the cheating thread

The #Astros stole signs electronically in 2017 - part of a much broader issue for Major League Baseball. Story with @EvanDrellich. https://t.co/VyS35fDT5D

— Ken Rosenthal (@Ken_Rosenthal) November 12, 2019

Astros using cameras to steal signs, a breakdown pic.twitter.com/rncm6qzXxw

— Jomboy (@Jomboy_) November 12, 2019

Astros hitters led baseball with the lowest strikeout rate and highest walk rate ... that just doesn't happen https://t.co/AL3ifbha1c

— Travis Sawchik (@Travis_Sawchik) November 12, 2019

the K% to BB% pic.twitter.com/GRKCwS2O8o

— Jonathan Drake (@JonathanDrake) November 12, 2019

would be interesting to see some analysis on that last graph to see whether or not it really is that significant of an outlier

kind of amusing in retrospect given all the talk about how unlikely it was for the Astros to lose 4 consecutive home games in the World Series. maybe the Nats figured it out.

don't have a sub to The Athletic but apparently Mike Fiers confirming it's true? this seems like kind of a huge deal

Forfit WS title feels fair.

your predictable 'cheating is actually good' take

So the Astros really have been using technology to steal signs, according to The Athletic. As I've written before, that's fine by me.

It shouldn't be considered illegal or unethical. It should be considered smart and savvy.

My column from the playoffs: https://t.co/AhLibqSK8i

— Jason Foster (@ByJasonFoster) November 12, 2019

this would be thread connections gold if anybody had ILBB on their SNA

as Billy Martin and Gaylord Perry would say, it's only cheating if you get caught

you all read that '51 Giants book, right?

oh my seeking a dodgy edge in baseball, I am getting the vapors

if you've got a runner on second relaying signs, i have no problem with that. non-players using expressly forbidden technology to do so is a different story

i don't watch sports to see who can cheat most cleverly

Astros were 60-21 at home by the way

throwback to '17

https://www.sbnation.com/platform/amp/mlb/2017/9/6/16262734/mlb-punishment-red-sox-sign-stealing-yankees-fines-hurricane-relief-apple-watch

Oh damn, I did not expect this angle:

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2862658-report-alex-cora-carlos-beltran-linked-to-astros-sign-stealing-scandal

crazy! wonder of mlb will have the balls to actually dish out actual punishment here.

yep i envision another Mets managerial search

In 1900, Reds shortstop Tommy Corcoran grew concerned about how Phillies third-base coach Petie Chiles planted his foot in the same spot for every pitch at Baker Bowl in Philadelphia. Corcoran ran to the spot and began digging. He found a small wooden box with a buzzer attached to a long wire. The wire led to the Phillies’ clubhouse in centerfield, where Phillies infielder Morgan Murphy was using binoculars to steal the catcher’s signs. Murphy would pass along the signs with a Morse-like code: one buzz for a fastball, two for a curve and three for a changeup. Chiles could feel the buzzes with his foot, and he relayed the message to the hitter what was coming.

https://www.si.com/mlb/2019/11/13/houston-astros-sign-stealing

In the first link of the Astros' front office to the sign-stealing scandal, Kevin Goldstein, a special assistant to Houston GM Jeff Luhnow, suggested in an email scouts spy on dugouts before the playoffs -- and potentially use cameras to get signs. News: https://t.co/fmr3kB1KhQ

— Jeff Passan (@JeffPassan) November 17, 2019

shoulda stayed at Baseball Prospectus I guess

It is pretty hilarious to make a big deal about using all this statistical information in decision making and then turn around and then "just put someone out in centerfield so we can steal some signs" ends up being the topper of the plan. Moneyball indeed.

Cheating is the new market inefficiency!

Wonder if the Astros' tanking years made it so that not winning was not an option and pushed ownership/management to green light this sort of behaviour. I always believed it was going to get ugly when you have 5-6 fanbases that are going realize that 3 seasons of straight tanking is going to be for naught and I circle back to the absolute chaos it would be in Houston if they didn't pull it off. Plus, the whole tanking to be great narrative the Astros/Cubs installed has served MLB so well.

Pro sports in general is pretty much a clown college these days. They could really just get rid of a 1/3 of the teams in each league and probably have a better TV product in the end.

I think pro baseball is a bit of a paper card house as I just don't see how the money adds up anymore in the game. It just does not seem to be that popular yet the money keeps going up, seems like an economic bubble waiting to pop.

https://static01.nyt.com/newsgraphics/2019/08/26/baseball-popularity/38a84a9487efa373cf8bf6b9cf6546https://static01.nyt.com/newsgraphics/2019/08/26/baseball-popularity/38a84a9487efa373cf8bf6b9cf654688fb4703c2/attendance_tg-300.jpg

According to Nielsen ratings:

In 2019, 12 of the 29 United States-based major league teams were the most popular prime-time broadcast in their market.

