Embrace, Classic or Dud?

Bah they're not as bad as Stereophonics or Travis, not by any means. It's just his voice........GAH. I remember when the other guy sang that single I was thinking "well now they're tolerable", and then the next one came out and mr moany was singing again.

So sorry Nick, it's a dud for me mainly. My 15 year old self bought the first album though, it'd definitely go on some kind of confessions thread now.

They emerged onto the scene touting their own greatness (well, Danny touted their greatness, the others were pretty quiet), claiming that they wanted to be judged alongside their heroes, dropping fantastic names left right and centre - The Beastie Boys, My Bloody Valentine, Sly And The Family Stone, Jeff Buckley, Smokey Robinson, Screamadelica, Marvin Gaye, Nirvana, The MC5 - and firing out self- aggrandising statements of intent every five seconds - "I wanna sound like The Beatles when they made Sgt Pepper if Brian Wilson had joined", "noone's made a better album since The Stone Roses debut, we can top it", "Bittersweet Symphony's a good song, but it wouldn't get on our album"...

The press compared them to The Stone Roses, said they had the sweep and scope of The Verve if Noel Gallagher was writing the tunes. Danny McNamara pugnaciously swept aside their contemporaries with some classic put-downs (the best of which, sadly, was in my fanzine, and thus was unseen by most people - "us treading water is better than Cast having a right good swim"). The claims made for their debut album were enticing and promising - it was going to have the eclectic upbeat vibe of Screamadelica, the classic tunes of the Roses, the rock numbers were meant to achieve the sonic dirtiness of MBV and The Jesus And Mary Chain, the songs they had in reserve for the album which they hadn't played live were meant to blow everything else out of the water. They claimed the second album was already written, and that it was psychedelic.

All this, combined with the big psychedelic feedback-and-horn wig-out at the end of All You Good Good People, the shimmering, tear-inducing horns of Now You're Nobody and the punch-in-the-face-electric-shock guitar solo and white-noise-brass of The Last Gas got me enticed as an 18 year old looking for the new Stone Roses. I was writing a fanzine about various bands, Spiritualized, the Roses, The Verve, etcetera, and I wrote off to loads of bands asking for help and input. Noone wrote back to me, apart from Danny McNamara. I interviewed them, they were incredibly nice, and then the debut album was released a couple of months before I got to university. On the day it came out I was diagnosed with chickenpox, funnily enough, and it had been my 19th birthday just three weeks previously. Thought the album was OK, but not quite what I had hoped for. The rock ones didn't sound like MBV, and the one that they hadn't played live yet, the title-track and album-closer, was a limp Hey Jude pisstake without the spirit. It sold shit loads. It didn't deserve to.

Hooligan I really liked, and the second album I still think is pretty good, with some outstanding moments. The first album is stodgy, a few good songs but really badly arranged and produced. It certainly isn't the psychedelic pop epic they hinted at. The third album starts incredibly well, and then the next nine tracks are a let down, with a couple of near-exceptions. Counting b-sides (the Drawn From Memory-era crop especially) they've probably done a dozen or so thracks that, if put together, would pretty much constitute a great album. Richard is probably the best thing about the band, it seems to be his songs I lean towards, and he's certainly a better singer than Danny. Mickey Dale is a fantastic keyboard player and guitarist, and the other two are very good musicians, though not particularly outstanding or memorable. I think danny, nice bloke as he is, is more of a hindrance than help. He's not the greatest singer in the world, this much is obvious, but that's not the problem. The problem is that he rubs people up the wrong way, and he used to open his gob without thinking too often. First impressions stick. Plus he insists on writing boring songs about splitting up with his girlfriend.

After all the hype and missed opportunities - Dud.

Search - Now You're Nobody (Ep version), The Love It Takes, New Adam New Eve, I Wouldn't Wanna Happen To You, Brothers And Sisters, Get On Board, I've Been Running, Over, Redemption (Richard-sung demo of Satellites), Blind, the Reverend Bass mix of Save Me, the secret gigs (which were class to start with - 40 people in a forest on a summer afternoon, free beer, brilliant).

Destroy - Come Back To What You Know, all the gobshiteness, the dodgy production on TGWO, recent b-sides where Danny sings with a cold, their awful and almost undeserved reputation.

However it is now time for the group to move on from their maudalin past, if they do not i feel that the next lp could be their last. On the other hand if the do the best could well be yet to come.

