Big Boi - Sir Lucious Left Foot: The Son of Chico Dusty (2010)

http://www.nataliedee.com/033006/totally-great.jpg

Album of the year for me, hands down. <3

Love "Tangerine" and the leaked singles.

I love "Tangerine" and "Turns Me On" the best.

The beat on "You Ain't No DJ" is go blown out I keep expecting dude from Sleigh Bells to float down and play some monster riffs on it

just wait till pfork festival

too bad Tapes 'n Tapes won't be there u_u

T.I. sounds so...sexy riding that guitar on "Tangerine," don't he?

al have you heard him on the new mary j song? best he's sounded in like two years

Haven't heard it yet! Would like to.

Okay, "best he's sounded in like two years" sounds really awesome considering he's basically been killing this shit out of everything since he got out.

wtf is a vonnegutt

metal band

Okay, "best he's sounded in like two years" sounds really awesome considering he's basically been killing this shit out of everything since he got out.

― The Reverend, Tuesday, June 29, 2010 11:02 PM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark

hold on, T.I.???

t.i.'s mary j verse is dope but not like way out of step w/ what hes ever been doing imo - p standard quality loverman verse?

metal band

wait, really? is avenged sevenfold on the next ugk album?

<3 u wiki: On June 29th 2010, the album was leaked on to the internet. No comment was made that day on the reaction and suspicion around the leak.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_Vonnegut

?

http://www.myspace.com/vonnegutt

?

j0rdan do you think t.i. has not been killing shit since he got out of jail? if you do, then I think it's fit for me to declare that we have a disagreement on the subject of whether t.i. has been killing the shit out of everything since he got out tbrr

love that Big Boi reps for Texas Pete

http://www.chilliworld.com/i/p/144.jpg

Yeah, this is great. Vonnegutt sucks, though. Love "Tangerine" and "You Ain't No DJ" and "The Train Pt II" a lot. Then again, I thought "The Train" was one of the best (and only good) songs from Idlewild.

j0rdan do you think t.i. has not been killing shit since he got out of jail? if you do, then I think it's fit for me to declare that we have a disagreement on the subject of whether t.i. has been killing the shit out of everything since he got out tbrr

― The Reverend, Wednesday, June 30, 2010 12:24 AM (1 hour ago) Bookmark

yeah i think he's been average on street ish and embarrassing on shit like "hello good morning" but he sounds great on the mary joint imo

I agree with Rev, T.I.'s been killing it lately. Even on the Drake track!

this album is brilliant. and i agree w/rev, t.i.'s been killing shit this year, though i haven't heard the mary j track.

he pretty much always sounds sexy tho!

T.I. is good on "Hello Good Morning". It's really nice to hear all these T.I. joints on the radio all of a sudden since he's been missing for a moment tbh

I should probably actually listen to this album, huh

it goes w/o saying that rick ross on "hello good morning" >>>> t.i.

what, no

t.i. >>>> nicki minaj >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rick ross's terrible verse that i have to actually fwd past every time now

tip's whole verse is invalidated by saying "i'm the captain of the cool kids"

no surfboardso but ross has been dropping hot guest verses/remixes all year

like what? "hello good morning" and that k michelle joint are the only ones springing to mind and he's not good on either of them

hello good morning, o let's do it, angels (is that 2010?), all i do is win (remix)

also he wrote diddy's o let's do it verse which is the best on the song

i haven't heard the "o let's do it" remix because for some reason i just didn't find "feat. diddy and rick ross" all that tantalising a prospect

which "angels", the dirty money one?

can't really remember anyone on "all i do is win", don't like that song much in the first place

yeah i thought "all i do is win" rmx was really boring at first but i hear it all the fucking time down here cuz khaled works at the big rap station and i've actually warmed up to it -- ross, nicki, busta, jada, fat joe all have pretty good verses considering

his two angels ones are awesome imo -- wish that beat was a rick ross song and not a dirty money song, even tho i can get into it in the right mood

diddy has a fascination with ross -- i really do wonder if it's some perverted biggie thing -- they've been on 3 songs together this year already

ross mugging in the background while diddy robocroons his verses in the "angels" rmx video is really a treat

the original "angels" has really grown on me but i can't imagine what fatass rick ross would add to it