An additional seven teams ranked in the top three in prime time.

On cable, 24 major league teams ranked first in their market in prime time.

M.L.B. ranked first over all on cable in every major league market in the United States except Miami.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/10/22/sports/baseball/baseball-popularity-world-series.html

good EW episode w/ Paul Dickson on sign stealing thru the ages

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/effectively-wild-episode-1459-the-history-of-sign-stealing/

Someone edited the 2017 #WorldSeries Wikipedia page and awarded the World Series MVP to....the #Astros centerfield camera man. #MLB #Dodgers pic.twitter.com/S6x8q4R3Fd

— Matt Johnson (@MattJ_Sports) November 21, 2019

like Manfred said, just the Astros!

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2870111-report-2018-world-series-champion-red-sox-used-video-replay-room-to-steal-signs

and further:

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/28439945/sources-mlb-decision-discipline-astros

whoa

BREAKING: Per sources, MLB’s penalties for #Astros include:

*One-year suspensions for GM Jeff Luhnow and manager AJ Hinch.

*Losses of 1st and 2nd round draft picks in both 2020 and ‘21.

*A fine of $5M.

Full story and more context with @EvanDrellich: https://t.co/djvKEYFiC7

— Ken Rosenthal (@Ken_Rosenthal) January 13, 2020

i'm assuming Luhnow and Hinch can't/won't appeal?

alex cora's gonna get nuked too

and Beltran?

beltran will skate because he was a player at the time, and apparently they're not going after the players

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EOLxKeUXUAADD27?format=jpg&name=small

NICE

🥃🐸 pic.twitter.com/vP5A0s59uT

— Trevor Bauer (@BauerOutage) January 13, 2020

wow. honestly i haven't followed all of this very closely. i knew it was serious, but didn't realize the penalties would be like this.

the question is what if we know about 3 more teams come April

Didn't think Manfred had the stomach for it tbh

losing those draft picks is no joke, even if you're picking 30th

if the red sox investigation uncovers anything at all, i think cora might get a lifetime ban

In no way did I think there'd be a penalty with teeth, wow.

Sweep your own front porch or damage your own dugout monitor.

Jim Crane says Jeff Luhnow and A.J. Hinch have been dismissed.

— Jake Kaplan (@jakemkaplan) January 13, 2020

Wow. Manfred also went after the Astros’ baseball ops culture. He called it "very problematic” and “insular” and "one that valued and rewarded results over other considerations.” I am surprised he would make those points so bluntly in this report.

— Marc Carig (@MarcCarig) January 13, 2020

i knew if i saved this picture on my phone that one day the perfect news cycle would hit pic.twitter.com/tKAuxiZVxB

— ric sanchez (@ricsanchez) January 13, 2020

a lot of people (online) think this still didn't go far enough – but daym if this isn't much harsher than i was expecting!
esp glad Taubman got spanked hard.

can't wait to see what they do to Cora, he may very well get the worst of it.

well Luhnow is likely done in baseball so it's hard to sketch 'worse'

anyone could hire him on, in theory, after his suspension tho.

less likely than Hinch i think

luhnow 'accepts responsibility' but was clueless; it was all the fault of 'lower-level employees' and alex cora

Here is Jeff Luhnow's full statement, his first response to today's news. pic.twitter.com/9AbDFEtkbP

— Jared Diamond (@jareddiamond) January 13, 2020

Happy new year “bro”. I hope this year you find happiness, clearly the most miserable soul on this app. GOD BLESS ❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️ https://t.co/w4kxR4Ejya

— Lance McCullers Jr. (@LMcCullers43) January 13, 2020

^^^ Clevinger & Bauer went after McCullers but shit's all getting deleted, that's one of the few virtues of twitter embeds I guess. ^^^

i think the real lesson we've learned here is: never leave mike fiers off your playoff roster

Didn't expect people to get fired over this. Sean Payton wasn't fired by the Saints (sorry, football mention on a baseball board) in the headhunting scandal.

Luhnow's "I am not a crook" statement is clearly a lie, but obviously he wants to claim plausible deniability when he looks for another job.

Different universe, but in the book I'm reading about the '69 Mets, there's a J.C. Martin-related tangent about how the no-hit White Sox used to a) doctor the field around home plate to deaden balls off the bat, and b) keep all their baseballs in special storage so they'd come out feeling like shot puts.

(I think that may turn up in Ball Four somewhere too--it wasn't a secret.)

Cora fired.

baseball in the 2010s/20s is some bleak shit

life in the 2010s/20s is some bleak shit...the sludge runneth over

cheat lie steal...the american way I suppose

It is still unbelievably hilarious in the wake of all the analytical baseball it still comes down to just f'it we are going to steal some signs.

