Worst Beatles song on Abbey Road

Maxwell to walk this?

Come Together

maxwell or i want you.

"I Want You"

Oh! Darling. Hate it hate it.

any one of the first 5

CT and OG are great, eejit.

The medley is great, but the rest of the album I'm not overly fond of.

What do people count as the medley? You Never Give Me Your Money onwards?

I include Because, not sure why though.

yeah

xpost

i never get the 'come together' hate. but the rest of side one is bollocks.

Gotta be "Maxwell..."

Voting for "Come Together" and knowing nobody else will do. But it's still the worst song here. Not to fond of "I Want You (She's So Heavy)", "Mean Mr. Mustard" or "Polythene Pam" either, but "Come Together" remains the worst.
"Because" is fantastically beautiful though, so John's contributions weren't all bad here.

Otherwise, I guess "Maxwell's Silver Hammer" will walk this poll, and I would say it's a kind of interesting song.

Sure, it's not my favourite track here, and as a song itself, it is a bit too simple. But it does have those synth bits that are maybe the best synth on the entire album. And also, there is something intriguing with the lyrics: Here you have this happy-go-lucky twee nursery-rhyme-like melody, and the lyrics seem quite twee at first glance too. But then, hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.

Mind blowing.

Fucking psychopath.

Am I the only one who really really doesn't have any problem with "Maxwell" or what? Why do people hate it so much?

Also I've decided "I Want You" is one of my favourite Beatles tracks - it's so terrifically epic and towering and jazzy and heavy and crunchy and it just overwhelms. Sabbath, two years before the fact basically.

"Octopus's Garden" distracts me more than "Maxwell," because I've been to the House on the Rock.

I think I've decided Abbey Road's possibly my favourite Beatles albums right now, and the only one of which I've gone out and bought the remaster so far. It's compact and it's got everything you need from the Beatles. It also has some of their most beautiful moments, as well as their most harrowing.

The only things I don't like are Mean Mr Mustard and Polythene Pam. The latter I'm going to allow because of the comedy scouse accent, but Mean Mr Mustard annoys me - I don't see how a tramp with no money could be counted as "mean", as the traditional meaning of the word assumes that you are Scrooge-like, which would be impossible if you don't have any money or clothes. Those two tracks sound really unfinished and knocked off and they ruin the loveliness of Because onwards.

polythene pam rulez

Cards on the table time; Abbey Road doesn't really do it for me.

I don't see how a tramp with no money could be counted as "mean", as the traditional meaning of the word assumes that you are Scrooge-like

It's about a man who has lots of money because doesn't spend any of it.

But he's "saving up to buy some clothes"

you are dead maxwell

mind you he does keep a ten-bob note up his nose (so is it a sleight at a certain someone's cocaine habit?)

Polythene Pam is fantastic if it's about a tranny. Either way, Ringo's go-go drums create a beautiful effect here.

the traditional meaning of the word assumes that you are Scrooge-like

mean
2  /min/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [meen] Show IPA
–adjective, -er, -est.
1. offensive, selfish, or unaccommodating; nasty; malicious: a mean remark; He gets mean when he doesn't get his way.

Yeah, but considering that most of the song is about the man not wanting to spend money (or giving the appearance of not wanting to spend money), I think that dog latin is probably using the right connotation. Or, it's a double meaning.

I mean, my strongest suspicion is that it's just doggerel and shouldn't be looked into too deeply.

The backing vocals on Polythene Pam are terrific.

This is my favourite Beatles album. Everything apart from Maxwell's and Octopus's is sublime and enormously poignant.

Octopus's is ridiculously poignant. It is the saddest song ever.

I usually skip 'Maxwell' and 'Oh Darling' because they're boring, but 'Here Comes The Sun'. It absolutely infuriates me for some reason, so I'm voting for it. It's not even just the stupid complexity of the breakdown, I'm grinding my teeth long before that.

. It

It's compact and it's got everything you need from the Beatles.

It doesn't really sound like The Beatles though. Sure, it's a great pop album in its own right, and there is now way that I'd speak unfavourably of "Abbey Road" as a whole. It stands among my fave Beatles albums too, but for The Beatles, as in their typical trademark sound, you'll probably have to go back to 1966 or earlier. 1967 had some of it in it too, only it was another Beatles (the psychedelic Beatles), but from 1968 onwards they were so eclectic and fragmenting they didn't really have that typical Beatles sound anymore. They may have tried to go "back to the roots" in some of those songs, but mostly it was their Hamburg roots rather than the Merseybeat roots. The last Beatles song that really sounded like The Beatles was "All You Need Is Love".

"their Hamburg roots rather than the Merseybeat roots"

what the hell does this mean? they went back and forth between the two. they got good in hamburg but they hardly picked up on new roots.

Didn't George always have a twenty quid note in his shoe/sandal?

what the hell does this mean?

Plain 50s rock'n'roll minus the melody/harmony element that George Martin helped add from "Please Please Me" onwards.

Geir, you make The Beatles sound crap.

Maxwell cos show off-y Paul has always irritated me.

"the end" -- ponderous po-faced pretense.

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Most wtf moment of all these threads.

THE DRUMS! THE GUITARS! THE BEASTIE BOYS!

"the end" -- ponderous po-faced pretense.

Yes... but it still works.

I can't see anything po-faced in The End at all.

Not voting in this one. There are no bad songs on this album. I can't even rate one subjectively "not as good."

I pissed everyone off on the remasters thread just by mentioning I don't like this album so I won't repeat.

My vote- Something. Something in a way I vomit everywhere, more like.

Also, the end of The End is spectacular! Ballsy rock-out to stripped down, quirky piano and voices (and those little cheeky guitar licks!) to big ballad finish out of nowhere, all in the space of thirty seconds. And it all works perfectly.

xposts

Oh Dalek
you make me stand up
you make me sit down daleks
sit down Daleks
etc...

http://s.bebo.com/app-image/7925666873/5411656627/PROFILE/i.quizzaz.com/img/q/u/08/04/01/teletubbies_po.jpg

?

o_0

"Also I've decided "I Want You" is one of my favourite Beatles tracks - it's so terrifically epic and towering and jazzy and heavy and crunchy and it just overwhelms. Sabbath, two years before the fact basically."

It sounds absolutely nothing like Sabbath. Nothing. Also it is a shit song and it has my vote.

Abbey Road came out four months before Black Sabbath s/t. Dont know where the 2 year timeframe comes from.

Know what you mean about 'Something', I always found it too saccharine and I hate the way Sinatra's verdict always gets cited as somehow conclusive - but I found Take 37 as a surrogate for not being able to afford the remasters and I love it now

The soaring middle eight in Something makes the song.

Hi. This is a wholly unfair poll. Wholly unfair.

can I vote for two? Maxwell and The Endy-poo (just the part from "...and in the end" forwards)

You know if "Faust Arp" had been added as an option, it'd win by miles!

(Nobody voting "Her Maj" ?)

