What kind of EOY Metal Poll do you want this year?

keep the arguing off the rolling metal thread and do it here please

For me, I find the really long rollouts to be frustrating because the threads become huge and unwieldy to read very quickly. So even if I am curious about what placed, that's outweighed by how overwhelming it is to load and then read 1000+ post threads with lots of JPEG's of album art and YouTube embeds and everything.

Thread people do you want a poll?

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:13 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Not if you're rolling out 200 albums, but if you want to do 50 or whatever than cool.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:14 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Then cool. Damn phone second guessing my bad typing.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:15 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

what difference does it make? The point is to introduce good metal albums to ilx that might not get exposure elsewhere.

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:16 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I'm not rehashing the argument for the umpteenth time. As with your other polls, feel free to do without my input. As poll runner that's your right, and others enjoy so go with my blessing.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:19 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

but you're saying you wont vote or anything unless its a top 50 only!

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:23 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Yep. Same as I haven't voted in the 70s or 80s polls. I don't enjoy them so don't participate.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:25 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

All because of a longer rollout?

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:29 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Yes. I enjoy polls that are as much about what placed as where it placed. I like the suspense; it keeps me engaged where a long rollout doesn't. It's all personal preference.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:36 (59 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

so you're not interested in discovering albums that are good that you didn't know about?

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:38 (57 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Hrm, something between 200 and 50, I see an ideal compromise here, 100! While not that many people actually like 100 metal albums in a year, there is easily a top 100 that will interest various folks. I know I usually get turned on to a dozen albums or so every poll that I'd missed. Hopefully we can talk EZ into at least voting for his top 20?

Last night I was listening to some doom (Pagan Altar, Candlemass, Saint Vitus) and reading H.P. Lovecraft's "The Dreams In The Witch House." I recently reviewed Pagan Altar's Judgement Of The Dead complete with a ghost story: http://fastnbulbous.com/pagan-altar-judgement-of-the-dead-1982/

Any other Halloween-inspired listening?

― Fastnbulbous, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:45 (50 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I fucking hate ILX polls and poll threads. Frankly, I think we need an I Love Polls board where that's all it is, and every other ILX board is mercifully poll-free. If you run an end-of-year poll (which we all know damn well you're going to, because that's what you do here), I will not read it or participate.

Note: This is not a reflection on you as a person, AG, so please don't take it as a personal attack.

― 誤訳侮辱, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:49 (46 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I think its usually 100 and he refuses to participate. Last year he got others to join him.

hah xp

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:50 (46 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I've said this all before, but since you keep prodding I'll say it again. I think there are plenty of ways to discover new stuff, like reading this rolling thread, for example. A best of/year in review should be about the things the voting community agrees on, not everything each member likes. The ballots we all post after do a great job of that, and I don't think the poll should try.

Again, different strokes for different folks.

I think 100 is still too much, because the voting pool is small. The whole ILM community only does a top 77 with way more voters.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:50 (45 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

noted, phil. no worries.

xp

and it misses out on a LOT of good albums as a result.

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:51 (45 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I'm pretty sure I voted last year despite my reservations. Maybe not though. I definitely voted in the main poll.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:51 (44 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Every cutoff misses great records. Just lost them all and have fun.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:52 (43 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

List not lost. Fucking phone.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:53 (42 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

once the results are in hardly anyone is interested in albums in other peoples ballots. Its far more likely an album getting its 15 mins of fame in a longer rollout will get way more checking it out than it showing up in someones ballot.

But if you're not happy with the way myself,jjj and glenn run the poll, then feel free to run it yourself without us if you think you can do better.

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:54 (41 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

the only thing that matters is the poll. And if it can be run better and get more participants by someone else running it i'm happy to step aside.

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, 26 October 2012 18:02 (33 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Dude, don't be silly. I have nothing against any of you or how you choose to run a poll. I just explained why I'm not participating and wasn't even snarky about it (for a change, I freely admit). I have a different philosophy, that's all.

Good luck, have fun, and my historically fringe votes won't even be missed very much.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 18:03 (32 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

ag, i have no idea why i bother, but here goes:

if you want to turn people on to new records, a top-200 rollout is an awful way to do it. i don't have time to listen to samples from 150 records. i also don't have time to follow a thousand-post thread that takes days and days to finish. if you did a top 50, i could follow the whole thing and listen to many of the ones that i hadn't heard.

but you're going to do whatever you want so

― call all destroyer, Friday, 26 October 2012 18:04 (31 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

it was not me who mentioned a top 200 fwiw it was ez snappin

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, 26 October 2012 18:05 (30 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

you did 125. my point stands.

― call all destroyer, Friday, 26 October 2012 18:07 (28 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

well, we could dispense with a rollout completely and just put a full list in one post just like how it happens in a magazine.

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, 26 October 2012 18:09 (26 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Do we have to have this argument every year?!

