Click here to talk about the next Grizzly Bear album - Veckatimest

26/5/09

at long last...

1 About Face
2 All We Ask
3 Cheerleader
4 Ready, Able
5 Southern Point
6 That's Not True
7 Two Weeks
8 While You Wait For the Others
9 Fine For Now
10 Dory
11 I Live With You
12 Foreground

Supposedly it's an island.

Veckatimest Island is one of the Elizabeth Islands of Dukes County, Massachusetts, USA. The island has a land area of 0.0675 km² (0.026 sq mi, or 16.675 acres) and was uninhabited as of the 2000 census. [1]

thank you wikipedia

Hard to know what to expect from this considering how much they've pushed their sound between previous releases.

true, and that even increase the anticipation..

http://static.rateyourmusic.com/album_images/o2106108.jpg

Fine For Now and While You Wait... (as performed live) sound to me somehow like the songs from the last Walkmen album

http://www.pitchforkmedia.com/article/download/50396-on-repeat-grizzly-bear-while-you-wait-for-the-others-live-on-kcrw-mp3-strea

http://www.pitchforkmedia.com/article/download/142489-new-music-grizzly-bear-two-weeks-live-on-late-show-with-david-letterman-st

http://www.pitchforkmedia.com/article/download/144567-video-grizzly-bear-fine-for-now-new-song-live-at-all-points-west

"Two Weeks" and "While You Wait for the Others" were probably the two best tracks I heard last year. Combine that with the quality of the Department of Eagles album, and you can count me as in high anticipation.

"Two Weeks" and "While You Wait for the Others" were probably the two best tracks I heard last year.

OTM. by a long shot, even. i'm sort of irked that they leaked so early though, as i've probably listened to them a few hundred times each. is "this is going to be the best album ever" getting my hopes up too high?

It's real good.

I'm really looking forward to this. Like, REALLY. Owen, have you played on this one?

No, I didn't play on it. I offered, but they wanted Nico instead.

It's real good.

Merriweather good?

God I hope "Merriweather good?" doesn't become part of the ILM lexicon...

looks like it's gonna be more straightforward-song-oriented record, less atmospheric and "experimental" than Yellow House

^alarming news

if you say so

welcome news

^alarming news

― sonderangerbot, Monday, February 16, 2009 10:17 PM (Yesterday)

http://www.chelseapies.tv/breaking-news.jpg

yeah, it's more alarming than welcome..
it's a logical prediction i think, after listening to the 3 songs above,plus the 2 songs they contributed to the 4AD new compilation album,
than again,time will tell..

Not really sure that pop melodies are their strong point (knife was the only big hummalong choon on yellow house) its more the atmospherics and twitches of the thing that got me hooked.

"Each day spend it with you yeah / all my time spend it with me yeah" says you're wrong.

haha, yeah that one too.

it has leaked, really not good at all, but then i don't like them. i am sure the kids will love it.

apparently the leak is super low quality, i'm trying to wait out til something better floats around. anyone found anything better than 128kb?

pretty disappointing on first listen..

Was never much of a fan before, but kind of unexpectedly liking this. "Two Weeks" especially.

256kb version has leaked. There's no groundbreaking move here, but overall the record is pretty solid on first listen. And While You Wait for the Others is great.

I'm now officially sure this band are not for me. Couldn't get into Yellow House apart from Knife and this one just sort floats by in a mellow fog. I actually found it difficult to listen to the whole thing in one go, just too samey.

"I'm now officially sure this band are not for me"

i don't think i'll listen to the current record too much either, but it's different from Yellow House, so maybe it WILL be a good record for people who disliked them before

I love this cover.

http://www.mbvmusic.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/grizz.jpg

I don't get the alarm at it being more song-orientated. I prefer "Two Weeks" and "While You Wait for the Others" to their previous stuff - or find them more striking or whatever - for precisely that reason. I'll probably wait for the release to listen to this, I'd say.

"southern point" starts out sounding like skip spence before going all full-blown orchestral. that's a nice surprising hark back to horn of plenty

this is one of the worst records of the year. i am glad that there is not much praise for it. i guess it could still be coming. the same as those who seem to think that 'the watchmen' isn't pure torture. i am happy for kelly leak though. now maybe there will be a michael beck revival.

the last half of that post was admirably cubistic!

"i am glad that there is not much praise for it"

yeah i mean it doesnt come out for like two months so

I think we should all look into posting in a cubistic style. Otherwise we could all get stuck in a rut. Just like agricultural machinery in a rainstorm. Heavy equipment requires immense amounts of fossil fuels. Gerald Ford.

