What the fuck is this: Castlevania SOTN is now going for like $70?!!

FFVII going for about that much last I checked.

About a year ago, I realized I could sell the thing on eBay and make some cash, so I called the friend. He had lost it. *Slaps forehead*

"lost it"

I don't see why they couldn't keep the big PS1 games in print. People still want to buy them, obv.

Am currently playing Aria of Sorrow, having beaten Harmony of Dissonance last week. I also picked up Circle of the Moon over the weekend, but it's used and a bit dodgy. Still, the cart is rare enough that i'm going to hang on to the thing.

JUST SAYYYIINGGGG. don't steal

He paid $110 for FFVII.

Yeah, I think these are the three I've played, I love these games.

AB, how is C2 hugely flawed? Not that I disagree, but it's been years.

I think someone had to tell me before I got it, but I hadn't really played it much yet at that point

Castlevania III is pretty great. I bought it about a year ago, and play it off and on every month or so, getting a little farther each time.

It's standard trial-and-error, talk to everyone, "lots of places to go, only one correct order to visit them" garbage, but also adds in an annoying day/night system and some 'puzzles' you'd have to be psychic to figure out. (disclaimer: I didn't get halfway through it, so maybe it improves later on)

CV 64: players hate it, and the CV creators have pretty much disowned it. if you still want to play it, get legacy of darkness instead.

The CV Dungeon is an excellent resource for the series: http://castlevania.classicgaming.gamespy.com/dungeon.html

Holy shit yes, esp. if you have Suik 2.

lotsa late SNES/Genesis-era anime, too

did anybody play any of the PS2 games? I'm wondering if Lament of Innocence is worth trying out or not.

http://www.joystiq.com/2007/08/23/new-castlevania-coming-to-mobile-phones-in-september/

Castlevania: Order of Shadows

features a new storyline and original soundtrack

http://www.djork.net/castlevania/

Castlevania name-generator!

Castlevania: Bus Ride of Burnt Toast

Playing C:Order of Shadows. It's a lot like the NES versions, due to the limited controls. You still have stats & an inventory, tho.

Two new games on the way, another DS title and a 3d fighter:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castlevania:_Order_of_Ecclesia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castlevania_Judgment

Apparently, the Portrait of Ruin team is again working on this. Too bad I sold the DS a year, but we'll see.

I kinda burned out on these games when I picked up that GBA double pack with Harmony/Aria, though they were both fun. Both pretty good, though Aria was way better (damn you addictive soul collect-a-thon!) in general.

Not sure if I should still bother to get the two DS games, or just wait until Order comes out.... what say you?

Got an emulator for the original PC Engine "Rondo of Blood". Yeah, it's the best Castlevania game ever.

http://castlevaniadungeon.net/Images/Intros/rondoa.gif

I really like the anime feel on this one. The controls are perfect and the game music is amazing. Stage 2 is like being in the "Thriller" music video.

This game is a work of art, Roget Ebert can suck it.

I need to get these drum samples.

Playing "Castlevania: Bloodlines" for Genesis now. Amazing soundtrack as always, cool as hell bad guys, nice weapons, etc. Buying a Castlevania game is like buying a Beatles record.

Bloodlines was awesome, underlooked probably because it wasn't a main series title. Definitely preferred it to IV though, and a good stepping stone to the Rondo/Symphony series.

it's not a lot like buying a beatles record

I never had a Genesis so I never got a chance to play Bloodlines.

Do what I did, emulate it long after the fact

Just remember that at the end of game, it IS supposed to be like that ;)

Yeah im emulating a Genesis, playing games i never got to play. Also had a friend try out Splatterhouse 3 last night, which was also pretty damn cool.

I meant it's like buying a Beatles because i like the Beatles and i remember buying my first Beatles record and liking it and every record after that, I didn't know what new stuff would be added, or how orchestration or production had changed, but I always knew i would enjoy it from beginning to end.

Maybe i'm missing out on the crappy Castlevania entries. Never played 2 much.

lately i've been regretting giving my GBA SP away (years ago), mostly so i could play Castlevania: Aria of Sorrow again.

http://www.vizzed.com/vizzedboard/retro/user_screenshots/saves8/81983/Castlevania%20%20Bloodlines_Jun23%209_14_13.png
OK so i beat it last night, on Easy, but using Quick Saves to rather cheap effect a few times. Like any old game this is HARD. Final boss was pretty awesome, if seemingly never-ending at the time. First the Grim Reaper deals out tarot cards and you have to knock through each one. Some of them are re-fighting old bosses, some of them give you food, some of them just shoot fireballs at you. Then the green haired evil witch from the opening cinematic splits into 5 different duplicates and then summons a bunch of floating spheres that all align in a pentagram. You have to hit her before they all combine or else dodge a lightning strike, or wheel of fire that looks like a dragon, or circle of knives flying at you, etc. That part was pretty cool and I just figured it out on my own.

She also changes into a green half-man half-worm demon and then finally the above grotesque monster with a horrible face for a crotch that spits out streams of fire. The end of the game was extremely anti-climatic, at least it was for me, with simply a cool-looking full-screen loop of your character watching the castle crumble into dust in the distance, hair waving in the wind, standing on top of a mountain or something over endlessly swirling clouds or water or who the hell knows but it looks cool. It was fine w me tho because the game seemed to really go on and on for a LONG time.

It never slowed down, and while yeah there were only 2 or 3 bad guys on the screen at once, it usually felt like more. Plenty of really cool graphic tricks in this, neat water reflections, cool rotating floors and things that deliver a real 3d illusion. At one point *** SPOILER *** you enter a room where the screen is split into 4 parts and each part is horizontally offset in some effed up way, as if you are playing the game through a funhouse mirror or something. It's the most mind-blowing part of the game. At least until a stage or two later when you revisit it, only the distorted view is gone and THE ENTIRE STAGE IS UPSIDE DOWN. Thank God there are no enemies in these parts.

I almost feel like this was better than the Super NES one, it seems to control a little easier (even on an GENS) and the graphics are just jaw-dropping! There's the Genesis version of Contra waiting for me but something tells me it can't possibly be this good.

No doubt it was better than Super IV IMO. i don't remember Hard Corps being at the same level, but still pretty good? Alien Wars on SNES was more to live up to

The end of the game was extremely anti-climatic, at least it was for me, with simply a cool-looking full-screen loop of your character watching the castle crumble into dust in the distance, hair waving in the wind, standing on top of a mountain or something over endlessly swirling clouds or water or who the hell knows but it looks cool.

Hah maybe i've blocked them all out cos getting to the ending is always such a treat!

IV, Bloodlines/New Generation, and Rondo of Blood/Dracula X - those are the only 16-bit Castlevanias, right? Or are there more?

I purchased the Dracula X disc for psp just to get SOTN as a playable game

THE ENTIRE STAGE IS UPSIDE DOWN. Thank God there are no enemies in these parts.

I mis-remembered this. There are enemies during this part. This game is hard! And so good! I've played it through 3 times now.

i found my long, long-neglected DS and started playing through Aria of Sorrow again. this game is perfect.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SahSabf2-0s

Hah I've been playing through "Rondo" again, trying to find all the secrets and rescue all the anime damsels. Level 6 is just an incredible presentation. An evil necromancer stands in front of magical symbols and conjures a bunch of bosses from the first Castlevania game: the giant bat, the Medusa, the Mummy, Frankenstein's Monster, etc. and you have to fight them all with a single health bar while a blazing hot evil organ arpeggio runs up and down the scales.

awesome.

Um I've been playing Symphony of the Night. It's really sad that they didn't make another 2D console Castlevania after this one, it really is the peak of the form. I love the use of 3D, which is usually deployed to render doors or other box-shaped objects (flying novels! secret-entrance-concealing bookshelves!) but last night I ended up underground in some vast cavern system where the 3D started being used to render molten lava bubbling up from the earth.