― Bound by Habitrails (J3ff T.), Friday, 26 October 2012 18:13 (22 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Apparently.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 18:13 (22 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

but i'll tell you what. I'll come up with a few formats then run a standard poll with them and we agree to abide with the results. That way everyone has their say. Cant say fairer than that.

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, 26 October 2012 18:14 (21 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

ez does,jeff.

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, 26 October 2012 18:14 (21 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Dude, just do a top 50 or 100. 200 is WAY too much. I really appreciate the hard work you put in running the poll, but since this thing is supposed to be for the community and not something that you came up with yourself (like the 70s and 80s polls), I feel like the community does have a say in the rollout – And it seems like the community is saying that they want a smaller list.

― Bound by Habitrails (J3ff T.), Friday, 26 October 2012 18:15 (20 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

dear j3ff i did not say i was doing a top 200. That was ez snappin.

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, 26 October 2012 18:16 (19 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

What kind of EOY Metal Poll do you want this year?

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, 26 October 2012 18:24 (11 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

And i put a no poll option for phil

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, 26 October 2012 18:25 (11 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Angry metal dudes! It seems AG is trying hard to accommodate here. Personally I really don't understand the complaints about longer rollouts. If you don't think they're fun or useful, just wait for the last day when the top 10 or whatever are revealed. What's the big friggin deal?

― Fastnbulbous, Friday, 26 October 2012 18:27 (8 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I cant please everyone and no matter what I do someone is unhappy so there's a poll to decide. Whatever ilx wants ilx will get and we need to abide with that.

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, 26 October 2012 18:28 (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Voting no poll.

― One bad call from barely losing to (Alex in SF), Friday, 26 October 2012 18:29 (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

For me, I find the really long rollouts to be frustrating because the threads become huge and unwieldy to read very quickly. So even if I am curious about what placed, that's outweighed by how overwhelming it is to load and then read 1000+ post threads with lots of JPEG's of album art and YouTube embeds and everything.

― Bound by Habitrails (J3ff T.), Friday, 26 October 2012 18:37 (3 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

well i do ban youtube embeds so thats never been a problem.
Have you tried switching off pictures in your settings? I think people enjoy seeing thealbum covers

Even without that stuff it's still a pain, especially if you haven't been keeping up from the start – like, since you start the poll, you have it bookmarked as you go so it's very easy to follow, but if you come in even a couple hours late, it's a really intimidating thread to start reading.

so maybe you just want a magazine style list posted in one shot?

I'll make one post and then (likely) stay out of this since I barely listen to any metal and have no business voting, but EZ's points are so plainly otm when he said "A best of/year in review should be about the things the voting community agrees on, not everything each member likes."

ILM has rolling threads for just about every genre at this point. I even have my own rolling thread that no one ever visits besides me. The EOY polls are where all these disparate threads congeal into a couple weeks of discovery for everybody. Anything (be it poll length or nomination rules or what have you) that could diminish widespread participation is antithetical to the process and desired result.

I actually agree with Johnny and EZ.

I think a top 50 rollout that allows for conversation about the albums that place high would be best. And I say this as someone whose favorite albums usually place between 100 and 125 every year.

mr troll apart from the fact you're not part of the metal community, every year we do very well ballots wise. So that is not a problem. Maybe we get lots of ballots because of the longer rollout and people feel their vote counts?

but if you wish to volunteer to run it instead of me then you can.

we all know Swans will win it anyway

Sure, AG. What I just wrote up there was "trolling".

Here's what REALLY happened. I was browsing through the reposted convo up there and EZ's distillation of how EOY polls work best when they work was so great that I had to back him up. J3ff agreed. That's it. You can take off your foil hat at any time.

74 ballots last year.

Also, we should consider disallowing Swans again.

Great, 74 is a lot. I voted in the metal poll one year and I think only one of the albums I voted for placed, but that was cool. I actually checked out some things I'd never even heard or heard of just because people were so enthusiastic about them. (I didn't like a lot of it, but that's not the point.) That was a 100 album countdown, though. Any longer than that, and I'd have been completely lost and/or wouldn't have the interest in following along.

I'm honestly not trying to pee in your punchbowl. I'm trying to offer up an outsider pov as to why gigantic rollouts are a) unnecessary and b) intimidating.

no worries. i just want to point out that I never said I was going to do a top 200. It was never an intention to do that.

And I don't buy the argument we would get more voters than we already get if the rollout was 50 or less. If people feel their vote might not count then they may just not vote.
Still, everyone has a chance to put their point across and lets see who says they will vote for the first time if its a smaller than 100 rollout.

Yeah dude, you asked us for our opinions, we are giving them to you. Don't be quite so defensive.

well I am still allowed to respond or give mine!

Certainly. But there are, you know, degrees.

Another repost from the rolling metal thread

I like a hundred plus poll 'cause it gets me outta my metal comfort zone to try new earth shakin' tunes...

