The Wire Vs Careless Talk Cost Lives Vs NME

you don't need to read this stuff. the music is in your head. remeber that 'indie kid'.

Then again, you may not. It's not my place to tell you what you should or shouldn't buy. All we try to do is cover the music we LOVE in a sassy, informed and passionate manner - and aim to communicate the enthusiasm we feel to others. We enhance the pleasure you draw from listening to great records: we don't claim to be taste-leaders or elitists or set agendas.

But possibly we do, and are, anyway.

The paper quality is superb.

You want a list of bands in the next two issues: man, we sure as hell don't work that way. We go on passion and wit and spontaneity, and fuck everything else. You can check out previous band lists and (a little) writing and photography at www.carelesstalkcostslives.com - I wasn't actually going to advertise the site here, because ILM is sacred. But hell. I hate typing out lists.

Oh, and you won't get many lists either. Unless we change our minds.

Half of us here seem to write for it anyway, I say plug the link away if you like. :-)

The Wire... I've only read once. It seemed like Record Collector with better quality paper

Careless Talk Costs Lives... eh. I don't call myself a writer, I've only written for it once... It's got stuff you'll love, it's got stuff you'll hate, but at least it'll have stuff to solicit an emotion other than "Steve Sutherland and Mark Beamount should both take an axe to the skull, whilst April Long is buggered by the hounds of hell, and Imran Ahmed is forced to watch".

FUCK OFF

Or didn't you read that part?

FUCK OFF!!!

'cause hey, some of us don't have time to read an eight page article about the senseless things.

but mostly i read books.

"man, we sure as hell don't work that way. We go on passion and wit and spontaneity, and fuck everything else."

Yeeah! Sounds good!

FUCK OFF with your paper quality

The bands NME covers are mostly rubbish doomie.

'''cause hey, some of us don't have time to read an eight page article about the senseless things.

but mostly i read books.''

so lets go through this one: you don't have time for an eight page article but you have time for books.

i just like the facts, ma'am. concise and simple and direct.

i would choose nme for indie and kerrang for punk rock coverage.

"But hell. I hate typing out lists"

yay bitch! FUCK OFF!

i'm just in the music writing game for the free cds, bub.

''i just like the facts, ma'am. concise and simple and direct.''

not enough.

''i would choose nme for indie and kerrang for punk rock coverage.''

I thought 'punk' had died long ago. but you know that already.

Nah - I like getting my musical news from the newstand - a quick read - flip through - whilst waiting on a friend, that's when I read the magazines.

The NME is good 'cause you get coverage on the way to work and you've only spent £1.50 so you can trash it after reading it - it's the equivalant of an indie Heat Magazine. Wire/Etc - bore me please! Do I really want a sub - lester bangs article about some guy's life who reviews rock records veiled as a 'piece'. no way jose.

I like my music articles trashy, fun and easy.

''i just like the facts, ma'am. concise and simple and direct.''

not enough.

Enough for me.

''i would choose nme for indie and kerrang for punk rock coverage.''

I thought 'punk' had died long ago. but you know that already.

Depends - o.k., if you are to be pedantic - i like kerrang for a quick overview of loud noisy fuck you rock and roll.

'no self indulgence, please ma'am, i'm full up on the lester bangs and mash'

yeah that was bad! though mark s did a nice rewrite (though no doubt you will rubbish it).

The wire can be dry at first. This months issue there really is fuck all apart from the article on Lou harrison (i like william parker but I'm starting to hate david keenan). But it depends what music you like I suppose (and since you write for the NME, i suspect you wouldn't). I think if NME did an article on Harry pussy or Boredoms (and they caught on to these things quickly) then I'd buy it again. Or that i felt there were things to discover every so often it would be good.

I know that andy capper likes boredoms. I've been away from the country for a while but hasn't there been an article on them, say?

At least w/Wire you know what reelases are coming out (again I like some of the music they cover) and you are gonna know when derek bailey is playin (next week w/prevost near hackney i think).

''i like kerrang for a quick overview of loud noisy fuck you rock and roll.''

terrorizer does the whole thing much better i think.

i'm just mindful of ego. i did a beachwood sparks review that was beautiful written and almost poetry (teehee). The editor told me that it was a fantastic piece of writing and was impressed and then emailed me back and told me to rewrite it and I agreed with him. It was self indulgent to the person who did not know the beachwood sparks. the wire is for the music boffin with the bad breath boring everyone about their john cage collections.

The wire can be dry at first. This months issue there really is fuck all apart from the article on Lou harrison (i like william parker but I'm starting to hate david keenan).