This game looks fantastic, and my only criticism is that back-tracking, eventually I start going through the same areas I've been through dozens of times, which gets tiring. But this is a convention of the genre (and one that usually turns me off to Metroid & Super Metroid after I sink a half dozen hours into it) and when you DO reach a new area, it is that much more special.

Again, it's a travesty that this is was the last 2D console Castlevania. Imagine what they could've done on the N64! Imagine an HD Castlevania for PS2! I'm sure plenty have. I've just completed the first castle and intend on getting the best ending (I've gotten the inverted castle before but never stuck w it). The RPG elements in this are brilliantly seamless, and the fact that you can switch capes or equip a new weapon and the in-game sprite actually changes appearance to reflect this is wonderful! I would say this is the number one Castlevania (and objectively for western players it is, since Rondo didn't get an original release here) but the backtracking is just not my cup of tea. So personally I still think Rondo is the best, seconded by this, with Bloodlines a very very close third. But ask me tomorrow and I may think Bloodlines is the best (it has the best music and level design imo).

SNES version is just too muddy for me, both video and audio. It's like a Castlevania talking through a pillow. SOTN and Rondo both have this romantic, baroque, Rococo aesthetic to them, something that takes monster movies as a jumping off point to explore a heavily stylized compendium of historical European fantasy.

http://fantasyanime.com/valhalla/castlevaniasotn/screenshots/large/15-AbandonedMine06.png

Also, Salem Witches in the Abandoned Mines. So cool!

Kind of kicking myself because I'm playing the PSX version and apparently the Saturn one has a playable Maria and a few extra areas. On the other hand, here's an excuse to play this game all over again!

Great game! Loved/hated scouring the entire castle for weird zircons and stuff. Loved Legion, what a boss. Loved the floating clock-sword. Don't remember the final boss.

Super Castlevania IV is really great though, my second favourite in the series, best graphics of all the first-wave of SNES games and one of my favourite soundtracks. Love the intro to this cue, damn hxxps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtEn0f5CWQo

SOTN: there's one or two weird boards in the colosseum where the difficulty is suddenly through the roof, memories of sailing through the game to come crashing to a halt, reloading reloading etc.

I can't think about this game without thinking of when it first came out and I was playing it, with a friend looking on who only played TBS games and held side-scrollers in great contempt. He was complaining for about 10 minutes at how stupid the logic of video games is, and how he couldn't understand how I could put up with it, etc. etc. I told him to shut up. After a couple of minutes in silence while I was going through one of those underground cavern areas, he said in this loud and indignant voice:

"THAT FROG HAD TWENTY DOLLARS."

Love those underground caverns, especially the sound design as you get closer to the waterfall.

adam, i love your retro revives. have you played the GBA ones, like Aria of Sorrow/Dawn of Sorrow? because those are brilliant 16-bit-style sequels.

Thanks... No I have not played them! I am super looking forward to them!

they're dope man. do 'em all

they're not very good!!

i mean i played ecclesia and the portrait one and the sci fi one, one of them. something about the level design in them all was just. Did You Like That Burger? Have Another Burger. Have Two More Burgers. Here Are Some More Burgers For You.

lol. i thought aria/dawn had good level design, but are mostly great because of the 'soul' system: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castlevania:_Aria_of_Sorrow#Tactical_Soul

lol thomp

I like the painting one, some good boss fights in it

Aria of Sorrow was great. Haven't tried the other GBA ones, but would be willing to after playing that one.

I mean sotn is a really broken feeling game mechanically -- taking away the whip but keeping inertia and acceleration at castelvania-standard levels makes everything feel really somehow off. then there's like a fighting game move set and rpg stats and then the three transformations, none of which three play very well. but i think the really broken collection of ~ludic possibilities~ really works against the sort of cosy horror aesthetic, the sense of entrenchment the player feels in the world. and all the fragments of castle really neatly incorporate distinct, er, forms of spatial awareness.

compare and contrast super metroid: you have like 2% of alucards total moveset but everything feels more tightly constructed around it. -- everything expands the map for you.

i want to claim that the small format games try and improve on sotn without noticing it works because broken. the soul system, hm, I think I spent 25 mins killing the one enemy type to get through a particular door, so fuck that, frankly

I played a little Aria of Sorrow last night and WOW YES MOAR PLZ! Somehow I completely slept on the Gameboy Advance and now it feels like I missed out on SNES 2.0. Aria is pretty amazing, though I have no idea how to use the soul system yet.

Konami is easily my favorite game company of all time.

yup, GBA was fuckin' boss

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ahsiMTd82bU

Castlevania Chronicles for Playstation is pretty cool! The Belmont kinda looks like Danzig. And on the last level you get to fight panthers and knife-throwing maids on your way up Dracula's castle.

IGA (the main Castlevania oroducer since Chronicles) left Konami a month ago. Loved his portable Castlevanias. Hopefully he can make more of those types of games now, since Konami only makes Monster Hunter and Metal Gear now.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2014-03-17-castlevania-developer-koji-igarashi-leaves-konami

I thought that had already happened! PLEASE do a Mighty No. 9-style Kickstarter.

I played some more "Aria of Sorrow". DAMN it is sweet! I think I like it even more than "Symphony of the Night" at the moment. Controls and animation is smoooooth. Music is great. The song in the Study really reminds me of "Conan the Barbarian" OST. This game is a little on the easy side but that is fine if you don't mind not losing the 15+ minutes of game time and exploration you did since you last saved. The monsters are really wonderfully drawn and varied. I feel like every 2 screens it's a new set of bad guys!

Yeah, "Aria of Sorrow" rules.

it totally does. have you gotten any of the shape-changing souls? those stick out in my memory.

I am playing Rondo of Blood for the first time and I'm dying and dying and dying and dying

yeah, Rondo is OG Castlevania difficulty

Rondo is the best one!

My top 5

1. Rondo of Blood
2. Bloodlines
3. Aria of Sorrow
4. Castlevania 3
5. Symphony of the Night

rondo is really satisfying, tough but fair. also had a sweet ost. (but I guess most of em do)

Yeah, some of the best in gaming! Sometimes it really sounds like Goblin.

It's the first Castlevania I've played that's level designed for secondary weapon use. I... love it so far. I can't beat the minotaur but I beat the sea snake

Sea snake is super tough! Make sure you find all the secrets, if you think the level design is good now just wait.

Yeah, some of the best in gaming! Sometimes it really sounds like Goblin.
--▴▲ ▴TH3CR()$BY$H()W▴▲ ▴ (Adam Bruneau)

hah, yes! sometimes it's like a tough but sentimental scene in a hk action movie too iirc

I must play Bloodlines some time. And get past the initial stages of Dracula's Curse -- I always went for the clock tower path and got stuck.

since Konami only makes Monster Hunter and Metal Gear now.

Monster Hunter is Capcom of course. Can't believe I messed that up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FsvpXTqJuvk

I am playing "Order of Ecclesias" on an emulator, projected. This is my favorite Castlevania game, and is objectively the best one yet. Sadly it is also the last 2D one. The best thing about this game is that it takes place outside the castle, unlike the previous god knows how many games. It's an awesome thing to be fighting monsters in a graveyard, I can't believe it's not something that has been really done before in the series! The graphics are AMAZING and this is one of the very few games where you play as a female hero! Overall it is a breath of fresh air! Lots of new sprites and enemies. AMAZING soundtrack. The bass and drums sound like crisp 70's studio rock like Steely Dan or something, and the songs are all 4 tracks or less.

