Rap Vs. Metal

Voted SB

fair enough

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zthUBcCMiFA

Nakh otm

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_l7k9ggh1wgQ/Sy6CTKoHPSI/AAAAAAAAAns/zVpTbn1keDc/s400/Soundtrack+-+Judgment+Night+-+front.jpg

damn that's quite a mix

p. important in my upbringing tbh ^^^

also, there's like nothing on earth better than rap music, so

mudhoney & sir mix-a-lot

two groups I never thought would be lumped together as such but I like it!

the seattle early 90s connection

should have been Teenage Fanclub w/ Boo-Yaa T.R.I.B.E. tho

p much the best song on the record is Mudhoney/Mix because the bands clearly like each other, whereas a lot of the others were kind of cobbled-together

"I wanna put you in the mud... honey"

hold up - these are actual collaborations as opposed to just a random assortment of groups that appear on a soundtrack? omg

there's like nothing on earth better than rap music metal, so

music died after 1982

http://oi53.tinypic.com/29f2pe1.jpg

hold up - these are actual collaborations as opposed to just a random assortment of groups that appear on a soundtrack?

:) (I can't even tell you how many times I've watched that clip over the last week just for that damn puppet)

hell yeah judgement night soundtrack!

wgw very mean to ppl who took too much acid when they were young imo

metal-rap not an option, abstaining

Now can I get an encore, do you want more
Cookin raw with the Brooklyn boy
So for one last time I need y'all to roar

voted 'rap'

Holy Diver
I'm a survivor
Feelin' like DeNiro in Taxi Driver
With Jodie Foster
And Harvey Keitel
Looks like I'm walking through a living hell

voted 'rap'

you guys thought you had D-40 pegged as some metal stan but he shook you up with a different look

lol

So spark that out
And I'll get lifted
Feelin' the effects
Of what my spliff did
'Cause I'm gifted
I read Sun Tzu
I brought a gun too
So you'll never come to

i think it's "spark that L"

especially because it rhymes with "hell" and is a word that means "marijuana cigarette" and makes sense as a sentence

do you ever take a look at yourself?

since when does "L" mean marijuana cigarette?

since before you gave up the shins and started liking rap

lol

judgement night soundtrack was great.

I assume this thread was started to move what deej/D-40 was saying on the poll thread to here. I don't think we should be having a metal vs rap fight as one of those is not better than the other, but i am interested in what deej says about why rap & metal shouldn't be comparable and why he dismisses metal as more of a niche genre just because it doesn't crack the top 10 singles chart or what have you.
but just for once can we have a civil thread on it guys?

I dunno,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_number-one_albums_of_2010_%28U.S.%29

Six rap albums hit #1 in 2010:
Ludacris, B.o.B, Drake, Eminem, Lil Wayne, Kanye

Four metal hit #1 in 2010:
Godsmack, Linkin Park, Avenged Sevenfold, Disturbed

\o_o/

You could argue, I think, that Hip Hop has changed the soundscape of popular music in much deeper, wider, more lasting ways than Metal has. Don't think that would be a case for saying one was better than the other tho.

i listen to way more rap these days but i'm gonna abstain anyway because it's fucking metal, dammit

fair point jim, but you grew up in the midlands where metal started, did it have an impact there?

bye fun thread

Dude, when Lady Gaga or Rihanna where metal and spikes and S&M gear in their shows, where do you think that came from?

Adam and Eve Online?

I'm not saying metal had a bigger impact in the UK than rap, but I think it is fair to say that raps impact on the UK is a lot smaller than it had in the USA?

x-post - lol

voted 'rap'

― D-40, Tuesday, March 22, 2011 8:24 AM (1 hour ago) Bookmark

sorry enbb but i do think deej has an interesting take and i would like to engage with him here rather than doing it on the hip hop poll/other threads where it seems to come up a lot,better to have it all on here and if it comes up again it can be pointed to this thread.

I could go either way here honestly.

today it is metal.

but I think it is fair to say that raps impact on the UK is a lot smaller than it had in the USA?

didn't you see about a boy, mystikal changed that kid's lyfe

Godsmack, Disturbed and Linkin PArk are barely metal.. lol.. and A7X are terrible.. At least with Lil Wayne, Eminem and Kanye, you have game changers..
MAinstream Metal, or at least Metal that sells records here in the states, usually doesn't reflect the true heart of metal proper..
But you can't pin one against the other.. appels in oranges. Each genre has had their peaks at different times in different ways.

Dude, when Lady Gaga or Rihanna where metal and spikes and S&M gear in their shows, where do you think that came from?

― maher shalal smash paz (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, March 22, 2011 4:53 PM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Adam and Eve Online?

― ancient, but very sexy (DJP), Tuesday, March 22, 2011 4:54 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

lol

You could argue, I think, that Hip Hop has changed the soundscape of popular music in much deeper, wider, more lasting ways than Metal has. Don't think that would be a case for saying one was better than the other tho.

But who was sampling who in the early 80s... lol

You could argue, I think, that Hip Hop has changed the soundscape of popular music in much deeper, wider, more lasting ways than Metal has

lol waht no way. they are both massive influences on the form of popular music

pop rap:underground rap::pop metal:true metal

Sean otm

if it wasn't jim who said that i may have took it that he meant metal changed things for the worse while hip hop did for the better, but it was jim, and he loves some metal.

I don't know who's being hilarious here but seriously if you think Metal has influenced popular music a tenth as much as Hip Hop has then you are nuts.

Metal is Metal, it keeps to itself and the only exceptions I can think of are Eddie VH on "Beat It" and Rihanna wearing studs apparently. Whereas since the 80s Hip Hop has affected the production techniques and musical form of enormous fucking swathes of Pop, not least of which is R and B itself.

there's been no metal vs hip hop wars like there was way back with punk vs metal has there? I know an awful lot of people (especially americans) who really love both. The metalheads hatred of nu-metal is nothing to do with hating rap, it's to do with the fact that most nu-metal was shit (and some of it barely even had rap in it), was there any great raps in nu-metal? It's sure not something i've ever seen anyone write about.

Jim, metal and hip hop have had a huge impact on the underground too (where it all sprang from obviously, but there's still massive underground movements ,and in metals case about 3 million sub-genres,some of whom that are pretty massive and have followers who only listen to that sub-genre)

bye fun thread

― ENBB, Tuesday, March 22, 2011 4:53 PM (13 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

otm

punk likes to co opt other aesthetics. tons of punks like hip hop now & cheer whenever an oddfuture type group shows up & interpolates punk values thru a h-h lens

metal is just metal

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_metal_subgenres

OTOH D-40's about to weigh in on the subject of music he knows nothing about so the thread could get trainwrecky fun if we hang out

Godsmack, Disturbed and Linkin PArk are barely metal.. lol.. and A7X are terrible..

and Drake, BoB and new Ludacris are barely rap

deej's important distinction is what punks think of it \o_o/

I believe this track could settle the question for good:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZ0CB7d6UdQ

I don't see how anyone can claim metal has had little to no influence on current music given that practically every current guitar band out on the scene today cops metal tropes from guitar solos to distortion filters; it might be more accurate to say that, since metal is older, its epicenter of change happened earlier.

