The 25th P&J Singles Poll!

For this poll I actually WILL vote for The Darkness.

Toughest poll yet! Went with "Get Low" 'cause lot's of my other faves are assured of getting plenty ILM love.

Coldplay ftw, natch!

Tempted to vote for The Roots, but "Hey Ya" still works.

Told ya.

"You Don't Know My Name" and "Step in the Name of Love (remix)" and "Clocks" and "Why Can't I?" and "Rock Your Body" all still sound pretty good to me, but there are so so many songs here that I kinda never want to hear ever again (including pretty much the entire top 10).

Hmm, I count six all-time classics on the top ten--and the rest ain't bad either.

LOTTA good stuff here but went with "Get Low"

"The Way You Move" is the first song on this list I don't find totally fucking awesome.

This is impossible. About half this poll is world-beatingly good. 2003 is quite possibly my favorite year for singles there is.

That one, Clocks, Snoop's Beautiful (sorry, always found Pharrell's mayfield particularly awful on that one), Christina's Beautiful (you can't hurt me so don't hurt me!), The Roots featuring Lo-Fi Kravitz and Alicia Keys are the only ones I'm not basically A++++ about. Haven't heard the New P's or Zevon, though.

there's only a couple of songs in the top 20 that are just ok.

"The Way You Move" has aged really badly.

Oh, "Ignition" and "Crazy In Love" etc. are classics, no doubt. But I'd switch the station if I heard them in 2007, and might need another 4 years before I actively want to hear them. (xpost)

LOL @ "Pass That Dutch" getting grandfathered in on this poll.

Those Roots and A. Keys singles are completely fucking killer and entirely make up for the rest of their overrated careers. Cody Chesnutt is the whole reason "The Seed" is their only good song, anyway. They're so damn sexless and dangerless otherwise, even when they're trying to be otherwise.

LOL @ "Pass That Dutch" getting grandfathered in on this poll.

-- Alex in Baltimore, Wednesday, November 14, 2007 6:47 AM (Wednesday, November 14, 2007 6:47 AM) Bookmark Link

Indeed. How the fuck did "Pass That Dutch" place and "Gossip Folks" not?

the answer is "Work It." I like "Pass The Dutch" but think "I'm Really Hot" was the real keeper on that album.

"The Seed" is the best Stones single since "Start Me Up."

I am utterly alone in finding "Pass That Dutch" relentless and great.

Yeah, I do too. That's my favorite Missy album.

"The Seed" is the best Stones single since "Start Me Up."

-- JN$OT, Wednesday, November 14, 2007 6:54 AM (Wednesday, November 14, 2007 6:54 AM) Bookmark Link

This.

'03 really was an amazing year for singles. good ones not on this list:

Talib Kweli - “Get By”
Linkin Park - “Faint”
Freeway featuring Peedi Crakk - “Flipside”
Baby featuring The Clipse - “What Happened To That Boy?”
Joe Budden - “Pump It Up”
Bone Crusher featuring Killer Mike and T.I. - “Never Scared”
Sean Paul - “Like Glue”
The Youngbloodz featuring Lil Jon - “Damn!”
Trina featuring Ludacris - “B R Right”
Nivea featuring R. Kelly - “Laundromat”
Evanescence - “Bring Me To Life”
Christina Aguilera - “Fighter”
Kanye West - “Through The Wire”
Cee-Lo featuring Timbaland - “I’ll Be Around”
Good Charlotte - “The Anthem”
Mario - “C’mon”
Kelly Clarkson - "Miss Independent"
Daniel Bedingfield - “If You’re Not The One”
Blink 182 - "Feeling This"
David Banner featuring Lil Flip - “Like A Pimp”
Kelly Rowland - “Can’t Nobody”
Wayne Wonder - “No Letting Go”
Juelz Santana featuring Cam’ron - “Dip Set (Santana’s Town)”
Da Band - “Bad Boy This, Bad Boy That”
Lil Mo featuring Fabolous - “4Ever”
Monica - “So Gone”
Bow Wow featuring Jagged Edge - “My Baby”
Jagged Edge - “Walked Outta Heaven”
The Foo Fighters - “Times Like These”
Busta Rhymes featuring Pharrell - “Light Your Ass On Fire”

It is pretty great. Just not as great as "Work It."

xxp

"Through the Wire" placed in 04. (xp)

Busta Rhymes featuring Pharrell - “Light Your Ass On Fire”

Would've gotten my vote.

