Kanye West & Jay-Z - Watch The Throne [2011]

http://platform.ak.fbcdn.net/www/app_full_proxy.php?app=178091127385&v=1&size=o&cksum=56a7ad52b3b7ab16b6f1df2560f70692&src=http%3A%2F%2Frootmusic-images.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpages%2F197603%2Fstyles%2Frm-css-main-banner-1294691961_520.jpg

http://www.facebook.com/WatchTheThrone

like eli... i did it

As someone who likes My Dark Beautiful Twisted Perverted Unconscionable Adolescent Thesaurus-Driven Fantasy, this is amazing...ly embarrassing

does that say HAM or HA(two smaller h's)

Crap Goin' HAM

i like it \o_O/

yeah but you are capt-save-a-major-label-past-it-album

more like watch the groan, amirite

xpost, yeah, kanye is so over, it's been a whole two months GAWSH

we live a rolling news world

a hoy hoy treatin rappers like pitchfork treats tapes n tapes

they r trying to blackmail me into 'liking' their page in order to hear the song but i have too much integrity for that. someone post a link?

http://www.missinfo.tv/index.php/kanye-west-jay-z-h-a-m-the-first-single-off-watch-the-throne-produced-by-lex-luger/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

the beat on this is okay i guess but the rapping is :-/ :-/ :-/

I like the terrible classical singing at the end

i pretty much gave up on this whole thing when kanye either referenced or bit that wayne line from "miss me"

(not a snarky statement btw; at least one of those women is horrible, but I like what they are doing)

ugh if I wanted awesome forward-thinking beats and half-assed lyrics about dicks being sucked, I wouldn't have paused my lil b playlist long enough to listen to this shit

i'm not sure how anyone could really feel invested in this at all -- there was just a kanye album that against all odds was pretty great but not especially for the rapping & then we all know about jay-z

i guess people just need star power rap to care about all the time regardless of it's actually good or not? i guess kanye/jay spitting stilted raps over an 'of the moment' producer suffices

xp ... cuz at least he has charisma. and an excuse.

kanye sounds so bored

Shouldn't it be H.A.A.M?

Biglinton Says:
January 11th, 2011 at 7:43 am
Wow hmmmm i guess ill be the first to say, im not really feeling it and i mean the whole song. Isnt going HAM a southern term to go crazy, stupid, wild when has kanye or Jay-z ever used someone elses TERMs or words, they are inovators. Just like when trey songz went at r kelly for using Auto Tune when r kelly is the man when it comes to singing and is respected by all in R & B im just not feeling it. And this beat is not Kanye or Jay Z, you ever wondered what KRS-ONE would sound like on a three six mafia beat or NAS on a LIL JON track this is how i felt it was not the beat for them, the only east coast rapper thats good on southern beats is Jadakiss, and im just giving my opinions, just saying and in my defense im 24 i got every jay cd every kanye cd i know wat there capable of but this is not it and the track wasnt put together very well sounds kinda bad for two top artist

wonder if that kanye/terius collabo is ever gonna happen?

xxp it's usually accepted that one can omit articles from acronyms

biglinton pretty much otm... except about kanye and jay-z not jacking other ppl's words, lol

there should be a poll -- in which year in the next 10 will people finally stop caring about new jay-z music?

according to 'dj tech', never:

dj tech Says:
January 11th, 2011 at 7:52 am
get ready for the gays or pink mafia niggas to go on every hiphop blogsite cosignin this bullshit all day actin like they like this bullshit. this shit sound like two people tryin to do somebody else style point blank

WATCH THE THRONE!

http://rawjustice.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/toilet.jpg

that... this is terrifying

i like the beat better than most of MBDTF and it's a good look for lex luger i think but wow the rapping is dire. who is kanye trying to ape in the first verse?

good beat. bad rapps. lex luger is a great producer.

disappointed that GIS wouldn't help me find a picture of a toilet on a TV screen

has any artist lost it as completely and totally after being so brilliant for so long as jay?

rod stewart is the one that comes to mind

thank god this has a thread so it doesn't slip by our attention

hahaha the weird classical breakdown reminds me of the Great and Mighty Poo from Conker's Bad Fur Day lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0w5neFPat1w

^^^way better song

god this sounds like one of those things where some random internet guy raps over a real beat and uploads it to napster as "NEW KANYE/JAY-Z"

the beat is not redeeming either of them. it makes everything worse. i'm sure its pretty great on it own but the whole package is insufferable

god this sounds like one of those things where some random internet guy raps over a real beat and uploads it to napster as "NEW KANYE/JAY-Z"

in fairness this is exactly what happened; it's only a coincidence that it's actually Kanye and Jay-Z

people who act like Lex Luger is a great producer are fronting harder than people who act like Jay and Kanye are still great rappers imo

lol @ Kanye trying to doubletime for practically the first time in his career, and still filling a bunch of bars with grunting "HAHHH"

the beat reminds me of some trae song i can't remember the title of

(the main beat not the tarded classical stuff)

lol @ Kanye trying to doubletime for practically the first time in his career

lol

people who act like Lex Luger is a great producer are fronting harder than people who act like Jay and Kanye are still great rappers imo

― some dude, Tuesday, January 11, 2011 10:56 AM (52 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

some dude acting like 'like me' or 'grove st party' are flukes is fronting harder that his initial reaction couldnt possibly be incorrect

You both are right to an extent -- lex proved himself to be more creative than maybe a lot of us thought, but ppl aren't trying to get "grove st party" beats from him. Everyone wants "bmf" and now we're on like the the 56th incarnation of that beat

there should be a poll -- in which year in the next 10 will people finally stop caring about new jay-z music?

― J0rdan S., Tuesday, January 11, 2011 10:08 AM (22 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

you might as well be asking when people will stop making a big deal over shitty new U2 or Paul McCartney albums i.e. never

some dude acting like 'like me' or 'grove st party' are flukes is fronting harder that his initial reaction couldnt possibly be incorrect

― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, January 11, 2011 12:53 PM (13 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

the second half of this sentence went off the rails somewhere, i don't even understand it

yeah poorly worded but it makes sense if u parse it -- sayin u are in denial that your initial reaction to lex being an overrated one-dimensional producer is wrong

i gues this isn't really my biznass but if there's one thing that i really admire about al it's his ability to -- seemingly -- not hold grudges & in a way evaluate songs/albums as if previous works by the artist didn't exist

jay-z sounds hilarious on his chorus!

Man. Both Nas/Lil Jon collabs that I know of are awesome.

Anyway, the beat is awesome and al is mad, Kanye sucks, the classical bits suck, Jay is ok.

"Grand Finale" for sure

Yeah, the Nas/Lil Jon songs are fantastic. "Grand Finale" is really good too.

ok i am never going to listen to this again

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s53SiLUIguk

^better rapping, better classical, worse beats imo

urban appropriations of opera wld be such a better thred than this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7gHULq5-Qo

doooope

this is terrible

i don't think the beat on h.a.m is good at all. it's got no knock, would sound pretty unremarkable on a mixtape. kind of imagine lex luger rolling his damn eyes @ jay z and kanye wanting to make a retarded attempt at high art & probably making 100 grand or whatever ppl get paid for jay z beats for adding an opera sample to something he had prepared for a french montana mixtape cut

I just figured the opera was Kayne's meddling.

some dude acting like 'like me' or 'grove st party' are flukes is fronting harder that his initial reaction couldnt possibly be incorrect

― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, January 11, 2011 12:53 PM (13 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

the second half of this sentence went off the rails somewhere, i don't even understand it

― some dude, Tuesday, January 11, 2011 6:06 PM (4 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

yeah poorly worded but it makes sense if u parse it -- sayin u are in denial that your initial reaction to lex being an overrated one-dimensional producer is wrong

― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, January 11, 2011 6:44 PM (3 hours ago) Bookmark

deej i am so glad u went to the mat for this incomprehensible jibber jabber never change

Don't get why you've latched on to "Grove St. Party" as a standout, maybe my least favorite song on Flockaveli.

WHAT

ok u keep bumping "bricksquad ft gudda gudda"

deej re: "Grove Street Party" is on some "milhouse is not a meme" ish

deej re: "Grove Street Party" is on some "milhouse is not a meme" ish

― Whiney G. Weingarten, Tuesday, January 11, 2011 5:41 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

its a single w/ a video and an atypical beat for lex that showed some range so made total sense to bring up in this context u tard

and sorry no one repping for this total disaster of a track gets to make pronouncements on taste for anyone

i don't think the beat on h.a.m is good at all. it's got no knock, would sound pretty unremarkable on a mixtape. kind of imagine lex luger rolling his damn eyes @ jay z and kanye wanting to make a retarded attempt at high art & probably making 100 grand or whatever ppl get paid for jay z beats for adding an opera sample to something he had prepared for a french montana mixtape cut

― flopson, Tuesday, January 11, 2011 4:27 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

100% otm

deej i am so glad u went to the mat for this incomprehensible jibber jabber never change

― aka the pope (BIG HOOS aka the steendriver), Tuesday, January 11, 2011 4:29 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_leftkrHJkw1qf8yek.gif its not jibber jabber hoos

al initially argued that lex was one dimensional
i think hes in denial
because its bcome evident that isnt true
& said he was fronting otherwise

Yeah I think this 'album' is gonna be terrible with like 2 or 3 ok songs and maybe 1 pretty good one.

grove st party is amazing and an easy highlight imo

hey deej

can you please post that van der beek gif again

never seen it before

yeah poorly worded but it makes sense if u parse it -- sayin u are in denial that your initial reaction to lex being an overrated one-dimensional producer is wrong

― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, January 11, 2011 1:44 PM (6 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

let's not play armchair psychologist about whose stated opinions are honest and who's living in a funhouse mirror world of denial, okay? i mean he's got some good beats that don't sound like his 2 big hits on Flockaveli, but i don't think it's too crazy to say hey let's pump the brakes on "great producer" until he has a 3rd hit or shows some serious versatility or consistency.

if u want me to say southside on the track is a better producer i agree
but i think hes established dude has skills, he produced the bulk of flockaveli which is already being considered a classic ... if thats all he ends up doing hes carved a spot for himself

yes, that's exactly what i want you to do, i want you to say that someone i've never heard of is a better producer, you read my mind

i love that deej's posting style has just devolved typing a bunch of gibberish with someone associated with Brick Squad and then getting all defensive about it

Has anyone really been far even as decided to use Wooh Da Kid even go want to do look more like?

yes, that's exactly what i want you to do, i want you to say that someone i've never heard of is a better producer, you read my mind

― men are from mars, bruno has no penis (some dude), Tuesday, January 11, 2011 7:34 PM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

sorry i thought you still paid attention to new rap

i like how whiney's posting style is being the most insufferable person alive

the last 6 months on ilm have kind of been deej & whiney's own 'watch the throne'

can someone tell me why al even posts in these threads when he never listens to the music we recommend or recommends any of his own -- just plays dumb & goes 'why would i have heard of that' when we mention someone the rest of the cru has been talking about for three plus months

in case it isnt clear, i was bringing up a comparable producer from the same milieu who has produced w/ a wider range of styles

this album is sort of a brilliant move on kanye's part because its going to suck up all the backlash that would otherwise be directed towards MBDTF

ha! otm

Has anyone really been far even as decided to use Wooh Da Kid even go want to do look more like?