Leif.

LEIF!

language poetry pronouncements on grizzly bear responses should sure show the key to them

they're trying too hard to be "great" on this record imo

and it shows

"i am glad that there is not much praise for it"

as a matter of fact theres lots of praise to it.most people who listened to it seems to like it.
(2nd best record of 2009 in rateyourmusic for example)

DJ Martian?

ha?!

hey is that the actual track listing above? if so i have been listening to it in a helluva fucked up order.

do you guys actually not like the album?

It's not the right order, above. The ending is right, but it begins Southern Point -> Two Weeks.

Backlash came really early for this one

"southern point" is the jam

i am glad that there is not much praise for it

the leak really sucks though, i expect a strong resurgence of love once the official release hits. this album is so good, i'm surprised there hasn't been more praise.

i really like it. i'm quite happy they've distanced themselves from the lo-fi trend, simply to prove that they've got nothing to hide. they've also toned down their harmonies, which works really well to highlight each vocalist's talents.

"two weeks" sounds like it's made for an iphone commercial, but aside from that (not really a bad thing, it just stands out as being the poppiest song on the album) the album is really strong and consistent, and has continued to reveal itself over repeated listens as one of the best releases this year.

I'm surprised, too, by the indifference to/hatred of this album. This is one of my favorites of the year so far. I was disappointed when Yellow House came out because it seemed so much less interesting to me than I was hoping, but this album is just beautiful. It's more three dimensional than Yellow House in every way. It has better melodies, more interesting rhythm and orchestration, and more emotional weight. Like the Fever Ray album, the sound on this has a lot of depth and dynamic range, and every song is filled with beautiful detail.

Where is this indifference/hatred perception coming from? All of the official reviews so far are positive to fawning and the posters on here acknowledged that the early leak was low quality. Let's let it be officially released before we jump to conclusions.

I haven't read too many reviews. The Wire review did stand out as being extremely negative, however. Of course, knowing The Wire, this could still end up on their 50 albums of the year list. I guess my perception of indifference comes from the fact that this has been widely leaked for about a month now, without much discussion of it here.

The Wire review did stand out as being extremely negative, however.

Interesting... copy/paste?

"Grizzly Bear started out as the lo-fi home recordings of Ed Droste. Via 2006's Yellow House, they have since become a full group, with shared writing duties and, in preparation for this album, long sojourns holed up in rural houses arranging and rearranging new material. Some groups, given weeks to rehearse and refine, end up deconstructing and rebuilding assumptions about the very sounds they're working with - Radiohead, say, who recently took Grizzly Bear out on tour. In Grizzly Bear's case, all that time and work has produced something that's queasily overworked, overthought and overwrought."

That's funny, I don't remember them giving a very favorable review to Radiohead's "Kid A" either.

"Musically it draws on a similar current to Feist or Fleet Foxes, a kind of backwoods 21st century twee, which makes big pop eyes at you while scrupulously avoiding anything that woud actually be too oviously pop, harping back to some kind of folksy idyllic infancy (which Animal Collective do) while avoiding anything so abrasive as an actual 21st century sound (which animal collective, with their digital junk and clatter, don't)."

This ^ is total bullsh*t, imo.

"All the care expended on the sound and textures, on trying to make it impossible for the listener to object, the effort to be liked, crashing against that indie ghetto inflection of not wanting that effort to be obioius, makes Veckatimest a precious, cloying listen. After a while the glossy reverbs, the dewy sparkle of the vocal harmonies, the rich mahogany acoustics, the maple syrupiness, makes you long for the uncluttered space, the forensic dryness, of a Jim O'Rourke mix - or anything to strip back the sonic varnish and let Droste and co's undeniable hook-writing ability stand alone."

I don't know, it seems like some of the things that are most criticized about this are among the things I like the best about it.

yeah that review is crap. if they really were "trying to make it impossible for the listener to object, the effort to be liked, crashing against that indie ghetto inflection of not wanting that effort to be obvious" they succeeded, the album sounds really natural to me, and i really get the feeling that they are just nice guys who have never tried-hard-to-be-liked-but-tried-hard-not-to-make-it-obvious. whatever that means. also, just in general i think reviews where the reviewer makes suggestions as to what the album should have sounded like ("uncluttered space, the forensic dryness, of a jim o'rourke mix") are always wrong.

whatever that organ/mellotron/modulation thing they do on the chorus of ready, able = i like

yes! I also like what sound like consecration bells on "Two Weeks".

the coldplay/radiohead/u2-ness of 'foreground' really gets on my nerves.