"Also I've decided "I Want You" is one of my favourite Beatles tracks - it's so terrifically epic and towering and jazzy and heavy and crunchy and it just overwhelms. Sabbath, two years before the fact basically."

It sounds absolutely nothing like Sabbath. Nothing. Also it is a shit song and it has my vote.

Abbey Road came out four months before Black Sabbath s/t. Dont know where the 2 year timeframe comes from.

― Bill Magill, Friday, September 25, 2009 9:18 AM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark

True, but that noise ending is DECADES ahead of it's time.

Voted "Maxwell's", though this bootleg recording from the sessions almost redeems it:

Maxwell's Silver Hammer (John Sings)

'Her Majesty' is the perfect way to sign off.

Would be amusing if IWY(SSH) won both the best and worst track polls

would also be a flaming disgrace and would necessitate the deletion of ILM XD

gonna go with 'Something', I have decided, because urgh

Adam, you've heard of The MC5, right?

Definitely "Oh Darling." Generally prefer flimsy-whimsy like "Octopus's Garden" and "Maxwell's MC Hammer" over Paul-in-late-60s-primal-scream mode.

Not a fan of Oh Darling, but this can really only be between Maxwell's and Octopus for me. The rest all is sublime.

Oh Darling was the song it took me the longest to love. The clincher is when Paul goes all shouty over the arpeggiated guitars.

hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.
hey, wait! It is actually about a mass murderer! That is kinda cool to me.

Adam, you've heard of The MC5, right?

Not much, do they have a track that has a lot of white noise over it?

Several, from 69. Jazz noise odysseys.

"the end" -- ponderous po-faced pretense.

― flying squid attack (tipsy mothra), Friday, September 25, 2009 1:59 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

don't think you have heard 'the end', friendo.

Sabbath, two years before the fact basically.

"Abbey Road" released September 1969
"Black Sabbath" released February 1970

this album rules and i like every song on it to varying degrees though 'maxwell's silver hammer' is a little repetitive and grating. 'i want you' is sick, you take away the vocals and it's a dope-ass jazz track.

i think the first side of this is remarkable, that said i voted for "maxwell's silver hammer" even tho i think it's a cool & buoyant song

this was the best of the reissues btw

Thanks Scik Mouthy, I will definitely look into them!

this album rules and i like every song on it to varying degrees

totally

i can't vote for any of these--a perfect album. can see why people hate Maxwells, though

voted octopus's garden, but for years I always skipped come together and here comes the sun. now i love come together, and at least appreciate here comes the sun. at one point i did go thru a "maxwell's is trite garbage" phase, but i'm over it

I hardly like any of this album. What was Lennon doing? Lazy bastard.

iirc "octopus's garden" was revelatory on the remaster

i also think that this is their best album

don't think you have heard 'the end', friendo.

the ponderous part is the vamp, which does almost nothing and for too long too. the po-faced pretense is the cutie-pie denouement. that couplet is maybe the dumbest lyric mccartney wrote for the beatles.

(and because of its title and placement in the catalog, it gets taken and used as this sort of epitaph for the whole band, which is an injustice.)

"Octopus's Garden" distracts me more than "Maxwell," because I've been to the House on the Rock.

So have I and I'm still voting for "Maxwell's," my choice for the worst Beatles song of all-time (to whatever extent it really is a Beatles song - so much of this sounds like tracks from early solo albums to come). It's the very definition of arch and no doubt influenced a lot of lesbian folk music (if you're wtfing at that line, you've never heard lesbian folk music). 2nd worst: "Oh Darling." John was right - he should've sang it instead of Paul (if it had to exist in the first place).

But yet again, he rights himself with "Golden Slumbers" vying with "She's Leaving Home" as his loveliest melody. "Golden Slumbers" into "Carry That Weight" literally stopped me in my tracks the first time I heard it. Why the fuck couldn't he keep this up?

It's the very definition of arch and no doubt influenced a lot of lesbian folk music (if you're wtfing at that line, you've never heard lesbian folk music).

o__0

I see that you're not a fan of parenthetical expressions.

I love parentheticals (except when they contain crazy talk).

s(tfu)

You know what? Apart from IWYSSH, My favourite moment is on Here Comes The Sun, a song which I think is hugely overplayed and revered for perhaps the wrong reasons. The bit I like is the moog(?) organ harmony that creeps in very subtley towards the last part of the track, shining through the dinginess of what would be an accomplished but maybe slightly dull track.

"Golden Slumbers" into "Carry That Weight" literally stopped me in my tracks the first time I heard it.

and every time after for me.

My favorite moment is in the second verse of Golden Slumbers; right after he sings "Once there was a way to get back home", a couple bars of beautiful and sad orchestration brings the waterworks.

My favorite moment is when the

one two three four five six seven, all good children go to heaven

comes back in right before The End

d.l. the moog on here comes the sun is the farthest thing from subtle (love it though)

'Maxwell' because it's just so jarring on the album. I like the song in and of itself, but in the scheme of the album it's just..erm...ill-advised.

"you Never Give Me Your Money' and 'Golden Slumbers' I think redeem Paul somewhat of Maxwell.though. I can forgive him for it.

Also 'Sun King'...I get a lot of Jimi Hendrix out of that, the deep bass and the style of drumming, reminds me a little of 'May This be Love'.

And WTF at anyone voting 'The End'. The end is their 'koombayah' moment! the drum solo! the guitars!It fairly rocks the house. As Nick said: THE BEASTIE BOYS!!

I like Abbey because after all the fragmentation of The White Album, and the ice that had seeming set in on the Let It Be sessions, I just love that they found a way to just do what they loved, together, one last time. Cheesy, I know.

Coffee hasn't quite kicked in yet. Apologies for poor self-expression.

Oh, and one more thing about Abbey Road - it's perfect bathtub music. Make sure you bring the Matey and floaty toys too.

http://i34.tinypic.com/20gef7c.jpg

"Oh! Darling" - so obviously a genre exercise and a pretty unimaginative one. (Would've made more sense as a White Album track.) And I kinda hate that arpeggiated-guitar part (surely there was no need to play that middle-eight TWICE.)

What's the genre? I just thought it was boring.

The genre was Paul.

have to be predictable and go with maxwell. just horrribly irritating. would have been better if bernard cribbins had sung it.

octopus's garden is harmless enough. and given that I harbour atlantean ambitions, I can appreciate the sentiment.

everything else is just too good to even vaguely contemplate voting for it.

standing on the cast-iron shore yeah xp

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-cvLjylEqk

I went with Polythene Pam, although to be honest a lot of side 2 sounds kind of patchy to me. It has some amazing moments to be sure, several of which have been mentioned, but it always sounds like what it is to me -- a bunch of song fragments pasted together, rather than some sort of larger piece. I find myself wishing that the best parts had been made into full songs and the worst parts discarded.

