battle of the egomaniacal, pan-genre overproducers w/ albums of shimmering genius that i want to drown in '10

thanks for making this

oh great, now he wants to drown puffy and kanye

fuck you if you vote kanye

i like the kanye record probably more than every other LTTP voter, but this isn't even a remotely tough choice for me

i'm kind of worried ppl wont click on the thread title

also i voted kanye

people probably won't

well idk is that such a bad thing? i'm not gonna be sad if loannis doesn't get to defend kanye's record on another thread

this thread is about how diddy's record is better that kanye's record

idk what to say about this really

the puffy album is longer and still more consistent & on top of that, it's length and scope aren't buffered my nonsense like 6 combined minutes of vocoder piss & chris rock

still haven't bought either of these yet but i'll vote diddy because i'm pretty sure that's what i'll think

fuck you if you vote kanye

― fruit of the goon (k3vin k.), Friday, January 21, 2011 12:14 AM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark

also the guests are involved in LTTP in a completely homogeneous & sensible fashion -- diddy creates a world where a long stream of huge international superstars adds to the storyline of the album -- all the guests pop up at the right time & maybe the only one you could quibble w/ is the weird biggie cameo, but even that makes sense because of how intertwined diddy still is w/ him

otoh, on ye's album the guests can get tiring, esp in the middle part, and even something like the awesome rick ross part on "devil in a new dress" has been rightfully criticized for seeming grafted on

fuck you if you vote kanye

― fruit of the goon (k3vin k.), Friday, January 21, 2011 12:14 AM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark

― some dude, Friday, January 21, 2011 12:23 AM (2 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

fuck you if you vote kanye

― fruit of the goon (k3vin k.), Friday, January 21, 2011 12:14 AM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark

― some dude, Friday, January 21, 2011 12:23 AM (2 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

― call all destroyer, Friday, January 21, 2011 1:23 PM (53 seconds ago) Bookmark

my guess is diddy is the better swimmer.

Suggest Ban Permalink

fuck you if you vote kanye

― fruit of the goon (k3vin k.), Friday, January 21, 2011 12:14 AM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark

― some dude, Friday, January 21, 2011 12:23 AM (2 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

― call all destroyer, Friday, January 21, 2011 1:23 PM (53 seconds ago) Bookmark

― dayo, Friday, January 21, 2011 12:24 AM (15 minutes ago) Bookmark

see, now I have to vote for kanye. on general principle.

fuck you, pillbox!

fuck you, pillbox!

― call all destroyer, Friday, January 21, 2011 1:47 PM (15 seconds ago) Bookmark

fuck you, pillbox!

― call all destroyer, Friday, January 21, 2011 1:47 PM (15 seconds ago) Bookmark

― dayo, Friday, January 21, 2011 12:47 AM (36 seconds ago) Bookmark

^^ not a constructive way of getting folks to give the diddy record a proper look tbh

i just couldn't resist piling on for the sake of a gag, no ill will to pillbox

srsly guys... i'm crushed :(

contrarianism here makes me want to vote kanye

http://1hiphopucit.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/diddy-pool-party-2.jpg
http://mobile.holymoly.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/mobile_450/big-pictures_t_kanye-west-amber-rose-in-bikini-on-beach-and-by-pool-in-barcelona-19080912.jpg

those slacks look ill fitting

contrarianism here makes me want to vote kanye

― max, Friday, January 21, 2011 12:19 AM (11 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i feel u, but its really a much crappier album :(

Also trying to reverse-contraristan ILX is a mug's game.