^this seems right

plus punk has been all about rap from like the beginning if I'm not mistaken...?

xp well you have to admit that his punk cred is unimpeachable

p.s. D-40 this is just good-natured ribbing so don't get all agg it's cool

DJP otm. like ask Coldplay and the Fray how many Metallica albums they had growing up

there were metal albums way before punk albums tbh

NWOBHM >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> grime

xxpost

There probably is another conversation I'd want to have less than that ever in my life but I'm struggling to come up with it

I don't see how anyone can claim metal has had little to no influence on current music given that practically every current guitar band out on the scene today cops metal tropes from guitar solos to distortion filters; it might be more accurate to say that, since metal is older, its epicenter of change happened earlier.

OTFM thx Dan, was trying to think of how to put this myself

dude you gotta chill on your hatred of grime

it's like I keep expecting you to pop into the politics thread and say "THIS IS FUCKING WILEY'S FAULT, ALL OF IT"

i don't really hate grime

Nah Grime is a major force in Britishes and Worlds music and should be combatted with as much intensity as possible

black metal features shrieking vocalist, fast-paced guitars, and blistering drum fills, while speed metal features shrieking vocalists, fast-paced guitars, and blistering drum fills, which in turn stands in clear contrast to death metal that showcases shrieking vocalists, fast-paced guitars, and blistering drum fills

Can't move round here for people talking about Grime this and Grime that, had to tell my mum to shut up about it the other night.

reggae is where it's at

plus punk has been all about rap from like the beginning if I'm not mistaken...?

you are mistaken, can't tell you how many punks I heard spewing quasi-racist freedom rock type arguments against rap back in the day

Edward III lookin p. fuckin stupid right now. No one correct him.

Seriously, AG, I know its tempting, but dont tell him the five or six ways he's totally fucken wrong

i wasn't going to

death metal vocalists definitely do not shriek.

I genuinely just wanted to engage with deej and hear what he had to say on it as he likes to bring this subject a lot but unfortunately that doesn't make a fun thread for anyone else.

joeks bro

death metal vocalists definitely do not shriek.

― i have a hot bagel waiting for me in my bed so ill say this: (kkvgz), Tuesday, March 22, 2011 1:20 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

NO ONE CORRECT HIM OR HELP HIM

why are we begging for clusterfucks? what kind of net benefit do we imagine we will take from them?

whiney lookin p. fuckin stupid right now

edward i found your joke quite funny actually fwiw

oh, i see, hahah, nm

good look e3

at the end of today everybody kicks everybody else's ass

i want more deej

why are we begging for clusterfucks? what kind of net benefit do we imagine we will take from them?

― Destroy A. Monsters (Drugs A. Money),

I'm not

e3: doesn't matter since you were joking, but I was more referring to folx like Lydon and Byrne: I got the impression that they were very supportive of rap at the outset, and probably saw it as not much different than the stuff they were doing in 1980...

not sure what Whiney was talking about? prolley looking p stupid right now; nobody correct me

i want more clusterfucks. someone tell aerosmith they're turning this thread into a book

actually whiney was talking about my metal post but he's too fuckin stupid to use xpost

my punk/rap post was serious tho

yeah there may be a point where those guys don't count as punk anymore

i want more clusterfucks. someone tell aerosmith they're turning this thread into a book

aren't you too old to be wanting more clusterfucks?

^^^ lame attempt at increasing likelihood of clusterfuck

I had a friend who used to say (this was mid 80s) "if I wear a DKs pin nobody cares but if I wear an LL cool J I am guaranteed a ton of shit"

punks were not some monolithic organization for or against rap but there were plenty who didn't get it and/or actively hated on it ime

xp what your question or turning the thread into a book...?

*turns thread into book*

OH SHIT HERE WE GO

man asking me to clarify my jokes makes me cry giant tears. I know how to say "xp" if I mean it dude xp

*adds new footnote w/r/t "xp controversy" to book of this thread*

sorry xp

idg what was crazy abt my post

ime metal dudes much more territorial than punk dudes these days. punk is fuckin shit up, metal was abt doin your own thing. dan's post abt metal being earlier than rap otm also

lol this is an actual thread you're making legit posts in

punk more outward facing/confrontational/invested in coopting other cultural ideas & being like 'bro u could totally make this but, like, diy'

lol this is an actual thread you're making legit posts in

― blingee cummings (J0rdan S.), Tuesday, March 22, 2011 6:05 PM (31 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

so was djp & others \oO/

this is an argument about punk v rap, not punk v metal

METAL V RAP, ffs

how many lattes did you have today dude

LOL

i want to hear more of deejs insight on punk that he learned from watching that one episode of vh1s history of rock so if the rest of you could just quiet down already

oh considering that 32 minutes passed there i guess you did, lol at me

the booyaa tribe FNM song on judgement night is the pinacle of something, although i am never quite sure what that something is, but i like it

also we need a metal vs techno poll thread so we can talk about the ludicrous spawn soundtrack plz

Lester Bangs' rotting corpse to thre...oh wait!

zp

i want to hear more of deejs insight on punk that he learned from watching that one episode of vh1s history of rock so if the rest of you could just quiet down already

― broke my o_O face o_O (jjjusten), Tuesday, 22 March 2011 18:41 (27 minutes ago) Permalink

hey man,

i was obv speaking in huge overarching generalities, but i do want you to know that i think you're a terrible poster & mod & this is exemplified by this lazy baiting

hahaha awesome

'dont be dick, except when you can'

i do appreciate yet another thread where aerosmith assumes im a total moron by completely misreading me

like, dudes, im not an idiot. i dont think theres some essential true punk or something. im obv talking about the giant, one-dimensional representatives of genre as perpetuated by vh1 shows bcuz in a thread like this theres really nothing else to talk abt

"lazy baiting"

sounds dirty

dude you are so weird

like honestly theres no reason not to lighten up on all of this - its just so bizarre, no ones trying to assassinate your character

Wait - deej is D-40 now? Is that as in W?

deej, why are you talking about punk at all?

id have zinged anybody with that same line tbh, its very much not pointed at u in specific, it was just such a hilariously trite "lipstick traces" book jacket blurb thing to say that i couldnt pass it up

Wait - deej is D-40 now? Is that as in W?

uh

http://janedark.com/e40.jpg

like if i showed up on this thread and was all "well you see the thing is that hip hop was something that gave voices to people that didnt otherwise have a voice in popular music" *strokes chin thoughtfully* i kinda hope peeps would clown me too

lol it is seriously impossible to misread "metal is just metal" - it means "I literally have no idea what I'm talking about"

Man, I realized that and was just fucking around.

you have to wait for him to come back and give six to seven posts on the meaning of "just"

like if i showed up on this thread and was all "well you see the thing is that hip hop was something that gave voices to people that didnt otherwise have a voice in popular music" *strokes chin thoughtfully* i kinda hope peeps would clown me too

― broke my o_O face o_O (jjjusten), Tuesday, March 22, 2011 7:20 PM (25 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

except i was speaking in broad strokes to fit in w ridiculous thread concept, so i misread your tone when u started clowning instead of like playing along i suppose

lol sorry k

for my part, any excuse to post an E-40 photo

and finally the thread comes into its own

all this punk vs. metal vs. rap was solved by late period black flag i think

why is this thread concept ridiculous?

