ILM is kinda sucking these days (boring and meta ignore not safe for work)

I've been thinking the same thing.

people are liking boring things

i agree scott. seems like everything is either polls, lame zings, or general snarkiness. whatever, i am sure someone will flame me for saying this too, fucking predictable.

but hey, fuck the problems, let's create some solutions MAAAANNN !

i'd contribute more if anybody else cared about the stuff i like

ILM isn't liking anything right now. Go look on the "New Answers" page. Not much new stuff being talked about. It's just polls.

is this the place where us funhating pollhaters get to say "I told you so"

Fallow periods, they happen. Also, it's early summer and everyone's going out more. (At least I am.)

It's true that I've not had any one big album or song to really grab me this year -- Portishead's the exception but I almost don't count it because I was presold on them. But last year the year was half over before something did that to me so I'm patient.

is this the place where us funhating pollhaters get to say "I told you so"

I ain't gonna stop ya!

2008 has been a very slow year, polls are actually what is keeping ILM interesting at the moment...

This is what you get when the previous year was filled with too much good music. (I hope you're real happy with yourself, 2007.)

So...anyway, how about that Los Campesinos album? *cough*

man there is so much good music this year it's ridiculous, what are you talking about

the pollen in the air is not a good thing

skot, i'm tapping out too. generally because of last year's unpromising crop of boring facebook meta chatters and heavyhanded aspie mods.

i dont know how to decribe it but i feel the whole thing has become an instant message exchange. and i hate IMs.

more importantly there should be a use value to msg boards. finding new artists, finding new cool shit. ilx has been bone dry in that regard in the last year. skot, no promises on heavy post volume, but you might find this more your speed in your darker msg board moments.

2008 has been a very slow year

-- Bee OK

________________________

man there is so much good music this year it's ridiculous, what are you talking about

-- J0hn D.

I think Bee's right. I mean, there have been some big deal and/or v. good discs this year, but it seems slow to me. I'd love to be convinced otherwise, tho (I got a bunch of those Circuit City eMusic cards to burn through, so I'm looking for some inspiration).

I'm with John, actually -- I did say no one thing has really caught me off guard to the point of instant obsession, but there's been a LOT of good music and I'm enjoying it immensely. So it's not like there's nothing to talk about.

Ironically enough, I've been busy with writing more music criticism and stuff that will hopefully lead to a lot more money than music criticism. And, you know, life. Also, whenever I post something not on the metal thread, people tell me that it's self-evident, so I've given up on the rest of you monkeys.

How dare you have a career.

But yeah, llM does seem slow lately, and it's not like I'm one of the more prolific posters anyway. But hey, LJ is back, so maybe that will usher in a Renaissance!

How dare YOU have a career!

We are the new Chip and Dale.

The Rescue Rangers iteration, or the regular old Disney ones?

still blamin the polls, it took em a year or so but they gradually replaced good discussion (I know, poll-defenders, there are some poll threads that are exceptions, but the notion that music discussion = ranking things worst to best is a pretty closed system)

Polls are terrible. You can hide them, but that's not the problem. They are like black holes for conversation.

What about a poll ranking your various login names over the years, J0hn?

banana nutrament ftw

haha sanskrit linking to the dermy.

http://waxidermy.com/images/deal.gif

I still think the polls should be on a separate board.

As Geir starts an Elvis Costello poll...

Most new music sucks anyway, and the new music that doesn't doesn't get any attention from the kids. It's more fun discussing old music.

Alison!

(Oh, sorry!)

I figured it out! All of Geir's posts make total sense if you add "to me" after every sentence!

It's like adding "in bed" to the end of every fortune in a Chinese fortune cookie.

Most new music sucks anyway, and the new music that doesn't doesn't get any attention from the kids. It's more fun discussing old music.

-- Geir Hongro, Thursday, June 5, 2008 2:20 AM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

in bed

A meme is born.

Yeah, that should keep you entertained, Scott!

Most new music sucks anyway, and the new music that doesn't doesn't get any attention from the kids. It's more fun discussing old music.

at Burger King

Come back Jess H., Come back Yancey S., Come back Keith Harris, and Love Bug Starksi's not around much these days.

Plus ILX could use some new folks (ideally some into more than indie-rock)

Most new music sucks anyway, and the new music that doesn't doesn't get any attention from the kids. It's more fun discussing old music

in bed with a hot chick.

IN STEREO

at Burger King.

ILX could use some new folks (ideally some into more than indie-rock)

A-FUCKING-MEN

Plus ILX could use some new folks in bed

(ideally some into more than indie-rock) at Burger King

to me, with a hot chick

I see less and less ILX'ors being primarily indie-rock fans, but maybe that's just my misimpression.

(xp)

oh god-x-post-fucking-damn-it

to me, whatever.

The sentiment in this thread-title is one I myself have been espousing, hence my recent attempt to bump a load of "interesting" threads. Didn't really work out.

JGO I will Paypal you five bucks if you harsh on the next dumbass Lorax post like that again, that was a beauty to behold.

i mean ffs that dude deserves my vocabulary

Link?

lorax behaves like a dicksleeve: if someone tells you that they like *the homosexuals*, what current group/artist would you tell them to check out?

where it was all hatched: The Resonant Frequency #57: Perfect World POLL - "Perfect songs are hard to find; here are 12 to start with."

i think that thread was the nadir

see, I like the polls, because I don't see much discussion on non-poll threads, and they get conversations started. I don't see how having polls makes OTHER threads suck more.

on the other hand I agree that ILM has been boring lately. I've been using site new answers instead of just loading ILM and it's opened up a whole other message board of (sometimes) fun. I rarely even read ILE before site new answers. So I think a lot of the blame should rest on site new answers.

I also agree with the comment above that posts like IMs have taken some of the vitality away, but I don't think that's the only thing going on.

I mean I still post to the poll threads but in doing so I'm just as guilty of lazy posting as anyone else.

Polls are retarded.

Polls are stupid if you think you gain anything "objective" from the final result, but as a way of focusing attention, they can help focus a thread. Not every thread needs that focus, but why not let a thousand flowers bloom? Unless there's an argument that polls cause all the other flowers to wilt, which I don't see.

this has been a really great year for albums-- indie esp. so it doesn't surprise me that ILM's been a snooze

polls are fun! if you don't like bowie don't click on the bowie poll threads! if you like bowie click on the bowie poll threads! what's the big deal?

it ruins the mood

IN BED

wait, that actually kind of made sense

i think the only unworthy threads are ones that splinter discussion among threads. everything else i could care less about. i mean it takes me what 0.2 seconds to decide if i wanna click on a thread or poll or not? idk

wait, that actually kind of made sense

Always.

xpost

see, I think that's what polls do. they replace a thread revival and subsequent new discussion with a bunch of discussion by people who never read any of the related non-poll threads, so 1. stuff gets repeated and 2. the people from the orig thread don't have much incentive to say anything besides going "uh, we talked about this already when we did that "OPO Pink Floyd album" thread."

What sleeve said there -- part of the problem is a temporal one. Points of view can and do change, and people say or project things that they don't think later on, or that they would heavily rewrite or reconsider. This would seem to be a reason to do 'new' threads via the polls, but the flipside is that there's a valuable tension to be found in those older judgments versus the newer ones, in one place.

I hate to be mr. we already had this thread eighteen bazillion times person but, uh, there I go.

I hop back and forth. at various points in the past x years I have been bored/disgusted with basically every board here that I've ever posted to, ILM probably moreso than the others since it's so dependent on 1. new releases 2. new beefs 3. new posters to talk shit with - it's both the most vibrant/active and the most inconsistent of all the boards, blessing curse yada yada [ heavy-handed aspie modding ]

Polls are terrible. You can hide them, but that's not the problem. They are like black holes for conversation.

hey! there's been a bunch of poll threads with great discussion going on. see the Ride - Nowhere poll thread, that discussion was great, very fun to read.

They are like black holes for conversation.

yeah i don't see how a "POO: Prince single" from 3-4 years ago is any better/worse/different than "POLL: Best Prince single" so it's probably the quality of the posters in whatever thread you're thinking of not the poll form itself

see the Ride - Nowhere poll thread, that discussion was great, very fun to read

one of the better thread bimblifications, yeah

although dude you were responsible for that shoddy "12 perfect songs" p-fork dick-suck so in a way you are responsible for ILM being crap

responding to sleeve: yeah, I see what you're saying. I don't revive many old threads or read through the archive much, so I just respond to threads others have started or revived. I'd generally like to talk about older stuff, because I don't have much cash to spend on newer stuff and I don't get promos. But the liveliest / brainiest / whatever threads are mostly about newer stuff, so I mostly have to sit them out. I'm also under the impression the things I like have either been talked to death (e.g. Stones, New Order, JAMC) or are not well-regarded here (e.g. REM, Keith Whitley, the Judds) and so aren't likely to make ILM less boring if I got all thready with them.

" so it's probably the quality of the posters in whatever thread you're thinking of not the poll form itself"

yeah, it's the old generation was better routine

can we at least all agree that ILM has improved since geir hongro stopped making polls

polls are fun! if you don't like bowie don't click on the bowie poll threads! if you like bowie click on the bowie poll threads! what's the big deal?

-- J0rdan S.,

why cant more people here think like this kid? (in bed)

<3 u j0rdan

xp wait NO

here is a next level thread:

Hide Geir Hongro Polls

But even if you ignore the poll threads, I wish there were more people posting here. There are only a handful of people who contribute to the Rolling ringtone rap thread, and another small handful to the country one, and likewise for the r'n'b thread, and d-bags jazz one, and even less than that for the whirrled music one and the reggaeton one and the chitlin circuit soul one...

We need more bold, proactive posting about musical theory and critical analysis. My two cents. Well, two more.

challop

Euler, you definitely have my unneeded permission to start a Keith Whitley thread.

polls are fun and blaming polls makes no sense

I'm scared of ILM.

Oh my gosh but I ran into the thicket anyways.

i'm always in for a tough time trying to find something engaging, because i always consciously scroll through the hip hop threads of which there are always about 60 on the main page.

so it's probably the quality of the posters in whatever thread you're thinking of not the poll form itself

I see what you're saying but part of my point is that reviving those quality posts would perhaps spur better discussion than starting over from ground zero.

i'm always in for a tough time trying to find something engaging, because i always consciously scroll through the hip hop threads of which there are always about 60 on the main page.

-- Charlie Howard, Wednesday, June 4, 2008 11:37 PM (18 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

;_;

i think the "rolling" threads suck too. they might have tons of info on new stuff, but i never go into them. there's just too much info. you miss them for a second and you're lost. i liked it better when people would start threads on individual songs or albums. whatevs.

but you might find this (waxidermy) more your speed in your darker msg board moments.
-- sanskrit, Thursday, June 5, 2008 1:52 AM (3 hours ago) Bookmark Link

i tried to register a week or 2 back and they said they weren't accepting any new applicants. emailed them and they never responded. weak

the dermy is cool. also, co- sign xpost.

as a new ilm'er

a) you guys have already pointed me to loads of new (to me) music, so to me this place doesn't suck yet

b) it is a bit intimidating at times though - not so much that i fear getting flamed for saying something uncool, but that you all seem to refer to each other by first names that don't match your screen names, so it seems a bit insider-y, and i can't always follow the conversational thread - "as to what mark said, fred's much more otm and sarah - loved those photos!" who the hell is mark and fred?!?!? what photos?!?!? stop trying to be cool, you're just members of an internet forum ffs - it's pretty much a given we're all just geeks here, so stop pretending knowing "if assholes could fly this place would be an airport"'s real name makes you cool somehow, would ya? it would make conversational threads easier to follow for us newbies anyway :)

c) the reviews do tend to be a bit one-linery. i've copied this style so far just to fit in like (being new here and all) but at times it seems a bit content-low. is a multiple-sentance paragraph too much to ask for?

d) the polls are ok i guess, but i agree they tend to be a bit limiting - i mean, i'd rather hear WHY i should be interested in an old thomas dolby album (it is just nostalgia, or is this stuff actually that still that good 20 years later?) than which song on the album is best.

but, you know, whatever - overall i personally like this place (my new timewaster!) - it's worth it for the music recommendations and occasional witty one-liners.

though this britney obsession is a bit worrying.