Is there a third album that you could contraristan for over and against both of these? I can't think of one.

ariel pink lol

Pretty sure there's an implied term of Contraristan's Constitution that reputable indie rock doesn't count.

i vote dave coulier

the contraristan here would be the jazmine album?

if only swizz had released his album last year!

voted kanye because it is the better album

fuck you if you vote kanye

― fruit of the goon (k3vin k.), Friday, January 21, 2011 5:14 AM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

maybe the only one you could quibble w/ is the weird biggie cameo, but even that makes sense because of how intertwined diddy still is w/ him

i rolled my eyes slightly at the single but it makes total sense on the album; it comes after the weird gilded cage of "shades", which is where diddy and the voices in his head (cuz that's the function justin and wayne play there) seem on the verge of tipping into madness, and "angels" is the album's dark night of the soul, set in a gothic cathedral, wandering into the graveyard - and obviously, there he's haunted by the ghost of biggie - as j0rdan says one of the most important figures from his past.

i am so fucked. ouchie.

Don't like either of these, these gigantic all-star-cast blockbuster ego-trip "narrative" albums are really the last thing I want to be listening to nowadays.

Really, I love ILX. I mean who else, where else could you find something so ridiculous as a Pink Floyd vs. Joy Division poll?

― Progoths = Prog Rock Goths (Bimble Is Still More Goth Than You), Saturday, January 24, 2009 7:09 PM (1 year ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I mean I'm just so happy we didn't have to go to war over Pink Floyd. Whew. We didn't have to have the barroom brawl. Everyone is happy. Oh man. Whew.

― Progoths = Prog Rock Goths (Bimble Is Still More Goth Than You), Saturday, January 24, 2009 7:15 PM (1 year ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Ugh, this is not right. So not right.

― Someone Still Loves You Evan and Jaron (Tape Store), Saturday, January 24, 2009 9:18 PM (1 year ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

No, it is the will of ILX. We can live with this. We can. Yes we can.

― Progoths = Prog Rock Goths (Bimble Is Still More Goth Than You), Saturday, January 24, 2009 10:00 PM (1 year ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

:-(

i rolled my eyes slightly at the single but it makes total sense on the album; it comes after the weird gilded cage of "shades", which is where diddy and the voices in his head (cuz that's the function justin and wayne play there) seem on the verge of tipping into madness, and "angels" is the album's dark night of the soul, set in a gothic cathedral, wandering into the graveyard

It's shit like this that puts me off, it's like why should I care about Diddy's ostentatious introspection? It's so fucking indie. Go and party on a yacht in Miami or something!

well he does that too on the album, doesn't he. by your reasoning anything that deals in emotion is "indie"!

and it sounds like what you want out of pop is, like, ke$ha

It's more a personal thing, I am utterly incapable of identifying with these hugely rich successful people and their problems so they just seem whiny and self-indulgent to me. I don't give a shit. I don't want to watch films about the private demons of the super-rich and super-famous either unless there's a really interesting compelling personality shining through and I don't get that with either Diddy or Kanye.

It's also probably why I like the other two Dream albums much more than Love vs Money.

i listen for the music myself. but then, i'm crazy like that.

and it sounds like what you want out of pop is, like, ke$ha

Yeah but you know this full-well not to be the case. It's the self-indulgence rather than the emotions.

diddy: helping us all understand that the rich have cathedral shaped emotions too - by making music so lovely you can ignore them

diddy easily

ftr i <3 pillbox

i rolled my eyes slightly at the single but it makes total sense on the album; it comes after the weird gilded cage of "shades", which is where diddy and the voices in his head (cuz that's the function justin and wayne play there) seem on the verge of tipping into madness, and "angels" is the album's dark night of the soul, set in a gothic cathedral, wandering into the graveyard - and obviously, there he's haunted by the ghost of biggie - as j0rdan says one of the most important figures from his past.

― lex diamonds (lex pretend), Friday, January 21, 2011 3:11 AM (4 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

this is great!