― BlackIronPrison, Friday, 26 October 2012 19:26 (47 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

100 feels about right, i like the current format a lot. I discover plenty of new stuff through this poll as most ilxor voters listen to different styles than i generally do (and more American bands).

I vote for 1000 because thats what AG's gonna do anyway.

Actually voted no poll.

you never vote in the polls so why vote no?

you dont even post on the thread!

You could roll out a top 50 and then after counting down to number 1 post a list of the next hundred or whatever - then you get a more manageable list but you can also have discussion on what missed the top 50 and people can discover things they might be interested in that way.

past experience unfortunately shows that most people dont care once the #1 has rolled out.

sure you get a few who will (and they might even post here that they do) but that doesnt mean everyone does. And more feel inclined to give something a listen as the list gets rolled out. If you wait til the end then most will just listen to the top part of the poll. I know this from years of running the damn thing.

Again, not trolling but just bringing a different pov, but a lot of the suspense of what might make it what might not is non-existent when the rollout becomes abnormally large (and rankings are as close to arbitrary as they can be without actually being arbitrary..."Oh no, my favorite only made it to #148! I was hoping it would be in the #130s!"). The suspense of a smaller-scale rollout is the thread's engine. Even if there's not as much conversation after #1 is revealed, people still do go through other posters' lists and check things out.

the poll should be about introducing albums to people who are unaware of it. Suspense is for 12 cds a year man with limited tastes in metal who likes whatever is popular and has fuck all interest in new metal.

and if anyone wants it run another way please step up and volunteer to run it without myself,glenn and jjj.

If you want to introduce albums to people who are unaware of them, why have a poll? Just have a "list your favorite albums" end of year thread and create a Spotify playlist off of it.

Isn't this always how it works?

AG: "I'm going to poll the poll to avoid conflict. Yay!"
...other posters chime in with non-combative but different ideas...
AG: "Oh yeah, well run it yourself without any help then! My way or the highway!"

how this always works is that ez snappin moans about a rollout then his mate johnny fever, who does not post on the metal thread and has no interest in metal, decides to troll.

every damn year

Indicate to me one place in this thread that either EZ or I have "trolled".

You asked for input. You got POLITE input.

so why doesn't ez snappin and johnny fever run it instead? That way nobody complains as the perennial 2 trolls are running it!

seandalai already said he will tabulate so you dont even need to do much.

o_O

Apart from some dude, who has issued with album/track distribution on the ballots, I don't get these kind of complaint in my artist/decade/EOY polls. Why? Because I just kind of go with the flow. People thought 100 was too many for the EOY, but 50 was too few. I don't remember who suggested 77, but it was a brilliant idea and we've rolled with it for two years and intend to do the same this year. I embrace input and tailor polls accordingly. You resist input with every fiber of your being.

The answer is because YOU are running it therefore you CANT troll it like you do every poll i ever run. THATS WHY!

Anyway, it's your poll. I'm not running it. I'm not even voting in it. I only posted in this thread because EZ made a solid point.

But I have not "trolled". I've been nice, perfectly civil from the initial post onward, and you've been wholly reactionary and a grouch.

we never have a problem with longer rollouts. its only the same people who complain each year. Everyone else always seems to enjoy it.

But if ez snappin wants to run it his way then he can take over.

its only the same people who complain each year. Everyone else always seems to enjoy it.

Well then why are you even pre-polling the poll? Like I said, you request input and then beat it away.

Please stop bringing me up like some kind of boogeyman.

You asked for rolling thread regulars to chime in, and I did. I gave you my opinion without malice, trolling or any meanness, elaborated with my reasoning, and then encouraged you to do your thing because other people like it. I have no interest in running this or any other poll, never have, never will.

Please, just leave me out of it and leave me alone.

algerian goalkeeper, you could have avoided this if you just said "i will be running the eoy metal poll, format will prob be the same as last year" but one of your many compulsions is this weird idea of ensuring that everyone has input/is "happy" even though you vociferously yet passive-aggressively reject that input by stating that you will only run the poll if you can run it the way you want. this leads to these threads which are the equivalent of petting a kitten unti all its skin has been rubbed off and its head is a bloody pulp.

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRUqTirzFQGeJAqPNN3egUCnUDSUfe4Q4geJdfxGUty2fn91yLp9rc5E3oqCQ

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_txyx9yP6SLc/TIT30JBR1jI/AAAAAAAAAdM/ykfbwdAopIQ/immortal.gif

to put it another way--

1. no one else seems to want to run the poll. if anyone did, they likely would have spoken up. this is probably because running the poll sounds like a pain in the ass to most people, whereas you seem to enjoy it.

2. if we take #1 to be true, you can run the poll however you want! there is prob very little you could do that would turn away mass amounts of voters.

3. therefore, asking for the input of the community is a simple act of courtesy. you can choose to take our suggestions (most of which boil down to reducing the number of albums that make the list) or not. a polite, but firm, rejection would tell us all we needed to know.

4. INSTEAD, you get cranky when anyone suggests an alteration and tell them they can run the poll. that's not what anyone was suggesting!

