Calif. teacher resigns after leaving family for student

i just kind of can't believe that the older person in an older/teen relationship isn't manipulating the teenager. maybe not 100% of the time, but probably most of the time. which is kinda why i want to punch that guy in the picture above.

I don't mind discussing Beyonce w/my dad because, while we can bond on being over the hill, skeevey dudes checking out the belles, we also know it's just a window show and nothing else will happen nor would we want it to and I have plenty of experience to show that the appreciation of beauty doesn't diminish w/age nor would I want it to. I see no shame nor feel any compunction about admiring pretty ladies any more than admiring pretty flowers or a sunset. I'm not going to get my mind's panties in a knot 'cause of the way I am programmed.

― Morning becomes apopleptic (Michael White), Thursday, March 1, 2012 4:36 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i agree w/ this. it's not very common, but it is possible to just admire women out of your league/age group from afar in a way that's just kind of passive and not disgustingly anatomical or whatever.

The sexualization of younger and younger women

I cannot tell you how much I disagree with this.

I guess on re-reading I shd clarify that I can see how it would get less viscerally disgusting as you get older, until the point where you and your cohort are, like, responsible adults by some definition, and a woman your age is a "younger" woman but not a "young woman." There are other gendered things about that stance that don't sit right with me but it's not like being in HIGH SCHOOL OR COLLEGE and your dad leering at your friends in front of you, for instance.

has a dream about the high school student

the fact that he fantasizes about her saying "fuck me Mr. McAllister" always makes me lol because what kind of thing is that to say during sex

xp

let Penthouse Forum teach you how to live

damn, Shakey beat me to
http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_l9j5ucgDgF1qzzh6g.jpg

there's definitely some manipulation going on there. that photo looks like 'dad reunited w/daughter after she was rescued from pedo ring' more than 'loving couple celebrates impending nuptials'

always good to get banaka's take on these things

I've never witnessed my dad leering at anybody really so I guess I have not gone through this particular "rite of passage"

maybe he was leering at you

the fucked-up power relationship is kinda implicit in any relationship where you have someone who is of, say, college age or older, pursuing a teenager.

See, I don't think this is true. Although, of course, your phrasing is purposefully built to imply activity on the part of the person who is older and passivity on the part of the younger person. Many people in such relationships would not perceive that as accurate, rather that they entered into a relationship with one another. But the teacher-pupil relationship (and the child's-best-friend relationship) are coming from a base where the power relationship of the older half is very much ingrained, and I find it difficult to see how you can form a healthy partnership from that.

watching Solid Gold with my father was an odd experience because he would shout "WOO! SHAKE IT!" at the Solid Gold Dancers and I would always think to myself "they can't hear you"

The sexualization of younger and younger women

I cannot tell you how much I disagree with this.

knowing you, I'm anticipating some kind of historical argument that is totally OTM

xp

Hey some dude, I was reacting to your calling it "a rite of passage" because that makes it seem like something it's normal to go through, you could even say it's healthy. Like, it's gross to kids when they figure out their parents had/are having sex, too, but we would say that that knowledge is a healthy, if temporarily uncomfortable, part of growing up. I don't think being a witness to your own dad perving on young girls is in the same category.

But the teacher-pupil relationship (and the child's-best-friend relationship) are coming from a base where the power relationship of the older half is very much ingrained, and I find it difficult to see how you can form a healthy partnership from that.

right yeah totally agree with this.

my god election is good imna rescreen asap

DJP+Dad bringin the sitcom lolz in this thread

my dad embarrassed the hell out of me when i was a kid. often. so embarrassing. he was definitely from the mad men 50's. not a bad guy at all, but ugh...

mw, sexualization by mass media isn't the same as acknowledging that people of that age have sexuality of their own.

Banaka otm

Hey some dude, I was reacting to your calling it "a rite of passage" because that makes it seem like something it's normal to go through, you could even say it's healthy. Like, it's gross to kids when they figure out their parents had/are having sex, too, but we would say that that knowledge is a healthy, if temporarily uncomfortable, part of growing up. I don't think being a witness to your own dad perving on young girls is in the same category.

― drawn to them like a moth toward a spanakopita (Laurel), Thursday, March 1, 2012 4:43 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lots of rites of passage are unhealthy and gross, that wasn't my implication at all. the so-called rite of passage ITSELF involved feeling disgusted.

what i am saying really is if you can get through your whole life without having the asexual view of your parents that you had as a child tarnished in any way, you are among the few and the fortunate afaict

lewd and lascivious battery: Teacher charged with having sex with 14-year-old student

And I'm saying that viewing your parents as people with a healthy sexual relationship does not necessarily entail accepting that your dad is going to lust after teenagers all his life because I think that is an embarrassing and shameful way to be and we should not accept it for ourselves in our own lives.

mw, sexualization by mass media isn't the same as acknowledging that people of that age have sexuality of their own.

but... young girls were super-heavily sexualized (in lots of cultures) way prior to mass media

xp

what i am saying really is if you can get through your whole life without having the asexual view of your parents that you had as a child tarnished in any way, you are among the few and the fortunate afaict

I knew I'd told this story on here before

The sexualization of younger and younger women

The sexualization of women happens when it happens and it usually happens pretty young (hello, what does pornography originally mean?) and it's precisely culture and 'civilization' and morality that tends to make people have to wait before shagging like stoats. If a man is a man at 13 in Jewish culture and a mere girl can be married at (to me) obscenely young ages in arranged marriage cultures where the consummation happens at 12 or 13 or 14; in a world where life expectancy was in the 40's or 50's until fairly recently, the current re-sexualization of adolescents is just reverting to the human id, albeit for other id reasons like money (status) or greed.