This is may be better than Rondo of Blood! I loved the alternate character in that game, Maria. She played differently than Richter and the more open-ended and freer play style is in "Order of Ecclesias", only tenfold. Like "Megaman", you can defeat enemies and gain their powers, so there are literally hundreds ofways to play this game. It is very open world! Yet the maps are usually compact and simple. The graveyard is just 3 or 4 screens horizontally spaced. The overall aesthetic of the game is 70's Prog Jazz Rock Occult-Themed Dungeons 'n' Dragons Concept EP. You will leap from tree to tree, a raven haired witch with RPG memory loss and a very particular set of skills, slashing flying skulls with batwings with a pickaxe, the graveyard around you blue in the moonlight.

d'oh i meant Order of Ecclesia

01 Order of Ecclesia
02 Rondo of Blood
03 Bloodliines
04 Castlevania
05 Aria of Sorrow
06 Symphony of the Night
07 Castlevania 3

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7kGm5csoWVQ

^Listen to that music and tell me it's NOT awesome

Like for the most part Castlevania has been this minimalist Hammer monster movie tribute yet Rondo of Blood and some of the stranger stages have had a baroque, medieval flavor to them, and it occasionally edges towards Fantasy rather than Horror. This game has both in good balance. You may hear a cat meowing and find one standing still in the depths of a sort of ancient library or science laboratory, but you will be fighting flying horse heads and shrieking Lina Blair/Exorcist-style banshees.

uh sorry for the poor grammar/spelling i'm having a bit of rum

great level design in that music clip there

I was going through the snow-covered mountains, across rope bridges and into spider-infested caves, and I had been through the are several times before, and out of nowhere when the screen was scrolling down I caught sight of a yeti on a bridge! He recognized me and made some alert noise and jumped off into the distance. This game really catches you by surprise!

The sound design in "Ecclesia" is amazing. The music is sort of a higher def sequel to "Super Castlevania IV". Some trip hop drum n bass inspired Ghost Jazz in here.

Some of the sound effects, like the banshee screams, and some of the other monster wailings, are genuinely chilling. And is there another game out there where you are under the sea fighting giant poisonous starfish by shooting lightning from your hands at them?

It controls like BUTTER. Better jumping than Super Mario Bros. Easier multi-weapons than Mega Man 3. You can choose between English and Japanese voice overs. The character sprites are all large and it feels less maze-like and telescopic than previous post-SOTN entries. More arcade-like.

I found it underwhelming at the time but don't really remember why. possibly just metroidvania'ed out? you're making me want to give it another go in any case.

Better jumping than Super Mario Bros. Easier multi-weapons than Mega Man 3.

You're just trolling now.

haha

Yeah those aren't true that's a bit of hyperbole. I mean to say jumping and the swiss army knife weapon system are really fun.

The Metroid aspects are really toned down, you never have to really walk through an area to get to another, they are all laid out as different spots on a map. And a warp trip back to the hub village is really inexpensive. What I hated about the Metroidvania style in the past has been having to go all the way across a map and having one map be the entire game, so you are always having to go through the same areas over and over. That's more or less gone from this one.

My favorite of the Metroidvanias. Portrait of Ruin also had multiple maps, but Ecclesia did it better. I also like that they put the warp rooms and the save rooms right beside each other.

I'm in love with Rondo of Blood. I have Ecclesia waiting once I finish. I love these games ;_;

http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/cvbook/cvbook.htm

Really extensive overview of the series, get a load of the contents list, I'm always amazed how many games there are.

HG101 is always a great resource

FYI: A lot of the Castlevania stuff is currently (and thru tomorrow) on sale for cheap in the Playstation Store.

Yeah, the articles deepened my appreciation of games and I used to be on the forum all the time but since I don't play games anymore I had nothing to contribute but criticizing people's choice in films and comics. But seriously, it's the least assholish game forum I've ever seen.

It almost feels like the series might stay dead for a while too but Silent Hill has made a comeback sooner than I thought (not sure that's a good idea though). I'd probably rather another set of games replaced Castlevania.

I have barely touched games for a couple of years now, very little suits my conditions and I'd be surprised if I bought another console again, so I have mixed feelings about there being new attractive games but part of me does miss things about them.

Unsure whether to buy the cheaper Kindle version of the Castlevania book.

It quite annoys me that there is way more sale of individual old games than bundled collections. A disc with over 20 Castlevania games would probably be possible but it's maybe too cool an idea to ever happen. Sad thing is that I don't have the patience to beat most of these games anymore. They'd need to have newly made easy modes for me.

My ranking of the ones I've played enough of (I had two of the earlier games but didn't get far)

Symphony Of The Night
Aria Of Sorrow
Circle Of The Moon
Harmony Of Dissonance
Dawn Of Sorrow
Portrait Of Ruin
Order Of Ecclesia
Bloodlines
Lament Of Innocence
Lord Of Shadows

I played the majority of these games within a two year period and had a total blast. The effort and enthusiasm I was able to put into games waned so I never finished Portrait Of Ruin (but I was close), Order Of Ecclesia and Lord Of Shadows. I never would have been able to beat Bloodlines anyway but I got close to the end.
All the Gameboy Advance and Nintendo DS ones are very close calls.

ha - i also ended up halting on Portrait. i really should get back to it...

That brutal dungeon survival task and the final boss is what made me give up.

http://i.imgur.com/iUfLVAS.jpg

A new account going by IGAVANIA has been posting cryptic pixel art and "I will return" stuff on the Castlevania forums.

Quarterwomann
‏@Quarterwomann
Lots to report, but one thing Your Qrrespondent can't nail down is the timing—what arrives with the moon, and what comes later?

Sadly some GG idiots are starting to troll those forums =(

Always liked the idea of new Castlevania inspired games more than new entries in the actual series because they aren't obliged to follow the story and don't have to have Dracula in the game, more freedom. Same goes for other franchises.

One of the worst things about really geeky game fans is the expectation developers often pander to of more story focus developing in earth shattering directions like DC and Marvel try to do. It's really silly when you get Tekken and King Of Fighters intros still insisting on overblown drama. Resident Evil got bad for this.

Quarterwomann? Q-Man changed genders?

I disagree RAG, I absolutely loved the full out B-movie gloriousness of the recent Netherrealms story modes (Mortal Kombat 9/X, Injustice)

But yeah, more Castlevania would be sweet... just a matter of time before they return to their senses and go back to making 2D games, or if IGA or someone can pick up the slack Mighty No. 9 style...

Sounds like she is working for 8-4, a translation/PR team that did the kickstarter for MN9!

I was disappointing that Iga's ____ of Sorrow games referred to a battle in the year 1999 that finally killed Dracula for good... and then that game never got made.

"aren't obliged to follow the story and don't have to have Dracula in the game" you mean like Lords of Shadow? just kidding

Games rarely return to 2D. There hasn't been a genuinely new 2d Capcom fighting game since Capcom Fighting Evolution/Jam (2004) and that game was made of more recycled character pixels than most fighting games. SNK hasn't really made anything new in ages and even they might not have 2d in their future if they continue to make new games at all.

I haven't seen that Mortal Kombat game's story mode, maybe it's fun but surely you don't thrill to "Oh no! Ken Masters (or Jill Valentine) has been radicalized with PSYCHO POWER and has to fight our hero!" or some dumb rivalry with the angst pumped up to maximum?
Cutscenes with emotional drama rarely do anything other than face imploding cringefests.

I'd love it if someone made more 2d games like Ghosts N' Goblins/Ghouls and Splatterhouse. I love scrolling 2d horror games.

the recent MK games are a lot more tongue-in-cheek (well, i guess they always were compared to SF/KOF). MK9 has a Butterfly Effect-eque plot involving Raiden sending a message back in time to undo the events of MK1-8, only to have things go catastrophically wrong with each timeline alteration. even Injustice constantly brings up how ridiculous the whole plot is, with SUPER SRS EVIL ALTERNATE UNIVERSE SUPERMAN as the villain. but really, it's a clever way to get you to play most of the characters on the roster for single player story mode, and it's fun and goofy universe stuff

i love touches that (and, no i don't think they need to apologize at all for being completely B-movie level) show there's a degree of care or love for the universe. The King of Fighters series started off putting little pre-match animations between distinct characters to highlight friendships/rivalries and other relationships in the '90s. MKX does a fantastic job with this, every single combination of characters has unique voiced banter entering a match. Injustice did his too with the clash events

are for 2D vs. fake 3D/2D, yeah, I would prefer if we got more Guilty Gear/Arcsys/Persona-style hand-drawn games too, but today they're pretty confined as "anime niche" even inside the sadly niche genre of fighting games. The SFIV series and MK series made distinct returns to 2D gameplay this past generation, especially compared to that dire early '00s period

Well those MK scenes are far wittier than anything in the tedious KOF13 faceoffs. But in Snk Vs Capcom Chaos there was this gem from Akuma: "Beating you was easier than smacking a baby. Not that I would ever do that."
I would generally prefer arcadey games avoided story and dialogue or kept it to a bare minimum unless they knew it was something they could do especially well.

