2014 Rock and Roll Hall of Fame Nominees POLL

The Purp.

But I think they all are worthy candidates.

why do they nominate hip hop for this

Because they're the new rock stars.

do you think anyone would have minded if on 9/11 al qaeda targeted the house of reps + the rock and roll hall of fame museum rather than the pentagon + wtc

except for KISS these are all solid acts imho

How in fuck is Link Wray not already in? I assumed he was inducted in the 80s.

This bears repeating:

"Kiss is not a great band, Kiss was never a great band, Kiss never will be a great band, and I have done my share to keep them off the ballot." -- Dave Marsh

Nirvana is the sure bet, and what the Hall of Fame is about. NWA is the actual rockstars, what the Hall of Fame should be about. And The Zombies are a sentimental favorite without a chance in hell. Who I'm probably gonna vote for anyway. Time of the Season, man.

anyone who doesn't vote Chic is a disgusting savage

If the question is "most deserving" I don't know how anyone can argue with Nirvana, whether you like 'em or not, would vote for 'em or not, etc. No disrespect to any of the other artists on the list, of course.

And yes, wtf at Link Wray not already in.

Chic and The Meters are the other criminal past omissions.

Voting ll

I always vote for whoever I most want at the closing jam

really suprised Deep Purple and Link Wray arent' in

If mats get in they should do a flip on Madonna bringing the stooges and have lorde perform in their place

shocked link wray isn't in but vote for the meters.

I'd put in Nirvana, the Replacements, and LL Cool J...and I suppose Linda Ronstadt, too. (Historically, in terms of female pop stars, I certainly consider her more significant than Chrissie Hynde or Annie Lennox.) As to who will go in, I'd say Nirvana and Ronstadt are the two best bets from that list (Nirvana obviously automatic).

would've voted H&O but I want to conserve my energy for Facebook fights.

Sorry, missed Chic--I'd probably put them in too. So much of their case rests on two or three hugely important songs, though, and those are the toughest calls.

Only 1 choice? That's impossible on a very strong ballot. I voted Chic but could have also went with H&O, Yes, Meters, Ronstadt and others.

Nirvana is a ringer. I'll vote for Chic. Especially with Get Lucky being so huge.

why do they nominate hip hop for this

― sleepingbag, Wednesday, October 16, 2013 12:18 PM (7 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

why does rock and roll need a hall of fame and why do people give a shit about it

(voted chic obv)

Hall & Oates not being in already is disgusting savagery.

sex pistols' response to their invite is the only thing justifying the existence of the rock'n'roll hall of fame

N.W.A.

Yes NO!
Voted: Link Wray

Link Wray or GTFO

Voting Link Wray then The Meters then Chic.

Would love to see Yes get in, but voted Link Wray because without him (and Bo Diddley and Chuck Berry and a few others, obviously) there basically wouldn't even be rock guitar.

voted YES. something uneasy about that, but YES

i thought the rock and roll hall of fame was proverbial

link fucking wray

aside from KISS i'd be ok with pretty much the whole list getting in but voted for Link Wray cuz he's way overdue

i guess cat stevens shouldn't really be in...

there will be a "fans ballot" determined by an online poll http://rockhall.com/get-involved/interact/poll/

I voted for Chic, LL, The Meters, The Replacements and The Zombies.

write-in vote for Question Mark and the Mysterians

Voting Link Wray then The Meters then Chic.

― Boards of Komeda (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, October 16, 2013 7:15 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

link >>>>>>>>>>>>>> meters >>>>>>>>>>>> chic >> everything else

Torn between H&O and The Zombies

Deep Purple and Yes, and i dont really give a shit about any of the others. Get some prog in there

here is a hilarious carpet bombing of the farce that is the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame

http://www.salon.com/2013/10/17/keep_the_replacements_out_of_the_rock_hall/

I think the HoF started out with decent intentions, mainly, to credit artists who wouldn't have otherwise received such recognition by any other institution. It seems strange to think about now, but in 1986 the Grammys weren't about to hand out lifetime achievement awards to Chuck Berry, Bo Diddley, or Little Richard, never mind recognizing Robert Johnson or Charlie Christian.

When it comes down to it it's basically just a big museum. It cracks me up that people get so butthurt about it. The actual "hall of fame" part is so preposterously unobjective that why anybody cares is beyond me.

Yeah, otm. Still, until Caetano Veloso and Gilberto Gil gets in, I will be mad as hell!

Voting The Meters for museology's sake. This institution means nothing if they let everyone in!

Chic
Peter Gabriel
Hall and Oates
The Replacements
Linda Ronstadt

Apparently the only thing I don't like about the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame is the rock & roll.

Also, I love the Replacements but they just don't belong there! There ought to be a Pete Rose option for this thing.

This institution means nothing if they let everyone in!