Also, "Something" is one of the greatest songs/recordings in the history of ever. I think it sounds incredible on the remaster. That bridge! That bassline!

And I like Maxwell's just fine.

My favorite parts of Polthene Pam are the yeah, yeah, yeahs.

anyone who votes in this poll hates music

(voted golden slumbers, but meant to vote sun king)

"Maxwell", easily. I love "I Want You"!

this is hard but it's 'oh darling'

not a bad song though, just kind of ordinary on an album full of extraordinary ones, and its not particularly interesting lyrically

maybe if i had gotten into the beatles as an adult i'd have issues with maxwell (and yellow submarine) but those ones are a lot of fun when you're younger and nostalgia kind of gets in the way now

voted maxwell's, duh. would like to hear Lennon singing Oh Darling -- does a bootleg of that exist or am I dreaming.

"Oh Darling"; simply the least interesting track here.

Voting Mustard. The weakest of the fragments, and none of the full songs is really worse! Took me a while to come around to "Oh Darling" and to re-appreciate "Octopus's Garden" after knowing it since kindergarten, but this is a really solid set of songs. No, it's not Revolver but there is some A game stuff here. It's hard for me to imagine the Beatles in the 70s not putting this on, individually, and going, "shit, my records now really don't sound this good."

I'm pretty sure John didn't, but more than any of the others (well, apart from Ringo, but he always knew anyway), he should have.

maxwell's silver hammer. i love this album, but there a more than a couple songs that i could've voted for. for all the credit the beatles got for making/inventing the "cohesive-album-as-unit" i think this is the only one that succeeds. the songs are actually inseparable in my mind-and not just the medley-i would never listen to "come together" or "maxwell's silver hammer" or "octopus' garden" but lord knows i wouldn't dare think of skipping them while listening to this precious, perfect album.

"Oh Darling" = Beatles doing Badfinger-style powerpop. (which is great btw). :)

oh darling is my favorite beatles song

yes the production on abbey road is generally very badfinger sounding.. moreso than other beatles releases

mean mr. maxwell

Wow, listened to that George Martin BBC thing, and the section where he isolated "Come Together" tracks is brilliant! I honestly can't see how anyone can hate it..

Not much of a song anyways. Just the same very short phrases being repeated all over and over, and hardly no chords at all. Still among my least favourite Beatles tracks overall.

Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.

Maxwell's is actually giving me the creeps right now. Why would someone bother writing it? Oh and the subject matter too, obv

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

Never in doubt

This and the White Album poll should be proof that Paul tryin' to force a hit during late-era Beatles just didn't work. His merciless enthusiasm for those two tracks is legendary.

whodunit?

2. Something 5
8. Because 4
6. I Want You (She's So Heavy) 3

At least no one was crazy enough to vote for You Never Give Me Your Money.

there is something so truly gratifying about the first 5 tracks finishing in the top 5 slots

can't believe there are 3 people on this board black hearted enough to vote for "her majesty"

i voted for the fucking unlistenable 'i want you (she's so heavy)'

I listened to it last night in a marathonesque feat of endurance obv

well done ILX

i'm content w/ these results

I've always thought "I Want You" was boring, hard to put my finger on why. The sheer force of the ending is something, but the path there has never done anything for me in 30 years of listening.

Part of it's how musch I love hearing the melodic pop etc Beatles get so heavy and repetitive, and how good I think they are at it, but if that's not yr thing I can see it not appealing... kinda goes for Come Together a bit too

I'm kinda happy to see how well Polythene Pam did

Not boring to me in the slightest... It's proto-metal, and I really like metal.

xpost

"9. You Never Give Me Your Money 0"

"8. Because 4"

crazy

But "I Want You" doesn't just have that silly "I want you....*bah bah bah*" riff, it has that amazing bridge section where they hit that crazy organ chord and Paul answers it with this ridiculously cool bass line right before the metal part. In one section of the song John is screaming during this break and it overloads the mic. Later - right before the Santana-esque mini jazz odyssey section - you can hear someone switching the pickups on their guitar while they prepare to take you on an instrumental tour of latin-flavored psychedelia. I love so many parts of this song I hardly even notice the supremely banal riff it's built upon anymore.

whodunit?

2. Something 5

I think I accidentally voted for Something, thinking for a moment that I was voting for "Best Song of Ever." My bad.

I love seeing "Come Together" up there. :) "Something" doesn't deserve the same amount though, it's obviously the highlight here, and probably the best song George ever wrote.

i voted for the fucking unlistenable 'i want you (she's so heavy)'

― history mayne, Tuesday, 29 September 2009 00:56 (9 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Not a Oneida fan then I take it?

If you don't like She's So Heavy, you are probably too faint of heart for real heavy metal :(

"I Don't Want You (She's Too Heavy)"

If you don't like She's So Heavy, you are probably too faint of heart for real heavy metal :(

Eh?

Adam that riff's perfect, it's just a base for the REPITITION and embellishments, it'd kinda suck if it was "better"

i don't like heavy metal.

If only "She's So Heavy" was heavy metal, it might be better

It'd be an odd fit

Album's full of odd fits as it is

Yeah true, they prob could've fit it in by way of overall production, which I kinda find a bit overwhelming on this album... might be my copy maybe, prob necessary, but I think someone said before it feels a lot more like Venus and Mars or something than like Revolver, prod wise

It feels even more like this:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2411/2223029113_fb5af4e2f8.jpg?v=0

Mmm true

Still a v unifying prod approach, not a defining one

I don't know who that it. Is that the guy in the middle's real hair, or is he wearing a Davy Crockett hat?

How the hell can anybody tell "I Want You" is unlistenable without listening to it?

"I Don't Want You (She's Too Heavy)"

― Tied Up In Geir (Geir Hongro),

That was pretty funny

Yeah, was going to repost and laff as well.

Oh, and that Badfinger album is great, good pick.

How is 'I want you' metal? Sounds to me more like blues and surf riffs rather than metal riffs. Ok, well maybe the final minutes when the sluggish and ominous guitar riff comes in on top of everything, but still...

I'll agree that the track could be at least 2 minutes shorter tho.

For me the question is "How is 'I Want You' not metal? Okay, maybe I'm being facetious, and yes there are more elements to it than being merely a proto-metal jam, particularly the more jazzy section, but consider:

- Traditional heavy metal is basically an amped up, turbo-driven version of the blues. Maybe later developments (particularly with early-'90s black metal bands like Emperor) deliberately chose to avoid blues scales and licks so as to annex themselves from Afro-originated music. On the whole though, metal originators like Iommi and Page were playing white, English blues music invariably played with large amounts of distortion.

- The slowly-played 6-note guitar arpeggio that introduces 'I Want You', is in the same kind of haunted-house minor key attributable to many many classic and alternative metal bands. It's almost the same scale used to open Black Sabbath's eponymous track on their debut album, except BS have reduced it to a stark three-note.