dope verses namely

last train to paris
wheels look like a ferris
your jeweler should be embarrassed
rick the ruler my moolah produced the karats
let's bow our heads i gave you something to cherish

~~~diddy's autotears~~~

I haven't heard a version of "Hello Good Morning" w/ Ross or Nicki, or any of these other remixes you guys are talking about so

I mean obv I've heard Diddy's "O Let's Do It" verse from his epic youtube vid

lord forgive me i'm talking oatmeal in the winter
talkin leather interior, oak wheel in the center
my nigga deal coke, still into opium
condominiums in the center of ethiopa

diddy's thing at the BET awards was the only one that was even remotely good

T.I. is good on "Hello Good Morning". It's really nice to hear all these T.I. joints on the radio all of a sudden since he's been missing for a moment tbh

― The Reverend, Wednesday, 30 June 2010 07:36 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i remember when i first heard "welcome back" on the radio, it was so nice to have ma$e back, i welcomed him

TANGERINE IS THE SHIT

even through my crappy PC, this album sounds awesome. i love the soft 70s sounds that bubble up through the disc, e.g., the organ in turns me on.

Ridiculously anticipating this, I had no idea it had leaked.

kudos to him for http://twitter.com/Therealbigboi/status/17314033140

will do so on the strength of this

liking this a lot tbh

t.i. >>>> nicki minaj >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rick ross's terrible verse that i have to actually fwd past every time now

omg seriously lex my good man seek help for your nicki stanning syndrome, there's universal health care in the uk right?

oh and this album is just fantastic.

goddamn goddamn goddamn
considering how much I had built this thing up in my mind, I'm amazed it lives up to expectations.
Add in Lookin 4 Ya, Ringtone, Dubbz, Royal Flush and Something's Gotta Give for the full experience
might buy this out of solidarity
THAT MEANS I HIT THE HEAD LIKE GREG LOUGANIS THEN I'M SPLASHIN

honestly between this and the dream album I have been swept up in
http://www.1888pressrelease.com/imagespr/imgs/159379/euphoria_20mascot_2072dpi.jpg

omg seriously lex my good man seek help for your nicki stanning syndrome, there's universal health care in the uk right?

i don't even think her verse here is amazing or anything, but i don't think it even counts as stanning to say that nicki minaj >>>>> rick ross even in general terms

really? i feel like you would recognize the power of BAWSE!

it took me a while but that big fat fuck sorta got to me

I know it's entirely the point, but I want to hear a full length version of Feel Me

i don't dislike officer rawse, he's done stuff i like, but he's just solidly there at his best, i don't really care about him specifically

"daddy fat sax" is so great

love the scratched samples on the hooks...i wish there was more scratching in hip hop

dl'ing this now but would happily pay for it if I wasn't uh totally broke

I kinda hate Rick Ross tho

I didn't care for "Shutterbug" much last month and preferred "For Yo Sorrow"; now I've switched my vote.

the album makes me appreciate shine blockas more too, that intro is so euphoric and the effect is even better listened to in sequence than after loading up a youtube video or whtever

wow this is really fucking good. maybe a little too busy/cluttered in a couple spots

Some of this does sound cluttered, especially when the beats, rhymes, and life rush in to fill the gap between one of his patented two-syllable elongations ("wo-MAN"), and Janelle Monae's equivalent in 2006 would have sounded just as blank as Monae does in 2010. But this is muscle-flexing at its most winning

yeah i like this, it's like bursting with energy, musical ideas, amazing rapping, perfect antidote to drake's narcolepsy

I like it but my favorites are the songs I'd already heard (Shine Blockas, Shutterbugg, General Patton, Fo Yo Sorrows). You Ain't No DJ is pretty great too and I like Hustle Blood a lot more than I usually like songs with R&B hooks.

Maybe the others will grow on me.

perfect antidote to drake's narcolepsy

^^^^^^^^^^^

i know they are last year songs but shine blockas and fo yo sorrows are my 2010 summer jams at this rate, f all y'all (dunno who this is aimed at, <3 y'all)

i write knockout songs
you write punchlines for money

:D

yeah the rhymes on this are great. this is how it's done folks.

only thing rong with this is the shoddy artwork. hope dre at least drew him a nudie lady for the disc

kinda sad how badly Dre dropped the ball and flamed out in comparison

diddy's thing at the BET awards was the only one that was even remotely good

yeah he slayed it. i even liked travis barker on it. there's some hot shit on 'fuck a mixtape' too imo.

really digging this jamie foxx cut

lol @ david blaine ref

Janelle Monae's equivalent in 2006

Got Purp? was 2005

I've had problems with both leaks I've tried to dl, so I'm giving up and waiting for the official release now. SO excited though.

glad to see such a great reception for this album. "shine blockas" has grown on me quite a bit. when i saw the video for it, i wasn't sure where he was going, but god did it ever sound great in my headphones.

still waiting for what nerd is gonna be the first to drop the "LOL CORNY INDIE ROCKERS WHY ARENT YOU LISTENING TO [X]" bomb like with Cuban Linx II

you would wait for such a thing

lol

took my by surprise so many times on 1st listen (follow us), still trying to get it all processed and clip lyrics. way out in front for the best thing i've heard this year though.

was stunned to find that Hustle Blood was Lil Jon production
nothing really bad on this album but the half assed skits; otherwise, it's top 10 material easy

I've had problems with both leaks I've tried to dl, so I'm giving up and waiting for the official release now. SO excited though.

― he's always been a bit of an anti-climb Max (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Wednesday, June 30, 2010 4:54 PM (6 hours ago) Bookmark

half-assed skits... david blaine cracked me up for real, plus it only takes like 10 seconds, how it ougtta be done.

now this goes out to all my players in the back sippin yak, gettin around corners in the lack (?)

the odd reappearance of an old pharoah monch line: "queens is in the back sippin yak, yall wassup?"

Besides the skits, the into is also useless. It's funky but totally unnecessary.

on first listen this is better than speakerboxxx by a mile.

Speakboxx was pretty great, it was only The Love Below that dragged that album down.

S'boxxx is great, but it works best in context as a counterpart to The Love Below. This one has enough range to stand on its own.

i just realized "Royal Flush" isn't on this u_u

those crackers weren't playing fair at Jive

This is fantastic. tangerine, shine blockas, night night, the train pt. 2 are the ones that struck me the most on first listen. Great all the way through. I agree with this being better than speakerboxxx that was still awesome.

shine blockas is summer as fuck

"Back Up Plan" is real good

You know what it is about this album?

Big Boi sounds like he's having a fucking blast making this music...there's just such a sense of enthusiasm and fun.

It sort of points how how joyless and dead a lot of stuff feels today.

absolutely!

that's why i don't even hate the skits really, they are kinda dumb but more in just a silly, stoned "kickin' it w/yr bros" kinda way

"Speakboxx was pretty great, it was only The Love Below that dragged that album down."

just cos dre3000 gets so much love theres no need for people to overcompensate with the big boi praise.

but yeah the thing about this album is that big boi sounds really hype and energetic. dont think ive heard him like this in a long time.

the energy + enthusiasm on this album reminds me more of stankonia than speakerboxx/love below

yeah Speakerboxxx had a pretty bummer vibe under a lot of it

kind of a bloated vibe, a bit like wu tang forever.

but not as good.

Complaining about skits, really y'all?

dudes don't really do drive by shooting skits anymore, i could go for one of those

skits are kinda worthless these days, tbf

the skits make me smile. a lot of them are fun and really set the mood. tea time! c'mon. thats great stuff.

im pro skits on this album.

complaining about skits on an outkast album is kinda wtf

yeah Speakerboxxx had a pretty bummer vibe under a lot of it

I dug that, tho: "Unhappy" and "Reset" were among the best tracks on that album.

i dont think big boi does 'deep' lyrical content all that well. esp not on his own. which is why big boi doing a more 'serious' bummer vibe album doesnt work nearly as well as big boi doing a big brash thing like this new album.

i unfollowed big boi on twitter after one time where he retweeted about a 100 people who said they liked his new leaked song. i did a tweet like "ok @therealbigboi thats ott...unfollowed". just tried to follow him again and give him another chance but he has me blocked! lol

i can't wait to hear this album; i'm sure it's great and happy albums are awesome, but:

i dont think big boi does 'deep' lyrical content all that well. esp not on his own. which is why big boi doing a more 'serious' bummer vibe album doesnt work nearly as well

this is crazy talk. like jaymc said, "unhappy" gives the lie to all of that.

yeah I think he's got depth to spare - his range is pretty broad

he is maybe most enjoyable being impish & braggadocious tho

diff strokes for....

i think hes def got range. i just dont think hes got the depth to really put as much into it or give it real gravitas like dre3000.

gotta echo all the "You Ain't No DJ" love

eh 3000 hasn't displayed any gravitas in like 10 years

xp

Full stream up:

http://www.billboard.com/#/features/release-of-the-week-big-boi-1004101148.story?tag=hpflash2

shakey not a int playas anthem fan?

First skit made me LOL IRL so

haha okay I forgot about that! yeah that was good

The Love Below is a mess, and the stuff that works on it isn't because of any "depth" (in fact I think it might be quite the opposite). For the most part you have to go back to Stankonia for any "wow that's kinda heavy" shit from 3000.

^^^re: Intl Playa Anthem

3000's verse on Royal Flush (a great track, should've been included on this imho) doesn't strike me as particularly deep either. some good punchlines

x-posts

Royal Flush and a few other tracks had to be left out because of some contractual fuckup.

Can rtc repost that quote about how titchy is worse than geir

nobody is worse than geir

real heads will know that it's titchyschneider that is actually ilx's premier subliminal chinese water-torturer - geir is but childs play in comparison.

― r|t|c, Thursday, October 22, 2009 5:20 AM Bookmark

lol @ this tho:

For a while I thought Geir and Titchy were trying to out-WTF one another but Martian has just stepped up and shown how a real artist does it.

― Matt DC, Thursday, November 29, 2007 2:56 PM Bookmark

You know what it is about this album?

Big Boi sounds like he's having a fucking blast making this music...there's just such a sense of enthusiasm and fun.

It sort of points how how joyless and dead a lot of stuff feels today.

― Q and Not Gucci (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Thursday, July 1, 2010 7:56 AM (4 hours ago) Bookmark

lol

It sort of points how how joyless and dead a lot of stuff feels today.

this really is how I feel whenever I dip my toes into hip hop these days (Lightweight Jammin excepted!)

"shine blockas" = a (the?) standout track for a lot of folks, maybe just cuz it's had more time to sink in. i like it, but it's not a favorite. then again, i don't often dig the smooth & floaty "euphoria" vibe that's become shorthand for wealth & success recently.

Tichy, what does it mean that Big Boi doesn't have the "depth" of Andre?

big boi likes kate bush! that's hella deep

spkrbx/TLB suggested to me that 3000 had a (not "deep" but) far-ranging pop genius that big boi lacked, a willingness to experiment (successfully!) with any crazy shit that might happen to cross his mind

SLLF successfully repudiates the dre = genius, BB = hard worker dichotomy though

i don't even think we need to hit yall with a second verse, but i - i think i just might because i - like to destroy shit

a willingness to experiment (successfully!)

this is the detabable part

detabable? don't mind me

Complaining about skits, really y'all?

do they suck? if they do, and they get in the way of shit, then they should be complained about

really what's annoying about them is that they aren't separate tracks that I can delete/skip

i don't even think we need to hit yall with a second verse, but i - i think i just might because i - like to destroy shit

― The Reverend, Thursday, July 1, 2010 3:54 PM (16 minutes ago) Bookmark

this. if the skits were half as awesome/punchy as his rhymes, then i think fewer people would be complaining about them.

speakerboxx showed quite a lot of experimentation btw

i wish big boi could be as deep as "roses really smell like boo-boo" man that was deep

http://www.mighty-vibes.org/forum/images/smiles/slowburner.gifhttp://www3.timeoutny.com/newyork/thevolume/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/leonard-cohen-songs.jpg

rev i love that line...reminds me of what dream said a year or so ago in the new yorker about not writing second verses

man cohen is so gangsta

http://www2.brandonu.ca/Academic/Arts/Departments/english/Kramer/Images/svcohen24b.jpg

Hate the hook on "Follow Us" and I'm not crazy about one or two tracks, but fuck me if the rest isn't just completely awesome. Also, I kinda like having the two versions of Shine Blockas - it acts like a "fuck yeah, this again!" reprise.