Yeah, that's pretty much how I feel about it. When the Dead got in before the MC5 (who still aren't in), that was the moment for me where it lost whatever credibility it might've had.

Cool museum, though. They have Louis Jordan's saxophone!

No one should want to be associated with an institution that inducted Eric Clapton three separate times before it got to Buddy Guy.

lol

STORM THE umm..

Its a great line, i also like the line about Zeppelin's thievery

to credit artists who wouldn't have otherwise received such recognition

I agree--and hope, in time, that will also extend to the New York Dolls and Husker Dus and Schoolly-Ds of the world. (I realize at least one of them has zero chance.)

Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.

Most desereving is the key element of theis poll.. Nirvana.

One day, it will be Showaddywaddy's turn

Poll = a great reminder to listen to East West again

"...strictly crafted for straight teenage boys and young men (and then, inevitably, old men)." Isn't this exactly WHY the Replacements should be in there?

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

justice

Voted for Link, but can't argue with these results.

Yes 6
Deep Purple 3

no

no, no, no

"Nirvana, KISS, Linda Ronstadt among Rock and Roll Hall of Fame inductees"
http://www.cnn.com/2013/12/17/showbiz/rock-and-roll-hall-of-fame-2014/

LOL, very pointed.

I was defending Cat Stevens not one week ago. But this...

rock, schlock, pop-to-stiffen-yr-cock

man if chic didn't make it after this year i don't know what it would take

otm, that was my first thought. i guess, hate to get all downer here, but, at this point it might take Nile's eventual (hopefully far, far in the future) passing to get them in.

yeah i didn't want to go there but that's what it took w/ donna summer. i figured daft punk would have the same effect but i guess not. it might just take demographic changes though that could work against chic for all i know, going from rock critics that hate disco to rock critics that aren't familiar w/ it.

Man, this is one poll I'm glad I voted in.

How many of the HOF voters are critics/journos anyway? Given who got in over Chic this year, I really want to know: who the fuck are these people?

the same group that inducted the red hot chili peppers

don't forget green day's a lock next year

pearl jam the one after that

maybe soundgarden will get in the year after just to make up for the lack of an arena rock legend that debuted in 1992. unless they go balls-out and induct STP

critically respected arena rock legend i mean (sorry deep purple)

with the tv element you can't blame them for making sure to rush in a still viable gen x totem asap

when 1992 debut acts are eligible i do believe IT'S TIME FOR RAGE

no doubt the other big altrock act debut that year that's conceivable (i guess stp is conceivable though)(still actually like more stp than pearl jam even if actual respect is decidedly in pearl jam's favor). other possibilities: pj harvey, tori amos. dre w/ the chronic, first mary j blige album in 92 and she seems like the kind of contemporary r&b act who's got a shot (ie she has recorded w/ bono). i'd like to think tlc have a shot. i'd really like to think swv have a shot but who am i kidding.

has any r&b act (or hell, any woman) been inducted in their first eligible year?

rhcp, gnr and nirvana are the only combos of late that come to mind

oh wait actually rhcp waited a few years

How many of the HOF voters are critics/journos anyway? Given who got in over Chic this year, I really want to know: who the fuck are these people?

― thewufs, Tuesday, December 17, 2013 1:31 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I don't know, but Dave Marsh is on the nominating committee, and he said (quoted upthread) that he'd do everything he could to keep Kiss out. Guess there's only so much one committeeperson can do.

when you said "its time for rage" i honestly thought you were describing the emotion not the band

may we live to find out if the foo fighters are immediately inducted in 2019

lord knows dave's put in the networking

I hope that the ghosts of Link Wray, Tony Thompson, Bernard Edwards, Bob Stinson, and Eazy-E haunt the fuck out of the Kiss voters for all eternity.

fucking foo fighters

the acts of late that got almost immediately upon eligibility

2014: Nirvana (first eligible year)
2013: Public Enemy (second eligible year)
2012: Guns'n'Roses (first eligible year), Beastie Boys (second eligible year)
2009: Run-DMC (first eligible year), Metallica (second eligible year)
2008: Madonna (first eligible year)
2007: REM (apparently they counted Chronic Town as the first album!), Grandmaster Flash and the Furious Five (first eligible year)
2005: U2 (First eligible year), Pretenders (first/second eligible year)

so I guess I was off - two women, a LOT of rap

inducting mozzarella sticks into the pizza HOF

2004: Prince (second eligible year)
2003: The Police (first eligible year), Elvis Costello (second eligible year), The Clash (second eligible year)
2002: Talking Heads (first eligible year), The Ramones (second eligible year), Tom Petty (second eligible year)

so - with tom petty and metallica as the exceptions to the rule - the best way to get into the HOF licketysplit is to be in the Spin Alternative Record Guide!

and if they'd done that book after their lollapalooza metallica might have been in it

I hope that the ghosts of Link Wray, Tony Thompson, Bernard Edwards, Bob Stinson, and Eazy-E haunt the fuck out of the Kiss voters for all eternity.

