Nuri and Schteve won't be anywhere near this thing - A thread for Bundesliga 2011-12

Here's Rafa to kick us off (no, not that one)
http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2011/aug/05/bundesliga-season-preview-2011-2012

Dortmund vs Hamburg (aka Arneson's Chelsea rejects) tonight. I won't get to see the match until tomorrow but looking forward to it nonetheless. Kagawa should be back in action I think, and Dortmund have managed to keep most of their title winning team together. Further down the league (probably) ex LFC legend Markus Babbel is in charge of newly promoted Hertha Berlin, who also now have ex Bayern youngster Thomas Kraft in between the sticks. Speaking of ex LFC legends almost called Babbel, Ryan Babel is still at the Hoff alongside the splendidly named Knowledge Musona!

Knowledge!

planning on watching more bundesliga this season. support hamburg, but hoping dortmund do well in the CL, glad they kept most of their team, and added some good players (Perišić and Gündoğan) to replace Sahin. Interested to see how poorly Hamburg's attempt to copy BVB and go with youth goes. I really like Son and Rincon and Elia (I guess Juve are making a move for him) so maybe it could work?

also Hamburg jut signed Norwegian Per Ciljan Skjelbred, a playmaker who trained with Liverpool and turned down their contract offer. anybody ever seen him play?

only occasionally in the cl some years back when he was still considered norways' greatest talent ever. no idea how that worked out for him, but i'm a bit surprised he hasn't moved earlier.

so Gündoğan goes directly into the starting line up with Bender as the two midfielders leaving team captain Kehl on the bench

My summer vacation from Ray Hudson was not long enough.

Seriously, dude needs to stop screeching at every through-ball before there's even a shot on goal.

Dortmund look good though.

dortmund are really entertaining to watch. 2nd goal is quite nice, i didn't see if grosskeutz was the one who gave that lovely little backheel flick though.

Lewandowski, but yeah it was great.

Didn't watch the game myself, but I heard from a friend Dortmund, at times, played spectacular. I am really excited to see this side in the CL.

Yeah Dortmund were v good last night, and the front four excellent. First goal a lovely counter attack - Kagawa picked the ball up midway between his own box and the halfway line, played it to Pistek (the right back) who lofted it down the line to Lewandowski(who was playing up front in place of the injured/tired Barrios). He played it inside to Gotze who rolled it left to Grosskreutz who took one touch into the box and rolled it across the keeper and in off the post. Lovely.
2nd goal was a terrific 1-2 between Gotze and L'Doski with a nice chipped finish, and the third was some great interplay between Bender, Gotze and L'Doski.
Gotze was very very impressive. I knew he had the skillz but was really wowed by just how often he spotted, and played, the right pass. Scary good for a teenager. Not sure who is going to drop out when Barrios is available tbh
Gundogan had a good debut filling in for the departed Sahin as well I thought.
Hamburg were poor, although Tore(ex Chelsea) was okay I thought, as was Jansen when he came on to replace Elia.

Mainz 05 opened their new stadium with a 2-0 win against last years runners up Leverkusen. Bayer were pretty poor and clearly missing Vidal in the midfield who they sold to Juve in the Summer. Without him Kiesling and Ballack still could only make the bench. Strange.

First goal was a horrible pass/clearance from their young goalie Giefer and a good reaction and finish from Allagui. The second was a nice swift move that ended up with Topsak turning the ball into his own net as he tried to stop a cross reaching Ivanschitz.

Polanski and Soto looked good in the centre of midfield for Mainz, but the 2 players who really stood out were the right back Caligiuri and the left winger, previously of Aston Villa's Academy, Stieber who was making his debut. V. similar in stature to Albrighton (ie small) but not as direct, tended to come off his wing and link play. Really impressive.

Kagawa scored 2 against Korea today, that dude is awesome.

Bayern fluked their way to a 1-0 win away at Wolfsburg. Gustavo scoring in the 90th min. No Robben (injured) so Muller started on the right, Ribiery left, and Kroos in the hole with Gomez up top. Uninspired and pedestrian tbh. Wolfsburg had a goal incorrectly ruled out for offside in the first half. Bayern appear to have no strikers other than Gomez. They won't make it past the group stages of the Ch Lge, if they get that far, imo.