I'm talking about stuff like this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8qG4AlK1qk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aYTPWAavALg

Even Guilty Gear is going 3d, but it has impressively maintained the 2d look more any 2.5d game I've seen but I'm not really into it anymore. But yeah, I'm really not into the style Blazblue, Arcana Heart, Under Night In-Birth, Persona 4 Arena, Aquapazza amd Chaos Code has. After all these games you really appreciate how well animated games like Streetfighter 3rd Strike, Darkstalkers 3, KOF13 were.

The SFIV series and MK series made distinct returns to 2D gameplay this past generation, especially compared to that dire early '00s period

Actually I'd say that was one of the best times for fighting games. Capcom vs Snk 2, Marvel vs Capcom 2, Virtua Fighter 4 Evolution, Neo Geo Battle Coliseum, King Of Fighters 2003, Project Justice, Street Fighter Ex3 (I liked it, but the previous game was probably better), Guilty Gear X2, Soul Calibur 2, Tekken 4 and Samurai Shodown 6. Those were some of the best instalments of each series.

heh, that DMC clip is really the "miserable pile of secrets" for its generation

sorry, realizing that I got way off track here since this is the Castlevania thread. to sum up quickly i agree and disgaree with your various opinions here; but basically to me there's everything up until about '98 and the Dreamcast era, upon which there were the endless sprite rehashes that you mentioned with a few bright spots here and there (like Project Justice! loved that game) while the mainstream releases were "dominated" by things like generic 3D SFEX/MK/Tekken sequels. i want to put time into modern 2D fighters like Xrd, BlazBlue, P4A and Skullgirls and see if they're worth it but, you know, time and age means i'm going to sway towards the ones with bigger player bases

back to the subject at hand tho, IGA forever

General fighting games thread

Just cut and pasted our fighting game conversation in a new thread to continue.

It was predictable that people who grew to hate Iga would miss his Castlevania after Konami tried to make it appeal to a wider audience. Not many important games got to continue that long in full 2d and I think people started to take it for granted that it would stay that way. Once a company loses a team with old school creative skills it's seemingly really difficult to get people who can do that again.

One major complaint about Iga was that the rpg elements were just getting tiresome and relying on "artificial" length with all the added fetch quests. He seemed to acknowledge this and he said that the remakes and reissues he was involved with was partly to test the waters and see if people wanted to go back to more linear levels, which indeed many long term fans were yearning for (and I guess a less complex map wouldn't be so exhausting for the team).
I used to think all these fans were full of shit but by the time of Portrait Of Ruin I did indeed get pretty tired of the complex maps and collectable quests.

What I respected about Iga is that he always said he was committed to value for money but the ways of extending the hours were sometimes a bit too grindy and laborious.

I wonder if his new game will be linear or complex?

http://swordorwhip.com/

Intriguing.

It's interesting hearing what Konami is going through. They seem to have got rid of Kojima and the new eagerly awaited Silent Hill was killed off. They want to make more Metal Gear games but aside from an apparently healthy pachinko income, there's nothing promising on the horizon to keep them afloat as a videogame company like Capcom has done despite their losses.

"What do you do when you find yourself without a castle? You build another."

Iga plays SOTN
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqheYYeA4k4

www.nintendolife.com/news/2015/05/koji_igarashis_castlevania_successor_teased_by_comcept_set_for_11th_may_reveal

"In any case all should become clearer at 11am Pacific / 2pm Eastern / 7pm UK / 8pm CET."

The runes on the chair have been decoded as "What a wonderful night to have a KS"

The suspense is killing me!

Also wading through Neogaf threads for rumors/new info (It might be the whiniest place I've ever seen on the internet/entitled nadir of consumerism). Rumors from anonymous inside source:

"There may be plans for "social" elements and "freemium" content. Hopefully tomorrow shows otherwise."

"- 2.5D
- Story takes place during Industrial Revolution, church worried that demons will invade if science prevails
- NotShanoa, NotJonathan and NotAlucard are the characters I saw."

"Yamane is in. So is the main programmer from the GBA/DS games. I believe he directed Harmony of Despair."

"Miriam's hair is dark brown. Shoulder length. Don't recognize the artist, but reminded me of OoE. Miriam is the protagonist."

"From what I've seen, it looks like OoE in 2.5D."

"From what I was told, drops are used for crafting skills and items. Seemed like Aria/Dawn with a middleman step."

"Okay, I'm done for the night. Last bit of info is that Fangamer is doing the merch."

it's up
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/iga/bloodstained-ritual-of-the-night

hooray!
i'll wait a little bit before they sucker me out of $28

Nice that the basic goal is secured already. Wonder how much further it will go.

2.5D -- hopefully it won't look as bad as Mighty No. 9

Hopefully more like Ultimate Ghosts N Goblins or Ori And The Blind Forest.

what is up with those old Mad Magazine style cast portraits though
They've already passed $1M, so Hayter guaranteed (as if this wasn't happening)
xp yeah I'm hoping it'll look better too...
i almost, almost want to pull the trigger on that $60 physical disc option but damn, two years...

$28 is a solid price point for this.

Seems like they need a tier for handhelds, tho.

I'm a little sad it won't be pixel art because they'll probably never go back that way and it would have been nice to see an pixel Igavania created from ground up because that never happened before.

I am fully willing to pay $28 for whatever game Iga makes (I bought Harmony of Despair and DLC, despite it sucking), but I think I'll just buy it when it comes out.

Did you get Judgement and Adventure Rebirth?

Adventure Rebirth is really good

whatever Igavania Iga makes. (I might buy Adventure Rebirth at some point, but then I'd have to plug in my Wii again.)

I didn't even know that game existed...

Yeah, it's just the whole KS "never knowing when a game is ever gonna come out" thing. And I'm not sure Iga has actually ever produced anything
independent of Konami... but in all likelihood it'll come out eventually.

Also wish there was a handheld tier, but I don't own a Vita anyway, which is probably the platform it would come out for

Isn't the original Wii shop dead now? Or are they still selling WiiWare?

Still selling Wiiware on Wii and WiiU. All of the Rebirth games are worth a look, M2 developed them.

LOL also completely unaware of the Wii fighting game. i just completely ignored that system after a certain point since I never picked it up. I'll remember them if I pick up a secondhand Wii at some pt...

I YouTube linked cut scenes from it last week.

Don't know if you guys have been hearing the news and rumours about Konami but right now it looks like they might stop making most of their videogame franchises.

ohhh i thought that was one of the N64 games

So I put down $60 for a physical backer edition. I hear they are implementing a 2D Classicvania version as well.

I was playing OoE earlier today. I was jumping from tree to tree, shooting lightning out of my hands at killer crows that were swooping in. I ran across bigfoot, who jumped off a bridge into the distant mountains. I thought, hell yes, I want more of this stuff!

New music sounds GREAT! I can't believe Michiru Yamane is involved!