― Montgomery Burns' Jazz (Tarfumes The Escape Goat), Tuesday, December 17, 2013 3:04 PM (9 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

and Tommy Bolin

there have been some but it has been quite a while and not any that would bolster any 'the rrhof loves r&b' arguments - it looks like otis redding, stevie wonder, and the temptations in 89 is the last one as far as i can tell. i thought al green went in right away but checking he'd been eligible a couple of years when he went in. tbf this is kind of the pattern for a while now, very few first year of eligibility (/= first year on ballot) inductees really - michael jackson didn't, bowie didn't, pink floyd didn't which is insane considering their debut is a major part of their story.

SPIN approval + a gold if not platinum record, so yeah i'd say green day within two years after pearl jam asap

and pearl jam asap i meant

2004: Prince (second eligible year)

Who the fuck was on the fence about Prince?

haha it's always cracked me up that that spin guide singles out metallica (and squeeze iirc) as acts that were alternative once but aren't anymore and then metallica headline like the very next lollapalooza. the dream is over!

that kiss, h&o and cat stevens got in suggests the boomer critics don't even remember what they liked, or that gen x'ers are fucking up their shit

chic as barry bonds, RHCP as jim rice

with all due respect to the deep purple brigade my big "this is seriously an injustice, it's been a decade" band is the cure

also eligibility is 25 years from first record, not first album ie beatles go in 25 years after 'love me do' not please please me. this definition seems to be poorly defined though as i remember r.e.m. definitely being announced as going in first year of eligibility though that's 26 after 'radio free europe'. u2 theoretically eligible earlier as well.

Fans were able to participate in the selection of the inductees through voting. The top five artists from online public voting made it onto a "fans' ballot" that was tallied along with the other ballots for the Class of 2014. The inductees were chosen by a secret ballot of 600 voters, a group that includes previous inductees, music industry veterans, historians and critics.

Who are these 600 voters?

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2008/POLITICS/11/05/angry.mccain.supporters/art.mccain.vote.gi.jpg

there are ilxors who vote in this thing

that kiss, h&o and cat stevens got in suggests the boomer critics don't even remember what they liked, or that gen x'ers are fucking up their shit

― da croupier

the latter i think, were any of these acts on the ballot before even? kiss induction reminds me of rush induction where all it took was one shot past the gatekeepers. something poetic (maybe not poetic, maybe hilarious?) about them going in w/ nirvana and over the replacements and it being announced the day of the last best show on wfmu. i wonder if gene will call in tonight.

so wait what happened to Dave Marsh wanting KISS inducted over his dead body?

acts in the spin alternative record guide top 100 who have gold or platinum albums and have not been inducted yet (And i'm sticking with first album in terms of eligibility just cuz REM's the only one in the last decade who got in before their first album was):

CHIC.

'80s rap legends with even less crossover than PE - Eric B & Rakim, De La Soul, Boogie Down Productions, Tribe (eligible in a year)

some influential new wavers Dave Marsh might think are overrated - The B-52's, Devo, The Go-Gos, The Pet Shop Boys, Violent Femmes, New Order

some folks who will eligible soon - The Breeders (eligible next year), Hole (eligible in two years!), Smashing Pumpkins (eligible in two years!), Liz Phair (eligible in four years!), Beck (eligible in 5!), Moby (eligible NEXT YEAR!)

two very european '70s groups - Abba, Roxy Music (should be noted the big american album is avalon)

throw pixies in with the "influential new wavers" group - forgot they'd accrued gold over the years

haha i can remember sometime in the late 80s mtv news doing man on the street interviews on who should go in the rrhof and some dude responding 'i think kiss should be abducted into the rock and roll hall of fame'. my dad found it so amusing, 'abducted' plus the idea of kiss in the rrhof! hope that dude's got some extra pep in his step today and am tempted to bring up this year inductees at xmas dinner just to see my dad's befuddlement - 'the doobie brothers aren't in there but kiss is????'

lol at KISS getting in instead of (for one) Deep Purple. It's nothing but a beauty pageant!

Is Dave Marsh gonna quit the committee in protest?

don't see Roxy Music getting in anytime soon

abba are in there, roxy music to the eternal shame of the rrhof are not. de la soul had considerably MORE crossover than pe (wait unless you mean critics in which case no hip-hop act has ever had the crossover pe had)(well maybe disposable heroes of hiphopcrisy, eligible in two years). breeders no, hole maybe, smashing pumpkins a lock, liz phair no, beck a lock, moby who knows (it would be fitting considering just how much of his career is due to rock critics trying to grasp 'techno' if he got inducted into the rrhof on the same impulse). those new wavers i'd say maybe except violent femmes who i don't think have a shot really.