Who is singing on that track? It doesn't really sound like Ed Droste to me.
I like the simplicity of it. It seems like a nice way to end the album.

it's ed. sounds a little, i dunno, campfire, on the first album. i think foreground is very pretty, just don't agree with a couple of production/arrangement choices, like the 'ominous toms' under "this is.....the foreground" like it's some deep important line

Daniel Rossen did most of the vocals on the last album and does the bulk of the singing live too so i guess it's him.

xpost

or not

sorry i thought we were talking about two weeks.

that's also ed on the lead on two weeks

has a good version of this leaked yet

i don't think the version i have is as good as the official preview version (though I can't hear much difference). in any event, it's certainly much better than what was originally floating around.

I want to hear their vocal harmonies put to use in big choruses and tighter songs. Some of the atmosphere of Yellow House was good, but for me it really only peaked with the one song that was a more standard composition: Knife, which is still breathtaking to me. There's a hell of a pop-rock band in there, somewhere.

Daniel have you heard this album? I wouldn't call the songs on this standard compositions exactly, but they seem somehow much more substantial than those on "Yellow House". I think what really makes it for me, though, is that it's full of melodies that I really like, that move me, which wasn't the case previously except for Knife.

My copy isn't of great quality, sound-wise. It has that blurriness that sounds like an overly close microphone in places. I know that's become a standard technique for some of the avant folk players (which may have started with Tower Recordings' "Folk Scene", and which "Yellow House" reminds me of in some ways), so maybe it's deliberate. I'm looking forward to getting a legit copy of this.

I must say that I'm gaining a new appreciation for the orchestration on "Yellow House" after listening to this album. Some very similar instrumental touches were there, just not the magic imo.

has a good version of this leaked yet

Yeah, but I'm not at liberty to say where.

Final master of this is terrific. I liked it from the crunchy leak, but this is just WOW.

Also I don't get the fawning over Knife from Yellow House; for me the best pop moment BY FAR was the "|each day spend it with you yeah / all my time spend it with me yeah" gallop bit in whatever that song was called.

has a good version of this leaked yet

Yeah, but I'm not at liberty to say where.

― Johnny Fever, Saturday, May 16, 2009 7:15 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark

this helps

Daniel have you heard this album?

No, not yet. I did hear a song from the new disc on Grizzly Bear's MySpace page (Cheerleader, I think). Liked it a lot; it had much more of a tune and structure than most of the songs on Yellow House.

"for me the best pop moment BY FAR was the "|each day spend it with you yeah / all my time spend it with me yeah" gallop bit in whatever that song was called."

On a neck, On a spit. not my favourite track but i do agree with you that Knife isn't even in the top tier of songs on Yellow House. i think their finest moment is the alternate version of Easier that was released as a single. that or Colorado.

on a neck, on a spit was my favorite from yellow house too. i couldnt get super into this a few months ago or whenever it leaked so i'm just going to wait for a really good copy. "two weeks" is one of the best songs of the year though, in any case

the alternate version of easier is the one song i've played the most (which is a lot).

even though it's still probably my favourite grizzly bear song, i think that yellow house would somehow be stronger without knife. it took me a while to get past such an incredibly catchy pop song when the rest of the songs are like a million times less instantly accessible. by the time i really appreciated every song of the album i was already starting to get sick of knife.

On a neck, On a spit. not my favourite track but i do agree with you that Knife isn't even in the top tier of songs on Yellow House. i think their finest moment is the alternate version of Easier that was released as a single. that or Colorado.

yeah, i think all the fawning over "knife" is due to it being the most direct in terms of pop and melody. i found i really didn't pick up on a lot of the melodies on yellow house the first few times i listened. it's definitely a grower, imo.

That "Knife" is most direct in terms of pop and melody is what I like about it. The other tracks on "Yellow House" are definitely growers, but they seem less developed, there's too much unison singing, and there's kind of minor-key remove to them that prevents me from really giving myself over to them completely. There are moments some of the other tracks that are transcendant (like the "each day spending with you.." part of "On a Neck, On a Spit", the chorus on "Central and Remote", the nature sounds and strummed guitar at the end of "Little Brother"), but for the most part they don't have the sweetness or soaring emotion of "Knife". The new album has several tracks that I've fallen in love with already.

