The new Kanye album: 808s & Heartbreak

supposedly this is the cdq version of "love lockdown"

http://www.zshare.net/audio/185463400d4d711d/

and if it is its considerably worse than the version he did at the vmas

actually the outro is really rad but it was much better @ the vmas when his voice was way more prominent

Huh, I kinda saw him going in that direction after "Put On", but not that far along. I'll prob get shit for this comparison, but it reminds of old creepy, minimalist Nina Simone joints. It's not a hit, but I'm sure he'll have the massive pop joint to follow it up. On the balance, I definitely feel this tho.

(this doesn't sound anywhere cdq btw)

"creepy" isn't really the word I'm looking for..."harrowing" maybe?

in terms of the rock music he's always big upping in interviews, it doesn't sound like the killers, maybe like coldplay but i haven't heard their new album at all, def reminds me of ballads on the last tv on the radio album esp in the outro. dunno. i think its a good look and i won't be mad if the new album sucks since he put out an honest and good rap album only a year ago, but he definitely thinks out his albums well enough that this one could end up being really good.

I don't really hear any of that stuff. I need to mention how glad I am he's not calling this A Good-Ass Job. That would have been one of the worst album titles ever.

this makes me think of phil collins

^

this is weird.

BE KANYE FOR A DAY TAKE THIS BILL YOU SHURNKEN PRUNE FACE IMPOTENT MIDDLE MANAGER. YOU'RE NOW A VIRLE BLACK MAN WITH A CHIN THE SIZE OF MONT RUSHMORE

Yeah...I wrote a Kanye think piece back in May after I saw the Glow in the Dark Tour that jumped off of my impression that he really REALLY wants to transcend rap and just be a balls out insane pop star/icon. This is interesting, but not unexpected.

I wouldn't expect the whole album to be like this...remember, Can't Tell Me Nothing was the lead single off Graduation and that was initially received with a collective "huh?"

I'm still kinda amazed he's putting out an album SO SOON after his mother died.

ruh-roh:

http://www.pitchforkmedia.com/article/news/145449-kanye-west-arrested-for-assaulting-photog-cameraman

Kanye Guðmundsdóttir

aint no police man

also, there's no way thats the final version of that song you gotta be kidding me

yeah idk how kanye feels about free music or whatever but i find it dubious that he'd put the first single off his new album up on his blog, not to mention that the vocals just sound demoed

yeah, it sounds like he recorded the song, then changed/improved the vocal by the VMA performance, but kept the inferior old scratch vocal.

you just know when this underwritten T-Pain knockoff flops, he's gonna crow that it was too "creative" or "original" for radio.

many kanye hulked the fuck out on that photog

man**

before i read the story i thought it was gonna be drugs or something which wouldve sucked since he's obviously a really depressed dude

the chorus has the same melody as the main synth line from "pac jam"

i get the piano line stuck in my head and then it morphs into the loop from "homecoming" which i kind of hate

i think this song is pretty great though

I don't really know how you can call this a t-pain knockoff. other than the autotuner, it doesn't sound like t-pain (or really any modern r&b) at all. Sounds more like a spiritual or something

sorry "any modern r&b" is a stretch, make that "any modern r&b that gets played on mainstream radio"

granted, i mean mainly the use of autotune, which i don't think he's really progressed using in a trendy/novelty way yet. and i totally wouldn't have been surprised if T-Pain came out with this song, at least as an album track.

my main point was his idea of "being different" still usually involves biting another popular artist's style.

"still usually"??

anyway, since he is a rapper this song is still "different" and he's not ripping off those drums or the outro from any other rap/r&b artist

he shouldn't have leaked this. so un-kanye. the live version was incredible, I thought.

i'm in love with it, but the vibe is wrong

why? he's been putting out basically depressing shit like this all year. even his verse on "swagger like us" is kind of like a dirge

no. i mean it's un-kanye to let out something that's not PERFECT.

oh

"diamonds" and "can't tell me nothing" aren't perfect, esp as far as first songs from highly anticipated albums go

he should have let the live version exist for a little while as the sole entity of "love lockdown" to let the excitement build up. people were loving just the live version and it sounded great. I think you're on the right track and he's depressed b/c the these two things are troubling coming from a guy who should know way better than to get in a paparazzi throwdown and who is normally meticulous with his music. I mean, when has he ever been this hasty? dude released a fuckin snippet of "Can't Tell Me Nothing" and a preview of his pre-album mixtape!!!! and trailers for all his videos, etc...this is just another trailer but people are treating it like it's a real song hopefully it isn't

right, but he deemed them perfect enough. I don't mean it as a critical judgment

maybe you're right

the fact that he wrote and released this within 2 1/2 weeks is kind of troubling since his last three albums seem to have so much thought behind them, but i also doubt that this thing is actually gonna come out on dec 16

as for hastily putting this out, maybe he's just copycatting a trend that's running through the biz now? he did say it was his favorite song that he's ever written and maybe he just wants to capitalize on "put on" and "swagger like us" though he wouldn't even need to. not sure what his motivation is for putting it out so hastily. maybe there isn't anything more than he just really loves the song and wants people to hear it.

then again maybe he is in a fragile mind state~~

so un-kanye.

not really at all. the melancholy auto-tune singing from his verse from "put on" + his long-standing love of gospel piano = ??

: ( I still haven't heard the live version

what's the deal with this place looking all different????

http://www.dailymotion.com/relevance/search/kanye%2Bwest/video/x6oujo_vma08-kanye-west-live-at-the-2008-v_shortfilms

u can change it back to old stylee in prefs

xp: This is ILX 3.0, homeboy.

i'm rolling old school

also the studio version totally takes away the arena-scale epic style that the live version had. i've still listened to it on loop for the past 30 mins though

I'd like to point out that zero of the first singles from Kanye's albums have been obvious pop hits.

http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.tmz.com/media/2008/09/0911_kjanye_tmz_video.jpg

I wouldn't expect the whole album to be like this...remember, Can't Tell Me Nothing was the lead single off Graduation and that was initially received with a collective "huh?"

I definitely remember this....the weird thing is that

• it's now one of my favorite songs on an album I love
• I can't figure out how I would have thought it was out of left-field AT ALL

Why hyphenate left field?

Anyway I definitely hear the 'demo vocals' thing, especially on the chorus--it's somehow out of tune through the autotune.

I wouldn't expect the whole album to be like this...remember, Can't Tell Me Nothing was the lead single off Graduation and that was initially received with a collective "huh?"

I definitely remember this....the weird thing is that
it's now one of my favorite songs on an album I love
I can't figure out how I would have thought it was out of left-field AT ALL

Suggest Ban Permalink
― Doghouse O RLY (G00blar), Thursday, September 11, 2008 2:07 PM Bookmark

^^that otm shit

it reminds of old creepy, minimalist Nina Simone joints

omg this is actually right. this...this has no business being right! but it is. i was trying to imagine a "proper" singer doing 'love lockdown' and i couldn't actually think of anyone who'd be as mesmerising as kanye was at the VMAs (lloyd too wispy, ne-yo too understated...maybe usher, i was thinking, he could get that hysteria) but i would pay real money to bring nina back to life and hear her sing this.

'studio' version, or whatever it is, sucks. totally flat, no intensity. i wonder how many singing lessons kanye's been having?

the live version has a better vocal, but I still love the studio version

At the time of its release "Can't Tell Me Nothing" wasn't so much 'left field' as "Oh, look, Kanye got with Toomp and made his own generic T.I./Jeezy song," i.e. another example of him biting someone you might not expect him to in the name of creativity.

also part of the reason I don't like this shit is that I thought Kanye's singing was perfectly fine in an amateurishly charming way on old songs like "Spaceship" and "Hey Mama," Autotune does really unpleasant things to his voice.

I don't have any problem w/ him using autotune, but you are right about his natural singing voice being alright. If he wants to make an entirely sung album that's cool, but an entirely autotuned album is not only probably too much, but it sounds like he's not giving himself enough credit (first time for that hahaha).

both of u otm

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3148/2692549607_f7cc9666d0.jpg

umm

what, you thought I was making that shit up before? btw, that's probably the best subway ad I've seen, aside from the MTA Lost and Found one with the cobra and prosthetic leg.

between the time i opened the link and heard the preview and the time i clicked "download this file", zshare removed the file. shame, i really liked it, and thinks it speaks well for the direction mr. west is heading with the new album. granted, i haven't heard the live version everyone's talking about.

http://www.dailymotion.com/relevance/search/kanye%2Bwest/video/x6oujo_vma08-kanye-west-live-at-the-2008-v_shortfilms

Suggest Ban Permalink
― its sad he was a ringtone poster (J0rdan S.), Thursday, September 11, 2008 1:37 PM Bookmark

It's a great single, but not a great Kanye single.

I almost wish he wrote/produced it for someone else, someone with a more assured vocal: like Ne-Yo or Timberlake or something. It's a weird mix of amazing production and vocals about as good as something on Merge records or Arts& Crafts. It sounds like Blue Man Group. I'll still totally listen to a whole album of this, though. Go Kanye go!

I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be contrary, but I absolutely love the recorded version of this. I just watched the VMA version online and I think it lost something completely - surely his distant, wasted vocals are what makes the song? The live one just seemed a bit shouty - all the subtlety of it was lost. Either way, having though that I'd taken about all the Kanye I could suffer, his recent Put On verse and this are making me think that I might be about ready to listen to a new Kanye album.

I was going to throw this into the Carter 3 thread, but I might ask here whilst I'm at it. I've got to admit I have no clue about r'n'b whatsoever, but I absolutely love this, and the completely tripped out Weezy stuff too (Me & My Drank especially - also Pussy Money Weed, I Feel Like Dying, Prostitute Fling). Could someone give me some tips on other stuff I should check out along those lines, and any other Wayne songs I might be missing in that style?

radio mix apparently adds a 4x4 and claps

Newly recorded version of Love Lockdown is up on Kanyeezy's site. I'm still absolutely loving this song. I keep thinking of Rhythm of the Saints/Paul Simon during the outro. No bad thing.

http://www.kanyeuniversecity.com/blog/?em3106=206428_-1__0_~0_-1_5_2008_0_0&em3161=&em3281=

such a jam

everything is better on this verrrrrsion

"For bulk orders of Thank You and You’re Welcome!, please e-mail your request and quantity needed to t✧✧✧@wethink✧✧✧.c✧✧.

Thank You And You're Welcome!
Kanye West, J. Sakiya Sandifer
ISBN 978-0-9789679-1-8

Kanye West teams up with co- author J. Sakiya Sandifer to make his literary debut with Thank You And You're Welcome!, an entertaining volume of "Kanye-isms "-- the creative, humorous and insightful philosophies and anecdotes used in creating his path to success. It captures the same wit, playful irony, and piercing insight found abundant in his lyrics.

In Thank You And You're Welcome! Kanye delivers his personal message uncensored, without any five-second delay or media distortion.