5. if you have a specific way you want to do it, just be honest and say so.

we will abide by the results

i voted because i like voting for things

i find ~500 results to be too much to follow and i don't check in often enough at that point to see if poll is down to a more manageable number, so i'd say for sure no more than 100 results. i think very liberal voting policies are important too (minimum requirements for ballot slots) and also, interesting content during the countdown - ESPECIALLY quotes from ilxors who discussed the album, or submitted comments w/ their ballots.

I ask every year for comments and blurbs but nobody is interested. They prefer to keep those for their dayjob.

but if you want to pay them go ahead :)

at the very least it's not hard to write a sentence, or fragment, about what you like about the album

you can't do blurbs AND do 50+ results rollouts, gotta decide whether to focus on quantity or quality.

I just voted for top 50, mainly because it seems more manageable from my end. I can totally accept the argument that a bigger roll-out can and would open people's eyes to records they may not have discovered, and that's perfectly fine, but as Jeff said it can get intimidating to miss a few. I barely kept up with last year's.

Also, the large roll-outs do tend to lose the element of surprise when you get down to the top 10. If we stuck to, say, a top 50, the last few could really keep people guessing. That's a good thing in my view.

Top 50, then before #1 is revealed, a honorable mention list of the above 50 in no particular order (and no more than another 50)with brief descriptions of who and/or what...

I'm sort of torn here: I got a serious kick out of seeing some of my favorite albums place in the #101-#125 range last year; in a lot of ways that might've been my favorite part of the poll.

And yet I feel like EZ has a point.

I guess my thing is that the more expanded rollout imo worked brilliantly in the 80s poll because that decade had been polled to death, and your approach to it was a genuinely original one to take. It cast the decade in a completely different light and I think in those circumstances, that poll was a good place to introduce people to new records.

But I kind of feel like not every poll has to necessarily function like that. From my limited exposure to it, I don't really feel like the EOY metal poll is the ideal place to introduce new records; I feel like ppl who are looking for 50+ new metal records for this year to listen to have already found that. Which doesn't mean that you can't do a rollout of >50, just that maybe there are other purposes for this rollout to consider that might more ably suit it...

Like besides Fastnbulbous, I don't think a single person paid any attention to the Windhand album because it made #109 in the albums poll last year. My pleasure at seeing it place was purely selfish.

Anyways, I took FnB's cue and voted 100 in the spirit of compromise.

More pressing question for me: will stuff from the spacerock thread qualify?

actually Sean's idea is p great

Of course it is!! xp! lol!

I voted 100 but honestly I don't think their were a 100 hundred good metal albums put out this year (at least I've only listened to about a dozen I've really liked)...

And don't count on me to help with the planning or roll-out. Everytime me or AG get involved the trolls come in and ruin it. I'll participate but I'm preemptively resigning as a poll runner.

(WRT Space Rock -- if it can be described as "heavy psych" then I think it qualifies for sure. If its really just new age w/ guitars -- IMO it fit with the whole family of metal IMO. One exception being a typically metal-oriented artist doing an artsy side-project thing.)

*it DOESN'T fit...

Anyway, I didn't mean to suggest there wasn't a TON of great albums, I just don't know about them yet and I have persnickety tastes about what I like. I think a 100 rollout is long enough, 50 is too short (it will all be just the obvious stuff everyone knows about), and I wouldn't be disappointed by a 100+ as I genuinely enjoy long drawn out rollouts...

As for artist/album discovery, I tend to do this during the nomination phase. I understand a lot of people don't have the time or inclination for that but that's why I feel 100 is a good number and its ok to let the outliers be outliers... do yer due diligence!!

I am also out, this whole thing has turned into no fun to run, last year being particularly bad. This shit is a lot of work and a pain in the ass, and getting sniped at during the rollout for crazy shit like falsifying the results was the final straw for me. I hope somebody else steps up, and I'm sure I will participate, but I've pretty much had it with co-running the thing, sorry AG.

OK

As for jjj's -

and getting sniped at during the rollout for crazy shit like falsifying the results was the final straw for me.

This is what it refers to(not last years eoy poll), and yes jf has apologised many times(which i accepted every time), but he still snipes and you will notice that BILL who started the accusations never did apologise.Although it was really JF who ran with it(keep reading down from the 1st link) esp to this bit YOU TOTALLY MISSED THE ILX HEAVY ROCK/METAL ALBUM POLL COUNTDOWN, SUCKA (CLICK FOR A RECAP) but he doesn't deserve all the blame
YOU TOTALLY MISSED THE ILX HEAVY ROCK/METAL ALBUM POLL COUNTDOWN, SUCKA (CLICK FOR A RECAP)

Now:

jjj and viceroy, I totally understand about it being no fun and why you're resigning. I do not blame you. The same people (johnny fever,bill,ez snappin) troll every year and its quite clear unless they run it or someone else runs it the way they approve of, they will keep doing it or say they wont vote etc etc.
I feel the way we do a larger roll-out (125 last year) means that

A)More albums get "15 mins of fame" and are more likely to get checked out when it places in a countdown (complete with Spotify link) than after the polls done and ballots are published (not everyone even posts theirs!)
Maybe its psychological but seeing an album placed in a countdown means people really will check it out whereas if its missed out , its seen as not being in the list therefore not worth checking out apart from the fewer amount of people who do check out ballots at the end.