But the rest of it, where does the rest of it start? Ages ago, in a shed, a bedroom, a dream, a moment spent alone listening to a record that sounds so good you don't know whether to believe that it's true… Effort, focus, conviction that runs through your blood until it threatens to ruin you… False starts, fake heroes, misplaced desires and loyalties, did they really do that? For far too long… And then… A breakthrough, a moment of realisation, when hopes started to look as if they could be made solid… A glimmer of faith, and a record, a clumsy, amateurish record, made quickly and on the cheap, but invested with something money can't get hold of… A call to arms, a call to the people who've felt beaten, who've felt that there's something better out there. Cleansing. Soaring. Respect raises it's head, and four, no five, no… four (for now) people emerge into the light, holding this record that's taken years, more than years to create. Attention. A clamour to justify themselves, to prove that they are what they want to be, what they say they are… Good times coming…

A couple more records, a lot more faith, trust in craftsmanship, discordant self-belief and the knowledge that, when it comes down to it, admitting you're weak will help you through. Tenderness… We were scattered then, we didn't know that there were others out there like us, others with this passion, this faith, this feeling… All for the love of a song… It's not just the family that comes to watch them now, it's The Family, no more playing toilets with only a man and a dog for company, this is half way to Buckingham Palace… And all the time there is the pressure, the speculation, the suspicion on some parts that all is not what it claims to be, that there is too much conviction and not enough talent… The pressure takes it's toll, and the four (five) people at the heart of this decide to withdraw, to make things perfect before they re-emerge… Disappearing will become a habit…

Back to now, the end of the year that had started with the scream… Good times coming…

They've got wives and kids now, nearly, they've grown up a lot, they've been offered empty riches and cheap fame and they've turned them down in favour of love and satisfaction, they can sleep at night… This cavernous room, emptying slowly, a party, a thank you, a remembrance of times past, and that promise again… Good times coming…

Gratitude and affection, repaid faith… We've climbed towers, sung in forests, hummed on beaches, yelled in ballrooms, danced in quarries and professed undying love in sweaty back rooms of places we can't remember walking into… And all for… For what? For the love of a song, of a feeling, of the experience of being wonderfully alive. This is what we came here for all those years ago. This is what they were trying so hard to promise us way back when… People have fallen by the wayside, people have tried to tip the apple cart… But you can't. There's something here that stops it, that pushes out the bad. Cynicism can't compete with the feeling that can drag people across continents to spend a day in a muddy field surrounded by strangers, all for the love of a song… But we're not strangers now… We're unified… Those on the outside looking in don't know what it feels like… Instant friendships, a vivacious community founded on common affections and hopes, bonds that aren't going to be broken lightly… Good times coming…

But for now, a rest. Time off again. Not a withdrawal, not a retreat… An unwinding… The momentum has built to such a level that it can't go on without damaging what got it there. Time to take stock… Back to the start of the year, back to the scream…

Two years ago it could never have happened, two years ago the crowds may have been bigger but they weren't as faithful… But there and then… It was a reunion, a homecoming in spirit if not in geography… We didn't know it then (who could?) but the foundations of the year would be laid in that moment of joyous, wonderful release… As was their way, they had taken themselves off, withdrawn for a year and a day to find out who they really were and what they were capable of… The top ten visits, the record sales, the brink of going overboard, had they really wanted this? They had said so, shouted it loudly to anyone who'd listen… Because it was the thing to do, it was expected… It felt so good it almost felt right… But ultimately, you can't hide who you really are… It wasn't for them…

So they lock themselves away in the country… We could have forgotten them, if they hadn't meant so much to us. So we held the records close to our chests and we waited and waited until it seemed like there wasn't anything to wait for anymore… We remembered, in glimpses, what they'd meant to us at first… The tears, the fire, the mistakes, the potential… Never the finished article… But finishing doesn't matter, the means is the ends, it always was… Somewhere inside we could remember that promise, that conviction, that potential, and we would wait for them to come to us again, because there was the suspicion that this time, with these people, it would be worth it… But when they finally emerged again, smiling, singing simple songs, brandishing diversity and love and humanity, finally five, unified, they seemed to some like different people… Cynicism could have done for them again, but this time they were ready, they knew the best way to disarm a cynic is with charm, love, faith and warmth… In no time at all the protesters were humming along with the rest of us, begrudgingly, maybe, but they were humming nonetheless… Good times coming…

Where before they had seemed serious, restrained, paranoid and determined, now they were… At ease… Satisfied, comfortable with themselves and their art… An awareness that sometimes what seems throwaway and trite can be as profound as the most painful, heart- wrenched sentiment… They had made the record they felt they were capable of, and in the process of making it they had realised that they were capable of much, much more…

Back to now again, in this big, empty room again, where the DJ has played his last tune and the dancing has come to a stop, the emotions, adventures, passions and friendships of a whole year condensed, improbably, into a few short hours… All for the love of a song… And not a song that we even know just yet, because it's a song that's still being written… There are glimpses of it… Now that apprenticeships have been served, new directions have been found, now that they know who they are and what they can do, it's time to explore, to search through themselves, time to really see what they can do…

And if these five wonderfully flawed and human people can find it in themselves to search for what's best, for what's right, and then open themselves up and give it away to everyone who asks, then so can we… It's been a long trip and not an easy one… We've been lost, distracted, delayed… We don't even know where we're going… But that's not important anymore… We're getting somewhere… Good times coming…"

Ah, well.