The only time that I notice the author of music writing when it's dreadful. I can name a writer at the NME that comes to mind. But to be tactful I will not.

But it depends what music you like I suppose (and since you write for the NME, i suspect you wouldn't).

Huh?

I think if NME did an article on Harry pussy or Boredoms (and they caught on to these things quickly) then I'd buy it again. Or that i felt there were things to discover every so often it would be good.

Aaah. You are jaded. Better stick with Wire. The NME and Kerrang are for pop culture freaks.

I know that andy capper likes boredoms. I've been away from the country for a while but hasn't there been an article on them, say?

I saw a live review of the boredoms by andy capper. Though I have never met anyone at the NME. It's all done through email.

At least w/Wire you know what reelases are coming out (again I like some of the music they cover) and you are gonna know when derek bailey is playin (next week w/prevost near hackney i think).

*Yamusocrapn* Sorry - wasnt paying attention. ; - )

''i like kerrang for a quick overview of loud noisy fuck you rock and roll.''

terrorizer does the whole thing much better i think.

Can you buy terrorizer easily enough? I hate being inconvenienced by magazines. Defeats the purpose, does it not?

*yawwwnmusocraptalkyawwwn* What?

Personally and I talked to some people - no offence guys - but alot of people think that the wire has it's head stuck up it's own arse.

'Don't intellectualise my rock and roll' David Crosby

And why would I spent £3.50 to £5.00 just to find out what new music is out this month? Convince me of that. i'm eighteen to twenty - i want to find out what new music sounds like - do I spend rather alot of money or do I spend £1.50 and maybe a coke and a Heat Magazine for the price of one magazine that is just boffin wank material?

heh...here we go! I knew it would descend down the mis-informed, assumption making route. anyway, since when was the NME about 'pop culture'. I thought it was about 'indie' which is very different.

''But it depends what music you like I suppose (and since you write for the NME, i suspect you wouldn't).

Huh?''

I suspect you wouldn't like the music I like or the music the wire writes about, which is what I meant.

''i'm just mindful of ego. i did a beachwood sparks review that was beautiful written and almost poetry (teehee).''

you've got some ego problems of your own.

define pop culture. i think mcdonalds is pop culture. more so than a tate exhibition about it.

''But it depends what music you like I suppose (and since you write for the NME, i suspect you wouldn't).

Huh?''

I suspect you wouldn't like the music I like or the music the wire writes about, which is what I meant.

and in that statement are you implying that the music that wire covers is inherently better or worse?

''i'm just mindful of ego. i did a beachwood sparks review that was beautiful written and almost poetry (teehee).''

you've got some ego problems of your own.

oh yeah, bub? i can point to some of your posts where thou dost egoth runneth over. the internet is the super ego anyways. you can run rampant on the 'net without fear of repercussion.

i'm bored.

you've got some ego problems of your own.

anyways i am a good writer. that's just a fact. however, if i were full of ego why would i rip into some beautiful and make is grey and concrete like a david cronenberg parking lot (which admittedly is more beautiful sometimes like the archway tower). : - o

The wire it 3.30 and it's once a month. The nme is 1.50 and it's four times a month. there's a lot of 'stuff' being released so I can't just glance and say i want that and that, etc. anyway, as I said I liked some of the articles, just not this month.

''i'm eighteen to twenty''

heh...so you're 19 then.

''want to find out what new music sounds like - do I spend rather alot of money or do I spend £1.50 and maybe a coke and a Heat Magazine for the price of one magazine that is just boffin wank material?''

well, I don't like everything (every one has its likes and hates). One thing that I hate is the brand of indie that NME 'covers' week in week out. Rather have boffin wank material than just wank material.

Never heard of it. I would read the billboards in los angeles than hunt down a magazine (wait I lied Flux is a good magazine and i have to go to charing cross to buy it).

i'm off to bed.

night night

that's the coolest compliment ever. i am a drama queen. but not in my writing i.e. with characters and such. sometimes i think that life is a big needle and it's fucking me up throughout the day.

it's very much a 'I want this and I want that' culture. Sometimes I wish I could do all of my shopping at argos. It would make life less complicated.

''i'm eighteen to twenty''

heh...so you're 19 then.

hehehe.