I was waiting for this poll. will give Diddy a listen or three.

i only listened to the puffy album once and it had some cool sounds in it but it's clearly "not my thing." also for a "rap album" it doesn't seem to have much rapping in it. though i guess you guys are going to say that it's not really a "rap album." i'm out of my element.

why would it be a rap album instead of an r'n'b album ?

i guess because in my mind diddy is associated with rap music? this is making me feel like tuomas

i think its a rap album. it even made the goon poll

it's a rap/r&b album

^

Kanye's rapping has high highs (triple double no assist) and low lows (nnnnaaaahhh put the pussy snuffleupagus). Diddy never makes me go fuck yeah, but he never makes me groan either.

It's like choosing a mechanic that makes your car run better than ever but fucks up yr air conditioning vs someone who just makes it run

i have a feeling i'll end up liking last train to paris better, but since i haven't heard it yet, voted kanye (which is overpraised but still a damn good album)

and it sounds like what you want out of pop is, like, ke$ha

Animal/Cannibal >>>>> MBDTF

It's like choosing a mechanic that makes your car run better than ever but fucks up yr air conditioning vs someone who just makes it run

― Whiney G. Weingarten, Friday, January 21, 2011 10:10 AM (14 minutes ago)

doing this ignores the production and the hooks, which are much much stronger on the diddy album. the rapping is a push at best, yeah

the production and the hooks on the kanye album murk the diddy album

('Ye was my #3 of the year, Diddy was my #13)

It's more a personal thing, I am utterly incapable of identifying with these hugely rich successful people and their problems so they just seem whiny and self-indulgent to me. I don't give a shit. I don't want to watch films about the private demons of the super-rich and super-famous either unless there's a really interesting compelling personality shining through and I don't get that with either Diddy or Kanye.

It's also probably why I like the other two Dream albums much more than Love vs Money.

― Matt DC, Friday, January 21, 2011 6:06 AM (3 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

ha i kind of love this album in the sense that you can be impressed by, like, the pyramids, despite them being constructed by slaves & created as tombs for the superrich ... just bcuz the life is total alien doesnt mean they didnt create something of pure beauty

i think its a rap album. it even made the goon poll

― Whiney G. Weingarten, Friday, January 21, 2011 8:33 AM (56 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

yeah but i def didnt include it in my 'goon poll' ballot tho it made my top ten for pnj so

its not like we all decided it was a 'great rap album' or something

it def codes as sophisto-R&B to me

xxpost,

good post

thnx boo

what are Diddy's chances in this (and also on ilm's end of the year list) considering how poorly he did on the P&J list?

he'll fare a lot better here than p&j for sure

0 vs kanye
good vs the field

i have a feeling i'll end up liking last train to paris better, but since i haven't heard it yet, voted kanye (which is overpraised but still a damn good album)

― ilxor, Friday, January 21, 2011 11:11 PM (16 minutes ago) Bookmark

this is sound reasoning, good clutch move considering the poll ends in a month

the production and the hooks on the kanye album murk the diddy album

so so rong

i still get the sense that rap has 'crossed over' for rock-centric listeners much more than r&b has, which is why i suspect the diddy album wouldn't have been as huge critically as the kanye even if the tables had been turned on their exposure

the production on LTTP is so packed with ideas that enhance the songs and magnify what they're trying to convey - the production on MBDTF is badly mastered hollow bluster that either retreads ideas kanye's already done better or, like, dumps an orchestra or 3-minute vocoder solo in for no reason

the Diddy album isn't very "oh pity the superstar" -- some of that's that a lot of the emoting is coming from Dirty Money and those parts are beautiful and involving

i still get the sense that rap has 'crossed over' for rock-centric listeners much more than r&b has

let's be real, r&b barely exists for most rock-centric listeners (and most critics, sadlym are rock-centric listeners). they'll all agree it's equal in theory but in practice even getting them to hear r&b albums is some blood/stone ish.

it's so weird to see people even here be all "huh? whuh?" about the idea of an album being both rap and r&b. like, did you not notice how much they've intertwined for NEARLY TWO DECADES now?

