2012-2013 Hot Stove

@dbacks
Team acquires INF Cliff Pennington and INF Yordy Cabrera from @Athletics for OF Chris Young @CY24_7 and cash considerations

@dbacks
Team acquires RHP Heath Bell and cash considerations from @Marlins for Yordy Cabrera

wowowow, the Marlins better be paying a lot of Bell's salary

Jack Magruder ‏@JackMagruder
#Dbacks to pay $13M on final two years of , Bell deal, per Miami Herald's Clark Spencer.

o_O

waht

the d backs have made some real boneheaded moves lately

d backs should've charged the marlins an $8 million posting fee just for discussing heath bell

wow - i knew Bell was having a rough time outside of Petco, but didn't realize how bad until i looked up his numbers just now!

has a team ever done what the Marlins did this year? go on a huge spending bonanza and then switch right back into fire-sale mode before the season was even over?

yes, i believe they were called the Marlins

at what point are GMs going to finally learn to stop giving relievers big contracts

xpost Bosox 2011-2 never forget

true - the Marls and BoSox kind of pulled the same thing this year (except that Boston's '11/'12 offseason was nothing out of the ordinary for them, whereas the Marlins was)

Sean McAdam ‏@Sean_McAdam
Breaking: Red Sox have hired John Farrell as manager, signing him to multi-year deal. Official announcement coming soon.

Marlins should probably end every press conference where they introduce a new free agent signing with a quick turnaround trade for prospects

ha!

the John Farrell trade... I didn't think the J's would actually do it! wouldn't letting a division rival have your manager and all his knowledge of your team be very very bad?!

and why the the Sox want him so bad anyways? i had no qualms with him - but his record certainly wasn't all that great.

They don't want him for his managerial record, they want him because he's one of "their" guys, and when they tried hiring someone outside upper management's inner circle (Valentine), it failed miserably.

But I hoped we'd get more for him than Mike Aviles, WTF? Gotta say that in general I love the idea of trades involving managers though.

did any traded managers win a WS besides Gil Hodges?

Wait the A's got Chris Young?!?! Where are they going to play him?

I mean assuming Crisp or Reddick gets flipped now I like this deal. Green/Weeks/Sizemore or whatever combo seems like a better 2B choice long-term and I'm fine with picking up Drew's option (which I assume is the plan.)

I like that we go 15 posts before anyone discusses that aspect of the deal. Poor forgotten A's.

billy beane is out here sharking GMs again. chris young is a really good CF.

i still don't get what the d backs did... they shipped out a 16 war career player for the opportunity to acquire cliff pennington PLUS heath bell and $13 million of his salary

seriously wtf

Plus I think they sent some money to Oakland to boot!

Beane says they're keeping Crisp, so 4-man OF + DH if everyone's healthy maybe

If you combine this trade with the Stephen Drew trade, then the D'Backs traded shortstops with the A's (giving up their own All-Star caliber shortstop for the A's awful shortstop), and gave up Chris Young for a guy hitting like .230 in A-ball (from the Drew trade) and the ashes of Heath Bell. And that's even before you consider the salaries of the players involved!

yeah it's complete insanity

Very curious about the A's do about their SS and 3B situation given their glut of OF and 1B/DH types.

Mitch Williams thinks the A's are gonna flip Young.

Considering they just got him for Cliff Pennington basically I'm not clear what exactly they could expect to get back for him.

Why does anyone agree to trades with Beane?

i mean the Natinals broke even, both sides won but still.

He doesn't always win his trades. Hudson to the Braves was a total bust to give the most obvious example.

It is incredible that no matter who the A's have lineup wise they always have a very solid pitching. Some of that is ballpark and fielding, but a lot of it seems to be organizational...

Considering they just got him for Cliff Pennington basically I'm not clear what exactly they could expect to get back for him.

Justin Upton and cash.

HA ha!

did any traded managers win a WS besides Gil Hodges?

chuck tanner

guys this is the same dback team that traded a young reliever with upside for Matt Albers and Scott fucking Podsednik. it's Chinatown.

"Ken Rosenthal, of FOXSports.com, reports the Arizona Diamondbacks view SP Max Scherzer as a relief pitcher instead of a starter. This is one of the reasons the team is willing to part with Scherzer and RP Daniel Schlereth in order to obtain two starting pitchers."

If Jason Giambi is named the manager of the Rockies, which apparently is a possibility, could he be a player manager? If you're a player manager and the GM waives you as a player, can another team pick you up? Did that stuff retire with Pete Rose?

A player-manager in the 21st century? I would love to see it. McGwire still looks like he'd be available to pinch hit for the Cards (player-coach, why not)?

i wouldn't want a manager who'd waste a roster spot on mark mcgwire (or giambi)

Until this year, Giambi was still a valuable hitter, if he'd hit in '12 like he did in '11 then he'd be worth a roster spot for sure.

some retrospective lolz... prospects who were untouchable when Cabrera went on the trading block:

http://mlb.sbnation.com/2012/10/26/3559302/miguel-cabrera-detroit-tigers-trade-world-series

Problems with his argument is that it ignores $$$ (also kinda ignores positional value too). I can't remember if the Tigers knew they would be able to sign him to an extension immediately either. If another team couldn't sign that extension then you are basically getting Cabrera for two years at below market value (and getting Willis' awful contract to boot maybe) for many cost controlled years of Matt Kemp (or Jacoby Ellsbury or unfortunately Adam Miller--which is why prospect valuation is hard to do.)

It's also easy to say that you're trading for 10+ years of HOF-caliber play after the fact, but that's never a sure thing at the time. Hanley Ramirez looked like a sure HOF'er at age 24 too, and even until two years ago you could have argued that the Beckett + Lowell for Sanchez + Ramirez trade was a loss for the Red Sox even though they got another WS win out of the deal.

(i.e. they could have won the WS anyway by not making the trade and keeping two players who could have contributed immediately, been better in the long term, and spent a lot less money)

I'm dubious that Sanchez + Ramirez would have been better in 2007 and good enough to take the Red Sox to the World Series. And there really is no argument to winning the World Series.

and or even

Definitely not better, but maybe good enough. They would have been a few wins worse in '07, but better in '08 and '09 when they needed a couple of extra pieces to get over the hump (especially '08, when they lost the ALCS in seven). But you're right, flags fly forever, Ramirez crashed and burned, and Loria ruined the Marlins again, so this isn't really an argument anymore.

There's a good chance that your favorite team's prospects aren't very good. You think they're good, and that's adorable.

my favorite team's prospects are very good at running obstacle courses in the middle of the night

"especially '08, when they lost the ALCS in seven"

They won the ALCS in seven in '07 though (came back down 3-1 too.)

One more year for Leyland -- two AL pennants and 100% player support obviously outweigh all his in-game and lineup weirdness.

OK, who wants Delmon Young and Jose Valverde?

Weight Watchers

zing!

I saw something that said kuroda would be amenable to another 1yr deal. pls come back to los angeles.

Peavy, White Sox, 2/29.

surprised by that, i guess it's reasonable for all involved tho

Better than his $22m option for the White Sox for sure.

adam jones beats out mike trout for gold glove

my hero chase headley also gets one, pretty cool

oh god, hardy and wieters are deserving but jones has not been good in CF in both of his GG years and this shit is going to keep convincing him he was

Jon Heyman ‏@JonHeymanCBS
Rafael Soriano will opt out of #yankees contract today. Story up on http://cbssports.com .

You'll never guess the name of Soriano's agent.

When is the bubble going to burst on closer contracts? You'd think GM's would start getting smarter -- Heath Bell and Ryan Madson flamed out, Papelbon was good but not great, etc. And the WS was a matchup between a team whose closer imploded in the playoffs (and picked a new closer on the fly) and a team that lost their closer at the start of the season, switched closers again late in the season, and won the WS.

Speaking of which, Royals just declined Soria.

so there's your answer?

Speaking of which, 3/22.5 for Dodger Brandon League.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/baseball/mlb/dodgers/la-sp-1031-dodgers-brandon-league-20121031,0,779145.story

If a Ned Coletti built team ever wins the World Series I eagerly await the flood of "YOU EGGHEADS KNOW DICK ABOUT SHIT" stories.

if league can close games and let that idiot mattingly use his best reliever (jansen) in the best spots other than the 9th I dont think this signing is bad.

plus, infinite money.

indispensable tweet

JIM BOWDEN ‏@JimBowdenESPNxm
Miami Marlins, Toronto Blue Jays and Colorado Rockies continue managerial searches

http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/11/02/rick-hahn-trades-kenny-williams-son-away

^ lol!

Marmol for Haren? (LOL!?)

wait what now

MADNESS!

http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/11/02/angels-trade-dan-haren-to-cubs-for-carlos-marmol/

There must be MUCH more to this, right?

wacky

Mike Redmond,Marlins mgr. makes me chafe at growing # of skippers younger than me.

lol terrible, but i guess it's the best trade they could've worked out before midnight

xp

also Marmol is set to make $9.8 million next season.

how are major league general managers all so stupid

marginally free up $ to pay trout

yea i assumed marmol would be makin like 4

Sam Miller ‏@SamMillerBP
In his career, Carlos Marmol ranks first among all pitchers in hits per inning pitched, and 121st in WHIP

"angels acquire all-time league-leader"

also sox resign ortiz for 2/26

dude has a shot at 500, would probably make him one of the lowest-WAR HOFers ever

hell he'll probably get voted in anyway when bill simmons kills every other voter

lol

DKnobler ‏@DKnobler
Haren for Marmol trade is indeed off. Doesn't appear that Haren will end up with Red Sox, either.

plz keeps rumors labeled as such.