B)I feel a longer rollout than 50 encourages more people to vote if they know their more 'obscure' but equally as good albums stand a chance of making the poll.
The reason the metal poll was set up was because metal wasn't getting in the EOY poll and metal fans weren't voting as they felt it was a waste of time voting as they felt there was no chance of getting more than 1 or 2 token crossover p4k approved albums in it.
Then some of the metal fans felt that the more obscure dm/bm wasn't making it so the metal poll rollout was extended . That pleased those voters and they turned out in numbers.
Lots of really good albums were introduced to greater ilx as a result. Would be a real shame if that was lost and people feel its not worth voting as their albums have no chance of making it.

However since Glenn has already said he's not doing it this year and now viceroy/jjj & henry have resigned I think it's a good time for me to resign too and the poll can have a fresh start with a new team behind it. It will stop this nonsense and everyone can start from year zero. Leave all the stupid shit behind.

Plenty of people have an opinion on how it should be run and someone should volunteer to take over.
Last year we had 74 ballots and the year before 80 ballots so people are happy how its run (mostly) if you take that into account .
Seandalai has already said he will set up voting forms and tabulate which is basically most of the hard work. You just need to set the rules, run nomination thread,voting thread then do a rollout or full list in 1 go. Whatever you choose.

Johnny Fever is infact good at running his own polls and I believe he would be a good choice and ez snappin & bill could help him out. (at least that way the poll will run smoothly as they cant snipe at their own poll).

I would like to see them takeover and run it as they wish and I will still vote n stuff (sans sniping) and I wish them every bit of luck with it.
I hope everyone will enjoy it and you all participate in large numbers as before and give us a good poll.

I hope you guys will run the poll, have fun and everyone enjoys it.

JF,EZ & Bill. I hold no grudges against you. I still like you guys, sure we have disagreements but not talking to one another,hassling etc would be stupid and, its not for me, at least. As far as I'm concerned its all done and forgotten.

Just concentrate on the poll and make sure its a good one.

Thanks to all who voted in the past , I hope you discovered lots of good albums and had fun.
On behalf of myself and the others - I hope you all enjoy future polls no matter who runs it.

I miss Twisted Pollstarter.

um

I know I am going to regret adding my two cents here, but why was this thread started if you know how you like to run the poll? Just do it how you like - all this seems to be is a chance for either pre-emptive validation or having a pop at people who have different ideas to you. You seem to be pretty good at running polls, even when people are initially against your ideas, so seriously, just go for it.

EZ & JF came on this thread and said nothing trolly at all, they merely stated their preferences. Do you not see how calling that trolling is ridiculous, when that is what you claim to have started the thread for?

Also: jf has apologised many times(which i accepted every time), but he still snipes... it was really JF who ran with it(keep reading down from the 1st link) esp to this bit - you can't say you accepted the apology if you're still going on about it and using it as a weapon. That's not what accepting an apology is.

Really, already regretting posting here. Shoot me now.

Please don't! I just had a dream!

http://static2.dmcdn.net/static/video/456/794/21497654:jpeg_preview_large.jpg?20120423161811

daer emil.y its not my concern now. We all resigned to let them takeover and run the poll the way they think it should be as they have been harping on about it for every poll.

Please note 2 other people resigned first because of their trolling to which I followed. I note you don't reference them and seem to want to lay it all on me. You may not think they were trolling this time but bear in mind they have been trolling for years and know how to push buttons while appearing reasonable to outsiders. Do you really think the others would resign for nothing? We all resigned over the same thing and the same people who trolled for years. Also it was jjj who first brought up the jf accusing us all of cheating,not me. I just explained it for people who may be unaware of it and might believe the bs about being reasonable.

oh and the poll was because of this . Where it was made clear that everyone should have a say and i shouldn't run it how I want to.

but since this thing is supposed to be for the community and not something that you came up with yourself (like the 70s and 80s polls), I feel like the community does have a say in the rollout – And it seems like the community is saying that they want a smaller list.

― Bound by Habitrails (J3ff T.), Friday, 26 October 2012 18:15 (20 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

AG, neither EZ nor I give approximately ANY fucks about this EOY metal poll. I was responding to comments he made that were pasted over from the rolling metal thread when the topic was brought up there. I thought they were on point and said so. You, my friend, are the one who became a complete drama queen at even the sight of him or I in this thread, regardless of what either of us were actually saying.