I also bought the book they are basing the monsters on, the Lesser Key of Solomon. It's the more popular OTO translation by Macgregor Mathers with an intro and illustrations by Aleister Crowley.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lesser_Key_of_Solomon

some of those monsters are straight outta SMT/Persona. Ha.

https://ksr-ugc.imgix.net/assets/003/824/226/0cc31003258a1e01ec3eaf1d93fe2a8b_original.png?v=1432076642&w=700&h=&fit=max&auto=format&lossless=true&s=3f675dc571d2688de7214046603a211f

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TU-NF6SJxps

This is a super early animation test but it's kind of amazing how quickly they were able to pull this together. This game may turn out to be really really special.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=waAsGYKptqI

Watch for the third advert. It's really funny.

ha

The CV4 beta was very different! It even has a boss that isn't in the finished version. "Through a room!"

good god the commercial with the SCIV beta was so long. as long has HUMANLY POSSIBLE

punk rock dracula was nice

yes japanese punk dracula ftw

http://www.twitch.tv/ffstv

Iga's playing through Shantae right now. They are celebrating the biggest video game kickstarter ever, ending tonight, with $5.5 million right now.

So insane. This couldn't have happened at the right time, with what's happening with Konami and all. Every time someone bashed 2d gaming, everyone that bailed after 3d started and uglied up and sold out games, all that karma is getting funneled into this project.

Now they are interviewing Michiru Yamane, who composed "SOTN".

Even though I haven't played any games that I've actually Kickstarted, what the hell... fine. In for the $60 physical edition. Maybe by the time it comes out I'll have finished playing the DS games.

I'm glad they managed to get there without me.

That's great that it did so well. I wonder how many backers are long-term fans, how many are very recent fans. I wouldn't have thought it normally but maybe Lords Of Shadow did introduce the series to a much wider audience?

Was there alternate language pages for this kickstarter? Because I'd assume a lot of backers would be non-english speakers.

Maybe I could find a cheap PS Vita to play this on? (Assuming I can get a physical copy of Bloodstained from shops).

http://i.imgur.com/Q7I79Ju.png

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/iga/bloodstained-ritual-of-the-night/posts/1506864

gotta say i really like the way this is looking. even if she is a bit small on the screen, the design of the castle itself looks really nice from this one image!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4um6_cNpb6M

huuuuuuh

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAL07Pbqx3c

Looks like they're playing it safe with the Igavania formula, which is fine. Backers shouldn't be disappointed.

https://www.twitch.tv/

live-streaming it right now

....and they're out of time! Iga says that a demo should come out for fans this week (hopefully)

that looks tight

Graphics are a bit disappointing but I'm sure it'll be fine.

feel the same. i don't even want to see anymore until it comes out

demo is out. plays like a dream. this really feels like the sequel to SOTN/AOS. it's so perfect they have backdash cancelling, instant-slicing-when-landing, etc. other kinds of Vania minutiae built in already.

i like the graphics, never thought the day would come when i had a Castlevania in 1920x1080 but here we are. they are a little rough (def need some AA) but this is exciting! and hey it's an alpha demo or whatever.

i really like when you get a shard and it's the huge splash screen.

http://i.imgur.com/6E7RM69.jpg

sorry if huge

http://i.imgur.com/cyM1OOu.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/fUCgQGa.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/QnT5a46.jpg

the boss fight is kinda blah but the game is a lot of fun to play. the cell shading graphics can look really rough. but for an early demo this is promising!

http://i.imgur.com/HrfZMDr.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/tt9W47q.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/tXc8j6Q.jpg

that Netflix show is pretty sick. not afraid to be goofy. i liked how much of the SOTN castle was in that first episode, looked like all the design was based on the og pixel art.

i liked the netflix show. main flaw is that is 100% setup for future seasons

i played Bloodstained at NYCC... not looking good. pretty clunky and early

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8zaNelwUU8

C'mon Iga, if they can do this level of 2d surely you can. This looks brilliant.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfJ7TqkjKeU

recording the soundtrack & interviews w Michiru Yamane & other composers. also a little footage of the game.

yeah the game was supposed to come out last year but im all for them taking their sweet time. plus, this means i can get it on Switch. seems like the perfect system for this...

This game seems to have been in development forever, but it's obviously meant to scratch that Castlevania itch:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyskUorhheg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTRohTxCRlk

Bloodstained: Curse of the Moon, the 8-bit style prequel game to Bloodstained, is coming out tomorrow. it has very strong Castlevania III vibes, and it has many og Castlevania creators working on it. in a lot of ways it is the first new Castlevania game in a long time.

not sure exactly when it comes out, but there has been an email sent out to Kickstarter backers. only confirmed dates so far for consoles are May 31st for 3DS and June 6 for Xbox. they are giving out temporary Steam codes for anyone who backed the game on consoles, as it seems they are still waiting on console keys, but have the Steam ones ready to go. i backed it for Switch and was able to get a Steam code that said it is valid until June 8.

it is 20MB lol

wait a minute i am playing it rn! looks like this game is out!

this is really cool. very CV3. the art isn't the prettiest (not nearly as good as classical Castlevania art but what is?) but it is still a fun and cheap Castlevania knock off. the music is awesome as heck, and the 8-bit presentation feels very true to authentic limitations of that era. the art not being pretty comes from over-use of tiles in some places, which is really just more economy. levels are visually varied with layers of parallax and lots of colorful well-defined sprites.

the level design, enemy combat, etc. are all classic CV. items are valuable again; they help you get past the gauntlet of enemies. it controls like CV3 except with ROB/SOTN stair-jumping. difficulty wise it is not a pushover, i died twice before beating the first level, i would say harder than SOTN at least. the boss fight was kind of like Order of Ecclesia, with a large, almost puzzle-light battle.

the game is so Castlevania. jumping around slicing floating lamps and candles while fighting goblins and monsters. i started as a dude with a sword or something and then met Miriam and gained her as an ally and she has a whip and basically controls like a Belmont, only she can slide like in Mega Man 3.

https://i.imgur.com/BkxEXU2l.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/V3DQxKKl.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/ENikJkYl.jpg

Doh! Only the Steam version is available to backers, console codes aren't out yet.

Confused, is this out for Switch now or not? If I backed the Kickstarter shouldn't I get a code or something?

would like a new metroidvania castlevania for the switch though

unfortunately i don't think it's out for Switch yet. but if you backed the kickstarter for it on consoles, you should be able to use the Steam code in the meantime. look through your emails to find the Survey Resender and use that.

i hear the EShop gets updated around noon EST so maybe it will come then. kinda sucks but still it's nice to be able to play in the meantime.

I don't even know what Steam is.

it's an online PC hub/store where you can buy games. if you are writing on a computer it probably supports Steam.

So this is to play games on my computer? I've never really done that (have a laptop).

yeah. you can buy games through it and play them w it. not sure if you have to give them your CC or not for you to make an account.

install Steam, go to Games, and Activate a Product on Steam. then you post in the code and it installs the game. to get the code you have to go to the back survey, and you can resend a link to that, if you search your kickstarter emails.

i wonder if that is David Hayter doing the cheesy voiceover on the trailer.

The whole reason I have a console is to not play games on my computer.

hah. yeah w the amount of controller driver issues an stuff i deal with, i entirely understand.

i probably wont play this too much on Steam cos i want to play it on Switch.

it's no big deal to only play games on a console, but you miss out on a lot. like games that are just much better with a mouse

that's pretty much just shooters though and gyro aim makes up most of the difference.

i guess stuff like RTSes too but i don't really play those these days

4x strategy probably not a good fit for console either, or text adventures.

4x strategy probably not a good fit for console either, or text adventures.