― Whiney G. Weingarten, Tuesday, January 11, 2011 8:40 PM (28 minutes ago)

ok this is killing me

hey dudes i post from work sometimes & dont really have much time to edit/scan what im writing.

WHAT

ok u keep bumping "bricksquad ft gudda gudda"

― fruit of the goon (k3vin k.), Tuesday, January 11, 2011 3:39 PM Bookmark

forgot about that one, but gudda gudda actually kinda works in the context of all the anonymous guest rappers on flockaveli.

http://www.worldofkitsch.com/objects/images/home_bathroom_toilet.jpg

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_levkd9J70t1qzp1o3o1_500.jpg

lol

can someone tell me why al even posts in these threads when he never listens to the music we recommend or recommends any of his own -- just plays dumb & goes 'why would i have heard of that' when we mention someone the rest of the cru has been talking about for three plus months

― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, January 11, 2011 8:47 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

hey dudes i post from work sometimes & dont really have much time to edit/scan what im writing.

― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, January 11, 2011 9:16 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

hey dudes i dedicate what little music listening time i have to the albums i'm trying to keep up with and don't have an extra hour a day to dedicate to checking out every youtube deej posts. also i turned off images on ilx a while ago because of overzealous youtube posting and having images turned off makes even clicking on the youtube links kind of a pain in the ass and requires a couple extra clicks.

also afaict Southside has been mentioned on ilx TWICE ever before this thread, and wasn't on any of the Gucci or Waka official albums with easily found production credits, but apparently somewhere everyone's been talking about him for the last 3 months and i'm a total ostrich with my head in the sand for not knowing everything about him

i dunno dude i thought 'body bag' was a pretty well known song, brick squad only has a couple name producers, & a bunch of us were talking about the production on the wooh da kid tape which is almost entirely his & iirc made our list of the best albums of 2010 so its not totally obscure or something here

this is a dumb argument regardless, my only point in bringing him up was to say that i understood why ppl think he has limitations relative to other producers

ok plz say that what rev posted is the artwork

http://www.soundonsight.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/06/hamm3.jpg

it's not.

but it should be.

http://www.lukechueh.com/images/paintings/paintings-whole/Ham.jpg

is jay-z pitched up on this? he sounds like he took a hit of helium beforehand

can't believe they tricked me into liking this on facebook I don't even know how to unlike things

Has anyone really been far even as decided to use Wooh Da Kid even go want to do look more like?

― Whiney G. Weingarten, Wednesday, January 12, 2011 9:40 AM (12 hours ago) Bookmark

this is brilliant - now I picture deej talking like boomhauer now in my head with random bricksquad nouns thrown in

i dunno dude i thought 'body bag' was a pretty well known song, brick squad only has a couple name producers, & a bunch of us were talking about the production on the wooh da kid tape which is almost entirely his & iirc made our list of the best albums of 2010 so its not totally obscure or something here

― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Wednesday, January 12, 2011 1:49 AM (7 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

you know how sometimes people on ILM chide you for not knowing everything about their favorite indie bands or accuse you of playing dumb? that's kinda how it feels when you act SO disappointed and exasperated with me for only listening to 11 Brick Squad mixtapes & albums in the past 2 years and totally sleeping on 27 really essential other Brick Squad releases

lol

seriously, i would say there's def more a case to be made that deej should hear ONE Shellac album than some dude should know who produced some Tyga song that wasn't even a single

that tyga song is a single, with a video
i listen to rap music & dont listen to rock -- confused about how this is still an issue for you dude

yr parochial

and most ppl here aren't

which makes it an easy thing to call u out on

just because something has a youtube video doesn't make it a single. you can't even get it on itunes. why would al have heard it outside of clicking your youtube link in rolling swag or are you really gonna be all "read yr vibe.com blogs"

can't wait to cop all 1,397 Lil B "singles" he's supposed to be up on

I'm kinda with Whiney on this. Unless something is SUPER memorable (either in a good or bad way, doesn't matter), youtube clips kinda just all fall into the abyss of a terrible memory. Even if I do try to keep up with them in my bookmarks.

hey al was just a lil confused that a dude who used to interview producers & wrote for scratch wasnt aware of a new producer w/ a fair amount of attention behind him -- he also produced the new gucci single fwiw -- not trying to start shit here & im surprised this is a point of contention

its a youtube with 300,000 views. its a single guys. its the internet era this is how it works

which makes it an easy thing to call u out on

― bernard snowy, Wednesday, January 12, 2011 9:34 AM (14 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

call me out on?? what?

i would argue that most people on here are just as parochial but normalize their listening experience

stoppppp

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxbTRh1o_RU

110,112 views

its the internet era this is how it works
its the internet era this is how it works
its the internet era this is how it works
its the internet era this is how it works
its the internet era this is how it works
its the internet era this is how it works
its the internet era this is how it works
its the internet era this is how it works

its absolutely fucking mystifying to me that i cant make any kind of statement on here any more w/out it turning into some humongous clusterfuck. nothing im saying here is ridiculous or out of line or batshit. tyga doesnt have 1,315 videos. we were talking about the career of lex luger so it makes sense that we'd talk about name producers in his circle & that i might assume some contextual knowledge on al's part.

gr8 video whiney, how's the column goin

totally creepy that zvook knew i was working on a column right now!

deej im on yr side bro. u could buy matador records and ppl wld still find ways to give u shit.

(fwiw, despite being unaware of any previously expressed opinions re:lex luger, i found the post that started all this fairly easy to parse. and whiney's parody sorta reminds me of how kids in middle school used to bully other kids without ever stopping to investigate the initial premises on which said bullying was based. "you said you had a crush on CHARLIE, that's a boy's name! hey everyone, deej likes boys!!!" "nuh-uh you guys, I said 'charlize theron', she's an actr—" "DEEJ LIKES BOYS, DEEJ LIKES BOYS!!" etc etc)

are you denying deej doesn't do that shit all the time because

like seriously fuck you guys if you're seriously gonna give shiplo shit for not knowing who's producing the hot new YouTube leak from the Coconut Juice guy

what shit are we talking about now

re:

are you denying deej doesn't do that shit all the time because

― Whiney G. Weingarten, Wednesday, January 12, 2011 4:04 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark

"are you denying deej doesn't do" what are you even talking about whiney you rambling crazypants?!?

are you denying deej doesn't get on people's cases when they dont see the world exactly like he does. it really is a case of "how can you NOT KNOW THIS, rap critic."

I mean I'm guilty of this behavior too, electric vindaloo, but still

seriously can't fathom why only deej constantly because this shit for y'all?
— whiney impression

oh you were talkin about that still, lol

the only thing i'm finna deny is ever having taken part in this thread, if anyone asks

http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/46175000/jpg/_46175654_handbags_44.jpg

hey al was just a lil confused that a dude who used to interview producers & wrote for scratch wasnt aware of a new producer w/ a fair amount of attention behind him -- he also produced the new gucci single fwiw -- not trying to start shit here & im surprised this is a point of contention

― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Wednesday, January 12, 2011 10:48 AM (10 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

it's only a 'point of contention' because i couldn't help but make fun of the fact that you put words in my mouth about me liking someone i've never demonstrated any familiarity with. is he getting the same fair amount of attention Lex Luger is getting? because his profile doesn't seem comparable at the moment. and i definitely wish i was as up on producers as i was a few years ago but in this beloved internet mixtape era so few guys even get any fucking credit for their beats that it's increasingly hard to keep track of them.

btw Tyga is a pretty popular rapper with lots of YouTube videos with views in the millions, including a random freestyle w/ about 5 times as many views as this 'single'

i mean if i failed an important test here sure banish me from goondyland and disallow me from participating in your goondeer games by all means

http://consequenceofsound.net/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/fuck-this-christmas.jpg

btw Tyga is a pretty popular rapper with lots of YouTube videos with views in the millions, including a random freestyle w/ about 5 times as many views as this 'single'

― men are from mars, bruno has no penis (some dude), Wednesday, January 12, 2011 10:17 AM (19 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

fwiw this point was about whiney being pedantic about shellac for some reason -- its a luger beat & i never had any expectation about you 'knowing it' -- i made a reference to it that, if you were curious, you could have looked up on youtube if u missed it on my y-e list or when it was posted in the swag thread.

