I will keep doing, but not worth it! The 2016 Presidential Primary Voting Thread

i guess krugman says it was iowa itself that convinced black voters as a group to get behind him

http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2016/02/02/post-iowa-notes/?smid=fb-share

xp: Sanders definitely has them as part of his platform but in the times I've seen him speak and certainly in the soundbites that are his campaign ads, he's done a terrible job of connecting them (see his total bungling of the reparations issue, which he didn't even need to come out in favor of in order to handle it better than he actually handled it).

― its subtle brume (DJP), Tuesday, February 2, 2016 4:44 PM (17 minutes ago)

i was disappointed by bernie's reparations answer too but it was...candid? at the very least?

it would seem to me that, politically, after iowa/NH would be a good time to start emphasizing that part of his platform, as he starts to campaign in more diverse states

maybe - and that was because he carried the WHITE there. It was clear he wasn't Jesse Jackson (or Shirley Chisholm) 2.0.

xp

the WHITE vote duh

idk, maybe krugman's otm there, but i'd like to see some evidence to back that up. It sounds more like media CW to me than anything.

wow, krugman is really all in for hillary. kind of sad

Certainly taking a harder line on the corruption of our politics by big money is important — and no, giving some paid speeches doesn’t disqualify her from making that case. (Cue furious attack from the Bernie bros.)

He was in 2008 too!
xpost

Sanders should do some media buys featuring Hil & Bill pushing the crime bill... and maybe some clips from this speech:

http://www.cnn.com/2015/07/15/politics/bill-clinton-1994-crime-bill/

https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--PEn-Kvwc--/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/mmgrifg8rgxnnswy8wnk.jpg

Sanders should do some media buys featuring Hil & Bill pushing the crime bill

super-predators line is the obvious go to

sanders certainly has a lot at his disposal if he should choose to go down that road, and obviously i think bringing up bill's history is fair game. the demographics of iowa/NH meant he probably didn't need bring out the big guns yet, but at some point he's going to need to if he's going to try to give this a serious shot

he should go after Biil's big gun.

Sanders doesn't seem to have much appetite for the "politics of personal destruction", as they say. He gives every indication of having drank his own kool-aid as far as the broad appeal of his own policy proposals is concerned. But policy proposals alone are not what turns out votes.

if by "big gun" he means reminding voters about the Telecommunications Act, Commodity Futures Modernization Act, elimination of Glass-Steagall, welfare 'reform,' and Marc Rich, sure.

it does seem like all people remember about the 90s were that there were jobs and money flying around, but if you look at any of Bill Clinton's singular accomplishments the majority of 'em are pretty execrable. He could give a decent speech though.

also Alfred omitted Clinton's loosening of FDA regulations allowing drug companies to advertise, which you can definitely trace our current pill-addiction epidemic to, imho.

I am very interested in seeing what happens in Nevada and South Carolina as I think that's going to be an indicator of the actual level of Sanders' minority support

haven't looked at polls but I think Hillary will KO Bernie in South Carolina

i don't think a lot of people know bernie that well. not just minority voters.

― scott seward, Tuesday, February 2, 2016 4:48 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah, this is interesting. i mean elsewhere i think we're all pretty much agreed that the hypothetical matchups showing clinton or sanders doing better or worse versus trump or cruz in the general election are basically meaningless, because most of the people answering haven't got strong opinions on most of the people being named, and would probably tell you so. so when we swing around to the dem primaries and specific groups sanders needs to do better with, i'm kinda willing to buy that he has some room and time to grow as he takes on individual states and throws down big ad buys and barnstorming and all that kind of stuff. not "win south carolina" room to grow - i mean come on.

nonetheless it is possible he could gain some. maybe some parts of his message connect while others fall flat, or this varies across the demographics he's trying to get on board. it would be nice to see some more detailed and precise polling of south carolina, which i suspect we shortly will. when the campaign first got rolling, sanders was polling at like 2%, 5% in south carolina. in august, the first or second time i started arguing with frederik b about this, sanders was up to 9%. he's now at 32.5%. that's still a horrible, crushing defeat vs. hillary - but it means he's bringing somebody on board. may in fact just be white south carolinian college students - i don't know. but he's been very steadily inching up there. be interesting to see how it looks once post-iowa polls start showing up.

lol I just looked at the polling. me otm

yeah welfare reform, NAFTA, DOMA/dont ask don't tell, the 94 crime bill, etc. plenty of great stuff there that could be targeted to different demographics xxxp

we're looking beyond SC, Chachi.