the opera on Gen Patton is a bit much

I agree – that's the track I had in mind upthread when I said it was cluttered in spots.

"Daddy Fat Stax" hasn't been mentioned, but great proper opener. Accordion on rap songs is always a good idea.

i wish big boi could be as deep as "roses really smell like boo-boo" man that was deep

― Vuvuzola Jesus (Whiney G. Weingarten), Thursday, July 1, 2010 4:45 PM (45 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

real talk

someone lolled at "daddy fat sex" a while back, but yeah, no real mention, and it's great, excellent opener. "sax" though.

"follow us" makes me cringe, but i can't deny it. i mean, i really want to hate the chorus/hook, cuz it seems so objectively awful, but it works for me despite my reservations. have resigned myself to just plain liking it.

and "patton" has to be a joke, right? at least in part. wtf aspect makes the overcluttered ridiculousness a bit easier to take, but yeah, not a favorite.

"lookin at ya" sounds great at the very end

The chorus on "Follow Us" is garbage. Ugh. Can't stand it.

I get that Gen Patton is intentionally over-the-top bombast I think it just goes too far

the opera on Gen Patton is a bit much

― has arlen specter never heard clarence thomas's laugh? (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, July 1, 2010 4:10 PM (26 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

naaaaaah I love Gen. Patton, it's nice to have one bombastic headbanger on the album

xpost

"general patton" sounds like circa-04 dipset but with better rapping, which is a dope thing to sound like imo. i like how the horns lend some subtle funk to it.

Follow us would be preety amazing if they didn't have the surfrider foundation baby-are-you-a-badfish-too allstars singing on it

this record is going to explode my brain when everyone makes me want to hate it by saying stupid things about it on ilx

it is mostly fun, if occasionally a lil weird here& there

tbh i don't think the album is quite as good as most are making it out to be, it's a fun album, but not totally amazing and i feel like "you ain't no dj" aside, i'd already heard the best tracks

haha deej, on release day you should compile the 10 stupidest things said about it on ilx into a listicle

this new big boi is pretty ghttp://www.bestmusiconcampus.com/_media/GA/KennesawStateUnivers/Vonnegutt/image/v9.jpg

FOLLOW US

"Tichy, what does it mean that Big Boi doesn't have the "depth" of Andre?"

it means that big boi is more shallow is what it means. i dont recall anyone ever really contesting this until they started to split, and suddenly in collective kneejerk fashion, people started overcompensating for the praise and respect dre3000 got by saying big boi was not just in fact equal, but the better member. or that speakerboxx was better than TLB. im all for backing the underdog, and for backing hip hop made by a member of a RAP group over some bad try-hard prince and p-funk-isms from a guy that for a while thought he was better than rap, but the distance between these guys got pretty big for a while. this new album reminds me that big boi was always seriously fierce as a rapper. but it doesnt make me think that hes NOT better doing stuff like snappin and trappin or gangsta shit (hated that dre3000 line about playing his guitar btw - very annoying 'me so quirky' lyric) than he is doing tracks like unhappy.

overcompensating by backing the guy who can actually make an entire album's worth of listenable music

listenable, but not actually that remarkable. whereas TLB had more standouts. big boi isnt a great producer on his own either, which didnt really help. id still rather hear outkast as a rap group over any of their solo albums tbh, but id take dre 3000 over big bois solo material.

i pretty much think the litmus test for whether you're a rockist should be having to pick between Andre or Big Boi

bullshit.

and its that ridiculous POV that leads people to overhyping big boi.

i don't think we'll see anything as stupid as titchy comparing 'speakerboxxx' to 'wu-tang forever'

whereas TLB had more standouts.

They were "standouts" cuz they were awful!

uh yeah. cos hip hop double albums (albeit one thats separated by the members) are just incomparable.

Dre is a phenomenal rapper but he got less and less interested in what he was best at. He reminds me of Neil Young in the eighties: drifting from genre exercise to exercise, in a perverse attempt to deny his talents.

i dont recall anyone ever really contesting this until they started to split

I suspect you are wrong about this

but id take dre 3000 over big bois solo material.

SLLF combined w/Speakerboxxx is head and shoulders above TLB

lol @ how no one ever mentions/discusses Idlewild. I don't think I ever even listened to the whole thing.

xp

I bet tickey likes Gnarls Barkley more than Cee-Lo's solo stuff too

Dre is a phenomenal rapper but he got less and less interested in what he was best at. He reminds me of Neil Young in the eighties: drifting from genre exercise to exercise, in a perverse attempt to deny his talents.

― Filmmaker, Author, Radio Host Stephen Baldwin (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, July 1, 2010 10:57 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

otm, perfect comparison

though hopefully he won't get to his old ways and shocking pinks era

yeah wow @NY comparison Alfred, that's an interesting parallel. something to chew over

I'm not sure the things that drove Neil in the 80s are close to what is driving Andre at this point, but certainly the results are similar. T/S Trans vs Love Below (I might pick Trans tbh)

the distance between these guys got pretty big for a while.

The only time I heard distance was in 2003, when one was thinking more symphonically with arrangements while the other was playing bad guitar and singing in a parched falsetto.

I bet tickey likes Gnarls Barkley more than Cee-Lo's solo stuff too

Goodie Mob w/Cee-Lo better than both imho!

also kudos ilx, it took just a day from us to get from excitement to whiney/titchy bitchfest to "it's really not THAT good" backlash...so efficient

by all means an artist has gotta "stretch" but there's risks. Big Boi stretched modestly: his arrangements and choice of guest artists got more wack; Dre was the flashier one, more interested in sonic impact, but his failures make me question whether he wanted to impress us with how deep his CD collection is.

there are so many problems with The Love Below - it tries really hard to get by on doing a lot, to coast on credit for being all the things it's not (ie a "rap album"), but a lot it fails. Crappy guitar playing, gratuitous drum 'n' bass programming, a serious lack of editing (pretty much every song is several choruses and/or a couple minutes too long), frustratingly simplistic lyrics and hooks. I never want to sit through the whole thing.

On top of that, there isn't much 3000 has done in the 00s besides that. Some cartoon work, a couple shitty movies, a handful of guest verses, and Idlewild. Kinda pathetic.

not to back titchy up but i think some of you guys protest too much re: the love below

im not even talking about the new album so stfu. i like the new one. its cool.

"Dre is a phenomenal rapper but he got less and less interested in what he was best at. He reminds me of Neil Young in the eighties: drifting from genre exercise to exercise, in a perverse attempt to deny his talents."

cant disagree with that. i never listen to speakerboxxx or the love below (though a day in the life is still great) if im honest. my favourite kast song of the last decade is prob mighty o.

"I suspect you are wrong about this"

yes, probably, some disagreed, im sure.

probably you mighty intellects on ilx.

goodie mob with ceelo (ie the first album) is better than gnarls and cee-lo solo. same way outkast is better than dre solo. liked tracks like big ole words but god, a lot of solo cee lo was pretty awful. never want to hear ceelo talking about being a closet freak again.

dude took his guitar for a walk in the park, got lost, never came back

xp

"im not even talking about the new album so stfu. i like the new one. its cool"

^^this was in response to the whiny post made by missipipi shakedown

i only referred to you as fighting with whiney not backlashing

hey ya is pretty dope still.

I have trouble not viewing 3000's retreat from music as an admission of defeat, as a kind of capitulation. His issues with how hip hop was evolving were front and center and he was clearly growing uncomfortable/uninterested in a lot of hip hop culture, but rather than use his position and prominence to try and reshape or remold things in a different direction, he just gave up and walked away. Which comes off as a cop-out. Hip hop is pretty boundless in terms of the sounds and styles it can accomodate, it's sad that he wouldn't use this to his advantage and instead opt to make a fairly ambitious but also amateurish hodge-podge and then just vanish. Big Boi's approach, by comparison, is so much more inviting and invigorating.

(won't argue that Hey Ya is an amazing track - knocked it out of the park with that. little else on the album comes close though. maybe Dracula's Wedding)

Don't mind "Spread."

Yeah, "Spread" is quite good. One of the few times he really succeeds on TLB.

"she lives in my lap" is still my jam

gotta say "Turns Me On" is my fave even though it's essentially a note-for-note rewrite of

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TFmfwRJ68Ww

lol @ how no one ever mentions/discusses Idlewild

p much every Andre track on that is terrible*, while about a third of the Big tracks are good

*fsvo terrible, the whole album is, like, perfectly listenable

fsvo?

big boi is a great rapper, titchy is wrong except that yes ppl are overrating big boi now but its still a good album & both it & speakerboxx are much better than love below ... speakerboxx is in fact great

i kinda had a good time with the movie (idlewild) even though it was kinda o_O goofy

i didn't see the movie but nothing i saw about it made it seem that it would be anything other than goofy

general patton is dope btw

would love to see any other example of people complaining that a rap beat is too epic

as far as comparing big boi + dre.... i love them both but big boi has a new album and dre doesn't!

^^^ real talk

i was gonna say that at least bun's verse isn't corny on this remix then he started rapping about remixing the song like kool aid

as far as comparing big boi + dre.... i love them both but big boi has a new album and dre doesn't!

― hoes on my dick cos my groceries bagged (tpp), Thursday, July 1, 2010 5:40 PM Bookmark

^^much more fair than most of what ppl have been saying itt

by the way everybody, this album is still great after you listen to if for three days straight

I actually liked that Kool Aid line...

i'm glad someone else remembers that dungeon family album! that was great.

I really enjoyed this on first listen - all summer jams all the time!

I feel like it really has a similar feel to the DJ Quik & Kurupt album, so I have a tendency to want to hold it to that standard. It doesn't hit the mark as consistently though, and it ends up feeling kind of disappointing to me, even as I like almost everything on it. I wish I could share you guys' unabated enthusiasm.

give it a few weeks

Eh.

It reminds me a lot of The Humdinger by Nappy Roots, similar riotous vibe. And, yes, Quik & Kurupt as well, but that's such a lean album it's bound to be more consistent.

Funny you mention BlaQKout, Rev. I was driving around tonight and the same sort of thought popped into my head. I think BlaQKout is better, though. Initially at least.

i described it as "this year's blaqkout" to someone yesterday! not quite true but it was to get them to listen to it and it's true-ish enough

Oh yeah, The Humdinger is a good comparison, too! (Which reminds me I need to hear their new album.) And this is probably as good as The Humdinger, so I really shouldn't be giving it short shrift.

idlewild does still have some jams ppl

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNoLHZauCZs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVOhLxnEjAU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0LTGQ7XKyM

basically if you cut out the lolsmfhdre3000 bits its a dope album imo

did Marcello once say that Idlewild was just as great if not better than any other Outkast record, and anyone who disagreed was plainly a Tory scum who should have their ears filled with molten lead, or something like that?

i'm glad someone else remembers that dungeon family album! that was great.

^^^this. love that record. seems like it was totally slept on

Yeah, it's classic for all time. White Gutz is the best ever. With a killer Big Boi opening verse

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjNKP4o9pgw

go from 12 to 12 Monday to Sunday.... take the first two days and sleep like mummies... and I'm out

2x

xp

idlewild has mighty o. forget all those other tracks, except maybe hollywood divorce. dungeon family album is cool but if they had done it earlier in the day (like say around the time they did cool breezes watch for the hook) it would have been 10 x better. felt like another crew album for the sake of a crew album, and a bit after the fact, by the time they actually got round to doing it.

you know who should do an new album?

cool breeze!

embarassing moments in ilx poll history

Best verse in "Watch For The Hook" (1999)

dissapointed royal flush isnt on this btw.

does this album have the best (american) rapping of the year?

I just got this at the same time I got the two E-40 Revenue Retrievin albums and I gotta say it's a close call