I haven't heard the alternate version of "Easier".

if you want to hear it, go to blip.fm and type in "grizzly bear alternate" and listen to either of the first two entries

i've never been grabbed by a grizzly bear - i think that's my problem w/ them - i wish they were less ethereal vocally then they are - i feel the same way about GB that i feel about fleet foxes - i would enjoy this record if i heard it from another room or if i was at a campfire but w/ headphones im just kind of bored by it

lol i've never been grabbed by a grizzly bear SONG

if you webmail me ill tell you about the time that i was grabbed by a grizzly bear tho

i've never met a fleet fox - i think that's my problem with them

i've never been to a wolf parade - i think that's my problem with them

I think Southern Point might be my favourite on the new album; I like GB best when they gallop and spiral, which they do a lot on this tune.

so pfrk gave a perfect 10 for "while you wait for the others.

i predict a 9.6 for the album

while you wait for the others does manage to deshackle them from hazy ethereality while still being an interesting arrangement and stuff

oh wait, maybe it isn't I was listening to david sylvian/holger czukay at the same time by accident. went together tho

While You Wait For The Others gives me exactly what I want from a Grizzy Bear song. It hangs together as a memorable tune, it has that clever stuttering rhythm, and -- best of all -- it puts those great voices to their best use during that wall-'o-harmony in the chorus.

I guess I'm the "pop-inclined listener" that Pitchfork mentions in their track review.

Looking forward to this disc.

"While You Wait For The Others" is great, but there are several tracks on the album that are more immediate and pop-oriented. The first half of the album seems to have more hook-filled pop to me. Beginning with "Dory" there's a more eclectic, experimental feel. I think Pitchfork is right about "While You Wait" being a way back into the record. It brings back some of the pop sensibility in its chorus and seems to flow naturally into the cinematic "I Live With You" and "Foreground".

I've been underwhelmed by what I've heard (and I'm a fan of some indie and twee pop), and this Washington Post review by David Malitz does little to change my concerns.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/05/25/AR2009052501900.html

Of all the bands that could have been named Grizzly Bear it ends up being a bunch of precious art-rockers from Brooklyn whose music has no teeth at all. What a shame. The band is universally adored -- critics, bloggers, Josh Groban, they all sing their praises -- but the truth must be told: Grizzly Bear makes boring, bloated music that at best sounds like a second-rate Beach Boys rip-off and at worst indulges in the worst prog-rock excesses of the '70s.

"Veckatimest," the band's third album, is a trudging affair. Grizzly Bear's songs are like fancy, 500-piece jigsaw puzzles. There are the cascading harmonies, choral arrangements, specks of violin, twinkles of piano, reverb-drenched electric guitar. Except once everything interlocks and you stop to take in the final product, there's nothing there. It's all meandering textures. This is a band of sonic showoffs, nothing more. And who likes showoffs?

"Cheerleader" isn't as overstuffed as most of the album, but the result sounds like a Phil Spector track stripped of all its soul. "Ready, Able" gently saunters through four minutes of vocal and orchestra flourishes without any payoff, unless dramatic moaning is payoff. In which case this album is like winning the lottery.

"Two Weeks" is the exception to the rule, the one song that doesn't lull the listener into a near-comatose state. It's vibrant, based on a loping, descending piano riff -- just a few simple notes, but they resonate more than anything else on the record. The rest will send you into hibernation. -David malitz

I'm thinking about getting this based on the Josh Groban hype.

This is a band of sonic showoffs, nothing more. And who likes showoffs?

Ugh. Hate this line of argument so much.

"Two Weeks" ... the one song that doesn't lull the listener into a near-comatose state

i agree with this

did they used to have a hotter drummer?

They were fabulous live when I saw them last year at the Walt Disney Concert Hall in LA. And if anything, I felt they weren't showing off *enough*.

The Los Angeles Philharmonic opened with a few fabulous performances of some of the band's favorite classical stuff---stuff ranging from Stravinsky to Britten. Met them at the afterparty; all lovely, unassuming people.

i don't find grizzly bear to be boring at all, and i find "it's boring" to be just as shoddy an argument as the "sonic showoffs" one that jaymc pointed out above, especially when the critic doesn't even bother to validate that claim any further. is it boring because the music is slow? explaaaiiiinnnnnnnn.

did they used to have a hotter drummer?

Vivian Bear

Streaming it now.

This disc is very good.

streaming it too. hell of a lot better than their previous stuff i think?

When reviewers claim a record sounds like the Beach Boys, I almost never agree. Case in point, that review quoted above. Do others hear the Beach Boys in this album?

i don't think there's much grounds for saying that they're ripping off the beach boys. aside from the fact that they often have full band vocal harmonies, which obv the beach boys didnt invent anyways, there isn't much similarity in terms of melodic tone or composition style.