"My book is a guide to creating then celebrating your moment!" says Kanye.

holy shit @ the drums on this

that book is the stupidest piece of shit i've ever seen. this song fucking rules....i'm feeling this i've probably listened to it 30 times

Thank you for the insight, Artist Formerly Known as Preview of the Matrix XII.

Song link on Kanye's blog seems to be dead now.

its all over the place elsewhere, tho

http://www.kanyeuniversecity.com/client_images/kanyewest/3106_3ae4b2eac234124f5b0b8066db1e2e40.png

I CHANGED MY ALBUM TO NOVEMBER SOMETHING CAUSE I FINISHED THE ALBUM AND I FELT LIKE IT.. I WANT YALL TO HEAR IT AS SOON AS POSSIBLE

There needs to be a 'musicians photographed in studio crouching over gear looking intensely at something' thread. (Other recent candidates would include Trent Reznor.)

i just ran out and bought a case of GURU

what is that blue thing on top of the ensoniq? is it made by IOMEGA?

holy shit the drums

yes

sooooooooooo when is this track gonna be out cuz I don't think I can handle waiting

already on iTunes

yeah thanks, talkin bout the one with Jeezy, you know, like in the picture!!!!!

what's the over/under on amount of autotune used on this song?? will jeezy go autotune or will it be just kanye??? I mean there's def. gonna be a lot of it on the album

uhh... that could be from when were working on "Put On"

that'd be silly since it's from a post about the new Kanye album. but anyway why would anyone be holding their breath in suspense about a collaboration between 2 guys who've collaborated several times before?

i agree w/ al in theory, like, most of this 'creativity' is an extension of overhype that goes to every dude like this (andre 3000 disease, basically) where they adapt something established by someone else but in their hands it becomes all pomo-acceptable since it didnt start as something loved only by teenagers a la t-pain or whatever - but i dont think that makes it bad, and his twist on it is here, and it is what it is. im not enamored of this kind of stuff but it seems like hating on it is beside the point. im into niches almost inherently at this pt, unless the crowd-pleasing is closer to 'pandering' than 'experimental mainstream'

yeah...I mean how hardline I am on that position really depends on what the album turns out to be like. Graduation was by no means bad, but I thought his turn towards dancey synth stuff and bland "universal" stadium rock lyrics wasn't really a great direction for him as far as the quality of his music, so if this just keeps going that way I'm gonna be bummed out. I'm sure it'll be more interesting than 10 autotune ballads, I'm just still uneasy with the possibility of there being, well, more than 1.

yah its kind of hard to tell, his career has so much momentum at this pt though i wouldnt be surprised if this became a pretty modest hit - his name recognition is pretty much coldplay levels or higher, this situation reminds me of ppl predicting that lollipop was a bomb and it dominated the summer

but anyway why would anyone be holding their breath in suspense about a collaboration between 2 guys who've collaborated several times before?

sorry dude but this is really stupid. should I not have been anticipating the new clipse cuz they already worked with neptunes on their first LP? or a new Bowie record with songs co-written by Brian Eno after one album just because they collaborated before? I don't understand this.

Jeezy + Kanye = great music (so far)

what's not to look forward to?

also kanye's creativity is at an all-time high right now and Jeezy is arguably the most relevant rapper after you know who (perhaps even more so) and he's willing to do some really ambitious things musically right now.

Graduation was by no means bad, but I thought his turn towards dancey synth stuff and bland "universal" stadium rock lyrics wasn't really a great direction for him as far as the quality of his music, so if this just keeps going that way I'm gonna be bummed out. I'm sure it'll be more interesting than 10 autotune ballads, I'm just still uneasy with the possibility of there being, well, more than 1.

i agree with this. graduation is not that great looking back, and I think he clearly feels that it didn't live up to his own ambitions and that's why he wrote and recorded a new one in such a ridiculously quick period. but thinking that it's gonna be an album of 10 autotune ballads is a little cynical and seeing jeezy there got me hyped a little because it shows he may have some pretty interesting idea of what his newest album should sound like outside of just mediocre singing and autotune

jeezy x kanye makes no sense as something to be excited about

jeezy is best over atl-style trapper anthems w/ creeping recession-themed insecurity seeping into the normal triumphalism

kanye is a creative art school kid-style wacko who wants to do big beat version 2.0

I just said I know it won't be 10 autotune ballads and I'm not actually that cynical.

xpost - yeah, I like "Put On" and Jeezy in general, but they don't strike me as a really inspired pairing with any degree of chemistry, just two famous guys who occasionally get together to Venn Diagram their respective fanbases.

i mean, 'put on' is the bomb but its not really bcuz of some crazy creative confluence of talents between the 2 rappers

al otm re: venn diagram

i am in disagreement here. but totally futile so just yeah.

there are soooooo many "venn diagram" half assed phoned-in tracks out there(see: slu, pretty much anything with Wayne or jayz on it) and of all the hit collabs of recent months/ years "put on" is one of the most synergistic and genuinely creative.

what is kanye adding to that song? its a dope song cuz the beat is hard as fuck, the hook is dope, jeezy sounds energetic on it. hearing kanye on autotune is almost an afterthought, 'synergy' is appropriate only in the most cynical marketing audience venn diagram style

and i mean i like kanye's verse fine, it just doesnt really 'make' the song or anything

i mean synergy as in, two guys sitting in the studio and coming up with an idea for an original track. not synergy like oh how fantastic would it be if we got kanye on jeezy's first single.

like, see how they're sitting there together in that picture. kanye's verse for put on wasn't emailed to Jeezy's manager and then forwarded to an engineer at the studio...

whatever. you said "the bomb"

the truth bomb

um the kanye verse does make "put on" a classic and not just another jeezy single

my view on the potential non-rapness of this album is that it looks like kanye is setting himself up as rap's first classic rock artist. looking back on bowie's career or neil young's or lennon's, they all have departures like this amongst their discography, and i think this is a purposeful thing by kanye. and to be honest, i think it's kind of refreshing that kanye's deciding to move beyond in a way that is atypical of when rappers say that they are moving beyond rap (i.e. bullshit like a crunk rock album or by making a clothing line or whatever). this album is in the realm of something that could end up being really good from him, and even if it's not good it will certainly be interesting and when we look back on his 10 albums or whatever i think we'll be able to appreciate it as an inspired artistic departure

wjatever kanye is better tha jayz these days but he still was gay and still sux dick plus he's positive in negative times plus he doesnt know anything rreallyl r4elelvelant i heard except jesus walks was amazing the nigger was a human being who was black

While we're all talking about the predictability of Kanye's genre-fuckery, non-rapness, etc....

I wrote a thinkpiece on this facet of Kanye after I saw Glow in the Dark back in May or June, and promptly forgot about it until this whole 808s+Heartbreak thing started. In light of this, it's probably due for some substantial revision, but I figured I'd throw it into the general discussion.

i dont have the time to read this just now but ill def get to it

"Put On" isn't great/interesting because of synergy between Jeezy and Ye. As stated earlier, there really isn't any. It's great because they both take the same template and run in completely different directions with it.

deej otm all over this bitch btw

err, not really, just his first couple posts

"Put On" isn't great/interesting because of synergy between Jeezy and Ye. As stated earlier, there really isn't any. It's great because they both take the same template and run in completely different directions with it.

― Darryl Strawberry (The Reverend), Thursday, September 25, 2008 12:39 AM (36 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

^^ yes.

Heard "Love Lockdown" on commercial radio today. The presenters were a bit "WTF" but then they were like that when "Gimme More" came out too so I don't know if that means anything.

I love "Put On" but agree with deej/al - though I do like Kanye's verse.

this song is awful u guys

i can see myself liking it like i like "drunk and hot girls" in the context of an album maybe but whoever said way underwritten way otm

I like the circular nature of the lyrics.

I just tried to download it to work out what I think of it, but got what turns out to be the Blestenation remix of Ladytron's "Ghosts" instead. i like to think someone thought that listeners would just accept that it's the new kanye track.

my view on the potential non-rapness of this album is that it looks like kanye is setting himself up as rap's first classic rock artist.

This is so ridiculously wrong I don't even know where to begin.

To be quick, there is no "classic rock" canon in hip-hop and there never will be such a thing. Hip-hop is not rock, and even if Kanye bends the rules on this album a bit more, he's still going to be a hip-hop artist and have nothing to do with classic rock. There is already a classic hip-hop canon. See for starters Run DMC, Eric B and Rakim, Public Enemy, EPMD, A Tribe Called Quest, De La Soul, Gang Starr, Nas, Jay-Z, etc. All of these artists are classic beyond a doubt, and not one of them is going to cross over into the classic fucking rock canon, thank goodness. And Kanye is no different, despite his mainstream appeal. In retrospect he will just fall into the hip-hop canon. Nothing more, nothing less.

love this song, best thing i've heard all year

ilxor J0 was not suggesting Kanye was picking up a guitar and running through "Black Dog," and to act like he was is a little disingenuous. Graduation and to a further extent this new single are borrowing the scope and (arguably) unearned drama of classic arena rock and applying it to a rap context.

Am I getting you right Sarge? Correct me if I'm wrong.

kind of, but i don't even mean it in rock sounds. more of like, at the height of his popularity, bowie went off to germany to make music that didn't sound like anything he had ever made. neil young (i think) had the infamous fight with his label about making music that was a departure from his sound. no one in rap has ever made a non-rap album at the height of their popularity, and if you look at rap's canonical album artists (pac, jay, nas, ugk etc) none of them have a non-rap album in their discography. i think what kanye is doing (intentionally or unintentionally) is very much of a classic rock mentality in the sense of being really popular and making an "experimental" album. i mean maybe you can compare it to run dmc putting out "walk this way" as a single off their third album but that doens't seem to exactly stick either.

"Love Lockdown" is the best piece of pop I've heard since "Umbrella" or maybe "Piece of Me". I have no idea if it'll break big, but I've been singing it pretty much nonstop for five days now (albeit asking filling in all kinds of strange and generally lewd things for "love").

add me to list of people who love "LLd"

http://i8.tinypic.com/53fbyw6.jpg

happy birthday btw

J0rdan, since when is it the "classic rock mentality" to make an experimental album at the height of popularity? That's where my problem lies with your analysis. Perhaps we are going by different definitions of classic rock? When I think classic rock I certainly don't think Bowie, I think Stones, Who, Zep, Floyd, Doors... but not Bowie.

ok well maybe my terminology is off but u get the point

Either way, it's not something conventionally done in rap music. xp

The debut followed by the sophomore slump followed by the return to form followed by the experimental album is the standard rock arc, isn't it?

Maybe so in the Pitchfork era. The first album is rated too high due to hype, the second is rated too low due to backlash, the third is hailed as a return to form because the backlash has subsided, and the "experimental" fourth album is almost never too challenging, but maybe a slight departure in sound.