Go-Go's and B-52's stand a waaaaay better chance than nauseating synth pop duos like the Boys.

Is Dave Marsh gonna quit the committee in protest?

I wouldn't be surprised. He quit the P&J poll over less.

yeah there's a segment of rock crits that get psb but there's another segment for whome they're a one hit wonder and they'd wonder how they hell they even came up in the discussion.

If it weren't for Clarence Clemons with E Street (and David Sancious and Ernest "Boom" Carter, but I dunno if they're being inducted), this would be the first year with no black inductees.

Mistakenly implied moby album one dropped in 90 but its 92. Not like it matters as he's done a horrible job of maintaining iconhood

Have the Eagles been inducted?

into the Venereal Disease Hall of Fame

aw Alfred, I was setting you up for a "well, yeah"!

it's nice to see the investment in something this meaningless isn't limited to baseball fans.

It's just a parlor game, basically - when the acts you'd vote for get in, you get to feel a little more superior about your own judgment and/or sense of history. When the wrong groups get in you get to grouse about how old and out of touch the HOF voters are. But this year is a doozy - they must be a lot older and whiter and more male than I realized. We really shouldn't be surprised - with a few exceptions, including the token rap groups anyone with ears and eyes could recognize were the Chuck Berrys and Elvises of the style, the HOF's picks over the past decade look like the halfhearted canon of somebody whose critcal engagement with rock and roll ended around, say, 1986.

DON: To be recognized by your peers, to acknowledge that you're all part of this community, giving it back to millions of fans, is truly an honor. It's why we got into the biz in the first place.

GLENN: Henley, if we ever revealed how much shit Irving's got on the governing board we'd be bigger pussies than what we got in Topanga Canyon.

DON: Well, yeah.

Also, the HOF still gets a televised ceremony and loads of national press coverage for their induction ceremonies every year; I doubt any of the great writers who post here can ever hope to command the same kind of attention no matter where their pieces run. Whatever bullshit canon the HOF throws together, it's the only one a lot of casual music fans will ever know.

LOL Alfred

Chris Ott’s Videos
1 Video
http://vimeo.com/user16672669/videos

casual fans of anything can go jump in the volcano

Haha you are the most predictable culture snob ever

he sent a postcard from the volanco

Not caring about or paying any attention to the Rock and Roll (or Baseball) Hall of Fame--understand that.

Getting upset about the Rock and Roll (or Baseball) Hall of Fame--can't imagine getting upset myself (not now, anyway--when I was younger, maybe), but if you care passionately enough about getting it right, I can understand that too.

Saying you don't care and then proceeding to get upset--makes no sense. Not referring to anyone here, but I have encountered that on Facebook.

Yeah, that last one was pretty much the mantra of Rush fans prior to last year. "They should be in it! And it's stupid, anyway!"

It's like the Woody Allen joke that begins Annie Hall: "The food's terrible there--and such small portions."

Not surprised Roxy Music isn't in the R&RHOF, but it's weird to me that Eno isn't in it as a solo artist/lionized producer.

they're super slow on that front, quincy jones only recently made it in

Yeah, but they took so long on Quincy because when he inducted Nesuhi Ertegun in the early 90s his speech primarily consisted of playing up his own achievements, with maybe a sentence or two about Nesuhi. The committee found it disrespectful, and didn't particularly want to sit through another Quincy speech anytime soon.

haha i did not know that

I've always maintained that, sensibly chosen, a British Rock and Roll Hall of Fame would look different at the edges than an American Hall of Fame. Roxy Music and Slade and Nick Drake and the Jam would all make the British version, I imagine.

It'd have a tough time finding any worthy "early [pre-Beatles] influences," though.

i always have to remind myself re: roxy that the chris deburgh stuff is way better known in the US than the glam shit, though even if it was known its not like they've let t rex in

Yep -- "Lady in Red" is the most egregious Roxy ripoff to score in America. A few of these might be worth polling.

I meant that each country would still be inducting artists from the other--just that there'd be British picks over there that wouldn't make sense here.

I'll get grief for this, but (reminder to self: avoid Facebook at certain times): if you think it's great that Hall & Oates are in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, fine, but for someone like me, there's a disconnect between that and getting indignant about other picks and non-picks. Sorry.

H&O are in a strange place. The older nominators don't deny their chops or hitmaking but they weren't exactly lavished with praise at their peak. They're an act who look tailor-made for the joint until you read the fine print.