Do others hear the Beach Boys in this album?

Call me crazy. I hear Journey in this album (re: vocal harmonies).

I hear Journey in this album

so, which track is the Grizzly Bear's Don't Stop Believin'?

While You Wait For The Others, I'd say (tho it's slower, smarter, more melancholy).

And Foreground is their version of a Journey ballad.

Washington Post guy quoted above OTmfM.

no way! i wouldn't automatically disagree with someone who doesn't like the album either, his points are just super wrong. after giving what sounds like glorious praise to the album's production he gets all "it's nothing but texture," as if it's some kind of amorphous ambient album. if you doesn't like something about the songwriting say it, but don't act like it doesn't exist. he says the album is overstuffed, but it's way less sonically crowded than "yellow house" and a million times more precise and controlled. he says the album is boring but he doesn't explain why, and he barely even mentions what they sound like. i have a strong feeling that david malitz had decided he didn't like the album after hearing it talked about a million times and wrote the review having only listened to it once.

^I agree. And comparing this album to the Beach Boys is lame. It's the kind of thing somebody who doesn't really listent to much music would write, just because there are multiple-part harmonies.

david malitz has never heard a 70s prog rock album if he thinks veckitamist is anything close to one. at most they sound like procol harem

Yellow House was a favourite of mine in 2006...it went well with the Fall season; it was brooding and slow...its melodies understated...I listened to that record probably for about 6-7 months on a fairly regular basis...and i even attended a G-bear show opening for TVOR. I don't think I listened to Yellow House at all in 2008, except when i pulled it out around Christmas time...it now sounded dull and laborious. I've been listening to the advance of Veckatimest for about 3 months, and it does little for me...there's really nothing here that excites to any great degree. It certainly has some moments of stunning beauty/Ready Able has a lovely languish to it, "They go we go, I want you to know, what I did I did." I would prefer more of this repetetive hypnotizing vocal arrangement actually...I tend to agree with some of Grizzly Bear's detractors at this stage; they can become a tedious and boring listen...all that being said, i might still pick this up...?

Southern Point, people, Southern Point. What an opener. The galloping! The spiraling!

yeah parts of this are really good. southern point is very good, two weeks is incredible, but the middle sort of loses me for a while. while you wait for others picks it up and the last song is nice but kind of an outlier...as such it works as a closer

The middle section is very gentle and dreamy; I'd wager on, like the second side of Leaders Of The Free World by Elbow, it growing in stature as people become familiar with it over a few months / a year or two.

Is it just me or does "Southern Point" have some major Pink Floyd Animals influence in there? I distinctly hear "Dogs" in that guitar part.

Love this album. Some great hooks in the bridges and choruses.

how ca-a-an i, get o-o-out, of what i'm in, to, with you?

is veckatimest's "each day i spend it with you now"

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?multiverseid=2217&type=card

<3 chuck eddy

Chuck Eddy: So what’s supposed to make these lethargic twits so otherworldly and awesome again? Must be the harmonies, since as innocuous as they are, they’re all I hear, beyond some piddly clinking at the end. And that’s enough for a full fucking page in the NY Times Sunday Arts section? Which I didn’t read? This is hookless, gutless, grooveless, shapeless drivel for college children who still wet Mom’s bed. “Doo wop” my ass.
[1]

not even heard this record but "who wet the bed" is a fairly desperate criticism. who is he liam gallagher or something?

put on some real fuckin music for real fuckin men

like christy moore

"college children"

what is a "college child"

someone who listens to "grizzly bear"

yeah cos real people have real jobs like mechanic, or soldier, or ROCK CRITIC, lololol

lol

in a a way,i wish i could like this album more.
maybe it's the sort of an album that in some years from now will click with me at last.maybe not.

Indie rock band Grizzly Bear is having its best week ever as its third full-length studio set, "Veckatimest," arrives at No. 8 with 33,000. That's the first album to chart on the Billboard 200 for the Massachusetts band and it also gives the quartet its best sales week. 40% of its sales came from downloads while another 24% were shifted at independent and small chain stores.

jeeeez

just got this the other day, but i haven't really listened to it

Oh so YOU'RE one of the guilty ones.

on vinyl, even :-/

Chuck Eddy: So what’s supposed to make these lethargic twits so otherworldly and awesome again? Must be the harmonies, since as innocuous as they are, they’re all I hear, beyond some piddly clinking at the end. And that’s enough for a full fucking page in the NY Times Sunday Arts section? Which I didn’t read? This is hookless, gutless, grooveless, shapeless drivel for college children who still wet Mom’s bed. “Doo wop” my ass.

fucking sad piece of writing imo.