As far as rock music pre '00s is concerned... not seeing it, Hoos.

can't believe no one has commented on the song from the studio video with GLC and (Im almost positive) jon brion.... It sounds great and is nothing like "LLd" and way more like LR era GOOD music kanye. starting to think that graduation may seem like a misstep looking back a few years from now...not comercially obviously.

i saw ppl saying that song was from 808s but also saw ppl saying it was from glc's album

ive said this elsewhere but late registration imo is his most uneven album but also his artistic masterpiece

kanye working on glc's album in the middle of his own album's creation

ive said this elsewhere but late registration imo is his most awful album

I don't really like any of his albums front-to-back but Late Reg is the closest he comes to front-to-back goodness IMO. Plus it has my fave song by him "Crack Music"

3.5 good songs on that there album but whatever

haha the number one thing i don't want to do tonight is get into this debate again

I think my main problems with it may be the overall sound. Where Dropout sounds warm and Graduation sounds glossy, LR sounds astringent.

problems

It sounds like a bad cocaine album.

or maybe it's kanye's tusk?

i just think that even though LR is plagued by having peaks and valleys akin to jumping off everest and landing in death valley, it's his most nuanced and cinematic album. i like tons of songs on graduation but it just isn't that interesting to me. i appreciate the glossy, stadium-ready aesthetic but it's just not as interesting to listen to over the long-terms as shit on late reg that is even just pretty good like "hey mama". and that doesnt even touch on the shit on there that is classic like "gone", "crack music" and "we major"

i also love the cinematic shit on dropout like "get em high", "two words", "never let me down" etc etc. there just aren't songs as epic on graduation imo

Graduation is more of a piece to me. The epicness isn't really song by song, but how they all fit together. I love Dropout, but wouldn't really describe it in those terms. That's more of a sheer number of dope songs (even if they don't all quite fit together) type album.

I just don't get what people see in most of the songs on LR, it's like, of those songs you listed, "Crack Music" and "Gone" are alright at best, but kind of stilted. "We Major" is some Vegas-sounding bullshit. "Hey Mama" is unbearably twee.

"We Major" is some Vegas-sounding bullshit.

we view this album the same way just i think kanye doing vegas is dope as fuck

haha to each his own then

the drive slow video is kanye, paul wall, glc and tip driving around vegas in dark tinted cars and the whole video is basically showing the reflections of the lights off their glasses and the windows. so awesome.

Can I ask about something weird (maybe a mastering mistake?) that's bugged me ever since LR came out. There's this one random note somewhere in the second half of "Roses" that is way louder than anything else in the song. Am I the only one who's noticed this?

xp: "Drive Slow" is awesome in general. I might say that's Kanye's best verse ever.

haha i've never made it to the second half of roses so i can't help u

might be paul wall's best verse ever too

i think my fav ye verse of all time is the second verse of "gone"

Houston >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Vegas haha

the production aesthetic on Kanye's albums tends to be different enough that I could see that coming down to personal taste. but Late Registration was definitely his peak as a rapper, I can't imagine him writing a verse like the ones on "Diamonds" (or even "Gone" or "Drive Slow") today.

at least not without a punchline involving bodily fluids

Late Registration was definitely his technical height as a rapper and took his production in a direction that was interesting and expansive while still warm and Kanye-ish. Graduation's stadium synths seemed kind of bandwagon hopping and although they're glorious, they put Kanye at a remove. Part of his charm for me has always been his proximity, openness, whatever. Details not platitudes.

However, College Dropout's still probably my favourite Kanye album -- the classics are there and it's goofy, self-aware and fun. Late Registration has a few awful moments (Bring Me Down, Celebration) and some songs are overlong (the We Major SECOND outro?), plus when it tries for Family Business sentimental, it hits Hey Mama/Roses maudlin. That said, LR can be cut down/edited to a skitless 15 tracks that's easily his strongest artistic statement musically/thematically/lyrically and clocks in at just under an hour.

the second outro on We Major is the best part!

^agree

also, whoever said that was gonna be a GLC track was right and that sucks

ELLEN EXCLUSIVE

yah its kind of hard to tell, his career has so much momentum at this pt though i wouldnt be surprised if this became a pretty modest hit - his name recognition is pretty much coldplay levels or higher, this situation reminds me of ppl predicting that lollipop was a bomb and it dominated the summer

― deej, Wednesday, September 24, 2008 3:15 PM (1 week ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

deej otm, this has 'hit' written all over it

yah i mean the ellen premiere kinda tells you all you need to know there

I guess...this song somehow sounds even worse to me in the context of a radio mix than just playing it cold off a website. The piano sounds like a cheap MIDI up against the distorted vocals and stylized percussion. I know it's already a hit in many senses, but can anyone seeing it having the R&B radio legs of other sangin' rapper songs like "Lollipop" or even Diddy's "Last Night"? Is it a pop radio smash on the level of "Gold Digger"? I know I was way off to say it would outright flop, but this seems like the kind of song that people will quickly forget when a better single or album track comes along.

Miami Vice meets The Lion King.

i think hoos was otm that it will remind ppl of phil collins

yeah but honestly that's an insult to Phil

true come on phil would bury this as an album track

fwiw i think he has a good shot of selling 1 million+ his first week out

i love that video

i seriously just want ellen to jump up on her couch and be like

THIS A WORLD PREMIERE
WE THE BEST
WHO
WOMEN'S ENTERTAINMENT
WE

i seriously just want ellen to jump up on her couch and be like off a bridge and into the ocean after being pulled over by two hating cops

lmbo @ u btw

never gets old

http://i34.tinypic.com/opwdph.png

i doubt kanye is making a direct reference to american psycho but this shit looks eerily like patrick bateman's apt

http://i35.tinypic.com/xfumvt.png

http://i35.tinypic.com/2zin5gy.png

that was the first thing i thought of

or at least that whole pristine outside/empty outside yuppie aesthetic in a more general sense.

*empty inside

hmmm maybe but it would be pretty lol of kanye to be jocking tv on the radio and justice as soon as last year and now be making a STATEMENT about that culture

more likely that he is clumsily trying to portray himself as an AMERICAN PSYCHO but rarely does kanye make statements but not make them totally bald-faced

tv on the radio and justice aren't yuppies though? i mean this is more, well, phil collins isn't it

haha if he's actually making a direct reference to his song sounding like phil collins by modeling the room in his video after american psycho kanye needs to be admitted into a mental facility immediately. it would also be my most favorite thing of all time

but yeah i see what you're saying. then again kanye also jocks coldplay and keane which are pretty yuppy music i guess? i don't even know what yuppie music is now.

you are probably right about the pristine outside/empty inside thing though if anything he's probably just referring to himself

i don't think it's anything specific (except maybe american psycho), it's just that whole general 80s yuppie banker thing...do we even have yuppies in that way any more?

it makes me like the studio versh of the song a lot more though (GOD the autotune on the chorus is still a buzz-killer though...it sort of limps flaccidly into "so keep your love locked down" instead of bursting into the melody as at the VMAs)

it sort of limps flaccidly into "so keep your love locked down" instead of bursting into the melody as at the VMAs

ya i agree but i would only like love lockdown as a period piece if not for the outro which is truly awesome

good eye on the american pyscho thing, y'all:
http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1596504/20081007/west_kanye.jhtml

oh sweet

"You know at the end of the movie (that) he didn't really kill anyone. (I just liked) the clean aesthetic and the way he was all about labels. I wanted to express all of that in the video."

it's funny that bateman's materialism (which all told doesn't encompass clothing really, not at least as much as business cards or facial moisturizers) is all he really took from it. though i guess he's probably fronting about the emotional resonance for him

yeah I don't think he's really taking the perspective of a serial killer or wannabe serial killer, especially considering that the 2nd single is some "boo hoo woman you're so heartless" shit:

"I don't have a rapper's name, [but] I have really good taste and anyone who likes it probably has really good taste too."

He needs to write a second book just to include that one.

"I wanted to come up with a theory that applies to my life in 2008, not someone else's thousands of years ago. I wanted to make a book for non-readers, like myself," he said. "I only read when necessary, so me and my friend designed this book."

oh, kanyepaws

kanye is a genius and that video is brilliant

that quote re. books hurts my head. We are now "designing" books? kanye OTM, I guess

ok i have now begun to find all the silly shit kanye says totally amazing.

i also find him somewhat attractive in the 'love lockdown' video, mainly because of the american psycho association :/

'saight

peeq23 (6 minutes ago) Show Hide 0 Marked as spam Reply when I first heard 'Put On' i was like oh no Kanye is doing the T-Pain thing too!? Now I hear the whole new album is gonna be like that. I miss the old Kanye with the soul beats, it's gonna be a #1 album still cuz it's Kanye but I just wish he woulda lost the T-Pain voice with some soul beats..damn Kanye :(

ehhhh

like this one better

this song really doesn't reassure me that Kanye isn't too infantile and emotionally stunted to make a breakup album that's not all whiny, petty bullshit that'll ultimately make me feel sorry for the ex that put up with him for so long.

yeah lost his soul to a woman so heartless is kinda :-/. it's typical ye narcissism, but it's the gross flipside of the euphoric fun "i'm the best there ever was" kinda stuff. on the other end it mutates gross solipsism.

mutates INTO gross solipsism

I like the 1993 euro vibe I'm getting from all these new songs.

so is he going to rap at all on this new album?

ok i've just seen on pitchfork that it's pretty much all singing. and has a quote from the fader where they compare it to indie music. man how much does the fader love doing that??

i like the "heartless" beat

keyboard riff sounds like the next episode or something

^^ apparently that's from a song he did w/ Sophia Fresh prod. by T-Pain, not something from 808s & Heartbreak.

I kind of hate "Heartless," not so sure about "Coldest Winter" yet. wiki says that there's a song that samples Rilo Kiley, which is funny considering there was that whole thing a minute ago about Kanye playing songs for Jenny Lewis in an airport but not knowing who she was.

i heard this today! he actually unbelievably pulls it off. it's a great album.

"Heartless" is awful

Suggest Ban Permalink

i heard this today! he actually unbelievably pulls it off. it's a great album.

― lex pretend, Thursday, October 30, 2008 12:50 PM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark

are jeezy or wayne's verses any good

jeezy's is excellent, that track is one of my favourites. it's like a reverse 'put on' - kanye does his thing over [something] piano (i cannot read my own notes), then there's this drawn-out pause and then jeezy is ushered in my disembodied howling wolves, and he raps about being born under the full moon. also rhymes podium with sodium.

no other guest verses! (which is impt, i think.) but there are two tracks which i didn't hear cuz kanye hasn't finished them yet

*by disembodied &c &c

d-_-b

weird/awesome that he fully indulged his dance influences and made a great song

Kanye West's The Postal Service

and yes i will fully endorse and d^-^b that

Kanye West's 808s & †

man every time someone hypes up a new leak from this record

http://web2.modmyprofile.com/mmc/celeb-quotes/zoolander-mugatu-crazy-pills.jpg

btw backing vocals on this are from our man Kid Cudi
http://www.digitalexcellent.com/binaculars/eagle_using_binoculars_hg_wht.gif

on one hand "anyway" could almost be a katy perry single, but then again katy perry singles would probably be good if katy perry wasn't involved

it's more Vice City though which i'm definitely cool with

― Barack HOOSTEEN Obama (some dude), Friday, November 7, 2008 6:02 AM

hahaha i was just thinking "how long until someone does this"

"with the barack husession running around"

Kanye West - Anyway [exclusive leaked] lil wayne young jeezy jonas brothers spears jay z

hahaha i was just thinking "how long until someone does this"

lol i had the idea a while back but just never got motivated to use it til just now

"The whole album you can rap over at the end of the day, but I'm trying to put on those Phil Collins' melodies."