Really, the perfect way for the city of Enron to get it's champion.

It is also totally Pete Rose for him to say, "no big deal we all cheated on this stuff" to "this is worse than me betting on baseball" within like 72 hours.

xp i'm with you man

I think these 20s are oiff to a roaring start!

a friend of mine notes this is a victory for the union in a weird way. not going after players because it would drag out forever. unlike the PED scandals where management got off scot-free.

Beltran rumored to be stepping down

lol

“Integrity” is a huge franchise buzzword with the Mets - especially with Fred Wilpon - to the point there is legitimate concern for Carlos Beltran’s job at the moment.

— Mike Puma (@NYPost_Mets) January 15, 2020

hmm

Jessica Mendoza is the first Mets employee to publicly address the Astros scandal.

She said she has a problem with whistleblower Mike Fiers going public and telling the world about the Astros’ cheating. https://t.co/nlGnsx3pTs

— Tim Healey (@timbhealey) January 16, 2020

what a stunning lack of perspective

Thank you for your service, Carlos Beltran.

he had a decent run, but a .500 record just isn't going to cut it

he lasted longer than wally backman with the d-backs, at least

uh oh

Beltran's niece tweeting about the buzzers, which matches up with what Ive been told from about 5 different parties. pic.twitter.com/zla70bW0Wu

— Jomboy (@Jomboy_) January 16, 2020

I don't know if this is a topic of conversation or not (and I can't decode the tweet above): will this cast residual doubt on something like Altuve's MVP (and, way down the road, come up when he goes on the HOF ballot)? I wouldn't think so, but it was the hitters who benefited, after all.

NYC sportstalk radio already fulla Aaron Judge fan bullshit

how is it bullshit

if true, wow

I know lip reading is your thing but it looks here like he’s saying “camisa, no camisa” pic.twitter.com/4LZyGUSCm4

— Alec Guarino (@AlecGuarinoo) January 16, 2020

I mean I can't think of any other explanation for this, baseball players love having their shirts ripped off more than anyone

Hade bcz NYY fans of all ppl bitching about needing more trophies

What happened was wrong. I said so. But a lot of you people are out of your minds. Beltran’s family told ESPN they don’t know that person. I think one reason why people keep us around here is we don’t lose our shirt for every unsourced whistle in the wind. pic.twitter.com/bH8mScReWR

— Richard M. Nixon (@dick_nixon) January 16, 2020

wonder if Altuve's device was made by the same company

i'm at a loss pic.twitter.com/XcFXjGeWDU

— Natalie Weiner (@natalieweiner) October 22, 2019

My understanding is that "Beltran's niece" may be a former player, the name is a joke?

yes I don't want a trophy, that's boring

*extremely yankees fan voice* wow it’s a shame that the red sox, astros, and mets have all had to fire their managers

Dave Martinez the only WS winning manager who is still managing the team he won the series with.

As a Dodgers fan I want to tap dance on the Astros grave but there's no fuckin way. Everyone is dirty, imo.

It would have been funnier if it was the Cubs.

as they pointed out on the EW podcast, it's "early days" for the Stankeehive to be gloating

plz jesus, let the Stankees be next

Early days lol, our two biggest rivals just lost their managers and draft picks and have been branded for history as cheats

Not to mention the expansion team across the river now needs a manager

gloatgloatgloatgloatgloat

expand this, Booby

lol

If you thought this was going away today, you were wrong. Now there’s a call from Congressman Bobby Rush of Illinois for a Congressional Oversight hearing on the MLB cheating scandal. pic.twitter.com/TJlreTHKYr

— Levi Weaver (@ThreeTwoEephus) January 17, 2020

http://cdn.ppomppu.co.kr/zboard/data3/2020/0117/m_20200117085014_ffqbygcv.jpg

LaRussa double "cheating" pioneer?

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/28503160/jack-mcdowell-says-tony-la-russa-had-sign-stealing-system-white-sox-80s

McGwire and Canseco's manager cheated? Damn

this discussion of "Beltran's niece" etc is p funny

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/effectively-wild-episode-1488-wrinkle-wrinkle-little-star/

Banghazi https://t.co/NpAUb6A6fX

— McNally 🗺 (@LikeTheMaps) January 20, 2020

lol that EW episode number is cursed..

lol

Keuchel apologizes for Astros sign-stealing scandal. Said it was “not like every game we had it going on.” pic.twitter.com/oAS4DewLk5

— Paul Sullivan (@PWSullivan) January 24, 2020

I thought the pitchers would be immune from all this, but I guess they benefited too. Has Verlander said anything? He can get a little self-righteous at times about other people's transgressions.