not having heard of southside on the track entirely was a surprise to me, tho

http://images.livemixtapes.com/artists/trapaholics/southsidetrack/cover.jpg

did we tlak about this? cuz it's preyty dope

01. Southside On The Track - Intro (0:31)
02. Wooh Da Kid Feat. Waka Flocka & Frenchie - Face Down (4:28)
03. Kebo Gotti Feat. Wooh Da Kid & Bo Deal - Real Street Niggas (5:25)
04. Gucci Mane Feat. OJ Da Juiceman & Wooh Da Kid - Bought A Chicken (4:21)
05. Gucci Mane Feat. OJ Da Juiceman & Wooh Da Kid - Jackboyz (4:24)
06. Gucci Mane Feat. Wooh Da Kid - Bitch Get Up Off Me (3:53)
07. Wooh Da Kid - Danger (4:20)
08. Kebo Gotti - 100 (4:01)
09. Nino Cahoots - Rollin' (1:51)
10. Waka Flocka - Bussin' At Em (3:56)
11. Slim Dunkin Feat. Lil Capp & BC - Too Late To Swing (4:48)
12. Wooh Da Kid - Geek Show (4:02)
13. Gucci Mane Feat. Slim Dunkin & Pastor Troy - F*ck The Club Up (4:59)
14. Tay Don - Let Me Get Em (3:15)
15. Waka Flocka - It's Me (1:33)
16. Wooh Da Kid - Homicide (3:04)
17. Waka Flocka - Luv Dem Gun Sounds (3:36)
18. Waka Flock & Southside On The Track - Lambo Dis Summer (3:19)
19. Wooh Da Kid - Mosh Pit (4:21)
20. Southside On The Track - Outro (0:20)
21. Southside On The Track - Bonus Beat (3:43)

still partial to tay beatz/tay don though

and i didnt know if you liked him or not, i was just using him as an example of someone in that milieu who had more range

for the 90th time

04. Gucci Mane Feat. OJ Da Juiceman & Wooh Da Kid - Bought A Chicken (4:21)

early 2012 thread title contender

rolling thread*

with all respect to deej and whiney - al i feel like you have the responsibility and the capacity to be the adult in the room in these situations more often than not and imo you've been failing in that regard lately. just let it go sometimes

hey i'm even older than al! i have a kid and a mortgage and errthing, what kinda adult shit do y'all need me to do?

2007 moving chickens thread

if your job doesn't offer a 401k program, think about setting up an IRA, also quit arguing about kanye west

2007 moving chickens thread

― surfboard dudes get wiped out, totally, Wednesday, January 12, 2011 11:55 AM (55 seconds ago)

ha yeah yall missed out on this one

lol matt

okay i'm downloading this southside mixtape now so hopefully one good thing comes of this thread

lol

http://blogs.villagevoice.com/music/2011/01/10_lex_luger_tr.php

it doesn't include the tyga track because we assume you've already heard it

because it has 300,000 youtube hits and THATS HOW IT WORKS

wow v shocked that lex luger and i are the same age! i feel so diminished!

flopson on the track

grow up

why doesn't this thread have 4000 posts, yall slackin

lol

http://blogs.villagevoice.com/music/2011/01/10_lex_luger_tr.php

― Whiney G. Weingarten, Wednesday, January 12, 2011 12:01 PM (22 minutes ago) Bookmark

this kdi si reatarded

that juicy j/ k michelle is so blatatantly produced by Juicy J. it even has a drop by gucci at the beginning going "JUCIY J ON THE TARCK"

or

if he knew anythign about juicy j he'd know that "SHUTTHEFUCKKKAAAAAAAA" is his thing on his tracks. it soudns so clearly like a juicy j beat too

fuckt hat guy i hate bloggers

with all respect to deej and whiney - al i feel like you have the responsibility and the capacity to be the adult in the room in these situations more often than not and imo you've been failing in that regard lately. just let it go sometimes

― fruit of the goon (k3vin k.), Wednesday, January 12, 2011 11:50 AM (24 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

yeah i feel you. trolling deej is fun and all but it hilariously seems to make him madder if i try to agree to disagree and walk away or apologize if i've overstepped, so i should probably stick with that.

dont know why u think im angry, i apologize if i gave u that impression

nah i'm not saying you're mad itt, at least not more than the baseline seething anger in every deej post

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_leftkrHJkw1qf8yek.gif

I'm sure this applies to pretty much everyone ever posting on the internet, but I feel like its especially true in deej's case, in that I don't think he realizes how often he comes across as being really angry.

deej just needs to learn to show up, drop knowledge, & just let ppl dealwithit.gif instead of getting so caught up & into this endless cycle of heightened frustration & reiteration

like i think dude is prob the most knowledgeable rap poster on the board right now & his insights & youtubes are highly valuable to us all, there's no need to get so heated when someone gets offended that u think gza similes are corny. there's grace in just letting shit like that slide & contributing more positively

i agree with your assessment & will try to pay less attention to rong posts in the future

i love how the closest thing to you lightening up is "i'll just ignore the people who are WRONG WRONG SO WRONG"

that was tongue in cheek

but i can see how there might be confusion when expressed thru seething rage

see, thats it, kinda hard to tell w/ you dude

and he slips in another dig, way to let it go

boys

while i am in dr phil: goon (http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_leftkrHJkw1qf8yek.gif mode should just also say that whiney should post more thoughtful things abt rap he likes & stop trying to pit goon against goon & that al should post hot baltimore youtubes in the gun sounds thread

goon ( r ) m.d ( e )

flopson dropson realtalk

yeah i never post baltimore stuff in the rolling threads, partly because a lot of time the stuff i like best isn't on youtube, but maybe i'll try looking more

what the fuck is wrong with you guys

whiney why do you have to constantly antagonize deej

deej everyone

Lex's best beats are as evil as anything this side of Shawty Redd, but hit you so hard you barely notice.

...

lol surfboards went h.a.m. in the comments section

while surf is getting pendantic about lex luger this is probably as good a place as any to clown the das racist guy who referred to jeezy's "lose my mind" as a lex luger production in pitchfork

i will continue to h8 on ppl saying dude is a bigger deal as a producer than drumma boy

he might be a hotter name right now but he's certainly nowhere near as good

speaking of -- what happened to FATBOI

^^^xlnt question

iirc hes somehow tied w/ whoever is producing also ran jason caesar, R&B star

can we plz make a "rolling deej/whiney FITE! thread 2011" and get back to discussing jay/ye

ok what would you like to discuss about this fascinating upcoming collaborative album ::leans forward with chin resting on fist::

lol

ok what would you like to discuss ::leans forward with chin resting on fist::

new board description right here

An entire thread misses the point of a Wayne/Birdman diss track and is also generally wrong about it

why the hell are there so many posts about this album already

many of them were yours, to be fair

lol i don't remember a thing about what was said in this thread -- lemme investigate

ha i have like 8 total posts in this thread -- garden variety deej/whiney/ship argument

i don't get hurting's post either -- the song is surely not a baby/wayne diss track considering wayne collaborates with kanye quite frequently -- the "baby money" thing is probably a stray shot but otherwise i think that's a pretty generous reading seeing how vague the rest of that section of the verse is

i didn't really remember anything about this song -- the production is pretty great, i wish the beat had gone to someone else. kanye is so terrible on this song but i think this is the best jay has been since maybe that "hot tottie" verse -- sorta wish this was a solo jay thing actually

i don't get hurting's post either -- the song is surely not a baby/wayne diss track considering wayne collaborates with kanye quite frequently -- the "baby money" thing is probably a stray shot but otherwise i think that's a pretty generous reading seeing how vague the rest of that section of the verse is

― J0rdan S., Thursday, March 31, 2011 4:42 AM Bookmark

Yeah but also "half a billi" plus half the Kanye verse is basically aping Wayne's flow, plus the Miss Me reference.

Anyway, "Like Eli, I did it" = great line imo.

Also:

Bow down, brother pay homage
Don't spill hate all on my garments
Commes Des Garcon, f-ck your fresh
Head shots n-gga f-ck your vests

-- a bit Jay by the numbers but still classic

literally groaned when i saw this thread again, had totally and blissfully forgotten this thing was due to exist

can you imagine how sick we'll be of this album by November when they get a single in heavy rotation and actually release it

if alex da kid is involved i might leave the country

The thing is there is something very petulant and bloated and overindulged about kanye and jay right now but I'm sort of enjoying that stage as part of the dramatic arc of their careers, maybe in part just because there haven't been that many hip-hop stars who have reached that stage.

literally groaned when i saw this thread again, had totally and blissfully forgotten this thing was due to exist

― r|t|c, Thursday, March 31, 2011 2:06 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

"i swam waters with great whites"

o i get it

chris martin is 'great' now?

no he's referencing forthcoming guest spots by Roger Waters and Jack Russell.

and Leon Russell

I ate sixty-five hot dogs
y'all motherfuckas can't hold food
I sang tenor in a show choir
y'all motherfuckas woulda been booed

http://rapradar.com/2011/07/20/new-music-jay-z-x-kanye-west-otis/

way to ruin one of my favorite songs kanye

man, if people lost their shit for "shine blockas"

that said, this is amazing imo

Beat is too spare for my liking. I feel like it needs more of a kick and snare in there.

they really shouldn't have let solange's son sing at the end tho

tired of people rapping over loud vocal loops, shit just gets irritating more often than not

this is just a shitty loop to rap over tho

i mean theres basically nothing either of these guys will do that i can like so

Beat is too spare for my liking. I feel like it needs more of a kick and snare in there.

― MarkoP, Thursday, July 21, 2011 1:01 AM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban P

Agree 100%. Doesnt have enough spank for my liking, sample gets old real quick.

ppl have been complaining about kanye's drums... forever?

Ya but these are like non existent, more so than normal, could just be the mix.

better rapping would help too

I'm not even as jaded towards these two as a lot of folk. I just find this specific track to be on the annoying side.

I actually really like this, for the most part. The rapping is definitely the weakest link but I feel like the minimalism actually works wonders here.

Yeah, I was prepared for this to suck, but can't front.

Theres just nothing here to care about...banal at best

every rap song on billboard sounds like an ibiza bloodfart or radio disney and ppl complaining about a gritty soul sample, smfh

^^WATCH THE THRONE

I think now is a good time for me to upload the "Otis" skit from C-Murder's "Trapped In Crime" since it's not on YouTube

http://www.mediafire.com/?x5i6mgknchmcdqb

^essential skit

This thread will be a great big ole of complaining.