Is that whole story I've heard about the origin of women shaving their legs generally true?

Yeah, shakes, but those cultures were quite likely fucked up? Like, those young women were valued by older and more powerful men for their virginity, their fertility, the fact that as soon as they got married off at age 15, women had 29 kids and aged 20 years prematurely until they died in childbirth? Whatevs, they didn't exactly get the awesome end of the stick. So I don't see why examples like that should be aspirational?

Yeah, shakes, but those cultures were quite likely fucked up?

writing off an awfully huge swathe of civilization here

most of civilization has been pretty fucked up, in retrospect

And I'm saying that viewing your parents as people with a healthy sexual relationship does not necessarily entail accepting that your dad is going to lust after teenagers all his life because I think that is an embarrassing and shameful way to be and we should not accept it for ourselves in our own lives.

― drawn to them like a moth toward a spanakopita (Laurel), Thursday, March 1, 2012 4:49 PM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

ok i'm not gonna keep stopping you from making these huge leaps of logic from what i said onto what you think i'm saying so have fun with that

Also, something I have never, ever got; why is the fact that your parents are fucking so gross to people? Do you really live in such an artifically antiseptic world that you would wish upon your parents that they become eunuchs? Did you never see happy lovers as a kid? Never see horses or butterflies rutting? Never wonder at the driven resiliance of salmon swimming upstream to spawn and die?

I just...don't get it and I never have.

mw you are talking about having a personal sexuality. This thread is specif about inappropriately older men having sex with or wanting to have sex with really young women. If you want to argue that you think it's awesome that you can fantasize about fucking teenagers and you feel good about being that guy, obviously that's up to you.

hmm I just don't want to think about my dad's penis, I guess, why is that complicated

i don't think pointing out how these relationships could've been, might've been normative in totally different history/context/culture/experience has any bearing on how they occur in our culture where they're certainly not normative. did we invent the idea of childhood (and later teenagehood) fairly recently in human history? yes. but now that they're been invented, it's not like they're just made-up nonsense. partially they were invented bc they were needed. just bc children were forced to labor throughout human history doesn't mean we should do it now.

reallllllly wary of any arguments that want to discuss this issue in terms of "biology" or "humanity's id" or "what other cultures have done in the past"

Also, something I have never, ever got; why is the fact that your parents are fucking so gross to people? Do you really live in such an artifically antiseptic world that you would wish upon your parents that they become eunuchs? Did you never see happy lovers as a kid? Never see horses or butterflies rutting? Never wonder at the driven resiliance of salmon swimming upstream to spawn and die?

I just...don't get it and I never have.

― Morning becomes apopleptic (Michael White), Thursday, March 1, 2012 9:55 PM (41 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Complete guess, but possibly a natural thing to stop you from wanting to fuck them yourself and thus create an inbred and unhealthy population? No idea whether that's true, though.

just bc children were forced to labor throughout human history doesn't mean we should do it now.

right obviously I'm not saying it's good or anything. but it's also not an aberration.

why is the fact that your parents are fucking so gross to people? Do you really live in such an artifically antiseptic world that you would wish upon your parents that they become eunuchs?

I'm not taking this as having been directed at me, but just in case: I said I think this is healthy! Just temporarily uncomfortable for you as a kid/teen.

This thread is specif about inappropriately older men having sex with or wanting to have sex with really young women. If you want to argue that you think it's awesome that you can fantasize about fucking teenagers and you feel good about being that guy, obviously that's up to you.

uh, pretty big difference between fantasizing about and actually doing something.

well, it's an aberration by contemporary standards. it's an aberration to stone homosexuals, but during most of history it was legit. our ethical expectations have changed. xxp

Laurel's "at younger and younger ages" implies that it's some deviation from the norm... but the norm, broadly speaking, has been pretty fucked up historically!

xp

Laurel, what we aspire to is very, very often not our biological past and eyeing beautiful women neither negates a healthy sexual relationship nor is it particularly shameful or even embarrassing (as long you're discreet).

- acquaintance who once complained to me about how "hard" it is to be a hs teacher because of the preponderance of hot young chix

― be scientific, douchebag (Shakey Mo Collier)

as a working teacher, i find this really f'd up and i find this really hard to understand ... no matter what they look like - and i have met many who look like more or less like adult women - teenage girls are still teenagers: obnoxious, childish, irresponsible, naive, selfish, etc ...

i really think you would have to

-- enjoy and seek out these personality traits (hard to believe)
-- only think about physical qualities (easier to believe)
-- have something wrong with you

to be attracted to a teenage girl

reallllllly wary of any arguments that want to discuss this issue in terms of "biology" or "humanity's id" or "what other cultures have done in the past"

This is perfectly healthy but I'm even more wary of arguments that don't. By all means kick a theory in the nuts if you think it makes baseless assumptions based on prejudice or self-interest or bias but at least come up with a theory?

I grew up in the country and I never saw horses or butterflies rutting as a child. How would you even know the butterflies were rutting?

obnoxious, childish, irresponsible, naive, selfish, etc ...

are you talking about one of my exes?

they stick together xp