Me before reading this thread: :)
Me after reading this thread: :(

richard- you're sick.

the laughter has been sucked out of this thread.

gimme a break.

Wait, RJG wants to tickle me now too? What is going on here?

"Seriously, what is UP with all the Seinfeld hate??!! "

I don't know, but there is something seriously wrong with anyone who can't see the utter genius of Seinfeld.

I hate when people say things like that. Taste is taste. I have a totally instinctive revulsion to this show, a revulsion I probably should analyze -- but that would necessitate actually watching it, and life seems too short at the moment.

"I hate when people say things like that. Taste is taste."

yeah, I know.

i think it's funny but i think everything's funny

(even will and grace, i lied abt that upthread so as to look cool)

haha on the doc abt brit sitcoms just now they said solemnly "the last of the summer wine is unique among sitcoms"

which is true: i don't think it's funny really

ok a bit

I think Last of the SW is funny and Seinfeld is funny.

Seinfeld gets criticised for its nihilism because it verges on excessive depth - for America. (The characters try to do volunteer work and fail, Elaine campaigns for equal opportunities because big breasted women are favoured over her, people turn to Judaism 'for the jokes' - the pathos of the attempt towards something that circles back into bourgeois stasis is nearly voiced. But whereas on Seinfeld minor characters suffer, on 'Curb Your Enthusiasm' Larry David is the middle class child abuser, the fake Jew, the wife beater.)

http://www.seinfeldscripts.com/ now has ALL the episodes transcribed.

How can anyone really vote for anything lesser than A FUCKING

GODLIKE GENIUS!

Seinfeld seriously ruined me for ALL other "sitcoms", they just all really suck in comperison.

this will obviously interest no one but i'v got every single episode on tapes. I'm sure i'm not the only one. My giant beloved Seinfeld shelf.

< / brag >

"I am a fancy boy."

All you hataz are NOT SPONGEWORTHY.

I sort of find the show shrill and insulting, like a Jewish/New Yorker version of blackface minstrelry. George is like the Sambo of the UWS.

Perhaps if I watched it enough and could get into the rhythms, pick up the nuances (if there are rhythms to be gotten into and nuances to be picked up) and noticed the characters interacted with but ultimately transcended such carcicature, I'd like it better.

I get this sense that people (who watch Seinfeld) are flattering themselves in this perverse and counterproductive way by imaginging themselves to *be* these grotesque caricatures, like it gives their self-involvement some kind of splendor by association. I guess in this way it is a complex mixture of self-hatred and aspiration and conforming to others' expectations and occasional transcendence of these things as "Will and Grace." That show makes me uncomfortable too, but my superficial sense is that the staging and line delivery is better in "W&G" (I don't know about the writing).

I think a couple words left out may have rendered those last two posts incoherent. Please let me know if that's the case.

mentioning Will and Grace in a thread about Seinfeld renders everything incoherent. what is going on?

"if there are rhythms to be gotten into and nuances to be picked up"

yes, Seinfeld is all about nuances and rhythms.

"staging and line delivery is better in 'W&G'"

The staging and line delivery (as well as the writing) are the main things that make Seinfeld so laugh-out-loud-able. Some of the funniest moments are based purely on the way one of the characters says something or a basic interaction (the other funniest moments come from an intricate and complicated script revealing itself).

Line readings: they always seem to be playing to the gallery, like they're always cocking their heads audience-ward to gauge the reaction while it's happening (like: "Eh? Yeah, you think that's funny? You like that?") that slows everything to a turgid crawl for me, even if the pacing is ostensibly frenetic.

Stan Brakhage loved this show but he had bad taste far as I can tell.

Didn't he direct a bunch of episodes?

Yeah, this is the scene where Elaine goes to buy a salad and spends 15 minutes whinging about the varieties of crouton:

http://www.fredcamper.com/PF/Brakhage/hellitself2b.jpg

The Eight-Ball Jacket.

"Are you really gonna wear that thing?"

"All signs point to 'yes'".

Nice finish on that one, Amateurist.

Um, I've seen (I think!) pretty much every episode of Seinfeld, and I don't remember that scene.

Puddy is my favorite character EVAH. "I'm not the one going to hell."

Art Vandalay.

"And you wanna be my latex salesman."

AJ Pennypacker

Buck Naked.

Advantage, VARNSEN!

"We already got a T-Bone. It's Neil, in accounting"

(I actually work with a Neil, in accounting, and yes, we called him T-Bone for a while)

"I'm not gay! My names Buck Naked and I'm an out of work porn star!"

My fav line:
"I'm gone for two weeks and you turn my house into...into..Bourbon Street!"

"Oh... I spend Baby!"

"But I don't want to be a pirate!"

Jerry Stiller rocks. I even watch King of Queens just for him.

http://wwwimage.cbs.com/primetime/king_of_queens/images/sub_bio_pic_jstiller.jpg

I hate all the Stillers. I think I basically hate all of this nth generation Borscht Belt humor.

high five, Ally.

Low five.

The show would definitely suck without Kramer. In certain ways
he's as shallow as petty as the others, but he's also so sincere
and puppy-dog-like, you can't help but sympathize with him -
as he falls flat on his arse time after time. All of his half-arsed
schemes fail, don't they? And he apparently doesn't have a job; I
think he literally survives by eating Jerry's food.

Will & Grace doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same
thread, much less paragraph. It's just so cheap and
obvious, although the pill-popping secretary is vaguely entertaining.

Kramer has a job...he's on strike from the bagel joint.

Ok, so in the window of my office is a big huge model ship. I'm not sure why. Our company has nothing to do with cruises, shipbuilding, fishing, the ocean, etc. It's just there. And all the time, we are getting people ringing the bell to ask us about the goddamned ship, like the ship is some kind of interesting thing. So I'm outside smoking, and this old couple comes up and asks me about the ship, like what happens all the damned time.

Thanks to this thread, I blurted out, "It's the Andrea Doria."

Kramer does have a job. He's a bagel maker. He's just on strike, yo.

Argh. crosspost.

Amateurist: No_self_hatered=No_sense_of_humor.

Top o' the heap classic. Best non-animated comedy in the history of television, even though the last year or two's worth of episodes (sans the beating heart guidance of Larry David) were a bit "out there" and stretching for material, plus they made George this sort of annoying crank. And the last episode sucked bigtime.

I watch reruns of this show whenever I have the chance, seriously. I'll watch 2-3 episodes a day if I'm watching TV and there isn't an episode of Survivor or Temptation Island on.

Jerry himself is probably the weakest link, but I find his "bad" acting not even bothersome. He does add some classic lines like "I just had a bowl of Kix" and of course there's the whole "awthatsashame" sort of dismissive lack of caring tone that informs the whole show. It's George, Kramer and Elaine who make the show hum like a fine-tuned Beemer. Plus the classic support cast (George's parents, Jerry's parents, Uncle Leo, Newman, Puddy, the Rosses, Mr. Pitt, J. Peterman) -- just excellent, excellent casting where each actor is probably playing the role of their career.

My favorite show of all time would still have to be The Simpsons, but overexposure to the more classic episodes has left me really not wanting to re-watch those episodes much, but something about Seinfeld is different. It puts other "comedies" like the shite that ABC shows (dumbass shows with Jim Belushi, John Ritter, etc.) to shame, even with the wacky slap-bass keyboards, bad poofy Jerry hair, and the black jeans/white sneakers look.