Side Note: I'm very neutral about this project at best.

ok

Nah its only been goon heads so far itt. once ilm notices this shit is about, the thread will be all positivity as they buy their one rap album of the year

this song is horrible and awkward

i'm SO BORED of kanye and jay and wayne

I suppose people are gonna go as mad for this one as they did for MBDTF? Something to look forward to

I suppose people are gonna go as mad for this one as they did for MBDTF? Something to look forward to

i can't remember what it was that geared the anticipation for that record so high -- kanye being a dick in public?, or the good fridays downloads, idk. but this seems like a lot smaller?

Return to conventional rap after 808's as well

promised to reunite cast of 'run this town'

watch the game of thrones

like the beat even if it's a little too skewed to be funky. almost reminds me of something like madlib would make

this song is horrible and awkward

^^^OTM this loop is stupid.

beat is actively annoying

it kinda grew on me

i'm kicking around starting a serious thread where we try to really figure out how and why jay-z started to suck as as rapper, it's really interesting to me to hear a guy that was probably once one of or the greatest lose his ability to rap...like even more than ice cube

working theory: he somehow unconsciously started to mimic aspects of peedi crack's flow but can't pull it off

"sophisticated ignorance, write my curses in cursive"

oh STOP it kanye, you 're not fooling anyone. you write your curses in CAPS LOCK, we've all seen it

also i saw a tracklisting for watch the throne that said LMFAO is on it...and the return of that Mr Hudson douchebag from forever young..

who the fuck is that guy is he english or something?

I love this beat. Kind of wish it was two different rappers on it.

give it a few days

This is embarrassing. Clumsy beat (chopped up verses OK but the full vocal bits, nah) and terrible MCing, especially from Kanye (the accustomed/customs/customer bit). At the risk of sounding like my dad, it makes me want to watch this clip again:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dael4sb42nI

i doubt there's a devoted mr hudson thread but since his name came up here, an amusing tweet from a fellow journo

kieran_yates

Remembering interviewing mr hudson-he opened with 'are you excited to meet me?'I replied 'are you excited to meet ME?'
4 minutes ago via Twitter for BlackBerry®

every rap song on billboard sounds like an ibiza bloodfart or radio disney and ppl complaining about a gritty soul sample, smfh

― harbl bosses (Whiney G. Weingarten), Thursday, July 21, 2011 1:14 AM Bookmark

^^^

Not sure about the track yet but a lot of the complaining just seems like "this ketchup tastes different from my regular brand"

I wound up loving HAM fwiw.

every rap song on billboard sounds like an ibiza bloodfart or radio disney and ppl complaining about a gritty soul sample, smfh

this is OTM, at the same time this gritty soul sample is just shitty/clumsy so it's not really an improvement. I'm not complaining about the aesthetic, it's the execution that sucks.

the rapping is fine this is great

I think it depends on context. If they're pushing this as the hype new single for the summer or w/e (which I assume they're not) then it's a joke, but it sounds like a good album track to me. I like the rapping and the beat is a little off but I still enjoy them rapping over something that sounds different.

"ibiza bloodfart"

all time the more I think about it

I keep waiting for Nicki to pop up

ibiza bloodfart sausage

rap song by jay z more like crap song by jay pee

and kanye WORST

Nah its only been goon heads so far itt. once ilm notices this shit is about, the thread will be all positivity as they buy their one rap album of the year

― I am Louise Boat (a hoy hoy), Thursday, July 21, 2011 12:09 PM (10 hours ago) Bookmark

god, as a non-goon, this is pretty rich: you come off as one of the herbiest motherfuckers on the board

WARSH MY THONG

lol "herbiest"

herbiest!

Once when I was sitting on my porch in New Brunswick with my housemates, and this guy walking past looked right at me and says "You a herb. You know you a herb."

http://www.flooglebinder.com/images/herbie-fully-loaded.jpg

l-r: a hoy hoy, history mayne

herbie goes ham

herbie as a motherfucker

nice ass, history mayne

history mayne hot ready and herbish

like the beat even if it's a little too skewed to be funky. almost reminds me of something like madlib would make

― van ingalls wilder (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Thursday, July 21, 2011 9:32 AM (4 hours ago) Bookmark

first time I heard this, I thought it was way sub-madlib shit

yeah, some DRUMS might have helped.

nah I could care less abt drums do whatever you want as a beatmaker but if you loop then loop well

just let madlib do it

^^^

Theres plenty of rap thatsounds unlike ibiza bloodfarts (lol coinage though) that theres no need to accept sub par product. Surprised at some of u for repping this, esp flopson. Theres nothing moving about this production, it's 100% reliant on the source sample + the fantasy that kanye is doing something interesting, something "artful", to the source sample. Like how we are constantly required to read "deep" arty subtext into everything he does, the benefit of which is never extended to other rappers.

Jay's entire rapping existence is empty. He has nothing left to say and there is no sense of investment. How many ppl repping for this thinks it has remotely the power of any given late 90s album track? If this wasn't burdened by event status it would still be forgettable

agreed on jay, he's completely useless as a rapper now

h8 the way these two (and wayne) have come to represent what's up with hip-hop nowadays. move ASIDE, past-it irrelevances. i'm so bored with everyone jumping on everything they release as though it's even remotely interesting, let alone a pop event.

what kind of person cares about billboard in 2011 is the question

lex otm re: j-z but I really don't think you can call Kanye a "past-it irrelevance" just yet

Like what does saying jays rapping is "good"here even mean? He didn't trip over his words? Jw managed not to do a juiceman freestyle or the game written clunker? When is "good rapping" supposed to add up to something?

indie record label owners?

xposts

Theres plenty of rap thatsounds unlike ibiza bloodfarts (lol coinage though) that theres no need to accept sub par product.

yeah i'm not talking about tity boi or purp durst or whatever, i'm saying it's nice to hear platinum, billboard-charting rappers do something that sounds weird and gross instead trying to beat will.i.am to be the first rapper to jack "walking on sunshine" or wrestle with BoB over who could be the first to have Joe Jonas on a hook

When is "good rapping" supposed to add up to something?

Its like I totally follow you through the first three questions, then you lose me completely.

Jw managed not to do a juiceman freestyle

lol

kanye and wayne and jay are relevant, they just suck now

Theres nothing moving about this production, it's 100% reliant on the source sample + the fantasy that kanye is doing something interesting, something "artful", to the source sample.

^^^^this

I just mean, "good rapping" here simply implies competence...his raps used to work so well bcuz of how evocative they were, not bcuz they were adequately delivered with occasional cipher-winning "clever" punchlines...the big picture was the point

every one of the jay-z verses on this song start off sounding like jay forgot he was supposed to rap

people really slept on how funny this post is

they really shouldn't have let solange's son sing at the end tho

― tupac, bach (J0rdan S.), Wednesday, July 20, 2011 9:02 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

oh wait, i just thought it said "they really shouldn't have let solange sing at the end tho" lol

um, guys, the blogosphere has already spoken on this:

http://www.complex.com/music/2011/07/whats-the-consensus-the-internets-top-tastemakers-react-to-jay-z-kanye-wests-otis

I don't really pay attention to kanye but this was the last beat he made that I heard and liked

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4u97twEUObU

ha, forgot that kanye had a verse on that kweli track

i sympathize w/ whiney's position -- the flipside of this is that it's not like "otis" is gonna get any radio play, so it's not exactly like they're altering the culture or something

You know what “Otis” was? A warning shot. Not to the competition, but to the critics. We didn't believe WTT was coming and they slapped the taste out our mouth in three minutes. Is it the best offering from these two to date? Nope. But this is just what we needed to keep quiet until the full project comes. This was for us. The bloggers. The writers. The tweeters. Now we can't say anything. This is mean. Not perfect. But MEAN. Imagine what they have to say to the competition. SMH

lol

Every one is afraid of getting cut from g.o.o.d. music listening sessions

as for the chopping of the beat... it's not necessarily novel, but i think ye does a good job of providing something that is minimal and energetic in a way that lends itself to the cypher thing they seem to be aiming for. it's almost as if someone is beatboxing for them, and yet it still has an air of "this is a hi-fi, expensive sounding beat on the jay-z/kanye album"

bloggers that are major label orifices shouldn't masquerade as critics

also was wondering: can complex give me any insight into what shoes jay-z & kanye were wearing during the recording of "otis"? maybe kid cudi knows? maybe they could put a gallery together? i'm dying to know

Yah it functions, I don't think it's a wack beat, it's just not astonishing, and an otis sample is an easy way to be critic proof. Who could hate a classic soul sample?? Etc

Who could hate a classic soul sample?? Etc

― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Thursday, July 21, 2011 6:29 PM (52 seconds ago) Bookmark

yeah... like, i said: "if people lost their shit for 'shine blockas'"

lol whiney your ibiza bloodfart comment is making me lol at this araabmuzik album i'm listening to on spotify (it's p good tho)

that araabmuzik album is wonderful. jam & spoon!!

wait...he samples jam & spoon? which track?

hey lex, the pitchfork review makes it sound like lots of the album is just him sampling popular techno or club tracks and not really changing them at all? i never listen to dance music so i wouldn't know, is that true?

i like it though

"I made Jesus Walks I'm never going to hell"

right in the night

xp he doesn't change the samples themselves much but the backing is completely different? i wouldn't trust a p4k review on this anyway

yeah i just don't even listen to dance so i didn't know if it was true...i just knew him for some of his cam stuff and being that kid showing off crazy shit on the MPC on youtube

"This was for... The tweeters"

Tweeters around the world have time off during this track, NO SNARE.

certainly is the toughest i've ever heard anyone sound while pedalling the i think this song is all about me! sentiment

i'm kicking around starting a serious thread where we try to really figure out how and why jay-z started to suck as as rapper, it's really interesting to me to hear a guy that was probably once one of or the greatest lose his ability to rap...like even more than ice cube

― van ingalls wilder (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Thursday, July 21, 2011 12:38 PM (6 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

working theory: he somehow unconsciously started to mimic aspects of peedi crack's flow but can't pull it off

― van ingalls wilder (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Thursday, July 21, 2011 12:39 PM (6 hours ago) Bookmark

i have detailed charts and timelines on this subject fwiw

also it was the influence of young chris's whisper flow more than peedi that undid hov

oh shit yeah you're totally right wrt to young chris, that was actually who i meant

i want to see these charts!