As for the kerfuffle on the all-time poll, for which I've apologized about 50 times now, and you say you're past but continue to bring it up every single chance you get, that's your baggage at this point. My conscience is clear.

Also it was jjj who first brought up

anyway you & ez are now free to run the poll the way you want to. Have fun.

Your reading comprehension is for shit.

It's my suspicion that you simply don't want to do the EOY metal poll this year and, instead of making a dignified and well-reasoned exit, you want to pin it on "trolls" who aren't even being anything resembling trolly. Be an adult, AG.

Wow, I just went back and read the dust-up in the all-time poll for the first time since it happened and even then I don't think I come across as a troll. I had clearly been misinformed about whom the voting body was comprised of, and admitted that rather quickly. All this time I'd been remembering myself being a total dickhead, but actually I was just confused as hell.

Nope. I reject any responsibility for any of this.

jf you seem to wilfully ignore the fact the other 2 quit first BECAUSE OF YOU and others trolling the poll EVERY year. But you like to wilfully ignore everything so you can just try and make it all about me.
or

Can someone (non-combatively) explain the fixation on polls in general? Is that really the reason people come to ILX - to vote in polls? It's certainly not why I come here, and I suspect I'm not some weird antisocial outlier in that regard.

they are (used to be at least) fun for the people taking part.

And it leads to people finding out about good music that they didn't know about previously (hence me using longer rollouts).
Others have different reasons for liking polls of course. Some just like the suspense of polls.

Despite your protestations of innocence, JF, you're the biggest troll of metal and rock threads I know. You can deny it, but whatever man... I'm checking out of this thread now before I start getting too many posts flagged.

just for the record no one trolled the 2010 or 2011 metal polls

There's a definite misunderstanding of the definition of "troll" with you guys. Dissention? Maybe. But it's not like I posted 100 goatse pics in any of your threads.

yeah also that

I was reading through Rolling Metal this morning and I feel like EZ at least is getting a bad smear job here. Here are his first four posts* from the exchange (also c&p'd upthread):

Not if you're rolling out 200 albums, but if you want to do 50 or whatever than cool.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:14 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I'm not rehashing the argument for the umpteenth time. As with your other polls, feel free to do without my input. As poll runner that's your right, and others enjoy so go with my blessing.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:19 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Yep. Same as I haven't voted in the 70s or 80s polls. I don't enjoy them so don't participate.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:25 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Yes. I enjoy polls that are as much about what placed as where it placed. I like the suspense; it keeps me engaged where a long rollout doesn't. It's all personal preference.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:36 (59 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

now true--EZ did say that you were going to do a top 200 out of nowhere, but the pollrunners were arguing as if that was a reasonable expectation (not "top 200 wd be silly", but "what difference does it make?"). But anyways, for the rest of it, he is saying things like feel free to do without my input", "go with my blessing", "it's all personal preference": word usage inidcative not of a troll but of somebody attempting to agree to disagree. I have zero problem with anyone in this thread, and I'm not super familiar with similar problems to execute the metal poll in the prior years, but I'd hate to see EZ go down as the troll who ruined it for everyone this year when I think he really was just amicably saying that he might not vote.

everybody is cool here, I just really want to say a good word for EZ

Likewise. That's the only reason I even posted on this thread in the first place.

I voted for top 50.

can i vote "i dont care as long as im not spammed about it"

Can I vote "I don't give a fuck and can you please stop projecting against some people who might have disagreed with you one time (but can you please not count this disagreement as "trolling" so you don't count me in with them) and if you want to poll the top metal releases of the year just get on with it".

you can't please all the people all the time...

bailing out at the first sign of the slightest criticism is weak sauce.. Bailing cuz suggestions of a different way, also weak sauce. Bailing cuz others bailed, weak sauce. Thinking these guys trolled anything, weak sauce.

You live for the EOY poll, Kerr, Do it. Who gives a flying fuck all what anyone thinks of how its done. If you can't handle any sort of opposition, then you shouldn't be on the innerwebs at all.

too much weak sauce = absolute FAIL!

You pretty much freaked out and failed pretty hard on your response to any and all of this Kerr, Sorry, Bro.

look sean,apart from the fact I've obviously burned my bridges here as long as i run the poll then some people wont vote and wont be happy unless i run it their way and arguments will continue. And jeff is right, its the metal thread regulars poll and its for them to decide on how its run and who its run by or if they even want one. I know everyone must be sick of it, i know the 3 of us who resigned are. This is not a diss on jeff btw. He's quite right to have said it.

Ez, im sorry for blaming you. I overreacted because of previous arguments with you in other polls and I suppose because you're friends with jf. Any problems with him should not be taken out on other people. I'm sorry to have offended you and i value your friendship and im sorry to have lost that. Please accept my genuine apology. I would hope that whoever runs the poll will be able to count on your vote and that plenty of others vote too.

Apology accepted, water under the bridge, etc.

you never vote in the polls so why vote no?