40's kinda in his own universe tho imho

thanks for the heads up. love this.

one good thing about it is sometimes i think big boi has a bad weakness for too many guests, and guests for their own sake, plus poor hooks, but this album does pretty well in avoiding those. plus the hook with janelle monae is sublime.

does this album have the best (american) rapping of the year?

― titchy (titchyschneiderMk2), Friday, July 2, 2010 1:43 PM (24 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I think the Roc Marciano might take that one for me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0uVHsPOL8j0

And actually the new Eminem has some pretty otherworldly rapping-qua-rapping on it even if his concepts/choruses/beats/ideas are totally in the shitter

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLinkJvoasY

love a good 6/8 rap

Roc marciano is good but totally workmanlike, wouldn't say he's the best this year.

dare i ask?

i would like for whiney to be banned for continually talking about that eminem song

eminem is so fucking lame

A few days ago they played "Love the Way You Lie" and "My Name Is" back to back on the radio and the difference was like O_O

Hearing Eminem coming from cars so much this past week has been :(

Dre is a phenomenal rapper but he got less and less interested in what he was best at. He reminds me of Neil Young in the eighties: drifting from genre exercise to exercise, in a perverse attempt to deny his talents.

[...] by all means an artist has gotta "stretch" but there's risks. Big Boi stretched modestly: his arrangements and choice of guest artists got more wack; Dre was the flashier one, more interested in sonic impact, but his failures make me question whether he wanted to impress us with how deep his CD collection is.

― Filmmaker, Author, Radio Host Stephen Baldwin (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, July 1, 2010 4:07 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

there are so many problems with The Love Below - it tries really hard to get by on doing a lot, to coast on credit for being all the things it's not (ie a "rap album"), but a lot it fails. Crappy guitar playing, gratuitous drum 'n' bass programming, a serious lack of editing (pretty much every song is several choruses and/or a couple minutes too long), frustratingly simplistic lyrics and hooks. I never want to sit through the whole thing.

On top of that, there isn't much 3000 has done in the 00s besides that. Some cartoon work, a couple shitty movies, a handful of guest verses, and Idlewild. Kinda pathetic.

[...] dude took his guitar for a walk in the park, got lost, never came back

[...] I have trouble not viewing 3000's retreat from music as an admission of defeat, as a kind of capitulation. His issues with how hip hop was evolving were front and center and he was clearly growing uncomfortable/uninterested in a lot of hip hop culture, but rather than use his position and prominence to try and reshape or remold things in a different direction, he just gave up and walked away. Which comes off as a cop-out. Hip hop is pretty boundless in terms of the sounds and styles it can accomodate, it's sad that he wouldn't use this to his advantage and instead opt to make a fairly ambitious but also amateurish hodge-podge and then just vanish. Big Boi's approach, by comparison, is so much more inviting and invigorating.

(won't argue that Hey Ya is an amazing track - knocked it out of the park with that. little else on the album comes close though. maybe Dracula's Wedding)

― has arlen specter never heard clarence thomas's laugh? (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, July 1, 2010 4:21 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark

just alfred and shakey, but others seem to agree. is this really the ilm verdict on 3000 and the love below? cuz i disagree entirely. i don't see the record as a failure on any level: "spread", "she lives in my lap", "hey ya", "roses", "pink & blue", "dracula's wedding", "take off your cool"... though andre's obviously reacting against hip hop and/or the idea that he's a rapper on TLB, i don't see him as abandoning his gifts. i'm reminded of the fables regarding dylan's first electric shows. all the folk hardliners are said to have frothed with rage, but in retrospect, the progression feels more natural than shocking and didn't have much to do with the core of his music. see the non-rap-ness of TLB in similar terms. it may not be what he'd led us to expect, but it's nonetheless a damn fine album taken on its own terms.

been almost 7 years since speakerboxx/TLB, and it's true that dre hasn't done anything of real note in that time, but it's still too early to declare him musically dead.

wow it's been that long....what is his deal?

wonder if he's the next lauryn hill or what

name me another artist who came back strong after a 7 year vacation

dude is finished

i have no doubts that if andre was sentenced by a judge to make a southern rap album that it would be dope as dope gets, but i don't think he has any interest in that at all, and he sucks at any other music besides that, so yeah, he's done

Dylan?

xpost

maxwell

when did Dylan ever stop touring/making records...?

Maxwell

ha xpost

portishead

you could maybe MAYBE make an argument for Miles, but even that was just 5 years. and I tend to really hate his comeback stuff.

good call on Maxwell tho

when did Dylan ever stop touring/making records...?

Seven years between Under the Red Sky and Time Out of Mind if I omit the cover albums that Greil Marcus likes more than I do.

mission of burma

dinosaur jr.

name me another artist rapper who came back strong after a 7 year vacation

I don't know what your point is. The continuing vitality of De La Soul and Public Enemy tell me that hip-hop is certainly not a young man's game.

Dr. Dre

? Mascis never stopped making music. bands breaking up and reuniting is not the same thing...

xp

i would definitely argue that it is

that is a response to soto, not shakey

I don't have a point I was just curious - it seems pretty rare to me. A lot of examples cited so far seem kinda dubious/not analogous

like... raekwon and big boi have put out great records recently, but when hip-hop feels vital to the country, it's def a young man's game

name me another artist who came back strong after a 7 year vacation

dude is finished

― has arlen specter never heard clarence thomas's laugh? (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, July 2, 2010 2:41 PM (18 seconds ago) Bookmark

i have no doubts that if andre was sentenced by a judge to make a southern rap album that it would be dope as dope gets, but i don't think he has any interest in that at all, and he sucks at any other music besides that, so yeah, he's done

― hell hath no furry (J0rdan S.), Friday, July 2, 2010 2:42 PM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark

well, in all fairness, it's been only a few years since idlewild. the fact that we didn't love it doesn't wipe it from existence. lots of people come back from one less-than-stellar album.

right now the young men are failing us, more or less -- but it's still a young man's game

Dr. Dre

lol

There are certainly people making better old man rap than fucking Public Enemy (or even De La who aren't completely terrible at present date)

well, sure, if we want to evaluate an artist on his moment of greatest mass cultural impact...

xxpost

We disagree, Rev. Loved the last two PE albums.

virtual old man rap renaissance in the last couple years IMO

lots of people come back from one less-than-stellar album.

in 3000s case I think it's two less than stellar albums and a bunch of bullshit movies/cartoons. and there's also the fact that he really does NOT seem interested in music - he doesn't wanna tour, he's not interested in hip hop, he wastes his time on shitty little movie roles, etc.

[There are certainly people making better old man rap than fucking Public Enemy (or even De La who aren't completely terrible at present date

also Rev otm that's a pretty weak pair to cite Alfred (also neither of those acts took the extended vacation route 3000 has)

Also "old" is a weird adjective to use around hip-hop. Ghostface is old. LL Cool J is ancient.

De La Soul didn't release anything for a five-year period, but I guess they toured and did whatever during that time.

I'm going out the door for drinks, so when I return a little soused I'll have more to say. Kisses!

when hip-hop feels vital to the country, it's def a young man's game

― hell hath no furry (J0rdan S.), Friday, July 2, 2010 2:50 PM (17 seconds ago) Bookmark

virtual old man rap renaissance in the last couple years IMO

this is really true to my ears - I haven't heard anything from young guys that's wowed me as much as Ghostface, Raekwon, E40, or Big Boi in recent years

this is probably true (otoh jay-z's 40)

exactly

i mean, prior to "shine blockas", we would have had equal reason to wonder about both BB and andre. speakerboxxx & idlewild aren't my favorite albums (prefer the former), but i wasn't ready to write the verdict. i was curious about what might come next. and i'm still in that position wr2 dre.

I haven't heard anything from young guys that's wowed me as much as Ghostface, Raekwon, E40, or Big Boi in recent years

― has arlen specter never heard clarence thomas's laugh? (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, July 2, 2010 2:57 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark

would say i haven't heard a lot from young guys that's wowed me as as much, but yeah

Big Boi was doing that ballet in Atlanta, put out the Got That Purp mixtape plus a couple singles and all this stuff

# 2004: "This Is How I Feel" (from the Earth Wind & Fire album Illumination)
# 2005: "Never Gonna Let You Go (She's a Keepa)" (from the Omarion album 0)
# 2005: "Porno Bitches" (from Bizarre album Hannicap Circus)
# 2005: "My Man" (from the Carlos Santana album All That I Am)
# 2005: "Girlfight" (from the Brooke Valentine album Chain Letter)
# 2005: "Smilin' (You Caught Me)" (from the Sly & the Family Stone tribute album Different Strokes by Different Folks)
# 2006: "Wanna Move" (from the Diddy album Press Play)
# 2006: "Margarita" (from the Sleepy Brown album Mr. Brown)
# 2006: "Porno Bitches" (from the Devin the Dude mixtape album Weed, Wine and Women)
# 2006: "Ms. New Booty (remix)" (from the Bubba Sparxxx album The Charm)
# 2007: "Last Night (Remix)" (from the Diddy album Press Play)
# 2007: "And I Love You" (from the Rich Boy album Rich Boy)
# 2007: "Hood Figga (Remix)" (from the Gorilla Zoe album Welcome to the Zoo)
# 2007: "Get It Shawty (Remix)" (from the Lloyd album Street Love)
# 2007: "Hood Boy" (from the Fantasia album Fantasia)
# 2007: "I'm So Hood (Remix)" (from the DJ Khaled album We the Best)
# 2007: "Hold Up" (from the Chris Brown album Exclusive)
# 2007: "I'm Crazy for Love" (from the Lim Jeong Hee album Before I Go J-Lim)
# 2008: "Energy" (from the Raheem DeVaughn album Love Behind the Melody)
# 2008: "U Know" (from the King Vashawn album Villennium)
# 2008: "Love's Crazy" (from the Slim album Love's Crazy)
# 2009: "She Gotta Friend" (with Gucci Mane and Juelz Santana)
# 2010: "Nothin' On You Remix" (with B.O.B. and Bruno Mars)
# 2010: "Tightrope" (with Janelle Monae)

Andre, otoh busy getting on John Legend and Gwen Stefani albums...

# 2003: "Boogie Man" (from the Big Gipp album Mutant Mindframe)
# 2004: "Bubble Pop Electric", "Long Way To Go" (from the Gwen Stefani album Love. Angel. Music. Baby.)
# 2005: "That's Sexy" (from the Q-Tip album Open)
# 2005: "Junglebook" (unreleased version; original version from the Esthero album Wikked Lil' Grrrls)
# 2006: "Throw Some D's (Remix)" (from the Rich Boy album Rich Boy)
# 2007: "What A Job" (from the Devin the Dude album Waitin' To Inhale)
# 2007: "30 Something (Remix)" (Jay-Z feat. André 3000 & Ice Cube)
# 2007: "You (Remix)" (from the Lloyd album Street Love)
# 2008: "Green Light" (from the John Legend album Evolver)
# 2008: "Everybody" (from the Fonzworth Bentley album C.O.L.O.U.R.S., also featuring Kanye West)
# 2010: "Ride" (remix) (from the Ciara album Basic Instinct)

there's good stuff there

dre is awesome on "green light" -- his verse on that fonzworth song is actually pretty good

both big and dre are pretty great on "int'l players anthem"

big was awesome on "i'm so hood rmx", "she got a friend", "get it shawty rmx"

listening now - I don't really get around to enough rap to say that this is better than everything else or anything but I am loving the hell out of this

yeah Intl Players Anthem is the standout from this period (at least what I heard of it)

xp

<3 Dre on the "Walk It Out" rmx

I walk it out like Usher
if you say 'real talk', I probly won't trust ya

yeah that's a seminal line

your white tee, well to me
look like a nightgown
make your momma proud
take that thing two sizes down

i could give a damn about your car
but then i would be

whoever compared this to quik & kurupt is otm i was thinking the same thing

I gotta say, if "You Ain't No DJ" is any indication, Andre can still make awesome rappin'-ass rap beats when he wants to.

"Tangerine" is such a low-key banger imo

I can't help but feel like the Too Short cameo is totally squandered.

^^^so true

he says like 4 lines? wtf

yahhh

Yeah, those Big Boi lines are the perfect segue into a full Too Short verse, which I always feel robbed of when listening to the song.

wish it has more Bun and Pat too

someone did gucci lines in shine blockas? can someone help me?

they put Gucci in a cell
did my deal with the jail
I make music, I make movies
I need Tyler Perry's cell
--- smell coming out the lamb