That’s because of his allergies. He’s constantly battling them with the help of Flonase

I’m an Astros fan. To understand the scope of the Astros cheating & the players involved, I logged every trashcan bang from every Astros 2017 home game w/ video available. Over 8,200 pitches watched and over 1,100 trashcan bangs found. The results are at https://t.co/kVtisgUo74.

— Tony Adams (@adams_at) January 29, 2020

wow. nice job Tony Adams!

https://i.imgur.com/IFvOCQI.png

why'd they bang so little for Altuve?

trying to figure out what the variation of the frequencies of the bangs among the players means. at first i thought it could just be attributed to situational things (e.g., runners in scoring position, or a situation where a certain pitch is more or less likely). but then, compare altuve and gonzalez. they both saw similar numbers of pitches (866 and 776), but altuve only has 2.8% bangs while gonzalez has 18.9%. that's huuuuuge, and can only be explained by altuve opting out of the scheme in some way, like "hey don't bang me, bro". which the other players did not choose to do, it seems.

guilty: gonzalez, beltran, springer, bregman, gurriel, correa, marasnick, gattis, white

total exoneration: altuve, reddick

partial exoneration: mccann

xp

was typing that out as you asked the question! to me, it means he must have known and told them to stop

I thought altuve had the armpit buzzer tho.

was that the theory that turned out to be tweeted by a troll posing as carlos beltran's niece or something? honestly, around the same time there were several different instances, prominent and otherwise, of people getting all riled up by something that turned out to be obviously fake, and i can't remember what the verdict was

Nothing proven on that

looooool i cannot visit tony adams' site at work because of a content filter (i didn't even know we had one)

Manfred policing you

Amazing detective work by Adams. 1100 bangs but the scheme worked for a specific pitch, a changeup for instance. If pitchers through their changeups 25% of the time, then they had to steal signs on 4400 pitches to get 1100 bangs. It works out to half of all pitches for the entire season (or at least within the sample size, which isn't small).

wait was Altuve wearing a buzzer thing proven false somewhere

wasnt proven either way iirc

xp yes and obv some hitters are going to see more offspeed pitches than others irrespective of situation

would like to see this broken down by % of ABs w/ one or more bangs

yeah my immediate thought was that maybe altuve saw nothing but fastballs, but i don't think that's the case

i would never doubt anyone who went to these insane lengths, but i have to say listening to a handful of these audio clips, i couldn't hear much

Just looking at the Jays they used their can against... kind of gross some of the scrubs they felt the need to cheat against.

On August 4th, the game with the most trash can bangs, the Astros scored 16 earned runs. Mike Bolsinger, a Blue Jays reliever, allowed 4 earned runs in 0.1 IP. He never pitched in the big leagues again. https://t.co/iEWXSokLvn

— David Spampinato (@DavidSpampinato) January 29, 2020

Data analysis of Tony Adams data: Astros didn't benefit

Used the data from @adams_at to look at the impact of the Astros' trash can banging in '17. I applied run values above outs to pitch outcomes (ball, strike, HBP, 1B, 2B, 3B, HR, out) and compared pitches with and w/out bangs.

Here's the difference by batter at the PA level pic.twitter.com/RyeXPRWzGg

— Bill Petti (@BillPetti) January 30, 2020

paywall:

https://www.baseballprospectus.com/news/article/56750/moonshot-the-banging-scheme-hurt-the-astros-as-much-as-it-helped-them/

Astros were one of the only teams to not host a Pride Night/Day. That changes in 2020 -- it'll be held June 24 vs. Twins.

— Alyson Footer (@alysonfooter) February 4, 2020

You knew this was coming: Rose has applied to be put back on the HOF ballot, citing recent events.

Fuck that repugnant, opportunistic piece of shit.

That he is though he still deserves to be in

tom verducci will be interviewing aj hinch on the mlb network tomorrow at 6pm eastern

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/the-most-important-bangs-of-the-astros-scheme/

‘Dark Arts’ and ‘Codebreaker’: The Origins of the Houston Astros Cheating Scheme

MLB Commissioner Rob Manfred’s previously undisclosed letter to Astros GM Jeff Luhnow details the team’s spreadsheet and algorithm to steal signs in one of the biggest scandals in baseball history

On Sept. 22, 2016, an intern in the Houston Astros organization showed general manager Jeff Luhnow a PowerPoint presentation that featured the latest creation by the team's high-tech front office: an Excel-based application programmed with an algorithm that could decode the opposing catchers' signs. It was called "Codebreaker."

This was the beginning of what has turned into one of the biggest scandals in Major League Baseball history. Throughout the 2017 season and for part of 2018, Astros baseball operations employees and video room staffers used Codebreaker to illegally steal signs, which were then relayed to batters in real time. Another Astros employee referred to the system as the "dark arts."