Leverkusen somewhat scrambled to a win yesterday. The winner coming in the 86th min after Rofles(just on as a sub) kept a corner alive at the far post and Kadlec shot home from 6 yards. Tough on Bremen who had looked comfortable on the whole although Wiese had produced 2 good saves from shots from outside the box. Still fear for Bayer in the Ch Lge however. This team look well short of being able to compete at that level.
Ballack started this week and looked nothing more than o.k. Bender played well alongside him. I was impressed by both the Leverkusen full backs - Castro(on the right weirdly) and Kadlec on the left.
Bremen frwd Thy missed from 3 yards out middle of the goal blazing over the bar. Awful.

Anything about where Diego is going if he's still frozen out at Wolfsburg? Have heard Atletico Madrid, also Liverpool, the latter seems unlikely.

Leverkusen must really miss Arturo Vidal.

Convince me to not support Bayern Munchen.

Dortmund play a more attractive game? Robben & Ribery are forever injured, sulking or both?

Diego's a strange one boxall. Not even on the bench at the weekend, Magath not the type to forgive and forget so he must surely be done there. Also Wolfsburg aren't so rich that they can afford to have an asset sitting around doing nothing. I suspect that they haven't had any halfway decent offers. Perhaps someone will take a chance on him with a year's loan?

Bayern are a strange one. A lot of their team make up the national side, who I absolutely love to watch. If you add Robben and Ribiery to those core German players the result should be even more exciting, but it just doesn't seem to work out that way. Robben in full flow is still a sight to behold mind you.

Ribery likes underage prostitution and supporting Bayern makes me believe you do to.

Gladbach completly outplaying Wolfsburg tonight. 3-1 at h-time after being 1-0 down to a nice Hasebe half volley. Bobadilla looks a handful up front. Hitzlsperger not having the best of debuts for Wolfsburg.

Ended 4-1. Reus got 2, the 2nd of which was a lovely team move culminating in a cross from out right with the outside of Arango's left foot volleyed home from 8 yards. Wolfsburg were woeful.

how does reus rank among young german tyros?

He played v well tonight, but whenever I've seen him in the past he's definitely a level below ozil (obviously) and gotze and muller. Think he's at the same level as Schurlle (who came on against Brazil). He usually starts wide right but seems comfortable swapping wings and quite often will get in the box or even gravitate towards the second striker position. Not lightning fast but very good at joining in from off the wing. Not really a take it down the line winger.

^ just watching this match now - Kjaer looks awful - hopefully just a blip in his generally promising career so far, or is the move to Wolfsburg something of a curse for foreigners (Diego, Josué I thought would be much better, Dzeko + Grafite a great combo but now look at them).

I put this on largely because I saw Hasan Salihamidzic was starting, and he's wearing an arm cast and limping off holding his leg after 20 minutes. Wolfsburg, what a disappointment.

kjaer is supposedly not very happy at all in germany and in talks with roma.

So Bayern routed Hamburg 5-0 at the weekend. I don't really have the vocabulary to explain just how terrible Hamburg were. Shockingly bad, hopelessly inept. Bayern were an improvement on their first 2 games of the season. They moved the ball much quicker and varied the point of the attack more than the had in those games. Muller looks much happier as the central one in the 3 behind the main striker and should definitely keep his spot there in preference to Toni Kroos.
Tymoschuck started in place of Gustavo( a player I've been impressed with) and had an outstanding game;great range of passing. Him and Schweinsteiger ran the show. Robben got a p.sweet goal as well.
Bruma perhaps the only Hamburg player to come out of the game with any amount of credit. Petric was left on the bench and Elia only got 4 mins.

Hertha Berlin beat Stuttgart 1-0 last night. Last time they were in the Bundesliga they only won one home game all season so they've matched that at least. Not that good of a game tbh tho the second half had it's moments. Neither team had all that much quality, although the shining exception was Hertha's Ebert who plays as the right side attacker in a 4-2-3-1.
A week late, but Ryan Babel scored a beauty for Hoffenheim last Saturday.
Leverkusen/Dortmund on ESPN at 5.30 this afternoon, although LFC may take preference for me.

Leverkusen-Dortmund dissolving into a fascinating mess of a game here.

Wow, what a great match. The defending on both sides was fantastic, though I couldn't tell if Leverkusen's 19-yr-old keeper was a new phenom or just very lucky. Was really impressed with André Schürrle.