6:49pm: The Cubs have acquired Dan Haren from the Angels in exchange for Carlos Marmol, confirms Bruce Levine of ESPNChicago.com (via Twitter). The deal was first reported by Yancen Pujols of El Caribe (via Twitter, Spanish link).

wasn't a rumor

http://images.hitfix.com/photos/1830213/fleetwood-mac-rumours_article_story_main.jpg

please keep rumours labeled as such

yeah that def wasn't a rumor... someone in LA came to their senses

well, that is why you have to consider an LA trade unofficial for 48 hrs.

btw, Mark McGwire moves to Dodgers as hitting coach. "Hey Kemp, how did you get your muscles?"

yeah that def wasn't a rumor... someone in LA came to their senses

i read it was the Cubbies that yanked the deal off the table!

A's re-sign Bartolo Colon. I guess drug cheaters are an undervalued commodity now!

well yeah, that is the type of thing beane would never care about

Cared enough about it not sigh Bonds though. Who knows what kind of pressure GMs were under though.

jason bay is a free agent!

woohoo, NOW I'M feelin the JOY like PARIS HAAS BEEN LIBERATED!

sounds like m/l just releasing him right?
still, im ecstatic. good luck usany mets

Astros now have DH if Berkman falls thru

would actually like to see that

j/k, no team that hires Kevin Goldstein will make that step

did he actually lose bat speed/mechanics/etc or just fall off randomly?

if the latter he wouldnt be the worst gamble out there

jason bay seems like about as solid a bet as post-mets robbie alomar imo. seems to me that he just fell apart completely.

concussion(s) didn't help, i'm sure

wonder if that concussion from a couple years back is what did it.

my man

I don't get this, Bay could have kept the guaranteed money, why did he agree to end the contract? Was he so unhappy with the Mets that he left money on the table? Or does he really believe the stuff he says about getting a fresh start somewhere else (assuming someone wants him)?

well we don't know the terms right? they could have basically paid out his entire contract.

mets got to defer some $ or something but yeah i think hes ultimately getting everything due 2 him under the contract

idk they couldve said we'll bench u all or put u in the minors (if he had options) all season long if u stay

only Johan left from the Plague of Minaya

(and I can't second-guess that one, stupid me)

Walt Weiss = Rockies mgr

http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/8605249/colorado-rockies-choose-ex-player-walt-weiss-next-manager

DKnobler ‏@DKnobler
Blue Jays acquire Jeremy Jeffress from Royals, per his agent

they also signed Maicer Izturis to a 3 year, 10 million deal.
(Anthoupos's largest FA deal to date!)

ooops - 9mm

it seems like the royals sold jeffress... not sure what that's about

fuck baseball

http://i.minus.com/ioJyaNOQQbHKe.gif

omg

WHY?

because Poligrip doesn't hold like it used to

http://espn.go.com/blog/playbook/trending/post/_/id/10701/jeff-kent-talks-on-being-voted-off-survivor

It was classic Jeff Kent after the former big league baseball player was voted off Wednesday's episode of CBS' "Survivor: Philippines."

“I’ve probably made $60 million playing baseball, but I really wanted this million," Kent said on the telecast. "It’s not even a million. It’s $600,000 once Obama gets his share, but this really sucks!”

That's such great timing--election Tuesday, voted off the island Wednesday. Black guys named Barry will not leave Jeff Kent alone.

H AH HAHAHAAAA!

to be honest - i've been following this season and he seemed pretty level headed. had somehow wound up cheering for him towards the end!

He was a great player, and I'm sure there was a grey area as to who was most responsible for the friction between him and Bonds.

kent only made $60 million????

bref has him at $86 mil

it's really crazy how much baseball salaries have gone up. $86 million is, what, one andre ethier contract now?

The 86-60 difference must account for Clinton's share. The Bushes took nothing.

yeah. kent never made more than $10 mil in a year. part of it may be he was a little bit of a late bloomer.

Well Anal Kent tends to make poor financial decisions, like contributing to Prop 8.

Wonder if he paid for this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=51NfZWrkimY

Jin up

http://mlb.sbnation.com/2012/11/10/3627244/ryu-hyun-jin-los-angeles-dodgers

http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/blog/jon-heyman/20956505/lefty-star-affeldt-giants-appear-to-have-agreement-on-new-3-year-deal

I assume u mighta caight Sandy Alderson's standup last week: "What outfield?"

http://nymag.com/daily/sports/2012/11/sandy-alderson-did-a-set-yesterday.html

Jon Morosi: Blue Jays on verge of acquiring Josh Johnson from Marlins. Deal could be even larger than that.

omg

With Buerhle?

ommmmmmmg

being a marlins fan must be the worst thing in the world

we have the heat, so that helps

AND REYES!!!!!!!!!!

https://twitter.com/jonmorosi/status/268493135292813312

expensive free agent signings you regret is the new market inefficiency

j0rdan I will be in your fair city tomorrow but I have no free time so I wont stalk you or anything. havent done enough in miami to judge is seriously but I do enjoy looking at loria's publicly funded stadium outside the courtroom window

ha i don't actually live in miami right now... it is a nice looking stadium tho

looks like more mere rumors so far

i guess nows as good a time as any for toronto to make a power play, the AL east is the weakest its been in a decade

Buster Olney of ESPN.com writes that "just about everybody making money is going to Toronto."

lol

looks like more mere rumors so far

― saltwater incursion (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, November 13, 2012 6:28 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark

lol this is being reported by multiple outlets. also there are "trade rumors" and then there are "the marlins are trading their entire team" which i'm pretty sure would have to be solid to go public

I will believe this deal when it happens. Possibly not even at that point.

if all 5 rumored marlins are going, their payroll for next year stands at around 12.25 million

which begs the question, what costs more - the product on the field or the dinger machine?

it's not a rumor

Juan C. Rodriguez ‏@JCRMarlinsbeat
Can confirm...JJ, Bonifacio, Buck, Reyes and Buehrle all headed to Toronto. #marlins

wow

this is going to be a new thing, isn't it, teams just sign a ton of players to stupid contracts and when things start to look bad unload literally all of them on a team that has room to spend

not a bad strategy really

gotta think the jays will trade a few of these, right?

the thing is that they're all good players on agreeable contracts

except for john buck who is terrible but his deal only has one year left

xpost
and look how it paid off for the marlins in 2012!

Someone get working on the 30 for 30.

Jon Morosi ‏@jonmorosi
#Marlins opened season with a payroll of roughly $100MM. After this trade, non-arb 2013 obligations will be ~ $16MM. Historic salary dump.

somehow they managed to not acquire a single good player either

did they hire a manager or are they just going to have use a strat o matic machine

@Giancarlo818

Alright, I'm pissed off!!! Plain & Simple

ahahahahaha fucking loria. what a fucking conman.

How bummed is John Farrell I wonder.

mamet couldn't invent a scam as ingenious as the one loria's been running for years

selig's such a rotten old pile of shit for aiding and abetting this guy for so many years. what a bunch of crooks

somehow they managed to not acquire a single good player either

if they managed to land Gose/Marisnick and or Nicolino, they at least got a couple of decent prospects. Nicolino, especially.

@AndyGlockner
The Marlins got $409M in public funding (on false pretense) that will cost the city $2.4 BILLION to pay off.

what was the false pretense? I haven't followed the great Marlins swindle that closely, past the stupid contracts they signed last year and then dumped this offseason.

maybe that they'd field a major league team?

This makes a lot of sense for the Jays, the AL East hasn't been this wide open in twenty years.

maybe that they'd field a major league team?

They spent years saying they couldn't compete until they had a stadium. I assume that's the main thing.

theres also the false promise that stadiums bring in money for the neighboring area that will pay for the public investment, which aint true

the "false pretense" thing is kind of a false pretense in itself because no one was truly under the impression that the city needed to fund the stadium. but it just didn't matter.

this could still turn into a good thing for FLA

FUN FACT that i just studied: if giancarlo hits 7 homers before june 25th next year, he'll become at least the 10th youngest player to ever hit 100, knocking off frank robinson. if he hits them before april 17th somehow, he'll become the 6th youngest. 7th looks most likely. of the 10 players currently on the list, it's 9 hall of famers and tony coniglario.

the fact that they did this and couldn't even pry toronto's universally agreed upon top prospect is the most embarrassing part of this imo

yunel & hetch are essentially worthless, alvarez is league average (maybe slightly better in the NL) and then they got a single-A pitcher and a guy who hit .233 in AA last year

that's terrible! really it shows you just how desperate they were to unload everyone. they basically had no leverage, which is insane.

is it all final?

henderson alvarez k's something like 1 batter every fifteen starts or something.

or so it seemed during my brief fantasy fling with him

let me rephrase that: during the brief period he was on my fantasy baseball team

lol

no marlin fan should ever get excited about a free agent signing from this point forward.

i'm just hearing about this, feel sorry for Marlin fans.

what free agent signings?

wait, Brett Lawrie was made for South Beach, how is that not happening?

J0rd, I have "multiple outlets" for ya right here.

SBN reporting it, so legit.

http://mlb.sbnation.com/2012/11/13/3642726/blue-jays-marlins-trade-josh-johnson-mark-buehrle-jose-reyes

i lol'd

http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/533657_300796786687858_2144679415_n.jpg

Do the Jays even look like a team that can win the AL east now tho?
Do Johnson and Buerhle make up for the fact that they still have Romero and... uh... who's the 5th starter... JA Happ?
Do Reyes/Boni make up for the fact that they still have weirdo letdowns like Rasmus, Lind, to a lesser degree maybe Lawrie (& very poss Edwin next year)?
Is stacking the surviving Canadian ball team Loria's final fuck-you to the city of MTL?