I really don't see what the fucking problem is calling people by their real names.

That was @ stop trying to be cool... comment

like who cares if i call black beyonce "john" ffs.

now now mark

haha I was just wondering about BLACK BEYONCE, hadn't seen that one before.

xpost to new person: a lot of those names aren't "real" names, they are older usernames that people just got in the habit of using, e.g. I would maybe call electricsound "esoj".

i never get that warm fuzzy thrill if someone calls me 'charlie'

"I really don't see what the fucking problem is calling people by their real names."

the problem is that only those who already know everyone on a first name basis can follow the conversation. thus new members are discouraged from joining the thread. just saying.

the "stop trying to be cool" thing was a bit tongue-in-cheek - thus the emoticon at the end of the paragraph. please don't take it personally.

:)

if "if assholes could fly this place would be an airport"'s real name was john, i think i'd much rather type that personally

did we call him 'roger' in thread because we suspected he was 'roger adultry'?

"suspected"

"if "if assholes could fly this place would be an airport"'s real name was john, i think i'd much rather type that personally"

yeah, i admit that might not have been the best example. but if you typed "iacftpwbaa" or "assholes" or "airports" or something, well, i'd be able to follow the thread anyway... look, take my argument and replace "if assholes could fly this place would be an airport" with someone who has a screen name that's actually typeable, ok?

"the problem is that only those who already know everyone on a first name basis can follow the conversation. thus new members are discouraged from joining the thread."

just to clarify - the linear layout of the board makes this more difficult - if you're responding to something upstream, the ONLY way to let the reader know what you're responding to is by quoting the original post (whch no one ever does) or by naming the poster. which, if you use their real name/old screen name, which i dont know, means i have no friggin idea which post that rebuttal/agreement refers to. and, given the reply is often ultrashort, along the lines of "fred otm" or "george, you're missing the point - what about the synths in the song after it?" it's a bit frustrating at times trying to figure out what the hell half of these posts even mean?

but, you know, newbie here, who am i to criticize etc etc

no one cares :)

yeah i figured

BLACK BEYONCE is not a name, its a feeling.

and a name.

i think messiahwannabe is on to something here. i've been sorta feeling the same way about ILM lately, but maybe because it's gotten too familiar, too cliquey. i mainly troll the dance threads, and i really feel like i *already* know what everyone thinks about everything. sort of a lack of useful new tropes.

also we haven't had any big revitalizing projects for a while (think rough guides or cover connections) to get everyone excited about ilm again

messiahwannabe just sorta stick it out. you could start a spreadsheet of names as you figure them out, maybe add relevant personal info if you think it would help. also i think there's a thread called "nu-ilx name rollcall" or something like that.

it's not just ILM necessarily either ... seems like the noize board is also really dead these days?

that one's kinda obvious

the one-line review aspect youre talking about messiahwannabe is hardly enforced - do whatever the fuck you want. its just the way some people have either A) established sort of an already well-known vibe because of their proclivities being well known or B) the way some people tend to post in general. as long as getting chopped to bits by someone who doesnt agree with you doesnt get under your skin, have at it.

xpost: yeah noize board demise has really bummed me out, but i think that nu-code and limited mod powers really had a lot to do with that (not to get involved in that argument again)

also maybe a bit of infighting and banning and crying and bitching?

yeah well i know but i didnt want to drag any of that out again

still, a few yellowcards and a few reversible bans and EVERYONE ADMINS EVERYONE CAN ADD ADMINS might have saved the day - or maybe not

also not to bring this up again but lots of lol-intended threads are being made on 77 c.f. cankles' jugaloo thread

anyway, a quick look at the number of under double digit new answer threads on ILM right now is a little disheartening, esp since the only explodo one i see is the worst 90's UK band thing, which would be great if i cared or knew anything about it

on the other hand, even though that Residents Duck Stab/B&G thread is short and a poll, there have been some great posts on it. proof that passionate weirdos of whatever listening stripe are still doing stuff worth reading here.

i think messiahwannabe is on to something here. i've been sorta feeling the same way about ILM lately, but maybe because it's gotten too familiar, too cliquey. i mainly troll the dance threads, and i really feel like i *already* know what everyone thinks about everything. sort of a lack of useful new tropes.

so true...you'd swear we were all being held hostage on those dance threads.

a lack of useful new tropes

If you stick aeround you get to know everyone's names pretty quick. Plus probably a ton more about them than you'd ever wanna know.

Messiahwannabe should def. go for some Jagz (soz Just Got Offed) style word overload. The board needs it.

WHO IS B.B.??

john justen

I can't be bothered to read this whole thread but I'm blaming ROLLING THREADS. In times gone by if someone heard just one amazing track they'd go 'OMG OMG and start a thread about it', now amazing tracks and entire albums get buried away on rolling threads only read by a handful of people.

That's why 'there's loads of good stuff happening right now' (or even crap stuff, at least it's talking about it), and 'there are hardly any good threads on ILM' crop up in the same post.

I agree with Matt DC, I think - certainly in that I never really look at the rolling threads, and so am presumably missing lots of things I might otherwise look at.

I think some polls can be quite interesting / fun. The Britpop stuff over the last week has been fun, if, I guess, not that informative / richly intellectual, just because it was a lot of reminiscing rather than engagement / theorising.

I also think that, while there's been quite a lot of music this year that I like, there's not been THAT much for people to get excited about on a wider, cultural scale - the things I like this year are more solipsistic than ever before, perhaps - Elbow, Spiritualized, etc. I'd have loved people to get excited by The Do, and though people would, but it didn't happen.

I also think that... perhaps ILM did finally just get old, in a couple of ways. Firstly, the forum itself is now nearly 8 years old, and many regular posters have been around for most of not all of that time; a lot of wider 'idea' discussions have been had already, often many, many times.

Secondly, and more importantly I suspect, while the average age of ILM posters has posters has probably stayed much the same as newer, younger posters have joined, the posters who've been here a long time are now 8, 7, 6 or so years older than they were when they joined. People have mortgages, families, more responsible jobs, and a) simply don't have time for dicking about on the internet so much as they used to, and b) have probably mellowed in their opinions and their need to voice those opinions. Newer posters see the 'old guard' posting short pithy replies (partly due to net speeds these days as discussed before, and partly due to the above) and that's how they learn the vernacular of the board.

I think the rolling threads originally worked in a 'let's unclutter ILM so it doesn't have eight Kompakt or dancehall threads going at any one time' but they've now uncluttered the boards to such an extent there's not much new music there, just really big albums or polls or discussion of music that's ten years old. Not that there's anything wrong with the latter but I kind of miss 'one song' threads.

Considering now all you need to do is start a thread, post a YouTube link and people can go 'wow' or 'fuck this shit' or something more verbose, the last few years should have made this sort of discussion easier but strangely it's gone the other way.

Yeah, I'd love to read the Rolling Metal thread but have convinced myself that it's 50% things I don't care about and 50% things I must buy, and with a couple of thousand posts or whatever that must mean $$$$$$.

Rolling threads do stop revives on albums and tracks if people discover them six months late or whatever. By the time I've cottoned onto something it's 300 posts upthread and it seems rude to bring it up.

Never read Rolling threads, seem too clannish and exclusive to me

This thread is sad but true. Hope it's just a temporary lull.

welcome, messiahwannabe!

i wouldn't listen to "wilter", he sounds kind of miserable

have you posted yet to the "Introduce Yourself" thread? you should!

i agree about the "Rolling" threads, i think they're a much bigger problem than the polls

Introduce Yourselves!

Well you can only have one thing or the other. You can't install regulations to ensure that people do not start multiple threads on the same artist and then moan that nobody talks about x, y or z any more.

In any case I save all the long form writing for FT and my own blogs these days; there doesn't seem a great deal of point posting it here any more.

What 'regulations' would these be? Starting multiple threads on the same topic =/ starting multiple threads on the same artist.

Never read Rolling threads, seem too clannish and exclusive to me.

Ditto, sadly.

I like certain rolling threads. I think they cover a lot of bands/stuff that probably wouldn't otherwise necessitate a thread of their own. Matt H's rolling punk thread comes to mind. Is the alternative to start a thread for every single band mentioned? I've always been hesitant about being thread-start-trigger-happy in case they sit there empty and wasted and dead. Is that not worth worrying about?

The mail prob is that you don't exactly get why a thread may have been revived.

See a "Windowlicker, is it a Luke Vibert Ripoff?" thread revive, you don't naturally see the "MTV got caned for playing the sweary video at 8:30pm" story, so you think "not that old arg, I avoid"

That must be another "mike t-diva" contributing regularly to the rolling Top 40 thread, then.

I read the rolling punk thread. And occasionally the rolling metal thread, but that does move quite fast. I've never found either of them to be clannish or exclusive though.

Hmm, I kinda like the rolling threads.

The fault's prob. with me, I'm too much of a dilettante to get embroiled in Rolling threads

I'm scared of ILM.

-- Abbott, Wednesday, June 4, 2008 11:10 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Link

Big egos here.

i too have been feeling this
- so much so i actually ventured over to ILE yesterday.
first time in in 8 years.
part of me agrees re the Polls/Rolling threads, they can be good, but on the whole most of them just end up being a point system, and thats not a massive leap from a Q review really is it.

So many of the polls are gratuituous. The Times New Viking one comes to mind. And these epic multi-part polls.

I suggest we list some ways to improve ILX, then turn that list into a poll, and then we all agree to abide by the winning result.

That must be another "mike t-diva" contributing regularly to the rolling Top 40 thread, then.

Oh, him...!

I also used to post on the rolling World Music thread, but kinda lost interest.

I suggest we list some ways to improve ILX, then turn that list into a poll, and then we all agree to abide by the winning result.

1. Ban Dom?

I actually ought to look at that World Music thread a lot more.

I haven't been here that long (two years or so maybe), but I don't see it as being that much more boring, insular and hostile to outsiders than it was when I turned up. It has neither improved nor declined in my time here. The rolling metal, world music, reggaeton/salsa and jazz threads are pretty much all I look at, because I really could give a flying fuck about indie and dance music and chart pop, plus I am pretty defiantly American in my listening habits and general musical knowledge, so much/most of this board is lost on me anydamnway. I've started a few threads that have gone mostly nowhere, but I don't care. The best thing about ILM for me has been the discovery of a bunch of amazing writers (Ned, John D., Scott Seward, many others), many of whom I have now had the opportunity to pay to write elsewhere. So for me this is like the world's most awesome version of Mediabistro, or something.

ilm has been shit for as long as i can remember, which is a very long time indeed, but all this begrudging the rolling thread people their fun is arriere-garde claptrap. the rolling threads seem more laid-back and less challops-heavy than the oldd ways.

rolling threads can of course have great stuff in them but they disregard the main strength of the ilx format which is asking questions

ilm (and ile) has been compared to various things over the years - a party (that has perhaps gone on too long), a bar, a pub. everyone has had the experience of being in one of these places and finding yourself talking to someone who isn't asking you any questions but instead just expounding on their pet subject - no matter how brilliant they are there's something dull about it

Yeah I'm not 100% hating on the rolling threads, they bring a lot of stuff to my attention that people wouldn't start a separate thread for. Also they can have a much more laid-back feel to them. At the same time I sometimes feel they suck in topics that maybe should have their own thread - albums especially.

i mean i'd go so far as to say greenspun's format (accidentally?) hit upon the very basis for philosophy and rational enquiry, a line that zig-zags from socrates through hegel and is the foundation of modern journalism: set up a question to provoke a counter-reaction, and poof - it's a new idea generator

xpost

of course if your goal with ilm is to add to your iTunes wishlist then this part is beside the point

No, if they're truly brilliant you should be spellbound, transformed, exceeded.

on ft and blogs i'd agree, dingbod (note to messiahwannabe: dingbod is also known as "marcello") but ilx's format is many-to-many (i.e. more like a party or a pub) rather than one-to-many (i.e. the radio)

i mean i'm sure the pub bore and his circle of mates also imagine they are transforming all who pass within their ambit

It needs to be more like Parliament and I don't mean the band.

