

it saved malk's voice on many occasions.

bob wasn't in the studio til btc? maybe the pac trim ep?

is this true? just seems a bit weird seeing how in the doc he sort of makes a point of him being a "real" member of the band.

― sonderangerbot, Sunday, October 11, 2009 3:52 AM

bob's original purpose was 2nd drummer to gary young in case gary couldn't play. also did a bit of the tour managering for a bit. then they got him some maracas, cowbell, tamb, and a nord lead once west,s was brought in. read the book, pretty sure it covers all this.

wiki claims he's on 'watery, domestic'. also tour managered silver jews and jicks as late as 2006

seems like a dude really

the notes to the cr;cr reissue (i think that one; mb wowee z.) have malkmus saying of one song that he screamed so loud he almost passed out during the recording. this would probably explain why he thought having one of the other guys do the screaming might make sense

Plus if you're on tour and you wanna bring your friend along, you gotta find things for him to do here and there. Doesn't seem so weird to me.

I'm currently trying to obtain a copy of the rebellious jukebox that Steve Malkmus wrote for melody maker around 1992. I think it appeared after S&E and before CRCR. I've googled all of the various relevant combinations of words but haven't managed to find it. Rocksbackpages.com doesn't seem to have it in their archives so I'm now totally stuck. Can anyone help me with this? Tons of gratitude if so.

I feel like I've seen that before somewhere, but Google is failing me as well.

i'd like to find this too. is some of it mentioned in the Pavement biog?

I'm not sure. I recall reading it at the time it came out and remember it as being written in a really interesting way, kind of like the lyrics to S&E.

European Tour dates

05.04.10 - Dublin, Ireland - Tripod
05.05.10 - Glasgow, Scotland - Barrowland
05.07.10 - Paris, France - Le Zénith
05.08.10 - Amsterdam, Netherlands - Paradiso
05.10.10 - London, England - Brixton Academy
05.11.10 - London, England - Brixton Academy
05.12.10 - London, England - Brixton Academy
05.13.10 - London, England - Brixton Academy
05.15.10 - Minehead, England - All Tomorrow’s Parties
05.18.10 - Brussels, Belgium - Ancienne Belgique
05.19.10 - Berlin, Germany - Astra
05.20.10 - Prague, Czech Republic - Palac Akropolis
05.21.10 - Vienna, Austria - Arena
05.22.10 - Munich, Germany - Muffathalle
05.24.10 - Rome, Italy - Atlantico Live
05.25.10 - Bologna, Italy - Estragon
05.27.10 - Barcelona, Spain - Primavera Festival

Neil, someone on the Electrical Audio forums posted it in '06.

1/2. THE STOOGES: "FUNHOUSE"/ THE RAMONES: "LEAVE HOME"
I listened to these two records in a sort of daily rotation in my late teen years, and I think they burned into me an appreciation of the power of simplicity, and a distate for the tiresome inefficiency of all the puffy rock that was around at the time. While I was in college; I saw The Ramones play an absolutely uninspiring, rote-repetition live set about six months after I first saw Iggy Pop get a blow job from a fully-looped junkie chick while sitting on the edge of a pool table. Surprisingly, neither spectacle has affected my opinion of these records.

3. SUICIDE: "SUICIDE"
When I was 17, my mom came downstairs while I was listening to 'Frankie Teardrop' really loud. That was the only time she ever asked if I was using drugs.

4. JOHN CALE: "FEAR"
I have a high regard for John Cale, despite there being only one or two worthwhile moments on each album. I saw him live with a rock band, about the time 'Vintage Violence' was released, and he
was incredible. At the end of his set, he climbed the lighting rig while balancing a tray of cold cuts from the dressing room, and dangled, hanging from his heels, while he threw salami at the crowd. When the tray was empty, he crumpled the aluminium foil into a wad the size of an apple and bit off a mouthful, chewing it while he babbled into a microphone which he somehow maintained control of. I caught a slice of salami and pinned it to my jacket right next to my Naked RayGun 'No Sex' badge, where it stayed long enough for people to start complaining about it when they saw me. Weeks I think.

5. MINUTEMEN: "Buzz or Howl Under the Influence of Heat"
The band that proved the point best that being outstanding musicians didn't need to interfere with fully kicking ass. I could have named any of their records, which are all nearly perfect. To
say that the Minutemen influenced me, and an entire population of others, is such a gross understatement, it's like saying the Civil War had 'some effect' on the slave trade. The only other three-piece rock band to carve out such a distinctive path would probably be the Wipers, about whom you limeys know way to little for me to help you very much.

