Mystery Science Theater 3000: C/D, S/D.

Well, I think it's important to remember that both Cinematic Titanic and that _Heat_ thing already happened some time ago, then CT ended -- slightly murkily from what I remember -- and then a little later comes the announced reunion and all, which per Joel's comments we now know at least Trace was involved with to some degree in initial form before turning into what it is. I think there's a lot left unsaid happening, call it 'Minnesota nice' if you like -- and I think it's notable that Josh, who like Trace was there from the get-go, was definitely looking askance at things post-CT/when the revival happened. You're definitely right about the reunion special of course, though I imagine other factors were also at play. If anything when it comes to who gets along with who and how, I tend to see the Rifftrax team (counting Bridget and Mary Jo now) at the center, Joel and the new crew to one side (and if you want to, count in people like Paul Chaplin there) and Trace/Frank on the other, with the long overdue royalties to each of the original team members helping to at least keep things reasonably balanced.

Little io9 interview with Felicia Day: http://io9.gizmodo.com/mst3ks-new-villain-felicia-day-explains-how-a-simple-ac-1793696340

Never felt one way or another about Day but this bit speaks to my heart:

Bad movies are my favorite. I love bad movies. I actually read a study the other day that smarter people like bad movies and I felt really vindicated. Because I’d much rather watch a cheesy kung fu film from the ‘70s than any Oscar-winning film ever.

The study, whatever, but the last sentence there is gold.

Trace afaik seems pretty content w/his Mads shows and living back in Minnesota. (i'm guessing the new MST3K is L.A.-based? idk)

Felicia Day otm, Netflix having all those Shaw Bros films available recently was fantastic

Yeah, LA-based.

Anyway the official site is now up and running:

http://www.mst3k.com/

Including a debut of what's supposed to be a regular 'behind the scenes' thing with Joel:

http://www.mst3k.com/chat_with_joel_mst3k_season_11

This is interesting and makes a lot of sense:

L: How would you say riffing has changed over the years?

J: I think it's changed a lot. The thing that changed it the most, in my mind, was us doing those hundred Cinematic Titanic shows. Doing a hundred live shows really puts a really different spin on it. You really have to own it, because the audience is watching, and they're reacting to it in real time.

We're fortunate because we really made Mystery Science Theater in a vacuum, and it worked. People liked it. But doing it live puts a little bit more of a emphasis on the strength of the riffing. I think the difference, from my perspective, comes from my experience with doing those live shows.

And then, of course, another important aspect is the new writers, and the new people filling the show with ideas and riffs, and the performers. So I think from an editorial standpoint, I was bringing my experience of doing those hundred shows on the road, in front of different audiences. And then, you bring that knowledge together with these really great new performers and also really great writing staff, and then you just kind of go from there.

The whole chat is pretty good -- it's definitely the deepest I've seen Joel get in terms of dealing with fan expectation, trust in the process and the sense that the show really did meaning something *really* deep at its best, however interpreted.

All of this still doesn't skip over the many elephants in the room we've raised over the last eighteen months, but even so.

Joel's been really impressing me with the thoughtfulness of his interviews. This one hits the same highlights as the others but there's still some great stuff in there

http://www.theverge.com/2016/7/24/12266652/mystery-science-theater-3000-joel-hodgson-interview-comic-con-2016

Okay so...

Today was the sneak preview stream for backers and since I kicked in money after the fact to snag the first two KTMAs, meant I got access to the stream etc. Scattered thoughts, and allowing for the fact that this was the first episode:

* Riffing was pretty solid and at times very much on. Easily the strongest part of the whole deal. Not totally used to all their voices yet -- the new Servo/Crow voices are pretty serviceable takes on the 'standard' voices (Hampton Yount, who plays Crow, sounded both like Bill and Trace in a way), but sometimes all three of them blended together. Also Yount is kinda where Bill was when he started -- doesn't have the puppeting down in the theater fully when it comes to syncing the riffs, but everyone starts somewhere. Tom floating around at points...kinda gratuitous but hey. Gypsy cameos random but hey. Rock stupid movie, perfect material to work with, a couple of great deep-cut callbacks to the classic era, so that much is back and I'll be fine with checking out the other episodes for that reason alone. But that said:

* The skits etc....yeah, that's not so sharp. Way more than the actual riffing, you get a sense of a lot of self-consciousness happening that translates into a kind of forced manicness at times from the neo-Mads and a sort of 'we're aiming for a breezier version of sleepy-eyed Joel era' from the SOL team, and it's not really clicking for me. Again, may improve, but if this sets the general tone and stays there, that could rapidly get really grating. Nothing was really funny, maybe more smile-inducing at points, wince-inducing at others. Best moment is a return to the letters bits featuring, indeed, letters from little kids. That was always something I loved about the letters when they did them and I hope that keeps up. And EASILY the worst part was a skit involving a rap about monsters around the world which, just, no. Pure amateur-hour 'I'm a wacky fan at Comic-Con and I love TMBG and Jonathan Coulson and MC Chris and I think I can be a smoothie too' pain. I should have just fast-forwarded through that.

* As for the trappings: wide screen format's fine of course, also nice seeing a movie at full screen too. There's definitely a 'show more!' element going on with Moon 13 now, but the SOL bridge sure looks flat. Door sequence is cool, a neat reinvention that's a technical treat. The 'house band' in Moon 13 is random but gives an excuse for skull-wearing minions, with Har Mar Superstar as the vocalist. Having the 'commercial break' moments in the film works pretty nicely, it's less the skits and more halfway through each film stretch, and in a nice touch has the band playing arrangements of classic-era MST songs, though without announcing which so it's a good mental exercise for the obsessed fan (hi there!). And there's enough rough in-camera models and the like to make everything feel just so; if anything I was getting used to some of the new camera angles and the hand-held shots.

* They have cameos straight out of the gate but I won't say who -- good combination, though kinda wish it was a better bit.

* As for the opening and closing parts: the new full intro, once it starts, is fun enough, with Har Mar and Felicia Day doing the singing. And the 'love theme' variation at the end is a full new one -- and an actual orchestral arrangement, it turns out! Played by a Macedonian orchestra at that. As learned from the credits, which are long as hell now. (There's your difference from a 'put together with a small crew in Eden Prairie' to a 'filmed in LA' setup right there.) Unfortunately to fill out the time the love theme ended and then that god-awful rap played. (I assume they'll do a different song from the show for each episode.)

So yeah, it's MST3K: The Next Generation as I muttered way back when the Kickstarter began and there ya go. Now I should really just relax.

Separately, the Rifftrax crew have done another MST reriff, only this time it's Bridget and Mary Jo doing Angel's Revenge, which is a perfect idea:

http://www.rifftrax.com/angels-revenge

Oh and one other thing -- yes, the stingers at the very end of the episode are back too. And it's a perfect moment.

Wow. Thanks for sharing, Ned. A lot to mull on there. Guess I should, in the end, just give it a chance of my own, but good to be warned about things that might give me serious winces, will make it easier to push past them if so and try to appreciate the other stuff.

Is it cool for me to say that as long as the riffing is good, that's all I really care about? I mean, I'm happy to have Patton Oswalt on board, but the riffs are all I cared about re: this show in the first place.

ts: cringey self-awareness of new MST3K vs cringey oblivious parts of old MST3K

tbf I skipped most of the sketch scenes anyway unless there was singing or timetravel involved

I think the thing is that, divorced from the whole Vampira/Svengoolie etc. line of descent, ie the cultural familiarity that made the whole TV hosting/cheap station setup idea of MST immediately accessible, it becomes something where it's trying to compete with its successors as well as other approaches to movie riffing on YouTube etc. etc. It's a knowing anachronism, and that's just fine, but that can be a hard balance to maintain.

Is it cool for me to say that as long as the riffing is good, that's all I really care about?

Then you're set. I was trying to get a sense of the 'pool' of cultural references they were drawing from, and generally it felt more pop culture so far, not that I was expecting deep historical nerdery or the like. Again, first episode, and I'd like to see what ends up happening in the rest first. But I legit laughed at many points throughout, it was all perfectly comfortable. (Odd little bit now that I think about it -- there were a couple of moments when the riffs juuust anticipated the camera shot they were referencing by a hair. Something else to ascribe to getting used to the process, I figure.)

If I'm honest with myself, probably half of MST host segments - and nearly all of the Sci-Fi-era opening and closing ones - are pretty lame, with a lot of theater-club mugging overworking not-that-funny jokes. Buuuuuuut the other half are another story, generally lovably homemade and building on the characters' different voices in a way that really charms me, much like the core Muppets do. And the great sketches (pretty much all from the Joel+Trace+Frank era imho) are really great.