I'd throw in JT's "Señorita" and the Dandy Warhols' "We Used To Be Friends" too.

yeah, I should've remembered that. I almost said "Slow Jamz," which was also on a list I made in '03, but I knew that that definitely placed in '04. (xpost)

Songs I voted for that aren't on Alex's list (which I dig at least 50% of) or the Pazz.

Good Charlotte, "The Young And The Hopeless"
Queens Of The Stone Age, "Go With The Flow"
Eamon, "Fuck It"
Junior Senior, "Shake Your Coconuts"
Kelly Osbourne, "Come Dig Me Out"

Eamon, "Fuck It"

Makes me want to go on a murderous rampage.

Freeway "What We Do"
Killer Mike "Akshun" and "Adidas"
Jay-Z "La La La"
MOP "Put It In the Air"

DMX "X Gonna Give It To Ya"

oh "What We Do" is a straight classic, one of those kinda on the borderline between years that I was thinking of more as an '02 single.

as for Phair, "Why Can't I?" is OK, but I prefer "Extraordinary" or "Rock Me."

oh "What We Do" is a straight classic, one of those kinda on the borderline between years that I was thinking of more as an '02 single.

-- Alex in Baltimore, Wednesday, November 14, 2007 7:19 AM (Wednesday, November 14, 2007 7:19 AM) Bookmark Link

Right, "Akshun", too.

I actually didn't like "Flipside" at the time, even though I bumped that Freeway album like hella.

I voted

"Step in the Name of Love (remix)"

Hmm, I count six all-time classics on the top ten--and the rest ain't bad either.

-- JN$OT, Wednesday, November 14, 2007 8:41 AM (43 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

are you on crack?

yeah there are tons of classic singles on there ... but most of them are like our generation's classic rock radio at this point

"but"

I think I'd like "Extraordinary" if half of it wasn't taken up with that endless "sane pyscho" refrain.

also Rev's anti-Roots hate is way out of proportion!!! they wrote some sexy tracks. "you got me"?? "silent treatment"? i like them at their lite-jazziest

Oh no! Too many people be liking great songs!

also Rev's anti-Roots hate is way out of proportion!!! they wrote some sexy tracks. "you got me"?? "silent treatment"? i like them at their lite-jazziest

-- deej, Wednesday, November 14, 2007 7:27 AM (Wednesday, November 14, 2007 7:27 AM) Bookmark Link

They're so damn sexless and dangerless...even when they're trying to be otherwise.

-- The Reverend, Wednesday, November 14, 2007 6:50 AM (Wednesday, November 14, 2007 6:50 AM) Bookmark Link

"Get Low", but the R Kellys are the ones I go around singing most often--"Get Low" is harder to sing

also Rev's anti-Roots hate is way out of proportion!!! they wrote some sexy tracks. "you got me"?? "silent treatment"? i like them at their lite-jazziest

-- deej, Wednesday, November 14, 2007 7:27 AM (Wednesday, November 14, 2007 7:27 AM) Bookmark Link

They're so damn sexless and dangerless...even when they're trying to be otherwise.

-- The Reverend, Wednesday, November 14, 2007 6:50 AM (Wednesday, November 14, 2007 6:50 AM) Bookmark Link

-- The Reverend, Wednesday, November 14, 2007 9:28 AM (48 seconds ago) Bookmark Link

yeah but you put those in the wrong order. i was answering you.

even the hokey indie gimmick singles (danger high voltage, move your feet) were really solid this year

+ the darkness, !!!

"Frontin" maybe the only vegas lounge neptunes track i enjoy

"B R Right" is way better than "Stand Up" ... too bad

BUHRUM-DUM-DUM DUH-DADA-DADA-DUM = totally sing-worthy

"Sexy" Roots songs are failed sexy, though, and failed sexy is about the worst thing music can be.