6. THE POP GROUP: "WE ARE TIME","SHE IS BEYOND GOOD AND EVIL"
English Art wank that has held up much better than most of his contemporaries. Their disregard for even the slightest hint of linear movement was truly inspiring.

7. THE CONTORTIONS: "BUT THE CONTORTIONS"
I never bought into the James Chance-as-James Brown thing, but sonically this album defined the space within which many lesser talents continue to work. The frantic mood and the exasperated/confrontational delivery have yet to be equalled, and the belly-laugh quotient remains high, especially when Chance starts blowing. Personally I'm sad this aesthetic has decayed into
the lounge rock (Eggs, Combustible Edison) and retro-beatnik (Morphine) genres, without anyone trying to keep the level of hostility very high.

8. GLENN BRANCA: "LESSON No.1"
This record woke me up to using extended repetition and consonance as compositional elements, and is actually denser and more invigorating than more preened pieces from later in Branca's career, which says a lot. I know Can, Neu, Kraftwerk, Philip Glass, LaMonte Young and several generations of longhairs had been exploiting similar-to-identical ideas for decades, but hey, I bet people were
jerking off for centuries before you figured out how to.

9. BAD BRAINS: "BANNED IN D.C."
In certain circles, this cassette was as common as "The White Album" was at hippie pads. Probably my choice, along with the first Die Kreuzen L.P., as the recording that validates the American hardcore movement. On a purely musically level (silly branch dynamics political discussion aside) this tape is stunning. Amazing songs, stop-on-a-dime tightness and lightening speed. Listen to the drumming on this. Man, could those fuckers play. Do not confuse this release with any of the other Bad Brains releases, which are terrible without exception, especially after Living Colour hit the scene.

10. THIRD WORLD WAR: "THIRD WORLD WAR"
This album has the best title of any record ever released, and it represents a bizarre and inexplicable tangent of my taste - extreme English boogie rock. I have an equal fondness for the Dr
Feelgood album, 'Down by the Jetty', or any of several records by The Count Bishops, StackWaddy or Motor Boys Motor, but this record gets the nod for its abrasive personality, impressively rude guitar playing and no-holds-barred radical communist lyricism.

11. RUDIMENTARY PENI: "FARCE"
Blazing, shrieking and utterly unintelligable at times, this is intensely personal music made by excellent musicians who don't ever seem quite in control of it or themselves. The mood is barely
restrained, near-paranoid obsession that is by turns baffling, enthralling and frightening. This is their best and most representative record.

12. THE DIDJITS: "HEY JUDESTER"
Primal, non-derivative rock ' n ' music from Matton, Illinois. The humour and weirdness are matched by spot on playing that neither trivialises nor romanticises the genre. This is also one of the best sounding and most revealing recordings of a rock band ever. A song about dropping acid with Jerry Lee Lewis and then watching him kill one of his wives could only be topped by a paean to prison life, or a song about a carburettor, both of which are on this album. Hands down the best rock ' n ' roll album of the Eighties.

13. SLINT: "SPIDERLAND"
Stark and simple, it dosen't suprise me that this album has spawned a whole sub-genre ('Slint Bands') in the States. Few of those bands have the grace or restraint to make music this moving, however. When I first heard Slint, I didn't 'get it'. Once I 'got it', their music took whole days of my life. It was like listening to that first Ramones album over and over and over, just to make sure I got everything out of it. I felt honoured to own a copy.

14. CHROME: "HALF MACHINE LIP MOVES"
Probably the weirdest band ever to come out of San Francisco. They did the impossible of making freaked, strained sounds while rocking quite hard. Most bands are capable of only one or the other. Chrome records exicited and confused me, and I listened to them on headphones a lot.

15. THE FALL: "SLATES"
A weird band at their weirdest. On 'Slates', the Fall reached the pinnacle of the rambling, babbling rockabilly style that would ultimately be pillaged to lesser effect by bands like Pussy Galore, Royal Trux, Pavement and Girls against Boys.

london london london london minehead

i mean, fuck that frankly xpost

Did not actually mean to paste the text there, sorry. Complete disaster as that's Albini's.

Just bought tix for Berkeley show in June....YES.... Ticketmaster fees hateful as usual....

i'm hyperventilating. June is too far away!!!

are there still US dates being added? Or is that it? was hoping they might make it to my neck of the woods. at the moment, Berkeley is the closest! and I'm in Colorado ....

i'm a bit bummed they're only doing festival gigs around here. in someway i have to go, but i'm not sure if i'll buy a roskilde ticket for their sake only...

Damn didn't know they'd announced a Bay Area date. Just got two tickets!

Currently looks like Berkeley is the only US date besides Coachella & the Central Park stand in September.

http://www.tourtracker.com/artist/pavement/1019251