- Similarly, the ominous crunching bass and rhythm guitar onslaught that ends up dominating the track is so reminiscent of doom/stoner metal from Black Sabbath to Electric Wizard that it almost had to be a blueprint for someone along the way.

- The pure self indulgent riffery - many simple, repetitive routines playing off each other over a deliberately lengthy track, and also the minimalist lyric hark towards some of the more stoned-styles of metal playing. Again, Sabbath are a major reference point, but it's also worth referencing something like "Since I've Been Loving You" by Zeppelin, which is more or less the same track but made more technical.

- Last of all the title - "She's So Heavy" - the term "Heavy Metal" had probably not been coined by then, but it is a HEAVY track, and maybe whoever did invent the term might have been influenced by it at the time.

On the whole though, metal originators like Iommi and Page were playing white, English blues music invariably played with large amounts of distortion.

Plenty of Sabbath has little or no discernible blues influence. Also the Beatles didn't actually invent EVERYTHING, you know!

the term "Heavy Metal" had probably not been coined by then

Such confidence!

Nothing the Beatles did advanced the cause of heavy, complex or otherwise confrontational music 1/3 as much as fucking 21st Century Schizoid Man

...but IWY(SSH) is awesome, aye

They were pretty crap at heaviness. "Helter Skelter" works because it's an insane mess. Something like "Yer Blues" is fucking rubbish.

For me the question is "How is 'I Want You' not metal? Okay, maybe I'm being facetious, and yes there are more elements to it than being merely a proto-metal jam, particularly the more jazzy section, but consider:

- Traditional heavy metal is basically an amped up, turbo-driven version of the blues. Maybe later developments (particularly with early-'90s black metal bands like Emperor) deliberately chose to avoid blues scales and licks so as to annex themselves from Afro-originated music. On the whole though, metal originators like Iommi and Page were playing white, English blues music invariably played with large amounts of distortion.

- The slowly-played 6-note guitar arpeggio that introduces 'I Want You', is in the same kind of haunted-house minor key attributable to many many classic and alternative metal bands. It's almost the same scale used to open Black Sabbath's eponymous track on their debut album, except BS have reduced it to a stark three-note.

- Similarly, the ominous crunching bass and rhythm guitar onslaught that ends up dominating the track is so reminiscent of doom/stoner metal from Black Sabbath to Electric Wizard that it almost had to be a blueprint for someone along the way.

- The pure self indulgent riffery - many simple, repetitive routines playing off each other over a deliberately lengthy track, and also the minimalist lyric hark towards some of the more stoned-styles of metal playing. Again, Sabbath are a major reference point, but it's also worth referencing something like "Since I've Been Loving You" by Zeppelin, which is more or less the same track but made more technical.

- Last of all the title - "She's So Heavy" - the term "Heavy Metal" had probably not been coined by then, but it is a HEAVY track, and maybe whoever did invent the term might have been influenced by it at the time.

I think you might be overrating the beatles influence on heavy metal. King Crimson influenced heavy metal. Jimi Hendrix influenced heavy metal. Iggy Pop, Jefferson Airplane, The Velvet Underground, Grateful Dead and the Doors all influenced heavy metal. 'I want you (She's so heavy)' and 'Helter Skelter'? Well, not much. They might get away with being one of the first bands trying it but that doesn't mean they influenced the whole lot to come.

oh come on Ozzy's favorite band is the fucking Beatles

Also: You don't become heavy metal by simply amping up and distorting a blues riff.

I listened to Abbey Road in the car on a drive out of town this past weekend and, as it always does when I play it and really listen to it, it really blew me away. It feels very apart from the rest of the Beatles catalog; the use of synths on it really makes it feel like a 70's album and there are flourishes here and there that recurr in McCartney and Harrison's solo work. I'm really astounded that they were able to make this record and it's always seemed like these sessions aren't very well documentated, either in photos or in stories. For a band that was allegedly at each others throats they sure don't sound like it, nor do you ever hear of blow ups. It's very professional, and its all a bit sad as well; it's probably obvious and cliche now but when I think of the composition and meaning of You Never Give Me Your Money/Carry that Weight/The End I'm pretty bowled over. The attention in giving each person a solo spot in a song called "The End" seems like a love letter to the band.

haha, this conversation reminds me of ones i used to have at school about the worth or "trueness" of metal. no the beatles didn't invent HM, but I still maintain that I Want You is very metal in many many ways.

I never understand why some metal fans got SO UPSET at the very thought of sharing lineage w/the Beatles. Seriously, what makes the Revolution single less metal than The Wizard or whatever?

And I hear a lot of the same faux-jazz noodlings in I Want You (She's so Heavy) that are present in lots of early Sabbath stuff (Fairies Wear Boots, coda of War Pigs).

Oh The End is so clearly the song that is meant to END The Beatles. I have always been so interested in the difference between the end they made for themselves with Abbey Road and the end that actually was with Let It Be!

My friend has compared it to the FLOURISH that Michael Jordan showed after he made the final shot against the Utah Jazz but how it wasn't his actual END after all. His Let It Be was the time he returned to play baseball and then went to the Wizards.

there are flourishes here and there that recurr in McCartney and Harrison's solo work.

Lennon too - Come Together sounds a lot like the material on Plastic Ono Band for ex.

(although it is weird to me that post-Beatles Lennon pretty much completely abandoned the character sketches and goofy wordplay that pop up all over his Beatles work, incl Abbey Road)

Yeah, his work really seemed to lose the sense of humor that his Beatle's songs had. I always got the feeling that his third person/narrative songs were a direct result of competing with McCartney.

I still maintain that I Want You is very metal in many many ways.

I've always heard it as more like heavy psychedelic, rather than heavy metal.

oh come on Ozzy's favorite band is the fucking Beatles

― the taint of Macca is strong (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, October 6, 2009 2:40 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark

OTM

and Sabbath was originally a blues band!

Beatles:

Singles - generally Rock
Albums - generally Pop.

For me the question is "How is 'I Want You' not metal?

I would say it may be heavy rock, but not metal. Deep Purple, Black Sabbath, Uriah Heep etc. were counted as heavy rock. The "metal" term started with NWOBHM in the late 70s, no?

I think the 'heavy metal' descriptor starting getting thrown around in the early 1970's by the Creem staff.

xpost noooh.

Famously, originated from "Heavy Metal Thunder", i.e. "Born to be Wild"

Deep Purple, etc.

The "metal" term started with NWOBHM in the late 70s, no?

NWOBHM was so-called because it was the resurgence Of British Heavy Metal, i.e. the New Wave.

y'see?

The "metal" term started with NWOBHM in the late 70s, no?

*slaps forehead*

FACEPALM.JPG AMIRITE

/sorry

I want to sb anyone who doesn't like this album.

Geir dlta.