fuck it what the hell
gucci man, so I'm gucci'd down
she got on chanel
------ blowing stupid kush
like I'm in a rush
in the club with a half a pound
hundred fifty blunts
zone 6 east atlanta
zone (don't fuck with me alone?)
so I shine like it's showtime
all my jewelry on
on the block with a stupid watch
boy you need to stop
when I stop everybody watch
car don't have a top
in a stretch, cost a stupid check
rolling up the pack
got 'em gone, I can't even flex
east side where you at?

IT'S GUCCI !!!

they put Gucci in a cell
did my deal, went to jail
I make music, I make movies
I need Tyler Perry's cell
loud smell coming out the lamb
fuck it what the hell
gucci man, so I'm gucci'd down
she got on chanel
in the cut rolling stupid kush

the end of that hits so hard

on the block with a stupid watch
boy you need to stop
when I stop everybody watch
car don't have a top

i never realized how dope this is

thx j0rdan!! i love that tyler part; sounds like "i need a pair of carousels"

zone (don't fuck with me alone?)

can't exactly make this out though -- tbh it sounds like "fuck with meat alone" \(o_O)/

FYI: All the lyrics are in the booklet.

did my deal, went to jail

i always heard this as "then medea went to jail" lol w/ the tyler perry ref

yeah "shit i thought gucci mane said" could probably be a hot tumblr meme blog

on the block with a stupid watch
boy you need to stop
when I stop everybody watch
car don't have a top

i never realized how dope this is

― hell hath no furry (J0rdan S.), Friday, July 2, 2010 9:11 PM (17 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

lol

???

if you can't grasp that bit you should stop trying to like gucci mane imo

no prob

on the block with a stupid watch
boy you need to stop
when I stop everybody watch
car don't have a top

i never realized how dope this is

― hell hath no furry (J0rdan S.), Friday, July 2, 2010 9:11 PM (18 minutes ago)

yeah i was just thinking this earlier as i read it

xp oh brother

Hi, boys. What'd I miss?

zone (don't fuck with me alone?)

not that it makes sense as far as i know, but I always heard it as "Zone 6, East Atlanta's own/fuck with Nia Long"

glad this album doesnt have any dre3000 cameos actually. not cos i think theyd be pooor, but cos without them it means big boi stands alone, without the album resting on the outkast factor.

weirdly tho i dont really think of big boi as an old man rap artist, not like bun b, ghostface, or whoever. especially not the way hes rapping on this album. plus he doesnt do the whole 'im so weary' shtick.

(as suggested above) he sounded much more weary as of speakerboxxx

Whiney's right, the rapping on that Em song is great, but the beat, guitar, Pink hook, lyrics and tone of voice are all really fucking terrible. Quite a feat!

Hope the Big Boi album comes out here this week, thread has me totally excited. Also has me wishing I hadn't lost my Cuban II CD in the meantime.

there's a lot of good stuff here but as an album begins to seem pretty arbitrary past maybe the halfway point - i think perhaps the true peril of an "old man" rap record isn't always so much solely in terms of outmoded styles as the lack or loss of a dialogue (between the songs, the context, the listener whatever) within that chosen metier? basically "good songs" aside i don't ever get the feeling anything is like, happening here, and that air of inconsequence lingering makes repping this record only seem like a reification of bias so much as anything

like i find it hard to accept people wanna put this up against quik and kurupt - maybe on a critical reception level, or just yeah generally on a old stager observation, but blaqkout is so much richer a record on so many levels it's crazy

oh i like the skits on this btw

motherfuckin henry

^^yes! if i am totally h w/ myself, that might be my favorite moment on the whole album

its not an 'album album', its more just a scattering of good-great songs. inevitably peters out mid/three 1/4s of the way through, but it can be edited down. quality never drops tremendously either, it just doesnt all hang that well together.

if i was being really picky, i could say the enthusiasm is a tad affected. like big boi is manufacturing that ebullience/'inspired' mode, but that might be reaching.

but its the rapping - the FLOW - that makes this album.

xxp i'm with you guys on the skits-- 1. they're funny 2. it's nice to get a couple seconds between tracks to process the song that just ended

off the top of my head, david blaine and the be still --> fo yo sorrows transition skit are prob my favorites

xxxxxxxxxxposts - de la soul have been dope in the past decade and don't deserve to be seen in the same league as the mess that is pe.

<3 Dre on the "Walk It Out" rmx

I walk it out like Usher
if you say 'real talk', I probly won't trust ya

― The Reverend, Friday, July 2, 2010 6:15 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

always assumed the line was "walk it out like (an) usher," which I think makes a lot more sense. but then there are a lot of lines in that verse that are kind of irritatingly nonsensical or grammatically garbled, never thought it was one of his best remix appearances.

maybe someone tagged his Unk MP3 as Usher

"walk it out like (an) usher"

this barely makes sense too

i agree with rtc -- i think the quik & kurupt comparison for me was def not about level of quality but just the general all-over-the-place summertime vibe of it all -- obv quik is much more of a master of making that feel cohesive & effortless & most importantly, UNIQUE

inconsequential feels right

hey rtc have you heard the e-40 album?? im real curious abt your reaction i think its awesome

theres this kinda GTA-city feel about it where its taking me forever to feel like i really know all the songs on it

aight ima put it on after the football ('day shift' anyway, there's 2 of these things?)

i know u & whiney were on it already but i forgot another example of an gr8 old man rap album that didnt feel old last year was juvenile's - don't think i ever got round to mentioning how much i <3'd it

i feel like rtc has been otm itt

another otm statement is you dweebs should listen to some funky house instead of all this but ok nm here goes with this h20 alb

a bunch of us like funky house! i do wish i followed it more tho

i'm slowly making it thru all these ill blu mp3s that tim sent me, but it's a lot of ish!

haha at the expense of revealing my patented 15 minute album listening "technique" -

1/ arent all 40 albums like this anyway? boosting this now is reflected glory from general bay rennaissance (i hear) which this sound here doesnt really represent - all these stark sparse slappaz could still be 'tell me where to go'

2/ i really never liked 40 tbh, too much hyuk hyuk

3/ best track is 'this a boy', then 'rick ross horns' & 'everyday is a weekend', and then i'd have to listen to 'bitch' n 'dem boyz'

i will listen to this properly soon but im not in the mood as it turns out - am i wrong tho?

yah i mean i know what you mean -- at least the first part, 'arent all 40 albums like this anyway' -- number 2 i dont agree w/ at all though

but your first point, yeah i mean noz said as much when we were talking about it online, but for some reason once i spent a bunch of time w/ it it was just like ... it feels like it has some kind of grand overarching purpose i havent quite cracked yet, that its sprawling overwhelmingness is its own thing but also like ... its NOT just jumping on nu-bay and getting all these dj fresh beats or whatever, hes not trend hopping **yet again** plus there's not a hint of the kind of pandering crossover-y ness that ruined ball street journal either ... cf (sorry to do this) my review here http://www.hiphop.com/reviews/31
like basically i think its as if hes figured out what an e-40 record should sound like & has stripped away all the bullshit, then just made only good songs in that vein. and made tons of them, as if hes making up for it. its like hes playing just to the fanbase that always followed him cuz he knows no one is buying records anyway, a huge record that never feels like hes run out of ideas & instead feels like he was worried he was running out of time to say what he had to say, worried the industry would die before he could release another record or something idk. making up for lost time, maybe. im sorta shooting off the top here, i just know i keep coming back to 'every days a weekend' 'lightweight jammin' 'dem boyz' 'i get down' 'hes a gangsta' 'the weedman' 'this a boy' 'whip it up' etc etc etc

also as far as #2 goes theres a lot of heartfelt stuff on here!

like what i complain about in that review is ball street journal feels kind of aimless and directionless, like he has no confidence or intent except releasing another record... by making this one such a massive undertaking it just sorta creates its own inertia of purpose ....

& it incorporates the new bay stuff w/out being indebted to it

sorry if this sounds like a super-subjective response but i should mention that anecdotally, i just hear a lot more rap fans talking about this one than his last couple. like, this feels like a record that is broadly appealing to u.s. rap fans. (this is definitely not reflected on the internet mostly, and particularly not reflected in gen. hip-hop media)

Are we talking about Night Shift or Day Shift or both?

^ yeah i'm still unsure on that

by inertia you mean just like, gravity right? - or is my grasp of physics inadequate

i think i feel what ur saying tho, like it's def a less compromised and more self-possessed album than i remember ball street journal being - and i think ur also right to say hopping on nu-bay wouldnt have rang true either; the (v vague) analogy that springs to mind actually is donaeo in the uk last year who - albeit through reinvention, ie he'd been around in different guises for years - really found his sense of self as an artist via the energy of funky house around him and its rebirth of the uk as a scene but never resorted to mimicry or pandering as such. obv there are different local logics at play with that comparison but basically

point #2 i will accept as a cheap shot but tbf it's not like his delivery doesnt naturally preclude hearing him in a more serious way to some extent

im talking about both -- i think by inertia i mean weight/gravity but also like ... the sense that he wasn't really controlling the direction, he just kept making tracks that he felt & the record sorta took an uncontrolled movement of its own, but that this movement is what was missing from his last few records.

i havent taken physics since i was 15 obv

both are pretty much a unified piece imo **esp** in the ipod age

how dope is the 'whip it up' beat

sry i said 'ipod age' w/out scare quotes

people are bein otm itt, I don't really have any desire to play this as an album through and through - just kind of cherrypicking random songs

so like inertia's resistance is in its ineluctable inevitability etc - crazy but i like it!

my fave typo of yours is still "peons to devotion" on ur old maxwell rvw fyi but i see some spoilsport sub caught it eventually :(

haha i caught it

btw wait til u hear 'knock em down music'

"If I look like I got some money ain't nobody gon' wanna give me none." True true, 40.

btw there's already a separate thread for the 40 albums fwiw

(I think they're both pretty great, Day may have a slightly higher ratio of great tracks imho. I never bothered with Ball Street Journal. Loved like 2/3rds of Ghetto Report Card tho)

hesa hesa hesa hes hes a gangsta

Ya I know Shakey, but I can't find it with a quick search.

Also, man I miss Jazze Pha beats. I was always a fan of dude's production.

the 40 thread is called lightweight jammin

im still uncontrollably repulsed by post ... '02 jazze pha beats

i'm sayin

sorry if this sounds like a super-subjective response but i should mention that anecdotally, i just hear a lot more rap fans talking about this one than his last couple. like, this feels like a record that is broadly appealing to u.s. rap fans. (this is definitely not reflected on the internet mostly, and particularly not reflected in gen. hip-hop media)

― blap...tremendo (deej), Saturday, July 3, 2010 3:13 PM Bookmark

I know no one really dug Ball Street Journal like that, but My Ghetto Report Card was a HUGE HUGE record here. You could not escape either of the singles and everyone was bumping the album.

is the dashiki making a comeback http://rapradar.com/2010/07/03/new-video-big-boi-x-big-rube-general-patton/

I'm actually doubting there will ever be another Outkast album after reading this

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/04/arts/music/04bigboi.html

Jive seems like the absolute worst possible outlet to record your music.

first lets lol at

The rapper Big Boi in Atlanta in May, photographed alongside a mirror.

The rapper Big Boi in Atlanta in May, photographed alongside... ANOTHER BIG BOI?

lol

Jive “had no involvement in the songs I recorded with Mr. Benjamin,” Big Boi said.
Ha is he parodying the Times style of using last names?

i'm thinking that maybe someone forgot to add brackets around that

otoh LA reid seems like the best record executive there is

"them crackas wasn't playing fair at jive" iirc

xp yeah, LA Reid has always struck me as an all-around pretty decent guy. I also appreciate how his def jam seems willing to cut their losses and just put a damn album out already if the music already exists, evem if it ain't gonna sell like that.

