the Sonic Youth poll for songs with Lee Ranaldo on lead vox

"Genetic"

"Mote" would have taken it if not the for the four minutes of noise at the end.

Like I said on the other thread, "Hoarfrost." The guy's too fulla bad Beat poetry for my taste, so he only takes off when the music is as mysterious and mysteriously sexy as the best Beat poetry. "Hey Joni" is pretty thunderous though. Even if isn't a dialogue with the most famous Joni, I like to think so: one shit talker addressing another.

when i saw them last week they played "Hey Joni" and both songs from the new one -- three Lee songs in one show! <3 <3 <3

Hey Joni

"Mote" took it BECAUSE of the four minutes of noise at the end!

pipeline or mote

Mote
Mote
Mote

Gonna have to agree with everybody else and say "Hey Joni."

Soto is OTM about him, too

man he is on less songs than i thought he is on

'skip tracer'

lee's "bad Beat poetry" is better than anyone else in the band's "bad Beat poetry"

Well, no: Moore sticks to slogans-plus, while Kim filters Germaine Greer through back issues of Artforum.

Can't decide between "Mote" amd "In the Kingdom #19" which I love for its cinematic feel.

Actually "Wish Fulfilment" is pretty lovely too. Lee always did a line in sad melodees better than Thurston did.

my ranking:

Eric's Trip > Skip Tracer > Genetic > Hoarfrost > Hey Joni > Karen Revisited > Pipeline/Kill Time > Unwind > What We Know > Mote > Wish Fulfillment > Saucer-Like > I Dreamed I Dream > NYC Ghosts & Flowers > Karen Koltrane > Rain King > Paper Cut Exit > In The Kingdom #19 > Rats > Lee #2 > Walkin Blue

went pipeline/kill time narrowly over eric's trip and genetic

karen revisited over wish fulfillment, genetic, and rain king.

"Mote" took it BECAUSE of the four minutes of noise at the end!

Word.

"Mote" would have taken it if not the for the four minutes of noise at the end = throwing a bone to Lee (duh)

Moore sticks to slogans-plus, while Kim filters Germaine Greer through back issues of Artforum.

Soto = national treasure.

Lee's very easily my least fave of the three voxers. But oddly enough, he sings my two fave songs on Daydream Nation (if Trilogy doesn't count). So I'm voting for "Hey Joni" today and "Rain King" if I get another vote.

Even if isn't a dialogue with the most famous Joni

But there's definitely a way in which the most famous Joni haunts the song. She's one of the things we have to put behind us.

you think Lee had to convince other members of the band to indulge him with a long noisy coda?

There's a sense in which he Keeps The Band Real by reminding them of their boho past.

xpost um, that's not what throwing a bone to him means

But yeah keeping it real (ugh) is about the only function his noise bullshit serves (besides disfiguring good songs/albums).

again..."his noise bullshit"? Thurston and Kim songs don't have any long noise sections?

But yeah keeping it real (ugh) is about the only function his noise bullshit serves (besides disfiguring good songs/albums).

o_O

pure wrongness

I accept him, like George Harrison in his band, as part of the Sonic Youth Experience; he coughs up at least one song per album that pushes past my visceral biases. I mean, the band is not the same without him.

fuckin the future

Is Julio Afrokeluchie Dave Queen?

I like Genetic a lot, but I think it's going to get overrated a bit due to the whole "Kim and Thurston leave the best song off of the album" thing.

I think Kim actually has the better vocals on I Dreamed I Dream (wish she'd stayed with that approach instead of descending into suck-dom) so it's hard to give that to Lee.

I'm just going with the best song on this list, from arguably their best album, so Pipeline/Kill Time.

hey joni

though this whole list of songs is going to make a killer comp -- i love LEEEEEEE

that should probably read: this whole list of songs is going to make a killer, slightly repetitive comp

guys eric's trip is so much better than hey joni!

some dude otm

dunno, i think it's that super cool ending on Hey Joni that seals the deal for me ... one of the top Sonic Youth-y moments for Sonic Youth!

First of all,

"I mean, the band is not the same without him."