It needs to be more like Parliament and I don't mean the band

Although that might help too.

I'd vote for that

"i refer the honourable gentlemen to the answer i gave some moments ago"

"ORDER - ORDER"

hmm .. it could work.

Horrendous idea. Parliament (not the band) is all about grandstanding; challops abound, trolls would fit right in.

I think it the case that any messageboard worth reading or spending time on has a necessary degree of intimidation about it.

We already have that, it's called Tombot.

Parliament (the band) is also about grandstanding; challops abound, trolls would fit right in and play a saxophone or something...

"Well, allright. Hey I was diggin' on y'all's funk for a while.
Sounds like it got a three on it though, to me.
Then I was down south and I heard some funk with some main ingredients
Like Doobie Brothers, Blue Magic, David Bowie.
It was cool,
But can you imagine Doobie in' your funk? Ho!"

Johnnie Walker keeps trying.

"your honour i move that the motion be blasted into funk orbit"

I think my main aversion to the rolling threads is that I feel like a completely frivolous dilettante and if I were to hang out with the 'specialists' they'd mock me, justly, until I cried.

Oh for the golden days of the Jay-Z/Nas rolling thread...

Which is many people's (me included) feeling on first finding ILM, oh the ironing. xp.

I've found ILM a bit sucky for a while, I must admit. It's mainly because I'm talked out on just about everything I'm interested in, and the one or two things I'm not talked out on, I'm the only person who cares about it. Or maybe just me and Gareth.

I think my main aversion to the rolling threads is that I feel like a completely frivolous dilettante and if I were to hang out with the 'specialists' they'd mock me, justly, until I cried.

Don't think this is at all true of the punk, metal, indie or dronenoiseetc threads

huh i was just wondering about this, I hardly ever post to ILM anymore. it's been a conscious decision, like Pashmina I felt like I was talked out and starting to repeat myself, which is already one of my bad habits.

and for me the rolling threads -- more than the polls -- were a turning point. some of the jazz polls led to good listening/rediscovery , most I just ignored. somewhere in 2006 ILM got seriously balkanized.

this nails it:

Never read Rolling threads, seem too clannish and exclusive to me

-- Tom D., Thursday, 5 June 2008 09:49

The rolling metal thread isn't really clannish at all. It's also pretty much zing free. And whilst some of the albums/bands do have enough crossover appeal for separate threads (Mastodon,Qotsa,High On Fire, Isis,Boris, Sunn0))) etc) , most would just clog up ILM with 5 new answers if they were lucky.

I did some of those jazz polls but gave up after people complained I was doing too many polls.

Sometimes I just get too enthusiastic about things and go a bit OTT. But sometimes music excites me and I can't help it.

I read the rolling punk thread. And occasionally the rolling metal thread, but that does move quite fast. I've never found either of them to be clannish or exclusive though.

I've jumped into the metal thread with my foot in my mouth a few times, but I've never felt like I was infiltrating a clique or anything.

As an aside, I think the key to following the rolling threads is to bookmark the crap out of 'em; I used to lose my place all the time.

(I've never used a bookmark!)

I love the rolling threads, and they're all pretty-much zing free. They seem to be places where people can talk about music without the need to make jokes. There are occasional fites, but they seem to be about stuff, rather than personalities, unlike elsewhere. If you feel you don't have anything to contribute, they're great for lurking (which is what I mostly do). Poll threads on the other hand are completely tedious to read, on the whole.

I suppose the fact that I'm not particularly interested in any of the genres covered in the Rolling Threads has some significance

And in conclusion: everyone should be like me and not worry. Uh.

Even then, don't like the idea of them (xp)

ILM has gotten pretty slow. I miss the album and song threads. I hate polls. I don't have time for Rolling Threads and also find that they can be too clannish.

most would just clog up ILM with 5 new answers if they were lucky

i think this is a clue

not that the bands or subjects are lame, but that you're asking the wrong questions about them (or not asking questions at all)

The question is why is a question about ILM stultifying incorrectly marked not safe for work meaning that those in offices can't reply to it during their ILM hours?

Uh, because that was a joke by Scott, who put that in the subject line when he started the thread?

Yeah, it's not a proper red warning.

Raw P: It is still in the title.

Ned: I don't see it in the subject line. This would not be the first time I have missed this kind of joke. Appreciate your 'Uh' by the way.

This is kind of why ILx is down in the dumps.

i.e. people missing jokes.

still blamin the polls, it took em a year or so but they gradually replaced good discussion (I know, poll-defenders, there are some poll threads that are exceptions, but the notion that music discussion = ranking things worst to best is a pretty closed system)

-- J0hn D., Wednesday, June 4, 2008 9:11 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Link

when I start my album polls I really don't care about the polling itself I just want to talk about the album

The year-by-year polls about Pazz & Jop albums and singles last year (and some of the subsequent year-by-year ones about NME etc Brit polls)actually generated a lot of good, interesting discussion. Otherwise, I really have nothing against polls; they're easy enough to ignore, and no more boring, in general, than those ancient OPX sorts of things.

Rolling threads make a lot more sense than individual-record threads (which I've almost always ignored, though the Ashlee and Vampire Weekend ones weren't bad) in my book; records happen in a context with other records, after all, and the rolling ones let you get the big picture. Plus there are so many interesting records out there that devoting so much energy to just one of them almost never makes sense. The most interesting threads on ILM in the past few years have mostly been rolling threads. But yeah, they're not what they used to be, either; only one I post on myself these days is the country one (and occasionally the hard rock one), and since I'm writing way more outside ILM this year, I'm nowhere near as obsessive on even those as I used to be. (Some people would probably say that's a good thing.) Metal one I barely post on at all anymore, though that probably has at least as much to do with me being really bored with metal and unable to get inspired by it these days than with anything on the thread, which still seems to be alive and kicking.)

xpost to DK: There aren't enough hours in the day for me to get half the jokes in this place! (Although during last week's cross-board dramas, I did try quite hard. It was all quite cumulatively engrossing, in a rubbernecky/sleuthy kind of way.) In which case, I'm personally quite glad that a corner seems to have been turned on the hitherto increasing dominance of meta-zing culture, as clever as some of it was.

* Pause, as I assess the chances of this being copy/pasted into a rolling zing thread on some board that I never read. Oh, whatever. *

xpost to xhuxk: When I was doing bits and bobs for Stylus, ILM informed my opinions rather usefully. Now that I'm doing bits and bobs for a mainstream newspaper, I feel a lot more separated from it.

I like poll threads, because they get REVIVED! TWICE!

ILM I've always seen as having mainstream taste ( amongst other things since it does cater for all IMO)

This is kind of why ILx is down in the dumps.

-- Dingbod Kesterson, Thursday, June 5, 2008 1:13 PM (23 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

i.e. people missing jokes.

-- Dingbod Kesterson, Thursday, June 5, 2008 1:15 PM (21 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

maybe cos most of the 'jokes' simply ain't funny?

What I meant was over-literal readings of things which are clearly intended not to be taken seriously.

Let's all raise our games and let this thread die.

ILM would be improved if random googlers didn't need to register to post on the Dave Matthews Thread.

jeez people, thread title sarcasm like this has been part of ILX since its inception. how did you guys ever parse Allyzay posts??

wallofvaginas.jpg

I was semi-tempted to post that and actually make it NSFW just to avoid any confusion but thought that would be mean.

so consensus is:

-no big crossover albums
-rolling balkanization
-not enough discussion on poll threads

Can't do shit about #1. #2 can be helped by maybe starting independent threads for stuff Rolling dudes think might have broader appeal? #3 might be helped by starting interesting polls.

Could you start a poll thread on that?

The point about the clannishness of the rolling threads is that, for the posters within them, it's quite handy to have a place where a basic level of knowledge of the product is already there, so posts don't have to start with "Royce Da 5'9" is a Detroit area known for his early association with Detroit hip hop luminary Eminem and subsequent solo career, during which he has released 3 studio albums as well as numerous mixtapes."

"Black Sabbath were a band formed by four gentlemen in a mystic far away land, one of whom lacked some parts of fingers."

so posts don't have to start with "Royce Da 5'9" is a Detroit area known for his early association with Detroit hip hop luminary Eminem and subsequent solo career, during which he has released 3 studio albums as well as numerous mixtapes."

ha actually i would be in support of this cuz new jacks would be informed and conscegneti could lol @ the stiffness of the language

conscegneti

nb this word does not actually mean anything

i think he's a shortstop for the brooklyn dodgers

The "Sceg"

I don't see why ILx should have to do homework for lazy people who can't be bothered to Google or otherwise find out for themselves.

lovely with carbonara though.

This isn't a mandate, Marcello, it's a suggestion as a way to inform the uninformed in order to usher new people into discussion.

xp

The point about the clannishness of the rolling threads is that, for the posters within them, it's quite handy to have a place where a basic level of knowledge of the product is already there

Of course, no point in anyone else getting involved with them

No. The uninformed should inform themselves before coming on here.

More elitism, more intimidation - then standards of discourse might be raised since posters will be expected to work harder.

so according to marcello if anything is stultifying the debate on ILM it is the lack of intimidation and elitism?

They don't need a message board they need a good stint in the army, or maybe down the mines.

God, even this thread is boring.

Good to see the old style Marcello coming back.

More elitism, more intimidation - then standards of discourse might be raised since posters will be expected to work harder.

-- Dingbod Kesterson, Thursday, June 5, 2008 2:11 PM

I understand where you're coming from, and it's certainly plausible that an uptick in elitism would weed out lolposts and make everyone start posting in paragraphs again, but it seems just as likely that this place would become just as boring as Dissensus as a result.

I dunno. I found the Ashlee Simpson thread elitist and intimidating in the best sense of both terms - I don't know enough about her music to join in the discussion, and I'm afraid the writing doesn't quite convince me that her music is worth knowing, but hey! Serious, intelligent and evocative discussion on ILM in 2008! Who'd've thought it? A few more threads of that calibre would be more than welcome.

The main reason it sucks now is because nearly everyone who is the least bit interesting has been banned.

Dissensus painted itself into its own corner very early on and it's never really recovered.

OTM on that Ashlee Simpson thread

We could be the zingy One Touch Football.

what i remember being annoying about dissensus was how slowly everything would load

Yeah that's the annoying thng about Dissensus

Is that still going? Only ever looked at it once or twice.

actually Dom, recently there's been a very similar thread over on OTF re the quietness of the Music section.
guess its just one of those phases for all as has been mentioned previously.

The QUIETUS-ness of the music section morelike amirite?