Dissing a backpacker group as "sexless and dangerless" is, well, not wrong, but I dunno, kind of pointless, unless you think all rap has to be sexy and dangerous.

Probably. Fwiw, I couldn't get into them even when I was a backpack dork.

Black Thought certainly likes to think he's sexy and dangerous on occasion, so it would seem a valid criticism. Though personally I think he's at his best when he's doing one of those cheating songs.

Looks like I picked the wrong week to stop smokin' rock!

many x-posts

i think their best songs are the implicitly sexy ones tho ... the smoother the better.

black thought never sounds like he's trying to be sexy, he sounds like hes trying to be serious

That's true I guess, in the sense that their (implicitly, explicitly, whatever) sexy songs sound like boring, serious sex.

There's such a thing?

yeah there are tons of classic singles on there ... but most of them are like our generation's classic rock radio at this point

-- deej, Wednesday, November 14, 2007 9:26 AM (42 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

"but"

-- Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Wednesday, November 14, 2007 9:26 AM (42 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

Yeah, I'm really interested in this point. How did so many of these songs become wedding staples? Between the two OutKast songs, Beyonce, Kelis, and Justin Timberlake (and maybe R. Kelly and Junior Senior), it's like the only year this decade that's done anything like that. Throw in the fact that "Toxic" was a late 2003 release (showed up on P&J in 2004), and it's really kind of weird.

Was 2003 really the year that pop "broke"?

I voted for Kelis. Like the rest of you I could have voted for just about anything on this, great list. I don't care if it is like classic rock, I like classics duh, esp. these twinkly ones like "Milkshake" "Pass That Dutch" "Such Great Heights" "Clocks" etc

I dunno, but I've heard the phrase "boring sex" bandied about, mostly in relation to middle-aged long-married types who do it missionary once a week. Probably a strawman as all middle-aged people have been divorced since 1994. xxp

It was a really great year for pop! (Occam's razor, etc). I took issue with deej's hesitating to crown the year because so many songs are overplayed.

xpost to jaymc

2003 wasn't the year that pop broke, just the best year for pop in a long time.

WTF? First we had indie-kid guilt; now we have pop-/hip hop-/R&B-kid guilt?

xp to deej, obviously.

I already know I have backpacker guilt, so nobody needs to call me on it.

if ignition doesnt win this you should all be ashamed of yourselves

Oh no! Too many people be liking great songs!

OTM. This mentality is especially retarded coming from critics.

poptimism guilt

you guys are reading wayyyy too much into me just being tired of hearing these songs eleven million times. i like classic rock too... im not going to front like 'ignition remix' is anything but classic. its just that i've been wayyy overexposed to it over the last couple of years

deej, i think the thing people are having a problem with is you calling someone "on crack" for saying that the list has several classics and is mostly good, and then admitting that you basically agree.

i was saying he was on crack for saying there were only six!!

in the top ten alone!?

oops didn't see that ... altho i still say there are more than six! eight easy (zzz @ stacys mom)

I used to sing "Stacy's Mom" to this girl Stacy cause it bugged her (mad lulz ensued the time I managed to get her brother to join in), and one time this guy who overheard said, "Wow, I can't believe you like rock. Most black guys like rap." I was just like "...", too angry to even call him on it, luckily other people did and he had a new reputation for racist shit that followed him for the rest of high school.

Most white guys like sappy warmed over new wave

He was asian, I think they like classical or something.

Rapture: "House of Jealous Lovers" (Universal)

This is where I came in!

i like every song on this list except the liz phair one and the jet one (which is still pretty ok)

Man, looking at the two polls, I'm amazed at how boring and shitty the albums were and how incredibly vital and exciting the singles were. 2003 was the year of the radio.