''want to find out what new music sounds like - do I spend rather alot of money or do I spend £1.50 and maybe a coke and a Heat Magazine for the price of one magazine that is just boffin wank material?''

well, I don't like everything (every one has its likes and hates). One thing that I hate is the brand of indie that NME 'covers' week in week out. Rather have boffin wank material than just wank material.

what do you mean by brand of indie. this week's issue is cool - interpol/the pattern/the beachwood sparks/datsun. i hate the word indie. i like independant.

but the wire is tedious wank material. it's like jerking off to kafka when you could just easily masturbate to henry miller. or one step again - linda lovelace (for kerrang readers only)

it was you that started on the ego thing.

''define pop culture. i think mcdonalds is pop culture. more so than a tate exhibition about it.''

my point was that the NME is stuck down the 'we hate pop' road, etc. And it's coverage is really tired.

but I prefer the wire because the bands they cover are simply better in my opinion. And it just isn't restricted by 'indie' and what the major labels are offering this week. at least the ppl in the wire seemed to dig deeper.

my point was that the NME is stuck down the 'we hate pop' road, etc. And it's coverage is really tired.

that's not pop culture not least we are in some bizarro world where it has a different meaning. everything boring is pop culture.

but I prefer the wire because the bands they cover are simply better in my opinion. And it just isn't restricted by 'indie' and what the major labels are offering this week. at least the ppl in the wire seemed to dig deeper.

dig deeper or become masturbatory obscurists. 'look at me, look at me, i have a recording of the noises that john cale's fridge makes' - five stars obviously. whose really reading it anyways? hell to me would be paved with back issues of the wire or being stuck with the editorial and writers in an elevator.

but that's just me.

the NME type 'indie' is already being obscurist. Mention beachwood sparks or interpol and you'll get a blank look. having read the NME for a few years they got as obscure as the wire (it's just the labels that release it are different). the john cale stuff is far easier to get hold of as well but have you heard it doomie or is this another ill informed opinion of yours.

I don't write lists and so on. if I'm passing through a shop and I happen to see something I might try it. Nobody can get hold of everything. a lot of the wire's stuff is available in a record shop, you can easily mail order it too.

what's so good about Flux magazine?

hahahah....at least I don't read the wire which is the pretentious cunt magazine of choice.

whatever NME says about Beachwood Sparks, it is still mostly plugging Starsailor, and Starsailor are the Cliff Richard of our times. I mean, Tim Buckley couldn't help sounding like Roger Ramjet, but this guy actually tries to!

CTCL is good, but I wish to God they'd hang fire on their CRAZY rock'n'roll quotes, you leaf through and there's endless "I pissed in a milkbottle, added a frog and poured it over my salad"'s everywhere.

am not an authority though.

I usually just read my articles and go wow...cool.

i'm interested in the lee interview but i've always steered clear of wire as it always bored me.

i suggested he was 19 (he said he was 'between 18-20'). He's 30 then is he? The wire is closer to what I like. The bands seem to be more anarchic even. Indeed, I only read things that I'm interested in. It is impossible for me to keep up unless I actually was paid to do that (somehow).

to the person who told doomie to fuck off...was it the same person who told me to fuck off on that Nick drake thread and ran away when I told he/she was a coward.

I don't always get the "post electro scatalogia suffused with swedenborgian metaphysics" stuff either, but that's just me. The Wire turned me onto some jazz and contemporary classical that I love.

As for Martin Denny, it evokes the nightmarish, tone-bending world of Elvis's Blue Hawaii film to me. Creepy listening!

i wish it was a martin denny world. also lsitening to gary usher's symphonic tribute to the beach boys and the vines (still think they are garbage though)

try www.carelesstalkcostslives.co.uk

Email me direct if you continue to have problems.

also: like julio sez your idea of pop cult is bollox. not in a "define popcult" way but in the way you and writers of yr ilk ("freaks" as you call them so selflessly) hide your massive egos behind a popcult flotsam flux existentialism, creating this higher collective order that just seems to end up suppressing anything you don't like rather than open the whole thing up. so the wire is boring according to the great popcult whorl ie YOU. it's just so selfconscious, so mannered. SUPER egolitarianism (heh) rather than just, like, living. having an opinion - yeah that's ego too. but at least it's honest. far more corruptive to selfdeny ego and then masquerade it as general truth.

Okay, carry on. Sorry.

Y'know in the music rag biz jargon= being a wiseguy.

but thanks for entertaining me.

see, this man don't give a fuck. i do it for the free cds. let me walk you through that, "Bob". i. (meaning me) do it (meaning write) for the cds (music on cdrs). Do you understand me?

let's do this again, bob.

i. (come on say it with me) I do it for the free cds. Break that down with your thesaurus. Ten Dollar Words shows massive insecurity, man.

indeed deraymi. you want paralleles on algha marghen. Its a 'jazz' album. I gotta run, W. marsalis might be after me now I said that.