My sense of them pretty much jibes with this guy's:

http://www.robertchristgau.com/get_artist2.php?id=555

For someone younger like you, Alfred, I can understand where they were all over the radio when you were a certain age, and you look back on those songs with a great deal of nostalgia--like I might look back on the Carpenters or somebody like that. I don't hate them--like "She's Gone," don't mind a couple of the '80s hits. I think they have as much business being in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, as, I don't know, Cat Stevens, who I also like.

(I.e., younger than me--I realize you're not 25 or anything.)

considering hall admonished babyface on stage for calling them "blue-eyed soul" when they accepted some songwriting award (darryl sees no color!), and he's already made some "the suits don't usually go for me" response to this nod, their induction speech should be a trip

i'm hoping he can sound like his moment in the sun is bitterly overdue while also calling out that the delfonics or somebody have yet to be inducted

But that's the thing: nostalgia doesn't color my opinions. I've listened to them plenty. What bothers Christgau about Hall -- he's an asshole looking for kicks -- is precisely what I love about them. He seems to accuse them or their audience of bad faith: the fans want smoochy synth-soul without realizing the songs are mostly nasty kiss-offs. His criticism is spot on for the wrong reasons.

h&o kind of clears the path for acts like journey and bon jovi - multi-decade hitmakers whose big numbers are enjoyed by young people without a lot of irony

...that critics have always found pandering and callow, i mean

kiss too

(xxxposts) Okay--as you might guess, they've never interested me enough to give them any thought. "Sara Smile"'s the other early one I like.

All I've read are the early eighties RS reviews, which are predictably ambivalent. Were H&O as reviled as Journey, KISS, and Bon Jovi?

no, but they're on that spectrum - with michael bolton on the other side

I'm quite sure Bon Jovi will waltz in immediately. Which, again...I approach Bon Jovi and Hall & Oates from old-fogey rock-critic world. There's nothing I can say that would convince anyone who believes such people should be in there.

h&o have been eligible for over a decade longer than bon jovi has been, so i'm not saying they're getting in next year

just that this year makes abundantly clear that critical favor matters less when it comes to '70s-into-'80s artists than enduring jams and cultural cachet

all the ones with critical favor AND enduring jams are already in, probably

def leppard need to go imo, though maybe docked a few points for 'adrenalize'

I tend to see this through the prism of the Baseball Hall of Fame, where the argument often comes down to "I'm an inner-circle person" (where you only admit Babe Ruth and Greg Maddux and people like that) vs. "I'm a big-hall person" (which extends out to Jim Edmonds and Carlos Delgado and such).

So: Elvis is Babe Ruth, and Buffalo Springfield is Carlos Delgado, and when you get to Bon Jovi and Hall & Oates, to me you're in Vince Coleman territory.

critical favor matters less when it comes to '70s-into-'80s artists than enduring jams and cultural cachet

Completely--that's why my frame of reference makes zero sense at this point.

I understand the taxonomy but ugh I'm still repulsed at thinking H&O have anything in common with Bon Jovi besides hair and a regrettable 1990 collab.

with the replacements already making the long-list, i do wonder how the brit side of college rock will fare - like, could husker du get in before the cure?

the smiths will probably get in before too long - enduring jams, cultural cachet, guitar-centric

no. too british, and never rose above cult-status in the US.

and i kinda doubt husker-du or the cure will make it. poison might, tho!

def british, but that cult just gets bigger every year and no keyboardist with a funny haircut to scare the dying boomers

Second poll I ever posted:

The Bert Blyleven Poll

My first instinct was to say the Cure would never get in, but I realize I haven't a clue who votes, and I'm sure I drastically underestimate how loved the Cure are by people 10-15 years younger than I am (I see some of that here). And even though I want to believe Husker Du would one day get in, I might be way off there, too.

morrissey's enough to scare the dying boomers.

blondie got inducted, i'll give you that.

Morrissey's enough to scare Penguin Classics.

i would love a rock-n-roll hall-of-fame that inducted the smiths, husker du, the cure, siouxsie and the banshees, etc.

Oh, very nice
Very nice
Very nice
...Oh, but maybe in the next world
Maybe in the next world

along with having songs kids still worship and critical acclaim, the cure and the smiths are the icons of alt-rock cultures - once pearl jam and green day and the pumpkins get in these guys will seem severely overdue. you're forgetting that the velvets, zappa, patti smith, costello, etc are all in and the replacements are already making the longlist

that said, since the replacements are way more of a American Rock Critic Dude band with a far smaller cult than either the cure (who've had multiple top 40 hits!) or the smiths, it does seem like the bias swings stateside for sure.

hm, how old will morressey be when he's finally inducted into the hall-of-fame?

http://farm2.staticflickr.com/1210/1434983046_b06fd254df.jpg

i have no doubt he'd having charming words the second they made a ballot

yes . . .