^otm.

remix of that lumidee song is fire.

i'm voting "maps".

voting for:

Panjabi MC featuring Jay-Z: "Beware of the Boys (Mundian To Bach Ke)" (Sequence)

runner-up:

Lil Jon & the East Side Boyz featuring Ying Yang Twins: "Get Low" (TVT)

no use for:

Johnny Cash: "Hurt" (Universal)
!!!: "Me and Giuliani Down by the Schoolyard (A True Story)" (Touch & Go)
Yeah Yeah Yeahs: "Maps" (Interscope)
Coldplay: "Clocks" (Capitol)
Christina Aguilera: "Beautiful" (RCA)
Alicia Keys: "You Don't Know My Name" (J Records)
New Pornographers: "The Laws Have Changed" (Matador)
Postal Service: "Such Great Heights" (Sub Pop)
Warren Zevon: "Keep Me in Your Heart" (Artemis)
Radiohead: "There There" (Capitol)

There are a few others I have no opinon at all about, but I'll leave them alone.

And there a lot that I like a lot.

My ballot that year:

1 Panjabi MC featuring Jay-Z Beware of the Boys (Mundian To Bach Ke) Sequence
2 Lil Jon & the East Side Boyz featuring Ying Yang Twins Get Low TVT
3 50 Cent In Da Club G-Unit/Shady/ Aftermath/Interscope
4 Living Things Bombs Below SKG
5 Lycaon Pictus Lycaon Pictus no label
6 Bat Eats Plastic City Beat no label
7 Toby Keith I Love This Bar DreamWorks
8 Man In Gray Incommunicado no label
9 Hitman Sammy Sam Step Daddy Universal
10 Molotov Frijolero Universal

Damn, but you're consistent, Chuck!

you consistent-ass mutha!

Panjabi MC featuring Jay-Z: "Beware of the Boys (Mundian To Bach Ke)" (Sequence)

This is the one my girlfriend would be voting for, if she was ever bored enough to actually lurk on ILM.

I heard that for the first time in forever recently, hasn't really dated well. Jay getting vaguely political and the unlikely collaborator make it catnip for critics, but it's still like the 3rd best hip hop song with the Night Rider beat at best.

I actually prefer the version without the Hov.

Me too. Even Jay-Z realizes he doesn't need to be there and drops out not even halfway through.

Insanely brilliant year. toot toot/beep beep.

I actually prefer the version without the Hov.

-- da croupier, Wednesday, 14 November 2007 22:45 (28 minutes ago) Link

Thirded.

I wonder how many votes were for the Jigga-less version.

I went with "hot & fresh out the kitchen" but I should've gone with "we did it for love, yeah, that's why we did it"

Went with !!!: "Me and Giuliani Down by the Schoolyard (A True Story)," yet another song that most take for a novelty but I find deeply, deeply sad. Also, greatest New Order song not by New Order. The 4:19 - 4:49 chunk, I mean.

M.I.A.:

DJ Shadow: "Six Days (Soulwax Remix)" (Island Japan) - Probably overrated this. But still a head-scratching mashup of The B-52's and ask Josh whoever.

Twista featuring Kanye West & Jamie Foxx: "Slow Jamz" (Atlantic) - Oooh lookee who got on the Kanye tip early.

Kiley Dean featuring Timbaland: "Make Me A Song" (Beatclub/Interscope) - Songs about songs are usually better than mere songs. And you have to at least acknowledge that she put up front what every pop star this decade was/is asking for behind the scenes.

Fast Food Rockers: "Fast Food Song" (Better The Devil) - Not what Blondie ever had in mind.

Richard Thompson: "Oops! I Did It Again" (Beeswing) - Not a single (that I know of). But at least HE knows it's a great song.

Toni Braxton: "Let Me Show You The Way (Out)" (Arista) - You gotta love a woman who can bend Curtis Mayfield and The Impressions to such nasty ends.

Dizzee Rascal: "Fix Up, Look Sharp" (Beggars Banquet) - "I Luv U" could peel yellow off a lemon. But this is the one that fucks with textuality the most. And isn't that why all the Simon Reynolds types listen to this stuff in the first place?

The Fever: "Glamorous Life" (Kemado) - In 1000 years, will archivists figure out that Eela She's was the original?

I love the way "Fix Up, Look Sharp" doesn't quite loop right. You can totally see the seams.

I've narrowed it down to 21.

You can totally see the seams.

Yes, exactly! So fascinating for that aspect. It's as much Billy Squire's song as Dizzee's.

And that willingness to give one's self/song up marks a crucial difference between grime and most American hip-hop of the non-backpack variety.