― valorous wokelord (silby)

i thought you were saying 4x was not a good fit for text adventures and got to thinking about "suspended" (which isn't quite the same thing but has pretty strong strategy elements)

there was a console civ but it was pretty much what you'd expect from a console civ

man this is pretty awesome. feels nice to play this with a PS2 controller but i need my dang Switch code so i can play it there.

i can't get past stage 4 lol. Curse of the Moon is actually legit NES tough.

i am liking the graphics more and more. some of the art looks like random "level asset" tiles but for a game this big it makes sense, plus there is plenty of beautiful art throughout the game. important to remember they had to deal with creating everything from scratch. the 2D Castlevania series were always reusing art and repurposing character designs etc. and by Castlevania they 3 had this library of classic designs that had already withstood multiple teams and generations of games.

not only that but they had less screen space to deal with. the new game is still pixelated 8-bit art but on an HD widescreen scale. thank god they did not have camera zoom. i played some of Harmony of Despair and did not enjoy myself. having the screen too zoomed out makes it look more like a maze, the art looses definition, the sense of place is lost.

they really went classic with this and it feels like an NES game, just designed for a larger screen. level design is classic: some platforms, some stairs, some enemies placed among them. bottomless pits are back, reinforcing the ideal of enemy as level design. the threat of knockback deaths forces you to reconsider your approach. the ghouls and demons placed throughout are not mere combat challenges: they require adjustment of pacing, they require strategy. the bosses are the same, only on a bigger scale. large gorgeous pixel art, wider areas of attack, multi-stage fights. very much an evolution of OoE.

https://i.imgur.com/v9bcWpTl.jpg

this keeps getting better and better. i love the green bricks on red/purple bg they got going in some of these levels. its sort of punk. i love the alchemist, even though he is super slow and useless against most enemies, it is such a cool idea, and sometimes you can actually do some damage w that cane of his.

the enemies are duocolor cartoony horror fantasy throughout and they keep switching it up for every level. rn i am fighting evil giant scissormen and jumping blue bunnies. i just fought a painting (which was more or a puzzle than a fight, which was cool) and earlier i ended up fighting a cool boss on the top of the ship that reminded me of Rondo of Blood crossed w Mega Man.

So lame that backers get their codes not just last but late.

all the backer codes should be out now. i got my NA Switch code last night. also there is a E3 Beta Backer demo of the full game coming June 21st.

still really love "Curse of the Moon". a friend came over to check it out and we used casual mode to run through most of the game. it's a really nice addition cos otherwise it is for real NES hard. casual mode gives you more health but it also nixes fallback, which is a huge help around all those bottomless pits.

finally beat the game on Veteran. now playing on Nightmare and getting wrecked by the turtle boss in level 2. the fight is definitely more difficult. like the move where they are at the top of the screen and rocks fall down 3 times before he lands, now there is a rock right in the middle where you used to be able to hide. yeah it's crazy shit.

also started a new game using Zangetsu and killing the allies, gaining new abilities along the way. the jumping slash and the double jump are very nice, but now im wondering how i will make it through the later stages with a single character...

going back and replaying the earlier levels, it is fun to switch around characters and try out different techniques.

sometimes one of them will have a skill that makes them particularly suitable to nerf the room. sometimes the vampire can just fly over enemy's heads, hitting restorative potions along the way, sometimes he is shit in a room. so there's a bit of strategy to it. it's only a matter of trying them out to see who is best where.

i have Curse of the Moon on Steam and Switch and play it on PS2 controller vs. Joycons and imo i prefer the latter for controller and presentation. for some reason the UI in Windows is a bit crap.

I said this in another thread but worth repeating - Curse of the Moon is really good. Praying that the full, "real" game is as good, because the preview build I checked out last year was pretty weak.

That said - there are SO many indie Metroidvanias and otherwise that have come out over the past decade, I have no idea what's actually worth the time. Looking for advice on this one, since I several in my libraries already - Gaucamelee, La Mulana, Steamworld Dig and more I'm forgetting. I started Shovel Knight, which is pretty awesome. Others I'm curious about like Axiom Verge, Shadow Complex, Ori & The Blind Forest, Dust An Elysian Tail, Salt & Sanctuary, and so on. Someone also mentioned Hollow Knight as a good Metroidvania that just got ported to the Switch. I want hot takes, people - what's actually worth the time?

Shovel Knight is tons of fun, with tons of content. Which Steamworld do you have?

Played Shadow Complex a hundred years ago and it was slick but ultimately kinda bland?

I totally loved Salt & Sanctuary as a 2-D game where all the classic Dark Souls elements are used really well (different classes/approaches, losing your currency upon death and having a chance to regain it, blocking/dodging/parrying, etc). Although oddly I don't have any desire to replay it...they really released it at exactly the right time (just before DS3 came out).

second the S&S love, that's a great game.

I got about halfway through Axiom Verge, got stuck, and completely forgot about it. i played through Shadow Complex and i guess i had a good time but i remember almost nothing of the experience.

I think I have Steamworld Dig 1 on like three different platforms

Oh man, get the sequel! It's the same idea but even cooler and better.

axiom verge is my favorite of the recent batch; hollow knight is also very good (and quite long, I didn't finish it)

I thought Dust an Elysian Tale was really boring

but I did enjoy the Strider reboot, worth a go if you see it cheap

I have that from PS+

new Bloodstained Steam demo is supposed to drop on June 21st.

Hollow Knight definitely rules. it gives me more Metroid feels than Vania but that is mostly the level design. controls are nice and the hand drawn art is very charming in an Edward Gorey way.

Metroidvania games always seem more metroid than vania to me, tbh. The metroid part is the exploration of the map, gradually accumulating new skills/items that let you backtrack and reach previously inaccessible areas. What is the vania part? Just being awesome?

Maybe a sort of Gothy vibe?

I don't think it's a matter of 'parts' - it's that Metroid and middle/late Castlevania are the most influential examples of this formula.

the melee combat. Metroid was shooter based. the focus on fantasy over sci fi.

Oh, we're talking the parts of Hollow Night specifically? nvm

Vampire Killer came out 2 months after Metroid and had backtracking/unblocking previously inaccessible areas. ditto Simon's Quest. "Metroidvania" the term is used because both series have used these elements since their inception.

Hollow Knight makes me think Metroid cos the rooms themselves are cavelike floating platforms and such. you could plop Samus down and it would work. you even attack the barriers on the sides of screens just like you attack the doors in Metroid.

but the combat is more close-quarter, more like SOTN.

middle/late Castlevania

I guess that’s the key. Symphony of the Night, especially. Early castlevanias didn’t have the backtracking and all of that, though, while they were all present in Metroid from the very beginning.

Yeah I was very disappointed to find Castlevania IV on the SNES mini was fully linear, no exploration/backtracking in there at all.

Anyway my metroidvania recommendation if people are looking for good examples of the form would probably be Shadow Complex.

I've gotta try IV again. I don't think I ever finished it. Playing through the original Castlevania with the ILG thread a few years back was so much fun.

Some of the earlier Castlevanias have multiple alternate routes

Rondo of Blood has alternate paths and secret levels. Bloodlines has areas you can only access with certain abilities. Castlevania 3 has alt paths.

Simon's Quest had lots of backtracking and a full 2D open world with upgradable abilities that unlocked inaccessible areas. before that the original Japanese Castlevania Vampire Killer had backtracking and it came out two months after the first Metroid.

Simon's Quest had lots of backtracking and a full 2D open world with upgradable abilities that unlocked inaccessible areas.

obv i defer to you because i know you're a huge fan of those early games, but that's news to me! my old school castlevania go-to is 3. i don't think i ever got far enough in simon's quest to realize it had those elements you were talking about. I should revisit.

Simon's Quest rules! i recommend playing it with a guide as the NPCs are purposefully designed to mislead you in places. once you get past the infamous obscurity it is a really cool game that is ahead of it's time design-wise. also the music is my favorite of the series.

it sort of makes sense that Castlevania would need capacity of a CD to go fully open world though. you can do caverns with minimal tile art compared to a detailed castle where every room sort of has to have a unique look to it and there are all kinds of additional details like chairs, furniture, lamps, etc.