I wet my bed laughing.

grizzly big & rich

kixxly bear

So what’s supposed to make these lethargic twits so otherworldly and awesome again? Must be the harmonies, since as innocuous as they are, they’re all I hear, beyond some piddly clinking at the end. And that’s enough for a full fucking page in the NY Times Sunday Arts section? Which I didn’t read?

I'm no Grizzly Bear fan (video's cute, music's pretty zzz) but if you want to know why people are so otherworldly and awesome maybe you should read the full fucking page in the NY Times Sunday Arts section.

haha yeah lol at "Which I didn’t read?"

MUSIC CRITCS ARE THE ART OF PRETEND FORGETFULLNESS

it's a very nice sounding cd with some fantastic standout tracks (somewhat deceptively bundled at the beginning), but i don't know, from what i read i expected it to sound more vital and focused for the whole duration. some of these songs play out a bit like mood pieces. didn't anticipate all those extended lulls, which are pretty enough but a little pedestrian.

this could still grow on me heaps though. i'll be happy to keep listening.

hmmmm 'ready, able' has some lovely bits. overlooked that one the first couple of times i played this through.

thought this was really otm

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/30/arts/music/30griz.html?_r=2&ref=music

esp the first paragraph

Music moves; it can’t do anything else. Grizzly Bear’s songs rev without going anywhere. With broad vocal harmonies and harmonic motion built from unusual guitar tunings, the band gives you beauty until you can’t stand it. I found myself lost in a few bright, bursting moments of its show at Town Hall on Thursday. They felt like static pleasures, though. The concert sits in my memory like a slide show.

I don't recognise claims that this album has "no rhythm" or that it makes rhythm a very poor cousin to harmony, or something; maybe I listen differently to other people but I hear a lot of rhythmic shifting in this band, a real galloping imperative on some of the faster number. Southern Point, to me, isn't about the harmonies, for instance - it's about the driving rhythm of the fast section, the tumult, the spirals of guitar. It's about it being psychedelic.

otm, this is like when ppl cited that national album as having "no rhythm" (i think it's when that dumb sf-j piece came out) because the only rhythm they recognize is funk or something. the drummer in this band is sick.

does anyone get a bit of an ayers/wyatt canterbury vibe from this record?

there's a live video/interview up on spinner.com, music notwithstanding these guys are super boring.

no discussion they have rhythm though. that's probably what's drawn me to them before, those heavy chunky beats. i'd say they would do better with a lot less swooning vocals and harmonies etc, but it's a formula i guess.

http://www.barbican.org.uk/music/event-detail.asp?ID=9467

Grizzly Bear + London Symphony Orchestra
Brooklyn's Grizzly Bear have produced one of 2009's finest albums in Veckatimest. Here they perform arrangements by composer Nico Muhly with the LSO
31 October 2009 / 20:00
Barbican Hall

Tickets: £20 / 25

Anyone else thinking of going?

Tempting.

Chuck Eddy: So what’s supposed to make these lethargic twits so otherworldly and awesome again? Must be the harmonies, since as innocuous as they are, they’re all I hear, beyond some piddly clinking at the end. And that’s enough for a full fucking page in the NY Times Sunday Arts section? Which I didn’t read? This is hookless, gutless, grooveless, shapeless drivel for college children who still wet Mom’s bed. “Doo wop” my ass.

fucking sad OTM piece of writing imo.

Fixed.

one of my friends graduated from an elite college three years ago and now lives with his mom. he loves grizzly bear. QED

i like this but I like it decidedly less than the earlier two records.

"All We Ask" is a real gem - those chords on the Rossen-sung bits are delicious.

This is hookless, gutless, grooveless, shapeless drivel for college children who still wet Mom’s bed.

this works for Vampire Weekend, too

It works for most every white indie guitar band on the market!