And yeah, this whole aspect of the show (along with the premise, and it even having hosts) belongs to the Vampira/Elvira tradition, so a certain campiness and inessentiality is sort of innate to it, but when it finds its groove I'm won over. YMMV of course.

I pretty much don't like any of the sketches in either era. Maybe one or two here and there, but it's such a low rate that after a while I always skipped them. I guess they were trying to match the low budget feel of the movies, but I'd prefer they also match the funniness of the riffs

Is it cool for me to say that as long as the riffing is good, that's all I really care about? I mean, I'm happy to have Patton Oswalt on board, but the riffs are all I cared about re: this show in the first place.

― some sad trombone Twilight Zone shit (cryptosicko), Sunday, April 9, 2017 1:13 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

same -- i get Dr C's point about the good skits being "lovably homemade" and all, but i'm really just here for the riffs

I'm really not feeling this revival, but I suppose non-Netflix ppl will get to see this in about 6 months.

also there was a Sunday NY Times piece, and i am shocked that Minnesotans are not boycotting as this is being made in LaLaLand.

suppose non-Netflix ppl will get to see this in about 6 months

Is this how it works? I've never had Netflix, so I dunno how "exclusive" their content is.

i assume there will be DVDs eventually...

Oh, duh.

thanks ned. i trust your judgement on this thing.

http://netflixlife.com/2017/04/13/mst3k-return-netflix-time/

also:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C9TtcEvV0AAXjdq.jpg:large

xxpost -- Yer welcome. Be interesting to see what people think tomorrow.

Kickstarter backers who ponied up to a particular amount will get (in fact I think are already getting) full downloads of the season now, and there was a Blu-Ray set planned too. Presumably these will also be available to the general public separately.

As for that tattoo, I assume that is Eric H.'s

Not yet, but consider it stolen.

tom servo of finland oh i get it haha

Servo could get it too.

And...we're back.

Wikipedia has a full list of the new episodes plus guest stars already, of course:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Mystery_Science_Theater_3000_episodes#Season_11_.282017.29

Going on vacation tomorrow for a week and a half so I think I'll dip into these here and there along the way.

they're seated on the right side of the theater and it's driving me crazy

...but that's where they've always been seated.

they keep talking while the movie is playing!

Jerry Seinfeld guest stars.

wait didn't they use to sit on the left side

n/m i'm crazy

Bones?!
JIM!
FOSSIL bones?!
FOSSIL JIM!

Synergy!

http://io9.gizmodo.com/mystery-science-theater-3000-casts-its-riffing-eyes-on-1794340882

Slew of other stories and things this week but having mentioned Shout! Factory's role in all this, this is worth a read:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-company-behind-the-mystery-science-theater-3000-revival-1492029705

lol gbx

the only thing thats giving me a bad trip is the robot voices. it also sucks that every ep is written by a different group of hollywood ppl rather than a room of weirdos in mn but whatcha guna do.

Detail from that WSJ story worth noting:

Ownership of “MST3K” (and the right to produce new episodes) belonged to Jim Mallon, the executive producer who originally launched the show in the Twin Cities. Decades later, “Jim was very happy living in Minneapolis and going to his mailbox every few months and getting a nice check from us. What more did he need?” Mr. Emmer said. “But we wanted the freedom to expand this very underutilized asset.”

In partnership with Mr. Hodgson, who left the show in 1993, Shout bought “MST3K” for an amount in the seven figures, a deal that took about six years to negotiate. Next came the Kickstarter campaign, intended to not only raise cash for a new season, but also to get fans personally invested in its success.

“Is there a lot of trust for an entertainment company in L.A.? Not really,” said senior vice president of business affairs David McIntosh. “It would be a nightmare scenario if the fans turned on us.”

Also, massive new post from Joel on the Kickstarter page

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/mst3k/bringbackmst3k/posts/1859562

only MST3K event i went to was a Dragoncon thing where a couple people from the show introduced a new DVD and hundreds of us all sat in a conference room barely able to see a screen at the back of the room as it played a DVD. i ducked out after 15 minutes cos it was a huge waste of time but it was standing room only. pretty sure they have nothing to worry about.

is this "nightmare scenario" no more crowdfunding your Netflix series