Yep Schurrle the best player on the pitch by a wide margin. Pops up left/right/middle. V good. Thought Bayer were well in control until the sending off. Probably the poorest I've seen Dortmund for a year and a half. The only one who didn't disappoint was Gundogan, Grosskreutz especially poor which is unusual. Wolfgang Stark lived up to his FM10 status as most bizarre Bundesliga ref.
Best I've seen Bayer play this season and Rofles must start instead of Ballack. Toprak v good a CB.

Yeah the refereeing was very odd - though I've noticed the near-total lack of sufficient extra time in many Bundesliga matches, is that a cultural thing?

Agree that Groskreutz had a poor match, I was hoping Kuba would come on earlier. I love watching center-forwards as skilled/technical as Lewandowski but I wonder if Dortmund will suffer from a lack of someone to score ugly goals for them. Maybe if they get enough set-piece headers from Hummels and Subotic to supplement their prettier play it'll be enough.

yeah, they don't seem to do stoppage time in Germany. V weird.

so, rasmus jönsson's gone to wolfsburg. not sure i get it, thought magath was more into big men? also, kjaer basically had a done loan deal with roma, but then wolfsburg sneakily tried to change his future €8m buy out clause from optional to mandatory and now it seems he's not going anywhere after all.

Gomez with his second hat-trick of the season. Bayern 5-0 up after an hour against Freiburg. Meanwhile Dortmund 1-0 at home to newly promoted Hertha Berlin.

How's Ribéry doing for Bayern? He scored 2 goals for them today but he's been shit as hell for France. Does he give his best for Bayern and doesn't give a fuck about France or are those two goals just a fluke?

He's actually looked good this season imo. His best for a couple of years.

Ah, I love Felix Magath

€10k: Fines for Wolfsburg strikers Patrick Helmes and Mario Mandzukic for "failing to follow tactics" in a 4-1 defeat last month. Other routine fines at Wolfsburg: €1000 for an "unnecessary backpass", €500 for failing to control a high ball before it bounces, plus €250 for wearing headphones on the coach. Players' union: "This really isn't legal."

Oh, and Hamburg continue to be truly miserable. Werder Bremen eased to a 2-0 win over them, both from former Chelsea legend Pizarro (ho ho). The second goal was rather fine. The third time I've seen Hamburg this season and each time they have offered absolutely nothing. They have never suffered relegation I don't think, but I'm starting to believe that this might be the year.

loooooooooooooool xpost

The most hard-hitting comment, however, came from Jens Lehmann, who is threatening to give TV punditry a good name. The sporting director Frank Arnesen obviously "didn't know any German players", quipped the former keeper, "that's why he only bought Chelsea players and Scandinavians". Ouch. "If they keep getting negative results, " he added, "it's perhaps an advantage for Oenning that Arnesen doesn't know any German coaches either." Double ouch.

yeah Hamburg have never been relegated from any league in their history (bundesliga only began in the early 60s) they seem to be very proud of this fact, as there is a clock on their homepage counting how long they have been in the top flight.

Fining Mandzukic for 'failing to follow tactics' seems to have worked. He scored twice yesterday in a 2-1 win over Schalke. Wolfsburg were outplayed tbf but Huntelaar had one of those days and missed a load of chances. Farfan looked good, as did Schalke's young centre back Matip.

Ryan Babbel gets his fourth of the season. The Hoff 2-0 up on Wolfsburg, fines yet to be determined.

Just come off for half time and one of the Wolfsburg players swapped shirts with a Hoff player. The fine for that will be astronomical! Babel's goal was a 35 yarder btw, dodgy goal-keeping tbh

What's the difference between Hamburg and an Ü? The Ü has two points.

Oenning sacked

Only just caught up with Hannover/Dortmund from the weekend. Dortmund controlled the game without creating too many chance against a strangely negative Hannover (Cherundolo dropped to the bench btw) Kagawa got a lovely Kenny Dalglish vs Bruges in the European Cup Final goal and Grosskreutz missed a chance for 2-0 from 3 yards out. Then Hannover woke up, decided to attack for the last 15 mins, and scored twice in final 4 mins. So Dortmund lose 2-1 and their title defence is looking v unlikely indeed.

Meanwhile Bayern march on, although if Petersen is going to deputise for Gomez for any extended length of time that could change. He scored tbf but also missed a few v presentable chances, actually maybe he is the perfect gomez replacement after all!