This previously undisclosed information about the origins and nature of the Astros' cheating comes from both a letter MLB commissioner Rob Manfred sent to Luhnow on Jan. 2 that outlined the findings of a league investigation, as well as interviews with several people familiar with the matter.

Eleven days after Manfred's letter, which was reviewed by The Wall Street Journal, MLB announced that it had suspended Luhnow, as well as field manager A.J. Hinch, for the entire 2020 season. Hours later, the Astros fired both Luhnow and Hinch.

The existence of Codebreaker shows that it was the Astros front office that laid the groundwork for the team's electronic sign-stealing schemes.

During MLB's probe, Luhnow maintained that he had no knowledge of any of the Astros' misconduct. However, Manfred wrote in his letter that "there is more than sufficient evidence to support a conclusion that you knew -- and overwhelming evidence that you should have known -- that the Astros maintained a sign-stealing program that violated MLB's rules."

But while the league collected evidence that showed Luhnow was aware of Codebreaker's existence and capabilities, it couldn't prove that he knew how it was used. In response to Manfred's letter, Luhnow presented investigators with a binder with more than 170 pages that cast at least some doubt on the contents of the initial letter, according to multiple familiar with the matter.

These people described the situation as a "he said-he said" between Luhnow and Tom Koch-Weser, the team's director of advance information, who sent two emails to Luhnow in 2017 that referenced "the system" and "our dark arts, sign-stealing department."

Luhnow opened the emails, but told investigators he did not read to the bottom of them.

Complicating matters further, Koch-Weser's responsibilities were reduced following the 2019 season, but before allegations of the Astros' cheating became public in a November story in The Athletic.

MLB couldn't decipher whose account was truthful. In his final findings, Manfred said that the investigation revealed that "Luhnow neither devised nor actively directed the efforts of the replay review room staff to decode signs in 2017 or 2018."

Luhnow declined to comment through a spokesman. In a statement released last month, Luhnow said, "As the commissioner set out in his statement, I did not personally direct, oversee or engage in any misconduct." The Astros did not provide comment on behalf of their employees. Koch-Weser did not respond to requests for comment.

The way Codebreaker worked was simple: Somebody would watch an in-game live feed and log the catcher's signs into the spreadsheet, as well as the type of pitch that was actually thrown. With that information, Codebreaker determined how the signs corresponded with different pitches. Once decoded, that information would be communicated through intermediaries to a baserunner, who would relay them to the hitter.

Starting around June 2017, the system was embellished by Astros players. They started watching a live game feed on a monitor near the dugout and then would bang on a trash can to communicate the coming pitch to the batter. The "banging scheme" lasted through the 2017 World Series, which the Astros won over the Los Angeles Dodgers. Manfred said Luhnow was unaware of the banging scheme.

But everything started with Codebreaker, and the use of it to steal signs continued into 2018 -- not just at home, but also on the road.

Luhnow acknowledged to investigators that he recalled the intern's PowerPoint slide about Codebreaker and even asked questions about how it worked. He said that he was under the impression that it would be used to legally decipher signs from previous game footage for runners on second base to disseminate, rather than live in games.

The intern, Derek Vigoa, currently the Astros' senior manager for team operations, told investigators that he presumed Luhnow knew it would be used in games because that was "where the value would be," according to the letter. But he said he didn't recall whether he explicitly told Luhnow that Codebreaker would be used during games.

Vigoa's presentation wasn't the only time Astros employees say Luhnow was informed about Codebreaker. Koch-Weser, the Astros' director of advance information, said he discussed Codebreaker with Luhnow in one to three meetings after the 2016 season.

Koch-Weser told MLB that Luhnow would "giggle" at the title and appeared "excited" about it. Koch-Weser also said that Luhnow sometimes entered the Astros' video room during road games and made comments such as, "You guys Codebreaking?"

Luhnow denied Koch-Weser's accounts.

Other Astros employees told MLB's investigators that they believed Luhnow knew about Codebreaker, but they provided no definitive proof. Matt Hogan, now the Astros' manager of pro scouting analysis, told investigators there was no effort to hide the use of Codebreaker in front of Luhnow when he visited the video room. In fact, he told them, "it would have been something to show we were working and get validation of our work." Luhnow denied seeing evidence of sign-stealing during those visits.

In October 2018, Luhnow met with Koch-Weser to discuss a potential contract extension. In preparation, Koch-Weser outlined his arguments for an extension in a Slack post that included the term "dark arts." He wrote, in part: "Lastly, I know the secrets that made us a championship team, some of which he[']d definitely feel a lot safer if they were kept in-house." Koch-Weser told MLB investigators that during his meeting with Luhnow, he used either the term "dark arts" or "codebreaking" to tout his efforts. Luhnow denied that Koch-Weser referenced either of those things.