Totally, he is just a fucking great guitar player, so regardless of whether you like "his" songs or not, he is a huge part of what makes this band great. Just so many great Lee moments on almost any SY song. But, this is the Lee vocal poll, I guess, so really difficult for me. Would change all the time, but if I really go with my gut gotta say it's "Hey Joni." Just so good. All the Washing Machine songs are great, he was certainly on a roll from that record through Sonic Nurse (if having one or more songs a record can be considered a roll, but it would make a really good record if you combined the songs from the records from that span). Gotta say the biggest surprise when I gave Sonic Nurse a listen again after a long hiatus was "Paper Cup Exit," stuck out to me as maybe the best song on that record.

A disproportionate number of my favourite SY songs are Lee's. I picked Hey Joni, but that could have easily been Mote, Wish Fulfillment, or any number of others. He doesn't get a lot of songs per album, but I think he tends to make his song or two really count.

yeah, I don't think that Lee is really the "noise guy" of the band -- a lot of his lead guitar stuff is super-melodic, psychedelic grooviness.

this is the toughest poll of all

Voted Paper Cup Exit.

fuck me. could have gone with at least 13 of these. went with "Eric's Trip" in the end, probably 'cause it's the very best track (maybe) on their most overrated album ever.

Pipeline or Wish Fulfillment probably my fave tracks of his.

don't really get the noise blame he gets here either (it's Sonic Youth for chrissakes), his songs usually sounds pretty good even before i've had my coffee. like tylerw said, he's often a bit groovier and more adventurous player

We'll know there when we get there.

There's a sense in which he Keeps The Band Real by reminding them of their boho past.

But yeah keeping it real (ugh) is about the only function his noise bullshit serves (besides disfiguring good songs/albums).

this is some seriously wrong shit, even for ILM!

So it goes.

I give most of the credit for the trippiness of ATL, though.

thanks for letting us know

You're welcome, hoss.

Can't decide between "Mote" amd "In the Kingdom #19" which I love for its cinematic feel.

^this

but I think "the bridge" might be my favorite lee song

oh believe me, there'll be a Lee side projects poll at some point

Oh we believe you!

But yeah keeping it real (ugh) is about the only function his noise bullshit serves (besides disfiguring good songs/albums).

Actually, let me clarify this so Mr. Que doesn't run out of heart pills. I'm really only talking about "Mote" and "Karen Revisited" here. I'm well aware that noise plays a rather, um, crucial role in Sonic Youth. But in those two instances, it diminishes the songs/albums. I think I've made it pretty clear that I love Lee. So, deep breaths.

i think it's wrong to assume that just because Lee sings a SY song that the "noise bullshit" is his

where is the LOVE for PIPELINE?!

not only a great Lee song, but great production and DRUMS.

SY should call their next album "NOISE BULLSHIT"

just a reminder:

who is the best songwriter in Sonic Youth?
Message BookmarkedBookmark Removed
?

Poll Results
Option Votes
Lee 28
Thurston 24
Kim 14

who is the best songwriter in Sonic Youth?

i think it's wrong to assume that just because Lee sings a SY song that the "noise bullshit" is his

― Mr. Que, Tuesday, July 14, 2009 10:19 AM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

otm esp because that SY book makes a big deal about how they write all their songs by jamming until the music is done and then deciding who does the vocals. don't know if this was always their process but it definitely has been for all the recent ones.

Pipeline/Kill Time or Eric's Trip.

I love me some Lee. I have a few of his side projects, the tape loopy ones and the DIY bedroom ones. I remember liking the ep on Starlight Furniture Co.

gotta give it up for the solo demo of "Eric's Trip" on the DN deluxe thing-o.

I'm really only talking about "Mote" and "Karen Revisited" here. I'm well aware that noise plays a rather, um, crucial role in Sonic Youth. But in those two instances, it diminishes the songs/albums. I think I've made it pretty clear that I love Lee. So, deep breaths.