As if things weren't bad enough at the moment, Jürgen Klopp will have to face his nemesis at the Coface-Arena on Saturday afternoon: Stephan Mai. "Stephan who," you ask? Mai is not a player nor a manager but a TV reporter working for a regional channel in the Southwest of Germany. According to the local "WAZ" newspaper, Mai has attended 50 games that have featured Klopp either as a player or a manager (with Mainz and Dortmund) since 1993 -- and Klopp has not won a single one of them. The 43-year-old manager is apparently all too aware of this curious jinx. When his Borussia conceded a late equalizer to draw 1-1 at Kaiserslautern in February, Klopp angrily refused to give Mai an interview after the match, calling him a "Seuchenvogel" (literal translation: a pestilence bird), a harbinger of bad luck.

i dont think i'll ever be convinced by him.

Barrios off to China is a head scratcher to me. He's only 27.

Huge wages on offer in china, I was reading. I dread to think how.

bah, that sucks. was hoping spurs would show some interest in him.

so is there any way dortmund can buy back Sahin? not on the bench again today. he's not injured right?

It's clear Mourinho doesn't rate/trust him. He's gotta go somewhere and play. Thought Gundogan had a really good 2nd half of the season tho so Klopp may not want to disturb that. Gladbach could do with a central midfielder to replace Neustadter if Sahin wants to come back to Germany.

Hertha go 1-0 up vs Hoffenheim. Great delivery from a free kick and the faintest of touches on the header into the net. Still alive, barely. They need Bayern to beat Koln, and tbf Bayern have put their first team out despite having nothing to play for.

Lucky escape for Hertha, Shipplock takes it round their keeper but then trips over the ball. Chance wasted.

And more good news, Thomas Muller puts Bayern 1-0 up. If it stays like this Podolski and Koln are down.

Now Ryan Babel has been sent off for Hoffenheim. As far as I could see all he did was run into a someone.

On replay an outrageous acting job from the Hertha player pretending he'd been caught in the face after the incident. He hadn't.

Right on half-time Hertha denied a clear penalty with the goal gaping CF brought down 4 yards out.

Geromel, who might be the worst defender I've seen in the Bundesliga this season, scores an own goal to put Bayern 2-0 ahead. Looking good for Hertha, 1-0 up playing vs 10 men. But you never know.

Incidentally the idea that Gylfi Siggurdson isn't good enough to get into this Hoffenheim side is laughable. Really.

Ben-Hatira makes it 2-0 to Hertha. Unless Koln recover from 1-3 down in the last 15 mins against Bayern then Hertha survive to face a relegation play-off and Koln are relegated.

Wait...Hoffenheim pull one back with 5 mins left. An equaliser would mean Hertha relegated.

Bayern now 4-1 up so that match is settled. Hertha need to hold on for 4 mins against 10 men. if they can't manage that then they deserve to go down.

Corner to Hoff, 2nd min stoppage time

Goalie up. Cleared. Breakway. Slotted into the empty net!!! 3-1 Hertha. THEY SURVIVE. For now.

Koln relegated.

Huntelaar bags a brace to win the scoring title with 29 goals. Gomez 26.

Laughed at this, re the Koln game

Farewell, Poldi," read a supporters' melancholic banner. "If we could, we'd leave, too."

So it's all over for another season. Almost.

Champions - Dortmund (with a Bundesliga record 81 pts)
Automatic CL Qualification - Bayern, Schalke
CL Qualifying Round - Gladbach
Automatic EL Qualification -Leverkusen, Stuttgart
EL Qualifying Round - Hannover
Relegated - Kaiserslautern, Koln
Promoted - Furth, Frankfurt
Relegation/Promotion Play-Off - Dusseldorf vs Hertha Berlin (first leg tonight)
German Cup - Bayern vs Dortmund (final on Saturday, Dortmund going for their first double)

You don't have any personal ties to the Bundesliga, do you? How's it been, immersing yourself in a random league? Do you pick up any lols?

Relegation/Promotion Play-Off - Dusseldorf vs Hertha Berlin (first leg tonight)

is this 3rd-from-bottom-in-the-1st-div v. 3rd-in-the-2nd-div?