*let's go of your hand and sets you free into the world*

true. just turned 23 a couple of weeks ago.

doomie's attitude sounds like he is 19. well...lets try and guess everyone's age. Bob? 20. Doomie? 17 surely Gareth? 120.

It depends on what music you enjoy listening to. That's all there is to it.

did you really think i was gonna try and prove my popularity/sex prowess on the INTERNET?

"bob- we think the wire is a good mag but I think the idea of comparing the wire to NME/CTCL is wrong. their musical universe is completely different. It depends on what music you enjoy listening to. That's all there is to it."

No. It's not about trying to convince them "my" music is better. In fact it's about showing how very little to do with music this is on their part. But I appreciate you pulling me away from the brickwall anyways. Whatever.

(as much as i want to)

Read this slowly - this sentence makes absolutely no sense. 'with music this is on their part'.

O.k. 'Bob' again.....I. do. it. for. the. free. cds.

Geez D Howie Dee.

here is another reason why i write for the nme. i'm seeing my favourite west coast band - the tyde - on monday and i'm doing a review and got some cds and passes into a sold out show.

I'm not sure why it's here, but I like it.

I saw you at the show. Didnt really want to say hello as too many people - confusing - being a recluse - better.

i don't have the problem. other people do.

is 93 feet east cool venue?

WTF is in my coffee.

When Careless Trout Costs Lives launches, it will blow every other rag out of the water. TROUT, WATER, DO YOU SEE?

If all NME writers have as little self-respect as you, it probably goes some way to explaining why the magazine is so bad... ah fuck, does that mean they're gonna spike my Reading story now? No. Didn't mean it. It's a joke. You NME types know when to recognise a joke when you see one, don't you? Still, it does seem weird, your defensiveness. Once upon a time, people would have been proud to write for the NME - not "I do it for the free CDs and guest list". Man, oh man. What a fucking lame reason. I'm guessing you're about 24 and feel you know everything there is to about life. Man, oh man. That's a real shame. "I do it for the free CDs and guest-list". Man, oh man. What a pitiful existence.

Fat. Fourty. Bitter.

You are unimportant and you are the reason i have the attitude I do.

I'm not surprised you post anonymously. If I was your editor and read your posts, I'd sack you on the fucking spot. And If I find out any of the Careless Talk writers have the same attitude then they're fucking sacked too. Unless of course I change my mind...

I think I should write for Careless Talk Costs Lives - I haf just written a GREBT review of Pokémon Snap!

"You are unimportant and you are the reason i have the attitude I do." It doesn't even make sense. If I'm unimportant I have no bearing on your attitude whatsoever.

What's up being anonymous, huh? Too little self-respect to use your own name? Man, fucking stay away from being a music critic if you don't consider what you do to be important or an art - no wonder the reams of press we read are so grey and dull and lifeless. Congratulations doomie, congratulations on contributing to life's general mediocrity. You must feel very proud of yourself when you wake in the morning. "I'm an NME writer! I get free CDs and I can get in free to concerts!" Whoa! You really have reached life's pinnacle there.

You know, if you have no pride in what you do then stay the FUCK AWAY from my art. I'm fed up with apologising on behalf of people like you, trying to explain 'we're not all like that' when of course I know that most of us are.

Think of taking a career change Doomie. One where you're not ashamed to use your real name. One where you actually feel good about what you do.

I know about you.

Leave me alone. You are sad.

This is something I might ACTUALLY stop downloading Andrew Scott porn for and watch...

i would like to say that i'm always suggesting ideas for bands and music to improve - my goal is simplier - i want to show kids that there is an alternative to nu-metal.

UUUUHHHHHHH half naked Andrew Scott in plastic trousers, COME TO KATE, NOW!!!

How's the book, coming, Doomie? No, this is a serious question, I'm not taking the piss.

Hm.

And What "are the Two Momentous Announcements from the makers of NME" trailed for next week.

I kinda like the football idea, cross promotion up the wazoo. Im sickening even myself, still woulnd't put it past them.

...i have many such stories. unbelievably, some are even duller than this!

found everett's home page!!

J34H!@# FUKC!|\|G PR0G R0X0R!@#!@# BR!|\|G !T 0|\|!@#!@#!@#

Well, ‘Everett’, ‘Jerry’, ‘Legend’ … I am new to the game and have not spent a lot of years doing journalism. But let’s break this down.