Castlevania has a more dense world. this is one thing i like about Hollow Knight, there is tons of grass, fences, signs, wrought iron posts, etc. architectural detritus of no consequence littering the landscape that you can satisfyingly slice. it is enjoyable even though it provides no real benefit, like rolling in OOT.

i mean all this is _true_ as far as that goes, but nobody really used the term "metroidvania" before sotn, did they?

steamworld dig 2 is definitely an improvement on the first game. kind of blows it out of the water, honestly.

that's it, i'm using internet search

check out this URL: http://tvtropes.org/g00/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Metroidvania?i10c.encReferrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8%3D&i10c.ua=1

This sub-genre gets its name from the Metroid and Castlevania series. The Trope Maker was Metroid, published in 1986, and subsequent Metroid games have consistently used it in all of its installments (except Prime Pinball). Castlevania first used the style in 1986's Vampire Killer and 1987's Castlevania II: Simon's Quest, before abandoning it and then returning to it after the success of Castlevania: Symphony of the Night, the Trope Codifier. The term itself was originally used for the Castlevania games of the same style as Symphony of the Night, but Jeremy Parish of Retronauts, expanded the definition so that it referred to an entire genre; his use of the term popularized it, and along with it his definition. Ironically, the designer of Symphony of the Night actually modeled that game on the The Legend of Zelda series, which also shares a number of traits with this genre though is often overlooked in discussions due to not being 2D side-scrolling.

While Metroid and Castlevania were the Trope Maker and Trope Codifier, respectively, the Ur Examples were Brain Breaker (1984/1985) and Dragon Slayer II: Xanadu (1985). Several early Metroidvania titles were inspired by these titles, particularly Xanadu. Metroidvania elements could be traced further back to non-platformer games Tutankham (1982) and The Portopia Serial Murder Case (1983).

interesting tidbit from that:

An interesting note is that the man behind most of the Metroidvania titles had actually never heard of the term until around 2012 (though he quite liked it). He said his inspiration in creating Symphony of the Night actually came from Zelda II: The Adventure of Link (which in turn borrowed elements from Dragon Slayer II: Xanadu and the original Metroid).

E3 backer demo codes have just been released for Bloodstained

yeah the vania part just refers to symphony of the night and it's successors which were the other high profile game series that used metroid style world design in a side scroller

played the new demo for a bit, i like it! very cool that when you change your equipment, it's visually represented in the on-screen character.

this game is looking really cool! the cutscenes are a little rough but the design of the levels themselves is very promising. it really feels like HD SOTN level of detail wise. rooms have all kinds of furniture, chairs, lamps, curtains, cabinets, piles of books, candelabras, the necessary gothic garb. i just want to stop and look at the backgrounds, which is what SOTN made me want to do, so that's a good sign.

the 3D graphics really stand out in areas, like outdoor sections where trees and rows of statues scroll in the foreground and background. some cool perspective effects, like an MC Esher style castle, at play here. they did some of this stuff in SOTN w some light use of 3D animation to emphasize a kind of infinity mirror giant castle. so what we have here is proportionally and gameplay wise pretty classic SOTN level design, with plenty of platforms, only really nice.

this feels like a totally different approach than the 2.5D games they have done so far. the Rondo remake was a little dull and blurry. here things really stand out and it works well. its the closest thing to an HD Dawn of Sorrow. also the game is no pushover which is good news, one of SOTN's biggest criticisms. looking forward to this!

https://i.imgur.com/RMOvSqol.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/yDtiCzyl.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/qYsTpLil.jpg

any game where you can sit down is a good game

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_Q1rXhHL6g

oh god the '90s video edit fx

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvmdRTk3B9A
Never really heard much about Slain: Back From Hell.

And new trailer for Blasphemous
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=srtnPqP9fn8

The initial release of Slain had bad gameplay, then the designer listened to the player response and improved it.

I'm starting Sundered, which has goodly backtracking but it also has enemy waves that have too much chaos for me to use any strategy. I'll stick with it.

Bloodstained this month, OMG. I might buy it at full release price, which I haven't done for any full-priced game since Order of Ecclesia a decade ago.

Who's playing Bloodstained? I got past the demo portion. Great so far.

Bloodstained is going hard into SOTN territory. I thought a character was the game's version of Alucard, but then I found another character and that was DEFINITELY Alucard.

plan to dive in on Sunday. sounds good

There are some tricks retained from SOTN that are given away in the loading screens. I think that's a good compromise between being beginner-friendly and being for Castlevania veterans. And there are also at least a few new tricks I've found.

One example: The backdash system is exactly the same as SOTN, where you can cancel a move into a backdash into another move, but you can't backdash a second time. This gets a loading screen hint. In SOTN, repeated dashing was best with a shield equipped to cancel into because they had no recovery time. Now in Bloodstained, I haven't found a shield yet, but you can cancel backdash into duck to achieve the same thing.

There's one shard that's obviously very powerful -- the books. You can equip two safe rings (def++, att--) and they'll still do good damage because they aren't based on the attack stat. I got through one of the bosses on the first try just by hitting it with the books. Today I switched out them out just because they were getting boring. It seems like a lot of the shard attacks aren't very good, but it'll be fun to experiment with them.

Way back when I backed Bloodstained for the Switch. Got the download yesterday and played a few minutes, but it seemed kind of ... janky. Looked online this morning and I'm not the only one having problems on Switch. :(

yeah it sounds like the switch version is rough

Just posted on their kickstarter page
“We have been listening to the feedback regarding Switch performance. Our goal is for everyone, regardless of platform, to be able to enjoy the game and have it run smoothly. We want to live up to your, and our, expectations.
Throughout the QA process we have been addressing performance issues in the game. Update 1.01 was published to Switch prior to launch to add content and improve performance. It did not accomplish as much as we had hoped and we need to do more.
To address the concerns brought up by the community we are immediately shifting resources to improve performance and stability for the Switch. You can expect a number of small updates that will improve different areas of the game rather than waiting longer for one big update. We will have more details as we dive into the work.
We thank you for your patience and apologize for the inconvenience.
Jason “Question” Ryan
Sr Community Manager – 505 Games”

The PS4 version has crashed 3 times at the crafting screen for me. Not a huge deal but I've got to remember to save before and after crafting.

tbf they've only been working on it for four or so years.

Anyone played the retro Castlevania collection on switch? Looks fun, but I never played these games as a kid, and wondering if they hold up without the nostalgia value

Didnt know about this, I'm glad this type of collection is still coming out because I thought digital downloads of single games was wiping them out.

They take a bit of getting used to. I haven't played most of them but Bloodlines is good fun.

First game is tougher than I had patience for.

just skip straight to III imo.
and Bloodlines is nicely getting more recognition

then again, the music is kinda awesome in all of them, even if they're not as playable (looking at 1 and 2)

First official US release of the Famicom version of the third game, I think? It has better music and Grant is easy mode.

I beat Ritual of the Night. It has all the usual Iga pluses and minuses. I'm not sure if it will stand the test of time as well as SOTN, as it doesn't seem to have as many wonderful small details. But I still hope Iga cranks out sequels reusing all the assets.

Vigil: Longest Night
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yh9IhIMUwrc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_wGzvD4BN4
Is this proof you don't need a specific franchise to keep a very specific game genre alive?

people have been making indie SotN's by the dozens for the past 5+ years, they just aren't always as aesthetically close as bloodstained or this

Yeah, I've been getting lists of them popping up on youtube but I'm not paying close attention. Ved looks very nice but it didn't have monsters, castles etc. Any good ones not mentioned on this thread?

people like hollow knight a lot

timespinner is a decent sci-fi take on one

The phone version of SOTN is $3 and I hear it's good.

Order of Ecclesia is now going for like $100. wtf konami, print more games.

Konami is exclusively a pachislot company now

https://imgur.com/a/I3DoKJe

let's try that again
https://i.imgur.com/IZ1ndgt.jpg

"What is a man? A miserable little pile of secrets!" is my COVID motto

excellent

so the TV show takes a long while to get going but is very beautiful Nd once it's warmed up is really quite good. I'd love a new Castlevania open world game. but does/will such a thing exist (particularly for ps4)?