― Algerian Goalkeeper, Friday, October 26, 2012 5:00 PM (3 days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Democracy at work baby. voting no.

Johnny Fever is not a troll, stop saying that

but he still snipes and you will notice that BILL who started the accusations never did apologise.

^what?????? apologize for what?

I have to agree with some dude. If you're willing to let bygones be bygones with me you owe Johnny the same courtesy. Whatever past issues you have they aren't relevant to this discussion; he wasn't rude or abusive or anything but supporting my viewpoint here, and it would be good of you to let it be just that. Not saying that if JF or I do snark or snipe at you down the road that you can't be pissed, but I would hope your apology can include him too.

Bill: the accusation in one of the allitime metal polls (I think it was albums?) that the results were rigged

Hahahahaha, that's a funny accusation, i wouldnt have said something like that. If i implied it my tongue was firmly in cheek. I dont care enough about polls to have levied such an accusation.

I think that's what it was about at least. in all honesty, I might be wrong about that.

huh, i guess i thought that poll fixing thing was last year but it was longer ago than that. it makes sense though, i remember having to be kind of dragged into doing the EOY metal poll last year by AG, and completely sat out the 80s poll despite being asked to help with it because i kind of have a bad taste in my mouth abt it.

also (and obv I have no issue w/you as a poster or person and all that stuff JF), JF totally does troll poll threads. I think its meant in a constructive way because I think he has pretty strong ideas about how polls should be run, but between the weird falsified votes thing, and then showing up like 15 times in the beginning to snipe about the long rollout on the 80s poll that seems pretty clear. i think the prob is that people take this stuff too personally (myself included), its just a temporary poll result, and yeah, i dont think doing it is fun anymore, but somebody else ought to take a crack at it.

Actually, the 80s rock poll is what changed my approach to interacting with AG about polls. I've been rude in the past and I was rude on the 80s thread, but once that dust up died down I realized its a pointless endeavor. When I chimed in on this thread here, I did so in a calm way and, imo, have remained calm throughout. I'm sorry for being a crank in the past, but I'm being unjustly branded a troll in this particular thread (and in any AG-run poll thread in the future). I'VE SEEN THE LIGHT!

JF polls are run like 800 times better than AG polls so let him count the ways imo

Looks like you got the job JF!

I'll be busy with the broader EOY polls, but thanks.

As was stated by AG, the EOY poll seems to turn people on to new music they might not have heard. So with that as the main reason for it, maybe just do a recap of the years releases.. those who want to particpate can still post a top whatever list of the year, but instead of trying to calculate some sort of standings, which I personally could give two shits about the order these things are in, i just like seeing the list!

List em in no particular order.. the 100 cool things that came oput this year as contributed by the ixl faithful..
Sounds a lot easier, and gives everyone a run down of the years gems.

Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

The noes have it!

No POLL
My babe
No POLL

i'm not a metal fan, in fact i hate it, didn't vote but don't think you should go by these results either. there are just haters out there, they just click on this poll and hit no poll just to fuck with things. get the results from the people who posted in this thread instead and go from there. don't go by the results those people are just fucking with you.

i say throw out a poll, that is what ILM is all about!

to be fair quite a lot of ilm's poll haters are metal thread regulars.

or go with the field instead against no poll and more people want it than not.

I don't know if it's statistically accurate to say "no poll" "won"... The people who wanted a poll split their votes among the different quantity-of-rollout levels... By my calculations, 43 people still want a poll of some sort versus the 20 haters.

Not a big metal fan, would probably not read a fifty item thread, definitely not a hundred item rollout, but definitely would read hilarious meta-thread about what kind of poll to have.

Yeah dude, looks like more than twice the number of naysayers (who wouldn't vote in the poll anyway) want a metal poll. We like the metal poll, AG, and we appreciate that you run it, I think people just get sick of the drama surrounding the actual running of the thing every year. If you just ran the thing without melting down like this, I think you'd find that it would go pretty smoothly!

^otm

Apart from the fact the same people criticise every year and my co-runners also pulled out(would not do it without jjj at least as he's always been there but i appreciate the viceroy doesnt have the time hence him not helping with 70s poll too).

Its quite obvious most of you want a top 50 and I don't.
I do not like top 50s, they are too restricting and I firmly believe that a 125 like last year helped introduce way more albums.
When results are rolling out some people are intrigued and check out albums as they get posted on Spotify or wherever .
If a full list is posted at the end most will have decided they're not worth checking out as they weren't in the rollout.
It's the rollout that gives people the impetus to check those albums out.
That is how I do my polls.

However this poll is the metal threads poll and people want it done differently. The vote is clear and you all voted for a top 50. So someone else should run it. I think johnny fever should takeover as he is the one who every year makes it firmly known it should be 50 albums and that his polls are better than mine. Nothing wrong with him having that opinion, he might even be right but I just would like to see him back it up by running the metal poll this year. I'm sure the fact the numbers back him up in this poll will mean he runs a very successful poll and I look forward to the results (stuck away down the list - hah!)