• "The smell of burning animals is making me sick. I can smell burning flesh . . . and I hope to God it's rock-n-roll hall-of-fame voters."
• "how could all those dance acts get inducted before me? dance music is the refuge for the mentally deficient. It's made by dull people for dull people"
• "Robert Smith is a whingebag."
• "he rhino is now more or less extinct, and it's not because of global warming or shrinking habitats. It's because of Beyoncé's handbags. By the way, Beyonce should never have been inducted 30 years before me."

Daryl's already bringing the noise!

http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/daryl-hall-stunned-by-hall-and-oates-rock-hall-of-fame-induction-20131216

"Critics were creating a sort of canon of music back in the day and they didn't really understand my roots," says Daryl Hall. "I think Philadelphia has been underrated over the years as a musical region. I wasn't respected for being what I was."

about Hall & Oates, aren't they the biggest selling band of the 80s? so them getting isn't that surprising.

i think Depeche Mode even make it before the Cure or the Smiths if any of theme make it in my lifetime.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ truth

Lol no way mode before cure.

about Hall & Oates, aren't they the biggest selling band of the 80s?

No. Best selling duo ever yes

I doubt Daryl will argue with you though

They don't even have a guitarist

Depeche related xpost. H and o obv had ge smith.

"I haven't a clue. It's probably because they had their own opinions about what constituted exceptional music in that period of time and it was based on a lot of things that I wasn't really interested in. I have slightly different roots than most of the writers."

I'd be interested to know what those roots are. He keeps referring to the "old guard" holding him back--I assume he means the likes of Jann Wenner and Dave Marsh. I believe those folks revere Motown and '60s soul music. What am I missing?...What roots is Daryl Hall referring to?

Blonde ones

Hasil Adkins?

They don't even have a guitarist

only crappy indie rock bands have a guitarist. and, bear in mind, they're crappy.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/style-blog/wp/2013/12/18/a-vote-for-chic-but-not-for-nirvana-a-rock-and-roll-hall-of-famer-voter-explains-her-ballot/

ilxor interviewed

xxp Daryl Hall might be talking about Philly soul which was loved by people like Xgau and Marsh but I guess it did alienate some (most?) critics. none of the Thom Bell groups are in the Hall! H&O got in before the Stylistics or the Spinners.

The O'Jays and the Dells are in, but yeah, that's it. Can't fucking believe the Spinners aren't in.

The O'Jays and the Dells are not Thom Bell groups. did The Dells do anything of note on Philly International? I figured they got in on the strength of their earlier material.

Ah, right, I was thinking more Philly Int'l in general. And you're right, the Dells on PI were in the twilight of their career, iirc.

But jeez, Thom Bell should be in the HoF, too.

the old rock dudes that get the vapors whenever an abba go in are wrong in thinking yr abbas (or hall and oates lol) are garbage but i do sorta agree w/ them in that i think the rrhof might actually be less insulting if it was strictly rock centered and not this fucked up generous rockist definition of 'any rock and any other pop worthy enough to be deemed rock'. it'd be more interesting also.

For the HoF to narrow the parameters would be a step in the wrong direction.

The problem is, this whole stupid fucking marketing idea of "classic rock" that was created/took hold in the mid-80s created these fucked-up and arbitrary distinctions wherein The Moody Blues are Classic Rock, but Bo Diddley, Chuck Berry, and Little Richard are not.

xp who would care about a "rock" hall of fame? this format does have it's problems as does the whole "rock and roll is where pop music stops to suck" boomer rhetoric. they should call it a pop hall of fame, quit with all the "early influence" bullshit and let everything (except jazz, pazz and jop is wise that way) in.

am I way off? was the argument for rock and roll (which is basically everything after Elvis) as this truly autonomous great post war invention every worded convincingly? convincingly in the sense that the author actually seems to know his shit about early pop. more and more it just seems like boomer nostalgia and I get a strong urge to just start digging for all those endless Bing Crosby records and find someone who can convince me that Elvis or Lennon or Brown or Jay-Z are doing anything fundamentally different.

Keep the name, but let everything in: Duke Ellington, Pierre Henry, Webern, Albert Ayler, Sinatra, Merzbow, Stockhausen, Keiji Haino...

o obv it's too late now

fuck it.
i know i am a britisher whose opinion counts for nothing.
but, in the last 6 months the back catalogue of KISS has been more enjoyable, more smile inducing than anything released in years.
yeah, they are old and cliche heavy.
yeah, they are corp loving fuckers.
but damn, the flow of albums from the bands debut to 'love gun' is chocka full of boozed up gems.
oh, and the last 2 albums have been totally worthy of attention.
summary : had i voted, it would have been KISS.

nooooooooo

the old rock dudes that get the vapors whenever an abba go in are wrong in thinking yr abbas (or hall and oates lol) are garbage

For what it's worth, my objection to Hall & Oates is far, far from them not being rock enough. I was very happy to see Madonna go in--she was, and deserved to be, automatic--would love to see the Pet Shop Boys go in, would even (more subjectively) like to see Tommy James go in. I don't think Hall & Oates should be in because, in terms of what they do--pop, pop-soul, call it what you want--I just don't think they're anything special.

yeeeeeeeeees

xp I agree with this (and share the enthusiasm for Madonna/PSB/James) but a large percentage of ilx doesn't which always confused me. I mean yeah, Sara Smile is cool and so is I Can't Go For That but damn...