Theres plenty of rap thatsounds unlike ibiza bloodfarts (lol coinage though) that theres no need to accept sub par product.

yeah i'm not talking about tity boi or purp durst or whatever, i'm saying it's nice to hear platinum, billboard-charting rappers do something that sounds weird and gross instead trying to beat will.i.am to be the first rapper to jack "walking on sunshine" or wrestle with BoB over who could be the first to have Joe Jonas on a hook

― e herbiest unum (Whiney G. Weingarten), Thursday, July 21, 2011 5:50 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark

jsy snd kanye made a gang of my favorite songs of all time together from 2000 to 2005 but honestly this is like championing some shitty '80s Rolling Stones song just because it doesn't have synthesizers

yeah i dont really hear 'weird' in this at all

Theres plenty of rap thatsounds unlike ibiza bloodfarts (lol coinage though) that theres no need to accept sub par product. Surprised at some of u for repping this, esp flopson. Theres nothing moving about this production, it's 100% reliant on the source sample + the fantasy that kanye is doing something interesting, something "artful", to the source sample. Like how we are constantly required to read "deep" arty subtext into everything he does, the benefit of which is never extended to other rappers.

Jay's entire rapping existence is empty. He has nothing left to say and there is no sense of investment. How many ppl repping for this thinks it has remotely the power of any given late 90s album track? If this wasn't burdened by event status it would still be forgettable

― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Thursday, July 21, 2011 5:41 PM (3 hours ago)

great post

hey kevin! :)

it's nice to hear platinum, billboard-charting rappers do something that sounds weird and gross instead trying to beat will.i.am to be the first rapper to jack "walking on sunshine" or wrestle with BoB over who could be the first to have Joe Jonas on a hook

this is also a weird sentiment to me because were you expecting these specific billboard-charting rappers to engage with will.i.am or BoB over pretty hooks

i mean, kanye's sampled otis redding before. it was better the first time too.

like what is so novel about this, dude.

Surprised at some of u for repping this, esp flopson

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlOxOkQaDiw

einh i like this beat because its sloppy & fun, absence of drums is cool i think ur taking the sample a bit 2 personally, think the way he uses it has a neat lopsided throb to it. sometimes that is enough what can i say. theyre still disgusting as rappers & its true its impossible to buy into any of their sense of their own glory. this sounds like it was knocked off in a couple minutes & that's a lot less painful than most of their other recent stuff thats overwrought & just as dumb

yeah to be fair im sure this will be the least objectionable track on the lp

Ok I gave it a couple more listens you guys are right Jay-Z's rapping sucks on this -- there isn't even a memorable punchline. Kanye is better. I will still defend HAM and I still want to hear this record.

whatever happened to Big Hat Club?????????

i still hope it will surface someday

Last Great Jay-Z Verse?

^^real heads know the deal^^

I'm not a businessman!

― Tape Store, Monday, June 11, 2007 2:37 AM (4 years ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i swear i heard that punchline before that song and ive never been able to figure out what it was

thinking it was messy marv or smoething

i'm not a busimessmarv i'm a busimess, marv!

diamonds remix was definitely the last time motherfucker was COLD

lol xp

We don't resort to violence
we own resorts and islands

I used to give a shit, now I don't give a shit more
Truth be told, I had more fun when I was piss poor
I'm pissed off, is this what success all about
A bunch of niggas acting like bitches with big mouths
All this stress, all I got is this big house
Couple cars, I don't bring half of them shits out
All this ace of spade I drank, just to piss out
I mean I like the taste, could have saved myself six hours
How many times can I go to Mr. Chow's, Tao's, Nobu
Hold up, let me move my bowels
I'll shit on y'all niggas, OG tell these boys

[Juan:]
Y'all ain't got shit on my nigga

[Jay-Z:]
I got watches I ain't seen in months
Apartment at the Trump I only slept in it once
Nigga said Hova was over, such dummies
Even if I fell I land on a bunch of money
Y'all ain't got nothing for me

i hate that verse..."such dummies" is the kind of clumsy turn of phrase peak era jay would never touch

"success" was easily the rawest shit off AG & i dig that verse but nas bodied him on that song

beat is pretty sick

yeah it is

jay's prolific shittyness is kinda like the simpsons'

The Simpsons has actually reached the point where the bad seasons outweight the good. Jay hasn't got anywhere near that in terms of albums yet.

jay-z is really dire on this. kanye kills it. beat is good once it gets over showing off that they can basically replay huge chunks of the original and not care about paying through the nose.

in other words, kanye has taken the throne.

http://ow.ly/i/eFFJ/original

this one is better
http://www.egotripland.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/AD_WatchTheThrone.jpg

The title of the song basically tells you how little effort has been put into giving the sample any resonance whatsoever. It's just "Otis" and that's assumed to be sufficient.

Also the tracklist for the album has it as - (feat. Otis Redding). I'm sure he'd be honoured.

if madlib did that no one would say anything

My perception of that decision may be influenced by my thinking Kanye is an arrogant dick alright.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWjhnBr5fNE

if madlib did that no one would say anything

― titchy (titchyschneiderMk2), Friday, July 22, 2011 6:04 AM (4 hours ago)

i'm sure the 12 people who heard it on the first day it was leaked might not care, yeah

this song is kind of a throwaway nothing

I like bits of this review.

http://passionweiss.com/2011/07/21/the-adventures-of-millionaires-and-otis-jay-z-and-kanye-love-themselves-tender/

There are so many gifted rappers making powerful, funky, and fun music that I don’t have time to hear soul night at a post-modern art gallery only open to people whose fortune exceeds 50 million or last name is La Croix.

soul night at a post-modern art gallery only open to people whose fortune exceeds 50 million or last name is La Croix.

haw, i wish it sounded as interesting as this

terius could do that! #fancy #ifchristianlacroixbringsasmileillbuyit

I can't think of less appealing any subject matter than how boring it is to be rich

I can: rape

nah there are good songs about that

oh okay, you win

Every MC faces the problem, after a certain age, of running out of pressing things to say but I've rarely heard such a blatant admission of lyrical bankruptcy as this - such a lack of curiosity about anything beyond their own cloistered orbit. If you haven't heard it before, here's a much better Otis-sampling track called Otis.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5Lreb5U87U

durutti column is gully, son

You know it.

vin rock comin' with the digital delay 4 ya azz

Kanye's obviously needed more Tracy Chapman.

needs more ibiza bloodfart

+1

I can't think of less appealing any subject matter than how boring it is to be rich

― No Broehner (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, July 22, 2011 11:44 AM Bookmark

To me that's exactly where the humor and swagger of Success comes from though. Because it's not really "I'm so bored of being rich" it's "I'm so rich I'm bored." There are a million songs about showing up at exclusive clubs in a Lex, but I don't think any other rapper has ever said "How many times can I go to Mr. Chow's, Tao's, Nobu" in a verse.

maybe if you weren't a shithead and actually appreciated good food as a pleasurable experience and not some "trophy" to lord over ppl heads jiggaman?

eh i like aspirational raps, hes just been doing them for so damn long now its like, how can you still be excited?

whats new here is the shifting brand names -- no longer about cristal -- but the story is sorta getting run into the ground here. dude has nothing going on in his life

i totally disagree, jay's problem is mostly that he lost his flow and works too hard at 'clever' wanna be slow burners where he used to have a kind of blithe, effortless wit. it has nothing to do with him being more comfortable or out of touch now that he's been ridiculously wealthy for 13 years as opposed to when he'd been wealthy for only 5 years and was still making great music.

idk i think all his best albums had a sense of *having something worth saying* about them but maybe thats too abstract a quality

relative to the more obvious problems you're describing

i dunno -- American Gangster and Kingdom Come probably have more of a thesis or statement behind them than some of the early albums that are ten times better. if anything Jay is too conscious of 'having something worth saying' these days because he's so aware of his importance and how much every word will be discussed and pored over.

i mean if ever there was an album where someone just raps their ass off and makes great songs without any regard to saying anything """"meaningful"""" it's Vol. 3

i think all of those songs say something, i think hes just too self aware about '''saying something''' now

all of his vol 3 songs i mean -- he was getting across a sensibility & there's a tremendous amount of novelty not just to the sound of those records but the character they portrayed

well yeah, agreed. i just don't get why you're focusing on the namebrand raps like that's a symptom of anything in and of itself -- i'd think if anyone understands it's not the subject matter but how you talk about it in rap it'd be you. (xpost)

i don't know if there's that much novel about Vol. 3 that wasn't established or heavily implied on the first three albums -- feels like a very confident and capable 'if it ain't broke don't fix it' album to me

although whatever sounds and tropes were familiar on that album are nothing compared to how well worn every aspect of "Otis" is from 11 years of Jay/Kanye collaborations

i dunno i dont think there are many songs on that record that sound like rehashes of anything on RD through Vol 2

not rehashes, but not a lot of new sounds (pretty much same production team from Vol 2 as opposed to bringing in a whole new team on The Dynasty), only a couple songs that explicitly deal with his post-Vol 2 level of fame or anything he wasn't speaking of before that

i guess what i'm saying is that this new stuff feels like, 'this again huh' in a way that that stuff didnt

oh yeah totally -- i feel like that's more about kanye going back to the soul sample well than jay not getting enough inspiration from his awesome life, though

don't wanna derail the thread bc it's innaresting but
http://nymag.com/daily/entertainment/2011/07/have_you_ever_wanted_to_see_fo.html
the clip of jay whispering FLY PELICAN FLY just might come in useful at some point as an illustration

al ship otm

A searing look at the compromises of fame and fortune.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rpjU_LfXcPA

jay-z shouldnt try and think of something important to say cos thats never been what hes about really. his best songs are about a certain sociopath-style coldness and generally just rhyming about being a complete asshole and emanating 100% pure asshole persona, whether its is that yo bitch, throw your hands up or takeover. when he tries to reach for deep feelings (or worse, say something about something more important than himself, though of course nothing could ever be more important than himself), it usually just seems try-hard or lacks much gravitas. his problem is that now hes such a big celeb holding hands with gwyneth at glasto or whatever he feels he cant be the old mean asshole he was in all his classic material and so is struggling.