1. I enjoy the free CDs - only when the music is something so beautiful and unknown I have to write about it. Three of my articles were cut down or not used because they were not requested. Did I consider that a waste of time? No. I felt - as I do about writing - but differently - journalism for me is me being a conduit for something beautiful that I am listening to. If I can share that feeling - and inspire somebody to buy that particular piece of music than I have done my job.

2. Sometimes, ‘Jerry’ or can I call you the ‘Legend’ or maybe just Evie…being on the guest list is not a good thing. But it's like when I go to a friend's art show or reading, it's a happening, and it makes me feel that life is beautiful when I leave.

Man, oh man. What a fucking lame reason. I'm guessing you're about 24 and feel you know everything there is to about life.

I’ve lived a good life - pain, death, joy and sorrow - not a secluded life of rock and roll and music industry. But do I know everything there is to know about life? Hardly. That’s the exciting thing about it.

Man, oh man. That's a real shame. "I do it for the free CDs and guest-list". Man, oh man. What a pitiful existence.

You funnily enough picked up on that - did you not? I just broke it down - this is what a journalist does and gets. He/She gets paid, gets free cds and gets on the guest lists. For a rock and roll freak like me, this is heaven. Maybe you are too jaded - afterall that is what my music writing is there for - to serve SOMEBODY ELSE’S art. That’s the crux is it not? The only art I can see is the art of inspiration. You, Evie, seem to think that you are art. That is wrong. You may have been a hero at one point for others but your time is up but you won’t leave the party, will you?

Oh, and something else, "Doomie".

Yes….’Jerry’, ‘Everett’ ‘Legend’.

I'm not surprised you post anonymously. If I was your editor and read your posts, I'd sack you on the fucking spot.

No offence, Evie but there is no way that I would work for your magazine. It’s dull and pointless and badly written. I’m sorry. That is how I honestly feel about it - never mind the price.

And If I find out any of the Careless Talk writers have the same attitude then they're fucking sacked too. Unless of course I change my mind...

Oh you are such a powerful man. Eek!

And please don't write in riddles...

Would it be untoward to say, please don’t write at all, Everett? That was bitchy for me to say - but you have been bitchy. To be honest Everett, I have read a handful of your articles and it always goes back to you. Which bores me. You are not the art. You review the art.

"You are unimportant and you are the reason i have the attitude I do." It doesn't even make sense. If I'm unimportant I have no bearing on your attitude whatsoever.

Your unimportance is so powerful that it has an affect on my life. When I see you - you are a guide on how I don’t want to end up. The music industry can change you if you will let it. I like to keep it pure - the music and me. Or as honest as I can be. I have good friends that keep me grounded. I am learning to be the best writer that I can possibly be.

What's up being anonymous, huh? Too little self-respect to use your own name? Man, fucking stay away from being a music critic if you don't consider what you do to be important or an art - no wonder the reams of press we read are so grey and dull and lifeless.

O.k., ‘Everett’, ‘Legend’, ‘Jerry’.

Congratulations doomie, congratulations on contributing to life's general mediocrity. You must feel very proud of yourself when you wake in the morning. "I'm an NME writer! I get free CDs and I can get in free to concerts!" Whoa! You really have reached life's pinnacle there.

It upsets you that I have broken down the essentials of music criticism. Tell me how would you be a music journalist without free cds and guest lists, Jerry?

You know, if you have no pride in what you do then stay the FUCK AWAY from my art.

I thought Lester Bangs invented it and you are a weak imitation. Why have the Pepsi when you can have the double vodka?

I'm fed up with apologising on behalf of people like you, trying to explain 'we're not all like that' when of course I know that most of us are.

Most publicists like me because I am very very euthanstic about new music and spent time campaigning to get bandsd in the press when I know for a fact I would not be doing the review.

Think of taking a career change Doomie. One where you're not ashamed to use your real name. One where you actually feel good about what you do.

You don’t know me. And I do feel good about what I do. Music Journalism is one facet. I’m young, dumb and full of words - to quote my agent. I write books, ghost write short stories and screen plays, write short stories, music journalism - I don’t need a prat like you to tell what makes me feel good. And guess what? I temp as well and try to have a loving relationship with my girl. I don’t really have time for negativity or you. I’m too busy doing what I love. And I will be successful and the funny thing is that you will never know my name. Which is good.

I love writing. I love rock and roll.

Tell me where I am going wrong oh god of rock journalism - ‘cept wasting time on this board - which I will stop today.

See, writing, to me is so beautiful that negative creeps like you will never kill it. I will always have that talent, regardless.

Bye.

Dooomie.