Bloodstained: Ritual of the Night is the new offbrand castlevania by the SotN guy, because konami doesn't make video games anymore

That's sort of what Bloodborne is in a way

oh yeah if by open world you meant a big fancy 3d gothic horror game then you gotta look elsewhere, bloodstained is a sidescroller like the classic ones

thought this bump was going to be for the new saturn rom hack

for all those with a saturn (lol) and a ram expansion cart (lmao)

Is Bloodborne not just a Dark Souls game by another name? Yes a lush 3D open world game not too dissimilar to Witcher 3 but with more castles and vampires and stuff would be logical. Seems they've missed a trick considering the show is now 3 seasons in.

Have to say I was not a fan of Super Castlevania then or now. Found it quite monotonous for a game that still gets good contemporaneous reviews. that was a hundred years ago though and I've never played another CV game since, so interested in how subsequent ones compare

Play SOTN!

No interviews or anything but this is a competent history of Super Castlevania IV and Bloodlines.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xB1-AKS3S0g

I think all these Castlevania-like games is an ideal situation. Videogames is the place I'm most tempted to defend franchises, because it doesn't seem obvious to me that completely new teams could make new games to fill a void left by Mario and Zelda being knocked off, there are other similar games of course but I never felt most of the games inspired by 3d Zelda had the ingredients I liked.

But I'm extremely out of touch with games now.

tim rogers has observed that Zelda-likes are the hardest kind of game to make and that sounds right to me, on the evidence. On the other hand, Celeste is the best Super Mario game.

3D mario is probably harder since no one outside of nintendo has managed to replicate it yet afaic, but it's a much more specific formula than zelda

depends how specific you're being but there were loads of 3d cartoon platformers following Mario 64... what about Spyro etc?

celeste is a negroni to SMB’s aperol spritz

3D mario is probably harder since no one outside of nintendo has managed to replicate it yet afaic

tbf nor has anyone inside of nintendo

dog latin have you played all of these? https://www.polygon.com/features/2018/10/10/17952674/the-12-best-indie-metroidvania-games

this is about my most hated genre, the nearest i get to liking any is the procedurally generated dead cells. but that's not about exploration so much as movement and combat. apparently on ps4 symphony of the night is available in a resissue packaged with the actually good rondo of blood. play that instead.

(caveat: i don't know how lazy of a job the emulation is. the first couple reviews i saw had no complaints but they also complained that rondo 'doesn't hold up as well' so they are obviously deeply untrustworthy individuals.)

don't listen to thomp lol

play hollow knight

I did the whole emulator + SotN thing a couple years ago. It's baffling that they hid the 2nd half of the game behind secret requirements.

it was the '90s, man

‘the second half of this game is lazy and bad’ : well, who’d play that.

‘this game has a whole secret second half’ = cult classic material

lazy???!!! those boss designs! those backgrounds! those sprites!

depends how specific you're being but there were loads of 3d cartoon platformers following Mario 64... what about Spyro etc?

― thomasintrouble, Friday, May 29, 2020 4:15 AM (six hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

aria of sorrow is the best castlevania btw

was gonna say i feel like it peaked with that one but i haven't given all the DS entries a fair shot yet

I find Celeste to be a painful chore TBRH, although I do go back to it occasionally.
I absolutely love the aesthetic, the art, the music, but it's all so fiddly and just thinking about it makes my nape ache.
Other than being a platformer, I couldn't compare it to SMB. It's about having lightning-quick reflexes and doing the same sequence of movements over and over and over again, which is probably why I also find it hard to love things like Dark Souls.
SMB by comparison has become such a well-realised world with its own lore and mythos. While the gameplay is always top notch, I think I play those games because I'm excited to be enveloped into its world of pipes, toadstools, turtles and ghosts.

i love celeste and SMB3 with all my heart. to me, the similarities are in the perfection of the mechanics (especially the jump), the 1:1 feeling of "being" the character on the screen and being able to make them move exactly as you want to, in near real-time. that's a very hard thing to get right.

but yeah, otherwise i don't think celeste is any sort of replacement for mario. they're very different

the jump in celeste should be in the louvre

the jump on one side of the mona lisa, then the dash right horizontally across it to the other side

that's what the mona lisa is smiling about, that sick jump+dash

lazy???!!! those boss designs! those backgrounds! those sprites!

― Doctor Casino, Friday, May 29, 2020 10:18 AM (three hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

it's more that the level design is lazy -- you can fly anywhere, so they add a ton of spikes and lasers, the end. but also most of the sprites are ripped from rondo of blood, beelzebub and the optional boss being exceptions.

I always thought the abilities+map accessibility stuff in the Iga games must have been a nightmare to plan and possibly the reason he started experimenting with fighting games and a more linear Castlevania at the end of his time at Konami. Were all abilities definitely unlocked by the second half of Symphony?

Big 2d games tend to have lots of reused sprites because it takes forever to make them, sadly.

Spyro was particularly different from Mario. I think there's maybe as many as 15 amazing Mario games (including the Yoshi and Wario games) or maybe 40, haha.

You need to get the mist and bat forms in the first castle. The double jump can be skipped by exploiting a bug with the wolf form. The down-up super jump can easily be skipped.

the more forms the betta tho, looove that stuff

I didn't know there was a bug with the wolf. Wolf was only fun for running down large halls. Super jump was great fun.

Did you ever try climbing the clock tower with the wolf? Pretty hard and fun. Seems like it was unintentional as it would crash the original japanese version.

No, I never even heard of that.

it's more that the level design is lazy -- you can fly anywhere, so they add a ton of spikes and lasers, the end. but also most of the sprites are ripped from rondo of blood, beelzebub and the optional boss being exceptions.

― wasdnous (abanana), Friday, 29 May 2020 17:24 (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

thanks that’s what i would have posted if I hadn’t been in bed

i like Celeste mechanically but wish i could excise between 80 and 100% of the script

i feel like its lineage isn’t particularly Mario tho. it feels more like a ZX spectrum platformer (though obviously , yes, much better) than a console one.

tbf i haven't played rondo of blood since the late 90s when i foolishly let my original copy slip into a friend's hands. i did remember a bunch of the sprites going over to SOTN so that's fair. but not all of them surely!! i dunno i had a blast in the second half, love all those environments, shit was cool. def not as "tight" as the first half but that's true of tons of games that open up in terms of linearity as you go on.

The Last Faith
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lN3Opf27zto
It's amazing how many of these games there are, I find most of them on this channel, but see this playlist in particular.
http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL7eMqz_fn4BpW8BEBUQcmHtAi3Xc77ef4

SOTN and another CV game is cheap on PS Store at the moment so I grabbed them. Worth it?

Certainly. Rondo of Blood is my favorite of the "classic" gameplay style. It placed #44 on this recent forum poll of platformers: https://www.resetera.com/threads/reseteras-101-essential-platformers-top-101-posted-hm-voting-in-progress.217215/

I picked up the collection with 1-4 and Bloodlines. I've never played Bloodlines before.

Bloodlines is totally dope. One of the best classic era titles.

Interesting that Wallachia goes for a specifically early 90s look
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8CPL7Y4aAw

And the new Record Of Lodoss War game looks modeled on Iga era Castlevania
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FdmKbXx6gtU

A Lodoss War game? in 2020??
All for it, but surprised. Lol at that "Item Get" animation being a carbon copy of the Igavania message style

the lodossvania is by the same folks that made the touhouvania game a year or two ago that was pretty good

I didn't realize that the first Lodoss book (Grey Witch?) appeared in english a few years ago, some reviewers say it's completely generic but I'm putting it on my endless list of things I'd like to but probably wont read.
Actually I didn't know there was a book series that came out of another table top rpg.

I had no idea that in Castlevania: Symphony of the Night - the gradient in the UI flips based on which castle you are in (normal or upside down) pic.twitter.com/tSpORA19cz

— Derek Daniels (@derek_omni) May 18, 2021

They should flipped the text as well for the full upside-down experience

literally had the same thought

people would have hated it, but now, in retrospect, they would have loved it

Looks worthwhile. A Metroidvania with Mexican folk art design https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCHux28VA3s

Interesting