kanye however has always been about the contradictions and obv made it his shtick before not even caring about being contradictory and just being another plain rich asshole, the diff is that he can get away with it as he does it with a lot of humour and charm and is generally a more likeable asshole than jay-z who even when a millionaire who is BFFs with chris m and gwyneth and whoever else still feels he has to mean-mug all the time and prob has no interior life going on (i lol'd at his recent list of his all time favourite books) and is basically just a more shallow, one dimensional guy.

when he tries to reach for deep feelings (or worse, say something about something more important than himself, though of course nothing could ever be more important than himself), it usually just seems try-hard or lacks much gravitas. his problem is that now hes such a big celeb holding hands with gwyneth at glasto or whatever he feels he cant be the old mean asshole he was in all his classic material and so is struggling.

this totally sums it up - jay-z's so conscious of his establishment, elder statesman status (plus he's probably just grown up anyway and isn't that asshole any more). his desire to make "classic", "canonic" material these days is so transparent.

its even more transparent if you read that 'biog' (or whatever it was meant to be) he put out. it was obv heavily ghostwritten anyway, but the phrasing was like another person, and so polished that you wondered what the point of it was really, other than a plea to be taken seriously by the establishment (fwiw critics seemed to eat it up) that hes been courting for quite a few years now.

fwiw i think this beat and kanye is/are great when they start rapping (the 30 second mark). its a great no frills, just back to back rhyming song. jay-z is pretty woeful but when was the last time we heard this kind of uninterrupted back to back tag team type of song? its pretty great if you wanted to hear these guys just get on with rapping and not care about anything else.

East Hamptons dry fart

when he tries to reach for deep feelings (or worse, say something about something more important than himself, though of course nothing could ever be more important than himself), it usually just seems try-hard or lacks much gravitas. his problem is that now hes such a big celeb holding hands with gwyneth at glasto or whatever he feels he cant be the old mean asshole he was in all his classic material and so is struggling.

this totally sums it up - jay-z's so conscious of his establishment, elder statesman status (plus he's probably just grown up anyway and isn't that asshole any more). his desire to make "classic", "canonic" material these days is so transparent.

― lex pretend, Saturday, July 23, 2011 4:35 AM (3 hours ago) Bookmark

yeah i mean i think the change actually happened pretty quickly after his relationship with beyonce started -- just look at the first two singles after that, "bonnie & clyde" and "excuse me miss." in a way i think it is cool that he fell in love and became more respectful of women in his music (and hey if you're going to be whipped, it may as well be with beyonce) but that kinda feels like the beginning of the end, in terms of him becoming this nice guy who wants to be everything to everyone.

I find Jay's career to have a nice dramatic arc, at least for a good part of it, and "Success" to me is like the beginning of a third act -- underdog makes it all the way to the top, but then eventually gets bored and petulant once there. I agree after that there's not much more to say about being really fucking wealthy. Maybe he can rap about being on the boards of charitable foundations and attending $500-plate fundraisers, or about sailing across the Atlantic with a surgeon buddy, or start name-dropping the hedge funds he invests in or whatever.

Kingdom Come was pretty petulant

Great points by everyone wrt jay and his persona. Still, I think a far bigger problem is the actual technical, structural, flow related ways that he's changed. I heard jigga what on the radio the other day and it was really striking, because all I've lately is new stuff. I could hardly believe how good he used to be. Also that jaz verse still rules.

Basically I'm trying to say that we'd be a lot more ok with his new persona and even lack of content if he could still rap on that level or if he hadn't fucked up his flow so badly

otm

yeah "jigga what" is flawless, listening to him doubletime on "h.a.m." is pretty sad by comparison

yea his flow has def taken a knock. the whispery thing was terrible. worse is that being compounded with various gimmicks like pausing to emphasise a usually anticlimatic punchline or just try and complicate his flow unnecessarily. worse than all that (and the whispering thing was a nadir i feel for rappers in general, apart from a few exceptions, like um, YYT) though is that he just sounds like hes umming and aahing on this song, like he doesnt quite know what to do with himself. and worst of all, he doesnt actually sound that confident. prob cos the whole mean 'tude he used to have was so tied with his confidence. strip that away and you have a guy with an already weak voice with an increasingly shaky sense of delivery.

oh man or that time he started saying "sweet!" a lot

his adlibs/'vocal trademarks' have gotten progressively more painful. its like heas turned into a bad/dated seinfeld/sitcom extra. i think the title track of kingdom come might be the last time i thought he really came with it (though the rest of the album was pretty weak).

looooove i don't get enough of it

(nothing new here but)he shouldn't have came back from retirement.

oh the "AUGH" all over "D.O.A."...yeah this could be a poll unto itself

so this is out now.

trying to think up a reason to bother listening to it, drawing a blank

classic lolz like jay-z planking on a million?

"classic lolz"?

i think i disapprove of that, like, conceptually

i'm not laughing, at any rate

you don't ever seem to laugh alex.

i laugh a lot!

but you hate jokes so what do you laugh at? the absurdity of the universe?

i dont think u get it, we're laughing at jay-z, not with him

i dont think u get it, we're laughing at jay-z, not with him is the name of my collaboration project

yeah but i'm not so desperate for laughs that i'm going to subject myself to this thing on the day of release as though it was an album i'd actually been anticipating, just so i can mock a couple of old men

i mean who carezzz

and on a practical level i'm aware that the meagre lols i'd be able to glean from it wouldn't actually be worth the hour of boredom listening to the thing would entail

jeez kanye's only 34 lex

- "posting from the crypt"

more like watch me groan

more like watch me not care about this album

you can't care about popular culture right now and not partake in listening to this album. 90% for kanye

you're not too cool to listen to an album kanye west

There are people out there, reasonable people, who are not interested in Kanye West.

Sure, but they don't all come and tell me how uninterested they are.

I am very much too cool to listen to kanye west, but I'll check this out anyway

Fwiw lex, I'm p much with you and haven't listened myself, but I think you are a bit too strident here. I'm reserving my fun-poking for Yeezy and Jay themselves, not getting my knickers in a twist cause people I like are listening to an album by two popular musicians.

i will always listen to a new jay-z album

lex your thing that kanye isn't "relevant" is really weird, like he's p much super relevant in pop culture and music right now

like u2! and train!

he's p much super relevant in pop culture and music right now

Outside of the critical pant wettings I don't think anyone cares that much about Kanye. Certainly not outside North America.

Kanye is still huge here but I'd bet he hasn't been as big a he was circa graduation since. Certainly his music hasn't been

He's still a huge pop personality

my stridency comes from seeing this clog up my twitter feed. i think i'd understand it more if it seemed like people actually thought it might be amazing rather than just this vaguely depressing herd-like "listening to this week's It Album because, uhhhh everyone else is".

idk i haven't listened to a full jay-z album since the black album either, never bothered to listen to the lcd soundsystem one last year...there are too many albums to listen to that i actually have somewhat high expectations for.

unlike john maus's record, this is not on spotify

People care a lot about Kanye. Especially the types who only listen to one rap album a year

more like a huge poop personality

^^

so this is out now.

idk i haven't listened to a full jay-z album since the black album either

This is where lex's argument kinda falls apart for me. I mean, how can you rail against how awful someone is if you haven't listened to a full-length in nearly a decade? Granted, its not like Jay isn't overexposed through his guest spots and singles or anything, but I kinda feel like listening to "event" records you aren't really inclined to is one of those "know thy enemy" type things so you can, at the very least, load up on new ammo as to why you hate someone so much.

you can't care about popular culture right now and not partake in listening to this album. 90% for kanye

― surfboard dudes get wiped out, totally, Monday, August 8, 2011 11:47 AM (1 hour ago) Bookmark

this is the kind of thing that makes it seem like homework btw

I mean, how can you rail against how awful someone is if you haven't listened to a full-length in nearly a decade?

sadly not having heard a whole jay-z album in that time doesn't mean i haven't heard any new jay-z material

Kingdom Come could be a Schrödinger's cat masterpiece if you would just OPEN THE BOX, lex!!!!!!!!

we were all just keeping Blueprint 3's greatness from you as a prank! you missed out on the album of the decade!

if you go to your grave without hearing how totally competent and inoffensive American Gangster was, your family will never forgive you!!!!!!!!!!

i envy people who have the willpower not to listen to new Jay-Z albums

^

if i had never listened to new verses from jay-z i wouldnt know what his achilles heel is

i think listening to new jay-z albums is kind of fascinating

it's just 45 mins idk

Its his heel isn't it

There's definitely a huge part of me that admires lex digging his heels into this, but there's also a small part of me that kind of feels like this is the sort of "pulse-check" event album that critics should hear just to be able to smartly dismiss when Pazz & Jop season rolls around again.