I may have mentioned this before but I get bummed out every time I dance to "Hey Ya!" Outkast admonish us for just wanting to dance. And yet they create one of the most infectious dance beats ever to go under (really over) the admonishment. So is there something fundamentally wrong with the song since few pay attention to its essentially bummer lyrics (beyond the Polaroid bit)?

Oh yeah. That line "Y'all don't even hear me, you just want to dance" is brilliant, because it occurs at the exact point it changes from poorly-remembered breakup song to well-remembered call-and-response rave-up.

I actually prefer the version without the Hov

I don't necessarily disagree with this, by the way. (It's been a while since I heard the version without him in it, but it seems like a completely reasonable stance to take. I may well prefer versions of most things without Hov.) But I still prefer the version with Hov to anything else on the list, which is why I voted for it.

!!!: "Me and Giuliani Down by the Schoolyard (A True Story)," ... The 4:19 - 4:49 chunk

Yeah, I vaguely remember a few seconds in the middle that wasn't as much a chore to get through as the rest of it. Haven't heard this in a while, though -- I remember it totally pissing me off at the time for not having anything to do with the Paul Simon classic (my favorite song ever by him) that it takes its name from. Did it sound as much like bad Big Audio Dynamite as !!!'s other stuff (or their other early stuff, anyway, before I gave up on trying to like to like them)? Please refresh my memory.

It also probably annoyed me for having nothing (that I could discern, anyway) to do with Giuliani (which probably just made its title seem gratuitous and stupid to me), but I'm not sure why that would have made the music any worse. (Also, I've never been a huge New Order fan, so maybe that's a factor, too. I did vote for "Round and Round" in P&J once, though.)

Also, they always sounded like a jam band to me back then (which wouldn't have bugged me so much, maybe, if their Williamsburg-ish fans hadn't mostly seemed like the kind of people who woud have looked down on jam bands with more jam-band-like haircuts.) (And yeah, I know that makes me knee-jerking whatever.)

Jet: "Are You Gonna Be My Girl" (Elektra)

How the hell did that get in here?

By being a good record, maybe?

i played that !!! track for the first time in a few years during a disco/house set last weekend, but only the first three minutes or so.

it got a much better response than i expected.

dudes voice is pretty obnoxious

i didn't give a shit about !!! when this came out but Myth Takes really warmed me up on them. Now I dig this album too. BAD is a good reference point but their music's a lot less twerpy.

!!!'s I mean

!!! is the worst band ive ever seen live

liar

they're one of the worst I've seen, for sure.

they are even worse if you see them in a temp. venue with a sound guy who's in over his head.

out hud was rad the one time i saw them live.

I saw !!! at the TLA in Philly earlier this year, and they were pretty awesome. Some online clips I've seen (Esp. in cramped venues) seem a little ragged in comparison.

!!! were awful

I'd have listened to Myth Takes more closely if I hadn't gotten a copy of the LCD Soundsystem around the same time (similar scratchy-guitar electro forcebeat to these ears), but this thread reminded me to whip it out today.

http://wilstar.com/midi/whipout.wav

i am not lying, anthony.

It also probably annoyed me for having nothing (that I could discern, anyway) to do with Giuliani (which probably just made its title seem gratuitous and stupid to me)

It's explicitly about Giuliani's cabaret laws (or his reactivation of ancient ones - I don't know the specifics). But well before I knew that, I loved how the song wasn't this organic whole, how its parts abrade against one another.

The trajectory of the song mimics the hipster's dance from distanced boogie to a steady build up of passion until it gushes out in the feeling mighty real New Order portion of the song. But then the hipster fears getting caught with his/her hands up in the air. And so s/he puts them down quickly and returns to the distanced boogie, a shift signaled in the lyrics by a move from an acknowledgement that dance music takes us over to a goofy, direct address to Giuliani and Bloomberg. The failure to invest in one's investment, Lawrence Grossberg calls this. And if this quality marks !!!'s fans more than any other (as suggested by the comment on their Williamsburg-ish fans), then at the very least "Me and Giuliani" is an honest evocation of it.

Why do they suck live?

Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.

hmm i duno they just really were a turnoff. the guitars were thin, the drums were played with no feel, the bass was quietly uninspired. it wasnt anything resembling "funk" or "dance" or whatever. and then theres that jackass singer acting like a jackass and he also sounds terrible.

i'm jealous of anyone whose never seen a worse band than !!!

ok maybe not THE WORST ever but they are theee worst live band.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mT0uBzv7kd8

worst ever!

I like some of their records and when I saw them it was 5 years ago so I'm sure they're better. Anyway, no worse band exists than Sebadoh in '95 when I walked out of the show after two-and-a-half songs (about one song before the band itself walked out), this I know to be true.

What was so bad about that show, Matos (not because I doubt you, just curious)?

I like that video!

That !!! song sounds a hell of a lot like "Papa's Got a Brand New Pigbag"

I like that video!

Yeah, I don't see what's particularly objectionable about it.

What was so bad about that show, Matos (not because I doubt you, just curious)?

Watching three grown adults throwing separate tantrums with their instruments (not in, say, a Lightning Bolt sense, more like in a I'm-going-to-crawl-into-the-corner-and-suck-my-thumb-for-the-rest-of-the-night one) is not especially enjoyable.

Wow!

basically it was an extended three-way hissy fit. it was kind of hilarious how bad it was.

Wow! That video is definitive proof—as if any were really needed (regardless of what one may have read by SFJ)—that white indie-boyz should never ever try an' get funkay! Also, this ain't 1965, and you ain't no Mick Jagger! Otherwise, Anthony Is Right—it ain’t that bad.

if you think !!! suck live you should try listening to their records. actually don't

anyway crazy in love is the correct answer to this poll

!!! was pretty great at Coachella a few years back, but I admit it was so hot that my brain had melted at that point so I may not be a good judge.

!!! were fantastic in the Glade at Glastonbury earlier this year, but yeah, the vocalist = pointless.

Good year for singles - some stiff competition, but I'm going with Panjabi MC.

My choice is Crazy In Love.

I can't pick any song here without instant regrets, so fuggit, I'm just not going to vote.

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

HAHAHA

hahaha

xp

MICCIO STOP PULLING A HINDER

the goofiest thing about these polls is the Darkness getting less singles votes than album votes.

whats so funny?

ILM are you feeling alright?

you look so fine cuz i reeeeely wana make ya mine

I actually considered voting for Jet.

Warren Zevon: "Keep Me in Your Heart" (Artemis) 1
The White Stripes: "Seven Nation Army" (Third Man/V2) 0
50 Cent: "In Da Club" (G-Unit/Shady/Aftermath/Interscope) 0
Justin Timberlake: "Rock Your Body" (Jive) 0
Justin Timberlake: "Cry Me a River" (Jive) 0
Junior Senior: "Move Your Feet" (Atlantic) 0
Sean Paul: "Get Busy" (VP/Atlantic) 0
Pharrell featuring Jay-Z: "Frontin'" (Star Trak/Arista) 0
Electric Six: "Danger! High Voltage" (XL) 0

I can't pick any song here without instant regrets, so fuggit, I'm just not going to vote.

-- The Reverend, Friday, November 16, 2007 3:12 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Link

Yeah, I know, but Zevon still would have beaten at least seven of those either way.

W T F

To paraphrase Ron Sparks: "If I tried to put my thumbs down any further, I would mess my pants. And then my pants would be full of Hinder Jet."

ppl be pranking the p&j polls. crazy that neither jt track got a vote.

Yeah, these results aren't actually real.

!

"real"

Dammit! Coldplay wuz robbed!! Robbed I tell ya!!!

"Go Hinder"

Oh well, only three more years to go. Thank xrist!

as it obviously looks like a good idea to keep doing this

never say die!

I was the one who casted the vote for Warren. You just have to go with your most favorite track in these polls and this one honestly was. I love the idea and the execution. It is true that I am as shocked as I can be in this situation that nobody voted for "Seven Nation Army". If a second vote could be given in these things then that would have received mine.

WTF is everyone's problem, that Jet song is awesome.

I don't remember 22 people saying it was awesome upthread.