and that Diddy was the one initiating a lot of the intertwining early on

the Diddy album isn't very "oh pity the superstar"

yeah this is something i mentioned in my review - there really isn't much self-pity there. it's emotional and often sad and strange, but that's not the same as self-pity - not once does he whine like kanye does.

the Diddy album isn't very "oh pity the superstar" -- some of that's that a lot of the emoting is coming from Dirty Money and those parts are beautiful and involving

― gosamosapodin simgibmelreel (some dude), Friday, January 21, 2011 9:53 AM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

there is definitely some 'universal'-ness to diddy's album that doesnt exist in kanye's earnest personal & kanye-centric record

no sign of Diddy on Xgau's list thought. and he is always on the lookout for a great r&b album.

I bet if you asked most people on the street who P Diddy was they'd answer "a rapper", so you'd expect people to mentally categorise it as a hip-hop album without having heard it. Also in recent decades hip-hop has probably impacted more on r&b than vice-versa.

in in recent DECADES sure but in the past 3-4 years rap has been following R&B's lead waaaay more than vice versa

not that anyone who still calls him P Diddy would have noticed

Yeah that's true, but the idea that people would pick up a Diddy record expecting hip-hop is not that weird.

if you asked most people on the street who any famous black guy was they'd say 'a rapper'

he still goes under p diddy in the uk, cuz some british person somewhere was already going under diddy

lol al

^^^truth bomb xxp

@ kev

it's the idea that someone would pick up a hip-hop record and be surprised at the presence of r&b that's weird to me.

kev otm, cf rich j's crusade on this note

the biggest hit off of Diddy's 2006 album had no rapping

http://fourfour.typepad.com/fourfour/2009/11/if-hes-black-he-must-rap.html

ha didn't know he was still P Diddy in the UK! fascinating. is this record billed as P Diddy-Dirty Money?

it really is totally weird and racist that people are calling this a "rap album" just because he has tons of successful singles as a rapper and there's rapping on practically every track on the album.

tbh the marketing of the album has been pretty inconsistent about whether this is a Diddy album or an album by a group that consists of Diddy and 2 R&B singers

xp no, i guess the unwieldy addition of -dirty money circumvents the copyright thing

He's one of the most famous people in the world, of course he's going to overshadow the other guys.

the production on MBDTF is badly mastered hollow bluster that either retreads ideas kanye's already done better or, like, dumps an orchestra or 3-minute vocoder solo in for no reason

I don't think you know what mastering is

guys it doesn't matter what genre this album is

when i interviewed him he was really adamant that dirty money was a trio, and that dawn and kalenna were his equals in it. it's true in some ways but he didn't really back it up in press shots etc (though on the other hand, the press didn't show much interest in the girls). and ultimately the album is his story.

^xxpost thats always the best zing because like NO ONE knows what it means really

I don't think you know what mastering is

i'm going by a) what a bunch of electronic producers i know have said about it, b) my own ears

I gotta agree about the bad mastering on Kanye stuff - I've got a pretty expensive headphone setup and it always sounds like there are these just bands of empty frequencies in his songs

I can't listen to 'the good life' anymore because it sounds so hollow in places when it should be filled wall to wall

I'm listening to all of the lights right now and kanye sounds like he's on the moon, really distant and tinny. whereas "ass on the floor" just spills out into all the frequencies from the first second and doesn't let up

for the matter of ending this discussion, fwiw, i dont evaluate this *as a rap album,* like its not competing w/ the jacka & e-40 in my mindgarden, it's created its own artistic space, so i dont really think of it 'pushing hip hop forward' or something -- its a tangent of rap, it uses rap as a tool to create an overarching feel but isnt really worried about making rap-qua-rap imo

what could really compete with the jacka

are you done

yeah...i put it on my goon poll ballot just because but i would've been fine with it being disqualified (xpost)

haha yeah, i'm done.

i def agree with you, deej. I like that Kanye and Diddy are taking rap to this new, weird, indescribable place and I hope more performers are up to the challenge

as much as i love the Diddy album i don't really feel like it's any more of a UNIQUE PAN-GENRE FUSION than like the fucking Drake album or whatever. and i still have no idea what people think is all that new or indescribable about the Kanye album.

it def feels like the rap version of the 70s prog-rock boom, and I hope there's more on the way. Diddy and Kanye are like the King Crimson and Genesis of this shit. Odd Future/Lil B are clearly Zappa and Beefheart. Kid Cudi is Kansas.