I CAN'T PARSE THIS

all those guys (save buck) are really good if they stay healthy so they should def compete for the wild card

you leave colby rasmus alone. he's set to bounce back big next year, already reportedly in the best shape of his life in 2013 spring training somehow

plus his dad will get super pissed if you call him a letdown, seriously, you don't want to get his dad involved, he's insane

post-trade the jays look better than the orioles team that made the playoffs this year though thats not saying much

I think it's saying SOMETHING.

This new Js team is going to be insanely fast!

Is this actually official?

Do the Jays even look like a team that can win the AL east now tho?

Absolutely. A LOT of BALT regression and a little good luck and they win p easily imo.

Do Johnson and Buerhle make up for the fact that they still have Romero and... uh... who's the 5th starter... JA Happ?

See Yankees, NY 2011-2012

Do Reyes/Boni make up for the fact that they still have weirdo letdowns like Rasmus, Lind, to a lesser degree maybe Lawrie (& very poss Edwin next year)?

Yes

Is stacking the surviving Canadian ball team Loria's final fuck-you to the city of MTL?

Now that's crazy...

― Thwartstop (Will M.), Tuesday, November 13, 2012 11:58 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

reyes & boni are truly a joy to watch, legit might have to become a jays fan this year

Is there a point where enough is enough and Selig/owners force Loria to sell? Are there any mechanisms for that occurring in the MLB?

Schott may be a more terrible person but Loria has done more damage to the game.

loria is only there because of selig iirc

Yeah it's pretty hard to argue that Loria is not the worst owner in any sport possibly ever. Even the Clippers dude or the 70-80s Cavs guy just seemed incompetent and Modell was only hated in one city. Loria ruined baseball in two countries!

yeah, sterling is up there but there's more of a slapstick quality to them, even tho he's a rather evil person.

the only person comparable to loria IMO is dan snyder

He is really awful, but he doesn't seem quite as venal to me.

ok the FU MTL thing was facetious but anyway. what is BALT regression? also, yeah i am more or less a jays fan (live in mtl now but lived near toronto in 92-93) but i still find this trade appalling. maybe in part bc I live in MTL now and I've already had the loria/selig hate branded upon my brain, but come on, how can this shit be allowed to happen? i truly hope people in miami boycott mlb ball next year (isn't there a lot of a ball to watch there anyway?)

that said i will prob not boycott mlb ball bc itll be more fun to go & watch now even though the skydome is still kinda awful imo

BALT regression = the mediocre baltimore team that made the postseason this year probably won't outplay their talent again

except they got better after the luck and had one of the best run diffs in the second half

lol I thought BALT was some new sabermetrics analysis

the way i see the future:

Loria cedes erritoriality rights to the Rays for a ton of money, who then move a highly watchable team into a fairly new stadium and market eager for a change.
Loria flips homeless team to Mark Cuban or some some other douchewrapper for a ton of money, they move points West.
Loria makes a ton of money.

Jonah Keri:

Of course, now that the Marlins have dispensed with the pretense of fielding a competitive major league team for next year, we're supposed to believe that Loria's reckoning is coming. If fans have no faith in what you're trying to do, they'll surely stay away in droves. For all the snark over a lack of fan base, the Marlins did draw 2.2 million to their new park this year. If attendance drops something like 30 or 40 percent, that could cost the team about $30 million in 2013. That sounds terrible. Until you remember that the Marlins spent $118 million in payroll this past season. They'll probably spend less than half of that next year. Do the math. They're going to come out way ahead....

I don't blame (Loria) for any of this. I'm just impressed by how well he worked everything to his advantage, taking advantage of elected officials, short-sighted businessmen, and a system that rewards the kind of behavior that might seem despicable but is impossibly profitable. When it comes to Jeffrey Loria, I'm just in awe.

http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/42760/theres-shrewd-theres-genius-then-theres-marlins-owner-jeffrey-loria

Hunter to Tiigers, 2/26.

Loria flips homeless team to Mark Cuban or some some other douchewrapper

no professional league wants any part of mark cuban fwiw

Kahrl gets a Gillick-era scent from TOR:

http://espn.go.com/blog/sweetspot/post/_/id/30805/bringing-back-the-blue-jays-superteams

that is a dumb piece. the J's were good in the early 90's by spending money and making trades?! NO!
and what the fuck did the O's or A's do out of the ordinary to "go for it" last season?!

I think Kahrl means that the O's and A's showed that there's no reason to punt the year, ever, unless you're in complete rebuilding mode like the Astros. The A's did "go for it", but in a low profile way that the rest of the league didn't appreciate at the time, e.g. signed Cespedes, practically stole Reddick in a trade, etc.

and what the fuck did the O's or A's do out of the ordinary to "go for it" last season?!

STEFAN DREW AND JIM THO

should I feel bad for Stanton or is he likely to get traded too?

makes too little $ to trade

unless he raises enough of a stink

oh sure but what's the point of keeping him at this point?

yeah, that's basically what was pissing off cameron this morning

This isn’t even about signing future free agents. This is about being able to retain any homegrown developed star in the future, including Giancarlo Stanton. He’s under team control for another four years, but the likelihood of him taking anything this ownership group tells him seriously just went to zero. His “I’m pissed” tweet says it all; it’s a good bet he’s already informed his agent to ask for a trade or is counting down the days until he is traded to a team that actually appears interested in winning.

And if you can’t keep a 22-year-old superstar, then what’s the point of any of this? The whole point of having cheap young Major League talent is that you can get quality performance at a low cost, allowing you to redistribute the majority of your payroll to expensive veterans and build a good team around them. But if you alienate your franchise players and have lost any credibility in negotiations with free agents, then all you are left with is a bunch of minimum salary kids who aren’t good enough to win on their own.

2014 Angels OF

Trumbo
Trout
Stanton

Early benefit of the Hunter deal: not having to worry about the Tigers signing Logan Morrison

i want to get stanton into a hitters park for his peak years, i don't even mind if its yankee stadium i just want this to happen

Loria will present Stanton with a necklace and everything will be cool.

fp'd u ciderpress

definitely agree with the whole "ban Loria from baseball" idea

i'm reading a lot about how the J's "won" this trade, which sort of seems silly to me. Buehrle, Buck and Reyes were all O_o free agent signings last year. i'm wondering if the J's signed them as free agents now to the same contracts, how the fans would react. i guess probably pretty excited, mainly because they have not spent much money at all for a while. the Reyes signing probably wouldn't be questioned too much, Beuhrle would raise some eyebrows and Buck would have people slapping their heads. My point is, none of the three is any sort of steal. These aren't Vernon Wells level contract disasters by any means, but the J's will be paying a little more than what these guys will likely be worth for a few years.

Also coming in is a year of Josh Johnson at a decent bargain and Bonifacio for pretty low cost. And 4 million. Which I'm not even sure what the point of that is, when they just accepted something like 160 million worth of contract obligations.

And what left Toronto… Three of their top-10 prospects (with all the no-gaurontee warnings etc that prospects bring), one other off-brand prospect, Yunel Escobar (who was not long for this city), a back of the rotation starter in Henderson Alvarez and Jeff Mathis, a back-up catcher. Nothing that will be missed immediately, although it pains me to see Nicolino and Jake Marisnick go.

Basically the J's got a lot of talent and a lot of salary obligations for filler and a hand full of prospects. It's a good trade that instantly puts the J's in contention, and I'm not saying they "lost" this trade. Just that when you take emotion out of the equation (especially for a city that has not had ANY sort of winner for a while), it looks a lot more even to me than people are making it out to be.

i did a lot of typing there for me!

David Cameron's an idiot. The problem with this trade is that 4 years from now Mike Stanton might not re-sign?

yes!

i mean, it's one of the problems. not the main one. but it's certainly a big issue. how is it not?

the point isn't that the trade is terrible in a vacuum

it's that it means various negative things for the franchise as a whole, the potential ability to re-sign mike stanton being one major one

well a)4 years from now, who knows what in the hell will happen, and b)young guys sign extensions with bad teams all the time, if the bad teams are willing to pay them. McCutchen with the Pirates, Adam Jones and Nick Markakis with the Orioles. Those franchises hadn't been any good in more than a decade, but it wasn't a problem.

cameron wasn't talking about 4 years from now, he was talking about stanton demanding a trade now

and seriously dude goes by giancarlo why would anyone ever choose to say 'mike' over that

i'm reading a lot about how the J's "won" this trade, which sort of seems silly to me. Buehrle, Buck and Reyes were all O_o free agent signings last year.

yeah, for the marlins, but that's the point. trades should have the same value in a vacuum, and teams like the marlins shouldn't take a year pretending to be a real team and then unload the money on a real team the next year. those contracts aren't nearly as bad for a team with the 8th biggest MLB market (not including the rest of canada, i don't really know how the fans work up there). the jays completely rebooted their team and instantly became some sort of contender for the next couple years, and they didn't even give up d'arnaud or gose. that makes them look good!

but i think most people aren't really talking about who 'won' the trade, it's more about which team is doing better for their fanbase. BURN LORIA is the main storyline imo

Ha ha - i def agree with you about the main storyline!

But a lot of Js fans are going on about how they fleeced the lol marlins

a lot of fans don't give a hoot about payroll/prospects

somebody on BP said Miami can still sign a free agent w/out a NTC if they offer the most $.

well a)4 years from now, who knows what in the hell will happen, and b)young guys sign extensions with bad teams all the time, if the bad teams are willing to pay them. McCutchen with the Pirates, Adam Jones and Nick Markakis with the Orioles. Those franchises hadn't been any good in more than a decade, but it wasn't a problem.