Koch-Weser also used the term "dark arts" in the Astros' Advanced Scouting Department's 2019 budget Excel spreadsheet. Luhnow acknowledged that he reviewed the document but denied reading the tab "dark arts" was written in and denied that any discussion of "dark arts" took place during the budget meeting.

In Manfred's public report last month, he said that Luhnow received at least two emails that mentioned the Astros' sign-stealing. His letter to Luhnow expanded upon the content of those emails.

One was sent by Koch-Weser on May 24, 2017, and was titled "Road Notes (April-May)." The five-page email included six underlined topic headings, with the fifth one called, "The System" -- a reference to what Koch-Weser described to investigators as "all kind of covert operations," including sign-stealing. Luhnow told investigators he didn't read the full email because of its length, and that he was unfamiliar with the term "the system." Two people familiar with the matter said it was generally known in the Astros front office that Luhnow expected his staff to put pertinent information in the first page of any email.

Luhnow responded to that email a day later: "These are great, thanks." He wrote another email about three hours later. "How much of this stuff do you think [Hinch] is aware of?" Luhnow asked Koch-Weser.

On Aug. 26, 2017, in another "road notes," Koch-Weser wrote: "The system: our dark arts, sign-stealing department has been less productive in the second half as the league has become aware of our reputation and now most clubs change their signs a dozen times per game." He added that struggling teams like the Toronto Blue Jays and Oakland Athletics "seem not to care as much."

Luhnow responded two weeks later.

"Tom, this type of write up is very helpful," he wrote. "Seems like our baserunning is still pathetic. What the hell happened to our pitching this series? I mean that was historically bad…"

Nonetheless, Luhnow told investigators that he did not read the full email because of its length and that if he had, he would have followed up because the reference to "dark arts" sounded "nefarious" and "sinister."

The evidence led Manfred to believe that Luhnow knew about that element of the Astros' sign-stealing. In the last paragraph of Manfred's letter, he wrote: "I intend to hold you accountable for the egregious rules violations that took place under your supervision…"

Luhnow was suspended by MLB for a year on Jan. 13. He was fired by the Astros hours later.

On Aug. 26, 2017, in another "road notes," Koch-Weser wrote: "The system: our dark arts, sign-stealing department has been less productive in the second half as the league has become aware of our reputation and now most clubs change their signs a dozen times per game." He added that struggling teams like the Toronto Blue Jays and Oakland Athletics "seem not to care as much."

lol

also fuck these guys

i liked

In October 2018, Luhnow met with Koch-Weser to discuss a potential contract extension. In preparation, Koch-Weser outlined his arguments for an extension in a Slack post that included the term "dark arts." He wrote, in part: "Lastly, I know the secrets that made us a championship team, some of which he[']d definitely feel a lot safer if they were kept in-house."

...that featured the latest creation by the team's high-tech front office: an Excel-based application...

The way Codebreaker worked was simple: Somebody would watch an in-game live feed and log the catcher's signs into the spreadsheet, as well as the type of pitch that was actually thrown. With that information, Codebreaker determined how the signs corresponded with different pitches.

L

O

L

"high tech" "algorithm" "Excel" "system"

=

some dude doing data entry

I found a picture of the mastermind behind "Codebreaker"!!!!11

https://i.imgur.com/1gUXTFX.jpg

mike bolsinger, the jays pitcher who got shelled by the astros in 2017 and never pitched in the majors again, has sued them

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/columnist/nancy-armour/2020/02/10/mike-bolsinger-sues-houston-astros-says-cheating-changed-his-career/4712164002/

https://sports.yahoo.com/new-details-in-astros-cheating-scandal-put-carlos-beltrans-legacy-in-jeopardy-230153436.html

sure ok "innocent astros"

jesus this organization

https://mlb.nbcsports.com/2020/02/13/astros-owner-on-sign-stealing-our-opinion-is-this-didnt-impact-the-game

What a shit show of a press conference . Ban this fucking team from the game

It's asking a bit much to expect a detached billionaire owner to take responsibility for actions by his "low level employees" (doubtlessly how he sees them). I'm not sure what people were expecting from this. Not to mention that Crane was exonerated by Manfred's report, which was a whole other load of BS, but it means that Crane really isn't obligated to comment on this at all.

xp otm

xp Crane is very obligated to comment on it, he’s the owner of the team. Also, good leaders take responsibility instead of running away from it.

They’re gonna get the fuck booed out of them all year

it's going to be hilarious

I haven't been paying super close attention the last couple of weeks -- have all the sanctions from the league come down or are we waiting for more?

still waiting on sox

according to passan, crane is also lying

Then came the 2018 postseason. During the American League Division Series, a man named Kyle McLaughlin, whom Crane brought into the Astros organization, was caught pointing a cellphone toward the Cleveland Indians' dugout from an on-field camera well. He was removed from the area. The Indians warned the Astros' AL Championship Series opponent, the Boston Red Sox, about McLaughlin, and during Game 1 of the ALCS, he was again removed from a camera well next to the dugout.