(oh, alright, he does)

also want to sb these ppl

4. Oh Darling 10
6. I Want You (She's So Heavy) 3

rev!

this album is so fucking perfect, i could never vote for any song on here -- in fact i'm gonna listen to the remastered "octopus's garden" right now, fuck all 14 people who voted for it

won't front like I don't skip maxwell but this is my favorite beatles joint by far

some time early last fall i sang "oh darling" with cute girls on a porch. i recommend this activity to all.

this is also by far my favorite beatles joint

remaster is so dope

quando para mucho
mi amore
de felice
corazon

mundo paparazzi
mi amore
chica ferdy
parasol

Haha, I didn't know those were the words! I assumed it would mean something.

www.iamthebeatles.com/article1260.html

In 1971 John said that "Sun King" came to him in a dream, but in 1980 he said it was "garbage". This song by Lennon reminds me of a combination of I Am the Walrus and Because. It contains basically nonsense, combined with wonderful harmonies, making it a really beautiful song. The closing lines are nothing more than Italian, Spanish and Portugese words which are more common to tourists.

John Lennon, in 1969 said, "We just started joking, you know, singing `quando para mucho.' So we just made up... Paul knew a few Spanish words from school, you know. So we just strung any Spanish words that sounded vaguely like something. And of course we got `chicka ferdy' in, a Liverpool expression. "Chicka ferdy" could also be a combination Spanish/Liverpudlian pun "chica verde" [green girl] or just like `na-na, na-na-na'-- "as one child would say to taunt another."

"Cake and eat it" is another nice line too, because they have that in Spanish-- 'Que' or something, and eat it." In this song, The Beatles freely mixed dialects and languages here, (Italian, Spanish, and Portuguese) and when this is combined with less than perfect enunciation and accent, many uncertainties arise, leading to many possible interpretations.

The words are as published: "Quando paramucho mi amore de felice corazon Mundo paparazzi mi amore chica ferdy parasol Cuesto obrigado tanta mucho que can eat it carousel"

"Parasol" is an umbrella, of course, but literally translates as "para sole" as in for the sun, or perhaps "pa re sole" for sun king.

"Paparazzi" are people who take pictures of celebrities.

"que can eat it" should be "que/cake and eat it",

"carousel" is a popular brand of chocolates in Britain.

"Obrigado" is Portuguese [thank you], or "obbligato" [musical term - secondary, yet necessary part]

A literal translation would most likely be:

Quando para mucho mi amore de felice corazon "If/When For Much, My Love Of Happy Heart"

Mundo paparazzi mi amore chicka/chica ferdy/verde para sole "World Paparazzi, My Love, Chicka/Girl Ferdy/Green For The Sun

Cuesto obrigado, tanta mucho, que/cake and eat it, carousel/cara sole This Thanks, Very Much, Cake and Eat It, Carousel/Dearest Sun

Regardless, I think it's still a rather cool song!

In 1971 John said that "Sun King" came to him in a dream, but in 1980 he said it was "garbage".

^Suggest ban John Lennon. Agree with the people above who said this is the best Beatles record. THis is my favorite, by far.

2nd half of this is all-tyme, best thing beatles did ever

Are these Lennon explanations/interviews collected anywhere? I enjoyed reading McCartney's explanations reading, wouldn't mind hearing Lennon's.

Are these Lennon explanations/interviews collected anywhere? I enjoyed reading McCartney's explanations recently, wouldn't mind hearing Lennon's.

you can assume that any ref to a Lennon 1980 interview is the mammoth Playboy one. which is online and is a great read.

I have to like this album bcz it has a permutation of my name in the title.

"carousel" is a popular brand of chocolates in Britain.

Carousel means a merry-go-round more than the box of chocolates, even in the UK (not even sure if Terry's Carousel chocs were around in 69?).

I don't remember any "Carousel" chocs, but hey.

Whole album is total joy. All of it. Even Maxwell. Which I only voted for because it jars a little...but damn, there's nothing bad on the whole album! at all!

yeah, was kinda digging Maxwell the last time I listened to this tbh.

while i hate both come together and silver hammer, i tend to only skip come together as at least silver hammer isn't overplayed as a motherfucker

I get it now.

http://devonrecordclub.wordpress.com/2013/02/12/the-beatles-abbey-road-round-46-nicks-choice/

I once saw an amateur porn flick where the two protagonists were listening to Abbey Road as background music for their amorous shenanigans. At first I thought that their choice of putting on 'Come Together' was some kind of witty statement of intent, but then 'Something' came on and I was like "ah, they're listening to the whole album here". By 'Maxwell's Silver Hammer', the drawers were off and a certain part of the male anatomy was getting feasted on somewhat enthusiastically, leading me to think "man, this must be the most surreal and unlikely porno soundtrack ever". I didn't stick around for 'The End', although I'm fairly confident that I could have predicted the outcome.

"Bang, bang," indeed. (arches eyebrow, strokes chin)

Something in the wayyy she mooooves...

I mean, it's very fair to say that I haven't been able to listen to 'Maxwell's Silver Hammer' in the same way since. Any time I hear it now, I just think to myself "Ha, folks recorded themselves fuckin' to this!"

Although, in their defenece, they were probably turned on because of the fact that the world is round. Ah.

*defence

That typo wasn't made due to typing with only one hand, don't fret folks :P

Blows my mind!

SHE'S SO HEAVYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!

i wish i weren't burnt out on all the 'famous' songs on this album (and that i liked 'maxwell' a little more).

I'm gonna need a bellyful of wine.

He wanted her bad and it was driving him mad.

Was she wearing jackboots and a kilt?

Can't remember, although even if she had been it would have been kinda irrelevant by the time 'Polythene Pam' came on! :P

And so he quit Police Department, and got himself a steady (hand) job...

Funny how the segue from I Want You to Here Comes the Sun is one of the most effective pieces of sequencing in the history of recorded music yet only makes real sense in the post vinyl era.

http://thumbs4.picclick.com/d/l400/pict/232049711395_/The-Beatles-Abbey-Road-LP-Apple-SO-383-Stereo.jpg

haven't heard Abbey Road in a while. found it for a dollar at a thrift store a few weeks ago. "Come Together" is still great, and so minimal. a lot of these songs have very stripped down arrangements compared to there other more over-produced psychedelic arrangements. its a good look. it is needed too cos half of this is basically McCartney's first solo album, it's a bit heavy on the melodramatic on the latter half of side 2. "I Want You" is still my favorite, fading from proto metal into noise rock, like something off "Here Come the Warm Jets", and violently cutting off at the end. "Here Comes the Sun" is just lovely, it is the kind of song that instantly makes you feel better. the moog here is great. "Because" is the final big showcase for the synth, and it goes out with a bang, The Beatles sort of playing with a cross between "Lucy in the Sky" and "A Clockwork Orange" meets The Beach Boys. they've already done the Edwardian/Victorian thing with harpsichords many times over by now, now they are using these electronic sounds. anyways the rest of the album is fine, "Sun King" sort of inventing slowcore and Wes Anderson indie rock aesthetic. "Polythene Pam" basically being a fast punk Adam Ant-style reboot of The Beatles as they sounded in 1963, "Yeah yeah yeahs" and all. "Golden Slumbers/The End/etc." all seems more and more incredibly pompous as time goes by but eh... "Her Majesty" is super-fine, wish McCartney had dispensed w the melodramatics and done more of this off the cuff DIY stuff. all in all a really great album, and the performances are almost all at their peak, something that probably wouldn't have happened had they not gone through the intense daily routine of "Get Back", which is something "Abbey Road" certainly benefits from. songs like "I Want You" were worked out at the start of the year, and you can hear that confidence in the playing.