Yeah that's the annoying thng about Dissensus

-- Dom Passantino, Thursday, June 5, 2008 9:35 AM (10 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

ha well i just gave up before actually reading the content at a certain pt

I've been feeling the same for a few months now, dunno why...I scan New Answers prepared to not see anything I'm very interested in & rarely if ever read the poll threads.

I'm in one of those periodic phases right now where the only thing I can listen to is The Fall or talk radio. And what is there to post about the new Fall record...? GUYS THIS ONE IS REALLY GOOD I'M SERIOUS (It really is though)

Re: the rolling threads I don't find them exclusionary or clubby at all, & I esp. value the big ears and opinions on the psych/drone thread though I rarely post there...

The QUIETUS-ness of the music section morelike amirite?

v. smooth sir.

Current top four threads on Dissensus:

Grime Top Tens
incedental (sic) music
New Skweee Mix
crucial new riddims

QED

LOL more like

i get the impression that nothing interesting ever happens on that board

i think one big problem is that new pop music is increasingly irrelevant to anyone's lives

New pop music is fantastic and selling, what's wrong with you

I'm here for old stuff. Can I wait til new pop is old?

your honour, i move the following be blasted into the sun and re-funkified:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=566k5h8M9f8

what is new pop music for? staking out tribal ground? we have a million other ways to do that now. cause it sounds good and makes us dance around? i've already got more songs than i can ever listen to that do that already. to challenge a staid society? please.

Your name is Nick Hornby and you have been formally been disqualified from ILM. Now foxtrot off to the first Old Tyme Dancing messageboard you can find for all your Wee Georgie Elrick needs.

My own self-amused argument of late -- pop music is the biggest musical subculture there is, because it's *all* subcultural.

yeah sorry, that was pretty low-quality trolling. see that's what comes of just sticking it onto the bottom of a longer thread rather than having the pressure and performance of a new thread all your own.

xpost

Ned i have no idea what you're talking about

The Billboard Hot 100 Top Ten:

1. Lil Wayne feat. Static Major - "Lollipop"
2. Leona Lewis - "Bleeding Love"
3. Coldplay - "Viva La Vida"
4. Rihanna - "Take a Bow"
5. Katy Perry - "I Kissed a Girl"
6. Usher feat. Young Jeezy - "Love in This Club"
7. Jordin Sparks Duet with Chris Brown - "No Air"
8. Ray J and Yung Berg - "Sexy Can I"
9. David Cook - "The Time of My Life"
10. Madonna eat. Justin Timberlake - "Four Minutes"

Seriously, who gives a shit about any of these songs? Even "Four Minutes" didn't spark 1/10 as much discussion as "Hung Up" did.

the answer to ilm sucking is obviously more navel-gazing

Tracer: it's hard for me to easily sum up, honestly (and I really, REALLY have to get back to some work here) but I think the slow-grind collapse of the music industry specifically is taking the wind out of the idea of 'pop music' as universal cultural benchmark. Related to that, I think that's a big reason why 'pop music' as such has gained such relative cultural cachet from commentators this decade, it provides something to hold onto even while the business side of it ebbs away. Again, I'm not stating this as pithily (or probably accurately) as I'd like, but I'm trying to make a distinction as well between 'here is why I like or dislike (x)' -- that's why I think Snrub's complaint just now is an invalid one -- and an assumption that there's an actual mass engagement with (x) in the first place. Subject for another thread at this point, I think, or an old one continuing this kind of discussion.

Seriously, who gives a shit about the Billboard charts?

As good an indicator of the most popular pop music at a certain moment as any I guess.

The Billboard Hot 100 has been out of touch ever since it jumped Debby Boone's shark.

the madonna song is totally phoned in wackness, which is why no one gives a shit

10. Madonna eat. Justin Timberlake - "Four Minutes"

o noes!

(sry, back to your discussion then)

How dare you have a career.

-- Ned Raggett, Thursday, 5 June 2008 02:01 (13 hours ago) Link

How dare YOU have a career!

-- Jeff Treppel, Thursday, 5 June 2008 02:05 (13 hours ago) Link

We are the new Chip and Dale.

-- Ned Raggett, Thursday, 5 June 2008 02:09 (13 hours ago) Link

Surely you meant "Mac 'n' Tosh," sir?

(sry, back to your discussion then)

Why ILM has been boring:

Not enough big wide-ranging discussions of new music. The best ILM threads are the longest (mostly). I was disappointed at how weak the Portishead Third thread was. Say what you want about the Vampire Weekend thread but there was some really strong discussion in there.

Not enough enthusiasm/evangelisation of stuff we actually like. I want threads to sell me something and convince me why it's good. All of the poll threads assume familiarity with their subjects so if I know nothing about XTC - "Big Express" I'm not gonna learn much about it from the poll. Or rather, why would I care if someone thinks song X is better than song Y when I don't know either?

At least with the rolling threads I can read through and get some potentially interesting recs. I don't really post to the metal thread but there I'm likely to find someone telling me why some random metal album is awesome.

I also think that, while there's been quite a lot of music this year that I like, there's not been THAT much for people to get excited about on a wider, cultural scale - the things I like this year are more solipsistic than ever before, perhaps - Elbow, Spiritualized, etc. I'd have loved people to get excited by The Do, and though people would, but it didn't happen.

Very true. There have been a few threads this year devoted to a new disc or a new act that led to a long discussion that broke off into interesting directions, e.g., the thread about No Age's Nouns. But it's been few-and-far-between in that regard.

But I don't think this is necessarily an indication that something's gone wrong (although, as I said above, I don't think poll threads are good for conversation). When I look at "upcoming releases" calendars, I see lots of highly-anticipated discs that might be, as Nick puts it, "cultural items" on the horizon (maybe within niche communities, but "cultural items" nonetheless). I'd guess that some of those discs will lead to threads with the kind of deeper discussion that we've seen on ILX in the (relatively recent) past.

although dude you were responsible for that shoddy "12 perfect songs" p-fork dick-suck so in a way you are responsible for ILM being crap

We need more bold, proactive posting about musical theory and critical analysis. My two cents. Well, two more.

Louis:

Given that M@rk's Resonant Frequency column is all about musical theory and critical analysis, these two posts are in conflict. I think you missed the point of the poll (as did most). It could have turned into an interesting discussion -- which song(s) that M@rk named were perfect? which weren't so perfect? what other songs are "perfect" to each of us? and what makes a perfect song?

The poll itself isn't the point of the thread; I was aiming more so to discuss the theory behind it.

We need more bold, proactive posting about musical theory and critical analysis.

Musical theory? Such as?

xpost, to Louis - I mean, if you're gonna target the lack of critical/theoretical discussion on ILM, the better target would have been my own recent "Music That Enhances Sex" poll, quite obviously.

I agree ILM has been especially boring lately. And I'm tired of these threads with blanks in them i.e. ____is the new____ or _____ is so ______ they make ______ look like _____. I just don't find that kind of thing inspiring at all. Come to think of it, it's kinda like Mad Libs, but far, far less entertaining.

I kinda like sleeve's idea that polls could be on a separate board, too.

I Poll Everything

i like the rolling threads. better than starting a thread on some random jazz album that'll get 0 - 5 posts and fade away.

It's sweet that people liked the Ashlee thread, but you realize that it was populated by people who stopped coming here because they got trolled out, right?

Shame

i like the rolling threads. better than starting a thread on some random jazz album that'll get 0 - 5 posts and fade away.

i already answered this - keep up! if you start a thread and it gets five responses there is something wrong with the way you asked the question.

and in that case - is it really worth talking about at all?

thats bs, plenty of great albums worth talking about w/ perfectly fine questions that dont get more than 5 posts bcuz the thread starter is not tim finney

i'm just an old lump of coal, but i'm gonna be tim finney someday.

Let us decide to ask a few interestingly posed questions about especially new and exciting albums/artists/etc. that we would normally keep to one of the rolling threads (in my case, the only one I read is Rolling Metal) and see what happens.

i'm trying to think of some provocative, interesting way i could get people to care about the new Brian Blade album or some brass band shit, but i'm coming up empty.

tits.jpg

guys i'm going to post more to ILM now so don't worry

Jordan, I've been about to check out that Brian Blade album for the past few days based on your flakking.

Tracer learned his lesson when he started that Go-go thread.

I think you missed the point of the poll (as did most). It could have turned into an interesting discussion -- which song(s) that M@rk named were perfect? which weren't so perfect? what other songs are "perfect" to each of us? and what makes a perfect song?

The only remotely interesting part of this is the final sentence, and I personally regard the idea of a "perfect" song to be a red herring because there are so many variables in music. Still, we could have had that discussion WITHOUT appealing to such a crass and blatant authority as a popular indie website, or starting a poll whose options would almost certainly occlude any proactive theoretical debate. I don't think the idea of creating a "perfect" song is at all interesting, sorry. It's a big, booming, subjective point of pseudo-critical wankery, the enemy of theoretical innovation or fun.

so consensus is:

-no big crossover albums
-rolling balkanization
-not enough discussion on poll threads

#2 can be helped by maybe starting independent threads for stuff Rolling dudes think might have broader appeal?

-- BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Thursday, June 5, 2008 1:59 PM (3 hours ago) Bookmark Link

Let us decide to ask a few interestingly posed questions about especially new and exciting albums/artists/etc. that we would normally keep to one of the rolling threads (in my case, the only one I read is Rolling Metal) and see what happens.

-- roxymuzak, Thursday, June 5, 2008 4:46 PM (40 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

great minds

otm

There's too many threads.

I would much rather look at board that had few threads about noteworthy albums than sifting through "BEST ALBUM WITH A DOG ON THE COVER POLL"

New Music on ILM #1: Five O'Clock Heroes feat. Agyness Deyn - "Who"

rolling balkanization

I'm pro the continued separation of ILM into tribes which have and want nothing to do with each other.

I would much rather look at board that had few threads about noteworthy albums than sifting through "BEST ALBUM WITH A DOG ON THE COVER POLL"

-- Whiney G. Weingarten, Thursday, June 5, 2008 12:46 PM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

these are why rolling threads are the best, i guess they just get daunting after a while

I'm pro the continued separation of ILM into tribes which have and want nothing to do with each other.

This is shit for the many people who dearly like a lot of different musical styles.

And it's great for people who long ago got tired of the standard belittling and values/taste warring that's standard practice here.

Ride it out dude. Pay the haters no mind and they will magically stop affecting you. I say this as someone who learned the increasingly easy way.

likewise

This is shit for the many people who dearly like a lot of different musical styles.

-- Just got offed, Thursday, June 5, 2008 5:55 PM (15 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

rock, prog-rock, and post-rock?

He makes a good point, though. Ringtone is my home, but no way I can keep up with Metal & Dance too.

Balkanization is never the answer, people. Look at the Balkans.

I hate when threads you like just disappear, whatever happened to rolling teenpop. So good.

jordan.xls

I'm just waiting for Tombot to lock the rejected jbr screenames thread and then it's adios.

i don't follow all the rolling threads obv. but it's nice that they're there. i've stopped in the country thread to ask about something before.

honestly, i can't believe that there's a better forum than ilm as far musical breadth goes.

we could have had that discussion WITHOUT appealing to such a crass and blatant authority as a popular indie website,

you're making a lot of assumptions there buddy. i didn't appeal to anything, i simply linked to a column which i found interesting as a starting point for debate. and sorry if you're too cool for that "popular indie website" -- M@rk writes one of the best music columns on the web there, and even if you don't care for the "perfect songs" issue, you'd do yourself a favor to check out the 50+ chapters he's already written.

i've stopped in the country thread to ask about something before

I really like when people do this, especially when they're not one of the six or seven people who usually post on that thread (who tend to agree with each other too much anyway). Don't think anybody has ever been "shouted down" or lol'ed out or anything.