I think I might really really love this album. I haven't listened to all the leaks (kinda holding out for the final product) but am expecting genius.

i do not understand j0rdan's usage of this gif but it is cracking me up regardless

http://www.digitalexcellent.com/binaculars/eagle_using_binoculars_hg_wht.gif

Likewise!

is this going to be as horrible as the songs i've heard?

An album's sound is often strongly influenced by the songs that are on it, yes.

ha, it was meant to be a little tongue-in-cheek, but i've got really really low expectations for this. kanye Pain doesnt seem to do it for me

pssst.....none of the songs on this can hold a fucking candle to a phil collins hit.

ain't that an understatement.

I don't know about you guys but I usually assume that about every album.

alright HQ leaks are out

hey look the song he comes closest to rapping on is the best one

guys, t/s: portishead's "machinegun" vs. kanye's "love lockdown" (/third vs. 808s)

wait, i heard a mashup in my head

Portis and Kanye are my two fave records of the year.

Personally, I don't think Clinton Portis Sings! lived up to its potential.

I love this record.

Me too.

If you guys like this, you should totally check out this guy Akon. His tracks aren't as distorted, and he's not a whiny emo fucktard, but it should satisfy you in a similar way musically, if not emotionally (again, Akon isn't a whiny emo fucktard).

that was funny.

because it's true

how does this not make Kanye's shit look amateurish

This, rather (forgot links embed now).

The album so far is reminding me of Destroyer's Your Blues, weirdly. Both are the work of artists seemingly bored with being tasteful, with making songs that immediately fit into what they themselves think of as 'good'. I hear a sort of conscious push into the realm of bad taste, an artist's challenge to himself to try to make something good with awful tools. Also, both albums get off on using supposedly 'inhuman' technology (midi for Bejar, auto-tune for Kanye) to communicate very human pain.

well said! that's an interesting parallel to draw, but I definitely see it. I've got to listen to it more to really know what i think.

i love this album.

even with the arseholy celeb shit.

the "love lockdown" chorus is the best part of this record by a mile for me so far. kinda indifferent to the rest, which is good because i was expecting to hate it

an artist's challenge to himself to try to make something good with awful tools.

if Kanye was trying to making something good with awful tools, he would have sung without autotune.

zing!

lol @ Weezy's big line on "See you in my Knightmares": "Girl we through / you think your ish don't stink / but you are Mrs. P.U. / and I don't see you with me no moo"

Titchyschneidermk2 otm - kanye's 'pity the poor rich boy' routine is grating, especially during an economic crisis; Jeezy's album feels much more relevant right now. It's like that line in "Flashing Lights" where Kanye says he hates the paparazzi worse than the nazis...really??

Love the beats though - reminds me of Erykah Badu in building grooves over hooks.

"Routine"? The guy just lost his mother AND his long-time girlfriend....

this is a great album

lots of hooks both from the beats and from the singing

best song is "amazing" mostly for when the beat drops out and jeezy descends from the clouds

my only complaint is that ye uses autotune in lots of places to make his voice sound rough. there isn't lots of robotic harmonizing a la "put on" or even "love lockdown"

i'm almost glad he used autotune. if he didn't it would have been a little more obvious that 1) his voice isn't good and 2) neither are his melodies
don't hate the record though

ugh @ new version of Welcome to Heartbreak...why? it was synthy and perfect and GLORIOUS and now it's all....piano tinkling? urgh. unnecessary.

Still not sure what to make of "Robocop" - basically an epic mess. "Amazing" prob. my favorite track; everything comes together nicely w/ "Bad News." Great synths all around. Takes a few listens to sink in.

paranoid is the best and then robocop.

heartless is decent too

I adore Robocop! The strings! The melody!

DROP IT DROP IT

those drums, too

paranoid ftw so far

this album should just be a single with 10 different remixes of paranoid

yeah paranoid is the hot hot jam

da croupier otm.

this is some realy emperor's new autotune shit going on right here.

the way t-pain mispronounces Wisconsin > this album

2 stars in allmusic.

allmusic otm

if anyone can send me a d/l link i'd be very grateful

only crappy versions of it on slsk!

thepiratebay.org

yeah but i have no idea how those torrents work

i don't usually download albums but there's no way i'm encouraging everything this album stands for by contributing to its sales total, so maybe i'll find a way to DL this.

10 versions of Paranoid going extrava--gangsta radioooooooooooo

hmpf

without extravagangsta radiooooooo

i really have to appreciate akon's mastery of the mindless hook rhyme "hook up/make up/link up" after hearing kanye sing one line over and over and over and over on his choruses. kanye was the master of the detailed off-rhyme, now he's just creating these pea-brained mantras that would be too vague and dippy for a livejournal.

akon kills the hook on "out here grindin'" by dj khaled

i wonder how many of you would be flipping shit if jamiroquai had recorded this after a break-up.

srsly if fred durst had come up with this in 2.5 weeks after a break-up I'd be like, "christ what happened to you, where's the lyrical wit?"

I dunno...both are shooting blanks lately, but it's been way longer since I heard a tolerable hook from Akon than from Kanye.

that's some false equivalency shit right there

That tom green stunt fred durst pulled was pretty solid

i have a hard time believing anyone over 20 could hear the shit coming out of Kanye's mouth re: break-ups and be remotely impressed. Unless you're Spencer Pratt.

you keep harping on this irrelevant Kanye/Akon comparison and then accuse me of a "false equivalency" for talking on the same terms? wtf

xpost

dude it's not irrelevant to compare Kanye to Akon when people here are going gaga for Kanye doing a piss-poor Akon (autotuned "i'm hurting girl" whines, i.e. "Right Now (Na Na Na)"). But it's false equivalency to say "I dunno, Akon's been pretty bad for a while" when the Kon's at worst delivering pro forma competency in the hook dept and Kanye has started drooling into a cup.

"Love Lockdown" is kind of great, both on its own merits with its naval-gazing minimalist construction merged with the drumming breaks, and when placed next to everything else on the pop charts at the moment. It is certainly the most unique-sounding hit on the countdown at the moment.

Also the video is kind of great:

This Kanye vs Akon argument is incredibly retarded btw

Maybe I'm just missing how Kanye isn't trying to do what Akon does. That maybe this album made in 2.5 weeks isn't sloppy as fuck for purely conceptual reasons, but because Kanye is an overconfident egomaniac who thinks making autotune r&b is easy ("you can just say the same phrase over and over! you don't have to even TRY to rhyme!").

eh, if I never thought Akon was good for anything but 2 or 3 memorable choruses to begin with (the most recent of which were all 2+ years ago), then yeah, I don't feel like I need him as a measuring stick to figure out just how awful AutoTune Kanye is.

Seriously, if you're criticizing Kanye's new shit for not rhyming, you need to shut up and relisten to his old shit. Dude has NEVER rhymed, ever. Plus, dude has never been that skilled of an MC. Kanye's entire road to success has been one paved by an uncanny ear for a hot production job and and strong gift for thematic selection.

I am not saying anything about the entirety of the new album because I haven't heard it yet, but "Love Lockdown" is fucking great and dismissing it as being like Akon shows a fundamental lack of understanding of what Akon actually sounds like.

Seriously, if you're criticizing Kanye's new shit for not rhyming, you need to shut up and relisten to his old shit. Dude has NEVER rhymed, ever.

upthread I was praising him for his entertaining off-rhymes. "isotoner/appolonia" shit. I'd never suggest he was a skilled MC per se, but he knew how to be memorable and his "singing" overwhelmingly avoids what was previously engaging about his vocals.

Musically he still has the knack for drama (though I don't find the slapdash quality of the new stuff as engaging as many do, obv), and "Love Lockdown" shows that. But I find his "vocal style" incredibly grating, and as Akon is one of the more successful guys putting out "ooh you hurt me" autotuned hits in the pop charts right now, I think its a valid comparison. I get why people bring up Portishead, but why should we assume his intent is not to compete with peers on the pop charts? Have you heard "Right Now (Na Na Na)"? Is it really that much of a stretch to say its thematically consistent with 808s & Heartbreak, if more polished and less "navel-gazing" soundwise? I think it's just as valid to talk about how this stuff works (or fails) on a pop level (where Akon comes in) as well as on an art-song/top-ten-critics-poll level.

"why should we assume his intent is not to compete with peers on the pop charts?"

on the American Music Awards last night, he won some award for Graduation, and was saying, artists today shouldn't settle to compete with their peers on the pop charts, but to be the next Hendrix or Zeppelin. So an answer to your question is: b/c we're taking him at his word.

I haven't heard the whole album yet but "Love Lockdown" is fantastic and if Akon sounded like that I'd be all over his shit.

Fine, then. His vocals suck ass compared to Jimi Hendrix and Robert Plant.

What does vocal style have to do with a song's theme?

xpost haha, no I think it's fair to compare him to his pop peers, absolutely, even to assume that his "intent is to compete" with said peers. But the album's a hell of a lot more interesting (for me, for me) than Akon's records.

It doesn't, but along with heavy autotune, both Akon's hit and Kanye's new stuff have the singer bawling over their ex.

x-post I can see how it's more "interesting" for some, though I think cult of personality is playing into this a LOT.

I agree that the "Love Lockdown" vocal performance isn't that great. I think it's the ambition of those 60s and 70s artists that he's striving for. Whether he can execute remains to be seen---execute both in songwriting and in performing. Part of me thinks this is just some blustery bullshit, and that lots of R&B artists and producers are swinging for the fences today.

admittedly Akon appears to be aiming more for the cultural stature of Michael McDonald.

but if what Kanye has to say about heartbreak is as dimwitted and self-involved as it is, I kinda wish HE'D aim for MOR too.

When you say "Akon's hit", do you mean "Lonely", "Smack That" "I Wanna Love You" or "Don't Matter"?

I mean "Right Now (Na Na Na)," the song I've referenced numerous times (the ONLY song of Akon's I've referenced on thread) and linked to. The one that's in the top ten right now.

You take my point, though, which is you are reducing Akon to one song you don't like and using that to encompass his entire career. Your entire argument is built off of tenuous assumptions.

Dude, I'm saying it's better than Kanye's recent songs.