― Panaïs Pnin (The Yellow Kid), Wednesday, November 14, 2012 6:27 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark

sure, but this is very clearly a different situation, i think. it's not to say that he still wouldn't re-sign, just that there's a chance it severely diminished his desire to stay with the team. there are repercussions for treating people this way IMO that goes beyond how much money you can throw at them. thinking that it's as simple as "signing with a bad team" is missing the point.

somebody on BP said Miami can still sign a free agent w/out a NTC if they offer the most $.

― saltwater incursion (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, November 14, 2012 7:39 PM (59 minutes ago) Bookmark

this is probably true, but how much money? would they be forced to sign a player at 3/40 instead of 3/30 so that the player would assume the risk of going to the marlins and potentially being traded at the drop of a hat? that doesn't really seem worth it. if they wanna keep throwing obscene contracts at the heath bells of the world then it probably won't matter.

David Cameron's an idiot. The problem with this trade is that 4 years from now Mike Stanton might not re-sign?

i read it more as "if trading away a young superstar hitter with 4 years of control is a logical move for your team then you're probably fucking up", and I think they do need to trade him

they don't need to trade him

and seriously dude goes by giancarlo why would anyone ever choose to say 'mike' over that

― I have done bad. I love my pj's. (zachlyon), Wednesday, November 14, 2012 6:47 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark

Hurrr, why would anyone pick fewer syllables over more. Me no thinky good.

i don't see a reason to keep him, you can easily flip him for 2-3 great prospects can you not? i mean the marlins are pretty much guaranteed to be awful for at least two years and he's rightfully pissed; no way in hell would I want to play for that team

well there's no guarantee that they're going to be terrible. i mean, it's likely, but look at the orioles and astros. a few shrewd moves and some luck and you never know.

but more to the point, you don't have to spend money to field a competitive baseball team. but if you're also not going to keep your great young players when they're on cheap deals, then there's no sense in even owning a team. the marlins at least known that, and have demonstrated that for just about their entire existence. there's no sense in trading him until it's time to give him a major contract, and they're not going to.

http://i.imgur.com/OmSoYm.png

hahah

lol

oh man

lol

Hurrr, why would anyone pick fewer syllables over more. Me no thinky good.

― turds (Hungry4Ass), Wednesday, November 14, 2012 8:57 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

tf it was a joke

holy shit

Yeah, there's no way they're trading Stanton now - in 3 or 4 years, that might be a different story.

I'm with Thermo though in that I don't think this is really that bad a trade for the Marlins in and of itself. The bad part is that they're dropping payroll by like 70 million or whatever. But that's not forced by the trade. They could easily go out and spend that money on Josh Hamilton, Anibal Sanchez, and Mike Napoli. (But they won't)

i totally feel thermo (so to speak) -- these guys the jays got are good, but not as good as their contracts. if they're suddenly flush with cash i guess it makes sense -- you can't just go pick up half a dozen free agents so easily. but if the money is too much, then that's bad.

also i had hopes for nicolino, but yeah he's just a class a guy.

the jays know what they're doing, the al east is wide open and it's worth taking a shot. but they didn't pick up any slam-dunk impact players in the deal.

idk if that's true... reyes and JJ are both really, really good. bcuz of their injury history you can't quite call them slam dunks, but they're pretty damn close.

yeah that's what i'm talking about, jj is a significant risk and reyes is prob a decent risk

i actually think that josh learned how to pitch last year w/o pushing himself into injury but that just may be wishful thinking.

reyes will certainly play less games next year but he's still awesome

joey rois

guess prince albert was otm in taking less for a ntc

i actually don't think he took less, but yeah

Thermo, your analysis is way off if you think that Johnson is a decent bargain and Buerhle is O_o. Buerhle has been one of the most consistent starters in baseball for the last decade and was really good last year, Johnson hasn't been healthy, ever. But even 75% of Johnson plus Buerhle and Morrow plus one of Drabek/Romero finding themselves would be a really solid rotation.

the jays know what they're doing, the al east is wide open and it's worth taking a shot. but they didn't pick up any slam-dunk impact players in the deal.

― call all destroyer,

Definitely, '13 is the year to go for broke in the AL East, it hasn't been like this in a really long time. I guess the Jays are thinking that they already have two impact players on offense, so they didn't need that from this deal. They needed to improve some very weak spots in their lineup and rotation and now they've done it.

it seems like we're always saying "this is the year the Yankees $100m in bad contracts starts to hurt them" and then they win 95 games somehow

I think people are actually saying because there is an extra chance to make the playoffs and the Red Sox are currently mediocre that now might be a good time to try to contend.

lol was just reminded of the sound byte from the showtime franchise show where reyes & hanley said theyd play out the rest of thier careers in miami like lebron & wade

earlier this season i thought the 5 way logjam for first in the AL East would happen in '14. but Boston faded early, NYY have the luxury tax reset.. sure, '13 is the year to go for broke.

one important point i'm not seeing -- and i admit i don't know how contracts work, don't the lack of no trade clauses carry over to Toronto? If everything breaks bad for TOR and they want to fold at the deadline a healthy Reyes or resurgent JJ could be some nice chips. i'm not seeing the risk factor here with the option of hot potatoing the backloaded contracts somewhere else.

if adam jones can be the best player on a playoff team then who needs impact players

hmmmm. Kevin Goldstein caused a kerfuffle at a SABR thing last year by saying, by raw objective criteria (ie not adjusting for era), Adam Jones is probably a better athlete than Willie Mays was.

i think he's right! but in today's context he's not quite an 'impact player'

B.J. Upton is apparently Atlanta's #1 target

Hope they get him. Meanwhile, looks like Gerald Laird will be McCann's backup since Boston got David Ross.

so there's absolutely no one for the red sox to add this offseason, is there?

Atlanta was my pick for Upton in the mlbtr free agent prediction contest, so here's hoping!

loll

They're on the roster? RT “@jposnanski: Here's my question: Why would anybody go to a single Marlins game next year?” @manofteal

Buster Olney ‏@Buster_ESPN
Melky Cabrera, two years/$16 million. http://espndeportes.espn.go.com/news/story?id=1660011&s=bei&type=story … With the Blue Jays.

dang

Azulejos > Blue Jays, btw

so are the Jays keeping all these guys errrr no?

either way this is a great move by AA, whoever got Melky was pretty much guaranteed to get him at undermarket value. and with the Jays this move is likely to get overshadowed anyway.

@hankschulman
Report from ESPN Deported says Melky has a two-year, $16 million deal with Toronto.

i think they're just trying to take advantage of a weak FA year by building a really deep team that they can trade from later

wow. he still gets 8 million per year and then for two years.

what sort of contract were you expecting him to wind up with? it's maybe 1mm more a year than i would have expected.

OF. FUCKING. COURSE.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/miami-marlins-told-jose-reyes-mark-buehrle-they-would-not-be-traded-broke-promises-111612

not unexpected, but okay that sucks

otoh i am hoping that for $14.5m/yr mark buerhle can do without his pit bull for a little bit. and i'm pretty sure braden and brooklyn will turn out okay.

also, toronto is awesome -- these guys should be excited

(i don't mean to be all like 'fuck u damon krukowski go on tour', but i'm pretty sure buerhle and reyes had the ability to get a no-trade clause somewhere had they found it necessary)

i expected Melky to make around 5 million and only get a one year deal. so he is getting about 11 million more than i expected.

melky is gonna be 28 and hit a shit ton the last two years -- maybe it was all roids, but considering the money thrown at much shittier and older players it doesn't seem unreasonable

yeah i mean 1/5 is absolute chump change. melky could've gotten that if he had missed half the season after getting three fingers amputated.

OF. FUCKING. COURSE.

LAST. PLACE. FIGURE. IT. OUT.

you guys make a good point. still i don't know why any club would give him more than one year...

http://www.csnbayarea.com/common/medialib/223/880031.jpg

alex rodriguez is making $119m over the next five years in case u forgot

but Rodriguez signed the deal before getting caught and was the best player in the game. apple to oranges.

gotta figure that people look at Braun and think "hmm chances are maybe he was on something, went off it post-near suspension, and had an almost identically good season. if melky can do the same the deal's a huge bargain.

alex rodriguez was once perhaps the best player in the game, but i would argue that promising him $21m in the year that he turns 42 (i.e. 2017) was rather more wishful than offering melky cabrera $8m apiece for his 28th and 29th years.

and maybe he shits the bed, but that is chump change for a guy who sort of shared a locker with world series champion hunter pence.

that lasted only one game, only one day were Milky and Pence in the same line up.

i didn't bring up Alex, just reacting.

no, it's not a bad deal.

i think there's a very small chance Melky underperforms in this contract. obviously PEDs were helping him but I never believed that they could add 60 points to your batting average or make you mash 20 more HR's a year. what do you think he gets if he wasn't busted?

John Kruk ‏@JohnKruk_ESPN
50 day suspension...full share in the post season...2 year contract with a raise...that should keep players from using...unbelievable...

yeah Bee OK and Kruk, some of us don't give a shit about PEDs, still

Pence got an MVP point. :o

juan pierre to the marlins!

So much for them having trouble signing free agents! Lol

jordan, will I get my ass kicked if I wear this to my first Marlins game?

http://i.imgur.com/n5KtP.jpg

cheered, maybe

do the Marlins have fans?

The Js just rehired John Gibbons.
w t fucking f

Tosca '16! Tosca '16!

ha ha!

Jeremy Guthrie gets $25/3 from KC

deadline for rule 5 draft protection is tonight; lot of dudes being added to/designated from the 40-man

@mike_petriello
YES RT @Buster_ESPN: Sources: The Yankees have agreed to terms on a one-year contract with Hiroki Kuroda.