Yeah, Pitchfork has gotten really quite good, it's big enough that it can be alarmingly retarded and great at the same time. The poptimist column is consistently great and the piece about Blackout is one of my favourite pieces of music writing that managed to nail what I love about that record, make me look at things about it in a different way and just be a really great piece of writing in general. And I learned about cheveu there.

the opeth review on pitchfork was pretty good. except for the part where he dismissively sped through their back catalogue. and how may times do you really need to fucking mention mastodon in a review of a band that bears no relation to them whatsoever. i mean, come on.

Because Mastodon is the only metal band there is. The other is of course Pig Destroyer.

Yeah, Pitchfork has gotten really quite good, it's big enough that it can be alarmingly retarded and great at the same time. The poptimist column is consistently great and

this ^^

like any site, it has its high and low points. there are at least 5 or 6 writers there i think are very good, though, and check out their reviews regularly. not to mention the great columns (Resonant Frequency, Poptimist, sometimes Puritan Blister too) and the generally well-thought out interviews (PJ Harvey a couple months ago was a huge highlight). i'd be hard pressed to name a website with more consistent, high quality music writing in 2008.

of course, it has its low points as well. see lately: the Spiritualized and Black Angels reviews, both of which i think relied verrrrry heavily on sweeping generalizations (Spiritualized) and cliches about "drug music" (Black Angels).

It's like anywhere, you kinda need to get to know the site and you don't even need to try to ignore all the rubbish (Exclusive, The Gossip on tour with CSS!!!) because you don't even notice it. Yeah, Resonant Freq is quite good often too.

I miss Stylus, that one I liked.

Resonant Frequency is one of the best columns about music being written today.

Stylus was excellent. i got a shoutout in the year-end Bluffer's Guide too! thanks guys!

Exclusive, The Gossip on tour with CSS!!!

major LOLZ

does ott still write for pitchfork? that guy is a stinker. peeyoooo!

okay, it seems i only have myself to blame. i've been busy with other stuff and haven't been able to singlehandedly keep ilm entertaining. i apologize. for the lack of random picture threads. the lack of long spazzy thread titles. i'm sorry for everything.

ilm just needs a little more bite is all. a little more tang. some zazz. we'll be up and running in no time.

just a little too toothless these days. no i don't want flambe wars and all that no no no just a little more...grit. a good thread to sink my teeth into for fun and profit. that no age thread was pretty entertaining! considering i've barely heard the band. and that's the kind of thread i like. it can be "about" anything and go anywhere.

when ile would hold their semi-annual let's diss ilm fest on some metathread people would always say that they never came here cuz it was so "scary" and "intimidating". ha! they wouldn't say that now i'll bet. buncha pussycats on here. and that can be nice sometimes. (thinking back to when i first started hanging out here and blount and jess would rip someone to shreds and send them home crying without blinking an eye)

WTF? Stylus Magazine is no more???? (x-post)

way xpost "It's a big, booming, subjective point of pseudo-critical wankery, the enemy of theoretical innovation or fun."

see here, you're completely underrating pseudiness. Its what ILM was built on and a little bit of what makes this place special.

also scott is right. ILM just needs to pull its socks up a bit and stop pretending to be a snob while secretly dancing around the room.

ILM needs to bring back PEW

WTF? Stylus Magazine is no more???? (x-post)

uhhh

Shocking news.

Alfred, this was the first you'd heard about it too I'm sure.

RIP month of falsely feeling credible

yeah guyz mr snrub is being completely serious

This is no way for Todd Burns to treat his staff. See the knife in my back?

does ott still write for pitchfork? that guy is a stinker. peeyoooo!

okay, it seems i only have myself to blame. i've been busy with other stuff and haven't been able to singlehandedly keep ilm entertaining. i apologize. for the lack of random picture threads. the lack of long spazzy thread titles. i'm sorry for everything.

ilm just needs a little more bite is all. a little more tang. some zazz. we'll be up and running in no time.

just a little too toothless these days. no i don't want flambe wars and all that no no no just a little more...grit. a good thread to sink my teeth into for fun and profit. that no age thread was pretty entertaining! considering i've barely heard the band. and that's the kind of thread i like. it can be "about" anything and go anywhere.

when ile would hold their semi-annual let's diss ilm fest on some metathread people would always say that they never came here cuz it was so "scary" and "intimidating". ha! they wouldn't say that now i'll bet. buncha pussycats on here. and that can be nice sometimes. (thinking back to when i first started hanging out here and blount and jess would rip someone to shreds and send them home crying without blinking an eye)

-- scott seward, Thursday, June 5, 2008 2:50 PM (24 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

is scott proposing to make ILM The new home of meta?

Ride it out dude.

Not necessary. I don't miss people not participating, or stopping in, if that's actually what's happening.

Balkanization is never the answer, people

It's working great in the US, far as I'm concerned.

In answering another query, Rolling Teenpop was rubbed out when one of the solid contributors got sick of it being trolled and asked for locking.

It's working great in the US, far as I'm concerned

o_O

I'm going to assume Gorge is joking about not minding that people *who would otherwise like to talk about country music* stay out of the rolling country thread because the people on that thread don't want "outsiders" in. Because that's a bullshit attitude to have on a public message board.

Maybe he doesn't want extreme metal fans posting in his rolling hard rock thread?

Yeah, the thing you need to understand about George is that he is a good writer and really knowledgeable in his fields, but he is the metal/hard rock version of Geir and you just have to add "to me" or "in bed" after everything he says.

That prostitute guy is maybe more Geir-like.

Or more annoying anyway. I like Gorge.

For what it's worth Re: rolling metal thread, I found it much more accepting, less cliquish, and easier to join in when I first arrived at ILX than it has been when I've made attempts to join the conversations on ILE, even after I'd been here for a while.

for what it's worth, i don't even spend 15 minutes a day on ile these days. and i used to hang there all the time.

i totally made ilm entertaining for myself tonight. i always forget that i have to make my own fun.

for what it's worth, i don't even spend 15 minutes a day on ile these days. and i used to hang there all the time.

Just wait for Lost's new season. Or do you still follow that?

Even if you might sometimes think this (thread title) you can always bump some old jazz thread and then I know what I like about ILM once again. So I think it might be wrong

i watch Lost faithfully, but I kinda got lost by the lost thread. what people are saying here about rolling threads applies to me and the lost thread. goes to fast and my brain can't keep up. i just try to remember, like, THREE things that i saw on an episode of Lost. I definitely can't hold theory discussions about it.

i HAVE been going on my sadly neglected I Love Books a little more recently. the board i started one long ago winter in another life. mostly cuz i'm actually reading some books lately. that helps.

I'm kinda holding out that rolling threads that aren't TITTWIS/Chicago style clique gossip will slowly be replaced by more individual topics threads as more people grow annoyed by the red bar eating their conversations

remember when 400 posts was, like, CRAZY? now we do it all the time and momus hasn't posted in years

The red bar is your friend, Tombot!

yeah, i just never see anything on ile that makes me want to join in. and i used to start threads like a maniac, eh, what are ya gonna do. it is an ebb and flow thing. i'll be back when i have the time.

and the noize board! jeez, what did happen there? i never go there either. i used to be there every day. it can't be ALL your fault, tom. hahahaha! i don't keep up with the inner turmoil, so i'm kinda out of the loop. if i can get someone to tell me who gareth is this week i feel like i've accomplished something. is gareth even around now!??? i don't even know. and nobody will tell me what happened to blount or if he has ever come back. it's all a little confusing sometimes. where is jack cole!!?? is he okay?
and is roger really back? i got no roger hate.

noize bored gutted by IRL

blount = balls
jack cole = jack battery-pack I think
roger = if assholes could fly etc

can't keep track of gareth

i always forget that i have to make my own fun.

Can everyone tattoo this on the backs of their hands so that the next time everyone wants to freak out about how awful and boring everyone else is, we can all look at the backs of our hands and stop being dumbasses?

wallofvaginas.jpg

there aren't any threads for nektar. there should be at least one. but what do i know--i'm still waiting for someone to respond to my one thread--scott walker vs. david sylvian

i like nektar a bunch. and scott walker would win that with both hands tied behind his back.

nektar vs. walker?

NO! scott walker -vs- david sylvian

i meant who would you take, walker or nektar? nektar has better album covers, at least. and if we're throwing japan and walker bros in sylvian vs. walker, it's maybe not so cut-and-dried

Hey, it's not my fault that most music people want to release these days is boring shite that I've forgotten about before I can get to a computer and post "hay check out this hott new electo-twee act from Estonia".

Personally, I blame Raggett and the Club of Rome All Music Guide who are implementing the New World Order strategy (popular music division).

What, where?

Don't play dumb with us Raggett! We know what you're up to...

That embedded Nektar sub-thread went well. Perhaps I should start the Zickzack/German punk RFI thread here while I've got everyone's attention.

I have little time for music these days. It saddens me but what can I do about it? Two kids have taken over my life. They bring me more joy than music could ever do, but fuck I do miss the days of listening to dEUS and No New York on repeat all evening long.

Ah, you could just listen to them anyway and get the kids hooked. Indoctrination. Oh wait...

Is ILM better yet?

I will start making my own fun (read: Keith Whitley mania) here soon, but I am heading to the olde world for a few weeks. So for me, no more ILM, I love you but you're bringing me down.

Come back with tales of mystic lands.

Is ILM better yet?

Still the same tiny amount of contributors to some of the Rolling threads---whirled one, reggaeton one, etc. I need to acquire some new '08 releases in such genres...

Some interesting threads have been started or revived since this one, tho. Maybe it's had a good effect.

Newer posters see the 'old guard' posting short pithy replies (partly due to net speeds these days as discussed before, and partly due to the above) and that's how they learn the vernacular of the board.

-- Scik Mouthy, Thursday, 5 June 2008 18:52 (2 days ago) Bookmark Link

A lot of my recent posting is done on my mobile, which doesn't really allow for extended posts: If you press the wrong button, everything you type is lost without warning. So there's no point going into any detail about anything.

I don't know how many people are affected this way. Probably just me.

Not just you. Same here.

POLL

(joke)

you kidz and yer gadgets!

anyway, ilm is fine now. i had time to make it better for myself.

i had time to make it better for myself.

in bed.

(Still works)

suggestion of Zickzack/German punk RFI thread perked the whole place up

I admit I didn't read this whole thread. I tried to for quite awhile but then work got to me and then...

Anyway, I would like to suggest that if we do polls, please let's not have TOO MANY CHOICES IN THE POLL. I don't know if someone else has brought this up but it really spoils the fun and randomizes everything if there are too many choices in the poll. Especially sad are these types of best of the year things from publications. I thought the Melody Maker 1988 had a reasonable # of choices, but there are many others which have way too many choices.

okthnkxbye

naw, that's a good point

Maybe we need more threads about bands you've never heard of, or songs you like when you're drunk?

I can't understand all this poll hate at all. The polls are the main interesting new thing on ILM because they haven't been done before. ILMers seem irrationally afraid of having redundant threads, so we get one giant thread about a band which, if you haven't been on the board since like 2001 means that you have to read through the opinions of a bunch of people, many don't even post anymore, just to understand where the thread is at 7 years later. Fuck that.

At least with polls there's the chance to stimulate a new conversation with active posters on an old topic, plus you get the extra benefit of knowing exactly where those sufficiently motivated to register and click a button stand on the topic. The main problem comes in when people include too many choices and make their polls meaningless.