My entire argument is simply that rather than hearing Kanye's recent music as some bold break into the unknown, it sounds like really bad Akon. And if Kanye's recent songs are so miserable and monochromatic that they can almost all be negatively compared to a single (and current) hit of Akon's, so be it.

if someone wants to argue that the sloppiness of the songs isn't "bad Akon" but "interesting Akon," removed of the mainstreaming polish and moved into a more fascinating minimalist style, that's fine too. but to say that there's no connection between the autotuners in the top ten pushing heartbreak r&b seems willful.

i think da croupier is otm but dan you need to hear the kanye record - its very not good, and i like love lockdown too

most of the songs are terribly unmemorable

Are you confusing Akon and T-Pain?

no, one has a top hat and one is from africa

God, I wish Kanye would just go fuck a bartender like T-Pain did.

"unmemorable" is the correct word. i doubt ill want to listen to any of this in about a month, other than the chorus to "love lockdown" perhaps

yeah the funny thing here is Anthony is acting like a renegade for making the same statements about nu-Kanye that have been made hundreds of times before (including on this thread) but replacing "T-Pain" with "Akon."

no, one has a top hat and one is from africa

― banana thug (M@tt He1ges0n), Monday, 24 November 2008 22:12 (25 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

^^^two types of people on this planet imo

Al, plz to point out my Lorenzo Lamasity on this thread so I may admire it. Unless you just mean that I defended my negative opinion and made a few jokes.

also T-Pain doesn't really do "plaintive" with any earnestness, god bless, so I really wouldn't compare him to Kanye. If there's some sadsack T-Pain I'm forgetting, please don't remind me of it.

you've constantly framed your arguments in the context of "you guys" "flipping shit for" or "going gaga for" Kanye's so-called "bold break into the unknown," when the opinions on this thread have always been pretty mixed and often leaning towards negative.

xpost

I guess I missed the negative stuff under the cut, I've just been marveling at Whiney/Brainwasher/Lex all o'dat.

My point is that you're conflating sonic signifiers. Kanye's autotuneocopia is not directly analogous to Akon's reedy voice, and thematically-speaking Akon is much broader than Kanye sadface.

If you were complaining about this as some horrifying combination of sad Akon and T-Pain, I don't think very many people would be arguing with you.

(btw I've now heard "Heartless" and I still think it's way more T-Pain than Akon, I also think "Heartless" is a big bag of sick compared to "Love Lockdown")

most of the songs are terribly unmemorable

huh, i think the album's saving grace is how strong the album's hooks are.

it also sounds nothing like akon.

I guess I missed the negative stuff under the cut, I've just been marveling at Whiney/Brainwasher/Lex all o'dat.

i haven't even been raving about this album much here? really kanye is the last artist i want to talk about on ilm.

i dunno they sound like songs i 'wrote' when i was a kid or whatever -- real 'catchy' but not catchy you know what i mean?? like ... "this melody sounds pretty" but then there's nothing about it to stand out, its just one of millions of melodies

Yeah, he's also like T-Pain. Akon doesn't always smother on the autotune to Pain/West levels but it's crazy audible on recent songs, as is the style these days. Pain's musical persona is so whimsical that I felt the "Mr. Lonely" side of Akon was closer to what Kanye is going for. Though now I do wonder how people would feel about these tracks if they were on Three Ringgzzzzz.

yeah i can see what you mean but all i'm saying is that i could remember how each song went off the back of one listen, which is pretty rare.

xp

i haven't even been raving about this album much here?

don't take it personal, your comments were merely visible in the "fresh" part of the thread when I belatedly checked it out.

The people raving about "Love Lockdown" upthread are mostly the same people being ambivalent about the whole album downthread.

T-Pain does hooks on a lot of party songs but all his solo singles are pretty sadsack, if usually in a tongue in cheek way. he's always the loser in the club, catching feelings for a stripper or a bartender or talking someone up and asking them to go home with him but never saying that they actually did go home with him. it's not exactly the woe-is-me breakup album shit Kanye is going for, but I'd say he's done enough stuff in that vein to equal "Mr. Lonely" and then some.

Not to speak for Anth0ny here, but I'm pretty sure Akon's (and Kanye's) earnestness versus T-Pain's tounge-in-cheekness is the distinction he's drawing.

Yeah kanye was LATE TO A WEDDING HE DIDNT EVEN HAVE A DATE FOR

well, Kanye can't stop making corny pop culture references like "how could you be so Dr. Evil" even when he's trying to make a serious emotional epic, so it's not like he's completely out of T-Pain territory. Akon isn't so much earnest as completely lacking in humor or self-awareness, IMO.

xpost

for me what makes 808s successful is that

- the music is good (and unique) enough that it's not reliant on kanye's solipsistic lyrics for emotional power (and enables me to overlook the worse lyrical missteps)
- i think this may well be unintentional but kanye's inability to articulate his emotions in a satisfactory way is v effective - often w/confessional lyrics, the point of identification is when the artist finds it most difficult to piece together a confession

of course that can only succeed when the music is captivating enough, it's like a house of cards.

the dr evil lyric is really bad though.

xpost-- I agree with all that. It's a reductive argument.

btw had no idea this was a kanye track until just now

feat al tariq!!

Complaining about how bad Kanye sings or how it's not good R&B music is really, really missing the fucking point

And yes the lyrics can be bad, but so can Trent Reznor's and Tori Amos's and Billy Corgan's and Ne-Yo's and whoever else makes good heartbreak music.

Complaining about how bad Kanye sings or how it's not good R&B music is really, really missing the fucking point

Complaining that he sings badly and the album is no good as R&B is irrelevant?

I'm saying that Kanye is walking some weird line he's drawn between R&B, hip-hop, electronic music and underground rock music. And that allows him to borrow and recontextualize elements from ALL of them. Yes, the vocoders are from R&B, that doesn't make him Akon. He takes the vocoders from R&B, the tuneless, vulnerable singing from indie-rock, borrows Jeezy from hip-hop, throws on some unf-unf electonic squiggles and it's a new thing. He's no longer tied to any of their rules, so trying to hold him up to them irrelevant. He's making a KANYE record, free of scene and expectation and genre trappings.

If Iron And Wine sang all shitty and broken like that, people would be pissing their pants about how "pure" and "untouched" it is. The fact that a famous rap guy can't do that without everyone freaking out and expecting him to stay in some corner is stupid and borderline racist.

...

http://media.bigoo.ws/content/gif/music/music_139.gif

Also, Trent Reznor's lyrics are much much worse than this.

Get in your corner, Kanye! Stop thinking you can sing boring, awful songs. That's a white man's job.

haha yah the kanye haters here are real big iron&wine boosters let me tell you

And yes the lyrics can be bad, but so can Trent Reznor's and Tori Amos's and Billy Corgan's and Ne-Yo's and whoever else makes good heartbreak music.

He takes the vocoders from R&B, the tuneless, vulnerable singing from indie-rock, borrows Jeezy from hip-hop, throws on some unf-unf electonic squiggles and it's a new thing.

I just want to make sure these aren't missed following that "U RACIST" salvo at all us Iron & Wine enthusiasts wishing Kanye would make with the shucking & jiving. lol x-post

but srsly I do wish he would stay in the corner of not sucking

http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee212/spetsnazx/Thread-I_like_where_this_thread_is_.jpg

If Iron And Wine sang all shitty and broken like that, people would be pissing their pants about how "pure" and "untouched" it is. The fact that a famous rap guy can't do that without everyone freaking out and expecting him to stay in some corner is stupid and borderline racist.

I hate Iron and Wine! Do I hate boring white guys with guitars?

wasn't directed at anyone on this thread, sorry if it seemed that way.

Nobody puts Kanye in the corner.

haha how could it NOT sound that way...?

now i'm all confused.

I'm still putting my thoughts together, but 808 strikes me as the kind of Noble Experiment about which lots of rock crits will expend their allotted word counts whenever they type "the underrated." More than half the album just doesn't work.

i think i just got punkd recontextualized

Hey winey just cause he's "borrowing" from different genres doesn't mean that the final product is immune to sounding embarrasingly bad.

I phrased it wrong. I'm more upset at the general critical concensus (re borderline racism challopyness) but I stand by ilx shouldn't compare to akon

i do like bonnie prince billy and MOP.

Well Jeezy, autotune and unf-unf are pretty Akon. Though yeah, if "tuneless" is a conscious lift from indie rather than a sign of ineptitude, then he's sucking in a whole new way.

Dude, defend it then! Don't question our motives. Make a bonfire of auto-tuners.

kanye hitting that glass ceiling, Will Oldham and Devendra watching him from the window and laughing at his airs.

(xpost to Chris)

i talked about this in some other thread, but yeah my problem with this album is twofold:

1) NONE of the songs are memorable (to me), also they are really dull melodically -- which is a shame because i was hopefully after "put on" that he could keep coming up with awesome autotune usage

2) i really really enjoyed kanye's previous thing (though less so with each album) of sort of...uh...recontextualizing the old school r&b sample east coast production style

I think maybeI'm just in love with this album and I get upset when people can't see it my way u_u

It's ok. Graduation is my favorite Kanye.

I mean, I think EVERY song is memorable, and I can't name another album this year where that is true.

i watched through the wire on youtube the other day and i want him to make shit like that for ever and ever

"All Falls Down" >>>>>>> "Through the Wire"

(partially because Stacy Dash in a tight dress >>>>>>>>> pictures of Kanye in the hospital)

Oh, we're beginning THIS game again, aren't we?

i like all falls down too! : )

every song should sound like "slow jamz" by twista!

no jaime foxx no credibility

yes we are playing the talk about awesome songs game again!

"Good Life" >>>> "Gold Digger"

If "THIS game" = "talking about how hot Stacy Dash is", then YES WE ARE

+

http://thekaoseffect.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/stacy-dash.jpg

= awesome

"Through The Wire" is one of the few early Kanye hits I still can't get to. That and "Jesus Walks."

I do have to give him props for positively referencing Vanilla Sky on his first hit. It was fair warning.

Kanye singing through glass jaw >>>> Kanye singing through auto-tune.

The pit and the pendulum

thru the wire and jesus walks are so good !! i guess im kind of tired of the latter still tho

sped up chipmunk style vocal samples are and will always be totally awesome.

While we're not talking about 808s and Heartbreak, I was always surprised "Spaceship" didn't blow up, love that track. As far as lyrics go, I identify more with a guy in a dead-end job who hates his boss more than the woe-is-me sad rich dude in "Pinocchio Story."

xp to m@tt - Lace is a nice touch.

thru the wire is the one chipmunk sample of his I don't think I'll ever cotton to and Jesus Walks is just not what I want to hear about that subject. Both also have lyrical refs that again, really just serve as fair warning as to how his eventual rumination of love lost will resonate with me.

Jim Greer: A lot of people don't - save it for the game! Let's get started. The categories are: "War", "Hard Times", "Bear Attacks", "Ailments", "Dead Wives", and finally "Coal Mining". And, Wayne, as the returning champion, you pick first.

Wayne: I don't much cotton to these computers today.

Jim Greer: You are good! As always, I'll pick for you. Let's try "Ailments". The question is: "How things treatin' ya?"

Wayne: I can't complain. My leg hurts, it means it's bound to rain. Wish them doctors at the VA could get that shrapnel out of my shoulder.