Whiney G. Weingarten is Geir Hongro.

wtf whiney

OH NOES ANALOGIES!

if there's any hip-hop engaging with 70's art-rock it's Dalek as we both know (need to get that Faust collab...)

more like "oh noes 'prog-rap' again"

when is Jay-Z's prog album coming out? they should all have a tour together.

ah but if we're talking analogy, then Kanye is more ELP than KC :P

(and El-P is...oh whatever)

Emerson, Drake & Palmer

didn't know Genesis and Kansas hung out all the time and made really similar music

i'm not saying these album are engaging with it at all (besides Kanye's KC samples obv), I'm just saying it feels similar w/r/t rap as prog did to rock in the 70s

i thought they were like the Flaming Lips and the Chemical Brothers

the very best prog came out of the desire to musically innovate and challenge. this stuff seems to come out of 'ok so how do I spend all this money on music - I know, vast and otiose, full of import but still populist shit that questions its own value while simultaneously affirming it'

so basically, Pink Floyd. who weren't prog.

roger waters -> noel gallagher (Be Here Now is a work of similar scope to MBDTF) -> kanye

you know some dude, your and deej's inability to deal with rap on any level besides "this comes from a tradition of RAP and i refuse to look at any other way, and anyone else who does is a herb/lame/weirdo/OMGROCKCRITIC" is super-insufferable and disingenuous and weaksauce.

The Pink Floyd metaphor is really apt, LJ; but there's no reason to temper it with a "this isn't real prog" non-argument

Kanye makes way better beats that Roger Waters and "Everybody knows I'm a motherfucking monster" is a stronger statement than anything on The Wall

Pink Floyd were soft jazz-rock with art-rock trappings, quite hard to define except 'big and important', a genre which Kanye belongs to

I gotta agree about the bad mastering on Kanye stuff - I've got a pretty expensive headphone setup and it always sounds like there are these just bands of empty frequencies in his songs

#humblebrag

ok, just shut the fuck up, LJ

you know some dude, your and deej's inability to deal with rap on any level besides "this comes from a tradition of RAP and i refuse to look at any other way, and anyone else who does is a herb/lame/weirdo/OMGROCKCRITIC" is super-insufferable and disingenuous and weaksauce.

― Whiney G. Weingarten, Friday, January 21, 2011 11:27 AM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i was doing iffy Ramones and Superchunk analogies on The-Dream thread the other day, i'm more of a hypocrite making fun of you itt than a rock-averse snob or anything

#campaignforrealprog

"progressive rock" is straight up the 15th and 16th words in the Pink Floyd wikipedia entry. this is no occasion for your hair-splitting tomfoolery, dogg

You're like a 14 year old interrupting with "Metallica's not real metal, which is like 1000000% not the point of any of this"

yeah, it's time for OUR hair-splitting tomfoolery! wait your turn!