"Maybe we need more threads about bands you've never heard of, or songs you like when you're drunk?"

definitely. but i'm only one person. i do what i can.

in any case, here's a picture of that guy again:

http://www.consumerist.com/images/2006/04/MulliWalmartGreeter.jpg

:o

Fatboy Slim Singles Poll [Started by banriquit, last updated 18 minutes ago] (I Love Music) 17 new answers [POLL closes: July 02]
Chemical Brothers singles [Started by HI DERE, last updated 20 minutes ago] (I Love Music) 46 new answers [POLL closes: July 05]
Oasis single with the most asinine lyrics [Started by musically, last updated 23 minutes ago] (I Love Music) 42 new answers [POLL closes: July 02]

the best polls so far are the lines from rap song polls! as to what wins or loses - i mean, there's no compendium of these things.

http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:Rmdf3S25JrsTuM:http://bits.webhs.org/blog/shit
All of this poll shit is out of hand.

they can't all look intersting

*sigh*

Or maybe I'm so ridiculously bored at this stupid job that it can never possibly satisfy me.

feeln u dogg last week i tried to revive a bunch of threads about hip-hop & white ppl but nobody was interested

was sucking at the time seward wrote that. not now.

but yeah people still insist in doing some silly polls

I was gonna start a Nicodemus thread (not the riddims dude), but I didn't know how to give it an angle, except for 'ayo... how bout this Nicodemus dude?'

rolling vinyl thread, non-indie underground PUNK thread, MS records thread, and world music threads thrivin!

hey now dont leave rolling metal out there mang

No, it's just me, I'm sure.

It's been better than 2008 for sure

Just curious--and this is coming from one of the all-time great thread assassins* Anyway, I'm sure I'm this for others, but does anyone else have particular posters that you reflexively recoil from? (NO NAMES PLEASE) like they drive you crazy? I think I'm projecting my own shit on them, but god, this person posts everywhere and makes me crawl up the wall....

*I would say people comment on maybe 1 in 20 of my posts, although sometimes a thread of mine will do sort of well.

all of them.

name names xp

fwiw i'm really enjoying ilm these days for the most part. thank u bookmarks!

I'm really sorry for posting in all the ILM threads : (

It's Ned isn't it

paranoid now

*conspicuously avoids posting on thread*

iago galdston that is a terrible, terrible post for a number of reasons, chiefly that i opened this thread hoping to see a proper moan about the traxpoll results ;)

now have your clusterfuck

It's Ned isn't it

*camera closes in*

Soon.

Maybe this is a bad idea when things have been low-conflict lately, at least on the threads I've been reading.

iago u need to harvest that impulse to recoil

Ha ha, I didn't mean to but I guess I got a response for once! Meta-meta

I'm really sorry for posting in all the ILM threads : (

― 乒乓, Thursday, January 24, 2013 8:55 PM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I meant he posts all over ILE in addition to ILM--I didn't phrase that right. It's nobody who's responded here though! ;)

Clue 1: male

I could've changed the gender though, but I would never, ever say. No one has affirmed or denied having this feeling though (even though i'm probably rocketing up the charts with this little riddle)

Iago Galdston
Strongo
Matt P
乒乓
polyphonic
NickB
imago
Raggett
Rudipherous
flopson

don't say it... just savagely zing them next time u run into them in a thread...

i think, sadly, that you might want to take the strike mark off old iago g.'s name. i'm pretty sure i'm projecting my own issues onto him/her.

ach that old twist ending eh, 'it was himself all along'

sing another one

consistently worst taste in music on ILM

乒乓 is unstrikeoutable

hey nickb why didn't you cross me out

I should think of a really weird, distinctive word, give it to you guys, and when you see a mystery poster use it in a response, you'll know exactly who i mean

because you really are the worst xp

that word is....travertine.

rolling 2008 list thread for shit to keep mccain from becoming president

does anyone else have particular posters that you reflexively recoil from?

Heh...yeah. (longer answer deleted)

there are always going to be people who rub you the wrong way, he said gingerly.

http://i45.tinypic.com/35170wp.jpg

what the travertine is going on in here?

there are several who REALLY make me want to start an @ILXTXT twitter account.

if you think it would be better and more accurate than 'solitary posts that etc etc', then you should totally go for it

clue: it wouldn't be

bit defensive there lol m9

ilm is prob the worst i can ever remember it. i know i'm not alone in thinking this. but i'm equally sure some people are enjoying it.

Chief Keef killed ILM

there are several who REALLY make me want to start an @ILXTXT twitter account.

― Blue Collar Retail Assistant (Dwight Yorke), Friday, January 25, 2013 4:37 AM (3 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

somebody made this already, can't remember the twitter handle tho

http://twitter.com/WhineyGMemorial

:D best gravestone

haha I'm thinking of another one though? like dedicated to O_o indie fuxxor posts or something. idk.

ilm is prob the worst i can ever remember it. i know i'm not alone in thinking this. but i'm equally sure some people are enjoying it.

― Ballboy to Afghanistan (LocalGarda), Friday, January 25, 2013 5:11 AM (4 hours ago) Bookmark

is it any worse than it was in 2010. i cant tell the difference

i don't even care anymore about content. its a straight up ocd thing for me now. clickclickclickclick...

i don't know about the quality of ilx, but complaints about quality def seem more pathetic with each year.

^ meta

i find myself more and more out of step w/ broader ilm music taste (i didn't like the vast majority of tracks that placed this year) but there are enough posters talking about music i love on various rolling threads and stuff that i can't complain at all.

i don't know about the quality of ilx, but complaints about quality def seem more pathetic with each year.

cool post.

is it any worse than it was in 2010. i cant tell the difference

yes.

sorry but it's like complaining that a bar you haunt isn't as cool as it used to be, except it's byob so you can't even blame alcoholism for your continued patronage

why is it worse?

afaict we just have more rolling thread so it's become on a whole more balkanized, but like breakout artists within each 'genre' still seem to get their own threads

pavement thread bumps are at an all time low

we still have jokey radiohead polls

service guarantees citizenship

would you like to know more?

if you feel like ilx isn't having enough interesting conversations about 80s music the problem might be that you like boring music

sorry but it's like complaining that a bar you haunt isn't as cool as it used to be, except it's byob so you can't even blame alcoholism for your continued patronage

yes, everyone who has any prob with ilx should leave immediately.

ILM is having quite enough convos about shit 80s music kthx

complaining about ilm is like dancing about the architecture of a squalid outhouse

yes.

― Ballboy to Afghanistan (LocalGarda), Friday, January 25, 2013 10:29 AM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark

whats the difference... mate

yeah i'm kind of curious how it's failing you

not gonna start a big flamewar about it, really. it just feels like a smaller number of people policing a smaller number of threads.

I think that just reflects ILX's aging demographic in general - we're no longer attracting college kids (calls iatee over)

we all shrink as we age.

I dunno, I'm just bopping along.

Just eyeballing it, there were like 60 or 70 threads updated on ILM yesterday (not including the ones that have been revived today). I didn't post in all of them, but I know I read a lot more than I post in general. ILM's been my #1 source for music information for the last 5 years. It's a cornucopia!

tbh i'm comfy with not having a new "OHMYGOD I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU PEOPLE LISTEN TO (C)RAP MUSIC HAVEN'T YOU EVER HEARD OF THE ARCADE FIRE???" kid every month

think we're already at quota

And here I was thinking we were reviving the thread to talk about how this is a GOLDEN ERA for ILM post-tracks poll results thread.

people who are unhappy w/ ilm - i wonder what kind of genres/music you feel aren't being covered adequately?

indie rock

there's a lovely rolling indie rock thread that i personally never open but i'm sure is just wonderful

And here I was thinking we were reviving the thread to talk about how this is a GOLDEN ERA for ILM post-tracks poll results thread.

― xyzzzz__, Friday, January 25, 2013 10:49 AM (1 minute ago) Bookmark

lol.

tbh i'm comfy with not having a new "OHMYGOD I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU PEOPLE LISTEN TO (C)RAP MUSIC HAVEN'T YOU EVER HEARD OF THE ARCADE FIRE???" kid every month

― why can't he just sing normally, unmannered and natural? (Noodle Vague), Friday, January 25, 2013 10:47 AM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark

think we're already at quota

― why can't he just sing normally, unmannered and natural? (Noodle Vague), Friday, January 25, 2013 10:48 AM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark

where are these people, i never see them.

lazy victimless zings man

i don't really have beef with ILM, there's been some good discussion on classical and non-Western musics of late and the rolling threads keep stuff i'm interested in a convenient drawer and some of you kids shd probly ease off the polling but the FP button still works and ILM's still a good bet if you fancy a really bitter, personal clusterfuck to go off so hey

indie rock

― an eagle named "small government" (call all destroyer), Friday, January 25, 2013 10:50 AM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i dunno if this is sarcastic or not but there's definitely been a huge shift away from indie and towards mainstream pop and dance music in the 5-6 years i've been on ILM

i don't really know if it's sarcastic or not either tbh

rolling rock/indie/alt/experimental/pop-but-weird stuff 2013
Rolling Indie thread 2013

and i'm sure plenty more for individual artists

not bad for a genre that is totally non-descriptive and means nothing

can't see how you can say ILM's dropped off when Neon Neon: Collab. between Boom Bip and Gruff Rhys ft. Fat Lip, Spank Rock, The Magic Numbers and more is riding high on SNA

tbh i'm comfy with not having a new "OHMYGOD I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU PEOPLE LISTEN TO (C)RAP MUSIC HAVEN'T YOU EVER HEARD OF THE ARCADE FIRE???" kid every month

We could do with a couple of really committed bratty American EDM Bassnectar-rocks-have-you-seen-Molly types.

ilm outreach program

would always be good to have new blood but i think we're reaching the point in time where college-age kids who would once have been interested in ilm have grown up w/ social networking sites instead of internet message boards so this is kind of a foreign concept now

social networking sites don't necessarily play the same role - like you're not interacting w/ strangers

would always be good to have new blood but i think we're reaching the point in time where college-age kids who would once have been interested in ilm have grown up w/ social networking sites instead of internet message boards so this is kind of a foreign concept now

really doubt anyone new would get very far with the competitive edge around the place.

if only we could go back to the gentle days of strongo & and what

pretty sure ilx is way friendlier on the whole than most message boards

stfu

this forum is incredibly useful because its archive is so deep, everyone w/ actual complaints since this thread got bumped (xcept local g.) is a really shitty poster

indie rock

― an eagle named "small government" (call all destroyer), Friday, January 25, 2013 10:50 AM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i dunno if this is sarcastic or not but there's definitely been a huge shift away from indie and towards mainstream pop and dance music in the 5-6 years i've been on ILM

― tity boi historian (ciderpress), Friday, 25 January 2013 15:58 (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

the "indie" tag's become such a bete noire on this board over the years that i've automatically started associating it with bad hipster music, or bland guitar rock, when i'm sure that's not what the thread is about at all, but i still refrain from clicking on those threads for fear they'll be about that, or they'll be full of Lex-a-likes complaining about "indie", or whatever.

there are several who REALLY make me want to start an @ILXTXT twitter account.

― Blue Collar Retail Assistant (Dwight Yorke), Friday, January 25, 2013 1:37 AM (6 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

didn't you come to this forum because people were making fun of some listicle you wrote

it's kinda weird bc i think i love ilx + ilm these days more than i ever had.

Sick burn, but no.