Jim Greer: That is correct! And, my, you are grizzled. It's still your board, Wayne.

i rly rly love 'say you will', but the second half of this album drags. on the whole tho i still like it on first listen.

i don't get the akon comparisons at all. for one anthony, you're ignoring the obvious point that people care about this album because it's a big departure from the music of kanye west. for one, this has always been his appeal ever since he hired jon brion to do late registration. for two, no one cares about "right now (na na na)" because it sounds like every other akon single ever. even if you cared enough abotu akon to care about the release of right now, it's immediately irrelevant based upon "i wanna fuck you" and "smack that".

and yeah i buy all the arguments about why the album doesn't sound good. maybe i have a higher tolerance for autotune and maybe i'm seeing mediocre beats through rose colored glasses, but to actlike people shouldn't care about this is either disengenious or stupid.

and as for your other argument, i think if jamiroquai was the #1 pop star in america and he made a straight up rap album after a break-up, lots of people would care about it.

and i agree w/ whiney-- kanye's operating in another zone right now. to be reductive, pop stars like t-pain and akon don't have beats like this. not even in the slightest. and trip-hop/idm artists don't have hooks like this either. he's said in interviews that he's trying to make straight-up pop music, but this-- whatever you want to classify it as-- isn't traditional pop music.

also u all are racists

robocop^

who did kanye break up with

j0rdan s.

HAHA YESS XD

ya if you buy the deluxe edition of this the poster is a picture of me and kanye during the good times

http://img2.timeinc.net/people/i/2008/news/080324/west_phifer240.jpg
L-R: J0rdan S., Kanye W.

nothing about any of the above is funny except that i actually thought it would be a good idea to ask instead of google

couldn't afford a car so she named her daughter j0rdan s.

http://i34.tinypic.com/t85hxz.jpg

http://www.usmagazine.com/kanye-west%3Dalexis-phifer-split
Sources close to the Grammy-Award winning rapper previously told Us that he would tie the knot with Phifer to honor his late mother Donda’s wishes that they make their relationship official. (Phifer stood by West's side after Donda died following plastic surgery last year.)

“I’m just going to go and get married,” West told GQ last year. “I’m not going to make a big deal out of it.”

The couple — who were honored at Us' Hot Hollywood bash last year — had been dating since 2002, but split briefly in 2004 when West briefly hooked up with Brooke Crittendon, an assistant at MTV, a source told Us.

you're ignoring the obvious point that people care about this album because it's a big departure from the music of kanye west.

...

I can see how it's more "interesting" for some, though I think cult of personality is playing into this a LOT.

― da croupier, Monday, November 24, 2008 9:49 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark

the very IDEA that personality would have anything to do with pop music is INFURIATING to me

haha mini kanye means i'm dr. evil i guess

its only one of many ways to listen to music

my bad i must've missed that post, but more than cult of personality (which def does have a lot to do w/ it) im saying that at face value the music is different than any music kanye west has made. you can't say the same about akon singles. and again, no r&b on the radio sounds like this.

it sounds better

and re: people digging this because its unusual crap from KANYE WEST, I shouldn't judge, I own Dee Dee King's "Funky Man" 10-inch (play it at 45 and it sounds like Cartman!)

people say "lol bad lyrics" but notice how the beat is so much more turgid, distorted, almost industrial, than most rap was at the time. no rap on the radio in 1989 sounded like this.

if anything, cult of personality makes me dislike this record more...it's harder for me to feel empathy for his heartbreak songz when he spent much of his 6 year relationship talking about what kinda porn he likes and constantly being seen w/ hot model/celeb chicks he may or may not have been banging.

yo, he did some things but that was the old him

these songs are so baddddddd, personality aside

"You got a new friend, well I got homies" may be the no homo line of the year, btw (xpost)

well when i say cult of personality i mean a big pop star that i like and follow pretty closely putting out a departure of an album.

the lyrics read like shit mostly but i guess i don't mind them just like i don't mind some saddo shit like bright eyes.

I know a Walk Hard ref will piss Anthony off but haha "That was early Kanye, this is middle Kanye"

It's a little early for Kanye's Songs From 'The Elder' but hey

x-post i am so not pissed off by that ref

btw, my first post should have been 'mugatu otm'

haha

let's talk about jeezy

standing at the podium
tryna watch my sodium

^^lol XD

It would be awesome if Kanye pulled a Slow Train Coming.

people say "lol bad lyrics" but notice how the beat is so much more turgid, distorted, almost industrial, than most rap was at the time. no rap on the radio in 1989 sounded like this.

cuz it sounds like 1986-era Rubin, Mantronix, Schoolly D, Word Of Mouth, doy.

you flatter Dee Dee

yo, croup, what it is? uh, yeah...this album is some serious garbage (no akon references or nothin')

its bad homies
first kanye joint to displease meh

autotuners is biters

i guess i just don't get it. i find this worthy of neither adulation nor ire. good beats, bad hooks, embarassing lyrics (though to be fair there's a very good chance they're intentionally bad - but that's beside the point). that's all i got out of this. i don't understand why some people are so determined to give Ye the benefit of the doubt here, or why they're so convinced this is some misunderstood work of genius. there's just nothing going on here! there's nothing i find groundbreaking about this, it's just as-expected MOR. it doesn't make me like him any less, though, and next year when he goes back to the things that make him work as a musician, all will be well again.

it's been my experience that when musicians try the "one for Hollywood, one for me" approach they rarely get back to Hollywood, for better or for worse.

yeah, Graduation was already kind of a victory lap album. Not sure Re-Enrollment would be fresh so much as safe. This is sort of like if Kurt Cobain had lived to make that album of pipe organ-based songs he was threatening.

wasnt this supposed to be "good ass job"

"post-collegiate ennui"

"backpacking around Europe for a few months until I figure things out, OK?"

that reminds me that I always wanted Kanye to do an album called Semester At Sea.

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/11/25/arts/25kanye_337.jpg

irl lolz^

Thr33 Ringz > 808s & Heartbreak

Long Lap Dance > Love Lockdown

I'm all for Kanye expanding his artistic vision but pls to make it sound less like the postal service.

dee dee king is the perfect soundtrack for this thread.

i've never successfully made it all the way through that song at regular speed. I don't know how anyone could, unless maybe they were thinking "hmmm, a slow-ass song that's four minutes long, what a bold break for a Ramone. The perversity intrigues me."

yo i finally heard this why yall ain't tell me dude went and made a m83 album i will ride for this

This may be my favorite album of the year.

Seriously from all the defensiveness happening in this thread I was ready to write this off without even listening to it but I finally heard it and damn dude made a really good corny indie fuxxor soul record. 1--that's not what I saw coming after Graduation. 2--it's hooky and churning and interesting on its own merits i think but it def has more in common with shit like Cold Vein (no I'm not opening that can of worms again) than anything else he's done. It's like it's 2020 and a bunch of British white dudes just got ahold of rare groove Soulquarian singles and started making these tracks except Kanye is those British white dudes.

if you will

i say soulquarians just cause this sounds like their churning-soul-grooves put through 4534577397598 filters

damn i sound like a dumbass huh

kanye digs him some british white dudes so that makes sense

I dunno I've just been listening to this alongside a bunch of Soulquarian shit today and they share a vibe is what I'm saying

im not disagreeing with you at all-- i mean it certainly isn't rap music. im saying kanye is openly influenced by indie music so what you're saying makes sense in a way

All the critical comparisons to Kid A in terms of this record being a palate cleanser are interesting because they took a sound that already existed and projecting their own neuroses and alienation into it and staking a claim in it. I think that's what the homie is doing here and all the critics who hope this is a digression might be missing the point of their own Radiohead references when they forget that those British white dudes integrated that departure into the sound of their previous work for the rest of their career thus far.

and staked a claim in it

i need to listen to this again, but i'll say that the more i think about it, the more i like the idea of this record. from a listen and a half or so, i don't think it's got the tunes to make it work, but i wanted to hate this really badly and i don't, if that makes sense.

dude the tunes just get better and better, I promise

egomaniac who can't sing rushes album of heartbreak ballads with the help of a friendly robot about how neglected girlfriend who appears to have spite-cheated on him is Dr. Evil DON'T LAUGH THIS IS SERIOUS.

so what do we like about the idea of this record?

or are we talking about whiney's "mixin the jeezy with the auto-tuneless with the unf-unf" thing

MAJOR artist (whom I love) takes a total left turn from making big hip-hop records (big in the sense of being big-money, big-production, aiming for four or five hit singles) that, for all of their innovation are firmly in the vein of 00's mainstream hip-hop (ok, the 'innovations' are pointed towards changing the face of 00's mainstream hip-hop), to make a smaller, quickly-made album of a totally different style with almost no rapping that seems, if not totally soul-baring, at least like the work of someone who's gotten sick of projecting the persona he's projected all his life.

Yeah, I'm gonna be interested in that 'idea'.

Basically, you may not like the record (of course! a lot of people don't like lots of things!), but if you think that KW is an important artist (I guess you might not), it's tough to see how you wouldn't see this as, at the very least, an interesting 'idea' of a record.

I've only heard half of it so far (picked it up on way home yesterday, had to split time with a Darkthrone record I bought) but it sounds like what I wanted it to sound like. I like the idea of Kanye making a record with a limited palette, I like the idea of Kanye making a record that is drastically different, I like the idea of anyone rushing a record because they feel strongly about it rather than waiting and making it "perfect." I don't care that dude can't sing and I don't really care about lyrics. It sounds sad, isolated, robotic, and distant.

I don't know where I'll end up placing it in terms of this year, Kanye's discography, or whatever but at least he is trying something.

xpost I happen to think that on top of that I'm gonna end up thinking it's a very good record, but I'm still developing my thoughts on that.

I never said it wasn't an "interesting idea." I said I didn't see why we like the idea. Songs From The 'Elder' was interesting, but sword & sorcery was not a good look for Kiss. Neither is humorlessly damning your ex in autotune for a whole album.

Also, judging from "Amazing" and every word that comes out of his mouth in interviews, his blog and on stage, Kanye's persona has not changed.

Admittedly, if you don't care about what he's saying it's easy to admire him for wanting so badly to say it.

I like the idea of Kanye making a record with a limited palette, I like the idea of Kanye making a record that is drastically different, I like the idea of anyone rushing a record because they feel strongly about it rather than waiting and making it "perfect."

Even if we acknowledge that you and I look for different things from albums and recording artists, this is kind of horrifying. Why would you like the idea of Kanye squelching his strengths in order to quickly release a more "honest" recording?

idea would have been more interesting if he had jon brion on this one

Alfred I think you fucked with my terms a bit. If Kanye's main strength is producing good tracks, he certainly hasn't squelched that. And I have no idea if it's "honest" or not (and certainly from what I did get from the lyrics his perception of his relationship with his ex is more than a little fucked) but again, after three monstrous albums of really detailed hip-hop, I am excited that Kanye would choose this. My first admittedly cheap reaction by comparison was "is this what people said when Nebraska came out?" and then "probably not because rock dude goes acoustic is a much more accepted idea."