not trying to be be contrary here but reading between the lines of that article i'm not sure i quite see what's so demonic about vibe?? you can bitch all you want about evil money-grabbers insensitive to art but if i were a record exec in charge of half of one of the biggest selling outfits of recent years i dunno if i'd be happy to unquestioningly accept an album of dude pottering around in his shed either - it's not even like we're talking about a big ambitious project like idlewild here (which jive already took an L for). and then they're just supposed to hand shit over to def jam instead? come on

also are we talking about the same genius super exec la reid who just handed shyne a ten million dollar contract the second he came outta prison?

haha dunno why i wrote vibe, meant jive obv

because jive has a storied history of telling people they're gonna put their record out and then when the ink dries on the contract, they uncross their fingers and say MAYBE IN THREE YEARS MOTHERFUCKER LOL

and then they're just supposed to hand shit over to def jam instead?

it's not like they can use the Big Boi Feat Andre track themselves, so it's just churlish and spiteful to bar him from including it on the album.

mega xposts but re: dre not producing anything of meaning, I hesitate to bring it up but the 2007 Class of 3000 soundtrack had a few standout tracks
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kn_EGLtOVGU
Andre just went off and did his own thing; hollywood called him back and he answered so good on him.

this record is going to explode my brain when everyone makes me want to hate it by saying stupid things about it on ilx

it is mostly fun, if occasionally a lil weird here& there

I suspect i'm gonna feel this way but for now "You Ain't No DJ" is brill. Also I love the parts of "General Patton" when the stop-watch hi-hats get replaced by a single ominous tic on the offbeat.

i'm a bit late on this but goddamn it is great

Only on ILX can you be late before the album comes out.

ahhh, night night is so awesome.

am i the only one that kinda digs the chorus on "follow us"

Follow us would be preety amazing if they didn't have the surfrider foundation baby-are-you-a-badfish-too allstars singing on it

― Vuvuzola Jesus (Whiney G. Weingarten), Thursday, July 1, 2010 6:05 PM (1 week ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

yeah i know everyone hates it!

i really like the chorus, i just wish like someone but TOMUZ PYNCHIN or whatever their retarded name is was singing it

do you guys think janelle monae was like "hey mom, i'm on the big boi album!" and queued up the track only to be greeted by "when was the last time you went teabagging?"

am i the only one that kinda digs the chorus on "follow us"

― altered scones (J0rdan S.), Wednesday, July 7, 2010 10:05 PM (32 minutes ago) Bookmarkno, i love it. one of the album's musical high points. tried to hate it, but couldn't.

am i the only one that kinda digs the chorus on "follow us"

*raises hand cautiously*...

It's actually one of the first things I can't wait to hear when I put on the album.

as sung by the dong beach dub allstars

What's wrong with the Follow Us chorus exactly? There are worse choruses on this record...

do you guys think janelle monae was like "hey mom, i'm on the big boi album!" and queued up the track only to be greeted by "when was the last time you went teabagging?"

― altered scones (J0rdan S.), Thursday, July 8, 2010 1:27 AM (9 hours ago) Bookmark

lol

Nothing is wrong with the chorus itself, its just that it pops in like someone changed the channel to some terrible Can't Hardly Wait soundtrack Wheatus fratboy booger-and-beer Long Beach chillin in my sandals bro bro bro band

i'm listening to this for the very first time right now

As someone who until 30 seconds ago had no idea who Vonnegut were, it doesn't really stick out like a sore thumb at all. I just assumed it was some bunch of session musicians they bought in.

FOLLA US NAAAAAHHHH BRAAAAHHHHH

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_Ck63LqoIae4/SgDSFcnrMOI/AAAAAAAABlU/WGZuCFb34o0/s1600-h/l_e20c71131b70dba96c7c3e8ef329b385.jpg.jpeg

fuck is this jay-z kid cudi bullshit!!!

Maybe you should stop listening to Jay and Cudi, and actually put on the Big Boi record instead?

Bought this today. You Ain't No DJ produced by Dre3k :DDDDDDDD Maybe he still has it?

i don't get the complaint that this album drops off - its strongest run is definitely the middle section! "shutterbugg" through to "be still" (i love the start and end too, but that's the peak bit for me)

it also definitely feels like a coherent album to me, not just a hotchpotch, though maybe this is cuz i hadn't really been anticipating it all these years as i basically lost all interest in outkast sometime around 2004, so the quality of "shutterbugg" and "fo yo sorrows" blindsided me a bit.

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4123/4758328231_e79e21181e.jpg

John NAGLwood

xp someone should prob tell that guy that Nelly is not southern.

haha waht

Cherry Ghost are masters of the manly ballad.

"Nelly's winning way with a one-liner..."

HAHAHAHAHA.

I thought Nelly was from St. Louis...? That's the south.

Ban swvl

this clearly comes from a british paper, iirc

uh, as i recall Nelly generally repped the midwest.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DE1_6WJ371A

can we just agree to LOL at "Andrew 3000"?

http://www.villagevoice.com/pazznjop/critics/2008/784269

what a dumbfuck

haha flobots

Also, yes, you're the only one who likes that Vonnegut chorus, J0rdan. I refuse to believe more than one person does, and even that claim I'm pretty skeptical of.

I've never paid any attention to Nelly, don't mind me

http://www.villagevoice.com/pazznjop/critics/2008/784269

what a dumbfuck

― goole, Thursday, July 8, 2010 3:13 PM (9 minutes ago)

Well now it all makes sense. A writer who counts Glasvegas and Dido as his top two albums of 2008, as well as Death Cab's "I Will Possess Your Heart" as the best song of that year. Happy to disagree with this idiot regarding Mr. "Patten" and his new solo album without "Andrew 3000" as his George Michael. Go to hell.

ppl who begin with the premise that andre is better can blow me

I mean, I'm all for a rational, well-reasoned two star review of the Big Boi album. But this guy's a fucking tool.

its like england doesn't even have wikipedia

lookin for ya is a bit dissapointing as a dre-big hookup. not sure about the other bonus tracks floating around. :|

apart from royal flush obv but i heard that ages back.

3000 verses on devins "what a job" and "intl players anthem" get him a decade long pass

this album bangs so hard ... tangerine getting rewound about ten times this evening ... BOI STOP!

might not sleep tonight as i have "igotabackupplantothebackupplantobackupmybackupplan" rotating continuously inside my head voice

I can see some dude polling this album in December or January and almost every song will garner at least one vote.

Really wish the skits were on separate CD tracks. I'd like to put "General Patton" on a mix, for example, but I'd hate to burden friends with the David Blaine skit at the end...

Fairly simple editing job i would have thought

yep

Anyway...apparently Big Boi is already working on the follow-up to this and it's gonna be called Daddy Fat Sax: Soul Funk Crusader.

David Blaine skit is great and any friend you make a mixtape for will be better to have it

man maybe I need to listen more but I'm just not feeling it

and this from somebody who thought speakerboxxx >>>>>>>>>> the love below

like maybe I'll come around but it's one of those times when something everybody loves + should be right up my alley leaves me cold

Have to say I found it pretty lol I got an advert for big boi's kennel in the inlay.

This record is phenomenally good..for lack of a better word, it's just so 'musical'.

i don't get the complaint that this album drops off - its strongest run is definitely the middle section! "shutterbugg" through to "be still" (i love the start and end too, but that's the peak bit for me)

I think the opposite, there's a bit of a dip for me between You Aint No DJ and Shine Blockas.

Back Up Plan is so so great.

david blaine-baiting haha

that classic lazy last resort of hip hop albums

the album lacks a third section that really concludes it satisfyingly. it kinda just soldiers on. not that the quality drops off, it just doesnt really add up to much beyond a selection of good stand alone tracks. im not sure im really going to listen to it as a whole - id rather just play daddy fat sax, turns me on, gen patton, and shine blockas (and the remix) over and over. do like you aint no dj and tangerine a lot but yelawolf kinda ruins aint no dj.

no hustle blood??

But it's got a backup plan a backup plan a backup plan a backup plan a backup plan a backup plan a backup plan a backup plan!

i mean, i think the album could do with editing but i dont know what id take off.

^^ amazing post

Doesn't seem to be much love for The Train Part II in this thread. I actually think it would make a better closer than Back Up Plan (which is still awesome).

do like you aint no dj and tangerine a lot but yelawolf kinda ruins aint no dj

No.

I think "Hustle Blood" is my favourite thing on this right now. The groove is so deliciously slow.

otm. crazy that it's produced by lil jon

ive kinda warmed to yelawolf (or been forced to since listening to you aint no dj, which has one of my fave beats on the album) but he is kind of a poor mans thirstin howl.

Have you heard his mixtape titch?

He comes across less gimmicky in a sustained hit (though he's less gimmicky-seeming here than on his first verse on Rich Boy's "Go Crazy" - the second verse more than makes up for it there)

i havent, but i know a lot of people were going crazy about it. ill try and search it out.

actually its not that hes a poor mans thirstin, more than he just reminds me a bit too much of him (and plus, i loved mr howl).

If anyone fancies adjusting their tracklist, according to Big Boi Looking 4 Ya was supposed to come after Hustle Blood and Royal Flush was going to be the last track.

haha really don't see that thirstin howl thing. i think yelawolf is going to be huge

i havent, but i know a lot of people were going crazy about it. ill try and search it out.

It's the best album of this year IMO.

Yup.

train 2 and hustle blood are my favorites atm. cracks me up every time big boi says "choo choo" in the train 2. so many cool little vocal parts in that song.

*torrenting now*

people have the weirdest complaints about this album

haha thirstin howl?

looking forward to future references in this thread to pumpkinhead, breez evahflowin, and sir menalik

haha

i cant be the only one who hears it.

wishing i had one of the soundbombing comps on my ipod like a mutha right now tbh

thirstin was dope

soundbombing 2 was underrated imo

underrated in retrospect by herbs who are ashamed of their backpack past maybe?

^^

thirstin's skilligans island was one of the best albums of that era btw.

i really want to start a thread about "black-tracking" which is my theory that white rock critics love to REALLY BACK african-americans who makes remotely avant-garde music for the maybe span of like two years and then deem it "LOL SO CORNY" by the end of the decade. It's happened as long as I've been listening to music and it's super-racist and really fucking sucks

Tracy Chapman - P&J #3, 1988
Terrance Trent D'Arby - P&J #25, 1989
PM Dawn - P&J #5, 1991
Arrested Development - P&J #1, 1992; P&J #12, 1993
Disposable Heroes Of Hiphoprisy - P&J #19, 1992

I don't feel like looking up the rest, but same shit happened to Tricky, Rawkus, Def Jux, etc.

Oh, and grime

Wyclef Jean: Wyclef Jean Presents the Carnival Featuring Refugee All-Stars

^^^ this finished at No. 16 in 1997

terrance trent's "weird" albums aren't that weird and are really good actually.

I am never ashamed of liking backpacker stuff!

actually just downloaded The Appetizer a free EP by Punchline and Fokis, pretty awesome, came out last year i think....

Can't you apply that hindsight to lots of music that critics turned around went lol wtf was i thinking, no matter what race/genre is involved?

I think Whiney is OTM re: critical reaction to this stuff but for the record...

Tracy Chapman - P&J #3, 1988
Terrance Trent D'Arby - P&J #25, 1989
PM Dawn - P&J #5, 1991
Arrested Development - P&J #1, 1992; P&J #12, 1993
Disposable Heroes Of Hiphoprisy - P&J #19, 1992

I don't feel like looking up the rest, but same shit happened to Tricky, Rawkus, Def Jux, etc.

... I hated all this crap when they came out.

except for Tricky, that first album is really good

it's just reactionary, I think. White critics priveleging stuff for what it's not (ie mainstream black culture which is too "scary"/alien for them)

also - the pattern of only liking black music for being 'avant garde' or 'state of the art' and not being interested in much else about it.

Tracy Chapman - P&J #3, 1988
Terrance Trent D'Arby - P&J #25, 1989
PM Dawn - P&J #5, 1991
Arrested Development - P&J #1, 1992; P&J #12, 1993
Disposable Heroes Of Hiphoprisy - P&J #19, 1992

were these guys really avant garde though? michael franti? pm dawn?! i think they were liked for other reasons (being musical/conscious rappers etc)

(pm dawns second album had some great stuff on it btw)

it's just reactionary, I think. White critics priveleging stuff for what it's not (ie mainstream black culture which is too "scary"/alien for them)

um, being reactionary doesn't make it any less racist, particularly when it always follows the pattern of "wow this is neat, black people don't do this! I love it!" ----> "ugh this is corny, why don't they do what black people do?"

xp: PM Dawn and Disposable Heroes of Hiphoprisy were pretty avant-garde given what was going on around them when they both hit the scene, particularly DHOH and their appropriation of industrial music.