That post doesn't mean I don't enjoy ILX btw.

yeah i dont actually have complaints really, im just meta-rambling which is a waste of time so i'll stop

go home and get yer fuckin listicle

someone started a rather interesting vaporwave thread the other day and there were people making fun of him / her because of b links: not cool. the hipster thread has a vice article mocking young people who are doing internet eh poetry? kind of hipsterrunoff-like and once I read it it seemed kind of cool. ilxor is awesome reading but not a fun place to post your naive non Ph.D thoughts, it's too hostile. needs more noise. and lex fighting, love when he gets angry.

those rolling indie threads are mostly about bands doing old school indie and indie pop rather than mainstream NME or Pitchfork-style indie rock

yo wolves, i wrote the VICE piece you mentioned, holla at ya boi

I should start by saying I still generally get good value out of ILX/ILM and there are loads of great people here.

But with ILM I basically feel everything gets sucked into the middle a bit and there isn't as much depth around the genre-specific stuff anymore, plus reviving old threads is far less likely to start a discussion. Meanwhile rolling current dance threads (obv my personal interest) need a fairly big thing to get people talking to each other and not just posting links.

I feel like at one point you had enough people posting regularly that any single post would usually get a response, there's also sometimes a sense of who shouts the loudest and it's a bit less conversational.

Maybe it's dance threads in particular that are dwindling, that'd be where I'd notice.

i'm not so into dance music so forgive my ignorance but it seems like dance music would be particularly difficult to have long conversations about. "this is really great to dance to" "i agree"?

those rolling indie threads are mostly about bands doing old school indie and indie pop rather than mainstream NME or Pitchfork-style indie rock

― a la recherche du tempbans perdu (NickB), Friday, 25 January 2013 16:39 (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

what kind of stuff do you mean?

xp it's just bloody computer music

i listen to tons of "dance" music (but rarely dance) and the questions abt quality and interest almost always revolve around production techniques and construction rather than danceability.

production techniques don't really interest me at all personally, so i guess i haven't noticed their absence

dwight: thanks for the piece because I didn't know it was a 'thing', it's just what you do with your internet addict friends (?) but it's nice you can become famous for it now. I can't read facebook comments so I don't know what the people said but the article had that experienced-condescending-bitter tone directed at stupid young people, we know what it feels like and in the context of this thread that attitude won't attract new posters and in the end ilm gets stuck with rolling indie vs. rolling pop vs. R&B for the next few decades.

When I first came to ILM (IDK, 2004?), it felt like, for better or worse, a kind of inspired insurgency. Poptimism was a mission, and there was a fervor to the whole thing. ILM eventually won its coup, and since then it has been faced with the far more mundane and undesirable task of governing.

haha

i don't even know what 'poptimism' refers to really. the critical acceptance and engagement with mainstream pop music?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pOg4PTa0oIY

what kind of stuff do you mean?

well my perception is that it's more likely for people to be talking about bands like veronica falls or stuff on slumberland etc rather than i dunno, the vaccines or the maccabees or the new klaxons album or whatever

ah cool. i'm not that fussed about veronica falls type stuff. sometimes i wonder what it is i'm actually interested in, but it doesn't really fit into a rolling thread.

oh it's not restricted just to bands that sound like that, there's all sorts really

i think ILM has been pretty good for the last couple years IMO

but i never had any thoughts like this about how it was some important quest, just killing time bullshitting about music and stuff

When I first came to ILM (IDK, 2004?), it felt like, for better or worse, a kind of inspired insurgency. Poptimism was a mission, and there was a fervor to the whole thing. ILM eventually won its coup, and since then it has been faced with the far more mundane and undesirable task of governing.

― space phwoar (Hurting 2), Friday, January 25, 2013 10:56 AM (33 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

but it keeps me aware of pop stuff like miguel that i never would have listened to otherwise

When I first came to ILM (IDK, 2004?), it felt like, for better or worse, a kind of inspired insurgency. Poptimism was a mission, and there was a fervor to the whole thing. ILM eventually won its coup, and since then it has been faced with the far more mundane and undesirable task of governing.

― space phwoar (Hurting 2), Friday, January 25, 2013 11:56 AM (22 minutes ago) Bookmark

plus pop music betrayed the cause by deciding to mostly suck assholes for the last *checks watch* 6 years

lol

but it keeps me aware of pop stuff like miguel that i never would have listened to otherwise

― mh (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Friday, January 25, 2013 12:30 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah well I heard about Miguel on NPR (from two ilxors), so meh!

i'm sympathetic to any theory of the case that blames poptimism for theoretical stagnation but i can't imagine 50 polls about bob dylan would be any better

i feel like people talk about dadmusic just as much as they did in the pop evangelism days, if not more. for example i would never have expected the degree of enthusiasm that people showed for the paul simon poll

doesn't seem like there's much at stake in any of the dance thread discussions these days. bring back pipecock ;)

is there a rolling thread to post about music that doesn't fit into any of the rolling threads

but it keeps me aware of pop stuff like miguel that i never would have listened to otherwise

― mh (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Friday, January 25, 2013 12:30 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah well I heard about Miguel on NPR (from two ilxors), so meh!

― space phwoar (Hurting 2), Friday, January 25, 2013 11:34 AM (18 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

ok thanks

the era that is now being looked back at fondly in itself was considered a decline for ILM when it was actually happening, there's always some nostalgia for some half remembered "golden age" when things were so great, but when it was actually happening it was viewed as not as good as another fictional golden age.

looking at the early posts on any thread that's like 8+ years old is a great reality check.

old ilx was shit

what's the average age of ilxors that primarily hear music through clubbing/dancing/etc? i feel totally alienated from that segment of ilx.

ILM needs more drone music imo

skot and wmc are talking about me btw but thats fine. I prefer to know my enemies so if annyone has a problem with me then post away the reasons I do not mind at all.

u are universally loved

<3 AG

you love long lists. I can never forgive you for your love of long lists

the era that is now being looked back at fondly in itself was considered a decline for ILM when it was actually happening, there's always some nostalgia for some half remembered "golden age" when things were so great, but when it was actually happening it was viewed as not as good as another fictional golden age.

looking at the early posts on any thread that's like 8+ years old is a great reality check.

― mh (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Friday, January 25, 2013 1:02 PM (12 minutes ago) Bookmark

yeah i was gonna say this, by 04 at the latest the 'ilm's gone down the tubes' crowd was already pretty vocal

that said, ilm's gone down the tubes

old ilx was so mean

hang on .. back up people, did someone mention a new klaxons album ?

[ i still love killing work hours here despite the lack of the old school ilm attrition chaos ]

let's go down the tubes - have a banana!

my favorite series of threads:

Has ILE Gone Down The Dumper?
Has the "Has ILE Gone Down the Dumper?" Thread Gone Down the Dumper?
has the 'has the 'has ile gone down the dumper' thread gone down the dumper' thread gone down the dumper?

"skot and wmc are talking about me btw but thats fine."

silly paranoid android i SO wasn't talking about you. i have no problem with you. i hid polls on ilx years ago.

It would be totally disingenuous to say I don't have issues with you, AG, but I think we manage a pretty successful peaceful coexistence.

yes I like to think i do try to make up with people. I do not intend to annoy people. Most of the time I have no idea i do it. Its never intentional. Must just be an online thing.
Scott im glad about that. fwiw i like you guys.

and if anyone does have issues with me then please webmail me and im happy to talk to you about it,

I have no issues whatsoever with you, man. Just so you know :)

tell New Management i said hi

i thought you were new management

Iago I wish you would've just called out the person who offends you rather than saying "somebody in the room"
I don't recoil from anybody's posts except my own in retrospect

<3 AG, too

When I first came to ILM (IDK, 2004?), it felt like, for better or worse, a kind of inspired insurgency. Poptimism was a mission, and there was a fervor to the whole thing. ILM eventually won its coup, and since then it has been faced with the far more mundane and undesirable task of governing.

― space phwoar (Hurting 2), Friday, January 25, 2013 11:56 AM (22 minutes ago) Bookmark

plus pop music betrayed the cause by deciding to mostly suck assholes for the last *checks watch* 6 years

― turds (Hungry4Ass), Friday, 25 January 2013 17:32 (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i feel like the ORIGINAL ILX ETHOS is kind of dissipated by the time the term 'poptimism' gets coined, i don't know: the difference between 'this petey pablo single sounds like disco inferno's early EPs' and 'this taylor swift album sounds like a magic unicorn that shits rainbows'

ilx's tone of discussion has shifted (in part w/ the increasing er professionalisation of a bunch of ppl on the board) so there's a lot more emphasis on keeping up with things and less on exegesis. and 'keeping up with things' includes a lot of insider baseball talk. -- it seems like unless you're getting paid to write about hip hop then there's little point in your attempting to take part in the rolling molly thread or whatever it's called.

otm

so so otm

even the otms are otm.

ez snappin otm

i feel like the ORIGINAL ILX ETHOS is kind of dissipated by the time the term 'poptimism' gets coined, i don't know: the difference between 'this petey pablo single sounds like disco inferno's early EPs' and 'this taylor swift album sounds like a magic unicorn that shits rainbows'

ilx's tone of discussion has shifted (in part w/ the increasing er professionalisation of a bunch of ppl on the board) so there's a lot more emphasis on keeping up with things and less on exegesis. and 'keeping up with things' includes a lot of insider baseball talk. -- it seems like unless you're getting paid to write about hip hop then there's little point in your attempting to take part in the rolling molly thread or whatever it's called.

― attempt to look intentionally nerdy, awkward or (thomp), Friday, January 25, 2013 2:44 PM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark

my dude

non-pros have held held their own just fine on rolling raps, just say u feel intimidated and need ur hand held rather than inventing some horseshit projection

ok tough guy

i didn't say it was impossible to take part. i said there wasn't any point.

i used to read/post to rolling rap despite knowing nothing but its gotten more impenetrable each year imo

i couldn't hang with this feral younger generation of goons, after having my "things just ain't the same for gangstas" moment i left, got chubby and moved to miami

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LyUCy3eOvs

modern country song about rolling raps

less of a vocal britisher presence of the old old days - tom, marcello, mark s., dom, lord custos xmas number one showdowns - led to more idiots like me who took foghat really seriously? feel like that was one change among many. i honestly don't even remember what was going on here or what my problem was when i started this thread. i was just bored and cranky.

well those guys going away didn't LEAD to idiots like me. idiots like me just got more vocal in their absence? possibly? i have no idea really.

rtc's otm though. it's true there are a few posters who mostly post content but they mostly popped up in the last year or two, plenty of exegesis on rolling rap threads

custos was british? no way! hes one of yours surely!

having said that i am very grateful that u all don't post in the thread

custos was british??

xp

part of it may be that rap music itself is getting progressively weirder over time

having said that i am very grateful that u all don't post in the thread

― flopson, Friday, January 25, 2013 3:05 PM (8 seconds ago) Bookmark

We'd be grateful if you didn't post outside of it. Haha, just funnin *punches you in the armm*

sometimes i wish i could filter goon threads to only "new [x] tape is good" posts

part of it may be that rap music itself is getting progressively weirder over time

― tity boi historian (ciderpress), Friday, January 25, 2013 3:05 PM (25 seconds ago) Bookmark

*shittier

custos' humor read aloud w/a british accent *does* make a *bit* more sense

i always assumed he was british!

let's split the difference and say he was Canadian

we don't have lords in america

all those long brit top ten posts made me think that. where was he from? plus, he was a lord.

you have traci lords

ah young master custos, have you compiled yet another top ten list

[lots and lots of x-posts]

I too miss the exegeses. I've felt underwhelemed by my own presence here since I've halfheartedly "returned". It's like I can't find the stretches of time nor summon the mental reserves to really dig in deep and exegete, and I can only blame myself for that; you can't really expect exegeses if you yourself don't exegete from time to time. "Old ILM" (circa 2000/2001 when I first started reading/posting--back in my college days) felt like such a warm place, full of mentors (I suppose that was a function of being a pretty young poster). I do fully recognize that Old ILM had its fair share of sniping and pissing and stuff as well, but it somehow felt different. Like there were fewer walls up, less snark. I don't know. (Again, that may well just be my filter.) Re: poptimism and the discussion above (good post, thomp), I feel like Old ILM's "pro-pop" stance was an openness to pop, a willingness to engage with it and take it seriously, but somewhere along the line it became an "of COURSE I like pop, and I'm suspicious of those who don't" sort of stance. What once felt freeing then felt less so. I'm just throwing this out there, but the internet (for me at least) used to feel like this neat escape from actually dealing face-to-face with people all the time, and there was a wonder in bonding with folks on a board like ILM. Now that we're all on the internet and FB and stuff all the time anyway, what if that has the cumulative effect of making ILM feel a little bit like just more everyday bullshit rather than a special place?

you have traci lords

i have her album .. does that count .. .