Croup one thing we agree on is that the death of Kanye's sense of humor is really unfortunate, and it's the reason why he'll probably never top Dropout in my mind.

does that mean we get kanyes born in the usa next OH YESSSSS !!!!

ice cr?m otm, this is now my prayer

esp since he'll probably name it LOOK AT MY HOT ASS

Alfred I think you fucked with my terms a bit. If Kanye's main strength is producing good tracks, he certainly hasn't squelched that. And I have no idea if it's "honest" or not (and certainly from what I did get from the lyrics his perception of his relationship with his ex is more than a little fucked) but again, after three monstrous albums of really detailed hip-hop, I am excited that Kanye would choose this. My first admittedly cheap reaction by comparison was "is this what people said when Nebraska came out?

Fair enough, but Tunnel of Love was a better album about "relationships" and characters.

yeah, I'd be tempted to compared 808s to Tunnel but that'd just be way too kind to it.

Tunnel Of Girl What The Fuck Is Your Problem

Nebraska: studio-savvy populist releases "dark," "introspective" album that gets cited more than listened to, and is a fucking grind when it's on. No idea if Kanye's watching Wise Blood and reading Raymond Carver.

he might be watching True Blood

shaq is watchin true blood

you mean shaqula

yah dat guy

I'm really speaking more to taking a hard left in terms of production/arrangement decisions than mood/content (to the extent that they can be separated) but yeah understood. I like listening to Nebraska though! More than a couple Springsteen mega-epics in a row may also be called a grind.

this album has some nice songs that prob wouldve been better as album trax on a kanye pop banger

thats all LOCK THRED

HOOS YOU JUST COMPARED THIS GARBAGE TO COLD VEIN.

ET TU HOOS ET TU?

YOU BETTER PLEAD MENTAL INSOMNIA ON THIS AND GO WATCH LOST BOYS!

g00blar was very otm up there, and i agree with vampire about appreciating Ye trying to make something of a moment in time rather than striving for perfection. like i said, the more i think about it, the more it makes me want to like it, or at the very least appreciate it. gotsta listen later today

i wish i knew how to enjoy this album

I think most people have a pretty warped idea of how long it can (or should, or would) take to write and record a piece of music, and whether that length of time has any real bearing on the end product most of the time. So situations like this make me really wish we had no idea how long it took to make, because it just becomes this black whole of speculation and a way to credit or blame the speed of the process for the quality of the record.

xpost

I mean, other major label rap albums don't take months and months and months to make because they're much more patiently considered and refined than 808s...Kanye just has the luxury of producing everything himself, and not having the label constantly bring new producers/guests for him to work with or push the release date back to record more if the first single isn't a hit.

I'm not sure whether I'd like or care about this album if I didn't already like Kanye, but I do and I do and I do.

The funny thing with me is, Kanye's been one of my fav producers for a long time, I was copping his mixtapes and shit well before College Dropout, and I never really got fed up with him during a lot of his post-fame tantrums and bullshit...I just don't like the musical direction he's been going in since Graduation at all, whether he's rhyming or singing or producing or whatever, it just doesn't sound good to me. The fact that this album is so wrapped up in his personal life is almost incidental as far as my distaste for it.

xpost sure but Kanye's own major label rap albums were probably more patiently considered and refined than 808s....I don't think the intent is to compare it to all albums, just to respond to peeps saying "it's rushed" as an accusation. We also know from the man himself that the release date was pushed up because of his enthusiasm for the material.

fwiw Kanye probably worked faster this time as much because he wasn't writing (rap) verses as because it was an urgent passion project.

i've only heard a couple songs but i like how it sounds. the melodies didn't really stick, but the beats are interesting and i've always found his rapping kinda annoying, so i don't miss it.

Weird thing is, if Kanye actually knew or understood house music, some of the ideas he's trying to pull off here could work better. It feels like he's grasping for a new style, not knowing that others have been doing robotic soul for 30 years...

And he still writes awful lyrics.

I thought i was gonna hate this but i don't! I'm not sure if I care about the whole heartbreak angle at all but this thing has got hooks.

"When I grab your neck/ I touch your soul" is a motherfuckin' crepey line

It feels like he's grasping for a new style, not knowing that others have been doing robotic soul for 30 years...

yeah i tend to think that makes for super interesting results in general though

TS: 808s & Heartbreak vs. Trans

or, you know, Young Americans

also, Trans is sweet.

808 and Heartbreak has no "Like an Inca," so it loses.

Had a chance to interview Kanye a month ago and he was talkin' a lot about house music. I asked him 'bout it and he growing up in Chicago and the guy said he definitely would like to go into that direction sometime. He also said he wants to do RHCP covers in his next live act.

I really like Love Lockdown, like really, really like. It makes me think more of filter disco like Modjo or even a track off Phoenix's second album than Phil Collins. I've read at least two broadsheet things that mention him as being basically the only innovator in modern hip-hop. WTF? I always thought he came across as pretty bland until Stronger. I think there's this OMM culture that builds shit like this up (see also The Roots, they, like play instruments). Like he never sounded particularly interesting or innovative, but in the context of this MOR pop, he seems way more interesting.

stronger is SO bland -- who needed to hear that song remade?? it sounds like a mashup

its so great btw

he never sounded particularly interesting or innovative, but in the context of this MOR pop, he seems way more interesting.

― I know, right?, Friday, November 28, 2008 12:13 AM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark

ahaha ok cannot cosign this

I never really gave a shit about him before Flashing Lights, I only liked Stronger retrospectively

he's had a huge hand in shaping the sound of hip-hop since the turn of the millennium

????????????

He just seems like the american Robbie WIlliams

uh

I have no idea how he shaped the sound of hip hop

for one he's by far the number one influence on new rappers that have a "chance" to break into the mainstream post-lupe, dudes like b.o.b, charles hamilton - basically this whole idea that you don't have to have the thug image to be a successful rap artist.

and early this decade you couldn't run from the kanye/just blaze-style of hip-hop with songs like "izzo", "takeover", "slow jamz" (and blaze songs like "oh boy" and "girls girls girls"). this was by and large lots of popular hip-hop early this decade (it was certainly the pervading sound of non-southern hip-hop). you're looking at guys like just blaze, mannie fresh, timbaland, neptunes - i think timbaland's the only guy who has a had a bigger imprint on rap as it stands now since kanye dropped than kanye

j0 brings it but i was just gonna say

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Blueprint

I mean if you understand the impact of The Blueprint in terms of production styles and the impact of College Dropout in terms of acceptable mainstream rap subject matter his influence should go without saying.

the only dude who has surpassed kanye in popularity this year is wayne and his image is patently post-kanye

That sounds like a pretty good line of reasoning but I can't really get behind it, maybe its just because I find his earlier stuff just really really boring.

"Boring" is acceptable and decidedly different from "I don't see how he's been influential"

'Robocop' is so awesome. I like the mildly incongruous use of 'Stephen King' in there as well. 'Paranoid' is well good too. It's middle heavy, EOE&H is.

but i don't see how he's been influential, or don't really believe it, but that may be because I can't believe it because of how boring I find him if you follow me, well how boring I used to find him.

You don't listen to a lot of American rap music, do you?

no not really but why do you say that?

http://www.vts.intute.ac.uk/detective/image/case-closed-stamp.gif

Had a chance to interview Kanye a month ago and he was talkin' a lot about house music. I asked him 'bout it and he growing up in Chicago and the guy said he definitely would like to go into that direction sometime. He also said he wants to do RHCP covers in his next live act.

― elgolfo, Thursday, November 27, 2008 2:03 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

KANYE WANTS TO DO A RHCP JOINT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.vts.intute.ac.uk/detective/image/case-closed-stamp.gif

actual lol

fuck.

CASE CLOSED STAMP

fwiw from a non poster user like myself. Whoever said they liked the idea of this album is otmfm.
This is prehaps the cd I most want to love from all of the 'o8. I do like it, really much.
But that outro on say you will is far too self indulgent.

too close for words, switching to jpgs

as much as i love this album i will cosign this

But that outro on say you will is far too self indulgent.

The "spoiled little L.A. girl" outro shit is super unnecessary and kind of bullying too

i think timbaland's the only guy who has a had a bigger imprint on rap as it stands now since kanye dropped than kanye

― racist (J0rdan S.), Thursday, November 27, 2008 4:59 PM Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

there was also that one dude with dreads who yelled a lot

why doesn't he come back already

So, yeah, 808s & Heartbreak can be queasy and even morally indefensible sometimes. But that puerile sentiment also gives it its force. Intentionally or not, Kanye has tapped into a mood here that transcends whatever his personal troubles might be. With winter looming and economic futures looking scarier every day, the icy throb and barely contained rage capture the ambient dread bleeding into everyday life from all sides. Like that crowd in Singapore, we might not understand exactly what Kanye's trying to say, but, unlike them, we get the idea. This is a work borne of depression, and in the coming Great Depression, we'll need it.

Tom Breihan, Village Voice

maybe i just need to lose my job to get this album

ouch dude

but seriously im unemployed too and i think it eats nuttz

the biggest problem w/ Tom's review is that he constantly references his assumption that the audience at a Kanye West concert in Singapore don't understand English.

also the fact that it's a positive review.

Even if he obviously shoulda checked, I understand why someone would assume they don't speak English in Singapore. But I don't understand why someone acknowledge how repulsive the lyrics get (which puts the review a step above most) only to say "yes but with the world in such shit shape this hateful whining about an ex is exactly what we need."

"spolied little LA girl" is one of the best moments on the album imo

/\/\/\/\/\/\
THIS = OTM

fwiw from a non poster user like myself. Whoever said they liked the idea of this album is otmfm.
This is prehaps the cd I most want to love from all of the 'o8. I do like it, really much.
But that outro on say you will is far too self indulgent.

haha that was me i think, and i'm liking it more after more listens. i think say you will is great, but yeah it could stand to lose a couple minutes

i like the """"idea"""" of this album too...

but i think the album itself is pretty boring and flat out embarrassing in parts.

All Kanye albums are embarrassing in parts, even the great ones!

That is OTM. I've been listening to this pretty exclusively for a couple days now and I really, really like it. Tom is really, really reaching in that paragraph you quoted but the album is absolutely about nailing down a particular mood. The fact that Kanye would lay some of this stuff out so bluntly is embarrassing and sort of admirable at the same time. That line from RoboCop--"I told her there were things she didn't need to know/but she never let it go" (or whatever it is exactly)--I think Kanye KNOWS how bad that sounds but the album is all about playing out the end of the relationship from a certain perspective. It's not typical woe is me stuff at all.

All that and "Love Lockdown" which is basically a new generation's "Tusk".

OK, that's enough.

No, I think there are some more tenuous classic rock analogies we can stuff into this turkey.

It's Kanye's Done With Mirrors! His Goat's Head Soup! The 21st century Houses of the Holy! The Magical Mystery Tour of rap!

Hahaha got y'all.