fwiw the best-metal-tracks-of-all-time poll worked out fine (even if I didn't vote in it lol) and the number 1 winner was definitely unexpected and not really even all that canonical in a VH1 way, I don't understand why you don't think the hip-hop poll can work equally as well. these are all just broad topics to stimulate conversation anyway.

i still have no idea why deej just started talking about punk for no reason

AG brought it up:

there's been no metal vs hip hop wars like there was way back with punk vs metal has there?

and tbf I think this is largely true, cuz hip hop fucked with metal from almost day 1. they were never oppositional, really.

oh, AG's dumb. It's because in the 80s, punk kids and metal kids were basically two people coming up in genres that essentially came into strong periods around the same time. I'm sure if there was some genre running counter to the hip-hop revolution around 1987 to 1991 (lol madchester), there'd be genre wars too. But lol at deej's explanation

metal's older than punk dude

metal dates back to '69

ag brought up punk so i started ~reflecting~ on how the relationship w/ hip hop & metal was diff than hip hop & punk, rap & metal seemed more like collaborators all the way thru limp bizkit/dj premier, where punks just entered hip hop entirely & became 1, like sage francis' fanbase is all these punk & hardcore dudes iirc

whats 'lol' about my explanation whiney

they were never oppositional, really.

there was a little bit of blowback in the 80s from the rap side

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vg_Ksggwm6k

and a little from the rock side

http://www.imosh.com/NOVELTY/images/A1688%20RAP%20SUCKS%20TEE.jpg

but i mean the only reason rap existed in the suburbs was because Rubin pitched Run-DMC/Beasties/LL as essentially rock bands with a new look and sound. Crossover was WAY bigger than warring

Uh, i know Drugs, I'm not a complete fucking idiot

I'm saying the rise of hardcore and the rise of thrash were around the same time

metal vs. punk dates back to the whole mods v. rockers thing way back in England in the late 60s

metal vs. rap dates back to a handful of deej's posts last year

i mean, deej, if you wanted to make the punk point, you'd be better off talking about, like, the Blondie dudes playing on the Wild Style soundtrack, not the fact that Sage Francis fans wear hoodies

punks just entered hip hop entirely & became 1, like sage francis' fanbase is all these punk & hardcore dudes iirc

you didn't actually just say this

please confirm/deny that you said that so that when you start saying people misunderstood you I can point to it

don't you guys remember "entering hip hop from the rear" by the feederz

Metal vs rap never got as big as it could have because half the rap kids were former metallers who realized that listening to rap would allow the to get away with dropping n-bombs under the guise of quoting lyrics.

</metalpoisonedforeverbyshittyhometown>

:(

at least we got you to enjoy an Iron Maiden album I guess

i mean, deej, if you wanted to make the punk point, you'd be better off talking about, like, the Blondie dudes playing on the Wild Style soundtrack, not the fact that Sage Francis fans wear hoodies

― maher shalal smash paz (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, March 22, 2011 7:33 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

thats an example too. idk it seems like, as a generalization, its true that punks moved into the rap world, where metal just collaborated or got aesthetic ideas from rap

i dont give enough of a shit to vet all this but it seems more or less true

uh rap got plenty of ideas from metal too tbh

if you can call samples "ideas"

slow down there cowboy

at least we got you to enjoy an Iron Maiden album I guess

I've liked Powerslave since 1986! jjj had me all up on Anthrax at the time as well.

that punks moved into the rap world

can i get some actual examples of this that aren't "collaborations or getting aesthetic ideas"

i dont give enough of a shit to vet all this but it seems more or less true

t/f you have a tattoo that says this

I mean it's like dude I don't want to bait or argue w/you but you make these assertions that are similar to "the Franco-Prussian War took place in the Bahamas" and then say "not really gonna look it up, besides people keep taking me out of context"

idk why everyones intent on telling me im wrong, im just spitballing here not writing a thesis, and there are elements to what im saying that are obv true ... rap metal was never considered part of the rap world, but rap artists have totally incorporated aesthetic ideas from punk, diy ish, methods of distribution, etc

can i get some actual examples of this that aren't "collaborations or getting aesthetic ideas"

― maher shalal smash paz (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, March 22, 2011 7:39 PM (40 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

odd future

epitaph records signee sage francis

btw I am not 100% sure there ever was a Franco-Prussian war so in case there wasn't my bad

see i just classified those dudes as guys that dug classic rock so i got to keep listening to all the metal i wanted! xpost to djp

Faith No More

can i get some actual examples of this that aren't "collaborations or getting aesthetic ideas"

um the Beastie Boys? Blondie?

Esham

tbf The Franco-Prussian War did take place in Turks and Caicos

I've liked Powerslave since 1986! jjj had me all up on Anthrax at the time as well.

― ancient, but very sexy (DJP), Tuesday, March 22, 2011 3:39 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

How did you feel about the n-bomb drop in Keep It In the Family? Joey Belladonna sounded pretty uncomfortable singing it.

german success in franco-prussian war largely due to superior sunscreen and flipflops iirc

one obv possible exception to what im talking abt would be horrorcore ... ive never heard interviews w/ like brotha lynch hung or w/e about what his inspirations were. or early 3-6 for that matter. would be interesting to know

Horrorcore

tbf The Franco-Prussian War did take place in Turks and Caicos

my favorite war because it had blue drinks and conga lines

was just gonna say Three 6

if metal imagery etc inspired them xxxp

yah but deej i think you say that because you dont know much about metal - ie the fact that kinda all extreme metal was born out of tape-trading culture and equiv DIY stuff - like i think that you see all metal through a weird lens xp to way back there

Metal imagery inspired Public Enemy. Hank was working at a record store and liked the way Megadeth/Iron Maiden had the same dude on every cover. Thats why the PE logo shows up the way it does on Black Planet

How did you feel about the n-bomb drop in Keep It In the Family? Joey Belladonna sounded pretty uncomfortable singing it.

okay come on now

I do react negatively to that word, but I think using it in the context of "you are an asshole because you call people this" is entirely appropriate

Oh, of course it's different, but it's still a pretty shocking thing to come out of your speakers.

was gonna say 3-6 too

btw the same town made me hate the same dudes, but i just decided they were classic rock listeners and thus metal was safe for consumption

She Watch Channel Zero is not part of the rap world... gotcha

neither is BDP sampling Blue Oyster Cult

or Jay-Z's 99 Problems

or Licensed to Ill

xp

"Fuck you Toto and your legions of racist fans, you are dead to me!" xpost

Rick Rubin = not part of the rap world

xp

I mean, I do a whole DJ set of rap songs that sample metal songs, so dont even get me started on naming shit cuz i'll be here forever

It's kind of hard to just handwave them as "classic rock" dudes when the classic rock you're talking about is Ozzy Osbourne and Black Sabbath and they are also into Judas Priest and Dio and Iron Maiden and Motley Crue and etc etc.