‏@DougHenwood
The Hillary-Bernie Olive Garden meme is just like real sexual harassment, says this extraordinary piece

People write this crap because the positive case for HRC is so weak.

http://www.salon.com/2016/02/02/bernie_bros_stop_this_meme_your_dumb_joke_about_hillarys_music_taste_isnt_funny_its_predictably_sexist/

damn, this thread is already HUUUUUUUUUGE

um

https://store.tedcruz.org/product/blacklisted-loving-it-poster/

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-W2VqgKeC-J0/VrDrIankK7I/AAAAAAAAeSg/YVO502nkoaA/s640/Screenshot%2B2016-02-02%2Bat%2B9.43.34%2BAM.png

person who wrote that is a music journalist, not a political writer, and the piece is ill-served by its headline xps

'It's a Miracle Trump Didn't Invent the Selfie'

When did Lefsetz start writing for der Spiegel?

David Brooks goin existential:

Donald Trump Isn’t Real

Haha omg

i don't think a lot of people know bernie that well. not just minority voters.

― scott seward, Tuesday, February 2, 2016 3:48 PM (53 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i mean they know what he looks like and that he wants a revolution or whatever.

― scott seward, Tuesday, February 2, 2016 3:48 PM (53 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

"is he the angry old white guy?"

― Οὖτις, Tuesday, February 2, 2016 3:49 PM (52 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

loool

I always forget that not everyone is like my friends/family, we're all hyper aware of politics and plugged in and mostly for Bernie

lolllll xp

Hologram Trump for veep

RE Heidi Cruz holy shit i wondered whatever happened to Tracy Flick

uh Tracy Flick is obviously Hillary

no way Flick would have ever gotten down w/ Bill

idk what a gym teacher has over Bill

this face though

http://gawker.com/rumor-heidi-cruz-is-so-repulsed-by-iowans-she-has-to-s-1756461603

haha yeah it's like that freeze-frame in the film

Arthur Chu has thoughts about Berniebros: http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/feb/02/i-like-bernie-sanders-his-supporters-not-so-much-berniebro?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

didn't even really consider this in the midst of the clown show. kind of interesting...

http://thehill.com/policy/energy-environment/267937-cruz-victory-threatens-ethanols-power

ethanol subsidies are bullshit, if this somehow puts a chink in their armor as some kind of mandated policy at the federal level, that's a good thing imo

agreed

big soy needs to find a way to make a way to profit off of setting their shit on fire like the corn ppl

I've never heard that nickname for Christie.

That Salon piece is predictably idiotic. They must pay really well for the writers to be willing to attach their names to shit like that.

idk I figure mocking Hillary picking a Celene Dion song as her campaign song in '08 is pretty much the same as a music publicist sexually assaulting women

https://41.media.tumblr.com/c3fb86709469392e3cc353590a6aef92/tumblr_o1w291vBNF1s7e5k5o1_500.jpg

this fucking guy, 1994

to save time, not clicking any URL including "berniebro"

@pareene
oh god wait Hillary is Hubert H. Humphrey

hawkish, presents self as avatar of real (non-elite) Democratic base, anti-left but not conservative

Eugene McCarthybros

Yeah, except her pecker has never been inside anyone's pocket.

Chris Matthews had an interview with Hillary Rodham Clinton on the MSNBC channel of the electric teevee machine Tuesday afternoon that was flatly astounding. This is especially true if you remember Matthews' sorry history with the Clinton family, especially concerning HRC, against whom he was so hostile in 2008 that kindly Doc Maddow called him out on it on the air. Now, though, apparently, Matthews sees HRC as the only thing keeping the Battleship Potemkin from sailing up his driveway....

http://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/news/a41754/chris-matthews-hillary-clinton-interview/

"We agree on universal health-care."

Holy fuck, she said it would never happen just the other day.

Apparently Marco doesn't want *that* much change.

http://bipartisanreport.com/2016/02/02/plagiarism-marco-rubio-gets-called-out-for-stealing-president-obamas-speech-video/

And as noted by someone above, I thought it weird he seemed to be bragging about coming in third with "So this is the moment they said would never happen. For months, for months they told us we had no chance."