I wrote a story about the McLaughlin incidents, and in it, I reported that the Oakland A's had accused the Astros of relaying pitch types to batters during an August series. Further, I reported, two major league players had said they witnessed the Astros hitting a trash can in the dugout as a way to alert hitters.

Again: This was in 2018, more than a year before Crane claims he learned of the issue. The day after the story was published, Crane told another reporter to leave McLaughlin's name out of his story. Clearly Crane knew that a story about McLaughlin had been written. Either he learned of the story's details or avoided them altogether. The former would make him a liar. The latter would make him an owner who ignores potentially injurious information about his billion-dollar business.

the classic question: is he a dumbass, is he a liar, or is he a dumbass liar

day-um

You can see how visibly pissed Cody Bellinger is when talking about the Astros pic.twitter.com/QUXiNwzbxd

— Blake Harris (@BlakeHarrisTBLA) February 14, 2020

How many bench-clearing brawls for the Astros this year? Assume teams will be coming for them.

yep it's gonna be a long year for Houston

lol

The Houston Astros and their 'handling' of the sign-stealing scandal has led some SoCal Little League groups to ban the team from their names. Like in Long Beach: 'Parents are disgusted ... with the Astros and their lack of ownership and accountability.' https://t.co/Ox49MKZjNP

— Brian Martin (@TheBMartin) February 14, 2020

The internet is undefeated...🤣💀 pic.twitter.com/uIj1wt1W3w

— Rex Chapman🏇🏼 (@RexChapman) February 14, 2020

disappointing they don't play the Dodgers in the regular season but they do have a September series at Yankees Stadium which is probably gonna get pretty rowdy

I mean every Yankees fan probably believes 100% that the ALCS walkoff vs. Chapman was illegitimate

I was referring to the question about Crane taking personal responsibility for any of this. Whether he knew about the cheating or not, Manfred let him off the hook, and he can claim that the guilty parties have been punished. There's not a single owner in baseball that would admit to anything more if placed on the same situation.

The fact that he botched his message during his press conference is another thing entirely.

Fresh walk up music for Jose

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0P6zEU_G9v4

this is really not going well. manfred was super pissy today about media reporting on it

The Braves' organist can be pretty sassy with opposing-player walkup music -- last time I saw them it was against the Astros and he used both "It's a Small World" and the Muppet Show theme for Altuve. My money's on heavy use of "Bang the Drum All Day" when they play in September.

Only caught tweets of like every manfred answer at the press conference but every single one makes him sound like more of a scumbag

What a slippery little weasel

Selig was a different sort of transparent weasel

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c3LM2iQ8p7A

Carlos Correa has the Jesus lines^

I never in a million years thought I would ever miss Commissioner Bud Selig.

To be clear, I don't miss Commissioner Bud Selig. But I'm not sure he could have handled this crisis any worse.

— Rany Jazayerli (@jazayerli) February 16, 2020

lol astros

Astros pitcher Francis Martes suspended 162 games without pay after testing positive for Boldenone, a performance-enhancing drug. He was previously suspended for a similar violation in March.

— Brian McTaggart (@brianmctaggart) February 17, 2020

Atlanta Braves outfielder Nick Markakis has joined the chorus blasting the Houston Astros over their sign-stealing scandal, telling reporters "every single guy over there needs a beating."

"It's anger," Markakis told reporters of his reaction to the Astros' scandal and the ensuing response. "I feel like every single guy over there needs a beating. It's wrong. They're messing with people's careers."

Markakis did not elaborate on what would constitute a "beating." At least two pitchers have indicated that they would consider throwing at Astros batters, and William Hill sportsbook set an over/under of 83.5 for Houston hit-by-pitches in 2020, a number that would rank as one of the 10 highest in the previous five seasons.

that would be a fun over to put your entire life savings on

lol now lebron is weighing in

Love this Justin Turner quote: “Calling the World Series trophy a piece of metal, I mean, I don’t know if the commissioner has ever won anything in his life. Maybe he hasn’t. But the reason every guy is in this room, the reason every guy is working out all offseason and showing up to camp early and putting in all the time and effort is specifically for that trophy, which, by the way, is called the Commissioner’s Trophy. So for him to devalue it the way he did yesterday tells me how out of touch he is with the players in this game. At this point, the only thing devaluing that trophy is that it says ‘Commissioner’ on it.”

it's pretty crazy to see baseball players talking like this about the league, never seen that before

good turner quote.

i think the players' outspokenness is a combo of (obviously) the scale of what the astros did and their idiotic communications to the public afterward, the upcoming bargaining agreement negotiations, and (going out on a limb here) possibly a greater level of awareness of labor issues in general.