I'll bet nobody wanted to give up a draft pick to sing the guy..

drudgesiren.gif
andino to the m's

i wonder whether the acquisition of robert andino or trayvon robinson makes the o's or the m's a more attractive location for hamilton

I was so pissed when the dodgers traded trayvon for a backup catcher in the bedard-red sox trade but turns out hes just another of the thousands of 'put up insane numbers in the PCL but cant stop striking out' prospects that come and go every year

yeah dude was like 6th in OPS on that team

Jerry Sands is the next guy on that list of Abq Isotopes I'll be curious to watch with the Red Sox..

kinda want some stats guys to run numbers on whether playing in insane minor leagues like the pcl/cal league has a detrimental effect on development vs. more sane minor leagues. they can put a big photo of brandon wood on the cover of the report

Dodgers almost always promote their best pitchers straight out of AA because they'll only get their confidence destroyed playing on the moon

I'm biased by how much I liked Knuckleball, but I can get behind this:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/magazine/sportsman/11/15/ra-dickey-david-epstein/index.html?sct=mlb_wr_a1

Dodgers almost always promote their best pitchers straight out of AA because they'll only get their confidence destroyed playing on the moon

the J's were doing this too, having the AAA team in Vegas.

ousins was claimed by the Mariners two weeks ago. It has already been a busy offseason for Cousins, who was waived by the Marlins and then claimed by the Blue Jays, who designated him for assignment at the end of October. The outfielder has a .523 OPS in 188 career plate appearances with the Marlins since 2010.

poor Chone.

cousins is awful (obviously)

chone dfa'd

'chone figgins still in baseball' is the more impt takeaway

Longoria's extension seems risky -- how many third basemen were worth $16M at age 37? Third basemen usually decline really quickly entering their 30's.

the previous extension was highway robbery for the rays so its not a net bad if you ask me

seems like another good deal for the rays. right now each WAR is worth about $4-5 million. by the time Longoria is 37, that $/WAR figure will probably be much larger, since it grows as players are paid more and more each year. if it's $8 million/WAR when Longoria is 37 (a conservative guess, I think), he would only need to provide 2 WAR to be worth his contract in that season. and even if he doesn't, he's likely to provide enough net positive value earlier in the contract to compensate anyway.

If you're going by his average salary from his first year through the end of this extension, then yeah it's a good deal. But that's not really the point. You never want to give a guy a lot of money based on what he's done in the past and get stuck paying for his decline years. Also I think $4-5 million/WAR is the cost of a win on the open market? Wins are a lot cheaper if you develop prospects and sign players to team friendly contracts that buy out some of their free agent years, i.e. what the Rays have been doing the last few years.

yeah, fair point re: $4-5 million/WAR being for free agents rather than homegrown talent. but the extension covers the 2017-22 seasons - wouldn't he be allowed to exercise his free agent option by then? (i don't know, honestly, it just seems like he would. sometime i need to sit down and actually learn the ins and outs of free agency eligibility). so it seems fair to use that as a means of comparison for those seasons.

speaking of which, the deal was $100 million for those 6 seasons, so it's basically:

2017 (age 32): $16.6 million
2018 (age 33): $16.6 million
2019 (age 34): $16.6 million
2020 (age 35): $16.6 million
2021 (age 36): $16.6 million
2022 (age 37): $16.6 million

again, let's take $5 million/WAR as a starting point for 2012. i think 5% inflation per year is pretty standard. if that holds true in the future, then in future seasons the value of each additional WAR is:

2013 $5.25 million/WAR
2014 $5.51
2015 $5.79
2016 $6.08
2017 $6.38
2018 $6.70
2019 $7.03
2020 $7.39
2021 $7.76
2022 $8.14 million/WAR

to break even in value for each of the contract extension years, then, he'd have to generate the following WAR:

2017 2.6 WAR
2018 2.5 WAR
2019 2.4 WAR
2020 2.3 WAR
2021 2.2 WAR
2022 2.1 WAR

even in decline in his 30s, i think he has a good chance of matching or exceeding those marks. also, as a young franchise player who will most likely play his entire career with the same team, he has value beyond what he does on the field: he's worth money to the Rays in merchandise, improved ticket sales, etc. so i still say it's a good move for the Rays.

Longoria's extension seems risky -- how many third basemen were worth $16M at age 37? Third basemen usually decline really quickly entering their 30's.

if you judge a contract by its last year you'd probably come to the conclusion that teams shouldn't sign anyone

yep, frogbeez otm

xpost But that's usually true! (if you just consider contributions on the field, and not merch, the value of having a franchise player who fans like to support, etc.)

Realistically you hope to not end up overpaying for someone's decline years, and there aren't many third basemen who aren't in serious decline in their mid-30's. In six or eight years time they shouldn't have to spend $16M to get 2-3 WAR at third base.

Jonah Keri's MLB Trade Value column for Grantland is a good read:

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8627606/rating-players-contracts-major-league-baseball-part-1

I'm assuming Trout will be #1. Could it be anyone else? Maybe Verlander, but there's always more risk involved with pitchers.

Well Aramis Ramirez is 34 and just put up a 6.5 WAR season so it's not really that hard to imagine Longoria getting 4 WAR at 32 to make this contract worthwhile

not saying it's ideal, but is it even possible for a team to secure a long-term deal with an elite player that isn't sort of a ripoff for the tail year(s)? scott boras and his ilk aren't going to accept a long-term deal that has a salary that decreases along with the player's ability during the twilight of a career. it seems like both parties recognize that the deal is like a see-saw: better for the team during the earlier years as (hopefully) the player is outperforming their salary, and better to the player in later years as he's probably getting paid more for what he's worth. but it seems pretty rare that a player will be consistently paid close to what they're worth, season by season, over a period of several years. elite players attract enough attention that teams are willing to take the risk.

I'm terrible at judging the marketplace (and truthfully not that interested), but I looked at Longoria's career box this morning, and, at 27, it seems like a reasonable contract to me. He looks to be on a HOF path--he's not Mike Schmidt, but he might be in that second tier of great third basemen with Graig Nettles, Ron Cey, etc.

xp that's an interesting concept but as far as I know only hockey really structures long-term contracts like that (and their CBA is totally busted). the thing is teams are more interested in winning now than later - what motivation do team personnel have to avoid stuff like the final 5 years of the A-Rod contract (or the inevitable decline of Pujols and Fielder) when they don't know if they'll even have their job in 3 years?

(i know nothing about hockey - they structure long-term contracts like that on purpose?)

oh, i'm not saying that they're structured like that on purpose "ok pujols, how much are we going to underpay you the next few seasons and how much are we going to overpay you when you're 48 years old and claim you're 42?"), just that the incentives on both sides end up leading to that result.

and i have no idea what i'm talking about, of course, i'm just bored and thinking about things

hockey currently structures its contracts that way as a method of getting around a salary cap. annual cap hit for a contract is the average $ over the life of the contract, so teams sign players to lengthy front-loaded deals -- they players still get their money and have less incentive to keep playing for peanuts when their skills have eroded (retirement obviously removes the cap hit, except for guys over 35 at the time of signing).

it's a stupid loophole in a stupid league, and one that is not likely to exist if the league ever plays again.

xp well I think that is implied in all long-term deals. nobody thinks a 37-year old is going to be as good as he was at 31. maybe players/agents don't like deals where they essentially get pay cuts every year? or maybe the teams believe they can dump the contracts Vernon Wells style before they kill the team? I don't have any idea either.

Realistically you hope to not end up overpaying for someone's decline years, and there aren't many third basemen who aren't in serious decline in their mid-30's. In six or eight years time they shouldn't have to spend $16M to get 2-3 WAR at third base.

i guess my main point with all of that was just to say that i'm sure the Rays don't think Longoria will be worth $16 million in 2022, but they're willing to put up with it because they think that the surplus value he'll provide earlier on in the extension will more than compensate. and that i agree with. and if they wouldn't have offered the deal, i'm sure another team would have been willing to offer at least as much.

by the way this is pretty much exactly what happened with the Brewers and Ryan Braun last year

there is obviously a little extra value there too, I've seen firsthand what happens to a team's ticket sales when they actually lock up their good players. that said though Rays fans don't seem to want to come out for anything so this may not help much

not saying it's ideal, but is it even possible for a team to secure a long-term deal with an elite player that isn't sort of a ripoff for the tail year(s)?

Yeah, it's pretty much impossible. I think its accepted that if a player signed to a long term deal plays at a star level for more than half of his contract, that qualifies as a smart deal. And if you look at what Longoria will earn over the next ten years, it doesn't look so bad compared to what Pujols, Votto, and Fielder are getting. It's a bit surprising that the Rays broke the bank for someone, but if you're going to do it, then do it for a franchise player. It's when teams like the Yankees start shelling out $90M for the likes of AJ Burnett that things get ridiculous.

it seems like both parties recognize that the deal is like a see-saw: better for the team during the earlier years as (hopefully) the player is outperforming their salary, and better to the player in later years as he's probably getting paid more for what he's worth.

Yes and no. Did anyone say that about Ryan Howard's extension? I think we tend to apply this logic selectively.

well ruben amaro is an idiot, so that doesn't count

Howard contract has been a superlol from the start

Longo implications for Wright and the Mets?

http://mlb.sbnation.com/2012/11/27/3697022/new-york-mets-evan-longoria-extension-david-wright-free-agency-rumors

Yankees keeping everyone but Swisher?

http://mlb.sbnation.com/2012/11/27/3697936/yankees-offseason-rumors-free-agents-trades

not sure if they bring back martin if he keeps asking for the moon. dude would be total garbage if he didnt hit in that bandbox in the bronx.

don't think there are too many better options out there tbh

which is why he isnt gonna get that 4/40 he's looking for

if that's seriously what he's asking for... O_o

Mark Sheldon ‏@m_sheldon
Confirmed: #reds sign Broxton to three-year, $21 million contract with $9 million club option for 2016 http://bit.ly/Riv90m

sigh

it's funny that they made the smart signing of madsen last season then instead of getting him on an even cheaper one-year deal this year just turn around and lock broxton up for 3 seasons

Jon Morosi ‏@jonmorosi
If #Tigers are going to make a move at shortstop, needs to be a more athletic player than Peralta (20 GIDPs this year, below avg range).