Fuck you Toto and your legions of racist fans

I know I keep saying this but new ILM board description

also occurred to me that metal and rap both share a love of gothic fonts/tattoos

xp

Jesus, I read that as some sort of protracted Wizard of Oz metaphor that I couldn't quite wrap my head around.

call me when a metaller tattoos an ice cream cone on his face

You should be glad I didnt stick with my original "Kansas? More like racist Kansassholes!" line xpost

stupid face tattoos is something else that metal and rap share

Uh, i know Drugs, I'm not a complete fucking idiot

I'm saying the rise of hardcore and the rise of thrash were around the same time

― maher shalal smash paz (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, March 22, 2011 2:31 PM (17 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i don't know about this, hardcore had peaked earlier i think...when is the first thrash record? 85-86?

rap samples every genre under the sun -- doesnt really work for this argument

call me when a metaller tattoos an ice cream cone on his face

brb, gettin ink

excellent new level of nonsense coming w/the argument that the music being sampled in rap is never actually germane to the rap in question

so u guys think rap & metal have the exact same relationship as rap & punk, or are their differences? bcuz it seems to me they interact in difft ways.

please refrain from any Kansas/asshole portmanteau combination words ;_;

hey aerosmith u are kind of a dick

Kill Em All was 83, around the same time hardcore punk was defining its more purist aspirations

"Kanye doesn't really like Donny Hathaway - it just happened to be around for him to sample"

like, just 20% less condescension?

"Kanye doesn't really like Donny Hathaway - it just happened to be around for him to sample"

― five gone cats from Boston (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Tuesday, March 22, 2011 7:55 PM (9 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

the framing of this is absurd

lolol I am trying to think of who in our high school was all "Kansas? THAT'S THE BAND FOR ME" and the only answer coming to me is "the stoned ppl", which was like half the school across all kinds of aesthetic boundaries

hey aerosmith u are kind of a dick

it's true! one thing I have going for me though is if I make an assertion that's immediately proven wrong by a bunch of people I don't try to construct ridiculous defenses for it

deej i dont think any 2 things have the exact same relationship so thats kinda setting up the goalposts a bit

so u guys think rap & metal have the exact same relationship as rap & punk, or are their differences? bcuz it seems to me they interact in difft ways.

― D-40, Tuesday, March 22, 2011 3:54 PM (21 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I mean, we're talking about three genres that have 100+ years of history between them. Are we talking NOW? Cuz for every Travis Barker there's a Tommy Lee

oh hey look at the philosopy major lol at me xpost to myself

what are we even arguing about and can we drop it in favor of more rude classic rock portmanteaus

i do think that yer reading of the DIY distro aesthetic being vastly different between metal and punk is 100% inaccurate

well i wouldnt mind obv xpost

deej, I would say the punk/rap crossover is prolly more than the metal/rap crossover in 2011, but is def lesser than the metal/rap crossover in 1987-1994. And that's mainly because of the always-changing definition of punk

deej i dont think any 2 things have the exact same relationship so thats kinda setting up the goalposts a bit

^^^this

rap borrows from everything, including metal. saying that sampling doesn't matter is like saying the sound of the music doesn't matter.

deej i dont think any 2 things have the exact same relationship so thats kinda setting up the goalposts a bit

― broke my o_O face o_O (jjjusten), Tuesday, March 22, 2011 7:56 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

well, that was my initial 'goal,' it seemed to me that there were interesting ways in which they interacted differently, and i tried to articulate them, which led to a game of 'lol deej doesnt know anything about metal!!' followed by relentless posts from aerosmith that, had i made in a rap thread, he would be getting all self righteous about what a dick i was

chicagofuckyourself xps

as always, the "teams" and subcultures how everything intersected was a lot messier and weirder than its being portrayed here...

obv hardcore and metal were all intertwined esp by the mid 80s, metallica famously went to see black flag in SF a bunch of times and there was all the crossover dri/coc stuff and black flag dug dio and GNR had duff in the band and he was an ex-punk, and then seattle goes without saying in terms of punx reappropriating sabbath, and then there was faith no more and lots my friends like metal and punk and rap and metallica wore misfits t-shirts and then anthrax and PE bro'd down and sir mix-a-lot had the metal church dude play on his cover of "iron man" by black sabbath and people listened to all these black and white dudes making loud and angry music and we were all like fuck you mom & dad

deej, I would say the punk/rap crossover is prolly more than the metal/rap crossover in 2011, but is def lesser than the metal/rap crossover in 1987-1994. And that's mainly because of the always-changing definition of punk

― maher shalal smash paz (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, March 22, 2011 7:59 PM (29 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

this post seems sensible to me & i appreciate an answer that isnt abt treating me like an idiot thnx

m@tt yr the best don't ever change bro

yah srsly

lol DJP my best friend in 6th grade signed up for Columbia house and got the Best of Kansas tape by mistake so he gave it to me for Christmas; I started listening to it on a whim like 2 years later around the time I was reading a lot of Alpha Flight comix and became kind of a big fan for a while. Just bought like three of their albums a few months back

How many of the goons besides myself are serious metalheads?

I am not a serious anything

How many of the goons besides myself are serious metalheads?

― maher shalal smash paz (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, March 22, 2011 8:04 PM (46 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

h3lgeson obv

"Styx? I think you meant 'Dicks'."

i hate metal

tbf it hates you too

j0rdan, u ever try on that torche album? str8 goonrock classick

blue oyster cunt

^winner

no one wins with blue oyster cunt

j0rdan, u ever try on that torche album? str8 goonrock classick

― maher shalal smash paz (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, March 22, 2011 4:08 PM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark

no :( -- one of these days

apologies to jj if i misread his tone here

Underground metal is better than mainstream metal (and rap) with few exceptions.

Mainstream rap is better than underground rap (but not metal) with few exceptions.

Rap metal was okay for a minute but became irrelevant once it was done and nobody added anything interesting to the mix other than a dee jay making noises on top of guitar or a rapper rapping over guitar noise.

So... metal.

insert "pretty fly for a white guy" joke, um... somewhere

xp

How many of the goons besides myself are serious metalheads?

― maher shalal smash paz (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, March 22, 2011 8:04 PM (46 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

h3lgeson obv

― D-40, Tuesday, March 22, 2011 3:05 PM (15 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i was definitely, when i was a kid....though i wouldn't really call myself one now, esp by the standards of dudes on the metal thread, like at all. i remember when i first heard death metal, like deicide and morbid angel and stuff and i couldn't really hang with it, i like napalm death but that seemed more hardcore really...i don't know what it was but the last stuff i loved-loved was the big thrash bands

but i don't know any of the stuff they talk about now on the metal threads. but yeah i loved it back then when it was popular music and still love all that stuff.

m@tt's metal cred maps pretty much identically to mine. I mean I still listen to the odd metal record here or there (I like the droney/doomy stuff mostly) but yeah I have no idea what any of the guys on the metal thread are talking about most of the time.

but yeah i loved it back then when it was popular music and still love all that stuff.

it's still pretty popular. In the 00s i saw more kids in metal tees and hit singles by metal bands in the (UK) top 10 than ever before.

i didn't like that stuff admittedly but you cant say its not popular.