I want to hear it so I can make smart arguments about why its total garbage instead of presumptive, uninformed ones

^^^ that

I understand thats not always lex's mo, which sounds like a zing but I mean I've certainly endured enough similar arguments from others about music I think is good that I don't have much sympathy when it happens to shit were all "supposed"to hear

But no matter what uninformed hating can be frustrating

lex's whole thing is pretty cover your ears and yell la la la though

and fwiw i think there is a time and place for that

like i guess i 'should' listen to the LMFAO album or the Foster The People album before i make blanket assumptions about their contents, the only reason i don't but i probably will listen to this is that those guys didn't make The Blueprint

if you have a listening meritocracy then that is cool. i am listening to this record now & it is pretty fine & i like some of it + then some of it's kinda nothingy or not so great. there are some nice passages. i think there is something to be said for listening to things not because they're being discussed but just because there is nothing to be gained by not - it can be a pretty passive thing. trying to go for a 'the pinefox' style post here in which i diplomatically lay down my opinions.

think rapping about potential kids is probably a good direction for jay

People care a lot about Kanye. Especially the types who only listen to one rap album a year

― Number None, Monday, 8 August 2011 18:08 (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

watch out, you may get called a herb for saying something so true.

after kc, ag and bp3 i'm never gonna listen to another jay record. its just not worth it.

after 808 and mbdrhtjf, i'll allow kanye another stinker before giving up on him. although graduation wasn't exactly terrific.

So its a three stinker rule, then? Fair enough. Although I 100% disagree in calling 808s a stinker.

my bad, how could i be so dr. evil?

lol

a hoy hoy :)

good job

Yep that one line completely ruins the rest of the album.

the rest of the album ruins the rest of the album, i thought.

yeah it's not exactly the only facepalm moment

yeah that is one example of many

I was kidding. But seriously if I let every Kanye facepalm line ruin a song for me, I'd never have listened to him ever.

if i wanted to list to someone sing-speaking a bunch of emo bullshit through ugly vocal processing i could just put some of my own old ilx posts through a speech-to-text program.

lol

I thought there were at least a couple Kanye stans on ILM that liked that album too, guess I'm alone now after the backlash.

ilxor still has yr back

bon iver used to post to ilm??

kshighway, iirc

there's no way markers is bon iver. you can't get slurpees out in the wisconsin wilderness.

yeah the good old wilderness of eau claire, a college town of 65,000 an hour from the twin cities

tbf i know nothing of the vast wasteland beyond the 13 original colonies, nor do i wish to

if you make it out to these parts, i would give you lodging in my sod house and share my hard tack and pemmican

xpost -- Greetings from the mystic realms of the West.

as far as i know y'all are churning butter while listening to an inbred brother and sister duo playing "love lockdown" on squeezebox and fiddle.

I see White Stripes jokes are back in style

We done evicted them thar varmints from their cottage for disrespecting Old Widow Rutzleplain and her stagecoach team.

as far as i know y'all are churning butter while listening to an inbred brother and sister duo playing "love lockdown" on squeezebox and fiddle.

― king of torts (strongo hulkington's ghost dad), Monday, August 8, 2011 1:17 PM Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Naw, I left Portland almost a year ago.

lol

Meanwhile, Hua Hsu:

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/6844020/let-eat-cake

Even if I'm not sure I agree with much of that, its a good read. But, uh, groan @ "In the informal game of Throne".

haha yeah just read that

I thought there were at least a couple Kanye stans on ILM that liked that album too, guess I'm alone now after the backlash.

― jon /via/ chi 2.0, Monday, August 8, 2011 4:06 PM (32 minutes ago) Bookmark

lol c'mon dawg

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2011/0808/grant_g_kanye_jayz_576.jpg

nagl

? I'm not all butthurt, I thought 808s had a decent following at the time.

(xp)

it still does, you're reacting to like 3 people itt as if it represents all of the board

^^

Haha, no, I was just waiting for someone to pipe up on my behalf.

which was my first mistake, tbh

lol that jay kept in that fly pelican fly line...idk why but it kills me almost as much as 'looooooooooove' on monster

Scarface ref. He's not nearly the first rapper to use it.

Cuban Link in "Off The Books" for one

huh ok that makes a lot more sense
ive only seen scarface once, ages ago, & that seemed like enough

kinda wish jay was like cormega, az OR EVEN NAS type of guys that sort of fade away and you can appreciate their hardearned wisdom over period correct beats instead of this stupid shit and his book and i actually just want an album of song cry if i have to have kanye and jay-z together or even better just beanie jay-z freeway face touching meditation shit somehow someway and an illadvised but actually great collaboration with somebody from another milieu(?) (like ha remix whatnot)

otm

That Hua Hsu review is fucking brilliant. If I'd written that I'd give myself the rest of the week off.

And now comes soundtrack, the income-gap raps of Watch the Throne. Maybe anything otherwise would have been an empty gesture of affiliation, the pretense of feeling another's pain. But then again, isn't that what it always was? As it is, the kingdom appears peaceful, all the necessary treaties brokered and alliances forged. The rulers admire themselves in a splendid mirror, the ruled watching the throne from afar.

Scarface ref. He's not nearly the first rapper to use it.

nicki minaj on "super bass" this very year

lex's whole thing is pretty cover your ears and yell la la la though

it's not really, i'm not saying i am NEVER GOING TO LISTEN TO THIS ALBUM and making a point of that - it's just so far from a priority, given expectations, that i don't see why anyone's hovering over their laptop to d/l it the minute it's out. that's behaviour i reserve for shit i'm actively enthused about. as is constant tweeting about any given album.

and i KNOW none of y'all were enthused about it ahead of time so i don't see why the liveblogging and the FIRST!s and so on, unless you had an actual commission

I finally listened to this thing. I just came in here to lol @

"sweet king martin, sweet queen coretta, sweet brother malcolm... I GOT A MILLION HITS ON MY BLOG, HANH"

wow, my mistake. i thought this thread was being bumped because people were actually talking about the record instead of having a pissing contest about who could not listen to it THE HARDEST

lmao

the rapping is pretty enhhh, especially on jay's side, but the beats are phenomenal and clattery and Terrordome-disco all the way through. Kanye shouldnt have been so greedy with em. It should have been someone else's record.

A bunch of people on the internet that haven't heard this record yet told me this is terrible, so now I can just skip it.

Honestly, I just haven't had time to check it out yet.

One-man pissing contest.

a vision

we talked about this on the liveblog thread, u late

there's not really much to say about this anyway -- rapping is pretty boring, beats are pretty dope as fuck aka who woulda guessed it???

the dubstep song is p fuckin stupid afaik.

and i like the NIN breakdown at the end of "Ch**seheads In Paris"

that dubstep song is like the best beat on the album

you only like it because jay can't keep up with it, so it sounds like all that Daniel Johnston YouTube rap you like

i don't listen to dubstep rap

and also, like, LMFAO at tastemaker Kanye West arriving three years later than Snoop to cop the steez of fratboy grime.

yeah except the beat is still better

also i have no idea what your post about jay z means

and on some shit like all those rap albums from 1990 having a shitty hip-house song, fuck that

also i have no idea what your post about jay z means

― J0rdan S., Wednesday, August 10, 2011 1:47 AM (15 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

the last half of the song moves too fast, so Jay is just behind the beat, totally off the rhythm. it sounds like all that stupid, off-center "then i swag my swag/then i bitch my swag/bitch a swaggy bitch" bullshit u like

well for one there's rapping off-beat on purpose and rapping off-beat bcuz you're old, but anyway re-listening now and i think he sounds fine by his standards

probably should start a "best beat on 'watch the throne'" poll in a few days

if only to troll deej

i dunno, i heard jigga kill the fast beat on "Jigga What, Jigga Who" when i was a young sprout. http://i.imgur.com/OEwRG.png, jay.

well, yeah

you only like it because jay can't keep up with it, so it sounds like all that Daniel Johnston YouTube rap you like

― Erin Go! Bwaaaah!!! (Whiney G. Weingarten), Wednesday, August 10, 2011 1:44 AM (4 hours ago) Bookmark

the last half of the song moves too fast, so Jay is just behind the beat, totally off the rhythm. it sounds like all that stupid, off-center "then i swag my swag/then i bitch my swag/bitch a swaggy bitch" bullshit u like

― Erin Go! Bwaaaah!!! (Whiney G. Weingarten), Wednesday, August 10, 2011 1:49 AM (4 hours ago) Bookmark

<3 <3 <3

i can't decide if i shoudl listen to this or ferrari boyz every morning this week

neither album is all that great

AllHipHop just sent this to us all:

The artist behind the elaborate design for Jay-Z and Kanye West's new album Watch the Throne has revealed his inspiration for the unique album cover artwork. Riccardo Tisci, who designs for French fashion house Givenchy, was tapped to create the album cover for Watch the Throne, after designing the artwork for the album's first single, "H.A.M.” According to Tisci, he decided to create the artwork to symbolize the “masculinity of two of the most iconic rap figures of our time." The artist meticulously incorporated a variety of religious symbols, animal faces and symmetric shapes, giving the album an embroidered feel, while leaving the inside artwork with a painted and printed feel. "I am honoured to have been asked to be part of this incredible music moment with such amazing artists," Riccardo Tisci told AllHipHop.com. "I am impressed by the amount of respect they have for music and art. We share the same way of working: like a family."

xp: yeah that's why i've been switching back and forth so much, haven't really absorbed either verywell

Like I thought. A thread full of mess. smh

thx for your input

what should i be listening to

I know it's missing the entire point of the whole thing, but I really wish this album was fun, even for a song or two. I wish there were a couple of jokes ("planking on a million" doesn't count). Beats are great, though. And I like the first Frank Ocean hook.

Is this all just an elaborate exercise to prevent Drake -- the humblebrag-made-flesh disciple -- from laying siege to their kingdom of bizarrely simultaneous self-worship and self-pity? Are they fantasizing about being widely hated because they find it preferable to being widely ignored? Watch the Throne is far too good to condemn them thus, but not good enough to erase the possibility.

harvilla

love that review

whiney killin' it w/daniel johnston

Are they fantasizing about being widely hated because they find it preferable to being widely ignored?

ha this is one reason i think i really want to ignore them

they fantasize about being widely hated because everyone in rap fantasizes about being widely hated

you could debate the degree to which kanye is fantasizing

haha

so is frank ocean all 'don't call me r&b' because he's a mediocre singer i guess?