Really don't have any beef with anyone on that list, as they are all pretty notable artists in one way or another and most were obviously very popular.

The Rock Hall and it's Rolling Stone dorks have a thing against any type of hard rock. Whatever...i'm sure the millions of people that have listened to Deep Purple, Judas Priest and Iron Maiden and gone to their gigs for like 40+ years the world over don't really give a crap about some knick knack store in Cleveland.

If 29 US top 40 hits including seven at #1 isn't "special" in the world of music I don't know what is. What other "pop, pop-soul, call it what you want" acts have a similar track record?

I mean Don Henley should be in the RRHOF and jail.

Well, yeah.

I don't think HOF entry should be conferred solely on chart success/records sales. The Glee cast now has 51 Top 40 hits--should they go in? Katy Perry has eight #1s--should she? On the list of cumulative weeks at #1, Boyz II Men are fourth and Usher is sixth. For most Top 100 entries, Drake is 10th with 65. If you look at lists of biggest-selling albums/artists, you're into Meat Loaf and Linkin Park and Dido.

I'm not saying chart-success/sales shouldn't be part of someone's qualifications. But there has to be more, I believe. Critical acclaim, impact, and influence, roughly speaking. The problem is, measuring those things can be highly subjective.

and KISS have benefited from critical acclaim.

I think Kiss is silly too. And I have lots of nostalgia for Kiss Alive.

Let me amend one sentence: I'm not saying chart-success/sales can't be part of someone's qualifications--if there's more, they strengthen the case for somebody. They don't need to be, though, if the other three are strong enough. For me, the New York Dolls have three of those four things covered; they should be in. Hall & Oates have one of them covered, just like Linkin Park. I mean, I don't know--did Hall & Oates influence anybody? Probably, but my guess would be they only influenced lesser versions of themselves.

Influence is a nebulous point too, no? If I dismiss an artist's claims, I gotta go by my own ears. Spoon, the New Pornos, the 1975 sound influenced by their electro-soul fusion.

I don't think influence is important either. Like the Who are not in solely because of their '64-'67 output. But from Who's Next on, I've never been able to see how they were influential at all. Nobody else sounds like that.

(xpost) Yes--as I said, those other three things are much harder to measure, at least for artists somewhere in the middle. Public Enemy's had lots of critical acclaim, Nickelback's had none. Hall & Oates...on the positive side of neutral, but not by much would be my guess.

The Who are in because of what they did between "I Can't Explain" and Quadrophenia. I wouldn't start chopping that up for pockets of influence. I don't think there's any argument that they weren't influential, is there?

I wouldn't say influence is confined to sounds-like-that, either. I'm sure some of the singer-songwriters in there--Joni Mitchell, Randy Newman, Leonard Cohen--have greatly influenced lots of artists who don't remotely sound like them. In some ways, I'd say that's the most impressive kind of influence (and, again, short of confirmation by the influenced artist, hard to measure).

using acclaimed music as our baseball reference stand in h&o critical acclaim is slightly better than elmore james, the residents, autechre, and the raincoats. slightly worse than little willie john, blind faith, john zorn, saint etienne.

also using baseball metrics comparing itunes era vs when h&o charted is comparable to using steroids era numbers vs mid 60s. glee the equiv of coors field during steroid era obv.

did the who influence a better version of themselves?

Steroids-era comparison dead-on. (I'd add, though, that the shadiness of Hall & Oates' heyday when it came to radio and airplay--thinking of that book Hit Men--balances that somewhat.)

and willie mays and hank aaron were on speed what of it

Willie Mays was fast, yes.

But from Who's Next on, I've never been able to see how they were influential at all.

don't forget likely 2015 inductees Green Day!

think green day's inspiration w/ american idiot and whatever the next one was again might've actually been the kinks though that might just be cuz obv the album before those was obv 'inspired' by the kinks

or Big Country's late eighties albums.

"The Glee cast now has 51 Top 40 hits"

Kind of the equivalent of steroid-ERA power numbers. Chicks dig the dance numbers!