um i'm not saying it's not popular but like this is only my own perspective it was just THE MUSIC, like this is when i was in late elementary jr high and early HS, like metal was ubiquitous, it was before rap really broke thru and it's not like kids were listening to bruce hornsby and shit like that...so everyone listened to "metal" whether that meant GNR or def leppard or exodus or judas priest or maiden or all of the above.

idk anything about how popular it is in the UK but it is not remotely as mass culture as it was then in the US, that is not arguable IMO.

i don't know about this, hardcore had peaked earlier i think...when is the first thrash record? 85-86?

btw I don't know about this - in the US, maybe so, but some of the greatest thrash bands before thrash meant metal were like raw power & some of the swedish/finnish punx who were at least on the west coast called "thrash punk" -- I first heard thrash being used to describe metal stuff I think around '84-'85 but would bet a quarter, not that I could prove it either way, that "thrash punk" was a term being used on the west coast around '82-'84

Pretty sure this is true - in CA at least, in 81-2 thrash meant hardcore punk. I'm sure MRR was using the term in their early issues.

xp to m@tt: I'm with AG on this one: I know a TON of ppl into metal, metal is as big as it ever was, and metal cru here only really touches on prolley a third of it if that...there's reasons for that: a lot of metal is geared towards to the yoof and has lots of goff-emo-core elements in it, and metalheads in this thread are pretty disdainful of youth culture, see bands like All Shall Perish in probably the same way fans of classic horror look at a lot of these watered-down, starlet-of-the-week, Hollywoodized horror movies; doesn't mean there aren't more horror movies now than there ever was...

maybe metal is not as visible in the wider culture as it used to be but it still very much has a lot of impact...

and metal cru here only really touches on prolley a third of it if that..

more like one hundreth, there's so much stuff we miss/unaware of and we all tend to have different favourite sub-genres as well, though we are interested in lots of sub-genres. I've always thought death metal was the big 'mainstream' extreme metal genre but lots are like me and dont seem to bother with it, so it gets a bit of s short thrift round here. Though i do enjoy phil and smithy's dedicated posts on it.

i know a ton of people into metal too, it's still popular, but like i don't exaggerate when i say like 90 percent of everyone in my jr high, if you had asked them, would have said their fav music was metal. some would have meant metallica and some would have meant like poison and motley crue but it was all considered metal.

drugs a money, metal is like a lot of rock (and even dance) it's really splintered now. Bound to be a nirvana or g n r or metallica or zep or sabbath along eventually (guaranteed we will be too old to like it)

okay it was not that way in my school but I was a nerd...

xp

m@tt i know the usa was very different, rock was more of a cult thing (no dedicated rock radio) nevermind metal in the uk in the 80s. Even grunge bands were lucky to get top 10 hits. Nirvana never even got a #1 single. But then in the 00s nu-metal and the Kerrang sponsored emo were having top 5 hits and #1s. Now there's Kerrang TV & Radio (no actual metal on in mind you - hah)

there was 2 metal fans in my year at school. (i wasnt one of them)

I had a cousin who made crossword puzzles composed entirely of Slayer references so

noone was into "indie" either. how times changed

um i'm not saying it's not popular but like this is only my own perspective it was just THE MUSIC, like this is when i was in late elementary jr high and early HS, like metal was ubiquitous, it was before rap really broke thru and it's not like kids were listening to bruce hornsby and shit like that...so everyone listened to "metal" whether that meant GNR or def leppard or exodus or judas priest or maiden or all of the above.

idk anything about how popular it is in the UK but it is not remotely as mass culture as it was then in the US, that is not arguable IMO.

― Bleeqwot the Chef (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 22 March 2011 20:48 (19 minutes ago) Permalink

yeah see (to discuss original thread post) i think this is a generational thing, & this is what surprises me abt the metal comparisons in ilx threads ... rap's era of being the predominant pop sound has been much more recent. so when ppl compare the rolling metal thread w/ the rolling rap one it strikes an off note for me, cuz its not the '88 rolling metal thread but its not nearly so long ago that rap was dominating the charts (& it still is for the most part a huge part of the current pop sound in a way it isnt for metal) (and when it is, its the kind of metal 'metal thread' dudes arent messing w)

metal was never the predominant sound anywhere in the pop mainstream (except maybe in the lol 90s), m@tt's experience is an exception I think

i mean the goon thread uniformly dislikes eminem but wed never say hes not real rap or w/e

like late 80s/90s was probably the commercial peak of metal in the US

xp

also no one was comparing the rolling threads - people were comparing the ALL TIME POLLING THREADS

big difference

shakey, i mean like metal in the sense of the pop metal era, like bon jovi and poison and britney fox and def leppard hysteria and etc, that stuff was absolutely the pop mainstream, and at the same time bands like metallica and priest and maiden could still do platinum plus numbers that are bigger than "pop" acts today

also no one was comparing the rolling threads - people were comparing the ALL TIME POLLING THREADS

big difference

― Hyper Rescue Troop (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, March 22, 2011 9:16 PM (21 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

not in terms of electorate xp

yeah that's why I said late 80s/early 90s (Hysteria is '87 for ex) - covers the big pop metal explosion and also the grunge aftershock, GnR, etc.

xp

not in terms of electorate

no but it is a big difference in terms of what's getting talked about. Like both are genres that are over 30 years old, why can't an all time poll for one work as well as the other? Is it just because metal happens to be roughly 10 years older? that's ridiculous.

In the UK though "metal" is more mainstream than it was in the 80s/90s lol UK i guess. Cu as deej says, "real" metalheads dont fuck with it and thats true. We dont read kerrang and kerrang doesnt cover it even though its still in the lineage of what they do cover,its just that Kerrang is a corporate publication and has moved on to what is more popular rather than trying to make something the next big thing like the NME has always done.

lol Shakey

"metal never dominated popular music except for those five years where it dominated popular music"

drugs a money, metal is like a lot of rock (and even dance) it's really splintered now. Bound to be a nirvana or g n r or metallica or zep or sabbath along eventually (guaranteed we will be too old to like it)

i know this...what i'm saying is I think metal gets misrepresented in this board, and it's a big reason why goons act like no one really listens to metal, which is outright wrongness. i actually think metal is bigger than rap right now; goons do a really good job of keeping track of a lot of developments in rap, and that's not what metalheads here do at all...most metalheads pick through stuff and find things that would interest them; it is a lot more elitist, and there's tons of bands like Suicide Silence, Dying Fetus, Chelsea Grin, I Wrestled a Bear Once, and on and on, that may only getting passing coverage if that. I know a ton of metalheads irl and yet I probably know two or three who have ever heard a Kyuss song, or a High on Fire song, except for the ones that I have made an effort to introduce those bands to...

but yeah, my impression is that at least in Midwestern America, all the goth kids, and skater kids, and punk kids and stoner kids, pretty much all of them are metalheads now...metal has absorbed all those subcultures