#humblebrag

― one pretty obvious guy in the obvious (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Saturday, January 22, 2011 12:29 AM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark

if youre a serious music fan and you dont have at least some dough invested in your listening setup then i just dont knoww what to say

Love both but voted Kanye, just think its a better album, if you don't like it smd

best thing about ilx right now is LJ losing his shit over dalek and kate bush so genuinely, i love it

I wanna hear rap's Van der Graaf Generator. It's probably one of those anticon assholes, though.

if anything I'm all for splitting the definitions of 'progressive rock' further and further down until each band practically has its own genre classification - you just can't file VdGG alongside Genesis by any yardstick, no way

so while Pink Floyd may have had 'progressive' tendencies, in their most successful period their songs were pretty big and dumb* - they didn't have the questing, dynamic-shift narrative flexibility of the classic prog bands

*dumb as in, could be followed with nary a raised eyebrow - theirs was a genius of popularity

anyhow, I listened to MBDTF all the way thru and nothing really surprised me at all, apart from the beat on Monster - it all seems to fit together as part of a Big Statement where nothing new is revealed but plenty arrives as planned - in that regard it is a success

i cant even read your posts

pink floyd was psych IMO no prog

if Immortal Technique finds a really good + bonkers producer he'd probably be the closest rap has to VdGG :D

use urbandictionary deej

yeah and helg otm, ty

oh my god, Drake and Poison Clan and Spoonie Gee are nothing alike but they're still all "rap," just shove it up your ass, LJ

I wouldn't say B.o.B has anything remotely close to the "questing, dynamic-shift narrative flexibility" of Kool G Rap, but he's still a rapper, ffs

Rush is the one that's even harder to place on the prog continuum

This is honestly an improvement on "is it racist to call Diddy a rapper?"

pink floyd was psych IMO no prog

Pink Floyd started out as psych, yes, but then they got good.

it's unhelpful to think of them all by the same token, though, as you yourself have said in criticisms of deej and some dude! yes, they all use rap. the monkees and emperor use sung vocals (sometimes)! rap is a broad church and you gotta either break it up or accept that the term means barely jack shit

underrated bert post

yeah, LJ, but i was having an argument where I compare the thrust of wide movements, you're the dipshit who started bringing semantics into it

michael nesmith and the first national black metal band

You're personal beef with the word "prog" has nothing to do with what we're talking about.

I just want you to be precise when bandying around great big analogies, Whiney. I want you to nail it, not half-ass a comparison and then claim to have discovered a repeating history.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CdJTfGiRCI

Yes, I know "indie" is CRAZY WORD with EVOLVING SENSIBILITIES and CHANGING DEFINITIONS. But sometimes you have to have suspend an obsession with scene minutae if you want to have a conversation with other adults and not come off as an aspie freak

l0u1s jagg3r knows more about rap than you.

and we all know more about l0u1s jagg3r than any rapper, unfortunately

word, whiney's all like "NWA blah blah blah" and louis is all like "yo dude toddy tee yo yo yo"

l0u1s jagg3r knows more about rap making himself the center of threads than you

l0u1s jagg3r knows more about rap than you.

― Matt DC, Friday, January 21, 2011 11:50 AM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Dude really puts the Dyson in Michael Eric Dyson

Anyway, I'm gonna reiterate that prog basically sprung up as the culmination of 'oh wow, anything is now possible!' and the rapid rise of recorded sound - people wanted to push it as far as it would go, and combine every previous style into a new thing. What Kanye is doing is more what peak-era Floyd or Zeppelin did, which was to create enormous castles of pop, not in the service of seeing what's possible but in the service of Answering the Big Questions About Why We Listen To Music - big, dumb and self-obsessed. What is truly revolutionary about MBDTF except its sense of import? That's why I make a Be Here Now comparison. They're very similar albums in many ways.

god this isn't about me you dicks, plus you know very little about me save for a few boring notorieties lol exactly xp

trying to think of an amboy dukes joke...pls stand by

Whiney knows more about rap than anyone I've met IRL probably and he still makes a comparison between Kanye West and 'The Gates Of Delirium' I mean dude

lol what is happening in this thread...is it whiney and deej realizing that they really have a lot in common, and stop fighting to team up against the greater enemy - lj? please?

Yeezy reupholstered my Debussy

people make threads with lj posts about lj more than he does imo

I totally think of Oasis when I spin east coast rap

? LJ prolly hate oasis and never talk abt them iirc

Oasis are more like Dre and Snoop. East Coast rap is closer to My Bloody Valentine or Swervedriver.

please. stop.