worst song? "Golden Slumbers". i can appreciate the whole medley and Paul trying to be operatic before Queen's time but he is taking himself and rock n roll so seriously for a lot of this stuff u feel. no wonder he ended up working w Dave Grohl.

i always hated this album. besides George's songs, i can't stand anything on here. i hate the way it sounds, and that awful medley. never understood why it gets more love than the white album.

because it's better

Otm

this time around "Maxwell's Silver Hammer" had a real strong Everly Bros. vibe to it

"Come Together" is one of the only Beatles song - with "Get Back" and "Lady Madonna" - that I have always hated.
I'm particularly fond of "Sun King". So blissful and warm.
And I prefer the "anthology" full and slowed down demo version of "She came in through the bathroom window".

the only shit thing about Sun King is it's not 6.30 minutes long

someone should make an extended remix of it !

That bit in the medley where Paul sings "Soon you'll be away from here... " with the strummed guitar sounds a little like Led Zeppelin.

and the "nah nah nah" just before the "1234567"

That bit in the medley where Paul sings "Soon you'll be away from here... " with the strummed guitar sounds a little like Led Zeppelin.

yeah always felt like there are bits throughout this album that sound like crystalized 70s classic rock.

lennon's exaggerated scouse vocals on 'polythene pam' is one of my favourite beatles moments

That's why I hate it. It sounds like a 70s classic rock album. The White Album was done on eight track, but it sounds more primitive than this, more uniquely Beatles. I loathe Come Together, the one time Lennon really nicked something. Boring annoying song anyway.

Their best album. Shakey and brimstead OTM.

'Sun King' is absolutely gorgeous.

The one time? Hmmmmmmm......

pee wee crayton, "do unto others"

I find it utterly confounding how anyone could love '70s Fleetwood Mac and not love this album.

I love this album but I'm not fussed about etc.

^immediately after finishing "Abbey Road" last night i listened to "Tusk" for the first time and it was really nice.

Burned out on pretty much all Beatles albums, this one is no exception. Au contraire.

because the Beatles aren't Fleetwood Mac... the way every Beatles LP was recorded, especially the mono records, has this punch/clarity/compression that is utterly unique and essential to the 'magic' of the Beatles... I remember reading somewhere about how Abbey Road used more modern tubes or something... but it just feels strangely antiseptic and dead compared to the earlier records, or even Let It Be. George's songs on here are incredible, but this has always been my least favorite record of theirs bc of weak ass Lennon/McCartney songs, the production, and the medley, especially the finale. it's so sentimental and proto-wings, i just prefer the menacing schizophrenic vibe of the White Album more.

Oh yeah, burned out for life.

DeAgostini are about to start a "Beatles on 33 1/3" series, BTW.

could be their worst yeah. maybe Help but no i think this still takes the title. unless you're counting Yellow Submarine. thank God they quit when they did before they got any hairier. hairy Beatles blecch.

Do you think there's something to the notion that bigger is better in terms of recording equipment?

[Laughs] Well, that's because it was all tube equipment. All the albums up until Abbey Road were recorded through a tube desk. Abbey Road was the first album that was recorded through an EMI transistorized desk, and I couldn't get the same sounds at all. There was presence and depth that the transistors just wouldn't give me that the tubes did.

That must have been frustrating.

Oh, it was. But, of course, it gave a texture to the Abbey Road album after all, which is quite pleasant. But at first, being used to the tube desk and being confronted with the transistorized desk, it was like chalk and cheese. It was hard. And there was nothing I could do about it except craft the music around it; it was a much softer sort of texture.

http://www.mixonline.com/news/profiles/geoff-emerick/364925

the one time

lol gtfo

xp yeah that's it, thanks for the link. explains why Abbey Road just never sat right with me. also George really can't write bridges- Something and Here Comes the Sun lose steam in the middle, despite their gorgeous guitar hooks.

Abbey Road is the best sounding Beatles record, IMO. Really warm, full bottom end, a great drum sound and of course brilliant harmonies.

Or to sum it up in an equation... flappy bird = wrong.

:)

That makes a lot of sense -- and yeah, this record was something of a template for pop/rock in the 70s, at least on the mainstream end a la Fleetwood Mac/Paul Simon (or hell, Carly Simon).

lol at worst Beatles album. It isn't. You *could* make an argument that it's a somewhat contrived attempt at recovering the Sgt Pepper studio magic (sans psychedelia), and after Let It Be, George Martin said something along those lines. The songs themselves are kind of all over the map (similar to the white album), but the performances and production are both ace IMO. Worst song for me is probably Octopus' Garden, though it really doesn't matter, because the record is such a huge thing for me, it's like asking what's my worst childhood Christmas memory. Even the time my sister broke my magnetic Batman is a beloved family anecdote now.

Abbey Road does sound hazier/hairier/more stoned than even Rubber Soul. Definitely proto-70s.

xpost Great drum *and* bass sound.

xp to the Emerick quote btw on mine

http://files.gamebanana.com/img/ico/sprays/538578b593b47.gif

i agree the performances here are ace. and i love when I Want You violently cuts off. i just don't fuck with the songs, the medley, or the proto-70s sound. different strokes turry

abbey road is pretty much the only beatles album (+let it be) that i never get burnt out on

i don't think i'll ever get burnt out on "Come Together". Ringo's drumming is too good.

"Octopus's Garden" is lovely and knows what it is, a silly song w bubble sound effects. always loved the slightly sinister inflection on the "Happy and we're safe" backing vocals.

When I was younger, my least favorite songs were actually the hits - Come Together (because it seemed simpler and less pretty than the rest of the record), and Here Comes the Sun (because it seemed corny). I've come completely around on Come Together, but still sometimes will skip Here Comes the Sun. Still pretty good tho.

also George really can't write bridges- Something and Here Comes the Sun lose steam in the middle, despite their gorgeous guitar hooks.

this...um...no. The bridges take those songs to another plane. And in the case of "Sun," it's a plane where Ringo expertly negotiates the 11/8 - 4/4 - 7/8 time signature cycle with swing, power, and grace.

I'd skip'Something' but not 'Here comes the sun"

and fwiw I think it sounds tremendous. Obviously, from Emerick's perspective of only working with tube gear, the difference between tube and transistor seemed stark to him. Abbey Road sounds different, but not worse than what came before. And I'd argue it's the apotheosis of Ringo's tea-towel-dampened sound.

the bridge in "Something" is the best part of the song imo

Tarfumes and Adam OTM.