*scratches Edgar Renteria and Maytag washing machine off wish list*

broxton is infuriating. the numbers say he can dominate but he will absolutely shit the bed in certain situations. he also has terrible luck.

he's a relief pitcher

that's all you have to say

presumably it means free aroldis at least

does this mean Baker will finally get his chance to pitch Aroldis into dust? stay tuned!

pettite has signed on to get injured for half the season in a yankee uniform for 2013

the pirates have acquired quad-a first baseman clint robinson and pitcher vin mazzaro, who may have had the worst single outing in major league history, from the royals.

i like clint, hope he can lahair it for a bit

braves apparently signed upton

Ken Rosenthal
‏@Ken_Rosenthal
Final terms: Upton is five years, $75.25 million with #Braves. Pending physical.

Second part of the Grantland trade-value article:

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8627624/rating-players-contracts-major-league-baseball-part-2

I'd take a few of these guys on my team. (Cabrera at #9 is surely too high. Have to believe he's peaked, I don't think he'll be losing weight and gaining range, and look at some of the names below him.)

jesus christ, braun is almost 30? how does time fly like that...

Cautiously optimistic about Upton.

Mmm yeah. Any time you can pay 15 mil a year for a sub-300 obp, you gotta take it

at least he doesn't strike out much

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cory patterson, OUCH

it's almost as if OBP isn't the sole defining factor in whether a player is good

oh god joe morgan's just gonna get more confused now

http://www.seattle-duiattorney.com/blog/wp-content/spiezio.jpg

(Cabrera at #9 is surely too high. Have to believe he's peaked, I don't think he'll be losing weight and gaining range, and look at some of the names below him.)

It's a trade value list, not a long term value list. Trading for him now means you're getting him for three likely peak years (without having to pay to watch him fatten up and decline) at a below market cost.

Yeah--I saw that group of pitchers below him (Verlander, Felix, etc.), but didn't look at the details of their contracts. As I said above, the money side of the game loses me.

yeah its not like a 'who would you build your team around' article as much as it is a function of production/$$$$$$

trout might break out of his #1 position once he hits super 2 arb and gets paid a fortune

Nationals acquire the Width of Two Testicles from Twins for Minor League RHP Alex Meyer.

oh i get it!

Saturn Nuts aka Bronson Arroyo?

Denard Span ‏@thisisdspan
Going to a quality team and organization. I feel like a little kid again lol

*giggles*

Russ Martin is a lol pirate.

david wright locked up, congrats morbs, face of franchise, big tv market, yada yada

building block *whistles past graveyard again*

sorry about RM, mook

Hot stove, phantom deer

http://bloximages.newyork1.vip.townnews.com/stltoday.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/9/2e/92ebcf2f-f90e-587f-8336-85861bf44392/50b80833ed3e8.preview-620.jpg

Property owner isn't buying David Freese's deer story

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/columns/bill-mcclellan/article_e85ee795-9a32-56eb-a92a-feea48e3fc21.html#.ULjVE1ADIuM

Tire tracks show that the SUV left the road approximately 50 feet east of Duff’s mailbox. The vehicle smashed through the mailbox, crossed the driveway, jumped a small stone decorative wall, crashed through a fence and then proceeded into a field. It continued about 300 feet through the field, then veered back toward the road. It crashed back through the fence and hit two trees — exposing the roots of one of them — before coming to its final resting place against the third tree.

hell of a deer

sounds like the deer was driving

Jason Parks ‏@ProfessorParks
The Yankees didn't have the cash to match the Pirates. In other news, white people no longer think The Wire is awesome.

gtfo if you don't think hitting a deer at high speed forces you to wreck everything around you

deer can't drive!

braves trade hanson to angels for jordan walden

idgi

I get trading Hanson -- his mechanics have been giving me the terrors for years. Don't know anything about Walden.

walden's actually pretty good. he strikes out a ton of guys (10+ per nine innings, i think), although he walks a lot too. seems like a good trade for the angels, though.

typical mlb reliever - k's a bunch, is prone to control issues and walking too many. I guess hes now the 6th inning guy so who cares! low leverage situations ftw.

i'm not quite sure why walden fell out of favor with the angels... hanson is total damaged goods, though, i'm surprised the braves were even able to unload him for that much

oh, i didn't realize his arm was that busted... R.I.P. tommy hanson. :(

walden might have fallen out with the angels when they forced him to be their closer because their pen was in shambles and he wasnt good enough to overcompensate. like a 2011 ernesto frieri

he was pretty good for a bit, but then couldn't find the plate to save his life iirc.

Jason Parks: "He can use his previous success in ATL as arb argument despite poor season. It's a weird system. He could get paid a lot"

hanson clears out 5 mil, it'd be cool if braves made a run at jupton now

haha, apparently jordan walden momentarily leaves the ground when he pitches:

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/703613/walden4.png

http://mlb.sbnation.com/2011/9/2/2400667/jordan-walden-delivery-mechanics-jump

remind me to photoshop that.

The Marlins are interested in Mark DeRosa, according to Juan C. Rodriguez of the South Florida Sun-Sentinel.
DeRosa told reporters back in mid-October that he was considering retirement, but he has apparently changed his mind. The 37-year-old was limited to 48 games in 2012 with the Nationals because of injuries. He would presumably serve as a utilityman for the Marlins.

Why does this man continue to cash mlb checks when all he does it get hurt

http://deadspin.com/5965214/alex-rodriguez-to-undergo-surgery-on-his-other-hip-miss-a-large-chunk-of-next-season

Slight sense of anxiety here...

‏@thisisdspan
I have no ideaRT @LouieRanks: @thisisdspan yo denard are you gonna be doing a press conference in DC?? Welcome to the city bossman!!

http://deadspin.com/5965214/alex-rodriguez-to-undergo-surgery-on-his-other-hip-miss-a-large-chunk-of-next-season

summon chase headley

ugh, don't even

rip a-rod, you had a good career.

i have to admit i am kind of looking forward to the fat-rod offseason pictures. always trying to outdo jeter.

Giants re-sign this copilot for 4/40

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A6Y-oRfCYAACP-J.jpg:large

Soria in Wash's hands

http://mlb.sbnation.com/2012/12/3/3724446/mlb-winter-meetings-joakim-soria-signing-texas-rangers

the Giants resign Angel Pagan?

so happy about this move as he is very much a Giant now.

not sure of this is the right spot, BUT: Lenny Dykstra just got sentenced to 6 1/2 months in prison!

scrappy!

On Monday, Dykstra had about a dozen supporters in court, including his ex-wife and his son, Cutter, who is playing for the Washington Nationals’ Single-A team in Maryland.

As the grey-haired Dykstra was being led away from court, he turned to the group and gave a thumbs-up.

uh yeah, thumbs up

based on what it seemed like dykstra's situation was over the last few years, i would be giving a thumbs up too over just 6.5 months

Haren to Nats, $13 M

all i remember about lenny dykstra as a player were his roidy arms and his status as the most disgusting user of smokeless tobacco in baseball history.

the law firm I work for used to represent him when he had money. the dude is fucking nuts.

pre-roids Mets days he was just a little wiry dumbass.

Napoli to Boston, 39/3

i am liking the haren deal

victorino to sox is the perfect combination of shitty unlikeable player with shitty unlikeable team. Hope Hamilton signs there too.

Assuming that all of Haren's problems last year were due to injury (and assuming he's healthy now), it's an amazing deal for the Nats.

unless he's never healthy again

He'd never been on the DL in his career before this season, which has to count for something.

victorino to sox is the perfect combination of shitty unlikeable player with shitty unlikeable team. Hope Hamilton signs there too.

― pun lovin criminal (polyphonic), Tuesday, December 4, 2012 6:07 PM (42 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

did not know he was unlikeable, do tell

victorino is kind of a baby but he's also the prototypical "love him on your team, hate him on others" player

I just don't like the guy. But I have no good reason. I don't like his face?

ok!

3/39 for everyone!

is everyone getting ready for pierzynski and youk as yanquis

dale sveum shot by robin yount in hunting accident (with shrapnel, in the ear)

will never forget the yunel escobar era in miami

he must be devastated.

The Giants went 3-for-3 with their key free agents, and it cost them $78 million.
The price of being champions.
Second baseman Marco Scutaro joined the mix late Tuesday, agreeing to a three-year, $20-million contract that'll keep him a Giant through 2015. On Oct. 30 of that year, he turns 40.

three for three, i will take it. hope it doesn't blow up in our face like the resigning of the 2010 players after a Championship...

Help me out here, Bee: giving a 3-year deal to someone who's currently 37, where do you not see the many pitfalls here?

Bee, Aubrey Huff waves hello

i really like the strategy of staying in the same bad division and getting really hot in october with the same exact team

yes it's a year too many, along with the Pagan deal. the money isn't too outrageous and basically have the same team coming back.

Despite the two championships, I knew the Brian Sabean we used to know and love hadn't gone away forever ...

for all the shit talk, I cant argue with 2 championships in 3 years. they do stupid shit but keep winning.

speaking of stupid shit, this whole saga between the mets and RA Dickey gets my vote for most obnoxious winter meeting story line. either sign him or trade him. jesus.