― Kevin John Bozelka, Tuesday, July 14, 2009 11:17 AM (14 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I guess I understand this, but not really. I've never been a big fan of the long slow instrumental drift that closes Washing Machine, but a nice little "end of side 1, turn over record" moments no Goo and Murray Street always seemed to work fine for me as part of each album's arc.

Never heard that demo.

I always felt that the extended noise parts on Goo were overdoing it. I know a lot of people feel that way about Daydream, that they could've edited that stuff down and made Daydream a fine single album but it always seemed essential on Daydream, whereas with Goo I find myself reaching for the "next" button.

Dan Selzer beyond OTM! Evol to you.

i think it's wrong to assume that just because Lee sings a SY song that the "noise bullshit" is his

otm esp because that SY book makes a big deal about how they write all their songs by jamming until the music is done and then deciding who does the vocals.

Right but that doesn't negate the fact that conceptually, the noise bullshit is his on those two tracks, esp. since he's the one who's voiced the most discomfort (c. Goo at least) with the band's more songful direction.

all fine and good except Thurston is so clearly a bigger noise fiend in almost every way

Right but that doesn't negate the fact that conceptually, the noise bullshit is his on those two tracks, esp. since he's the one who's voiced the most discomfort (c. Goo at least) with the band's more songful direction.

― Kevin John Bozelka, Tuesday, July 14, 2009 10:39 AM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

uh it does negate that fact, the noise can't be his if the band writes it by jamming. also it's weird that he supposedly has concerns about the move towards songs since he's written some of the songiest songs on their albums in the past 10 years or so. "walkin' blue" is the most traditional thing on the eternal for example.

So what, I'm lying now? And look up the word "conceptually" when you get a chance.

pipeline/kill time, followed closely by hey joni

I'm not saying you're lying, I'm just saying sometimes there's a difference between what someone says and what someone does.

"Karen Revisited". The moment when he/they should "Karen" the first time, after the "ask me if I care" bit, seals it for me. I love emo SY an awful lot, perhaps because detached SY dominates their oeuvre and so the emo moments stand out.

guys are you ready for me to blow your minds? ready? Paul wrote "Helter Skelter"!

You can trade it for John's "Good Night."

whoa, I thought motley crue wrote "helter skelter"

xxpost

But the most pressing question is who writes your posts.

http://images1.cafepress.com/product/99684311v20_150x150_Front.jpg

Difficult but I think I'll go with 'Slip Tracer'

can I just say that I always thought the "it's 1963, it's 1964, it's 1957, it's 1962" part of Hey Joni reminded me of the Richard Mguire comic in one of the Raw books where the date keeps jumping forward and backward, the one that was a big influence on Chris Ware's "Lamp"

it's funny when they do it live and he throws out a completely different set of random years, tho

Joni Mitchell's so old that there's no record of a birth certificate, remember.

gonna wait till the day before and see which of my faves doesn't have an outspoken supporter

i really like his delivery of the phrase "new york city ghosts ... and ... flow ers ..."

i'm aware it might be seen as a bit cornball

lee's "bad Beat poetry" is better than anyone else in the band's "bad Beat poetry"

― thomp, Tuesday, July 14, 2009 12:37 AM (20 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Well, no: Moore sticks to slogans-plus, while Kim filters Germaine Greer through back issues of Artforum.

― My name is Kenny! (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, July 14, 2009 12:39 AM (20 hours ago) Bookmark

i actually wrote a post kvetching about how "Beat poetry" is sort of grabbed at as a descriptor for er 'wide-eyed and/or sweary spoken word possibly mentioning sex and/or drugs'. i wouldn't want to deny that he has bad poetry moments, but he seems like to 've read, you know, probably all of the new american poetry, and not just part iv

taking skip tracer, cuz i voted for it:

"the girl started out in red patent leather / very I'm-in-a-band"
"borrowed and never returned : emotions, books, outlooks on life"

- these are

i) not particularly good as poetry
ii) not particularly Beat, i think, as poetry
iii) pretty good, actually, as spoken word song things

haha 'skip tracer' is a burroughs reference isn't it n/m

Ranaldo writing lyrics based on Bishop or Merrill poems would probably meet my standards

(xpost)

i'll take ranaldo over beck or whatever else was on the alt-rock charts during the 90s.

