tipping

keep trying horseshoe, not good enough for excelsior yet

maybe someday youll be at frogbs level

I think it's a bit late to put "the whole thing" down to "a self-perpetuating cycle". Subjects don't "self-perpetuate", people make sure they they keep making the rounds and here it is you, sir, that is keeping the wheels in motion. xp

there's a world outside of ILX you know

― frogbs, maandag 20 juni 2011 23:24 (10 minutes ago) Bookmark

Ok, listen up jokeboy: You are continuously - with a faux air of choir-boy naivety - aiming for confirmation of a certain idea you have. That black people tip less than white people. Iatee and others have already pointed out how ludicrous and racist both your notion, and the way you go about it, is. Yet you keep falling back on a "guys seriously, I am just wondering about this. Could it be true? There's websites mentioning it too!" stance. If you've not already concluded that what you are just wondering about, it means you are willingly continuing to push the stereotype, to keep this racist myth alive. To which I can only reply: fuck you.

cartmanesque tbf

Your progression was:

what races are the worst tippers -> yes I meant are black people bad tippers -> I really just wanted to know if it was a stereotype

The dodging is actually a lot worse than asking "Is there a stereotype that black people tip poorly?" Then again, you know that asking anything racially charged while being you is kind of a bad plan....

What, in your opinion, am I dodging? I've worked as a bartender and I've never noticed it and don't really have a reason to be racist. Yes I have heard people bring that up straight up and would have posted it that way if people here weren't so super sensitive about pretty much any type of race issue.

Basically I'm wondering which races/demographics you guys think tip the best and the worst

Best = humans, worst = marmosets

Anyway, ime, worst tippers are tables w/a bunch of messy kids, followed by tables w/lots of ppl who split checks.

did modestmickey used to be a bartender? i'm getting a Let's contribute to jaymc.xls by listing everything/body that ILX has determined is racist kind of vibe

would have posted it that way if people here weren't so super sensitive about pretty much any type of race issue.

pro tip: then don't post about any type of race issue

Ok, listen up jokeboy: You are continuously - with a faux air of choir-boy naivety - aiming for confirmation of a certain idea you have. That black people tip less than white people. Iatee and others have already pointed out how ludicrous and racist both your notion, and the way you go about it, is. Yet you keep falling back on a "guys seriously, I am just wondering about this. Could it be true? There's websites mentioning it too!" stance. If you've not already concluded that what you are just wondering about, it means you are willingly continuing to push the stereotype, to keep this racist myth alive. To which I can only reply: fuck you.

first of all, wtf is this thing I'm 'continually' doing. i haven't concluded shit and if it was a racist myth there wouldn't be an NPR article about it

okay, let me seriously ask here, what do you guys think my motive is here? like what reason would I have to perpetuate some myth?

first of all, wtf is this thing I'm 'continually' doing. i haven't concluded shit and if it was a racist myth there wouldn't be an NPR article about it

― frogbs, maandag 20 juni 2011 23:49 (35 seconds ago) Bookmark

Yeah because if things aren't true there wouldn't be people talking about it on the internet, right? Oh wait...

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

On to the next thread

xp so is your conclusion that NPR got bad data? that they're racially motivated?

if it was a racist myth there wouldn't be an NPR article about it

http://www.latenightwithjimmyfallon.com/assets_c/2010/11/Boss_Thumbs_Up_gif-thumb-350x197-15764.gif

Yeah, well, NPR doesn't hire black people.

that's why it loves reviewing shit like Wilco

okay, let me seriously ask here, what do you guys think my motive is here? like what reason would I have to perpetuate some myth?

― frogbs, maandag 20 juni 2011 23:50 (45 seconds ago) Bookmark

Your motive seems to be gathering support for your racist preconceptions. But why the fuck ask us what your motives are?!

Guys have I turned myself into troll-bait here?

oh i see you didn't read my posts then

What, in your opinion, am I dodging?

The fact that you are trying to turn it into a discussion about black people not tipping?

If you wanted to know if it was a stereotype, you could have asked that or even gone to google. It's not that you even really have racist intentions on this one, it's just that you left your material that would make the question sound neutral until the end: "I've only had experience as a bartender and black people tend to tip as well as anyone else, but at a party some server friends told me that there's a stereotype of black people tipping poorly."

IMO that sounds like a reasonable query, approaches race from the individual perspective standpoint, and doesn't dodge around. Instead it went from you being afraid to say the phrase "black people" into "hey black people tipped me well for drinks!"