I think a fair # of metal ppl would take issue, or at least want to heavily qualify, whether what dominated popular music when Bon Jovi et al were reliably charting was "metal"

yeah i guess comparing uk and us is really weird cuz the cultures are so different, like at the same time frame, say, stone roses were like what? playing soccer stadiums and not "that one band with the fishermen hats i saw that one time on 120 minutes"

even most of those hair metal bands that were huge in the usa in the 80s never got passed like #37 in the pop singles chart or got near top 10 albums chart with the exception of bon jovi,def leppard,maiden and the odd one hit wonder song. Early 90s must have been different though as motorhead,saxon and a lot of those nwobhm bands got on top of the pops. But late 80s - only way to hear it was was power hour/raw power or tommy vance friday 10pm R1 in my experience

and smithy otm re pop metal

M@tt's experience was very common across a lot of Minnesota; I'd say that my high school was very similar where ppl listened to other things but the default 90% of the school had in common would fall under one of the metal subcategories, whether it was Bon Jovi or Def Leppard or Iron Maiden or Motley Crue or Dio or Metallica or Slayer or Iron Maiden or Cinderella or Winger or etc; the only ppl not on board with at least one of those groups were the CC kids, some of whom were still into Stryper.

bnasically we metallers will never be unified, its too big a genre and getting more splintered all the time. its no joke , sub-genres like black metal now have about a dozen sub-sub-genres.
so yes, dan p will always be correct in comparing it to techno!

i actually think metal is bigger than rap right now

^^^yeah this sounds absurd to me

I have a lot of respect for dedicated metalheads, but who the hell would vote "metal". It simply lacks the variety that hip-hop does.

That said, I don't understand people who listen to nothing but metal. They always seem like cool people but how can they listen to something so loud all day?

yeah this sounds absurd to me

It is 100% absurd if the Billboard charts are a good metric.

ha i even had stryper, youth ministers did more for that shithole band than they ever knew, to hell with the devil was ok, all the girls liked the power ballad off the next album

yeah this sounds absurd to me

It is 100% absurd if the Billboard charts are a good metric.

― ancient, but very sexy (DJP), Tuesday, March 22, 2011 4:33 PM (15 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

yeah i looked and there were 2 metal albums on the top 100, children of bodom at 36 and some old linkin park record way down the list...unless the band casting crowns is metal but not sure.

itunes there were only a couple, one being saliva (lol)

rap is the most popular music in the world, it is hard for me to imagine anybody who thinks much about popular music asserting otherwise

the only people I know who are into rap (apart from my bandmates) are on this board lol and that includes my world of younger relatives/acquaintances. otoh all the kids know metal and various metal bands, because they are part of Rock Band

btw upper m casting crowns r kvlt as fuck, you're on my fkkn hitlist now

It is 100% absurd if the Billboard charts are a good metric.

big "if" there lol

but I hate these kinds of theoretical audience-strawmanning hypotheses that never go anywhere.

If metal is more popular than rap, then why doesn't every single car commercial and soda commercial have metal in it?

old people don't like it

cars are sold with indie rock anyway

Old people started it!

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-L5qGCxezhUg/TV1ouu1mu5I/AAAAAAAACvU/rrmnsLj0dF4/s1600/ozzy-osbourne3.jpg

"look at me, so young and spry with my whole life ahead of me; pass me my walker so we can go fuck up some olds"

damn this is trve

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uHdcyue0bSw

if we're going on car commercials then yeah everybody can just kiss ben gibbard's ass 'cause he's the most popular singer alive

xp upper m otm, I feel a winter chill from the darkest caverns

this IS the most important question in pop

Rap

; goons do a really good job of keeping track of a lot of developments in rap, and that's not what metalheads here do at all...most metalheads pick through stuff and find things that would interest them; it is a lot more elitist, and there's tons of bands like Suicide Silence, Dying Fetus, Chelsea Grin, I Wrestled a Bear Once,

yeah we definitely do ignore the huge mainstream metal bands, if we do mention it a lot of us LOL at it. Phil is the most mainstream friendly of us (outside whiney who likes lots of popular stuff in all genres) and even phil doesnt really mention those bands much unless hes linking to an article about them on his msn blog).

ILM metalheads do not represent metalheads in general at all.

and yeah, no way is metal bigger than hip hop ,but its not as insignificant as deej makes out. Plus an awful lot of metal will never appear on charts as most places selling it are not affiliated to charts people and of course the whole DIY culture that makes up maybe 70% of metal releases these days.

also soda is sold with techno

geez whiney it's like you've never watched TV?

does rap sell anything? I guess I noticed an E-40 quote in that latest robot vodka ad. that seemed pretty weird tho

I don't think deej "makes it out to be insignificant" where do u get that

rap sells shoes

do you guys live shoeless under rocks

bigger =/= most popular, which is not something I'd be v good at gauging living in bumfuck Michigan...bigger as in more ppl doing it, and more going on with it, and I'm p sure I threw in the Midwestern America caveat though maybe not in front of that particular phrase...

I honestly can't remember the last time I heard somebody rap about a product

xp

there is nothing elitist about ignoring "I Wrestled a Bear Once" xposts

also, rapping hamsters sell tiny cars to cityfolk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kfJnqbudMzs

Plus an awful lot of metal will never appear on charts as most places selling it are not affiliated to charts people and of course the whole DIY culture that makes up maybe 70% of metal releases these days.

these numbers at their highest possible estimate don't equal a mid-level rap record in its 32nd week of release. rap is just much, much more popular globally than metal.

http://visboo.com/img/new/scumbag_steve_to_EUF8a_640_01.jpg

there is nothing elitist about ignoring "I Wrestled a Bear Once" xposts

who do you love more them or casting crowns

I don't think deej "makes it out to be insignificant" where do u get that

on some other threads over the last year he's often said that metal has had hardly any hits in the last 20 years. or words to that effect

and ILM's favorite rapper M.I.A. also sold tiny cars to cityfolk:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uN9eK0It62Y

also, rapping hamsters sell tiny cars to cityfolk

I curse you for reminding me of this abomination

M@tt wtf is that pic of?

rap is just much, much more popular globally than metal.

I have no idea how anyone could accurately gauge the global popularity of any kind of music in this day and age - there's just too much being listened to that I'm sure is not tracked anywhere

thats a picture of varg in junior high xpost

theory: indie is more popular than metal

in the united states

currently

SCUMBAG STEVE!

I don't even know what the word "popular" means anymore

hip-hop also sells energy drinks

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DwhTYFwfACA&feature=related

and detroit automobiles

god I hate advertising

http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/scumbag-steve

lol the still frame on the youtube here is crackin me up

hip-hop also sells energy drinks

pfft maiden were on the lucozade adverts throughout the 80s & 90s

wtf does that even have to do with anything

it means hip hop is not alone in selling energy drinks obviously

it obviously doesnt mean anything important though.

dunno why it would bother you though

Listen to more metal.

Personally cant listen to metal (or any genre of music) all the time. Even though Jazz has been what I haven listened to a lot this past month.

Metal because metal includes Dream Theater. Rap metal is the worst option of all because it mixes two evils.

dream theater is way more evil than anything else.

i dont think anyone in the crowd at a dream theater show is under 300 pounds

xanth novel bullshit for adult bedwetters

metal for rush fans

or what whiney said

im happy to turn the rest of this into Dream Theater joke time

Dream Theater >>>> Rush >>>> Metal

Q: How many Dream Theater fans does it take to screw in a lightbulb?
A: One to do it and another to tell you what AWESOME TIME SIGNATURE it was in

Q: How do you tell the age of a Dream Theater fan?
A: Count the zits on his back?