As far as lyrics go (for Lee and for Thurston) I really want someone to expand on the Kim Fowley influence, 'cause to my ears there are just *huge* similarities between 70's Fowley and teh SY. Xgau drops the reference to Fowley being a big influence like it's common knowledge, but damned if I've ever read anyone flesh that out.

Anyway, Hey Joni's spoken bits end up reminding me an awful lot of the spoken part of the otherwise dissimilar "Love Is A Game" by the evil Mr. F.

Xgau didn't mean that musically, though. He meant that they both ripoff the consumer with bad music and/or bullshit repackagings.

I always thought that, but the way Fowley's lyrics read is actually crazy similar to SY's.

hey, I love "Bubblegum"!

I love all of Outrageous.

The ones I love are Sunset Boulevard and International Heroes. Anyway, lyrics to Fowley's "Blow Up" (for example) are totally SY compatible. They could cover it and nobody would know it wasn't an original.

Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.

felt like throwing "Skip Tracer" a vote today

good song!

"Kick it!" (Hey Joni)

"Mote" now and forever. (It's actually my favorite SY song, period.)

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

Am surprised that Genetic finished so unloved.

i think most of us who are nuts about it probably had their fill of repping for it by the time the Dirty reissue came out

i can dig these results

i dig them too, except for Wish Fulfillment finishing below Kingdom #19, that's just crazy

would've voted "In The Kingdom #19" because of the screaming when thurston lights off firecrackers in the studio

though this whole list of songs is going to make a killer comp -- i love LEEEEEEE

― tylerw, Tuesday, July 14, 2009

probably would've voted "hey joni" but "what we know" deserves something

The fact that "Wish Fulfillment" got only 3 votes is kinda sad

low "wish fulfillment" tally is surprising and none for "Saucer Like"?! thanks for the

sweet, thx barnaby, never got around to doing that cop myself.

and enjoy the show tonight! they were awesome when i saw 'em a few months ago.

tx for the tape, barnaby. looking forward to revisiting some of the post-thousand leaves tracks that i either wasn't crazy about at the time or never heard at all. remember "NYC ghosts and flowers," for instance, being horrid, but maybe i wasn't listening right, i dunno.

anyway, i'm bummed to have missed this poll/discussion, SY being one of my favorite bands, lee being my plastic jesus. would have voted for "mote" (raggett OTM), "rain king" or "i dreamed i dream." god, but "pipeline," but "hoarfrost," but "skip tracer"...

Thanks Barnaby.

Downloaded it. Thanks!

used to think he was the best songwriter evah or something

'it sounds crazy' but by hit-rate there can't be (m)any better

^ OTM

tho tobin sprout hit a similar average on those early GBV records

(faultless 2nd bananas poll)

seems like spiral stairs would fit in there, but he is far from faultless

I would jump off a building and hoped I landed on Spiral Stairs.

i dont even know which songs he wrote

generally speaking, the ones he sang ... two state, hit the plane down etc.

well he wrote pavement songs so i'm not sure he's going to be challenging schubert and arthur lee

unexpected tag team

the Lennon-McCartney of art-suck?

are schubert and arthur lee faultless second bananas?

art suck could be your life

arthur LEE, not arthur SUCK...! God, clean out yr ~ears~

thanks for that comp!!! lee is the best!!!

i def wouldve chosen 'hey joni' on this poll cuz its my favorite SY song

karen I & II are so perfect, beautiful and sad

i made a Lee mix a few years ago, cool to see someone else's and some small ways the sequencing is similar (especially opening with Mote/Hoarfrost): http://narrowcast.blogspot.com/2006/08/sonic-youth-notorious-rockin-lee.html#comments

yeah hooray and thanks. tried to get this together inspired by his thread but foiled by mp3 lack.

home from dinner and listening to the comp. lost the sequencing importing it to ituens, so i'm just running it sequentially. wanted to note that the drum break before the second verse of "pipeline", about 1 minute in, is one of my all-time favorite musical moments. bum ... ba BOOM ba ksh ksh (pause) crak boomboom BAM BAM! so rad.