it is pretty wild

KM otm, i think it's just that teams work very hard to implement systems of signals and strategy and even when guys uh "organically" or "artisanally" try to steal a sign here and there they'll get a ball in and high next time up. or god forbid a guy should try to break up a no hitter with a certain type of hit.

also for the Astros to have a team-wide communications system means the gloves are really off now. other teams feel like they were totally duped by these guys.

it's not the conspiracy, it's the coverup

i think it was turner who also mentioned that a) teams having to constantly change signs/have meetings creates pace-of-play issues much bigger than intentional walks, and b) being a pitcher who ends up standing 55 feet away from a hitter who knows what's coming is fucking dangerous

when will the first Astros beanball game occur? Do they play Saturday?

does it count as a beanball if someone in the stands threw it?

home saturday vs the nats
split squad at the nats on sunday
full squad at the tigers on monday

interestingly they do not play the yankees -- guess the atlantic/gulf coasts are largely separate

i missed this

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/28730745/frustration-mounts-rob-manfred-edict-protect-astros-beanballs

Some organizations might be aided by their own limitations. The video room at Oakland Coliseum resides a significant distance from the dugout, former Athletics pitcher Brett Anderson mentioned.

“I know the A’s weren’t cheating,” said Anderson, who signed with Milwaukee this winter. “Because, one, I don’t know if they could afford it. And to relay from fucking 300 yards away in the video room? What were we going to do, get some vendor to throw some popcorn up in the air, or something? It’s too fucking far to relay something.”

Anderson joked the only way for Oakland to communicate would be through the ballpark’s decaying infrastructure. “The lights go out, it’s a curveball,” Anderson said. “If there’s a sewage backup, it’s a fastball.”

haha that rules

Off-topic but it was SO WEIRD when both Anderson AND Trevor Cahill came back to the A’s in ‘18

lol xp

eat shit papi

Papi on Mike Fiers: "Why didn't you talk about it during the season when it was going on? Why didn't you say, I don't want to be no part of it? So you're looking like a snitch. Why do you have to talk about it after? Why did nobody say anything while it was going on?"

— Ian Browne (@IanMBrowne) February 20, 2020

stfu & go drink a milkshake papi

papi was a juicer so he's got to stand his ground

he does love baseball cards, though. he loves to sit at the kitchen table by himself and dream of baseball cards.

I agree with this take

https://www.theringer.com/mlb/2020/2/26/21153495/houston-astros-sign-stealing-scandal-baseball-fan-interest

We are hooting and hollering every time a new baseball player goes in on the Astros. We are eager to debate which teams will bring down baseball’s newest menace. Why do you think my editor asked me, a football writer, to write about baseball? Because we can’t stop clicking on articles about baseball!

yeah 100% cosigned here too

no, this is not baseball itself

Baseball now has a team that everybody hates, and what a blessing it is.

i've found the seething bloodlust of the fans on reddit twitter etc mostly irritating and the opposing players leaning into it strikes me as empty theatrics. maybe i'm cynical but i'll never assume a pro athlete is above cheating to get an edge. one of the cool things about wrestling is that if you pay enough attention to all the behind the scenes bullshit you come to learn that even the most beloved faces are complete pieces of shit.

Listen the Red Sox are genuinely evil but I’m not sure I’d go so far as to label them baseball’s Cowboys

don't you have a gio urshela votive candle to be lighting

I probably should be tbh

hviii, u root for baseball's 1977 Oakland Raiders

righteous

BREAKING: #RedSox penalties:

*Loss of 2020 2nd-round pick.

*Ban of replay operator J.T. Watkins through 2020 playoffs and from doing same job in ‘21.

*Ban of Alex Cora through ‘20 playoffs, but only for conduct with #Astros.

Story with @EvanDrellich: https://t.co/6Ysn9hsRFa

— Ken Rosenthal (@Ken_Rosenthal) April 22, 2020

"2020 playoffs"

what a joke

ya, that's pathetic.

So we're supposed to believe that Cora was a key figure in the Astros' cheating scheme, but somehow wasn't fully aware of the cheating happening in Boston that coincidentally started when he arrived?

he was fully reformed!

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/does-cheating-matter/

https://nypost.com/2020/06/13/yankees-up-in-arms-after-judge-orders-to-unseal-mlb-letter/amp/

The Yankees don't want to release the letter, claiming it would cause "significant reputational injury". That is the most pathetic defense ever, why would anyone give AF about that.

I mean seriously, the Astros incurred the stiffest punishment in the history of baseball, but goshdarnit now that people might think a little less of the Yankees organization this has got to stop.

well it's a goddamn golden reputation, you must admit

streisanded lol

Thought the judge in the url referred to Aaron Judge