Metal-loving peanutbrains should pay more attention to time signatures, key changes, mood changes, and not least keyboard solos.

Prog loving dipshits should pay less attention to wonky, worthless twaddle for mouth-breathing neckbeards who pretend their penis is a dragon.

Music is all about being clever. Dream Theater are still too aggressive for their own good though. They should turn down the aggression considerably and become more like Flower Kings or Spock's Beard.

Hey rush had tunes

Music is all about being clever.

and rappers are NEVER clever

Q: Whats the difference between Dream Theater and a "table is the table" movie

A: One has four guys jerking off and the other is a porno

Rappers are considerably less musically clever than metal musicians. Which is why metal wins out. I can more easily stomach listening to rap than to some growling singer screaming over a 600 BPM bass drum beat and extreme Marshall riffs though. Even though the latter probably has more artistic value.

http://4gifs.com/gallery/d/180763-1/White_people_snuggies.gif

geir what do you think of
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDca_QjTxTs&;feature=player_embedded

vs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-H96gfvAV0&feature=related

is that video a recording of one of Momus's wet dreams?!?

Metal-loving peanutbrains should pay more attention to time signatures, key changes, mood changes, and not least keyboard solos.

Doom-Death, Technical and Melodic Death Medal, Symphonic Black Metal and such are all genres built basically around weird time signatures, key changes, tempo and mood shifts... these experimentations and things are what make them seperate sub-genres.

I don't know of any metalheads that are completely allergic to synthesizers -- drum programming and atmospheric effects at least are kind of ubiquitous in a lot of metal these days. You are talking about a creature that died out in 80s.

i'm listening to metal RIGHT NOW

Doom-Death, Technical and Melodic Death Medal, Symphonic Black Metal and such are all genres built basically around weird time signatures, key changes, tempo and mood shifts... these experimentations and things are what make them seperate sub-genres.

In which case I see no reason why Dream Theater fans should be mocked for being into the same. Dream Theater are basically about the same thing, only a tad bit less aggressive. Sort of a missing link between metal and 70s symphonic rock.

One word...

Rick Rubin

Rick Rubin is not exactly prog....

Otherwise... Rick Rubin is famous for a bunch of horrible and unlistenable rap/metal-fusions, a handful of underproduced acoustic albums consisting of cover versions performed by elder statemen. And actually one rather good album by Tom Petty.

He's done metal and rap, some pioneering rap, remember...

RUN DMC and SLayer... 'nuff said.. lol!

In which case I see no reason why Dream Theater fans should be mocked for being into the same.

they get mocked because they're SHITE!!

Dream Theater is never and will never be the band one thinks of when they think Metal..

In which case I see no reason why Dream Theater fans should be mocked for being into the same. Dream Theater are basically about the same thing, only a tad bit less aggressive..

pussy bullshit is not v metal imo

An interesting story...

My fiance's daughters boyfriend is an aspiring hip-hop producer. Knowing I have schooled music background, he is always asking me questions about melody, and keys, and arrangements..
I picked him up one day and the bridge to Slayer's 'Raining Blood' happen to drop just as he got in the car. He bugged out-wanted to know who it was, what was going on, who did they do that-he went bat shit and wanted to sample it..

My point being, unless you really really get into the lyrics of Hip-hop, which IMO is the MOST important aspect of the genre, you're not gonna be moved by the music. Like Chuck D said back in the day, its the CNN of the streets... its lost some of that lately but it comes and goes with its street imprtants..
But just hearing a simple part of one song, the kid bugged out way more than the stuff in his own 'wheel house'.. He was moved in some way by that one part and wanted to incorperate it in his own stuff..

its a constant feedback thing how Hip-Hop and Metal have influenced each other over the years.. Both are very important, and neither is better than the other. My first love is metal, but I have a great soft spot for early 90's hip-hop ala The Pharcyde, Tribe Called Quest, Hierogliphics...

Channel Zero was originally a Bad Brains sample iirc and i rc

Synthpop and soft rock >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rap and metal.

what about synth-rap and synth-metal and synth-rock?

There is no such thing as synth metal.

Synth rap, as in early stuff like "The Message" or "Planet Rock", was not that bad. I didn't really start despising rap until it abandonded electro and went for a more "rock" or miminalist approach to its backing tracks. Which is actually why I hate rap metal so much. "Walk This Way" was the moment when I started hating rap with a passion.

judas priest did synth metal!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DdwuxoSHsSo

eddie van halen gets shit for not enough guitar and too much synth

Bal-Sagoth is kinda synth-metal in that most everything on their records is synthesized.

judas priest did synth metal!

Not even "Jump" is synth metal. Synthpop, by its very definition, is completely devoid of anything but electronic instruments. Just one guitar solo is enough not to be synth. Thus, synth metal can not exist because metal has to have guitars to be metal.

Synthpop, by its very definition, is completely devoid of anything but electronic instruments.

No, it isn't!

synth metal
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E32cHLtuIfw&feature=player_embedded

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKN2_-zepEY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTyNF5rdsYk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=orlcQccpwbQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31-BycUUq0M

proper genuine synth metal

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sv556twnK44&feature=player_embedded

unless you really really get into the lyrics of Hip-hop, which IMO is the MOST important aspect of the genre, you're not gonna be moved by the music

just wanna say that i really really really disagree with this

Shades of early SAGA in this more commercial effort from Saracen. They are doing a concept CD about Marilyn Monroe feat. Robin Beck as Marilyn in 2010. Hope it marks a big return for these guys!!
wederell1 11 months ago

what does an "aspiring hip hop producer"'s love of a slayer beat have to do with appreciation of lyrics

really disagree with the whole "black CNN" thing (though P.E. are among my favorite groups ever), and with the "not being moved by the music" thing, and with everything Geir said...

...ever

will do

i am a nonviolent dude but i srsly want to punch all of you in the face

like a bunch of times

Just one guitar solo is enough not to be synth

Geir, Geir, Geir...I have in my music library a perfectly enjoyable synthesizer-based song called "Change The World", which you yourself may have listened to once or twice, and which features a clearly metal-derived guitar solo among the synths. If there's no such thing as synth-metal, and that guitar solo disqualifies it as synth-pop, then exactly what the hell do you call "Change The World" anyways??

I consider "Change The World" to be a power ballad, not synthpop. :)

Two-in-the-Pink-One-in-the-Stink Floyd

If I pick my top 100 songs between the two, I would say 75-80 would be rap.

However, over the last 15 years or so, metal seems to be keeping it more real.

unless you really really get into the lyrics of Hip-hop, which IMO is the MOST important aspect of the genre, you're not gonna be moved by the music

just wanna say that i really really really disagree with this

yeah me too, this just seems really wrong, and doesn't map to how I got into hip-hop at all

how about albums wise? Metal really is not a singles orientated genre, kinda why comparing rap hits to metal hits in the singles charts is pointless. Metal and all it's subgenres do have one more thing in common - Albums Orientated.

Metal and all it's subgenres do have one more thing in common - Albums Orientated.