Especially those who play shows with orchestras.

music critics who act like tough guys towards non-threatening indie bands still at least as obnoxious as the bands themselves.

it's not a tough guy pose really if the music sounds like sesame street

am still genuinely confused as to why the go-to move is to infantilize bands recognized as belonging to this amorphous "type."

because they sound like music made for little kids?

i'm not trying to be dense on purpose but i don't understand that sentiment at all.

yeah i dont either and lots of times it really is ppl taking macho tough guy stances - there were so many people when the vw album dropped who were like "this just makes me want to listen to black flag!!", which while maybe true, isn't a valid criticism of the music, not to mention that no one will ever go "wow this black flag really makes me want to listen to some soothing minimal techno!"

there were so many people when the vw album dropped who were like "this just makes me want to listen to black flag!!", which while maybe true, isn't a valid criticism of the music, not to mention that no one will ever go "wow this black flag really makes me want to listen to some soothing minimal techno!"

i guess when i listen to this kind of music, it reminds me of the same kind of instrumental music that played during those weird segments on sesame street. it also feels spineless. yeah the melodies might be okay--but it's just not my cup of tea. i think the reason VW makes people want to listen to stuff like black flag or whatever is because it's like the complete opposite of the experience you get from listening to VW. in a way, it is a valid criticism: "I hate this so much, i want to listen to the complete opposite."

it reminds me of music written for kids--Raffi, etc. singsongy and catchy, sure but at the end of the day totally weak and lame, musically? i dunno

i mean if it's "not your cup of tea" that's fine i guess--do you just dislike indie pop? 'cause then you're not going to like vw. but what is "spinelessness" as it applies to music? because it comes across as a v. posturing word to be using.

i'm also generally bothered by the idea that there is some kind of general category that ties together a lot of these bands that get tied together. it's as lazy as "i like everything except rap and country."

i was thinking about raffi, and barney, and sesame st. neither vw or grizz bear are ANYTHING like that stuff dude.

for me these kinds of sentiments always reminded me of like a hulking mosh dude going "fuck this pussy shit!" which is not really a sentiment that vibes w the way i grew up and/or live

and if anything the tying of these bands together is really just a way to express distaste towards skinny jeans hipster kids because the number one thing that's similar about vampire weekend and grizzly bear are their audiences

i'm not saying there's a category though--just saying what i don't like about two bands. and yeah i like "indie pop" whatever that means. . .which to me it means Built to Spill and Beat Happening and The Clean and stuff. and it's not lazy either--i've listened to these two bands we're talking about and i don't like them. how is that lazy?

sorry you think i'm posturing but spinelessness just to me means dull boring crap like VW and Grizzly Bear and the Decemberists. sorry you don't agree with me that it sounds like little kid music, but i'm not here to convince you, i'm just telling you what i think

and if anything the tying of these bands together is really just a way to express distaste towards skinny jeans hipster kids because the number one thing that's similar about vampire weekend and grizzly bear are their audiences

this is total bullshit, dude. i haven't said a single thing about the audience, i've stuck to talking about the music and why i don't like it.

yeah ronan pointed out what a bs criticism the "bedwetting college child" is upthread, but some people sure do hate that indie rock

although i do think the bedwedding crack is pretty funny

fwiw, my review here isn't negative:

http://www.emusic.com/album/Vampire-Weekend-Vampire-Weekend-MP3-Download/11227999.html

yeah sry mr. que i didn't mean to imply that you were creating a category but there is a general sentiment in criticism of this stuff that it is linked and the big musical argument seems to be that it's "weak" or "pretentious" or that it is "This is hookless, gutless, grooveless, shapeless drivel for college children who still wet Mom’s bed". i mostly want to engage you on what makes it "dull," "boring," "spineless," etc. etc. but that's cool we don't have to go there.

fwiw i hate the decemberists because their lyrics are just too much and they seem to be genuinely boring rhythmically (which i don't think is a valid criticism for vw or gb).

i mean i know this is ilm and stuff, but when i mention a band to a friend and he says "i dunno i found it kind of boring," i usually just say "ok" or whatever. sometimes we'll talk more about why it's boring and stuff, but not everyone has to like the same bands! i just think they're kind of dull. there's lots of music out there, though, that's the good thing

hatred of colin meloy bringing people together

i don't hate indie rock--i just hate some bands

yeah dude i'm def. not trying to convince anyone of anything but this is an interesting conversation to me.

i agree that grizzly bear is hookless, gutless, grooveless and shapeless its just the bed wetting thing that puts me off. while it's a good zing there's just an air of masculine superiority to it that i don't really like

xp Mr Que i definitely feel what you're saying, i hate neither indie rock or the audience, couldn't really care less, but to me this new album sounds offensively nice and well-mannered in all the wrongest ways

how is anything that is orchestral not very nice and well-mannered

these posts are boring

lets all listen to the royal trux

"hookless" - possibly tho i don't really think so
"grooveless" - depends on what yr looking for i guess
"shapeless" - could definitely see this
but what is "gutless" anyway?

doesn't make you feel like you are going to shit your pants

wimpy

like the band hasn't listened to enough rock and roll to make it interesting for those of us who LOVE rock and roll

i mean yeah i guess if you require x amnt of rock and roll in music i can see these bands failing.

i mean yeah i kinda do--otherwise i'll just listen to classical music

classical music is for pantywaists

sometimes we want to act like pantywaists--good music to wet the bed to

lol i have no use whatsoever for recorded classical music.