lol yeah - wasn't to implying it isn't racist!

I can't tyupe todaye

i really want to start a thread about "black-tracking" which is my theory that white rock critics love to REALLY BACK african-americans who makes remotely avant-garde music for the maybe span of like two years and then deem it "LOL SO CORNY" by the end of the decade. It's happened as long as I've been listening to music and it's super-racist and really fucking sucks

Tracy Chapman - P&J #3, 1988
Terrance Trent D'Arby - P&J #25, 1989
PM Dawn - P&J #5, 1991
Arrested Development - P&J #1, 1992; P&J #12, 1993
Disposable Heroes Of Hiphoprisy - P&J #19, 1992

I don't feel like looking up the rest, but same shit happened to Tricky, Rawkus, Def Jux, etc.

― Attention all Whiney fans! (Whiney G. Weingarten), Friday, July 9, 2010 8:55 AM (49 minutes ago) Bookmark

since it's on radar, add the love below. maybe not "avante-garde", but boundary pushing in a way that's similar to tracy chapman, TTD'arby. loved by many critics upon release, looked at askance a few years down the road.

laughable how critics (eg the guardian) talk about the way you move being as good a single as hey ya really.

race plays into this, but there's also a tendency among certain fans & critics (myself included) to gravitate to the weird & experimental in pop at the time of its release ... but then to retrospectively devalue it in favor of that which proves durable/universal over time. this tendency overrates novelty in the short run, overrates traditionalism in the long.

got any non-black examples

beck?

Well PM Dawn really started sucking, so that may be why critics distanced themselves.

Beck's best work seems to still be held in high regard, no...? Odelay, Minite Vultures, One Foot in the Grave, for example. That recent Beck poll got a LOT of votes

I was gonna say, Beck still gets plenty of crit love in certain circles.

Yeah dude, I think Odelay is looked on with way more regard than Of the Heart, of the Soul and of the Cross: The Utopian Experience

I don't know a single critic or rap fan who liked soundbombing when it dropped and doesn't now. I think whiney is full of it. Y'all forget that the gangsta populist rap is cool now crew was made up of new jacks who didn't get into rap until they were in their mid 20s

Also pm dawn and michael franti always sucked? Tracy chapman was always p lame? This theory needs work.

PM Dawn is awesome

i dunno, i think beck is a good example. odelay seems to be held in much lower regard now than it once was. i seem to remember it being heralded as some kind of epochal event on release. seen now as a good/fun nostalgia piece, like "shit, remember the 90s?"

back when there used to be electroclash, novelty appeal led critics to foam about all kinds of stuff that they turned their backs on in a heartbeat. peaches, anyone?

(love u peaches btw}

By yr theory why has kool keith maintained his critical respect? Why are outkast getting praise to the point where big boi's solid but not exact?y mindblowing solo record is a bnm ??

Dude, Pitchfork just called Beck one of the 100 best albums of the decade, i think that's critics holding him in higher than Michael Franti

Cool, deej, be sure to the same annoying logic games you play with our Gucci argument. "Whiney said X happens a lot, so he must mean X must happen EXCLUSIVELY"

Yeah contenderizer's got a good pt here actually _ I don't think u can speak so broadly about why some acts keep critical respect and some lose it. I'll be the first to say race enters into how critics receive everything but this theory has too many exceptions to make a rule.

what's the critical consensus on Basehead now?

Dog your theory has more holes than swiss cheese don't act like that's more about vendettas than normal criticism

I know MIA's not black, but every critic rushing to call her a retard all of a sudden probably fits into this too somehow.

uh she is a retard

racist

i know :-(

wtf is going on with your display name?!

The one generalization I think u can make here is that critics are just as bad/worse than the general public at jumping on every single trend when its new and shiney and are as quick to drop it when they realize it might make them look stupid. Lots and lots of bandwagon jumping

critical respect for kool keith seems stuck in some weird divide where the artist is respected, but there's some hesitancy about the crowd he appeals to. which isn't the same as a retraction of praise, but it's guarded, somehow. outkast are a perfect example of short-lived novelty appeal, cuz big boi's last couple recs are much more rap-traditional than TLB. a lot of people went nuts for TLB in the moment, then stepped back, while big boi's rep has steadily improved.

and maybe i'm wrong about odelay. rarely see beck mentioned as a touchstone in describing interesting contemporary music, but do hear a lot of "lol beck" chatter. random talk probably isn't the best measure of critical respect though.

xxpost

I got 20/1 odds that it's kenan-related

Y'all forget that the gangsta populist rap is cool now crew was made up of new jacks who didn't get into rap until they were in their mid 20s

fwiw I was listening to NWA in 10th grade. so, y'know, I assume you ain't talking to me

Someone dig up that Spin top 200 albums of the last 25 years list and count how many times Beck is on it

The one generalization I think u can make here is that critics are just as bad/worse than the general public at jumping on every single trend when its new and shiney and are as quick to drop it when they realize it might make them look stupid. Lots and lots of bandwagon jumping

― blap...tremendo (deej), Friday, July 9, 2010 1:47 PM (1 minute ago)

http://i46.tinypic.com/14udeeh.jpg

Rap traditionalism is totally what's hot w critics right now tho - wow this sounds jusy like ugk!! - another prob w the avant garde theory

critics are just as bad/worse than the general public at jumping on every single trend when its new and shiney and are as quick to drop it when they realize it might make them look stupid.

― blap...tremendo (deej), Friday, July 9, 2010 10:47 AM (5 seconds ago) Bookmark

this x1000. it's not necessarily that cynical, though. if you're sincerely interested both in music and the evolution of pop culture, you're necessarily gonna be drawn to what seems novel in the moment. that it takes you some time to fully process it isn't really a fault.

what's the critical consensus on Basehead now?

they were ALWAYS slept on iirc but those first two albums are back-to-back classics. much love from me.

Rap traditionalism is totally what's hot w critics right now tho - wow this sounds jusy like ugk!! - another prob w the avant garde theory

― blap...tremendo (deej), Friday, July 9, 2010 10:49 AM (12 seconds ago) Bookmark

YES. totally. but that can be seen as a larger-scale version of the process - applied to a genre, not just to the artists in that genre. critics first approach the genre in terms of what "rises above" it, and only in time come to embrace it on its own, self-defined terms.

this goes back to my main problem with Altered Zones is that good music should transcend the news peg of trendiness. Bands like Oneida and The Oh Sees who just make good album after good album deserve more shine than Memory Tapes

i mean, god, when we look back at chillwave it's gonna make grime look like Elvis on Sullivan

don't look back

wtf is going on with your display name?!

― Attention all Whiney fans! (Whiney G. Weingarten), Friday, July 9, 2010 1:46 PM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark

it's part of a tuomas post from iltmi

play with toys is great - haven't heard it in forever

Rap traditionalism is totally what's hot w critics right now tho - wow this sounds jusy like ugk!! - another prob w the avant garde theory

― blap...tremendo (deej), Friday, 9 July 2010 18:49 (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

This is totally different to critic rap traditionalism though because ugk&hindsight&southern revisionism.

Bands like Oneida and The Oh Sees who just make good album after good album deserve more shine than Memory Tapes

― Attention all Whiney fans! (Whiney G. Weingarten), Friday, July 9, 2010 10:51 AM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark

yeah, oneida deserved much more than a blip of curiosity for rated O. one of the best psych records of the last few years.

what thread was this again?

i mean, god, when we look back at chillwave it's gonna make grime look like Elvis on Sullivan

grime was pretty important

By yr theory why has kool keith maintained his critical respect?

well, i mean Ultramagnetic and Critical Beatdown are core NYC rap canon, so he has support based on that, not just Black Elvis and shit

Oneida rules.

also michael franti sucks and has always sucked

i don't think grime really fits into this theory either because most of the producers actively switched up their sound to something more populist. the avant-garde music you could call 'grime' (and not dubstep or funky or something else) did for the most part just stop. critics lost interest because there was nothing to be interested about.

boundary pushing in a way that's similar to tracy chapman, TTD'arby. loved by many critics upon release, looked at askance a few years down the road.

I've been defending poor TTD for years!

'more populist' is actually not the right words since there was a few years where grime was actually avant-garde and massively populist. but you know what i mean

ttd was never seen as avant garde. neither was tracy chapman. critics kinda loved and hated each in equal measure if i remember right. but they changed their minds really quick with ttd, maybe cos they wanted to see him put back in his place. now hes seen as an embarassment. and neither fish nor flesh - which was incredible - is seen as an utter failure.

if anything, i think stank/tlb-era outkast will be seen a bit more like idk, PE? praised as the future/innovative/progressive etc at the time, but as non-rap critics saw little merit in anything else about their music (they arent going to be getting hyped about a dope verse, esp if its laced with questionable content) they will find it hard to really see/remember what good it is after the moment has passed. its only real worth is that its 'new' and has amazing of the time/future sonics etc. whereas rock will be praised long after the moment as its deemed to be more timeless and has things like songwriting/lyrical worth going for it. obv with PE theyre praised and always will be for being political but thats always with reservations cos of griff/homophobia/sexism etc etc, its the sonics that is most indisputable about them. 'black music' is often left to languish purely in the pop culture moment. i mean, you read about R&B and hip hop and its always the futurism and the shock of the new that is talked about - which is cool, everyone can see that part of its appeal. but thats pretty transient stuff.

black music' is often left to languish purely in the pop culture moment. i mean, you read about R&B and hip hop and its always the futurism and the shock of the new that is talked about - which is cool, everyone can see that part of its appeal. but thats pretty transient stuff.

― titchy (titchyschneiderMk2), Friday, July 9, 2010 12:29 PM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark

that sounds true, but the same thing happens to most music of every sort. it exists in its moment, but then fades to make room for whatever comes along next. and the appeal of futurism seems to have waned in recent years, at least in terms of how mainstream american critics discuss rap/R&B.

i guess i'm out of the loop somewhat, in that i still rate outkast and PE as highly as i ever did. i never heard the bomb squad as future music, though, i just thought it sounded good.

well yeah, the 'futuristic' R&B and rap that hit the pop charts in the late 90s and early 00s will prob be canonised in years to come. p4k and spin roundups seem to include it. i suppose what i was saying in a slightly roundabout way was just repeating that this music is praised for those qualities first (and yes current-recent stuff isnt praised for that, as its not - cos not much of it is really doing anything as dramatically diff/new as before - eg the big boi album doesnt have that same wtf is this feel of stankonia to it), which is maybe justified, as that is what half the producers are going for too. theyre not really thinking about 'let me write the most amazing song', theyre thinking about beats.

anyway this album is pretty fucking great

Yeah, this album is fucking fantastic. This week I bought this and the two E-40 albums, all three immediately catapulted to the top of my very short list of great 2010 rap albums.

so many great lines on those 40 records

need to pick up those E-40s

That titcy post is actually totally right on imo. Black music and rap in particular has always had to stand out and v little respect is given to something for being typical but really well done ... its why quik languished critically for so long. While like indie by nature every record is 'new' bcuz that's sorta what defines it as indie. And he's otm about the pe/kast comparison.

the e-40 records are great. there's a thread THAT'S LIGHTWEIGHT JAMMIN' but discussion on it has kinda spread out across ilm as u can see

Probably the problem with Whiney's theory is that the category he terms "avant garde" really should be "not gangsta rap".