The increasing popularity of metal, and also the revival in prog insterest, is kind of fascinating considering the album format is said to be on its way out. Obviously going to take some time until it disappears then.
(It's not like neither metal nor prog set the album charts on fire either though - they tend to be dominated by MOR balladeers and "Best Of"-albums these days)

The increasing popularity of metal, and also the revival in prog insterest, is kind of fascinating considering the album format is said to be on its way out.

No doubt.

Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.

the album format isn't on the way out. Plenty still making them, Geir's "kids" might not be buying them but they still download them for free.

Geir doesn't have kids, just men on the street

The increasing popularity of metal, and also the revival in prog insterest, is kind of fascinating considering the album format is said to be on its way out.

metal kids still buy crazy albums and buy crazy albums on VINYL. Aspie tendencies lend themselves to owning fetish objects. Which is why i def love the BUSINESS of selling underground metal music in 2011 (ie., Here's a limited edition 180-gram vinyl, hand-numbered) more than the business of underground hip-hop in 2011 (here's my mp3 mixtape in 128kpbs, i didn't even tag them shits lol)

like I like both records, but what do you think has been more satisfying for me in the last 6 months? Buying the Wormrot album on beautiful/disgusting/fun worm-colored peach/brown vinyl (edition 100) or downloading the Fiend mixtape and realizing all the tracks were just dumped in alphabetical order

depends on whether you're an "aspie" or not ;)

eh artists who pay attention to detail >>>>>> artists who don't imho

when the goons talk about mixtapes I thought that there might have been actual mixtapes/cdrs for some to buy

nah its a misnomer

Ha, yeah, I assumed they were rips of actual physical mixtapes. Spend too much time in the cassette-loving noise crowd, I guess.

this thread got real cuet

sold out of the trunk of a car or something...

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h279/juicyfrt/2nvedm0.jpg

Geir's "kids" might not be buying them but they still download them for free.

You sure they download the entire album? And if they do, do they listen to all the tracks? In sequence even?

I don't know about the kids, but among all the tr00 metalheads and crust-punx I know (who are in their mid-late 20s) downloads are basically 'tinny bullshit' to whet your taste until you can get your hands on the vinyl. Albums on vinyl are very conducive to full-album listening (or at least half of it, heh), since its kind of a pain to get up and move the needle to play specific tracks... you just wait for them.

Sure... But, even though I am no expert of metal, I kind of doubt that metal sells more on vinyl than CD. Vinyl sales have increased a lot the past years, but it still doesn't compare with CD sales or downloads in any way.

Geir you often tell ilx what "kids" all over the world are doing, I thought you would know

and i think metal kids will d/l full albums, anyones guess to whether they listen to it in full.
Obv the more kerrang orientated emo stuff that has hit singles might be more prone to singles only downloading.

dont see why rap kids wouldnt d/l full mixtapes either

XXP I think the latest Ozzy album might be a good benchmark for that as it had as wide a Vinyl release as it did a CD one, and isn't niche or extreme metal. And I have no doubt it sold way more CDs than LPs. But I wasn't talking about the general audience I was talking about 'extreme' fans.

who the hell would buy the latest ozzy album though?

the winner of this poll is the one ilxors hate the least, right?

metal gonna get pwned yall

i am of the "ladies ladies you are both v pretty" persuasion wrt to this, but i just didnt want anyone to get too shocked is all

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

strong showing by rap metal

these results are otm

thank God

did anyone vote rap-metal seriously? lol Maybe members of Urban Dance Squad lurk on De Subjectivisten

this was closer than i thought btw, i expected 100 votes for rap and about 12 for metal

its almost as if you have some sort of persecution complex about liking metal that everyone calls you out on

deeper shade of soul is my shiiiiiiiit cousin

Although the popularity of these styles has declined, some believe that rap rock may regain popularity, with younger music fans discovering bands in the genre. Drew Simollardes of the band Reveille states that "I feel like lately it’s more appropriate. People are sick of a lot of the stuff that’s out there right now."

Your search - "Drew Simollardass" - did not match any documents.

deeper shade of soul is my shiiiiiiiit cousin

― Bleeqwot the Chef (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Thursday, March 24, 2011 10:43 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i bet a deej hates "deeper shade of soul"

or will humblebrag that he never heard of it

'humblebrag'??

i had to look up what it was

seems lol but not v great or anything

im sorry you feel guilty about know abt lame alt-rap crossover tracks from the early 90s whiney but dont project shit on me

late 80s you herb

oh so it was out when i was 6 yrs old. /humblebrag

obviously it's a horrible crime to not have the exact same musical background and reference points as whiney, deej let's meet up in study hall and go through the metal textbooks so we don't have any more "guy from mayhem committing suicide picture" type gaffes

the only thing that offends me about all this is deej callin Urban Dance Squad lame

yeah can you believe he had the nerve to voice his opinion about that song after you speculated that he hates it apropos of nothing

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02Yql63Ssw8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3EJJjR8Kgw

they changed quite a bit by 94

*changes vote to metal*

remember this one whiney? this was on 120 mins all the time here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2X_4kr-nsE&feature=related

Wonder if Tuomas was a fan of this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQR9bw-4R08&feature=related

That one was okay, but I liked "Down the Drain" and "Living It Up" more. "Living It Up" still sounds pretty good, btw, I last played it a couple of weeks ago. Sadly it's not on Youtube though, except for some lame live version.

dont see why rap kids wouldnt d/l full mixtapes either

But then, a mixtape is by its very definition a collection of tracks rather than a cohesive full artistic album.

deepahshadahsoul!

yea-ea-ea-eaaaaaah

watching videos when i was 10 or whatev, i used to always get SUPER PISSED when they showed the drummer and it would be edited wrong so they were hitting the snare where the bass drum was and vice-versa (this happened a LOT in hair metal videos ca 1988-1990).

But I guess since I had such limited knowledge of how DJing works, it wasn;t until rewatching the "Deeper Shade Of Soul" as a 31-y/o that i realize they never really edit the DJ so he's actually doing what the song is doing :(

LOL I remember getting the Deeper Shade of Soul single when I was nine and playing it for my fourth-grade class...everybody hated it!

A friend of mine dragged me to an Urban Dance Squad show well after their prime. I had only ever heard "Deeper Shade of Soul" a couple times at that point and nothing else. I found the concert very confusing.

I used to really like this track when I was 12 or so. It is a song that did not transcend its era.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q2a4MPP7zRI

remember this one whiney? this was on 120 mins all the time here

yep, it's a classick

yes!

This one was one of my favorites
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGV0XWsSr3I

I may have had depression in my teenage years.

Anyway, I wouldn't call them Rap-Metal. They're more rogue-rock.

jacka interview

You listen to reggae – and any other music outside of rap?

I listen to soft metal, heavy metal: Isis, Opeth. They’re really good.

Anyway, I wouldn't call them Rap-Metal. They're more rogue-rock.

please send invoice for tonight's drinks to me in thanks for this great lol

holy shit that demagogue song i have not thought of that in forever

i really do think we listened to a lot of the same stuff in early 90s jj (except you hate grunge)

listen a lot to both but think my heart's in metal, so woulda voted that. rap I always feel like an outsider amongst the heads even though I enjoy listening to it.

might be partially biased cos I'm listening to Napalm Death right now tho