Sorry for being harsh but I'm just being honest. Or basically how I think I should be. I think everyone clouds the issue - it's the artist that is important not the journalist. And I think that's where alot of people fuck up.

We are sad, aren't we?

"I love writing for the NME. I would do anything for that magazine. I am guarded on this board for obvious reasons. But I love rock and roll. I love writing. I am just not holier than thou like you."

Who's the fucking self-important twat now? What? YOU'RE GUARDED ON THIS BOARD FOR WHAT OBVIOUS REASONS? Like we fucking care whether you're some self-preening little twat with his name on the Tyde guest list and his bundle of free Beachwood Sparks CDs. Hey Doomie. Are you really, really famous then? Do you have stalkers? Kids clamouring in the street for your autograph because you once had your name printed in a national publication? Is that why you're guarding your identity? OR ARE YOU JUST A FUCKING COWARD WHO CAN DISH OUT CRITICISM BUT CAN'T TAKE IT LIKE ALMOST ALL OF YOUR BREED? Let me clue you into something. I couldn't give two hoots who or what you are: if you write for the NME, I sure as hell won't recognise your name. Like most of this country.

Please. You love writing. You love rock and roll. You love writing. Right. Hence the statement: "I am only in this for the free CDs and the guestlist." Oh...you want to take it back now? It was irony. Well, slap me down and call me a fuckhead! It was a joke. That's why you had to repeat it 10 times - yes 10 times - on this thread, while trying to bully another poster. Jeez. I can understand why IPC only pays its writers 9p a word...9p too much, I'd say. Or is the low payrate why you have to keep repeating yourself?

(The line "fat, 40 and bitter" - stand aside, Paul Merton and let Doomie take the floor... I bow to your biting wit, my man. I am suitably crushed. I am actually 41, and prefer the adjective 'corpulent'. Bitter? At least I'm not jaded at 21... and if you're any older you should be damn well ashamed of yourself.)

So you wake in the morning and think "Doomie, I'm a damn fine writer and I love rock and roll", do you? I'm happy for you. Very happy. Pur another dime in the jukebox, baby.

I really should take my time over these things.

"I love writing for the NME. I would do anything for that magazine. I am guarded on this board for obvious reasons. But I love rock and roll. I love writing. I am just not holier than thou like you." Who's the fucking self-important twat now? What? Nope, not me, that was written in a haste response to your bitch about me. YOU'RE GUARDED ON THIS BOARD FOR WHAT OBVIOUS REASONS? Nope cause a lot of people on this board don’t like me. Like we fucking care whether you're some self-preening little twat with his name on the Tyde guest list and his bundle of free Beachwood Sparks CDs. I never actually talk to anyone in the music industry Everett - I don’t give out my phone number, I just like the music and me, cause it’s beautiful. But see the Nope above for my reasons. Hey Doomie. Are you really, really famous then? Do you have stalkers? Kids clamouring in the street for your autograph because you once had your name printed in a national publication? Is that why you're guarding your identity?

Nope because a lot of people on this board don’t like me. Which is cool.

OR ARE YOU JUST A FUCKING COWARD WHO CAN DISH OUT CRITICISM BUT CAN'T TAKE IT LIKE ALMOST ALL OF YOUR BREED?

Nope because a lot of people on this board don’t like me. This was before the NME.

Let me clue you into something. I couldn't give two hoots who or what you are: if you write for the NME, I sure as hell won't recognise your name. Like most of this country.

Nope because a lot of people on this board don’t like me. This was way before the NME. Please. You love writing. You love rock and roll. You love writing. Right. Hence the statement: "I am only in this for the free CDs and the guestlist." Oh...you want to take it back now?

Nope. I love music. I love shows. I love live music. So nope.

It was irony. Well, slap me down and call me a fuckhead!

Nope. I don’t think you are a fuckhead. Just delusional to your status.

It was a joke. That's why you had to repeat it 10 times - yes 10 times - on this thread, while trying to bully another poster.

Nope. Sorry if the other poster felt like I was bullying. I just am shy about it. ‘Cause I’m learning. It’s the lapsed Catholic in me. And I thought I was having a good conversation with Gareth before you burst in.

Jeez. I can understand why IPC only pays its writers 9p a word...9p too much, I'd say. Or is the low payrate why you have to keep repeating yourself?

Nope. It’s higher than that. (The line "fat, 40 and bitter" - stand aside, Paul Merton and let Doomie take the floor... I bow to your biting wit, my man. I am suitably crushed. I am actually 41, and prefer the adjective 'corpulent'. Bitter)

And you spend your time on an internet board trying to crush the enthusiam of a young journalist? Sad.