"influenced by" /= "kinda sounds like"

green day covered "my generation" in their youth and wound up making bombastic arena rock opera hoo-ha about teenage wastelands if anybody has a problem with me bringing up the who they can report me to dave marsh

the shadiness of Hall & Oates' heyday when it came to radio and airplay

as if that's changed,

Does "the Glee cast" mean all those people putting out their own records, or did the cast have 51 hits working together? I just checked, and the show's been on since 2009. Do they literally release a new single every month? When they do get inducted, I'd like to know the answers to these questions.

as if the rrhof wasn't in cleveland cuz of alan freed supposedly

every track from each episode is released on itunes after it airs

who is Bob Lefsetz?

All those singing competition shows like American Idol and The Voice nearly always have at least one contestant doing a Hall & Oates song, and I'm pretty sure that I've seen a medley of their stuff on one of them. The producers of those shows definitely consider Darryl Hall one of the greats/"must cover" artists along with Whitney, Mariah, Aretha, Stevie, Celine, etc.

Back in before "What do those shows have to do with rock and roll?"

...i'm sure the millions of people that have listened to Deep Purple, Judas Priest and Iron Maiden and gone to their gigs for like 40+ years the world over don't really give a crap about some knick knack store in Cleveland.

very true. Folks who like these types of bands (and Alice Cooper and Black Sabbath etc) dont give a shit about this stupidity. Except for Eddie Trunk for some reason who cant let it go.

Eddie won't rest until the greatest rock band of all time, UFO, has its own wing of the Hall of Fame

Im a fan of UFO (see my display name) but that guy is obsessed. Its hilarious.

Folks who like these types of bands (and Alice Cooper and Black Sabbath etc) dont give a shit about this stupidity. Except for Eddie Trunk for some reason who cant let it go.

You say that, but I have a looooot of friends who are into hard rock/hair metal/pop metal etc. who have been very, very irate about the whole KISS thing over the years, and are irate about Deep Purple now, and Judas Priest etc., etc. etc.

http://wac.450f.edgecastcdn.net/80450F/ultimateclassicrock.com/files/2013/01/Kiss.jpg

so . . . the replacements didn't make it in? i'm shocked, shocked.

You say that, but I have a looooot of friends who are into hard rock/hair metal/pop metal etc. who have been very, very irate about the whole KISS thing over the years, and are irate about Deep Purple now, and Judas Priest etc., etc. etc.

― Ian from Etobicoke (Phil D.), Friday, December 20, 2013 10:06 AM (12 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I wasnt including any hair/ pop metal folks with that. Im not sure what their take is on all this shit.

Ive never heard a Maiden or Priest fan bitch about this issue.

Steroids-era comparison dead-on.

and willie mays and hank aaron were on speed what of it

Major League Baseball essentially segregated til the early '60s, rock n roll even longer.

Leading the charge for Yes' induction? Rick Santorum's campaign strategist.

I'm going to the induction ceremony concert tonight in Brooklyn

Hall & Oates, Peter Gabriel, Bruce/E Street, Cat Stevens, supposedly Nirvana fronted by Joan Jett, etc. Some all-star tribute to Ronstadt. I guess KISS is not gonna perform?

should be interesting at least

was not on my list of things I ever thought I would go see but my wife wanted to do it and it's right in the neighborhood so what the hell. as RnR Hall of Fame classes go it's a pretty good lineup imo.

http://www.stereogum.com/1675039/nirvana-play-with-joan-jett-at-their-rock-roll-hall-of-fame-induction/news/

This could've been amazing, hope it was

http://instagram.com/p/morsMiBrcd#

Kim Gordon

....which was already linked in that article. Nevermind.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4m3TF9NurW8

lol I guess that's why the St. Vincent show I was supposed to see in Cleveland last night got rescheduled

Yeesh, is that what Lorde sounds like? I've never heard her. Awful.

Interesting choice, considering she was born after Cobain died

Yeah I ws just thinking that tonight, kinda cool. I like this a lot bt was rly just hoping she didn't actively fuck it up, so

Joan Jett's voice remarkably in line with Cobain's. I would see that line-up.

yeah the Nirvana thing was pretty cool. Joan Jett was great, Kim Gordon rules obviously, St Vincent was really good. not too into Lorde but she sang fine I guess. they could have done a lot worse with those picks.

I'm a little disappointed that it wasn't a whole set with Joan, which I'd been hoping for since the rumors about her performing with the band started earlier in the week -- she's been nominated for the Hall a couple times without getting in, so I thought it was maybe a gesture in line with Madonna having the Stooges do the performance for her induction. actually, that works with Kim Gordon being there, too, so still pretty cool.

also pretty cool that Kim sang a semi-obscure song like "Aneurysm." although doing the one Nirvana song that Sonic Youth have covered would've been maybe a little too bold.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=psRQYt2rymQ

yeah i wouldn't have guessed they'd play that track in a million years.

It's an awful lot of ppl's fav tho, I ws more pleased than surprised. I love Lorde tho so y'know