Here was my 'team of the first half of the season'

----------------------Ter Stegen(Gladbach)---------------------------

--Piszczek(Dortmund)--Dante(G'bach)--Badstuber(Bayern)--Fuchs(Schalke)

-----------Schweinsteiger(Bayern)----Lars Bender(Leverkusen)---------

-------Harnik(Stuttgart)-----Reus(G'bach)-----------Ribery(Bayern)---

-----------------------------Gomez(Bayern)---------------------------

Instead of doing a 'team of the 2nd half' I'll do a team of the season.
The following players have had a v good last 5 months however

Didavi (Nurnberg)
Gundagun (Dortmund)
Kiessling (Leverkusen)
Helmes (Wolfsburg)
Blaszczykowski (Dortmund)
Alaba (Bayern)
Jones (Schalke)
Mame Diouf (Hannover)

xps
Yes ahoy hoy. That's right.

It's been really good fun. In the Prem familiarity with the players had bred contempt a bit. I kinda wanted a break. The Prem obviously still has some great players and stories etc. But I liked coming to the Bundesliga somewhat fresh. If I didn't have to rely on seeing the games as they happened over the internet then I'd consider doing France next, but due to my work hours and ESPN showing 4 or 5 live or delayed live games a week which I could DVR the Bundesliga was perfect for me.

You have made this thread A+ funtimes. If I *hopefully* get this new job and it means I stop working weekends, I might bite yr style.

As for lols, it would help if I could speak/read German obviously! So most lols are second hand from Rafa's Guardian column, or the comments attached by people who do seem to actually go to the games. Although Felix Magath at Wolfsburg, who managed to use 25 players in the first 8 games! And 36 by February!

Thx a hoy, and good luck on the job front.

Team of the Season (according to me)

-----------------------Ter Stegen(Gladbach)---------------------

------Lahm(Bayern)--Hummels(Dortmund)-Boateng(Bayern)---Fuchs(Schalke)

--------------------Kroos(Bayern)---Jones(Schalke)--------------

---Harnik(Stuttgart)--------Reus(Gladbach)---------Ribery(Bayern)

--------------------------Huntelaar(Schalke)---------------------

So, dominated by the top 4 teams which makes me a little sad as I wanted to put some 'under the radar' players in there tbh.

GK- Neuer had a great year, Bayern conceded fewest goals, and he is deservedly Germany's #1. But Ter Stegen was simply faultless in the dozen or more games I saw, which considering he's only 19 years old is amazing.

RB- Piszczek had an excellent season for Dortmund, but Lahm moving to RB with the emergence of Alaba at LB really improved Bayern.

CB- Hummels was a shoe-in. His distribution is top class. Boateng, Badstuber, Dante, Papadopoulos was a bit of a coin toss but Boateng has the added versatility of being able to play RB as well. Also Dante had one v terrible games that I happened to catch as well.

Deep Lying MF- Schweinsteiger missed a lot of the season due to injury. Gundogan had an amazing 2nd half but took a while to find his feet. Neustadter was excellent for Gladbach, and I don't think Dortmund lost a game that Kehl played in this season. But Kroos has been class all season whether filling in for Shweinsteiger or playing in behind Gomez. Jones had a 6 game suspension during the season and got booked in 80% of the rest of the games, but provided Schalke with incredible levels of box to box energy and destruction. Is this really the same guy who was at Blackburn?

Attacking MF- Blaszczykowski did a brilliant job of making up for the absence of Gotze. Robben was terrific for Bayern, when he played. Harnik though, 17 goals are hard to argue with. The #10 role went to someone who isn't a #10, but Reus had to be in the team. Sorry Kagawa, sorry Raul I'd happily take either of you as well. Ribery was the best left sided player by a distance, although Arango did get the same number of assists (12) and Draxler had a very nice first full season.

Cf - Huntelaar won the cannon for top scorer(disappointingly not an actual full sized cannon) and was excellent throughout and lethal when paired with Raul. Gomez can consider himself unlucky but hopefully the winning goal in the CL Final will console him. Maybe even more hard done by is Lewandowski who went from back up to Dortmund's top scorer of last season Barrios, to starter due to Barrios being injured to start the season. He took the opportunity with both hands and had a tremendous season - 22 goals, 8 assists. Mobile, skillful, hard working, good in the air. He reduced the fit again Barrios to an after thought. Also scored the winning goal in the kinda title decider vs Bayern.

i'll second a hoy's post, you made following this thread a pleasure. the bundesliga used to be the league i watched the most apart from ligue 1, so reading your comments on it was great fun.

xpost: and now to read your team of the season post

Thx Jibe. Your Ligue 1 posts were what inspired me tbh.

lil bit surprised hoffenheim have managed to get eren derdiyok, really good player from what i'd seen

i think he'll do well. After some back and forth, Leverkusen seem to have decided Kiessling was the man there ahead of Dredyiok, and towards the end of the season abandoned playing them both together.