I'm sure none of you would have a problem with him running it if he agrees to do it this year?
He might even get metal thread regulars to vote who don't normally vote. Something that I have never been able to achieve. Far too many wont vote and I cant change their minds. And I know it annoys them even if I bother trying. If the poll was to represent all the rolling metal thread regulars opinions then I have failed. Hopefully now that we have stepped aside others will take part. That will make it the best poll we ever had if everyone votes and comments.

Mind you if you look at the figures 21 people do want at least 100 in a rollout haha

20 want smaller and 2 people dont care they just want a full list without a rollout and 20 dont want a poll at all.
The list voters have the casting vote!

Its quite obvious most of you want a top 50 and I don't.
I do not like top 50s, they are too restricting and I firmly believe that a 125 like last year helped introduce way more albums.

Why did you even conduct a poll about the poll, then? You invite drama, man.

The vote is clear and you all voted for a top 50. So someone else should run it. I think johnny fever should takeover as he is the one who every year makes it firmly known it should be 50 albums and that his polls are better than mine. Nothing wrong with him having that opinion, he might even be right but I just would like to see him back it up by running the metal poll this year.

I will be busy with the major all-genre ILM poll, and I really have no interest in running a poll about music I find mostly ridiculous/stupid/growly/boring. Thanks for considering me again, though!

You're welcome!

psst, you should do a top 77 like the all-genre EOY poll. VIVA LA SEVENTY SEVEN!

that's too in-jokey for me

I will be busy with the major all-genre ILM poll, and I really have no interest in running a poll about music I find mostly ridiculous/stupid/growly/boring.

dude

lol, AG knows my opinion on most metal made past the year...let's say...1989. 80s thrash, 80s pop metal, and some punk-metal fusion and some nwobhm is about all I'm into.

I don't listen to metal, I will run this poll impartially and unprejudicedly

top 666 or gfto

gfto?

hmmm

glad we resolved this

or not.

since the majority of ppl want to have a poll of some kind, i'd be willing to run it if no one else has a burning desire to do so.

This poll poll result is split too many ways.

Maybe you should have a straight poll/no poll poll poll then if poll wins have a poll poll without a no poll option.

Poll.

what about a Top One poll? imagine the tension! what will the top one be? ?

Snake and Snake 2

snake 1 = 1080
snake 2 = 2097

i have got a nokia 3210 nd my higest score is 1080 in 1 and 2097 in2 i want more score i am from india

― muneeb saleem, Sunday, March 7, 2004

of the 41 voters who wanted a poll, the average number of results desired (counting "100+" as 150) is ~85. including the pollhaters the average is ~57.

sometimes my snake goes backwards and the food eats IT..... is their something wrong with my phone?, so far the food has a top snake of 1.

― snake master, Thursday, May 20, 2004 9:33 PM

Top 100+ category supports top 100, so it should be combined with top 100. Thus, Top 100 or more = 21 votes for the win. Given that AG does all the work, he can decide whether to do 100 or 125 or whatever. Let's do this.

I don't know if it's statistically accurate to say "no poll" "won"... The people who wanted a poll split their votes among the different quantity-of-rollout levels

I appreciate the EOY poll but, as I've mentioned, I didn't vote in this because I have no strong opinion on how long the rollout should be. (I'll check out the top 20 regardless.) So there may be other people who prefer having a poll to not having a poll but who didn't vote in this pre-poll poll.

other people who prefer having a poll to not having a poll but who didn't vote in this pre-poll poll

Sorry! It was produced by Oliver Stone. Who doesn't get those two confused amirite?!

Oops! Wrong thread!
Whatta day.

What kind of "What kind of EOY Metal Poll do you want this year?" poll do you want this year?

counting 100+ as "100" gives us ~73 for poll-wanters or ~49 for all voters, the hypotenuse of that triangle is ~88, 88 is neo nazi code for "HH," that is, "heil hitler," whose birthday is 4/20 so the top 420 metal albums should be polled. obviously.

the people have spoken

EOY Metal Poll's Terrifying New Math

evidence of 88 entering the collective subconscious

OTM

I guess there hasn't been many votes this year...?

nope. Only 11. A lot of regulars haven't voted. Im beginning to think the shorter rollout last year pissed off the lurkers as they just haven't showed up nevermind the thread regulars.

No way to know of course as they're lurkers who wont post!

2010 had 80 ballots
2011 had 74 ballots
2012 under new management there was 51 ballots

I'll vote, but the only album I care enough to vote for is Power Trip's.

cheers jf. Think it may be its last year tho :(

I know I haven't promoted it like I did in the other years I ran it but people complained a lot and this years been stress free as I havent. No win situation.

Time for someone else to volunteer to run it?

Mordy suggested that someone else should run it now but will anyone volunteer?

I will volunteer however, fair warning here, as a poll-hater I will auto-delete all ballots unread, on balance I'm probably the wrong guy for the job