Always loved the shifting time signatures during that part of 'Here Comes The Sun', and Ringo does indeed navigate those time signatures well without messing with the basic flow of the song.

The middle part of 'Something' is my favourite part too.

some insane opinions itt - most days I'd probably rate this as the *best* Beatles album for many of the reasons already mentioned, songwriting + performance + production are all at peak. The bridges in Something and Here Comes the Sun are both incredible! That "you're asking me will my love grow" bit come the fuck on!

also George really can't write bridges- Something and Here Comes the Sun lose steam in the middle, despite their gorgeous guitar hooks.

I've been on these threads for years bashing George yet this thought is insane to me

always hard to lose one's place in the vanguard

Yeah, there's more than a few songs in Harrison's solo discography that I'd be the first to criticise for various reasons, and find his voice far less tolerable on much of his post-All Things Must Pass work... but if there's two Harrison songs I can't fault it's his contributions to Abbey Road.

He didn't write two more perfect songs from a formalist's point of view than his Abbey Road material. There's that condescending line of George Martin's about "Something" ("I didn't think George was up to it. Super song."). Even at his worst (1974-1980) his gift for melody (the guy could write a pretty one) didn't abandon him like his singing and arranging skills did.

I know its strange but I sort of lived with the cassette edition for ages, so to me its Here comes the he sun and Something as the first two tracks.

'Here Comes The Sun' led off the A side on the cassette?

the bridge on "here comes the sun" is insanely cool, tarfumes otm. my favorite part of the song is the beginning of the final verse.. the addition of the piercing yet soothing synth lead with "the ice is slowly melting" just kills me every time. i want to believe him!!

"Sun King" is kind of a big bag of nothing.

"the ice is slowly melting" just kills me every time. i want to believe him!!

good news!

and it won't be years!

I may have asked this before but does anybody know what the first audible instrument in "Because" is? It seems halfway between an electric guitar and a harpsichord, always been fascinated by that sound and how it was achieved.

huh a Baldwin electric spinet apparently

don't mind me

i always thought it was the moog, so thanks

here comes the sun frequently brings me to tears, but yeah, the "sun sun sun here we come" bit just takes me out of it. same with "does your love grow" in something. what can i say? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
but I really don't like All Things Must Pass, doesn't do it for me at all. i prefer the bloodletting on Plastic Ono Band.

it always bugged me that I Want You and Because are based on the same arpeggio, separated by only a half step (Dm and C#m)

all things must pass has a lot of good moments but shit is a dreary record sometimes

don't think i've ever listened to even half of it straight throguh

The songs are pretty, George's singing isn't.

man that record got me through some really hard times, I will fight anyone that thinks there's a better Beatle solo album

"Sun King" is kind of a big bag of nothing.

At last, some sanity itt. "Because" is worse though.

the only song i don't really f/w on All Things Must Pass is "Isn't It A Pity", everything else is great.

xp ugh wrong wrong wrong

this thread sucks

I hadn't heard ATMP until I was in my late 20s, though I knew the radio hits. Love most of it (never actually listened to "Apple Jam"), don't dislike any of it, and significant chunks are superior to most of Let It Be and some of the White album. "Wah Wah" in particular has some dynamite Ringo playing on it.

And this Harrison tune should've been on the White album even with Lomax singing, a la "Lose This Skin" on Sandinista!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEJBItLnw5I

xp ugh wrong wrong wrong

― brimstead, Tuesday, October 11, 2016 4:13 PM (six minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lol which post

the one about "sun king" and "because" being bad songs

i would like to disagree with the idea upthread that "something" has a bad bridge. imo it's the best part of the song

a lot of it's down to the arrangement though, how the percussion and strings just start moving around furiously

'Because' has often been the track from this album that I find myself playing a lot on repeat... I really, really love those vocal harmonies and the general atmosphere/vibe of the track. The a cappella version on Anthology 3 is gorgeous too.

"Because" is great. yes the atmosphere....those arpeggios... i love the Switched On instrumentation. song itself is very Yoko Ono. harmonies are wonderful, up there with "Smile".

Sour milk sea is so fucking good

I've never liked it tbh, always sounds like a halfway point between Savoy Truffle and Get Back to me

this would have been a much much better album with HCTS as the lead track. oh well

i don't think you can pin 'much much better' on sequencing

maybe 'better', maybe even 'much better', but not double much

Glad to read this discussion today. I think I might like Abbey Road as much as the White Album if it had been recorded with the same gear. It's like there's a sonic space that opens up on this album and maybe the Beatles didn't realize that they weren't filling up the space because the way they arranged things would have done so on the old technology. There were bands in the '70s who got this and were able to fill up the space with more color - like say "Calling Occupants" off the first Klaatu album. A lot of Klaatu, actually.

otm

Well yeah, obviously, since Klaatu was the Beatles.

Obviously!

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/b6/59/75/b659755676fc19515270d55baaf819c0.jpg

This LP sounds far more warmer and fuller to me than the white album, without a doubt.

fwiw i don't think the white album sounds very warm or full at all, it's very abrasive and raw sounding. i just like the hodgepodge nature of it and the expansiveness over the concision of abbey road.

yeah yeah its supposed indie virtue ("check it out, the beatles are 'fucked up'")

"they just don't give a fuck"

but as someone whose favorite FM album is tusk, i feel ya

although take out lindsey's amphetamine workouts and tusk really isn't all that weird, imo

it's not that. i hate pavement. i think the raw & abrasive qualities of the white album are very purposeful. it's part of the wildly paranoid and unhinged atmosphere and drive of that record.

anyway. ill stay out of here. we all love the beatles :)

xp otm about tusk's weirdness - also it's not just Lindsey's songs that make it weird, it's the stark contrast between his songs and Stevie's and Christine's that makes it so bewildering.

was it really purposeful, though? how much did george martin and geoff emerick's absence contribute?

it's sloppy and disjointed because they didn't want to work together anymore!

that too!

well certainly the sequencing is pretty abrasive, and like tusk, the record is weirder for its contrasts - Mother Nature's Son next to Me and My Monkey, Good Night after Revolution 9... the songs with 'raw' production are mostly Lennon's, with the exception of Helter Skelter, which was a very purposeful attempt to make a more raucous record than The Who. But like Glass Onion for example, that's a very rough around the edges song that is greatly benefited from the orchestra loops that Martin added. Even Happiness is a Warm Gun, recorded live, sounds loose and raw, and that was the one moment during the entire recording of the white album where the band was getting along.

Also, lyrically, the songs are much darker and scattershot than on Abbey Road.

Lennon's lyrics were all pretty scattershot from '67-'71 or so. He probably didn't feel this way but musically I think his stuff really benefited from restraints applied by the others (whether it was Paul or George Martin or whoever) and more considered arrangements. I know he loved to rock out and keep it real and all that rockist shit but Dear Prudence and Mean Mr. Mustard are a good deal improved by the other's contributions imo.