Hertha have just managed to blow a 1-0 lead (Hubnik header from a great Ben Hatira corner) in the home leg of the play-off. Dusseldorf came back to win 2-1(storming Broker run and finish, Ramos own goal from a well delivered free kick). Last 30 mins were quite fun but overall was a match between 2 poor teams.

do dusseldorf fans sing songs by La Dusseldorf? Cause if so that is the team i want to support.

What a weird game the German Cup Final was. Bayern changed their game up, which considering Dortmund had beaten them 4 times in a row made sense. They pressed high up the pitch with intensity, attempting to do to Dortmund what Dortmund usually do others. And it worked, at least in the first half.

Dortmund never found their rhythm, Bayern completely dominated possession. And yet at half time the score was Dortmund 3 Bayern 1. Well by somehow I mean because the Bayern defence was shockingly bad. Dortmund had maybe 5 attacks and scored 3 goals. Kagawa, obviously inspired by the watching Mike Phelan (okay and Fergie as well) scored the first and set up the third. The 2nd half was more of a stroll but included a nice Grosskreutz nutmeg on Shweinsteiger to set up Lewandowski's 2nd goal, and a Manuel Neuer mistake leading to a Kuba assist for Lewandowski's hat-trick. Ribery also scored a p sweet goal.

Finished 5-2 to Dortmund, they complete their first double and become only the 2nd team in history to beat Bayern 5 times on the spin.

Is Lewandowski a top-level player? And who were the first side to win 5 against Bayern? I find that stat surprising, considering they had little success to speak of 'til the 70s.

Yes, I think he is. Has a Kuyt like work ethic but scores goals as well, 30 this season. I wasn't sure about him last season, tho I think mizzell rated him. But this season he's been fantastic. I get the impression, probably unfairly, that a lot of the players in this team are playing above what is their 'natural' level. Think Klopp and Dortmund showcase them to their absolute best, but Lewandowski would do well most places I reckon.

Frankfurt beat Bayern 5 in a row in the mid 70s according to commentary dude y'day.

Really sweet from Ribery. I've happened upon the last quarter by accident, Bayern looking slightly better tbh.

<3 dortmund.

btw I was wrong about frankfurt beating bayern 5 times in a row in the 70s, it was werder bremen apparently.

i was high on lewandowski last season as a big young striker with potential. i def did not think he would replace barrios so quickly and absolutely.

dortmund's double was great to see. now i have to cheer for bayern in the CL final, which i do not like.

although this article about bayern's jewish heritage and anti-nazi activity makes me like them. a little. http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/may/12/bayern-munich-anti-nazi-history

Last night's 2nd leg relegation/promotion play-off had a little bit of everything. Dusseldorf had won last week's away leg 2-1. They scored after 25 secs of the 2nd leg, Biester from 25 yards. Hertha equalised with a free header from a free kick midway in the half. Then Hertha had Ben-Hatira sent off just before the hour. 5 mins later Dusseldorf scored. So 4-2 up on agg, at home, vs 10 men. No problem right? Well..Hertha pulled one back on 85 mins so were a goal away from snatching it on away goals. Cue flares on the pitch and 7 mins stoppage time. After 6 mins the Dusseldorf fans decided that they'd waited long enough and invaded the pitch. 20 mins later the teams came back out to play the last minute. Finished 4-3 on agg. Dusseldorf promoted and Hertha relegated.

season starts today! new thread needed, i suppose shinji won't be near this thing is the obvious title.

Apparently this is the only continental European league not bought up by that Al-Jazeera offshoot that almost no US television carriers have? :(

Thought it started next Friday?

Are we gonna have seperate yearly threads again? I'm personally gonna attempt to watch a lot more Italian football.

oh shit, totally misread the date on the fixture list.
i could be in to a european catch-all thread . think the spanish one got the most traffic last year, right?

yeah but most of that is el clasico