I will gladly make anyone a CDR or MD of tunes to make you change your mind about Embrace.

i don't care about all the 'behind the scenes' crap about embrace. some of what i read here sounds dreadful and it looks like they needed a slap from time to time. but i like their songs. not all of them, but bunch of them.

never seen them live (going to a gig in november), so i will reserve judgement about their live show

plus, i quite clearly HAVEN'T taken P.Scott's ideas on board! :P

a lot of my favourite music (well, Talk Talk) is shared with monsieur southall, why on earth shouldn't i trust his judgement?

(and it's great!)

If that's true, Tom, well, I await the PRICES FALLING with interest.

-- Tom D. (tom_donnelly@h

^this is madness (he said, somewhat predictably)

Does Louis like Fugazi?

Errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr, in what way?

I have slsk and can probably use it but I haven't worked out how to share files, so am not risking it yet in the big wide world (web).

Get one copy of "In a Glass House", Louis.

Pash, are you sure it's a genuine, cogent artistic statement rather than the outrageous exhibition of chops I've come to expect from Gentle Giant aka Dream Theater: The Prequel?

My old band used to do a cover of "Outdoor Miner" and we worked out that Robert Gotobed drummed more or less to our standards.

Cor anglais on "Mutual Friend" incidentally played by June Whiting who also played the instrument on MIKE OLDFIELD'S ALBUMS!!

"gentle giant aka dream theater the prequel"? wtf.

I imagine the previous issues will be cheap now. And they never went for ridiculous amounts even before.

Well yes, that's true, but everything gets called "prog" these days, so i thought I'd join in

Another regrettable consequence of the CD revolution - NO FREE SINGLES OR EPS WITH ALBUMS!

Yeah, IIRC the new versions have the extra tracks chopped off, crazy.

My point about Gentle Giant is that they seem to neglect the construction of great songs in favour of 'wow, the keyboardist is ALSO A BRILLIANT XYLOPHONIST OMG'. I have seen the live DVD. Hmph.

Pastoral psych = Julian Cope?

back to Embrace, briefly, 'new adam new eve' is FUCKING PHENOMENAL, why did they not use this as a springboard from which to launch the rest of their career?

Over, the first track on the next album, will tickle you maybe even more. The last two tracks on Out Of Nothing also will.

so danny has some spare time from the Embrace dayjob i see ?

http://www.myspace.com/theaftershow

He's on sabbatical, saving New Young Pony Club from obscurity in the North West.

Templecloud?

Covered One Big Family. Got used in a KFC advert.

Embrace are back. And they sound fucking good. This is not the faceless britpop outfit you're looking for.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f1Hc4HxFwpc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIoCq-jwlQk

Blind (original B side version) is still miles better than most indie bands ever IMO

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=veHcXwgyXt0

God I love Blind.

yeah it's great

The Love It Takes is the stealth cut from Drawn From Memory, it does bedwetter rock with the sort of subtlety & craft that makes it convincing rather than trite

Looking at Facebook I think we've been street-teamed her, which is funny.

Here not her.

Kinda, yeah. Sorry about that.

Ha, don't apologise; I find it really funny actually given my relationship with them. Have you posted here before much?

From those clips above, Embrace have gone a bit Hope Of The States

Never posted here at all, but I've lurked a fair amount haha. And I knew this thread existed so I figured I'd throw the new clips on.

they do have a harder edge these days, we will see. how am i not in this thread before now? i know i have posted in Embrace threads before.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=G6sFSdcWNWE&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DG6sFSdcWNWE%26feature%3Dyoutu.be&app=desktop

It's... alright. It's a big rock song with some bleeps in the middle 8 and an interesting coda. It's not Danny singing until right at the end, unless the weird falsetto is him to start. Eight years; they've obviously moved on a bit. I don't know whether I give a crap anymore or not. I also don't know if I can offer any kind of value judgement about their music.

EP in February, proper album in April.

special deluxe edition album selling for 75 pounds.

http://pics.campl.us/f/1/11177.949217202531cb9b1279c590e8092a20.jpg

For imago. Note bassist's t-shirt.

This album is actually, surprisingly, really great.