So the way you're coming off is that you want affirmation of this belief, or you're just so clumsy when talking about race that it sounds that way

i was basically not trying to let this fall into "confirmation bias" as in if no one knew what the fuck I was talking about then I could assume the whole thing wasn't really anything. btw I didn't really say that i've been tipped well by black people but rather that I don't think or wouldn't guess that it's an issue of cheapness because that really does fall into some stupid racist bullshit which I was trying to steer the thread away from

honestly, I have no idea, that's why I brought it up because it's kind of a weird thing. in my experience as a bartender they aren't exactly cheap people and I'm not sure if there are cultural issues or what they could be

― frogbs

So the way you're coming off is that you want affirmation of this belief

I don't really want affirmation of anything - tipping culture in general is pretty interesting to me, ultimately I tried to phrase things so that I didn't seem like I was racist but I'm not really good with that and given ILX's tendencies to make everything look worse than it really is I probably should have known better

frogbs, have you served black people as a bartender? How did they tip?

mh - i wasn't referring to the tip there, what I mean here - and this is something that a lot of servers would probably back me up on - is that I don't think the issue of "cheapness" (which I'm assuming a lot of you are trying to make this thread about?) really defines how much a person tips. we're talking about places where people willingly pay $8 for a $1 dessert or $5 for a pint of beer that they know costs less than a buck - if people really wanted to be cheap they probably wouldn't go to restaurants or bars very often

I think you're confusing living cheaply versus being a cheap bastard.

btw yeah I have served black people and they generally tipped alright unless the bill was really big, in which case you wouldn't get 10-15% but you'd get enough to make it worth your while, nothing I would have thought of before it was mentioned to me.

in general the idea of tipping 15% on bills that are big because of shots or other 'low-maitenance' items is really stupid anyway

I think you're confusing living cheaply versus being a cheap bastard.

well there's a difference between the guy who only orders the $1 tappers or whatever or the cheap rail mixers all day and just leaves a dollar vs. those who buy a bunch of shots and don't tip well

in general the idea of tipping 15% on bills that are big because of shots or other 'low-maitenance' items is really stupid anyway

*sigh*. if you'd read upthread, you'd see the debate on this, but it's pretty dumb to change the proportion of your tip in regards to the amount of work done, because they still 'served' you regardless, and they have to tip out on those sales that they got.

don't like it, don't eat out...

btw the NPR story I posted is hilarious for several reasons, not least:
- byline: "JUAN WILLIAMS"
- last paragraph:

Lynn suggests that the American restaurant industry begin a campaign to inform people about the basics of leaving a tip. He urges the use of advertisements, educational pamphlets, and even putting tipping information on menus. And Lynn suggests that restaurants could introduce a game in which dining parties would have to tip at least 15 percent in order to be eligible to win a contest.

I have worked at multiple restaurants that put gratuity guidelines at the bottom of the bill - auto-calculated 15% and 20% of the pretax total.

that's become the standard at many of them around here too.

A lot of places in Montreal had these table-side card scanners that had buttons built in for 15/18/20. Pretty neat in that you could do the complete debit transaction right there.

I think there are a handful of places here that have those....not taken off though.

*sigh*. if you'd read upthread, you'd see the debate on this, but it's pretty dumb to change the proportion of your tip in regards to the amount of work done, because they still 'served' you regardless, and they have to tip out on those sales that they got.

don't like it, don't eat out...

thats the thing. besides that thing I mentioned above, I usually do this anyway but I do question it. like if I'm drinking at a place with $1 mugs and I get five of them, I'll tip 2-3$ which is 40-60% but I don't know why it's dumb that the 'minimum' tip should be 15% regardless of how simple your order is or how inflated the prices

because there's a lot of uncredited shit that waitstaff/bartenders do that might not have to do specifically with your order, but it contributes indirectly?

yeah that's a good point

i think the idea i'm getting is that tipping culture as a whole is kinda dumb

It'd make more sense if people were paid a reasonable wage and tipping was 100% merit, sure

the thing is though servers/bartenders would make less if they were paid wage + no tip. at least in good restaurants.

it really does suck waiting tables, too. stressful, tiring, you take it home w/ you, and pretty much have to sacrifice entire days quite often to work. I'm more than thankful for my full time, well paying job right now, where I have all nights free.

hey yall. whats goin on in this cool thread

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_0OfuYBJa3Lg/R6bz5e-DcoI/AAAAAAAABsI/_qUcu2KQOA4/s400/tipping01.jpg

l-r: frogbs, mh, Neanderthal

yeah despite what iatee says bartenders have to work super hard sometimes, its not like they always just sit around chatting and drinking with the customers. some friday/saturday nights we'd get absolutely slammed and it would be 4 hours of people yelling out drink orders and complaining that they're not getting served on time, with like 60 people at the bar despite there only being 30 seats, so there'd be no time at all for rest, tbf you would get tipped well on those days

Neanderthal - a black person? *destroys self*

well I do listen to a lot of rap, but no, I'm Powder ....

hmm. black people like rap? could it be true? is it because the lyrics are often "thuggish" or is it because it's good "dancing music"?

o what have i done ;_;

btw that post actually was pretty racist

actually it came off as being sarcastic about racism which isn't racist

but righto