As a non-professional (again, pretty much under a rock), I appreciate the keeping-up angle of ILM. I am pretty skeptical about the value of most exegesis of music anyway, not that it doesn't make sense to me some of the time.

I just assumed he was an anglophile american. I bet he still posts here under another name ashamed of his past.

Also I miss dj martian.

I too appreciate the keeping-up angle. That said, I don't look to exegesis for truth or revelation necessarily, I look to it because it makes me feel some sort of a connection to another human mind beyond just "you should check this out"...

Also I miss dj martian.

totally.

I started posting on here way before I got to grips with a two decade run of alcoholism and hard substance abuse so I can't really complain if people think of me/talk to me like I'm an asshat. However there's a poster who never misses an op to try and paint me as a misogynist which is genuinely really upsetting and usually ends with me not coming here for a few months. Also, my site is very important to me, so I take criticism of it to heart. I should grow a thicker skin. That said, there are a couple of posters who do it so often that I can't help thinking of them as mean spirited. But the bottom line is it's my fault if I can't help but take it personally.

ILX is much, much friendlier than it used to be. I took part in the last hip hop albums poll which would have been unthinkable a few years earlier.

ilx is a much better place with you doran

ILM is kinda ROCKING these days! wooooo!

Yeah, gotta say I have been getting turned onto a lotta great stuff these days through ILM, and I come here primarily cause the stuff popping up is coming from general enthusiasm most of the time. Doesn't really get old for me.

Also, my site is very important to me

despite having had little involvement in recent times, me too ..

It's hard to convincingly prosletyse when ILX is full of such great writing that seems so casual and easily-formed, it can be intimidating trying to discuss something that someone else has managed to examine and evaluate fully in a few sentences.

and if anyone does have issues with me then please webmail me and im happy to talk to you about it,

― pfunkboy (Algerian Goalkeeper), Friday, January 25, 2013 1:59 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lol on the occasions when you have gotten on my nerves i can't imagine a less appetizing prospect than "e-mail exchange with Algerian Goalkeeper"

tbf al we've never really had a falling out or fight though.

yeah it's never been too bad. but i feel like when you get on people's bad sides, it's from earnestly talking their ear off, so i just imagine the reactions when you "let's take it to e-mail!"

when you say

fair point!

AG, I just wanted to tell you: the big super duper giant heavy-rock/metal poll you ran in 2010 (which I discovered last year) was hugely responsible for this continued slide into the reeking bowels of black/death/doom. I still go back and check it out somewhat regularly, and it always reads/scans differently based on knowing more records and continuing to evolve my tastes. Classic stuff. I used to hate polls--or think I did--but I can longer say that.

haha you dug the 80s one too!

I definitely did... I'm always finding new music to listen to, but it almost always seems to be new old music. I think I've heard a total of 6-7 records that came out in 2012.

there's a comprehensiveness to ilm these days that's amazing. the golden years were great but were a fairly narrow slice.

non-pros have held held their own just fine on rolling raps, just say u feel intimidated and need ur hand held rather than inventing some horseshit projection

^^^ this sort of internet hardman vibe - which isn't really that widespread on ilm, but is more in evidence than it used to be - is exactly what people mean when they say ilm sucks more than it used to, I think. it contributes nothing of any value to the conversation; it impresses no-one; it's worthless. I was a kid once too though so whatever, people outgrow this shit eventually.

ILM is kinda sucking my dick these days.

Yours truly,
Internet Hardman

bring back mark c

Is the not-using-a-question-mark-when-asking-a-question thing an Internet Hardman Behavior?

or just laziness

Would you prefer...................excess punctuation?????

(Yes, I really have nothing better to do that I'm up to doing at the moment.)

i think people do it in imitation of tone of voice?

or do you have an example in mind

Yeah, that!

Scott's earlier-today angst is funny. Taking Foghat more seriously is one of the best things that ever happened to ILM...

yeah ur right aero, the reason ilm sucks is the definitely lack of precious civility and not at all the guy apparently saying that there's too much expertise being put in front of him on a silver platter to contribute and that lower standards would be more inclusive

i'm not a hardman i'm a bitterly fed-up man

i am an unattractive man i believe my liver is diseased

notes from drownedinsound

how the fuck do you know about drownedinsound

he's had expertise put in front of him

Rtc why are you so mad?

I guess there's less snark for the sake of snark these days than in the 2008/9 I will cut your face years but who gives a shit really.

why cant we get some sort of external great firewall to prevent auslanders accessing nationally sensitive material like drownedinsound

higher standard = youtube on a silver platter

when a pro posts a youtube, the critical assessment of said youtube is impprinted. if you can't sense the evanescent exegesis of the professional youtube post, you need to gtfo

drownedinsound is the only site i hear about more irl than online

Rtc why are you so mad?

― mh (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Friday, 25 January 2013 23:53 (Yesterday) Bookmark

idk bruh i guess i have to shamefully admit i like music and talking about it and stuff? "it seems like unless you're getting paid to write about hip hop then there's little point in your attempting to take part in the rolling molly thread or whatever it's called" is just an abysmally feeble attitude imo, what more can i say

voila:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60-BN9KMc_E

that's expert youtubeship right there. don't try that at home. it could get ugly.

I like talking about music too

scott, I must admit that the historical context summarized within the imprinted exegesis of your single youtube post strengthened your overall argument for the importance of light in Ironhorse's lyrics. expert indeed.

Drownedinsound had me for a while but it's impossible to not grow mortally sick of it

is that whineys site

lol

Following on from something that someone posted somewhere upthread: I think people can take the quality of writing on ILM for granted, maybe because it's a casual place, but a quick glance at somewhere like DiS will show that concepts like "going down the shitter" are relative in the extreme.

ilx's tone of discussion has shifted (in part w/ the increasing er professionalisation of a bunch of ppl on the board) so there's a lot more emphasis on keeping up with things and less on exegesis.

ILM always has never ceased to be a place on which to post as to whether you liked what you were just listening to. Not even answering why, though that helps. And then people might keep on your toes but surely that's the best bit?

If anything ILM is better because of polls (no stay with me on this), how the right poll one can help to put a lot of history together neatly. It was great listening to bobbins over Xmas after not paying much attention for a few years. I feel I can get to really good bits of things I only pay attention to part of the time quickly.

the state of the union is strong imo

If anything ILM is better because of polls (no stay with me on this),

man you think you know a guy and then he stabs you in the back

all i know is:

You have posted 58,187 messages

You wanna know how to get Capone? They pull a knife, you pull a gun. He sends one of yours to the hospital, you send one of his to the morgue. *That's* the *Chicago* ILM way! And that's how you get Capone. Now do you want to do that? Are you ready to do that? I'm offering you a deal. Do you want this deal?

Everyone mostly otm. I lurked ILM for years before I ever posted, and when it was, it wasn't often before I became a regular on ILE and the other boards and started only glancing at ILM.

The best parts of ILM were the deep-digs into musical influence and contextualizing music in its present and its influence.

The sniping and sarcasm kept it from being cuddlestein livejournal. Maybe the regulars don't post personal accounts of music as much because we have outlets for relating personal experience detached from music.

My tastes aren't making me pick up as wide of a selection these days, maybe because I don't feel as enthusiastic about pop music. It doesn't mean I don't listen to pop radio or loop up a bunch of youtube stuff, but I'm confident in where it is and don't need that context. Kind of turns me off to read about it, actually.

I know I've clowned a few people for Tuomas-style "I don't know who that is" statements, but more for the fact that you can find out /who/ someone is really easily in 2013, and then you can come to ILM or wherever for /why/ they are worth listening to or how they relate culturally. I can't go to wikipedia, see that Artist A is influence by Artist B (which I do know) and know what they're like, but I can come to ILM still and trust that I can say "Hey, I don't know much about A, I'm a fan of B, where do I start?" and feel like I'd still get some feedback. Well, if anyone's paying attention.

I should really just listen to whatever scott says. Life would probably be better.

hey, what's up ilm is pretty cool every1 should just <3 one another peace love the gap

I am hoping beyond hope that I'm not Iago's bad and hated poster

i feel like the ORIGINAL ILX ETHOS is kind of dissipated by the time the term 'poptimism' gets coined, i don't know: the difference between 'this petey pablo single sounds like disco inferno's early EPs' and 'this taylor swift album sounds like a magic unicorn that shits rainbows'

ilx's tone of discussion has shifted (in part w/ the increasing er professionalisation of a bunch of ppl on the board) so there's a lot more emphasis on keeping up with things and less on exegesis. and 'keeping up with things' includes a lot of insider baseball talk. -- it seems like unless you're getting paid to write about hip hop then there's little point in your attempting to take part in the rolling molly thread or whatever it's called.

― attempt to look intentionally nerdy, awkward or (thomp), Friday, January 25, 2013 7:44 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

otm

― the late great, Friday, January 25, 2013 7:46 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

so so otm

― the late great, Friday, January 25, 2013 7:46 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

god, so otm it hurts.

I don't feel like ilm has changed THAT much in twelve years but maybe it's just that I haven't changed that much.

as a general meta point, of course ilm has changed, of course it changes and continues to change. this attitude that some people have like "people said it was shit 5 years ago and look at us now, still postin'!" is some "best of all possible worlds" nonsense. if you think that then why even bother posting on a meta thread?

relevant xpost!

too much expertise being put in front of him

I am generally a big fan of rtc's contributions but it's precisely this attitude that bothers me about ILM at the moment. the sanctity of subjectivity used to be a big deal here and it isn't anymore.

As a place to talk records it has remained the same. And ok there are other parts of ILM as it might have been conceived that have faded but essentially the basic thing has remained with ways to deliver that discussion changing at times (via the dreaded by some polls, say). xp

As a place to talk records it has remained the same.

yes it still has buttons and boxes you type in.

we still communicate using symbols that we call "letters".

any analysis beyond that isn't even worth expending precious letters on.

Boxes to type in is enough though. it basically comes down to that.

letters form words and we have other symbols to punctuate them like commas to mirror breathing and pauses when we talk.

anyway you can flip or deflate "too much expertise" to say hey there are people who care about what they are talking about. Maybe too much at times but isn't that a positive.

there's not much point discussing this when your pov seems to be that the place would always be the same regardless of anything or anyone posting in it.

what an endorsement

ILM as a place to discuss a real actual range of musics with 'popular' at its centre (the key thing) hasn't changed so you get posters who like lots and are open to liking lots of other things too. you simultaneously see people who like and know a thing in detail and others who want to find out more and post er somewhat more naively perhaps but I don't see lots of shutting out. Don't get how they're cutting subjectivity?

Couple of other msg boards I've seen over the years don't have anything like ILM has, as in lots of experts who congregate on one thing (bcz the board was designed for that).