8.5 BNM

http://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/15725-watch-the-throne/

ahahah

the outro to the song w/beyonce is gorgeous
i didn't love that review but it feels sorta appropriate that it addresses the standing of the LP above either jay or kanye's non-production contributions. kayne really annoying on a lot of this, and yet it sort of doesn't interfere with what you get from listening.

harvilla review was a hell of a read. i guess i will listen to this.

http://victory-light.blogspot.com/2011/08/i-watched-throne.html

best review yet

8.5 BNM

http://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/15725-watch-the-throne/

"Watch the Throne works best when Jay and Kanye are just talking about how great they are."

which song does jay reference "Bustin At em" ... read it somewhere but havent listened to the album very closely yet

When Jay-Z says "who gon stop me now" it sounds like "Hugo, stop me now," which makes me think he's got something to fear from Hugo Chavez, which is nonsense.

or this guy that produced a song on the album

http://www3.images.coolspotters.com/wallpapers/13032/chad-hugo-mobile-wallpaper.jpg

i knew that was an alfred post before i read who wrote it

When Jay-Z says "I'm gon believe in fidelity it sounds like "I'm gon believe in Fidel," which makes me think he's got something to fear from Fidel, which is nonsense.

XD

now one with "Buckley"

When Jay-Z says "will.i.am you mah man" it sounds like "William, you mah man" which makes me think he's got something to learn from William F. Buckley Jr., which is nonsense.

<3

the "otis" video is really fun -- jay-s is so cornily endearing

in that video

Hey, Alfred!

When Rev says "Hey, Alfred" it sounds like "Hey Al, Fred," which makes me think I'm standing next to Fred Flintstone, which is nonsense.

the "otis" video is really fun -- jay-s is so cornily endearing

― J0rdan S., Thursday, August 11, 2011 8:15 PM Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Yeah, Jay looks like he's having way more fun than he has publicly in ages.

Enjoyed the video.

saw on twitter that this is supposedly hitting spotify tomorrow, so that'll be nice

uh, by tomorrow i mean later today (friday)

Haha. I just went back and watched the "Girls, Girls, Girls" video. At the very end Kanye tries to get a high five from Jay, who snubs him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUg7G3CPos0

*disappointed yeezy*

ha that should really be a gif

I like coming here because most critics seem to give Kanye so much leeway it's nuts. Until the inevitable "Nabisco OTM" review, only Hua Hsu has really nailed it for me.

I don't know why people get so excited about it sounding expensive. I don't remember ever hearing a great hip hop album and thinking, "Brilliant, this sounds like it cost a ton." (Maybe Life After Death en masse but not in individual tracks.) One for the "apparent praise which make you never want to hear the record" thread from P4K: "Listening to it is sort of like watching George Clooney get all his movie-star friends together for a party at his Italian villa, and, along the way, maybe dream up Ocean's Twelve."

Meanwhile the only track P4K singles out as a failure, That's My Bitch, sounds fantastic to me.

jay isn't really interesting or on point outside of a couple of tracks but kanye just seems kinda annoying throughout, so him getting props for anything other than the production seems over-enthusiastic. there's something really funny about his occasional 'serious' tone, like what it is he's trying to project when he's trying to sound a lil more detached & weary & bummed out, cf new day or the chicago/iraq one.

i remember ignoring that's my bitch after hearing it originally but yeah i find it pretty & almost guiltily irresistible, the ridic bon iver lines particularly.

saw on twitter that this is supposedly hitting spotify tomorrow, so that'll be nice

― markers, Friday, August 12, 2011 2:15 AM (7 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

thx 4 the heads-up

feel like aziz azari has sort of reached the end of his 'arc' now

man u guys weren't joke that otis video is great! super infectious, now i think i like the song

jay hasn't had that much fun since...uh...the Hawaiian Sophie video?

broke down and am listening to this

as of track one, this sounds really, really fun

I have zero opinion on the quality of the rapping beyond it isn't detracting from my enjoyment

track 2 is in 3/4

basically this is just pandering to me so far

okay boo why did it go back into 4 at the end

copout imo

kind of impressed by the sparseness of arrangement on track 3

not really impressed by what Kanye is doing on this track, tho; there is nothing more annoying that K in bray mode (except of course Drake)

okay the little argument break in the middle is a bright spot

y'all are some cynical bastards if you are hating Jay on the track about his future kid

yeah that verse is lovely

up on spotify y'all

btw which tracks are the ones where Jay is all old-sounding and off the beat, because so far I haven't noticed it yet (except maybe "Otis")

as of track one, this sounds really, really fun

I like it a lot, but I maintain it's not a lot of fun. Except "Otis," especially after watching the video, which is fantastic.

Most of the Jay criticism OTT is baseless and weird and following some narrative previously set-up. He sounds fine here.

I think he sounds fine, just totally uninspired. There aren't many of the really embarrassing moments he's been specializing in in recent years

i don't know how you could feel like jay is really on point unless your first jay record was like the black album or something

I like coming here because most critics seem to give Kanye so much leeway it's nuts. Until the inevitable "Nabisco OTM" review, only Hua Hsu has really nailed it for me.

Regret to inform you that my paragraphs detailing why Kanye's so irritating were editorially excised, on the logic that everyone's already heard it. Maybe I'll put a "spare Kanye insults" post on Tumblr after the review's up.

looool

I be watching these niggaz watching the throne
watch me take they wristwatch then watch me go home - Sean Price via twitter

i don't know how you could feel like jay is really on point unless your first jay record was like the black album or something

it's pretty easy if you think "Hard Knock Life"-era Jay was massively overrated

(tho it's pretty well established that I am the only human being on Earth who feels that way)

xp Ha ha

what on earth

contraristan par excellence

Jay in that "Otis" video reminds me of Phife.

http://28.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lptl2gl1Mx1qz7d0ro1_400.jpg
http://4sqatl.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/zoolander-jeep-scene.png

lolololol

<33333333333333333333333333333333333

lolololol

― om nom nom nnamdi asomugha (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Friday, August 12, 2011 7:16 PM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

<33333333333333333333333333333333333

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Friday, August 12, 2011 7:19 PM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark

it's pretty easy if you think "Hard Knock Life"-era Jay was massively overrated

― CLUB PISCOPO (DJP), Friday, August 12, 2011 12:49 PM (3 hours ago)

http://www.slapupsidethehead.com/wp-content/media/2009/04/lalala-i-cant-hear-you.jpg

haha that hotlink bubble

y'all are some cynical bastards if you are hating Jay on the track about his future kid

― CLUB PISCOPO (DJP), Friday, August 12, 2011 11:44 AM (5 hours ago) Bookmark

that's seriously like the first verse in like 7 years where i feel like jay is saying some real shit that i feel

paparazzi gonna make my kid's life a mess :/

listening to this now

not great but

it's pretty silly that this is metacritic of 76 and my beautiful dark twisted fantasy is 96

yeah I like this more that MBDTF

which of these is supposed to be "dubstep"?

I finally listened last night, and def prefer to MBFFAWETF

still on my first full listen as i type, but so far i like mbdtf better

The video makes "Otis" bearable now. It's almost like the mix is better than when I first heard it.

rev very much otm

sonically both albums are similar but i find it much easier to buy into kanye's album as something that makes a lot of sense in the timeline of his career -- as a one off this album is what it is, but it serves no larger purpose imo

... so you agree with Rev that this album is better, but yet it is lesser than the worse album?

xp re: dubstep "Who Gon Stop Me" uses Flux Pavilion's "I Can't Stop"

thx!

the last half of the song moves too fast, so Jay is just behind the beat, totally off the rhythm. it sounds like all that stupid, off-center "then i swag my swag/then i bitch my swag/bitch a swaggy bitch" bullshit u like

I don't agree with this but I am giving it a pass because "then i swag my swag/then i bitch my swag/bitch a swaggy bitch" is hilarious

J0rdan, I think you misread me.

For one, I like this album more because it's not as blown out and self-important. I mean, it is blown out/self-important, of course it is, but really cuts back on the grosser indulgences.

serving no larger purpose is the best thing about this album imo

It's more listenable than MBDTF, less pompous, more beautiful less twisted "Who Gon Stop Me" and "New Day" will probably make a playlist. But to me these two have exhausted so much of my patience over the years that to give'em credit for finally making an average album again is almost wasted praise.

^^^^^

but I'm the guy who thinks about half of American Gangster is pretty good so whatever.

Also: I don't know whether to express gratitude for the lack of an "Empire State of Mind" or "Stronger" -- an obvious multiplatinum Top 40 crossover. The album doesn't sound shaped. It's like, "Here's some samples, some raps, have fun, guys."

(I guess the whole record attempts an obvious multiplatinum Top 40 crossover)

I think the whole nature of the project, it being inherently a one-off that doesn't really 'count' toward either's solo career, is its biggest strength. They're just relying on their combined starpower to sell the record, not trying very hard to make singles (I don't love "Otis" but I respect that they popped out a song like that mere weeks before the release date with a video just after). The iTunes before physical release thing should have been standard years ago but no big rap star, including either of them, would have tried it with a solo album before because there's so much fear-based emphasis on first week numbers that a staggered release schedule could hurt the initial figures, which this time around they can afford to not worry about.

less pompous

this part isn't true -- & it also isn't more listenable, either -- it's a worse pop album, and most of the songs just bleed together imo

after listening to the kanye album once i could tell you something about each song -- on this album i still have no idea what songs anyone is talking about aside from the singles

the problem w/ this album is that jay-z is a very boring album & kanye is less compelling when he's doing straight rapping, bcuz he's not really a great rapper

jay-z is a very boring rapper*

anything kanye does needs to be 100% full retard, or else it's either boring (this album) or terrible (pick one of his guest verses of the past 3 years)

yea otm it's not cohesive @ all, reminds me more of kanyes good friday project tracks than mbdtf

so far i def like 'no church in the wild' & 'otis' the most prob, also dont hate the mr hudson song, somehow

u belong in mo-seums

anything kanye does needs to be 100% full retard

no.

I don't know what that means either.

you think Jay-Z is a boring rapper? Do you mean boring rapper NOW?

anything kanye does needs to be 100% fully committed, which nothing he's done since late registration has been

he's pretty committed to saying HANH a dozen times every song