Shark Sandwich

(for the Web 2.0 generation)

"Finally the lame-ass Chitown faggotry hip-hop Yankee Hotel Foxtrot has arrived"

admirable

Does "Street Lights" remind anyone else of Coldplay?

not trying to troll, but the bleating/heartfelt/wounded vocals are reminiscent of Chris Martin; wouldn't be surprised if this was one of Kanye's Sincere Ballad reference points

yeah actually coldplay did come to mind on first listen

hmm my knowledge of indie bands isn't great but i was thinking more arcade fire? or that awful shoegazey band stars. whatever, 'street lights' is the only track on 808s that i really find unlistenable (oh haha apart from the interminable live thing at the end). though "spoilt little LA girl" is definitely a nadir.

I like spoit little LA girl -- a moment of self-recognition!

lol

Despite my trolling upthread, I quite like this. I can't completely handle the unrelentless emo, but it's important to remember that Kanye's always been a bit like this (Family Business on the 1st album arrrrggggg) 'Amazing', 'Love Lockdown' and 'Paranoid' are all great. It's quite depressing that I was expecting to be disappointed by the Wayne track....the guy needs to lay of the drugs srsly. At the same time I'm really glad Kanye still got the big raps collabs on this, rather than getting Chris Martin or whatever. Do people think this album will have much of an influence back on rap? Do rappers have the same opinion as most rap fans which is basically one large nh?

All Kanye albums are embarrassing in parts, even the great ones!

― The Saving Grace of Gospel House (The Reverend), Friday, November 28, 2008 2:02 AM (9 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

do you mean lyrically or production wise or both?

because i feel like the embarrassing "song writing" on this is nothing like he's done before

i dunno i mean i dont hate this...

i guess i'm just saying "oh, kanyepaws" on this when everyone else has been saying it all along

I actually really dig Street Lights, but Arcade Fire is really off the mark, Lex. Stars are occasionally as shoegazy, but at least 50% of the time are rocky and shimmery and so forth.

Lighten up on the taiko drums and what you do have is something off of Thom Yorke's Eraser. One or two lines repeated endlessly, drum loops and electronic processing. Harrowdown Hill, or Black Swans, or something. Except w/ harmonies.

Yeah "Street Lights" is probably my favorite song other than "Love Lockdown", and I can't stand Arcade Fire.

do you mean lyrically or production wise or both?

― ♪☺♫☻ (gr8080), Friday, November 28, 2008 1:23 PM Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Both, although the production on Graduation probably comes the closest to skipping out on one of those.

heard "Paranoid" in the club tonight-- sounded awesome

I hear the Chemical Brothers in Street Lights. One of their soft-psych collabs with an indie singer - the stuttering drums, the ethereal backing vocals, the shimmering production. One of maybe four great songs on a deeply unlovable record.

Heard the whole thing for the first time today and I totally love it from beginning to end

I don't really listen to the hip-hop/R&B station here, but I usually stop to hear what it's playing as I scan the dial, and I like "Keep Your Love Locked Down." I will have to check out more of this album.

I think "Paranoid" almost sounds like a New Order song.

Heard the whole thing for the first time today and I totally love it from beginning to end holy shit are you people serious with this garbage?

http://tinyurl.com/cnvbppeople be likin recordshttp://tinyurl.com/cnvbp

was ILX around when Kid A came out?

don't believe so, no

i think it was around but maybe no one really cared, there's definitely a thread on bombs over baghdad and didnt that come out before kid a?

Radiohead Album Cover: What Are They Thinking?

Kanye West's The Postal Service

― HOOS HOOS HOOS on the autosteen (BIG HOOS aka the steendriver), Friday, November 7, 2008 5:56 AM (3 weeks ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

and yes i will fully endorse and d^-^b that

― HOOS HOOS HOOS on the autosteen (BIG HOOS aka the steendriver), Friday, November 7, 2008 5:57 AM (3 weeks ago) Bookmark

^^^i've said this to people before

dont think this record and Kid A are really in the same universe, though i like this lots now

dont think this record and Kid A are really in the same universe, though i like this lots now

Bingo.

okay, now you folx are ruining this thread even more than miccio did

"Finally the lame-ass Chitown faggotry hip-hop Yankee Hotel Foxtrot has arrived"

― Peter "One Dart" Manley (The stickman from the hilarious 'xkcd' comics), Friday, November 28, 2008 10:45 AM

where is geir to say this has some nice melodies cause i'm not gonna say it

"Finally the lame-ass Chitown faggotry hip-hop Yankee Hotel Foxtrot has arrived"

― Peter "One Dart" Manley (The stickman from the hilarious 'xkcd' comics), Friday, November 28, 2008 10:45 AM

― dumb pseud (some dude), Saturday, November 29, 2008 11:33 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark

Yes quoting Dom is the sure way to help your case.

quoting dom quoting gq!

Wow even better.

this thread deserves to be ruined.

made out of some dude

http://i36.tinypic.com/sgr1vb.jpg

hahahaha kanye dresses like david lynch !!!

uggh man wtf is this shit

http://www.collider.com/uploads/imageGallery/Inland_Empire/david_lynch_image.jpg

if there was a picture of lynch wearing sunglasses they would look just like kanyes no doubt

shit shit, that's what xp

man i'm gettin old if this is what kids are feelin nowadays

I guess what's happened that over the past seven to ten years, the term "underground" has changed. It's changed so much from when it used to mean Boot Camp and DITC. The records some of these kids are doing isn't even rap. It seems like it's problematic because you have all these different types of people under one umbrella. There's a lot of shit that they're putting out that I don't even want to be associated with. I think that's where the problem comes in. Certain people don't want to be associated with stereotypes in music. A lot of shit that's put under the underground umbrella isn't even rap music. It's about kids talking about how they love their girlfriends, pick flowers, and eat granola bars. That's homo shit to me.

You're right, you are getting old.

pink granola bars are dope tho

tell me more about getting old plz

I'm not even smart enough to know that answer. Half of the rappers look like indie rock kids that could be in Weezer. They're skinny, nerdy kids with glasses and tight jeans and Def Leopard t-shirts. I don't know what that's about. I don't really know how that happened. The only way you ever clean up anything is just to support the good shit and ignore the wack shit. As long as these kids keep on thinking that that type of shit is good, I guess it's not going anywhere.

well son it begins when u start going WHA everytime u hear abt what the kids are into - after that u stop giving a fuck generally - pretty sweet imo

xp

y'all are like South Park every week being all "What is with this High School Musical shit?" "What's is with this Twilight shit?"

lol

hahaha

i would totally watch a South Park pop-culture-monster-of-the-week episode about flamboyantly dressed autotune rappers

Say goodbye to 10 minutes of your life:

^^^ awesome youtube great job

hey remember when kanye sampled classic breaks instead of fuckkin alan parsons project and movie soundtracks like hes goddam el-p or some shit

classic breaks like laura nyro

funkin kids!

the laura nyro sample was on "graduation" but nice try dummy

i already got in this fight back when that album dropped but kanye's abandonment of black artists and embrace of gay adult contemporary/white ppl music and hipster favs like daft punk and can and steely dan (who are all dope btw) was well underway by then

that diamonds are forever shit was on late registration or are you gonna pull some "i only fucc with the the shit he did for Knoc-Turn'Al and State Prop"

dude was sampling pat benetar before he was signed

hay who wouldnt sample pat benetar guys guys

that diamonds are forever shit was on late registration or are you gonna pull some "i only fucc with the the shit he did for Knoc-Turn'Al and State Prop"

― uәʇɹɐƃu!әʍ ˙ƃ ʎәu!Ⴁʍ (Whiney G. Weingarten), Monday, December 1, 2008 11:10 AM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

dogg i thought shirley bassey was black til i just wikipedia'd the bitch

and 50 was droppin bassey breaks back in 99

aite that didnt work but

50 cent - rowdy rowdy dropped in 99

samples bassey - light my fire which was on blue note if i am not mistaken

im not saying dudes cant sample corny white music - some of my fav joints of all time sample corny white music - just saying if you started out known as dude who brought old soul and funk breaks back to the radio its weak to get all designer shades bloggy sci-fi on some b.s. and you can tell from that samples vid

(Shirley Bassey is black. Welsh mother, Nigerian father)

i eagerly await the viewing of these 50 youtube

damn shirley was dope back in the day
http://assets.mog.com/pictures/wikipedia/47147/Bassey.jpg

Kanye's always sampled from a pretty wide swath of obscure and popular (mostly popular) soul and rock and pop. The problem with the new album is partly that it doesn't have hardly any samples (only on 2-3 songs I think?), and he's not really a very good 808 producer.

^this is basically how i feel. kanye could really flip samples in cool and inventive ways...the farther he gets from that, the worse he gets IMO

http://www.kanyeuniversecity.com/blog/index.php?em3106=215136_-1__0_~0_-1_11_2008_0_0&eM=

i'm especially grateful for his blog these days, as it reaffirms he's not really a joyless saddo

whatever hes sampling the problem is that he cant write a melody for shit

i'm sorry the homie fails your melody test boss but i dig the tunes on here, i feel like they're pretty strong.

earworms

yeah seconded, w/a pretty strong litmus test - had to review it off the back of one listen, in the label office, with a slight head cold and with what sounded like an actual band practice going on one floor below, but when i got round to writing the review a couple of days later i could pretty much remember how all the songs went. which isn't the case for most albums at all.

he cant write a melody for shit

― deej, Monday, December 1, 2008 5:06 PM (16 minutes ago) Bookmark

yeah this is the absolute most rong criticism ive seen of this album

also if i actually sit back and weigh kanye's work up against each other i'd say this is definitely the weakest of his albums, and what he's doing now is nowhere near his 01-05 work, but what he IS doing is interesting (and good) enough that that's not quite the point - he's still sustaining my interest in him as an artist, he's evolving into something different but not disappointing me (and again that's not something too many acts can do).

"kanye's work up against each other" <= ugh grammar

i think to the extent that 'earworms' can have a negative connotation that he is capable of them. "Heartless" get stuck in my head all the time but I don't want it there, it's such an ugly limp little melody.

yeah but saying he can't write melodies is just ridiculous

So the Big Question is "is this a detour or a new direction?" amirite

and honestly if it's a new direction i'm not quite so enthused, i don't think this idea can stretch much further than he's taken it without resulting in mush.

i really dont think its ridiculous at all -- these songs are utterly unmemorable except when they are in which case i wish i didnt remember them

'earworms' my ass

more like assworms amirite

deej i would consult http://www.webmd.com/

deej i would consult http://www.thespoof.com/search.cfm?tag=ass%20worms

super wormjoke sesh

super badjoke sesh

http://www.thespoof.com/sitepics/pdi/71007-1459bloke.jpg

heartless sucks imo, but the rest is pretty dope esp. say you will and love lockdown

^^^that's basically how I break it down to an extent

I just voted this album #1 in the Pitchfork readers' poll.

thats right ilxor, stick it to the man

I just noticed it's "make up", not "make love" in that Akon song