hokay, so i listened to all the lee is free songs, and they are some great, but it was somewhat disappointing to find that the somewhat disappointing post-dirty dropoff that i once thought i noticed still seems to exist. at least in and among the lee songs. i'd hoped it was mere figment and that i'd be blown away, chagrined chet-like at what i'd then failed to understand. but no.

of the songs i knew, i still dig "skip tracer" and the thousand leaves cuts, still loathe "nyc ghosts & flowers", and "rats" is awesome (but much better than most of RR, iirc). biggest surprise was the relative excellence of "karen revisited" and the eternal tracks (great drum recording). reservations aside, i guess i need to pick up the last 4 albums and really spend some time with them. rather ripped is the only one i've heard from front to back...

'pipeline' is sucha rad fukken song man

fukken a

No problem on the mixtape, you're all most welcome.

The Manchester gig I caught in December wasn't so hot unfortunately. I wasn't really feeling the setlist and the band seemed under-rehearsed (Catholic Block took three attempts to get right!).

Still, the encores ruled.

Sonic Youth - Manchester Academy - Dec 30th 2010

1. No Way
2. Sacred Trickster
3. Calming The Snake
4. Tom Violence
5. Walkin Blue
6. Leaky Lifeboat (for Gregory Corso)
7. Poison Arrow
8. Anti-Orgasm
9. Antenna
10. (I Gotta A) Catholic Block
11. Stereo Sanctity
12. What We Know
13. Massage The History

Encore

1. The Sprawl
2. Cross The Breeze

Encore

1. White Cross
2. Death Valley '69

haven't seen them in so so long. have to make the time next time they're around.

"i dreamed i dream" got fukken shafted in this poll. one of their very best songs. half regret voting for "mote" now...

no votes for "Saucer-Like"?????????????????? besides that wack beat poetry shit in the middle, that's one of SY's most thrilling and creepy songs.

"Saucer-Like" is great, one of the reasons I love that record. Still hard to vote for it over the other classic Lee tunes though.

Would put it over "Skip Tracer" though (even though I also like "Skip Tracer" a lot ....)

My picks

Hoarfrost is an unexpectedly low key and beautiful choice, from one of my favorite Sonic Youth albums

We'll know wheeeeeennnn

it's so good

Skip Tracer is my #1, glad to see it listed. Great song, kind of scary.

"Rats" v. underrated Lee cut.

I remember liking Pipeline/Kill TIme but I think Eric's Trip was the first time I thought of Lee Ranaldo as a distinct entity within the band

same!

even on "Hoarfrost" I thought at first that Moore sang it.

His solo records have been outstanding. It doesn’t sound anything like Sonic Youth. It’s much more melodic. Almost like classic rock.

Crazy that "Genetic" only ended up with 2 votes. It was on the My So-Called Life soundtrack (which should be polled!)

he grew up as a deadhead xp

Great Lee video (we need that SYR with Nels Cline!): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVMo4F2H0dY

"Wish Fulfillment" is such a sad song. Like something Thalia Zedek would have written.

Skip Tracer is so good.. the production on Washing Machine is stellar, I never really recognized its shortcomings (lack of bass?) ... i didn't realize Lee had such a strong presence on Unwind, it's not so obvious / apparent. a friend of mine once recorded (himself singing) a short parody of Ranaldo's vocal delivery--it's pretty spot on. Haven't kept up with Lee's recent output, he seemed to get a bit hackneyed (similar to Thurston), recycling bits of his old recordings for some of his more recent free-form sound work, but i can't really speak on the recent song-based stuff

Eric’s Trip made me think about music a little differently when I heard it in high school - like, I’d heard a few Somic Youth songs, and had even seen them live at this point (touring Murray St at a festival), and I got that they incorporated noise, but what I’d heard was the jams in the middle of songs (or just slamming their guitars against the amps during Karen Revisited). Eric’s Trip was the first song I’d heard where the noise seemed to actually propel the song, and it didn’t conform to the way I thought about proper songwriting at all, but I immediately loved it.