? At least I'm not jaded at 21... and if you're any older you should be damn well ashamed of yourself.)

I love my life. I’m hardly jaded. I’m beginning to think there is a miscommunication here. OH well.

So you wake in the morning and think "Doomie, I'm a damn fine writer and I love rock and roll", do you? I'm happy for you. Very happy. Pur another dime in the jukebox, baby.

Nope. I think, damn I love my girl and am a lucky fellow to have her.

So Doomie now turns out to be a slightly matryed, self-righteous NME hack who is so scared of other people he won't even reveal his own name.

Sweet.

Self-righteous? NME? You don't have the fucking right my son... Since when is a self-confessed hack who is only in it for the guestlist and CDs got any right to be self-righteous? (Doomie, please don't assume that everyone writes about music for the same reasons. Would you do it if it weren't for the free CDs and guestlist? Would you do it if you weren't being paid? Well, would you?)

So, you're *helping" new bands, are you? Have you picked up a copy of the magazine you write for recently, Doomie? Or is it you I have to thank personally for the pre-eminence of the Vines and the Strokes? Gee thanks, Doomie. You are so forward-thinking.

"...that is what my music writing is there for - to serve SOMEBODY ELSE’S art."

Man, you are so fucking wrong. Get out of this fucking art form Doomie, before you ruin it for others. Please. I'm begging you. I'm down on my bended knee. You don't understand even Rule Number One, do you?

Maybe that's why your music writing is there...and that WOULD explain a few things, wouldn't it?

Wonder why.

Hardly. I am the guy that write some live reviews. And people and not revealing my name - it’s down to this, I was a jerk on this board, I apologised, but people don’t like me which is understandably because of it. I’ve tried to help where I could - with Marcello and such. The only time that I felt slightly martryed was when my dad blew his head off with a shotgun or my mother died before I was twenty. I’m just happy to be alive and want to be alive and enjoy my life.

Sweet.

Self-righteous? NME? You don't have the fucking right my son...

You placed that accusation on me.

Since when is a self-confessed hack

Never said that.

who is only in it for the guestlist and CDs got any right to be self- righteous?

Maybe you should reread the post above. I’m more aware and very thankful for the publicists involved.

(Doomie, please don't assume that everyone writes about music for the same reasons. Would you do it if it weren't for the free CDs and guestlist? Would you do it if you weren't being paid? Well, would you?)

Actually - I would be alright - I have my other writing and my temp job and yes I have contributed articles without payment loads of times to various web ‘zines.

So, you're *helping" new bands, are you? Have you picked up a copy of the magazine you write for recently, Doomie? Or is it you I have to thank personally for the pre-eminence of the Vines and the Strokes? Gee thanks, Doomie. You are so forward-thinking.

Nah. The bands that I throw out into the nme were , Homelife, Kinski, Screaming Seagull, The Warlocks, Speedy J.

Don’t really like the Vines much. They have nothing special and the Strokes, I dig the Strokes, but this is all very last year.

The cool things that the NME have opened u p my eyes and ears to is Southern Records/Anti-Con Collective/Racebannon/Mum and Dad.

This is getting sort of dull, Everett, can we drop it here?

Back when I was better known, we would invariably print threats both verbal and physical made against me by readers and musicians - we used to run a book of 20 Internationally Known Bands Who've Said They Will Punch Everett True out in print. In the flesh I had rock stars come looking for me with bodyguards, glasses held to my throat, pushed down flights of stairs...

And you're scared of a handful of ILM posters, almost all of whom are certainly the meekest people you could meet? I'll say it again: Doomie, YOU'RE A FUCKING COWARD.

I agree. Let's drop it. I can't help thinking that if I ever met you in the flesh we'd probably get on just fine.

I like the name! and it was shortened from doom patrol which was my favourite sixties coic.

Back when I was better known, we would invariably print threats both verbal and physical made against me by readers and musicians - we used to run a book of 20 Internationally Known Bands Who've Said They Will Punch Everett True out in print. In the flesh I had rock stars come looking for me with bodyguards, glasses held to my throat, pushed down flights of stairs...

that doesnt impress me, Everett. I grew up in the toughest project. Went to a private school on a scholarship. When my dad killed himself I was bullied up 'til I fucked out of that town.

But this is getting silly. I don't give a rat's arse about some Visage singer who hated you. And you're scared of a handful of ILM posters,

Embarrassed, more like and very very shy. Though I did meet Mark S for coffee and it was pleasurable but then heard that he had said a bunch of nasty shit about me. I'm just reclusive. I find more than my five friends to be confusing. I've got five people who I would entrust my life with. Why would I want more?