Hmm--maybe we should just go back to doin' the old fashioned type polls, people. You know, where we each state which particular song/album we're voting for and then some sadsack sucker (me!) gets to tabulate the results. What say all y'all?

I say the same thing I've always said -- who cares who wins? That's the least interesting thing about these polls anyway. But the polls are still a good idea, since they inspire people to have interesting discussions about songs they otherwise wouldn't talk about much. (And yeah, again, the Jet song is fine.)

I agree with xhuxk, the results are worth a laugh but not much more, and you can just look at the second and third place ones to see how things worked out (since I gather whoever has enough time to waste to screw up the results is just picking one song they think is funny).

Well, yeah, I do pretty much agree with all that. But I also believe that some people may be kind of put off by these shenanigans; SWoods, for example, has more or less stopped posting since it became "obvious" that something odd was going on with the results. And I, for one, really miss his posts.

well you could just run the ordinary poll and if you want to do the work, tabulate what people say they're voting for. Better you than me...

Well, that's the question alright: is it worth the trouble? Hell, there are only six polls left, anyhow.

the results are worth a laugh but not much more

Right. Does it occur to anybody (except, maybe, the jackoffs who are rigging the results) that the poll winners are pretty meaningless in the first place? (I mean, maybe that's the jackoffs' point?) The sample of voters is just too small and insular, and when voters can only vote for one song (when, in Pazz&Jop, the whole point is they vote for ten), the results just aren't that interesting in and of themselves, whether somebody's messing with them or not. So I miss Scott's postings very much, too (I'd wondered where he'd gone), but I'm still stumped that the results-rigging bugs anybody that much. If I could figure out why people thought the winners mattered in the first place, maybe I'd get it.

If, say, the ratings used the old Radio On template (where every voter had the opporunity to rank every song on a 0.0 to 10.0 scale -- so you could help ALL the songs you like and hurt ALL the songs you don't), the results would be a lot more interesting (and, I suspect, a lot harder to rig.)

It doesn't really matters (to me, anyhow), for pretty much the reasons you stated. It's just a minor annoyance, is all. If other people are bugged, however, I could always just go back to running old-school type polls--as I already mentioned above.

xp

True enough.

xhuxk OTM and hopefully you won't get the same bullshit zings I got for suggesting that the polls might actually mean something if they were set up better

if only the discussion matters, why dont you just...discuss them

JN$OT how old are you

too old for this shit probably.

um, soory about that, deej. In answer to your question: I'll be turning 43 soon enough. Like I said--quite likely too bloody old for this nonsense.

oops, that should read *sorry*

if only the discussion matters, why dont you just...discuss them

I think the "deciding which one to vote for" gets people thinking, and talking more than just "discuss these songs" would. So the poll itself, like I said, is a good idea. There are just ways that a poll might spur even more discussion than these ones do.

Then say "only pick one."

you could even come up with some kind of abbreviation for the term and have it at the beginning of the thread's title...

xhuxk otm. Who cares if someone's messing with the results. Joke's on them.

Guy that voted for Zevon: Follow your heart and don't let me discourage you!

OK, I see what happened. All the votes for Love's "My Little Red Book," the Supremes' "You Can't Hurry Love," and Golden Earring's "Radar Love" got counted as votes for Jet.

Wait, so are people thinking now that those impossible to follow "OPO" threads are somehow inherently better than poll threads -- even flawed ones like this? Sorry, but that's just nuts.

(Actually, maybe they're easy to follow. How would I know? I haven't read one in years. Just don't get why poll threads would automatically be worse. Either way, with these Pazz & Jop ones, you'd have to list all the choices at the top anyway -- so what would you gain by not making it a poll?)

@!#@!%

hahaha

The Rev OTM.

i don't quite get what the big deal is here unless somehow these poll results somehow also work as a time machine, which has now irreversibly altered the fabric of the music canon.

http://www.physics.unc.edu/~reichart/krksmll.jpg

"This works as a time machine. The fabric of the music canon has been irreversibly altered."

http://www.eyeofhorus.org.uk/images/photo/10tennant/series-02/13-doomsday-finale/doomsday-tardis-supernova.jpg