Musically, solo Lennon never approached his Beatles work. Nothing even remotely like Strawberry Fields or Walrus there.

this is a discussion for a different thread but generally I agree. The strange rhythmic turnarounds and relatively ambitious structures that regularly appear in his Beatles work p much completely disappeared from his songwriting after 1970. I think I've commented on this before somewhere around here.

I think Plastic Ono Band and half of Imagine are up there w his best Beatles work, but yeah after that it's a steep decline.

Agreed completely re: Lennon's rockist tendencies. That's why most of his solo records are so abysmal. so many Chuck Berry rewrites.

and again, Glass Onion is a great example. There's a no-strings version on Anthology I think, and it sucks. Tuneless w/ no personality - but those perfectly placed orchestra loops completely elevate it.

this is a discussion for a different thread but generally I agree. The strange rhythmic turnarounds and relatively ambitious structures that regularly appear in his Beatles work p much completely disappeared from his songwriting after 1970. I think I've commented on this before somewhere around here.

― Οὖτις, Wednesday, October 12, 2016 4:29 PM (four minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

fortunately these appear on Yoko's albums

Shakey OTM re: Lennon's stuff benefitting from restraints from others and others helping to get the best out of his material. Once Lennon was out of The Beatles, his gift for melody didn't disappear, it's more that he developed a solo style and... didn't really move very far from it.

fortunately these appear on Yoko's albums

totally!

There's one or two tracks on, say, Mind Games which would have been great in the hands of The Beatles and George Martin, but as they are they come across as "solo Lennon by numbers"

compare w/McCartney, who never really stopped trying to push himself musically (or at least never shied away from the kind of ambition he showed in the Beatles)... but missed out on the Beatles' quality control process. This is why people continue to make "lost Beatle album" compilations from the 70s songs -- it just seems like they could have gone on making good stuff if they'd been able to hang on, professionally.

def a "greater than the sum of their parts" scenario

weirdly Lennon's the only one who made two albums I consider great all the way through - POB + Imagine. (The rest get one apiece - Ringo, ATMP, Ram)

and then of course there's the Yoko albums and Pussycats... maybe I'm talking myself into a more positive appraisal of Lennon's solo stuff than I wanted to admit

McCartney's weak spot was always his lyrics and occasionally failing to recognise when he'd written a dud. His gifts for coming up with catchy melodies and ensuring his songs are arranged and recorded well have never left him, really.

Band On The Run!

has a bunch of crap on it!

His gifts for coming up with catchy melodies and ensuring his songs are arranged and recorded well have never left him, really.

no argument here though, he def eclipsed the others in this dept.

Yes, I've just bought that for someone, so I've been listening to it a lot. So many of the songs are so flimsy and overlong. (xp)

despite that I am generally a bigger McCartney fan than a Lennon one, I don't rep for any of his solo records as being great all the way through. JL/POB is the single best Beatles solo IMO, and both Imagine and All Things are really good -- about as good as the best McCartney record in fact -- but not as classic as, say, the 3rd or 4th best Beatles record.

McCartney II tho

sad that Gone Troppo is always overlooked when people discuss the best solo Beatles album

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLSKNzT0Ve8

I like Mac II! Definitely filler on there tho (if "Secret Friend" was on the original running order in place of 10 minutes of lesser stuff, I'd certainly put it in the discussion for best Beatles solo LP)

John has a way more interesting solo career, including his collaborations with Yoko, the Plastic Ono Band stuff, and Yoko's solo albums that he worked on as well. many of the early Yoko Ono albums have songs with more Beatles playing on them then are on actual Beatles songs. very cool experimental stuff giving maybe an alternate history of the Beatles if they kept going into pre-punk. John's solo work is patchy but i really enjoy things on just about all of his records ("Mind Games" being a hidden gem imo) right up to his death.

Paul seems to do best when he is just doing DIY albums at home experimenting w multitracking. makes sense as this is how some White Album tracks were done!

in the aftermath of the Napster/pre-iTunes era (1999-2004) I had many friends burning CD-Rs of Macca comps. I got one I treasure because of the formidable consistency of those A-sides, album tracks, and B-sides sitting beside each other.

there's some really great stuff on Ringo's 70s + 80s solo albums

mind games is excellent except for a couple really shitty songs (tight ass and meat city come to mind).

we've definitely done many versions of this. and i guess "they sure needed each other as checks and balances" is basically part of canonical beatles lore at this point. which certainly beats "if only yoko hadn't ruined everything" as far as the sophistication of narratives carried around by the general listening public. but imo the biggest problem with almost all the beatles solo records is, following an initial or nearly-initial burst of "i'm free!" creative greatness, they get lazy. maybe in a totally typical and understandable way: you've been one of the kings of the world for 5-6 years. time to just chill out and do whatever you feel like. hey, it's the Me Decade after all. this plays out in different ways and maybe overlaps a lot with them getting so far up their own success that they can't really be constrained or challenged by any of their collaborators.

macca gets the best results out of this - if you're in the mood for what he does - because he's just more restless musically and wants to try each new toy that comes within earshot. he also generally retains a gift for melody that is able to carry him through all but the dudliest of dudly pointless lyrical conceits and tangents. nothing close to the masterpiece-after-masterpiece production of the beatles, but highly listenable and for a fan (like me and several others here) very very enjoyable. but he also is very clearly surrounding himself with people who don't challenge him, esp. denny laine for a decade's worth of "sure boss, sounds good!" his best records - save early flourish ram - are produced out of weird circumstances, constraints, or collaborators: martin for tug of war, costello for flowers in the dirt, travel woes and tight timelines for band on the run, starting from scratch on the two mccartneys, etc.

with john it's more what y'all have been describing - the songwriting rapidly gets just kinda boring, you don't feel like he's really laboring over these things; indeed you feel like he wears it as a point of pride that he's not. unfortunately the muse strikes infrequently. i honestly think that POB aside you really are okay with the greatest hits for his solo career. it's a great greatest hits! there just aren't that many killer album tracks in that discography. i've listened and tried to find them. the exception of course is pussy cats. whatever its flaws that's not a boring record.

iirc, Denny Laine was kicked out of Wings for standing up to Paul.

McCartney II is, at this stage, the most overrated McCartney solo record. Back To The Egg, though - underrated as fuck, and I quite enjoy the fact that I'm one of a handful of people that consider it one of his finest records.

So, Abbey Road guys

What about it?

It contained within it the seeds of "Spies Like Us."

back to the egg and mccartney 2 are my favorites (well, along with ram and band on the run and chaos and creation)

sad that Gone Troppo is always overlooked when people discuss the best solo Beatles album

― soref, Wednesday, October 12, 2016 2:16 PM (two hours ago)

soref, where were you in 2006? You have officially joined the club that I think previously only comprised myself and Geir.

I was gonna say!

The time is now.