I'm happy.

almost all of whom are certainly the meekest people you could meet? I'll say it again: Doomie, YOU'RE A FUCKING COWARD.

So. I've been called worse.

Bye.

yeah. I'm beginning to like you too Everett. Sorry for being bitchy. I didnt mean half the things I said. My hands type faster than I think about the consequences.

ps. Ned - if that was the case - i would be on these boards more often, would I not?

Too busy Ned.

Sorry.

Don't even care that you guys are moving to a new address.

Everett - I have to say this about you - you are the fourth person in the music industry who is crazy enough not to give a shit about the consequences.

I hope you have a second coming.

t.

You will, you will...

ps. everett - i have two forms of music writing - lyrical and loving and straight forward. i was in pain over having to ditch the lyricalness but and yes - i maybe be fucking up an art form - but i'm learning.

but i'm done - this was surreal madness and a good way to end my association with this board.

see you everett and hope you have a good one.

et: as a music journalist, i largely side with you. hell, i have to - i'd like to think i'm in my vocation for more than just the Free Stuff. but, to continue to rub knobs with the admittedly bewildering doomie in this silly (albeit hugely entertaining) pissing match - doesn't it degrade your point, even ever so slightly?

i'd love to hear wot mark s thinks about this, esp. the above regarding zee wire.

oh, while i'm here. i know you dropped out of this long ago, julio, but isn't it silly for you to deride the NME on the basis that they're stuck down the "we hate pop" road? i can't remember the last pop rekkid you didn't slag mercilessly. not trying to start something, just curious...

as you were!

Nope. Not scared as I did not say anything inflammatory 'cept against everett true/jerry thackeray/etc. And why should I be scared? Is the music industry full of scared people already? 'Sides that's not my name. And you did not read the full argument did you? Oh well. Did not expect anyone to. Just pointlessly side with Everett even though we both came to some sort of conclusion.

anyone remember mastermind then?

now, is that not a good job for jerry and i? we've entertained.

hooray!

back to work.

though the thread is good reading!

you know you want to be drawn in.

come on ... slowly now.

But firstly, Lisa, have you decided on what magazine you wanted to buy?

but oh well. it was entertaining nonetheless! hahahaha....and a good blow out to my time spent with the greenspun crew.

so, lisa, has this helped you decide which magazine you're going to subscribe to?

Well its between The Wire and CTCL. It won't be NME. Is it worth emailing The Wire to see if anyone will fight Doomie and Everett?

''oh, while i'm here. i know you dropped out of this long ago, julio, but isn't it silly for you to deride the NME on the basis that they're stuck down the "we hate pop" road? i can't remember the last pop rekkid you didn't slag mercilessly. not trying to start something, just curious...''

I am following on and off. I've only been in this board for a year so I didn't know much about doomie. Have to agree it is very entertaining. Well done Jerry you have really added the 'fourth dimension' this thread needed.

Mark p- you're not 'starting anything'. I'm happy to answer: what I'm criticizing is NMEs attitude. They will ridicule pop and yet put the very same pop they hate on the cover (because that is what sells). or they will put industry approved 'indie' bands on there (the very same thing).

as i recall whenever a thread is started on a pop single I usually don't go to these threads unless its indie related (the strokes or white stripes, say). i don't listen to radio anymore...so I can't comment on the single unless I happen to hear it and feel strongly about it.

I haven't even heard the vines...

but in reality all the magazines cover different territory and appeal for different reasons.

Is no one goint to blow the whistle on Doomie's real identity then? Go on, you know you want to...

um... you could pay for CDs and gig tickets, perhaps? which i have done, many times, and will continue to do...

Surely you don't pay for a band that you do not particularly want to see, do you?

The bullying continues.

This whole thread is idiotic and bullying.

hey, 'dustin', how are you doing today?

i generally don't go to see bands i don't particularly want to see, so draw your own conclusion. but i have bought PLENTY of records on various whims and been, by turns, elated and dejected.

available from: hmv, borders, virgin, record shops, newsagents.. all that shit.

Hey Ned, I got scouted for CTCL, yo yo yo.

When CTCL reaches issue one, we're gonna sackeveryone (if you CAN sack unpaid contributors, that is) and begin anew: I myself will be looking after the design, Steve after the words, and Andrew after photography. And David Mc - who is the only man (I'm guessing here, having never met) who does any work around here - can handle our debts... I mean, business side.

who is cozen??

Robin, yes, it's ending with issue #1. Its gonna be a doozie.