This thread is making me wanna play Killing Joke.

you should have said "this thread makes me want to read a thread on I Love Books."

Does anyone remember the movie The Ice Pirates, with the space herpes? Listening to Grizzly Bear is what I assume that contracting space herpes would be like.

GRIZZLY BEAR

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/31hDuFOy3DL._SL262_.jpg

-VS-

SPACE HERPES

http://www.theicepirateship.co.uk/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/.pond/spaceherpes.jpg.w300h163.jpg

... there's just an air of masculine superiority to it that i don't really like

also grizzly bear are gay im pretty sure well some of them atleast.

"This is just music for saddo students who think the scene in 'Rushmore' when "Ooh La La' starts playing is the most life-affirming moment in the history of art."

I've been listening to this on and off since it came out, and the better moments on it are only coming into focus for me now, i.e. it did seem like an undifferentiated mass at first. One thing I did notice was that the bass and drums are used mostly as punctuation, so you're never gonna see them lock into a groove. Not that the songs seem structured/written with that in mind. Also, yer average indie pop rhythm section can look a bit out of their depth when they try that stuff.

That said, a lot of the more over the top criticism of the band seems like it's coming from people who want to live vicariously through music, and to them, Grizzly Bear seems a bit too much like looking in the mirror (ooh burn I know).

I just think there are some good songs but the album lacks cohesiveness (sequencing specifically) and was generally over-thought on a song by song basis.

That's the best criticism I've seen of it thus far. I think it ought to be twO songs shorter.

free show in de Willaimsburg today

might be a mob scene though. last week they turned away girltalk/max tundra goers who didn't show up by like 11

haha, 11. wtf

the gates don't open til 2. Screw any show that involves 4 hrs in line.

naw you can just walk right in. they dont come on till like 6. that line is for suckers.

I got thru the gate at 3:15. Liked their set, esp you-know-that-one-song, but don't get the worship.

I assume the "you-know-that-one-song" is The Knife, but the new disc is waaaaayyyyyy better than Yellow House (The Knife is on Yellow House).

so, uh, "while you wait for the others" featuring michael mcdonald

You mean starring. He has the lead!

listening to this Michael McDonald version right now. it sounds very different and very good.

I only heard a portion of it and it sounded kind of strange.

but the new disc is waaaaayyyyyy better than Yellow House

Respectfully disagree.

i listened to it on bad speakers but while i liked mcdonald's vocal, it sounded awkwardly placed on the original track.

totally

i think the thing that stood out for me on my first listen was how it ended. Michael was really able to shine, though the original is better.

couple listens later i'm diggin it a lot tbh.

this whole album is actually intriguing.

I feel bad for being kind of dismissive on first listen way back whenever.

they have taken a beating as of late on this board. their album is better then Bat for Lashes or Yeah Yeah Yeahs which ranked higher.

I don't think ilm hates grizzly bear as much as ilm likes the idea of hating grizzly bear.

"hookless" (sorta) "grooveless" (I am pretty sure they weren't trying to make funk music) and "shapeless" (this is a good thing)...and very pretty. also kinda proggy.

yeah, been finally coming around on this album the past few months. mea culpa. it still wouldn't have made my top 10 but mighta snuck in the top 20. while you wait for the others is great.

love Ed Droste's soaring, reverbed-out oooooohhhhhhoooooohhhhhhoooooohhhhhh at the end of "While You Wait For The Others"

tbh i kind of love how ready, able's chorus sounds

Can't get enough of this at the moment.

My bandmates all fucking love this album and basically want to do this kind of thing, whereas I just wanna do funky reggae post-punk jams. How can I tell them they're wrong?

Maybe you're in the wrong band.

never liked anything by these guys before, but "Sleeping Ute" is awesome

tis indeed

In retrospect this is one of my favorite records of the 00's.

it's an awesome record, and they're an exceptional band. your revive and the thread i just posted coincided

yes covers: opo

there isn't enough magic music to go around

coincided because your yes thread coincided with my having recently revisited this, which made me think to revive this thread

The other night I was working on a song on the guitar and then I thought to myself "I think I have sort of a Southern Point vibe in mind," and then I went to listen to that and thought "I will never record anything remotely as breathtaking as this, should probably just give up."