It's funny to remember that I used to think that Coletti was the brains of the Giants operation.

now its hard to tell how much sway coletti has now that the new ownership and kasten have taken over.. I just assume any dumb move the dodgers do is his fault.

eric chavez to the d-backs

great signing. would love to have him for 3 mil.

DKnobler ‏@DKnobler
Marlins wanted Keppinger.

:(

a suggestion that the mets trade dickey to toronto for jose reyes

I always love a good hunting-related injury!

Padres' Andrew Cashner was dressing meat. Puncture wound to right thumb. Lacerated tendon. Surgery. Three month recovery.

Meat-dressing injuries are pretty awesome, too.

Jason Bay to Seattle

Will Carroll ‏@injuryexpert
Kevin towers and posse rushing through gardens heading from suite to suite.

MLB Network needs Carroll Cam.

Injury Cam

Happy to report that Rule 5 draftee Kyle Lobstein is a pitcher.

he was asembled from the cadavers of six lobbers

Randy Choate, LOOGY, to the cardinals for 3 years/7.5 million

he's 37.

he's really good tho

yeah, it's not terrible or anything, and the cardinals needed another lefty in the bullpen. we'll see how this looks when he's 40, though.

he's not a power pitcher so i could see him throwing a few more years but i'm not sure why they had to give him three years guaranteed, seems like a bit much

NBC Sports' Craig Calcaterra reports that the Pirates have re-signed free agent righty Jason Grilli.

guys guess who Grilli's agent is -

http://blog.prorumors.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/gary-sheffield1-300x300.jpg

Randy Choate, LOOGY, to the cardinals for 3 years/7.5 million

he's 37.

― dexpresso (Z S), Thursday, December 6, 2012 12:44 PM (20 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

kinda weird to go for three years at such a low aav, he has a shot to make more money going year-to-year. maybe he just likes stl or whatever.

reuben amaro is such a horrifying GM

choate pitched 38 innings last year. its good to be a loogy.

reuben amaro is such a horrifying GM

is this about revere or the alleged interest in acquiring michael young?

michael bourn must be pissed off. he waited way too long to cash in once the run on CFs started.

honestly if they could get michael young for nothing and have texas pay some of his salary i don't think it would be a horrible move to see if he bounces back a bit

the ben revere trade is out of control tho, wtf is wrong w/ that guy

nice deal for the twins tho. sounds like they got 2 starters for one slightly used but younger version of juan pierre.

yeah they must've been laughing like crazy

Ben!

don't the twins have an entire farm system of juan pierres at all times anyway

every outfielder, a juan pierre
every pitcher, a scott baker

that rangers fan michael young he my team youtube kid must be all grown up now, right?

Phillie CF w/ zero career HR & .319 obp = awesome

unfortunately for the phils they wouldn't be able to hide young's shitty defense in the DH slot for 70-80 games per season like the rangers have been doing for the past couple of years.

that revere trade is insane

don't the twins have an entire farm system of juan pierres at all times anyway

From what I read the twins have jack shit to fill in at CF.. Maybe they'll sign Bourn? If his market has evaporated its not a bad idea (assuming hes doesn't cost a pick).

some sick deep nerdery in the fgraphs comments

Now here’s a little story I got to tell
About three bad brothers you know so well
It started way back in history
With Revere, Trevor May, and Vance Worley

after following the nfl and nba offseasons a little closer this year I have reached the conclusion that baseball's offseason is excruciatingly long and drawn out

I guess theres way more $$$$ involved and guaranteed contracts to consider..

nfl and nba have shorter offseasons?!

cameron also supports young to philly http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/michael-young-a-good-bet-for-philadelphia/

BMac signs with the the Dbags, sigh

am i sposed to know who bmac is?

he's a bro

oh HIM

Dodgers sign Greinke: $12M signing bonus - $17MM salary in 2013, $24MM in 2014, $23MM in 2015, $24MM in 2016, $23MM in 2017, and $24MM in 2018. that's $147MM over 6 years; an average of $24.5MM a year - 0.1MM more than Sabathia! O_O

dodgers are nuts

Is there anyone with a BP subscription who could send me/post this article? Thx.

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=19068

Is Greinke to Dodgers official? I'm still reading it as "Dodgers closing in on Greinke"

Apparently he has an opt-out clause which he can exercise after the first year if he is traded (if you believe ESPN's sources), i.e. just in case the Dodgers go all Marlins on us.

lol amaro

dayton moore caved

Marc Topkin
‏@TBTimes_Rays
Hearing #Rays have traded Shields AND Davis to #Royals. Working on confirmation and return

fire dayton moore

lol otm

Good god.

i feel terrible for royals fans, truly

i was just thinking, like, if the marlins had traded mike stanton for dan haren in 2009 that i think i would've given up on baseball by now

Well, David Price is not happy.

And Heyman thinks the Rays got bilked.

i would love to see andrew friedman's reaction to getting traded the no. 1 hitting prospect in baseball for a 4 win pitcher

heyman flipped a switch when he left for CBS

FIRE DAYTON MOORE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Marc Topkin ‏@TBTimes_Rays
Huge #Rays trade is Shields AND Davis (and PTBNL) to #Royals for OF Myers, RHP Odorizzi, LHP Montgomery, 3B Leonard

i resent friedman's luck rn, honestly

as is every other team without a james shields to spare

i feel like this is a dream not happening in reality

Is Greinke to Dodgers official? I'm still reading it as "Dodgers closing in on Greinke"

Apparently he has an opt-out clause which he can exercise after the first year if he is traded (if you believe ESPN's sources), i.e. just in case the Dodgers go all Marlins on us.
--NoTimeBeforeTime

Greinke can also opt out after 3 years

"Clearly, this brings a wonderful package to what we're trying to do here in Philadelphia," Phillies general manager Ruben Amaro Jr. said. "One, he's a very, very good ballplayer. He has a tremendous track record. I know that last year was not his best year but after talking to the scouts and discussing it intently with the rest of our front office, we felt like this is an excellent person to bring to our club."

"He has all the elements we're looking for," Amaro Jr. said of Young. "First of all, the makeup is extraordinary. He's the ultimate team player. He knows how to play baseball. He's a winning baseball player. He's had the opportunity to be in big games in the playoffs and he just fits real well.

"The fact that he hits right-handed helps balance our lineup out a little bit as well. I just think all the elements he brings to the table for us are very, very positive."

he knows how to play baseball.

lol

"The fact that he is bipedal helps balance our lineup out a little bit as well."

keithlaw ‏@keithlaw
One final thought before I sign off: Talked to a bunch of scouts/FO folks tonight. Every last one of them said the Rays came out way ahead.

JJ Cooper ‏@jjcoop36
Think the Royals got fleeced in the Shields-Myers deal? 6 out of 6 pro scouts/front office execs I surveyed disagreed. http://ht.ly/fYtOZ

"scouts" are the worst

It goes without saying that in pure baseball terms, I despise the the Royals trade of late Sunday night. Despise. Deplore. Deride. Disapprove. If there was a Royals Tradebook Page, I would click the "dislike" button at least 10,000 times.

http://joeposnanski.blogspot.com/2012/12/a-desperate-grab-for-hope.html

Joe's memory of that Marlin's deal is a lot different from mine. IIRC no one was really sold on Miller/Maybin and the whole thing was basically conceived as a salary dump (no one remembers that the Tiger's got Dontrelle Willis as well).

yeah it's not a good comparison. you could easily make the argument that a prospect like myers (consensus top hitting prospect who is also universally seen as major league ready and also hasn't ever played for his major league team) has never been traded before. i think rany was tweeting about this last night but myers is much more than just a "top prospect". he's in the elite of the elite class.

IIRC no one was really sold on Miller/Maybin and the whole thing was basically conceived as a salary dump (no one remembers that the Tiger's got Dontrelle Willis as well).

Maybin and Miller were in Baseball America's top ten that year.

Still blows my mind that Dombrowski signed Willis to an extension TWO WEEKS after the deal was made (or two months after Willis completed [at that point] his worst season).

haha, last paragraph in that article was the best imo:

OK, that's about 2,400 words on the Royals' side of the trade. Here are 38 for Tampa Bay fans: You got one of the game's best prospects and three other potential prospects, for a 31-year-old starter who was only under team control for two more seasons, and a bullpen piece. Yeah, a good day's work.

prediction: the royals will win 85 games

"Maybin and Miller were in Baseball America's top ten that year."

The next year? Or the beginning of that year? Maybin was still #6 in 2008, it's true, but there were some concern about his swing (admittedly none about his athleticism).

Either way Miguel Cabrera is a LOT better than Jamie Shields in any universe.

measuring any trade against any trade the marlins have done is pretty faulty in general

joe is still so great

Point is, the Royals did not get a sure thing here -- the way the Tigers did with Miggy. They got a pitcher they love for a lot of old-fashioned reasons -- his competitiveness, his focus, his verve, his nickname (Big Game Shields!). These things might indeed matter. But these were also the reasons the Royals acquired Jason Kendall.

big yield shields

big game james remains the least-deserved nickname of all time

His career away numbers are pretty ugly.

"scouts" are the worst

― J0rdan S., Monday, December 10, 2012 12:08 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark

Huh?

I'd love to know why scouts is in quotes... are they aliens pretending to be baseball scouts

seems like 'scouts' could be anything from a 25yo up and comer who knows sabermetrics back and forth to a 60yo veteran scout who doesn't know what OBP is

just because you have the ability to watch a pitcher/hitter and figure out how good their mechanics are etc doesn't make you an authority on baseball transactions

if you can use terms like toolsy and fringy and rate things on a 20-to-80 scale, you're set

haha

Don't forget Harold Reynolds' two essential scouting accessories: straw hat, stogie.

scouts are important, beyond the M Lewis-style caricature.