And I think he's conflating the audience reactions, as if the critics who rush to praise The Love Below are the same critics who now say "lol so corny". Undoubtedly some are, but I think the majority of critics probably feel the same way about the album now as they did at the time (and for TLB you can substitute the other albums on the list).

But I think the real issue is that critical reactions to black music are tidal: the tide rushes in following the release of something like The Love Below and lots of critics who never talk about rap (or indeed much black music at all) normally declare it to be a classic for its iconoclastic sound, then (as critics do) move on, and the tide goes out.

The people who never thought The Love Below was particularly amazing are more likely to be the people having ongoing discussions about hip hop and so they get a bigger role in defining its rep longterm than they did when the tide was in.

If I asked all the indie guys who worked at the arthouse cinema I worked at in 2003 whether they still think The Love Below is amazing, they'll probably say yes. But they're too busy listening to Phoenix again to join the dialogue. Likewise the older critics who embraced the album are busy wringing their hands over Liz Phair.

So it's like turning up to a second vote on an issue, and in the first vote the majority was massively with you, but then in the second all the guys in your faction forgot to turn up and now the opposition have the numbers.

Those guys I worked with almost never check black music so it's not that surprising that the tide usually never comes back in. They're not punishing Andre 3000 exactly - after all, they've paid him greater regard than they have most other black music.

Not surprisingly, the "avant garde" black music that is actually liked across the board - Prince, early Timbaland and Missy Elliot, A Tribe Called Quest, to name just three examples - doesn't tend to suffer these humiliating reversals of fortune.

Which is not to say any album in his category actually deserves this fate, but I think it's a bit more complicated than it's being described.

cutty, tell us about doing your verse on shutterbugg

he kept it playa while some chose to play it safe

loving "daddy fat sax" more and more every time

Listened to this three times now and it keeps knocking me out. Great tune after great tune, I don't think there's a note of it I dislike.

all about hustle blood today

gonna sound a bit anal here and i know kast have always worked a lot with singers but several of the hooks on this record arent that memorable imo. never bad but not really on par with what outkast usually do. theyre a mite predictable. id like it if big boi didnt rest so hard on guests (esp singers) all the time. unless the guest is killer mike or backbone, obv.

listened to this a couple times on a road trip this weekend, the only track i skip is the janelle monae one. too repetitive, not enough big boi, and her vocal sounds like it goes with a different track.

yeah I'm not a fan of that one either. It has a nice melody and production but it's too repetitive and she sounds cold and empty.

This album got a lot of play this weekend. So, so good.

It's a good album to play while hanging with bros.

In my case, bros being a gender neutral term. Twas a dance party at our place Saturday night.

love Big Rube goin in at the end of General Patton

we can end the vicious cycle affecting our youth today if we just stop lying... if we just stop lying... stop lying... ... lying

In my case, bros being a gender neutral term. Twas a dance party at our place Saturday night.

― Official Cheese-Filled Snack of NASCAR since 2002 (B.L.A.M.), Monday, July 12, 2010 12:10 PM (6 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

braggin

finally got this--it's rock solid tho i don't think i'm in love with it. not crazy about: vonegutt, the endless janelle chorus, the yelawolf verses (unfortunately!). pretty crazy about: tangerine, shutterbugg, a good lil jon production! not seeing the blaqkout comparison--that was way more one dude's crazy vision and frankly it's much weirder than this.

also the ad for antwan's pit bull kennel in the cd booklet is pretty o_0

yeah thats the other thing about all the big boi defending - for all the stuff about him dre3000s equal, the reason people just dont get as excited is that hes always the more down to earth, regular kind of guy compared to dres weirdness/adventurousness. you can see why they need each other. big boi on his own is very capable and solid and consistent and everything, but he lacks that extra something that would make these tracks more interesting/'different'. dre3000 on his own meanwhile is left to indulge all his bad ideas of wackiness unchecked and while more 'brilliant' needs someone like big boi to make things more fully formed. kinda why this album, though good, and with about 4-5 standouts/virtual big boi/kast classics, isnt really much more than solid. hard to really fall in love with it, hard as big boi tries, not least cos hes so dependent on outside guests.

these songs don't need to be wackier.

If I didn't read ILX, I don't think I'd ever have realised The Love Below was so reviled. I feel like the last person here who actually rates it. I'm not sure whether, according to Whiney's theory, this makes me not racist or a particularly stubborn racist. It's confusing.

xpost - i didnt say wacky.

dorian it obviously means youre a racist in denial.

Cool. Just checking.

you are all of the varied many types of racist. your racism contains multitudes.

agree with call all destroyer's take 100%.

and to expand on "you ain't no dj" - absolutely LOVE the beat. been listening to lots of old IDM records lately and this track hits me in the same pleasure zone. rigid, funky, TOUGH. would fit right in on a gescom record.

but the first yelawolf verse just sounds so... leaden? doesn't sink the track but eh.

did not realize lil jon produced "hustle blood" until just now. crazy.

yelawolf's flow on that track is kinda weird and threw me off at first but clicked on successive listens

i don't get why ppl are so amazed that lil jon did "hustle blood". he's been doing shit that sounds like that forever.

^^^yeah doesn't strike me as an unusual production for him either

xpost

yeah, I'm not ruling the dude out. hopefully the same thing happens for me.

just a little bit of a bummer since it's easily one of my fave beats on the album.

can't say I've followed lil jon closely but I haven't heard anything that delicate from him that I can recall

yelawolf's flow on that track is kinda weird and threw me off at first but clicked on successive listens

― Mister AOR (The Reverend), Tuesday, July 13, 2010 1:11 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark

yeah it is a weird flow, kinda breaks up the momentum of the track, but i kinda dig it

i'm not sure if i like it, but it seems pretty ballsy to leave that much space in a verse on a big boi track, when he just eats up those 16th notes (although i guess that's what andre 3k does to some extent, he's just way better at it)

it hasn't really clicked w/ me either. my reaction was basically that he'd blown a big opportunity; but then i figured big boi must hear something in it that i don't.

just to add to the chorus, this is really really really good

I kind of think yelawolf just didn't wanna outshine big boi on his own track

Like T.I. did

well that's one theory

love yellawolf's choppy flow on "you ain't no DJ", esp. relative to big boi's density & speed. it's only the first verse that's so off-kilter anyway.

current favorite = "hustle blood", unlikely to be unseated. and i guess most people aren't gonna come around on "follow us" [sad]

point me at other Lil Jon songs that sound like Hustle Blood plz

if that "follow us" chorus is successful at anything it's for getting stuck in my head for over a fucking week now

xpost, it's a great chorus. I've said like a million times I love "Follow Us" but just can't stand the "bros icing bros" tone of dude's voice. it would be like my fave song on the album for me if they got like Cee-Lo or someone to sing it. I still play it all the time.

i agree with that

thing is, i hate that style/tone/type of music, too, but it works for me in context. and i guess, sure, if someone i actually liked were delivering the chorus in a style i don't ordinarily have problems with, i might like it more...but it's hard to say. love it as it is, cringe factor included.

i'm kinda noncommittal on it, but BOI does it ever sound like the next single after shutterbugg

I don't think we've discussed how MASSIVE "Shutterbug" sounds in the car, on the radio, especially the intro: the drum program, stuttering bullfrogs, two-note synth hook. I mean -- WOW.

still dont like yelawolf

^yeah me either. Only truly weak link on the album for me, and not to be a 3 Stacks hater, but the beat on that is maybe the weakest on the album

i think the only one i don't really like is the jamie foxx song

Have to say I found it pretty lol I got an advert for big boi's kennel in the inlay.

also the ad for antwan's pit bull kennel in the cd booklet is pretty o_0

it would be totally amazing if Big Boi travelled back in time and retroactively inserted an ad for his pit bull business into the Speakerboxxx/Love Below booklet

WAIT WHAT HOLY SHIIIIT

i'm pretty sure that shit like that has been inside rap albums forever?

::shrug:: not the ones i have (nb i don't have speakerboxx/tlb)

get some Public Enemy or Ice Cube albums, buy a Rapp Gear bomber jacket or Lench Mob hat

shutterbugg still reminds me of

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ngsO-TT2GI

Yeah I see it, but Shutterbugg itself is way better come on.

the bubble bunch is dope wtf

i don't think that was a criticism

yeah wtf is wrong with you deej

the "bros icing bros" tone of dude's voice.

Explain?

http://www.bestmusiconcampus.com/_media/GA/KennesawStateUnivers/Vonnegutt/image/v9.jpg

http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~mrl35/recent-photos/riddhis-birthday-formal/smirnoff-ice.jpg

i don't think that counts as explaining

dude looks and sings like a fratboy with a badfish tattoo, what else do you want from me?

1st picture explains that but i don't get the smirnoff ice one! smirnoff ice = drunk student union nights. gross.

I don't get how someone's voice can resemble the "sound" of the Bros Icing Bros website.

sigh

Sorry, that sounded a bit Tuomas, didn't it?

Nevermind.

http://www.chicagonow.com/blogs/partly-politics/assets_c/2010/06/Blank-Facepalm-thumb-387x259-155318.jpg

The idea that the Vonnegut chorus is remotely out of place on a album where one of the track begins with fucking grunge guitar is ridiculous. If he actually sounded like one of the dudes from Wheatus or Blink 182 I'd understand but it's a pretty nondescript voice. If it was a sample or just some session musician guy no one would bat an eyelid.

I mean I know Whiney is bending over backwards not to look like a corny indie fuck here but there's such a thing as trying too hard.

If he actually sounded like one of the dudes from Wheatus or Blink 182 I'd understand but it's a pretty nondescript voice.

FOOOLLAAAA US NAHHHHHHHAhhHhhhHHhh TRY RO WALK AWAYYY NAHHhhhhHHHAhhHhhhHHhh NOT ANOTHER LET DOWN WE'VE FGOT SOMETHIGN TO SAY....

RrrriiirrrIIIIIHGGGNNNnnnnnnNNNNnnnNNnnOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHH

http://c2.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/27/l_e166e12022224cabacee72f33841f3fd.jpg

The idea that the Vonnegut chorus is remotely out of place on a album where one of the track begins with fucking grunge guitar is ridiculous

the guitar gets buried by hard beats pretty quickly though, and that chorus is unavoidable

If it was a sample or just some session musician guy no one would bat an eyelid.

as far as i knew it was just some session musician guy, it still sticks out as being all radio rock (compared to every other singer on the record)

too be fair, i'll still take a Vonnneggutt chorus over the roots fucking with blog-rock any day

yeah when i heard it i had zero idea it was some dude from vonegutt and i still don't really know who vonegutt is.

it sounds like bad active rock radio type singing which i imagine is exactly what vonegutt is.

yeah, no one is purporting to know/care who vonnegutt is.

i'm pretty sure they're big boi's fuzzbubble or spymob

Yep. Fourth google result mentions "Purple Ribbon Records Artist Vonnegutt".

Lol

http://7oneseven.com/projects/vonnegutt2010/vonnegutt_j/vonnegutt_j_01.jpg

First song on their MySpace is called "Bright Eyes".

"Here's an unlikely recipe: Take classic emcee skills and dope lyrics, add pop sensibility and rock energy. Stir. Sprinkle a dash of inspiration from a literary icon. What do you get? Vonnegutt."

hahahahahha

Um heytards I know whiney wasn't dissing b. bunch maybe read the post right after it??

Shutterbug is way better??

Y'all going out of yr way to make me seem crazy lately or what

I guessusually its just al being disingenuous about amy winehouse or w/e but still, my post was not hard to parse

im totally underwhelmed by this album. i like 4 songs enough to go back more than a few times though

I think I might like Turns Me On best.

my bad deej, i totally glazed past that post

http://www.cnn.com/2010/SHOWBIZ/Music/07/06/big.boi.interview/index.html

I would love to hear the collaboration he's angling for at the end of this article

so would i, but when he says he's looking for her, i just think...yeah, you and the whole rest of the world too.

vonnegutt song = the kid cudi effect

so would i, but when he says he's looking for her, i just think...yeah, you and the whole rest of the world too.

― لوووووووووووووووووووول (lex pretend), Wednesday, July 14, 2010 1:14 PM Bookmark

ha at me assuming this automatically meant lauryn hill