Outkast are totally the Blur to Kanye's Oasis - got there first, way better, solo projects not bad either, doesn't matter that they got outlasted

hey I like analogies now

i have created a monster

Xxxpost he compared the kanye album to Be Here Now.

STOP IT. NOW.

Guess I gotta listen to the Diddy album now, do my penance to this thread

may even end up liking it. someone wanna give odds on that?

lock thread before someone compares cam'ron to kevin rowland...though...come to think....

clipse = ween?

why bother with jazz when you could listen to eminem, the duke ellington of hiphop

― -+-+-+-++, Friday, April 14, 2006 8:59 AM (4 years ago) Bookmark

Clipse=folk implosion

this thread is about how diddy's record is better that kanye's record

― fruit of the goon (k3vin k.), Friday, January 21, 2011 12:19 AM (11 hours ago)

I for one feel like the 5,000 ILM posts discussing these two albums have been insufficient, so let's knock this derail off the head.

:)

Guess I gotta listen to the Diddy album now, do my penance to this thread

may even end up liking it. someone wanna give odds on that?

― kate bush fan (acoleuthic), Friday, January 21, 2011 5:09 PM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i have no idea whether you will, but you should do it

Derail is cool BUT NOT THIS FUCKING DERAIL. NO. NO. NO.

back on track:

Is Rick Ross the only dude to be on both albums?

yes, altho minaj was on the official "hello good morning" remix

I have to pick between two albums by two rich black males whose albums are basically about them whining on how they won't let go of their delusional male privelge for a chance of true love. The albums are like twins who were separated from birth. I wish their was a tie option.

^^^valuable comments

thing is 'love' is one of those things everyone has a delusional privilege about

Swizz on both albums too

also Jay if you count ghostwriting on the Diddy

i think the real star of both albums is LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE

Tbh, I don't really see LTTP as being dependent on a narrative of Diddy's fame and wealth at all. Most mentions of it are pretty much in passing, and he doesn't really dwell on it like Kanye does. It's just kind of background noise to the love/redemption stories, whereas Kanye very much foregrounds it.

yeah i may be just enjoying the sound of the album too much to care but i've never noticed anything going on in the album that makes me give a second thought to the album's supposed narrative or Diddy's emotional state. actually, once or twice it did make me wonder if he's STILL pining for J.Lo

And I don't think it's fair to call the album whiny either. Puff for the whole album sounds like he's tying to work through his shit, where Kanye wants to impress you with his problems more than deal with them. Diddy couldn't care less about that.

the lyrics on lttp are pretty straightforward heartbreak stuff; if u object to them u object to....love songs?

I was just joking in my assessment. I love both albums equally even though I eye roll in Diddy's and Kanye's attempts at sincerity.

rev otm

i'm kind of worried ppl wont click on the thread title

― Whiney G. Weingarten, Friday, January 21, 2011 12:16 AM (23 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

def avoided it til now. then at first thought the poll was who'd id rather see you drown

I would drown Diddy. Kanye still has a glimmer of hope with therapy.

Diddy seems pretty well-adjusted imo, i think he's kind of figured out how to live.

http://wtfoodge.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/diddywtfisthis-thumb.jpg

http://i666.photobucket.com/albums/vv26/ufckingpics/diddyonajetski.jpg

We should invite Diddy to 77.

Puff for the whole album sounds like he's tying to work through his shit, where Kanye wants to impress you with his problems more than deal with them.

yes, v otm.

good post

Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

haha awesome

if only whiney were here to see this

<3 u ilm

Kind of glad of these results especially after seeing that crappy "All Of The Lights" video. Kanye is actually irking me now after years of toleration. I guess we all have our limits.

oh god i forgot this was the thread with the interminable whiney/lj argument about prog, h8 u ilm

Love is a motherfuck lex. haha