I also think Shields is a p good pitcher, didnt understand who allegedly got fleeced til just now. Maybe wait n see?

i don't think its so much that it's not a fair trade in a vacuum as it is that the royals aren't good enough or deep enough to be trading in this direction yet

right & they also felt compelled to trade potentially one of the best young RFs in baseball while employing one of the absolute worst players in baseball (frenchy) at that position. robbing from the x to pay the y, or whatever the saying is.

also dave cameron mentioned this yesterday but it hasn't really been brought up that much but the royals paid much, much more than the reds did to acquire latos or the nats did to acquire gio and shields isn't remarkably better than either of those two guys.

Video game lolz

http://www.fangraphs.com/not/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/fhqH3.png

http://i.imgur.com/yjzPK.jpg

Is that game fun

i still remember the one for Wells.

Is that game fun

― pun lovin criminal (polyphonic), Monday, December 10, 2012 7:54 PM (3 hours ago) Bookmark

i played it once and found it to be a pretty poor management sim, but i dont know what the hot alternatives are these days. im more of a front office football 07 guy

Y'all play iootp?

mgmt sims, ye godz

George Brett ‏@GeorgeHBrett
The chess board looks good time to sacrifice a rook and a castle to go for checkmate lets go royals

(a rook is a castle fwiw)

Well you do have two of them.

rooked is one word that comes to mind when this trade comes up

I can't even imagine how awful it must be to be a Royals fan right now

"right now"

they seemed so happy for billy butler during the all star game.. pretty much the highlight of their season u_u

I feel Royals fans had legitimate reasons to be excited for the next 4-5 years which is why this has to be such a stomach punch for them. I don't even know if this'll make them a better team in 2013 which would really make this a disaster. If I were a GM I'd be super skeptical about acquiring a pitcher from Tampa Bay.

The Dodgers will pay 10 players at least $11 million next season. The Rays have never paid anyone that much in a single season.

i know Myers wanted $2MM as a draftee but does anyone else fear there will be a late June announcement that the Rays have locked him up for 7 years/18 million or some shit like that?

Youk to Yankees. f u Sox

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-WKMst9BK6AQ/T-S-eulj0AI/AAAAAAAAALA/kMJXutwBOOY/s1600/tumblr_lpc1xxI7sF1qfpukv.jpg

Indians got Trevor Bauer, Matt Albers, Bryan Shaw, and Drew Stubbs. Reds got Shin-Soo Choo and Jason Donald. D-Backs got Didi Gregorius, Tony Sipp, and Lars Anderson.

arizona's GM is fucking awful

deal is amazing for cleveland, wow

Jason Martinez
‏@mlbdepthcharts
Kevin Towers has traded Chris Young, Trevor Bauer, Matt Albers, Bryan Shaw for 2 SS's that can't hit, Tony Sipp, and Lars Anderson. #Dbacks

don't forget heath bell!

"deal is amazing for cleveland, wow"

Deal is pretty good for Cincy as they might finally have a real lead off hitter. Uncle Walt pretty much Dusty-proofed the lineup. Only question is that Choo hasn't played center in a few years (nor has Jay Bruce), but got to give it some

yeah it depends on how choo adapts to center and how much you care about team control of players

Reds are at the 'in it to win it now' stage. Gregorius isn't going to play second with Phillips around and they already got Cozart at short who is pretty much the same player with one year in the bigs. Drew Stubbs is a nice fielder in center, but the guy can't hit and has gotten worse 2 years straight. They really didn't give up that much.

I see the deal for Choo not unlike what the Giants gave up to have Pagan last year.

Reds got a quality lead off hitter with a utility infielder and didn't have to give up Mike Leake or any of the the top pitching prospects to fill the need. Choo might only be there for a year, but they also got speedster Billy Hamilton lurking in the background as a shortstop now, but being moved to CF in winter ball.

this is a fair trade for Cinci and the Indians, I don't know what the hell Arizona has to gain from it.

For the Indians this trade is all about whether or not Bauer turns out to be good to great, right? That seems like a good gamble for a year or two of Choo. Reds appear to have given up nothing of substance for him and yeah D-backs appear to have gotten nothing.

ugh, FINALLY

cardinals human body Skip Schumaker traded to Dodgers for some guy who doesn't matter.

thank GOD

hey dodgers fans, get ready to watch skip schumaker hit weak grounders to second base, no matter what the situation is, while nearby people who don't know anything about baseball like him because his name is skip

Marc Topkin ‏@TBTimes_Rays
Ex-#Rays DH Damon tells @MLBNetworkRadio after seeing Shields + Davis deal he'd like to go back + finish career w/#Royals/. Has said that b4

i get the sense arizona saw something it didn't like in bauer's mechanics. also, he has very idiosyncratic ideas about his workout regimen that may have been rasmusesque minus the dad

Youk is EIGHTH '04 Bosock to move to the Bronx

wau: Reds leadoff hitters delivered a collective on-base percentage of .254 last year.

http://www.baseballthinkfactory.org/images/uploads/article/Kevin-Towers-Diamondbacks-trade-Wikipedia.png

bauer is also a mess.. he's been using his own training regimen and deals with his own mechanics and wont alter anything because hes stubborn as shit.. the way his mechanics work now is that he leaves a ton of stuff up in the zone which works in the minors but gets punished in the bigs..

wau: Reds leadoff hitters delivered a collective on-base percentage of .254 last year.

Looks like Dusty should have put his catchers there!

Youk is EIGHTH '04 Bosock to move to the Bronx

― saltwater incursion (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, December 12, 2012 11:16 AM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

sometimes the http://www.flipflopflyin.com/flipflopflyball/ infographics just write themselves.

I feel like Eli Whiteside has been on like ten different teams since the season ended. Now he's on the Rangers?

from another site I read

Nov. 5: Yankees claimed him off waivers from Giants
Nov. 24; Yankees signed Whiteside for 2013
Nov. 28: Blue Jays claimed him off waivers from Yankees
today: Rangers claimed him off waivers from Blue Jays

3 waiver claims in 38 days.

what other catching options did the yankees uncover in those four days?

hey dodgers fans, get ready to watch skip schumaker hit weak grounders to second base, no matter what the situation is, while nearby people who don't know anything about baseball like him because his name is skip

― dexpresso (Z S), Wednesday, December 12, 2012 8:19 AM (8 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i hope you adjusted your batting gloves 5 times before posting that.

who pioneered that habit? the first to stick in my mind was nomar

http://www-thescore.s3.amazonaws.com/images/44848/original.gif?1327980390

giants sign andres torres to complete their OF situation.. blanco/torres in left pagan in center and pence in right.. looks like some wackness to me but whatever Im sure they'll win another world series to spite everyone

kevin towers's moves always make 0 sense to me but then his teams end up doing fine anyway despite looking awful on paper

giants sign andres torres to complete their OF situation.. blanco/torres in left pagan in center and pence in right.. looks like some wackness to me but whatever Im sure they'll win another world series to spite everyone

― johnathan lee riche$ (mayor jingleberries), Thursday, December 13, 2012 10:01 AM (33 minutes ago)

So basically SF traded Ramon Ramirez for Angel Pagan.

uhhhhhhh

http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/mlb/story/_/id/8744414/josh-hamilton-agreed-deal-angels-source-says

fuckin l.a. teams man

if it's true, an outfield of trout, ham, trumbo

lol

Jon Heyman ‏@JonHeymanCBS
#rangers were not given a chance to match the angels deal

chrrrist

pretty clear neither side really wanted to continue that relationship

no better place to stay clean then LA amirite

maybe noted fellow jesus stan albert pujols sold him on it somehow.

tru

both l.a. teams are amazingly stacked with potential schadenfreude

Just continuing the Lakers' recent run of success.

i hate the new era of tv money

;_;

i realize it's just an extension of what was already happening, but ;_;

NOW
this
is going
to be
FUN

California rules, everyone else drools

what news today

welcome back Torres and Hamilton to the Angels makes sense.

dempster to BOS for 2/26

gross

Vernon Wells still makes 21 mil per year for the next few years, lol

hooo boy

Torii Hunter @toriihunter48I was told money was tight but I guess the Arte had money hidden under a Mattress. Business is business but don’t lie.

In all fairness if he had waited until Greinke was finished they might have re-signed him.

ha ha torii u mad

If Hamilton's healthy, I'm trying to think of the last 1-3-4 as awesome as this one--1990 Henderson/Canseco/McGwire (20+ WAR)? And Canseco wasn't Pujols, and McGwire wasn't yet McGwire.

someone should really fix baseball

god but even so, and even though i hate the angels, i'm sort of excited to see them next year

dodgers and yankees are still schadenfreude tho

OTOH I will be stoked if TX and OAK continue to dom the ALW and Anaheim is stuck floundering with those bloated contracts.

cubs signed anibal, good for them

is it possible for me to just say that i hope trout and pujols and hamilton all have great years but LAA still misses the playoffs

i'm always going to be a fan of those three

yeah I'm not digging this new market at all

cubs signed anibal

Maybe not, apparently

would be a bad move for them

Jonah Keri ‏@jonahkeri
Anibal Sanchez' last 3 years aren't that far from Greinke & Shields. Making half Greinke's contract & didn't cost Wil Myers.

anibal is crazy underrated

definitely, but he'd be wasted in chicago

i like anibal but i actually think the saber community is overrating him w/ how much hes been talked up

i like that his name is Anibal.

i hate the new era of tv money

;_;

― dexpresso (Z S), Thursday, December 13, 2012 3:06 PM (8 hours ago) Bookmark

as a braves fan, i REALLY hate it

If Hamilton's healthy, I'm trying to think of the last 1-3-4 as awesome as this one